1514 - Emma is a Bisexual Kinkster who Makes a Living Studying Kink

Summary

Strictly Anonymous Confessions

Episode 1514: Emma is a Bisexual Kinkster who Makes a Living Studying Kink
Host: Kathy Kay
Guest: Emma (Psych of Desire / The Erotic Realm)
Date: July 10, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this candid and intellectually stimulating Fetish Friday episode, host Kathy Kay welcomes Emma, a self-described bisexual kinkster and sexologist from Australia. Emma runs the popular “Psychology of Desire” Substack and hosts “The Erotic Realm” podcast, where she blends her academic background in psychology with personal explorations of kink. Together, Kathy and Emma take listeners through Emma’s origins in kink, her unique journey of sexual self-discovery, her research into the psychology of fetish and desire, and a deep dive into the science of kinks—including foot fetishes, oralism, and the misunderstood world of sadism. The episode is packed with sharp analysis, laughs, vulnerability, and plenty of thoughtful discussion about human sexuality.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Emma’s Background and Origin Story

• Early Life: Emma (40, cis woman, bi, switch) grew up in a conservative Australian state where homosexuality was illegal until she was 12. Childhood was marked by lack of representation and stigma around queerness.

  • “I was getting all of this messaging around sexuality that just was quite negative… I remember going to my mum at one point when I was around 8 and actually asking her, you know, am I gay? Because I enjoyed holding my female friend’s hand.” — Emma [10:13]

• Relationship with Her Mother: Supportive, open, enjoyed “dirty jokes”; crucial for Emma’s positive attitude about sexuality.

• University and Moving to Melbourne: Breaking out of depression and discovering her identity, she moved to the more progressive Melbourne, akin to “the San Fran of Australia,” and found community in the kink scene.

  • “I started going to different events and found that I felt like home when I was around these kinky people.” — Emma [12:05]

2. Exploring Kink: Discovery of Dominance and Submission

• Early Assumptions: Like many women entering BDSM, Emma initially assumed she was submissive before realizing she was fundamentally a switch with a dominant streak.
  • “Through the process of exploring with partners who were more submissive… I have a really large dominant side.” — Emma [13:17]
• Childhood Dominance: Recounted being “bossy,” organizing play, and early shaming, linking it to broader cultural suppression of assertive girls.
• Kink as Self-Reclamation: BDSM and kink helped Emma reclaim and embrace her dominant traits.
  • “Kink allowed me to reclaim that repressed, forgotten part of myself.” — Emma [15:37]

3. Historical Roots of the Dominatrix

• Emma trained with Anomus, a Melbourne dominatrix and historian who traced dominatrix culture back to Sumerian times, highlighting that power dynamics in kink are ancient and cross-cultural.
  • “It’s not a new thing… it’s ancient and it’s always been around.” — Emma [20:09]

4. Why Are So Many Men Drawn to Submission?

• There's no single reason—relief from daily control, fetishism, sensation-seeking, and more.
  • “There are so many different reasons… I find so fascinating about the psychology of desire, that we’re all so unique.” — Emma [21:29]
• Cites stereotype of dominant CEO seeking submissiveness, but stresses women seek these dynamics too.

5. Emma’s Three Main Kinks

• Impact Play: Likes both giving and receiving spanking, flogging, caning, preferring “thuddy” sensations when bottoming and “stingy” ones when topping.
• Oralism (Auralism): A fetish for sound, particularly the sound of spanking and commanding voices.
  • “I’m pretty sure that I can orgasm from sound alone. It hasn’t happened yet, but, you know, that’s on the list as well.” — Emma [25:29]
• Sadism & Subspace: Enjoys inflicting pain as a form of consensual sadism and discusses the science and stigma around it.

6. Understanding Sadism, Consent, and Pain as Presence

• Sadism Today: Emma distinguishes between consensual sadism (now recognized as non-pathological) and non-consensual, stressing kindness and empathy among consensual sadists.
  • “Some of the nicest people I’ve met are sadists, and I think that’s because… they’re not repressed in their tyrannical nature. It has an outlet.” — Emma [31:23]
• Pain and Subspace: Discusses pain as “energy” and “presence,” referencing meditation practices (vipassana).
  • “Pain is presence.” — Emma quoting a guest [29:23]
• Subspace: Describes subspace as a blissing, floating, post-pain state akin to an orgasm for the mind and body.
  • “It feels like you could just be in that space forever.” — Emma [36:22]

7. Oralism: The Fetish for Sound

• Shares findings from her own listener survey: most common oralist triggers are music and commanding voices—especially among women.
  • “Some people described having the experience of enjoying music like you, but to the point where they could orgasm from listening to their favorite classical piece.” — Emma [39:59]

8. Why Do More Men Have Fetishes Than Women?

• Discusses possible neurological, cultural, and evolutionary reasons.
• Foot Fetish Science:
  • Men’s brains have a larger, more defined area for genital representation (somatosensory cortex), which is adjacent to foot representation—possibly explaining the prevalence of male foot fetishes.
  • “The female foot fetishist just pretty much doesn’t exist. If someone’s listening and they are one…email us!” — Emma [46:16]

9. Relationship Styles & Personal Life

• Emma identifies as “monogamish / ambi amorous”—open to various relationship models, including monogamy, open relationships, polyamory, and D/s dynamics.
  • “I have explored pretty much every other type of relationship setup.” — Emma [49:23]
• Has service submissives (e.g., foot worship, being driven), and feels fulfilled by variety rather than favorites.

10. Emma’s Work: Psychology of Desire & The Erotic Realm

• Her Substack (psychologyofdesire.com): Offers essays, research, and surveys exploring all aspects of kink and sexuality.

• Podcast: “The Erotic Realm” blends storytelling with science, featuring both everyday kinksters and experts (“kinkspurts/sexperts”), exploring the psychological and academic dimensions of desire.

  • “It was born out of this recognition that we all have our own story to tell...I wanted to offer a space where people can share their desires and experiences, including the darker desires of kink, and really dive deep into their erotic psychology.” — Emma [55:19]

• Signature Question: Asks each guest to sum up their eroticism in a single word; after 114 episodes, only two people have matched—underscoring the rich diversity of human sexuality.

  • “It just really demonstrates how unique and wonderful we all are.” — Emma [57:48]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Breaking Through Internalized Shame:
  “Through the process of exploring with partners… I have a really large dominant side. So that was quite the shift and quite the journey.” — Emma [13:17]

• On Sadism:
  “Some of the nicest people I’ve met are sadists… they’re not repressed in their tyrannical nature. It has an outlet.” — Emma [31:23]

• On Subspace:
  “It feels like you could just be in that space forever.” — Emma [36:22]

• On the Uniqueness of Desire:
  “I think one of the ways that’s demonstrated on the show is at the end... I ask each person to sum up their eroticism in one word… I think there’s only been two or three people that have said the same word.” — Emma [57:27]

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Emma’s Backstory, Coming Out, and Initial Kink Awareness: [08:02]–[14:15]
• Transition from Sub to Switch, Childhood Dominance, and Repression: [13:17]–[15:37]
• Historical Roots of Dominatrix / Training Experience: [19:05]–[20:28]
• Why Men Seek Dommes and Submission: [20:44]–[22:33]
• Emma’s Top 3 Kinks & Oralism: [24:58]–[26:04], [39:05]–[41:56]
• Understanding Sadism, Consent, and Pain: [27:36]–[33:50]
• Subspace & Its Nuances: [32:37]–[37:00]
• Science of Feet/Fetish Origins: [42:58]–[46:47]
• Discussion of Relationship Styles and Personal Approach: [49:23]–[51:34]
• Emma’s Podcast & Substack / Closing Remarks: [55:19]–[57:48]

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Resources & Further Listening

• Emma’s Substack: psychologyofdesire.com
• The Erotic Realm Podcast: Available on all major platforms
• Instagram/Twitter: @StrictAnonymous

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This episode offers insightful, nonjudgmental exploration of kink, desire, and the science behind them, anchored by Emma’s personal transparency and research perspective. It’s a must-listen for anyone curious about the true diversity and depth of human sexuality.

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[Revisit standout quotes at 13:17, 31:23, and 36:22 for Emma’s most memorable insights.]

Transcript

[A]

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[D]

Probably the only good advice I'll ever give you is to re hide your whips and chain.

[B]

Here is Your host, Kathy.

[D]

Hey, welcome to the Strictly Anonymous podcast with Kathy. If you haven't followed the Strictly Anonymous podcast on Instagram or Twitter, follow me at Strict Anonymous if you want to be on the show, it' called Strictly Anonymous because I keep everyone anonymous. I change people's voices. You could email me from an phony email. Call me from a phony number. I just want to hear your true story. And since this is a Fetish Friday episode, I love to hear your story about your unique fetish. Whatever you're into. If you got a fetish, you could be on the show. And if you have a pantyhose fetish or a cross dressing fetish and you call in, I will give you free access to my Patreon. Now on my Patreon I have two tiers. One for cross dressers and one for for hosers. Those are guys who like pantyhose. On those tiers you get every single episode early ad free plus intro free. Also you get all the picks, anonymous picks of all my guests. Plus you get exclusive content over there. And since I've been doing this for many, many years over on Patreon, there's so much exclusive pantyhose, fetish episodes and cross dressing episodes that are only available on Patreon. The hoser tier is $8 a month. The cross dressing tier is $10 a month. Dresses also get the hoser episodes as well. But if you call into my show, you're going to get a whole year free. So if you want to call into the show because you have a fetish that you want to talk about, send me an email strictly anonymous podcast gmail.com or go to my website strictly anonymous podcast.com and click on Be in the show. I do have a book out. It's called Strictly Anonymous Confession Secret Sex Lives of Total Strangers. It's available on Amazon and ebook and audiobook and and paperback. But it is now available for audiobook to pre order. Okay. It's coming out August 25th, so it's coming out very soon. You could purchase that my book any by going into the description and clicking on the link. Now, anyone who calls into my show as well as anyone who buys my book, if you send me a screenshot of your purchase, I will give you free access to my Discord. My Discord super fun place. And in there there are so many different channels. You get to post whatever you want there and everyone posts and talks to each other and there's a whole community over there. It's private, it's free. But you could only get the link through me. I throw it in complimentary to anyone who calls into my show, joins my patreon, or buys my book. So send me a screenshot of your picture to strictly anonymous podcast gmail.com. there is a lot of fetish and kink channels over on my discord. Okay? Today I have on Emma, Emma from the Psych of Desire. She's got a great substack. Okay. And she's got a great website and she's got a great podcast called the Erotic Realm. She's super smart. She also has a very interesting backstory and we talk about it all on this episode. Emma is a kinkster herself. She talks about how when she was very young, she knew she was bi and she was very repressed about it. And then she talks about how she started exploring when she did and how she did. And then we talk about her top kinks, what she. She's into, which is super interesting. She's definitely a switch. She likes pain. She's a sadist. We get deep into that. She, like I said, besides having a very interesting backstory, she's also like, super smart and cites tons of research and. And stuff that's out there, because that's what she does. She is a sexologist. She is interested in the psychology of everything. And she does go deep besides talking about her. Her own life. And that's what you're going to get on this episode. We go deep into, like, why men have fetishes, women, if that's a thing. Why men are very into a foot fetish. She talks. She gets very super detailed about interesting data that's out there about men and feet and their brains. Wait till you hear about the connection that's there. It's all super interesting, but you're gonna learn a lot from her. You're gonna like her story. It's super interesting. I'm gonna put all of her links in the description because you're gonna want to probably go follow her, listen to her podcast because she's got. She talks to people on their stories as well as she has experts now, too, and she certainly is an expert herself. So I'm going to get right to it and be right back on with Emma.

[B]

This is the Strictly Anonymous podcast. Strictly Anonymous podcast.

[D]

Oh, hi, Emma. Welcome to the Strictly Anonymous Podcast. How are you today?

[C]

Hi, Kathy. I'm really good, thank you. I'm really happy to be here with you.

[D]

Yeah, listen, Emma, you got a lot going on. You are a sexologist. You run the. You run a Podcast called the Erotic Realm. Also you have, you have a very good popular sub stack. I saw like oh, 7, 000 members. Right. But you do have also a website, Psychology of Desire and you also have like an interesting backstory. Right. Like you have your own journey when it comes to, I would say maybe kink and, and sex and all that kind of stuff that I typically am talking about on my show. Is that true?

[C]

Yeah, yeah, that's true. So to give you an idea of who I am, I'm a 40 year old woman, cis woman. I'm BISE and I'm kinky. So I'm a switch. So I lack dominance and submission in my sexuality. However, I didn't always have the words for that. Right. So, yeah, I grew up in a time in Australia actually in a state where homosexuality was illegal until I was around 12.

[D]

You're kidding.

[C]

Illegal? Yeah. Yep. So I come from a state where there's a background with convicts and the whole conviction story from the state is apparently really mixed up with a lot of fear around homosexuality. So it's a really interesting history there. But that has led to a lot of, yeah, homophobic chat when I was growing up. So I was getting all of this messaging around sexuality that just was quite negative. But at the same time I was having these experiences where I was exploring with my friends from quite an early age and I was holding my friends, my female friend's hands and enjoying it and being naturally curious and expressive as a child. And I was a really high sensation seeker as well, which is what we find in a lot of kinky people. But you know, I don't know if you can remember, but there was no bisexual people on tv, let alone any lesbians or gay people really.

[D]

So I'm older than you and I remember in my lifetime. No, but I remember in my lifetime and I try to remind people of this because the younger generation doesn't understand this, but you know, now it's so great, a girl and girl action and stuff. But like in my lifetime there was a big stigma still on that as well that shifted at a certain point in the U.S. right. But you know, I grew up in a time where even that was as taboo as the guy and guy action thing, which still has a stigma on it more. So you know what I mean? So yeah, it was like a very, very much like nobody admitted. And then once it became like, oh, the cool thing to do, every girl's like, I have a girl crush. But no girls were admitting it before, trust me.

[C]

Yeah, yeah. So I Grew up with a lot of confusion and shame. And I remember going to my mum at one point when I was around 8 and actually asking her, you know, am I gay? Because I enjoyed holding my female friend's hand, but I didn't have the words for, you know, I was enjoying boys, too. And there was just no word around it. So you must have had a very

[D]

good relationship with your mother to be, you know, to sit, to talk like that to her at that time, you know, I mean, in that town. You know what I'm saying?

[C]

Yes. Thank goodness for her. She loves a dirty joke. So she's always been really open with her sexuality. And, yeah, she really enjoys speaking a little bit naughty, but that helps you

[D]

with your own sexuality, you know what I mean?

[B]

For sure.

[C]

Yep, definitely. So, yeah, I remember what happened. So I wasn't exploring a lot until I was around 18 and I'd gone to university, I'd studied psychology. And look, my life was pretty boring. I was feeling literally gray. You look at the. What I was wearing back then, I was wearing all gray. I looked really drab. I was a little bit depressed. Depressed. I know. And a few of my friends moved to Melbourne and I decided to move to Melbourne. And I don't know if you've been. But Melbourne is like the San Fran of Australia, right? There's lots of queer people, there's diverse culture, there's kink happening.

[D]

Oh, my God. You felt like finally your home. These are your people.

[C]

Yes.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Yes. You can go and explore whatever you're into in Melbourne. Yeah. I started hearing about kink and FetLife and I joined and I couldn't believe that I'd found my people. You know, it's like a Facebook for kinky people if no one's heard of it.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

And, yeah, I started exploring. I started going to different events and found that I felt like home when I was around these kinky people.

[D]

What were you into and what kind of events did you start going to? Like, I know that you say you were very kinky. You were into women. Were you, like, getting into the BDSM community and the kink community, or were you getting in the swinger community? Because those are very different.

[C]

Yeah. So for me, I was exploring kink. So I did what a lot of. I found a lot of women do when they first start exploring bdsm. And I assumed that I was submissive.

[D]

Right.

[C]

So I was going to these events and exploring with lovers as a submissive, which it turns out, obviously, I'm not. I've Already told you that I'm a switch. I have this whole other side. And that's been quite the journey for me, actually, because through the process of exploring with partners who were more submissive and exploring my dominant side, I came to realize that I'm quite naturally dominant and I have a really large dominant side. So that was quite the shift and quite the journey.

[A]

Right?

[C]

Yeah. And it's really interesting that because there are statistically, there's more female submissives. Right. So a lot of women naturally go towards that because they see that represented in kink. And it's really interesting because a lot of the time they do the same thing as me, and they journey through it and actually reclaim these forgotten parts of themselves. So when I was young, I was playing, you know, in a very, very bossy way. Very bossy. I was.

[D]

So you were a little dom. So you were the dom.

[C]

Yes. My idea of play was organizing my friends, determining the rules, punishing people if they didn't abide by the rules, and. Yeah. Educating them on the rules and hoping that they would, you know, get into line. So you can imagine I wasn't the most fun person to play with.

[D]

But someone has to listen. Someone has to take that role in a group.

[C]

I know, right? But as a little girl, I was shamed for that a lot. And of course, I remember this one particular comment that was made by one of my mother's friends. You know, I was. I was proclaiming that I was going to be a teacher. And she just said quietly, the poor children.

[D]

You know, the things you remember. Listen, the fact that. I mean, you're laughing now, but the fact that you actually remember that, it was, like, probably traumatizing, you know, for you to hear those words because you still remember them when you were little.

[C]

Of course, I took it to heart. Right. And, yeah, I. I had a lot of messaging around my bossy nature. And I can't help but wonder if I was a little boy, you know, showing those skills and those leadership. Yeah. It would probably be framed in a slightly different way. And I think that happens for a lot of little girls. And a lot of women real realize that when they've grown up and they look back at those moments and think, hmm, you know, actually, I have always had this inner dominant, this inner mistress in me, and I just need to bring her back out again. So for me, kink allowed me to reclaim that repressed, forgotten part of myself.

[D]

Interesting. That's interesting. And maybe that is why a lot of women like. And I wonder if, like, a lot more women got into kink. Maybe they would be able to find that part of them again because so many women do. Put it down. I never did. I was bossy from day one and I remained bossy my whole life, and I got a lot of for it and I never cared and I never really wanted to get married or any of those things. So it didn't really, like, it didn't really get in the way of my life really, anyway, like, so it didn't matter. But I. I would have had an easier life if I wasn't that way. And I believe most women don't have that much of a voice because if you want a lot of things in life and you want to be liked and you want to get married, you know what I mean? You got to shut the up, right? It's just a sad true fact, you know? And yeah, I always make jokes that I would have been very popular as a guy, but a woman, even out of a podcaster. I don't know if you're bossy on your podcast, but I'm myself on my podcast and the shit I hear from guys, it's like, if you. If this was Joe Rogan talking, you wouldn't be saying the shit you're saying to me, you know? But nobody likes a bossy woman. But they. But this is. This is the truth and I'm bringing it back to you. It's. They love it in the bedroom. For real. Like, that's what so many guys are looking for and so many women, like you said, or it are subby in. In when it comes to the bedroom. Right?

[C]

Yeah. 100. It's. It's changed. It completely changed my sexuality when I got back in touch with that repressed part of myself and claimed my inner mistress.

[D]

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[C]

See terms and one of the ways that I did that, actually. So, you know, I've done lots of different educational courses and had very varied experiences all around the world throughout my sex exploration. But one of the most profound ones was with Anomus, who is a dominatrix in Melbourne. And she has a really interesting point of reference for the way that she teaches about the dominatrix because she's a historian as well. So she wrote the book, I don't know if you've heard of it, the Arts and the History of the Dominatrix.

[D]

No. Should I have her on my show? Have you had her on your show?

[C]

I've invited her. Yeah. I'm hoping that she comes on. So please, yeah, invite her. She. She's amazing. So she traced back the dominatrix to the Sumerian times and so all the way back to the beginning of civilization, basically, and has shown that it's not a new thing for men to be seeking out the dominatrix for women to wanting, you know, wanting to be the dominatrix. A lot of people have this idea. It's, you know, just happened in the last 100 years or whatever. Yeah. But it's ancient and it's always been around. So to have that training and to connect to that, like, ancient lineage was really, really powerful and it completely changed my life.

[D]

Let me ask you this because you read the book and you know so much about this. You're highly educated when it comes to it. Like, do you know why so many guys want to be the sub in the bedroom and want to be dominated by women? Is there a reason for that? Do they?

[C]

I mean, I mean, I think I

[D]

know the reason, but I mean, are there so many different reasons or does this woman talk about the fact of why it has always been that way?

[C]

There are so many different reasons. I think everyone has such a unique sexuality that when you really dive deep into, of course there's patterns. Right. But when you dive deep into it, everyone's so unique and what they get out of it is slightly different. So for everyone knows about the. The stereotypical CEO man that is always in charge and he goes to the dominatrix to get relief, right from. He's always wielding power and then he goes to yield power.

[D]

And that's the guy I know.

[C]

Yeah, yeah. Talks about how, you know, that allows him to just relax, stop being in charge, experience it from the other side and just get that relief. And that's really, really common. And you know, a lot of women want that too. I mean, women are in charge a lot now as well. So yeah, a lot of us want to experience that in the bedroom too, which is, you know, amazing and fantastic. But you know, there's fetishists that go to dominatrixes as well, that, you know, there's so many different reasons, there's people that just like different sensations, people that want to be mummified. The list is as long as, as there are people, you know, everyone wants something slightly different. And that's what I find so fascinating about the psychology of desire, that we're all so unique and you know, sometimes you can guess what someone's into, but a lot of the time they surprise you. And I love that so much.

[D]

Oh yeah. I remember hooking up with this guy and he was so quiet, like the most passive, quiet guy he was. Happened to be gorgeous. He was like a 10 on a 1 to 10. So that's why I was with him. But he was like, had zero personality. But the first time I hooked up with him, he was like a maniac. He was like the most forceful and I'm not like that into that kind of vibe. But with him I was. Because it was such a talk About a switch. Right. And he. It was like this whole other side of him that you would never see, that would never be obvious anywhere else, was like, came out in the bedroom and it was so hot. It was, like, super interesting. And I wonder, though, like, for you, because you're a switch, do you find that, like. Like, for, like, do you find that you're different with men and women, or do you like to switch with both? I mean, because you do hook up with women, you hook up with men. Right. Like, is there a preference to dom one or the other? Is it a mood? Like, when do you want a dom? When do you want to sub?

[C]

So I'm much more varied with men than I am women.

[D]

Oh, interesting.

[C]

Yeah. So far, the women that I've been with, I'm always the boss.

[D]

Okay. Oh, like the little girl. That's a little girl in you?

[C]

Yes. I have been on the lookout for a woman that, you know, can be my boss, and I haven't met her yet, but I'm hoping I meet her at some point. I'm sure she's out there with men. I definitely switch a lot more. I don't know, perhaps it's the physicality aspect of it, because men are naturally more, you know, stronger than me most of the time. But, yeah, I do find myself switching with men a lot more. And it varies from man to man. So sometimes I will go on a date with a gentleman and I will know straight away if I'm going to be the boss or they're going to be the boss.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Or sometimes it'll be a gradual discovery. Sometimes we'll switch with each other. It varies from person to person. Yeah, it's really interesting.

[D]

Yeah. How come you never went to a dominatrix to get that experience with a very dom woman?

[C]

It. I have thought about it. It's on my list to do. Yeah, it's on my list.

[D]

That's where you'll find your girl. You know what I mean? Right? Yeah. So when you were going to those clubs, were you. I mean, you know, how far into kink do you get? Like, what are the things that you're into?

[C]

Okay, so my top three kinks. I always ask people on my podcast about their top three kinks.

[D]

Yeah, I like that. That's a good one. Yeah.

[C]

So first of all, I would say impact play. So I'm a spanker and a spanky. I love spanking.

[D]

Okay, interesting. And you like both sides of it, which is interesting.

[C]

Yes. So I'm an oralist. I don't know if you know what an oralist is, it's not. It's not the. Or it's the A, U, R, A, L, I, S, T. Oh.

[D]

So is that hearing?

[C]

Yes. So I'm a fetishist for sound. I love sound. I'm pretty sure that I can orgasm from sound alone. It hasn't happened yet, but, you know, that's on the list as well.

[D]

Oh, my God. I'm gonna dive deeper into that in a second, but keep going.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

What's the third one?

[C]

Well, I was just going to say one of the things I love about spanking is the sound.

[D]

Oh, interesting. So it's both.

[C]

If. Yes. So if I walk into a fetish club and there's spanking happening, I'll automatically go towards that sound. No matter what other sounds there are, that will be the one that stands out to me in the room.

[D]

Interesting.

[C]

And draws me in. But, you know, it's impact play. So I like spanking, I like flogging, I like paddling, whipping, caning. All of those.

[D]

Do you like. Because I've heard that there's thuddy, there's stingy. I mean, do you like both of those, or are you into just one or the other?

[C]

So I'm. I like receiving Thadde, but I'm much more sadistic in terms of giving. Giving. Sting Stingy than I am in receiving it.

[D]

Interesting. Is it because of the sound? Is it because of the sound that it makes? Is it. Is there a reason, do you think, for that?

[C]

It's because of my sadistic side. I know that it hurts.

[D]

It's so funny, but I love it. And I love that you're being honest, because so many people that don't really understand kink or bdsm, they really have a hard time wrapping their head around someone being into being sadistic and being a nice person. You know what I mean? They. They don't think. They think, you know, if you're sadistic, you're this terrible person. Right. Because I. I've been running a Fetish Friday episode series since I started my podcast 12 years ago. So I've had so many different episodes on stuff like this, and sometimes, like, the people that are listening to my other ones will tune into that, and they just chime in with, like, they just. With. With comments that you could just really tell that they just don't really understand what's going on.

[C]

Yeah, yeah, that's okay. I mean, I probably don't understand elements of their sexuality either, and that's okay, too.

[D]

But explain what it means to be a sadist and why, like, and how it could just remain a kink and it doesn't, like where it comes from or, you know, you're the, the psychology expert expert, you know, maybe try to explain it to that average person who thinks if you're a status and you like to create pain and that's a turn on to you, like, you know, maybe there's something wrong with you.

[C]

Yeah, well, I also like to receive it, so I just want to make that point. Let me explain a little bit. Yeah, let me explain a little bit about pain. So one of the, one of the issues with the stigma around BDSM is that until I think it was 2013, it was still in the diagnostic manual for psychological disorders and it was grouped, it was grouped together with, you know, terrible things like pedophilia and all these types of things as saying that any type of sexual sadism is a mental disorder. Right. So even if it was consensual between two people, that didn't matter. So it's only very recently come out of that and made the distinction between consensual sadism and non consensual sadism. Right. So what I'm talking about is consensual sadism, of course, two people or more that have decided that they're going to inflict pain on each other or one of them experience pain consensually. So that's, that's a big different between, a big difference between the two. Right, of course. And the other aspect is, you know, well, we need to break down what is pain. Right. So one of my recent podcast guests had this beautiful line where she said, for her, pain is presence.

[D]

Oh, interesting. I could see why that would. That's a, that's brilliant.

[C]

Yes, yes. So she meant that, you know, she has got a really busy brain, like a lot of us do, and for her, when she decides to experience pain, it stops everything and it's the only thing that she can focus on. Yeah, right.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

And then if anyone listening has done any form of meditation, I've also done some vipassana, and that's a Buddhist meditation where you go deep into the nature of pain. And the whole concept of it is that you sit in a position and you meditate on all the different parts of your body bit by bit. And you, you scan your body. If there's any pain in your body, you notice it, but you don't hold on to it. You just move on to the next part of your body. And what's really interesting, when you do that is quite often when you come back to that part of the body again that was painful, it's not painful anymore.

[D]

Interesting.

[C]

And so, you know, is it because you don't.

[D]

You're not attaching the. The thought to it?

[C]

Yes. Oh, yes, yes, exactly. So when you start to explore pain, which a lot of people do through kink and bdsm, you really start to break down this idea of it as well. And personally, I think of pain as energy. Right. And energy can be played with. It can be broken down. You can breathe into it. Like if you're stretching, you breathe into the pain and you relax it. Right. There's so many things that you can do with pain. So when we first hear that someone's a sadist, and the first idea we have is, oh, you know, they must be a tyrant, or they must get off on hurting people. Just in general, you know, some of the nicest people I've met are sadists, and I think that's because, you know, they explore that side of themselves, and they're not repressed in their tyrannical nature. It has an outlet.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

And we all have, you know, these parts of ourselves that are monstrous. Right. One of my recent podcast guests was talking about our inner monster.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

So to explore pain, to explore our inner demons and release it in a way that is consensual and quite often leads to pleasure. Because once you play with pain and play with this energy and this presence, it can quite often, you know, morph into this pleasurable experience. And yeah, hopefully. Hopefully that has. Has got to. Hopefully. I've spoke a little bit to pain there, and people can think about it a little bit differently. And when they hear sadism the next time, hopefully they. They won't be so quick to judge, you know, Exactly. The next time they experience pain, perhaps they will just. Just notice it. You know, if it's just a little pain, just notice the energy of it as opposed to running away from it. What happens if you breathe into it?

[D]

Yeah, that's so interesting. And what about subspace? Have you. I would assume maybe you've gotten there.

[C]

Yes, yes. So subspace is. Is incredible. So when that. When the pain, you know, pain is probably the. The easiest, you know, way to get to substance space.

[D]

Yeah, I could imagine it's.

[C]

It's so intense. But it's really interesting because you experience this kind of, you know, energy being pain and pleasure being two sides of the same coin. Right, right. And you never know exactly when it's going to flip. But at some point, when Experiencing pain, if you are breathing into it and you are seeing it somewhat like a meditation, it will flip and that energy can turn into pleasure. And I see it like we know the fight and flight system, right? Yeah. So when you're feeling stressed, you want to run away from the pain. And if you can't run away from it, at some point your body will kind of give in to the experience and it'll release a whole new amount of endorphins. And instead of wanting to get away from the pain, you will kind of relax into it. And that's what it feels like for me when I'm going into subspace.

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[C]

Broke [e-mail] so I might have all of these emotions coming up when I'm fighting the pain. I might feel anger, I might feel sadness, confusion, you know, all of these kind of negative types of emotions. But once subspace starts to happen and it's much more positive, it's almost like a relaxation into bliss. And a lot of people describe it like floating, A floating feeling. It feels like you could just be in that space forever.

[D]

Yeah, right. I mean, it brings you to another place, right?

[C]

Yes, totally. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And as opposed to running away, you want to run to it, you know?

[D]

Interesting. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's only for the ballsy that could go there. I mean, because it is an intense thing. But the, the, you know, from what I've heard, is that like, you know, subspace, it's kind of like an. Like you, you. Like if someone says, I maybe I think I've been in subspace. They probably never have. Right. Like, you know, when you're in subspace. Yeah, I would assume.

[C]

Yeah. It's like an orgasm. It's like an orgasm.

[D]

Right, right.

[C]

But the thing is, you don't have to experience pain to go into subspace. Someone might be tied up and tickled.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

And that might get them to subspace because, you know, they might want to try and get away from the tickling. It's so pleasurable. Take me away from this. It's too much. Stop, stop, stop. And then you have the same experience of giving in. It doesn't have to be pain that gets you there.

[D]

Interesting. Right? So it's. It would be like if I want to get into subspace and someone's like tickling me like crazy instead of them stopping when I say stop, it's if they don't stop. Right. And I allow that and go further with it. Maybe that's how you get into it. It's a matter of, like, not retreating from it. Right. It's going towards.

[C]

Yeah. So of course. Yeah. So of course you'd have the safe word there. Maybe, you know, stop. Probably not the safe word. As long as you don't say the safe word, then they keep tickling. Yeah. Yeah, that could definitely happen. Maybe, you know, someone would tie you up and you can't really move, and that might take you there. Right. It doesn't have to be, you know, a painful experience. Yeah.

[D]

Well, let's talk a little bit about the other kink that you have, which is so fascinating to me because I have something called misophonia, and it really is a real thing. It's in my.

[C]

Oh, yeah.

[D]

You know what I'm talking about. It's in my 23 of me. When people get mad at me with that. I'm irritated by bad noises. Like, I'm like, it's. I can't help it. Like, I would rather not be this way. So I'm like. You're like the opposite. It's like opposite side of the same, like, same coin. Like, you love. Love sounds, Right? Is that what it's about? It's like this intense sort of focus on it, but you're. It's enjoyable to you and it could literally turn you on.

[C]

Yes. So do you get the same experience? Do you have, like, pleasurable sounds as well, or you just have the negative sounds that you notice?

[D]

Listen, I'm a very. I mean, I would. I don't know if being very into music. I mean, I still drive my car with my son in it with loud music. Like, I'm 15, you know, I mean, in my 50s. I love loud music. I love, love. You know what I mean? I love going to the music. I like loud things. I love airplanes. I could go to the airport and listen to planes take off all day. So I think I have a. A pleasurable sound thing, too. Yeah, probably right. Doesn't that sound like it?

[C]

Yeah. So I would say I did. I did a research study on it.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

So I create surveys and send them out to.

[D]

Oh, interesting.

[C]

My followers. And one of them was on oralism. And the most common way that it showed up was through music and a commanding voice. Which, you know, it makes sense because a lot of my followers are kinky.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

But, you know, some people described having the experience of enjoying music like you, but to the point where they could orgasm from listening to their favorite classical piece, for example.

[D]

I could feel emotion from it. But no orgasm.

[C]

Yeah, well, you know, this is no. This is no physical touch.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Just sitting there and listening to it. And. Yeah. Quite a few people described different orgasms that they'd had. And a lot of the time, it's Actually, women that seem to be more drawn to this fetish, which is really interesting. Yeah. But it makes sense, right? Because, you know, we. We know that women really enjoy audio erotica, for example.

[D]

Exactly.

[C]

And no one's done a lot of research into this yet. I'm not sure if it's like, brain differences, cultural, but it's really fascinating to see that there is quite a gender divide between the two. Men loving the visual, women loving the auditory.

[D]

Yeah, totally. And when did you realize you were into it? Was it when you were walking through the clubs and you were going to these events that you started to realize that the sound was a very big part of it for you?

[C]

I mean, the term itself is only really new. It's only just been made a category on FetLife, so it's only really just emerging in the zeitgeist now that people are focusing on sound itself as a fetish.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

And that's what's happened for me throughout my life. You know, with my bisexuality, I didn't realize until the term. With my kinky self, I didn't realize until the term. And it just demonstrates how important language is describing our experiences. But, yeah, so looking back now, I can see, yes. You know, I was having an oral experience by being drawn to the spanking and going towards it so much, but at the time I was like, oh, just like spanking.

[D]

Yeah. Interesting, right? But now that there's this term, do you think. Because I always talk about this on my show, because. Because I've been doing Fetish Friday for so long, I, you know, I'm always having guys call in with. With fetishes. I could count on one hand how many women.

[C]

Right.

[D]

I've had that call in. Why do you think it is that so many more men have fetishes than women do? You know, you sound very educated on this stuff.

[C]

This. This is a really. This is a really hard topic, too, nailed down. I think it does have something to do with men being more visually coded because a lot of the fetishes, I don't know if this has been your experience, seem to be related to visuals as well.

[D]

Honestly, a lot of them start out very tactile, but I'm thinking a lot of, like, my hoes, my hosers, my guys into pantyhose, and a lot of cross dressers, you know, they. They. It's the panties, it's the feeling. It's tactile even before they're sexualized, you know?

[C]

Yeah. And the most common fetish, of course, is the foot fetish.

[D]

Yes. Yes.

[C]

So I did a whole Psychology of desire case file on this on my sub stack. People can check it out if they like, where I was trying to narrow down why men are more into feet than women. And I think it might be a brain difference. So do you know about the somatosensory cortex? No.

[D]

No.

[C]

So in the brain. In the brain, we have a representation of our body. Right. So it's called the humunculus. And there's more neurons, basically more brain power, dedicated to the parts of our body that are more sensitive. So of course, the lips are huge for the homunculus. The fingers are really big. But what's really interesting for the foot fetish is that the genitals and the feet are actually represented next to each other. Interesting.

[D]

And you mean in their brains?

[C]

Yes, in our brain. So women have it too. Okay, I have it too. And then there was this really interesting neuroscientist, Ramachandaran, and he was looking at people that had had their. Their feet and their legs amputated. And he had this one particular case study where this gentleman said that he was embarrassed to tell him, but every time he had sexual intercourse, he was experiencing sensations in the phantom foot. Wow. Right. And he was actually experiencing orgasm in his foot.

[D]

Interesting. Okay, yeah.

[C]

And so the orgasm, his orgasm, had actually expanded since having his leg cut off. Right. And this led Ramachandran to suggest that the. The representation of the foot in his brain. Of his genitals. Sorry, in his brain. Had become bigger because it had overtaken the part that was no longer used. That was used on the leg.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

So just demonstrating again how this cross wiring can. Can. Can occur.

[D]

Yeah, for sure.

[C]

So when I was writing this case file, I was thinking about this more, and I was like, I wonder if there actually is a gender difference in this part of the brain. So the somatosensory cortex. Right. Do men have, like, a bigger one or more neurons there than women? And might that explain why men are more likely to have foot fetishes?

[D]

Right.

[C]

And what I found was there is a gender difference in the research. So there's been neuroimaging studies that showed that men have a much larger and more distinct genital representation in the brain than women? Right.

[D]

I think we've all that makes sense.

[C]

Yeah. So, yeah, so I actually put forward this idea, the. The cortical amplification model of foot fetishism and said that, you know, I'm saying that maybe this is why men have the foot fetishes. And, yeah, women do not because again and again, like, I talked to different fetish experts, dominatrists, and they say the. The female foot fetishes just pretty much doesn't exist. If someone's listening and they are one.

[D]

Email us.

[C]

Reach out to me.

[D]

Yes, go on.

[C]

I'd love to talk to them. Yeah, so, you know, that's the foot fetish explained potentially why men in general have more fetishes than women. Women in studies where they've looked at, you know, how much women and men get turned on by different images, women always get turned on by more varied images than men, for example.

[D]

Varied. Like something like in the image there's more stuff or they. They want more like, visuals than just one. What does you mean by varied visual from memory.

[C]

Like, you know, different types of sexualities.

[D]

Oh, okay, I get it. Yeah.

[C]

You know, different animals having sex. So even if the women is. Women are reporting that they're not turned on, they would lose lubricate. They were measuring things like lubrication and, you know, the. The girth of the penis. So they were looking for differences between mental arousal and physical arousal. So there's some suggestion in the literature that perhaps women have more, you know, quote, flexible sexuality or more varied sexuality than men. And because fetishes are all about, you know, being, you know, pinpointing your desire, so to speak, perhaps men are more likely to go down that route than women. But that's. That's just my idea. That's. Yeah, that's an interesting literature.

[D]

Yeah, I like that. That's an interesting take. I remember having Diana Hansen on my show. She had. She was a woman who took over Leg magazine back in the day when it was like, really big and she turned it into what it was. She actually was the one who made it. It really big. And she spent her life sort of when she was at the magazine Leg. Leg show and all these other magazines run by men, you know, and she was the only woman in the game talking to guys with fetishes for so long. Plus she was married to a crushdresser. And I. I really. I wish I remembered what her reason was for why women don't have as many fetishes as men do. And I just don't remember what it is, so I shouldn't even bring be bringing it up. But her episode is out there somewhere. She's like, fascinating to talk to. I should tell her to be. I should give you her information to be on your show because she lived in that world and she was like the woman who, like, like, changed the game. She now did she did the Arnold Schwarzenegger book for that really Tashin book. She works for Tasha books now and does really amazing work. I'm sure you know Tasha and they do those big books and those beautiful books. It's a German brand but. And very successful. But she, she ran that show and she knew all about fetishes and stuff and she was really ahead of her time. So what about you with your relationships? Like are, have you ever been married or do you have long term relationships and are you a monogamous person? Non monogamous. I mean, how do you roll? Because it sounds like you've been in these clubs and in this kink world since the get go, you know. Right. Since you're super young. So what has your romantic life look like?

[C]

It's been really varied. Like. Like my life and like my exploration. Yeah, I have, I have, I haven't explored being married or engaged, but I have explored pretty much every other type of relationship setup. So I refer to myself as monogamish slash ambi amorous.

[D]

Oh, what's ambient.

[C]

So that is, you know, I'm open to many forms of relationship style. So, you know, I'm 40 now. I'm basically open to any style of relationship that works. I've tried being monogamous, I've tried open relationships, I've tried being poly and I found, you know, delight and issues in

[D]

all of them as, as is life.

[C]

Yes. You know, I've had DS dynamics as well, so purely kink based relationships. You know, I have had people that would service my feet, for example, you know, service submissives that would drive me around, purely just enjoy driving me around, things like that. So I've explored lots of different relationship styles.

[B]

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[C]

Shop [e-mail] I'm not sure if you have specific questions about any of them.

[D]

No, but like, is there anyone that you like the best, do you think, or do you just like, sort of, you know, you just, just in the moment and you know, just have whatever kind of relationship is in front of you depending on that person.

[C]

I'm one of those really annoying people that find it hard to do favorites.

[D]

That's okay that I understand that type of personality.

[C]

Yeah, yeah. So it depends. You know, right now I'm single. I'm traveling for the first time in a while. I've been single for most of this year, and I'm enjoying that. But I'm open, you know, to. To meeting someone or multiple people. I've been in throuples before.

[D]

Right.

[C]

And, yeah, I'm just enjoying exploring and being open to it. I'm meeting lots of interesting people at the moment through the podcast, and my world is expanding a lot, so.

[D]

And you date men and women, I would assume, correct?

[C]

Yes.

[D]

Right.

[C]

Yes.

[D]

And do you. But do you believe, like, in your life, if you were to be with someone very long term, that you could be monogamous for 10 years if you were with someone for that long?

[C]

Yeah, yeah, of course. Yeah, I think so. It would need to be someone probably that is switchy.

[D]

Right.

[C]

In some respect. Doesn't have to be 50, 50 switch, but, you know, in a way that I could explore both sides of myself.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

You know, my life is all about helping people explore their desires, so I really don't want to be in a situation where I'd be repressing a big part of myself. But, yeah, if I was with someone that I could explore with and that had a similar kind of mind frame around kink and sexuality as me, you know, I like doing lots of sex experiments and exploring the mind and the mind, the. The body in many different ways.

[D]

So. So you definitely need a partner that is open to all that too, as well. Have you ever been on the kink consultant podcast or have her. Had her on your show, Amanda Day?

[C]

No, not yet.

[D]

You should.

[C]

No, not yet.

[D]

She's actually a spank e who finally found a spanker to date. I mean, I remember when the first time she came on, she was looking for a partner. She was down for that in her life. And she did find her guy. And she. She was very. You know, she had been looking for a long time because it was very important for her as a Kingster. Right. To have somebody who was.

[C]

Yes.

[D]

Into what she was into, you know, even though that was harder to find than just whatever. She did find it, which I think is great. Listen, I've never been married. I've never had that desire. I think maybe now in my life because I'm way older and time goes by so fast. I. I could be with someone long term, but I, you know, I had all kinds of different relationships. And on my deathbed, I look back and be like, oh my God, I love my life. Like, I just, I had so many people in my life, you know, I mean, it's a lot of times married people tend to, tend to think people that don't get married, like something's wrong with you. It's like I could think the same thing about somebody that wants to be with one person their whole life, you know, I mean, I just never had that desire. You know, I love the way I live my life and had all kinds of experiences and stuff. And now maybe I would have a 10 year relationship, but I certainly didn't want that even at 40, you know what I mean? I had a kid on my own. I just, you know, so I, I totally get your whole vibe and respect that, you know, you're just kind of like who you are with whoever you are and you're open. Right. Which I respect because I think it's like, that's better than like the person that reads the book because I think a lot of times people are just like doing things because they think that they have to. You know what I mean? You're just being true to yourself.

[C]

Yeah. There's no right way to live. No way to live.

[D]

You're just going with whatever. Right. With whoever you're with and whoever you're on. So why don't you, you speak about your show and tell people where they could find it as well as subscribe to your substack to learn more. Because you sound so smart. You obviously have a great substack going on where people who are listening, you know, to this episode could get more information from you with all the studying that you're doing and everything. I could have talked to you for 10 more hours about that stuff. So give out your substack, talk about what you do on your podcast. I'll put the link to your website in the description for anyone driving. You don't have to remember everything she said, but why don't you just give your shout out to all your stuff?

[C]

Sure. So my sub stack is just psychologyofdesire.com and that's where you can find my writing and the links to the surveys that I mentioned. And there's also the podcast on there as well, which is probably the easiest place to find it. But if you want to find it on Spotify, Apple, or anywhere else that you listen to podcasts, it's called the Erotic Realm Podcast. And yeah, it was born out of this recognition that we all have our own story to tell when it comes to our desires and sexuality. And I wanted to offer a space where people can share their desires and experiences, including the darker desires of kink, and really dive deep into their erotic psychology. And it's really fun. You know, we explore a quote on the show and we also go into a scientific research article as well. Because my background is also in research science. Yeah. Which we didn't get to. But, you know, I like to bring that in and shine a light on the academia that is happening and the wonderful people that are researching sexuality in the. You know, and quite often people don't get to read their research, so you

[D]

do it for them.

[C]

That fun to go into. Yeah, yeah. And, yeah. So the podcast is one and a half years old. Last year it was focused on everyday kinksters, and then this year I've branched out to include more kink, kinkspurts and sexperts. And it's been. It's been really fun.

[D]

Yeah, that'll only help your show. I've. I've done. I did the same thing. It was only like people talking about their stories and I did the fetishes, and now I'm doing experts. I never had experts on before, but I find it super interesting. I think as long as you're doing podcasting, when it comes to podcasting is like what you enjoy. Right. I feel like someone like you, it would be natural to have the experts and really dig in deep to that stuff because that's like your background. You know what I mean? So it's. It would just make sense that you would enjoy those kinds of conversations too. And you're having them on your show.

[C]

Yeah, it's been really amazing. And you know, again, I'll come back to the point that we're all so unique and there is no normal with sexuality. And I think one of the ways that's demonstrated on the show is at the end of the podcast, I ask each person to sum up their eroticism in one word and one word only.

[D]

Oh, no, that's hard.

[C]

I know it's hard.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

I've done 114 episodes now, and I think there's only been two or three people that have said the same word. Everyone else has said something unique. Right. And it just really demonstrates how unique and wonderful we all are. And I just love diving deep into that.

[D]

Yeah, listen, I have like over 1500 guests on my show at this point because I've been doing it for like 11 years and, you know, I have a million swinger episodes. A million hot ones stories, a million cheating stories, A million pantyhose fetish guys, cross dressers, you know, and I'm never getting the same story because like you said, everyone is unique, and that's why I've been doing it. And to this day, I still. Every single person's, like I said, story is different than every other story, even though it's maybe a hot wife story, you know what I mean? Or a BDSM story. It's always unique and people are still learning. And I love it, too. You know what I mean? I find it fascinating to hear about all this stuff, but I love that you get into, you know, you're really focused on kink and that world. Right. Because I have a Fetish Friday episode so that, you know, people listening are going to be very into getting even more of that content over at your show and on in your substack. Right. So I will put a link in the description if you want to send me a pick or any kind of promo material for my Patreon.

[C]

Sure. Well, yeah, thank you so much and thank you for this show and what you. What you're doing. It's amazing that you've been going for so long and. And it's so cool to hear that you haven't heard the same story twice. And, yeah, I look forward to continuing to explore the erotic realm for the rest of my life, you know?

[D]

Yeah, totally. And I'll. I totally have you back on at some point, you know, to do a bigger picture episode. You know what I mean? This one, I want to get your backstory, but I'm always interested in the expert side of things or any kind of research, kink and fetishes and stuff. So, you know, in the future, we'll probably do another. Another collab. So definitely keep in touch. Thanks so much. Yeah, thanks so much, Emma, for calling in. This was super fun.

[C]

Thank you, Kathy. It was lovely to speak with you.

[D]

Awesome. Thanks so much. Bye.

[C]

Thank you.

[A]

Bye.

[C]

Bye.

[B]

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[D]

Okay, I just want to tell you before you go that my book, it's called Strictly Anonymous Confession, Secret Sex Lives of Total Strangers, is now available not only in paperback and ebook, but you can pre order the audiobook. It's still not going to be out till August 25, but you can pre order it. The book is basically 17 different stories taken from my show. I kind of picked one story from each category that I talk about on my show. Like there's a hot wife story. There's A cuck queen story. There's a cuck story. There's a gang bang girl story. Like I said, 17 stories. And they're all told in the third person and they're all true. I took the interview and rewrote it in the third person. And I wouldn't really call it like a total erotica book. Think like Penthouse letters. It's more direct. It's not so over the top. Like erotica. I don't really like that kind of vibe. Right. But these are true stories. 17 of them. They're really short chapters, easy read. You could read, you know, one or two and then skip around. You could read the whole book. It's available in ebag format, paperback format, and finally, the audiobook is available, coming out August 25th, but you could pre order it now. And if you buy my book in any format or pre order it, I will throw in a complimentary link to my Discord. My Discord does not disappoint. Okay? There's no way you get into My Discord any other way than getting the link from me. Okay? I give it to people who buy my book. There's tons of people in there. Everybody shares content with each other and that's what you get to do there. You could post your own pictures and videos. There's tons of channels. We have lots of contests where you could win a lot of money. It's a super fun place to be. It's a total, strictly anonymous community and you will love it. I will be giving anyone who buys my book access to my Discord. It's private. Like I said. All you gotta do is email me a screenshot of your purchase. Whether you did the audiobook, the ebook, or the paperback, send it to me at strictly anonymous podcast gmail.com. that's strictly anonymous podcast gmail.com and I will send you the link to Discord. So anyway, thanks so much for tuning in.

[B]

This is the Strictly Anonymous podcast. Strictly Anonymous Podcast.