
In East Cleveland, Ohio, Diane Madison - a mother and grandmother - was also a woman remembered fondly by her neighbors. In 2019, she woke to a knife at her throat, and the assailant was her very own grandson, Jalen Plummer. Years earlier, another...
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Sword and Scale contains adult themes and violence and is not intended for all audiences.
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Listener discretion is advised. A man's man should never be compromised when it comes to a female who's never been a man.
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Come take a load off. Put your feet up and listen to some murder. What a stupid thing to say. This is season 13, episode 33038 of Sword and Scale, a show that reveals that the worst monsters are real. If you're a fan of true crime, I invite you to check out our brand new YouTube channel where you could subscribe the opposite way you can on our website. See, on our website you can subscribe for 10 bucks for audio and then add video for another 10 bucks on top of that. On YouTube you can start with video and add audio. So, you know, take your pick. This is just gonna complicate things, isn't it? Oh, well, fuck my life. Most people don't actually need more caffeine. They need their energy to last. That's why I want to tell you about Strong Coffee company Strong Coffee is premium instant coffee built for focus and endurance, not spikes and crashes. Their black blend tastes like real coffee, but Each serving includes 15 grams of protein, MCTS for sustained energy and adaptogens like Ashwagandha and L theanine that help keep you calm and mentally clear. What that means in real life is simple. You feel alert, steady and focused for hours, without the jitters, without the drop off. It's coffee that actually works with your brain instead of pushing it too hard. They also make lattes if you want something creamier, with added protein and healthy fats. But everything they do is built around the same clean energy, mental clarity and productivity that lasts. If you're tired of coffee that burns out halfway through the day, this is a smarter alternative. I've arranged the highest discount they offer 20% off. Go to strongcoffeecompany.com and use promo code S W O R D at checkout. It's just after midnight in 2019 during the summer solstice, the longest day of the year. This isn't some mumbo jumbo new age crap. It's when the sun is furthest from the equator. And it's a time when some say the veil between this dimension and the others is the thinnest. Okay, so maybe there is a little New age wisdom. The most important point, though, is that it's Ohio, the state that's becoming quite popular around here for some reason. So it's June 21st in East Cleveland. Believe it or not, there are posh Areas in Cleveland so that some of you savages can pretend to be people. This isn't one of them. It's not a picturesque skyline by the lake or the downtown area lit up with nightlife. It's Collinwood, a working class neighborhood that feels like it's part of a bygone era, part of the Rust Belt. The houses are small and modest, but nice enough. And the lawns are mowed. There's just enough space in the backyard for a barbecue. Ah, Americana. A small, white Cape Cod style home faces a narrow street called Chickasaw Avenue. It's a mild but humid evening. No wind is blowing and it's dark. Windows stay open in most homes and the people inside are asleep, the fans humming in the background. But on this street, as June 21st turns to the 22nd, something bad is happening.
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911 dispatcher. Troop DNA. Police, fire, EMS. Hello? We just got stabbed. We're on chickens. I'm sorry? I said we just got stabbed. Who just got stabbed?
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The call almost sounded like a hoax. The child calling in was so calm and said she lived on Chicken Saw Avenue. But this was no joke.
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What's your address? Where you are? What's the address? The complete address. We don't know. You're on. What to drink? Chicken. Toilet. Are you a Euclid? No. Cleveland, Ohio.
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You may not have caught it, but the little girl said she was about to pass out. She was trying her hardest to stay alert and get the street names right. In this part of Cleveland, the streets seem to have Native American names.
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And you're on Chickasaw. Yeah. Do you know another street nearby? No, I'm using site. You're on Turkey.
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What she was trying to say was Cherokee. Note to parents, make sure that your kids know where they live and how to pronounce the street names. That's a small safety tip that rivals all of the canned goods and toilet paper you hoard in your Cape Cod summer home. Yeah, I know my audience.
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Okay. Who got stabbed, honey? Me and my cousin. By who? Our cousin. Okay, I'm gonna get you over to EMS, okay? Okay. Don't hang up. How old are you? 10. Okay. Don't hang up. Okay. Okay.
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The dispatch operator told the EMS responder she had a 10 year old who had a knife wound. It was hard to tell if his response was disbelief or mere frustration. I mean, this is Cleveland. Sadly, it's probably not the first time a kid called in about being stabbed. This place truly is a shithole.
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Okay. Are you still there, honey? Okay. Okay. She doesn't know where she's at. She says she's on a streetcar.
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The corner.
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What? She. It's not a corner. She just said she's on a street called. She said her and her cousin got shot. Okay, was her cousin Earth older than her?
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By this time, the polite little girl who was stabbed and tried trying not to pass out was getting frustrated. You can hear her in the background desperately pleading for help. She was probably wondering when the questions would stop and an ambulance would arrive. The victims were two 10 year old cousins who managed to escape outside. They were making their way to a neighbor's house, but all the time struggling just to stay alive. Thank God some kind. Kind people in the next street over were still up and looking out their window when they heard crying.
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911, that's a dispatch. I got a little girl outside my house. What's her. What's your address? My address is 19612CH and she's bleeding really bad. She. She. She's coming in my house. So please hurry. Bring somebody. Shut the door. Why you got the door open?
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Imagine that you're minding your own business and suddenly you hear little kids crying outside. You're like, what's that? You get up to see two blood soaked girls staggering towards your house these days? Would you even let them in? I mean, be honest. That's some the Shining bullshit right there. Some of you would probably slam the door shut. No doubt.
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She snapped on my door and said that she stabbed her. Bleeding to death. All her clothes is full of blood. Who's bleeding to death? The two little girls. Okay. And the little girl can barely talk. Yes. Okay, so let me ask you two more questions so that I can tell you what to do. These questions are going to help me help them. Okay. How old are they? Okay, they look like they're about maybe 12, 11. 12 years old. 13 at the most. And are they awake? Yeah, they're awake, but they're covered in blood. Okay, listen carefully. I want to tell you how to stop the bleeding. Listen carefully to make sure we do it correct.
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Okay, sounds like a plan. Right, but what do you do if you can't tell where the blood's coming from?
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So I need you to get a. Okay, it's all over. Okay. Is the burger still nearby? The one that stabbed him? No. No, no. Okay, and is there any serious bleeding? Seriously? Okay, are they completely alert? Are they going out of it unconscious? Yes. Okay, I'm giving this information to the dispatch. They're in line. Don't hang up. Okay? And you said there is more than one wound, correct? Yes. They got blood and they're landing in my house, in my foyer. And you're bleeding. Okay. Help is on the way.
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It always seems to take forever for an ambulance to arrive. And the questions from 911 operators are never ending. The truth is that the response time varies, obviously depending on where you live. But in urban areas, the average time is only about five to eight minutes. But those few minutes can feel like forever.
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All right, shut the door. Is she okay? Baby. Both of you okay? They're laying on the floor talking. How long is it going to take them to get here? They're coming right now. The fire department and the paramedics. And they're on their way? Yes, they're on the way.
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The excitement was almost too much for this lady. She started having her own issues.
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I got asthma and my breathing is getting heavy. Okay, do you have an inhaler that you can take? Yes. Yes, I'm about to use it. Okay.
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Look at that. Hailey, despite her own problems, this woman wasn't going to let two little girls slip into unconsciousness. I mean, if I needed somebody to bring me back, I'd want this lady. She goes hard.
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Hey, wake up, baby. Hey, wake up, baby.
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As the woman in the house is on the phone with 911, her boyfriend comes back. He sees the kids bleeding and crying.
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Hello? Give him the phone, honey. Say what? Hello? Can you tell where you guys are? We are right here on Cherokee. 19612 Cherokee on the corner. These kids have been stabbed up. Okay, give me. Give me that address again. 19612 Cherokee. Who am I speaking to? This is EMS and Police. Hurry up, please. These girls have been stabbed bad. Come back here, baby. Ain't nobody gonna mess with y'.
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All.
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Oh, my goodness. Come on. Who looking for us right now? Oh, my goodness. Come on, baby. Come on.
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The little girls confirm that it was a cousin who stabbed them. And she's afraid he'll find them. Not when this guy's around. I mean, would you with him? I wouldn't. Weakly, she tells him she can't get up.
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Open that door. This girl done been stabbed up bad. Okay, that's the address where they're going to be. The 19612. Yes, yes. 1961. Tips. Derek, hurry up. Oh, my goodness. Okay, are you guys responding? Petey? Yeah. Y' all sit right there. Oh, my goodness. This girl is stabbed up real bad. Does she know where the person went who stabbed her? Say what? Does she know where the Person go to stabbed. They said they looking for him.
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Shut up.
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Let me do this, please. Her. He said the person is looking for.
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Who's the person that they said they looking for them. Oh, boy. These gentlemen seem ready to carry out their own investigation. But police wanted a name. The little girls were scared and going in and out of awareness. It was hard to get the needed information and confusion was getting in the way.
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They don't know. Do y' all know sad y like that, Sir? Yeah, both of them sad? Yes. When you send somebody, sir, we got people on the way. I'm trying to get information from you. So if you kids are stabbed up bad. They two little girls. Oh my goodness, man. I sign this dude. Who is this guy? Okay, I got. Who is this guy that stabbed y'? All cap, I got two 10 year old stabs. S plumber.
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It was 18 year old jalen Plummer, their cousin, who was supposed to be staying with an aunt in a different part of the neighborhood, but decided to go on a killing spree at his grandma's house instead. And the grandma was still back at the house.
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Man, y' all, please hurry up. Send somebody for these kids. Take your grandma. Oh my. Oh, my God. Please hurry up.
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So much was going on. As the couple in the house learned more information, the panic escalated. Some people are good in crisis and some aren't.
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Don't tell me what to do. You go do what you should do. What you say. Do they know where they live at? Like an address? Do I know where they live at? Do they know their address?
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They called from Chickasaw Avenue where their grandmother, Diane Madison lived. The two cousins escaped, but left their grandmother behind. Then there was the cousin Jaylen, who caused the bloodbath. No one knew his whereabouts yet, but he'd better hope he didn't cross paths with his neighbor.
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Baby, just please calm down. Man, I find this motherfucker. Will you quit talking to me? Pam, stop talking to me, please. I'm not shedding shit. I wish this motherfucker would bring his ass over here. Oh, my goodness. Goodness. Okay, we should have police pulling up. Sir, do you see them outside? Oh, my goodness. Oh, yeah, they pulling up right now.
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In the immortal words of this Ohioan, oh, my goodness, this was Cleveland. But even our seasoned veteran here hadn't seen anything like this before. You could tell this was some fucked up shit that would stick with them. After talking with the two little girls and the couple taking care of them, officers realized they needed to go to the crime scene as soon as possible. While the girls were on their way to the hospital. What they didn't know yet was that there was still another child in that house on Chickasaw. Justin Madison, a 12 year old boy with autism. This was Jaylen's brother. And Jaylen was still in that house too.
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So this is the house? Yeah. Okay, so we.
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You guys have a crime scene log or anything?
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Yeah, I'll just tell you guys what happened.
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I also got the address that came over here.
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His little brother has like a mental disability.
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He came up to that window.
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This bedroom right here, those windows. She's laying in the south east corner of the room behind the door, face down.
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Justin was terrified and didn't completely understand what was going on. His sister had fled the scene with her cousin. Well, more like escaped. Justin was trapped in an upstairs bedroom and didn't even know he was injured. The police were about to wade into a blood soaked house, but first needed to convince her grandson Justin to unlock the door and come outside.
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Come here. Open the window. Hey. What's your name, my man? What's that? Where's your brother? Okay. What? Someone. Hey, I'm inside the house. Hey, I'm gonna cover the back.
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Justin was risking his life letting the officers in because the killer was still there. In the bathroom, the water was running. Jalen Plummer was fully clothed, standing under the shower. The blood from his own knife wounds swirled into the drain.
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You're okay. You're okay around you. What's that? You get my clothes for me? I want. I. I can't. Are. Are you okay though?
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Yeah.
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Wait. My brother. My brother in there. My brother did this. Okay. Please let me do this. You're fine. You're fine. How old are you, my man? 10. 12. 12 years old. 12 years old? Yes. I figured my mom. My mom would not. My mom is not at house. Where's your mom at? She at work? Yes.
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This was a madhouse. When asked for his mother's name, he was able to give it to the officer, but he couldn't spell it, saying that she never told him how.
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Okay, well, we'll call her. Okay. You're okay though. You're not hurt, right? You're not bleeding at all? Oh, you. You got stabbed, huh? Wait, I got that. Yeah, you got. You got some blood. What's your name? I got lucky. Yeah. When I saw the knife in there. You did? Where do you think the knife's at? And I cleaned it up. You cleaned it up? Yeah. Okay. It's in the sink. It's in the sink. It's in the sink right now. It's in the sink. Hey, he's saying the knife's in the sink. This guy, this victim? Yeah. He's got a little laceration to the back right now.
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The discovery of the murder weapon was good news and bad news. Good news that this unlikely and lucky victim found it, but possibly bad news that he cleaned it up.
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What's gonna happen to me now? You're. You're gonna get checked out by ems, cuz you're. You got stabbed. I'm gonna try getting a hold of your mom for you, okay?
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Justin naturally had a lot of questions about himself, his grandma Diane, and his brother, who had been led away in handcuffs.
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What happened to my brother? Now we got him. He's not gonna hurt anyone. Is my gun gonna be okay? Yeah, they're working on it right now. They're helping her. Okay. That's all you saw? A little dog? A little dog.
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I did not.
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I did not go in the house. I saw you outside. I came and grabbed you.
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What Justin didn't know was that his grandmother died almost immediately after being stabbed by his brother in her bedroom. They found Diane Madison dead of multiple stab wounds, including one that completely severed her carotid artery. And the little dog he was referring to was sitting on the bed in the same spot where he'd been sleeping peacefully next to his owner. Now, with a look of bewilderment, the dog wasn't alone. Almost everyone who knew Jalen Plummer was bewildered. No one could yet explain why a college bound teenager, quiet, smart and planning to study pharmacology, had suddenly turned into a violent killer. But there were cracks long before that night. This wasn't just one terrible night. It was the unveiling of a legacy that had been building long before Jalen had ever picked up a knife. Let's talk about something most people don't think about until it's too late. If you drink, even occasionally, you already know how unpredictable the next morning can be. Sometimes you're fine, Sometimes you're not. That's where liqueur comes in. Liqueur makes gummies designed to help prevent hangovers by supporting your body while it processes alcohol. The formula is built around dhm, a compound derived from the Hovenia dulcis tree that helps break down acetaldehyde, the toxic byproduct responsible for a lot of hangover symptoms. They also include milk thistle and prickly pear for liver support, B vitamins and electrolytes to help with dehydration and energy loss, and ginger root to reduce nausea. It's not about masking symptoms, it's about helping your body recover faster. They're easy to take, portable and practical, whether you're out for the night or having drinks at home. One customer summed it up I woke up feeling like I hadn't drank the night before. I've arranged the highest discount they offer. 20% off. Go to liqueur.com that's L I Q U R E.com and use promo code SWORD at checkout. There's something people don't talk about much when it comes to stress, the way it shows up on your face. Fatigue, dullness, Skin that just looks worn down. That's why I want to tell you about Love Indus and their Amrutini Luminosity dew drops. This is a daily serum that's often described as a facial in a bottle. And it's not hype. It's been featured everywhere from Vogue and Forbes to Harper's Bazaar and it sells out regularly because people actually see the difference. The formula is built around rare ingredients you don't see every day, like Muga Silk, a prized silk from India that helps reinforce skin strength and elasticity. Silver Tips tea for antioxidant protection and Ashwagandha which helps skin recover from stress and fatigue. The texture is lightweight and silky, not greasy, and it works across all skin types and tones. Each bottle even comes with copper crusted silk cocoons for gentle exfoliation. No irritation so your skin absorbs the serum more effectively. If your skin looks tired and you want it to look stronger, smoother and genuinely radiant, again, this is worth your attention. I've arranged the highest discount they offer. 21% off. Go to loveindus.com and use promo code SWORD at checkout. That's loveindus.com promo code SWORD for 21% off. Alright, let's continue. Some people still want a drink at the end of the day, but just not the alcohol part. That's where Good feels fits in. Good Feels makes THC infused cannabis seltzers designed to be light, consistent and easy to enjoy. No hangover, no heaviness, just a calm, lifted feeling that doesn't take over your night. They're made with natural ingredients and formulated to feel balanced whether you're relaxing at home or out with friends. It's a simple alternative if alcohol isn't doing you any favors anymore. And right now you can get 20% off at shop.getgoodfeels.com with promo code sword21 and over only please. That's shop.getgoodfeels.Com and use promo code sword for 20% off. On June 22, 2019, in East Cleveland's South Collinwood neighborhood, police responded to a bloody scene on Chickasaw Avenue. Two 10 year old girls escaped, escaped their home, reporting they'd been stabbed in their sleep. When officers got to the house, they found a third victim, a 12 year old autistic boy who confirmed that his brother was the killer. 18 year old Jaylen Plummer was in the shower rinsing off blood after stabbing the entire household in a bedroom. His grandmother, Diane Madison, lay dead from multiple stab wounds and her little dog also laid nearby. Jaylen offered only a chilling explanation. The mental health care system failed me, so I tried to kill my family. Signs of mental illness seemed obvious when Jaylen was taken to the hospital and questioned. Nurses bandaged the deep cuts on his hands, but it was as if his voice was bound just as tightly. His muffled words barely escaped. He spoke in vague, detached terms, referring to his siblings as child number one and child number two. He claimed he didn't know the names of his mother and grandmother and said he just called them mommy or grandma. His mother, Tania Plummer, would later tell detectives that Jaylen had no official diagnosis, but his behavior had drastically changed between the ages of 12 and 15. He'd been drinking, smoking, shutting down and fixating on dark things. She had just decided to get him into therapy. But here's what Jaylen's mother didn't want to say. She remembered that his behavior had started to change around the time of another arrest. Police already knew the name that would leave her lips. This was a man from the same city, a serial killer that had haunted Cleveland and was arrested and convicted during Jaylen's crucial adolescent years. It seemed possible this disturbed Jaylen so much that he became fascinated with killing and ultimately exploded in a murderous fit that night, leaving his grand grandmother dead. Diane was a loving, kind person, and I think sometimes that gets lost. Almost all of us who worked with her remained friends with her afterward. That's the kind of person she was. She was the kind of person others felt comfortable with because they knew she'd been through it. They knew she was the first to sympathize. She was always open to hearing about everybody's hard times because God knows she'd had enough of her own.
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And I just want them to remember.
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Her smile and remember how much laughter and joy she brought to people's lives. She was someone who was compassionate, who.
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Cared about her family, who cared about her grandkids, who Cared about her kids even when they couldn't reciprocate.
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Maybe Diane Madison wasn't just a grandmother. She was a mother of one of the most notorious killers in Cleveland's history. Her son, Michael Madison, grew up in that same house on Chickasaw Avenue. As an adult, he returned to raise a family there with his girlfriend, Tania Plummer. They had two children, including a disabled son. Eventually, Michael left them behind. Not before Jaylen witnessed it all, though. The growing suspicion, the arrest, the conviction of a killer, someone who had once called that house home.
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Conversation recorded on July 19, 2013 at 8:54. Please leave this back. If I try to figure, I'm going help you. Hey, how you doing? Okay, Send somebody over here. We can't get this one garage. We can't get a garage door open. But it's a smell. I know when the dead animal smell and I know it garbage smell. But the flies coming out of the wall from one side of the garage, I mean, it smells so freaking strong you could throw up. I mean, we just want to make sure ain't no body in the other side or something. I mean, it's so bad enough, man, you would throw up. It's hard to even taste the smell. So what's the address? 1395 Haiti. Eh, eh, eh. What's your name? My name's Chase. S H A Y. What's your last name, child? What's Your phone number? 216-870-8956. Okay. Are you talking? Yeah, we out here. I'm not here now. So we was waiting. Nobody ain't come up yet. We just. Okay, I'm gonna send someone out to you, all right?
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That smell in the garage, if you've never had the pleasure. It's a mixture of rotting fish, dead animal, skunk, and raw sewage. How's that lunch treating you? You're welcome. This call came in six years before Diane's murder. And it wasn't just the first sign of something horrific. It was the past catching up. It was a call to police from a cable company worker in this building that eventually led to the arrest of Michael Madison on murder charges. He lived there in an apartment, and one employee saw flies swarming in a nearby garage.
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So I went in there and when I smelled the smell, I was like, oh, my God.
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We need to call the police. East Cleveland police found the decomposing body of a female victim on Friday. They ID'd Madison as a suspect, arrested him at his mother's home, and began questioning. The garage wasn't behind Diane's house. It was on Hayden Avenue, near a small upstairs apartment Michael had been renting just a few miles away. Because by 2013, he wasn't living under his mother's roof anymore. And he wasn't the same cute, cuddly little boy she'd raised. He had turned cold. Michael Madison, Diane's son, was no stranger to trouble. He was quiet and withdrawn. He's always been that way. He'd been drifting for years through dead end jobs, short tempers, and the kind of isolation that makes neighbors nervous.
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He had anger issues. Sometime I would see him upset, yelling, and I just told him to calm down and he was okay. You know, he spoke to everybody.
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When the garage door finally opened and the truth finally came spilling out, literally, it wasn't just the neighborhood that changed. It was the entire Madison household, Especially his stepson, Jalen. The man he had once called stepdad would now be called something else entirely. A killer. Michael wasn't exactly a copycat. But his crimes bore chilling similarities to those of another Cleveland serial killer he reportedly admired, Anthony Sowell. Infamously known as the Cleveland Strangler. Sowell was convicted in 2011 after the remains of 11 women were found at his home. Years later, Jalen Plummer, who lived with his stepfather Michael in the same house, appeared to develop a disturbing interest in the same notorious figure. The coroner in Cleveland, Ohio, says six.
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Bodies found in the home of a.
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Convicted rapist were female. All were homicide victims. Police arrested 50 year old Anthony Sowell Saturday.
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Thank you Jesus. Thank you, Heavenly Father. I am so glad they got him because I wasn't gonna rest, you know, until they did. Before I had to put my fridge against the door and lock myself in before I could even go to sleep.
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Just two years after the Cleveland Strangler was put away, Michael Madison emerged onto the crime scene. Michael was born in East Cleveland in 1977. Former classmates barely remembered him because he had no real friends. He was, I guess, what you would call forgettable. He didn't graduate from high school, but he was far from stupid. He had a lot going on in his head, but no one ever bothered to ask what that was. And he never saw a therapist. But he needed one because he hated women. Specifically black women. The women who fell into his nightmare weren't prostitutes or drugged out street women. Not that they would deserve his fate. Instead, they were women with families, full lives and plans. And for a brief, fateful moment, each of them crossed paths with Michael Madison. The first body found was 18 year old Shirelda Terry. She had just graduated from high school with plans for a good life. That summer, she worked at an elementary school in East Cleveland, helping run youth programs and earning respect from teachers and neighbors. She was last seen alive on July 10, 2013, leaving school after her shift. But she never made it home. They met somewhere in the previous weeks and started texting. Michael lied, saying he was 25 with no children. When they opened the garage door, thousands of flies swarmed in the putrid air. Officers moved the bags containing her remains, and a trail of decomposition fluid left a mix of brown, gray, red, and yellow flowing like a dirty river on the concrete in front of was one of the most gruesome crime scenes they'd ever laid their eyes on. She died from ligature strangulation, and investigators also noted a severe vaginal laceration consistent with sexual assault while she was still alive.
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Chereldo's my angel. Well, everybody called her Cherelda. I called her heaven. I called my kids. I call my kids according to how they act. And that's my heaven. So to me, he took mine. She's a praise dancer. She's.
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She's a holy person.
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She's heavy into the church, and she's. She's my reader, my bookworm.
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It didn't take long for Michael to be arrested and brought in for questioning, but it came after a standoff at his mother's house. DNA and circumstantial evidence were strong, but during questioning, detectives hoped to get some answers as to why Michael had the spotlight for once. He talked a lot, but not about what mattered. And he wasn't the loud bragging type. Instead, he gave metaphors, quietly parables, detached theories about the human condition. It was as if the man accused of stuffing women into trash bags thought he was there to give a philosophical lecture. And while detectives paused for timelines and names, Michael offered riddles and speculations.
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You know, it's my first time really realizing just how different walks like are. Like, when I was younger, we stayed on the west side, and we stayed in Cleveland, so we go to school on the west side, you know, so the west side school had, like, you know, saying, Puerto Ricans. White's pretty good mixture. Then we moved here, and it's been pretty much just, you know, black on black for the majority of my life. I've always. I. You know, I told myself. Told myself I was like, in the country. You know what I'm saying? Three, four horses. You know what I'm saying? Couple cow, some sheep. You know what I'm saying? Some rams, some goat. What you going to do with a ram and a goat. I just like to see the rams, like they. I think they have like the most testosterone in any animal, really. The ram seen them going at it one time like rams. What when they bankheads and like that. Lean for leaning up and then leaning down. Don't like the rams. You know what I'm saying? Like the rams swagger.
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Yeah, he really did just say, I like the rams swagger. The conversation shifted for a minute to the day police picked him up. It was a sweltering day when police moved to arrest him. On July 19, 2013, he happened to be at his mom's house on Chickasaw. He and barricaded himself inside for hours. SWAT was called and the standoff ended only when officers used tear gas and broke the door down to force him out. They asked him what he was thinking at the time. If it sounds garbled, it's probably because of the cheeseburger he was eating.
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I really just run into my head that this was really happening. Pretty much just waiting off the wall. And from all the calls I got, I know it's not looking good for me.
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This guy's maybe the chillest killer they've ever interviewed. He went on to say that while police car sirens blared and lights flashed, while voices boomed over the megaphone yelling for him to come out, he was listening to his mother's wind chimes, smoking cigarette butts from the ashtray in thinking about his childhood.
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It's always good to have friends and family. No, man. Well, I usually have a lot of life. Friends and family are the ones who've done, you know, the worst in life. Like, you know, like, think about it, man. Like, do you think if I really, like, if I really just all out valued my mother and her opinion and how she would feel, I think I would have came out the door before that, you know what I'm saying? Before that door got hit like that. Can't that door up? Yeah, I'm saying, like, I'm not saying I. That that's the reason that I didn't come out. But like I said, man, family and friends would be the worst. And you know, I love my mother, but, you know, me and her got to a point where I, you know, really pretty much didn't care to see her again. But, you know, during certain times when, like, he was there for me, you know what I'm saying? You know, the whole thing was done for a second. Parents and move forward. Don't hold on to this. Don't hold on to that, you know, talking. I put all of that behind me. But have I really?
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At several points throughout the more than eight hours of interrogation, Michael alluded to a loveless childhood of neglect. According to him, his mother prioritized appearance and money over him. As much as detectives wanted to make him comfortable and hear about his past, they still had a job to do. And it wasn't to be a therapist for a killer.
B
Start at the beginning. Start at the beginning. Wherever you want to start. This is. This is your opportunity.
A
Tell me.
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What y' all think you got me for. Yeah, well, I got calls saying that they found the body in the garage behind the place on Starting hating. You know, people that call me, they say, hey, you know, they. I be around here a lot. Isn't that where you live at?
A
Let's answer that. Yes, that's it. That's where Michael lived. But all of a sudden, it was not really his place. His baby mama's name was on the lease, and people just sort of came and went, all helping pay the bills together somehow in some sort of weird collective, you know, Anybody could have been there. Anybody could have had access to that garage.
B
Michael, I don't know. You had conversation with the commander about the last six hours I've been over in your spot with an organization called bci. I don't know if you know what BCI is, man. You ever watch any of the CSI shows? Whenever something happens, you leave. Intentionally or inintentionally, you leave stuff behind, whether it be DNA evidence, fingerprints, blood. We're giving you the opportunity to tell your side of the story, man. Okay? But please don't. Don't sit here and insult me, all right? I've been spending the last seven hours processing your apartment. I know the evidence in your apartment. I know the evidence in your garage. I mean, please, please, please do me the courtesy of. Listen, I understand that people make mistakes. I told you before, I'm not here to judge you. But please do me the courtesy of being honest, man. All on me, though. What's that? Like you said, it's all on me. My mind. Just me. Because it's rented to you. Everybody says that you live there and they reputable. Their information is reputable because we got people that saw you in the apartment, man.
A
He argued that he was in and out of the apartment and hadn't been in the garage for weeks. The body was put in the garage less than a week before. All the detectives wanted was for him to fess up and tell them what he did, and they weren't getting anywhere. It was time to bring God into it.
B
Are you a Godbury man?
A
Little did they know that they had just made a massive overreach. This was the perfect opportunity for the suspect to preach.
B
That's all I want. That's all I got.
A
For real.
B
That's all I've ever really had. Was not. So then you believe in right and wrong, right? But I also believe in the chess game here on earth where you had a devil and you have God. Hell is right here on earth. Like you. Like you. No matter if you was a reverend, a pastor, a deacon, like you are not without sin. Like you sin. He sinned like no one, whether it be police pastor, no one can tell me this. Without sin, no one can tell me that they have never committed a sin and never broken the law. Whether it be misdemeanor or felony. Somebody like everybody has some type of skeleton in their closet. And whether it be pastor or chief of police, like, you know, throw a name on it. Skeleton skeletons can be as big as. As the name, like chief of police. That his skeletons can be just as big as, say, Anthony Sowell. All the way down to little girls just leaving daycare. Like no one. Like, yeah, no one's a God. And I know you know what I'm saying. I know it's good and I know it's bad.
A
They just let him keep talking. They let him drift through the vague philosophies and half baked sermons in his little cabeza. According to him, no one wanted to hear his story, the real story, quote, unquote. Again, you'll never convince a retard they're not a genius. He was fine talking about literally everything except the murders.
B
So you don't think anybody is gonna listen to your story, Is that what you're saying? Bingo. Bingo. We're here listening. I don't want to hear this. And we're the ones that are gonna have communication with the prosecutor. Y' all doing your job. No, Mike. They all disagree with you. Mike, man, I, you know, hate to seem like I'm wasting your time or anything, but, you know, this is like I'm. Like I told you earlier, I'm at the beginning line of some shit that you don't want to go through. You don't want to go through and probably. Y' all probably wouldn't wish on your worst enemy that I'm at the starting line of. It's not like. It's not like me giving you what it is. You won't gonna make this any easier for Me. You know what I want to do? I want to do the hardest thing that a police officer ever has to do. Do you know what that is? Go to work. No, that's easy. Going out there when people are doing bad things and catching them, chasing them, fighting with them, whatever it takes. That's easy. I want to do the hardest job when I have to go to somebody and say, I'm sorry to tell you this, but your loved one is no longer with us. They're dead.
A
This. It didn't faze Michael. He just kept talking until everyone in the room was numb. It's a cool parlor trick if you can do it. Politicians are great at it. It's a shame, though, he didn't talk until he was numb, because he would have already been there a long time ago.
B
I'm numb. I'm truly numb. Truly numb, truly numb. I'm not expecting to be hurt, you know? Song they say you prepared for the worst, hope for the best, prepared for the worst. Like, whatever the worst is. Like, I know it's still. Like, it's not like I'm about to go to war or I'm about to be shooting and going to war. I'm about to be in front of a judge around other criminals. That's what I'm saying is, man, Like, I don't. I feel. I feel. I feel it's nothing. I feel it's not a damn thing. Like, man, I'm sorry. Here. It's like I said, man, this. Like, it's this. This. This world that we live in. Like, from generals in the army to tenants, commanders. Like, how you think some of these wars is going? They just send somebody out on the front line knowing that these dudes ain't gonna come back. They ain't even supposed to even come back.
A
For the record, Michael was never in the military. He was just pulling out all the stops to make his case, Even by stealing valor. Even though he hadn't admitted to anything yet, he knew they had him, so he would just hint at the motive, which was I was neglected. Nobody ever listened to me. My baby mama nags me all the time because I don't have a job. Wah. She makes me feel less than a man. Women all want one thing. Waa. Wah. Wah. Holy shit. What an insufferable asshole.
B
I hope this serves as a way for these females to stop trying to fuck guys over, you know what I'm saying? Is that what's happening? Somebody, you over? Oh, I mean, other than the regular. No, not necessarily, but it's Gonna. It's gonna serve. At some point, shit gonna change. It's gonna be some type of shake up. It's only over. Is that what this is all about? No, I just don't know what this about. I don't know what the. I don't know. But, you know, good percentage of us see their wives run the show for real.
A
Then out of the blue, probably because they were so numb from the talking, the cops flipped the switch and asked him point blank.
B
First time you ever killed anybody? The first time? Was that like a trick question? No. Why is it a trick question? Why would it be tricked? No, I ain't never killed nobody. Killed me a couple bugs or something. This is the first time you've ever killed somebody.
A
But that was a lie. In an obscured part of the interview that's barely audible, unfortunately, he admits to strangling one of the women. He was annoyed that she wouldn't leave and felt like she was trying to take advantage of him in some way. He was drunk and all he remembered was putting his hands around her neck. He never said she died, but he never said her name. Later, he claimed he found a body in a garbage bag and carried it down to the garage. But he never put it in there. It was a mirage of pieces, but the pieces corroborated the evidence. And it didn't take a genius to fill in the missing pieces.
B
You could be the man right now. Let's do it. Mike. I know, I know. You got power now. What do you think I mean, Mike? I don't know. You're not really being clear with it. You kind of. You know what we found yesterday, right? Think about what I found today, Mike. What were you talking about yesterday? You said, they're gonna learn. We're gonna teach. They deserve it. Ah, just talk about the siren. That's delirious. Numb. Like you weren't. And I was sitting there trying to put it all together. And after we took you back downstairs yesterday, Sergeant Ruth and I and Sergeant Gardner, we sat down in my office and we talked for a long time. And we just were trying to figure out what you were trying to tell us. And I inserted Ruth know now what? Exactly what you were saying, bro. Mike, I know now. We jumped right in like we found it. I found out you. You're the man. You aren't bullshitting. No. I hope y' all not see if y' all targeting me, but y' all not really telling me what you like. What is you saying? I got. I got. I got another body. I thought you were kind of blowing smoke up my ass yesterday. Me and Gardner and Ruth were talking about it and I thought you were blowing smoke up my ass yesterday. I said, I don't know. I said, way I think, I think he's telling me just by his body language, just by his demeanor, some of the things he was saying. You say you're talking outside of your mouth. I think that that was, that was you wanting to tell your story. And I'm giving you an opportunity now to do it. And I'm telling you I believe you. Now, I kind of half ass believed you yesterday, and I'm believing you 100% now. So you ain't. We ain't even on this one body. We talking about something totally different now. Whichever one you want to talk about, Mike, it ain't one, it ain't two. Let's do this all the way, bro.
A
Michael barely flinched. He had admitted to having dates to his apartment and getting so shitfaced that he didn't remember them leaving. He confessed to putting his hands around one of the women's necks and awakening to find a body in the garbage bag. That's bad. But even now, when confronted with more evidence and yet another body, he deflected. The detectives were running out of patience. And now they didn't just want to know why he killed. They wanted to know how many more dead women would be found and where they were located. There's a moment at the end of the day when everything finally shuts off. The lights are low, the house is quiet, and the only thing that really matters is how comfortable you are. That's what Cozy Earth does so well. Their bamboo sheet set, made from bamboo viscose, is known for its incredibly soft and natural cooling, especially if you sleep hot. The fabric drapes well, gets softer over time, and actually helps you stay comfortable throughout the night. They also make pajamas that feel just as good. Designed for those nights when you're not going anywhere and you don't want to rush anything. Cozy Earth backs everything with a hundred night sleep trial and a 10 year warranty, which tells you how confident they are in their quality. You can get 41% off cozyearth.com with promo code SWORD. So go get comfortable today and use promo code SWORD@cozyearth.com for 41% off. When they found the first body in East Cleveland in 2013, it was a trash bag in a garage. The neighbors had smelled something. By the time the police arrived, the case was already strange. The suspect, Michael Madison, was calm. He denied everything and admitted only Enough to seem helpful. One woman he said was dead, but he hadn't killed her. He found her in a bag. He just moved her. That's all he claimed. But the evidence was there. They still didn't have a clear motive, though. Only a suspect who talked in metaphors and acted like a victim all the time. This victim was also a father of two and a stepfather to one quiet teenager named Jaylen, who years later would erupt into his own kind of violence in the same house on Chickasaw Avenue. The violence from both men was directed only at women. The women who raised Michael and her grandson Jalen and three other innocent women who just happened to cross the wrong path.
B
Mike, you got the power. Obviously, she disrespected you. Obviously, she put you into that position. Something happened, bro. She made. You have to show her. And now all I want you to do is just show me. We'll talk about whatever you want to talk about. You want to talk about the most recent one first, or you want to talk about another one? Whatever one you want, bro.
A
In this tiny blue interrogation room that resembled a prison cell, detectives and Michael sat for hours on end eating cheeseburgers from McDonald's. As the questions came one after another. While the barred window raised, Michael smoked black and mild cigars, the smoke mixing with the scent of sweat and making its way out the window to the sweltering streets of Cleveland. They were finally coming to understand this killer.
B
I guess even before here, just, you know, pretty much knowing, like, damn. At 35, with no real background in school and no career, no 401 kids, a baby mama, as far as evil as they come, you know, I'm a real, like, I'm a real compassionate dude when it comes to certain things. What kind of things? Just, you know, people. People. But somewhere along the way, I just lost, like, I love. Like, I love females now, but a man's a man. A man's manhood should never be compromised when it comes to a female who's never been a man.
A
It was a simple but disturbing statement. In that one sentence, Michael revealed a cracked mirror of identity, pride, and resentment against women. In 2025 especially, it's not unusual to hear the voices of frustration from men who feel diminished in relationships and society at large. Still, his words, though wrapped in philosophical language, revealed a specific grievance. This was a man whose sense of self had been shaped and maybe shattered by the women around him. Still, nothing could justify the brutality that followed. He never offered a formal confession, not in so many words, but he did Give what experts call a functional confession. That's when a suspect doesn't technically admit guilt, but their behavior shows it. They lead police to evidence only the killer would know. They describe crime scenes in detail. They help close the loop. Think of Ted Bundy, who helped investigators find remains even years after denying some of his murders. Or Israel Keyes, who mapped out the burial site of one of his victims despite refusing to name all of his crimes. It's not in what they say, it's in what they do. Michael finally took detectives to the bodies. The first was Shirelda Terry, the body found in the garage. The young girl just starting her life. Next was 28 year old Shatisha Shealy, who had a daughter. Her body was discovered in a brush pile near the garage behind Michael's apartment. It was bound in layers of heavy trash bags, the same method used for the other victims. Forensic examination was limited due to decomposition, but there were signs of trauma and possible strangulation. Shatisha had bruises on her face and her clothing had ligature marks. Last to be found was 38 year old Angela Deskins. She was discovered days after the first body in a musty basement of an abandoned house near Michael's apartment. Angela was a quiet woman with a soft voice, trying to piece her life back together. Together. She had once worked as a hairdresser, someone who brought beauty to others. But she struggled to get by and pull her own life together. Someone introduced her to Michael. He seemed somewhat safe enough and had a calm personality. That was all it took. June 7th.
B
They tell us that's when they last saw Angela.
A
And since then they say they have been friends, frantically searching for her. But this week police confirmed their worst fear, that cops had found her body. That 38 year old's body. Investigators right now aren't saying how she died. Cops discovered her remains in a backyard Saturday near Shaw Avenue. Now new this morning, a statement from the family quote, angela Daskins was a.
B
Beautiful, sweet, kind hearted woman.
A
She was raised in Novelty, Ohio by.
B
Her father, Robert Askins, and her stepmother, mother Linda Daskins. Everyone who knew her loved her.
A
She was a wonderful daughter, sister and.
B
Aunt who truly cared about her family and friends.
A
She is loved so much and will.
B
Be missed by everyone who knew her.
A
In the days after Michael's arrest, neighbors were quick to share their memories. Not about him, but about his mother, Diane Madison, and what she'd been through. Everyone spoke highly of her.
B
I want her to be remembered as someone who cared deeply for her children, someone who cared passionately about her community.
A
She was Just a fine person. I'm a better person for have known her. Michael loved his mother. He admitted this openly. But he also alluded to neglect. What he didn't do in the interrogation was throw her under the bus. But the defense did that for him at the trial. The trial formally started in April of 2016. By early May, Madison had been convicted on all counts. Three counts of aggravated murder, three counts of kidnapping, three counts of gross abuse of a corpse, three counts of rape, and one count of possession of criminal tools. The following week, the court turned to mitigation evidence, opening the door for a glimpse into Michael's upbringing. Underneath the calm exterior of the woman next door, the community activist and loving mother and grandmother, the defense painted an entirely different portrait. They described Diane as cruel, neglectful, and violently abusive. Michael's attorneys revealed years of torment that started in childhood, documented by an expert clinical psychologist who evaluated Michael and examined his records. They said Diane beat him regularly, locked him in closets, and even forced him to eat feces. It didn't stop there. The defense told the court he was also sexually abused and emotionally abandoned. They argued that Diane's abuse left scars so deep that they helped shape the monster he would later become. During the victim impact statement given by Sherelda's father, chaos broke out in the courtroom. When for some reason, he stopped mid sentence and lunged across tables towards Michael. He started attacking him and had to be pulled off. His sister later clarified what happened. At that moment during the sentencing, you.
B
Have the families there and they're pouring.
A
Out their hearts and saying how they're.
B
Going to miss their families and what their families meant to him.
A
And he's sitting over there smiling, which.
B
Caused my brother to launch at him.
A
You to him. He heard the door, excuse me.
B
The life of my daughter, the life of my niece, the life of our baby, who we called heaven.
A
Okay, so it was horrible to be that close, to have to breathe his air, to be in the same room with a person that is so horrible and don't even care.
B
He don't care.
A
He was. He was laughing when she gave him the death penalty. You heard it at the end of the trial. No mitigating circumstances were going to stand in the way of justice. Michael Madison has now spent nearly a decade on Ohio's death row. He was sentenced on June 2, 2016, and was scheduled to die by lethal injection on May 20, 2021. But an unofficial moratorium on executions has stalled all lethal injections in Ohio since 2020. Want to know why? Well, they're waiting for an alternative execution method in place of lethal injection. You see, they can't get their hands on the right drugs to make the deadly cocktail. They can put dogs and cats to sleep all day long. All the strays put them all to sleep in a humane way, we're told. But they can't get the cocktail right for humans. Isn't that strange? It's almost as if they don't want to and are just hiding behind some bullshit regulation in order to not do it, despite what the populace might have voted for already. Doesn't sound very democratic, does it? Anyway, for now, this asshole is still alive as the system that condemned him sits frozen in time, almost by design.
B
I am struck by the sheer inhumanity of what one human being can do to not one, but three human beings. It is incomprehensible.
A
You cajoled, lured and deceived Shatisha Shealy, Angela Deskins, and Sherelle Deterre to your apartment for your depraved purposes. You went on to abuse the corpses of these three victims. You stripped them from the waist down. You folded them in half, binding them.
B
So that their feet were up by their ears. You wrapped them in multiple layers of trash bags, and you discarded them.
A
This killer didn't just kill out of nowhere. His crimes were monstrous, but they happened after unresolved festering thoughts from a long and tangled legacy of suffering. Then you add the alcohol and possibly drugs, and poof. You get a sword and scale episode. Lucky you. Decades later, in a cramped Cleveland apartment, a young Michael was beaten, locked in closets, humiliated, and allegedly forced to eat feces by the very person who was supposed to protect him, his mother, Diane Madison, a woman the public celebrated after her death. Later, he was allegedly sexually abused by one of her boyfriends. Michael felt emotionally discarded and shoved through the cracks of a system that barely noticed he was falling. Then came Tania Plummer, the mother of his child, who, according to Michael, belittled him and called him less than a man. A man's manhood, he said, should never be compromised by a female who's never been a man. That quote may sound absurd on the surface, but beneath it lies a cold bit of truth, one that points to a deeper identity crisis, especially among men raised in trauma by women who are in trauma themselves. It's a warped belief, born in pain and shaped by powerlessness. It's an endless loop. I don't know how the fuck we get out of. Do you have any ideas? And then came Jaylen, Diane's grandson, the quiet boy who watched all of this unfold who once lived under the same roof as Michael. In 2019, Jalen, just 18 years old, would creep into Diane Madison's home and stab her to death in her own bed. He didn't just kill her, he nearly decapitated her. He pleaded guilty in 2021 and is serving a life sentence with eligibility for parole in 30 years. His brother, sister, cousin, and sad little dog all survived the incident and remained in the care of their mother, Tania Plummer. So here is the question. Did Jaylen inherit the same demons that haunted Michael? Was this demonic possession some sort of poltergeist in this house of horror? Or do we accept a more rational explanation? Did Jalen learn violence by watching his uncle in and out of his life, bringing stories of abuse and death with him? Did Diane really change into the person neighbors claimed? Or did the darkness inside that house simply go unnoticed until it exploded again? Did the systems America has in place fail both of these men? Or did society simply stop asking the hard questions and stop doing the hard things once the bodies were found? In the end, does it all really matter anyway? It should. We all have this feeling in the back of our mind that it should. We should do better at raising all of our children. We should have a safer and happier and more mentally sound civilization. It started with the allegations of abuse at the hands of one woman. Two men carried it forward, and three innocent women, in addition to Diane herself paid the ultimate price. Not one of them deserved to die. That's going to do it this week. Thank you for joining us. I invite you to go check out our latest episode of sword and scale television entitled Home. Easily one of the most fucked up things you'll ever see. I promise.
B
Sam. Sa.
Date: February 6, 2026
Host: Sword and Scale
Theme: Generational violence, legacy of abuse, and the chilling realities of two intersecting Cleveland murder cases within one family.
This episode explores a deeply disturbing family legacy of violence in East Cleveland, Ohio. It traces the 2019 murder of Diane Madison by her grandson, Jaylen Plummer, and uncovers how her own son, Michael Madison, became one of Cleveland’s most notorious serial killers just years prior. Through gripping 911 calls, survivor interviews, and interrogation audio, the episode paints a chilling portrait of generational trauma, systemic failures, and the dark ripple effects of unchecked mental illness and abuse.
“Hey, wake up, baby. Hey, wake up, baby.” – Unnamed neighbor, urging the girls to stay conscious (11:56)
“Justin was trapped in an upstairs bedroom and didn’t even know he was injured.” – Host (18:17)
“Jalen Plummer was fully clothed, standing under the shower. The blood from his own knife wounds swirled into the drain.” – Host (19:15)
Jaylen’s Motive: Cites mental health issues and the “mental health care system failed me, so I tried to kill my family.”
Systemic Failure: Healthcare, legal, and familial interventions had all fallen short for Jaylen as his mental health cratered prior to the killing spree.
Family Trauma:
“Maybe Diane Madison wasn’t just a grandmother. She was a mother of one of the most notorious killers in Cleveland’s history.” – Host (31:01)
“You could be the man right now. Let’s do it. Mike.” – Interrogator (53:22) “I’m numb. I’m truly numb. Truly numb, truly numb. I’m not expecting to be hurt, you know?” – Michael Madison (49:50)
“A man’s manhood should never be compromised when it comes to a female who’s never been a man.” – Michael Madison (60:29)
Resilience Amid Horror:
“Despite her own problems, this woman wasn’t going to let two little girls slip into unconsciousness. I mean, if I needed somebody to bring me back, I’d want this lady. She goes hard.” – Host, on the neighbor’s handling of the situation (11:42)
Shock at the Scene:
“Oh, my goodness. This girl is stabbed up real bad.” – Neighbor to 911 (13:03) “In the immortal words of this Ohioan, oh, my goodness, this was Cleveland. But even our seasoned veteran here hadn't seen anything like this before.” – Host (17:05)
Reflection on the System:
“Did Jaylen inherit the same demons that haunted Michael? Was this demonic possession some sort of poltergeist in this house of horror? Or do we accept a more rational explanation?...Did the systems America has in place fail both these men? ...In the end, does it all really matter anyway? It should.” – Host (72:39)
Courtroom Emotion:
“He was laughing when she gave him the death penalty.” – Sherelda Terry’s aunt, on Michael's behavior during sentencing (67:08)
On the Execution System:
"They can put dogs and cats to sleep all day long...But they can't get the cocktail right for humans. ...Doesn’t sound very democratic, does it?" – Host (68:28)
Episode 338 delivers a haunting narrative of how cycles of violence and trauma can devastate families and communities across generations. Through firsthand recordings, chilling interviews, and unflinching reconstruction, it questions whether monsters are born, made, or both—and whether society has any real answers or willpower to intervene before tragedy strikes again.
A chilling listen that brings to life Cleveland’s darkest true crime legacy—an episode that stands as a warning and a lament.