#4381 Mr. Steal Your Soup (RE-UPLOAD)

Summary

Podcast Summary: TBTL Episode #4381 – "Mr. Steal Your Soup (RE-UPLOAD)"

Introduction

In episode #4381 of TBTL: Too Beautiful To Live, hosts Luke Burbank and Andrew Walsh dive into a myriad of topics ranging from airline frustrations and obsessive critics to reflections on media portrayals and personal anecdotes. Released on January 15, 2025, this re-uploaded episode maintains the show's signature blend of humor and insightful commentary as the hosts navigate through their day-to-day challenges and intriguing stories.

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1. The Duel Challenge: A Humorous Start

The episode kicks off with a playful exchange where Luke challenges Andrew to a duel. This light-hearted banter sets the tone for the episode, showcasing the hosts' camaraderie and knack for injecting humor into everyday conversations.

• [00:00] Luke Burbank: “I am challenging you, sir, to a duel.”
• [00:25] Andrew Walsh: “Now?”

This brief interaction highlights their long-standing friendship and ability to turn even mundane moments into entertaining segments.

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2. Frustrations with Alaska Airlines

A significant portion of the episode revolves around Luke's ongoing battle with Alaska Airlines. Luke expresses his dissatisfaction with the airline's frequent flyer program, specifically targeting the complexities and perceived unfairness of accumulating miles and attaining elite status.

• [02:27] Luke Burbank: “I am challenging you, sir, to a duel.”
• [07:26] Luke Burbank: “I was very obsessed with getting to a certain level of airline status with this airline this year.”

Luke details his attempts to reach the coveted 100,000-mile status, discussing the benefits such as lounge access and priority boarding. However, he laments the stringent requirements and additional mile purchases that make achieving this status feel less attainable and more of a first-world problem.

• [12:08] Luke Burbank: “I go hard in the paint on that soup when I do use the lounge.”

He humorously emphasizes his desire to maximize the benefits of his elite status, particularly the unlimited soup available in Alaska lounges, despite not maintaining an active membership.

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3. The AJ Weberman and Bob Dylan Saga

One of the episode's core stories involves AJ Weberman, a longtime critic of Bob Dylan, whose obsession borders on the eccentric. Luke recounts how AJ has spent decades dissecting Dylan's work, often misunderstanding or misrepresenting Dylan's intentions.

• [17:02] Luke Burbank: “AJ Weberman sifted through the prophetic singer's trash in search of meaning. He turned on him as a sellout and has spent decades trying to reclaim him for the counterculture.”

Listeners are introduced to historical interactions between Dylan and Weberman, including taped phone conversations from the 1960s, revealing a confrontational dynamic where Dylan attempts to reason with Weberman.

• [71:31] Andrew Walsh: “Man put that in the email signature.”

Through these narratives, the hosts explore themes of obsession, misinterpretation, and the fine line between fandom and harassment.

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4. Reflections on Media and Documentaries

The hosts delve into their perspectives on modern documentaries, using the Martha Stewart documentary as a case study. Luke shares his conflicted feelings about Stewart's portrayal, highlighting the complexity of documentary storytelling that avoids simplistic narratives of redemption or vilification.

• [51:22] Luke Burbank: “Martha Stewart got wronged, or Martha Stewart is terrible. Like what you just described is way better.”

Andrew draws parallels between documentary portrayals and real-life complexities, emphasizing the importance of nuanced storytelling that captures the multifaceted nature of individuals.

• [54:47] Andrew Walsh: “It was a really, really hard thing to try to talk to somebody about objective reality when they're not living in it.”

This discussion underscores the challenges of balancing entertainment with accurate representation in media.

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5. Personal Anecdotes and Listener Stories

Throughout the episode, Luke and Andrew share personal stories that resonate with listeners, adding depth and relatability to their discussions.

• Hummingbird Feeder Incident: Luke recounts a meaningful interaction with hummingbirds, contemplating the responsibility of maintaining feeders and the symbiotic relationship between humans and nature.

  • [97:57] Luke Burbank: “I'm thinking that you should take some. It should be gratifying to you in a certain way, that the birds drink what they need and they leave, because now they know they can rely on you.”

• Bus Encounter with a Troubled Individual: Andrew narrates an unsettling encounter with a regular at a local pop-up kitchen, highlighting issues of mental health and the impact of friendly gestures on those struggling.

  • [85:32] Andrew Walsh: “He was like, we're the ones who are, like, you know, sort of telling their own versions of I am Anchorman.”

These stories not only entertain but also provoke reflection on societal issues and personal connections.

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6. Cultural References and Media Commentary

The hosts weave in references to popular culture and media, analyzing characters and societal behaviors with their characteristic humor and insight.

• Anchorman Inspiration Debate: Luke and Andrew engage in a discussion about the real-life inspirations behind the character Ron Burgundy from Anchorman. They explore claims linking Bill Curtis and Mort Crim to the iconic role, reflecting on how media influences public perception of personalities.

  • [43:36] Luke Burbank: “I have gone around telling people that Bill Curtis was the inspiration for the character Anchorman because that's what I had heard from somewhere.”

• Moneyball and Professional Detachment: The hosts compare character detachment in Moneyball to professional interactions, illustrating how maintaining composure in high-stress environments is portrayed in media.

  • [29:59] Andrew Walsh: “Have you seen the book? Movie or the book?”

These analyses offer listeners a deeper understanding of how media shapes and reflects real-world behaviors and relationships.

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7. Closing Remarks and Future Content Teasers

As the episode draws to a close, Luke and Andrew extend their gratitude to donors, acknowledging the support that keeps the show running. They also hint at upcoming topics and encourage listeners to tune in for future episodes.

• [103:50] Luke Burbank: “I gotta go out and refill this bird feeder.”

• [104:04] Luke Burbank: “We are gonna be back here tomorrow with more imaginary radio for you, so please do join us for that if you can.”

Their closing remarks maintain the show's friendly and engaging atmosphere, leaving listeners anticipating more entertaining and thought-provoking discussions.

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Notable Quotes

• "I know this is unrelatable because it's like a first world problem doesn’t begin to describe it."
  — Luke Burbank ([09:30])

• "You can tell you and I have issues with drinking. Why would you ever stop? Just keep drinking until you're laying on the floor."
  — Listener ([99:18])

• "We laugh so we don't cry."
  — Listener ([36:05])

These quotes encapsulate the show's blend of humor with candid reflections on personal and societal issues.

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Conclusion

Episode #4381 of TBTL: Too Beautiful To Live offers a rich tapestry of stories and discussions, from airline woes and obsessive critics to heartfelt personal tales and media critiques. Luke and Andrew's dynamic interplay ensures that listeners are both entertained and engaged, providing a meaningful exploration of various facets of modern life. Whether you're a regular listener or new to the show, this episode delivers an insightful and humorous journey through the hosts' perspectives.

Transcript

[Luke Burbank]

Well, well, well, well, well. If it isn't the big time hotshot lawyer man. Oh, my God. I do not have time for you. Yes, sir. We both have busy schedules, so I'll make this quick. Shat, mince words with you for long. I am challenging you, sir, to a duel. I accept. Are you serious?

[Andrew Walsh]

Now?

[Luke Burbank]

I accept your challenge. Do you want time to think it over?

[Listener]

No, no, no.

[Luke Burbank]

Not at all. What time were you thinking of dueling? Anytime is good. Really, I don't have. You don't have time?

[Listener]

Cause you would have to go out.

[Luke Burbank]

And get a proper gun. No, I have a gun. I actually keep one right here in the drawer. You got one right there. I don't even see it. I like to keep it loaded because you never know who's gonna walk into a law office these days. Safety first. So let's rethink some things.

[Listener]

TBTL.

[Narrator]

Good afternoon, and welcome to Judgment City. You just had quite a little journey.

[Listener]

So for now, relax and enjoy the ride. I swear, every time this guy talks, all I hear is a turkey goblin.

[Luke Burbank]

You look like Matlock. No, I look like a young Paul Newman dressed as Matlock. It's not great. It's fantastic. You totally undersold it. The pageantry, the costumes.

[Listener]

Wow.

[Luke Burbank]

That is obviously what. It's clear that our view is. We don't support that view.

[Narrator]

It stinks.

[Luke Burbank]

All right. Hello, good morning and welcome, everyone, to a Wednesday edition of tbtl, the show that just might be too beautiful to live.

[Listener]

This song goes out to all the.

[Luke Burbank]

Coffee lovers of the world. My name is Luke Burbank. I am your host, coming to you from the Madrona Hill studio where we got both of the heaters running. But it is cold in here. I'm trying to keep my hands in operation here so I can play these little audio drops. It's like a fridge freeze your fridge freeziator in here. And it's also super foggy everywhere. Cloud, fog. Like we're just socked in by the fuck. I like saying socked in. It feels like that's some kind of a nautical term. Maybe. Anyway, here we are. It's episode 4381 in a collector series.

[Listener]

Let the fun begin.

[Luke Burbank]

I was in San Diego yesterday. Very different weather situation down there, I'm not going to lie to you. And of course, had to fly back on my beloved Alaska Airlines back up here to the Madrona Hill studio. And it's really hard when an institution, a company that I've loved so deeply, is doing me so dirty right now. I'm talking about my pitched battle with my favorite airline.

[Andrew Walsh]

I'm as mad as hell and I'm not going to take this anymore.

[Luke Burbank]

Also, I've been trying to get to this story for the last two days about a guy who has been like sort of a professional Bob Dylan criticizer. So explain that. Like, there's this dude who's probably about Bob Dylan's age and for a significant portion of his life and career, which is encompasses the same amount of time of Bob Dylan's life and career. They've been in this bizarre sort of enemies. But it's almost, I know, it's like what was that movie, that Best of Enemies that was about like Gore Vidal and William F. Buckley. They're sort of best of enemies. They seem to be on each other's nerves all the time, but also have a familiarity. Anyway, we'll talk about this and we'll play you some tape of these two guys talking on the phone from back in the like 1960s or something. Also, we're going to talk to this guy. Longest running cobra of the show. Please welcome the wickedly talented. He's Andrew Walsh and he's joining me right now. Good morning, my friend.

[Listener]

Good morning, Luke. I was a little distracted during your intro. I don't know if you saw this, we don't have time to get into it here at the top of the show, but maybe later on or maybe even tomorrow, got a very long email from a listener about some sky jinx that her husband was directly involved with. And I got to be honest with you, it's a very, very long story, all in text. And when I see a very long email like this, I'm like, this is probably a good story, but maybe a little bit too long for tbtl. But I was on the edge of my seat during your intro reading this thing. In fact, the audio levels are all jacked up at the beginning of the show. I got to fix that later because I was so sucked into these skyjinks. So more on that maybe later today or later in the week.

[Luke Burbank]

I, I mentioned this the other day just in passing at the top of the show. I said something like, you know, Alaska Airlines is on my list or whatever. And then our, our friend Lynn, long, long time supporter of and contributor to the show, was on the ascendant social media platform Blue sky yesterday. He was cutting and pasting or he was maybe reposting something. Said, is this what you're mad at Alaska Airlines about? And I was, I said yes, but for more selfish reasons, per usual. And Then a listener said something like, I'm shocked. And then I was like, really? Okay, you're going a little hard. Okay. I get to make the jokes about how I'm selfish. Nobody else does. That's how this works.

[Listener]

Trying to figure out because. Okay. Can I tell you my emotional journey with the story that, I don't know, you mentioned? I think the first time you introduced it on the show, maybe in Monday's intro, you said that, like, you're mad at the airline, but then you said, but it also, like, sort of. Well, Luke, I believe. I believe you said it underscores your unrelatability because you love using that word. I believe it emphasizes that. And then I. You said, if you thought I was unrelatable before, would you hear this story then, like, ooh, I don't know. I don't know if we want to hear this story. And so right now, where I am is. I can't tell where the kayfabe is. I know that Alaska. You truly love Alaska Airlines. I truly love them. I also know that you have a financial relationship with them.

[Luke Burbank]

I don't anymore, Andrew.

[Listener]

Oh, you don't? Oh, okay. So everything.

[Luke Burbank]

It's after 9pm Andrew. We can say whatever we want.

[Listener]

That's why I was like, okay, so. Whoa.

[Luke Burbank]

What.

[Listener]

What happened? What just happened?

[Luke Burbank]

I don't want to ruin your day, Andrew. I don't want to make anyone have the worst day of their life at their job. Do you have any idea what I'm doing here?

[Listener]

No. Okay. I wondered why that just came out of your mouth. Okay, you're doing something that I am not doing.

[Luke Burbank]

Tim Robinson on a ghost tour.

[Listener]

Oh, the ghost tour.

[Luke Burbank]

And the guy says, this is the last tour, so we can. Things can get a little racy. We can say whatever we want, and Tim Robinson becomes obsessed.

[Listener]

Sure, I am familiar with that sketch, but when that just flew out of your mouth a second ago, which I am beeping, I was shocked. But all of this is to say when you mentioned that this. That this conversation got moved to social media, where companies and people can be tagged in things, I got a little bit nervous because I wasn't sure if you were being outed speaking. But again, the hand doesn't feed you anymore, so bite away.

[Luke Burbank]

I suppose the hand hasn't fed me for a long time, other than just, I do genuinely like the product, and I. You know, I've got friends that work there, and. Well, we've got friends that work there for Captain Will. I mean, you know, so it's like, I'M not trying to. I'm not trying to be overly critical of a Northwest treasure, but I will tell you that I'm also trying to see if I can find this message that Lynn sent to me because I. Some of the specifics were kind of lost on me, but here's. I'll just try to break it down. This is the unrelatable piece of it. Andrew. I was very obsessed with getting to a certain level of airline status with this airline this year.

[Listener]

Yeah. Yes.

[Luke Burbank]

It used to be that the, the, the highest level of. Of airline status was called Gold 75K. And that meant you had to fly 75,000 miles in a year to get to. To get that status. And what that just generally means is a lot of little perks, like, you know, you don't have to pay for your bags and you can pick your seat in coach. Usually be in one of the better parts of coach. And it means that on certain flights, you might get bumped up to first class. Then they rolled out something called 100k, which I know you're not supposed to do math on the radio, but that's 25k more than 75.

[Listener]

Slow down, Einstein.

[Luke Burbank]

And suddenly e equals 100k squared. So then all of a sudden, now there's this. Now there's a group of folks that are actually in front of me in the line. And for all. Not for all of those things, but for the getting to be in first class part, which. Well, I'll. I want to preface all this by saying there. I know this is unrelatable because it's like, you know, you know, flying in first class is a. Is a lucky thing when it ever happens to anyone. And the idea that I'm. Part of my anger would be related to something about first class or whatever, which actually, it's. Weirdly, it's not. I mean, this all sounds very, very kind of unrelatable, except if you are flying constantly, thus, like, getting to, you know, get your luggage onto the airplane overhead because you got to get on the plane first, let's say, or not having to wait in certain lines, it actually really does accrete to a different kind of experience over the course of a year. So that's my defense of why I even care about this stuff.

[Listener]

Did you say accrete?

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah, it solidifies into something.

[Listener]

I don't. I don't know that word. Add it to the list of words for 2025 that we'll be reviewing 12 months from now.

[Luke Burbank]

Maybe it's all these little experiences that harden into a Big block of experience. That is a better experience. So at least that's what I think. Let's look it up.

[Listener]

Does it start with an E, do you think? I was actually wondering if there was any wordle implications here. Is it a 5?

[Luke Burbank]

It's an A word. It's an A. It's a crete. It's a crete. To grow by accumulations or coalescence.

[Listener]

Oh, interesting. Okay. Yeah, I was totally unfamiliar with that word and it looks like it's six letters. So it does me no good in a wordle. So I'm going to forget it. No point, no point saving that in there.

[Luke Burbank]

There's absolutely no utility to you using any brain, any of your storage space for. So anyway, all that is to say I know that that's the reason that I'm saying this is unrelatable is because everything that I'm talking about is. Is bougie ness at a certain level or being very cosseted or whatever. But it's just like cosseted. That's the kind of.

[Listener]

Go ahead. Sorry.

[Luke Burbank]

Carefully cosseted. I think. Let's just keep doing it. This is good for me actually, because I use. I think cosseted is to be carefully handled. To be cosseted, cared for and protected in an overindulgent way.

[Listener]

Two for two, my friend.

[Luke Burbank]

I better quit. Quit while I'm ahead. I'm. I'm batting a th. But that is not going to L. I. That's like, that's like somebody gets. Somebody goes, you know, three for four in their first game of the season. And then they're, they're batting, you know,750 or something. They're leading the, the. They're leading the, the batting race for the Whatever. Okay, so all that is to say I, I know that. That a lot of this is just like really. I mean first world problem doesn't begin to describe it, but basically once there was this thing that was the 100,000 mile people. It's like our friend broadcast Barry is. Although he cheated by marrying a man from Australia. I think that's. I think that's cheating. I think that's dirty pool Barry because he now and buying a house in Hawaii because there will always be an.

[Listener]

Asterisk next to his name.

[Luke Burbank]

That's all I'm saying. You are the Sammy Sosa of getting to 100k. No, I mean Barry just flies like every time I'm texting with Barry, he's like I'm somewhere over Guam.

[Listener]

Yeah.

[Luke Burbank]

What? But so, so this 100k thing and I actually, I didn't. I didn't make it to that level the last couple of years since they rolled it out. But I asked Barry. I was like, hey, man, what's. Is this worth it? Because this is another 25, 000 miles that you got to go out and, like, just spend time on airplanes or whatever. And he said, well, these are the things that you can get. If you do that one, you will probably, you know, hopefully if there's some empty seats up in first class, you might get moved up there. Also, you get a free membership to the lounge, which is like 500 bucks a year or something, and is the kind of thing that, like, most of the time, you know, I'm not at the airport early enough to. In fact, it wouldn't probably net out for you, Andrew, because you don't fly a ton. A ton. But if you did, you should. You would definitely be a person who should join that lounge because you do get to the airport a couple hours early. You've actually got some time to kill, and it's a very nice place to relax. And they've got soup.

[Listener]

I was gonna say. And they have soup. Oh, dude. Soup.

[Luke Burbank]

Oh, man, I'm not kidding you. I go. I go. I go hard in the paint on that soup when I do use the lounge.

[Listener]

Why do you think the lounges are so soup centric of all? Like, kind of. Because you would think, okay, yeah, grazing, you know, kind of an hors d'oeuvre situation. Soup does not usually fit into, like, a grazing situation. Yet my experience, in my very, very limited experience, which I think are always been with you in these lounges, is soup is really the main feature. The soup is the gem of the experience, which is there are not a lot of pho restaurants, and lounges are the only places that super center stage.

[Luke Burbank]

That's a really good point. And super crackers that never. That never left the dream state.

[Listener]

If I remember, I opened my own franchise.

[Luke Burbank]

But that's a great question. I wonder if some of it is. Because it's just. It's cozy. And also you can put it out and you can leave it as long as you have it on a low heat, you can kind of set it and forget it and then just keep refilling it and it gives people something to do. And. But I. I'll tell you some of the only time that I'll eat soup outside of the home is if I happen to be in one of those Alaska Airlines lounges. So anyway, that's like. I think that's like 500 bucks a year or something. That's a significant cost. And then also this. I think I actually said this to you on the show, but like the other or you could. And I actually didn't realize this was an either or. I thought this was all part of the. All part of the swag bag of making it to this thing. Yeah. Was you could bestow not the status that you have of 100k, but you could bestow MVP gold upon one person. You know, you get the golden ticket.

[Listener]

And MVP gold is below the 75. Whatever.

[Luke Burbank]

But it's just better. It's like you don't have to pay for your bags. You can pick your seat, which is a pretty big improvement. I mean, my advice in all this, even though I'm kind of grumping about this airline, is if you are somebody who is. Has any reason to travel at all, if you can possibly make it happen, try to only fly on the same airline. Like, because you might save a little bit of money here and there by by jumping on a different carrier because it's a little cheaper. But like, the big. The big difference for the people that have a. For the people who are having a less horrible travel experience, it's usually because they're only flying on the same airline and they have a little bit of status such that they can again, like, pick their seat before the flight or something. Okay, so. So we're getting to the end of the year, getting to the end of 2024, and I realize that I am at like 90. I'm going to be at like 92,000 miles. I'm going to need a cool 8 miles. 8,000 miles to get to this little number that I've now decided is the goal.

[Listener]

What if it's just eight, let's say taxi around a little bit. Can you stay tax.

[Luke Burbank]

Can I just ride on the wing, sir, for a moment?

[Listener]

Can you just take me.

[Luke Burbank]

Hey, Will, can you hook it up.

[Listener]

From Sea Tac up to, let's just say the U District? Okay, go ahead.

[Luke Burbank]

Right. Can I take it over to a different part of Tukwila?

[Listener]

Right, exactly. So, like, I'm thinking, like, maybe we stop off at Lovers very briefly. We get the Denny's, and then we're back.

[Luke Burbank]

Perfect.

[Listener]

Okay.

[Luke Burbank]

So anyway, so I'm. I'm like. Okay, I'm pretty close to this silly thing, so I might as well go ahead and just. I was going to, like, book a flight somewhere like I did two years ago that was to get to the 75k. Like, I'm going to book a flight to Germany or something or whatever. Or you know what I'll do. Becca and I will go to, like, Miami because that's a really far flight. And if we go there and back, it'll get me to 8,000 miles because of certain. It's not literally 4,000 miles away, but because of how the. How they basically calculate the miles, it would have gotten me there. And in fact, I booked these tickets. I booked us a roundtrip trip to Miami before New Year's because it has to be in calendar year 2024. And I had booked this whole thing and I called in and I was talking to somebody about it. I was asking something about the mileage, and the woman on the phone who was very nice, said, oh, you know what? Actually, if you're only doing this flight pretty much to get to this number of miles, you know, you can just buy the miles. And there are some special category. It's called like, E. It's. I always want to say eqc, but it's not. It's like ECH or something. They're like, is. You can just buy these miles and it will be cheaper than the plane tickets. But it. And then you don't have to actually sit on the airplane. And they also have this other thing, which are these carbon offset things where you can. If you're trying to get. Now, I don't think that's exactly what I did, believe it or not. I think I did it through this other program. But one of the other things they offer is if you are trying to get to a certain mileage number and you don't want to actually sit on the airplane, you can just buy it. And it's. It's. The Alaska Airlines promotes it as a carbon offset, which is. Does not stand up to any kind of scrutiny as a concept like this idea that you bought a seat on a plane but then you didn't go on the plane. I mean, you're not really buying a seat. But the idea that you gave Alaska Airlines money and they gave you miles, but then you didn't fly, so somehow the environment wins is a really, really thin premise.

[Listener]

They didn't ground the plane.

[Luke Burbank]

That's what I'm saying. The plane is still going wherever it was going to go. No planes were grounded in the creation of this film. I'm sorry. Like, so. But whatever. If we want to. If we're trying, we're talking about it some. At least if we're talking about it, something's happening. So this was the this was the, the blue sky that Lynn shared with me. Somebody was basically talking about how this carbon offset thing is kind of is pretty sus.

[Listener]

Right.

[Luke Burbank]

But this is where this relates to me and my selfishness, which is I go ahead and I, I pay the money, I cancel the trip. I. Which was a hassle because some of the tickets were non refundable. So now I have all this like credit like with all this money in this Alaska account that I don't really want or need because, because most of my travel is paid for by work. But it's because I couldn't get my money back on the Miami trip, all of it. And I go ahead and I buy the last 8,000 miles and I get, I'm a hundred thousand mile boy and I'm all excited. And on Sunday when I'm on my way to fly to San Diego, I go into the lounge and you know me, Andrew, there's nothing I like more than strolling into somewhere thinking I'm king of the castle. I'm like, all right everybody. Everybody just calm down. Yes, I'm here.

[Listener]

Where's the soup, Mr. What?

[Luke Burbank]

Clear a path to the soup.

[Listener]

Oh, Mr. Steal your soup is here now that.

[Luke Burbank]

Is the show title. I am like, I mean, and this is the thing, Andrew. I had 10 minutes before my flight was boarding. I didn't have enough time. Like, because you can, if you go to this lounge, you can just pay money, straight up pay. I don't know, it's like 40 or 50 bucks to like hang out in there or if you have guest passes. Like I, they give me a certain number of these guest passes every year, but they're, you know, you only get so many of them. You can use them. But in my mind it's like to use that on something less than like a two hour layover is such a waste. I need to be able to absolutely drain their soup supplies.

[Listener]

Now that's interesting. It is limited. It is. You have to think about the. Yeah.

[Luke Burbank]

Limits if you're not, like if you don't have the membership. If you have the membership, it doesn't matter. You go in there for 30 seconds because it's, you know, you code as much as you want. I haven't had the membership for the last few years because I've been too cheap to pay for it. So I am going in there and the people are so nice. The person at the front is. I'm like, yeah, I'm 100k. And so how do I sign up for the. How do I, you know, Am I, am I on the list now or something? And she's like looking, oh, I don't see you. She goes, sometimes you have to call them and select it or something. And I'm, I'm, I'm being nice to this person. I really am, but I'm inside, I'm being like, oh, you poor fool. You have no idea who you're talking to. You have no idea the level of importance of a person who has flown 92,000 miles and then purchased 8,000 miles of EQC points or whatever. And I'm like, well, how about this? And then she brings over her supervisor and they're looking and they can't find it. And again, I'm being totally honest. I was totally nice. I was not chippy. I was like, it was all fine. And they're like, well, do you want to use one of your guest passes? I was like, I've only got like 10 minutes. That would be kind of a waste. I want to save those for if I'm ever traveling with pores like Andrew. I want to be able to share this. Literally my thought. I was like, well, if Andrew and I are flying for work, sweet. And we need to go to one of these, I need to have these. Like, I have a. I'm a member. I'm not only a. I'm not only the client, I'm also the owner, whatever the hell. So this is, this is the part that in retrospect is really funny, Andrew. I'm just operating with the confidence of a guy who knows he's holding the best pair of cards, you know, like I'm holding the nuts, as they say. But I'm just humoring everyone by, by pretending to think about my bet, even though I know, like, I'm like, I'm 100k, baby. Like, I own this place. And so I go, well, how about this? I really said this. I go, how about this, guys? How about I just sneak over there and I grab a Coke Zero and I'm out of your hair? And they both laughing like, of course.

[Listener]

Yeah, right.

[Luke Burbank]

And I go, and I go, and I get my Coke Zero and I like, get my bag. And they're like, well, thanks for being 100k. They're being so, like, so nice to me. I was going to say solicitous, but I'm kind of medium on that word.

[Listener]

Where we want.

[Luke Burbank]

I think I might. Yeah, I'm like the Seahawks on the two yard line next year. I mean, kicking a 60 yard field goal anyway, so I get, you know, I'm on my way. And then, like, I think, like, I was in San Diego and I decided, okay, I'm going to take a minute, I'm going to call Ask Airlines. I'm going to tell them that, yes, I will take possession now of my. Of my benefits. And I call them and I get a person, you know, nice enough, but not. Not overly solicitous, but. But pretty nice, who is like, oh, were these organic miles? And I go, organic miles? And she's like, yeah. Did you fly all 100,000 miles? I was like, well, no, I. I flew 92,000 miles. And then I. Which is also, I think, not actually true. More on that in a moment because I think I'm getting these miles on my credit card, right. I have one of those Alaska credit cards. And I think that feeds into my overall tally. So the term organic is itself, I think, very, very questionable.

[Listener]

So that. That number 92. Well, you said, we'll get into it more in a minute, but it could have been like you bought something from Ikea and that added some miles, and you probably didn't even fly those full 92.

[Luke Burbank]

I believe that's. Yes, I think that's part of it. Um, according to Barry, too, because he. And I. Listen, he was the first person I called.

[Listener]

He should be on this call right now. He should be here. I should be gone.

[Luke Burbank]

Honestly. Live from Manhattan, Kansas.

[Listener]

Yes. Right.

[Luke Burbank]

So I'm like. She goes, what were they, organic miles? And I go, well, no, I mean, I flew 92,000 of them, which is what I thought at the time, and I bought 8,000. And she goes, yeah, these. These extra benefits only apply to an organic 100,000 miles. And I was like, organic? And I was like, do you have a supervisor? And then she puts me on the phone with her supervisor and I'm like, so hold on.

[Listener]

Well, maybe you. Maybe you'll get to this. But just so you know what my question is now, whether you want to answer, Answer it now. Or if it's coming up, is then what are the benefits of buying these extra 8,000 miles or whatever it was? It just knocks you the 70k or that, that third tier one.

[Luke Burbank]

What it means is I still will have. If there is a waiting list of people to be upgraded into first class, I would be above somebody who has, let's say, 75,000.

[Listener]

Okay, so that applies. Status as far as upgrade.

[Luke Burbank]

The upgrade thing applies. Oh, I got free food on the fly. I was not in first class flying home, but they gave me like a tapas box for Free.

[Listener]

Okay, so little things like that, but not. But the big one is not unlimited access to the lounge, which I really.

[Luke Burbank]

Was calculating because, like, the amount that I had to pay for the extra miles was, you know, was. Was not nothing. And I was like, well, but it's minus $500 because you're getting this free lounge thing. I'm like, you know, I'm going to make. I'm going to make Becca MVP gold. And then she's really going to finally love me. Like, I was like, this is. You know, I'm. I. I had a whole thing going in my mind. And again, I was wrong about that because you basically get to pick. There's this list of these, like, weird, crazy benefits that you can pick. Either free lounge, bestow MVP gold upon someone, free WI fi for the year. And there's one other one that's, like, just, like, no direct eye contact from.

[Listener]

The staff, I think.

[Luke Burbank]

So. Okay, so I am now I get transferred to Heidi, the supervisor. And I already know this is not going to go well because it's not her fault. She was trying to be helpful. But the person who I initially talked to puts me on hold and then says after a pretty long time says, thank you. Sorry for the long hold. I've explained to Heidi what's going on. Here's Heidi. And I was like, already, like, no, no, no, no. I don't want you explaining to Heidi what's going on. I need to be the tip of that spear. I need to be the first person because I have a whole tone of voice I'm using here. I have a whole way. There's. This is a. Listen, this. This is a whole system. And it can't be messed up by you explaining to Heidi. This guy's mad because he bought 8,000 miles. He's not getting his free stuff. That is not the narrative we're pitching here. This starts months ago with a boy named Luke who had a dream of being 100k.

[Listener]

Once in 1990, in Astoria, a young man and his Koosh ball had a dream.

[Luke Burbank]

Thank you. They had driven to Astoria in a very, very problematic Ford Econoline van. They had to stop often to refill it with water because it was overheating. There were no seatbelts for the seat.

[Listener]

They might have dragged a piano back home. Home, hard to see.

[Luke Burbank]

And that boy holding that Koosh ball that he had recently caught off of the Astoria Column, he said, someday I will. I will fly. And I won't just. I won't just fly. I'll fly. At the very front of the plane. So anyway, I re, I, I, I, I'm, I'm undeterred by the fact that this first person has already completely salted my game by telling my story, but in a non, like a non professional way. I'm a professional storyteller. So I, I decide to still give it my best shot with Heidi. I tell her the whole thing and I'm like, hey, you know, I was, I had these tickets booked for Miami. I was like, you can look at my, you know, you can look at my history or whatever. And I talked to somebody. They were very nice. What they explained I didn't actually have to do the flight if I didn't want to. I could just buy the miles. So I did that instead. And, and they didn't mention anything about how, you know, the whole. And so I'm just wondering if you could make a one time exception and just, you know, if I could just get the lounge membership because this was just some miscommunication and I really would have just done the flight, you know, and I get done and they're just like that, you know, that kind of pause where it's like the person is actually not considering that maybe they're just thinking about how to best bring you back to earth. But like, it was like this little pause and I'm thinking, well, maybe I've, you know, broken through to her. And she's like, well, it is, it is on the website when you're buying the Whatever. Eqc. When you're buying the EQC miles, it is on the website. So we cannot offer that to, we cannot offer that to you. I'm sorry, I was just like, oh. I was like, and this is Andrew. This is, I'm not, I'm not proud of this. But I said, okay, Heidi, I understand. I go, I just want to be clear. This is probably the not. This is not the last you've heard of this, which I don't. Where does that come down on the scale of like, Yelp review of a lifetime or you're effing with the wrong mother effer or it's not right as I believe you yelled at. Like, I don't know. How do we feel about that? This isn't the last you've heard of this? Not the last you've heard from me? Like, I didn't want, I didn't want it to seem threatening. I just wanted it to be like this. Listen, I understand why you're. And I never, I didn't get mad. I Didn't raise my voice. I didn't get. I didn't get testy other than to say, I just want to let you know that this is not the end of this story.

[Listener]

I feel like. I mean, as the king, you are merely the heir to the throne. As the king of the guy who says awkward things when he's upset or feels wronged, I can totally associate with the words coming out of your mouth and not exactly as you meant them. Having said that, I don't like that phrase because I know what you mean, which is you're going to keep on working on this, but Heidi doesn't have to be involved. You know what I mean? You might be going over Heidi's head. You might be talking to.

[Luke Burbank]

Believe me, but like, Heidi, the right email address.

[Listener]

Heidi might have heard the last of this because maybe her shift is. And then. Yeah, you know, like, so the. The thing that's off about that is it sort of puts it. It. It sounds like it puts Heidi in. In the crosshairs a little bit in a way that I don't think any. Anybody you, me or the listeners want.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah, no, I definitely didn't want her to feel like I was coming for her specifically. Although, by the way, be better at your job, Heidi. Like, there's a. There's a way to let people down. You know, there's a way to let people down. I think with. And this is the same thing happens in a lot of different professions where if you do it long enough, I think you just keep seeing people on their worst day and it can become very corrosive.

[Listener]

Yes.

[Luke Burbank]

And I. I can understand that intellectually, and I think it would. The same thing would happen to me probably. But it's like if you're the person whose job it is to tell a lot of people who are having a bad day that their day just got slightly worse, I think that there's. I don't know, I think that there is a. There's a tact that can be brought to that. That was not being brought to this conversation, in my experience.

[Listener]

Oh, interesting. I thought you were saying something else. I thought you were justifying Heidi's detachment by saying when you get better at your job, when you're meeting people on their worst day, maybe at first you. You bring a lot more empathy to the job, but after a while you become somewhat calloused because no matter how much you kind of coddle people, they're still just going to sort of dump their emotions on you. So you might. You might just start to Like I say, kind of build a callus up and just be straightforward with people. Not unlike letting a player go in Moneyball.

[Luke Burbank]

Have you seen the book? Movie or the book?

[Listener]

Well, I guess it's in both, but I'm referring to. It's like there's a couple of iconic scenes in Moneyball where they're teaching. Oh, Lord, I can't.

[Luke Burbank]

Jonah Hill.

[Listener]

Jonah Hill's character just to be completely detached. Like, you don't. When it's time to trade somebody or say you're not taking the field today because we're shipping you off to. To St. Louis, to Seattle, because you're.

[Luke Burbank]

42 and you had a. You had one good season in the Venezuelan League when you were 31, when you may have been using PEDs.

[Listener]

Exactly. So anyway, I could. I think what. I was defending that as sort of.

[Luke Burbank]

I wasn't. I was saying too. I was saying that it's. It's a hazard of a lot of jobs, but the people that are really good at their jobs manage to avoid it. They manage to somehow maintain their humanity. And when they're letting people down, they do it in a way that the people still feel kind of seen and heard. This didn't feel like that to me. Okay, so this is so. So my annoyance is really just kind of. Is kind of petty and whatever. I wanted to get to go to this lounge for free and I didn't read the fine print. Okay, that's my annoyance. But then this carbon offset thing, this is what Barry brought up with me. And I don't want to get Barry put on any no fly list. But sorry, this is. You're absolute. Barry's thing was like, you know, you can buy these. Like these. There's just whatever the sort of special kind of miles are that are the things that. That determine what your status is. Those. You can buy those with the carbon offset, but if they're not considered, quote unquote, organic, then what you are doing is you are really, really lowering to the degree that there was any even slight benefit to the environment, which there wasn't. But let's just say even from just a pure window dressing standpoint, to the degree that these carbon. Like you use carbon offset by your miles and then get your status or whatever, but you actually don't get the benefits. You are really, really like de. Incentivizing or disincentivizing people from even doing this kabuki environmental thing. Like, it should just be the case that if you get to the number, you got to the number. And again, the part about it that's actually really pernicious is this carbon thing. Like again, that's premise on the idea that the carbon thing actually does anything. So maybe my argument is kind of like all over the place. But it's like don't roll out this like bullshit pretend environmental policy and then also make it so that people are not incentivized to use the bullshit environmental policy because they won't get their free lounge access.

[Listener]

I honestly think from listening to this story, the most pernicious thing is that you had a plan, right? Based on the words of somebody who represents that company. You changed your plan. Now, I do have one question here. And this doesn't totally let that representative off the. You were ready to make this flight to Miami, which nothing at all suspicious about a flight to Miami and then turning around and just coming right back too. And you're just like, huh? For some reason my suitcase is 100 pounds lighter.

[Luke Burbank]

No, it's heavier when I come back.

[Listener]

Wait, no, no. Yeah, that's not right. Why would you fly to Miami?

[Luke Burbank]

You know anything about the drug trade, sir?

[Listener]

You know what? I'm going to pack up my suitcase full of drugs in Seattle.

[Luke Burbank]

Andrew, I have lie down to Miami beach for your new business model that you're launching of smuggling cocaine into miam.

[Listener]

I will say that Vivian and I quasi recent trip to Mexico. I remember I had some edibles on me somewhere and we were talking, we kept on joking around as we were in line to go through customs in Mexico. I'm just like, we're doing it, veebs. We're the ones who are smuggling drugs into Mexico. Can we make it work? By the way, did I tell you this also while we were waiting in that line like in Mexico, but ready to go through customs where you push the button and you find out if they're gonna do like a random search. And I don't even know what happens if they catch you with some gummies. I assume they take them and you go on your way. But I don't know.

[Luke Burbank]

But I saw what eat them in front of you.

[Listener]

Yes. And they tell you what colors taste like. We saw the, the telltale sign of an empty gummy wrapper on the ground as we were shuffling through.

[Luke Burbank]

And I was like, hide it in my stomach.

[Listener]

And I'm pretty sure there was only one. Well, I think there was only one, but I was like, veeb, somebody got nervous. But anyway, all of that is to say, yeah, I find my question for clarification is you were ready to make this plan to fly to Miami.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah.

[Listener]

This person said, you know, you can just buy the miles, same difference. Whatever. This person led you astray, did you buy them from that person or did you take that person's advice then go to the website where Heidi is saying all the rules are laid out? Because I guess that could be an argument for Heidi if I'm representing.

[Luke Burbank]

Absolutely. Listen though, by the letter I did, I had to go to the website. I mean it gets. Andrew, are you ready? It gets more complicated.

[Listener]

Oh good. I'm glad I led it to here.

[Luke Burbank]

The first. Because the first person who I was talking to who was really nice was like, I think you can buy these miles. And then I kept going to the website and it kept crashing and there was all the things. And then she had to talk to a supervisor. And it turns out you had to be at this, at that moment when I was talking to her. I was not within 10,000 miles of the goal. I was in like let's say 89,000 miles. And you can't even get in. The website won't even let you in there unless you're within 10,000. So I had to literally finish my trip and then get the credit for the miles and then I was, I was within, within shooting distance of it or whatever. But all that is to say I did go to the website. I did. I mean I should have read the fine print. I mean that's where it's on me ultimately. Like I don't think I was, I don't think that, you know, this is, this, this was on me for not reading the fine print. That being said, I just think it's a very weird way to parse this. And also again, back to the sort of. The carbon credit thing is the thing that I think is really BS like you make this thing that you're to kind of greenwash your stuff a little bit but then you, but then you're still so committed to getting that $500 for the lounge membership that you're not going to let those people who are buying these carbon offsets actually get the same kind of perks and benefits because you have, you've decided that that's not organic or something. I just thought that was a really, really.

[Listener]

That's a bad look and I'm totally freestyling here. I have no idea if there's any truth in this, but I would not be shocked to know that these so called carbon offsets also tally up in some way that look good in some sort of government filings or well they.

[Luke Burbank]

Look bad in front of the Trump administration. Well, but they're actually going to hide that.

[Listener]

They're like, can you roll coal on.

[Luke Burbank]

These, Corey Ten Boom. In the hiding place. Yeah, they're exactly like you roll.

[Listener]

Cool.

[Luke Burbank]

We laugh so we don't cry.

[Listener]

But yeah, you know what I mean, I'm sure in some sort of filings or certainly in some sort of corporate brag rag or you know what I mean, like presentations, they talk about everything they're doing for the environment.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah. And so what I am going to do, by the way, is I am going to write, I'm going to write an email to somebody there, I'm going to send it into the void, I'm going to try to figure out who and I'm going to state my case and I am going to include my auto signature that says I work in the media.

[Listener]

Daytime Emmy signature.

[Luke Burbank]

For the record, I took that off. Is, I mean I've already said this about my, I have an auto signature that I actually don't use very much unless I'm trying to indicate to the person that there is some reason that they might want to prioritize a response to me and that it just says like media stuff I tend to do and it just like lists the places that I do stories for or whatever. And I don't use that. I mean, honestly, I just don't know, believe it or not, I don't know how to make it happen automatically on my email. And so the only it's, I have to opt into it. And so generally if I'm emailing with you and John, I don't opt into it. I just like send it my regular email. But sometimes if I'm emailing an airline and I'm hoping that they'll kind of be like, well maybe we don't want to mess with this guy. I will absolutely opt into it. That being said, I do find it, I don't know, whatever, I don't need to get it. I don't need to, I don't need to yuck any yums. There are some autos, there are some auto signatures that doth protest too much that I've seen sometimes. Like for instance, if I had put, if I had Daytime Emmy award winning, you know, broadcaster as my auto signature, I mean that would be pretty brutal. It's brutal enough that I even have one listing my, my, my work jobs, but which is different than my volunteer jobs.

[Listener]

My work jobs I don't think I've seen. Maybe because we dance in different circles, but I Don't think I've seen a signature as you describe it. Now, I'm getting close to pushing you into an area that you so clearly just made it. You made it obvious that you don't want to talk about. But I'm trying to think of examples of signatures that seem like they go. Signatures that go too hard. I've heard signatures that go.

[Luke Burbank]

Signatures are doing too much.

[Listener]

Right, exactly. So.

[Luke Burbank]

Well, you know what it. You know what it really is? It's not even an. It's. It's actually. It's actually less an email signature. Although I have seen those certainly. You know, what it really can be sometimes is like Blue sky bio or before that, Twitter bio, where it's like just like, I don't know. I don't know.

[Listener]

That's a little bit more relatable. I know you're talking about everybody gets to live there.

[Luke Burbank]

Everybody should just live their life and do whatever they want, honestly. But it's like sometimes it'll be like, you know, somebody who has fewer followers than me online, which is not very many, by the way. I'm not. I'm not particularly noted social media person, but it'll be a person who's. And then it'll be like, you look at their bio and it'll just be like, who's. Who reps them for speaking inquiries, this person for. For fiction, this person for non fiction, this person. I'm like, wow, you got a lot of people handling this career that appears to be kind of in neutral.

[Listener]

I see. I was like, what is Luke's Blue sky bio? Also, I realized that when I started Blue Sky, I was also on Mastodon. We were throwing a bunch of stuff up there, and I never thought that. I didn't know that Blue sky would be the one that would stick. And I realized I need to change my banner photo. It's a photo of some. It was at a UPS store, I think. And you know how the UPS store, sometimes they'll put down. They'll tape down a little piece of paper so you can sign the receipts and you don't have to like run the pen across the hard countertop. You know what I mean? You need a little cushion sometimes. So it's just like somebody put down a piece of paper. But then of course, a million customers doodled all over it. And it's got scribbles. And at the time, it seemed like kind of a nice little photo to make my banner. But I look at it now and it just looks like garbage. And it looks like scribbles and I'm embarrassed as my social media presence continues to narrow down to just be Blue sky and Flicker. I need to make sure that those are pretty polished images out there. But having said that, I wanted to see what your. What your bio is on Blue sky and I see that you have. Somebody's been watching the Detroiters. A. The more crim of podcasting is not.

[Luke Burbank]

The more crim just.

[Listener]

Yes. He was a real guy though, right? He was a real Detroit broadcaster. Or is. Is. I said was.

[Luke Burbank]

I think was.

[Listener]

Okay, but.

[Luke Burbank]

But this was what I found out is. Oh, okay. Is he like on the nightly news there? I thought he was retired.

[Listener]

Oh, I'm sorry. He is alive. That's what I meant. Okay. Of course. Because he's still on the. He was still on the Detroiters a couple of years ago. Yes.

[Luke Burbank]

But this is what I found out about Mort Cram that I was surprised by is I have always. Excuse me. I've always told people that the Mort. I've always people told people that the Bill Curtis, who's the announcer on. On. Wait, wait, don't tell me. And a pal of mine, wonderful, wonderful.

[Listener]

Man put that in the email signature.

[Luke Burbank]

That he Daytime Emmy award winning journalist and real buddy Bill Curtis Knower person who receives a Christmas card from Bill and Donna Curtis every year. I have gone around telling people that Bill Curtis was the inspiration for the character Anchorman because that's what I had heard from somewhere and because Bill was kind of in a way, like as far as the local. You know, he was a Chicago, you know, he was a Chicago news anchor for years and years. And then he hosted all these shows that he also his company produces which were like, you know, like there was. I forget what the, the crime ones were. It was kind of before. It was before the true crime wave really sort of had reached its. Its apex. But you know, there was this one show that Bill did, American Justice, I think it was called, where he was always walking down the steps of like the New York District Court down there at 1 Center street and he would get to the bottom step and he would say, like, but sometimes dead men do tell tales.

[Listener]

Yeah, whatever.

[Luke Burbank]

And like, anyway, I love Bill Curtis. I love all of his stuff. I still, by the way, I still watch American Greed. American Greed is great. It's narrated by Stacy Keach. It's produced by Bill Curtis. Well, by his company. And it's nice because whereas sometimes the true crime shows, the events are too troubling. Like people really lost their lives, families really lost a Loved one. It's a really harrowing thing, and I do feel bad about getting entertained by that. But American greed is just like, they invested their money with a cocaine cowboy, you know, and it's just like lots of shots of a guy driving like a cigar boat in Biscayne Bay. Like, it's like, okay, I'm sorry some people lost their money, but nobody lost their life over this. But anyway, all that is to say I was under the impression that Bill Curtis was the. Was sort of the character or the real person that the character of Anchorman was based on. But that's. Mort Crim is claiming that. And Mort Crim may have. He wrote a whole book. I think it's called, like, Anchorman or the Anchorman or whatever. So I might have been. I might have. I mean, Bill Curtis has gotten plenty of flowers in his life, but I might have been adding one to his. One to his accolades. That he wasn't necessarily actually the. He was not maybe the inspiration for Ankerman.

[Listener]

Well, I have some questions. First of all, do you have any recollection why you were attaching that to Bill Curtis? Was it like, do you remember somebody telling you that or is it just something.

[Luke Burbank]

I think Bill told me that.

[Listener]

Oh, okay. Well, that's like the most interesting answer.

[Luke Burbank]

No, I mean, I don't think he told me. I don't think he told me that he was.

[Listener]

He put in the Christmas card.

[Luke Burbank]

You would know if you got Bill and Donna's Christmas card, Andrew, which you clearly don't.

[Listener]

I'm looking here. And now somebody named Harold Green. The Internet is giving the credit to the physical appearance of Rod and Burgundy. Character may have been modeled after real life news anchorman Harold Green. So, I mean, you know, I mean, I'm sure it's a composite anyway.

[Luke Burbank]

The Mark Crim one is confusing to me because I don't think that Will Ferrell or Adam McKay spent any significant time in Detroit.

[Listener]

Now here is. Okay, I gotta allow ads here. I'm allowing ads. I just use that. I'll allow it. Anchorman. Now, this is from wrkr Rock and roll, I'm assuming in Detroit, although I don't know where W R K R is. Anchorman inspiration was a Detroit News anchor from the 1980s, and they're associating with Mort Crim. Now, I will say I did not Google Mort Crim. You know, Anchorman. I just wrote who is the basis or who is anchorman based on. And I'm getting Harold Green and some articles saying it was more Crim. But I don't know what they're. You know, I don't know what they're basing this on other than maybe Mort Crim. I mean, I love this idea of, like, Bill and Mort and this Harold guy just all going around like, sort of telling their own versions of I am Anchorman.

[Luke Burbank]

And of course, because you rarely cross reference these things, it's totally believable. It's like a white guy with a sort of baritone wearing a suit, and you can kind of make the leap. Like, immediately when I thought it was Bill Critters, I was like, well, that makes perfect sense, you know, but now with it being potentially Mort Crim, that also makes perfect sense.

[Listener]

So here, let me. Just let me. Okay, I'm still. I. It's very important that you and everybody understand what I am quoting here. And I'm quoting 107.7 FM wrkr rock and roll dot com. But according to this article, it says in an interview I clearly overlooked from 2013. By the way, this is written in the first person of the. You know what? Whoever was both running the board for the morning show, writing this blog post, and probably also cleaning out the coffee pots in the lunchroom, says in an interview I clearly overlooked from 2013, Will Ferrell said he loosely based his Ron Burgundy character on Mort Crim, news anchor at WDIV in Detroit. Though the initial inspiration for the movie came from Crim's time in Philadelphia, the character traits were those of the man who took Detroit News by storm for 19 years. So whatever is it.

[Luke Burbank]

I don't. Why do we. Why is this important now? Is anchorman set? I always thought it was set in California, right?

[Listener]

Yeah. Isn't it? Is it Sacramento? I mean, it's. I've only seen that movie once, but people are obsessed with it. Isn't it like. I think it's like, kind of iconically in, I want to say Sacramento.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah. Because I just. For some reason, I feel like that character would have been written by somebody. Sorry, San Diego.

[Listener]

Damn it. Sorry to cut you off. I knew I was getting that wrong.

[Luke Burbank]

You were in this right state. Yeah, but like, the. Well, I didn't even know. I didn't know where it was. I knew it was in the state of California, but, like, I feel like that's the kind of character that you write because you grew up in a town and you had your local newscaster that you watched every night, like, with your parents. And so for me, somehow the question of, like, did Will Ferrell and Adam McKay and I don't Even know actually who's credited with writing Anchorman. I kind of associate them with it. But it could be somebody that grew up in Philly and just was watching Mort Criminal, you know, when they were a kid, and it kind of went into their. Went into their memory banks or something.

[Listener]

That wasn't your most unrelatable story. Thank you for being a tail.

[Luke Burbank]

All right, let's thank some donors. These are the incredible, wonderful, generous people who are supporting TBTL with a donation of their dough. And it's how this can be my job and your job and TBTL employee numero uno John Sklaroff's job. Thanks to folks like Sarah Hogan in Denver, Colorado.

[Listener]

Thank you, Sarah.

[Luke Burbank]

Interesting thing has happened since our time in Denver, Andrew, since our brief, wonderful week there where we then did that live hangout, was that somebody brought along their friend, this Denver news anchor. Speaking of TV news people, Kyle Clark, who was really a fun guy to hang out with and, and. And was like, you know, was ride or Die, was like. Was like, you know, in it to win it for the whole time. And like, we were going to third locations and stuff with him, and people were noticing. People were like, oh, are you the guy from tv? But the thing, I have to be honest with you, I wasn't before that night particularly familiar with Kyle. But since then, he's become a phenomenon.

[Listener]

Yeah. Because he hosted that debate, right? Is it. Is it Klobuchar? I get. I get some of my.

[Luke Burbank]

No, Klobuchar's Minnesota.

[Listener]

That's Minnesota. Right. But he.

[Luke Burbank]

He just. He's been like. He's just basically been, as you might say, speaking truth to power in various, you know, like, just through his show and through these debates that he's moderated and just through, like, interviews he's done where he's really just like, you know, sort of not let politicians who are prone to lying get out of, you know, get out of things and stuff. Like, it's just funny because once we hung out with that guy, then I swear to God, every time I would look on my phone, on Tick Tock or something, that'd be like, news anchor owns, you know, like, owns politician. I'd be like, that was a guy from tbtl, Denver.

[Listener]

I don't know why I said Klobuchar. I know. I. We're talking about Bami. I'm not talking about Bami. I meant Boebert. Sorry about that. I think the O sounds in their names got me confused. I'm embarrassed about that. I don't. Oh, yeah. Lauren Robert Yeah, that's the wrong side of the aisle. I. I knew. I knew it wasn't Bami. I call her baby.

[Luke Burbank]

You do?

[Listener]

Do you remember what everybody. When she was running for president, people called her Bay. Me, Klobuchar. B, A, E. Like bae. Oh, no, that really stuck with me for some reason. That and Joe Mentum really stuck with me, but not enough to. That's a really embarrassing confusion. Klobuchar and Boebert. Sorry about that.

[Luke Burbank]

Klobuchar has not at any time been accused of being overly amorous at a performance of Beetlejuice.

[Listener]

There was something about a salad on an airplane that I think was overblown.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah, that was probably over. I don't. You know, we don't have to litigate that right now. I was thinking about something like that the other day. What was I. Oh, you know, I watched the Martha Stewart. This is what it was. I watched the Martha Stewart doc on Netflix, by the way, would recommend. Really? It's made by. It's made by R.J. cutler. You know, he made the War Room. Remember that doc? Talking about, like, it's. This is a good documentary, this Martha Stewart one. It's not like, I don't think she signed off. I don't think she had, like. Like, you know, final cut on it. I don't. I didn't watch the credits, but I'm guessing she wasn't the executive producer because I think she was kind of mad about it.

[Listener]

She also said, huge difference in this day and age.

[Luke Burbank]

Yes. And that's. And. And we have to clarify that now. Right. Because so many of these documentaries that come out are actually just a. Even like, you know, that Michael Jordan won the Last Dance and stuff there. If the person who is the subject of the documentary has the final say on it, it is then a hagiography.

[Listener]

Right, Exactly.

[Luke Burbank]

So I don't think this was.

[Listener]

Right. The Tom Brady one.

[Luke Burbank]

God have mercy. So, yeah, so this one is not that. It's actually really well done and a really interesting. I mean, first of all, I didn't realize this. She was done extremely dirty on that stock thing with the prison time. Like, that was a really, really. And guess who. Guess who decided to make an example of Martha Stewart? Andrew.

[Listener]

Hmm.

[Luke Burbank]

James Comey. A young Jim Comey.

[Listener]

Not that young, probably.

[Luke Burbank]

I mean, he was.

[Listener]

He's looked young.

[Luke Burbank]

He was younger than us now when he's, you know, all six foot seven of him is in there. Because basically what happened was they were trying to get Martha Stewart on some sort of insider trading and the fact of the matter was she didn't do insider trading, so they couldn't prove that they didn't have a case. So then they went back and got her on. When they had called her in to question her about the insider trading, she had said some things to them that they deemed to be untrue. So it wasn't even that she had done a crime. It's that they accused her of lying to them about the crime she didn't do. And that's what they were able to get. That's what they were able to get her. Like, I don't know what it was three months in jail on, or is.

[Listener]

That what it was, three months? It wasn't even a year.

[Luke Burbank]

Okay, I don't think, I don't think it was a year, but maybe it was longer than that, but it wasn't. It wasn't longer than a year. But the thing, the reason I was thinking about this as it relates to Klobuchar, and I really was thinking about this thing with Klobuchar in the salad on the airplane or whatever that was because that was a story where Amy Klobuchar was, was, was seen as being less than kind to one of her staffers. And it blew up. And then the next wave of the story was we would never say that if it was a man, because if men are rude to their underlings, they're just being, you know, decisive and assertive. And I, I, I both agree that that is the case, but I also don't necessarily like that the argument goes so. Because we're okay with men being rude to people that are their subordinates, therefore equality is women being rude to their subordinates. I, I like no one being rude to their subordinates. And the reason I was thinking about that was because of the Martha Stewart thing. It is very much the case that Martha Stewart was a rough boss. And they have footage of her just being so mean to these people that are just helping her with this. She's doing a TV shoot. This is after she's been sentenced to jail, but she hasn't reported yet. And she's trying to do this big, I think it's like a Thanksgiving Day thing at her house or Easter or whatever. And she's like, has a crew out there to film her doing this. And these women are like, I guess, working for, I don't even think that they're like TV producers. I think they might be like, domestic help in her house that she's has cutting something with. And this one woman is apparently Using the wrong size knife. And Martha Stewart is, she says to herself, like, how can you be so stupid?

[Listener]

Oh my God. I mean, it's so much, it's, dude, it's so me.

[Luke Burbank]

It's so mean. And so I, I, I, I, I emerge from this documentary viewing experience with like a lot of complicated feelings because it's like, I do think that the she shouldn't have gone to jail over the stock thing. That was because James Comey is a bad person who I think might literally have like a psychological problem with women where he thinks it's his job to bring them low or something. That's all I can take from the fact that he did a, he did this to Martha Stewart for no reason. I mean, there's people there going, 99 out of 100 prosecutors would never bring this case. Like, it makes no sense. And then he does that to Hillary. With the releasing of various things at the worst possible times, Comey's got problems. But anyway, Comey do play that, unfortunately. But, and so anyway, in watching it, I'm kind of like, she definitely was a woman who was underestimated at a lot of times in her life and was mistreated because of being a woman and also was a real bad person to some people.

[Listener]

Real and like, oh, I hate that. I hate.

[Luke Burbank]

Dude, I didn't know how to, I literally didn't know how to feel. At the end of the documentary, which I guess maybe says it was actually a nuanced piece, I was like, I don't, this is not the Martha Stewart redemption story I was maybe looking for. And it's also not the Martha Stewart is the Queen of means.

[Listener]

I appreciate that. That's good. I mean, any documentary has a voice and has some point, obviously, but the fact that it wasn't just kind of like, this is the story that we are here to tell. Martha Stewart got wronged, or Martha Stewart is terrible. Like what you just described is way better. And honestly, like, I'm not really into modern documentaries. I mean, there was a time in my life when I would have said, oh yeah, I love docs. But since our world has become sort of like inundated with various kinds of.

[Luke Burbank]

Documents, the non fictionalization of all content.

[Listener]

Which makes it more fictionalized. What was I even just choosing? The other day there was something, oh, well, I told you before. Can we bring it up three days in a row, four days in a row? You bet your sweet ass we can. Leading up to Super Wildcard weekend. I told you I was interested in that in the Latest in season. Series of Hard Knocks. Or in season, I guess. Season of Hard Knocks. That looks at the AFC North. And last night I found myself, like, kind of in between things. I think I was making a fried bologna sandwich last night. I got some. Some sort of halal baloney from the sars. Super saver. This weekend actually comes. Like, you have to cut it yourself. It comes in, like, a little, like a bologna.

[Luke Burbank]

You actually have to be there when the head of household slaughters the bologna.

[Listener]

That is true, yes. Anyway, all that is to say I bought this little. I bought this, like, bologna. You slice yourself a type of bologna that I've never bought myself. Never sliced my own bologna before, you'd be surprised to hear. And then last night, I'm like, looking at it, I'm like, do I want this? What am I going to do with this loaf of bologna? I'm like, I'm going to fry this baby up with some eggs. And so anyway, yesterday I fried up some bologna and eggs, made myself a little sandwich on white bread. It was quite good. And I sat down behind my laptop in the kitchen. I said, what am I going to watch? I got about 20 minutes or something. I get into one of these things that I always threatened to watch instead of rewatching an episode of the Sopranos. And I paused for quite some time on the Hard Knocks and I almost hit play. And I was like, no. Like, I just know it's not going to be good. Like, I know what it's going to be. It's immediately going to be so cheesy because the reality tv, which seems already like an archaic term, but the reality TV ification of our culture over the past, like, 30 years now has really destroyed anything that isn't, like, the best documentary. You know what I mean? Like, I know what it's going to be. It's going to be Michael.

[Luke Burbank]

It's going to be.

[Listener]

It's going to be classically Michael Garrett speaking to the tv and just say, no, but Miles Garrett or just. It's just going to be. I just. I knew. I'm like, you know what? This is going to piss me off within five minutes of watching it. Because everybody knows how to. How to present themselves into a camera. These.

[Luke Burbank]

We have Shriver.

[Listener]

Yes. Over.

[Luke Burbank]

You know, over Stentorian.

[Listener]

Yeah.

[Luke Burbank]

I did see something with Miles Garrett the other day that legitimately warmed my freaking heart. Okay, so it was a guy who I think maybe plays for the Ravens, named, like, Rose. He's a lineman, offensive lineman named, like, Rosenkamp or something. Rosen penis. And he was.

[Listener]

That's joke.

[Luke Burbank]

That's a Fletch joke. It is Rosen. It's Rosen something. And he was walking off the field. Actually, it might have been, it might have been kind of in between plays, but he goes up to Miles Garrett and he says something like. Because there's this thing where a lot of these guys will trade jerseys at the end of the game.

[Listener]

That's why I think at the end of the game, I'm pretty sure they were trading.

[Luke Burbank]

So you know this clip?

[Listener]

Yeah, actually, I've only heard a paraphrase. I don't know if I heard the actual audio, but go ahead.

[Luke Burbank]

It's really sweet. The guy, Rosen, whatever, says, you know, I know that I'm just kind of a nobody, but would you want to trade jerseys after the game? And Miles Garrett says, hey, man, you're playing in this league, you're contributing, you're on a winning team. You're not a nobody. I got you. It was just like this quick little moment. But it, you know, was not for public consumption.

[Listener]

It just, I believe, was miked up for that game, which is why it was. It was.

[Luke Burbank]

Well, maybe it will. Well, then maybe that's the guy. I mean, I, I, Obviously that's the only way it could have been recorded. But does that mean. Was. Is Miles Garrett, Is he playing three dimensional chess? No. Did he know because he was miked up? Was he giving a speech there because he knew that there was ears on him? So he's gonna be the best Miles Garrett he could be.

[Listener]

I mean, listen, if you have a microphone on you, you're going to present in a certain way. Like even us on the show, as transparent as we are, you and I would have conversations if the microphones were turned off. Maybe that we wouldn't otherwise. Not that we're lying or being disingenuous, but you should be conscientious of or you should be conscious of when there's a microphone on you. So to a degree, he probably knew. But I also think that Miles Garrett is legitimately a good man, and I like to think he would also. And I don't know how this pertains to a lineman's work, but it may be somebody was just exaggerating on sports radio. But I swear I heard the. The following week, which might have been a playoff game. That lineman for the. Was it the Raven? He like, really balled out in some way. Or at least somebody was claiming that he had a really.

[Luke Burbank]

I love it. He's wearing the Miles Garrett jersey under his jersey. Like you got your. You got your Superman pajamas on under your. Under your school clothes.

[Listener]

Yeah, yeah.

[Luke Burbank]

Anyway, thanks. Thanks, Sarah. Thanks to Brigid Shobs of Chicago, Illinois.

[Listener]

Hey, Bridget. Long, long time.

[Luke Burbank]

Long time. That's where. That's where Bill Curtis is from.

[Listener]

And joined us. Bridget joined us on stage at our. At our show at. Was it the. The Virgin Hotel. Remember? We did a.

[Luke Burbank]

That night was a blur. Although you were the one that was on a lot of cold medicine. Why is it a blur for me. Yeah, I know we had Serengeti there.

[Listener]

That's right. He and I were sipping some cough syrup. Sure.

[Luke Burbank]

Julie Brown is in Renton, Washington, downtown. Julie Brown, thank you very much. Never heard that before. Kathy McLean checking in from Streamwood, Illinois.

[Listener]

Hey, Kathy, Good to see you. Beautiful. Two.

[Luke Burbank]

Two Illinoisans today. On the. On the list. Thanks also to Chad Wilson in Seattle, Washington.

[Listener]

Chad, good to see you. Thank you again. Thank you as always.

[Luke Burbank]

And then Katie Marie Harnish. Now, this is the thing. I. We have thanked a Katie Harnish many times. I'm wondering if the Marie feels new.

[Listener]

Yes. We're leaning in the rebranding.

[Luke Burbank]

We. And I love it. I'm interested. I'm. I'm intrigued. I'm very. I'm curious. I'm intrigued. That's what I was looking for. Katie Marie Harnish, thank you. Thanks to all of our donors for making TBTL happen today. We could not do this without you.

[Listener]

Hello and welcome to Top Story.

[Luke Burbank]

All right. Are we gonna get into this Bob Dylan thing?

[Listener]

Boy, we have no choice. We're already over an hour into the show. Wow.

[Luke Burbank]

I know. The good news is I'm all out of takes. I used all my takes up on the airline talk. So this is just gonna be kind of a straight recitation of this story, which, of course, I can't easily click on because the New York Times website thinks that I'm not subscribing to them, even though I am.

[Listener]

Oh, God. The.

[Luke Burbank]

The pains of modern life. Let me just go to my. You know, I'm paying for the New York Times, Andrew, but now I have to go to a gray market site to paste the link from the New York Times into the gray market site so that I can then look at it, because on this computer that I'm using, I'm not logged into my New York Times account.

[Listener]

I can't. I just can't. I just can't get mad at the New York Times over this. This seems to be a problem with your computer management. Like, I log into the New York Times thousands of times a day.

[Luke Burbank]

I don't have this issue on different. On different newspapers or different computers.

[Listener]

Well, certainly my phone and then my main computer, I guess, and the computer.

[Luke Burbank]

Well, I don't have any problems on my phone. It's just somehow I'm not logged in on this thing. It's thinking about it. Anyway, here's the point. Everybody knows Complete unknown that movie is. I still have not seen that. And I've been meaning to.

[Listener]

No desire to see that movie. That to me, no desire. Oh, it's the epitome of the type of movies. Like when I sort of found myself sliding into movie snobbery and unearned film snobbery as a. As a young person. It was like, I think it was these types of biopics that kind of pushed me over the edge of never wanting to see one of these kind of like cliche retail. I mean, I'm sure it's going to fit every single beat of every, like, music biopic. I just am not into biopics.

[Luke Burbank]

I. Well, I won. I, you know, and I'm going out on a limb here. I enjoy the music of Bob Dylan. Although, did I tell you this? I recently found out that Becca does not know. And the thing that's troubling about that is I have made her listen to a lot of Bob Dylan in the car.

[Listener]

Well, it's kind of swell of her how much she likes you then, right?

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah, that's a good way to take it, I guess. You know, for me, a Bob Dylan is like, when I can't think of anything to listen to, I'll go, like, in the last couple years, there's been a lot of Nashville Skyline and Blood on the Tracks. But anyway, I had no idea any of this was going on. But there's a writer for the New York Times, Corey Kilgannon, and he wrote this article, Bob Dylan is having a Hollywood moment. His number one hater is ready. And then the sub headline is, AJ Weberman sifted through the prophetic singer's trash in search of meaning. He turned on him as a sellout and has spent decades trying to reclaim him for the counterculture. There's just like a picture of this dude, AJ Weberman, who has been just obsessed with Bob Dylan and sort of like, I presume at some point a fan of, but then very kind of turned his back on Bob Dylan for not being progressive enough in his music, for turning his back on, like, liberal ideals. He really hated Nashville Skyline because it's kind of a country record and has.

[Listener]

No, I think Nashville Skyline has zero or almost zero like any, any kind of political bend to it. Where Bob Dylan came up in the tradition of like Phil Oaks and Woody Guthrie, right? And other people who were using their music and their folk music specifically to speak truth to power.

[Luke Burbank]

The opening of this piece is phenomenal, by the way. At a recent showing of A Complete Unknown, the new Bob Dylan biopic, a cheerful group of young women settled in to watch the delicately handsome Timothee Chalamet impersonate the singer. They barely noticed the 80 year old man sitting next to them, armored in a winter coat and a hat he never removed. Then the film began. This is all made up. The man brayed at the screen. It's not what you think it is. You're scum. And so AJ Weberman's full throated annotation of the film continued for two hours and 20 minutes, replete with dark interpretations of lyrics and references to how Dylan and the film intersected with such things as communism, the Bay of Pigs invasion, the CIA and Barry Goldwater. The group of women exchanged confused glances but said nothing.

[Listener]

I can't believe they didn't move seats.

[Luke Burbank]

Can you believe? Of all the people to be stuck other than you, Andrew, to be stuck watching a complete unknown with a guy who's got a 40 to 50 year history of obsessing over. Bob Dylan is sitting next to you just yelling, you're a scum. That's not how that happened.

[Listener]

They're like, why is Bernie Sanders so mad?

[Luke Burbank]

Vacuum pennies.

[Listener]

There's something about the photo at the top of this piece that I'm just like, oh, I see. If Bernie broke the wrong way.

[Luke Burbank]

There's a certain, there's like. There's a guy of a certain age who's been living in the Tri State area. I know Vermont is not New York, but just go with me. There's a sort of, kind of. There's like a white guy of a certain age who's been on the eastern seaboard for too long. They all fuse into the same person eventually, right?

[Listener]

I thought about the intro to this story a lot, Luke, and I wouldn't have stopped here except that you did sort of highlight it or underscore it, as you like to say. I couldn't help when I read like an introduction like this, which is really, really well written and really puts you in the scene I always picture like. So what was the real scene here? Because obviously the writer is there with A.J. right? It's A.J. yes. And so, and so I'M assuming that they are like, oh, this would be a good piece for the. Because I've never written anything journalistically before. So I guess you say, you know, we're going to do a bunch of interviews with AJ but, like, it would be good to have, like, sort of a scene that we can set. So I'm going to go see this movie with him. So obviously, the walk and talk Corey would do would do it. But, but it's also, it's interesting because it's print, which I have zero. You know what I mean? It's not even like, oh, well, I'm going to. I got to make sure the shotgun mic is working or whatever. Right. And so, like, so I'm assuming that, that the reporter, Corey, is sitting next to AJ and then he's trying to clock these women's reactions probably from the backs of their heads. Right. Like, there's not somebody sitting in front of the screen looking out at AJ and these women and how they're all reacting. Anyway, I just, I also was sort of picturing, like, how did this all go down with the reporter there it was.

[Luke Burbank]

I mean, yes, that's probably you're right. Or. I don't know. I don't know if this is what you're saying, but my guess is that Corey Kilgannon, wisely, and maybe his editor, had the idea we should go activate this situation by, like, going to watch a complete unknown with A.J. weberman. You know, like, I doubt that A.J. weberman was like, like, they called him. He's like, I can't talk. I'm going to see a complete unknown. And he was like, can I tag along? He's like, sure. Like, I have a feeling that this, they, they were where they were because of the New York Times having a good sense of what would make for good ink.

[Listener]

Right? Yeah. Yeah. And it is good ink.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah, it absolutely is. And those poor women. I hope that they read this.

[Listener]

Is this part of.

[Luke Burbank]

Why didn't they.

[Listener]

Yeah, unless it was a patch the guy. Yeah, exactly. I, I, Yeah, I maybe, like, I do think that, like, having assigned seats in movie theaters now makes people feel like they can't move.

[Luke Burbank]

Like, once the movie war on assigned seats, once again, you're scum.

[Listener]

How does it all come back to this?

[Luke Burbank]

So this is the, this is how A.J. weberman's described. He began as one of Dylan's keenest observers and fans, so intent on digging into the singer's life that he sifted through trash cans outside of 94 McDougal street, where the singer once lived, but he became Dylan's nemesis, calling him a hoaxer and a sellout, attacking him with an obsession bordering on madness. Now that Dylan is getting a Hollywood moment, Weberman sees a renewed opportunity to advance the anti Dylan agenda that has sustained him for decades. He's writing a new book, interpreting Dylan's lyrics and answering a cascade of emails and calls asking him for his take on the film. Though his garbage sifting has waned, his vendetta is as strong as ever. This is quality writing, my friend. I mean, without getting too even further bogged down all the details, the basic story goes, this guy Weberman was kind of sort of like a kind of an alt music writer, you know, leftist guy who as we've already established, was a Dylan fan and then became kind of a Dylan nemesis. But what's crazy, and this is something that I did not real. And so over the years he's, you know, done all this stuff where he's, you know, written things about Dylan that Dylan didn't like or he's gone through his garbage and, and, and written about what was in his garbage and stuff. But until listener Ryan emailed me the other day and said, oh, by the way, there's tape recording of these conversations, I had no idea that. And I'm. This would obviously be AJ Weberman. I doubt Dylan was recording these things, but there's phone calls of these two guys talking to each other. It's very interesting. One, I don't think I've ever heard Bob Dylan because he's so famously like, you know, shy about doing interviews. I don't know if shy is the word, but he doesn't like to do them a lot. Reticent.

[Listener]

Look at me. Look at me. I learned from you earlier in the show. Got some big words out here, you.

[Luke Burbank]

Know, Dylan just, I just don't, other than I know what his singing voice sounds like. But. And there are probably documentaries or there's probably things out there where Dylan has, you know, talked at length about stuff. I just haven't heard them or watched them. It was a weird experience to listen to Bob Dylan in an unguarded moment just talking to this guy. And I mean, this was a really different, as it's pointed out in the article, this was a different time back. This is 1971, this first piece of tape, because like, you know, nowadays it's like if I have, if I think Ariana Grande has sold out her ideals, I'm not able to take it up with her directly, like. But this was the days Where Bob Dylan didn't have a PR person or a PR team and you knew where he lived. And you. If you were this guy, you could just go through his garbage outside his house. I mean, you probably weren't supposed to, but the direct contact is what's really weird about it.

[Listener]

Well, you know, I did not get to listen to most of this tape, and I think you might have pulled some that you'll play for me here.

[Luke Burbank]

I got some here, yeah.

[Listener]

Do we have any idea how or why this interview with. With Dylan was set up? Like, how did they end up connecting? I mean, this guy is literally going through Dylan's trash. Dylan has to change his lifestyle. I mean, it's really intrusive. Like, it's really, really intrusive. It is sick. It is wrong how he treats Dylan. It was a bit of a different time, and maybe there was a sort of a feeling of, well, we're all fighting the same fight here. We're just, like, approaching it differently. Maybe there was some bonding there, but anyway, on a more pragmatic level, any sense of why Dylan would spend so much time on the phone with this guy who's harassing him?

[Luke Burbank]

I think Dylan's thought was, if I can talk to this guy, I can talk some sense into him, it will fix this. Because this guy is, like, writing these articles and saying all this stuff about Dylan that Dylan doesn't agree with and thinks it's factually wrong. And so he. I've listened to, like, half of, like, the longest file is 41 minutes. I listen to, like, half of it, probably, and, like, the sense I get is that Bob Dylan is just kind of like. He's just sort of, like, exasperated, but thinks, well, if I just. At least maybe if I just talk to the guy, I'll be able to talk some sense. And Dylan is remarkably, like. Kind of like. It's almost like they're on the same level, if that makes any sense. Like, Dylan is not treating him like a piece of scum. He's treating him like a collaborator who he just needs to talk some sense into. Here's the first. I don't know how the level is going to be here, but this is the first little chunk of tape. And this one is where I think, basically Dylan is finding out that this guy, A.J. weberman, is writing this big piece about him based on a conversation they had that Dylan did not realize was being recorded. And now Dylan is like, basically saying, if you want an interview, I'll do an interview, if you want to sit down. But he's like. But just, I want it on. I want it above the table. He keeps saying, I want it above the table as opposed to under the table.

[Listener]

Yeah. Not a secret. Recording.

[Luke Burbank]

Yes. Take a listen to this tape.

[Andrew Walsh]

What tape?

[Narrator]

You called Naomi?

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah.

[Narrator]

Told her about some tape. What tape was that?

[Andrew Walsh]

No, I didn't say. I didn't take any tape. What I, I did was I typed out my recollections of our conversation together, and I'm going to use it as an interview. I'm going to send it out to every underground paper in America for free rather than selling it to.

[Narrator]

You didn't tell me that was in the interview.

[Andrew Walsh]

Oh, well, didn't you? Like, didn't you, hey, man, you want.

[Narrator]

To have an interview with me? Let me know. I'll give you an interview. Don't take.

[Andrew Walsh]

Okay, okay, okay, fine. I was gonna let you see it beforehand, and because I realized that, you know, it wasn't taped, and I don't want to, I don't want to misquote you and put words in your mouth.

[Narrator]

What about the tape? Do you have a tape in your jacket?

[Andrew Walsh]

No tape. I didn't have a tape in my jacket. I don't have the money for one of those concealed tape recorders. I went to the door. So I just typed up, okay, look.

[Narrator]

Man, you want to have an interview?

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah.

[Narrator]

You know, have an interview, but don't. Yeah, you know, that's sneaky, man.

[Andrew Walsh]

What kind of sneaky shit, man?

[Narrator]

I mean, you come and talk to somebody and then type it up, right?

[Andrew Walsh]

But you, you know, I'm a cat who writes about respect.

[Luke Burbank]

It's so funny to just hear people casually saying, you know, I'm a cat.

[Listener]

I want to bring it back, man. I love referring to people and myself as a cat. And it's just so timestamped like that, like cool. Cool is a word that came from that same era, sort of, Right? And we stuck with that, and there's nothing weird about it. But you, you cannot just say you just can't call somebody a cat or yourself a cat.

[Luke Burbank]

Andrew, you know, I'm a cat who flies 100,000 miles on Alaska Airlines every year, man.

[Listener]

We all want to pass as cats.

[Andrew Walsh]

Specializes in writing about you.

[Narrator]

Yeah, man, I understand that, but, you know, if you want to have an interview, we can have an interview above the table, you know, and, you know, just keep it on top of the table. That's all I'm talking about. I mean, I, I, I think that I deserve that. Right? Sure, sure.

[Andrew Walsh]

That's Fine with me. I prefer it that way. You know, that would even make it better. Although this isn't bad.

[Luke Burbank]

Although this isn't bad.

[Andrew Walsh]

What I have here is.

[Narrator]

I'd like to see it anyway. Can you bring it around?

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah, I will.

[Luke Burbank]

Like.

[Andrew Walsh]

Well, should I just bring it around now or.

[Narrator]

No, no, no, no. Pilot the weekend. How about, like, you have, like, a Monday or Tuesday?

[Andrew Walsh]

Ah, see, the trouble is that these people are expecting. These people are expecting. Expecting something from.

[Listener]

By the way, you just.

[Luke Burbank]

You hear the wheels turning in this guy's head. That he doesn't want to wait till Tuesday to come have Bob Dylan preview this article or do the sit down. So he's trying to move it up. But it's like, it doesn't. It. That's like the sound of someone who's trying to make up their story on the fly. It's just. Well, I'm just. I'm thinking here that these people are. This is the. By the way, some of the best part of the tape. We're about to hear it, which is the reason Bob Dylan can't make for the weekend is because he needs to put together bookshelves Monday.

[Narrator]

All right, I'm working, man. I'm building some shit, you know, And I really got to get it built right. Just, you know, some tables and some shelves and some stuff. And I got to get it done, man. I put it way off.

[Andrew Walsh]

Okay, I'll tell him that'll have to.

[Narrator]

Wait, like one week or a day or two. Two days. Just let me see it.

[Andrew Walsh]

Okay, let me.

[Luke Burbank]

Now, if I'm doing the math right, two days is still within the weekend. So Bob Dylan, not a master negotiator. Give me a week or one day or two days. Or bring it now and bring it now. I'm putting a shelf together.

[Listener]

And now he's saying, just bring it and let me see it. Is he sitting down to an interview. Or is he reviewing the thing that this guy's already typed up?

[Luke Burbank]

I just find it amazing that we are hearing Bob Dylan at a point in his life and career where he's still putting together his own shelves. Yeah, there's nobody putting it off. He's been putting it off, man. He's been putting it off.

[Andrew Walsh]

Let me bring it over today. I'll just leave it in your mailbox. Okay, I'll be there.

[Narrator]

I'll be at the studio today. So bring it by. Yeah, and give it to me. But I can't read it. Okay, I'll be able to do that. And then I'll call you back.

[Andrew Walsh]

Okay, Groovy.

[Narrator]

All right, Bye.

[Luke Burbank]

Bye. Okay, groovy.

[Listener]

Groovy. Now, I do want to point out, am I right, this is 1971, that these recordings are like. But you said he's putting together his own shelves. But, like, this might be stars. They're just like us. Like, he is. Like, his. Some of his most iconic albums are already out by this point. You know what I mean?

[Luke Burbank]

That's a good point.

[Listener]

Well, Nashville Skyline was already out, obviously, because we talked about that as well as, you know, everything that made him famous. And like. So anyway, like, he's. He's still pretty. He's still pretty big at this point, but maybe he just wants to build his own shelves.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah, that's a good point. Yeah. That said, by the 70s, he's very much Bob Dylan. He's not like, playing at the Cafe Wa and trying to just, you know, get a little of attention for his music or whatever. So this is the long tape. We don't have to listen to a ton of this. I just wanted to play a little more of it for you, where he kind of calls him back. And they're now discussing the article. Dylan has read the article, and there's some stuff in there that Dylan wants to clarify. Like, and why this is interesting to me is because Bob Dylan, you know, could be seen as somebody who just doesn't care at all what anyone thinks of him. Like, that's just not his. That's not his bag, man. He's not that kind of cat. But in this, one of the things is he. He wants the guy to take out something he said about Johnny Cash because he doesn't want Johnny Cash to think that Bob Dylan doesn't like Johnny Cash.

[Listener]

Oh, something from the recording. Because that's. They. They collaborate on Nashville Skyline, right? Growing something.

[Luke Burbank]

Something from. That's on. That's on, girl. That's. That's on Nashville Skyline.

[Listener]

Maybe it's not. Oh, that might be Highways. I think it is.

[Luke Burbank]

I think it is. And I think it's. It's so bad. It's so bad. Listen, I don't care who knows it. I don't care if Bob hears this, if John hears this, anybody. If A.J. weberman hears this. That collaboration is terrible to me. Like, at the end, it's like they're two cats in heat that are trying to outdo each other with how out of tune they can be with their singing.

[Listener]

He. Oh, that's right. He originally released it on the free will and Bob Dylan in the 60s and then revisited it with Johnny Cash as a duet in Nashville Skyline.

[Luke Burbank]

But so anyway, this is a little more. We don't have to play a ton of it, but this is a little more of. Now that Bob Dylan has read the article and he's trying to negotiate some clarifications and corrections with this guy.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah, yeah.

[Narrator]

And you know, you asked me about corrections and all that and I noticed that you just had a big pile of them in your hand, you know, and I was wondering, like, if you're around with me, like, like you had a big pile of him in your head, man. You obviously had a whole lot printed up. So, I mean, like.

[Andrew Walsh]

No, no, I had the concordance. I have two, I had two Xeroxes made. Cost me a dollar four cents. I had two xeroxes of this made. Okay.

[Narrator]

Like, there's a couple things into that.

[Andrew Walsh]

Article, man, that I, Yeah.

[Narrator]

That I, I kind of object to Watch.

[Andrew Walsh]

Watch.

[Narrator]

One thing there about Johnny Cash, man. I don't think that's right. And then there's another.

[Andrew Walsh]

You're saying Johnny Cash is in the past.

[Narrator]

Yeah, well, I didn't. You didn't. I didn't say it like that, man. I didn't quite understand the article. Like, if you said, if you said in the article, you said that's past, that was the quote. But like it didn't really make specific whether that pertained to whether Johnny Cash is, you know, playing for the White House was in the past or whether I was digging Johnny Cash, whether that was in the past. The whole thing was kind of vague, man. I didn't want it, you know, I didn't want it to print it, that I didn't dig Johnny Cashman, because I do.

[Luke Burbank]

Kind of interesting, right?

[Listener]

Yeah.

[Luke Burbank]

Like, this is a very human side of Bob Dillard, who's really just kind of like worried that Johnny Cash is going to think he's talking about him.

[Listener]

Yeah, no kidding. And that. Which is totally understandable.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah.

[Listener]

It's kind of literally our colleagues, unlike.

[Luke Burbank]

The Martha Stewart documentary where I emerged with a more complicated picture of her as a viewer, I, I, after listening to a fair amount of this tape, I kind of am like sort of siding with like, not just siding with Bob Dylan as it relates to this A.J. weberman thing, because that's like not even a, that's not a debate. Like you have one person who was, who's crossing every kind of journalistic line you can and really harassing someone, but just of like, I don't know, my conception of Bob Dylan, he seems like so much more of a normal guy. Listening to him talk this way. Yeah, just, you know, which of course he is. I mean that. I mean he can't go around just being like full Bob Dylan every second of every day. Like that would be exhausting. But hearing him in this mode is kind of endearing in a way. There's a little bit more.

[Andrew Walsh]

Okay, okay. I'll say, you know, so I'll put down.

[Narrator]

Okay, all right.

[Andrew Walsh]

Okay, okay.

[Narrator]

The other thing was on Dear Landlord man. Like I. I couldn't have said that song was written for Grossman.

[Andrew Walsh]

No, you told me that you said it was for Al Grossman. I remember that specifically. I says, oh, it's.

[Listener]

He.

[Andrew Walsh]

He's giving me the.

[Narrator]

Well, man, like it wasn't all the way for Al Gran. In fact, he wasn't even in my mind.

[Andrew Walsh]

I know.

[Narrator]

Only later, man. Only later when people pointed out to me that it's song might have been written for Al Grand. I said, well, maybe it could have been.

[Andrew Walsh]

That's a good story to use, you know. You're just putting me on, man. You're giving me the man. I'm not putting you on line, man.

[Narrator]

No, I don't wanted you to print that. That was in for grossing because it wasn't.

[Andrew Walsh]

Who should I say?

[Narrator]

It wasn't for anybody, man. It was an ab. It's an abstract song. It sure as hell wasn't for you.

[Andrew Walsh]

It wasn't.

[Narrator]

It sure as hell wasn't. No, I was not even aware of you at that time.

[Andrew Walsh]

Isn't Landlord Critic though in your symbolism?

[Narrator]

No, man, like I wasn't aware of you at that time.

[Luke Burbank]

Now this is relevant because in the Times article it talks about the fact that one of Those things, this A.J. weberman guy is. Is. Is convinced that the. A number of the lyrics in various Dylan songs are about him. Yes, and. And like, I mean you. To try to find a specific meaning in a Dylan lyric or to find a coherent, you know, narrative, I think is. Could drive you crazy. And also I'm sure I could find things in Dylan songs that are about me if I'm looking.

[Listener]

Right. Exactly. Well, that's. I mean that's kind of the. This New York Times article kind of had me feeling various kinds of ways because it is a very interesting snapshot of a time and place. Like you said, like the relationship between celebrity and non celebrity is interesting here. I also think it has something to do with the wild times of being kind of a. A progressive person in the 1960s, you know, I mean, if this was who's the woman who was the, like, anti gay?

[Luke Burbank]

Oh, she just died.

[Listener]

Yeah, exactly. Like, Dylan wouldn't have hopped on the phone with Anita Bryant. Right? Like there's. He feels he. These two swim somehow in the same waters back enough so that Dylan is.

[Luke Burbank]

Is gonna, is gonna give him the time of day.

[Listener]

Exactly. This guy's an old year. This guy's a young yippee at the time. And, and Dylan is Dylan. And Dylan came up through like, you know, like the. It wasn't. Dylan was not just like writing about various things in his earliest days. Right. He was a protest singer. And so therefore he must feel like he owes something to this guy. Or this guy is not. Like. Because as I'm reading this, I'm like, he just gets crazier and crazier and in a certain way you're kind of like, oh, this is an interesting guy on a crusade. They're like, no, this guy's a stalker and breaking the law probably. Maybe he's not actually breaking the law. I don't know what laws he's breaking, but it does seem like going through.

[Luke Burbank]

People'S personality, if anyone should know the laws of garbage, my friend.

[Listener]

Right, exactly. To the point where this person, Bob Dylan, who has a right to privacy, has to start changing what he's throwing away because he's being watched. That's a really awful thing. And then you read it more and more and you're like, oh, and this guy also thinks that he's being sung about and written about in all these songs. That is a kind of delusion that we've seen from the radio side of things. Think. I mean, I told you once, I didn't have a lot of this, but in the brief time I was on the radio, we had one person who was parked outside this, this radio station calling the front desk, saying that they thought I was talking directly to them through the radio. You know, that's a real delusional thing.

[Luke Burbank]

I had a friend who, who reached out to me to tell me like, that she had finally met someone, which I was really happy for her because she had, you know, been kind of sort of unlucky in love. And. And then I said, oh, that's amazing. Like, who are they?

[Listener]

Or whatever.

[Luke Burbank]

And then she forwarded me a photo of an Ariana Grande album. Maybe this is part of why that name popped into my head and said. And I was like, oh, lol. Okay, who is it really? And they're like, no, no, it's Ariana Grande. The lyrics of these songs are about me. And then that was when I knew this person was descending into a mental health crisis. Like, it's a fairly common thing for people that are suffering through certain types of mental health issues to start to think that lyrics of songs are about them. You know, kind of. I think maybe we would call it grandiose thoughts or something. Eventually this person was, was, was, was explaining to me that Taylor Swift and Ariana Grande were fighting over her in their lyrics. And I was like, oh, man, it's really. And I'm sure our listeners have, have been through this with people before. It's a really, really hard thing to try to talk to somebody about objective reality when they're not living in it. It's like it's you. You go into it thinking you can prove it. Like she was thinking that Jay Z had stolen a bunch of her lyrics. And I was like, that she had written on a website somewhere and I. Or like poems she had written. And I said, well, the thing is, those songs by Jay Z were written before you put this website up. She's like, yeah, but they were saved on my computer. So we could have broken into my computer.

[Listener]

It's like, oh, man, this is a point there.

[Luke Burbank]

I mean, actually, that one was like, Well, I can't 100 say that's not possible. But I'm not sure all that is to say no. But when I was reading this stuff about the AJ Weberman, I was like, yeah, I wonder where the line for him, because he doesn't sound like. What happened with that friend of mine, unfortunately was they moved out of their place, sold all their stuff, showed up at an Ariana Grande show with their bags literally packed, thinking this was happening, they were going to get on the bus and leave. It sounds like this Weberman guy is a nut job. But he stopped short of that. Like, you know what I mean? Like, him saying, these lyrics are about me. It sounds nutty. But on the other hand, like, one of his things is, I was walking on Elizabeth street and I ran into Bob Dylan. And then Bob Dylan wrote a line about like, I walked past you on Elizabeth street and I almost punched you out. Now if I'm AJ Weberman, I could kind of see a world in which I just had a run in with Bob Dylan on Elizabeth Street. I hear a song where he says, I almost punched someone out on Elizabeth Street. I'm putting, I'm connecting those dots. It's a little less out there than my friend thinking Ariana Grande was writing about her.

[Listener]

I think that I've told You the story before. In fact, I'll bet you it was maybe somewhat inspired by you recounting that story about your friend. But I guess if you do remember the story, I have a slight update which saddens me. There's somebody who was a regular at the Pop up kitchen that I work at where we give out meals. And that's just a thing that I do for one hour outside on Sundays. And all kinds of people come through. We have a lot of regulars, but people who are various. Everybody needs food, right? And we're not getting a lot of millionaires coming through there. But you have some people who are clearly living, literally sleeping on the sidewalk. And you have other people who have various kinds of housing or whatever. They're in various stages of their life. And there is one fella who was an older guy, I'm going to put him probably in his 60s, older than me, I guess I should say. Kind of not, you know, kind of well dressed, looked like he probably has a roof over his head. Always wore one of those little golf cast caps that you and I always have trouble describing. But like always kind of a shorter man, almost like a little bit dapper in his own way. Never really said too much would come through, always, always took coffee and then we, we wouldn't really chat. He was a little bit, he didn't talk too much. But anyway, he was a friendly guy, friendly enough. We just didn't talk that much. And he'd go through the line and seemed like a very, very, I mean, I hate to use this word, but just kind of normal guy, right? And then I saw him on the bus. I don't know if you remember this story. Me and Genevieve were on the 40 and we saw him on the bus and he was walking by me. He got on the bus, I was already on the bus and I kind of nodded towards him and he kind of looked a little bit surprised that I nodded towards him. He took a seat somewhere else on the bus and then in a few minutes came up and sat in the seat directly behind me and Genevieve and said, hey, did you say hello to me? Or something along those lines. I don't remember how he broached the conversation. And I said, oh yeah, I see you a pop up. And he's like, are you following me? Are you one of the people who's following me? And I'm like, no, I'm not following you. And then he gets in this who about the government and somehow neo Nazis are involved and he's got there, they've Been after him. And that's why he has to move around a lot, you know, and just immediately into this whole narrative, but still looking at me and, like, asking me a couple of times, I believe, like, and you're not one of them. I'm like, no, man, I'm just on the bus. I just, like, you know, I like giving you coffee. Like, I'll see you on Sunday or whatever. He's like, do you want to see the documentation? Do you want to see the documentation? I can bring it all on Sunday. Will you be there Sunday? I can bring it all. I'm just like, you know, whatever. Sure. You know, I didn't really say much about it. The sad part is never saw him again. Never saw him again. He was a regular who came for coffee, I think. Food, little bit of companionship. Every Sunday for probably more than a year, if not a couple of years. I had no idea. The. Every single time I talked to him, he believed that people were out to get him, and this was one of the safe spaces for him. And then him just seeing me on the bus and me acknowledging him meant that I assume. I do not think it's a coincidence that he never showed up again after that. Like, he.

[Luke Burbank]

That's filed now under a place that is unsafe for him.

[Listener]

Yeah.

[Luke Burbank]

Where the people that are following him.

[Listener]

Because he thinks I'm following because I ran into him on a bus. You know, like, we both live in North Seattle, obviously. So.

[Luke Burbank]

Anyway, you shouldn't take the bus.

[Listener]

This is why you should never be friendly to people. You should.

[Luke Burbank]

This is why we should all be driving cybertrucks.

[Listener]

You should always be a Heidi from Alaska and never be overly.

[Luke Burbank]

Yes, thank you. Manage your emotions. Keep all of your emotions locked away. No, for real, though, Andrew, that is a bummer. And, of course, it goes without saying, there's nothing you should have done differently in that scenario. I mean, you're just being. You're living your life, and you're just being a nice person. Hopefully the guy's okay, wherever he is.

[Listener]

You know, I mean, I shouldn't have been wearing those Oakley sunglasses that also record everything.

[Luke Burbank]

Well, I mean, that's. Although I did see some of those that I did, kind of. So, you know, this is hummingbird central now, because we got this hummingbird feeder, and they're loving it. Jerry. So I've been thinking about hummingbirds a lot. And I've also been thinking, weirdly, this is going to be a name you have no context for. Spencer Pratt. So Spencer Pratt was one of the characters on the MTV reality show the Hills, which was a huge, huge things for people a generation or two behind us. Like, I was too old for the Hills, but there were a lot of people that were really into it. And Spencer Pratt married one of the other cast members from the show, Heidi Montag, and they got kids, and he was kind of the. The way that they framed him on the show was he was like, sort of like the. He was the heel. He was the bad guy. Like, everybody. People didn't like him. And. And I think that was amplified for the. The purposes of the show, obviously. So he's always. He's kind of like a. To a certain generation, if you say Sprints or Pratt, they're like, we hate him. Like, he was just a jerk. So meanwhile, he's been married to this woman for now a good number of years. They have kids, they have a family, whatever. Their house burned down in the Palisades thing. And. And. And he, bizarrely enough, has been narrating throughout the entire thing and has emerged as this, like, really interesting kind of, like, I don't know, person, slash, sort of con. I keep using the word conduit for some reason today, sort of a lens through which you can see what this looks like for people that, like. I don't get the sense that they lived in an overly grand home. In fact, one of the things that he was saying was after his house burned down was. And, I mean, they lost everything. He said that all. Every. Every penny they had was in this house that they had bought. And he said. And then everybody was writing, well, you're just a rich Hollywood celebrity, so who cares? And he goes, it's so funny how for the last 15 years, everyone's been saying, I'm broke, I have no money, I'm a loser.

[Listener]

Yeah.

[Luke Burbank]

And now my house burns down, and suddenly I'm a rich Hollywood. He goes, I'll take it because I love being a rich Hollywood celebrity. In your mind, you know, like, he has a really kind of interesting. A surprise. He has a kind of. A refreshing kind of, I don't know, authenticity or something. Would he be like, in my top five friends? Probably not, but. But I also. I keep seeing him on the Internet. This is the. This is one of the weirdest things about this whole fire story. And this does come back to Hummingbirds adventure, actually. So I guess that, like, I don't know, some number of years ago, five, 10 years ago, they had decided, actually, it might have been when the Hills was still on tv, his wife, Heidi Montag, was looking to become a singer. And she had recorded an album, and they had apparently spent all of the money they had as a couple on producing this album. Like, this was going to be her breakout album, and it was going to set them up, and it was going to really be the next phase of her career. And this is, you know, this was the whole thing. And of course, the album just, like, flopped. Nobody listened to it. It's now the number one album in America. There has been this crazy, like, Internet movement with all kinds of, like, not famous and famous people streaming, it being like, we're making Heidi Montag's album the number one album in America. And it. It worked. It's like that. I mean, maybe as of you and I having this conversation, it may have slipped, but it was the number one record on iTunes for, like, a number of days across all genres.

[Listener]

And it was specifically to, like, people were doing it consciously to get it to spike or it just caught wind the way that B side Pavement song did. And now it's their most popular song on all of the streaming services.

[Luke Burbank]

I think what happened was it started as a project to try to help this family out in a way by elevating her music. And then a funny thing happened. People started really liking the song. Yeah, people dig the song. It's like a real kind of dancey. It's like, you know, I mean, Paris Hilton actually put out a really good song called Stars are Blind that actually kind of slaps. And this is sort of in that genre in that whatever. So it's a. It's an easy song to listen to, but it is burning up the charts. And anyway, it's just a. Just like, I don't. I don't know what the financials of this are. In other words, I don't know if having your song shoot to the number one on iTunes for a couple of weeks, if that equals $1,000,000 or if that equals $1,000. I don't understand the economics. I don't know if this has actually changed their financial situation at all, because, I mean, the sense you got, and I really believe this was that this has absolutely ended them. You know, like, this is pretty much the only. The only asset they had in the world was their house, and it's gone now. And, you know, even if they can build it back, it's. They're not going to get. You know, they're not going to. The state of California's going to give them enough money to rebuild the house, etc. Etc. But the fact that, like, in the burning of their house. This, her record has now finally been found by the public and beloved by the public. Like, what a weird world that we live in. But anyway, Spencer Pratt has those. Had some at some point. He had some of those, like, whatever, meta glasses that were the Ray Bans.

[Listener]

Yeah, Ray Bans. I knew what I say when I said Oakley's, I knew it was wrong. Thank you, Ray Bans.

[Luke Burbank]

And he. There are these little. You can buy these little hummingbird feeders that sit over the glasses, but you can also film it. So if you sit very still, a hummingbird will come and drink nectar out of your sunglasses effectively, or your glasses. But you can. If you have those Ray Bans, you can film the whole thing. And I will tell you, I didn't, but I considered buying them for that. That specific purpose. I thought, what does Zen thing. If I can get myself, Andrew, to the point where I can sit quietly enough for a hummingbird to drink out of my eye socket, have I achieved total consciousness?

[Listener]

You have to do it on a mountaintop. I don't think I would like that. I've had some because Genevieve has a million hummingbird feeders. Well, like three. Somewhere between two and a million.

[Luke Burbank]

It's a week or four hours. It's Bob Dylan math.

[Listener]

Get it together. And so there's one that I think Genevieve might have moved it because it was spilling too much sugar water on our deck. But there was one that was right outside our front door for a while and kind of like if I would, like, go out the front door and then take a quick left to where my grill area was, like on a summer evening, you know, I was like kind of passing back and forth a million times. And I don't know if some of these hummingbirds were. I think they were being territorial. And I. Listen, I know, like. Like being scared of a hummingbird is not the most masculine thing in the world by some beaks. But like, when one of those guys is like, right, like, it would, like, hover like something out of a movie. Almost like. Almost like a. Like a flying drone out of a sci fi movie. It would, like, hover right in front of my face, like between me and the. And the. And the feeder. And I don't know that I loved it, to be honest.

[Luke Burbank]

I'm safely behind the glass here, but I will tell you. Yeah, maybe I would have to confront that if I did this. The Spencer Pratt eyeball thing. Here's what people need to realize about animals that seem. Because we've coded them as not dangerous that. That we don't need to be afraid of them. It's just imagine if they were a different animal. And by that I mean when people have, like, a small dog that's very out of control, it's trying to bite you, but it's small, and they're like, whatever, he's just a little, Little guy. It's like, yeah, what if that was a rat trying to bite you? Like, what if that hummingbird was a wasp? Yeah, like, what if that hummingbird was a freaking wasp that was out to sting you? You would be freaked. Yeah.

[Listener]

I mean, they're fascinating because they do. Like, you can feel the energy. Like, you can literally kind of feel the energy as they're just flapping those wings so unbelievably fast. Right. Like, there's a vibration in the air, and you can hear it and feel it when they're so close to your face.

[Luke Burbank]

What I don't understand, as I watch these hummingbirds, who, by the way, have drained, I'd say 60 of this nectar is gone now. They are really going hard on it is why do they ever stop drinking it? Like, I guess that's just. They have some sort of satiation mechanism that tells them when it's enough. But it's like, to me, it's like you're a hummingbird. It's wintertime, it's cold. It is. It's hard out there for a hummingbird. And now you just found, like, it's like you're. It's like you're in the. In the woods and you just found a steamer full of 1000 Dick's cheeseburgers, and you're just like, is anybody else seeing this? And then you eat one, and it's really good. Like, why would you ever stop? I mean, I guess because you got full, but I guess I just. I feel like this is, like, keeping these hummingbirds literally alive. And I would expect them to just drink themselves until they're like four times their normal size and they're just lying on the pavement. But I guess that's what. That's what satiation is for.

[Listener]

You can tell you and I have issues with drinking. Why would you ever stop? Just keep drinking until you're laying on.

[Luke Burbank]

The floor, see them having waxes over.

[Listener]

Their eyes, extended belly. You know, the cool thing is, and this is something that I think I've said on the show before and I truly never thought about until Genevieve got more and more into birds. And I will mention that, like, as long as I've known Genevieve, it was Sort of an. It was sort of an inside joke between the two of us. She's always been interested in birds to some degree. I remember we would be driving somewhere in New Hampshire in, like, 93, from Concord to Boston, and she would just blurt out, interesting bird, and point to the sky, like, somewhere. And we'd always joke around about interesting bird. And then she got more and more interesting. You know, she got more and more into it as we got older in the past, like, 10 years or so. And I remember sitting outside of our Wallingford apartment, and I don't know how well you remember that one, Luke. It didn't have a lot going for it as far as an apartment is concerned, but it had a really nice, very lush backyard. Small, but very lush backyard. And that's where Genevieve would sit out on the porch. And I was still a smoker at the time. And so, like, I would sit out there and smoke cigarettes, and Veeves would say, oh, yeah, see that bird? That bird there? They're going to be coming around, and they're going to be mad at those other birds because that's their territory and that's their tree, and they have a nest in there, and they're going to be hatching pretty soon or whatever. I don't remember what details Genevieve went into. I don't mean to make her sound like a savant, but she would just sit out there long enough to identify that these are the same birds. And it was such a revelation to me. That sounds so stupid, but, like.

[Luke Burbank]

No, I know what you mean.

[Listener]

Oh, it's the same birds. Literally. Like, I just always looked in the sky and was like, yeah, birds, they all look alike. I don't know. They come and go.

[Luke Burbank]

They're rolling stones.

[Listener]

I always assumed they were passing through. Exactly. But, no, they're the same birds. And so all of that is kind of what you realized the other day when your heart was a little bit broken because you had moved your hummingbird feeder a little bit, and then you saw the birds going to where it was. It's because they learned and they know. And so all of that is for me to say that I think that you should take some. It should be gratifying to you in a certain way, that the birds drink what they need and they leave, because now they know they can rely on you. You gotta keep that thing full. And they're gonna keep coming back, especially in the winter, but also in the other seasons. And I think that Genevieve actually does feel quite a bit of responsibility about that, especially in the wintertime. Like, these birds. Train these birds.

[Luke Burbank]

I'm a dependable man when it comes to his pets.

[Listener]

Yeah, right. This hummingbird is gonna be living with Becca by the end of the week. But, no, I mean, I do think. I don't know if that inspires you at all, but, I mean, I think it's really, really sweet to think about in that way. And it's just scientifically true. And also, it does mean that you should be thinking about, like, hey, if I'm going on a trip, I gotta make sure that these things are filled up. Because these birds, especially in this time of year, literally, they're relying on it. And you're kind of. You're building a relationship with them. Them.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah. You know what? I hadn't thought of it that way. And I like that. Like, because I think I'm like you, because I don't know anything about birds. I just assume that they're in constant migration, that they're literally. Which of course, makes no sense. Think about. They build nests, they have eggs in the nest, they come back, they feed the babies. Like, of course they have a neighborhood. It's like the Todd Glass joke. Why would birds ever live in a shitty neighborhood?

[Listener]

It is a good show.

[Luke Burbank]

It's a pretty solid spoof, but, yeah, it's like they haven't.

[Listener]

They have a neighborhood dialogue. I haven't listened to his podcast in so long. I hope he's still doing it.

[Luke Burbank]

He's doing some great. I see him on Tick Tock.

[Listener]

There's nobody like him. You cannot compare anybody.

[Luke Burbank]

Absolutely. Yeah. All right. I think that's probably enough for one day. I gotta go out and refill this bird feeder.

[Listener]

Yeah, you do. Yes, you do.

[Luke Burbank]

All right.

[Listener]

The music.

[Luke Burbank]

Well, thanks for listening, everybody. We are gonna be back here tomorrow with more imaginary radio for you, so please do join us for that if you can. In the meantime, have a great Wednesday. Take care of yourselves, and please remember, no mountain too tall.

[Listener]

And good luck to all. Power out.