Kenny Santucci | Success Isn't About Money - It's About Who You Become

Summary

Stronger with Don Saladino - Episode: Kenny Santucci | Success Isn't About Money - It's About Who You Become

Release Date: August 12, 2025

In this compelling episode of Stronger with Don Saladino, Don sits down with Kenny Santucci, one of New York City's top fitness trainers and the visionary founder of the annual fitness event, Strong New York. The conversation delves deep into Kenny's philosophy on success, his entrepreneurial journey, the importance of relationships, and his unwavering commitment to personal growth and community building.

Introduction: Redefining Success

The episode kicks off with Kenny Santucci sharing his personal definition of success, emphasizing respect and admiration over financial gains.

“Success, to me, wasn't money. It was being respected by the people that I admire.”
— Kenny Santucci [00:06]

This perspective sets the tone for the entire discussion, highlighting a values-driven approach to both personal and professional life.

Kenny's Journey in the Fitness Industry

Don Saladino introduces Kenny as a seasoned fitness coach with a stellar reputation, having trained A-list celebrities like Ryan Reynolds, Blake Lively, and Anne Hathaway. Kenny is also the mastermind behind Strong New York, an event that transcends traditional fitness by focusing on mindset, nutrition, and community.

“Strong New York is not just about lifting weights. It's about mindset, it's about nutrition, it's about people.”
— Don Saladino [02:59]

Kenny elaborates on the evolution of Strong New York, sharing insights into how the event has grown over the years and the challenges faced in scaling it alongside managing multiple gyms.

“I keep telling people, if you could get in the same rooms as the people you admire and they respect you, that's the game changer.”
— Kenny Santucci [00:28]

Balancing Passion and Business

A significant portion of the conversation revolves around the delicate balance between passion projects and the financial realities of running a business. Kenny emphasizes that his ventures, including his gyms and events, started as passion projects with minimal focus on profitability.

“It was never about the money. I was going to pour my heart into all these things because I live in the greatest city in the world. How do we not have an event like this in here?”
— Kenny Santucci [04:03]

Don echoes this sentiment, highlighting the importance of building equity and trust over seeking immediate financial returns.

“To build something like that and just break even, that's like the ultimate goal out of the gate.”
— Don Saladino [04:18]

Commitment and Sacrifice

Kenny shares personal anecdotes illustrating his dedication, including sacrificing personal relationships and leisure time to ensure the success of his businesses.

“I have no life, but I love it. It's a sickness because it's the best and worst thing.”
— Kenny Santucci [04:40]

This relentless commitment underscores the theme that true success often requires immense personal sacrifice and unwavering dedication.

From Acting to Fitness: Finding True Passion

Kenny's early aspirations included a foray into acting, attending the UCB (University of California, Berkeley) improv school and even taking acting classes. However, a pivotal moment led him to pivot towards fitness.

“I walked out [of acting classes] and I'm like, at least I tried it. And when I walked back into my gym, this feels like home.”
— Kenny Santucci [12:00]

Don relates to this journey, emphasizing the importance of following one's passion even when it diverges from initial plans.

“If you want to get involved in something because it feels right... There's no guarantee you're going to make a billion dollars.”
— Don Saladino [13:02]

Building and Nurturing Relationships

A cornerstone of Kenny's success is his focus on building genuine relationships, both within his community and with business partners. He shares a story about collaborating with a local juice shop owner to enhance both their businesses mutually.

“Now I have a giant flag... It's a representation of everything that you've done.”
— Kenny Santucci [23:00]

Don emphasizes the value of selflessness in business, pointing out how Kenny’s unselfish acts have led to lasting partnerships and community support.

“You gave value and you did something very unselfish. Now you have an advocate.”
— Don Saladino [23:34]

Overcoming Adversity and Staying Resilient

Kenny draws parallels between his journey and that of other successful individuals like David Goggins, highlighting the importance of self-motivation and resilience.

“When you start doing well in life, take a little bit off and recognize that you need to keep pushing.”
— Kenny Santucci [16:13]

Don supports this by sharing his own experiences, reinforcing the idea that consistent, incremental progress is key to long-term success.

“Keep hitting those singles and doubles and manufacturing. And then things start compiling.”
— Don Saladino [28:31]

Community Building: Online and In-Person

During a caller segment, Kenny offers valuable advice on building an engaged and connected community both online and offline. He underscores the importance of quality over quantity and emphasizes genuine care for community members' success.

“If you have five people or even three people, it doesn't matter. Add as much value to those three people and then those three people will be your marketing tool to get more people.”
— Kenny Santucci [34:27]

Don adds that personal interaction and providing significant value create lasting impacts, regardless of the platform.

“Focus on changing their lives. That's the one thing that Kenny and I, there's a lot that we agree on.”
— Don Saladino [38:20]

Personal Growth and Authenticity

The conversation also touches on the role of personal growth and authenticity in leadership and business success. Kenny discusses his drive to help others become better versions of themselves, which in turn elevates his own status and influence.

“I want people to look at me and see a part of themselves in what they want to build.”
— Kenny Santucci [39:17]

Don concurs, highlighting how authentic connections and leading by example are crucial for building a reputable and influential business.

“You are your business card. You have to lead by example.”
— Don Saladino [40:07]

Closing Thoughts: Embracing the Journey

As the episode wraps up, both Don and Kenny reflect on their shared values and experiences, reinforcing the episode's central theme: true success is about personal growth, meaningful relationships, and the relentless pursuit of one's passion.

“You have to want to see them win. And I think that's another key to life.”
— Kenny Santucci [20:07]

“This flag [at Kenny's gym] is a representation of a dream. It's a representation of a lot of hard work.”
— Don Saladino [25:18]

Key Takeaways:

1. Redefine Success: Prioritize respect and admiration over monetary gains.
2. Build Genuine Relationships: Success is deeply rooted in the quality of relationships and mutual support.
3. Stay Committed: Passion and unwavering dedication often require personal sacrifices but lead to meaningful achievements.
4. Focus on Quality Over Quantity: Whether building a community or scaling a business, providing genuine value to a few can organically attract many.
5. Lead with Authenticity: Personal growth and being a role model are essential for long-term success and influence.

This episode of Stronger with Don Saladino not only provides valuable insights into the fitness and entrepreneurial world but also serves as a motivational blueprint for anyone striving to achieve success that is both meaningful and impactful.

Transcript

[Don Saladino]

Blind Nil Audio.

[Kenny Santucci]

I just want to be in a room with the people that I admire. Then I'll know where I'm supposed to be. Success, to me, wasn't money. It was being respected by the people that I admire. And you were one of them. And I tell everybody that it's like, look for the people that you admire. Look for the people that you want to model yourself after. What are they doing? How are they doing it? And if you could get in the same rooms as them and they respect you, I mean, that's the game changer.

[Don Saladino]

Welcome to Stronger Today. My guest is Kenny Santucci. Kenny is one of the top trainers working in New York City today, and he's the founder of one of my favorite annual fitness events, Strong New York, which is happening this year on September 27th. I'm Don Saladino. Let's get Stronger with Kenny Santucci. Thanks for coming, man.

[Kenny Santucci]

Thank you for having me.

[Don Saladino]

Are you kidding me? So, you know, I think I was saying it to you earlier on. It's like, I think this podcast for me, really, it's not about followers. It's about, like, I. I've been in this industry now over 26 years. Jesus. Getting old, man. I just turned 48.

[Kenny Santucci]

Still got a great end of hair, though.

[Don Saladino]

I do. It's starting to gray, though.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah, but still, it's not like moving back.

[Don Saladino]

No, it's not moving back.

[Kenny Santucci]

I would have a full head of white hair, but I don't want it to fall out.

[Don Saladino]

Yeah. And I'm not going to color it. I decided. I'm like, you know what? Just. Just let it ride.

[Kenny Santucci]

Just let it go.

[Don Saladino]

Yeah, just let it go.

[Kenny Santucci]

It looks good. You pull it off, dude.

[Don Saladino]

It's good for my ego. So I think this podcast for me was really about the relationships that I've made over my last two plus decades in the business. They're out of the gate. I think the first, you know, whatever it is, two dozen people are going to come on. They're people that I think I've. I'm really close to. But more importantly, whether they're a superstar in Hollywood or whether they're a gym owner or on the CIA, they have a specific personality and character to them that I think would. You would agree that if you got into a room with all of them, you'd be like, all right, these are some cool people. You know, Gabrielle, Evie, you go on and on. Jay Redmond. I mean, these are. These are. These are good people that have, I think, have made a difference. And I called you up early because, you know. You know, you and I always had this conversation for the last 10 years. It's. It's one thing to do it and build a business, but when you're getting into the fitness and wellness space in New York City and you're doing what it is that I did many years before, you started it, you're doing now, and you're doing it at a high level, and I'm genuinely proud of you for it, because so many people will go in and they'll attack and they'll build and they'll complain, but early on, even when I saw you kind of getting your head kicked in a little bit, I was like, yeah, but he's kind of enjoying it. Which you got to be a sicko in a way. So, you know Kenny Santucci. Kenny is. Started the Strength Club, New York City. Right. Obviously telling you what you do. The audience know. But also started an event called Strong New York.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah.

[Don Saladino]

Which my podcast is called Stronger. So there's obviously. And Strong New York is about. It's not just about lifting weights. It's about mindset. It's about. It's about nutrition. It's about people. And I'm impressed because you've probably had. You started this event, I'm going to guess, seven, eight years ago.

[Kenny Santucci]

This will be the ninth one.

[Don Saladino]

Holy shit. Have I been there every year? Almost. I think yes.

[Kenny Santucci]

Almost like, you've been to all the big ones. So I. It was like, early on.

[Don Saladino]

Early on, when you had, like, we were all the way on the west side, so going there. And in the beginning, I'm like, man, this is going to be tough. Last year, coming, showing back up, watching you move the room, seeing the brand partners. In the beginning, I understood what you were trying to do, but I was like, is he going to be able to do it? And then I think last year was the year I saw it kind of come to place, and I'm like, oh, he's turning this into something.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah. And it's been going, knock on wood, it's been going great. Like, I really haven't. Every single. You must be killing it. I was like, no, the money. But it was never about the money. I was. I was going to so many of these things, and I go, I live in the greatest city in the world. How do we not have an event like this in.

[Don Saladino]

Out of the gate? If you can create something like that and just break even, in my opinion, out of the gate, that's like the ultimate goal. Because what you're doing right now is you're, you're. You're building equity for the future. You're. You're building a name for yourself. You're building a place that people are going to trust. Brands now that's when you start being able to charge more money. It becomes a business.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah.

[Don Saladino]

But right now, to walk through that room last year and to see had to be 2,000 people walking there was.

[Kenny Santucci]

We sold about three. A little over 3,000.

[Don Saladino]

It was incredible. Yeah, it was incredible. Even, even the, even the, even the apparel. So balancing that though, with running a full time. Running a full time gym is hard enough.

[Kenny Santucci]

I have no life.

[Don Saladino]

But yeah, I put, put you. But you. But you love it.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah, I do, I do. And it's.

[Don Saladino]

You love it.

[Kenny Santucci]

It's a sickness because it's the best and worst thing. I put this above everything else. You know, every time I, Everybody's like, why aren't you married? I'm like, I would half ass a marriage and kids so bad. Because even last night I had, I had clients this morning at 5:30. But I was up last night and I was trying. I'm screwing around with AI now because I'm trying to learn how to.

[Don Saladino]

It's addicting.

[Kenny Santucci]

Oh, it's so addicting. It's addicting like getting good at the prompts and the, the more it starts to learn, the more I'm like, all right, this thing's watching me.

[Don Saladino]

Yeah.

[Kenny Santucci]

Because it knows exactly what I want. So now I'm playing with it. I'm like, all right, tweak this, tweak that. It talks the way I talk. It's kind of freaky. I mean, I definitely. I'm gonna re. Watch the Terminator a couple more.

[Don Saladino]

Yeah, it's all, it's all happening. I got asked a question the other day about things in fitness now that you're excited about. And I'm like, it's gonna come to a point where all this readiness, all these readiness scores that we have, like, it's gonna turn around and be like, Kenny, this is what you need to do based off your. It's literally going to tell you. But there's no replacing the coaching connection. So I want to move to the gym now because I think that was the. You actually launched at. Around a little bit after you launched Strong Strength Club.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah. So the second gym we. I was in the middle of building last year was. I don't know why I did it, but I, we were building the event and the gym at the same time, you know, and I have a very small Team. So I literally had to put the gym on the back burner while we were doing strong. And as soon as strong was over, that following weekend, everybody, you should go away. I'm like, no, I got to go out to Jersey because.

[Don Saladino]

Yeah. So now. So now, just to reiterate, Kenny's got a gym in New York City, and he. A gym in Jersey that probably opened six months ago. What was it?

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah, about six months ago.

[Don Saladino]

Yeah, about six months ago.

[Kenny Santucci]

So I had an opportunity. A friend of mine used to own the gym, and last December, she comes to me and she's like, I want to. I want to leave the business. I don't like it anymore. She's like, if you want to take over the lease and everything. I had a couple conversations with the landlord. We kicked the can down the road, and I'm like, I don't want to go back and forth to Jersey. I never really planned to open multiple gyms. I don't know how this is going to go. I don't really like my family lives out there, but I'm like, how am I going to build an audience out there? I can't believe.

[Don Saladino]

It's cutsy. It's gutsy.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah. And I'm. I'm putting the. The pieces together on how much it's going to cost me, like, what it's going to cost out of pocket and everything. Finally, on July 18th of last summer, I signed the lease. And I'm like, all right, here we go. And you have to have some kind of clear vision of what you want and what you're trying to create. And then as soon as you start to really dial in and truly believe in it. Right. Like, I dump all my money into this. I dump all my time into this. And other people start to notice this. You've done it. Like, I talk about you all the time to everybody. The fact that I could call you a friend, the fact that you have me on this always, you are one of the very few. I can't really name any others off the top of my head that have come into this space and that have done what you've done in the hardest city in the world. But, like, doing it here and doing it somewhere else, it's different. It's different. It's. But. But you.

[Don Saladino]

There's a lot to juggle.

[Kenny Santucci]

But when it comes to, you know, I've obviously had celebrity clientele. Other people have. You have done such a good job of creating culture and creating that environment, and I see the way you handle yourself and the things that you've done. And I just try to mimic that.

[Don Saladino]

I appreciate it. You don't, you don't need to follow me. I mean, I mean, I, I, I'm, it's, it makes me, it makes me proud because there's not a lot of people doing it. I, I think people expect these things to happen too quick. And I know, and I know Strength Club is, is one example, but your, your event to me, impressed me because the first few years, I'll be honest, it felt like you'd show up to an event. It felt a little bit of like, like a cluster. There's all different things going on, and I'm just kind of like, what's he trying to do here? What's he trying to do here? And every year it got tighter, and it got tighter, and it got tighter. And it just shows that sometimes passion and purpose, I believe, is enough. So when I go after the event, I, I, I, I, I knew you were going after it because of passion and purpose, but it was up until the last year where I turned around and I was like, he did it, like, and, and, and, and there's not too many people I can say could pull that off.

[Kenny Santucci]

And I, I tell people all the time, I'll die before I let this thing fall.

[Don Saladino]

And I believe you will.

[Kenny Santucci]

And one of the stories I like to tell when people ask me about, well, you were, I did television work. And they're like, well, why didn't you see that through? And I, I tell them it's a very specific moment. I was taking, I was at, in my early 20s. I started going to UCB. I went there for like four years. And I enjoy comedy and help me get good at hosting and things like that. And I was doing a lot of that and I enjoyed it.

[Don Saladino]

All right, so what is ucb?

[Kenny Santucci]

UCB was probably the most famous improv studio and comedy school.

[Don Saladino]

Okay.

[Kenny Santucci]

In the city.

[Don Saladino]

Okay. So that's where people went to kind of work on their craft. And then from there they go to.

[Kenny Santucci]

Things like SNL or, yeah, like, it was like a feeding ground for snl. And then my agent was like, you should go take acting classes. So I dabbled a little bit. I took some classes. They got me into a couple classes that I really shouldn't have been in. They got me in one, it was a Stella Adler class. And it was like, met on Thursday nights or Wednesdays, and Thursday nights it was for the class could go all night because the instructor was like, if you're here, this is the most important thing you have to burn the boats behind you and go all in on acting. And he kind of said this. I joined like maybe two, three weeks into the class they got me in. And I'm sitting there in the back of the room because I definitely didn't want to be up front. And there's so many beautiful people in this class because everybody who's good looking wants to be an actor and actress here in New York. And then you had a couple of people who were like, all right, this, this is a huge personality. You know, they're probably not that attractive, but they're really good at this craft. One by one, he's inviting people up and they're crying, like on command. Like, they're just like. He wanted you to tell this monologue and start to cry. And I'm looking around the room, I'm like, are all these going to start crying here? Like, I don't know if I could. I haven't cried since my grandmother died. I don't know if I could do this. And in that moment, I realized that this, these people all want to act. I don't really give a. To act. So I walked out that day and I'm like, at least I tried it. And I tell everybody that, you know, my nephew is now 17, 18 years old, and he's talking about what he wants to do. I go, go and try anything you remotely have an interest in. And when after you realize that, hey, I want to see this through no matter what happens. If they never paid me a dollar to act or do whatever you want to do, then you'll continue to do it and you'll eventually make money from it. I said, I go. When I walked back into my gym, because I had already started like doing personal training stuff, I go, this feels like home. Yeah, this is where I want to be. And if I don't make any money, which you will not, you know just as well as I do, not for a while, for a long time. But you'll continue to do it, even if you did it for free. Well, then, then you found what your passion is. And then you'll eventually make money from that.

[Don Saladino]

You. And I'm, and I, I completely agree with you. I think sometimes that whole. I don't want to say this to talk people away from being organized or journaling or if it works for you, fantastic. But I remember I tried creating a 20 year plan, you know, 25 years.

[Kenny Santucci]

Ago, you would have never thought about it like this.

[Don Saladino]

Never, never. And you know, and even now, I wish I can Find it? Yeah, it's probably. I probably can, but I would imagine it's like this big graph of Scribble, Scrabble, and. But the reality is, it' 25, 26 years ago, if I described what I'm doing now, I wouldn't even understand because this stuff didn't exist. It's like, Kenny, you're going to. You're going to host an event, and you're going to be going. You're be doing virtual events and, you know, paid media spend, and you're going to be going on zoom calls, and, you know, you're going to be hosting communities on Facebook and you're like, what are you talking about? Like, what are you. Like, you're speaking Korean to me right now. This doesn't make any sense. That's the beauty of it. And that's kind of. That's a trait that I wish more people embraced. Get involved in something because it feels right. Like, if you want. If you're doing something to make a billion dollars, great, but there's no guarantee you're going to make a billion dollars.

[Kenny Santucci]

And you're going to probably give up halfway through because you're like, this is too hard. I don't want to do it.

[Don Saladino]

This is. But passion and purpose. I think, you know, I'll.

[Kenny Santucci]

Another story I like to tell, and this is the perfect moment for it. About six, seven years ago, when I started to learn about manifestation and writing things down, one of the things that I wrote down was that success to me wasn't money. It was being respected by the people that I admire. And you were one of them. And I remember writing that down. I'm like, I just want to be in a room with the people that I admire. Then I'll know where I'm. I'm where I'm supposed to be. And I tell everybody that it's like, look for the people that you admire. Look for the people that you want to model yourself after. What are they doing? How are they doing it? And if you could get in the same rooms as them and they respect you, I mean, that's the game changer.

[Don Saladino]

You understand? Adding value, though. So most people don't. Most people are looking at what's in it for me. I couldn't imagine how many people are trying to contact Joe Rogan to get on their podcast. Oh, yeah, yeah, right. Like, everyone's like, they're opportunistic. Like, they. They want. And I understand you want to do better in life, but I see it in you. Some really good, amazing qualities, but one of them is that you're trying to over deliver on value. And I think that's a lost art. Most people are coming and going. What's my session price? I couldn't imagine the amount of free sessions you've done, the giveaways, the amount of people you've comped come on in. And you know what? A big percentage of those burn you. Right? Like they end up never paying dividends, but the ones that do and that end up working out, those are investments. Those are long term investments. How do you think that's played a role in the build of your career?

[Kenny Santucci]

I always, always try to lead with the olive branch, Right. I always try to be the one who's willing to go further than the other person. I remember looking in the mirror and I tell that this is my number one story. I remember looking in the mirror when I was in eighth grade and I was 225 pounds. You're 12, 13 years old. I'm looking in the mirror. I got this huge belly, I got square glasses. I am the epitome of like what a comic book nerd would have been.

[Don Saladino]

I love it.

[Kenny Santucci]

And I'm about to go to this eighth grade birthday party. And that day at school, everybody was talking about, like, making out with girls. No one even talked to me about it. I. I go to this party and I'm like, I wasn't even an option on the menu. And I remember going home and looking in the mirror and just being like, all right. As soon as I could take control of my life, I will. Because no one wants to hear my problems. Nobody gives a shit. The only one who's going to change my reality is me. And there's always people waiting on it.

[Don Saladino]

It's wild that you thought that at that age.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah.

[Don Saladino]

That you actually looked at yourself and you were like.

[Kenny Santucci]

And I like.

[Don Saladino]

And I hear people having those moments too. It's like, it sounds very mature, but it does happen. Well, it's an eighth grade.

[Kenny Santucci]

It's the David Goggins story too, right? Like when he looked in the mirror and he's like, I need to change this. I'm going to do whatever. And it kind of hardens you. It's like it's that kick in the ass that most people need. Whether it's you hear from a doctor or you hear from yourself in the mirror, you have to come to the realization that if you want your life to improve, then you need to do it. And then when you improve your life now, you can go and improve other People's lives.

[Don Saladino]

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[Kenny Santucci]

There will be people who want to tear you down. The bigger and better you get. Always. How many people have been like, oh, he's a trainer. Oh, he's this, he's that.

[Don Saladino]

It's always gonna happen. It's always. You want to know? It's always gonna happen. I didn't. I didn't choose to get into the celebrity training world. That's not something I decided to pick. I. It was an opportunity, and I'm glad I. I took it. But I think when that term kind of got stuck to my name, I think, yeah, there were some people. You mean. You told me once, some guy was like, he never worked on the floor. And I'm like. I started hysterically laughing. I'm like, I don't know. A trainer that's worked more than me on the floor?

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah.

[Don Saladino]

Like, how could you?

[Kenny Santucci]

I said that. I go, I know him pretty well. I'm pretty sure that he's done.

[Don Saladino]

Yeah, he's probably giving away more free sessions than.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah.

[Don Saladino]

Than you've ever done.

[Kenny Santucci]

I Was like, you don't do what he did and not have to that.

[Don Saladino]

So that doesn't bother me. I think maybe in the beginning I would hear it, it would. Now I'm very comfortable with where I.

[Kenny Santucci]

Am, you know, and I think there's a lot of people, again, like, where people would fall short is that they'll start hearing these. These things and it'll start to tear them down.

[Don Saladino]

Yeah.

[Kenny Santucci]

You know, how do you.

[Don Saladino]

How do you talk to your people? How do you talk to your community, your clients? Because I know you're getting people who show up saying, I read this in this magazine or so and so told me this. What are. What's some. Because I. I think you're very good at this. I think you are. I think they're a great trainer. I think they're very smart trainers. Very great. They're great trainers and they're great coaches. And I think the training aspect of it, I think, is the person who understands the science, anatomy, kinesiology, they understand how to apply the movements, when to do it. I think that's one element. I think the other element is, you know, how can you get them, how can you get the most out of them? I think you're both. But I also know that that coaching piece is something that is probably, I would say I'd put you ahead of most on. Right. That coaching element, when you can really. And you see it in your social media because you see that you care and that you're trying with every client to just, what can I get out of this person in a good way? It's not about going as hard as you can go, but how do you. How do you. How do you motivate them like that?

[Kenny Santucci]

Well, I think that's. That's at the core of it. Right. You have to actually care. You have to want to see them win. I know if I could get this guy to win, then that's going to only make my life better. Seeing him smile, making him feel better. And even with my family, like, I was so tempted to let all my cousins and everybody come to the new gym for nothing, but I go, I need to get them to invest in this and believe in themselves. So if they're going to make the investment, if they see the value in that, right. And I said, I was like, I'm going to put in an account and just give them their money back, you know, when they, when they finally fall in love with it, because I want them to fall. Fall in love with. Because it's what happened to me. And it changed my life forever when I fell in love with fitness. And now it's a non negotiable. It's like brushing my teeth, taking a shower.

[Don Saladino]

Just give them a friends and family. Give them a friends and family. Don't. But, but you've got it. You've got. This is. This is what gets difficult about business. Right? It's. People always ask me, why don't you open your hometown? You'd kill it. I'm like, I can't. I'm friends with everyone. Yeah, I be, I be. I'd be dead. At least you don't have to be there.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah.

[Don Saladino]

You know, that's. That those are the challenges. It's being a business, but you actually.

[Kenny Santucci]

Have to give a shit. You have to want to see them win. And I think that's another key to life is I want to see. I want people to be like, hey, I met so and so, or I met this brand. For instance, one of my clients who had lost his job, he was working in the music industry, was that strong last year. He doesn't really like to work out. I mean, he kind of comes and goes a little bit. He got a job working with Kinetic, that ketone company. Yeah. Making a nice chunk of change a year. He loves the job, loves me. And he's like, that changed my life. Like, I want to see him win. I want to see the Ketone Kinetics win. I want to see people win. I genuinely want to see people win, especially the people around me. The people believe in me. If somebody's tomorrow like, oh, hey, don's podcast got 8 million downloads. I'd be like, I love it. I want to hear that like you. I don't understand why people want to see people lose so much. Because at the end of the day, even here in the city, if there's a coffee shop that goes out next to my gym, I'm like, well, now that's going to be vacant for a while. So it's less people in the area, so there's less chance of people coming to my gym. I want to see people win. I went downstairs, day one, the guy who owns the juice place underneath me, I said to him, I go, how quickly do you want to go out of business? He's like, why? I go, you got this cheap, shitty protein here. I was like, you're not. I go, you could upsell for creatine. We sat there for two hours ordering stuff on Amazon. I was like, listen, I have some stuff upstairs. I'll bring it down. Try this Give it to your clients. Let me know what they think.

[Don Saladino]

How'd it work out for him?

[Kenny Santucci]

He's killing it. He's got six locations now. But we became instant friends. I don't know the fucking guy from a hole in the wall, right? But he was like, why are you doing this?

[Don Saladino]

I'm like, because you understood the value of the environment that you're in, and you understood street traffic. And you also understood that if you go in and you give value to someone who's right underneath your. Your roof. Right. That he's going to say, you need to check this guy out.

[Kenny Santucci]

Exactly.

[Don Saladino]

But that's what I. That's what I mean by. By value. You did something very unselfish. The guy could have told you to go jump off a bridge or whatever. Then you move on and you probably forget about him in a few months. But, you know, you. You went and you gave. Gave value and you did something very unselfish to. Now you have. You have a. You have an advocate.

[Kenny Santucci]

We have. We have a great.

[Don Saladino]

You have a good friendship. Yeah.

[Kenny Santucci]

Well, what we did was my landlord, and this is another reason why it's impossible to run a business in New York.

[Don Saladino]

What landlords? God, don't get me started.

[Kenny Santucci]

So there's. There was an empty flagpole for the past two years hanging outside on Fifth Avenue in 28th Street. And I went to my landlord, I was like, hey, can I hang a flag out there? He's like, yeah, $2,000 a month. I go, $2,000?

[Don Saladino]

That should have been negotiated. That wasn't negotiated in your lease?

[Kenny Santucci]

No, there was another space, that golf space had it, but they moved out two years ago, so now the flagpole was empty. He's like, it's $2,000 a month. I go, come on, that's like, seriously? Yeah, it's a. It's a fourth of my rent. And you want me to give you another two grand to have a flag? I go, give it to me for 1500. And he's like, all right, fine. You could have a 1500. I went downstairs to the juice guy. I go, hey, I want to split this with me. You want to split the flag with me? And I was like, we'll do some work. And he's like, done. Let's do it.

[Don Saladino]

7,500 a piece.

[Kenny Santucci]

So now I have. Which I think is a pretty cool thing, I got a giant flag at 8 foot flag hanging on 5th Avenue with my logo on it, you know, I mean, it cost me more if I had the same space in New Jersey. They would just give me.

[Don Saladino]

But it's also. But it's also. I think it's. I think it's an important. It's an important milestone for you as well, because when that flag goes up, that's a representation of everything that you've done.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah.

[Don Saladino]

Because everything that you've done has gotten you there. And I think people don't realize the importance of that sometimes. I always say, like, I used to work at a. I used to intern at a brokerage house back when I was in college. I want to learn the financial system a bit, and I want to learn the market. So I went and I got an internship at a company called Paine Weber, which became ubs.

[Kenny Santucci]

Oh, wow.

[Don Saladino]

And I remember investing in some stock before the tech era, like, right before AOL and Amazon exploded. I made, like, a lot of money in, like, a summer, and I was like, shit, I'm going to be a broker. Like, this is. This is ridiculous. I just made 30 grand this month off of one stock. Like, yeah. Not realizing, you know, how it. How it ends up. But he. But he turned to me. I go, what do I do? Do I hold? Do I sell? And he goes, take. Take a little off. Touch and feel it. Get your investment back. And I heard that. That. That terminology, touch and feel. And it was like, when you start doing well in life, I think it's important to take a little bit off and to basically recognize and take a deep breath, like, hey, we're doing all right. Like, it's tough. I'm not in the clear here, but we've got to sit here and we've got to pat ourselves on the back and go, look, this flag's a representation of a dream. It's a representation of a lot of hard work. Every time I look at it, I feel a sense of pride. And I think that flag does a lot more for you when entering the building than you probably think.

[Kenny Santucci]

Well, yeah, I mean, it changed the way I look at myself and what I've built. And my brother was one of the people who brought up to me just last year.

[Don Saladino]

I'm like, is he older or younger?

[Kenny Santucci]

I have an older brother and a younger brother, but my older brother's always been, like, kind of my Yoda.

[Don Saladino]

Yeah.

[Kenny Santucci]

I go to him for a lot of. But I had said to him, I go, I can't figure out how to get this event to, like, just sell out. The gyms are such a pain in the ass. I was like, nothing I've ever done in life has ever been a home Run. I've never done anything that I'm like, well, that was easy. You know, you hear about all these people, like, oh, they created. I'm like, between the podcast two, I've had four gyms now up to this point, the clothing, everything, I've never had anything just pop off. But I continue to dig and dig and dig. And it's been over 10 years that I've been working for myself. My brother's like, you haven't gotten a check, you have to meet somebody.

[Don Saladino]

Yeah, no, listen, listen, it took me 20. Yeah, you're not even halfway there. It's like, but that's what I want you to feel good about. I'll never, I'll never forget, I think the L A Dodgers, it might have been 88 or 89. They played the Oakland Athletics in the World Series. And the Oakland Athletics, I think we're going to the World Series with like one of the most powerful, you know, offensive teams ever. And the Dodgers were going in with the weakest. Like they had Kirk Gibson who could barely stand on one leg. That's when he hit the game winning home run, you know, to, to win that series. And I think the Dodgers, that World Series, had one of the weakest teams in like World Series. They won the World Series and afterwards the sort of said, we're not a power hitting team. We're not a high average hitting team. We manufacture runs, we'll bunt, we'll get on, we'll steal, we'll hit a single, we'll, we'll, we'll squeak one through the minute. Manufacture, manufacture. And I think a lot of successful businesses early on get built on buns and singles and doubles and, and really it's been what's made my career up. Like I haven't hit the grand slam yet, where you're sitting there and suddenly like you exit and they're like, we're wiring 20 million to your account right now. I' that's fantastic. Nice. Okay, like, like a lot of our clients go through. That's fine. But I'm a believer. Keep hitting those singles and doubles and manufacturing. And then things start compiling.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah, it's funny you say that because I was just watching the story. Who's a golfer? Just one.

[Don Saladino]

Roy. Roy McElroy.

[Kenny Santucci]

Dude, what an incredible story.

[Don Saladino]

Unbelievable.

[Kenny Santucci]

Unbelievable.

[Don Saladino]

And I golfed with him once, by the way.

[Kenny Santucci]

Really?

[Don Saladino]

I shot a video series with him and then we played 18 at Shinnecock.

[Kenny Santucci]

No shit.

[Don Saladino]

We walked 18 together.

[Kenny Santucci]

Wow.

[Don Saladino]

Not Shinnecock. National. Before. He played in the Open at Shinnecock which might have been 18, but he'll.

[Kenny Santucci]

Miss, like, the easiest shots, make crazy shots.

[Don Saladino]

Like, he's a human.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah. And it's so impressive. He's what I like about him, and his whole story is that he is very human. He's very relatable.

[Don Saladino]

Yeah.

[Kenny Santucci]

You know, there was a guy in CrossFit years ago, this guy Jason Calipa.

[Don Saladino]

Oh, I've heard of him.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah. Yeah. Who was very similar. Like, he would always go head to head with, like, Rich Froning. Rich Froning. Like, never made a mistake. He's just like.

[Don Saladino]

Yeah. He's like, so technically determination.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah. Everything he's done is perfect. Where Jason would, like, win an event and then completely bomb the next one.

[Don Saladino]

And you're like, how did this happen?

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah. How are you? So good, but so bad at the same time.

[Don Saladino]

It's kind of cool to see.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah. But you relate to that because you're like, well, I'm very similar. Where it's like, I'll do something. I'm like, oh, that was a complete flop.

[Don Saladino]

Yeah.

[Kenny Santucci]

And then other things, you're like, okay, I'm. I'm sort of winning, and. And you just kind of rack up wins over life.

[Don Saladino]

And I think that's Rory. Rory. And I've worked with a lot of tour players, and I know a lot of tour players, and he's the one guy I'm always pulling for.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah.

[Don Saladino]

Because you just.

[Kenny Santucci]

He.

[Don Saladino]

But again, his team. I met his team. His team's exceptional. The people around him are exceptional. So he's had, like, I'm walking down the course with a swing coach from when he was, like, 10. He was there with him before the. Like, he surrounds himself with good people. And I think that's. It's almost a lost art. Like, people like you're. You want to develop good social media, yet you're hiring, no offense, a. A 21 year old who has no experience, who has no eye for this stuff. And you're like, oh, well, let's just have her do Twitter. And you're like, what the fuck are you talking about? This is your marketing.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah.

[Don Saladino]

Put a little more love into this.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah. Do you think your success. A lot of your success and how you look at business and relationships has all stemmed from your family, like, the way you were raised?

[Don Saladino]

Yeah. I think a lot of it has. I think this is becoming. You're interviewing me now.

[Kenny Santucci]

No, because I. I feel the same way. Like, my dad would always tell us, we don't have money, but we have family.

[Don Saladino]

Yeah.

[Kenny Santucci]

And I Always valued relationships. My friends, my family and I see a lot of similarities. And you, it's like where you, you've cultivated this team around you. Like everyone, like even your wife, like.

[Don Saladino]

I, oh, she's a machine. She's, she's, she's, she, she's someone that I wish I had involved in business earlier. But, you know, I, but when I got, I, my first day of work, I was seven. They had me a little tuxedo sweeping floors. And then I think I really seriously started working when I was 12 and by the time I was 15, I was like practically working full time during school and sports. Yeah, I got to see this blue collar type mentality, this catering hall mentality where you'd see weddings and sweet sixteens and bar mitzvahs and we'd be turning rooms around 3,000 dinners in a night. And my dad and I work until three in the morning and my grandfather in there, my uncle in there. And, and when you fucked up, oh boy. There was no, let's talk about your feelings now, get in the office. And I'd be sitting there and I would just take it. Which was a tough thing for me because when I got into business, I thought that was what you get projected. And I learned quick that that wasn't. But that for me, that place that I worked at was probably, that might have been my college. Granted, I went to a university and I graduated and I played ball. That was probably, that was my school for me because I just understood what it was like to roll up your sleeves and get dirty and cleaning a kitchen at, in August at three in the morning that had food and disgusting and sweeping the trash room every morning. Disgusting. Well, like that. But that was some of the greatest moments of my, like, of my younger life growing up. I'm like, I can't be any more grateful. I have that if I didn't have that. If you went back and you wanted to change that and have me work in a candy store, I'd be like, no, no, like I lose everything now be done.

[Kenny Santucci]

No, I, I feel the same way. I, I had to get a job. You know, when all my friends were going down the shore on the weekends, I was, yeah, I was pushing a lawnmower.

[Don Saladino]

Yeah.

[Kenny Santucci]

Because my parents are like, yeah, get to work.

[Don Saladino]

Like, all right, you want money, you work.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah, yeah. And that, that's what it was. It's like if I wanted to go hang out and have money, I had to go.

[Don Saladino]

Did they find it as a way to keep you out of trouble also? Do they feel like work was. Because maybe not for you, but for me. My parents are like, we don't want him to get in trouble, he's got to go. And they were kind of right.

[Kenny Santucci]

But no, my dad was just such a blue collar guy that he just thought like, you're never gonna stop working, so keep working and put your head down and just do what you have to do. And that's how I always looked at work.

[Don Saladino]

Well, listen, we're gonna take some questions now if you're cool with it.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah.

[Don Saladino]

Our first caller is Kirsty from Australia. Let's go meet her.

[Kenny Santucci]

This is sick.

[C]

As a personal trainer, running my own business, I work out of a gym, run workshops, retreats, and then I'm just excited expanding online as well. Something I know you both have experience working sort of brick and mortar and then going online sort of through the pandemic and things. I'm sort of really focused at the moment on building a strong online community that reflects the values that I really care about for my in person clients. So my question would be, what are like the top three things you would recommend each for? Creating a really well connected and engaged community both online and in person and sort of how can I empower my community members to help cultivate that culture and embody that themselves and sort of further those values that I want to instill?

[Don Saladino]

I think it's a great question. I want you to kick it off. Come on, you're the guest here.

[Kenny Santucci]

Well, for me, I think the most important thing is letting everyone know in your community, kind of that you live, eat, sleep and breathe what you're doing and that you genuinely care about their success. I think a lot of times when people want to move from in person to online, they think they need to have tens of thousands of people. The game online is always, we need more volume, we need more volume. But if you have five people or even three people, it doesn't matter. Add as much value to those three people and then those three people will be your marketing tool to get more people. But you have to genuinely care about their success and want them to succeed. So whether you have three people or 100%, three people, really show them that you want them to grow because people are coming to you. At the end of the day, these are other people in need who are like, hey, I want to take my money, the money I work really hard for, and put it into you because I want you to help me. And if you, if you're not helping them, if you're not facilitating what they need, then eventually they're going to go somewhere else. So how do you build more value into what they need? And don't even worry about the money. Like, the money will come when you do a really good job at what they're asking you to do for them.

[Don Saladino]

I think it's. It's. Obviously, it's a tough thing to follow when you're trying to pay bills, but he's 100% right. I mean, the one thing in my career that I never frayed from is that I didn't focus so heavily on the dollar, even though I needed it. Let's be very clear, we all need money. But going into the session, you know, it was never really about even. Even meeting a new prospect. I would sell, but I would sell differently. I wouldn't try and come in with this hard sell or push them. I wanted my performance to speak words. So going into that screening process, that initial session, my line has always been I needed. I needed them. Not I wanted them. I needed them to leave the session feeling like I was a necessity over a luxury. Because initially people look at us, all three of us, and they go, all right, you know, is it in the budget? And, oh, it might be expensive. And no, I didn't want that. And him and I kind of always lived by this. We want to get in front of someone. It wasn't about giving them a good workout. It was about giving them an experience. It was about giving them a path, an area to grow and a future in something and getting them to believe in things that they never thought were capable of. And that takes a special person. That's why when I was hiring, when I was hiring trainers, I never wanted to hear that they were into acting. I never. I wanted, like, what do you want to do with your career? I want to be in. I like, I want to learn from you. I want to be here. I want to be a sponge. I want to work with people. I want to improve lives. And you know what? It doesn't change from brick and mortar to digital. That's the mistake people make. Brick and mortar, you're building it one by one. And in the beginning on digital, you're building it one by one. He was right. Everyone in the. Oh, I don't have many followers. You have 500 people following you right now. Whatever. You're. How many people. How many followers do you. Do you have?

[C]

It's just under 800 at the moment.

[Don Saladino]

You have 800 people that. Imagine sticking yourself in a room with 800 people. That's a big room. And now you have an opportunity to influence them into changing their. Their lives. And that's. People don't think of it. They're like, oh, wow, I Wish it was 80,000. I wish it was 8,000, which was 800,000. Focus on those 800 people. That multiplies really quickly. So answering DMs is the same way as walking over to someone in the brick and mortar and saying, how can I help? And that's what you got to do. Like, it sounds funny when. Like, when you're on the toilet, it doesn't matter. Like, focus on changing their lives. That's the one thing that Kenny and I, there's a lot that we agree on, but that was the one thing I think we're the most similar in. In regards to.

[Kenny Santucci]

Well, I mean, I always look at you when you have all these celeb. Well, you had all these celebrity clients. And I go, what value does somebody like a Ryan Reynolds seeing? Don, he doesn't need this guy from Long Island.

[Don Saladino]

Yeah, he does, right?

[Kenny Santucci]

He said he saw value, and now you're just as important to him as everybody else on his team. So, yeah, you know, I try to facilitate the same idea. Whether it's Ryan Reynolds or it's a guy who comes in off the street who might work at the bakery down the block, I still want to see him succeed. If I get him to become a better version of himself, well, then he's going to tell everybody he's friends with and everybody he works with, hey, this guy really changed my life. I enjoyed being around him, but. And now you become more valuable. So adding value to yourself is by adding value into their lives.

[Don Saladino]

I mean, try and become like, you want to become the conversation piece at dinner.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah.

[Don Saladino]

You know, you really do. And whether it's. Whether it's virtually. Whether it's like, if you can get someone to improve and they walk into a restaurant or a room and people say the magic words to them, oh, my God, what happened to you? Like, that is. That is a complete reflection of you. Because they're going to be like, oh, my God, I found this amazing woman. She's an incredible coach. Oh, my God. I found her online. I shot her a message. She sent me like a paragraph back. Like, she's changed my life. Like, I can't even that now do that times a hundred thousand.

[C]

Yeah, that's magic. That's amazing.

[Kenny Santucci]

You know, living that lifestyle, right? Like, people want to look at you and be like, yeah, that's my trainer. That's my Friend. That's my coach, whatever it may be. I mean, you want them to look at you and see a part of themselves in what they want to build.

[Don Saladino]

You are your business card.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah.

[Don Saladino]

You are your business card. You have to lead by example. That's how I got. That's how I got started. I never wanted to work with my. My goal was. I swear to God, my goal was never to work as a celebrity. Never once in my life was I like, oh, I want to work with a professional athlete or celebrity. I just wanted a coach. But my first. My first celebrity client was someone not far from you, Hugh Jackman. And it was all because he saw how. How I trained, how I ate and how I carried myself. And he came over and he talked. He spoke to me about that, and I thought that was. That was really powerful for me because here's someone on the big screen that now was looking to me for some answers, and I was like, okay, like, this is what we have to do. And it was. It was all about his experience. It wasn't about social media. It was about helping elevate him. And because of that, because I was protecting him, and there was the trust. That's what allowed my career to snowball. On that. It was all my 100 of my career in brick and mortar was word of mouth.

[Kenny Santucci]

I'd argue that Don, when he was training Hugh Jackman, actually looked better than Hugh Jackman as Wolverine.

[Don Saladino]

You said it, but I'll take the compliment. Listen, good. Good luck to you. And do me a favor. We're all on social media, right? Give us some updates. Shoot us a DM once in a while. Let us know what's going on. I mean, we'll remember who you are. It'll be. It's always great to have a connection on. On that side of the world. But keep us posted if there's any questions you need to ask us. Fire away. On. On our. On our social media channel.

[C]

I will. Thank you so much. I really appreciate your time, and that was so helpful. Thank you, guys.

[Don Saladino]

Good luck.

[Kenny Santucci]

Thank you. Keep killing it.

[C]

Thank you.

[Don Saladino]

We got one more guest. I think it's Sean Stafford. Is it Sean Stafford? This guy's been one of my challengers for a while. Really great, dude. Sean, what's up, man? How you been? You're right.

[Kenny Santucci]

I've been good.

[Don Saladino]

Don. How are you doing? Well, man, it was psyched to have you on. I mean, you're like, you're. You're. You're my first repeat person ever. I think he was my first he might have been my first caller and my first repeat. This is big time stuff. Fire away, though. What do you. What do you have for us? Yeah, yeah. Kenny, I want to know what is on your workout playlist. You know, what amps you up.

[Kenny Santucci]

Oh, right now, I have to admit I'm doing a little throwback, which I hated the song when it first came out, but now I'm loving it. That Panda song by designer Panda. I don't know why I heard it. I heard it the other day.

[Don Saladino]

It just caught you.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah. And I just have it on repeat a lot of times, I have to admit. A lot of times if I'm in the gym by myself, I work out in silence. I don't know why. Just it's my time.

[Don Saladino]

It's peaceful. Yeah, it's peaceful.

[Kenny Santucci]

The other night I was listening to. I like some oldies, you know, if people think I'm a weirdo.

[Don Saladino]

But I like old 50s. Like, 50s, yeah. Yeah. I've been. I got an oldies playlist that I just built. I love it.

[Kenny Santucci]

I love. I'll put on, like, Frankie Valli, you know, kind of radio and just let that play out.

[Don Saladino]

Soulful.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah. I love that stuff.

[Don Saladino]

I love it.

[Kenny Santucci]

I grew up on it and, like, my parents only listen to stuff like that.

[Don Saladino]

Yeah.

[Kenny Santucci]

So it's. I don't know, maybe it's just I'm leaning into being a little bit older, but at the same time, I. I just enjoy that stuff.

[Don Saladino]

Stuff.

[Kenny Santucci]

But, yeah, I mean, obviously you could see the. The difference, right. Some of it's Panda, and then there's that other song. What was it? Some of the newer stuff. I mean, I. I'm not much of a. A pop song person, but there's a lot of people in my gym who love house music.

[Don Saladino]

Yeah.

[Kenny Santucci]

So I've been listening to a lot of house music.

[Don Saladino]

Music's a great question. Right? It's just. But it's so. It. It's so. It changes so much. Right. Because you just said 50s. I'll go from 50s to heavy metal to Madonna to Michael Jackson to Lionel Richie. I listen to everything it does. I was listening to Lionel Richie on the walk over. I was like, oh, Lionel Richie's on. I like it.

[Kenny Santucci]

I love Lionel Richie's.

[Don Saladino]

Unbelievable.

[Kenny Santucci]

Like, Dancing on the Ceiling is probably one of. Like, I could. If that song's on, I'm letting it play the whole way, too. I love that song.

[Don Saladino]

I'm putting you on the spot. What's the worst music to work out, too?

[Kenny Santucci]

I'm. I like country music, but like, working out to country music has just never been a thing for me. And there are people in the gym who love it and that. Like reggaeton. Like, I'm just not a reggaeton type of guy.

[Don Saladino]

I love reggae, but working out to it. Yeah, but I definitely. Country music, I like, but I wouldn't work out.

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah, I don't like working out too, but I mean, if I really want to get after it, you know what will fire me up the most is obviously always like 70s 80s rock, metal, you know. Yeah.

[Don Saladino]

Any rap, Hip hop in there at all?

[Kenny Santucci]

Yeah, yeah, I love. Actually, one of my top genres when it comes to workout music is like 80s 90s hip hop.

[Don Saladino]

Yeah.

[Kenny Santucci]

You know, I love, like, LL Cool J. I like A Tribe Called Quest.

[Don Saladino]

I love Tribe. Yeah, you listen to like, Nas and Mobb Deep. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Kenny Santucci]

So I'll put. Yeah, I'll put on, like A Tribe Called Quest radio and like, let that play. Yeah, I love that stuff. But like Lo Cool J and Run dmc, I love that. Yeah.

[Don Saladino]

Awesome. That was fun. I didn't realize. I mean, the time flew. I. I just knew with you it was going to be just a conversation, and I just think it's. It's fun and I could. I could talk to you for hours. So thank you.

[Kenny Santucci]

It is an absolute honor to be here. Thank you so much.

[Don Saladino]

Good luck with everything. The gym, you know, the event. Not saying you need my help, but you know, my door is always open. Call me if you ever need a.

[Kenny Santucci]

Don't worry, you're going to get a couple calls. Trust me. I love.

[C]

The views, information or opinions expressed in the series are solely those of the individuals involved and do not necessarily represent those of Chip and Joanna Gaines by Nail Audio nor Magnolia.