The Shadow Side from Mind Your Own

Summary

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Podcast Summary: Spooked – Mind Your Own: "The Shadow Side"

Host: Lupita Nyong’o
Release Date: March 24, 2026
Produced by: Snap Studios, KQED, Lemonada Media

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Episode Overview

In "The Shadow Side," celebrated actress and storyteller Lupita Nyong’o dives into the hidden world of Kenyan superstition and true crime. The episode first explores a personal anecdote about youthful guilt and then takes a gripping turn into the real-life confessions of John Kibera—Kenya’s most infamous grave robber. Through chilling firsthand accounts, listeners are led into a world where crime, culture, fear, and the supernatural intertwine. The episode asks: what truly constitutes “getting away with it,” and how far can you push the shadow side before it comes back to claim you?

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Key Sections & Discussion Points

1. Opening: Cultural Superstitions and Guilt

[02:58 – 12:45]

• Lupita Nyong’o shares a childhood story (set in Kenya) illustrating the intersection of superstition and the psychic burden of guilt.
  • Recounts a belief that if someone jumps over your legs, it can stunt your growth or make you barren, unless undone.
  • A sequence of escalating playground antics leads to her deliberately tripping a boy, causing a serious injury (a broken arm).
  • Lupita is wracked with guilt, fearing exposure, but the boy never recognizes her role, and she’s left to carry her secret alone.
  • Quote: “So what constitutes getting away with it? … If I didn’t tell this story, nobody'd know. But I would.” (Lupita Nyong’o, 12:35)

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2. Main Story: The Life of John Kibera, Kenyan Grave Robber

[15:03 – 47:43]

a. From Armed Robbery to Grave Robbing

[16:00 – 19:49]

• John Kibera recounts an early life mired in crime, leading to a turning point after a near-death shootout with police.
• Seeks less violent ways to make money; inspiration strikes at a funeral, noticing the wealth in expensive coffins.
  • Quote: “I really sat down and thought, what kind of crime would not bring me trouble with the police? … How could I steal these coffins?” (John Kibera, 17:17 & 17:52)

b. “Business” Begins: Robbing the Dead

[19:49 – 25:19]

• John assembles a small team, secures a buyer (a coffin dealer), and launches his first grave-robbing heist at Langata Cemetery.
• The wealthy are buried with valuable goods—suits, jewelry, shoes.
  • Quote: “Together with my team, we removed the suit, we removed the shoes, we removed the jewelry, then we dumped the body back...” (John Kibera, 20:39)
• They sell the coffins and valuables for significant profit, using obituaries to target wealthy burials.
  • Expands operations by infiltrating funeral planning meetings in suits to gather intel.

c. An Unlikely Partnership: Margaret Wanjiru Joins

[23:35 – 24:45]

• John’s partner, Margaret, becomes a key team member, skillfully gathering intel during funeral services under the guise of mourning.
  • Quote: “The lady was hardcore.” (John Kibera, 24:45)
• The team grows, their methods get sharper, business booms.

d. Eerie Consequences: Spirits & Superstitions Surface

[25:19 – 29:34]

• A failed robbery in Nyanza triggers tremors and hauntings among the gang; John is plagued by visions of an angered spirit, compelling him to pay restitution.
  • Quote: “When I felt that this dead body, this corpse, was tormenting me, I spoke to one elder ... he told me I had to find 50,000 shillings and go back to that community and ask for forgiveness.” (John Kibera, 29:06)

e. Escalation & Downfall: Greed, Loss, and a Brush with Death

[31:47 – 44:17]

• The team grows reckless, targeting high-profile graves (such as drug lord Ibrahim Akasha).
• A botched heist turns deadly—members are caught and executed by vigilantes. John is wracked by guilt for bringing friends into this tragic fate.
  • Quote: “They had families and I knew their families... I was heartbroken.” (John Kibera, 35:51)
• In financial need, John’s crew pushes him to return to grave robbing.
  • Margaret is asked to quit for her safety, accepting severance to start a business.

f. "Playing Dead": The Notorious Final Heist

[38:12 – 44:17]

• On Boxing Day 2004, a getaway vehicle fails to show. John carjacks a van from a national media company, is trapped inside with a coffin as police attack.
• In a macabre twist, John survives by hiding inside the coffin and “playing dead” convincingly when police open it.
  • Quote: "I lay completely still... trying to put on the look of a dead person." (John Kibera, 42:02)
• When police try to move the "corpse" to the mortuary, John breaks cover, terrifying crowds as the “corpse” is seen running away.
  • Quote: “Can't you see a corpse is running?” (John Kibera, 44:05)

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3. Aftermath and Redemption

[44:29 – 47:43]

• John turns himself in, serves six months in prison. His reputation as Kenya’s “most notorious grave robber” follows him everywhere.

• Social stigma isolates him—friends, romantic prospects, and community members avoid him.

  • He donates his ill-gotten gains: his house (to an orphanage), money (to a women's prison).

• Endeavors to turn his life around through church involvement and motivational speaking, warning youth that “crime does not pay.”

• Even as he attempts to start anew, the shadow of his past haunts him—most heartbreakingly, his wedding is called off when his criminal history is exposed in a newspaper on the very day.

  • Quote: “But on the wedding day, the father of the bride came with a newspaper showing me as a criminal. And he said he cannot allow his daughter to marry a criminal. So he took her away when she was still in her wedding dress.” (John Kibera, 46:51)

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• Witchcraft and caution: “In my family ... the Lord is our shepherd ... but also, watch out for that dude, watch out for that corner. Just err on the side of caution.” (Lupita, 03:10)
• First grave robbery: "He had on a suit, a golden ring chain, good shoes. I was ecstatic." (John Kibera, 20:07)
• Supernatural fear: "We all started trembling and we couldn't do it. And this is the first time I started suspecting that corpses could have evil spirits." (John Kibera, 25:30)
• Playing dead in a coffin: "I stiffened my body and opened my eyes wide and fixed them... I played dead as best as I could." (John Kibera, 42:02)
• Losing love to past crimes: “He said he cannot allow his daughter to marry a criminal. So he took her away when she was still in her wedding dress.” (John Kibera, 46:51)

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Timestamps for Major Segments

| Timestamp | Segment | |-------------|----------------------------------------------| | 02:58-12:45 | Lupita's tale of superstition & guilt | | 15:03-19:49 | John Kibera's switch from armed to grave robbery | | 19:49-25:19 | Anatomy of a grave robbery heist | | 23:35-24:45 | Margaret Wanjiru joins the operation | | 25:19-29:34 | Spirits, visions, and seeking forgiveness | | 31:47-38:12 | Team ambitions, high-stakes heist, team tragedy | | 38:12-44:17 | The final heist—“playing dead” in a coffin | | 44:29-47:43 | Prison, ostracism, redemption, lost love |

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Tone & Style Highlights

• Lupita’s narration is both honest and reflective, blending humor, introspection, and cultural insight.
• John Kibera’s storytelling is disarmingly candid—grim, humorous, and philosophical about crime, consequence, superstition, and fate.
• The episode moves from the mundane and relatable to the outrageous and supernatural, maintaining a suspenseful, immersive storytelling style.

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Closing Reflection

"The Shadow Side" is a deeply engaging exploration of the boundaries between guilt, fate, and forgiveness. Through Lupita’s personal confessions and John Kibera’s shocking life story, listeners confront the haunting weight of secrets, the moral consequences of “getting away with it,” and the possibility (or impossibility) of redemption. The episode blends personal regret with true crime and supernatural folklore, ultimately warning: the shadow side always follows.

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Transcript

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[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

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[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

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Spooksters Today we're riding down a special Spook path. Something a little different cause I'm gonna hand the Spook microphone over to a dear friend of Spook to introduce a series we made in partnership with Lemonada Media to show us Heart with soul, A sprinkle of darkness and drum roll. It's coming to you courtesy of the Oscar winning star of stage and screen, Lupita N Yong'.

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O.

[Mind Your Own Narrator / Announcer]

Because that's how we roll. Some of you Know her from Black Panther or A quiet place, day one, even 12 Years a Slave. But it spooked. We know Lupita as a storyteller, a 3am texter, a gift giver and a host extraordinaire, Lupita Nyong'.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

O.

[Mind Your Own Narrator / Announcer]

Taken away.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

Spooked.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

This episode contains strong language and graphic imagery. Sensitive listeners, please be advised. I don't know one Kenyan who would rule out witchcraft. Juju Urogi. Ah, no, it doesn't exist. I feel in some capacity, every Kenyan has a little belief, a hidden belief in urogi. In my family it was very much, the Lord is our shepherd and the blood of the lamb will cover me and protect me. But also, watch out for that dude, watch out for that corner. Just err on the side of caution. Today we're going to get into all of that superstition. Urogi Juju. We're crossing into the shadow side. I'm Lupita Nyong' o and this is Mind your own. When I was in Year seven, I was hanging out in our field at school. I'd finished my activities and I was waiting for the late bus. Me and my friends were gathered at the edge of the playing field. We were lying on the ground, we were chatting amongst ourselves, just kicking it. And there was a group of boys, I think they were like in year five, running around the field. But for some reason they decided to run in our area. They were running around us and one of the boys decided to jump over my legs. Over my legs. And I was like, so shocked because that is such a bad thing to do. In my culture, there's a superstitious belief that if you jump over someone's legs, you stunt their growth and you could make them barren. The way you undo it is he has to jump over you again. So I'm like, come back here. You come back here. Jump over me. How could you do that? So he comes, he jumps over me and now he's giggling. I'm like, you shouldn't be jumping over us. There's a whole field, go play elsewhere. Me and my friends are huffing and puffing, like, why are they doing this to us? Shame on them. They were so irritated, these small boys, you know? And then I decide, okay, if he does it again, man, I'm gonna have to have a word with him. He does it again. All my purges are falling on deaf ears. I swear to God, next time this boy comes my way, I'm gonna trip him. I'm just gonna kick my leg up, casually the way I have been doing and trip him. So, you know, I get back into conversation. But now my attention is fully on these boys. I'm pretending to engage in this gossip session, but no, I am like listening to the pitter patter of these boys feet, waiting for them to approach. And I lift my foot and it catches his and he falls. Yes, did it. But just as soon as I've rejoiced, I recognize, almost like in retrospect, that the fall didn't sound right. It was a P. And so I'm like, wait, what? I get up, all my friends get up. We're looking at the boy. He sits up, cradling his hand, and he goes, ow. And he looks down at his arm. I look down at his arm and I see that where it's supposed to be brown, there is something white jutting out. And no sooner have I seen that white thing jutting out of blood, his hand is facing the wrong direction. And then he starts to scream. I'm about to be in a lot of trouble. I broke someone's arm. I don't know what to do. There is panic all around me. My friends have run to call the receptionist. The teachers have shown up in no time. There's an ambulance there, you know, I just wanted him to trip and maybe have a little graze on his elbow. That's it, you know, a little whoops. I didn't want him to, like, I didn't want him to end up in hospital. He's put on a stretcher and he's carried away. The teachers that are left behind are trying to figure out what happened. And I feel like everybody knows that I did it on purpose. I'm hearing the boys that were running around, they're telling the teachers, oh, we were playing, we were playing. And then he jumped over. He jumped over their legs and tripped. I realized that nobody knew that I had done it intentionally. And so I chose not to say anything. I was crying and crying. And I remember like my teacher saying, why are you crying so much? You're fine. Can't you see that the boy is hurt? You need to have sympathy for him. Surely they would find out. Surely he would say something. I wanted to find out what hospital he was in. But then I realized that if I take too much action, they might figure it out. And then I might get expelled. My parents might have to pay the hospital bill. At that point, things were tight financially and I knew that he was out of school for a while, maybe a week or two. We were asked to write him a get well soon card. And so I signed the card. And I was just so sure that when he got better and came back to school, he would come for me. When I heard he was back that day, I didn't hear anything my teacher said in those first sessions of class, Man. Cause all I could think about was like, I'm gonna see him. I'm gonna run into him at recess. He was going to point a finger at me and yell at the top of his voice, it's her fault. It's her fault. It's her. Who did was break time. And very unceremoniously, he just passed me by. He had one hell of a cast on. He saw me, he said hi. I said hi. And he just went on. It was like he didn't even recognize me. Like he didn't equate me to his accident at all. At first I was perplexed because here I was and I saw his face every night. And so to see him so unburdened by me was really quite surprising. And then I thought, phew, that means I am really in the clear. I felt relief. And I just kept the guilt. I didn't get suspended, I didn't miss one day of school, and I didn't get socially condemned. If I didn't tell this story, nobody'd know. But I would. So what constitutes getting away with it? Don't go anywhere more. Mind your own after this quick break

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[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

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[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

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[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

Welcome back. You're listening to Mind your Own. At some point or another, we've all had a scheme. Maybe it's a gamble that you're sure is going to turn out in your favor. And it does, and it keeps working for you. It's almost too good to be true. Well, I can tell you with certainty that you have never heard a scheme quite like this one. Today on Mind your Own, we're taking you to Kenya to meet John Kibera, the man who disturbed the dead. I hope you're listening. John Kibera knows a lot about the thief manual.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

You know a thief is not wise. A thief's money is spent quickly, runs out quickly. When you are a thief, you have to be a hypocrite. You have just to pretend that you have no idea what is going on.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

Since age 11, crime was the only way he knew how to survive. He had been caught several times, served some time and went back to robbing banks and carjacking. One day it nearly cost him his life.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

We were at a place called Kawangwari. We accosted this particular victim as they were driving into the compound. We did not know that the police were laying in wait. Ambush. I heard the first gunshot, the second gunshot and the third gunshot. And everyone scrambled. We had gone as a squad of six people. The police gunned down two of them.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

John made it out alive, but this was his last time doing armed robbery. He realized he wanted to find a better, safer hustle.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

I really sat down and thought, what kind of crime would not bring me trouble with the police? What kind of crime would not give me trouble with the public?

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

Attending the burial of one of his friends who was involved in the carjacking was a brutal reminder of why he had to change things up. And at that funeral, he noticed something.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

In the cemetery. I noticed that the rich were being buried in very expensive coffins. And this is where I got the idea. How could I steal these coffins?

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

John imagines it would be like any other heist. You find a buyer.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

I found a coffin shop and talked

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

to the owner, put together a small team of reliable men.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

Two of them. We had been locked up together.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

And yes, there was that one grisly detail of handling dead bodies. But John had a solution for that too.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

Like three beers and then smoke some weed. Even thieves use drugs too, to sort of escape what awaits you.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

All that was left was to do the job. Luckily, John knew a spot that was just 10 minutes away from where he lived in Nairobi. In January of the year 2000, John Kibera and his band of misfits headed to Langata Cemetery for their first heist.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

Langata Cemetery Langata Cemetery is divided into three sections. There is a section for burying the very wealthy. There is a section for burying the millionaires. And the last section is for burying the poor.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

They got there at 2am so there were no guards around to watch them sneak into the wealthiest section of the graveyard. They picked a grave at random and shuffled off the top layer of soil. Underneath was a concrete slab.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

The rich plastered the sides of the grave and then they put the slab on top. The slab made the work easier because all you needed to do was just put it aside.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

After moving the slab aside, the team saw what they had come for. An expensive coffin. They hoisted the coffin out of the hole and set it on the ground. And when they opened it up,

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

He had on a suit, a golden ring chain, good shoes. I was ecstatic.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

John and his team pulled the body out of the coffin, which was less foul than he thought it would be.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

The kind of corpse we are talking about is a rich person's corpse. It was very well preserved. It was like a sculpture.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

Turns out even in death, the wealthy sleep better than the poor.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

So Together with my team, we removed the suit, we removed the shoes, we removed the jewelry, then we dumped the body back without any of the clothes or jewelry and without the coffin. They put the slab back so that people would not catch on. We were fulfilling the scriptures that say. A human being comes naked to the world and they should live naked. And by 4am I had taken the coffin to the businessman who owned the coffin shop. And he paid me my first 70,000 shillings.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

70,000 shillings. That could get you something nice like a top of the line computer or television. And then John took the chain suit and shoes to a second hand market called Gekhom Ba for some extra cash.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

And from there I felt business was really good because now I had found the shop and my work was now to bring in the coffins.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

But John is not even 20 years old at this point. And like a lot of people his age, he went through that cash fast.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

You know, you're in a bar, you need a drink. You know, a woman comes in, you need a woman. You don't want to embarrass yourself in your own local club.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

John knew he had a good thing going. He just had to think more strategically.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

I used to buy the newspaper every day to read the obituaries. And if the obituary was a full page or half page, I knew that the deceased was coming from a wealthy family. In their obituaries they must state that the meeting is taking place at 6pm at this specific place. That's where the meetings to plan the funeral are happening.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

John and his boys would put on suits to blend in, head to the funeral preparation meeting and listen. The bigger the budget of the coffin, the more money they would make when they stole it.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

Most days I could attend two meetings where people were mourning.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

But they couldn't go to the graveyard until nightfall. So during the day, John and his guys would just hang out.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

We'd go to bars. Iko River Road, Nairobi. Like one in River Road in Nairobi and another in Udiru. I love playing pool, so we always would play pool. Just waiting. Waiting for time for us to do our work. It was our game.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

One of these nights when they were out at a bar, John met someone special.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

Margaret Wanjiru. Her name was Margaret Wanjiro. We met in a bar in Nairobi. We were having fun and enjoying the one man guitar show. She used to work in bars. In the course of our conversation and getting to know each other until the point of getting intimate, that's when I told her about what I did and she understood.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

She didn't just understand. No no no, no. Margaret invited herself into John Kibera's team and she was in 200%.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

When the priest or the pastor would be saying it is time to lower the body, Margaret would be there and would really cry a lot. Some of the coffins were not sealed with nails but hard locks. And in that crying she would take an opportunity to take a photo of the lock to help us know how to open it later. The lady was hardcore.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

John's team grew to have eight people total and over the next year they would make around 150,000 shillings. Every time they dug up a coffin and sold the valuables, that was enough to buy a brand new car. And John's original hunch was right. This was much safer than holding a person at gunpoint or stealing a car.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

It was a lot better than armed crime or armed robbery. The cops wouldn't ask you any questions.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

It's true a corpse wouldn't give you the same heat a living person would. At least not most of the time.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

One time we went to steal from a grave in Nyanza province and when we tried to, we all started trembling and we couldn't do it. And this is the first time I started suspecting that corpses could have evil spirits. I only used to hear about it, but I never used to believe it.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

Okay, stay tuned. We'll have more for you after the break.

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[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

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[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

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[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

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[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

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[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

You're listening to Mind your own the team wasn't even able to get the coffin out of the grave. That's how hard they were trembling. And over the next few days, John started to see visions of whom he could only assume was that poor soul that he was trying to rob.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

When I went to sleep, I would see this person. Like literally I would see this person. And when I felt that this dead body, this corpse was tormenting me, I spoke to one elder and told him what was happening to me. And he told me that I had to find 50,000 shillings and go back to that community and ask for forgiveness. So I did to free myself from this problem.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

Well, a restless spirit and an anonymous donation was not enough to stop John from keeping this oper. Not when the money was so good.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

Now I had money. I built an amazing house, a seven story house in the neighborhood. I bought myself a Pujot 504, which was renowned in Kenya. I could pay to sleep in a nice hotel. I could visit different parts of the country. I could go to Mombasa, to the coast. I was at the peak of my life. It was like a London lifestyle.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

Not only was John's wallet happy, but he realized he kind of liked being the boss. This was a level of security and comfort. John had Just never known.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

So for each job we did, I had to get more money. I loved it. I was a patron. They wouldn't go on any operation without me. It felt good to be the boss who many people depended on.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

John Kibera could finally enjoy the little things in life, like dates with Margaret.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

She was the first person to just take me somewhere where we could relax, like a recreational place, like one where there was lots of entertainment with Kikuyu musicians, whom I loved. She was beautiful. I loved her heart and I respected her. She used to make me feel like a man. She really used to encourage me and tell me, you know, be strong, love. I did this work until it got to a point where the corpse was really nothing to me. We just kept on doing our thing without fearing anything.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

Which made John and his team more ambitious. They wanted to think bigger and bolder about their heists. Like when they went after the grave of Ibrahim Akasha, a drug kingpin who operated out of Mombasa.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

He was a drug lord in a coffin worth 1.2 million shillings when he was shot and buried. We got the coffin after two days. Word went round that Akasha had been exhumed. But no one knew who had done it.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

They had picked too big a target. News was starting to spread around Nairobi and other parts of Kenya that people were indeed stealing from graves. But the names and faces were still unknown. John and his associates continued to disturb the dead and tempt fate. Fearless, rich and a little sloppy.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

I remember it was a Saturday, around 1:30am. We had gone to steal a coffin at a place called Githonguri.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

Everything had been going as planned. They found a grave, dug out the slab, but before they could get the coffin out, a local spotted them.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

And they started screaming, thieves, thieves. We ran away and they started chasing us. My four colleagues and I took off and when we go to River Sagana, it was everyone for himself. At least I could swim. I jumped into River Sagana and I Swam for about 500 meters. I got out of the river and onto the road.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

John hailed down a vegetable truck that gave him a lift back to town. He rented a hotel room to and tried to lay low for the night.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

I was lucky to have gotten away, but I kept thinking, what about my colleagues? I was taking tea in the hotel when I heard it announced on the news. Thieves had been burned in Maragua when they were trying to steal a coffin.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

Some of John's guys had been caught by angry locals who wanted justice. They were taken to Maragua and executed as the other Hotel guests shook their heads at the news. John, for his own safety, played along and pretended like he didn't know anything. He knew he had to stay as far removed from this news cycle as possible, which meant he couldn't even go to their funerals.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

I did think about it. I would have wanted to, but the fear that I could go there and, you know, then the suspicion, people would say this guy was with them or they used to be together, that fear stopped me.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

And this isn't like that gang shootout that got John into grave robbing in the first place. No. This time John was the boss. John had spent time with them. John had brought each of them into the fold.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

They had families and I knew their families. I knew their wives, I knew their children. So I was really sad that I had brought them into this kind of tragedy. I was heartbroken. I felt like I had no strength. I would wake up and go to a pub, I would play pool. I would play from like 2pm to 8pm at night and then would go back home.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

John and his team lay low, not daring to approach another grave. But after a few months, the money started running out. A few of John's men approached him and said,

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

when the cooking stick breaks, that is not the head of cooking. Like, you don't stop cooking because the cooking stick has broken. So they said, let's get back to work.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

John agreed to continue the grave robbing spree. After all, it was the only source of income, not just for himself, but for his old team. And they'd all gotten used to that London lifestyle. But before he could plan another heist, he had to tell a certain someone that it just wasn't worth the risk anymore. That person was Margaret.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

I mean, she loved the work. But you know, when I looked and saw that trouble was starting to crop up, I felt, no, there is no point for both of us to die. And that is why I asked her to step aside from this.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

After a long and difficult argument, John agreed to give some of his earnings to Margaret so that she could step out of the coffin stealing game and start a business of her own.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

You do this and let me hustle.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

That marked the last time he and Margaret ever spoke. And John kept hustling, kept unearthing coffins, and kept tempting fate.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

We are Boxing Day. It was boxing day of 2004. We were at Langata Cemetery and we had dug this particular grave and we had taken the coffin out. But the vehicle that was supposed to come and collect the coffin was late. You cannot carry the coffin on Your back. You cannot put it on a motorbike.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

Daylight was approaching, and the team did not have enough time to put the coffin back where it came from. John knew that if they got caught with this coffin, it would be Maragua all over again. In a snap decision, he resorted to a skill he had sworn off what felt like a lifetime ago to hijack carjacking. And the first van they saw wasn't just any van.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

Tv a van belonging to the Nation

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

Media Group, probably the largest multimedia production company in all of east and Central Africa.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

I switched off the van and grabbed the key. Meanwhile, one of my teammates pulled the driver out of the van.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

The team left the newspaper employee on the ground and went back to the cemetery.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

When we got to the cemetery, the coffin couldn't fit because there were still newspapers in the back of the van. So I quickly got into the back of the van, I removed all the newspapers, I dumped them on the ground, and they handed me the coffin.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

After John pulled the coffin into the back of the van with him, his teammates closed the door and locked it from the outside. There were no windows, no screens to see the road or the driver's seat. So all John could really see was this golden coffin that they planned to sell. He heard his teammates get in the front and felt the van start moving. Now, Langata cemetery is very close to Nairobi Central business district, like 10 minutes tops. Surely they could get there, sell the coffin and ditch the vehicle. At least that was the plan. John was sitting in the back of the van in the dark when he

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

heard pa. Pa. Pa. That's when the shooting started.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

John was thrown against the wall as the van swerved and then came to a screeching halt. He desperately tried to find shelter as bullets punched holes through the van's walls.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

The van was like a sieve with

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

the doors locked from the outside. John had nowhere to go. But daylight was bleeding through those bullet holes, and it was shining a light on. On his one saving grace. John Kibera cracked open the lid of that golden coffin, slid inside of it, and closed it shut.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

After about three minutes of gunshots, there was silence. My colleagues, from the number of gunshots, I would not expect they had survived. So I knew they were dead.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

John lay silent and sweltering in the heat, but he could hear voices approaching. Police.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

I heard the door of the van being opened.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

Someone must have reported the carjacking.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

Police discovered that there was a golden coffin in the back, and they wondered what it was for. One of the police officers was asked to check what it was for. I lay completely still. I stiffened my body and opened my eyes wide and fixed them. In that panic, I cut off a piece of cotton wool from the side of the coffin and I put it in my mouth so I would look truly dead. And I just prayed for God to save me any way he could. When the police officer opened the coffin, we saw each other face to face. My eyes were wide open, but they were fixed. Trying to put on the look of a dead person. I played dead as best as I could. The officer slammed the coffin shut. He got out of the van and told the other officers that there was a corpse inside the coffin and it was sweating. I could hear them discussing among themselves what to do. They agreed that the cops need to be taken to the city mortuary. So they agreed that they would carry the coffin and put it in the police Land Rover. So six of the officers lifted the coffin and they were carrying it on the tarmac of Kenyatta Avenue. That's when my hat told me, don't be slow. So just as they were about to put it in the Land Rover, I smacked the coffin loudly. The moment I hit the coffin, the police officers dropped it. I jumped out and I saw a crowd of people. Everyone ran away seeing an evil spirit. Spirit had been seen in Nairobi. People were running, jumping into their vehicles and trying to get away. Remember, there were three other corpses and no one knew which one would get up next. A lady asked, what is happening? And I'm the one who answered, can't you see a corpse is running?

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

Amidst the chaos, John took off. He knew that the police would not treat him in any more kindly than they had treated the three corpses in the van.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

And I just felt time was up for this kind of work. Ahead of me. I saw Kamukonji police station. I ran there and talked to the ocs, the officer in charge. I turned myself in and I said I was the one in the coffin on Kenyatta Avenue. They took me to Makadara Court where I was charged with exhuming dead bodies. That is when the police put my name in the newspapers.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

John served six months in prison. After he got out, he tried to move back home to Kahangware. But he wasn't just John Kibera anymore. He was John Kibera, Kenya's most notorious grave robbery. He found out that the papers and tabloids had been spreading his story all over town. A man who made a killing from digging up the dead. And that reputation followed him everywhere he went.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

When someone hears that, you deal with corpses. They definitely fear you. This kind of crime is one of a kind worldwide. If I walked into a bar, someone would see me and recognize me and they would panic. If I interacted with ladies, they didn't want to associate with me. They were really scared of me. I needed new places. New places where people couldn't recognize me. I gave away my house to a school for orphans. As for the cash money, I donated it to Langata Women's Prison. Bought them blankets and supplies. I've never gone back

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

after that. John basically just attended church, did some volunteering and kept it low key. Maybe he thought he might be able to live a normal life now. Maybe his past was finally behind him, which could leave him room to build a future with someone.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

I met this girl in 2005. She was an usher in a church that I used to go to. Our wedding was to be in 2007. But on the wedding day, the father of the bride came with a newspaper showing me as a criminal. And he said he cannot allow his daughter to marry a criminal. So he took her away when she was still in her wedding dress. They got into the car and they left.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

John Kibera, thank you so much for telling us your story. These days, John is a preacher in Nairobi as well as a motivational speaker telling kids that crime does not pay. For more about John, check out our show notes and thank you for listening. It's been good to have you. I've really enjoyed going with you to Langata cemetery. In the middle of the night we looked left, then we looked right. The coast was clear

[Mind Your Own Narrator / Announcer]

until it wasn't

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

time to play dead. We'll see you the next time. You mind your own until then, here's a song from the continent Ott by Rouge. Mind your Own is hosted and produced by me, Lupita Nyong'.

[John Kibera (Grave Robber) / Interviewee]

O.

[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

This is a production of Snap Studios at KQED with sales and distribution by Lemonada Media. The executive producers are Glyn Washington and Mark Ristich. Our managing editor is Regina Bediaco. Our director of production is Marissa Dodge. Original music in my story comeuppance was by Clay Xavier. The story Graveyard Shift was produced by David Exume. Translation by Salome Nduku. Voiceover by Ndungi Kiduku. Original music by Laline Saint Just and Sam Law. Special thanks to our fixer, Michael Kaloki. Our Mind your Own producers are David Exume and Priscilla Alabi. Our story scouts are Ashley Okwosa, Fiona Nyong', o, Jessica Carissa and Lesedi Oluko Moche. Our editors are Nancy Lopez and Anna Sussman. Our story consultant is John Facile, engineering by Miles Lassie. Our music supervisor is Sandra Lawson, ndu, also known as Sandu Ndu. She also created the Mind you'd Own theme song with Peach Curls featuring vocals from Ejiorobo. Graphic design by Jemima Eke Original artwork by Mateusz Sitole. Special thanks to Alan Coy, Jake Kleinberg, Samara Still, Sarah Yu, Warner Music Group and Afripods. Make sure to follow Mind your own and listen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music or wherever you get your podcasts. There's even more to love with lemonada. Premium subscribers get exclusive access to bonus content from across the Network for only $4.99 a month. Subscribe now on Apple Podcasts. Now go out, get together and mind your own bodies.

[Mind Your Own Narrator / Announcer]

Thank you for tuning in to Mind your Own Spooksters. And thank you Lupita Nyong', O Big Love. And thanks as well to our part Lemonada Media, the Afropods, Warner Music Group, Snap's home station of KQED, Norm Elijah, Cas, Josh Lindgren, all of Team Snap. And to each and every person who put love into this show, there is so much more where this came from. Stories to make you laugh, make you cry, and let you look at the world through someone else's eyes. Listen and enjoy mind your own on any podcast platform.

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[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

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[Lupita Nyong'o / Mind Your Own Host]

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