Podcast Summary: Standard of Truth – S6E8 "The Book of Enoch Part 2 (Giants in the Land)"

Date: February 19, 2026
Hosts: Dr. Garrett Dirkmaat and Dr. Richard Leduc

Overview

This episode continues the discussion on the Book of Enoch, its apocryphal narratives, and its historical and doctrinal significance for Latter-Day Saints. The central theme explores how the Book of Enoch seeks to explain the origins of evil, the concept of fallen angels, and the "giants in the land" narrative referenced in both ancient Jewish and early Christian sources. Through close reading, historical context, and characteristic humor, the hosts investigate how these ancient traditions intersect with modern Latter-Day Saint thought and scripture.

Sections & Key Discussion Points

1. Light Banter and Listener Mailbag (00:37–18:05)

• Hosts open with friendly banter about locations, sports predictions, and podcasting routines, showcasing their easy camaraderie and humor.
• Two listener emails are read:
  • Sister McNew (11:38): Praises the show, mentions Russian-speaking missionaries in Montana, and enjoys the premium content.
  • Jeff from St. Augustine, FL (14:11): Shares growing skepticism due to the podcast, humorously questions the authenticity of everything (including podcasts themselves), and asks about the portrayal of Joseph as an angel in "The Chosen."
• The hosts stress their faith-centered, sourced approach and joke about premium content and loyalty.

2. Clarifying Doctrines: Angels and "The Chosen" (18:52–28:41)

Key question: Has mainstream Christian doctrine changed to adopt Latter-Day Saint views on angels due to popular media (e.g., "The Chosen")?

• Dr. Dirkmaat addresses the theology:
  • Traditional Christian theology treats angels as separate creations, not human spirits or resurrected humans.
  • The Book of Enoch is referenced as an influential apocryphal text for early Christians and Jews.
  • "The Chosen" sparked controversy by depicting Joseph (Jesus's father) as the angel comforting Jesus—Dallas Jenkins (creator) clarified this was not a doctrinal claim but an artistic choice. Evangelical backlash was strong, emphasizing doctrinal differences.
  • LDS theology (via Joseph Smith) is unique in teaching some angels are resurrected beings, but even within LDS tradition there's speculation, not concrete doctrine, about angelic identities (such as who visited Jesus in Gethsemane).

Notable Quote:

"I am not saying that Joseph is an angel... we just did it because we thought it would be beautiful artistically and spiritually." — Dallas Jenkins, as paraphrased by Dr. Dirkmaat (24:01)

3. Setting Up the Book of Enoch Discussion (28:46–32:40)

• Recap for new listeners: The Book of Enoch is an ancient Jewish text circulating at the time of Jesus, quoted authoritatively in the New Testament (Jude 1:14).
• The Book of Enoch influenced both Jewish and early Christian thinking about angels, evil, and the end times.
• The hosts highlight that while the Book of Enoch was not considered canonical, it provided vivid explanations for scriptural ambiguities.

Notable Quote:

"Here you have the New Testament... quoting this Book of Enoch as if it were scriptural or at the very least, authoritative enough that it's part of the argument about what the second coming is going to be like." — Dr. Dirkmaat (31:10)

4. Alternate Origin of Evil: Enoch’s Story of the Fallen Angels (32:40–46:25)

• Theological background: Unlike polytheists, Jews/Christians argue there's one all-powerful, all-good God—raising the question: Why is the world so wicked?
• Book of Enoch’s answer:
  • Angels ("sons of God") lust after mortal women, descend to earth, take wives, and teach forbidden knowledge (charms, metallurgy, vanities).
  • Their offspring are “giants” (with comic discussion about their size—3,000 ells ≈ 4,500 feet, or two Burj Khalifas!).
  • The giants are violent, cannibalistic, and their existence leads to chaos and widespread evil on earth.
• Genesis 6 Parallel: The often-debated "sons of God" and "daughters of men" passage is used by Enoch as the narrative's foundation.
• Hosts caution:
  • Many doctrines in Enoch are not compatible with LDS or mainstream Christian beliefs (e.g., the mechanics and consequences of fallen angels).

Notable Moment (Humor):

"If you had somebody that was 3,000 ells... you would go undefeated in church ball." — Dr. Leduc (45:11)

5. Influence on Early Christian Fathers (52:52–61:00)

• Clement of Alexandria & Justin Martyr:
  • Both recount stories closely paralleling Enoch—angels fall, take wives, teach forbidden things, and become sources of evil/demons.
  • These ideas shaped certain early Christian interpretations of the Genesis 6 passage.
• Key Distinction:
  • These elaborations are extra-biblical and eventually fall out of favor doctrinally as Christianity matures and canonizes scripture.

Notable Quotes:

"The angels transgressed this appointment, and they were captivated by love of women and begat children, who are those that are called demons." — Justin Martyr, as quoted by Dr. Dirkmaat (60:10)

6. Cliffhanger & Foreshadowing — What About Joseph Smith? (63:00–70:16)

• Dr. Dirkmaat teases further discussion of later early Christian writers (Irenaeus, Tertullian, Ambrose, etc.) for the next episode.
• The conversation pivots to the significance of the Book of Enoch in the context of Joseph Smith's revelations—especially the unique LDS interpretation found in the Book of Moses.
• Announcements: The monthly podcast newsletter is now active, and additional spots are available for the Missouri Nauvoo tour.

Notable Closing Tease:

"We will have multiple early Christian fathers. We will talk more about the apocryphal Book of Enoch and how it relates to Joseph Smith’s Book of Moses and the other teachings of Joseph Smith on Enoch in our next episode." — Dr. Dirkmaat (70:16)

Memorable Quotes

• "If you start putting air quotes around nouns, that's a real problem." — Dr. Dirkmaat (17:32, Mailbag segment)
• "You can't swing a dead cat in Missoula without hitting several babushkas." — Dr. Leduc (07:26, on Russian speakers in Montana)
• "They [the fallen angels] became pregnant. And they bear giants whose height was 3,000 ells..." — Dr. Dirkmaat (44:08, reading Enoch)
• "Never get involved in a land war in Asia, and never transform yourself into fallen man..." — Dr. Dirkmaat (59:12, with a Princess Bride reference)
• "Clement of Alexandria has got to be frustrated that he's Clement of Alexandria. The other one's just Clement." — Dr. Leduc (69:04)

Key Timestamps

• 00:37 – Banter, sports, and Russian-speaking missionaries
• 11:38 – Sister McNew’s mail: Russian missionaries and podcast praise
• 14:11 – Jeff’s mail: skepticism and angels in "The Chosen"
• 18:52 – Theological clarifications about angels in Christianity/LDS
• 24:01 – Dallas Jenkins' statement on Joseph as an angel in "The Chosen"
• 28:46 – Recap & setup: Book of Enoch, Jude, and authority
• 32:40 – Origins of evil: Enoch’s alternative narrative about angels, giants
• 45:24 – Discussion of giants’ size, humor break
• 46:25 – Enoch’s narrative vis-à-vis Genesis 6
• 52:52 – Early Christian fathers’ adoption of Enoch’s ideas
• 59:12 – "Classic blunders" and the fate of the fallen angels
• 63:00 – Cliffhanger: What does Irenaeus say? Announcements
• 68:26 – Teaser: Joseph Smith’s revelations and Enoch for next episode

Tone and Style

The hosts blend rigorous scholarship with dry wit and playful banter. They approach complex theological issues faithfully while gently skewering both ancient and modern misconceptions. Their back-and-forth keeps even dense doctrinal discussions light and entertaining.

Conclusion

This episode demystifies the Book of Enoch’s narratives and explains their impact on Jewish, Christian, and Latter-Day Saint thought—highlighting both the intrigue and the doctrinal pitfalls of engaging with ancient apocrypha. The hosts promise deeper dives into early Christian sources and, most importantly, an exploration of Joseph Smith's teachings on Enoch and how LDS scripture reframes these ideas.

Next episode: Deeper exploration of early Christian writers' views, and how Joseph Smith’s revelations draw from and transcend these ancient traditions.