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- [00:00]
A
You go to the suburbs where there's a lot of rich retired women.
- [00:04]
B
Okay, name them.
- [00:05]
A
Name them. Hawthorne is good shoes. Going like this. Yes, I get things taken up because I am short. Even though I don't seem short. No one believes it's a tall girl energy. I know I have a six foot personality apparently, but I am five foot two. Three.
- [00:21]
B
Welcome back to what Else? A miniseries proudly brought to you by Nespresso. For our final episode, we're stepping into the morning of another creative we admire, exploring the layers that exist beyond her career and the perspectives she's built along the way. Across this series, we've seen that there's never just one version of success. It goes beyond their job. Shaped by personal rituals, evolving priorities, and the choices we make every day, big and small. This series is made possible by Nespresso, where every coffee is a chance to discover a new world. Just press to explore over 30 exceptional Vertuo blends from single origins to fun flavor coffee, roast and ground sealed in aluminum for freshness and recyclable via Nespresso's program. Because building a successful life is easier with your morning coffee in hand. Hello, guys. I'm Rhiannon, Joyce Stylish's Wednesday and Friday co host. Welcome to what Else. This is a new series and today we are talking to the wonderful Kate Emma Burke. In these apps you guys know, we want to know what our guests are beyond what they do in their work days, as well as a little insight into their interesting jobs. And Kate, I sit next to you, so I know you have an interesting job because I see your screen and it's much more interesting than mine. I do want to give a little bit of a highlight reel about who you are. I'm not sure our entire community will be familiar with you. Beyond being our senior podcast producer on Stylish, you have a very, very impressive run sheet. In terms of your past work, I will say you are the former editor of Fashion Journal and you're a freelance writer, editor and copywriter. As a freelancer, you've written for some really prolific magazines, including Harper's Bazaar, Cosmopolitan, IG Magazine, Esquire. Guys, this list is long. Let me keep going. Frankie Magazine, Body and soul and more. That is such a serious run sheet. Kate, welcome. I'm so excited to have you today. How are you feeling?
- [02:10]
A
I'm feeling good. That was such a good guess. Up. I feel amazing.
- [02:13]
B
Okay. That's what I want. I want everyone to feel gassed up and jeed up when they're sitting behind the Mic, let's get straight into it with a wreck. You know, we love a wreck that's stylish. And if you haven't listened to our main roster episodes before, we actually have a weekly wreck that we call the swap. Kate, you've seen many swaps. It's now your time behind the mic. What's your swap for this week?
- [02:33]
A
Okay. It was hard to choose because when you've seen so many good swaps, you're like, the stakes are high. You've got to think of something actually useful and that people are going to love. I want to recommend or swap in. Never warns a substack. I know that you're a substack.
- [02:49]
B
Huge substack girl.
- [02:50]
A
Yeah, it's by Liana Saddenstein. She's a writer for the New York Times. She used to be like Vogue style editor, style writer. And she just writes incredible pieces. Like, deep dives into, like, archival fashion and does these amazing events in New York where celebrities come and sell their pre loved clothes. She's just got like, the most, I don't know, like the funniest, smartest fashion writing around right now.
- [03:14]
B
What would you say are her three words when it comes to, like, her style?
- [03:19]
A
Ooh.
- [03:19]
B
Or maybe even one of the three is too hot.
- [03:21]
A
Eclectic.
- [03:21]
B
Okay, cool. Yeah. Where I want to kick off is really focusing on the morning rituals and the morning routine. Starting every day from 7am everybody's first decision of the day is very important. I would love to know what is the main ritual you lean on to start your day and feeling good.
- [03:36]
A
For me, the main ritual is getting out of the house and going for a walk. This is a new thing for me. I used to be very much like, I wanna be cozy, I wanna be in bed. But now I'm like, I need a circuit breaker in the morning to get the blood flowing and to feel sort of on top of the day when I'm on my walk. A bit cheesy, but I think we were talking about this at work the other day. Affirmations and sort of mantras. And I now sort of have implemented something where every morning I ask myself, good can today be? Like, show me how good the day can be? Which is a bit cheesy, but I was telling you at work the other day, like, it actually worked. Like, I got into work and I got this cool freelance opportunity in my inbox and I was like, that is manifestation. Like, I'm looking for the positives.
- [04:18]
B
I am a huge believer in manifestation and affirmations. I was tickled pink Is that how you say it?
- [04:24]
A
Tickled pink.
- [04:25]
B
Okay, I'm famously terrible at sayings, but let's just roll with that. When people tell me that they're just embracing affirmations. Because I know you said that you think it's like a little bit cheesy, but it works. Yeah. I will constantly say to myself, I will hit this target or I will, we will deliver this. And it's like speaking with such clarity and, you know, being really affirmative with your language is really powerful. And I was literally like giddy when you were telling me about it. And it's not cheesy. It fully works. It's good to just have that constant reinforcement. Let's talk about getting dressed. Because you are very stylish and you have a very distinct fashion sense and I'd love to know like, what goes into your decision making process when you're getting dressed in the morning.
- [05:04]
A
So it never used to be a part of my process, but as I've got older, comfort has become a real focus, like how to be comfortable and stylish at the same time. I just can't handle anything that's like cutting in when you're sitting down all day for work or is like fitting a bit weird. So I'd say fit is super important. I get things tailored, I get things taken up because I am short. Even though I don't seem short. No one believes it. Tall girl, anything. I have a six foot personality apparently, but I am five foot two, three. So fit is really important. Comfort is super important, but also fun. Like, I love fashion and I've loved it basically for as long as I can remember. And having a real like, I don't know, like a piece that makes me excited to get dressed. So whether that's like a really nice shirt or a fun piece of jewelry or like a pair of pants that I'm going to layer with, you know, a skirt that is, yeah, important to me.
- [05:59]
B
I see an eclectic flair in that. Fun as well in how you accessorize. Today you're wearing this gorgeous pearl necklace and it's like a natural pearl. It's kind of like a tinge of pink and it's just, it's always, it's catching my eye quite. Tell me about your outfit today and why you wanted to wear this outfit and what process you went through to land.
- [06:16]
A
To land in this outfit. I love layering, as I mentioned, and I always feel my best when I'm layering when there's like a level of interest to the outfit. So this skirt has been with me. I think it's been with me for, like, 15 years now. A really long time. I used to work in vintage fashion, so it was one of those pieces I saw when I was in my early 20s, and I just knew that I loved it. And then it went into storage for a long time, and it came out recently, and I've just been. You've probably seen me wear it at work, loving, like, playing dress up with it and styling outfits in different ways. So I knew I wanted to wear this. And then I always feel my best in a shirt. I feel like a shirt is classic. It's timeless. You always feel confident. You always feel sort of put together. But I like making it a little more undone with, like, the tassels and fun jewelry and fun nails.
- [07:04]
B
Yeah, it's always fun nails. You always have really fun nails. I love a classic shirt as well. But you can definitely see that you've applied your personality, which I absolutely love. Let's talk about vintage fashion and secondhand. This is something you're really passionate about. What are your best tips and tricks for finding really good pre loved fashion?
- [07:23]
A
I think for finding good pre loved fashion, you've got to focus on fabrication. Like, are you looking at the tag these days? There's so much fast fashion that's infiltrated op shops and consignment stores, and you really need to see, is it, you know, a blend? And if it is a blend, is it more natural fibers than polyesters? For me, that's really important. I opt for, like, at least 60% natural fiber. Knowing where to look is really important. So we look, tell us.
- [07:50]
B
That's what. That's what the girl is. Want to know? Okay.
- [07:53]
A
Okay. You go to the suburbs where there's a lot of rich retired women.
- [07:57]
B
Okay, Name them.
- [07:58]
A
Name them. Hawthorne is good. I found some really good pieces there. Also, going out of the city, if I ever go on a road trip, I make my boyfriend, like, stop at all the op shops. Because. Because that's like, there's got so many gems, like, so many pieces there that people have just sort of discarded and not really thought about or they don't know the value of it. So I found, like, a designer bag at a country op shop before, and it was like, $50 when it should have been, I don't know, hundreds and hundreds.
- [08:24]
B
I do this a lot as well. Everywhere I go, whether it be a city overseas or a country town in Victoria, I'm always popping into the options. And also I love antiques.
- [08:33]
A
Yeah, like, it's Lived a life. It's lived a life. Yeah. And I feel that way about clothing too. It's like so special when you know that it's already lasted a whole life cycle or more and then you get to like give it another. Another life that's exciting and also just good for the planet, which is important to me.
- [08:49]
B
Very important. You and I have had a few conversations in the office about where we like to shop online for Pre Loved. Do you want to share some of your favorites?
- [08:57]
A
I love this year Collective. I don't know if you. I think you would have been on that.
- [09:00]
B
Actually bought my wedding shoes off Vestia.
- [09:02]
A
Oh, did you?
- [09:02]
B
Yeah.
- [09:02]
A
The Magda.
- [09:04]
B
Magda Butram. Yes. So she sent off. Never worn.
- [09:07]
A
Yes. That is so much good stuff. Like I. I think you do this as well. I see. Alert. I do. Like at the moment I'm looking for a new work bag. So I've got an alert for like the acne musubi bag because I refuse to shell out for the full price new bag when there's so many on there that are like half price or less. So I'm just waiting for the right one to come around because I'm waiting for a particular color. But you've got to be patient. I think that's a thing that sometimes people forget. There is a lot of like time you do have to put into it. You can do it in a smart way where you're saving those searches, you're getting those emails, but you kind of have to put the time in to
- [09:41]
B
find the good stuff in, which is the antidote to what we're told right now in the fashion industry. There's a lot of, you know, trends are moving so quickly. Pre Loved fashion. And shopping in that space is so much more thoughtful and considered and generally does take a lot more time. I'm going to share one of my favorite websites to also shop Pre loved fashion and I shared this with you the other day. It's called Pre Loved Closet and it's hilarious because I'm shopping like other people's wardrobes of things that they don't want and you usually know whose wardrobe you're shopping. So they actually have like high profile influencers or socialites who are looking to give the old stuff a second home. So it's really funny because a lot of these people I like follow on Instagram and then they'll just put pop their wardrobe up on plc, which is the abbreviation and I'm like, oh, I'm wearing Blah Blah's Jimmy shoes. I paid this less than half price for them. I always find stuff on their side really good for shoes and handbags. So. Okay, those are two spots that if you're into pre loved and you're wanting to buy, you know, designer goods as well at a reduced price, I highly recommend checking both of those out.
- [10:45]
A
I haven't gone to PLC I'm using the abbreviation now.
- [10:48]
B
Yeah, use the abbreviation.
- [10:50]
A
I need to go. That sounds like exactly up my alley. Almost like estate sales, you know?
- [10:54]
B
Yes.
- [10:55]
A
When there's like an estate sale in America and I don't know if you see that.
- [10:57]
B
One of my favorite sides of TikTok.
- [10:59]
A
Oh, I'm obsessed. And it's like some old, like, woman from, like, this always old Hollywood in la.
- [11:04]
B
She's like, sadly passed away. Rip.
- [11:06]
A
Yes, rip. The wardrobe shopping and like the antiques.
- [11:10]
B
I'm here for it.
- [11:11]
A
Oh, it's incredible. And yeah, the jewelry at the estate sales. One other, like a bonus swap or if I can, Mads actually got me onto this invaluable. It's a amazing antique, sort of like vintage jewelry website. And you can just find such cool stuff, and I think a lot of it must be from estate sales as well. So. Yeah, worth checking out.
- [11:33]
B
Okay, before we get into the next question, I do want to have a little coffee break because we are here with Nespresso. So let's head to the kitchen, get a little refresh.
- [11:39]
A
Mine's looking a little sad, so mine is too. All right, let's do it.
- [11:44]
B
All right, Kate, time for a little bit of a coffee break. I want to know what is your go to pick me up in the morning.
- [11:49]
A
I love a sweet coffee in the morning, which is surprising to all my friends because I'm a savory person, but I just love that little sweet kick in the morning. Really? Yeah. Puts a pip in my step.
- [11:59]
B
Okay, well, that works out perfectly because the vertuo up actually has over 30 different flavor ranges that you can choose from. And some of them are quite sweet. So I picked out one for you today. This one is called the sweet vanilla. So we're going to do like a sweet vanilla mocha style. So I've got the chocolate powder ready. The best part is one, this machine looks so chic. I just love how well it goes with the kitchen. But two, it's so easy to use. So all we have to do, pop this in little how to guide for you.
- [12:25]
A
I love it. Close that.
- [12:27]
B
But before we actually push the button, I'm going to prep your little mocha. So this is the sweetie Treaty.
- [12:32]
A
Yeah, love.
- [12:33]
B
All right, so what the coffee will actually do is warm the powder up as well. So I only have to give it a little stir. Pop it here. It's one of my favorite sounds, especially in the Shameless Media office.
- [12:43]
A
It's an exciting sound. There we go.
- [12:46]
B
That liquid gold.
- [12:48]
A
I was just thinking the same thing.
- [12:49]
B
Oh, that looks good.
- [12:50]
A
It looks so good.
- [12:51]
B
The chocolate as well. I have to give it a little stir.
- [12:53]
A
Yeah.
- [12:53]
B
Coffee is prepped. Now we need to do the milk super easy with the frother. So I'm going to lean over. Yeah, go for it. I'm going to just pop that button. Oh, it's frothing. Oh, that looks very frothy.
- [13:05]
A
That looks so professional.
- [13:06]
B
I'm going to do a little pour.
- [13:08]
A
Oh, my gosh. Yum. Even do some art latte. Art. It's not a latte.
- [13:16]
B
My skill set ends here. Okay, Kate. And there is your sweet vanilla mocha.
- [13:21]
A
Hot. Nice and hot. Oh, my gosh.
- [13:23]
B
Thank you so much. Enjoy. Taste test, quick.
- [13:26]
A
Wow. That is so good. I love it. The vanilla is really nice. Yum. And it's subtle.
- [13:32]
B
It's not, like, overpowering.
- [13:33]
A
Sometimes it's too. It's too much, but that's like, the perfect balance. Yum.
- [13:37]
B
Oh, there we go.
- [13:38]
A
Okay, ready to go.
- [13:40]
B
So you are the senior producer at Shameless Media, and I do want to talk about career for a little bit. You're also an editor and a writer, as I said. Up top. Really impressive run sheet. What has been your North Star for you in your career?
- [13:53]
A
I think curiosity.
- [13:54]
B
Oh, I love that she's prepped. Girls.
- [13:58]
A
I'm a curious girl. I've always been curious. I've always wanted to know more about, you know, the topics that I'm naturally interested in. And that just so happens to be like, fashion, beauty, lifestyle. Actually a lot of stuff, though. Like, I can spend an hour on Wikipedia. I can dive deep into, like, the weirdest little niche topics. So following my curiosity has really shaped my career, I would say.
- [14:22]
B
And being a freelance writer, a lot of the time you do have to pitch for work. How do you approach that process for pitching? Because I know there will be a lot of listeners out there who maybe are a little bit nervous. Being able to share your expertise and your tips on that would be really helpful.
- [14:36]
A
Yeah. So you need to really think it depends on who you're pitching to. But if you're pitching to a. A big mainstream publication, you need to sort of think about what's happening in the news cycle right now that you can anchor that story in. So, for example, maybe you're doing something about, I don't know, like dating. But then you want to like, see what's happening in the news. Is there something about dating that's really big right now? Maybe people are talking a lot about how they hate dating apps or whatever it might be. Anchor it in that and show that you've done your research, that you know it's a conversation that's happening right now. You want a pitch to be really short and snappy. Like, you don't want to be writing like a whole essay. That's not the point. You're not giving them the full story in the email. You want to package it up really nicely. Couple of sentences, show why you're doing the story and why it's going to benefit the publication. And then you want to have like a. I always do a sort of faux headline or a sample headline because it really helps an editor if they can see, like, okay, this is how it could be packaged up and that headline is really snappy or engaging or would make me want to click in. You're more likely to get your pitch over the line when you do that. And my final little tip is if you know that you're going to talk to experts, get them in the pitch as well and, you know, say, I want to talk to this expert, I want to talk to this person. Then they can really clearly see how the story is going to take shape.
- [15:57]
B
Shoes going like this. No, it's so helpful. Also really applicable as well when you're writing cvs.
- [16:04]
A
Oh, yeah.
- [16:04]
B
And resumes. I'm finding in a world of AI, a lot of the tips that you just gave can also be applied to that, that you'd mentioned writing about dating.
- [16:12]
A
Yeah.
- [16:12]
B
This has been a huge part of your career and your freelance writing journey. Can you tell us about how you started writing about dating culture or why? I actually care more about the why. Let's focus on that, the why.
- [16:23]
A
I'd never had a boyfriend and I was in my 20s, late 20s, and I was starting to feel really fed up with dating culture. And I dated a lot, but I'd never had a long term serious partner. So I think that's a big part of what drove me to write about it because I knew that there had to be other people out there that were experiencing all the, like, difficult and frustrations with dating. And I knew as well that, like, we're at a place societally where more people than ever are single and I wasn't seeing the content that I wanted to consume about dating and the difficulties around it, I guess. And then also I was working at Fashion Journal, I was the editor and the whole team were all in long term relationships. So I kind of became the guinea pig to like be sent out on assignments. You know, can you go talk to this witch about dating? Can you go get your tarot cards read to find out if you're going to be single forever or not? And I was like, sit up on dates and I would like go to speed dating events. And that's all sort of snowballed into like in media or in writing, you call it like your beat. Like that's your, your sort of specialty. I guess.
- [17:26]
B
Yeah.
- [17:26]
A
And dating writing kind of became my, my beat, I guess.
- [17:29]
B
Can I ask you a personal question?
- [17:31]
A
Of course.
- [17:32]
B
How did that affect your real life dating experience?
- [17:35]
A
Yeah, I actually think that it made. I thought that men would be really like put off by it and freaked out. But I was, I was careful not to like, I wouldn't put people on blast in terms of like expos? Identities or anything like that. And often I was talking more about like broader cultural things, but it was anchored in, you know, me trying this thing out and maybe sharing a little about my experience. But I was careful not to be like mean or nasty or like narrowing in on one person. It made me way more thoughtful about dating and it made me way more like, aware of potentially like toxic or negative sort of patterns that I'd gotten into with dating. And, and yeah, eventually I think it led me in the right direction.
- [18:17]
B
There's no better way to avoid red flags by experiencing red flags.
- [18:22]
A
Oh, I experienced so many. I feel like an expert in clocking the red flags because I talk to all the girls in the office about dating quite a lot and I love talking about dating. It's just something that I find so interesting and I think it shows you so much about just like, you know, just learn a lot about yourself and about other people and it's fun. So I, yeah, I'm really quick to be like, that's a red flag, like, cut them loose.
- [18:46]
B
It's also one of those things where for so long when you're single, you can kind of get to a point where you feel like, ugh, like, is this going to happen?
- [18:53]
A
Yeah, it has happened. Oh, I was in that state, like really thought I had to accept that I was going to be alone for forever, which sounds so dramatic. But I kind of got to the point of burnout, like writing about it being so in it really just Got to the, like a point of feeling exhausted by dating and by downloading the apps and by, by, you know, the whole cycle that you go through, it is such a cycle. Such a cycle. It's a vicious cycle. And you just end up feeling like, really fed up. So I decided to take a nine month break. I was celibate for nine months and I.
- [19:26]
B
Why nine months?
- [19:27]
A
Well, it was actually meant to be a year and I buckled. Okay. Yeah. Whoops.
- [19:32]
B
Rub was worth it.
- [19:33]
A
Yeah, Rub was worth it.
- [19:35]
B
It worked out. Yeah.
- [19:37]
A
So yeah, nine months to sort of re. Recalibrate and also to look at like, like what was I doing that was leading to these, like, cycles or these patterns. Right. And how was I. Was I choosing the wrong people? And if so, how can I go into the next, you know, stage of dating being more, I don't know, like, more conscious and more considered with the way that I'm dating? So the nine months really helped me work through a lot of that stuff. And then, yeah, the first date I went on was Rob. And I mean, just early on he was just so funny and kind and I felt so comfortable and I was really honest about which was quite a change. I was trying to be very, like, direct about what I was looking for instead of trying to be like the cool chill girl, which, like, I'm not a cool. I'm not a cool chill girl. Like, I'm anxious and I get stressed. You don't have to give that to
- [20:28]
B
a man for them to like you.
- [20:29]
A
Yeah. And like. Yeah, exactly. And being chill or like shalant, you know, Is that what they call it online? Like, it's. Is it. No, nonchalant.
- [20:37]
B
Nonchalant, yeah.
- [20:38]
A
I'm shalom, you know, Like, I care.
- [20:40]
B
Like I'm the opposite to that.
- [20:42]
A
I'm the opposite. I'm not nonchalant.
- [20:44]
B
I'm not chill either. People think I'm chill and I'm not.
- [20:46]
A
I'm like, no, I'm not. And that's okay. It's okay that we're not chill. You know, I think I was just really upfront about that side of myself and the fact that I was really, like wanting something serious and asked him really early on and then we were aligned and now it's been a year and a half and we are living together and. And yeah, it's going really well.
- [21:06]
B
I remember when you came into the office and quite vividly actually, we were in the kitchen and you were telling me about it and you were saying quietly confident that you felt like this was very different. Yeah. And it seems like all of that work that you put into really understanding yourself had paid off. I love the piece around honesty because that feels very similar to how Lou and I approached conversations. He'd been single for quite some time and I hadn't been single for that long. But the way that we met each other with honesty meant that, that the relationship could move forward quite quickly.
- [21:35]
A
Yeah.
- [21:35]
B
What advice would you give someone who's feeling a bit flat about dating and, you know, finding themselves in a position of it being taxing? What would you say to them?
- [21:44]
A
I'm going to sound like a broken record, but take a break. I don't think it's very healthy to do this cyclical thing where you're constantly downloading and going through heartbreak every couple of months. And I don't think we talk enough about the trauma that casual dating can inflict on your brain. And I think a lot of people get into this mindset where they think, think, oh, I just have to keep pushing and keep trying and keep putting myself out there. But if you're not showing up in a way where you feel good and you feel excited and you feel like ready to, I don't know, put a lot of energy into something, you're not probably going to find the right person or the right dynamic. So I think take a break. It could even be as long as like six weeks. You know, no apps. Just really sit with yourself and what you want. Do a bit of journaling and then go back and you'll be a bit more refreshed and a bit more like, sure about what you're wanting out of dating.
- [22:37]
B
You need a bit of a circuit breaker.
- [22:38]
A
You need a circuit breaker. Absolutely.
- [22:41]
B
I would love to know what is your biggest self discovery in your 30s?
- [22:45]
A
My biggest self discovery? I think my biggest self discovery would be to be kinder to myself. I think I am naturally prone to being a bit of a perfectionist or being quite self critical. And looking back at my 20s, I can see how, how much harder I maybe made certain moments of my life when they could have been a little bit easier if I'd just been kinder and softer to myself. So I'm trying in my 30s to like, treat myself more as like my own best friend. And yeah, be kinder, which is where the affirmations come in. And yeah, be softer and kinder to myself. I love that.
- [23:21]
B
And I think everyone could do with a little bit more of that in their life. Everyone. Be kind to yourself. Love yourself.
- [23:25]
A
Love yourself, guys.
- [23:26]
B
Love yourself. All right. I just Want to squeeze one more?
- [23:29]
A
You know, we love a hot take.
- [23:30]
B
It's stylish. Can I get you to give us your hot take?
- [23:34]
A
My hot take is that we all need way less clothes than we currently have. We need, like, I reckon, like 70, 60% less. Call it way back. You're making your life harder having a wardrobe that's bursting at the seams and too many clothes when you get ready in the morning. And true style and understanding your style is knowing that you don't need more and more and more clothes or more and more accessories. It's making do with what you have. And the other arm of this hot take is you do not need to buy new things for every event. I completely agree with that. And it's good to like, I call it. In my friend group, we have like a clothing trust kind of where shop your friends. Yeah. Someone will have a wedding and it'll be like, hey, girls, like, who's got a dress for me? And that's a great way to not. You don't have to add to your wardrobe, but you're getting a new cut, silhouette dress or color or like you're getting something in your wardrobe that feels new without having to over stuff your wardrobe. And that's what you've got.
- [24:30]
B
There are some friends in my group that I wouldn't let borrow my stuff, but there are some that I would. So you got to be careful. I love that rule. You've got to be careful and respectful.
- [24:36]
A
Yeah.
- [24:37]
B
Thank you so much, Kate.
- [24:38]
A
It's so lovely chatting with you.
- [24:40]
B
This is our third and final episode of the what Else? Series in partnership with Nespresso. We're so lucky to have you all and we'll be back in your ears next Wednesday. Thanks so much, guys. And let's.