This was one of the most fun debates I've had.

Mike Collins doesn't believe calorie deficits exist.

Not "are hard to sustain." Don't exist. As in, the framework itself is wrong.

That's where we ended up about 20 minutes into this episode, and it turned into of the more interesting debates I've had on the show.

Mike runs SugarDetox.com.
He's worked with around 60,000 people.

And his whole approach is built on the idea that sugar (and flour, and caffeine) functions more like a drug than a food.

For about a third of the population, he says, moderation isn't possible. They're biochemically incapable of stopping once they start.

I come at it from the flexible side. Whole foods most of the time, room for the foods you actually enjoy, and an understanding that calorie deficits still matter even when nobody likes hearing it.

So, we went at it.

And here's the thing — I didn't agree with a lot of what he said. But some of it landed.

His point about selection bias was a real one. My clients finds me because they want flexibility. His finds him because they've tried flexibility and it didn't work. Those are two different populations, and neither of us is going to fully understand the other one's clients.

Some points we debated:

Does eating fewer calories than you burn actually cause weight loss — or do sugar and flour mess with your body in ways that calorie math can't explain?
Is sugar addiction a real thing people can be diagnosed with — or just emotional eating wearing a fancier name?
How do scientists actually measure calories in food?
Can people genuinely not stop once they start eating sugar — or can anyone learn to moderate with the right approach?
Are eating disorder treatment centers helping people by letting them eat sugar and bread again — or making things worse?
Does eating "a little bit of everything" actually work long-term — or does it just give people an excuse to never really change?
Is the way bodybuilders eat (lots of carbs, then cutting hard before a show) dangerous — or is it just intense training that works?
Was my own history of binge eating an addiction, a way of coping with loneliness, or both?

We disagreed on how weight loss actually works, but we agreed on more than I expected — that sugar is a problem, behavior matters more than meal plans, your community changes your outcomes, and the person delivering the message matters as much as the message.

I referenced a few research articles in my closing monologue that back the flexible side. They're linked below if you want to actually read them instead of taking my word for it.

If you've been wondering whether you're someone who genuinely can't moderate — or if you've tried flexible dieting and it's not working — this one will be useful.

If you just want to hear two coaches disagree hard (respectfully) — also worth a listen.

Find Mike Collins at SugarDetox.com

And on Instagram @realsugarfreeman