Call-In Ep w/ George and Sam

Summary

StraightioLab – Call-In Ep w/ George and Sam

Big Money Players Network & iHeartPodcasts
Release Date: May 19, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode of StraightioLab features hosts George Civeris and Sam Taggart responding to listener call-in questions with their signature blend of intellectual rigor and offbeat, irreverent humor. The episode explores a wide range of topics—from the gay appeal of urban planning, summer vacation destinations for queer people, and the shifting cultural status of so-called "flop" pop stars to comedic thought-experiments like recasting Haim sisters in "Modern Family" and pondering the latent misery in mundane tasks.

The hosts maintain their hallmark critical eye on straight culture while also poking incessant fun at gay and alt culture—showcasing their skill at unpacking nuances of identity, aesthetics, and social behavior on a granular (often hilarious) level.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The State of Comedy and “Chill” Stand-Up

• [03:46–06:36]

• Sam reflects on his recent "workshopping" show, being purposely casual as he hones material for his tour.
• George commends Sam's consistent innovation and transitions, even when “chilling.”
• Discussion of their preference for traditional, straightforward stand-up over multimedia/alt-comedy excesses.

“There was an ending that made sense. I was impressed.” — George [04:43] “It was like a full hour of stand-up, Louis CK-style.” — George [04:45]

2. The Devil Wears Prada, Madonna, and Anna Wintour

• [07:10–09:52]

• Dissecting Madonna’s pop-cultural strategies (like the Anna Wintour runway video) and the “Devil Wears Prada industrial complex.”
• Extended riffing on Anna Wintour’s hold over Vogue, her successor's lack of iconic "look," and the broader implications for fashion leadership.

“She’s white-knuckling, hanging onto the rock climbing wall. I'm like, you gotta let go. There is a rope.” — George [08:11]

3. Summer Readiness as a Cultural Phenomenon

• [11:19–14:44]

• Sam and George discuss how they postpone summer-themed episodes until they “feel” the season; analogy to American politics and fashion’s future-planning.
• Proposal: ban planning more than a month ahead for anything—from flights to fashion.

“It should be illegal to book a flight more than a month in advance. It should be illegal to buy clothing for a season that isn’t currently here…” — George [13:00]

4. CALL-IN: Why Are So Many Gay Men Urban Planners?

• [15:04–19:52]

• Both hosts examine the trope of the gay urban planner.
• Urban planning’s appeal: branding, prestige, theoretical-activist blend, and the impulse "to control."
• Parallels between urban planning and entertainment: lots of “projects in development,” not always much realized work.

“The city is the gay guy’s country, is the gay guy’s farm. So a straight guy is planting corn. Gay guy’s planting buildings.” — George [16:02] “Urban planning is sort of interior decorating but for a whole city.” — George [16:54] “It’s one of those things that happens more in theory than in practice.” — George [17:47]

5. CALL-IN: Thoughts on Christopher Nolan’s Odyssey

• [25:38–29:15]

• Anticipating the “Nolan Odyssey” film; joking about casting, movie stars, and possible Greek backlash.
• Agreement: they want big movie stars, not “authentic Greeks.”
• Commentary on the pitfalls of ethno-nationalist discourse around ancient Greece and pop culture representation.

“A Christopher Nolan Odyssey should be the biggest movie stars on the planet … I think it’s great that it’s Robert Pattinson, obviously.” — George [28:30]

6. CALL-IN: Gay Vacation Destinations and Their Vibes

• [31:20–38:44]

• Sam gives an objective run-down of queer vacation hotspots: Palm Springs (“retirement community”), Fire Island (“government social experiment”), Provincetown/P-Town (“family oriented, gay themed straight town”), Zipolite (“heaven on earth”), Mykonos (“unappealing”).
• Palm Springs critiqued for its strict sound ordinance and old-gay protective vibes.

“Fire Island is basically a social experiment where at some point it’ll be revealed it was a government experiment and people will die. There were cameras there the whole time.” — George [34:50]

• Travel logistics woes (“should be an airport in Penn Station”).

7. CALL-IN: Depths of Everyday Misery

• [40:17–43:47]

• Inspired by a Tumblr post: what daily rituals elicit disproportionate misery?
  • George: paperwork, bureaucracy, especially with dual citizenship.
  • Sam: delays in dinner, and having to listen to sports audio in bars.
  • Both: freelancing means endless, redundant forms; agreeing that sports on TV in public is torture for the non–sports-inclined.

“Every single time I have to do any sort of paperwork or logistical thing...The idea of being in some sort of online portal that was created in HTML in 1994...I could die before finishing this task.” — George [40:35] “The noise of a sports game gives me an instant headache in a way that I’ve never understood.” — Sam [42:01]

8. CALL-IN: Boneless vs. Bone-In Wings — What’s Gayer?

• [47:00–52:41]

• DC caller instigates a passionate debate: are boneless or bone-in wings “gayer”?
  • Bone-in: masculine, “God-intended,” adult, but also queer/organic if seen as artisanal.
  • Boneless: infantilized/easy, but could also be “tender,” which is respectable.
  • Both agree: Bone-in is strictly straight. Boneless is ambiguous—could be straight man-child or femme/baby gay.

“Sometimes the obvious answer is the one that’s really funny.” — George [52:00] “Occam’s razor, I think.” — Sam [52:01]

9. CALL-IN: Who Is Your ‘Dummy’ Pop Star? (Artist You Love Despite Flop Status)

• [53:02–62:13]

• Listeners share their “Dummy” (i.e. flop-beloved) pop stars—Demi Lovato, Marina & the Diamonds, Camila Cabello.
• George’s pick: Rita Ora’s "Phoenix" album. Sam reflects on loving flop eras and pop stardom reclamation.
• Both lament that the gay urge for “fixer uppers” (e.g. reclaiming flop pop stars, bad actresses) leaves few left to newly champion—everyone else already has.
• Discussion on Katy Perry’s “flop era” and the shifting attitudes toward Grimes.

“We are addicted to reclaiming people.” — Sam [57:31]

10. CALL-IN: “Well Behaved Women Rarely Make History”—Historical Context

• [62:16–67:17]

• Listener/historian shares that the famous quote originated as a lament, not a call to insubordination.
• Hosts riff on how this reframes modern pop culture’s iconography of bad behavior and reality stardom.

“It's time to start rewarding the person who is, like, polite and normal.” — Sam [63:17] “We’ve interpreted it in the most honestly, gay guy way of ‘if you’re boring, get the fuck out of my face.’” — George [63:39]

11. CALL-IN: If Each Haim Sister Was Adopted by a Modern Family Family

• [67:25–72:21]

• High-concept pop culture mashup: assign each Haim sister to a “Modern Family” core household.
  • Este → Cam and Mitch (“freaks welcome”)
  • Danielle → Phil and Claire (even-keeled, grounded)
  • Alana → Jay and Gloria (“opposites attract”)
• Imagine Y2K-appropriate “white girl tries to be Latina” sitcom plotlines and comedic scenarios.

“She and Cam are, like, trashing the house because they’re, like, playing DDR. And then Mitch comes home and is like, you guys. Credits roll.” — George [69:29]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “You have to learn the rules first, then you can break them.” — Sam [05:37]
• “I don't want to keep blowing smoke up your ass, but as someone who has seen you be chill…I was impressed.” — George [04:24]
• "Everyone that we know actually is indeed in entertainment, but none of them have a thing out — credits." — Sam [19:39]
• “Palm Springs… it's a retirement community and if you go with a good squad, it can be fun. But if you aren’t there with a good squad, you’re just hearing 60 plus year old men talk about taxes.” — Sam [32:16]
• "Urban planning is interior decorating but for a whole city." — George [16:54]
• “Sports people are so lucky that there’s this thing that can always be in the background.” — George [42:39]
• "We are addicted to fixer-uppers." — Sam [57:46]

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Important Timestamps

• 03:46 – Episode proper begins; stand-up comedy chat
• 15:04 – First listener call (gay urban planners)
• 25:38 – Nolan’s Odyssey & Greek representation
• 31:20 – Gay travel destinations/vacation vibes
• 40:17 – Mundane misery (paperwork, sports noises, etc.)
• 47:00 – Boneless v. bone-in wings debate
• 53:02 – Pop star “dummy” picks (flop artists you love)
• 62:16 – “Well behaved women rarely make history” – contextualized
• 67:25 – Haim sisters/Modern Family crossover debate
• 75:50 – Wrap-up and listener thanks

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Tone and Style

This episode is chatty, fast-paced, and woven with playful banter, high-concept drag, and self-referential meta-humor. George and Sam maintain a tone that is simultaneously affectionate towards their queer niche-y listeners and ruthless about the vanities and foibles of both gay and straight pop cultures. Their Socratic, circuitous approach means that even the most absurd conceit is eventually analyzed for genuine insight.

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For New Listeners

If you haven’t listened, this episode is a great introduction to StraightioLab’s rare balance of queer-themed existential and cultural analysis, performed as high-wire comedy. Whether they're breaking down why so many urban planners are gay or constructing elaborate, tongue-in-cheek hypothetical sitcoms, George and Sam never fail to interrogate the world through a queer, playful, and critical lens.

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(Episode sponsored by multiple ad reads; summary skips these and focuses only on podcast content.)

Transcript

[George Severis]

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[Sam Taggart]

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[Caller]

All?

[Sam Taggart]

Summer's got a different tempo. Everything's a little looser, brighter. One plan turns into another. You hear something, you stay a little longer. Next thing you know, you're somewhere you didn't plan to be. It's those in between moments. That's where the ideas hit. Conversations stretch out. Little memories sneak up on you. Sometimes it's just about what's in your

[George Severis]

hand that Color that chill.

[Sam Taggart]

The new Tropical Butterfly refresher from Starbucks. Guava and passion fruit flavors with mango pineapple flavored pearls. Yeah, that feels like summer before you even taste it. Funny how one small stop becomes the

[George Severis]

best part of the day.

[Sam Taggart]

Start your summer rhythm with Starbucks. Try the new Tropical Butterfly refresher from Starbucks. Tour announcement starts now. Hello, everyone, it is me, Sam, and I am going on tour this summer. I'm doing my hour of incredible stand up comedy and I would love, love, love to see you there. So I will be in San Francisco, Portland, Seattle, Chicago, D.C. boston, Philly, and maybe a couple more. But if you are in any of those places, please, please, please get tickets. I would love to see you all there and I'm really, really excited because I love touring now. So see you there. Okay, enjoy the app. Bye. Podcast starts now. What is up, everyone around the globe. We are in New York City, if you can believe it.

[George Severis]

I said, let's start. And then you started. And I was like, hold on. I was not ready at all.

[Sam Taggart]

Wow, that is so classic.

[George Severis]

Well, I feel amazing. It's the day after your big show. Well, not your big show.

[Sam Taggart]

Let's be honest.

[George Severis]

Let's be honest. It was not a big show.

[Sam Taggart]

No, I.

[George Severis]

It's kind of a workshopping show at Union Hall.

[Sam Taggart]

I'm in my casual era when it comes to shows.

[George Severis]

Well, you're in the workshopping era, of course. And then you're gonna hard launch the hour when you go on tour.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah, that is what's happening. But it is funny because I'm being so casual. I am working it out, but I'm like, the way that I'm like, being chill is kind of concerning.

[George Severis]

You said this last night and I don't want to keep blowing smoke up your ass, but as someone who has seen you be chill, like when we were touring together, I'm like, every joke has a new ending and you have added things full on transitions to take from one thing to the other. There was new stuff. There was an ending that made sense. I was impressed.

[Sam Taggart]

Wow. Well, I'll take it.

[George Severis]

And it was like traditional. It wasn't. There was no multimedia, there were no songs. Not that I would be against that, but I'm just saying, it was like a full hour of stand up Louis CK style.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah, I'm going Louis CK Mode.

[George Severis]

We both are weirdly formally reactionary. Not content wise.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah, tell me more.

[George Severis]

I think we both weirdly have reacted against the alt style of comedy and are like, okay, we're back to like, wearing like A black crew neck sweatshirt and jeans and Converse. And no moving, barely. Like you can take the stool and do the act out of you fucking the stool. But that's it.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, it was almost like I saw, like, We Built a New World with anyone can do anything they want. You can be so crazy. You can do play a track. You can be so weird. And then you saw it in the wrong hands and you were like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. We've got to put a stop to this.

[George Severis]

No, completely.

[Sam Taggart]

We have to show them the way. You have to learn the rules first, then you can break them.

[George Severis]

Well, you have to learn figure drawing before you can be Marina Abramovic.

[Sam Taggart]

Exactly.

[George Severis]

And a lot of people are coming out there and they're saying, the artist is present. I said, well, let's see your resume. What art school did you go to? She's present.

[Sam Taggart]

Where's the work?

[George Severis]

Where is the work?

[Sam Taggart]

That being said, I did do one multimedia thing last night which is not gonna be part of the show.

[George Severis]

That's true.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, I woke up yesterday morning and I said, you know what's the funniest thing I could possibly do? Is like, they introduce me and then I play a full minute of Madonna's I Feel so Free before coming out on stage. And people will be like, they'll stop clapping. And they're still hearing it and they're like, so when's he coming out? I could not stop laughing. And then I did it. I will say it did not elicit laughter in the classic sense, but I was loving it.

[George Severis]

Well, you could have come out dancing or something, but instead you came out normally and then you said, okay, that's enough. Cut the track.

[Sam Taggart]

That was Alt's Boots.

[George Severis]

That was Alt. That's true.

[Sam Taggart]

So just play the song and not do any. People started. You could see them, like, peeking, like I was gonna come out in a costume.

[George Severis]

I was also like, oh, there's a song element.

[Sam Taggart]

No, not even close. I just woke up that day and said, I think will be funny. Which, by the way, of course, I do like that song. Now I know this will be coming out, and this episode will come out in roughly one month. So by this point.

[George Severis]

Yeah. All we know is she could have released a new song where she sort of talk sings over a different beat and is like, I'm putting on my shoes and walking, walk, walking.

[Sam Taggart]

I hope she write that down.

[George Severis]

Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

I can't let you just improvise that. No, I actually think the song is so genius, and I've decided that I'm all in on Confessions 2.

[George Severis]

Did you see her video with Anna Wintour?

[Sam Taggart]

I did. I didn't quite understand.

[George Severis]

I was so confused. The Devil Wears Prada industrial complex, by the way, I enjoyed the film, but the Devil Wears Prada industrial complex, where basically everything a la wicked everything is kind of spawned for devil wears Prada 2. It's like the Madonna album is kind of spawned for devil wears Prada 2 because she took advantage of the buzz of the film to do a video with Anna Wintour where people are walking down a Runway.

[Sam Taggart]

I'm also like, Anna Wintour, enough.

[George Severis]

Hello.

[Sam Taggart]

Are you like actually a worker or are you like just an actor that plays Anna Wintour? Like, at some point? It's weird.

[George Severis]

Well, not just that, but do you know she passed Vogue on to her successor, but then the successor is not named editor in chief, she's named director of editorial operations or something. And then Anna Wintour has a different job that is still above her and her office is next to her. And she was just on the COVID of Vogue. So I'm kind of like, Anna, she's white knuckling, hanging onto the rock climbing wall. I'm like, you gotta let go. There is a rope.

[Sam Taggart]

There's a rope. I mean, she's honestly being Jay Leno. She is being Jelo. She's being Jay Leno and she's not letting go. She's like, I give up. And then she's like, but I will stay forever.

[George Severis]

Well, she's also like, I give up. Watch me being interviewed by my successor about my legacy.

[Sam Taggart]

I do think the successor. I don't know how long it took Anna to find her look, but the successor does need a look. Right now, you're just normal girl.

[George Severis]

But I sort of think I've thought about this quite a lot.

[Sam Taggart]

Thank God.

[George Severis]

She has, I think, made the decision that her thing is gonna be, I'm relatable and I'm not Anna Wintour because it's. Which, by the way, obviously I disagree with, but it's.

[Sam Taggart]

That makes me nauseous.

[George Severis]

There's no world where she could reach. Imagine if she came in and she was like, my thing is literally like knee length black hair. I'm also doing a big look. It would, it would. She couldn't quite pull it off.

[Sam Taggart]

Yes, I know what you mean. But then I'm sort of like, well, then she shouldn't be hired. Like, we need someone who can pull off the big look. Someone who's been working on their look for the last decade as well as working on publishing it's complicated because I

[George Severis]

think the two options to me are either go full look. I am an influencer. I am Gen Z. Anna Wintour. I mean, she's not Gen Z, no fence, but I am like young Anna Wintour.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[George Severis]

Or have it be. This is a return to substance. We're going back to the Vogue that published Joan Didion. I'm like, bookish and serious and I'm blazer, blazer, blazer. And I'm hiring Pulitzer Prize winning critics to write about the fashion shows. But it's sort of like neither one is happening.

[Sam Taggart]

There's no choice being made. Yes, maybe I'm. But that could be an uneducated answer.

[George Severis]

I actually don't think it is. Did you see that Adrian Grenier did an ad for Jarlsburg? Referencing, of course, the grilled cheese with Jarlsburg that he made in the devilverse. Prada 1. He's not in the second film, by the way.

[Sam Taggart]

Really? Did he get canceled in some capacity?

[George Severis]

I don't actually think he did. I just think he wasn't asked to be in the film. That's interesting because he's still doing ads. It would be amazing if he took an anti cancel culture route to promoting A Devil Wears Proud and became sort of like an incel vibe.

[Sam Taggart]

That would be awesome. I'm surprised he's not brought back.

[George Severis]

I know you haven't seen the film yet. I would say there's barely enough for the new love interest to have something to do, let alone to bring back the old one.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, because they're too busy having a searing critique of the industry, the media industry.

[George Severis]

The love story is such an afterthought that they literally shot the whole movie. And then they're like, wait, fuck, it's supposed to be a rom com. And they like added this Australian guy and his entire personality is that he's a real estate developer. But not evil. But also. But also maybe evil real estate developer.

[Sam Taggart]

For good.

[George Severis]

Yeah. Well, it's not for good. It's like for neutral. He's sort of like. He's like. He's like, it's fine. I'm neutral. And that's his personality.

[Sam Taggart]

It's like Sandra Bullock in AI. It's like, well, if we're going to use it, it might as well be a good person doing.

[George Severis]

So today we're doing one of our classic Colin shows.

[Sam Taggart]

Yes.

[George Severis]

We were going to do the things of the summer, but then I was

[Sam Taggart]

like, it's not summer enough yet. Like, I don't know. I don't know.

[George Severis]

I know.

[Public Ad Read]

I don't know yet.

[Sam Taggart]

The thing with us when it comes to cultural critique is it comes from a very real place. We are struck by Christian God and we say, okay, we know what people will be wanting this summer. And until I feel the warmth on my skin, I'm not feeling it. And that crave to be in a pool. Only then can I really see what is coming for the summer.

[George Severis]

I completely agree. I'm actually feeling very non committal in a Vogue new editor in chief kind of way, where I'm kind of like, I don't know, I guess put Anna

[Sam Taggart]

on the COVID Even today it's like a sunny 65, 60 day in New York. And I was like, I'm gonna go out and walk around and probably get a manic rush.

[George Severis]

Yeah, I think we're gonna say manicure, but go on.

[Sam Taggart]

I walked around and I was like, everyone was still in like little jackets. And I was like, yeah, I'm not quite feeling it yet.

[George Severis]

I don't have vision. We have been edged. Summer. This is gonna be so irrelevant. By the time people are listening to this, you're gonna be melting on the park, being like, I wish a jacket.

[Sam Taggart]

Right, right, right.

[George Severis]

But we are in the kind of month and a half road map. Not road map, road literally to summer.

[Sam Taggart]

And surely there's a map.

[George Severis]

Summer. It's not happening.

[Sam Taggart]

No, it's not happening. But also it makes it hard to plan for summer. I think for both of us. We're potentially bad at this because until we are struck by the summer feeling, I can't make a plan for what to do over the summer.

[George Severis]

Okay. This actually is similar to how get ready for this. This is similar to how campaigns in America for the presidential race last way too long.

[Sam Taggart]

Yes.

[George Severis]

You should wait until people are in the mood to vote, and only then can you campaign.

[Sam Taggart]

Oh, my God. One month out.

[George Severis]

Yes. And that's actually how I feel about all decisions. It should be illegal to book a flight more than a month in advance. It should be illegal to buy clothing for a season that isn't currently here. You know what I mean?

[Sam Taggart]

Yes.

[George Severis]

Because it adds a layer of complexity to everything. And then you're part. And then everything is this long term competition. Fewer marathons, more sprints.

[Sam Taggart]

I mean, they're like spring, summer 27. I'm like, what are you talking about?

[George Severis]

Oh, don't even get me started. When I look at, first of all, it's Fashion Week every week, blah, blah, blah, everyone knows. But then you look at the fashion, it's spring. You're looking at the fashion week runways. It's winter.

[Sam Taggart]

It's winter on the Runway.

[George Severis]

I'm preparing for shopping.

[Sam Taggart]

I'm not thinking about this.

[George Severis]

I'm not thinking about what, you know, fur scarf is gonna. Detachable. Fur scarf is gonna look good on my parka.

[Sam Taggart]

And the fact that you are thinking about this makes me distrust you.

[George Severis]

No clue.

[Sam Taggart]

Because you're not listening to the network.

[George Severis]

You're not in the moment at all.

[Sam Taggart]

At all. It's so important to be present.

[George Severis]

Now, one could argue. Is that us advocating for literally fast fashion?

[Sam Taggart]

No.

[George Severis]

Okay, what about this? What about it's a full year in advance. You present the collection, and then you have a year to create it. Slow fashion style.

[Sam Taggart]

Slow fashion.

[George Severis]

But then it's released on the day summer starts, so then you see it

[Sam Taggart]

on the Internet, and then you can also go out and buy it.

[George Severis]

Yeah. Pre tape. Pre tape Fashion Week. Okay, that's pre tape Fashion week. But then have it come out when it's ready.

[Sam Taggart]

I like that you're making it illegal to buy a flight more than a month out. That's really good.

[George Severis]

No, it's good because also, like, you

[Sam Taggart]

never know what's gonna come up, literally. I also want to be able to look at the weather. Like, I would like to buy a flight, like 10 days out.

[George Severis]

I would say day of

[Sam Taggart]

God, if we had a lot of money, we'd be so cool.

[George Severis]

That is true.

[Sam Taggart]

Okay, should we listen to our first call?

[Caller]

Yes, Hi, Georgetown Sam, first time caller, longtime listener. I listen to your podcast every morning on my bike, ride into work, and it is really fabulous, I have to say.

[George Severis]

Oh, he's on the daily plan.

[Caller]

Okay, so this is a gay guy career question. I'm an urban planner, and I feel like urban planning is just filled with gay guys. Why? What about urban planning? I don't even know if I could answer this as a gay guy urban planner. Why are so many gay men doing urban planning? Feels like a conundrum that I haven't been able to answer. So wondering what your thoughts are. Thanks so much. Bye.

[Sam Taggart]

Why are gay guys doing urban planning? This is.

[George Severis]

Where do we even begin?

[Sam Taggart]

Well, first of all, they're not going to do rural planning. Let's start there.

[George Severis]

You want them to be farmers. They live in cities.

[Sam Taggart]

They live in cities.

[George Severis]

So guess what? It's kind of one of three options. The other two being sculpture and photographer. So, okay, obviously there's the obvious. The city is the gay guy's country is the gay guy's farm.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

So a straight guy is planting corn.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

Gay guys planting buildings. Buildings, yeah. Okay, so let's start there and let's actually end there.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, the other thing is, of course, there are gay architects, but, like, urban planning is different, definitely, because it's.

[George Severis]

Architects is vertical.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, architects is vertical, but urban planning, you get to, like, have sort of the same prestige. Like, you're like, I'm an urban. I do think gay guys like branding.

[George Severis]

Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

And so to say I'm an urban planner. You wanted to be an urban planner the first time you heard those two words.

[George Severis]

Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

You were like, wait a minute. That sounds good.

[George Severis]

Sounds like something I'm going to want

[Sam Taggart]

to do that's going to feel good to stay at a party. And then you're like, you look into how to do it and you're like, I can actually manage that.

[George Severis]

Yeah. I think urban planning is kind of really ocd. Gay guy that collects dollhouses and puts little things in the dollhouses.

[Sam Taggart]

Yes.

[George Severis]

It's sort of interior decorating, but for a whole city. I also think, you know, a city is where a gay guy can finally be himself. Of course. So then he becomes himself. Then he's like, okay, now it's time to sort of move stuff around. I also think it's not a coincidence that it's not all lgbtq. It's gay guy. Because it's still the male impulse to control.

[Sam Taggart]

To control.

[George Severis]

And so I think the male. I think architecture, as you're saying, because it's vertical, it's much more straight in that we're trying to go up.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

Whereas urban planning is much more. Okay, everyone, settle down. Not there.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, urban planning, you can also disguise as activism.

[George Severis]

Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

You get to have both worlds where you have a good job and you're a good person, which, again, is why it's a dinner party job.

[George Severis]

Yeah. It's kind of like how some people are public defenders, but also randomly rich.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah. We need to dig into that a little bit.

[George Severis]

Yeah. And then I also feel like urban planning. Here's another thing with urban planning, and I'm going to be honest here, sort of one of those things that happens more in theory than in practice. Urban planners love to read a bunch of books about urban theory. But then you're like, name one thing you've urban planned. And they're like, I love Jane Jacobs. And you're like, I know. Name one thing you've actually urban planned. And they're like, well, currently I'm working on. I'm doing some consulting. One thing you've Urban planned. Have you ever put a trash can on a block?

[Sam Taggart]

They're like, so I'm urban planning my summer. Like, I'm thinking, p. Town, I'm thinking, yeah, no, that's such a good point. I've always wondered this with urban planners and with architects, to be honest, I'm always sort of like, so if you're an architect, this is more towards architect. I'm like, where's the building? There's one building built every year. So what are you doing? All the other things, I think, to

[George Severis]

me, I'm like, architect. Well, yeah. It's like working at an architecture firm and then your whole job is kind of calculating. If we put the windows in a certain way, if enough sunlight will come in, that's a full financial quarter right there.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

But yeah, with urban planning, it's tough because I'm also like, if you made Hudson Yards, that's not very chic.

[Sam Taggart]

That's true. So do you think a gay guy was behind Hudson Yards?

[George Severis]

No, I don't think a gay guy was behind Hudson Yards. I don't think so either. But I do think. I think a lot of gay guys pitched on Hudson Yards. I don't think they were chosen.

[Sam Taggart]

That's tough. I mean, I'm realizing now the similarities between urban planning and entertainment.

[George Severis]

Oh, completely. It's. Everyone has projects in development. Everyone's like, I pitched this amazing park. You would have to. It would take, like, cost a lot of money and you would have changed everything. A lot of different stakeholders would have to agree on it. But it's amazing. And it's been written up in a magazine.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah. Because everyone that we know actually is indeed in entertainment, but none of them have a thing out credits.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

So that's where it's kind of similar. So now I guess I see it more.

[George Severis]

Right. And actually the theory and practice of it, too. It's. Everyone has all these opinions about where comedy is going or where entertainment is going, and you're like, have you written the script?

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah. Do you know what it's like to tell a joke?

[George Severis]

Hello.

[Sam Taggart]

Hello.

[George Severis]

Anyway, I would love to learn what an urban planner does sometime soon.

[Sam Taggart]

Did you dream of a. Sorry, dinner party job? Something that would be fun to say at a party when you were like, let's say, 18?

[George Severis]

Oh, sure, sure, sure.

[Sam Taggart]

Was there something where you were like, I'm gonna just say I'm this and lie?

[George Severis]

Or, like, imagining, like, what you would say? Well, obviously the dream is just you're a famous writer. That's like Joan Didion. Level.

[Sam Taggart]

Sure. See, that dream is a bit scary to me because then they're gonna be like, oh, what's your work? I like when it's like, I'm a engineer. Cause then no one can. No one's questioning what you're up to. They're just like, I believe you.

[George Severis]

So you want to talk less, you want to deflect, kind of. Okay, got it.

[Sam Taggart]

Got it.

[George Severis]

I want people, I want everyone to know I wrote the big column in the paper that was so controversial that people are egging my house and they pull me aside and they're like, but you were right though.

[Sam Taggart]

Wow, that's so interesting. You crave the controversy.

[George Severis]

I crave being a sort of niche figure. That's correct.

[Sam Taggart]

Wow, that's really awesome.

[George Severis]

Thank you.

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[Kal Penn]

hey everyone, it's Cal Penn. I'm the host of Irsay the Audible and I Heart Audiobook Club. This week on the podcast, I am sitting down with Ray Porter, the narrator of Andy Weir's audiobook project, Hail Mary Massive sci fi adventure about survival and science and what happens when you wake up alone, very far from Earth.

[Ray Porter]

I really had to make a decision because I caught myself getting that frog in my throat and starting to get teary as I'm narrating some of these sections and it's like, okay, yo, yo, yo, is this indulgence? And I really thought about it. I was like, no. At this point, it would kind of be betraying the trust the author and the listener have in telling this story if I don't go through it. But there's places in this book that deeply, emotionally affected me and I left it on the mic. That's great because it served the story. People will say like, oh my God, I cried at the end. It's like, yeah, dude, me too.

[Kal Penn]

Listen to Irsay, the Audible and I Heart Audiobook Club on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[George Severis]

Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile. I don't know if you knew this, but anyone can get the Same premium wireless for 15amonth Plan that I've been enjoying. It's not just for celebrities. So do like I did and have one of your assistant's assistants switch you

[Caller]

to Mint Mobile today.

[George Severis]

I'm told it's super easy to [e-mail]

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[George Severis]

Okay, next call. Wait, I'm also.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah, bring it back.

[George Severis]

There's something about the scale of urban planning. It's much more on the spectrum. Much more lesbian to think local. To think it's like farmer's market. Mm. But the gay guy is like the whole. You want to deal with the whole city who died and made you president?

[Sam Taggart]

It's God complex. That's not right.

[Caller]

Hi guys, longtime listener, first time caller. The question I wanted to ask today. Mostly interested to see George's thoughts, but also would love to hear Sam's opinions. As a Greek icon yourself, I'm wondering if you're interested in the new Christopher Nolan Odyssey movie that's coming out this summer. Thoughts on the casting, thoughts on just the epic tale that's coming to screen. Will you be seeing it? Yeah, that's really all I had today. Thanks guys.

[George Severis]

I'm pulling up the entire cast list

[Sam Taggart]

and I guess just off the bat, I want to say we are so excited for the Christopher Nolan Odyssey. We are the biggest Stans of Oppenheimer in the LGBTQ community.

[George Severis]

I've been wanting to do a big rewatch, even in chronological order, of the Nolan filmography, and maybe I'll do it in anticipation of the Odyssey, because I'm like, hold on, Nolan.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, that scares me. I'm scared to watch Inception because I hated it. So, so, so.

[George Severis]

Really, you know, I've never seen Tenet.

[Sam Taggart]

Me either, because people said it was bad, and I. Sometimes when things are bad, I get angry at them. And I don't want to be angry about my dear friend Christopher Nolan.

[George Severis]

But, see, I think. But then the cool opinion is that it's actually good. Well, I would do that. My fear is that I'm gonna go in being like, I want to be one of the cool people who thinks it's good. Then I fully won't get it, and then I'll be really angry with myself for not thinking it's good.

[Sam Taggart]

Wow. But do people actually think it's good?

[George Severis]

Yes.

[Sam Taggart]

I have not seen this opinion.

[George Severis]

Really?

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

Well, honey, you are not hanging out with sort of edgelord culture writers.

[Sam Taggart]

I'll say.

[George Severis]

I have not rewatched the Batman movies since they came out. I've never seen the Prestige. I've never seen Memento, believe it or not. And I've always wanted to see Insomnia because it's one of Robin Williams classic dramatic roles.

[Sam Taggart]

I've never seen Insomnia or Memento.

[George Severis]

But. Wait, so you hated Interstellar or Inception?

[Sam Taggart]

Inception.

[George Severis]

Okay. But Interstellar, I loved Interstellar. Okay, let's just rewatch. Oh, and I also didn't really care about Dunkirk, but it's not for me.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[George Severis]

So the cast is pretty much Matt Damon as Odysseus, Tom Holland, Zendaya. Elliot Page does not have what character he's playing go off. Anne Hathaway, Robert Pattinson, Jon Bernthal, Benny Safdie, Mia Goth, Charlize Theron, Travis Scott. Oh, okay. Wow. Lupita Nyong'. O.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, basically, we're thrilled.

[George Severis]

Yeah. I have just. I know I'm being sort of baited into expressing some opinion that these people are in Greek. I don't care. I think this movie needs movie stars. It's a Christopher Nolan epic. I don't think you need to put. Sorry. Nia Vardalos as Athena.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah, I can't believe. Is that even a controversy anywhere?

[George Severis]

Well, here's the complicated thing with Greek culture is that it's very easy for it to become right wing and racist in the wrong hands. Because people are very much like, remember ancient Greece, when everything was white and when real culture was happening? Unlike now.

[Sam Taggart]

Right.

[George Severis]

And it's very challenging to avoid that. And so I think oftentimes it's the only casting controversies where the people mad about the casting are actually not woke. And I don't want to be part of that.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, no, it's sort of like when people get mad at Lord of the Rings for having characters of color.

[George Severis]

It's like, it's a movie.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah, you can have that.

[George Severis]

Relax.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

So, no, I think that a Christopher Nolan Odyssey should be the biggest movie stars on the planet. I think it should be Matt Damon and Anne Hathaway. I think it's great that it's Robert Pattinson, obviously. Tom Holland. I'm like, let's see what he can do.

[Sam Taggart]

He does scare me. Nothing but love to him. I hope that he does an amazing job, but, I mean, he's fine as Spider man, but so far that's kind of it.

[George Severis]

I know. I worry.

[Sam Taggart]

I have fear.

[George Severis]

But I also think Christopher Nolan is a great director of actors.

[Sam Taggart]

Of course he should cast us.

[George Severis]

I would love for us to like the. You know, in Hunchback of Notre Dame, the two statues that are sort of. One of them is stupid and one of them's fat.

[Sam Taggart]

That would be so good.

[George Severis]

Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

I would even settle just for, like, they all jump out of the Trojan horse and we're just like, in a window and we're like, oh, no.

[George Severis]

Or one of everyone jumps out of the Trojan horse and then it's silent and awkward and then one of us, like, farts. It's like, you guys, we said, be quiet.

[Sam Taggart]

We're the silly ones.

[George Severis]

And the horses. We're the silly ones. Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

Okay. I like that.

[George Severis]

I do hope that this film has some comedic relief.

[Sam Taggart]

I hope it doesn't, really. I hope it's fucking dead serious.

[George Severis]

Because, of course, that's the one complaint with Christopher Nolan. It's like, lighten up.

[Sam Taggart]

I hope it's dead serious. And I hope the female characters are even flatter than in Oppenheimer.

[George Severis]

Okay, I know that everyone said the female characters are flat in Oppenheimer, but I think Emily Blunt did a really good job. Remember when she didn't shake the hand?

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah, she did a good job, but it was written, so.

[George Severis]

No, totally. Because she was drunk. Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

Well, her job was be drunk, don't shake the hand.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

And she ate down.

[Sam Taggart]

Nailed it. Like look sad as you hang up.

[George Severis]

I forgot how drunk she was. I just. I'm remembering now.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah, no, it was awesome. No, she nailed it, though.

[George Severis]

I also think. I will say, I think it's fun that Mia Goth is in it, and I think it's fun that Benny Safdie's playing Agamemnon. That's a fun choice.

[Sam Taggart]

He's a good actor.

[George Severis]

I agree.

[Sam Taggart]

Wake it up.

[George Severis]

Wake it TF up. So, yeah, I'm very excited for the Odyssey, and to be quite honest, we talked about this when we did the who weekly patreon. I'm excited for this summer blockbuster season. I'm like, between Odyssey, that Steven Spielberg movie where Emily Blunt goes.

[Sam Taggart]

Yes.

[George Severis]

And Disclosure Day. Disclosure Day. I'm gonna be clack, clack, clacking to the box office, I'll tell you that. And then devil rose, Prada 2. I think it's gonna be a good summer.

[Sam Taggart]

I think it's gonna be an amazing summer.

[George Severis]

John Leguizambo's in it. Oh, in the Odyssey.

[Sam Taggart]

Wow.

[George Severis]

Oh, my God. Travis Scott in the Odyssey. I'm sorry. Glad we live in the United States of America. Okay.

[Caller]

Hi, gay guys. Longtime listener for sun caller. I was listening to your recent conversation about the vibes in Palm Springs, and I guess as a Virgo, I would love a comprehensive or as comprehensive as possible list of all the gay vacation spots and their vibes and the pros and cons of each of them. Thank you so much. Bye.

[Sam Taggart]

I wanted to talk about this because, of course, summer's just around the corner,

[George Severis]

but of course not here yet.

[Sam Taggart]

It's around the corner. But like most things around the corner, you can't see them because they're around the corner.

[George Severis]

Around the corner is actually such a sinister phrase if you think of it. It's like, are we in? It follows. Anyway, go on.

[Sam Taggart]

It's so close, but I can't see it. I just have to trust that it's there.

[George Severis]

I just poke my nose with my straw. Gone.

[Sam Taggart]

Oh, my God. So someone was talking to me about this at the Eagle on Friday night.

[George Severis]

Unlikely topic and place for it to come up.

[Sam Taggart]

They were saying, can you rank the places? And I'm not gonna do. Because I don't want to do judgment necessarily at this stage. I'm going to see if I can avoid it because generally I feel like I'm being too negative.

[George Severis]

Really?

[Sam Taggart]

In life, I feel like I'm being too negative.

[George Severis]

Okay, so which ones do you love?

[Sam Taggart]

So I think the thing. I guess I can start negative.

[George Severis]

Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

It stems of course, from Palm Springs, because I was.

[George Severis]

Yeah, you hate Palm Springs.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, it's not for me. It's a retirement community and if you go with a good squad, it can be fun. But if you aren't there with a good squad, you're just hearing 60 plus year old men talk about taxes.

[George Severis]

I just want to say I think intergenerational friendship in the LGBTQ community is so important, and I think that we have to reach across the aisle. Whether you're a kind of multi hyphenate, perpetually up and coming creator in your mid-30s or a financial criminal who also loves John waters in his 60s.

[Sam Taggart]

I gotta say, I, of course, you know, call me a T shirt in a gift store. Cause I think old guys absolutely rule. But there's like something to. There's like old guy pride in Palm Springs where they're like mad at you for being in their space and you're kind of like, hey, I'm just trying to have some fun. And they're like, don't talk to me. Don't talk to me until you own a home.

[George Severis]

They are gay guys at a toxic gay bar and you are a woman entering. And they're like, that's not for you.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah, essentially, that's what's going on. It just isn't for me yet. But that being said, I always compare it to Fire island, and I don't think you should compare it to Fire island because Fire island is like one. It's both secluded, relaxing and party climby, psychotic. Fire island was the first gay vacation place I ever went. Was it your first?

[George Severis]

Yes.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

No, I went to P Town before I went to Fire Island.

[Sam Taggart]

Okay. And so when I first went to Fire Island, I was like, first of all, I'm in heaven.

[George Severis]

Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

But then when I went to P Town, I was like, oh, Fire Island's like unique.

[George Severis]

Yes. Fire island is basically like a social experiment where at some point it will be revealed that it was a government experiment and people will die. Totally. And there were cameras there the whole time. And the statistics that they are kind of surmising out of it are not gonna be pretty and they are gonna be used for evil.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah, it's too.

[George Severis]

I'm not surprised that it is very nostalgia based. Like, it's very, you know, Polaroid photo of an unmade bed and then it says Peter on it, you know.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[George Severis]

It's not gonna last. And it's, in fact sinking.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, it's literally sinking.

[George Severis]

It's literally sinking. And that's kind of the thing with Fire island, it's also. It's very like Keith Haring T shirt and denim jacket cosplay.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, one of the weirdest things about being on Fire island is when you see someone who is not in your aesthetic community.

[George Severis]

Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

Because you're like, oh, everyone here is cool. Everyone here is the same New York style.

[George Severis]

Right. Not the same.

[Sam Taggart]

And then you just see a random person from D and you're like, what's that happening here?

[George Severis]

Okay, so we have Palm Springs is old. Is social. Government, social experiment.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah. And. And not family oriented.

[George Severis]

Not family oriented.

[Sam Taggart]

There are you. Sometimes we'll spot one family there. But, like, there are.

[George Severis]

I'm calling child services.

[Sam Taggart]

Gay people to be weird. Yeah.

[George Severis]

P Town is very family oriented.

[Sam Taggart]

Very family oriented. It's sort of.

[George Severis]

Which I like.

[Sam Taggart]

Which I like. P Town was interesting. So when I went there after Fire Island, I was like, huh, so straight people are here, but they're not the focal point. And I was like, so can I still be gay if straight people can see me?

[George Severis]

Provincetown is a straight community that is gay themed. Yeah,

[Sam Taggart]

yeah, that's it. And it's nice. You don't feel as transported as when you're on Fire island, but at the same time, you do actually get to go to a movie theater if it's rainy, which is huge.

[George Severis]

Well, Provincetown is importantly in Cape Cod. And so when you're there, you are in Cape Cod.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

But there's just like a slight twist. Whereas Fire island, you can't compare to anything. Fire island, they said, we made this. We 3D printed this island. And it's just for the most disgusting gay guys you've ever seen. And they're all in a K hole.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah. P Town being so close to Boston gives it an interesting little flair because it kind of reminds me of, like, I went to, of course, college at the University of Virginia. It's a very fratty school. So being even vaguely into alternative culture, I was like, okay, I'm the most

[George Severis]

punk rock person on Kim Gordon. Literally.

[Sam Taggart]

And so I kind of feel that when I'm in P Town is. I'm like, oh, I guess I'm like, really, really edgy.

[George Severis]

I like that about P Town.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

No, yeah. I'm kind of all in on P Town these days. I. I do wish there was a direct flight from, let's say the 2, 3 stop that is right by my apartment to P Town.

[Sam Taggart]

I agree. I agree. I would even travel to that train stop to P Town.

[George Severis]

Yeah. And I will go to Penn Station. I'LL go to Penn Station. I'm happy to take the subway to Penn Station if then I could get a direct flight to P Town.

[Sam Taggart]

Yes.

[George Severis]

Because currently, I think I've done the research, and it seems like there's no way to get there from New York City.

[Sam Taggart]

And speaking of, there's no flights out of Penn Station. What the hell?

[George Severis]

Yeah. There should be an airport in Penn Station.

[Sam Taggart]

We need one. No. Every gay place is so hard to get to, and it's so crazy.

[George Severis]

Well, that's sort of the. I mean, you know, that is the advantage of Fire island, is that it is very close. Assuming everyone lives in New York, of course.

[Sam Taggart]

I know. I'm actually, like, pretending that I still live here through this conversation.

[George Severis]

Okay, so Palm Springs, P Town, Fire Island. Are there any other ones you want to sort of throw into the mix?

[Sam Taggart]

Well, I would want to throw in Zipolite, of course.

[George Severis]

Right. Which I've never been.

[Sam Taggart]

Which Heaven on Earth.

[George Severis]

And I'm happy to throw in Mykonos, which I have been to.

[Sam Taggart]

Oh, I've never been.

[George Severis]

I mean, to me, the gay life in Mykonos is so unappealing.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah. Everything I've heard about it sounds bad. I'm imagining, like, an active dump.

[George Severis]

It's just. It's really. I can't get behind it.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah. Do you know in Palm Springs, you're not allowed to play music outside?

[George Severis]

Yes, you've told me that many times.

[Sam Taggart]

I think somebody needs to stop them. How is this allowed?

[George Severis]

You have to go silent disco mode.

[Sam Taggart]

There's a whole town of theoretically gay vacationers not allowed to play music outside in their pools.

[George Severis]

You know what, though? The archetype of the kind of cranky old gay man wearing a little neckerchief, to me, is so such a vital part of our community that I'm like, God, I would love to be in Palm Springs and be yelled at by an old retired lawyer to turn down my Addison Rae mix.

[Sam Taggart]

They're literally kicking you out of the Airbnb. They own the house and they're kicking you out, and they're saying, go.

[George Severis]

No, they're renting out their Airbnb. But they're still there. They're watching. They're dropping in, like, every few hours.

[Sam Taggart]

They've got cameras set up. Yeah.

[George Severis]

They're like, are you gonna clean the sink? I was getting to it.

[Sam Taggart]

No, it's crazy.

[Caller]

Hi, Sam and George. I am calling because I was really inspired by, you know, like, some reposted Tumblr, whatever that was something like the last few hours before Getting your hair washed is like, you'll experience a depth of misery only known by Russian literature, something like that. So I've just been kind of thinking a lot about the abject lately, and I was trying to extend that to kind of my own life. And what I do agree with the hair washing thing, my thought, is a depth of misery that is unknown to anyone before me, for me is definitely like having to listen to, like, my husband podcasts in his car. Because they are straight guys, like, comedy guys, and they're not even, like, the worst of the worst. They're regular. They are kind of like alt guys. I won't say who they are because y' all probably know them, but, I mean, just hearing straight guys talking and trying to be funny is like. It's like hell to me. And I am wondering if y' all could say something in your life, like, an everyday occurrence or even just something in pop culture that makes you feel like no one's ever felt as miserable as you. And I don't. I obviously don't mean real pain or fear a thing. All right, love y' all so much. Bye.

[Sam Taggart]

Amazing call.

[George Severis]

Yeah, that's a really. It's a thinker, first of all.

[Sam Taggart]

Still using Tumblr.

[George Severis]

Go off Well, I like the idea of being like, I was really inspired by some bullshit.

[Sam Taggart]

I think this. Well, you brought up something when you were talking about this call before. If you want to go first.

[George Severis]

My instinct was just any and all paperwork. And obviously, I understand everyone hates paperwork. I don't think I'm unique in this. But there is a part of every single time I have to do any sort of paperwork or logistical thing. A big thing for me is because I'm not a brag, a dual citizen, I often will have to go to the Greek consulate in America or the U.S. consulate in Greece to do something to make sure that all the paperwork is in order. And each time, I could die before finishing this task. The idea of being in some sort of online portal that was created in HTML in 1994 and figuring out how it works and then getting the confirmation and then going there and knowing that there's going to be a crazy line and not knowing what language you're going to. It stresses me out so much. The other thing is we are both freelancers and we are constantly. Basically, half our life is filling out the same paperwork over and over again. But somehow there's one thing that's different in each one.

[Sam Taggart]

It's so crazy. No, I really agree with that. I think I also panic with paperwork in a bad way. The other one that you actually said before me, which I think is genius, is dinner being late, but it's not. The way that I think about my day is. So I'm like, okay, well, this is gonna take an hour, and then I'll have 15 minutes and I'll do this. So then when, like, one thing messes up, I'm like, okay, I guess today's done. I ruined today.

[George Severis]

Well, yeah, you're not flexible when it comes to food times. You need to have your lunch at lunchtime and your dinner at dinner time. I'm trying to think of other things.

[Sam Taggart]

I have another one that call made me think of is when I'm in a bar where there are sports playing and they have the volume on the noise of a sports game gives me an instant headache in a way that I've never understood. And I'm like, what's going on here? Cause even the idea of being like, go and watch the game kind of is like a fun idea. But hearing sports drives me insane. The beeping, the buzzing, the rumble of a crowd, the little commentator, the patter they have. I'm like, stop this.

[George Severis]

You know, sports people are so lucky that there's this thing that can always be in the background.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah. I mean, can you imagine if every single day there was a new episode of Drag Race and we were just sort of like lazily talking?

[George Severis]

But even if, for example, if we were really into soap operas, you know what I mean? Like, there's so many of them and they're constantly playing and there's characters you keep up with. Sports are non stop.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, the issue is we don't watch Housewives because that is non stop as well.

[George Severis]

Yeah. And by the way, enough.

[Sam Taggart]

I know, I know enough.

[George Severis]

I mean, it's all my examples for things that make me feel horrible. It's literally when air travel is terrible. You know, when you're stuck in an airport for hours. You know, a big one for me is when I. And this is related to the hair thing, but if I somehow don't have time to shower when I want to shower, and then I somehow have to be like out and about in a city and I can feel that I'm not clean, I truly want to kill myself.

[Sam Taggart]

Interesting.

[George Severis]

Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

That's when I'm my most free. That's when I'm Madonna. I feel so free.

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[Kal Penn]

hey everyone, it's Kal Penn. I'm the host of Irsay, The Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club. This week on the podcast, I am sitting down with Ray Porter, the narrator of Andy Weir's audiobook book project Hail Mary Massive sci fi adventure about survival and science and what happens when you wake up alone, very far from Earth.

[Ray Porter]

I really had to make a decision because I caught myself getting that frog in my throat and starting to get teary as I'm narrating some of these sections and it's like, okay, yo yo yo, is this indulgent? And I really thought about it. I was like, no. At this point it would kind of be betraying the trust the author and the listener have in telling this story if I don't go through it. But there's places in this book that deeply, emotionally affected me and I left it on the mic. That's great because it served the story. People will say like oh my God, I cried at the end. It's like, yeah dude, me too.

[Kal Penn]

Listen to Hearsay, the Audible and iHeart audiobook club on the iHeartradio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

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[Caller]

Hi Colin from Washington D.C. gay City in America.

[George Severis]

Do you want to apologize to him?

[Caller]

I discovered Stradio Lab at a tumultuous period of my life last year where I've become friends with a shocking number of straight men who I love dearly. But I also lost two of my closest straight male best friends. They in a major plot twist in my life, they both came out to me at the same time. They didn't know about each other either. No, they are not having sex with each other. But the three of us are still best friends. We're just all gay now. But a recent topic of discussion among my friends that are still straight men is a fervent debate about whether boneless wings or bone in wings are gayer. And I was surprised to find that my favorite podcast discussing the number one topic in my life, what is straight and what is gay, have not delved into the topic of wings. So what's gayer, boneless or bone in?

[Sam Taggart]

I do want to apologize to DC and the DC community. I've met many a gay guy from dc.

[George Severis]

Me too.

[Sam Taggart]

And whenever I go to dc, I have fun. I meet gay guys, I go to the gay bars and I have a blast. And this is what I was saying in life, I'm being so negative I can't not throw someone under the bus. Yeah, but I'll work on it.

[George Severis]

Well?

[Sam Taggart]

Well,

[George Severis]

I think it's important to live in dc.

[Sam Taggart]

How? So

[George Severis]

that's where it all began. No, I think the issue with DC is that it gets a bad rap because of the most evil people that live there. But by definition, every action has an equal and opposite whatever the fucking thing is, opposite reaction. All the most bleeding heart people that are trying to get the urban planning in check also live in dc.

[Sam Taggart]

No, it's true. It's true.

[George Severis]

They're obviously still socializing with Kellyanne Conway. But what are you gonna do?

[Sam Taggart]

I mean, it's so weird there. One time I went to dinner.

[George Severis]

Well, it's like how we're sometimes in green rooms with people where I'm like, so I've seen your set and it's fully right wing. But yeah, nice to see you.

[Sam Taggart]

One time I went to dinner in D.C. and sitting across the way was Steven Mnuchi.

[George Severis]

Oh, fun.

[Sam Taggart]

And I was like, what is going on? And every time we tried to take a picture of him, someone would stand in the way.

[George Severis]

Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

And I was like, let us take a picture of him.

[George Severis]

Yeah, that's kind of like when I, of course, saw Newt Gingrich. So basically, what is your take on bone in versus boneless? And I would go so far as to say more broadly with all chicken rather than just wings. Cause there's.

[Sam Taggart]

I think we should start with just wings and then potentially zoom out.

[George Severis]

Okay.

[Sam Taggart]

I think when it comes to wings, bone, here's where it gets confusing, is like, bone in. You know, it can be read as masculine. I'm doing this as God intended.

[George Severis]

I'm just covered in socks. Night out with the guys, just my damn wing.

[Sam Taggart]

And it could be seen as feminine to be like, I need the bone out and I need to have it a specific way. But on the other hand, it could also be seen as more organic. Y more like, oh, this is like real chicken. Like, I actually got this really nice chicken. And so I have these wings that are amazing. And so you want the bone in. And that's more of the queer perspective. Whereas straight people are like, well, as long as it's covered in the sauce, I don't really give a fuck. And it's like you're eating chicken nuggets, but they're covered in the sauce.

[Caller]

Right.

[Sam Taggart]

So I'm kind of confused and not sure where I want to land on this.

[George Severis]

And also bone in is more adult and boneless is more childlike. Yeah, obviously. Yes. So it is. Is obviously complicated, as are many things. Here's what I'm struggling with. Boneless wings is sort of vague to me. I'm almost like, are you a tenders or a wings person? Tenders. I understand what that is. And tenders are boneless.

[Sam Taggart]

Sure.

[George Severis]

You know what I mean?

[Sam Taggart]

Yes.

[George Severis]

I would never. I think to say I want boneless wings is a little baby. But to say I want tender is you're basically being like, I do want boneless, but I'm also an adult.

[Sam Taggart]

So to say you want a boneless wing, I agree with you that it's baby.

[George Severis]

Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

But is it baby straight or baby gay?

[George Severis]

Totally.

[Sam Taggart]

Is it like I'm such a little twink I can't even chew my bone? Or is it like I'm such a little. Like my wife has washed all my clothes for the last decade and I don't know how to eat around a bone? I'll choke and die.

[George Severis]

I think bone in is strict, Okay? I mean, sometimes the obvious answer is the one that's really funny.

[Sam Taggart]

Occam's razor, I think.

[George Severis]

Yes. But I do think there's also a horseshoe theory where it's like, okay, get ready for this. On the one end, straight guys bone in. Then you go into straight women and gay guys boneless, and then back around to queer, non binary, polyamorous bonin. You know what I mean?

[Sam Taggart]

Uh huh. No, that makes complete sense.

[George Severis]

That's kind of how I feel.

[Sam Taggart]

Okay, great. Yeah, Bone in is.

[George Severis]

And actually it's the same with. It actually tracks absolutely directly to Maha, where it's like. It is both right wing and then also like California clean living. Sober.

[Sam Taggart]

Totally. As are many things.

[George Severis]

So then you would sort of have to switch out the straight woman in the chart that I mentally drew. But there's no time.

[Sam Taggart]

There's no time. It's been drawn.

[George Severis]

I want chicken tenders. Interestingly.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, let's go to Julius. Ugh, I want to so bad.

[George Severis]

I can't. I'm going to the gym afterwards.

[Sam Taggart]

Respect.

[George Severis]

Okay, next question.

[Caller]

First of all, you have a solid city number, which was confusing to me, so I wasn't sure if this was right, but. Okay, so I'm calling because I don't know if you guys have done something like this in your. It's something that you would have already done, but I'm not really sure. But my roommates and I recently were discussing. I have one roommate who loves Demi Lovato. And so we were discussing who each of our dummies were. So a dummy is like basically an artist that you know is kind of a flop, but you just love them no matter what. Similar to. So he left Demi Lovato. I like Marina the Diamonds. My other roommate loves Camila Cabello. So it's kind of like if someone you know is bad, but they're also good. We were saying one of my roommates said Kylie Minogue, and we were kind of like, no, but I'm not totally sure why. I don't know how. It's like you have to be kind of bad in a commercial way almost. I don't know. All right, well, bye.

[Sam Taggart]

This is an interesting and difficult question. I'm scrolling through music Because I'm not sure one is not jumping out to me immediately. First of all, it's very disrespectful to little Miss Demi.

[George Severis]

It's disrespectful to pretty much everyone that was mentioned except, Sorry, Marina and the Diamonds. Because I'm literally not. No, I'm not gonna actually pile on Demi at all. I'm not even gonna say it's fair in any way. I mean, I do think her latest album flopped, and she will be the first to admit that.

[Sam Taggart]

But it's still, if you listen to it, it's fun.

[George Severis]

It's really good.

[Sam Taggart]

Succeeded in what she was trying to do.

[George Severis]

It's very good. And I think it'll be. Justice will come.

[Sam Taggart]

Yes.

[George Severis]

I mean, I do have one that is the most obvious and I'm such a flop for even going there. But I do like the Rita Ora album Phoenix.

[Sam Taggart]

Really?

[George Severis]

Yes. And there's actually a song that only I like, and it's called New Look.

[Sam Taggart]

Wow.

[George Severis]

And actually, it's not on this album. No, it is. I found it. But for whatever reason. And I actually think this album is pretty good, top to bottom. I'm not saying it's revolutionary, but it is very enjoyable in the car pop music. And one time I played it while we were in the car with my family and my dad was like, this is really good. Wow, that is interesting. I don't think she's ever reached those heights since then. Not that I've really been keeping up. But she's definitely someone who is definitionally sort of always considered a flop. But I actually think she is. But I think she was doing something here and then just never captured that moment again.

[Sam Taggart]

My greatest fear that's maybe coming true is, you know how it's like, do I have any original thoughts, or is it just that I believe what other people tell me?

[George Severis]

Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

Because honestly, when someone gets the stench of flop on them, like, true flop, I'm like, okay, I'm out. Cause I'm like, if you're already fascinated, that's true.

[George Severis]

Because you're never out with Gaga. And she has had the stench of flop on her on and off for years.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, and obviously I wanted to name that one, but it sounds like a cop out because now Gaga's so beloved. But I was standing Joanne harder than any anyone ever has.

[George Severis]

And you were standing artpop when it came out.

[Sam Taggart]

I was an early artpop, whereas I

[George Severis]

will be completely honest and say I was in the mainstream with Artpop, where I acknowledged it after the conversation had already Come back around. The tough thing with this question is that everyone that could be this, like, someone that could be. This is Carla Jepsen. But she's been reclaimed.

[Sam Taggart]

It.

[George Severis]

Everyone has already been claimed.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, and same for Tinashe.

[George Severis]

And same for Slater, honestly.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

And same for Charlie.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, like, if it were, like, four years ago, I could say Charlie and be, like, a hero.

[George Severis]

Same with Kim Petrus. Everyone that, like, was. No. There was no one left to be reclaimed. Basically, like, that. That is kind of. And that's one of the reasons why gay guys are struggling in their cultural commentary and turning to reality stars. Because you're like, okay, so every bad pop star has been reclaimed. Every bad actress has been reclaimed. Every bad musician has been reclaimed. The only person I have is this woman in this show who's famous for, like. Like, on the street. And you're like, she ate that.

[Sam Taggart]

We are addicted to reclaiming people. Yeah, It's. It's not right. Sometimes we. Sometimes we need to, like, look at the new nice home and be like, let's just buy that one.

[George Severis]

Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

Instead we look at the. The fixer upper and we say, I. I want that one.

[George Severis]

That is such a good point, actually.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah. We are addicted to fixer uppers.

[George Severis]

Someone that I. I struggle sometimes with.

[Caller]

With.

[George Severis]

Well, okay. Katy Perry is fully a flop currently.

[Sam Taggart]

That's true.

[George Severis]

Are you. Has the stench of flop alienated you, or. No?

[Sam Taggart]

No, it's made me want to support her.

[George Severis]

Interesting.

[Sam Taggart]

And I've said this on record, I believe, when I was an early hater of Katy Perry, and obviously, Teenage Dream is amazing. Whatever, Whatever. But I was still like, this girl's annoying. And then I was so mean about it, and she was like a punchline for me. And then everyone else also was like, okay, she's annoying. We hate her. And then I was like, hold on. Like, let's be nice, like. And so it was like, it became too much of a pile on. And so then I was like, well, let's pull it back a bit. It's time to be nice to Katy Perry. And I still think it almost is. Like, I'm wanting her to succeed. It's only fun to attack her when she's doing well and thriving. Like, when she's in a flop era, I'm like, well, we need to protect her. We need to support her and respect

[George Severis]

her even, you know, who had the Stentor flop on her and almost made me become fully reactionary as Grimes, Because

[Sam Taggart]

I was like, I was gonna bring up Grimes.

[George Severis]

I was kind of like, when it, you know, obviously in her personal life is, you know, a whole ass mess.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah. It's a whole assessment.

[George Severis]

You can quote me on that, that her personal life is actually a whole ass mess.

[Sam Taggart]

It's a whole ass mess.

[George Severis]

That said, I will never stop believing Grimes as, like a musical sort of visionary, to quote herself and her album Visions. And I will always be interested in seeing what she is up to, just from a purely aesthetic, artistic point of view, even if she's also like, by the way, I'm going to Mars and I'm raising my children there because I.

[Sam Taggart]

Because I want to homeschool them.

[George Severis]

You want to homeschool them?

[Sam Taggart]

She is someone that, at this point, she just feels like a close, personal friend. And so I will, of course, always listen to whatever she puts out. But then I will be like, this one. We have different ideas.

[Caller]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

She's not consuming the same media you're consuming.

[Sam Taggart]

And she almost doesn't like the things about herself that I do.

[George Severis]

Yes.

[Sam Taggart]

And her old music versus her new music, it's like night and day right now. She wants just the most polished, clean, overproduced thing she could possibly have.

[George Severis]

Is that true? I haven't listened to the latest. Latest.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, honestly, the latest song, I Kind of Love. I forget what it's called, of course. It's like angel something.

[George Severis]

Of course. Angel. Appreciate power.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[George Severis]

Equals one plus one.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah. Artificial Angel. No, that might be what it's called. Artificial Angels. Yeah. That song I kind of love. And the video I kind of like, too.

[George Severis]

Oh, I like the video. Yeah, I know this. You know, I'll say this about Grimes, and this is value neutral. She does evolve as an artist. A lot of the other people don't much like Bjork evolves as an artist. I personally think a lot of Bjork's most recent stuff sounds sort of like clanging pots and pans while a symphony plays.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, yes.

[George Severis]

But I think she is not resting on her laurel. She is trying to do something different.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

And I think not a lot of people are doing that.

[Sam Taggart]

And I don't know if this is relevant to the conversation at all, but as I was scrolling through my music,

[George Severis]

I was like, I know I need to stop scrolling.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, I was like, also like Chloe and Halle, they're not flops at all. But I'm like, come go back to doing music together. Be fun again.

[George Severis]

But I sort of think, unfortunately, they're done. They have lost their way.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[Public Ad Read]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

And I think it's because they were too young and there Were too many people in the room. Were telling them what to do.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

Wait, Chloe. Actually. Hold on, I'm going to find this song. I think it was Chloe. Chloe had a solo track. Is it literally Just have Mercy, which is her most famous song.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah. It's so good.

[George Severis]

That song is so good.

[Sam Taggart]

No, it's crazy.

[George Severis]

Oh, here's someone I will always stick up for, even when she's in a flop is. What's her name?

[Sam Taggart]

Amazing sentence. Oh, God.

[George Severis]

Doja cat. Thank you. Wow, that's very impressive.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah, you'll see. I think she's. She's always kind of.

[George Severis]

Also, let's get an acting career going. I think she'd be great on screen.

[Sam Taggart]

Okay, next question.

[Caller]

Hi, guys. My name is Ian, and in addition to being a glamour girl, I'm a historian. And I wanted to call your episode with Amy Zimmer. You guys are kind of pontificating about the quote, well behaved women rarely make history and the different things that it could be. And I wanted to chime in with my favorite fun fact ever, which is that that quote was actually coined by a Mormon historian named Laurel Thatcher Ulrich. And her big point when she was making the quote was that we need to write more history about well behaved women and that we ought not punish a woman for behaving well by, like, not making her go down in history. So it's sort of. It's still a feminist take, but it's not exactly the one that it becomes. So something to think about. I love the podcast. Thanks, guys.

[George Severis]

Isn't that so interesting?

[Sam Taggart]

I actually think that's genius.

[George Severis]

It's so amazing. It's very, like.

[Sam Taggart]

It's literally like the reality stars thing that we're talking about.

[George Severis]

Totally.

[Sam Taggart]

It's like, why are we rewarding these people for, like, taking a shit on the floor?

[George Severis]

Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

Like, it's time to start rewarding the person who is, like, polite and normal.

[Public Ad Read]

Yes.

[George Severis]

And it's actually like, it's interesting that we immediately think well behaved is a negative thing. Like, well behaved is in the eye of the beholder. A well behaved woman can be a woman that behaves towards social justice, that does all the right things.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

And yet it's basically, we've interpreted it in the most honestly, gay guy way of if you're boring, get the fuck out of.

[Sam Taggart]

The fuck out of my face.

[George Severis]

But if you make yourself known, let's talk.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah. Throw a drink in someone's face.

[George Severis]

Yeah, exactly.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah. This does sort of mess up my worldview, I must say, completely, because I'm not Sure. What to do with it now? Because I do use it as a justification for when I'm being bad.

[George Severis]

Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

Or being, being rude or maybe talking badly about D.C. stuff like that.

[George Severis]

Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

I'll say. You know, well behaved women rarely make history. And, but I, and but the problem is, no matter the, the point, both sides are true. It is true that you have to be bad and be sort of hated in order to be loved. And I think the person who originally said it is saying, doesn't it suck that well behaved women rarely make history? We need to celebrate well behaved women. But we're just taking it as like, well, you did point out a truth, which is that well behaved women rarely make mystery.

[George Severis]

Yeah. It's so fascinating. It's like pointing out how things are done. And there's two options. One is on a systemic level changing the way history is written so that well behaved women are platformed. And the other one is sort of an individualistic approach and actually like a sort of cynical approach of like, well, this is how things are. They're never going to change. Might as well throw a drink in someone's face so I can make history.

[Sam Taggart]

Of course. Well, it's also where you're changing. The way we describe history is groundbreaking and completely impossible because is that thing like the victors, Right. The story. Is that how it's said? Because someone like Jeff Bezos will be in history forever and ever and ever because it was like he was the king of the world.

[George Severis]

Talk about not a well behaved woman.

[Sam Taggart]

He's not a well behaved woman at all. He is a badly behaved woman. And I feel that like, whereas like, a guy who's like, just like, living his life and being like, really having a tasteful career and choosing a nice balance between family and job and being like, you know what, I'll just get the one bedroom house. I don't need to be a psychopath. No one's writing the chapter in the history book about him.

[George Severis]

I know it's true. But then of course, the obvious flip side of that is, does well behaved mean just complicit and unambitious and even not courageous or brave?

[Sam Taggart]

It just means there's something about, let's just like celebrate change no matter what.

[George Severis]

Yes. Well, it goes back to, I remember being, when I lived in Silicon Valley, the big thing was change the world. And it was always like, in what way is someone gonna. Everyone is changing. You can change the world by littering or by picking up litter. Which one are you doing?

[Sam Taggart]

Well, this is like how like news Isn't good for right now because they trying to be neutral is wrong. Like, it's just incorrect because some plans are good, some plans are bad. And that you can sort of even talk to like a person in data or science who like can look at something and be like, this is bad. So it's not good journalism to be like, I feel neutral towards this. And we almost need that with history where it's like, this happened parentheses bad, this happened parentheses good. Because right now it's just. We're just being like. And this changed stuff.

[George Severis]

Yeah. But the thing is the people writing the parentheses are not going to be the well behaved women.

[Sam Taggart]

Don't let me do it. I'm so well behaved.

[George Severis]

They're going to be the people that were unwell behaved enough to get to the history book writing. And they're going to be the ones hacking into the mainframe and saying parentheses bad about justice.

[Sam Taggart]

I mean, you're right. Unfortunately, we need better elections, basically, is what this all comes down to.

[Caller]

Hootie, Hootie, Sam and George. I love the Heim game, or Heimlich, I believe it's commonly known. I've incorporated it into my own daily life. So thank you for that. I am curious. I don't think you guys have done this one yet as kind of famously the two most crazed fans of the histicom Modern families. Which hymn sister would be each of the three core families. So you've got like Phil and Claire and the dumpy kids. You got Jay and Gloria and Manny. And then of course you have iconically Cam and Mitch and Lily. So I'm curious, like, which Heim's sister represents or would maybe it's easier to do, like which family would adopt each Heim? I feel like I have my opinion, but really curious. What do you guys think? Okay, bye.

[Sam Taggart]

So the premise is the Himes are up for adoption, but the rule is you can only take one.

[George Severis]

What's amazing though is that the three families in Modern Family are related to one another. So they can still remain in the same extended family.

[Sam Taggart]

That's really nice.

[George Severis]

They just have to go. They have a bedroom in a different home. But all the holidays and stuff. I mean, we've seen the show. They're interacting with one another constantly. There's no day in which the three Heim sisters couldn't potentially be at the same barbecue.

[Sam Taggart]

No. They're seeing each other every single day. Which I'm like, what?

[George Severis]

So they're able to produce their music, they're able to do their writing sessions. It's all good. It's all good. If PTA wants to meet with all of them, he's like, let's just meet at Phil and Claire's.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah. He's like, it's a 45 minute drive

[George Severis]

from my place because all the kids are out of the house.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

Okay.

[Sam Taggart]

This is an interesting. I'm going to say. I gotta say, Estie's gotta go with Cam and Mitch.

[George Severis]

Well, that was, of course, my instinct.

[Sam Taggart]

You know, it's freaks welcome. Over at Cam and Mitch's. You know, she's getting drunk, she's partying down.

[George Severis]

Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

And she's having fun.

[George Severis]

She and Cam are, like, trashing the house because they're, like, playing DDR.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

And then Mitch comes home and is like, you guys. Credits roll.

[Sam Taggart]

Credits roll.

[George Severis]

I think Danielle is Phil and Claire. Yeah, Danielle is Phil and Claire because

[Sam Taggart]

she is most like, even keeled.

[George Severis]

Yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

She's just like, I do my work. I'm really focused. And like, I. You know, I just want to be in a. I just want to be in a normal family for once.

[George Severis]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Sam Taggart]

And then I do think Alana, it does make sense, actually, for her to go with Jay and Gloria because, I don't know, I'm trying to think of the justification other than it's the last one.

[George Severis]

I actually think her and Gloria could have a really interesting dynamic. I think they could have a kind of. What's that? Literally police movie that Sofia Vergara is in with maybe Reese Witherspoon.

[Sam Taggart]

I don't know.

[George Severis]

Hold on. Hot Pursuit.

[Sam Taggart]

Never heard of this.

[George Severis]

Well, it has an 8% on rotten tomatoes, but I basically think that there's a world in which I could imagine a casting director being like, wait, opposites attract. Alanna Heim, Sofia Vergara. You figure it out.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

Whereas I don't think that could work with any of the other two.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, and I could see Gloria giving Alanna a makeover one episode, and it's really funny. And then Alanna brings Gloria to the indie rock show.

[George Severis]

Well, I also think there could be a really interesting kind of watch Y2K kind of casual racism storyline where Alanna tries to be Latina.

[Sam Taggart]

That would crush.

[George Severis]

You know what I mean?

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

And I think it could be done in a way where it's, like, offensive, but then people reclaim it later.

[Sam Taggart]

It could be done in a way that it stays on Hulu or whatever. But people do talk about it online and be like, can you believe this happens?

[George Severis]

Yes. It's like the episode is that Gloria is having her big family reunion and they're all flying to Colombia and Alanna comes and just says or does or wears something completely inappropriate.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

And I think Alanna Heim as an actor could pull that off.

[Sam Taggart]

I think she's got enough charm to pull it off.

[George Severis]

I think we're looking at a sort of White chicks level comedy. I don't think I'm the person to write it, but I'll be buying a ticket.

[Sam Taggart]

There's definitely scenes where Alanna's babysitting Manny and Manny has a big crush.

[George Severis]

Ooh, that's true. Because Manny would like a sort of alt ingenue.

[Sam Taggart]

Exactly.

[George Severis]

Manny isn't going to be attracted to Jessica Alba. No. It's like he likes Bjork and Fiona Apple. He's alt. He loves the Heims, and specifically Alanna.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah.

[George Severis]

Okay, I think that works. They should redo at least the opening credits with adding each of them to one of the framed photos.

[Sam Taggart]

That's a good idea. Just for us.

[George Severis]

Just for us.

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[Kal Penn]

hey everyone, it's Cal Penn. I'm the host of Irsay the Audible and I Heart Audiobook Club. This week on the podcast I am sitting down with Ray Porter, the narrator of Andy Weir's audiobook project Hail Mary, Massive sci fi adventure about survival and science and what happens when you wake up alone, very far from Earth.

[Ray Porter]

I really had to make a decision because I caught myself getting that frog in my throat and starting to get teary as I'm narrating some of these sections and it's like, okay, yo yo yo, is this this indulgent? And I really thought about it. I was like, no. At this point it would kind of be betraying the trust the author and the listener have in telling this story if I don't go through it. But there's places in this book that that deeply, emotionally affected me and I left it on the mic. That's great because it served the story. People will say like oh my God, I cried at the end. It's like, yeah dude, me too.

[Kal Penn]

Listen to Irsay the Audible and I hardly Audiobook Club on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts dealing

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[George Severis]

Okay, well we got there. I want to thank everyone for sending in questions with approximately three hours notice. We really appreciate it.

[Sam Taggart]

That was really nice.

[George Severis]

We had forgotten that we were supposed to do this call in episode today and we posted the morning of and

[Sam Taggart]

George texted me last night saying don't respond to this tonight, but what are we doing tomorrow? Yeah, and I said damn, I got it all mixed up and I want to.

[George Severis]

You know I've said some negative things about Mark Zuckerberg in the past, but it's because of him that we're able to post directly to all our fans and have them write in and say which heimsister do you think would be adopted by each of the families in Modern Family? And then a mere hour and a Half later, we can be in a studio answering that very question.

[Sam Taggart]

It'd be cool if you could be adopted as someone in their 30s.

[George Severis]

Yes. Well, that is, of course, the plot of the Blind side actually. He is in high school, but.

[Sam Taggart]

He is in high school.

[George Severis]

I think the actor was older.

[Sam Taggart]

Oh, my God.

[George Severis]

It would be interesting to be adapted. You know, that is one of the elements of intergenerational queer friendship is you're basically sort of adopted by an older man.

[Sam Taggart]

I've got older man friends, for the record.

[George Severis]

Of course,

[Sam Taggart]

for the record. And I have DC gay friends.

[George Severis]

Name one.

[Sam Taggart]

Okay, good point.

[George Severis]

Whereas I do have DC friends.

[Sam Taggart]

I have DC friends, just not gay guys.

[George Severis]

Right. Well, Are you talking about your sister?

[Sam Taggart]

Well, and various people I went to college with.

[George Severis]

Oh, right, of course, of course.

[Sam Taggart]

But that's neither here nor there. If we said anything too negative, just know that we're working on it. And.

[George Severis]

And I don't think we were negative at all. Yeah, well, I actually am feeling the opposite. I'm like, I wish I had expressed a more controversial, provocative opinion so that people could come for me and then I could reclaim myself as an artist.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, you did pitch Latina Alana.

[George Severis]

Yeah, that's true.

[Sam Taggart]

That's something.

[George Severis]

Yeah. And again, I'm not saying I would. I'm not pitching it. I'm saying that it could happen and it would be funny.

[Sam Taggart]

Well, you should write the script and

[George Severis]

I should write the script.

[Sam Taggart]

We should reboot from there. Yeah.

[George Severis]

Reboot Modern Family.

[Sam Taggart]

Reboot Modern Family. What? It's been. It's been a. How long has it been? I have no idea.

[George Severis]

They're all doing podcasts now.

[Sam Taggart]

Reboot Modern Family.

[Caller]

Reboot Modern Family.

[George Severis]

But you know what? Don't. Did you see Lena Dunn was talking about doing a girls movie, obviously.

[Sam Taggart]

No, I didn't see this.

[George Severis]

She said it. I mean, she was like, I want people to miss us first, and then maybe we'll come back. Obviously. I'm sure it'll be good. But I'm also like, let's use this momentum and do new stuff.

[Sam Taggart]

I actually like the sex and the cityification of girls. True. I think that would be really interesting. And even to see how they would lose the original spirit, but find something new. That's a weird bastardization. I kind of like, yeah, we need

[George Severis]

Lawrence of My Labia, but for girls.

[Sam Taggart]

Exactly. Can you imagine what the perspective would be?

[George Severis]

No, I agree.

[Sam Taggart]

Okay. I take it back.

[George Severis]

I would love a girls movie.

[Sam Taggart]

Yeah. I'm reading the book, by the way.

[George Severis]

So good.

[Sam Taggart]

So to die for. So insane. I can't believe it. Every sentence I'm like, what?

[George Severis]

Yeah. No, she's been through more than Jesus Christ.

[Sam Taggart]

Maybe we should do a Patreon about it. I would love to. Okay, that's it.

[George Severis]

That's it. Bye.

[Sam Taggart]

Bye.

[George Severis]

Podcast ends now for our visual learners. You can watch full video episodes on our YouTube channel and subscribe to our

[Sam Taggart]

Patreon for two extra episodes a month

[George Severis]

at patreon.com Stradiolab Stradiolab is a production

[Sam Taggart]

by Will Ferrell's Big Money Players Network

[George Severis]

and iHeart Podcasts, created and hosted by me, George Severis and Sam Taggart, executive

[Sam Taggart]

produced by Jenna Cagle, co produced by

[George Severis]

Becca Ramos, edited by Lauren Stumpf and mixed and mastered by Doug Bain.

[Sam Taggart]

Artwork by Michael Fails and Matt Grubb Theme music by Ben Kling

[George Severis]

if you're a maintenance supervisor at a manufacturing facility and your machinery isn't working right, Grainger knows you need to understand what's wrong

[Public Ad Read]

as soon as possible.

[George Severis]

So when a conveyor motor falters, Grainger offers diagnostic tools like calibration kits and multimeters to help you identify and fix the problem. With Grainger, you can be confident you have everything you need to keep your facility running smoothly. Call 1-800-GRAINGER Click Ranger grainger.com or just stop by Granger for the ones who get it done. At cvs, it matters that we're not

[Inner Balance/CVS Ad Read]

just in your community, but that we're part of it.

[George Severis]

It matters that we're here for you when you need us, day or night. And we want everyone to feel welcomed and rewarded. It matters that CVS is here to fill your prescriptions and here to fill your craving for a tasty and, yeah, healthy, healthy snack.

[Inner Balance/CVS Ad Read]

At cvs, we're proud to serve your

[George Severis]

community because we believe where you get your medicine matters.

[Inner Balance/CVS Ad Read]

So Visit [e-mail] or just come by our store.

[George Severis]

We can't wait to meet you. Store hours vary by location.

[Kal Penn]

Hey everyone, it's Cal Penn. I'm inviting you to join the best sounding book club you've ever heard with my podcast Hearsay, The Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club. Every episode, I nerd out with amazing guests and dive into the best new audiobooks available on Audible. It's the book club for your ears. Listen to Earsay, the Audible and iHeart audiobook club on the iHeartradio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Electric For All Ad Read]

You ever wonder how far an EV can take you on one charge? Well, most people drive about 40 miles a day, which means you can do all daily stuff, no problem.

[George Severis]

Problem.

[Electric For All Ad Read]

Go to work, grab the kids at school, get the groceries and still have enough charge to visit your in laws in the next county. But they don't need to know that. And the best part? You won't have to buy gas at all. The way forward is electric. Explore EVS that fit your [e-mail]

[George Severis]

this is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.