← Something Wrong With The Podcast
Something Wrong With The Podcast
SWWP #43 - Kanye, The Return of Verzuz, & Zohran's W (feat. Jordan From Complex)
01:02:00
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- [00:00]
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- [00:36]
Host
You have to use the mic this time because last time you did not hold it and it was like, I'm.
- [00:40]
Jordan from Complex
Getting better with this.
- [00:41]
Host
It pissed. You do this for a living. What do you mean?
- [00:46]
Jordan from Complex
Yo. Holy.
- [00:48]
Host
Welcome back to episode. I think this is 43 of something wrong with the podcast. A repeat. Guess we finally got him back. He's got a flight tomorrow. We. But tonight he's mine. Pause.
- [00:58]
Jordan from Complex
We made it.
- [00:59]
Host
We got Jordan is back. Jordan from Complex, which has been your moniker here. The voice and face of Complex. Every opinion is his and his only from that company. And we were just talking about Kanye's back. The Preacher is the, the record.
- [01:15]
Jordan from Complex
Yes.
- [01:16]
Host
I like it.
- [01:18]
Jordan from Complex
Look, he never couldn't. He never lost his ability to make beats.
- [01:21]
Host
Yeah.
- [01:21]
Jordan from Complex
Like, yeah, but I think that, you know, you know, as of the recording this today, he dropped the video of him holding hands with the rabbi to the Jewish community.
- [01:35]
Host
I mean, what is a better rollout than caping for the Jewish community? It's the rollout. Well, it didn't work in New York politics, but like, for, for, for centuries, that seemed to be the only rollout to get you what you wanted is caping for them.
- [01:49]
Jordan from Complex
So I'm going to say this because literally, as, again, as of the recording this, I made a. About Young Lean being on the New York Times podcast show. And he was talking about how he was hanging out with Kanye and then he had to stop hanging out with Kanye because he was like in his manic episodes. But he, like, you imagine how brutal.
- [02:12]
Host
Of a hang he would be during that time, literally.
- [02:14]
Jordan from Complex
But he was like, he fell for him because, like, he had also gone through manic episodes at a point. Whatever, whatever. And he was like, you know, empathetic. And I felt that because also, you know, that's what we need is more empathy absolving him of what he said or done. But it's like coming from someone like Young Lean who had gone through what he had gone through and seen it through and was able to come back on the side and be like, damn. Like, I wasn't going to ask him for a song at that point because I knew he was going through. It reminded me of like, when Gucci Mane was just on the Breakfast Club.
- [02:41]
Host
Yeah.
- [02:41]
Jordan from Complex
And he was like, with his wife and she was like. Yeah. Like he was tweaking on Twitter or whatever. Whatever. So it's like, all that being said, it's still hilarious to see that video.
- [02:51]
Host
Yeah.
- [02:51]
Jordan from Complex
Like true comedy. But I hope that it is a slight step towards, you know, yay. Getting. Just getting better, you know, hopefully.
- [03:02]
Host
So you're saying to get better. This is the. The step one to getting better is sitting down with a rabbi.
- [03:08]
Jordan from Complex
I think apologizing from. I think go. If. If he was. If the furthest we were was him saying Hitler wasn't that bad of a guy. If. If that's where we were in a real.
- [03:20]
Host
That Alex Jones interview.
- [03:22]
Jordan from Complex
If there's a real Alex Jones, Kanye and was. And the dude. Nick Fuentes.
- [03:29]
Host
Yeah.
- [03:29]
Jordan from Complex
Right.
- [03:30]
Host
That real life happened, Mr. Thumbs.
- [03:31]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah. To get from that.
- [03:33]
Host
Yeah.
- [03:33]
Jordan from Complex
To. To him holding hands of the rabbi.
- [03:37]
Host
True.
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Jordan from Complex
What's that? You know him. I'm not gonna say what doctor.
- [03:42]
Host
I'm not gonna say what he was.
- [03:43]
Jordan from Complex
But it was a Jewish like from that. So this is like, progress. And I would just hope that he. In the period that he's been kind of ghost and not on social media, which hasn't been long because he was on stream with Sneako and he was still tweaking.
- [03:58]
Host
Yeah. Yeah.
- [03:58]
Jordan from Complex
That crazy shit about Virgil. So he's still been tweaking as of like a few months.
- [04:02]
Host
It is funny. Leave it to Kanye for how. How I genuinely think how out of touch he's become. Leave it for him. Now it seems like collectively the world is again, I want to separate Jewish. The Jewish identity versus Israel as a country and like, the atrocities that they're doing there. But separating the two. What in history. Well, in recent history is a better time to pile on that community than now. And now Kanye's bending his knee, like, kissing their hands and probably gonna donate to aipac. It's like, no. Like the world kind of came around. Not to the extreme that you were saying, but, like, they're not as hot as they used to be, like, public perception wise. And now you're bending the knee, kissing this dude's head. Like, you know, saying they're not as.
- [04:50]
Jordan from Complex
Hot as they used to be in reference to the Jewish is absolutely insane. Like they're a rap group, like their day last soul or some.
- [05:00]
Host
I mean, But I'm right, though. I'm not. I'm like, what he said is foul. He went way too far. Like, it was. That was hate speech.
- [05:07]
Jordan from Complex
We do not support anti Semitism.
- [05:09]
Host
No. But, like, on the heels of Zoran winning for you to, like, bow down and. You know what I mean? Yeah, yeah.
- [05:16]
Jordan from Complex
It's like optics are a little weird.
- [05:17]
Host
You picked the wrong time.
- [05:18]
Jordan from Complex
But not for nothing, you know, that is not tapped into.
- [05:21]
Host
No, not at all. No, no.
- [05:23]
Jordan from Complex
He's so. That's why it's funny. Funny because it's like he is so in his own world that.
- [05:27]
Host
Yeah.
- [05:28]
Jordan from Complex
Whatever was going on in his own world must have come full circle.
- [05:32]
Host
Sure.
- [05:32]
Jordan from Complex
To the point where this. Regardless of what was happening outside of his bubble, in his bubble, he's come to the full circle conclusion to come and hold hands with the rabbi and apologize to the community.
- [05:42]
Host
I want to know, have you seen that new doc that came out about him?
- [05:44]
Jordan from Complex
No, I saw the trailers. I did not go to theater.
- [05:47]
Host
I. I only see every few days on my timeline, that Michael Che clip pops up where he. Che presses him out after the SNL bit. And he was like, why did you do that to me? He was like. And Connie's like, no, my brother and Chase like, no, that was up. That's all I've seen from it. But I do want to watch it. Haven't seen it. I'm also very curious. Who has been with Kanye? Like, who's been with him throughout all of this? Like, who is his guy manager, like, person. Like, who is the person that's actually seen him through this entire process?
- [06:18]
Jordan from Complex
Well, fun fact. So not.
- [06:20]
Host
Yes, Jules.
- [06:21]
Jordan from Complex
It's definitely not. Even though she was there for part of the journey.
- [06:23]
Host
Yeah. She got collected her coins.
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Jordan from Complex
She was there for part of the journey. His old manager, John Monopoly, he was with him during his, like, Asia tour. Like, when he was.
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Host
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [06:36]
Jordan from Complex
Stadiums in Asia. And he wanted to do an interview, and I was going to do it, but then I got super busy because he was also trying to promote some other shit.
- [06:44]
Host
But he was super open his iced out swastika. But. But funny enough, what does Kanye do with that now?
- [06:52]
Jordan from Complex
But even. Yeah. Right.
- [06:53]
Host
Give it to the Louvre. Like, what, they need some jewelry.
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Jordan from Complex
But here's the thing, though, right?
- [06:56]
Host
With.
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Jordan from Complex
Yay. It's so funny because, like, you always think he's past the point of no return, but, like, there's. Because he's done so much.
- [07:06]
Host
Yeah.
- [07:06]
Jordan from Complex
For the state of the culture. It's like he. I want. I can't say he's redeemable, but I also don't think he's unredeemable in the craziest of ways. Like, even, like to bring it to verses. There's versus conversations that have been going on since versus came back, and one of them was like how he. Kanye is basically unbeatable in a verse.
- [07:27]
Host
He is.
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Jordan from Complex
Which I agree with.
- [07:28]
Host
But he's a unicorn.
- [07:30]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah. Like, even in those convos, it's like you can still have these convos without acknowledging what he's on what. Which I think is a testament to how he even amidst all this, with enough handshaking rabbis, maybe he can inevitably won't ever get his business deals back. You'll never see him in a commercial again. But it's like, I don't know. You will never see him in a fucking commercial.
- [07:55]
Host
Kanye. I agree to your point. Like, his DNA is so ingratiated into, like, what? Hip hop. Hip hop, without a doubt. But even at a larger scale fashion. Yeah, Just culture. Like, as cliche as it is, street culture as a whole. Like, there was some line that came out the other day or the shoe line that came out, and it was like, clearly a rip of the Kanye who put that. Yeah. I don't know what.
- [08:21]
Jordan from Complex
I forgot who it was.
- [08:22]
Host
Whatever company was, it was like they all owe Kanye, like, a percentage because it's just variations of his technology. Like, his. Not his, but like his designs.
- [08:31]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah, yeah.
- [08:32]
Host
You know, so I don't. I don't know. But the Versus thing, since you brought it up, congrats on your. Your piece has got people.
- [08:38]
Jordan from Complex
Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, Versus is back. Complex has bought Versus with ownership. Like, bought it back. I guess Swiss Beats and them got it and then they partnered with Complex. So now we're going to be putting out, like, the future verses with Timberland and Swiss Beats or whatever. We did the big one with no limit cash money at Complex Con in Vegas, and we got, I think, like, a few more cooking up for the year before the year closes out.
- [09:06]
Host
Do you know what those are?
- [09:07]
Jordan from Complex
I actually don't.
- [09:08]
Host
Are you going to be working on those at all? In any.
- [09:10]
Jordan from Complex
I think so, because I think they want to, like, do content around it.
- [09:13]
Host
Yeah.
- [09:14]
Jordan from Complex
Kind of like what we just did, where it's like, I interviewed Master P before services, so I don't know if it's going to be a crew, like the no limit cash money or if it's going to be individuals, but I know they want to keep the momentum of how big that one was. So it's I truly don't know. But in the midst of Versus coming back, there was debates resp. Reignited online of like Jay Z. If he ever did a versus. Like an old quote. Let's make sure this is.
- [09:39]
Host
This is.
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Jordan from Complex
It was an old ass quote from like 2021 of him being like, nobody can with me in the versus.
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Host
Right? Okay.
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Jordan from Complex
So like, give him the grace of 2021. Very different.
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Host
But what has changed since?
- [09:50]
Jordan from Complex
I mean, it's just like, I think people's perception of the big three has changed and like, the power dynamics of rap. 2021 was like pre God's plan. Like his verse on God's plan. He was still like, you know, four years out of 444. So, like, he wasn't fully retired. I think he had thrown a few, like, loose features out. So he was still semi active. And the. The powers that be were like. Like 2021 was. Was still kind of intact. Now we like, I feel like 2021.
- [10:20]
Host
It'S fractured and now it's cooked.
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Jordan from Complex
Yeah, it's cooked. If some. In. In some ways, in a good way. Because now it's like, feel like they could talk however they want to hoe, which I feel like they couldn't. They wouldn't have done in 2021. That's why when he said that quote, initially, I don't think it sparked these debates that it did this time. But now is like, oh, yeah.
- [10:38]
Host
Not like just for my paranoia. I'm sorry. Just hold it close.
- [10:41]
Jordan from Complex
Oh, I got you. I got you. I got you.
- [10:43]
Host
Sorry.
- [10:43]
Jordan from Complex
Now he's just like, niggas is like, oh, no. Like, DMX could be hoving the Versus or, oh, Nas could go. I'm like, all right. No, the only. And I. The video that I made. The only that could be HOV or compete. My money's still on hold. But like, who. The only thing who would actually, like, probably compete and maybe beat him is Kanye. Yeah, ain't no. Because when you put in his production bag, it's different. Like, it's just. It puts him in a different category. Yeah, he produced for hov. You know, like, yeah.
- [11:17]
Host
Oh, yeah, player. Biggest hit. That's mine. Like, that's. I made that.
- [11:20]
Jordan from Complex
That is probably like, I get say Drake. I get say Wayne, but like, Drake is good. And Drake is probably unbeatable to any in his. In our current era.
- [11:32]
Host
But yeah. Yes, yes. Not probably.
- [11:34]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah, like, no one, like, talk about. Talk about some. I'm sorry. Nobody's trying to hit Kendrick. Respectfully, all respect to PG Leg and Autumn. Nobody trying to hear man in the Garden at the. No one's trying to hear man in the Garden. I'm sorry. I like the tour. Nobody's trying to hear Luther on a versus stage. What do you think, though?
- [11:54]
Host
I agree with you. I. I do think if it was a verse, because, like, versus the music is huge. But I also. After the locks, one really learned how much performance of a versus matters, and I don't think. I mean, Jay's not a good performer, so we can just say that. All right. Like, he's not. He's not Kanye.
- [12:12]
Jordan from Complex
Okay. Okay, Fair.
- [12:13]
Host
So, like, if we're gonna. If we're playing into what is a verses, it's not just the music. It's the performance of these records as well. Kanye would outperform the. Out of Jay Z. Yeah. Like, it wouldn't be close.
- [12:25]
Jordan from Complex
The. It's so funny, because the closest thing I feel like I've seen to a Kanye versus was I went to the free Larry Hoover show when he did the. With Drake, and it was like, obviously not. It was billed as a Larry Hoover benefit concert.
- [12:43]
Host
I think Connie got set up.
- [12:44]
Jordan from Complex
No, Drake got set up.
- [12:45]
Host
No, because didn't Drake do all his hits? No, Kanye did all his hits. That's right. That's what I knew one of them did.
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Jordan from Complex
The hits was doing some certified lover voice.
- [12:55]
Host
Yes. Yes.
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Jordan from Complex
That was when that album had came out.
- [12:57]
Host
You're right.
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Jordan from Complex
And it's like. And that's what. That's why I always feel like that's the closest thing I've seen to a Kanye versus because it's like, Drake's doing girl.
- [13:03]
Host
Yeah. Kanye set. I remember that his cellus was.
- [13:06]
Jordan from Complex
Then this come out. Wait till I get my. I'm like, yo. And just. He ran through, like, all his. He even did. Did find your love and reminded that he produced find your love. I was like, all right. Like, that was some. That obviously will never happen.
- [13:25]
Host
Such a Kanye play, too.
- [13:27]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah. But it was like, so, like, that was what really.
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Host
Like, I'm gonna look up the set list.
- [13:30]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah, look it up. Cause it was, like, nasty. And I know that Drake didn't know what Kanye setlist was finna be. Cause it was just. It was. It was so nasty.
- [13:42]
Host
Yeah. Cause he. He came out and started with. He did the praise God first.
- [13:48]
Jordan from Complex
Yes.
- [13:48]
Host
And then he just listen to Donda shit. Jesus walks all falls down Gold digger touch the sky stronger all the lights Black skinhead all day mer good life Flashing lights say you will for like, the comedown I Wonder. And then he did find your love.
- [14:07]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah. So he, like. And then he did run away and can't tell me nothing. Yeah, bro, that was his whole I'm trying to get my wife back tour.
- [14:15]
Host
And then Drake went. Did, like, his run of 12 songs. Then Connie came back, did Hurricane father stretch my hands in Paris. Bound to come to life in forever. They ended on forever.
- [14:27]
Jordan from Complex
God, he did.
- [14:28]
Host
Yeah.
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Jordan from Complex
Like, I blacked out at that point.
- [14:31]
Host
Yeah. Yeah, you're right. Kanye kind of lined him up on that.
- [14:34]
Jordan from Complex
It was od, bro. But it shows you, like. And honestly, that's a. That's a light hand. Because if A doing versus, he doing. Otis, he doing. If he going against hov, he's playing HOV records. Before HOV could play the whole. Yes, he's playing Takeover. Before Hope could play Takeover, he's playing.
- [14:49]
Host
That's the thing. Like, who's Versus? It's a sport. Who's Pettier? Kanye's that petty. He will just play the records that you would play for yourself and be like, that's mine. I did that. Dude. What?
- [14:59]
Jordan from Complex
Forget about Versus, too, is, like, you saw it with Cash Money, no Limit. It's like. It's all about, like, you just said how you play your cards. Like, Cash Money was the clear favorite. But when. When Cash Money played a Millie and Lil Wayne didn't come out, and then no Limit does down for my niggas and Snoop Dogg comes out, it's like, okay, ding, ding, ding. Like, it's. It's crazy. And niggas kept asking me, like, did I know if Wayne was or wasn't going to come out? I'll keep it a bean the entire time. I thought that was gonna come out.
- [15:30]
Host
Surprised that he didn't. Yeah.
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Jordan from Complex
I think the reason he didn't was because BG and Turk have some going on in between.
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Host
Yeah, there's obviously something. Yeah.
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Jordan from Complex
And Wayne, I had heard, had said that he's not gonna. He would only come out if they were all there. So since Turk didn't come, that's why he didn't come. If Turk.
- [15:51]
Host
That.
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Jordan from Complex
Yeah, like, I respect that. Yeah. So that was his thing. And he literally was supposed to perform in the club in Las Vegas. Knight canceled that performance, too, which makes sense because they would have looked crazy if he would have did fucking Dre's.
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Host
Yeah, he's right down the road. Yeah.
- [16:05]
Jordan from Complex
Pull up to the verses. That would have looked fucking crazy. But it sucks because I think Wayne showing up would have been a really big moment.
- [16:10]
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- [16:47]
Jordan from Complex
But Versus is back. Who do you want to see next? Who's your.
- [16:51]
Host
Who do I want to see in the Versus?
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Jordan from Complex
Who is your dream? Versus?
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Host
I think I like that it's like catered more towards the like the old. The old head.
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Jordan from Complex
Yeah.
- [17:01]
Host
I don't know. I would. I mean not like pin against each other, but I would love to see. I know, like because Dipset did it as a crew, right?
- [17:08]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah.
- [17:08]
Host
But I would like to see some of them do it. Like I want to see Jewels go up against like somebody like Fab or somebody. Yeah, just like Jewels record. Because I. What the game's been missing is one of my. That was like a big part of my.
- [17:19]
Jordan from Complex
I did not know that you were.
- [17:21]
Host
I loved that album so much when I was younger. Clockwork. That was like that beat is fucking crazy. Like I love that whole era was. Who else? I think like it'd be cool to get people like Three Six Mafia.
- [17:35]
Jordan from Complex
Okay.
- [17:36]
Host
Fucking like them Franchise Boys.
- [17:38]
Jordan from Complex
Okay.
- [17:39]
Host
Like I want to see people like that on Averse is like. I feel like stuff like that would be so cool because it's like the way Tiny Desk has brought back and celebrated artists that reintroduced them like kind of gave him like another burst into the younger demo.
- [17:52]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah.
- [17:52]
Host
I think that the snap rap era like of hip hop has been kind of forgotten and tucked and I think Versus would be a really good platform because Versus is a party like in the venue. It's a party. And what's like, who doesn't want to hear like Laffy Taffy or like, you know, like you're in my white. Like who doesn't want to see that go up and like re. Ingest that into like the commentary.
- [18:16]
Jordan from Complex
You're not trying to see Roddy Ricz.
- [18:18]
Host
Don'T give a fuck about the bot. No.
- [18:20]
Jordan from Complex
You're not trying to see him.
- [18:21]
Host
No, no. I don't want to see the hyper camera of his eyes. We. Yeah. No, I don't want the melodic flip of Lil Baby. No, like, none of those guys give me, like. And I sound like the old. Because, like, it. I'm an older guy, but, like, that stuff goes up. It's fun. It's like, it's also a. A nice burst of hip hop history.
- [18:43]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah.
- [18:44]
Host
Like, yo, these guys were huge. Like, Nelly.
- [18:49]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah, no, you're right.
- [18:50]
Host
Let's take it to the Nellies. Let's take it to the Ludacris. Do one.
- [18:53]
Jordan from Complex
Ludacris went against.
- [18:54]
Host
He did do one.
- [18:55]
Jordan from Complex
Who did he go against? I want to say he went against. Oh, my God. It was like he might have went against Nelly.
- [19:01]
Host
Did they. Did they do one together? I don't know.
- [19:03]
Jordan from Complex
Nelly also did one.
- [19:04]
Host
Okay, cool. Well, that. But that's you. That you kind of get what I'm saying? Like, that era of hip hop, like, even. I mean, maybe a little too small, but like a Petey Pablo.
- [19:12]
Jordan from Complex
Oh, yeah, you want some other.
- [19:13]
Host
I just want to see, like, those kind of guys get their moment because it's fun. Like, I. I still think about Juvenile on Tiny Desk. Like, how much that moment meant for hip hop. But more importantly for him. Like, he was. He lit up after that. Like, it was cool to see him celebrated in the. In the real time, in the room and then also, like, online. Like, the love for that performance was like, this is cool. Like, this is what hip hop. This is how you age gracefully. Yeah.
- [19:37]
Jordan from Complex
They called the versus effects. It's like the older rappers after verses, they get that.
- [19:41]
Host
Like, it's another boost.
- [19:42]
Jordan from Complex
Second, they get a little revenue. They get some streams. I. I do think it's important. And I. It's important to support our older rappers because is dying, bro. Like, you know, like, yeah, Rip d'. Angelo. It's like, yeah, Jesus. You know, niggas is passing away at, like, 50s.
- [20:00]
Host
Yeah.
- [20:00]
Jordan from Complex
So it's like, you know, we should really give the flowers and love to these legacy acts.
- [20:07]
Host
And what is hip hop? What is humanity without history? Like, I think we're so quick. We work in such, like, a bottleneck environment where it's like, swipe onto the next thing that makes me laugh, cry, feel anything. People, they don't disappear. They still exist. They're still humans. And they also did a very impressionable thing on their time here on earth. Like, let them have that again and just like, celebrate and learn. I think I'm again, really pushing into my old head narrative. Nothing. Fewer things in hip hop make me happier than younger kids having a reason to go explore Juvenile's catalog because of that tiny desk. I Love the fact that these kids are curious to look at something beyond what they're being told to listen to.
- [20:49]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah.
- [20:50]
Host
Like you're not force fed. You know, today's top 500 viral asshole chart. You actually are like, yo, this guy put out an album in 1999. I'm going to download that and play it today. Yeah, that's cool to me. Like, I don't know, you know, I agree.
- [21:04]
Jordan from Complex
And I, you know, I think that I feel like there is even with the verses, like a resurgence of even younger audiences hopefully discovering newer music. Like, I was having this conversation with Ebro about like, Unk versus veteran and like the terminology we use for older artists or older, like, people in general. And I feel like I really do don't. I don't think unk is a negative. Like, I think if you call somebody a veteran, that's you trying to be a little shady. It's like in NBA terms, it's like if you call him, it means you're way.
- [21:35]
Host
It's. You're past your prime.
- [21:36]
Sponsor Voice
Yeah.
- [21:37]
Jordan from Complex
When you call Jamal Crawford when he was still playing a vet, it's like, oh, like when you call DeAndre Jordan a vet. Yeah. Like he's on a vet.
- [21:45]
Host
And that one video of him you.
- [21:47]
Jordan from Complex
See, like, you think better a minimum. It's like, yeah. It's like you're on your way out, but you're just here to be that. That locker room guy.
- [21:53]
Host
Yeah.
- [21:53]
Jordan from Complex
But uncs, even when you think of what an uncle is, just like a nigga who still outside fake. Still at the barbecue. Even if he. Even if you think you shouldn't, he shouldn't be. He still has that youthful energy.
- [22:04]
Host
Yeah. And he still can, could and or should have a family. But doesn't.
- [22:07]
Jordan from Complex
But does it. But could still hang.
- [22:09]
Host
Yeah.
- [22:09]
Jordan from Complex
Can still give you advice when you need it.
- [22:11]
Host
Yeah. I'm looking in the mirror, but I turned. My birthday's a week from today.
- [22:18]
Sponsor Voice 2
Wow.
- [22:18]
Host
Really? Well, by the time this episode comes out, it'll be two days past my birthday.
- [22:22]
Jordan from Complex
Oh, well, happy belated. As of this video or after this.
- [22:25]
Host
Video, this comes out Tuesday. My birthday's Thursday. That's what I'm saying.
- [22:29]
Jordan from Complex
Oh, yeah. Glad to know that.
- [22:30]
Host
Yeah. 33.
- [22:31]
Jordan from Complex
Dang. And you know, speaking of jewels, watch this connection.
- [22:36]
Host
It's crazy.
- [22:37]
Jordan from Complex
What a perfect birthday gift that Max B. Is getting out of prison.
- [22:41]
Host
Wow.
- [22:41]
Jordan from Complex
Literally 3.
- [22:43]
Host
The guy two days before your birthday.
- [22:46]
Jordan from Complex
He went to prison on Sunday. I think that's right. Yeah. How do you feel about that?
- [22:52]
Host
My birthday? I do. We were just Talking about the UNC shit. Like, I think it's cool to get older, to. To lean more into who you are as a person, to evolve. Personally and through my career, I feel like I have, like, a foundation for the first time in a long time. That's dope. My professional career has been so, like, what the fuck am I doing? And there's no stability, no health care. Like, I was living kind of like a rabid dog, but, like, on camera. So, like, you know, people like, you.
- [23:19]
Jordan from Complex
Got it all together.
- [23:20]
Host
You're killing it, bro. I'm like, I can't afford a suit for my brother's wedding. Like, I don't have health insurance. I haven't had my teeth clean in five years. So it's like, to have that layer and to feel like, you know, I just showed you. Like, I'm happy to renovate my office and be like, look what I bought. A fudgeing bookshelf realist. That's the stuff that matters to me right now is, like, these bouquets that I put up in my apartment, my bookshelf that I can now afford, like, new furniture. And, like, that's cool to be able to, like, be like, yeah, like, I feel like I need to do some changes in my life where before financially, I'm like, I just. I want to, but I can't. Or I'll do, like, the ghetto version of it. Let me find one in the street. But, like, you know, I'm gonna walk around soho real quick. I'll be right back. You see me outside, I'm like, I'm just go grabbing a coffee. I got, like, a chair or some. But, like, yeah, like, it's just. It's nice. It is nice.
- [24:09]
Jordan from Complex
So the exciting part of maturing is finding joy in things like that.
- [24:15]
Host
Yes.
- [24:15]
Jordan from Complex
Like, things like getting a bookshelf. Like, this past weekend, I cleaned my closet out and organized my shit and got a new, like, drawer. And I was super hyped. Like, little shit like that.
- [24:25]
Host
Like, who do you tell that to? But how much does that matter to you? Like, it's a big deal.
- [24:30]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah. Like, doing little things that make your life slightly easier or slightly more convenient.
- [24:36]
Host
Yeah.
- [24:36]
Jordan from Complex
Like, I got shout out to on the rocks. This isn't sponsored, but they sent me an ice machine.
- [24:41]
Host
I saw that. And I saw you post that. I was jealous as, bro. I saw you post. I was like, damn, that's a hard gift.
- [24:49]
Jordan from Complex
Like, I didn't think I would. I want an ice machine. Like, every night before I go to bed. Now when I get My water before, like, from near my nightstand.
- [24:56]
Host
Yes.
- [24:56]
Jordan from Complex
Put some ice in that hole, dude.
- [24:58]
Host
I want that. So I, I, I'm, I'm a, I'm a home sipper. So I have a nice wall I kind of depleted, but, like, I use a lot of ice for mixing cocktails in it, bro. I want an ice machine just to, like, just real quick, give me a minute.
- [25:11]
Jordan from Complex
And it was easy to set up. Way easier than I thought it would be. Like, I'm saying, bro, I got a.
- [25:16]
Host
Spice rack in my kitchen, in my, like, shelf up there. Like, I'm just. It's like little shit that you don't think about or, like, even care to talk about. I'm eyeing a leather bag that I might get for myself as a birthday gift. I'm a big tote bag guy. I got a nice leather one that I'm looking at. But, you know, it's good to get old. What's this?
- [25:32]
Jordan from Complex
The suitcase called? The, the really nice suitcase.
- [25:35]
Host
Oh, like Ramoa.
- [25:39]
Jordan from Complex
Yes. Oh, I've been eyeing a Ramo for a minute.
- [25:42]
Host
So there's certain things that, not that I'm rolling in the dough by any means, but, like, there's certain things that I'm still very much on the side of. Like, do I need to get the most. Like, it's a suitcase. Like, it's going to get banged up. They're going to throw it around. Like, as long as it gets my shift from A to B real. But there is also something cool about having, like, the matching set. Like, I'm. I don't know when I'll be that guy in my life. If things are going extremely well, you'll know there'll be signs. But if I have like, that matching set of, like, the smaller, the bigger. How much do Ramos cost, Bro, it's like those, it's like an invest. There's like, I want to say like 1500 or like, what like the, the big John. Like the, the one that you check. Like, those aren't. But I mean, you're paying for quality. But it's also like, a lot of those companies come with, like, lifetime warranties. So, like, if a wheel. But like, then you got to send that bitch to Italy, yo, you know, it's like is watching like, a car.
- [26:36]
Jordan from Complex
One of my coworkers got gifted a.
- [26:38]
Host
Ramo that's fire good for that. Like, that's big.
- [26:41]
Jordan from Complex
And I don't know what the. Like, I don't know how I like what the, the shtick was. Anyway, your birthday is coming up. Yeah, I'M excited for that. Are you excited about Max B getting out of prison?
- [26:54]
Host
Dude, I called it. Look at that. 1600 for that joint.
- [26:57]
Jordan from Complex
That's OD.
- [26:58]
Host
That's just.
- [26:59]
Jordan from Complex
Maybe I'm not getting a remote right.
- [27:02]
Host
Man, tell complex, hey, you guys send me on the road every goddamn weekend. Give me a remote, put it on the. That's your thing.
- [27:09]
Jordan from Complex
I'm a corporate.
- [27:10]
Host
Yeah, it's a Christmas gift from Corporate. Man. You guys got me in goddamn LA every other week. Give me a Ramoa.
- [27:16]
Jordan from Complex
I thought that she was 500. I will not be getting the.
- [27:20]
Host
The toiletry bag is probably 500.
- [27:22]
Jordan from Complex
Y. Yeah, because it don't matter how much money.
- [27:25]
Host
That's what I'm saying.
- [27:26]
Jordan from Complex
I make. Like I can't.
- [27:28]
Host
There's some things, man.
- [27:30]
Jordan from Complex
Spending over a thousand dollars on a suitcase, that's absolutely.
- [27:34]
Host
I didn't grow up with it. I functioned my whole life without it. It's like. It's not like I need it.
- [27:38]
Jordan from Complex
A stack for a suitcase?
- [27:40]
Host
Yeah. What you got? Now you must have something durable because you're on the road.
- [27:44]
Jordan from Complex
I'm the rule. So I have one super reliable one.
- [27:46]
Host
Like a Samsonite or something.
- [27:48]
Jordan from Complex
It's some bullshit. Not bullshit. It's something my mom got me for Christmas like a minute ago.
- [27:51]
Host
Just shit on your mom.
- [27:53]
Jordan from Complex
It's not bullshit, but it's like. It's like kids. But it's like it's reliable because it hasn't worn out on me. I'm king Carry On. So, like it's a car.
- [28:01]
Host
I'm a Carry on guy too.
- [28:02]
Jordan from Complex
I only check if, like, I know, like I only check when I go to Complex Con. So Complex Con. I checked a bag and then I had to buy a bag out there. But like even then it's like I bought like a 60 big ass bag just to fit my in that I got from out there.
- [28:16]
Host
And. Yeah.
- [28:17]
Jordan from Complex
So it's like I never check bags because I live in perpetual fear of being that. That loses his bag.
- [28:25]
Host
Yup.
- [28:25]
Jordan from Complex
Like not to put his business out there, but that's what it was out there. Actually, I won't even say his name. But there's a person who was on a panel at Complex Con, a famous person who was flying from Amsterdam to Vegas for it and he lost his. His luggage.
- [28:42]
Host
Got lost. That's. See, that's a fear too.
- [28:44]
Jordan from Complex
And it's like if he. If a. Like that could get his.
- [28:46]
Host
Lost.
- [28:47]
Jordan from Complex
What?
- [28:47]
Host
That's the thing. It doesn't matter who you are. Like they throw it all in the same mix.
- [28:51]
Jordan from Complex
It Terrifies me. Yeah, I can't. I can never run that risk because I would be damned.
- [28:55]
Host
The carry on that I use, I got it honestly when we were. When we were touring the Roy Mall. Shit, like I bought it like a few years ago right before we started touring because we were going to be on the road for quite a while. It's just a little silver carry on. I took out like a hundred bucks cash, went over to Lower east side of one of these bag stores and I just heckled them down from like 300 to like a hundred cash. Yeah. And it's a little bullshit carry on. And that thing fucking goes. It is reliable, it's durable and it. And, and when we were traveling we would bring some merch on the road. We ended up like getting like four like big ass things from like another. But those big, big ones are dog shit. Like the wheels broke, the zippers were popping. Like they were terrible suitcases. They barely held the merch together. We ended up like taping one of them. But my thing is kicking and I still use it, nigga.
- [29:45]
Jordan from Complex
Bartered for a fucking New York City bro.
- [29:48]
Host
Carry some cash and go. Go talk people down.
- [29:51]
Jordan from Complex
What the fuck?
- [29:52]
Host
That's New York. That's what you're supposed to do here.
- [29:54]
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- [30:24]
Host
Big Zo Zoran mum Dami. Have you big yo, are you smoking.
- [30:29]
Jordan from Complex
On that Cuomo pack today? Are you sitting me?
- [30:34]
Host
Roll them up, send them back to Westchester.
- [30:36]
Jordan from Complex
Are you city? Anyone? Yo, respectfully, any who voted for Cuomo in big 2025 is a bootleg.
- [30:43]
Host
That's some made respectfully.
- [30:45]
Jordan from Complex
Like, like if you. That's wild dick sucking activity. If you voted for Andrew Cuomo in 2025. No cap, are you me? That's crazy.
- [30:55]
Host
I mean he all the only blocks he shook up were Staten Island.
- [30:58]
Jordan from Complex
Want to live in Gotham so bad. Like, want to feel like they end the surprise.
- [31:03]
Host
You don't want the Pierce nipple sex offender, bro. My dog.
- [31:07]
Jordan from Complex
You hear that?
- [31:07]
Host
You.
- [31:07]
Jordan from Complex
You saw. You saw the Ebro in the morning.
- [31:10]
Host
With E. Yo, the fact that that was the buzzer beater right before the polls like open. I was like, thank you, Ebro. Like he. What a made ass dude. That he just backed out of the call. Bang the call. Because he got between the iron sights. That's the most made ever. You could hear the.
- [31:35]
Jordan from Complex
Wasn't even crazy. That's no get asked on your campaign.
- [31:38]
Host
No, honestly, I didn't even see that clip. Went so crazy I hadn't even seen before. Good on Rosenberg for pressing him about the whole like, the whole like you are pulling this like pushing this Islamophobia and anti like Semitism about Zoran, which isn't true. And he gave a pretty shitty answer on that. But at least he answered it.
- [31:57]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah.
- [31:58]
Host
And the Ebro, he's Hebrews.
- [31:59]
Jordan from Complex
Like man's Trump. He said that if he had to choose between a bad Democrat and a communist, he's choosing you.
- [32:09]
Host
I'm honestly, I don't think that swayed the election by any means, but nor to what I'm like Trump endorsing him. What a stupid fucking idea by Trump.
- [32:20]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah. If he wanted. If he wanted Cuomo to actually win.
- [32:23]
Host
Yeah, like that was such a dumb. I mean it's. It's amazing how you can spend millions of dollars and try to like meticulously archetype like just architect a campaign. And then at the last second at the buzzer, bro, literally a buzzer beater for Mondami, which could have been not so much for his voters, but as he's at the poll with his wife and they're like, yo, yo, Dick Cheney died. And he's just like, oh, word. Like it was like, it was so dismissive. And his wife goes like. Like that. Thank God. Like his voters and get. Fuck Cheney. Fuck you, bitch. Rest in piss. Like. But it's amazing that his like things like that, that you don't plan, you can't control that things that just happen in your life could throw your campaign.
- [33:06]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah.
- [33:06]
Host
You know.
- [33:07]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah. It's wild, bro. And it's. I'm really happy. I'm really happy that he won also as like a very fresh New York City voter, I'd still be trying to vote in Jersey because I still have my Jersey address, but I live in New York.
- [33:22]
Host
Did you double dip? Did you try to hit him up?
- [33:24]
Jordan from Complex
I just voted in New York this year. I'm still big Jersey, but it's now that I pay New York taxes, like I need to vote.
- [33:30]
Host
Yeah.
- [33:31]
Jordan from Complex
New York. And it's cool to see someone who.
- [33:34]
Host
Like really came out the mud 34 years old, bro.
- [33:37]
Jordan from Complex
Like, that's crazy. As a very regular. Was at. Nigga was at. Was it Dambala? He was at Dumbella in Brooklyn.
- [33:45]
Host
Yeah.
- [33:45]
Jordan from Complex
Like, last week.
- [33:46]
Host
Yeah, he did. He had, like, six clubs that night.
- [33:49]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah. I want to say I feel like he went to, like, Record Rumor or some, too.
- [33:52]
Host
Yeah, he was outside.
- [33:53]
Jordan from Complex
He went to where the. Was at.
- [33:55]
Host
Yeah, that's.
- [33:55]
Jordan from Complex
That's. I saw he did a video with the. The Aki Way, the Chop Cheeses.
- [34:01]
Host
He pulled up on Moma. Boz's brother, Shout Out. DJ Moma. He pulled up on Momo. I saw they had a photo together. Like, that's real. As the. That he did at. I mean, the. That he did at Forest Hills was incredible. And. And the joint at Brooklyn Paramount was. I texted my friend because it's like the Live Nation venue. I hit my friend who was at the event alive, and I was like, dude, I'm so happy. Like, how was it? He was like, his family. He met his family. His whole team's like, they're all just such genuinely good people. Yeah. I was like, this just is, like. It's just nice to. It's not even like, the Democrat Republican. It's just nice to, like, feel excited about politics, like, in a positive way where it's not, like, device. Well, it can be divisive, depending on who you're asking, but it's like. It's spirited and, like, hopeful.
- [34:42]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah. That's the biggest thing.
- [34:44]
Host
Yeah.
- [34:44]
Jordan from Complex
I was about to say. It's like, there's a air of hope that definitely wasn't around when Eric Adams was running around. And say less.
- [34:53]
Host
Dude. Just do.
- [34:54]
Jordan from Complex
Was, Yo. Eric Adams made the most for himself of his.
- [34:58]
Host
He really. He. He pinched every penny that was in.
- [35:03]
Jordan from Complex
Every hookah shop with French Montana. Like, if you look up Eric Adams saylis on Getty Images, you find a picture of him in French Montana, literally. Because I found one. Like, it's crazy. Like, when I went to the Apollo. The Drake at the Apollo show, I was there.
- [35:18]
Host
Yeah.
- [35:18]
Jordan from Complex
That Eric Adams was in a section next to me with Aaron Judge, and I want to say Derek Jeter. Like, that was outside. They could say, I'm gonna have every perk, and I live. And I'm the mayor of the biggest city in America. I'm a make the most of it.
- [35:37]
Host
Yeah.
- [35:37]
Jordan from Complex
Give a fuck about the people.
- [35:38]
Host
The thing with Zoran that's, like, interesting to me is I think obviously, ideologically, they're very different on polar opposites in terms of him and Trump. But I think how someone like Zoran is birthed and becomes the seismic figure that he is politically is because of how similar, like, Trump created that environment.
- [35:59]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah.
- [35:59]
Host
Where he's so far in the other extreme, the other direction that it gave rise to that being a possibility in the Democratic Party.
- [36:06]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah.
- [36:07]
Host
Or like what we would be deemed by voting for him, like a far left extremist. Like, that's where the MAGA of that side.
- [36:14]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah.
- [36:15]
Host
So, like, I don't think Zoran would have existed. I think Cuomo would have probably caked, walked it had, you know, Trump not have been appointed or just involved in politics at all. We probably would have just gone with the established man and just welcome him back into New York with our open arms. Like, look at him. He's on a path to forgiveness. He apologized. Not really to the women that he assaulted. And welcome back. Like, continue doing your thing for the only people you care about, the billionaires that your friends. And like, shoveling money to Israel, even though we live in New York City. So I think it's really cool that, like, Zoran is clearly what the people want and what the people feel more so the youth. And I just pray that that effect ripples across every upcoming election. But I do think on, like, a very real note, I don't think he's going to get shit done.
- [37:05]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah.
- [37:05]
Host
No.
- [37:05]
Jordan from Complex
I was talking to one of my co workers and like, I think a very valid comparison is, like, similar feelings to, like, 2012 Obama, where it was like, it felt really great and it felt like. And it was a very historic and major moment. And then like, you're expecting, like this crazy seismic shift and things changed a little bit. But, like, don't really move like how you would imagine it to have moved.
- [37:35]
Host
Trump is going to make his time here very difficult. I think he said he's going to stop federal funding, which is illegal, but I'm sure he'll find a way to do it. And I think if Mom Dhumi can get two things done, the buses and those like, five grocery stores that he wants to, I think that in itself is the best of what could be from what we should expect and hope that he can do. But the, the biggest thing is, like, the fact that he was so championed and by a party that has really tried to box him out like his own party fucking hates him. These people, like, Hakeem Jeffries is a punk. Richie Torres is a, like, hokul. Got bullied into, like, going up there and like, supporting him. They're all phony, they're all frauds, all of them. But like the symbol of him winning is really the big win for what the people want to see representing them in the party. But not much is going to happen.
- [38:31]
Jordan from Complex
Look, facts. If that could get the free buses W. Yeah. Even though I don't even take the bus.
- [38:36]
Host
I don't. I haven't taken a bus in years. But you know what? A lot of people do and they need it make it happen. Yeah.
- [38:41]
Jordan from Complex
If that could get the buses free, I would say that's a double.
- [38:45]
Host
Literally everything he's proposing wouldn't help me at all. But it would help somebody that really needs it. So why the not.
- [38:52]
Jordan from Complex
That's what the city is about, bro.
- [38:54]
Host
Yeah.
- [38:54]
Jordan from Complex
I hope the next like that's all that was what his whole campaign was. It's like if I'm taxing the rich that you won't even in the way that you won't even feel that much to help the next. Like, y' all should be cool with it.
- [39:06]
Host
He had a bar on the flagrant podcast. I think we're talking about Ackman who's like been donate funding millions of dollars for Cuomo to beat him at that point. This is like a week or so before the election. And he was like, the man has spent more on ads against me and promotion against me than I would taxing him like with my plan. It's like that's how threatened these people are by just his beliefs and his ideologies is like a. As a political figure. It's like it's. It's. They're terrified because the system was built for them to succeed and for them to only succeed. So to in is something as minuscule as a free bus threatens the very top of like the guy that has a yacht.
- [39:55]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah.
- [39:55]
Host
It's like that they're. They're in the business of chopping down people at their knees every chance they get. Don't give anybody.
- [40:03]
Jordan from Complex
Listen. Whoop dee doo. We got a Muslim mayor. Suck my dick.
- [40:09]
Host
That's right. The New York City has gone to. I. Oh, I ordered a bacon, egg and cheese and they said they did turkey bacon. Yeah, they gave me no bacon. So it's only. It's only. It's only. Yeah. It's only cheese and egg for the next few years.
- [40:21]
Jordan from Complex
Speaking of New York. Basketball's back. Basketball's back. The Knicks aren't doing that bad.
- [40:26]
Host
We looked that three game losing streak was really sus.
- [40:29]
Jordan from Complex
Look my Bulls.
- [40:31]
Host
Hey. As of the recording of this, we beat you.
- [40:34]
Jordan from Complex
We're number one in the east though. You're the only that Beat us, actually.
- [40:37]
Host
Yeah, we are.
- [40:39]
Jordan from Complex
Me.
- [40:39]
Host
You know it's true. Bulls are my second team because I lived in Chicago. Obviously. It's like their legacy is incredible. But like, I used to go to their games a lot. I was there when D. Rose played there. I would go to their games.
- [40:48]
Jordan from Complex
Vucci, Maine.
- [40:49]
Host
Yeah, and me, they're good. They got a young, good, young team.
- [40:53]
Jordan from Complex
I'm watching some I never thought I'd see. I will. As a realistic Bulls fan, I was ready for us to be like. Like, yeah, we were 39 and 42 last season. Just wait till we're 40 and 41 this season. I was ready for slight change. Middle of the pack. I know we not even 10 games deep. I don't give a talking while you got it. We're back. Yo, you heard it here first. We're fucking back.
- [41:20]
Host
I low key thought that. Not that it would be a cakewalk, but it would be like not the hardest path for the Knicks to get to the finals, but between. The Bulls are playing great. Fucking VJ on the Sixers right now, bro.
- [41:31]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah, Edgecombe is some shit.
- [41:32]
Host
It's. The east isn't as easy as I thought it was going to be. Like, the teams look good. We got. Our rotations are terrible.
- [41:41]
Jordan from Complex
Mike's all that healthy, though.
- [41:42]
Host
True. And bench scoring is nice, but like, Mike Brown needs to figure out he's not doing a good job with the rotations right now.
- [41:48]
Jordan from Complex
Niggas tips need to get to get played full games again. Y' all was complaining. It's like about Tibs. Rest. Rest the players now.
- [41:59]
Host
I don't know, bro. Last game we put up 40 points. 40 plus points last night in the third and fourth quarter. So the guys look good. But like in it's. That was a quality win. But.
- [42:09]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah, but the Wolves threw in the towel like at the end of that game. I watched that.
- [42:14]
Host
I was like Wolves, bro.
- [42:16]
Jordan from Complex
Said. Said. Yeah, I guess it's. I was sick. You know what? Because obviously I'm a Bulls fan, but I'm also heavy in Wemby stock.
- [42:23]
Host
Same I watched every spurs game.
- [42:25]
Jordan from Complex
I am heavy.
- [42:26]
Sponsor Voice
Yeah.
- [42:26]
Jordan from Complex
Heavy in Wemby stock. I'm sick that they lost last night.
- [42:29]
Host
Last night ending was.
- [42:30]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah. Cause how you miss both.
- [42:32]
Host
Well, if you missed the first, you have to miss the second. I get. But like you cooked it, bro. You up.
- [42:37]
Jordan from Complex
You got. You got a lucky foul. Yeah, a lucky foul. You missed both free throws. I think the spurs are good. Are good, though. Like, Stefan Castle is nice.
- [42:46]
Host
He's nice. Very nice.
- [42:48]
Jordan from Complex
Obviously Wemby Is alien.
- [42:50]
Host
Mvp. Yes, I agree.
- [42:52]
Jordan from Complex
I'm mvp. Defensive player of the Year.
- [42:55]
Host
Sweep it.
- [42:56]
Jordan from Complex
And Nick N. I don't think they're gonna do that. I don't think they're gonna do that because I think Josh Giddy is getting most improved player, most.
- [43:02]
Host
Most improved. Well, I feel like if you win mvp, you can't win Most Improved. It has to be one or the other facts.
- [43:08]
Jordan from Complex
I mean, they don't give a. If they gave him defensive player of the Year and mvp, they might just say it, but I don't. I don't know, because with the. With the way that shit's rigged and. And they dealing with betting scandals, I don't know if they trying to play with the odds and.
- [43:21]
Host
Oh, yeah. What do you. How do you feel about. Do you gamble?
- [43:23]
Jordan from Complex
I used to.
- [43:25]
Host
And, like, basketball or anything or. What was your.
- [43:28]
Jordan from Complex
I used to be a big basketball parlay, like, college moneyline parlay guy. And I've actually been off it for like, over a year now, which I'm proud of. I. I didn't have a problem, but it's just like. Yeah, it was like, it was too stressful watching games. I been thought that, like, you guys are making betting commercials.
- [43:52]
Host
It's ridiculous. Like, I'm vehemently against it. I hate gambling.
- [43:56]
Jordan from Complex
You got Kenny and Charles mid game doing bet commercials.
- [44:03]
Host
Yeah.
- [44:03]
Jordan from Complex
And you didn't think niggas was gonna get a cut in on it.
- [44:06]
Host
The people that are responsible for the lines, like, the players that can influence the outcome.
- [44:12]
Jordan from Complex
The stupidest, most capitalistic, greedy shit I've ever seen. And I. It's funny to me that niggas are surprised that it went left. And this is just like, tip of the iceberg.
- [44:23]
Host
Oh, yeah.
- [44:24]
Jordan from Complex
Just going to get heavy by, like, All Star Break.
- [44:26]
Host
Like, what I. Yeah, my. My stance is like. I genuinely think the way in which we look at how cigarettes were so commercialized and pushed and like, you know, we watch that. That Netflix talk about the Sackler family that created, you know, the opioid addiction crisis, and they would, like, send free packs of pills and like, a stuffed opioid doll to hospitals for people. It's like, that's how I. That's how disgusted, like, how we look at that in hindsight. That's how I feel right now with this, like, over. Over in your face. We are with, like, gamble now. Download now for $53. It's like, this is a proven addiction. It is not only emotionally draining, but financially draining. You're not winning. No one wins. Like, it's Not a winning habit.
- [45:11]
Jordan from Complex
Vegas wins.
- [45:12]
Host
They will always win. And it's just they're, they're chipping at. If you look at, I saw some stat a while ago about like how like over 80 some odd percent of these bets are parlays because people are like, what's the deal? It's five, three, ten dollars at a time. That's all they eat off or parlays that they know nobody's gonna hit.
- [45:27]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah.
- [45:28]
Host
And it's like you throw in like a hundred dollars a week, like doing that. It's like it adds up. Like, yeah, you maybe hit one in your year of doing it and then you're like, it's just, it's awful. I'm so against it. I think it's terrible.
- [45:42]
Jordan from Complex
Doc that Julian is talking about on Netflix is called Painkillers. You should check it out.
- [45:46]
Host
It is incredible.
- [45:47]
Jordan from Complex
Very, very, very good doc that sheds light on how like painkillers and prescription drugs were pushed to doctors to give to so that the pharmaceutical industry could blow up at the expense of who would get addicted to those opioids. Solid doc.
- [46:05]
Host
The opening scene in that. And I know it's like an older doc I'm sure talked about, like the opening scene. That is their. They're looking at the health chart and the doctor's looking at the. On the scale of frown to smile, where do you live? And he's like, people get morphine when they're at the end of their life. Like when it's like the pain is too high to tolerate. You're going to die. Here's like a drip to just hold on, cling to life. He said, we need to find. It's either a 1 or a 10. We need to find somebody that's a 5 and keep supplying the mid tier so they'll keep coming back. We don't want what's a returning customer. If they're going to die in a week, they're not gonna. That's it. They're done. Onto the next one. We gotta wait for the next nearly dead person. We need to find that person that's still in the middle of their life that we can just keep feeding. And that's exactly what gambling is.
- [46:50]
Sponsor Voice
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- [47:23]
Host
It's fucking awful, bro.
- [47:25]
Jordan from Complex
You know it's bad. It's like a lot of my niggas gamble. Obviously, most people's friends gamble and shit.
- [47:31]
Host
I know a lot of people that do too.
- [47:32]
Jordan from Complex
It's bad, bro. And it's like, yes, I've seen hit crazy parlays, but it's like that's how they hook you, you know, you. Everybody knows one that hit. I know a. That won $80,000 off of a parlay.
- [47:43]
Host
He should gamble n. He's like a.
- [47:46]
Jordan from Complex
Regular and he just hit. He hit a crazy like 8 or like 10 game money line parlor. He. He bet every single result, right? But it's like, you see like that and you like, damn, like, maybe I should get back in it.
- [48:03]
Host
That. That's crazy.
- [48:04]
Jordan from Complex
It is, it is. Like, just see you think about it, you're like, Damn.
- [48:07]
Host
Like, nah, 80 grand. I'm not. I'm so.
- [48:10]
Jordan from Complex
Like, the odds of that happening are so slim. And it's like at the end of the day, it is all statistics. Like, yes, if you're really good at math, a could probably like finagle it.
- [48:18]
Host
Sure.
- [48:19]
Jordan from Complex
But most aren't good at math like that.
- [48:22]
Host
No, I'm the guy. Like, I don't even casino gambling. Like, where I. Where I grew up, my parents now live. They built a whole casino. It's like five minutes from my parents home. So we'll go upstate. Like, it'll be fun night. Like, have some beers at the bars downtown. Like, go to the casino, play some blackjack, right? I always have a limit. Like say I'll go in there, I'm like 300. If I lose it, it's gone. I'm not gonna try to win it back. But like, there's also a lever on that on the opposite end where it's like, if I'm up, you know, however much money, then I'm like gonna tap out, out. But then there's. I do this thing where it's like, if I'm up, say 200, I have 500 now. And then I lose that two to get back to what I came in with. I'm done. Like, I'm gonna leave with what I came with. That was a fun ride. Went up, came back down. I'm out.
- [49:05]
Jordan from Complex
Not going negative. You're not.
- [49:07]
Host
I'M never gonna. You'll never see me go negative. Yeah, that. No, no. Well, if I do go, if I lose the money, then that's me going negative. But I'm not gonna chase the thing to get out of the hole. Yeah, all that, man.
- [49:18]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah, bro, that gambling is cooked. And it's like. Yeah, it's like this is the tip of the iceberg for the NBA. This. They just go. They got Terry, Roger, and some Chauncey Belt.
- [49:29]
Host
Those poker games are crazy, bro.
- [49:31]
Jordan from Complex
Wait, what did they. Someone trailblazers. They made, like, a funny ass. Oh, my God, the jailblazers. The Jail Blazers. Yeah, bro. Chauncey and them. You think Chauncey was betting alone? Nigga, did you just. Look, all y' all just pray they don't get Brian, because you know Brian.
- [49:54]
Host
You know, just pray.
- [49:56]
Jordan from Complex
Look, MJ was a big gambler. Just pray they don't get Brown.
- [50:00]
Host
These guys. The thing with these guys, too, like, I'm not even gonna say, like, it's coming from Bron, but, like, you're such a. A mogul in a business and you cast such a wide net in terms of how you accrue wealth. You don't know where every dollar that is attached to you is coming from. That's a bar, and that can really jam up a lot of people.
- [50:23]
Jordan from Complex
Might be coming from the Mafia, apparently.
- [50:25]
Host
I would not. It's not a.
- [50:27]
Jordan from Complex
That's the thing.
- [50:28]
Host
It's not like it's like a long leap. It's right there. Like, it's in your league.
- [50:31]
Jordan from Complex
You might be throwing some bread to some niggas who put it in a pool for a Mafia.
- [50:35]
Host
Yes. Like, at some point in your 20 year career, someone has put a few grand in a brown paper bag and handed it to somebody.
- [50:44]
Jordan from Complex
Listen, no one's ever kept it a beam. But Mike's. I can't even speak on Mike because I know Jordan Brand got. Got reached, but y' all really think Mike left the league?
- [50:56]
Host
Oh, that was clearly gambling debt.
- [50:58]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah, yeah, because he just lost his love for the game.
- [51:02]
Host
There was a retweet. It was some funny shit. It was like, this is crazy. Like. Like, why don't. Why isn't it like the old days, like. Or like, how did people used to settle their gambling debts back in the day? And someone just, like, quote tweeted with a photo of Michael Jordan swinging a bat for the.
- [51:18]
Jordan from Complex
Like, you really think. And I say I can't speak too much on Mike because I literally yesterday watched a clip of Nori. Talk about some fucking. When he had said, like years ago that Michael Jordan hated hip hop and like, it followed him for, like, years. And he was like, I think he was on. He was on the Pivot podcast and they asked him about it. He was like, yeah, like I. He was like, I stand on that, but I definitely apologize. He was like. He was like, I can't. I'm never speaking on Mike again. So I'm not speaking negatively on you, Mike, if you happen to see this.
- [51:52]
Host
I truly think it's such a blessing that he played in the era he did. He would be so hated if he played in today's NBA. Like, if he was on the social media era, he would literally be the most hated person in sports.
- [52:06]
Jordan from Complex
A political Michael Jordan, who was the best player in the league but had.
- [52:10]
Host
A gambling problem, just a crippling gambling addiction. And asked. Just a pure asshole.
- [52:18]
Jordan from Complex
You know, they had the amount of cameras. I mean, I feel like he said.
- [52:20]
Host
Something like he would bully the staff at the venues. Like, he was just relentless.
- [52:25]
Jordan from Complex
It's. And it's funny now they have him doing like these halftime. Like the halftime.
- [52:30]
Host
Yeah.
- [52:30]
Jordan from Complex
In what? This one interview that they clearly shot all at once and are just putting.
- [52:35]
Host
Like one minute clips splicing it.
- [52:37]
Sponsor Voice
Yeah.
- [52:38]
Jordan from Complex
Like probably like a 40 minute interview that they're just taking one minute of and they're gonna stretch for like most of the season.
- [52:44]
Host
Yeah.
- [52:44]
Jordan from Complex
It's so funny.
- [52:45]
Host
Salute.
- [52:46]
Jordan from Complex
Because I see Salute to the legend, Mike Cherico. Because I never in my entire life thought I'd see this thing of Michael Jordan talking on a camera in any capacity just because he's so removed and he's a billionaire.
- [52:59]
Host
Yeah.
- [53:00]
Jordan from Complex
But like, clearly this nigga's ego just can't stop that.
- [53:04]
Host
That golf course that he owns down in Florida, my good friend of mine, I'm not going to name him. Doesn't matter. He works in an industry where you have access to the Michael Jordan, Tom Brady's, those kind of people. And they had a business trip down there. And the trip was literally them playing. It was a foursome. It was my friend's boss, Tom Brady, Michael Jordan. And I think Tiger woods was the fourth. Yeah. It was ridiculous. So. And he said this is like the course that they're on, Michael's course, you can order food and drones will drop it off, like at your hole. He said it was the craziest experience. You had a blast, obviously, being on the course with them for a few hours. So one of the guys that was like in the entourage, like one of my buddy's friends he's like, in the co workers space was like, just casually made a bet to Michael. I'll bet you five grand, like, Michael's like, he's like, I bet you 500. Mike's like, five grand or like, I'm not doing anything below. Below that. He was like, like, okay. So he did it. And I think the guy like won the hole. And he was ecstatic. Like, he beat Michael in a hole on his own course. The course is designed to play to Michael's strengths. So then Michael said, and mind you, none of them live in Florida. He's like, what are you, Michael, what are you doing tomorrow morning? The guy was like, I have to go home. I have a wife. I gotta go. We have a newborn. I have to go home to my kid. And he's like, no, you're not going home tomorrow. He goes, call your wife right now. And he's like, sorry, what? He goes, call her. Tell her you're not coming home tomorrow. And he was like, why? He goes, we're playing. He goes, we're two of us, we're doing 18 holes. And he was doing like five grand hole. He was like, that's the, our plan tomorrow is to golf this entire course. And I'm betting you on every single hole.
- [54:39]
Jordan from Complex
What the.
- [54:40]
Host
And he called his wife and canceled his plan and stayed there another day to play Michael. He's like, sorry, honey, I can't. Like, I gotta bet with Michael that I can't like. But like, that, he's still like that, bro.
- [54:51]
Jordan from Complex
Nigga, Michael Jordan is the greatest winner in I, I, I just feel like always talk about, oh, mentality. No, that is different. Like what, what solidifies it for me? That story just furthers it. But what solidified it for me originally was when I was watching the last dance. And he didn't cry or get emotional at any point when he was talking about his dad or anything. The only time that started tearing up was when he was like, listen, I want to win.
- [55:21]
Host
Win. Yeah.
- [55:21]
Jordan from Complex
That's my mentality, okay? Some people said, oh, well, maybe you're retiring. Oh, that's you. Because you never won anything. Like, and him breaking down, like, how.
- [55:30]
Host
It matters so much.
- [55:32]
Jordan from Complex
Like, he was like, if you want to play away, don't play that way. And he starts crying. Like that cares so much about winning. I can't look, I can't, I can't.
- [55:41]
Host
That's such a dangerous, like, it's amazing when you can harness that into a sport. But, but off the court, yeah, like, Tiger Wood's the Same way, like off the course. Like, that's a really dangerous way to have your brain wired.
- [55:57]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah.
- [55:58]
Host
You're like, everything I do is just, I'm going to be the top dog. And us, you know, who can drink this faster, like, who can, you know, hit a ball, fart, like it's everything I have. That, like, killer. It's not like, oh, that was fun. It's like, no, I'm going to win. It's like, yeah, you can't turn that off, bro.
- [56:19]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah, it definitely has.
- [56:20]
Host
It's got to be exhausting.
- [56:21]
Jordan from Complex
Negative ripple effects in like, you know.
- [56:24]
Host
Yeah.
- [56:24]
Jordan from Complex
You have to win in arguments. You have to win in like.
- [56:26]
Host
Yes.
- [56:27]
Jordan from Complex
In every component of your life.
- [56:29]
Host
Yeah.
- [56:30]
Jordan from Complex
Give and take to being a winner, I guess.
- [56:32]
Host
Yeah. Dude, I, I could not. I. That is to, to go to bed at night thinking like, you know what I mean? It's like, what do you, how do you turn that off? Off?
- [56:42]
Jordan from Complex
You can't listen. You know, that's why they say, like to become a billionaire, you were probably a bad person.
- [56:49]
Host
You are a bad person. Yeah. Like, you can't.
- [56:51]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah.
- [56:51]
Host
Like, is there an ethical billionaire? No, you really can't.
- [56:55]
Jordan from Complex
Maybe, maybe the closest is like Bill Gates because like he really does give out. Like he, he said like he was giving away all of his money. He dies. So I think that's pretty real.
- [57:06]
Host
I think there's like. Well, it's like where do you draw the lines of ethics? Because there are people that are like these AI that like that Asian kid, Alexander Wang, who's like 27 and he's like a self made billionaire. What he's creating, we'll see how that shakes out. But like, he's not. The ethics of it is like what he's doing consumes so much energy, it's not good for the earth. That's where I could see. But it's not like he's, you know.
- [57:34]
Jordan from Complex
Exploiting people directly to make profit.
- [57:36]
Host
Yes. Yeah, yeah. It's more like these hard. These servers are like the reason why, you know, there's droughts in certain parts of the country. Like, you know, it's just stuff of that. Like you could always scale it up to be like, we're all bad people.
- [57:50]
Jordan from Complex
But ends justify the means type thing, which is. Yeah, that's where it gets into like the. I had, I did like a club in high school. It was called Ethics bowl where it was like, nerd. No, not od.
- [58:00]
Host
Od.
- [58:02]
Jordan from Complex
No, but listen, let me explain, let me explain. It was like. And it was a variation. It Was a variation of a debate club.
- [58:09]
Host
I didn't mock trial, so.
- [58:10]
Jordan from Complex
Okay, exactly. It was a variation of a debate club where two teams would be presented a single ethical issue. And the goal was to break down the issue. And whichever team could break it down the best won the round. And it wasn't like, that's cool. Prove who what was right or wrong. It was just like break down every component of it. And so, like, it would help, like just the highlight the ethical ambiguity of a lot of situations and shit.
- [58:41]
Host
So do you have an example, like what you come to mind?
- [58:43]
Jordan from Complex
Yes, there's one that always comes to mind.
- [58:45]
Host
I was teed this up a few times.
- [58:47]
Jordan from Complex
There's only one that I ever remember. And it was like. So do you remember, like the grumpy cat meme? Like the cat that looked grumpy?
- [58:54]
Host
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [58:55]
Jordan from Complex
So that was a real cat. Yeah, but that was a cat that had dwarfism, and that's why the cat looked like that. But here's the. Here's the ethics of it. Right? So that became a viral meme.
- [59:08]
Host
This is some left wing.
- [59:09]
Jordan from Complex
Wait, no, no, it became a viral meme.
- [59:11]
Host
However, the cat didn't ask for it.
- [59:13]
Jordan from Complex
Wait, wait, no. However, to get a grumpy cat to breed a cat with dwarfism would be to breed a cat that would have a shorter lifespan because cats with dwarfism would die significantly sooner than regular cats. However, there were sick kids in hospitals who fell in love with the grumpy cat meme. And some of their last wishes was to have a grumpy cat. So the cat.
- [59:37]
Host
The question was take it down the same timeline.
- [59:40]
Jordan from Complex
Kind of. That's crazy. But the question was, is it ethically, what are the ethics of breeding grumpy cats in an effort to fulfill a child's dying wish? That was like one of the things that both teams have to then break down.
- [60:00]
Host
But it's like the kid dies and then what this cat, where does the cat go?
- [60:04]
Jordan from Complex
Well, then the cat. Now you're just kind of setting up a cat that didn't have to be born for a shorter life.
- [60:09]
Host
But you could say that about dog breeding. Every designer dog is like, I mean, half of these look at the built of like a dachshund or like all these like doodle hybrids. Hybrids like their. Their lifespans like eight years maybe, but it's just like, it's a cool dog.
- [60:28]
Jordan from Complex
Well, yeah, you could argue the moral permissibility of breeding any animal just because it's cute. Cute, like that's kind of the Whole you could take grumpy cow and put any, any animal breed you're breeding just because it's cute.
- [60:42]
Host
Yeah.
- [60:42]
Jordan from Complex
Type. It's like.
- [60:44]
Host
So I guess like what, what are we valuing more the life of that grumpy cat or is there a hierarchy? Are we saying these are people and if this is what people want, we should do things that service especially children. Anybody could use that.
- [60:58]
Jordan from Complex
Oh, this is so nerdy.
- [60:59]
Host
Anybody. I'm a, I'm a nerd. Like no, like, like look, you see.
- [61:05]
Jordan from Complex
How you like this topic.
- [61:06]
Host
I'm a big ass nerd. But like I, I'm curious. We could talk through too. But I'm curious. Like what. Where did you fall on this? Did you think that they should create those cats or.
- [61:15]
Jordan from Complex
Dude, I wish I could remember. I just remember the topic. But like as an adult right now.
- [61:18]
Host
How do you feel about it?
- [61:20]
Jordan from Complex
I don't think that it's. Again, it's not right versus wrong but I don't think it's morally permissible to breed an animal for the sake of comfort when the animal will live longer than you. Like I just don't think that your however many years left is worth. Is more valuable than the cats ate. I don't think that a cat's life is valued. Is worth more than a humans. I'll just keep it a bean. But if that cat didn't have to ever be born.
- [61:54]
Host
Yeah, true.
- [61:55]
Jordan from Complex
Then I think that give it. If, if there was a choice then you should not breed the cat.
- [62:00]
Host
I agree with that. My other thing is like if they're children too for talking like sick kids, give them a puppy.
- [62:07]
Jordan from Complex
But the thing is they, they want a grumpy.
- [62:09]
Host
Yeah. Well, you also probably want to live a little longer. Like it's not A lot of things are going to shake out in your life. You don't have much choice. Like do get a. Give the kid a puppy or just what would you rather have one grummy cat or like three cute kittens?
- [62:25]
Jordan from Complex
But that's not the question.
- [62:27]
Host
Well, I'm saying like there are alternatives that don't involve you breeding this like cat that's only gonna live for like, you know, six years.
- [62:35]
Jordan from Complex
Yeah, yeah. I mean, look, that, that is a part of breaking down the topic because.
- [62:41]
Host
Also give the kid a PS5.
- [62:43]
Jordan from Complex
Like also I should add each team had to argue one side. So like, like one scene would have to argue the.
- [62:50]
Host
This is literally mock trial. This is what I did. Yeah.
- [62:52]
Jordan from Complex
But yeah, it was just like ethical and it was there. Yeah. So that was ethics Bull.
- [62:57]
Host
Damn. Well, you gotta. You gotta probably run soon, right? I know we kind of get here and just get going.
- [63:02]
Jordan from Complex
I kind of just. You see, I'm late, but let me respond to these.
- [63:07]
Host
Well, we could rap. Jordan, I'm very honored every single time you. You bless me with your. Your presence. This is fun. Always is. Always a pleasure. And yeah, get that Ramo from Complex, my boy.
- [63:20]
Jordan from Complex
My.
- [63:21]
Host
I'm. I'm thinking that that's my. What do you call that? Damn. Why am I blanking on words right now? I don't know. I'm putting that out there. Putting that energy out there for you.
- [63:31]
Jordan from Complex
Manifesting.
- [63:32]
Host
Yes, that.
- [63:32]
Jordan from Complex
I'm manifesting.
- [63:33]
Host
You get. God damn, that took. That's embarrassing. Manifesting that you get every bag you deserve. That's a double entendre, buddy.
- [63:42]
Jordan from Complex
It's always fun. It's always a vibe coming over here. You know that. It took us a few times because I have been busy. Both sides.
- [63:49]
Host
Yeah. Yeah.
- [63:50]
Jordan from Complex
We're gonna try to make this more frequent, man.
- [63:53]
Host
For sure.
- [63:53]
Jordan from Complex
Something wrong with the podcast.
- [63:55]
Host
Something wrong with the podcast episode. I think 43. Something like that. Love you all. Good night or good morning, I guess, if you're listening this Tuesday morning. Peace.
- [64:11]
Sponsor Voice 2
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