#4778 This Isn't Just My Usual Apathy Towards Your Commentary

Summary

TBTL Episode #4778 Summary:

“This Isn't Just My Usual Apathy Towards Your Commentary”

July 24, 2026
Hosts: Luke Burbank & Andrew Walsh
Recording Locales: Luke in Las Vegas (off the Strip), Andrew at home with pets in Seattle

---

Episode Overview

Luke and Andrew reconvene after their recent Ohio trip, catching up from two very different climates: the scorching Las Vegas Strip, where Luke is on assignment, and Andrew’s Seattle basement, surrounded by his pets. They chat about the evolving harmony between Andrew’s puppy and cat, Luke’s battle with air conditioning as a newly “frail waif,” and launch a deep and funny exploration of Las Vegas’ mob history. A major highlight is Luke's behind-the-scenes tales from the Mob Museum, including an interview with a real-life mafia informant. The episode rounds out with classic TBTL energy: nostalgia about public radio, a Ben Gibbard story, and the always-warm Blursday (birthday) messages.

---

Key Discussion Points

1. Pet Harmony & Daily Rituals

[03:24 – 05:41]

• Andrew describes the calming routine of podcasting in his home office with his dog Lucy and cat Bingo following him around like a “pet train.”
• Bringing a new puppy into the house led to “animal harmony” after some initial chaos, and the pets have begun spending time close together, much to Andrew’s delight.

  “Everywhere I go, Lucy is behind me with the slight jingle of her dog tags...then if I turn around, Bingo is following her around. It’s life-affirming.” – Andrew (05:09)

---

2. Vegas Heat & Luke’s Temperature Battles

[01:49 – 14:49]

• Luke is staying in Las Vegas, battling between “310°” desert heat and freezing casino interiors due to aggressive air conditioning.
• Admits to feeling cold more often after a 20–25 lb weight loss; the thinner “frail waif” phenomenon means layering with jackets indoors and struggling with thermostats.
• Compares European attitudes to AC, noting how US over-conditioning is both a luxury and ecological problem.

  “I need to move to Europe where they apparently have no air conditioning.” – Luke (15:32)

---

3. Mob Museum Deep Dive

[15:38 – 37:10]

• Luke’s been working on a TV story at Las Vegas’ Mob Museum and provides a crash course in American organized crime’s links to Vegas:
  • History lesson: Mafia exploits legalized gambling post-Great Depression, introduces the culture of “comps” (free meals, cheap rooms), and loots casinos through creative “skimming.”
  • Emphasizes how modern Vegas has moved away from “the $5 steak” fantasy—the glitzy perks are long gone.
• Interview with Frank Calabrese Jr. (mob informant):
  • His dad, a violent Chicago mobster, forced him into the life.
  • In prison, Frank Jr. wore a wire at great personal risk, recording his father to keep him incarcerated in hopes of escaping “the life.”
  • Emotional paradox: connecting with his father for the first time while secretly betraying him.

  “The irony...is, like, their relationship finally connecting in this way as these conversations are what will mean his father never gets out of jail. I mean, does that not sound like a movie?” – Luke (29:23)

  • The mafia’s “death kneel” was not law enforcement, but corporate America; regulatory changes allowed big corporations to run Vegas, outmuscling even the mob.

---

4. Public Radio & Nostalgia

[20:41 – 24:19]

• Andrew reminisces about the comfort of listening to Fresh Air (and other NPR classics) the “old-fashioned way” on live radio, especially post-shower after a long day.

  “Why did I ever leave this type of programming behind? It is so great—and it’s ideal when you just jump into the middle of it.” – Andrew (23:05)

• Discussion of Tanya Mosley stepping in as co-host on Fresh Air, how Dave Davies recently retired, and how these NPR figures have become “public radio giants.”

---

5. Mob Movies and Real-Life Parallels

[32:33 – 36:47]

• Debate over connections between My Blue Heaven and Goodfellas. Both are based on Henry Hill and written from parallel perspectives (Nora Ephron and her then-husband Nicholas Pileggi). One is played for laughs, the other for drama.

  “There could be a movie—a rom-com—where a couple is writing mob movies from opposite perspectives.” – Luke (34:41)

---

6. Urbanism & Neighborhood Change

[41:13 – 47:22]

• Andrew ruminates about gentrification, including the pros, cons, and search for balance in urban neighborhoods (using his own in North Seattle and West Side Market in Ohio City as examples).
• Luke adds Aurora Avenue (his old Seattle neighborhood) has been “ungentrifiable” for decades—a place perpetually on the edge.

---

7. Seattle Music Lore: Ben Gibbard & Pete Townshend

[47:22 – 49:02]

• [48:16] Andrew plays a viral story: Ben Gibbard tells of Pete Townshend (The Who) earnestly* misremembering* Keith Moon serving dinner to homeless kids in Seattle—one of whom he swears was Kurt Cobain (who would’ve been about 10 at that time).

  “In no world are we going to correct this guy...we’re just going to talk about this when we leave.” – Ben Gibbard (reported by Andrew at 48:47)

---

8. Blursday/Fleursday (Listener Birthday) Messages

[50:19 – end]

• The show’s signature “Blursday” segment (“Fleursday” since it’s a day late), celebrating tens of listener birthdays and special wishes.
• Joyful and warm community vibes, in classic TBTL style, with humorous asides and recurring bits (e.g., pronunciation fumbles, pet names as sign-offs).

  “People increasingly using the Blursdays as a Palm Pilot, as a way of scheduling appointments and other tens.” – Luke (57:13)

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Andrew’s Freestyle “Peanut Bar Apology Rap”
  “Well, I’m a peanut bar and I’m here to say—your checks will arrive on another day…” (00:00)
• Luke summarizes Mob Museum lessons:
  “All of the stuff we think about as being Vegas-y—getting a free room or your meal comped...that was all just, you know, some guy named Joey the Chin…” (16:30)
• On being an informant:
  “I was either going to get killed...if I stayed in the crime life, or if I tried to leave, I'd get killed by him...this was better than the alternative.” – Frank Calabrese Jr. (31:17, paraphrased by Luke)

---

Key Timestamps

• Pet Harmony & Post-Ohio Reflections: [03:24–07:01]
• Luke’s Vegas Heat vs. AC Rant: [09:22–15:38]
• Mob Museum & Frank Calabrese Jr.’s Story: [15:38–37:10]
• Public Radio Nostalgia/Fresh Air Discussion: [20:41–24:19]
• Mob Movies & Ephron/Pileggi Connection: [33:04–36:47]
• Gentrification & Neighborhood Change: [41:13–47:22]
• Ben Gibbard/Pete Townshend Anecdote: [47:22–49:02]
• Blursday Messages: [50:19–end]

---

Tone & Style

The conversation flows with TBTL’s signature playful warmth and self-deprecation. Banter oscillates between deep dives (mob historiography, weight-loss thermodynamics, urban planning) and affectionate running gags about technology, pets, and aging. Authentic, quick-witted, and never too cool for a callback or a heartfelt Blursday note.

---

For Listeners in a Hurry

This episode is a showcase of why TBTL has endured: it’s about the gentle joys of daily ritual, the shared weirdness of growing older, and the unlikely intersections of American culture—served with genuine friendship and laughter. If you’re interested in mob tales, air conditioning complaints, or just want to feel part of the TBTL community, this one’s a must-listen.

Transcript

[Andrew Walsh]

Quick announcement for two of Greendale's finest. Payday is postponed until next week. So this is my freestyle rap apology. Well, I'm a peanut bar and I'm here to say your checks will arrive on another day? Another day, another dime, another rhyme, another dollar? Another stuffed shirt with another white collar? Criminals, Wall street taking the pie and all the black man gets is a play to white lies? Prisons, recruiting them, police bees shooting them? Rap artists looting them? Labels all diluting them? Barack Obama is scared of me? Cause I, I don't swallow knowledge and I spit it for free? Let me clear my throat. Ha ha ha. I don't know what that was. I don't, I don't know what that was.

[Andy Bowers]

T, T B, T L

[Luke Burbank]

Guess what day it is.

[Andy Bowers]

Guess what day it is.

[Luke Burbank]

It's Friday, Friday, Gonna get down on Friday.

[Andy Bowers]

Everybody's looking forward to the weekend. Alright, you ready? Yeah.

[Andrew Walsh]

Okay.

[Andy Bowers]

Beagle, beagle boggle, boggle boogle boogle. Okay, we ready to do it fast? Yes.

[Andrew Walsh]

Okay. Beagle boggle, boogle, beagle boggle.

[Luke Burbank]

What kind of disco dancing nonsense is going on here? Scritching is simply light. Scratching or grooming is a form of affection.

[Andy Bowers]

If there's a better use for the Internet, I haven't found it.

[Luke Burbank]

Well, all right. Hello, good morning and welcome everyone to a Friday edition of tbtl, the show that just might be too beautiful to live.

[Guest or Additional Speaker]

Isn't that for techno geeks with spreadsheet.

[Luke Burbank]

My name's Luke Burbank. I am your host. Meet the next generation of podcast stars coming to you from the Las Vegas Strip. Vegas, baby.

[Andrew Walsh]

Vegas.

[Luke Burbank]

Technically off the Las Vegas strip. But looking out at it, where we are going to hit, I believe, 110 degrees, maybe even more here in Las Vegas, Nevada today.

[Andy Bowers]

Never kick a cow turd on a hot day.

[Luke Burbank]

I mean, it is just. It was 90 degrees at 6am today when I was getting ready to go out to the first part of my TV shoot, which is what I'm here to do. I've been at the Mob Museum the last couple of days. I'll have a little update on that. Oh, we're at episode 4778 in a collector series. Let the fun begin. Speaking of updates, sounds like, at least according to some preliminary anecdotal research, that young people, very young people are no longer saying Google it. We don't say Google it anymore. Are you sure that's what they said on Ask Jeeves? We're saying something else now. We want to be cool and young and if there's one thing TBTL is known for. It's being cool and young. And sometimes would a not cool, not young show show the flexibility to do a Thursday blursdays on a Friday and present them as Fleursdays? Because that's exactly what we're doing on this Friday, doing some Fleursday messages for all of you. And we're saying hello to this guy. He is the longest running cobra of the show, maybe best known for his depictions of the tall ships. He is Andrew Walsh, and he's joining me right now. Good morning, my friend.

[Andy Bowers]

Your friend Andrew Walsh is living the dream right now. This is what, this is what we've been waiting for as I say hello to you on the podcast. Straight ahead of me in the basement on a little blanket on the floor, is my dog Lucy, going to town on a rawhide bone. Just, she's doing her work over there. I'm doing my work over here. It's a calming presence to have her here down stairs with me. Luke, it's all happening. This is when we got a puppy. This, I said someday this will happen. And here it is.

[Luke Burbank]

I like the idea of you and Lucy clocking in each morning and on your, like, you know, with your lunch pails.

[Andy Bowers]

Yep, yep.

[Luke Burbank]

And you're clocking in to do the podcast. She's clocking to chew on a bone. If we could get Bingo in there opening a can of sardines, it really,

[Andy Bowers]

it really is cute. Like, so there's more and more bonding going on between the two animals. They're still not like, kind of like snuggling up. It's also very, very hot here. But, you know, when we brought the new puppy into the house, there was a lot of, like, energy. And so she, the dog would chase Bingo. And I could tell Bingo sort of liked it, but it also got out of control at times. And she was a, she was such a young puppy. She didn't know how to control herself. And now they just, like, they hang out more. Like they were both hanging out on the bed the other day when Genevieve and I, neither one of us were in the bed. They were just sitting on the bed next to each. Like, that doesn't sound like a big deal, but it is a big deal to me. And I want us all to be a cohesive family. And now there's this thing where Lucy will follow me around everywhere. I think she knows I'm talking about her. She's bringing her bone into, into the office with me here, but she will follow me around everywhere just like glue. Like Vel. Well, I would say like Velcro, but I'm gonna say like hook and loop technology. She just follows me around. But then if Bingo is in the

[Luke Burbank]

mood, that relates to our top story today, by the way.

[Andy Bowers]

It does. And then when Bingo's in the mood to be around her, which is quite a bit, he follows her everywhere. So I have a little pet train going. Like, I'm puttering around, I'm going upstairs, I'm going downstairs, and everywhere I go, Lucy is behind me with the slight jingle of her dog tags. Right. And then if I turn around, I see that Bingo is following her around. It is. It's life affirming.

[Luke Burbank]

That's great. I'm so glad that you. You came back from our big trip to Ohio to find a home that was in animal harmony.

[Andy Bowers]

Exactly.

[Luke Burbank]

Not a home that was in disharmony or even worse. And this is what I honestly thought was happening. I did have a cowshe bet on this. A home that had been in harmony when you were gone and was thrown into disharmony when you returned.

[Andy Bowers]

Yeah, no, things are, I mean, things have, like, continued along the progress that we had already established as a full family. And I do think that maybe me being out of the house might have opened up more opportunities for the pets maybe to pay more attention to each other because there's a, you know, there's one fewer living being in the house. But I didn't want it to be like, oh my God, Andrew, when you're out of the house, everything is absolutely perfect. And it doesn't look like there is. There is still a little bit of. There were still flies. There were still ointment. Uh huh.

[Luke Burbank]

There were flies in the ointment? Is that what you were saying?

[Andy Bowers]

Maybe. Are we losing each other pretty badly? I'm noticing a huge delay in your responses.

[Luke Burbank]

I am hearing you just great because you are at your home studio where you have good Internet. I am at the Cosmopolitan Hotel, which the name Cosmopolitan would indicate that they have good Internet connection, but in fact they do not. So everything sounds great from where I am. I'm sure everything sounds terrible where you are. I apologize.

[Andy Bowers]

Well, it just is giving me the. I can't tell if what I'm saying is just deeply uninteresting and you don't know how to respond or if it's just some sort of delay issue or a combination of both.

[Luke Burbank]

Usually it's that I don't know what the appropriate response is. But not today. Today what you're hearing is not my Apathy towards your commentary. It is, it's just taking a while to come down the line and make its way to Las Vegas, Nevada. I don't know if it's the heat because it is insanely hot here. But then there's another side to that coin, which is it's insanely cold indoors everywhere. So I am sitting in the hotel room right now, but I have the sliding glass door open because it was so cold in the hotel room when I got back and I turned the AC off, but it's still freezing. So I'm letting in 310° Las Vegas air into the room so that I can actually tolerate being in here. So I hope it's not too loud. I hope you're not. Also, along with my delay, hearing sirens in the background and the various sonic, I don't know, annoyances of the Las

[Andy Bowers]

Vegas Strip, I don't hear any of the annoyances of the Las Vegas Strip. But now I am in the position that the listeners were in last week when I was like, we're not turning on any air conditioners in this classroom in Valley City, Ohio. And everybody forced us to do it. You think that if you turn on that air right now, I mean, listen, you know how picky I am about this. Why don't you just turn on the air and I'll tell you how bad it is.

[Luke Burbank]

No, it's, it's the opposite. It's too cold indoors. This is, this is the thing, this is why the Colorado river is dropping by. I don't mean to make a joke, but this is why, you know, Las Vegas is a town that, let's be honest, really has no business being here. Because all of these ginormous buildings, all these casinos, and even the Mob Museum where I was early this morning and where I'll be heading back to, they're all air conditioned to within a. I don't know, what is it, a Fahrenheit of their life. Like everything is so cold inside. So I can't. There's no appropriate dress for me because if I'm outside it's just, it's broiling. But as soon as I. So I'm wearing a short sleeve, kind of like a knit shirt. But then as soon as I go inside, it's frozen, freezing cold. Including in this hotel room, even though when I left I did not have the AC blasting. But I think just the ambient indoor temperature of the entire hotel is so cold that the only way I can get the room to a pleasant temperature is to actually open the sliding glass door and allow the heat into the room. That's what I'm doing.

[Andy Bowers]

Well, I mean, I don't want to attack you or your credibility here, but I'm starting to think that this is something you struggle with. It sounds like a personal bet because we were in Valley City again, as we were talking about all this week. We were there last week, and that seemed to be a recurring thing, like when you got. It was in the middle of a heat wave. And apparently when you got to our Airbnb before John and I, you literally turned on the heat and it had these old, like, kind of. It wasn't like. It wasn't. What do you call the. It wasn't like banister heat. It was like those old school radiators that are like in, like up to your chest or whatever. And it was radiating heat hours after we had turned it off. And I know it's like you wanted to be in the backseat of the car. Cause you thought the car was always too cold. I noticed when we were coming home, I don't know if it was you or just the program, but somebody kept turning the air conditioner. Like, basically that was me by turning it up to like 85 degrees. I would wake up sweating my ass off and I'd go outside and I'd look at it and somebody had set the thermostat to not even five. Oh, okay.

[Luke Burbank]

I thought you meant in the car. In the car coming home from one of our nights of doing something in Valley City. I was in the front and there was. The AC would be on and then it would be freezing. So then I would try to turn it off for a little while to warm, to have it just not be sub zero. But what I learned later was you were in the back seat trying to figure out what the hell was going on because the air kept turning off and you were sweltering. Andrew. I think what it comes down to is I'm just a frail little waif with bird bones.

[Andy Bowers]

Are you. You know, it's funny. You used to start this show years and years ago by giving your weight at the beginning of every show. We don't do that anymore. And I know that some conversations about weight can be fraugh, but in this context, no fraughtness intended. Maybe that's a show title. I don't know. It's so close, but not quite. Are you at a lower body fat than you usually are? Are you thinner now than you have been in the past year or two?

[Luke Burbank]

I. Here's what it is. I think I've been. I did drop a few LBs off of this LB and that was. But that was a while ago. I think this might be the first summer that I've gone through since I dropped about maybe 20, 25 pounds. And. What the. So I don't think I noticed it in the winter because, you know, you're bundled up or whatever.

[Andy Bowers]

What I'm noticing, don't worry about that. That's just a turkey gobbling.

[Luke Burbank]

What I've noticed in the summertime is that. And again, this was very much happening in Ohio as well, in places where it's very warm outside the in. And many people listening to this can. Can sort of relate. I've been dealing with this for years and years. I think of, for instance, every woman I've ever been married to or dated have always described this experience of just like it's hot outside and then you go inside and it's become over air conditioned. And I don't think I noticed that before, but with my newly slenderized figure, I'm noticing it a lot. And actually, you know what, that really is something that when my weight goes down by a few pounds, the first indication that I have of having lost a little bit of weight is that I find myself cold in scenarios that I did not previously find myself cold in. That's almost more accurate than the scale itself. I'm like, oh, I must be down a few, because all of a sudden I think it's too cold everywhere.

[Andy Bowers]

So just out of curiosity, you were, you were not. I had a feeling it was just programmed this way. Like we had a weird setup with the H vac situation in the Airbnb, by the way, the Airbnb was great. It was. This was not a huge issue. But I didn't know that you were having issues with feeling cold a lot of the time on our trip in various places. And also I noticed. So we had. It was weird. There were two thermostats in that building, but only one of them, the upstairs one, seemed to indicate that it controlled the air conditioning. And there were several times where I'd either come home or I'd wake up and I'd be like, why is it so damn hot? And it wasn't that the air conditioning was off, but it was essentially turned off by being cranked up to 85 degrees. Well, obviously an air conditioner, like, if you just say, hey, I want to keep the air in here to be 85 degrees, the air conditioner doesn't need to do anything there. It's already that hot. So my point is, I was wondering if the people who run the Airbnb have it on a, like some sort of a clock system like I have here at home in the wintertime, where at a certain time of day they're essentially turning off the air unless we override it or. I wasn't sure if you were just getting frustrated and just hitting the up button until like, it went off.

[Luke Burbank]

I would never do that to you. And John, there was one day, I think maybe the first, the day after we arrived or something where there was some confusion. You had your window open and I then was trying to turn the air on upstairs so it would cool your room down because your room had gotten really hot.

[Andy Bowers]

Because I didn't know we had air that day.

[Luke Burbank]

There was one day that I had maybe screwed it up, but then after that I literally never touched it.

[Andy Bowers]

Okay. Yeah. So they had it on some sort of a schedule.

[Luke Burbank]

What I started doing, I don't know if you even noticed this, I wouldn't have minded an atta boy. I just started wearing a light jacket in the house. I was like, let's leave this at a temperature that the other business boys seem to enjoy and I'll just wear a light jacket because I'm a frail waif, like kind of. I think of myself as the Kate Moss of this show, Andrew. And so, yeah, I'm a delicate flower that needs to be wearing a light jacket indoors these days when I'm in an air conditioned situation and you can't even control the.

[Andy Bowers]

I was going to say the temperature in your room.

[Luke Burbank]

I just seem to figure it out because, like, when I left, this is what keeps happening. When I come back to the hotel room, I'm dashing over across town to film stuff at the Mob museum. And then I come back to the room and it's, it's like a refrigerator. And I'm looking at the AC and I, I've got the AC at like, it says 70 degrees right now, which is just fine. But I think it's, it's colder than that for some reason. And I'm wondering if it's just the overall building. So. Yeah, I'm not, I'm not exactly. And the other thing too, this Mob museum, which is actually kind of interesting, I have to say. You hear like, mob museum in Las Vegas and you think, well, somebody found a fedora and a tommy gun and they're just gonna like, call it a museum. It's actually like a nationally accredited museum. It's the largest museum of its kind. They have A lot of interesting artifacts and stuff in there.

[Andy Bowers]

And it doesn't just focus on, like, the stereotypical Italian mob. Is it like all mobs?

[Luke Burbank]

It's primarily the Italian mob, but they have other examples of organized crime. And it's not just in Las Vegas. It's kind of, you know, it covers the entire movement of organized crime in America and its roots and kind of like why it happened and who the people were that tended to take part in it. So it's a pretty. Like, again, it's not like there's a lot of fly by night kind of silly little quote unquote museums in Las Vegas. And this is actually not one of them. You know, one thing that I thought was interesting that I didn't know before was that the whole. So, you know, Las Vegas is very associated with the Mafia because they legalized gambling in Nevada, like sort of coming out of the Great Depression, because they were just trying to figure out anything they could do that would kind of ramp up some economic engine in the state. And so all of a sudden you've got this state of Nevada that's got legalized gambling, something you can't do really anywhere else. And so who gets wind of this? Well, the Mafia, who had already been running underground casinos and, and nightclubs and things during Prohibition and, and in their various cities. And they're like, well, my goodness, why don't we all come out to Las Vegas and do this above board or at least run legal casinos that they then did all kinds of things. Like they rigged the scales so that when they were weighing all of the coins that came out of the slot machines, it would give an incorrect amount of coins to the, like, I don't know, the revenuers, whoever was like, supposed to be watching this stuff. And then they would skim those coins and then they would like, get the coins, the extra coins that no one knew about out back to the Kansas City operation or the Chicago operation or whatever. But they invented this idea of comps and like, super cheap, you know, steak and lobster and like, they paid Liberace $50,000 to perform in Las Vegas. All of the stuff that we think about as being kind of Las Vegas y, like I said, you know, getting a free room or getting, you know, your meal comped, which, by the way, happens less and less these days because Las Vegas is sort of hurting economically. And so all of that stuff. Oh, it's where you go to get a $5 steak dinner. It's like, no, the steak dinner is $200 now. They've just you have to pay full price for everything. And also there is gambling, if that's something you choose to do. Whereas the Mafia's whole idea was we'll make everything pretty much free as long as you gamble and then lose your money. That's going to be where we make our money. But this, the kind of vibe of Vegas and the comps and all that stuff and the having the big stars performing, that was all just like, you know, some guy named Joey the Chin or whatever was like, hey, we should have cheap lobster. And like it persists to some degree to this day because of these goombas that came out here and were kind of inventing this thing as, as it went along. All that is to say, I go out there on whatever it was Thursday morning and I told you it's already almost 100 degrees at this point. It's like 6:30 in the morning and it's maybe 90, 95 degrees. And I get out of the lift and the walk from the lift up the steps into where the museum is, which is actually in the old federal courthouse in downtown Las Vegas. It's like I'm already broiling. And then I step in and I start talking to one of the PR folks and she's wearing an angora sweater. And I was like, you must have lost your mind. What are you doing wearing a sweater? She says. She goes, you have no idea how cold it's going to be in this museum. And she was not wrong. So I know I'm just a broken record here, but all that is to say that yes, I have lost some weight and I think everyone's noticed. And it's made me, it's made me incapable of living in America in the summertime. I need to move to Europe where they apparently have no air conditioning. That's been a whole thing this summer as well, is like it's not a cultural thing in Europe the way it is in America. And so when they have these heat waves there's, you know, people are really getting overheated because they don't have a lot of ac. Of course the problem is the AC adds to the overall temperature of the planet. You cannot just take the warm air and replace it with cold air and then there's no more warm air. You've just moved it somewhere else.

[Andy Bowers]

The way you can tell is you can just stand on the wrong side of an air conditioner and feel what is pumping out. Okay, a couple of things. So first of all, I want to apologize for my last follow up question about the mob museum I did not realize I should have from context, but I did not realize that it was a museum dedicated to mob activity in the formation and early days of Las Vegas. I just thought it was a general mob museum and I wasn't sure if they covered everything from like Russian mob and stuff. I have a better understanding now and I'm a little embarrassed about my follow up question. And this is why I will never

[Luke Burbank]

you should not host. You should not be because they they

[Andy Bowers]

by the way, Fresh Air as I got out of the I'm going to tell you exactly what I said to Jennifer. I didn't realize we're talking about air conditioning and fresh air, but we're talking about different things. To talk about the radio show Fresh Air out of why in Philadelphia I

[Luke Burbank]

got out of the babies in for Terry Gross.

[Andy Bowers]

I got out of the shower yesterday and I just said to Veeves fresh Air still hits like I had not. I mean listening to public radio on whatever my local stations schedule was was such a huge part of my life. Whatever is on, you listen to it. Is it says you. Well then yes, I'll listen says me. Is it? What do you know? Remember what do you know with they

[Luke Burbank]

says I had to so I did.

[Andy Bowers]

Save it for your mob museum. God felt Feldman. Who wait though. Who hosted? Who hosted what do you know out of Wisconsin Public Radio?

[Luke Burbank]

It wasn't Marty Feldman is the actor, right? The guy with the notable eyes from the Bride of Frankenstein or whatever.

[Andy Bowers]

Oh, that rings.

[Luke Burbank]

Marty Bell is a different Michael Feldman.

[Andy Bowers]

Michael Feldman. Anyway, boy, what a way to ruin the flow on that. Anyway, I just never listen to Fresh Air anymore because I listen to so many things on demand. Like I haven't heard this American Life in years. I heard the very last few minutes of an episode when I was in Cleveland because I was listening to actual radio radio there. And then I think maybe our trip during our trip I was listening to Cleveland Public Radio a lot. And so when I came back home, I kind of maybe instead of dialing up something on my podcatcher, I've just been like putting on the KUOW app or sometimes I listen to Hawaii Public Radio if they're in a different day part that seems more appealing to me. And so yesterday I had a very big God, I achieved so much yesterday. We can talk more about that later or not if we want to to consider the audience's opinion on these matters. But by the end of a very, very long, sweaty, hot working man's day for me yesterday, I finally took a wonderful shower around five O' clock our time, and I dialed up some public radio station. I just caught a Fresh Air interview. In the middle of the interview with some sort of, I think, showrunner, somebody who runs a show based on their own, you know, like some TV show that kind of was their brainchild or whatever, you know, sort of an extension of themselves. And I had no idea who this person was. And, like, that feeling of just bouncing into a Fresh Air interview. And of course, it wasn't Terry Gross. It was some other. It was somebody else filling in. But, like, I heard the end of this interview. I waited for the back announce to hear who I was listening to, but it kind of didn't matter. I knew that back announce was coming. The back announce comes, and then they say, we're gonna take a quick break. When we come back, David Ban Cooley is going to review the new show Lucky. And I'm like, my God, why did I. What. What did I turn my back on? Why did I ever leave this type of programming behind? It is so great, and it's ideal when you just jump into the middle of it.

[Luke Burbank]

I feel like jazz critic Kevin Whitehead will talk about an album. No one's gonna listen.

[Andy Bowers]

I would have lost. I would have lost my goddamn mind. Also, that show Lucky sounds great. I've seen some trailers for it. I gotta watch it. But anyway, I don't know what I was talking.

[Luke Burbank]

Oh, I love. No, Fresh Air. Listen, Fresh Air. Fresh Air is. Yeah, it holds up. It might have been Tanya Mosley doing the interview. She's the co host.

[Andy Bowers]

Yes, it was. It was Tanya.

[Luke Burbank]

Product.

[Andy Bowers]

Yeah, she was. She. She was doing a really great job. That's right. When she identified herself at the end, I'm like, I know. Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

[Luke Burbank]

I actually think David being Cooley or. Sorry. I actually think Dave Davies retired.

[Andy Bowers]

Oh, okay.

[Luke Burbank]

Which is. Which is wild, because Dave Davies was brought in, I think, to kind of lighten the load on Terry Gross. You know, they used to have him in occasionally to fill in, and then eventually he was essentially the co host. And then Tanya was hired officially as the, I think, co host of Fresh Air, along with Terry Gross. And I think Tanya does a spectacular job.

[Andy Bowers]

Yeah, it was really good.

[Luke Burbank]

I'm very geeked out about knowing her because she has become a big. A big figure in public radio. The reason that I think I know that Dave Davies retired was because I just got done this morning interviewing a guy at the Mob Museum named Frank Calabrese Jr. And he is a guy who came up in the Chicago Mafia. His dad was. I bet you could guess Frank Calabrese Sr. And his dad was actually a very kind of terrifying, violent guy. And after kind of a life in the Mafia, this Frank Calabres Jr. Turned state's evidence on his dad wore a wire. They were both in prison together, and he wore a wire recording his dad talking about crimes and so that his dad would have to stay in jail for longer because he was so afraid of his dad, and his dad was not letting him out of the mob. And it's actually like. And anyway, he wrote a book, and he was interviewed by Dave Davies of Fresh Air, and he was telling me about it, and he said he was extremely flattered that when Dave Davies was having his retirement episode, he mentioned The Frank Calabrese Jr. Interview, like, as one of his favorites. And Frank was like, that really meant a lot to me, because I know he does a lot of interviews. I believe what Frank said to me was. And I'm not trying to lean into the stereotype at all, but he said, like, yeah, the publisher said, they want to have you on Fresh Air. And I said, on public radio. I said, what's a Fresh Air? What's public radio?

[Andy Bowers]

And this is the family that invented the Calabrese salad that you love so much.

[Luke Burbank]

Yep. It's that there. That's where they got their money from. They got that Calabrese money. I got to be honest with you, though. Like, they need to. They need to. Every time I try to take it out of the sandwich, they keep putting it back in. They need to make a movie. I mean, not like in America. We're not hurting for movies that are made about organized crime and their behaviors. But this dude's story is legitimately riveting. So he grows up in Chicago.

[Andy Bowers]

Rivet his dad.

[Guest or Additional Speaker]

It.

[Luke Burbank]

His. His dad. Don't make me get that sound effect.

[Andy Bowers]

I will. That was a solid joke.

[Luke Burbank]

His dad grows up. His. His dad. He's being raised in Chicago. He really idolizes his dad. And I guess the rule of the Mafia in Chicago is you don't bring your kids into it. You're trying to make a better life for them.

[Andy Bowers]

You kind of.

[Luke Burbank]

You get your hands dirty, but you. You know, you. They go to college, they get, like, straight jobs, but that's not how his dad rolled. So his dad's kind of like bringing

[Andy Bowers]

him into AJ And. What was the. What was the Soprano daughter's name? Didn't.

[Luke Burbank]

Meadow.

[Andy Bowers]

Meadow and A.J. they. They were kind of protected from the business, right?

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah. Ideally, you have kids that are just soft as shit.

[Andy Bowers]

Yeah, exactly. And annoying. I've learned anything from that show.

[Luke Burbank]

Annoying and bad at acting. If you're aj. Sorry.

[Andy Bowers]

Right.

[Luke Burbank]

You know me and that. That's like. There's nothing that could ruin a Sopranos episode for me more quickly than, like, an AJ plotline. Yeah. I think he got better as he got older.

[Andy Bowers]

Well, it's weird. I think there was a donut hole because I think when he's a really little kid, like, he didn't have to do as much and they didn't know probably that the show was gonna last so long and. And, you know, kids grow up, they change. I mean, that's why I always feel a little bit bad for him. Like, is. Yeah, some of that acting is really cringy. But also, can you imagine? I can't stand looking at photos of me from that, you know, my. When I was going between 11 and 14 or whatever it is. And here he is doing that and being expected to be an actor when he's like, I don't know, I just sort of found myself in this role.

[Luke Burbank]

Totally. No, you're absolutely right. Like, that's. I would. I would myself on stage at the Kiwanis Club. Stars of tomorrow ripping off the comedian Steven Wright.

[Andy Bowers]

Yeah.

[Andrew Walsh]

Right.

[Luke Burbank]

So long story. Hopefully a little bit shorter. He ends up. He always has a very complicated relationship with being in the mob. He doesn't really want to do it, but he really looks up to his dad. And so he's always trying to figure out ways to have a normal job and then only do some mob stuff on the side. And he's always trying to, like, basically say to his dad, like, I really don't want to do this anymore. Now I have kids and I want to, like, move away and. And, like, start my new life with my wife. And. And he ends up, you know, getting sent to prison with his dad. They're both in prison together, and he realizes that his dad is never gonna, like, let him out of this life. And so he goes to the FBI and he says, like, I want to wear a wire, and I want to, like, record my dad in prison talking about other crimes that will mean he has to stay in prison for longer so that I can get away and live my life. And then what happens is he ends up having this series of these long heart to hearts with his dad where, like, he's wearing a wire in jail, but his dad is, like, really opening up, and they're finally having the relationship that. Oh, and by the way, this. The Frank Calabar Jr. He had had a drug problem. He had addicted to cocaine. He's. He's sober. He's working the program in jail. He's loving jail. It's like a reset on his life. He's. He's, you know, dealing with his addiction. He's. His dad is not constantly pressuring him to go, like, beat people up over loans and stuff. But now he's in jail. He's wearing the wire. He's recording his dad so that his dad will never be able to get out of jail. And they're finally having the father and son moments that he's always wanted. Like, he works in the. In the kitchen, and he, like, makes his dad all this great food, and he's, like, pulling all these favors, and he's just like, the irony, I guess, it would be of, like, their relationship finally connecting in this way. He's always hoped, as these conversations are what will mean his father never gets out of jail. I mean, does that not sound like a movie?

[Andy Bowers]

Well, that's stressing me out. How does it end?

[Luke Burbank]

The dad killed him.

[Andy Bowers]

Oh, really? Did you already say that? And I lost the thread.

[Luke Burbank]

No, that was a joke. I was trying to think of the. No, I'm sorry. This is not the day for me doing droll, weird jokes where you can only hear me about 30% of the time. I'm sure this is one of those days. The listeners will never know, but, Andrew.

[Andy Bowers]

Well, I don't know. It's not. I just. There's a little bit of a delay on the line. I'm not. I. Because we're talking about it so much, I'll probably just leave it in, to be honest with you. It's not. It's not like we're losing huge chunks of you. But I also was just a little bit confused because I am watching Lucy chew on a toy that we called Jeff because it looks like a Jeff Koon sculpture. And I'm just thinking this might be the last days of Jeff, and it's her favorite toy. So I was a little distracted at the setup of that story, but by the end, I was very much.

[Luke Burbank]

We got to focus on the importance.

[Andy Bowers]

But the. By the end, though, like, now I'm, like, really stressed out about this whole thing because also, like. And again, this is maybe just a stereotype, but unfortunately, maybe it's not. But, like, I don't know. Being an informant never seems like it's going to solve all of your problems, because once you're in, like, you know, if he gets out of Prison. But he's known as an informant who ended up, like, getting his dad and, you know, a leader in this organization. More time, like, I just can't imagine ever, ever unclenching for the rest of my life.

[Luke Burbank]

I asked him about that, and he said, well, I felt like, first of all, his father had tried to kill him two separate times already, like, on the outside. So he was like, I was either gonna get killed, I felt by my dad, if I stayed in the crime life, or if I tried to leave the crime life, I'd get killed by him, and I was gonna be miserable. So I just figured this was better than the alternative. And what ended up happening was he did record his dad, also his uncle, his dad's brother also turned state witness. So they. The dad ended up getting stuck in jail for longer, where he eventually passed away. And a lot of the guys that were his layer of the crime family, the ones that would have been kind of mad at Junior, they all died too. They got old. They were unhealthy. So he was like, most of the people that wanted me dead, they're dead now. And he goes, and I also just have, like, very intentionally not. There's a bunch of people that I could name or that I know that I have not named because I don't want them mad at me. I'm just kind of living my life here, you know, in Las Vegas, you know, just trying to. I'm not really messing with anyone. I'm not involved in organized crime. So, you know, that's. As of right now, that seems to have been enough. Or keeping him safe. But I was under the impression, like, if you rat against the mob, you've got to be Steve Martin. In My Blue Heaven.

[Andy Bowers]

Exactly.

[Luke Burbank]

That's where you get all of. That's where I get all of my mafia information. That and the Sopranos are the two places I get all my information. I did say, though, is there.

[Andy Bowers]

Am I making this up? Because I think you and I one time on the show were kind of spoofing or something. We're definitely talking. Maybe we're spooking and we're talking about how My Blue Heaven seems to pick up Right where Goodfellas ends, Right? And then do we find out that that is not a coincidence? Does any of this ring a bell to you?

[Luke Burbank]

I do remember this conversation. What I can't remember is if that was a theory that we saw on the Internet, or if, like, did one of us have that theory? Did one of us have that? I watched My Blue Heaven, like, in the last two years, for some random

[Andy Bowers]

reason, it's not as good as you remember, huh? I remember rewatching it and being a little disappointed.

[Luke Burbank]

I don't know if I ever saw it. When it came out, that was the thing. I might have been watching it for the first time. But you know what? Maybe it was because I also watched Goodfellas for the first time a couple of years ago. Like, believe it or not, I had never actually watched the movie. So I don't.

[Andy Bowers]

Oh, yeah, no, here it is. Okay. So according to Wikipedia, which is now one of the most reliable sources online. That's right. That's all we've got left. I had a feeling. Nora Ephron.

[Luke Burbank]

Search it up.

[Andy Bowers]

So Nora Ephron did not direct it, but she wrote it. And it says it's the third film in which Martin and Moranis star together. Oh, he's hilarious, dog. It has been noted for its relation. It has been noted for its relationship to Goodfellas, which was released one month later. So this preceded it. And it says both films are based on the life of Henry Hill. So it's literally based on the same guy. Okay. And then I did with.

[Luke Burbank]

With wildly different approaches, though, Right. As far as the kind of seriousness of the film.

[Andy Bowers]

Yes. And it seems like it looks like both films are based on the life of Henry Hill. And there's also. It looks like the screenplays were written by. It looks like Nora Ephron was in a relationship with the guy who wrote Goodfellas at the time. So they were a couple who were writing these parallel stories.

[Luke Burbank]

That's fun. That also feels like that could be a movie, a rom com of some kind where you've got a couple that is romantically engaged. You know, they're a romantic couple and they're both writing mob movies, but Nora Ephron's writing the Nora Ephron version and the other guy's writing the other guy.

[Andy Bowers]

You know what? I think maybe her partner. And I'm trying to get this right here. And I'm sorry for. Let's see here. Yeah. So she was married to the guy who wrote the book that Goodfellas is based on, not the screenplay of Goodfellas. It's called Wise Guy, and his name is Nicholas Pileggi.

[Luke Burbank]

Oh, Nicholas Pileggi.

[Andy Bowers]

Pileggi. Okay. You know that name. I do not. So they were married. He's writing the book Wise Guy based on Henry Hill. She's writing My Blue Heaven, and then Goodfellas ends up coming out, and that's based on the book. So anyway, that's where we're at.

[Luke Burbank]

Well, what I will say is I was very riveted by. I realized I did, like, an hour and a half interview probably with this guy, Frank Calabrese Jr. And I knew as we were talking that only 40 seconds of this could live in the TV story. But I just literally wanted to hear the next thing he was gonna say about this crazy, like, wearing the wire stuff. I was like, how do you wear a wire in jail? He was like, well, I realized that we all had these headphones that they would give us or you could get from commissary that we hooked up to our little radios. Like they had transistor radios and headphones. You were allowed to do that in the jail. So he said, well, what if they put the listening device in the headphones? And then I just had them around my neck while I was talking to my dad? So then they had to. Like, in Quantico, Virginia, the FBI had to build this, like, headphone microphone listening device that goes down to the little, you know, transistor radio thing. And just. I don't know, I found the whole thing to be. I'm not like a guy. I mean, I did watch the Sopranos, but I'm not like a. I'm not particularly obsessed with the mob movies or the mafia or anything, but, boy, I was. I was riveted today. I was like, none of this is gonna get on tv, but, dang, I wanna know what happens. I was doing my own episode of Fresh Air in the basement of the mob museum.

[Andy Bowers]

Slow down, Tanya. But why is he talking so much? Like, why is he, like, in front of cameras? And I just feel like I would. And again, not that I would wanna live the rest of my life maybe, you know, it sounds like he's not living his life in abject fear, which I guess is good. But, like, do you also have to invite the public eye on you a.

[Luke Burbank]

I think it's how he makes his living. I mean, literally, he gives a presentation. I think he gives, like, four presentations a day at the Mob Museum. They're like 45 minute talks where he just tells his story and whatever. It's sort of like, you know, when you go to the hall of the Presidents at, like, Disneyland, it's like. Except it's really Abe Lincoln. Yeah, it's like a real guy who did mafia stuff. So 1. I think he has a financial sort of incentive. This is how he. And he wrote this book, which was a New York Times bestseller. This is how he's supporting himself. That's part of it. And I do really think the Mafia is very diminished from what it once was. I think if anything, the cartels are probably hugely powerful and obviously very dangerous. And there's other groups that deal in unfortunate things such as human trafficking and drug trafficking and things like that. I really do think it's kind of the best days of a guy in a tracksuit standing on a corner menacing a deli owner are really behind us. So I think the people that were from this guy's time that would want him dead are themselves probably dead. And so, yeah, I mean, I guess it's that he needs to talk about it to make a living. It's kind of his. It's his main thing he can offer. And also, I just think that the Mafia isn't what the mafia once was. At least out here in Vegas it's not. Which is also hilarious to me that like you have, you get the ultimate gangsters in here, which is called international publicly traded companies. And you know who the Mafia can't compete with corporations. Like, and this is one last thing I'll say. And then we should, you know, maybe move on to a more interesting topic or even the blurs days. But like, this is the reason that the mob got driven out of Las Vegas was because in the early days of the casino business here, the Nevada state regulation, this is before like 1960 something, I think, or maybe 1970 something. The Nevada Gaming Commission said if you have a casino, every single shareholder in your company has to pass an FBI background check. So what that means is if you're Bugsy Siegel, right, you can own a casino all on your own because you've got all of this ill gotten money that you've built up and maybe it's you and your three buddies and somehow you have managed to like have your background check is fine. Like you have three people that have to pass a background check. If you are the Hilton Hotel Company, you have 10,000 shareholders. Everyone who owns stock in Hilton is a shareholder and therefore would have to pass the background check to open a Hilton in Las Vegas. So they changed that law at some point and kind of counterintuitively, when they made it so that you didn't have to have all of your shareholders pass a background check. That was the death knell for the mob because now you had all these big corporations that could now come in and open their own casinos and just like use, use their massive resources to kind of like drive out the ma and PA Mafiosos.

[Andy Bowers]

You have basically Mickey Mouse driving out the mob.

[Luke Burbank]

Yes. And it really. I mean, this is an obvious trap to fall into too, because, like, the Mafia was very violent and they were bad dud a lot of the time. But it is like. I don't know, like, I've. I've had more than. As I've been doing this story here, and I've been talking to people just, like, randomly as I'm waiting for the elevator. One guy was the. The Lyft driver, and one guy was just in the elevator with me. Like, more than one person has said. Vegas used to be so much better when the mob ran it, when it was just, you know, a Goomba with a heart of. With a heart of gold who was, you know, just wanted to take care of you and you have a good time. It's like, these corporations are way worse than the Mafia. I don't know if that's true or not, but that's what people say.

[Andy Bowers]

I saw somebody, you know, often romanticize the very gritty days of New York City. And I saw somebody, like, kind of maybe make that sentiment on blue sky. And then somebody being like, you don't know what you're talking about. And just being like, this nostalgia for things when they were more dangerous and awful is not helpful.

[Luke Burbank]

Well, yeah. I mean, everything is in the rear view mirror, you know, Seems like, oh, wasn't that a nice time? And it's like, probably it wasn't.

[Andy Bowers]

Well, it's like there's a happy medium, though, too, and not to go back to it, but that's why I really enjoyed seeing the neighborhood of Ohio City where we were staying there. Because a lot of things have definitely changed for the better. There's some new trendy, ish businesses there. That was at Mitchell's ice cream Store. And there was kind of a hipster dive bar next to some probably Irish bars that had been there for a while, but it was a good mix. And when you go into the west side Market, where I took you guys, a market that's been there since, I'm guessing the 30s, although maybe earlier than that. Literally a place where farmers, like the guy we met in Valley City, where his great grandparents used to drive wagons up to the city to sell their produce or whatever, like at a. At the west side Market, like, yeah, right. Still slinging cased meats with that Eastern European influence, everything. It's not all trendy, and it's still just like. It's. It's amazing in the way it was then and bustling in the way it was then. Although I'm sure, like, you know, it's maybe a little bit more of a tourist destination, but it's still just, like, right in the heart of the city there. So, anyway, that's why I kind of like that. Like, I know that I've. Listen, you and I have been doing the show for a long time, and I have various feelings about urbanism, and I think that they've maybe evolved as I get older and have a little bit more context for things. And new money can be very upsetting in a lot of ways, especially when you're driving out old culture and people who've lived there for their entire lives or whatever. But also just being like, who's the character on Kimmy Schmidt? Carol Kane on Kimmy Schmidt, who's, like, trying to go around chaining yourself to the bulldozer. Yeah, exactly. And trying to keep your neighborhood as stabby as possible, which is pretty good. And I think I used to be more like that. And now I realize, like, no, let's just do things in balance, you know,

[Luke Burbank]

there's gotta be a way. Or maybe there doesn't. I don't know. But, yeah, ideally there is a way to sort of, like, have people living in the same area who are both recently arrived there and may have certain things that they want to try to spiff up and maybe not have it drive out everybody who was there before. Although if there is a way for that, it seems to. As of now, it's a little unclear as to how that works. I mean, your neighborhood, though, that you're in right now does seem. I don't know, you live there, but it seems like it's. I mean, you guys haven't gentrified the whole neighborhood, have you? I mean, I feel like there's a mix of different kinds of folks living in. Is that accurate or is that just my.

[Andy Bowers]

I mean, I think so. You said you were reading all those stories recently about how literally neighbors who live in, like, you know, houses around here were putting up barriers, basically putting up illegal barriers on their side streets off of Aurora because the violence was leaking off of Aurora Avenue into the neighborhoods. And so it's been. It's been sort of a weird time here. I mean, I still think that I live in the area of Seattle that catches. You know, it's either South Seattle or North Seattle. Right. That catch all of the headlines because of all the crime and everything. So, I don't know, it doesn't feel gentrified to me up here, and there's very little cutesy stuff up here at all. Like it's still it. You know, it'd still be on the, I hate to say it on the. If we're using the adjective stabby, I would say it's still like kind of on the stabby end of the spectrum. But you know, I mean, I do assume that, you know, with time and again, this is one of those things where it's like crime is bad, putting people's lives at risk and I'm including the people who are also addicted to drugs and are living on the street. I care about their lives and I don't know, there has to be a way to look out for our neighbors and the people who are in all kinds of distress on the street around here without also having to open up an umbrella store that only sells $300 umbrellas or whatever like I would sometimes see in Ballard or something like that.

[Luke Burbank]

I think you guys, and I say this with peace and love, I think you're, you're. It's going to be a number of years before you have an overpriced umbrella store there on Aurora. Because what's interesting about.

[Andy Bowers]

And guess who's going to open it? This guy.

[Luke Burbank]

That's right. That could be your million dollar idea. I mean the thing that's just so interesting about Aurora Avenue is, you know, I grew up on Aurora Avenue 40 years ago and it was exactly the same. Like nothing changes. Like it's ungentrifiable in my experience. You know, I mean it's exact, it is almost exactly like the Aurora Avenue that I grew up on. I mean maybe some different business names, but it's.

[Andy Bowers]

I got the impression that up here though, it's more, it's probably more crime riddled and then it was back then. Right. Are you talking more like the. A little bit south of me in the. More like Green Lake area.

[Luke Burbank]

You know, I don't live there anymore, so I guess I'm kind of just shooting from the hip here. But, but I guess, I mean, I just remember, I remember the stretch of Aurora between about like 80th and 80th up to about 105th, particularly because of the concentration of motels that, you know, were charged, I think pretty, pretty small fee to stay there by the night or by the hour like that just kind of, you know, it was a place where people who were really on the margins could kind of like, like stay for a while. And it just drew in a whole bunch of different sort of stuff around it. And I mean that just was always the story of Aurora when I was growing up. Maybe not so much over up kind of where, again, where you. Where you all are. Maybe it's. In fact, you know what? I do think that, like, for instance, up where there's just a tremendous number. At least there used to be in the last. I don't know, last time I drove through a tremendous number of, let's just say underclad. Let's just say young women walking around on Aurora, which has created, obviously, a huge. A huge pearl clutch. That was not like that when I was a kid. That part of Aurora was not. Was not, you know, beset by.

[Andrew Walsh]

That.

[Luke Burbank]

There were, you know, there were sex workers on Aurora, but it wasn't like that. Like what I drove through the last time. That does seem kind of like a new. A new thing.

[Andy Bowers]

I'm gonna try to play something for you here. Let me just see if the audio works on this. Okay. Yeah. Okay. I'm gonna refresh this. I want to tell you. Well, I want to set up a piece of tape, then I'll let Ben Gibbert take it from here. Oh, by the way, did I mention that Ben Gibbert is here? He's. He's been chewing on a bone right outside the whole time, and he has a story here that I was scrolling. I don't know if this is a new story or if it's just kind of getting. It was definitely not a new story, but I don't know if this piece of tape is relatively new or if it's just kind of getting another updraft or something. But Ben Gibbert of Death Cab for Cutie was. And. And of TBT Friendship and of tbtl. Whirly Ball games. He was on a podcast, and this clip is making its way around, and it's him telling. Telling a story. So apparently, I guess with Death Cab, they got to meet Pete Townshend one time. And Pete Townsend apparently told this story as Ben Gibbard tells us.

[Luke Burbank]

Where you guys from?

[Guest or Additional Speaker]

Like, well, we're from Seattle. And I try to form this connective. She's like, we actually know the guys in Pearl Jam. I know you guys are friends with Ed and those guys. He just kind of takes a moment. He's like, yeah, remember we were playing in Seattle in the 70s, and there were all these kids. We were staying at the Edgewater Inn. They're all these homeless kids. They're underneath the viaduct there. And Keith Moon, he goes and he takes him and brings him in the Edgewater Inn, and he serves them all dinner. And I swear to you that one of those kids was Kurt Cobain. And Wal and I just look at each other and we're like, what, man?

[Luke Burbank]

Like.

[Guest or Additional Speaker]

And in no world are we going to correct this guy. And there's a couple other people in the trailer, and they're like, wow. And I'm just like. And Wal and I are just like. I'm like, we're going to talk about this when we leave this trailer.

[Luke Burbank]

Right? I do believe he believed that.

[Andy Bowers]

I think that. Oh, yeah. I think he goes on to say, like, yeah, he was from Aberdeen and he would have been like, 10 years. Cobain would have been 10 years old at the time. But that is how. Like, I could. I understand, though, how that Townsend. Yeah, if. Yeah, 1970. Yeah, if that. Exactly. But Pete Townsend just has like, he's. They.

[Luke Burbank]

And one.

[Andy Bowers]

What were you gonna say one of

[Luke Burbank]

those boys was Ken Griffey Jr.

[Andy Bowers]

Right, exactly.

[Andrew Walsh]

Here.

[Luke Burbank]

Like. Like, who's the most famous Seattle person that I could think of who was. And that was Charles Royer.

[Andy Bowers]

Wait, no.

[Luke Burbank]

He would know who the former.

[Andy Bowers]

One of these homeless boys was. Ichro Suzuki.

[Luke Burbank]

There's a right way to rock and a wrong way to roll. You can't just listen to your song. Just remember that life, Life is number one. You can be having so much fun. Just remember the day.

[Andy Bowers]

Life is much fun.

[Luke Burbank]

You can be nothing. Number one.

[Andy Bowers]

All right, let's do some blurs days here. Or as you call them, Luke Flersdays, because we did delay them by a day.

[Luke Burbank]

Fleursdays.

[Andy Bowers]

Fleursdays. And this is good. We got more people to join the fleursday segment by delaying it today. If you want to submit a birthday wish to yourself or someone in your Life, email me andrewbtl.net and put Blursday in the subject line and then write a little message. Write a little message to that person. Hannah in Katy, Texas, says, my husband Thomas is a longtime listener of the podcast. So I'm donating in honor of his birthday on July 29th. This came in during last week's TBTL A Thon. Thank you so much for donating, Hannah. Appreciate it. And huge blursdays to Thomas. Huge blurs days. That's what I said. I'm standing by.

[Luke Burbank]

Mega blurs days. It's like a Jim Cramer thing.

[Guest or Additional Speaker]

That's right.

[Andy Bowers]

Happiest of blurs days to Cecilia in Atlanta. We know Cecilia from your TBTL book club family. We love you so much. We managed to discuss an entire book one time without revealing any actual plot details, just so as to not spoil it for you. Thank you so much for your positive energy and wonderful contributions. We can't wait to hold an in person book club with you when the 5 5000th episode comes around. Love ya. From Christine, Kelly, and Kathy. Do you think your mom will go to the in person book club, Luke?

[Luke Burbank]

Where are they gonna have it?

[Andy Bowers]

Probably. Maybe we're assuming that the 5000th celebration will be here in this part of the world in Seattle somewhere. And so I'm guessing.

[Luke Burbank]

Oh, yeah, we're saying that we're talking about that.

[Andy Bowers]

Yeah, I think we're saying that. So I'm guessing that when everybody gets together, they want to hold a TBTL book club in person. I think your mom should be holding the talking stick. I assume they have a talking stick.

[Luke Burbank]

I think you're gonna want to be careful with that. As a person who's grown up in the household where my mom was holding the talking stick. It can get out of hand.

[Andy Bowers]

We got a note here that is mostly in French, so unfortunately, I can't read it. But I'll read the beginning part. It says it's that time of year again. The 10 known as Karen is having yet another birthday. And then it says Karen. And then I'm guessing that maybe these are a bunch of salutations in French, but they're very long. And I. I don't know if people know this. I don't speak French, but it's signed Fritz, Olivia, and Mo. So happy blurs day from those folks. Karen.

[Luke Burbank]

Oh, la la.

[Andy Bowers]

Oh, that's what it says. Yeah. I don't know. It's not just like one. I don't know if this was, like, maybe a joke to get me to try to pronounce French or people think I speak French because my last name is Walsh, but it's pretty long. But anyway, I'm sure it's very sweet. I hope. This is from Kristen in Kansas City. Who says I want to wish Taylor. This is our pal Taylor, the Royals fan in ecop, the happiest of blurs. I feel like they explained ECOP to us once and I've already forgotten it. Do you know what ECOP is, Luke? The letters.

[Luke Burbank]

E, C, E, C, O, P. Is

[Andy Bowers]

it like it might be an area of Kansas City or something?

[Luke Burbank]

Let me explain it. I'll take it. Anyway, for every C is for. Oh, I don't know.

[Andy Bowers]

Yeah, let's just be careful with this. Actually, now that we're going in that

[Luke Burbank]

direction, it's another way to call a cat a kitten.

[Andy Bowers]

Okay, okay, okay. I want to wish Taylor and Ecop the happiest of blurs. Here are the top five things about her, says Kristen. Five, her dog George, number five, her dog George, number four, her Leo Sparkle, number three, her wit, Number two, her persistence. C, months spent tracking down a scammer who tried to steal a credenza from her. And number one, her loyalty. C, the Royals, who at the time of this email are only 11 games out of the wild card. Thank you for being a friend. Oh. From Kristen and Casey. Aw, it's very sweet. Happy Blurs day, Taylor. I texted Taylor today because I saw that our boy Mike of gummy art, who fashioned all of our TBTL trading cards that we're gonna be giving out pretty soon to everybody who donated at that level. He had a special card that he posted on Blue sky today because today is the anniversary of Jordan freaking out when what would have been a game winning home run was called back. He had too much pine tar on his bat. Are you familiar with this incident?

[Luke Burbank]

The pine tar is so familiar I

[Andy Bowers]

had to look it up.

[Luke Burbank]

It's wild that it's only the second most memorable thing I remember about George Brett and his hall of Fame career, actually, which unfolded right here in Las Vegas, Nevada, my friend. But yeah, the thing that always made me so mad about the pine tar incident is that that pine tar, by its nature is sticky. That's what it's there for. So the idea that it would help you hit the ball further.

[Andy Bowers]

Yeah. Right.

[Luke Burbank]

Is ludicrous.

[Andy Bowers]

The idea that helps you hang onto the bat.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah. In fact, it's the opposite. Pine tar would make it harder if your entire bat was dipped in pine tar. The ball is sticking to your bat more. It's making it more challenging.

[Andy Bowers]

Yeah. That's interesting. Yeah. And he got mad. I watched the video today. As somebody who did not grow up with. With baseball in my life, I. I enjoy just quote unquote discovering these things. When I see him mentioned he comes

[Luke Burbank]

tearing out of that dug.

[Andy Bowers]

Oh, my God. I would be so. I've never seen somebody like go after umpires like that before. I mean, that is. That is scary stuff.

[Luke Burbank]

Well, you saw Ferguson calling that umpire

[Andy Bowers]

a. Oh, yeah, yeah. What's that guy's name? Ferguson.

[Luke Burbank]

A fat pos.

[Andy Bowers]

And I don't think it was Ferguson. Right. It was. It wasn't it somebody who. What's his first name?

[Luke Burbank]

Former Mariner.

[Andy Bowers]

Yeah, former. Is it Ferguson? Okay. Is it Caleb? Okay. Yeah, yeah. Maybe I was just forgetting his name. Yeah. I didn't, I didn't like that too much? I'll be honest with you.

[Luke Burbank]

I didn't either.

[Andy Bowers]

I rarely get away, but come on, man.

[Luke Burbank]

I rarely feel bad for the umps, but I did feel kind of bad then. Meanwhile, I think that ump made a crummy call against us the next day. And I was like, I was tempted to Ferguson him, but I didn't.

[Andy Bowers]

Yeah. All right, here's one. This is from Maya, who says, happy Golden Blurs day to my friend Lisa. She's come a long way since her days as a Pepsi Junior Mariner, though she is still a long suffering fan all the way in Bend. Hope you have a great birthday and that we can soon get a happy hour on the books with the RT gang. Happy Blurs Day.

[Luke Burbank]

People increasingly using the Blurs days as a Palm Pilot as a way of scheduling appointments and other tens.

[Andy Bowers]

And I'm. I love that, honestly. It's one of my favorite parts of this, especially when it's in English. No names are in this one, but it says hap. It's very sweet. It says, Happy 21st birthday to our middle five. You've absolutely increased the rate that my hair has both gone gray and fallen out. But I wouldn't trade you for anything. Your mom and I are very proud of you and we can't wait to see what the future holds. Love you, kiddo. Very sweet. Happy 30th birthday to my wonderful wife, Shannon. Your intelligence, perseverance, humor and empathy are blessings to me and everyone else in our life. And you would not be half as sane as I am without. Nope. Let me. Okay, you know what? I made several mistakes in that, so I'm taking it over, but I'm not editing it out. Everybody's going to hear this again. Happy 30th birthday to my wonderful wife, Shannon. We got that. Your intelligence, perseverance, humor and empathy are blessings to me and everyone else in your life. And I would not be half as sane as I am without your support. Everybody follow that.

[Luke Burbank]

There you go.

[Andy Bowers]

There we go. Look at me. I'm growing up right in front of your eyes, Luke. Can't wait for the decades of birthdays, baseball movies, and more with you to come. Happy birthday from Bippis Barangas, Beth Gormus and Bobby Bathorgamus. I think Bathor Gammas are those.

[Luke Burbank]

It's gotta be some family names.

[Andy Bowers]

I'm hoping.

[Luke Burbank]

Let's go way back.

[Andy Bowers]

From someone who's apparently time banding, we got this note that says, coincidentally my birthday is on a Thursday this year. So I thought I'D self blurs or not if you've all stopped doing this. But I'll find out when I catch up. I'm up to episode 3317 so I'm getting there. I refuse bankruptcy. That's a long time ago. What are we on now, Luke? 4, 7, 7, 6 or no, 4, 7 7, 8 or what are we on 4778.

[Luke Burbank]

And I have to say that's, you know, you said like somebody who's time banding or whatever, but like they're coming by that. Honestly, sometimes people will be like, I don't know if they're doing the blurs days anymore because they've just fully stopped listening to the show. But that's a whole other thing. That's like, no, no, I'm just, I'm listening but I'm just taking my, taking my time and I'm being a completist.

[Andy Bowers]

And finally, Julian Salem, Oregon says, I want to wish my bestie KJ Lovely birthday wishes for the big five eight. Woohoo. It just says woohoo, but I felt like I needed to say it in that way. I don't know if you would agree with it. It has two exclamation points.

[Luke Burbank]

Hard agree.

[Andy Bowers]

Okay, thank you. Here is to another 25 plus years of friendship cahooting around wine, drinking, eating good food and laughing our butts off. Hey guys, you're going to need those. You are the best bestie one could ask for. Looking forward to spending Labor Day weekend together in the valley. Love you JK and that doesn't mean. Just kidding. That means that's Julie's initials.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah, yeah.

[Andy Bowers]

To say love you then JK right afterwards, that's. That would be like elementary school teasing. You know what I mean?

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah. No, we're. That's not the way the listeners are.

[Andrew Walsh]

Are.

[Luke Burbank]

The tens are kind, wonderful people. They don't say love you jk.

[Andy Bowers]

They're not like Joy who asked me to ask her to the dance. And then when I asked her the dance, she laughed at me in eighth grade. No, really, that was rough stuff. She was a cutie.

[Luke Burbank]

But that was a different person than the one that made you throw the necklace into the well.

[Andy Bowers]

She didn't make me. That, that was on me. That was probably when I was in fourth grade or something. But eighth grade was rough. Yeah. I was a new kid at the school and so was Joy. But we had a very opposite experience as she was a very popular, attractive kid and I was not. And so that was a rough one. But you know What? How's her podcast doing? That's what I want to know.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah. Game, set, match.

[Andy Bowers]

Probably less of a delay.

[Luke Burbank]

Well, by definition, any podcast would have less of a delay than we do today.

[Andy Bowers]

All right. Okay. We got the right music going. How we like this?

[Luke Burbank]

I like it a lot. And I think this is the time to say this, of course, brings us to the end of our broadcast week. Thanks, everyone, for spending the time with us. Thanks for being part of tbtl. We'll be back here on Monday sans delay. I'll be back in the home studio, and we'll have more imaginary radio for you then. In the meantime, have a great weekend, everybody. Take care of yourselves. Be safe, and please remember, no mountain too tall.

[Andy Bowers]

And good luck to all. Power out.