SWWP #5 - Dating, Kanye/Drake, & Clay/AD Reunion (Feat. Clay Gravesande)

Summary

Episode Summary: SWWP #5 - Dating, Kanye/Drake, & Clay/AD Reunion (Feat. Clay Gravesande)
Host: Julian Delgado
Guest: Clay Gravesande
Release Date: February 18, 2025

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Introduction and Guest Welcome

In the fifth episode of Something Wrong With The Podcast, host Julian Delgado welcomes back his close friend Clay Gravesande, marking Clay's first appearance on camera. The episode sets a casual and candid tone as Julian introduces Clay, mentioning his appearance on Love Is Blind Season 6.

Julian [00:00]: "Welcome back to episode five of Something Wrong with the Podcast. It's Julian, and we'll get to my guest in a second. [...] I'd like to welcome back one of my closest friends in this shit, Clay from Love is Blind season six."

Clay [00:34]: "Yes."

Navigating New York and Business Challenges

Julian and Clay engage in light-hearted banter about navigating Julian's New York studio, joking about the absence of an elevator and the physical demands it places on Clay.

Clay [00:56]: "How you close deals when it comes to women because you have to go up literally seven stairs... How the hell is she walking up these damn stairs?"

They discuss Clay's temporary relocation to Philadelphia for his sister's birthday and the recent success of the Philadelphia Eagles.

Clay [01:40]: "My Eagles just won the super bowl, so [...] I'm heading to Philadelphia [...] I'm always in New York, man, so you can always see me when I'm out here."

Dating Dynamics and the Escort Industry

The conversation shifts to the complexities of modern dating, with a particular focus on the escort industry. Clay shares insights into the financial and emotional aspects of hiring escorts, emphasizing the high costs associated with popular and attractive women.

Clay [05:29]: "The going rate for women that have, I would say, some type of clout is two bands an hour."

Julian reflects on his experiences in Amsterdam's red-light district, drawing parallels between buying prime products and seeking high-quality relationships through financial investments.

Julian [08:37]: "I'm going to buy the prime product... I'm going to hook up with the person that's way out of my league because I can pay for it."

Personal Relationships and Marriage Insights

Julian and Clay delve into the nuances of relationships and marriage, discussing the societal pressures men face to be married and the internal struggles associated with long-term commitments.

Clay [20:02]: "He was trying to make his wife happy, [...] marriage does not sound like fun for the man."

Julian [20:00]: "Women make it sound good... Men are more conditioned to act on emotions rather than process them."

They explore how financial stability and personal growth impact the desire and ability to maintain fulfilling relationships.

Julian [27:27]: "The American system... No one's paid enough to live, no one's paid enough to raise a family."

Impact of Fame and Reality TV on Personal Lives

The episode addresses the repercussions of reality TV fame, particularly through Clay's experiences on Love Is Blind. They discuss how public perception and personal relationships are affected post-show, including interactions with former partners and the challenges of maintaining authentic connections.

Clay [57:00]: "I saw AD recently... It was a complete waste of time anyway."

Julian highlights the difficulties of separating on-camera personas from real-life relationships, emphasizing the authenticity struggle faced by reality TV participants.

Julian [60:07]: "What the fuck, man? She gives everyone hugs. I kind of panic."

Discussion on Drake and Kanye

A significant portion of the episode is dedicated to the Drake and Kanye feud. Julian and Clay analyze Drake's collaborative approach with PartyNextDoor and Kanye West's controversial actions, reflecting on their impact on the music industry and public perception.

Julian [37:33]: "I'm very much excited for the album. I love, obviously love Drake, love pnd."

Clay [38:04]: "Kanye is probably being successful in the selling perspective, but not public perception."

They commend Drake's strategic collaboration to alleviate the pressure of solo releases, while critiquing Kanye's inconsiderate methods of expressing dissent.

Julian [42:11]: "Cut through all the Nazi propaganda and all that stuff... you ruined it."

Listener Voicemails: Navigating Ghosting and Personal Struggles

The latter half of the episode features listener voicemails addressing issues like ghosting in relationships and personal health struggles. Julian and Clay offer empathetic advice, emphasizing self-love, setting small goals, and fostering genuine relationships.

Voicemail 1: A 25-year-old struggling with ghosting and relationship discouragement

Julian [73:05]: "Everyone has been ghosted. I've been ghosted. [...] People need to take account for some people, being intimate is not as important or not as meaningful as it is for other people."

Clay [74:22]: "Fall in love with yourself... maybe there's a situation where the men that you're attracting is based off the energy that you're perceiving."

Voicemail 2: Someone recovering from seizures and seeking advice on starting a rough year

Julian [81:09]: "If you're someone that you want to talk to during this journey, keep calling in... Set small, little goals to make yourself better."

Clay [85:02]: "Have small goals... read books. Put yourself in an imaginary mindset where you are manifesting exactly who you want to be."

Conclusion and Final Thoughts

As the episode wraps up, Julian and Clay reflect on their personal growth and the importance of maintaining authentic relationships despite public scrutiny and personal challenges. They encourage listeners to prioritize genuine connections and personal well-being over superficial interactions.

Julian [94:04]: "This is awesome that like this moment's happening and for us to connect with the old show and to keep a real relationship, an authentic relationship."

Clay [93:11]: "I'll just say have small goals... redefine who you are... you own your destiny."

Key Takeaways

• Modern Dating Complexities: The high costs and emotional implications of hiring escorts reflect broader challenges in contemporary dating.
• Authenticity in Relationships: Maintaining genuine connections is difficult amidst fame and public perception, especially for reality TV participants.
• Navigating Ghosting: Emphasizes the importance of self-love, setting achievable goals, and fostering meaningful relationships to overcome the negative impacts of ghosting.
• Celebrity Feuds: Analysis of Drake and Kanye's public disagreements highlights the influence of strategic collaborations and personal controversies on their careers.
• Personal Growth: Encourages continuous self-improvement and adapting to changing personal and professional landscapes.

Notable Quotes

• About Dating and Escorts:

  Clay [05:29]: "The going rate for women that have, I would say, some type of clout is two bands an hour."

• On Relationships and Marriage:

  Julian [20:00]: "Women make it sound good... Men are more conditioned to act on emotions rather than process them."

• Regarding Drake and Kanye:

  Julian [38:01]: "I think this is smart by Drake because it takes... it's a fun venture for us."

• Listener Advice:

  Clay [85:02]: "Have small goals... you are the captain of your life. You own your destiny."

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This episode provides a blend of personal anecdotes, insightful discussions on modern dating and relationships, and commentary on the entertainment industry, all delivered with Julian's characteristic humor and candidness alongside Clay's relatable experiences.

Transcript

[Julian]

Nothing wrong with the pink. Rolling. Let me do an intro. My guest does not need an introduction. He should look very familiar to everybody. This is my first guest on camera. I have to do my corny. Welcome back to episode five of Something Wrong with the Podcast. It's Julian, and we'll get to my guest in a second. If you have a problem and you want to call in, call 877-557-SWWP. That's 877-557-SWWP. And I'd like to welcome back one of my closest friends in this shit, Clay from Love is Blind season six.

[Clay]

Yes.

[Julian]

Yeah. Welcome back, welcome back, welcome back.

[Clay]

Different circumstances, different circumstances.

[Unknown]

We've moved into a much bigger, bigger and better studio.

[Julian]

Man, look at this face.

[Clay]

That means it's going to be raw content, you know, Raw content.

[Julian]

Raw. Great seeing you, man. Welcome back to New York. Thank you for tracking up the fucking Mount Olympus over here.

[Clay]

So. So. So this guy Julian didn't tell me where he lives, man. I don't know how he. I don't know how you. How you close deals when it comes to women because you have to go up literally seven stairs. Seven flights of stairs, bro. I was exhausted coming here. It's in the most New York shit. I'm like, bro, is there an elevator? Like, I know you not going home after taking, like, with a woman. How the hell is she walking up these damn stairs?

[Julian]

I knew it was bad. Cause, like, I buzzed you in, and two minutes later, I get a phone call and you're like, you said 31, right? And I know most of you see that. Oh, well, I'm believing that. Like, oh, they think it's like, that floor, but I'm like, nah, it's on like, the F we're up there, so you gotta go. So you made it. Happy to have you back, man. What. What's. What brings you back to the east coast this time?

[Clay]

So fly, Eagles, fly. My Eagles just won the super bowl, so, you know, I gotta go to the parade tomorrow, so I'm heading to Philadelphia, you know, from the Jersey area. So. My sister's birthday is on Saturday. Sorry. So I'm gonna be celebrating her birthday with her. But I'm always in New York, man, so you can always see me when I'm out here.

[Julian]

Man, we gotta get you out here.

[Unknown]

Permanently at some point.

[Clay]

Well. Well, the issue is my business, you know?

[Julian]

Like, yeah, true. There's no yeah.

[Clay]

It's like. I mean, I think I could do my business in New York. I actually think it would be Pretty successful out here. But it's just. I wouldn't get as much lee room with this, with the warm season, if that makes sense, you know?

[Julian]

Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah.

[Unknown]

How much longer is it extended down there in Charlotte?

[Clay]

I would say I'm still able to get rentals. I got. My last rental was like November 5th. It was still like 70, like high 70s. And I probably could do more. Like even December we had like actually last week it was 72 degrees in Charlotte. Now it's like 36. I don't know what's going on. Shout out global warming. Yeah, shout out global warming.

[Julian]

I got to go down there. I still want to get on the.

[Unknown]

On the boat life.

[Julian]

I'm like itching to. To get out there.

[Unknown]

I hate also this is already.

[Julian]

I'm going to just say this. If you're all watching on YouTube, I'm significantly lower than clay. My chair is like a foot shorter. And I feel like this is again, first time doing an on camera thing. I don't like this.

[Unknown]

Well, still, I'll deal with it, but.

[Julian]

I'm just gonna put that out there. I look like a midget. Is that sensitive? I don't. I look small and it's really annoying me.

[Clay]

So we're working out the kinks.

[Julian]

So. Yeah, obviously. Well, let's get to. You're the expert on most. Most dating things and obviously love is blind.

[Unknown]

And the funny thing is we're recording.

[Julian]

This the day before the new season of Line comes out. Correct. So we are not aware of what's.

[Unknown]

To come in the first batch of episodes.

[Julian]

But what's your.

[Unknown]

Do you have any info, any.

[Julian]

Any insight or any expectations from certain people this season?

[Clay]

So the season is going to be in Minnesota. Minneapolis. Great city. Honestly, if you've never been in Minneapolis, try to go into summertime. But they have a really nice sky lounge. You ever been in Minnesota?

[Julian]

Nah, but my. My sister in law's from there.

[Clay]

Okay.

[Julian]

And that's all I got about it.

[Clay]

Yeah, it's an efficient city. I thought the food was pretty good. You're able to kind of move around. But anyway, and I ain't gonna lie to you, Julian, like, I'm a closer in Minnesota. Like the. The Midwest cleanup crew. Midwest bangs with the Midwest.

[Julian]

I think there's something special about Midwestern women. We were briefly talking about this before. Yeah, like the women, the. Maybe the people always say the coastal.

[Unknown]

Elites, the la, the New Yorks and.

[Julian]

Then even like Miami.

[Unknown]

People have such an expectation.

[Julian]

Their bar is so high. And I'm not saying, like the bar in the Midwest, I'm not saying it's low, but I think it's just more rooted in reality and people are just more satisfied with like, I guess the simpler thing. Just like the. The gesture rather than the. The showmanship of it. So it's like, look, this is. This is where I'm at financially. This is what I'm comfortable doing and. But I want to spend this time and spend this whatever I can in these resources with you. Rather, where it's here, it's like you can do those things, but if it's not at the place that's a Michelin star, if it's not the place where I'm gonna get seen around other celebrities.

[Unknown]

Then, like, it doesn't count.

[Julian]

It's like, well, that's not how relationships should work. So.

[Clay]

Yeah, I agree. It's definitely a lot more simple. I mean, it's not that much to do out there. So they're cool with just Netflix and chilling. They're cool with just coming over. Even the escorting, you know, the escorts are in Minnesota, a little different.

[Julian]

How's that work? I'm not familiar.

[Clay]

Not familiar with escort game.

[Unknown]

Not.

[Julian]

Not anywhere, honestly.

[Clay]

Really?

[Julian]

Definitely not Minnesota.

[Clay]

A little cheap. Little better rates there for your pocket.

[Julian]

What is the running rate? Because I'm not going to lie, man, that whole Skip Bayless, Joy Taylor thing.

[Clay]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know.

[Julian]

No one's worth 1.5. So, like, what. What is the going rate for an escort? I have no idea.

[Clay]

So it's not like I know all escorts. And the reason why I know you're the expert on only reason why I know this is because I have friends in the industry.

[Julian]

You're.

[Unknown]

You're the pimp.

[Clay]

No, they tell me. They tell me what it would have cost an hour. They tell me their bottom line, you know, but the going rate for women that have, I would say, some type of clout is two bands an hour.

[Julian]

Two.

[Clay]

Two bands an hour. So these are like your expensive. These are like your popular of people. These are like, you know, popular. You know, corn stars and all that stuff.

[Julian]

Censor right there.

[Clay]

Yep, yep, no problem. But. But, you know, there's like. But the women, like, you know, not like, I'm not saying Andrea or like Barnes who are like scores or anything like that, but like those kind of valuable. Those type of women would probably go for a lot more though, you know.

[Julian]

Okay, and when you say, is this like pull up purely for sex or is this like you still have to do the thing where you Take them to dinner. You have to do all the, the shadow, like the pleasantries of a date.

[Unknown]

Do you have to do that or.

[Julian]

Is it like just show up to my hotel?

[Clay]

So like I said, I have friends in the industry, but. But what goes down is there's an application or a website and then you find this person and you're talking to them. You know, it's a little skeptic because they're like, hey, can we FaceTime you? Cause they don't want you being a cop or anything like that. So they just pull up and you have an hour and you want to get kind of to it. So you can maximize that full time. Because most of the time when that hour is over, they're out, they want to leave. You know, the key is to look at the women that would like you in real life because they will stay longer.

[Julian]

But isn't like a man's judgment always, well, unfavorably skewed? Like, I know I could bag her. And then she sees you and she's like, I would never touch you with.

[Unknown]

A ten foot pole.

[Julian]

I feel like that's like the misconception is every dude thinks they can get with the girl, when in fact that is not more often than not the case. That's why the money plays such an important role. Because it's like, I know I'm a six, you're a nine, but with this two grand, you're gonna stay with me for this hour.

[Clay]

See, I agree with that. But you gotta understand, the better she looks, the higher the prices. And some of these prices are a lot, you know. Like sometimes, you know, from what my friends tell me, they just want a quick. Yeah, they want a quick little, I guess, I don't know, exchange. So you might go with the seven, you know, and she might be a little bit cool and have good conversation with her. And now she could be a repeat customer. Now she's get in there for a lower rate, you know, getting a little. Yeah, now you can maybe get another girl and you could get that rate that you got the first time with two women, you know.

[Julian]

But my, like, I don't know, am I crazy? Like, I went to Amsterdam.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Julian]

Years ago and I went to the red light district and I would see people like coming out of the rooms, whatever. And I just was like going to, I just wanted to see how the culture went. Like, how did. And I'm like, okay, obviously you're like, you're window shopping. You're obviously shopping to have like sex. But with that, it's like, if I'm in that situation or even in this situation, if it's money's involved, I'm going to buy the. The prime product.

[Unknown]

It's like going to an Apple store.

[Julian]

And getting the phone that came out five years ago versus the one they dropped today. It's like I'm putting money into this.

[Unknown]

Because it's an investment.

[Julian]

I'm going to hook up with the person that's way out of my league because I can pay for it.

[Clay]

Yeah. And that's a good price.

[Julian]

I'm not trying to pay for someone that looks like I could just pick them up at a bar. Like the whole point. Point is to pick up someone that would be way out of my thing.

[Clay]

Like, yeah, 100. I think more for me and. And the friends that I talk to about this is about the relationships. And also like sometimes those prime women. Right. And Julie, I'm sure you experience this in your life. The best vagina you've got has probably been a six or seven. It has not been the tens and the eights or the nines, because the nines and the tens are pillow princesses.

[Julian]

Yeah, there's a lot. Yeah, I'll give you. Yeah, there's a lot of the hands, like lays like, I just. I'm here. You're lucky. It's like you're thankful I'm here.

[Clay]

You even think about it, most of the women in the corn industry, most of them were not tens. Like they might be looked as that way now they're on TV as frequently you're seeing them. But, you know, most of these women are not the most secure. They have like, you know, they. They didn't think they were pretty, which is not saying that that's why they got into the industry then. Most of them got on it for financial and. And they wanted to do it. But, you know, they're not like the tens and they give the best, you know, everything, you know, like it's a 10 out of 10, you know. So I've. In my life, I'm 31 now. In my 31 years of living. I've. It sucks because you always want the baddie. The baddie makes you. Makes you feel like, man, I got this. And especially if you get a baddie that has a great personality, feel like you hit the jackpot. But more times out of not it just ain't it don't be hitting sexually. And I also talked about this too, Julian and I know we supposed to talk about. Talk about loves blind.

[Julian]

I'm going off no, because I have another follow.

[Unknown]

This makes perfect.

[Julian]

This is perfect.

[Clay]

It's perfect. Word. But, like, you know, I believe that I have gotten a little bit too much vagina in my life, and it has affected neurons of how I view the world.

[Julian]

That's a. I mean, yeah, I think there's a lot.

[Unknown]

The way you phrase that is hilarious.

[Julian]

But there's a lot of truth to that. I think there's a lot of. A lot of misconception and a lot of rewiring you have to do on a neurological level.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Julian]

Because I was talking about this with a family friend of mine, like, a family friend, a cousin of mine, and he was saying, like, the. Even from, like, the dating apps, like, the dopamine receptors, and just like, the constant. The constant want of, like, satisfaction, the constant need of, like, a hit, a text message, a notification and alarm. I think we're conditioned to that because we're like the cell phone era. And that even has now matriculated into something that used to be sacred, like intercourse. Sexual intercourse. And now it's like. Well, now we're even, like, gamifying that. It's like, okay, like, this was fun. Who's next? It's like, that's ass backwards. It shouldn't be like that.

[Clay]

Yeah, yeah, that's.

[Julian]

Yeah. Hey.

[Clay]

It's the nuances of everything that you're trying to adjust. We just want to wait.

[Julian]

So my last. With the escort thing, you said get the 10, but then they just come over to, like, the hotel, whatever. But if I'm like, you knew.

[Unknown]

When you go out to.

[Julian]

I live in Chicago. There's a spot in Chicago called the Viagra Triangle, where basically it's a place.

[Unknown]

Where there's no public transit.

[Julian]

It's all old, rich white men, and they have, like, drivers, and they're all, like, men in their 60s, 70s, but they all have women that are 25, 22 to 28 around there. Everyone knows the deal. They go to the steakhouse, they go back to their, you know, waterfront property, Lake Michigan, whatever, and they do their thing.

[Unknown]

But I know the joy for them comes with bringing these women in public.

[Julian]

And being seen with a hot, younger girl. Girl. So in my mind, I'm like, okay, is there. Is it really just purely pull up, let's get to the action and then leave? Or is there not a part of these guys, younger guys, not like the old men, where they're like, I want to be seen with the hot girl.

[Unknown]

Let me bring her somewhere.

[Julian]

That's why I'm like, $2,000 to have.

[Unknown]

To have sex is one thing.

Yeah.

[Julian]

But then it's like, okay, am I also paying for. Because if you want to be seen with her, you got to take her out to eat. You got to bring in all these different things. Like, there's a lot more expenses that go. I just don't know if that's, like, a thing people do well.

[Clay]

I mean, I'm sure you can do that. And maybe if you're a repeat customer, you could probably do that because essentially you're just paying for their time, just paying for that hour. So if I want. If I pay for escort, I say, hey, let's, you know, do some ATVs. I'm sure she'll be down with it, you know, and she'll be, you know, if I call.

[Julian]

Yeah, like, you want her to be seen with you? It's like, okay, like, she's beautiful. Let's fucking skydive. Like, I don't know.

[Clay]

Yeah, I mean, I think. I think, yeah, it depends on who you are and stuff like that. You know, I'm kind of the guy like, hey, I'll let you at the hotel. You will not be seen out with me.

[Julian]

I mean, I full trans.

[Unknown]

I'm with you.

[Julian]

I'm that guy too.

[Clay]

But I definitely don't want to be like, hey, this is the girl that I paid for all my old girls. Look at this. 2000. This is what 2000 got me.

[Julian]

You're just cash apping her, right? In real time, every minute. Here's every 20aminute, baby. Let's go.

[Clay]

And that's such a dangerous thing.

[Julian]

Yeah.

[Clay]

And I tell men, right, like, don't pay for vagina. Like, you know, at the end of the day, find women that can like you. But if you're making good money and you don't want to deal with some of the nuances of it, it has a market. And that's why I said that you don't want to go for the tens because they're gonna hit you out your pocket.

[Julian]

Yeah.

[Clay]

And I'm a ROI guy, you know, I don't think that there's vagina that's worth $2,000 an hour. I just don't. And I've had depreciating assets. It's a depreciating asset as soon as.

[Julian]

You take it off the line.

[Clay]

Especially because I fornicated in that industry and got it for free. I'm like, how much better you gonna be than that girl? Yeah, I'm not giving you two. Like, I'm saying I'm not even giving 500. You know, cut that out. Because I don't want the women that I've to know that, that I don't do that.

[Julian]

No, I know a couple girls that.

[Unknown]

Do this as well.

[Julian]

And I feel like this, the pay.

[Unknown]

Game is for married men.

Yeah.

[Julian]

Because it's like, look, I gotta, I. I have this. You have a job, but I have a family to lose. So like, I know a couple girls that have that, done that. And they're very like, the guy books a hotel, they just, you know, tell the girl the hotel say, hey, get the card. Get a card key. I'll leave a key for you, go to the room and then like, you know, on their business lunch break, they'll pop in hours time and then go about their day. And then she'll have the hotel for the day. Like stay if you want or go back to your apartment. That's like, I get it in that setting. I mean, it's not condoning it, but like, I understand why that makes sense because like, yo, I got a whole family, kids. Like, you can't come over to any. Like, just do this shit in the hotel room. Here's your two grand. Go about your life.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Julian]

And do that every, like once a quarter, whatever the hell they do.

[Unknown]

Yeah, yeah.

[Clay]

I mean, yeah, keep it going, man. But that's an interesting topic, man. Married men and what they do to keep their marriage going. And I just saw this one little context where it said that side women really keep marriages together. And it's a scary world out here, man. It's fun side pieces. Sorry, not side women. Side pieces.

[Julian]

I noticed one girl that does this and she's like a career woman. She doesn't like.

[Unknown]

But it's expensive to live in New York.

[Julian]

Like people do other things. I'm not knocking someone for getting it how they live, but she does this.

[Unknown]

But she also has a.

[Clay]

She escorts.

[Julian]

Yeah, she has a not for profit.

[Unknown]

Business that she, that she created, that she started.

[Clay]

Well, she's giving and.

[Julian]

No, no, no. Like this is like a legit thing. Like, like it's not like, you know. Yeah, it's not that. But she. I forget what her cause is, but she, instead of him paying her, like, you know, like whatever the rate is, she'll she.

[Unknown]

The guy donates to her not for profit. So like he's making like monthly donations.

[Julian]

Of like thousands of dollars. So she's like raising a lot of money to go to something amazing, like, great. No, no one I'm sure knows how they're Getting the money or, like, where it's coming from. They just think there's, like, this, like, angel investor, angel donor that keeps giving them money month and month over. But, like, she's using the escort industry as a reason to, like, really help a lot of people, which I think is pretty cool.

[Clay]

That's pretty genius, honestly. Especially if you could get some type of government.

[Julian]

And he gets a tax, right, because he. Because on his tax returns, whatever, it.

[Unknown]

Looks like he's just donating to a.

[Julian]

Charity, so he's getting kickback. Like, they're both. It's like, perfect.

[Clay]

She's a genius.

[Julian]

She. She got. She's getting off. He's literally. They're both getting off. He's cheating on his family. We don't need to talk about that. But he is doing charitable work and he's writing it.

[Clay]

That's what I'm trying to say. And this is what I was talking about with Love is Blind. This is a topic that I've been trying to talk about. About. I'd be leaving married men be cheating all the time. And, like. And, you know, I want to. You know, of course, I did love as blonde. I wanted love, and I wanted to be married. Like, I still would love to have a family. I would love to be married. But, like, when I was doing this show, you know, when you're about to do something and then, like, I don't know if you believe in God or any type of higher ups, but, like, it's almost like everything was. I was getting the answers that I need. It was just like married men coming up to me, like, yeah, I've been married for 40 years. And I asked him, like, hey, hey, man. Like, are you faithful? Are you happy? They were like, well, when it comes to happiness, you gotta do what you gotta do to make your wife happy. And you just get these answers and just like, bro, marriage does not sound like fun for the man. Like, I was kind of getting, like, reassurance from men.

[Julian]

Like, probably for the women, too. I think it's just like, something that's.

[Clay]

Like, women make it sound good.

[Julian]

I think they're better at convincing themselves that it's good. Yeah, I think men are. We are more. I think women are just conditioned to deal with emotions more and process those emotions more. I think men physically act on those things. So it's like, I'm uncomfortable. I have to hit something. Like, women are like, well, let's not resort to that. Let's talk through this. Whereas men are like, I don't like this anymore. I'm going to fudge my neighbor.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Clay]

Or not go home or I'm just going to work all fucking night and not go home to my family. That's. I'm going to be miserable. I'm just not going to go home. You know, that's what they be doing. And it's just like, I'm just like, bro, is it better being single? Like, because I want a family, but like, I know, but like, I really want the family. Like, I'm gonna be honest with you, bro, like for like the aesthetic of it, like, I'll be in sometimes like, you know, I'm in tech sales. I remember I was meeting the CIO and he said, do you have a wife? And I said, no. And it was kind of like. It was like a little bit of a. My powers kind of went away. Where it was like, not my powers, but like points kind of got deducted. Yeah, they Men of power like you to be married and stuff like that. But in the same end, when they find a man that's single, especially black men that are married and they see another black dude that's single and they think he's suave. Oh, they cannot wait to tell you about the reminiscence stuff they used to do. The women they used to talk to or what you doing in your life. They want to live your life. So I just be with married men. I'm gonna just need. I'm gonna need some pages where married men are like, man, I love my wife and this is what I do to be happy. Because every time the men that are faithful, they sound so miserable. Like they go to like, it's like. Only thing they could tell me is I gave it up to God, bro.

[Julian]

Especially like in this industry, like being in the music, entertainment. Like I've seen artists, managers, people like that I'm very close with or used to be close with or like, you know, publicly the faithful guy or just had a kid or whatever the case may be. And then it's like, you know, you just like, God forbid you leave your city and you go on road with like, you see how people. You're like, oh, like damn.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Julian]

I thought you were like, yeah, yeah. Cuz it's like, I know I'm. I'm rare in this case where like.

[Unknown]

I grew up in a very loving household.

[Julian]

I'm sure my parents never younger. I know there's probably some shit that I don't need to know about, but yeah. Point is my parents are still together.

[Unknown]

Very loving, supportive, all that, all that.

[Julian]

Rosy shit that like most people don't have the. The experience with.

[Unknown]

And I thought that that was normal.

[Julian]

Until I went to college. But then I get into this industry and even more, it's like every time I think it's like the layers just keep getting ripped and I'm like, oh, like even the people that are like the public perception, the facade is so strong that like I bought into it. Even though I know you personally. And as soon as we leave the city and as soon as we go anywhere, it's like you're a whole year of like your point of like your colleague, like I'm losing respect for. It's like, damn, I.

[Unknown]

What the hell, man?

[Clay]

Yeah. And it's like, especially if you know their spouse too.

[Julian]

It's like, I don't want to be like, I know you're not putting me in the middle of it, but it's like there. It's awkward, bro. Like, you can't do this and then come over for dinner and yeah. Staring at your wife like we were just. You were just tag teaming like, weird, bro.

[Clay]

Weird. It's weird.

[Unknown]

But I guess that's normal. And then that's what sucks is that is the normal behavior.

[Clay]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

Which I hate. I don't want that to be like the standard.

[Clay]

But yeah, same. And you know, it is a little bit weird. But like, that's why for me, bro, I'm not gonna force a relationship. Like for me, it's like the person I'm gonna marry is gonna be my best friend. It's gonna be like that friendship aspect has to be there. And I know I'm kind of going on a tangent.

[Julian]

We can talk whatever the fuck we.

[Clay]

Want to talk about, but like, you know, that person gotta be my best friend, bro. Because there's no way I'm gonna be married to somebody and I'm thinking about the next chick. Like, yeah, I just feel like that's miserable.

[Julian]

But I think a lot of that comes from within as well. To your point of like the conditioning of hooking up with a girl and then moving on the next one, then moving on the next one. You have to. These are bad habits that we've developed. You have to unlearn that habit. And that's not just going to come because you met the perfect woman. It's going to come of you meeting that person. But then also like making the difficult decision time over and time and time again. No matter when you're at home, when you travel, wherever you are meeting someone, she's beautiful and saying to Yourself every time.

[Unknown]

Yes, I could do this.

[Julian]

Yes, this is something that I would love to do, but I have to prioritize the person that I love, the person I'm like building my life with and have a family with. Like, I think a lot of people think, like when they find the one.

[Unknown]

Then like that thing gets shut off and nothing gets shut off.

[Julian]

Like, as if someone that's pretty open about like former addiction and stuff, like, yeah, it's never a switch.

[Unknown]

You have to just unlearn bad behavior.

[Julian]

And like, that's a lifelong process. Because I'm seeing like the men in their 50s or late 40s, whatever, that are still like, yeah, you know, I'm about to. I could smash that if I want to. It's like, bro, like. And I'm looking at them like, you're like 20 years out of your. Like, what is this? But it's like, yo, you don't just unlearn that. Like, that's who you are.

[Unknown]

Yeah, men.

[Julian]

You're like, I'll be. It's like, okay. Like, that's just how we are.

[Clay]

Julian is like, we're not really transparent about that and not at all. 40 year old men are not transparent about it. So it's like we feel like it's supposed to be like some type of switch and it never is. And so you're just going down this forever cycle of just like, you're kind of still the same immature person from your 21.

[Julian]

Yeah, I, I'm on. I. I had a bum that. That Raya dating app that everyone glamorizes. It's the worst dating app ever, really. But it's awful. But like, you're looking at it and it's like, you know, a lot of like, successful people and. But the Raya app's interesting because it has men and women you don't like. There's no like, preference. It just shows you who's on the app near you. So you'll be going through like your neighborhood ever. And like, it's not when you're looking for potential matches, it just shows you the sex that you want. But if you have the map open, you can see guys and girls that. And I'll be like looking through the neighborhoods and I'm looking at guys that are like peers of Jay Z. Like, these aren't guys that are like, these are men in their 50s. It's like, is. Does. Is this. It's ridiculous to me. Is it not ridiculous to you that you're on here? Like, is this. Where does that lie and also, like.

[Unknown]

All your photos are with Jay's.

[Julian]

You make it very clear that you, like, you 10 around the block, like, that's your homie. Like, it's just odd to me that these guys that are like, I have nothing against, like, you know, the gray hair look. That's dope, all that. But it's like, yo, if half your photos are from, like, 20 years ago, or if, like, you know, it's you.

[Clay]

Kind of catfish, it's like, what are.

[Julian]

You doing here, bro? Like, it's. You're the old guy in the club. Like, what.

[Unknown]

Why are you still here?

[Clay]

Identity crisis.

[Julian]

It's not cool to be here still. Like, everyone. I make fun of the shitty bars on the Lower east side of New York where all the interns go, because now I'm in my 30s and I think it's stupid.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

But I also was that at one.

[Julian]

Point, and I did that because that was where I was in my life.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Julian]

It would look insane if I was still going to those places today. Yeah, I can't do that.

[Clay]

You got to evolve.

[Julian]

You have to evolve.

[Unknown]

You have to age out of shit.

[Julian]

You have to become a fucking adult. I feel a lot of people are afraid to become an adult, but also.

[Clay]

Too, I'm going to give some people some type of credit when some relationships hinder your growth, you know, so then when you finally are out of it, now that is like your first, like, of you kind of growing and shit like that. But I agree with you. I believe that there's a lot of people who never grow. And it's like. And that's. And at the end of the day, for anybody, you constantly have to grow. Like, I don't want to be the same clay that I was five years from now. And like, that's the. That's what I try to strive.

[Julian]

I would hate to be me five years ago.

[Clay]

Yeah.

[Julian]

I wouldn't be here if it was me five years. It would be awful.

[Clay]

Like, but when I talk to my friends that are married and they got kids, their whole life is around that premise. Like, my boy, he. I kick with him all the time.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Clay]

He said, bro, last year was one of the hardest years ever. He just had his child. His child's about to be almost one. He said, bro, I feel. I don't know, my identity. Like, my identity is literally waking up and taking care of my child and making sure that my child is okay. And like, yeah, I'm happy I got my family, but it's like, I used to do things with My friends. I used to do all this other stuff. So that identity, like, you kind of always have to like, re. Look at yourself in the mirror and be like, who am I?

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Clay]

Because like, that identity could get lost so quickly.

[Julian]

It can't. But like also like, I mean, with a kid in particular, like, you're not the priority anymore. Like, these are decisions that you and your spouse, your partner made. Like, you brought a life into the world.

[Unknown]

That's your thing, that's your priority.

[Julian]

I'm not saying like shelf your whole.

[Unknown]

Life, shelf your existence.

[Julian]

But you gotta like, it's the baby, man. The baby can't do shit at all.

[Clay]

No.

[Unknown]

Except shit itself. Literally.

[Julian]

Shit. That's all it can do. You gotta like do every. And that's.

[Unknown]

Yeah, that.

[Julian]

I mean, that's a learning curve. One of my best friends from college has a kid. He's. I think he's just turned one. No, he's turning two. Yeah, he's at that age. And it's like seeing him and his wife go through that transformation together. And just like, he's very honest with how that's been, like, good and difficult. And I'm like, I can't even.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Julian]

Like, I spent an afternoon with them and their son and I was just.

[Clay]

Like, this is like, it's too much.

[Julian]

I can't even fathom, bro.

[Clay]

I was with my friend and like, I was probably at my boy's house for like an hour and I try to help him out with like holding the baby. Yeah, the baby's heavy. First of all, you gotta constantly, always entertain the kid.

[Julian]

There's gotta be moving.

[Clay]

It's always gotta be moving. I'm like, bro, like, how are you doing this? He has a two parent household. Like him and his wife both switch off. I'm just like, how does single parents do this at all? Like, I understand. What them women, would they be bitter with men? I understand now them women that be single, they got one kid and they hate men. Like, I get it. I kind of get it.

[Julian]

Now there's like also the incentive structure on like, economical. Like the American system. Like it. No one's paid enough to live, no one's paid enough to raise a family at that. So with that, like we're, you know, in our 30s, early 30s, 25, 26 used to be like the barrier of like, okay, I have, I have a kid, I have a family. This is my life. This is like what we're doing. Because I can afford it. I can work two jobs, I can do other things. So can My wife. And we can raise a kid happily.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Julian]

Now, like, people are just.

[Unknown]

It's tough to live alone.

[Julian]

So the thought of even, like, integrating another life into that, not even like, a child's, but also a spouse's, is like, yo, where does this money come from? Because it's not accessible. It's not. It's not like, I don't want those things. I would love those things, but I. It's easy for people like us. I definitely speak for myself to shelf the ideal wife and kid stuff, because I literally don't think I could afford any of it. Whereas that used to not be the case, you know, however many years ago. Like, why don't I feel like this stuff is even possible to someone like me? Which is scary.

[Unknown]

It's like, the barrier of entry shouldn't.

[Julian]

Be, like, you have to be astronomically.

[Unknown]

Wealthy to have a freaking kid in this country. That's insane.

[Clay]

No, it is. It is. And it's constantly. The prices are constantly going up. But, Julian, you just need to move out of New York. You'll be fine.

[Julian]

I love. That's the problem. Like, this is the thing about not having kids. I can still be selfish. It's like, I love it here.

[Unknown]

I love my life here. I'll continue to move shoebox to shoebox.

[Julian]

Climbing five flights of stairs every damn day. I have stronger glutes than Saquon Barkley. Like, I will do this because I'm single, and I can. And I don't mind paying a premium for what New York has given me. Career wise, friendship wise. Like, opportunity wise. But I'm saying all this now, I'm sure. Like, yeah, like, I'm. Maybe at some point it'll run its course. Maybe when I am at the wife and kids phase and I'm like, okay, money. It's. This is it. Like, I gotta use this money for them. I can't put it into. I can't pour it into a rent where I might have a washer dryer.

[Clay]

My dreams.

[Julian]

Yeah, bro. Clay, we're gonna take a quick break to talk about today's sponsor, Fergs Coffee. Our good friends out in la, named after the adorable dog Fergs, whose full name is Fergie Fergalicious Ferguson.

[Unknown]

The Fergs.

[Julian]

It's the cutest thing I've ever heard, you guys. I'm an avid coffee drinker. I drink coffee every morning. And if I'm not drinking coffee, I'm drinking Matcha. Fergs is a product that is heavy in my rotation in the Summer. I'm a big matcha guy. It's a little lighter.

[Unknown]

I love the color.

[Julian]

It just seems a little more like spring. Summery. This is. They also produce matcha powder. This is their matcha. I'm a big fan of their match product. And obviously Fergie, the little cute dog is on the COVID of it.

[Unknown]

Shout out to her.

[Julian]

We love Fergs. If you're a starter to coffee drinking, I always recommend starting light. You can always build your way up.

[Unknown]

The light roast here.

[Julian]

These beans are produced in Brazil. Their producers are fourth generation coffee growers, which is incredible. And the flavor palette here, Listen to this. If you're just getting into coffee and you're also happy to be down down with cacao powder, raspberry, lemonade, and passion fruit, this is just a great entry point. Who doesn't enjoy those things? And there's just like, why not start slow? Ease your way into the door. Now once you get.

[Unknown]

Once you have a full beard and.

[Julian]

You'Re up to the level of just you're a boss at this stuff, you got to bring out the French press, which. This is my new French press. I'm obsessed. I love it. Get a French press because this is how I treat my coffee. Even though you should probably do a pour over for the light roast, but for your dark roast, you get a French press. Bring out these bad boys. Same producers, same farmers from Brazil. Listen to this flavor palette.

[Unknown]

Baker's chocolate, orange, caramel, raspberry. This is a dark roast.

[Julian]

I love a dark roast coffee, especially when I'm doing it in my French press. It's just a great combo. This is, this is my nearly every other, every morning combo. Big fan of the dark roast and the French press. This is like our wild card. Get freaky. Just send it.

[Unknown]

Sleeper.

[Julian]

Probably my most favorite. And it's like a treat for me. Coffee bean. This is. Guys, the name is Columbia bubblegum. I mean, when you think of Colombia, I think of fun and bubblegum is just it's kid you think of happiness. The flavor palette for the Columbia bubblegum is plum, BlackBerry, tangerine and cacao nibs. Now this is also a light roast. So if you are getting into it and you want to start easy, go with the light roast.

[Unknown]

Why not?

[Julian]

I mean, the packaging is beautiful. I love the blue. Fergs has just been, you know, a great supplier of coffee. The owner's been in the, in the.

[Unknown]

Scene for over 10 years and he.

[Julian]

Took a risk, started his own company and I got a support. I'm here to support if you want.

[Unknown]

All of these products and more, they.

[Julian]

Also do these awesome ceramics. I love these cups that they make. I really want to order a couple. Anyway. You can check out all of their [e-mail]. that's Fergs F E R G S coffeeroasters.com. they also have an Instagram Fergs coffee. There you can see all their products.

[Unknown]

Photos of cute little baby Fergs, the.

[Julian]

Dog that we're all obsessed with. And get your hand on some of these products. All right, guys, let's get back to the episode.

[Clay]

Man, there's a lot going on at the start of this year. It's just been so many different things. And I honestly feel like sometimes with the presidency and all these new changes, there's, like. I'm a little bit of a conspiracy theorist, but I believe there is sometimes a little bit of distractions, like, for Trump to come in and his first thing he does is eliminate dei. And then just like, I don't. You know, me, Julian. I worked in corporate. I don't even believe there is dei. Like, I don't believe that these corporate companies ever wanted to adopt dei. Like, I remember when I was working, I was at a. You know, one of the best tech companies out there during 2020, and I remember when the whole George Floyd thing happened and just a fake, like, concern that they had of like, oh, Clay, are you okay?

[Julian]

And I was like, oh, yeah.

[Unknown]

How.

[Julian]

How can we make sure our only black employee feels seen?

[Clay]

It's like, you want lunch? Like I told I chicken. One of my managers was super cool. Like, my first line manager was cool. I just say, yo, it's Carrie, man. We don't gotta have this conversation. Like, let's just. Just be cool to me. Be cool.

[Julian]

Yeah. If you get it, you don't make it a thing.

[Clay]

Let's not make it a thing. Let's just try to get this money and. And whatnot. But, yeah, my ADHD is kicking in because I forgot what I brought that up. But.

[Julian]

Well, I mean, I. I. To go with what you just say. I was at Atlantic Atlantic when that George Floyd is gonna happen. And that was where the industry did.

[Unknown]

The blackout the squares thing.

[Julian]

And that was actually started by two women that. That are black to work for Atlantic. And that was, like, a great movement. But I did see a lot of the industry and a lot of players because, you know, be honest. Like, a lot of the people that run these record labels are white.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Julian]

And they're profiting off of a lot of, you know.

[Clay]

Yeah, black.

[Unknown]

Black.

[Julian]

Trauma, Trauma. And it was a lot of like, yeah, a lot of those. Like we were always remote, but it was always, you know, hey, our lines always open if you want to, you know, if you got any choir, hey, if you're feeling this way or hey, you can be late to the meeting if you want. It's okay. It's like a lot of that, that coaxing where it's like, don't this preferential. Weird. It's like the weird treatment that you do.

[Unknown]

It's not genuine.

[Julian]

Yeah, it's not like how many you had to watch a black dude get his neck collapsed and on for seven minutes for.

[Unknown]

Then to email me and be like.

[Julian]

Yeah, just in case you've ever got anything you want to talk about. That's what I had. That's okay. So that's the barrier. That's before we get to the check in if someone has to die.

[Clay]

And it just wasn't genuine with anything. Like even the Black Lives Matter movement wasn't genuine. Like everything to me is just all capitalistic. And I think that we just, hey, we live in America and we have to understand that everything is for profit. And if you kind of understand that nothing kind of like tricks you out, like even what you talked about with this whole penny thing, it's just a money play for the rich, you know, or for the people who's in that production. Because I'm like, I'm not really, like, I don't know, like, I don't really deal with pennies like that. So I would think it doesn't directly, like, but I'm sure that it does.

[Julian]

Like, I'm sure it's like ramifications.

[Clay]

Yeah, like, I'm sure, like, like, you know, taxes, taxes wise, you know, taxes round up to a certain amount, you know, hey, eliminate some taxes.

[Julian]

I do think you said like the black light. I think with a lot of movements, Di include, I think a lot of them are rooted and started.

[Unknown]

It's.

[Julian]

It sucks because it seems like the more steam and the more smoke a movement gets that's founded in good ideology and it has a purpose and it's serving people that are underprivileged or minorities. The. The juxt of it is perfect, it's great. But then when it gets. Becomes profitable, profitable and it gets climbs up that American corporate ladder, that's when the powers that be kind of muddy the waters and then that's where everything that pops off in this country eventually gets hit with that, like Capitalist, you know, wand. And then it's like, all right, now we're. How do we funny siphon money? How do we do the thing? It's like, it's hard to stay good.

[Unknown]

When the system itself will always trick.

[Julian]

You into becoming the problem. Like, it'll.

[Unknown]

You're. You're going to be the problem at some point. You're never going to stay in the clear.

[Julian]

You're. This great idea in execution will eventually get turned into some capitalistic nonsense where it's about profit and we'll, you know.

[Unknown]

Prop up the mission statement.

[Julian]

But, like, we're not really, like, I need another house.

[Unknown]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Clay]

I got to worry about this damn kid and put my dream away to put him in college. This little nigger who won't even do anything in life.

[Julian]

Give him a chance, Clay.

[Clay]

Like, why don't you go to a VO Tech school or get a skill. Get a skill. Get a trade. Go to trade school. Learn how to be a plumber. I think master plumbers are making hell of money right now. I think when I get a kid. Hey, you doing sports? You learn how to be a plumber?

[Julian]

Yeah, that's like a whole skill set. That's. There's a whole south park special about that. They're talking about, like, the. The whole bit is like the episode follows the arc of the new man is like taking your phone and calling a TaskRabbit or like taking your phone and having another man do something for you. And they're like, basically the. The people that, you know, do what we do, like, work in, have like a white collar corporate job. Their skills are. There's.

[Unknown]

There's nothing.

[Julian]

They have nothing to offer. And the real people that are eating are all the plumbers and, like, mechanics and people that like, use tools and can physically actually get stuff done. Yeah, yeah. I don't.

[Unknown]

This is a.

[Julian]

Not a transition at all. What's up?

[Unknown]

What do you feel about Drake, man?

[Julian]

I just want to know your thoughts because the album again, we're recording before the album comes out. The album comes out.

[Clay]

Yeah. Drake and Party Night's Door album comes out. Excited about that tomorrow.

[Julian]

I'm. This is. Before you get into. I'm very much excited for the album. I love, obviously love Drake, love pnd. They have not had a record that's bad together. I'm not too crazy about the snippets I've heard, to be honest. I think it's leaning very heavy into PND sound. And I know a lot of people are gonna say, well, that's because the.

[Unknown]

Album'S coming out through Sony, that's through his label.

[Julian]

That none of that matters. None of that has anything to do with how the sound is put out, what albums put out. Drake obviously has the final say on everything. But I'm. I'm curious. I think this is smart by Drake because it takes. It's not just Drake's music.

[Unknown]

So it'll be judged as a collab.

[Julian]

Album and it's alleviates the pressure. I don't think this is going to flop. I think it'll be a great project. But I think it alleviates the stress of like the first week numbers tag, the like the charting tag. Like it kind of alleviates Drake of like the stress of just going out there alone. It's like that's me and my guy. Like this is my. My partner and I are doing something together. Like this is a fun venture for us. It has nothing to do with everything that just happened for the past year.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Julian]

So.

[Clay]

And I think that it's comfortable for Drake as well because it's more of an R and B lane.

[Julian]

Yeah.

[Clay]

So it's like he. It's like it's not like he's anticipated to address everything which I know which what everybody wants to see. But you know, at the end of the day, man, I believe that you make music for women, it's always going to be profitable. And I know for me when you make R B songs or you make songs that I could play around women, it's getting played around me. So I think it's a really good play. Like you said. That was a beautiful point. I never even thought about that. Like just from the non pressure perspective of Party Next Door puts out the album. I don't have to worry about like the first week numbers. I don't have to worry about the pressure following up after Kendrick just did the Super Bowl, I could kind of put out a good album and if it has good music and it's, you know, Drake from a universal perspective. I think more of the common rap fans like Drake more than Kendrick.

[Julian]

Yeah.

[Clay]

I think more of the hip hop fans if you're like rooted in hip hop or more Kendrick fans. But it's no lie that Drake makes more universal music that could kind of get played around everywhere.

[Julian]

I think people, because I think because I've been coming off my previous situation, I've been so honest with my thoughts on this whole beef. I think because now I'm just like more to freely speak. People think I'm like pro team. I'm Pro. Both of them. People think I'm like Kendrick. I can just be honest. Kendrick won the beef. Yes.

[Unknown]

I listen to Drake's music significantly more.

Yeah.

[Julian]

Like, I'm always going to be more excited and more anticipating a Drake release. And I think your point's right. I'm sure he'll do some rapping, but if this isn't a rap album, so.

[Unknown]

We can't really judge it for.

[Julian]

Damn. Did he bar down? Like, he's probably gonna be singing every song, which is great.

[Unknown]

I love singing Drake. Give me more melodies and hooks.

[Julian]

Like, I don't care necessarily like, who he does the collab with. I just want more. If there's more Drake music.

[Unknown]

Awesome.

Yeah.

[Julian]

So I'm just. I don't know.

[Clay]

I. I think, you know, a lot of times when you're doing stuff in the social media world, time could seem like forever. And Drake is Kendrick. Beef has seemed like it's been forever. Like, this has dragged out so much. I know.

[Unknown]

Seven months.

[Clay]

Seven months. And I can't imagine, you know, I'm sure Drake has been a POS in his life, but I'm sure he's been going through it, you know, seven months of being in a limelight. Everything you do is kind of being watched.

[Julian]

Like, can't do a damn thing.

[Clay]

Can't do a damn thing. You know, so, you know, I think that this album is going to be good to, like, the redemption of Drake, because I don't think Drake is going anywhere. I do think that we won't hear Drake in the same capacity with his new relationship with umg. For some reason, man, it's hard fighting against the man, bro. It's horrifying against the system.

[Unknown]

Well, it's not built for anyone to challenge.

[Clay]

I mean, Kanye's fighting against any. And I would say Kanye is probably being successful in the selling perspective, but not public perception.

[Julian]

But even how he's fighting it is like, no one. You're. This is. This can come off so wrong. Like, cut through all the Nazi propaganda and all that stuff. And even, like, the anti Semitism, there are certain things he's saying about the industry that need to be addressed. Just how he's getting the attention riled up for those things is awful. It's like, bro, like, you had it, and you could have been the person to do it. But the things you said, the.

[Unknown]

The 200 tweets you said before, the.

[Julian]

One smart thing just kind of makes your point null and void. Like, you ruined it. You have the momentum, you have the money, you have the clout, you have the attention. But you, you fudgeing are selling shirts with these swats because like, I can't take you seriously, bro. I can't be like. That's when he's right. You ruined it.

[Clay]

Selling shirts with like Sean, Sean John.

[Julian]

Yeah. You're saying free puff like so you're just, you, you killed your own credibility. It's like you could be the person that stands up.

[Unknown]

You face the DDAs.

Yeah.

[Julian]

You've, you know, faced a record label.

[Unknown]

Face to record labels like you, you've.

[Julian]

Had chances where you fought and won. But I can't jump out for you if you're saying this irrational, wild. That's like, these aren't even like business things. These are like people like humanistic, human, Human stuff. Yeah. You're up human.

[Clay]

And I'm a big Kanye fan. Like I, I. Kanye is my favorite rapper of all time. Like graduation changed my life. Same, you know, you know, in college, just bumping graduation, like I Wonder is my favorite song. So it's hard to see.

[Julian]

Great record.

[Clay]

Yeah, great record, man. It's hard to see like everything that Kanye is doing. But also too, Kanye is used to kind of getting that click. So it's like, it's like repeated behavior. Right. And also I always kind of, I always try to speak for athletes. When you are doing well in life, there's not a lot of people that's going to tell you no because they are benefiting off of being next to you. So for an athlete, even for athletes, I'm sure for Kanye west, you know, you're not getting people who's going to discipline you or tell you stuff. You might be the public perception, but at the end of the day, you're still getting that dopamine of results. So for Kanye west, he puts out donda and it does. Well, he, he doesn't, he doesn't sell it on a regular dsp. He sells it on, he has a website, eventually goes on Apple Music and stuff. But he's, he, he makes hella money off of that. So now he's rewarded with, oh, fuck these guys. Like, they, they, they, they counted me out and now I'm winning. So I can understand how that changes his mindset for him to double down even more. Of course, even for an athlete perspective. Right. Where sometimes they're like, why is he acting like that? Well, he's never been told no. He's been, he's been a winner his whole life and people have always wanted to get around him. I'm not Saying that that is an excuse for his behavior. But I'm saying I understand it.

[Julian]

But even if you think with someone like Kanye in a particular case, like, the thing with him is, like, when he has been told no, he's come back even stronger and more successful than, like. Like, take the. The Grammy situation with terrorism. He hides away and then drops My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy. That's his.

[Unknown]

That's his welcome back moment.

[Julian]

He drops a classic album. Like everyone told me, no, you're out. Here's a fucking classic album, okay? The whole thing with the shoes, with Nike, awful situation. That blows up.

[Unknown]

You're done here. Fashion.

[Julian]

We don't want you here. Goes to Adidas. Changes that entire corporation, makes them, you know, relevant again. Drops like the hottest shoe for however many years. It's like, even when he's told no, it's by these incredibly large conglomerates, and he still comes back bigger and better. The Gap collab. You're still not welcome in this industry.

[Unknown]

Fuck it.

[Julian]

I'll go to Gap. Boom.

[Unknown]

Sells out all.

[Julian]

Like, you're dealing with someone that not only, to your point, isn't getting told no by the people that work with him and know him personally, but, like, when he is told no, he gets.

[Unknown]

So motivated and fueled to prove them otherwise.

[Julian]

He's like, I'm going to do this. You're not going to tell. Like, it's going to happen. My creative motivation and my hatred for.

[Unknown]

You is fueling me to do whatever.

[Julian]

The hell I want.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Clay]

And I've been reading this book. It's called Millionaire Mind. So it's like the psychology of your experiences dictate how you move about things. Right. So like you just said, every time Kanye has gotten to know, he's done better. He's been comfortable in that. In that kind of revenge, kind of stand standpoint.

[Julian]

He finds a lot of comfort in that zone.

[Clay]

He's very comfortable with. Hey, you don't think I could do it?

[Unknown]

Watch.

[Clay]

I'm gonna prove it to you. Like, I watched what was this documentary on Netflix.

[Unknown]

Oh, yeah, the G. Genius.

[Julian]

Genius. Genius.

[Clay]

Yeah, yeah, something like that.

[Julian]

Something like that.

[Clay]

It was just all of, like, hey, you know. Yeah. Even his intro.

[Julian]

Even his intro into rap.

[Unknown]

You.

[Julian]

You're a beat maker. Just make beats.

[Clay]

Make beats. Yeah, and.

[Unknown]

And.

[Clay]

And I love that about Kanye because I'm big on some manifestation. I think Kanye speaks a lot of stuff into existence, so there's a lot of good stuff about Kanye. It just. Man. And I don't even think he'd be meaning some of the stuff he'd be saying.

[Julian]

The problem is I. I do. He's done it enough.

[Clay]

Yeah.

[Julian]

Where it's like, I. You never really had a pass. And in the past, when people were like, well, he's bipolar. You have to understand that this is some of these out. Which, again, bipolar doesn't make you a Nazi. Like, there's. There's just things that, to me are just like, you're. You cross.

[Unknown]

You're done.

[Julian]

Like, I'm sorry, you can't.

[Clay]

I just hate that the only thing I say, Julian, this is just. This is my bias. And. Because at the end day, wrong is wrong. But I hate how when black people wrong, they're canceled. But when a white person does the same thing is it doesn't get talked about. So they want to make up a point about, oh, Kanye says some anti Semitism stuff. And I saw some guy say, hey, we need to take Kanye music off of Apple Music and Spotify. But then you're gonna be cool with Elon Musk doing the full squats, like, sign. And it's like, his stock is going crazy. Like, I bought more Tesla stocks. Like, he. There's no consequences, bro. Like, there's no consequence. Even think about Bill Cosby. Then look at what's my man name? Kevin Spacey. What's the other guy that used to drug women that. You know, Harvey Weinstein. You know, like, no consequences for white men that do the same exact thing. R. Kelly goes to jail. And I'm. And I'm not saying these guys are good men. I'm just kind of giving you. Hey, I could. For every bad black guy, I could give you a white man. And I could tell you that there's different consequences for both.

[Julian]

Yeah, but I mean, that's the. I mean, now you're just talking about.

[Clay]

Yeah, that's just.

[Unknown]

Yes.

[Julian]

Systematic racism. Like, these are. They're bad, but their friends are the people that make the decisions. So, like, you know, hey, that's my. We, you know, made a lot of money together. He let him go.

[Clay]

Black man, don't. Don't make mistakes, because you won't recover.

[Julian]

Like, your white counterpart definitely will not.

[Clay]

It's the worst when you got white friends, too. They got. Explaining them, bro.

[Julian]

The funniest thing this happened to me during the. During the Black Lives Matter. I was here, so I went to, like, a lot of the marches, and I participated in a lot, like, the protests. And there was one that was a biking one. It was like, yo, we're riding from, you know, Brooklyn through It was all over the city. And I'm. And I'm right. And my friend of mine, and he's. He's a white guy. He's. He's with the. She's great. And they. We end up talking these.

[Unknown]

This one guy has a low tire.

[Julian]

Pressure, and he's like, oh, do you mind? He noticed my pump on my. On my bike. And I was like, yeah.

[Unknown]

So we pull over, I help him.

[Julian]

Pump up, and he's like, yeah, I'm going to run in here and grab some beers. You guys want beers? And my friends like, yeah, like, whatever. So then, like, he goes in the store, and we're like, in the street, you know, but there's, like, hundreds of bikers. The roads are kind of blocked off. And he comes out, he, like, hands us a beer, and they're just like. They just crack in the military, start drinking. I was like, nah. They're like, nah, come on, dude. I'm like, no, I'm not gonna just open container right now in the middle.

[Unknown]

Of Brooklyn, like, outside where all.

[Julian]

There's a hundred cops. Like, I'm not gonna be the one.

[Unknown]

Black guy that has an open beer container.

[Julian]

And they just look at me like, oh, yeah. We never even think about, like, there's just, like, things that you don't have to think about or things you have to, like, abide by because certain rules don't apply to you. And you get the pass on a lot of things. Like, yes, he has an open container and he's out in the public. He's a good guy. Yeah, I can't do that. Like, I can't. And they, like. I think it's funny because we're in.

[Unknown]

The middle of a protest.

[Julian]

We're in the middle of a thing that kind of, like, broad brings attention to those things. But even in that moment, they still couldn't. Until it happened. They weren't able to, like, comprehend that. Like, oh, you.

[Unknown]

This is a different game for you.

[Julian]

I'm like, yeah, like, we're both living life.

[Unknown]

We're both literally in New York on.

[Julian]

This block right now, but we have very, very, very, very different experiences.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

Enjoy the beer.

[Julian]

I can't do that right now. Do it later when I'm home.

[Clay]

Yeah, I mean, you know, I'm on the lake, you know, and that's a white man's business. So, like, I'm out there late at night, and, you know, like, there's a lot of rules.

[Julian]

Give me a black man on a boat out there, man.

[Clay]

Yeah. And I got people I'm hosting and stuff like that. So it's a little bit of a different game, but. Yeah, man, you gotta learn how to code switch, man. Are you a good code switcher?

[Julian]

Of course. Course. Yeah, of course. Some would say too hard. Something. I'm white. No, I. No, I, I. It was a wake up call. I went to a very. Like, my. Where I grew up was diverse as.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Julian]

And predominantly black. Like, high school. I was like, fine.

[Unknown]

I was like, sick.

[Julian]

This is real life. And then I go to college. I went to, like, a private liberal arts college. And I was like, oh, yeah, I'm not. Yeah, I got. I know. I know who I am here.

[Unknown]

And it was.

[Julian]

That was a very difficult. When you're young, when I was, like, 17, you know, you go onto a campus like that and your instinct is to assimilate. So then you get like, you know, the Sperry shoes, the pastels, and you try to, like, send it fully like, I belong. And then like a year of that, or even. Maybe even two years out, you're like, oh, this isn't fucking.

[Unknown]

This isn't who I am.

[Julian]

Like a, you know, a junior at this point. I'm like, the hell is this?

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Julian]

Like, this is lame. Like, I'm not the weird. Like, this is corny. Like, you know, there's good people here, and I like. But the system and, like, the culture of this is not.

[Unknown]

Hey, it's definitely not real life.

[Julian]

I mean, it's literally. The college I went to is situated on a hill that looked down on the local people. It was like. It could not have been more of, like a. Yeah.

[Unknown]

Fairy tale in the sense that it's.

[Julian]

Like the elites are physically on the hill. It's called Lafayette College.

[Unknown]

Okay.

[Julian]

I've been.

[Clay]

I ran there.

[Julian]

Yeah, yeah. Great facilities. The elites are physically on a hill and everyone's directly beneath us.

[Unknown]

And God forbid a local walks their.

[Julian]

Way up the hill. Then it's like, what the fuck are you doing?

[Clay]

Is that a fun school? Lafayette.

[Julian]

I had a. I had a very interesting time there. In short, there were moments that were fun, but, like, I also was there in, like, a transition of power phase where they brought in this president that was trying to, like. Basically, he wanted to make it as closely academically rigorous because it was like a top 30 private liberal arts college. But he wanted to crack the threshold of, like, Ivy League status.

[Unknown]

So he basically came in and had.

[Julian]

A mission of kind of wiping frats off, kind of erasing Greek life in.

[Unknown]

Like, social culture and making it more.

[Julian]

Of just Like a nerd focused school. So my class and my friends, the people that I knew were kind of like the last beacon of we're smart, but we also like to have fun. Like we do shit.

[Unknown]

Like we like to drink, we like.

[Julian]

To have, you know, parties and stuff. And that was like, you know, a lot of us got in trouble and it was just like a whole like, you know, it was a difficult time.

[Clay]

I understand. Yeah, y'all were the rebels of the school essentially.

[Julian]

Yeah. And they've, they've won. They got rid of damn near everything. Yeah. Which actually is kind of in hindsight makes it look like I went to my school is great, but like now they keep climbing up the charts. I'm like, I wonder like a top 15 school.

[Clay]

It means more.

[Julian]

Yeah, it means more. Now I'm like, you know, you know, might as well have been Princeton, you know. But how, how was your experience? I mean, you know, you had a. Probably a more fun looser, we all think.

[Clay]

Right.

[Unknown]

Sports thing though.

[Julian]

I mean you're always tough.

[Clay]

Yeah, because you know, I was an athlete. So you know, we would get up at six in the morning to do, to work our cross countries. So with the cross country team, I ran track, ran 400 meters. No one knew. But we would get up at 6 in the morning, do our little workout. I'll have my first class at 10, practices at 3pm you got a weight lift at like 6pm Then if you're until your junior year, we're over a 3.4. You still have to do tutoring. You know, my junior year out of 3.3, I ended up graduating 3.5.

[Julian]

So obnoxious.

[Clay]

You're right there, right there. It sucked. So yeah, man, you see after, after you're done with you know, eating, which is like around like I would say 7, maybe 6:30. 7pm you got like an hour, then you have to go to study hall. So your day is pretty slam packed with, you know, mundane things. But you know, I have fun being an athlete. Like you find like the pleasures and the time that you do have.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Clay]

You know, I'm still texting, I'm still like, hey, come over my house and come over my Dorm at like 9:30 and I'm having a fun ass time from like 9:30, 10:30 and then go to sleep, wake up, do it again.

[Unknown]

My track career was cut short.

[Julian]

I did jump. I was long and triple jump and in. Damn. What meet was it? I think it was an indoor meet. No, this was, I think it was at Lehigh when it Was a meet we had with them. It was like, I think a fourth or maybe fifth or sixth meet of the year.

[Clay]

That was a flat track, right?

[Julian]

Yeah.

[Clay]

Okay.

[Julian]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I tore my patella there. Yeah.

[Clay]

Wow.

[Julian]

And then I, during a jump, like I'm running to taking off for a. It was either a long. I think it was a long jump, I think might have been my last jump of the day. And I tore it mid jumps, crashed into the pit. Slammed into the pit. And then knew immediately. Oh, immediately. Because it was always. My knee was always sensitive and it felt weird and I was like, something isn't right. And it, it happened there. My parents are there a coach there. The medic team ended up getting surgery. Luckily it was just arthroscopic. But I don't think they like, man, knocked it out the park because it's still to this day, you know, over 10 years later, it's still very sensitive to the touch. Like when I play basketball, I wear a sleeve. Like I'm very conscious about it. I don't know how much of that.

[Unknown]

It'S the mental versus the physical.

[Julian]

But then it didn't end up. I'd rehabbed a little bit of comeback. But like, I basically just like gave up track after that. And then I lived like a normal student life. But I do remember like the, the grind, the grind, the practices. And I would even freshman year, of course, all freshmen automatically the study hall was like a big thing we had to do like mandatory study halls. And it was like my whole was just like ba, ba, ba, ba. All my friends, like having fun, going to parties day drinking. I'm just like, yeah, I can't have a beer. I have to, I have a two hour lift in like an hour. Like, I can't do this. I can't do anything.

[Unknown]

Which honestly would have been better for me.

[Clay]

Yeah, I know you probably need a little more discipline. The most fun I had was when I tore my hamstring because I, I was at, I was five years at USC just because I tore my hamstring. So I did a fifth year senior year. That's, that's my true senior year where, you know, I was in school my fifth year, I didn't do nothing. Like I just kind of just like I took one class and was eligible. But that fourth year, my senior year, bro, when I was able to stay back, party with the student, man, that was, I was doing. That's when I got into marijuana. That's when I started drinking.

[Julian]

Like it was just what having that experience in college Is something special, man. Like, I don't want to like the older glory date, but like, that is really. Is a.

[Unknown]

Is very.

[Clay]

We're getting exposed to drugs.

[Julian]

Well, not just the job, but I mean, like, just like having a college is so community based where it's like, you know, everyone you need and everything you need is within like, you know, a football field size.

[Unknown]

So it's like everything is accessible.

[Julian]

I have all my friends here. Like, I've. What's my. What's my biggest stress? I have to study for a 10. Like. Yeah, the stress bar is so low. Like, everything is just so manageable and I miss, like easy to make friends.

[Clay]

Whereas an adult is so hard to make friends with.

[Julian]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Clay]

That's the most. Like making a genuine friend is so difficult. Like when you're in your 30s.

[Julian]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I've. I've struggled a bit with that. Yeah. Damn.

[Clay]

I ain't even talking. Nothing about love is blind. My ADHD went on a whole tangent.

[Julian]

Well, let's do. Because again, we're talking before this comes out. I don't know anybody. I don't know the situation.

[Clay]

Yeah.

[Julian]

How predictions. How many. Let's just rapid fire. How many people do you think are gonna leave engaged?

[Clay]

It'd probably be six people on each side to be engaged, but the Netflix will probably take five from each side. So it'll be five men, five women. I'm sure they'll do like a nice romantic getaway, but. Yeah, man, Minnesota. I'm interested to see how these people in Minnesota spit any game. You know, I was looking at a little bit of a spoiler video. So I saw who the five that are going to get engaged. So I'll be making sure that I pay attention to this.

[Julian]

Oh, man, you've spoiled it for me.

[Clay]

Yeah, you just did.

[Julian]

He's had five couples, man. I don't even know.

[Clay]

Whoa, whoa, whoa. That's always the case.

[Julian]

Okay.

[Clay]

It's always.

[Julian]

Wasn't there one season where it was.

[Clay]

Like two or three or sometimes it's like that.

[Julian]

The UK one might have been that. I watched that one.

[Clay]

Oh, with Sam.

[Julian]

Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, I watched. That was crazy.

[Clay]

Yeah, that was crazy.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Clay]

You know, and you know, Ali, one of the guys is messing with my ex fiance, actually.

[Julian]

I mean, I have to ask, what's up with you and A.D. have you seen her?

[Clay]

I've seen A.D. actually.

[Julian]

Really?

[Clay]

Yeah, I did. I've seen her recently. Like, I want to say, like, first.

[Julian]

Time since the show.

[Clay]

First time since the show was this first time since the reunion.

[Julian]

Was this planned or did you run into her?

[Clay]

No, it was not planned. I actually. So it was like one of them influencer events. Charlotte Hornets invited us out to a basketball game. It was. They invited us to the New Orleans Pelicans. So the Hornets and the Pelicans. It was. I don't even know why I went to that game. Yeah, I don't even know I went there.

[Julian]

The Knicks are in town or something.

[Clay]

I did get to see the. The Nuggets play the Hornets one. But, yeah, it was. It was a complete waste of time anyway. All the love is blind people there. Jimmy's there, Johnny, Amy, Brittany, you know, so I'm coming late. You know, I see. You know, I'm dapping everybody up. AD kind of pulls up super late. She gave everyone hugs, and she's just kind of like, I'm like, the last one. Cause, like, I'm in a corner and, like, there's a bunch of people from Love is Blunt that's in the middle. So she's giving everyone hugs. I'm getting ready to go get my drink.

[Unknown]

So you were there before her?

[Clay]

I was there before her. So she walked in and she's giving everyone hugs. And it's, like, kind of awkward because, like, I'm, like, the last one to receive a hug. So, you know, I don't know what to do right there. I kind of panic. So I was just like, hey, AD tapped her on the shoulder. Hey, ad. And went to go get my drink.

[Julian]

You did like, hey, give her a love tab.

[Clay]

Well, it's like. It's so awkward, man. I don't know, man.

[Julian]

There's no cameras there, right?

[Clay]

There's no cameras.

[Julian]

But.

[Clay]

But people are watching, though. People.

[Julian]

Of course they are.

[Clay]

And I'm like. And I'm like, is this a setup?

[Julian]

Like, I'm like, did anyone at that point, I'd imagine, because you'd been in the room where people like, Yo, AD's coming.

[Clay]

No one said anything.

[Julian]

Someone in the room knew she was coming.

[Clay]

Yeah, exactly.

[Unknown]

That they didn't know that she would be there.

[Clay]

And I'll. And Johnny's my man. I feel like it should have been my boy Johnny. Johnny should have been like, yo, bro, you know, AD's gonna come. But I don't know if he knew, though, you know?

[Unknown]

Okay.

[Clay]

I don't know if he knew. Cause Johnny was talking to Johnny. Jimmy's the one that told me to come over Johnny. Then I was talking to Johnny the most. But, yeah, I had no idea, man. And Kind of threw me off. So then I didn't really say much to her. We ended up. I ended up.

[Julian]

What'd you say?

[Clay]

I didn't say much. I just said. I tapped her and said, hey.

[Julian]

And after that interaction, you saw.

[Clay]

So I went to go get some beer. I went to go get some more beers. I stayed in a certain section. I was having conversations with the people who invited us out. So I'm out. I'm out. I go back, I watch a little bit of the game. 80 sitting there. She's taking pictures. I'm like, all right. I'm just feeling. I'm like, this is super awkward.

[Julian]

Yeah, it is. Like, that's very awkward.

[Clay]

Let me get the hell out of here. You know? It's time for me to go.

[Julian]

Pelicans.

[Clay]

Yeah, Pelicans. It's a. It's a horrible game. The Hornets are winning. It's like, let me get out of here. So I start walking out and to 80s credits. She says, clay. She calls me out while I'm out. I'm already out of the area. I adapt all the people from Love is Blind. I dap all the other influences up.

[Julian]

This is January 17th.

[Unknown]

Oh, yes.

[Clay]

Oh, that damn. I ain't know. The Pelicans won.

[Unknown]

I didn't even watch.

[Julian]

The pelicans won by 20. Okay.

[Clay]

They were.

[Julian]

Wasn't the Hornets up at one point? First half they were.

[Clay]

Wow.

[Julian]

They were up at half.

[Clay]

I did not watch a second.

[Julian]

Yeah, you guys got. They lost it. Lamelo had 29. Okay. Whatever. Game. Doesn't matter. So anyway, she comes up to you.

[Clay]

She says, clay. So I'm getting ready to walk out. She says, clay. And I'm like. I know her voice. I'm like, okay, what's this about? So she walks over, and we have a conversation outside of the facility. So she says it loud as hell, like it's mad influencers in that area. But I'm outside of it, so I don't get to see, like, the awkwardness.

[Julian]

Yeah.

[Clay]

But anyway, she comes down to say, hey, are we. Are we good? And I want to be like, fuck, no, we're not good. What the fuck? We have not talked in fucking years. In a year. But also, I understand why me 80 haven't talked. I got. I. I understand.

[Julian]

What do you think she meant by that? The. Are we good? Because that's like a coded.

[Unknown]

That can mean very different things.

[Julian]

Like, are we good? Can be. Are we good? Like, as friends. Are we good? Like romantic? Like, what. What do you think she meant by that?

[Clay]

Is it beef. That's what she meant. Yeah, she meant, is there a beef? And I'm just not a fake person, bro. Like, if you block me. And when I feel like we were cool. And the last conversation I had with you in person, it was all copacetic. I hung out with you, and we shared different things with each other. And it's like we watched all the episodes when all this happened, so then it airs for the whole world to see. You see the same thing that you just saw last week, and then now you switch up. I felt some type of way, but I'm also trying to be like, hey, Ad, I understand why you cut me off or while we're not having conversation, but I'm just not a fake person where I'm like, I haven't seen you in a year. Hey, Ad, oh, my God. Like, I love seeing you. Like, I'm just like, bro, I don't feel like referring. So I just didn't really know what to do. And I probably could have been like, kept it more corporate and like, yeah, I'm good, and blah, blah, blah, but I just. I just couldn't be fake, man. So.

[Julian]

So what'd you say?

[Clay]

I didn't. I just said, I'm good. I said, I'm good. Things are.

[Julian]

Well.

[Clay]

I wanted to tell her, like, yeah, I don't think we're good. You know, we. We haven't talked in a year or probably need to hash things out, but I almost felt like, what was the point of that? Like, because we haven't talked in a year, you know, I'm not. What am I about to do? Spend the block with you? Like, you know what I'm saying?

[Julian]

Like, well, that's what I was gonna ask. Like, if.

[Unknown]

If.

[Julian]

If she says, you know, are we good? And you. And you said, is this an opportunity? Like, do you want to. Is this something you want to. Now that there's at least some form of community? Do you want to talk to her? Do you want to meet up again? Like, not even romantically. Do you have shit you want to say to her? Is there stuff.

[Clay]

Here's the thing. Ad and I. I felt as though we're good friends, even, but she was my ex fiance. Regardless, our banter was good. Yeah, we were. And we looked out for each other. I feel as though now I disrespected that by saying no to her at the alternate, embarrassing her. And a lot of that stuff was. I didn't identify that it was wrong until it was there. But anyway, the ultimate premise of What I was. What I would like to do is for us to reference bro. Like, we could talk about things that we have issues with, but I don't. I don't feel like we're friends anymore, though. Yeah, I don't. I don't feel like that. Like, when anybody that's my friend, if we have a problem, I'm gonna want to understand what the issue is. But I don't feel like. I just don't feel like we're friends anymore. Like, we haven't talked in a year. There's been no checking on each other. Like, it's been nothing, you know? And anybody who doesn't check on me for a year, like, you're my acquaintance.

[Julian]

Or like, like, so you sound like you've. Like, you're.

[Unknown]

You're good.

[Julian]

You moved on.

[Clay]

I don't see. Because at that time period, I'm like, if I tell AD that no, we're not good, what am I going to do? Like, it's just going to be a conversation. And what, am I trying to make her feel sorry for me? Like, no, like, you guys, I'm happy. I'm actually happy for her. Like, I'm not a hater. I want the best for her, but I don't feel like we're friends. So it's like, when she came at me and we had that conversation, I was a little shocked. I was just like, I don't even know what to do in this moment because here's someone who I actually care for in the past, but we're not. Like, I don't have that same love for her like, I did. It just wasn't there, you know, because I don't feel like it was genuine, you know? So I don't know. I don't really know how to navigate that. When you love someone before, but you don't feel like the love is there, and then you're in their space. I kind of was fake because I just didn't know what to do.

[Julian]

That was a new experience for you? Yeah. It's like, it sounds like you moved on, but there's no beef. So it sounds like, you know, say there's another event, another Hornets Pelicans game or whatever. Like, and you guys end up in the same room again. Like, shit is cool, but it's not, you know, hey, let's, you know, come get a drink with me. It's like, we can exist in the same space, but let's leave it at that. We don't need to pretend like, you know, there's More to this than there is.

[Clay]

Yeah, 100%.

[Julian]

Yeah.

[Clay]

You know, and if we are gonna ever be cool again, I will want it to be genuine. Like, don't come in like, hey, are we good? Crack a joke. Like, you know what I mean? Like, you know me. What's up? Like, hit me like, nigga, you know, you should never. Like, it should have been like, more of a genuine thing. Like, hey, we good. It's like, girl, you know, we not good, but. Because you're not gonna be real. Yeah, we good. You know?

[Julian]

Damn. Yeah, I was hoping that. I was hoping there'd be, like, a redemption arc or, like, you know, did she dating? Do you know anything?

[Clay]

I don't know. I'm seeing what I see on Tick Tock. But, you know, I. I. Regardless, man, I do, like, want AD to win. Like, you know, I've shared moments with her and understand where she came from, where, you know, I can only do anything but root for her.

[Julian]

Yeah.

[Clay]

I guess I just get hurt with the fact that we were super cool. But I also have to understand that, like, I look like an asshole saying no to her at the altar, and I take. I understand that magnitude of that moment and, like, how that could affect her, you know?

[Unknown]

Would you ever.

[Julian]

Is this, like, a year now removed? Would you ever go back and watch it or you, like, you're never going to.

[Clay]

When people tell me they're watching Love is Blonde, I'm, like, sick. I'm, like, sick stomach. Like, please don't watch that. Like, in Julian, bro. Like, I'll talk to a new girl. The first thing they do is try to watch Love is Blind. I talked to a girl, and Christmas, that shit lasted for, like, three weeks. She had her whole family watch Love is Blind for Christmas. I said, oh, why are you watching? Making your mom and your dad watch Love is Blind.

[Julian]

I was gonna ask you how much is that? Because again, we're further removed than the last week's time we spoke. How much has that killed your dating life or is.

[Unknown]

I would imagine it's probably hurt more.

[Julian]

Than help in terms of, like, trying to take someone seriously.

[Clay]

Yeah, it's definitely hurt. I mean, I still get women that want to talk to me, but I don't. I wouldn't say, like, they're the women that I was attracted before the show. Yeah, I'm not getting, like, the tech babe baddies like I was in 2023. You know, I'm not getting the, you know, the finance guru women and shit like that. Like, I'm gonna get, like, of girls and, like, people in the industry. Like, I'm actually kind of finding a little more comfortable talking to people who have a little bit of a social media following.

[Julian]

Yeah.

[Clay]

Just because I feel like all of us kind of have social anxiety at a certain extent because, like, we're so public facing. It's like we're kind of like, always aware of, like, other people and stuff like that. So I'm kind of like leaning towards people who, like, have certain vices as me. But it's definitely affected my dating life for sure.

[Julian]

Yeah, yeah. You.

[Clay]

You never want to talk to a girl and she says, oh, yeah, my father watched your. Your scene.

[Julian]

You're like, oh, it's always tough to win. Like, especially being in like, the content game where.

[Unknown]

Well, on that level, that extreme of a personal level.

[Julian]

But this stuff is like, frozen in time. And it's like, this stuff happened, what, when it was shot probably three years ago at this time now. It's like, yo, like, yeah, it's on tv. Yes, that happened. But it was also. This is three years ago. Like, people reference things I've said on the podcast and the old episodes. Like, you said this about that one thing, that one time. You don't feel that way anymore.

[Unknown]

No, man.

[Julian]

My opinion change.

[Clay]

I don't.

[Julian]

I'm human. I thought this was good.

[Clay]

Sad with it.

[Julian]

Not a big fan of it anymore. I thought highly of this person after a while. My opinion, like, just because it's on camera and just because I said it in a microphone doesn't mean it's like a law. Like, I'm still.

[Unknown]

Stuff changes and like, you've ch.

[Julian]

Like you're not. It's not like every girl you've met.

[Unknown]

After AD You've done the same thing.

[Julian]

With, like, you've left on an altar. It's like, yo, like, this fucked up.

[Unknown]

And it sucks that there's a Netflix.

[Julian]

Fucking camera in my face during this. But I'm not. Like, that's not. You don't just make me that. I know that's your barrier of entry.

[Unknown]

For who I am is this show.

[Julian]

But, like, that's not. Come on. That's not.

[Unknown]

That's.

[Julian]

It's. It's real life, but it's not real life.

[Unknown]

Like, come on.

[Julian]

Yeah, that's always my thing with, like, the pod stuff. You're like, you said this. I'm like, dude, I said so much stuff.

[Clay]

I say so much microphone on my.

[Julian]

Face for three years, dude. I don't know what the hell.

[Unknown]

Yep.

[Julian]

So I don't know, man.

[Clay]

No, that's. That's. That's.

[Unknown]

That's.

[Clay]

That's facts, bro. It's like, bro, I. I evolved. I'm not married to my opinions. My opinions change all the time. Honestly, bro, I could say some wild, and you could literally check me in the same conversation. I'm like, damn. I don't even know why I thought that. Yeah. Like, it don't make no sense, bro.

[Julian]

Yeah, man, I don't know what I have for lunch today, but, you know.

[Clay]

People don't understand TV or understand social media, understand content, so, like, it's very. Like, they're very curious about it, and they kind of keep your paint. Like, when you say anything online, they act like you had that conversation with them, and it's like, yeah, bro, sometimes I say stuff just because, you know, it was. I was on a. The mic was in my face. I was drinking a little bit, and I spiced it up a little bit.

[Julian]

Yeah. You know, definitely.

[Clay]

Like. Like, the first reverse episode when I went and I met you, bro, I was lit.

[Julian]

We got.

[Unknown]

We got drunk.

[Clay]

I was lit. I like.

[Julian]

Like, I. Really drunk.

[Clay]

Yeah, you saw something. A little something. Like, I said everything in truth, but you know how liquor, you know, add an extra attribute to what you're saying.

[Unknown]

Definitely.

[Julian]

No, that was a fun episode.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Clay]

I missed my whole flight. Everything.

[Julian]

Yeah. Damn. I'm trying to think of what else.

[Clay]

I had so much anxiety that day. Too lit with y'all because of all the whole, like, Selena Powell thing. Like, that was.

[Julian]

The timing of that was crazy.

[Clay]

That, yo, 2024, bro. Like, just the anxieties of, like, man, I'm doing a podcast, and it feels like I'm about to do a presentation to my executive, you know, just like. Yeah, because the whole world's watching. Like, Like, I feel so good that that pressure is not on me anymore. Like, it's like, all right, cool. Like, now I can come on this podcast and talk about, you know, escorting. Like, I would. I wouldn't dare do that. You know, when I first meet you.

[Julian]

Yeah, we started with. We're having such, like, healthy conversations, talking about, like, content creation and starting businesses. And, like, I'm showing you my whole setup and all the tech. We're like. It's, like, very, like, informative. We're like, yeah, this is. You know, I'll help you out with the. As soon as they record. Yeah.

[Clay]

So these are $2,000 for some.

[Julian]

Now I'm like, what the. Well, we were just talking about the board, man.

[Clay]

I got a complex mind, bro. It Be like, damn, bro, I need to get money, I need to be rich, I need to be. I need to read this book. Vagina.

[Julian]

So much other stuff, but. All right, let's get into some voicemails. That's a cool little song. This guy's from Denmark, made this. Oh, nice.

[Clay]

He just made it.

[Julian]

Yeah, that's hard. Users. Yeah, it's pretty nice of them.

[Unknown]

All right, here we go.

Hi, I was just calling because I feel like where in the midst of a ghosting epidemic, every relationship that I. Well, situation that I've been in since I was 22 and I'm 25, turning 26 later this year. So I was just calling to see if you had any advice for a 20 something year old that is feeling a bit discouraged about dating and not even necessarily dating, but approaching having a relationship in the future. Because I'm just afraid that it's not going to happen because every situation has been the same since I've been Damn. Basically in college. So if you have any advice, I'd love to hear it. And I can leave another voicemail telling my actual stories of what's happened. But first, I guess, like I want to get past this shame. I guess we're feeling this way.

[Julian]

Jesus. Well, I was gonna say I feel like she's referring to one very specific incident that we're not aware of. Yeah, damn. I feel bad for. But like, I mean, that's.

[Clay]

This.

[Julian]

Is this not kind of. I mean, I don't know what to say. Yeah, she sounds awfully jaded. I feel bad for her in terms of like advice. I mean, everyone's been ghosted. I've been ghosted. I've been. I've done the ghosting. I think that's a young man's game. I think when you get older, you realize how shitty that can make someone feel about themselves. In particular, you calling here, like it has ramifications that make people feel less about themselves. And I think people need to take account for some people, being intimate is not as important or not as meaningful as it is for other people. And some people are better at having. Not better. Better makes it sound like you're worse at it, but like some people are more accustomed and more okay with having casual sex or hookups. Whereas it doesn't sound like they, you know, they'll string you along and then pull the rug out from under you once they have sex. And it's like, well, now I feel shitty about myself. Not just this relationship, I feel bad about myself. So I don't know, I Can random, random ramble about this, but go do your thing.

[Clay]

Yeah, I mean, I think she needs to get a better relationship with herself and in a sense of, you know, I understand she's 25, 26, and that's probably at the age right there where women are looking for their, their life partner. So I can understand feeling disappointed with getting ghosted especially. It kind of sounds like it's happened frequently. I would tell her to fall in love with herself. You know, maybe there's a situation where the men that you're attracting is based off the energy that you're perceiving and who you want to attract. You should probably try to become that. Frank Ocean had this line on Channel Orange or maybe it was the album at the Channel Orange where he said, I never fudge nobody that I wouldn't want to be though. And I'm like, man, I was such a powerful.

[Unknown]

That's a bar.

[Clay]

That's a bar. I'm like, man, like, that was such a crazy line. So, you know, like, everybody who I try to sleep with, like, maybe I should look up to them or maybe I should. There should be some aspect of them that I actually like, would love to learn about or want to gain. And that way, if you get ghosted, well, did you get a conversation? You probably gained something from it. So it's now the way the people who I'm dating is dating up. So even if I don't get the full, you know, exposure of them, I'm getting something out of it, which is evolving me.

[Julian]

Yeah. And like, and to the, to the guys, it's mostly men that goes. I've been ghosted. Honestly in the past when I've been ghosted, I was like, cool with it. But there are like a couple times where it hurts. You never want, you know, sometimes you want closure. But like, if you're a guy and you're doing that and to the guys are probably more likely to do this to you as well. Like it's, it's a coward's way out. Like, you shouldn't want to be with someone that does that to you or someone that treats you like that. It's, it's the non confrontational way to have them wipe their hands clean of a situation but then leave you like this.

[Unknown]

And it's not fair that you feel this way.

[Julian]

And they're probably doing this to like you know, 10 other women since then. So I would do want to say if you do have any. Hold on. Or any reservations, like, oh man, would.

[Unknown]

This one guy still think about her.

[Julian]

I still think it could work with this one guy. Don't move past these gentlemen. And also, I'm sure that there were patterns and things that they did that overlapped.

[Unknown]

This kid from college, this kid's.

[Julian]

In your young adult life. There's tactics that people do to get what they want. And I'm sure that there's repeated behavior that at this point, hopefully you can.

[Unknown]

Pick up when someone's doing that to you.

[Julian]

Just be wary of it. But it's. I don't think you should be. I don't think dating should be a.

[Unknown]

Cautionary tale for you.

[Julian]

I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with you. I just think you need to add to your initial point. Just, you know, pick yourself up and then I think go from there and just prioritize your well being over these.

[Unknown]

Others don't like love bomb or fall.

[Julian]

For somebody before you, I don't know.

[Clay]

And they older too, because you're in that. You're in that age range if you're dating 25, 26 year olds. I'll tell you, you ran into me.

[Unknown]

Me too.

[Clay]

You know, like, I was the gut.

[Julian]

Like, I'm speaking from someone that was a clinical ghost. Like, and I was never even at.

[Unknown]

That phase of my life.

[Clay]

And I didn't think I was ghosting. It's just like I had so much that I was dealing with and like, yeah, like a roster. So it's just like, it wasn't like I was even ghosting. It was just like, honestly, like, it just wasn't on my radar.

[Julian]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

Every time.

[Julian]

Yeah. Like, to your point, like, when I was. It wasn't like in this spirit. I wasn't like getting off on being like a bad guy, like, oh, I'd be next. Like, I wasn't. Like, there wasn't joy in like the.

[Unknown]

Ghosting part of it.

[Julian]

It was just like, okay, like, we.

[Unknown]

Had fun, we did the thing.

[Julian]

Like, okay, I'll just go, you know.

[Unknown]

Go on the next weekend or whatever.

[Julian]

Like, that was kind of my thing with it. I don't. But I don't think these guys are like getting off on leaving you ghosted either. But like, that's just to our conversation early about like dating now, it's like the culture is just built up on.

[Unknown]

Numbers and volume versus like substantial relationships.

[Julian]

And unfortunately there's casualties along the way. But don't beat yourself up over this stuff. Like, I guarantee a lot of your friends have been ghosted. A lot of your male friends too, have probably been. Men don't like to talk about it. I've been goes, it sucks.

[Unknown]

It sucked a few times when it's happened to me.

[Julian]

Other times I've been like, yeah, okay. But, like, that's a chin check every.

[Unknown]

Once in a while.

[Julian]

Last time I got picked up in public. This is over the summer. It was a while ago, a long time. Actually was the last two summers ago, this girl, we were making eyes across the bar all the. It was a day drink situation, like a Saturday. And I'm with, like, I'm late to.

[Unknown]

A group of friends that are playing.

[Julian]

Cards, and so I'm like, late to the thing.

[Unknown]

So they bend there, and I'm like, this girl keeps looking over.

[Julian]

And I was like, yo, has she.

[Unknown]

Been looking over here?

[Julian]

Like, is she looking at one of you? Like, no, she just started. I was like, oh, so maybe it's me. And I'm like, still not convinced that it's me. So they all go out to smoke, and we're leaving, packing our stuff up, and I run back in to go to the bathroom. And as I'm coming out, I'm the last one in the group to come out. She grabs my arm and, like, number, napkin, whatever. I was like, oh, I guess it was me. Go home with my friends. Like, we're drinking, hanging one of our apartments. I text her, she texted me back.

[Unknown]

We meet later that night and we hook up.

[Julian]

And I was like, damn, that was awesome. And then we hook up again, like another night or whatever, the middle of the week. And then I just never heard from her. I was like, damn.

[Clay]

Yeah, she was pretty.

[Julian]

She was cool. Like, I was like, that was nice. I was like, why did that have to. In my mind, I was like, you know, why that have to end? Like, that was shitty.

[Unknown]

And she lived near me, so I've been.

[Julian]

I see her in the street, and then I think she has a boyfriend. I think she was on a little hall pass situation or just cheating. But, like, in my mind, I was like, damn, why that have to end?

[Unknown]

And it sucks.

[Julian]

But, like, you know, people do things for different reasons. But, like, you're not the bad person for getting ghosted. It's usually the person that's doing that act that's the person in the wrong. So I don't know, man. Any last, last words?

[Unknown]

Don't go on. Love is blind.

[Clay]

Yeah, don't do that.

[Julian]

Don't. Don't think a dating show is your way to success.

[Clay]

It's gonna ruin it even worse.

[Julian]

Yeah, let's do another one.

[Unknown]

Yo, Julian, what's good. Hope you're doing well. Hope you're doing well. My intrusive thoughts currently is the fact that, you know, recently, in the last year or so, I've long grown like glowed up, you know, lost out of weight, got, got a degree, I'm out here popping in these, you know, industry streets, big time gigs, all of that. And I was supposed to be on working an international job. And while on the international job, I was ready to be, you know, like I was ready to be fucking.

[Julian]

Fucking. I ain't gonna hold you.

[Unknown]

I was ready to be, you know, experiencing this glow up. But I literally picked recently, you know, the time to fall in love with a shorty and I feel like a dunder done. Like I had to pick right now to fall in love. What do you think about that? Am I for that? Let me know. Appreciate you, bro.

[Julian]

Look at him. He's trying to.

[Clay]

Damn.

[Julian]

He's trying to actively avoid what happened to our last call. Like he's trying to be a good guy.

[Clay]

Yeah, he's trying to be a good guy, man.

[Julian]

Damn, I like this for him. Yeah, man, you can't. There's no to the conversation we had earlier. Like, there's no timeline on love. Something just happens. And I mean, if this is the person you love, this who you want to be with, then you gotta honor that, be a man about it and be faithful to your chick. That's kind of where I'm at with it. Like, good for you. Got a degree, you're doing a great job, you lost weight, like is going well in your life and it sounds like you did all that, a lot of that stuff on your own. But in doing so, it got you to the point to get the girl that you currently are with and love. So like, you know, girls will always be there.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Julian]

So like, if it doesn't work out with this one, guess what, there's another international trip or flight you can take to, you know, make up for lost time if you feel like you need to. Yeah, I'm taking the good guy angle on this. Do you want to take the heel and be like, you know, I don't.

[Clay]

Because I like what he's saying. Like, first of all, congratulations on you getting an international job. Congratulations on you getting your degree. Those are amazing things. And like, like Julian said that if, you know, you and the girl doesn't work out, you got the job, you got the degree. It sounds like you are on your way to, you know, being successful and being able to generate income in society. And if you're doing well money wise, bro. You always gonna have a girl, you know what I'm saying? So. And seem like you got good personality. I heard your voice and stuff like that. You cracking jokes.

[Unknown]

So.

[Clay]

Yeah, you know, I mean, so I think you're on your right path, I would say, bro, you know, leave it to, like, a guy like me. Like, I spent most of my twenties fornicating and messing around with women. And I was talking to Julian before this, where it's like, I felt as though that guys, it's. It's really celebrated for us to, you know, be with so many different women, fornicate with different women, but we're mixing up our energies with people. So I will tell you, I struggle with sometimes comparing too many women because I had sex with so many women before in my past. I compare them, you know, I remember I did Love is Blind, and I'm like, damn, about to marry AD but, like, how this is going to work, because I was just talking to a girl for six months. She was pretty solid. And what's she gonna think when I'm about to marry Ad and I only know Ad for 10 days, you know, so it's like you always have these comp comparisons. So I think relationships and I think that your life, especially if you're trying to be successful, would probably be better with just one woman instead of just managing multiple people, you know, because that's time and time is money. And if you could just deal with one person who understands what you got going on, your life, to me, would be a lot more simpler.

[Julian]

Yeah. And the whole, like, the grass is greener idiom, it's that I think that's natural. I think as humans, you're always like, how can I make my situation better? How can I evolve? And, like, look at. I'm sure you two, three years ago, would have loved to have, you know, looked like you do now with. With your, you know, weight glow up your your get the degree that you have, like, at this point where you.

[Unknown]

Currently are was the greener grass. You've hit it, you've accomplished it, and.

[Julian]

Look what's come of it.

[Unknown]

You have a great job.

[Julian]

You're in a healthy, beautiful relationship. Like, this is it. You did the very things that were.

[Unknown]

At one point the goal, one point the dream.

[Julian]

Don't foil them because you want to have, like, a rendezvous. There's nothing about being faithful. Most men, like, it's. It's lame to. To show faithful and pretend to be faithful and be a dog on the back like that's corny.

[Unknown]

That's not a good person.

[Julian]

You don't want to look up to those kind of people. We all know so many of those guys.

[Unknown]

The world is filled with plenty of.

[Julian]

Guys like that and they all have internal battles. I mean, do you want to spend half your time like, do you want to come home from a long international trip, tell your girl about what happened, then have like this weight or guilt while like knowing that you're obviously leaving out the nefarious part of the trip? Like, wouldn't you rather just like share what actually happened in the fun times you had and the international food you had and the drinks or whatever you did? Like, you don't want to have to.

[Unknown]

Sleep at night with her after being.

[Julian]

Gone for like a month or however many weeks, come home, get in bed with her and then just like feel like, damn, it's going to hit you. Like, that's the thing, that shit will.

[Unknown]

Hit you in the chest.

[Julian]

I've been in past relationship, I've fucked up and I thought it was like, you know, similar situation. I was out of the country, whatever, and I was like, I got back and I was like, man, I'm not, you know, I'm not thinking about that. I was fudgeing, you know where. And I got, as soon as I got home and I got back with, I was like, oh, this doesn't like go away. Like you, you feel it and she'll pick up on that energy. Like she'll detect something's off and you.

[Unknown]

Can'T vilify her if she does.

[Julian]

You can be like, you're crazy. She's right. So like just play smart. Don't be the bad guy.

[Unknown]

Don't want, don't aspire to be the bad guy.

[Julian]

It's not a good place to be, man.

[Clay]

Yeah, so, so you're not pussy, bro. You definitely a stand up guy. Good luck to you and your relationship.

[Julian]

Let's do one more. Hey, Julian. So I was in the hospital for the past couple of weeks. I had some seizures that, that's never happened before. Oh, and come out of the hospital and realize you're not on the pod no more.

[Unknown]

So it seems like your year has started pretty rough.

[Clay]

Just like, oh.

[Julian]

Imagine coming home and being like, that's your, that's your wife. That's the news in your life that matters. Like where the, where the is Juliet, bro?

[Clay]

How long I've been in this coma?

[Unknown]

All these bad takes gave me seizures.

[Julian]

And now I'm back and mine has and I'm like, relearning how to walk and all this, I could finally speak normally. I was wondering, you know, any advice you had on starting a new year in a rough place like this, you know, been. It's been not fun, and I just want to hear your thoughts. Appreciate it. Thank you. Well, I mean, rough places are relative, man. Like, I. I got fired. I didn't seize up, and I'm not learning how to walk. I mean, there's always, you know, knock on wood. I mean, you sound amazing. Kudos to you for literally and figuratively getting back on your feet. I'm sorry that the, you know, the breakup happened. You know, that's really. If that could have saved you a seize or two, I don't know. That's insane that you'd, like.

[Unknown]

This is on your mind when you're.

[Julian]

Going through, like, a.

[Unknown]

A medical emergency.

[Julian]

It's like, where the fuck is Julian?

[Clay]

Hey, man, you better, bro.

[Julian]

The thought of that to me is. I'm honored, but, like, what an awful.

[Unknown]

Thing to go through to then care.

[Julian]

What the fuck I'm up to. It's insane. Like, I'm picturing him, like, in a hospital bed learning how to speak and eat again and potentially being told he might not be able to walk again.

[Unknown]

In finding my new phone number and.

[Julian]

Calling and be like, hold on one. Doctor. Hold on a sec. I need to. Hey, Julian, man. Hey.

[Unknown]

You know, you heard.

[Julian]

You had a rough year, too, buddy. My shit was peanuts compared to what the fuck you're going through, man, so. But thank you. Let's give him some actual tangible advice. I was wondering if you have any advice to someone that's starting in a rough year in a rough place. I think anytime you're in a rough place, not even if it's like a New Year's thing in clay. I mean, I feel like we've all. You've had some rough places.

[Clay]

Yeah, definitely.

[Julian]

I think running from self evaluation is something that a lot of men do. In particular, it's the avoidant energy. I think it's important to look inward and give yourself time to think and reflect internally. Which means, like, you know, turning off the music, turning off YouTube, watching shows, listening to podcasts, and sitting with your thoughts, whether that be journaling or just.

[Unknown]

Thinking out loud or just thinking in general. Give your. Give yourself the attention that you need.

[Julian]

For yourself, and with that, also use.

[Unknown]

People that you love. I think a lot.

[Julian]

Again, men, mostly, when we're in a rut, we don't like to communicate. We want to hold it all in, talk to you, if your parents, siblings, relationships, friends, use them, talk to them. I'm not saying trauma dumb, but just say, hey, like, you know, I, this happened to me today, I'm feeling sad about this or this has been difficult and more often than not, there's someone that you're talking to that has had a similar situation.

[Unknown]

I'm sure not to the degree of.

[Julian]

Like the physical ailment that you went through, but like, you know, the, the.

[Unknown]

Self doubt or the questions about will.

[Julian]

I be myself again, will I bounce back? Everyone's gone through some form of trouble or trauma that they could at least pass on some enlightenment to your situation.

[Clay]

Yeah, that's, that's beautiful. As you said, I'm not gonna take up too much time, but honestly man, I feel like you're doing some of those things to redefine who you are. Like, you, you had a, a crazy situation. You weren't talking, you weren't walking, and it sounds like you were able to get on your feet. So you're already doing some things that to me are honorable for you, bro. I'll just say have small goals. Like, one of the things I do to help my mental health out is having small goals to accomplish throughout the week and that enhances my dopamine. And that way I felt as though that I was struggling when I would have long term goals. So for your perspective, you might want to be fully healthy and your doctor says, hey, it's going to take eight months. So you just having that one goal, it's gonna feel like it's eight months away.

[Julian]

Yeah.

[Clay]

You know, so maybe you have certain goals throughout the week. Like, you know, I want to do this an inch better. And I'm telling you, bro, just having like those small little goals, having a small, little dopamine is gonna make you feel a little bit better. And you know, I understand that you had a rough, rough start to the year, but that's just a start. You are the captain of your life. You own your destiny. So if you don't like the way how things are going, change that. Change it. Try to think about what, what would make this year worthwhile and aim towards that. Read books. Try to put yourself in an imaginary mindset where now you're manifesting exactly who you want to be. I hate to get so full out, you know?

[Unknown]

No, go up, dude. Let it fly.

[Julian]

I think this, the stuff like this, I mean, I feel like we don't hear a lot about this phase. We always hear so much about the, when the job finished, like, goals accomplished I did it. I climbed the mountain. We always hear about the success. But this guy calling in is, is.

[Unknown]

Called in shortly, like literally I can finally speak normally is the thing he said in this voicemail.

[Julian]

Yeah, like that in itself, like you're, that's huge.

[Unknown]

But you're also calling us at a very vulnerable time.

Yeah.

[Julian]

And if I'm someone that you want to talk to during this journey, like keep calling in, whatever. Like, but, but point is, your point, which I think is very important. Everyone is asked, what's your three to five year plan? What's your like long term goals? There's so many things that need to happen in those moments to make those things even possible. And for you, whatever those goals may be to your point of like the weekly goals, even if it's like a daily thing, challenge yourself. Hey, I, you know, I never read books I want to read.

[Unknown]

Don't just grab a 300 page book.

[Julian]

And be like, I gotta do like, okay, let me read like five pages a day. Start off like small, just make small.

[Unknown]

Goals or just do little things that.

[Julian]

Make you the better, the best version of yourself. Yeah, but dude, this is, I mean this is, I'm still not over. This is crazy. Thank you for checking in on me and I hope you call back and give us updates because you will, you know, your physic, your, you will build back better. You will be a better version of yourself.

[Clay]

Shout out to you man, you sound awesome as well. I didn't, I couldn't even tell that you suffered from a stroke.

[Unknown]

Yeah, seizures. Here's had some seizures that never happened before.

[Julian]

Came out of the hospital and never really. Yeah, I mean the fact that this.

[Unknown]

Is just all said in one breath to me is insane. I had some seizures that's never happened before.

[Julian]

And I come out of the hospital and realize you're not on the pod no more. Why is that? Even in the same, like shouldn't be.

[Unknown]

Treated in the same breath.

[Clay]

But you probably learned how to speak when he saw you weren't motivated enough.

[Unknown]

Like I gotta call Julie.

[Julian]

Yeah, like that woke him up.

[Clay]

Like you motivated him like saying completely. He couldn't. He stood up, he's like, wait a.

[Julian]

Minute, I can't take this dude. That's insane. Appreciate you man. Well, I think that's good. I don't know where we're at time wise, but I feel like we, we put in some work, bro. What's your plan? We got one night in New York. This, by the time this comes out, this night will be long and gone. What do you want to do tonight? You got any plans, man?

[Clay]

I got, I got my suitcase, so I'm going to the Philadelphia Eagles parade. And the thing is, I gotta be up at like 7 in the morning, so I feel like I gotta get back to Jersey. But I'm down to get a beer. If you want to get a beer.

[Julian]

We could pop downstairs. That's why where I live, there's plenty of options.

[Clay]

I'll just.

[Julian]

Let me get out of some sweats. I'll throw on some real clothes. Let's get a drink, man.

[Clay]

Let's do that. Let's do that.

[Julian]

Always fun, man. Always a good time. Oh, thank you for being with us. Obviously, if you want to call in, it's 877557SWWP. Your intrusive thought therapist is here, as is Clay. Clay, my first on camera guest. Thank you so much, man. I threw this together. I don't know. We got two lights going up, we got the single cam. Hopefully we can get two cams at some point. But I'm, I'm honestly, when I started this podcast, you were the first person I had in mind when it comes to having a guest on. So the like to our point of making goals to see it and to execute it. To me, this is a big deal. I'm not going to get emotional about it, but this is awesome that like this moment's happening and for us to connect with the old show and to.

[Unknown]

Keep a real relationship, an authentic relationship.

[Julian]

And for you to be here literally in my apartment, this means a lot to me. So thank you.

[Clay]

And I got shout out to you, man. You super authentic, bro, like from the moment. And we had our first conversation. You've been a legit friend and we were just talking about how it's tough to have like a dope friend. So appreciate you, bro, for just following up and just being legit.

[Julian]

Let's get a beer.

[Clay]

Yes. Get a beer, man. Go.

[Unknown]

Thanks, guys.