Adam Kay: Eleven Enormous Memory Boxes

Summary

Podcast Summary: Sort Your Life Out Unpacked – Adam Kay: Eleven Enormous Memory Boxes

Host: Dilly Carter (BBC Sounds)
Guest: Adam Kay, writer, comedian, and former doctor
Date: July 21, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this episode, organizational expert Dilly Carter invites beloved author, comedian, and former doctor Adam Kay to "Sort Your Life Out Unpacked." True to the show’s concept, Adam brings in three personal mystery objects from his home, each unlocking stories and reflections about what matters most to him. Amid tales of creative chaos, family, and the realities of parenting and memory-keeping, Dilly dispenses gentle but practical advice for decluttering and making space—physically and emotionally. The tone is witty, candid, and warmly self-deprecating, with both host and guest sharing laughs and relatable truths about clutter, sentimentality, and life transitions.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Adam’s Relationship with Organization & Mess

• Acceptance of chaos: Adam rates himself “3 out of 10” for organization (02:01), explaining that he’s “not bothered by mess” unless guests are coming round—then he’ll just “push some stuff behind the sofa.”
  Quote:

  “I had an epiphany in my 20s that I didn’t really care what people thought about me... it was very liberating. And then that gradually extended to other parts of my... life.” (02:22, Adam Kay)

• Upbringing & Rebellion: Both Adam and his husband James grew up in organized households, which led to a natural rebellion against tidiness in adulthood (03:10).

• Parenting knock-on: Adam jokes their children’s rebellion might be “with a J cloth” (03:39)

2. Quickfire Home Truths

• Adam’s home: “Knee deep in crisps.” (03:56, Adam Kay)
• Bedside table: “Covered in books... a wobbly stack.” (04:00, Adam Kay)
• Dishwashing bugbear: James never puts things in the dishwasher—even though it’s next to the sink.
  Quote:

  “It takes no more effort to open the thing and put it in the dishwasher than to put it in the sink.” (04:51, Adam Kay)

3. Unpacking the Three Mystery Boxes

A. Fabric & Wallpaper Swatches

(First Box Discussion 05:30 – 11:12)

• Reason for collection: Deep in a major home renovation, Adam is surrounded by mountains of fabric and wallpaper samples.
  Quote:

  “I would say that depth of stack—couple of foot of fabrics. This is a reflection of your life at the moment: choosing fabrics.” (05:49, Adam Kay)

• Moving & Storage: His family has moved out, put belongings in costly storage, and only decluttered “5%” of their stuff before moving (06:48).
• Unopened boxes dilemma: Adam admits some boxes have remained closed through multiple house moves and will probably go straight from storage to their new loft (07:29).
  Quote:

  “One day I’ll die and then my children will have to get rid of it. And that’s the plan.” (07:47, Adam Kay)

• Dilly’s advice: Urges Adam to sort through these boxes to spare future generations the burden.
• Memory Box Mountain: Adam’s kids already have 11 large memory boxes by age three.

  “We have three-year-olds now... we’ve got 11 of these boxes... That’s 66 boxes by the time they’re 18... This is unsustainable, isn’t it?” (09:06, Adam Kay)

• Dilly recommends one large 80-liter box per child, total, for all childhood keepsakes (09:34–09:43).

B. Magnetic Building Tiles

(Second Box Discussion 11:52 – 16:10)

• Favorite toy: Adam’s kids adore magnetic tiles, and they own “so many of them” thanks to enthusiastic gifting.
  Quote:

  “We have so many of them... I’d say like a mid-sized saloon [car] full.” (12:19, Adam Kay)

• Toy chaos: Despite baskets, tiles are scattered throughout the house, sometimes found in the fridge.

  “It’s like glitter goes everywhere. But on a sort of larger scale. A larger, more hurty scale.” (13:00 & 13:17, Adam Kay)

• James’ hyper-educational approach: Adam’s husband, James, quizzes their kids on shapes and terms (“That’s an equilateral triangle, that’s an isosceles triangle...”) (13:20).
• Cuddly toy overload: Soft toys are currently stored on radiators (fire hazard!), prompting Dilly to suggest hammocks and zip-up beanbags for storage (14:46–15:47).
• Adam on parenting journey:

  “There was a long gap between realizing we wanted to have kids... and working out the logistics… All the different, you know, avenues—all of which are a nightmare in a different way.” (16:10, Adam Kay)

• Adopted via surrogate: Both children had different gestational/medical experiences, including one child, Ruby, born six weeks premature (17:45).

C. Fountain Pen

(Third Box Discussion 20:48 – 24:54)

• Significance: Adam still writes by hand, which feels natural and fosters creativity—“writing is my job.” (20:57).
• Writing Process:

  “When I learned how to be creative, it was coming out my head... through my pen. So that’s the natural way for me to get my thoughts down.” (21:09, Adam Kay)

• Handwriting: Only Adam can decipher it, living up to the medical stereotype.
• Pen collection: Owns around 6–8 fountain pens, most gifts (22:34).
• Desk/Stationery Chaos:

  “In my desk there’s a big drawer… I don’t know what post-it I would write on this drawer... It contains a screwdriver, my passport, kid’s birth certificates... and some sellotape.” (22:39, Adam Kay)

• Creative mess: Desk remains functionally clear, but the chaos is pushed to the sides; Adam uses many colored post-its for plotting books and scripts on the wall (“Beautiful Mind” style) (23:33–24:12).
• Dilly’s verdict: Adam’s creative process works, so don’t mess with that—just contain it to the office!

4. Sell, Donate, Keep?

(25:53)

• Keep: The magnetic building tiles (“I can’t imagine a world where the kids can’t spend two hours building things.”)
• Donate: The fabric and wallpaper swatches (“someone else can have every style available in the UK”)
• Sell: The gift pen (best market value, though sentimental)

5. Adam’s Happy Place

(26:36)

• Favorite spot at home: With his kids, usually in their bedroom (“where they took their first steps,” despite the chaos).

  “That is what makes a house a home.” (27:02, Dilly Carter)

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• “If [the kids] are going to rebel, it’s going to be with a J cloth.” (03:39, Adam Kay)
• “One day I’ll die and then my children will have to get rid of it. And that’s the plan.” (07:47, Adam Kay)
• “We have three-year-olds now… we’ve got 11 of these [memory] boxes... this is unsustainable, isn’t it?” (09:06, Adam Kay)
• “It’s like glitter goes everywhere. But on a sort of larger scale. A larger, more hurty scale.” (13:17, Adam Kay)
• “Now all of my thoughts are about these two kids. I don’t care about myself in the slightest.” (18:08, Adam Kay)
• On his desk drawer: “Kid’s birth certificates might still be in there and it’s got my pension. And some sellotape.” (22:57, Adam Kay)
• On writing: “My process is often slightly messy, so I do have a lot of post-it notes… It’s a bit Beautiful Mind...” (23:38–24:12, Adam Kay)
• “The clutter is part of my process, or that’s what I’m claiming.” (25:28, Adam Kay)

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Organizational Tips from Dilly

• Moving: Use post-it notes to plan where things go before unpacking (11:12).
• Memory storage: Be ruthless—one big box per child for keepsakes (09:34).
• Toy organization: Use lightweight boxes or baskets that fit shelves; hammocks or zip bags for surplus soft toys (14:46–15:47).
• Clutter containment: Let creative workspaces be messy but keep communal areas tidy (24:54).

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 02:01 – Adam’s organization philosophy (3/10 for tidiness)
• 03:56 – Quickfire home truths (“knee deep in crisps”)
• 05:30 – First box: Fabric & wallpaper swatches/moving stories
• 08:15 – Memory boxes & decluttering for children
• 11:52 – Second box: Magnetic tiles & parental toy chaos
• 16:10 – Surrogacy, parenting journey, family changes
• 20:48 – Third box: Fountain pen & Adam’s creative writing process
• 25:53 – Sell, donate, or keep: making choices with sentimental stuff
• 26:36 – Adam’s happy place at home

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Tone & Takeaways

Adam’s humor and candor about the joyful mess of family life and creativity make this an honest, funny, and subtly touching episode. Dilly grounds the chat in practical advice, but never forces tidiness at the expense of meaning or memory. For listeners, the episode reassures us that organization doesn’t have to mean sterility, and that a meaningful, happy home can be “knee-deep in crisps”—as long as we’re intentional about what (and who) we keep close.

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Transcript

[Adam Kay]

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[Adam Kay]

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[Adam Kay]

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[Dilly Carter]

I'm Dilly Carter, the organized one, and this is sort your life out Unpacked. Get ready to unpack three boxes with my celebrity guest. Every box has an item from their own home, plus a load of stories and memories. And standby for my tips on how to sort your own life out too. My guest this episode is the beloved writer of the bestselling book and BAFTA winning TV show this Is Going To Hurt. And as a comedian and former doctor, he's very well placed to tickle our funny bone. He's content with a little mess, which is just as well as he describes himself as a 3 out of 10. When it comes to organisation, it is the hugely talented and hilarious Adam Kay. Welcome to Sort yout Life Out Unpacked.

[Adam Kay]

Thanks for having me. Thanks. Sort my life Out.

[Dilly Carter]

Oh my gosh. Well, I haven't yet, but I'm hoping to. 3 out of 10. When it comes to organization, Adam, why

[Adam Kay]

I'm not bothered by mess.

[Dilly Carter]

Okay, so you, and so it doesn't, you know, you don't see it.

[Adam Kay]

I see it. And if other people are coming around, you know, I'm aware that I'll be judged a bit and I'll, you know, push some stuff behind the sofa, but,

[Dilly Carter]

you know, that's, that's your method of organization.

[Adam Kay]

I had an epiphany in my 20s that I didn't really care what people thought about me a long time, like really stressed about how I dress and, you know, and do your hair and this stuff. And then I was like, oh, actually no, it doesn't. It was very liberating moment. And then that gradually extended to other parts of my. Of my life.

[Dilly Carter]

And is your partner the same so you both sort of enable each other?

[Adam Kay]

Yes.

[Dilly Carter]

I think the thing is with any type of. When you're like that, it's also a lot to do with how we're brought up and how we're raised. And, you know, sometimes the environment, you know, if our parents weren't naturally tidy or if they weren't naturally organized, then we tend not to be or we go the other way.

[Adam Kay]

So that's both of us. So we're both from quite organized places. On a coaster, please. Households.

[Dilly Carter]

Oh, okay.

[Adam Kay]

And so I think both of our natural rebellion has. Has led us to. Led us in the other. And the other thing is, if someone is always tidying up around you, it sort of doesn't really become part of the grammar of your life.

[Dilly Carter]

No. So do you think that is now going to have a knock on effect on your children?

[Adam Kay]

If they're going to rebel, it's going to be with a J cloth.

[Dilly Carter]

I cannot wait to see what you've brought in. I'm very excited about them. But I want to ask you a few quick fire home truths. Number one, how would you describe your home in a sentence?

[Adam Kay]

Knee deep in crisps.

[Dilly Carter]

Knee deep in crisps.

[Adam Kay]

Yes.

[Dilly Carter]

Complete the sentence. My bedside table is covered in books. Covered in books.

[Adam Kay]

I mean, I'd say there's, you know, there's sort of a good couple of foot stack of.

[Dilly Carter]

I was just gonna say. Is it a wobbly stack?

[Adam Kay]

Wobbly stack.

[Dilly Carter]

Do you read every night?

[Adam Kay]

Not every.

[Dilly Carter]

Try to.

[Adam Kay]

I read like Green Eggs and Ham every night.

[Dilly Carter]

Green Eggs and Ham. Great book.

[Adam Kay]

I probably read something for me every couple of nights.

[Dilly Carter]

What is your house? Bugbear.

[Adam Kay]

Right. So even though I've said I'm not, like I've said, I'm three out of 10.

[Dilly Carter]

Yeah.

[Adam Kay]

I'm not naught out of 10. I'm not a savage.

[Dilly Carter]

No.

[Adam Kay]

So James, my husband, seems congenitally incapable of putting things in the dishwasher. And like the dishwasher is next to the sink.

[Dilly Carter]

Yes.

[Adam Kay]

And it takes no more effort to open the thing and put it in the dishwasher than to put it in the sink.

[Dilly Carter]

In the sink.

[Adam Kay]

And like the worst of it is, so we're sort of redoing our. We're redoing our kitchen.

[Dilly Carter]

Oh, I've heard of that.

[Adam Kay]

At the moment there's a sort of Renault ongoing. And then they showed me this picture of this kitchen and said, do you think we should get two dishwashers and

[Dilly Carter]

you're like, you don't even use one.

[Adam Kay]

We're gonna have two empty dishwashers and a double stacked sink next to it.

[Dilly Carter]

Shall we have a look at your first item in your box? So if you'd like to pass me that over.

[Adam Kay]

There you are.

[Dilly Carter]

Thank you very much. We have swatches of fabric and wallpaper.

[Adam Kay]

Yes.

[Dilly Carter]

So tell me why. Well, I mean, you've just touched on the fact that, you know, you're renovating. So I can only imagine that all these swatches of fabric, which are very beautiful, by the way, are to do with your renovation. Tell me.

[Adam Kay]

I would say that that depth of stack.

[Dilly Carter]

Good.

[Adam Kay]

Couple of foot of fabrics.

[Dilly Carter]

This is a reflection of your life at the moment.

[Adam Kay]

Yes.

[Dilly Carter]

Choosing fabrics.

[Adam Kay]

Fabrics. And there's carpets and there's tiles and there's wallpapers.

[Dilly Carter]

And you're renovating the whole house.

[Adam Kay]

Yeah. So to the extent that we've been exciting, we've moved out.

[Dilly Carter]

Oh, okay.

[Adam Kay]

Really big, every room.

[Dilly Carter]

A really big renovation.

[Adam Kay]

Really, really big Renault. But. And it's a. It was a nice, like an old house and the lady who'd lived there before lived there for like 60, 70 years.

[Dilly Carter]

Wow. Okay.

[Adam Kay]

Amazing. But it needed, it needed so much work that we couldn't just sort of get on with it. It was like all the rooms. So we've moved from that into a much smaller place.

[Dilly Carter]

And so have you had to put stuff into storage?

[Adam Kay]

We've got. Yeah, we've got some stuff in. In storage.

[Dilly Carter]

Yeah. Which is costly, isn't it?

[Adam Kay]

That is costly.

[Dilly Carter]

Yep.

[Adam Kay]

We did throw some stuff out.

[Dilly Carter]

I was just about to say, did you have a declutter before you moved out?

[Adam Kay]

I mean, I'd say we got rid of 5% of us.

[Dilly Carter]

5%? Yeah, yeah. I mean, that's 5% more than you had. So.

[Adam Kay]

Yeah, you know, so it is. It's in the right direction. It's not like we've bought more stuff.

[Dilly Carter]

Congratulate you for that.

[Adam Kay]

So there's that. But there are quite a lot of boxes that have not been opened over two house moves.

[Dilly Carter]

Oh. So what does that tell you about the stuff in those boxes?

[Adam Kay]

If they haven't, they need to be treasured forever. I know, I know, I know. But it's sort of, it's.

[Dilly Carter]

Do you think the likelihood is, is that it's going to come out of storage and go into the loft? Yeah.

[Adam Kay]

Oh, yeah. 100%.

[Dilly Carter]

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. They're not going to go through it?

[Adam Kay]

No.

[Dilly Carter]

Why would you? Why would you. Why would you go through all of that stuff, let's just transfer it from one loft to another to another. That is what most people, they move house and they think, you know what, rather than deal with it, we'll just put it in the loft or we'll put it in the garage or we'll put it in the shed and then we'll.

[Adam Kay]

And one day I'll die and then my children will have to get rid of it.

[Dilly Carter]

Yes.

[Adam Kay]

And that's the plan.

[Dilly Carter]

Well, here is the plan that I think is a much better plan is number one, we should really go through those boxes because I'll tell you why, like you just said, rightly so, those boxes will go from one loft to another to another and they never get opened. And then, you know, fast forward 15 years, you know, 20 years, 30 years, your kids are then dealing with this stuff that has never been dealt with and no one knows what to do with it.

[Adam Kay]

There is also an active problem here which is we are creating memory boxes for the kids.

[Dilly Carter]

Wow.

[Adam Kay]

So it started like a lock of hair and like the first footprint and then we bought, went on Etsy and bought this like beautiful little thing with inlaid, you know, wooden box and like within like four minutes we've got more stuff that can fit in that box. So we then go to Tesco's and get the big 80 liter, you know, big box, big sort of see through plastic ones. So we have three year olds now, so they're a sixth of the way to being 18 and hopefully getting off the payroll and out the house. You know, theoretically, we hope as plan a, we've got 11 of these boxes,

[Dilly Carter]

11 memory boxes already, these 80 litre things.

[Adam Kay]

So that means if that's a sixth of it. Yes, that's, that's 66 boxes. That's, you know, that's a thick end of 5,000 liters by the time.

[Dilly Carter]

That's a lot.

[Adam Kay]

This is unsustainable, isn't it? Our loft is not. Doesn't have that space in it.

[Dilly Carter]

No, it doesn't. No it doesn't. And although we love our children and love everything that they make and create, we need to be ruthless about what we are keeping. Yeah.

[Adam Kay]

What's the right, what's the right. How many things should I keep per year of life?

[Dilly Carter]

Well, really I would say that actually I would only have one big 80 liter box per child for like all their.

[Adam Kay]

But what if they become president or something and they, you know, they need to. What's that archive gonna look like? They'll have to say to the Smithsonian, I've thrown away 5,000 liters of their terrible Easter pottery.

[Dilly Carter]

Well, this is it, I think. You know, we have to remember they are three years old. They've only had three years worth of memor. In fact, they've probably only had a year, haven't they, of actually being able to do stuff?

[Adam Kay]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. There's not the first year. They're not generating much that isn't in a nappy.

[Dilly Carter]

I really hope that your children are going to be presidents one day and that I'm kicking myself and you are going to come at me and go, I told you I should have kept all of that. Look, the world is their oyster. Who knows? But I think we have to be a bit realistic. If you think there's an endless supply of boxes in the world for their memories, you're never going to stop.

[Adam Kay]

No, you're right.

[Dilly Carter]

So when you move back into your house, how are we going to move back in? Because I'm a little bit concerned. Have you got a plan? Do you know exactly what you're doing?

[Adam Kay]

I've got absolutely no plan.

[Dilly Carter]

You've got no plans?

[Adam Kay]

No.

[Dilly Carter]

You're just going to leave everything in boxes and slowly just take one plate out at a time? Post it notes are my best friend. Post it. Notes are your best friend as well for when you are planning your space. So when you're moving into your new kitchen, before you unpack your boxes, have a look at the cupboards, have a look at the room and think, right, what do I want there? So having post it notes, sticking them on the cupboards just means that at least then you know, Right, okay. Let me just plan out where everything's gonna go before I start unloading boxes into any old cupboard and go.

[Adam Kay]

Because then the pans never move, do they?

[Dilly Carter]

What will happen is everything will get unloaded into those. Into those cupboards and you'll go, we'll deal with that later.

[Adam Kay]

Yes. And then they're there forever. Cause who's ever gonna take out all of the plates and move them?

[Dilly Carter]

No one is gonna do that. Have a thought at least in the back of your head before you go into that new space.

[Adam Kay]

Yep. Wise words.

[Dilly Carter]

I wish. I wish you luck. Shall we have a look at your second item? Okay. Would you like to hand me over your second box, please? Okay. Right. So in the second box I have. Oh, big box for a very small toy. And these toys, they're like.

[Adam Kay]

I mean, I could have filled that box.

[Dilly Carter]

You could have filled that.

[Adam Kay]

I could have filled a lot of that box.

[Dilly Carter]

You could have filled that box with these toys. So what I have in my hand, they're magnetic tiles. They're things that kids make houses, shapes, all sorts of different things with. So is this your children's favorite, absolute favorite toy? Yep. How many do you think you've got?

[Adam Kay]

I would say it could fill like

[Dilly Carter]

a 80 litre box.

[Adam Kay]

No, no, no. I'd say like a mid sized saloon.

[Dilly Carter]

A mid sized saloon? Yeah.

[Adam Kay]

We have so many of them.

[Dilly Carter]

Oh my gosh.

[Adam Kay]

And because. Because anyone who sees how much they love them and then it becomes like an obvious gift for them.

[Dilly Carter]

They must be more.

[Adam Kay]

Oh yeah, more of them. And like there are things they can do, you know, they're like expansion kits to buy marble runs and things like that. And so lots and lots of people, very kindly and their much loved items bought more of it. And it's expanded and expanded. And so even though there are now they're not in boxes, they're in like baskets.

[Dilly Carter]

Yes, yeah.

[Adam Kay]

Sort of big sort of wickery baskets. We've got a few, like maybe three of those.

[Dilly Carter]

Yeah. Filled with the tiles.

[Adam Kay]

Filled with these tiles. But they just end up everywhere. And I'll quite often go to bed and what's that in my. And then it's some triangle of this sort of magnetic plastic that sort of. It's just gone everywhere. It's like glitter goes everywhere. But on a sort of larger scale.

[Dilly Carter]

A larger, more hurty scale. Yes.

[Adam Kay]

And also sort of educational. Cause James will be like the. And how many sides has a cube got? Okay, let's work. So I don't believe in going. Could you. Could you coo to the babies, you know? Cause they're gonna have to speak the language. He's gone one further and speaks them like they're doing their sort of Ph.D. and so he'll say, and that's an equilateral triangle. And this was an isosceles triangle.

[Dilly Carter]

Wow.

[Adam Kay]

I mean, I guess. Sure. I mean, maybe they will be president. Maybe they will.

[Dilly Carter]

So the weirdest place you've ever found one of those is fridge in the fridge.

[Adam Kay]

Yeah. Cause they can. They can. Now Ziggy, who's the taller of the two, can just about open the fridge. So the fridge is now like another surprise cupboard for us.

[Dilly Carter]

Full of tiles.

[Adam Kay]

Yeah.

[Dilly Carter]

Brilliant. So you can get your milk and.

[Adam Kay]

Yeah. And a sort of, you know, mini rocket ship.

[Dilly Carter]

Would you rather have their stuff more organized? Do you think it would help?

[Adam Kay]

Yeah, that would help.

[Dilly Carter]

Yeah.

[Adam Kay]

Also we've got quite a lot of like shelving units, but that's Quite free form. It's still on display because it's an open shelving unliving. And also it's just like I put the thing on a gap on a shelf. Rather than this being in something and this being, you know, there's no categories

[Dilly Carter]

in your open shelving unit. No, it's just a mixture of things.

[Adam Kay]

It's a casserole. It's a casserole of things, children's items.

[Dilly Carter]

To make it look better, you could then put them into containers on the shelves.

[Adam Kay]

Oh, yeah.

[Dilly Carter]

So you could use boxes, you know, to put in there. So you might find a box that fits that space that looks lovely. Like, you know, your fabric, pastels, whatever it is. You want fabric because it's light so that the toys can go in there. You don't want anything plastic and heavy and bulky. And then you can categorize all of those open shelving so it looks much neater.

[Adam Kay]

Yes. The soft toys have proliferated.

[Dilly Carter]

I mean, you could always put them in a hammock and hang them from the ceiling. If there's lots of those that'll take them off the floor.

[Adam Kay]

So we've taken them off the floor and we've put them all on the radiators. Presumably at some point they'll just catch fire, won't they?

[Dilly Carter]

As well as that being a bit of a healthy health issue.

[Adam Kay]

The hammock, That's a good idea.

[Dilly Carter]

Yeah. But also what is another great idea if you've got lots of cuddly toys, is to have one of those zip up bean bags that you fill with the toys and then they've got like a bean bag and they don't mind

[Adam Kay]

about jumping on bluey.

[Dilly Carter]

They'll love it. They'll love it. They won't care because they'll switch it around. You keep out their favourites. So keep out their favorite toys and put away the ones that they're not playing with into the big bag.

[Adam Kay]

I like that.

[Dilly Carter]

And then you might have two little

[Adam Kay]

seats because the hammock is still on display.

[Dilly Carter]

Yeah. The hammock could be in the corner of their bedroom. So they could have a hammock each in the corner of their bedrooms for all the toys that they can't bear to be part top tier. Yep. The ones that they want to keep, they won't let go. Have a couple on their bed and then they can have a beanbag full of toys. Did you always want to have children? Was that always in your plan?

[Adam Kay]

It's. I mean that's a complicated one because there was a Long gap between realizing that we wanted to have kids in our lives and working out of the logistics of it and like all the different, you know. Cause, you know, whether it's co parenting or adopting and whether it's surrogacy or this or that or the other, and it's like there's lots of avenues, all of which are a nightmare in a different way. And they're all complicated and they'll have huge pros and potential cons. And so we just spent a long time, you know, we're not decisive people. We've had those swatches on our living room table for three months. It's probably delayed us moving back into our house that we actually want to be in. So like making this sort of absolutely enormous, enormous life decision.

[Dilly Carter]

It's huge.

[Adam Kay]

Took a while, but then once you've, you know, once you've committed then, you know, and it's. And they've been amazing.

[Dilly Carter]

Yeah.

[Adam Kay]

They've also been terrible, but they've overall been amazing children.

[Dilly Carter]

And you ended up having, having a surrogate.

[Adam Kay]

That's right, yeah.

[Dilly Carter]

And you had two surrogates with both children.

[Adam Kay]

So like plan A in our heads.

[Dilly Carter]

Yeah.

[Adam Kay]

Was that they'd be sort of born about the, the same time, but then the vagaries of IVF mean that, you know, one of them took a few cycles and one. And then, and then Ruby was born quite prematurely. I knew as soon as she came out that it wasn't. Everything wasn't going to plan.

[Dilly Carter]

Yep. She was two weeks. Did you say premature?

[Adam Kay]

She was about six weeks.

[Dilly Carter]

Six weeks premature. Sorry.

[Adam Kay]

And there were, she wasn't, you know, I didn't think she was making the right noises. And there were two. There were too many pediatricians coming there more people coming and then a lot of tubes. And I was just a bit like, you know, and everyone's being very calm and reassuring, you know, and this is fine. But I'm just like, this is. And, but, you know, and how does

[Dilly Carter]

it feel now you've got this family?

[Adam Kay]

Everyone says it goes so fast and everyone says it changes your life and you're like. But it changed your life more than you could. More than I'd ever realized because it made me realize how selfish I was as a person. And not in a bad way. I don't think being selfish is necessarily just all bad. It's like, you know, you're responsible for yourself and your life and your career and all these things. But now all of my thoughts are about these two kids. I don't care about myself. In the slightest. Now, if everything's fine with them, I am happy. All is well. Anytime, you know, I'm doing something like this and I'm on airplane mode, I've got a bit of my brain slightly stress that, you know, there's going to be a text from James about, you know, you know, do we need to see the GP about that? And can you look? Because that is all of my processing power is now about them. And so it hasn't just changed my life because there's a lot more, you know, bluey paraphernalia around than there used to be. It's changed my life because it's changed me as a, as a person and what's important to me and what. Of course, and what my plan. Now.

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[She's Birdie Advertiser]

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[Adam Kay]

looks like.

[Dilly Carter]

Let's have a look and see what is in this tiny little box.

[Adam Kay]

Tiny box.

[Dilly Carter]

A pen.

[Adam Kay]

Pen.

[Dilly Carter]

So this is a shiny silver pen and it is a fountain pen.

[Adam Kay]

So, I mean, writing is my job

[Dilly Carter]

and which you do so brilliantly.

[Adam Kay]

I do a lot of it and I still write by hand. Old school.

[Dilly Carter]

So you write everything down by hand?

[Adam Kay]

Pretty much. And I think it's because of what school was like. So when I learned how to be creative, it was coming out my head onto paper through my pen. And so that's the natural way for me to get my thoughts down.

[Dilly Carter]

Yeah.

[Whole Foods Market / Grainger Advertiser]

Obviously.

[Dilly Carter]

Feels more natural.

[Adam Kay]

It ends up getting typed up because I think my publishers might give me a phone call if I just sent in my sort of pages and pages of terrible. But it also means that anything I write, I then. It then gets another edit as I then type it up and sort of start up the sentences and another go. Yeah.

[Dilly Carter]

You can read your own handwriting.

[Adam Kay]

No one else can. I can.

[Dilly Carter]

I mean, doctors are notoriously known for not having good handwriting, aren't they? Why is that?

[Adam Kay]

I don't think it's fully unfair. I think it might be because you do quite a lot of writing.

[Dilly Carter]

Yeah.

[Adam Kay]

And I don't think it's possible to do nice copper plate, of course, at that speed. So it does eventually deteriorate a bit.

[Dilly Carter]

So by the time you become a GP in the surgery, that's why you like.

[Adam Kay]

It's all absolutely gone. Absolutely gone. And I get enjoyment from using a nice pen. I think that one was a gift because that's quite, you know, it's a gift that. It's quite an easy gift for a writer.

[She's Birdie Advertiser]

Of course.

[Dilly Carter]

A beautiful pen. How many do you think you've got? Fountain pens?

[Adam Kay]

I've probably got, I don't know, six or eight fountain pens.

[Dilly Carter]

Where do you keep all your pens?

[Adam Kay]

So there. So in my desk there's a big drawer which is. I mean, I don't know what post it. I would write on this drawer because it contains a screwdriver. My passport.

[Dilly Carter]

It's like a junkie.

[Adam Kay]

Kid's birth certificates might still be in there.

[Dilly Carter]

Crikey.

[Adam Kay]

And it's got my pension and think some sellotape.

[Dilly Carter]

Okay, well. So it's almost like a stationary drawer. Almost a stationary plus stationary drawers are, you know, can be very well organized very easily.

[Adam Kay]

It can be. I mean, it's. It's not. It's not a branch of Ryman's in there.

[Dilly Carter]

I mean. Shall I ask what your desk is like?

[Adam Kay]

Generally there's a clear area.

[Whole Foods Market / Grainger Advertiser]

There is.

[Adam Kay]

Because I have to have a clear area.

[Dilly Carter]

Yeah.

[Adam Kay]

Because I'm writing on a piece of paper with a pen and that needs.

[Dilly Carter]

Yeah.

[Adam Kay]

You know, I sort of have to

[Dilly Carter]

have to start with a blank space. Yeah.

[Adam Kay]

But to the margins of that. It's all sort of been pushed to the.

[Dilly Carter]

To the side. And does none of this cause you

[Adam Kay]

stress, you know, don't don't think it does.

[Dilly Carter]

You love to be working at a beautiful clear desk. Does that not help your creative process?

[Adam Kay]

No, no. Think so. The other thing is my process is often slightly messy, so I do have a lot of post it notes.

[Dilly Carter]

Yeah.

[Adam Kay]

Which you'll be pleased about.

[Dilly Carter]

Yes.

[Adam Kay]

But I.

[Whole Foods Market / Grainger Advertiser]

But.

[Adam Kay]

So when I. Like when I'm back in my office, this is harder when I'm just doing this in my bedroom. But I'm still doing a bit. If I'm planning out a script or something or a book or the structure of something, the post notes go up in different colours to show me. So this is this character's arc through it and so, you know, it's a bit like. It's a bit Beautiful Mind or something.

[Dilly Carter]

I try to solve a crime.

[Adam Kay]

Yeah, exactly. All I need is some red string and it's that sort of vibe. So there's a lot of that up, working out where to plant the different

[Dilly Carter]

clues, where they pop up through the book.

[Adam Kay]

Exactly. And maybe there's some clever way because

[Dilly Carter]

you always think you've worked it out in chapter two or three and then you're like, no, yeah, I'm saying put

[Adam Kay]

all the red herrings in. You have to do that. I can't plan it out on a spreadsheet so it gets planned out on the, on the wall. And so I don't. Maybe there's the neat way of doing that. If there is, I don't know what it is.

[Dilly Carter]

I think the fact that someone with a genius mind like yours, if that's the way that you create, then it's been successful. So you have to continue with that. Who am I to tell you to make your wal. I absolutely wouldn't because, you know, I am not creative like you.

[Adam Kay]

What you would say is, let's make the rest of the house neat and just contain it to my office.

[Dilly Carter]

Exactly. I would say, right, let's sort the rest of the house out so you can do what you want in your office. What's incredible is that all of this has come and stemmed from the fact that you were like you said, an obstetrician.

[Adam Kay]

Yeah. And I kept my diaries and you were a doctor. Not with a nice fountain pen generally, with a sort of a Bic Bioro, you know, in my scrubs pockets, scribbling down or something. But. And it's all.

[Dilly Carter]

You must pinch yourself to you now that you think, oh my gosh, now I'm writing, you know, TV shows and series and books and novels. It's great.

[Adam Kay]

It's absolutely Amazing. And, yeah, so I feel very, very lucky. So Even though. But I think the clutter is part of my process, or. That's what I'm. That's what I'm claiming.

[Dilly Carter]

Well, that's what all creative people claim. Well, thank you for bringing me in. Those three items. If you had to, which would you sell, donate, or keep?

[Adam Kay]

Much as I'd like to keep my pens and my livelihood, I can't imagine a world where the kids can't, you know, spend two hours building things. So I'm gonna have to keep the tiles. Keep that. I mean, the pen. I didn't buy that pen because it was. It was given to me by someone nice. But. But it probably got the best market value on the table, so I can sell that and just donate. So someone else can have every single style of wallpaper and fabric available in the United Kingdom when they're renovating there.

[Dilly Carter]

They might be able to make a lovely patchwork wall or blanket. You never know. And my last question to you. Where in your home is your happy place?

[Adam Kay]

Ah, it's. It's probably with the kids. It sounds soppy, but it's true, because, you know, which room. So it's in the bedroom with the kids, which is where all the bedroom with their kids are. And, you know, there's a lot of. I'm not saying it's 100% happy. There's a lot of screaming. It's also where timeout happens. It's also where we've had some great fun stuff. And, you know, and that's where they took their first steps.

[Dilly Carter]

And that is what makes a house a home.

[Adam Kay]

Exactly that.

[Dilly Carter]

Adam, thank you so much for your time. Thank you for coming in. It's been so lovely to sit with you and learn about you and your gorgeous family, and I wish you all the best.

[Adam Kay]

Thanks for having me.

[Dilly Carter]

Thank you. I can't wait to be back with you. For more revealing home truths, organizational hacks, and celeb unboxings, sort your life out. Unpacked is presented by me, Diddy Carter. You can watch us on iplayer and listen on BBC Sounds. And don't forget to subscribe on BBC Sounds and have push notifications turned on on to make sure you don't miss an episode.

[Zandi and Chris (What's Up Docs hosts)]

Zandi, Happy anniversary. What are you talking about?

[Adam Kay]

Have I missed something?

[Zandi and Chris (What's Up Docs hosts)]

Yes, and you have. We are over a year into making what's Up Docs. You didn't even get me a card.

[Adam Kay]

Is it really over a year?

[Zandi and Chris (What's Up Docs hosts)]

It is. Think of all the episodes we've done. How to look after our feet, our shoulders, our hips, our teeth. We've explored snoring, cholesterol, the immune system, endometriosis, all with the help of expert guests. I think it's fair to say we have plundered the world of health and well being, equipping ourselves and our listeners with the best information out there on how to look after our minds, our bodies, our souls even. And we're not stopping, are we? Chris we're most certainly not sand. We have a lot of new topics coming up, from tinnitus to acne, crying, male fertility. We are holding steadfast in our mission to sort facts from fiction, debunking wellness myths along the way. And you can find all of our previous episodes of what's Up Docs in the feed on BBC Sounds. And don't forget to subscribe on BBC Sounds and turn on the notifications so you don't miss any of these upcoming episodes.

[Adam Kay]

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