#642: Summer Camp

Summary

Tell 'Em Steve-Dave! #642: Summer Camp (June 30, 2025) – Summary

Episode Overview

In this episode, the TESD crew recounts the saga of Gidham's return to his beloved 1990s-era boys’ science summer camp for a tri-annual reunion—this time joined by Johnny Law as his "plus one.” The show weaves between Gidham’s nostalgia, Johnny Law’s first impressions, and the ever-present comedic skepticism, ribbing, and warmth of Walt, Q, and the rest of the gang. Listeners are treated to tales of camp hijinks, awkward reunions, contests, legendary counselors, questionable camp traditions, and lots of fish (and Natty Daddy). It’s a deep and very funny dive into the peculiarities of boyhood camps, all filtered through the irreverent TESD lens.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Who’s Here and What’s Going On?

• Participants: Regulars BQ (Brian Quinn), Walt, Gidham; guest Johnny Law. (00:52)
• Gidham provides the reunion context: he attended a boys-only science summer camp in the ‘90s that influenced him deeply. The camp closed in 2019 but still hosts alumni reunions (now for rent as an outdoor facility). (01:36–04:59)
• Gidham discusses his efforts to find a “plus one” for the reunion and his anxieties over "the optics" (e.g., if people would think he’s gay for bringing a male friend). Johnny Law was his ultimate recruit, happy to go. (09:34–13:02)

Notable Quotes:

• Gidham: “I went to a summer camp in the early 90s. It was a science summer camp for all boys.” (01:36)
• Host: “At 13, I would have rather been running around on my bikes with my friends than going to, you know, a camp like that.” (03:18)

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2. The Camp Experience: Rules, Rituals & Reunions

• Changing attitudes: Parents grew increasingly anxious about sleepaway camps (“stranger danger,” no phones), contributing to the camp’s eventual closure. (04:32–05:06)
• The camp is now essentially a time capsule, unchanged since the ‘90s—right down to the bunk beds, cabins, and former shower house (48:00).
• Deep camp lore: The Whacker family legacy (Don, Dave, and “Dick Whacker”), prompting jokes about sheltered parents and Dick Whacker’s upbringing. (06:56–07:49)

Notable Quotes:

• Johnny Law: “The whole vibe there is like…Walton-esque. It's almost saccharine.” (07:33)
• Walt: “Are those the two most sheltered parents in history that they don't realize, hey, maybe we shouldn’t call him Richard?” (07:20)

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3. Nostalgia, Awkward Reunions, & Gidham’s Reputation

• Gidham was excited to have a fresh audience (Johnny Law) for his camp stories, noting that the long-timers “had heard about the boots in '22.” (08:44)
• First awkward moments: Many didn’t remember or recognize Gidham at check-in. Some counselors recall him as an “insufferable asshole” in his youth, though now he’s much better liked. (21:32–23:24)
• Anecdotes surface of Gidham’s willful rebellion: refusing chores, needing to be carried around the field by counselors, ducking bathroom duty to avoid “Bon Ami” cleaning powder. (23:33–28:23)

Notable Quotes:

• Johnny Law: “It was very clear right from the start that no one really liked Giddam.” (23:05)
• Gidham: “I would not do what I was told. Like, I…did the exact opposite.” (23:30)

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4. Living the Camp Life: Fishing, Cabin Life & Camp Activities

Cabin Life

• Rustic accommodations: No A/C, bunk beds, and memories of Gidham’s legendary snoring (remedied now by separate cabins, CPAP jokes abound). (13:00–15:01)

Fishing & Outdoor Time

• Johnny Law is an avid outdoorsman; the pair spend hours fishing (sometimes successfully), and Johnny brings his own modern gear. Their time reveals more of Gidham’s softer side. (33:53–36:35)
• Quote (Johnny Law): “I've peeled a layer of the onion away…he is just a really sweet, great guy...It was also great to see him in a situation where…these guys loved him by the end of it.” (36:22)

Drinking

• Drinking is reserved for after dark, with Gidham detailing the perils (and hangovers) of “Natty Daddy” nights. (49:40–51:00)

Camp Contests

• The camp hosts a goofy relay competition (canoeing, sunken canoe, cereal-eating, card-stacking, fire-starting, etc.). Johnny Law locks down his canoeing event; Gidham nearly drowns himself in the sunken canoe and then rushes to win the cereal-eating competition, all leading to second place. (57:18–68:22)

Notable Quotes:

• Johnny Law (on the canoe event): “So I’m doing basically all the work...we did win.” (59:16, 59:25)
• Johnny Law (on sunken canoe): “He was getting to the point where...water would just be spewing out of his mouth.” (61:43)
• Walt: “Why are you in bad shape? ... Because of the underwater canoe. You're all sore and shit.” (89:56–90:00)

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5. Camp Rituals & Lore

Shower House Stories

• Hilariously awkward memories (with edge-of-inappropriateness): the no-partition shower house, counselors watching to ensure cleanliness, debate over the weirdness of adults monitoring showers, and speculation about “Sandusky” types (joked about, not substantiated). (40:00–47:00)
• Quote: “It looked like a place you'd bring cattle into with little spickets on top.” – Johnny Law (40:06)

Iconic Meals

• Nostalgic reverence for “camp food” (spaghetti, meat sauce, garlic bread, tacos, burgers, and cereal competitions). (31:25–33:23, 68:41)
• Gidham: “You know, this is probably the best meal I’ve had in about three months.” (32:28)

Awards

• The weekend’s ribbons: second place in the relay, green for participation, and brown “excellence in fishing” for both Johnny and Gidham after much boasting without photographic evidence. (69:50–71:21)

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6. Deeper Takeaways & Reflections

• The camp serves as a pocket of nostalgia for Gidham—a place tied tightly to his identity, despite a childhood marked by social awkwardness and being an outsider.
• Johnny Law and the hosts observe his fierce connection to objects and the past (e.g., his four phones), his difficulty letting go and moving on, and his evolution from troublemaker to lovable adult.
• The group gently roasts Gidham for his inability to downsize phones, his reverence for camp relics, and his hoarding tendencies.
• The hosts muse on how modern interventions and awareness could've made things easier for Gidham growing up—but celebrate his progress and current connections nonetheless.

Notable Quotes:

• Johnny Law: “The fact that he is the way he is today...is encouraging, because that means he can make even bigger strides going forward.” (86:36)
• Host: “He’s a great guy and he cares...it's hard to argue with your way; you worked out.” (87:17)
• Johnny Law: “Get him can put them down, man. I was impressed.” (50:49)

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Memorable Moments & Humor

• The saga of “Dick Whacker” and legendary camp names (07:03–07:52)
• Gidham’s insecurities about being seen as gay for attending with a male friend, plus the camp’s “throuple” in residence (10:04–19:03)
• The epic story of Gidham being piggybacked by a counselor due to refusal to run (23:49–25:57)
• Bon Ami powder, bathroom duty avoidance, and swapping jobs as a protest (27:21)
• The suspense and slapstick of the sunken canoe disaster (59:44–62:47)
• Johnny Law’s legal jousting with several other camp alumni-turned-lawyers around the campfire (80:48–81:21)
• Banter about “Showers at Auschwitz” and emphasizing nothing inappropriate happened, juxtaposed with jokes about “Sandusky.” (40:25–43:45)
• Gidham’s emotional response to the camp’s closing speech and the hosts’ mixture of genuine sympathy and comic prodding (76:25–77:36)
• For every marginally touching moment, someone offers a punchline—e.g., cereal-eating as a heroic challenge, “excellence in fishing” ribbons, ribbon colors, and the persistent question: why four phones?

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• “The whole vibe there is like the most wholesome, kind of Walton-esque situation. It's…almost saccharine.” – Johnny Law (07:33)
• “Nobody liked Gidham at the camp…back then, but now they do!” – Johnny Law (23:05)
• “It looked like a place you’d bring cattle into with little spickets on top.” – Johnny Law, describing the defunct shower house (40:06)
• “He was getting to the point where…water would just be spewing out of his mouth.” – Johnny Law, recounting Gidham’s sunken canoe ordeal (61:43)
• “I was devastated that I can't talk to my father, my mother, my grandmother…But then I hated this guy [the counselor] afterwards and he hated me…We made up.” – Gidham, on a camp grudge (76:00–76:12)
• “The fact that he is the way that he is today…is encouraging, because that means he can make even bigger strides going forward.” – Johnny Law (86:36)

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Important Segments with Timestamps

• Camp Background & Reunion Invitation: (01:36–05:34)
• Gidham’s "Plus One" Odyssey & Fears (09:34–14:44)
• First Reactions at Reunion (21:32–23:24)
• Legend of “Dick Whacker” (06:56–07:49)
• Counselors Remembering Gidham (23:05–25:58)
• Cabin/Snoring/CPAP Saga (13:00–15:01)
• Shower House Lore & Jokes (40:00–47:00)
• Fishing Bonding & Reflection (33:53–36:35; 72:35–73:39)
• Relay/Contests/Sunken Canoe (57:18–68:22)
• Legal Discussion by the Campfire (80:48–81:21)
• Award Ceremony & Speech (74:50–77:36)
• Wrapping up—Reflections on Growth & Camp’s Value (86:36–88:57)

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Final Thoughts

This episode is as much a celebration of camp nostalgia and transformation as it is a source of unfiltered humor and camaraderie. The crew’s mockery is balanced by genuine warmth for Gidham, who, despite his quirks, has metamorphosed into a beloved, if eccentric, member of the TESD family. The themes of growth, acceptance, and the enduring (sometimes embarrassing) power of camp memories ring throughout, making for an episode equal parts touching and hilarious.

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Summary by Segment

• Opening banter, camp background, and plus-one saga: 00:06–14:44
• Story of the reunion, first impressions, and lore: 15:00–25:58
• Camp traditions, contests, and fish tales: 26:00–50:00
• The legendary sunken canoe, competitions, and ribbons: 50:00–71:21
• Emotional campfire speech, reconciliation, and legal debates: 74:50–81:21
• Final reflections and takeaway lessons: 86:36–end

For new listeners: This is a classic, chaotic, and heartwarming TESD adventure—nostalgic, unfiltered, frequently inappropriate, and always funny. The details and laughs come alive even if you’ve never set foot at camp yourself.

Transcript

[Host]

Love old boy action. And you could use that as the weekly quote. Somebody drove a short bus into the lake.

[Co-host]

It was moist, sticky, thick.

[Host]

You bet it was.

[Co-host]

Tell him, Steve Dave.

Hello and welcome to this week's edition of. Tell Them Steve.

[Johnny Law]

Dave.

[Co-host]

We got BQ here.

[Host]

Hello.

[Co-host]

We got Walt here.

Yo.

[Johnny Law]

Got.

[Co-host]

Get him here. Of course.

[Gidham]

How do y'? All. How you stanking?

[Co-host]

Special guests. Johnny Law.

[Host]

Johnny Law, everyone.

[Johnny Law]

Hey. Johnny Law is here. Happy to be back.

[Co-host]

He made it back.

[Gidham]

He made it back from where?

[Host]

From the.

[Co-host]

From the.

[Host]

Did everybody listen to this? Know the adventure?

[Gidham]

No.

[Host]

This is a shit.

[Co-host]

Nobody knows what's going on.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

Any idea what happened?

[Gidham]

Except for my close friends who I tried to snag into this until Johnny graciously accepted.

[Co-host]

So once a year.

[Gidham]

No, it's three years since the last one.

[Co-host]

Okay. So.

[Gidham]

So we. I think we decided tri annually. Like every year is a little too.

[Host]

Nobody knows what you're talking about.

[Gidham]

So I went to a summer camp in my. In the early 90s. It was a science summer camp for all boys.

[Co-host]

How old would you have been, like, when you attended this camp? What were the ages?

[Gidham]

So it was 92, 93, 94, 95. So I. I think we. We age out at 16, but I was allowed to go at 17 because my birthday was in June. So.

[Host]

Big dick swinging.

[Gidham]

13 to 17. 13 to 17.

[Co-host]

13 to17. It was a science camp.

[Gidham]

Science summer camp. Open since 1963. And how'd you get in?

[Co-host]

Because of your massive fucking iq?

[Host]

Like an experiment or something. You have to write an essay.

[Gidham]

My parents saw an ad in Boys Life magazine and wanted to get rid of me for a month.

[Johnny Law]

Got you the check cleared.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

So you could be.

The camp was a month?

[Gidham]

It was. Oh, there was three sessions. There was eight weeks, six weeks and four weeks. So.

[Host]

So you did them all?

[Gidham]

No, I did the last four weeks. The last four weeks.

[Co-host]

So they didn't screen any. Any of the. Of the kids or the boys going in? Like you could have just stepped off the short bus and attended science camp. Like, you went. You went to school on the short bus for 12 or six months, then you went to this.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

Mensa camp.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Host]

Keep dropping in the short.

[Co-host]

But they were. They were like anybody's welcome probably.

[Gidham]

As long as. Yeah, the check clears.

[Co-host]

It wasn't for the gifted and talented or super.

[Gidham]

No, there was. There was gifted kids there, but it was.

[Co-host]

But they weren't actively pursuing them, though.

[Gidham]

I know. I don't think. Yeah, it's not like. Like some super station. Yeah, right.

[Co-host]

Okay.

[Gidham]

So I went there in the 90s.

[Co-host]

You loved it.

[Gidham]

I. I loved it. I loved it. Some people didn't like it that I loved it. But we'll get into that later.

[Co-host]

At 13, like if your parents suggested science camp to you, how would you have felt about it for a month? All boy action. As if you didn't have enough all boy action in school.

[Host]

I love all boy action. And you could use that as the weekly quote. I think at 13, I would have rather been running around on my bikes with my friends running around Staten island than going to, you know, a camp like that.

[Gidham]

But.

[Host]

But I can't say that I don't see the appeal of it. I do. Like, I wouldn't be like, I wouldn't say. I don't know why somebody would do it. I get it. I think it would be fun.

[Gidham]

A lot of friends in my neighborhood.

[Host]

Right?

[Gidham]

You probably did.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

So.

[Host]

Right.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

So you were happy to go to camp.

[Gidham]

Yeah. So at. Around. Eventually, for some reason, summer camp starts becoming less popular, I guess people, you.

[Co-host]

Know, with the other kids.

[Gidham]

You mean with. No, with. With kids and parents in general.

[Co-host]

Probably a lot of scandals, right? A lot of touching going on.

[Gidham]

No, no, no.

[Co-host]

It's just a lot of camp counselors getting charged with.

There's this one older camper.

[Gidham]

It's the rise of. It's the rise of phones.

[Host]

Somebody drove a short bus into the lake.

[Johnny Law]

I don't even think he's supposed to be here. He's like 17.

[Co-host]

One 19 year old camper says, who cares? I still love it.

Science, yo.

[Gidham]

Well, those campers become counselors.

[Co-host]

So why does it fall out of favor, you think because it's girls and other interests?

[Gidham]

Well, no, like, I've read articles. It's. Parents have this like, just like stranger danger has increased over the years. Parents are like, we don't want to be away because there was no phones at the camp.

[Host]

Right.

[Gidham]

Unless an emergency you had to send, you would send letters back and forth home. I think a lot of parents go. A lot of parents became like, very paranoid about sending someone away for, you know, 30 days. Yeah. And so they had to start closing some of the cabins. And then eventually attendance was.

[Co-host]

Was.

[Gidham]

Yeah. Started dropping. And then they 2019. They had a point. After the 2019 session, they announced the closure.

[Co-host]

That's still a long time.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

From the 90s to 2019.

[Gidham]

No, 60s from this.

[Co-host]

I know, but since you went though.

[Gidham]

Yes.

[Co-host]

I thought you meant in the 90s. It closed down. That's why you didn't go at 18?

[Gidham]

No, no, no, I couldn't. No, I couldn't go. I. It was the cut off. The cutoff age was 16.

[Co-host]

All right?

[Gidham]

So I got to go at 17 because my birthday was in June, so. But in 2019, they decided to close the camp, but keep it open as a outdoor facility that people could rent. So we decided to have a reunion that year or in 2020. Who's we? And then Covid, the. The alumni.

[Co-host]

You were involved in the decision making?

[Gidham]

Well, yeah. People were like, we're interested in coming.

[Co-host]

You found out about a third hand.

Did you wrangle people? Did you rally people, Old, old people to come and be like, hey, we're going to do. I'm setting this up. Like the curator set up his aunt meet. Did you set up the reunion?

[Gidham]

No. Someone. Someone suggested in the Facebook group.

[Co-host]

There's no waiting.

[Gidham]

Oh, someone said yes, because they're not going to. They're not going to have it if there's no interest.

[Co-host]

They set it up. And you attend it.

[Gidham]

They set it up. I agreed that I wanted to go. I showed interest and we organized that we wanted to go. But then 2020, Covid happened. We had another one in 2021, and.

[Co-host]

You fucking smart ass, couldn't figure a way to do it around Covid. All your scientists couldn't get together and fucking. You bring this brightest and best of a giant superstructure to figure out a cure, man.

[Gidham]

Well, it's not fun. You're running around in fucking masks and shit. So we had it in 2023. No, no, 2022. Sorry. 2022 was the first one.

[Co-host]

Thank God you're getting these facts correct. Yeah, someone's going to.

[Host]

Someone's.

[Co-host]

There are people are going to fact check.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

And be like, bullshit. It's.

[Gidham]

I'm a little mentally drained.

[Host]

The camp still stands as it stood back then.

[Gidham]

Exactly as it stood.

[Host]

And same owners. They just rented out to, like, weddings.

[Gidham]

Owner's original name was Don Whacker.

[Host]

Okay.

[Gidham]

He died, Dave Whacker took over, and now his son, Dave Jr. Runs it.

[Host]

Little Whacker still in the family.

[Co-host]

I would not want my last name to be Whacker.

[Gidham]

Okay. Childhood Don had two children, Dave and Richard Dick Whacker. I told this to John. He didn't believe me. We got to camp and someone brought it up and I was like, see.

[Co-host]

Are those the two most sheltered parents in their. In history that they don't realize, hey, maybe we shouldn't call him Richard? Are they that clueless and like, sheltered from the world?

[Johnny Law]

I can Say this when I got, you know, got to the property. The whole vibe there is like the most wholesome, kind of Walton esque situation. It's. It's so. It's almost. It's almost saccharine. It's so.

[Co-host]

So if somebody were to pull out a dick whacker joke, they would be looked at.

[Host]

They would be scant.

[Johnny Law]

They'd be like, I don't know, what's.

[Co-host]

With this asshole making fun of poor dick?

[Johnny Law]

I think after hours. After hours you can get away with a joke like that. But not. Not during like the five, right?

[Gidham]

Yeah. Yeah. So we. So this was the second annual reunion. Well, the second.

[Host]

An overnight affair.

[Johnny Law]

Yes.

[Host]

Okay. And they knew you were bringing a date?

[Gidham]

No, apparently they thought I was bringing my son. Yeah, because we'll tell the history.

[Co-host]

Like, how can it be?

[Host]

It's got to be some mother Johnny Law attended.

[Johnny Law]

I mean, it must be different mothers.

[Co-host]

So how long in advance do you know?

You need.

You need to bring your plus one.

[Gidham]

They announced it a couple months after the.

[Co-host]

So you're like, you're scrambling. I gotta. I gotta bring a plus one.

[Gidham]

I know. I wanted to after that first time, I wanted to bring a plus one because, like, you want to tell stories and when the people there know the stories, it's not as enthralling.

[Host]

You want an audience?

[Gidham]

Yeah. Yes, an audience. Someone to share this joy with me.

[Co-host]

Yeah, we heard about the boots in 22. Get them. We don't want to hear about them again.

[Johnny Law]

The strangers weren't really willing to pretend to be interested in what he said. So he needed to kind of bring someone that he could share that.

[Co-host]

These are stories all about campsite stories.

Was there a girl girls camp that you guys raided across the lake or anything?

[Gidham]

No, no, no. There was a girls. We had a sister camp called Camponica, but supposedly there was dances with them, but I never really got invited to those, I guess.

[Co-host]

Gotcha.

[Gidham]

So. So the first.

[Co-host]

You didn't have Johnny Law by your side at that time.

[Host]

Could have sued for discrimination.

[Gidham]

Yeah. So the first person I asked is Lindsay. And now this is two years ago, I asked her.

[Co-host]

Lindsay, the one who saved Chuck's mom's life with a kidney.

[Gidham]

And somehow in my head I thought.

[Host]

She'S like, haven't I done enough.

[Gidham]

Again? This is two years ago.

[Co-host]

I gave the. So I didn't have to go, I.

Think I'm gonna have kidney or. Oh, shit, now I really gotta give that kidney. I gotta get out of this.

[Johnny Law]

Get him. You asked her two years ago for this particular weekend?

[Gidham]

Yes.

[Johnny Law]

I mean, if someone asked me to do something in two years, I'd be like, what are you. Like, talk to me. Six months away or something.

[Gidham]

I wanna make sure you can get the time off and everything else like that.

[Johnny Law]

Two years. She might be at a different job.

[Gidham]

Okay. Well, she could put it in her calendar. We have calendars. So I asked her, and I said.

[Co-host]

Sounds hurt that he wasn't the first choice.

[Host]

Her.

[Johnny Law]

Who is this Lindsay?

[Gidham]

I thought she had agreed, and then I brought it up, and she was like.

[Host]

She hung up.

[Gidham]

She was like, I never said I would call it.

[Host]

Who did?

[Gidham]

So I went back and checked the messages, and she never actually agreed. She said, let me think about it. So now I'm scrambling to find somebody.

[Host]

Right.

[Gidham]

So my first thought. Someone suggested Steve. From reviewing history.

[Co-host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

And I kind of hemmed in hard because I'm like, well, what if people think I'm gay because I'm coming up there with a guy.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

And then what?

[Host]

Well, what if people think it's going.

[Gidham]

I would just feel weird, like, that's not me.

[Co-host]

Then what? Did what.

[Gidham]

You. You kind of, you know, assuage my fears that, like, people would think that I was gay.

[Co-host]

Oh, yeah.

[Gidham]

I brought a guy up.

[Co-host]

I would not think that's the first. No.

What is the first, then?

These are close buddies, you know.

Yeah.

They're into. They're into the pals.

They look like they. They would pal around together.

[Host]

A caretaker, perhaps a Make a wish.

[Gidham]

But then Steve bowed out because he had a family obligation. Walt offered to come.

[Co-host]

I did offer to go, which I cleared my schedule. And I. I have a feeling that he. That he was thinking ahead and being like, he doesn't want to hear the stories. He's going to get miserable. And he's going to be.

[Gidham]

I'm going to be seen.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

And I'm going to leave on Friday night, and I even make it to Saturday.

[Gidham]

Yeah. We agreed to the first meal, you'd be out. There's no chicken tenders there. There's no French fries.

[Co-host]

I stepped up, and I was like. I felt bad because he was scrambling and nobody would say yes. And I was like, if you can't find anybody, I'll go.

[Host]

What a good friend.

[Co-host]

I thought so.

[Gidham]

So then I reached. I. I asked Jimmy. Jimmy never got back. Oh, no?

[Co-host]

No.

[Gidham]

I asked Natalie, Chuck's girlfriend, if she wanted to go.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

And. But before.

[Co-host]

And you were really, really worried that people were gonna think you were homosexual, right?

[Johnny Law]

No.

[Gidham]

No. Again, it was a.

[Co-host]

It was something that was on your mind constantly.

[Gidham]

No, you got it out of my head. That would happen.

[Co-host]

Rubbing your back, telling you no one's gonna think you're gay.

It's okay, gay boy.

Sorry. You're a manly man. You slay that place.

[Gidham]

Everybody knows it.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

Then he gets caught. They're like, all right, get him. Let's hear your stories.

[Gidham]

He's like, oh, no.

[Host]

I walked into a Key west in the bathroom. That counts, right?

[Gidham]

I still think about it every night. So I asked Natalie and I asked Johnny Law, and Johnny was the first person to get back, like, within a minute. He was like, yeah, I'm in. Yeah. Yeah.

[Co-host]

You're an outdoorsman.

[Johnny Law]

I love this stuff.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, yeah.

[Gidham]

That was the other criteria. I was trying to find people who.

[Co-host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

Who would enjoy the outdoors.

[Host]

Right.

[Gidham]

Like, no air conditioning. I felt would have probably put Walt out a bit.

[Johnny Law]

There was a lot.

[Co-host]

There was no air conditioning.

[Johnny Law]

I have to say.

[Gidham]

No.

[Co-host]

Holy.

Wow.

[Johnny Law]

I don't. I don't think you would have enjoyed this.

[Host]

Not a single piece of it, not.

[Johnny Law]

One piece of this would you have enjoyed, because there'd be other stuff that was happening that would have destroyed your ability to enjoy what's going on. The food.

[Co-host]

How do you guys.

[Gidham]

I think you would have liked rotating games. Rotating games. I think you would have liked.

[Co-host]

Okay, but how do you guys handle that kind of environment where there's. Especially at this past weekend. It was moist, sticky, thick.

[Host]

You bet it was. Oh, the weather. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Wait, what other sleeping arrangements?

[Gidham]

Cabins.

[Host]

Two to a cabin.

[Gidham]

No, it's a cabin for. You could hold eight people.

[Johnny Law]

There were three total in the cabin.

[Co-host]

So you're sleeping with strangers?

[Johnny Law]

Well, one stranger, I'm assuming in the same room.

[Co-host]

Or is it. Do you have your own room?

[Johnny Law]

It's one big kind of room, like.

[Co-host]

With, like, bunk beds.

[Johnny Law]

Bunk beds.

[Co-host]

Holy.

[Gidham]

I did.

[Johnny Law]

I did.

[Co-host]

Can you imagine?

[Gidham]

Now I'm gonna say I did tell Lindsay that I could probably arrange for her to have her a different cabin than mine.

[Host]

Okay.

[Gidham]

So, like, we would not. It would be like, oh, get him.

[Host]

I don't think anybody is thinking that you. Well, my first would be at all disrespectful.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

Not a complete gentleman. The first.

[Gidham]

The first reunion there after the first night, my cabinet was like, I hate to say this, but I have to leave. Your snoring is so bad. I could. I couldn't sleep at all.

[Host]

Okay.

[Gidham]

So I'm like, okay, I'm good with my own private cabin.

[Host]

Right.

[Gidham]

So I could just, you know, bounce off the walls there.

[Host]

So you left Johnny Law alone with the other person?

[Gidham]

No, this is my first couple years.

[Co-host]

So I had to leave because I.

[Johnny Law]

Very much got to witness the snoring.

[Host]

The snoring, really? Yeah.

[Co-host]

Well, so did Walt. Right, when you were in Florida, right? Yeah.

We slept many nights in our hotel. And it is. It is shocking that he's not still alive. The way that he snores. Like he has that apnea. Oh, my God. He needs Cerebro from fucking. What's that from X Men. He needs that over his face. He needs some massive.

[Host]

Yeah, the. What do they call those machines?

[Johnny Law]

A cpap.

[Host]

Yeah, cpap. Why don't you. Why don't you try that?

[Gidham]

I gotta go first.

[Johnny Law]

You'd have to go to probably a doctor.

[Host]

Yeah. You can't buy one at Goodwill.

[Johnny Law]

That's the road.

[Host]

The flea market. Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

Any Victorian breathing machines.

[Co-host]

So you came. You came down here, you met up with Gidem, and then you guys drove from here together.

What's your first reaction when you get this text? You're like, is this real?

[Johnny Law]

I was driving, actually. I was taking my parents out for their anniversary. My wife's in the car and my parents. And like, on the screen, it pops up, you know, hey, do you want to come to this camp? Other stuff. So I go, can I go to the summer camp? So I was like, you know, can I go to the summer camp with. With. Get him. Is. Does that. Are we doing anything that week?

[Host]

Right.

[Johnny Law]

My wife kind of, like, knows what? Sure. Everything's going on. So she's like, yeah, that's fine. And my parents are like, what are you doing? Like, I'm going to go to the summer camp with this guy. Get him. And they're like, oh, okay. Like, very strange. But I was like, but they know.

[Host]

You'Re an outdoorsy type.

[Co-host]

Yeah. This isn't a gay man you're going with, is it?

[Gidham]

Is he a bear?

[Johnny Law]

And. And so I was, like, thrilled to do this because he told me there'd be fishing.

[Gidham]

I sent you a link. Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

And he was right. It was. It was a great time. I really did have a blast.

[Co-host]

And what's the missus thing? Because you don't really. I mean, your only time you spent with Gidham is with the time you've been here. So you're really going.

[Host]

No, they hung out in Key west together.

[Johnny Law]

Oh, that's right.

[Co-host]

I forgot. Yes. I was near you. Okay, so. All right, I take it back. So the missus knows that you're.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

You know, she's like, you know, she's like, obviously, you know, she's pregnant now.

[Host]

Oh, congratulations, man.

[Johnny Law]

You know, she's like, obviously my number one priority should be going to the summer camp.

[Host]

Yes.

[Gidham]

Well. But he asked me two years ago.

[Host]

Once that baby comes, you won't be having time for summer camp shenanigans.

[Co-host]

Right?

[Johnny Law]

We'll see. You know how far along I like that. She is like three months along now.

[Gidham]

Well, technically at the next reunion.

[Johnny Law]

She was thrilled by the way that I was out of the house.

[Gidham]

His wife and baby.

[Host]

Right?

[Gidham]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Host]

Oh, yeah.

[Gidham]

There was a lot of families there. So many families.

[Johnny Law]

If you can get my wife to stay in one of those cabins, I'll give you a thousand dollars.

[Host]

Might as well sleep in a spider's web.

[Gidham]

No, it's very clean. It's a very clean place. Nickname.

[Co-host]

You're very concerned that people were going to think you're a homosexual. But if you brought Lindsay or you brought Natalie very quickly, it would have been evident that you guys were just friends. So maybe they would think that, like, you were just their gay friend.

[Gidham]

Yeah, possibly.

[Co-host]

So no matter what, people are going to think you're gay going to this camp.

So I have to ask, though, did I put the seed of asking Johnny in your head? Because I remember one afternoon, or we were driving somewhere and I said, here's what you do. Get him. You asked Johnny to go in your place and pretend that he's you and that you guys have work done. You got your teeth fixed and you got your shit together.

[Host]

And we could have put an earpiece in so Gideon could have told him what to say and do.

[Co-host]

I said, you go and say you sleep in the woods and you watch everything from afar. Then you realize all of a sudden, Lindsay has decided she will attend.

[Host]

She's going to be sleeping in a.

[Co-host]

Cabin with Johnny Law.

[Gidham]

And you're holding.

[Host]

So does Natalie.

[Gidham]

Which would not have been out of place.

[Host]

Oh, yeah. There was an arrangement like this.

[Gidham]

So what?

[Johnny Law]

Yes.

[Gidham]

So my first year there, I saw this guy there with two women and I thought that, like, one was a spouse and the other one was a friend.

[Co-host]

Right?

[Gidham]

But then, like after camp, I kind of like, you roll it over in your head. I'm like, I wonder if they were like a tri couple, like a throuple.

[Co-host]

Is that legal in New Jersey?

[Gidham]

We weren't in New Jersey.

[Johnny Law]

I mean, I don't think they were married.

[Co-host]

Oh, that was in Pennsylvania.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, I don't think they were married. So they were just together. They were partners. Kind of thing.

[Gidham]

But they were back this year and like, through overhearing, like, they were an actual.

[Co-host]

So this guy who's scored two women, he's got two gals on each arm.

[Gidham]

Yeah, well, one guy, he's the smartest.

[Co-host]

Guy in that camp. Like, how did he handle that?

[Johnny Law]

Well, you're gonna see the women first. Oh, no.

[Gidham]

Oh, no, no, no, no, no. Is he the most. They might listen. They might listen.

[Co-host]

Was he the most popular dude in camp?

[Gidham]

Not that.

[Co-host]

Was he somebody that. You're like, that dude. So fucking got some Riz.

[Host]

He was in the land of the blind.

[Gidham]

He was.

[Host]

One eyed man is king.

[Gidham]

Yeah, he was late 90s.

[Co-host]

All right.

[Gidham]

Yeah. Wow.

[Co-host]

Two women.

[Gidham]

Yeah, it was.

[Co-host]

And you know, he brings both just to show off. He's like, oh, you brought your wife? My wives, yeah.

[Host]

Look at how not gay I am. It seems like that's all they care about.

[Gidham]

Well, they took off for a full day.

[Host]

You sure? Wasn't a gay conversion camp they sent you to. He's just not aware.

[Gidham]

They took off for a full day to go, like, antiquing.

[Host]

Yeah, sure.

[Gidham]

Yeah, they did. Apparently the world's largest uranium glass museum is in Pennsylvania, close by the camp, so.

[Co-host]

All right. So did you know that there would be no air conditioning? Yeah, you need it.

[Johnny Law]

And you're like, I figured there would be no power in the cabins, so I was ready.

[Co-host]

But you're like, you do that? You.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, I like.

[Co-host]

You go into the middle of the wilderness with a satellite phone and nothing else?

[Johnny Law]

Well, yeah, other gear.

[Co-host]

So is this like the Four Seasons then?

[Johnny Law]

No, the Four Seasons is still the Four Seasons. You know, I still like the Four Seasons. Yeah. It was better accommodations than I anticipated.

[Gidham]

So you have power, water, toilets. Everything's in every cabin. You know, hot water.

[Host]

Oh, great.

[Gidham]

Yeah, yeah. So what they do now is it's an outdoor facility, so for apparently three months a year, they rent it out to a Jewish summer camp.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

So they don't have to, you know, the Jewish summer camp runs everything and they just, you know, collect the check for the. Right, yeah. Facilities. They have a rock wall climbing course, archery, the lake. So many things.

[Co-host]

So who's the first person that you walk up on?

[Gidham]

Introduce Johnny to the camp director's son, Dave Jr. So we go to check in Wacker. Dave Whacker Jr.

[Johnny Law]

Yes, D. Wacker.

[Gidham]

So he's like, oh, oh. He's like, okay. I was so confused. He goes, I thought you had a son. I was confusing you with somebody else who had a similar name.

[Johnny Law]

But I Think. I think we. My impression of this whole first meeting, I really thought that you really knew these guys, like, really knew these people, and that they knew you really well. I was expecting, like, you know, him to walk up and they'd be like, oh, yeah, right.

[Host]

How have you been?

[Johnny Law]

How's it going? It's like there was.

[Co-host]

People didn't know even went to the camp.

[Johnny Law]

I kind of felt bad for Gideon because Gidham was, like, on the drive down saying, you know, oh, these are some of the greatest guys. And, like, there was this closeness and stuff like that. And then the first person he meets is kind of like, which one are you?

[Co-host]

Dave Whacker. Didn't know.

[Gidham]

You didn't know.

[Host]

Well, he was. He was after your time.

[Gidham]

Well, he's. Yeah, that was.

[Co-host]

Senior would have known, you know.

[Gidham]

Senior, yes.

[Co-host]

Yeah. Well, you used to do. You got talked to a lot in camp?

[Johnny Law]

Oh, yeah, I actually did.

[Co-host]

He got in trouble this weekend, people.

[Johnny Law]

So there were. There were a lot of counselors that attended this, you know, and these counselors would have been Giddam's counselors.

[Co-host]

And how many. How many attendees do you think would you put at this weekend? How many were there?

[Gidham]

70.

[Co-host]

Whoa.

[Johnny Law]

Wow. 70.

[Gidham]

With all the kids and everything. I don't think I could pull up. I could pull up the photo.

[Johnny Law]

I don't know.

[Gidham]

Yeah, okay.

[Johnny Law]

I don't think it was. I could be wrong, but, yeah, I was thinking more like 40.

[Host]

40. Still.

[Johnny Law]

Still, you know, impressive. But I might be wrong, but the counselors were really impressed, I think, with how Gidham has changed over the years because one of them described Giddum as a camper, as an insufferable asshole. So I really was expecting to go there and be like, oh, Johnny, can.

[Co-host]

You aim that up at your mouth a little more?

[Gidham]

No, just tilt the mic.

[Co-host]

Just tilt the mic.

[Gidham]

The actual Mike, it's. No, no.

[Co-host]

Yeah, there you go. There you go.

[Johnny Law]

So I was really expecting it to be like. Like a. Like a. Like a frat reunion or something that everyone's like. But it. It was very clear right from the start that no one really liked Giddam.

[Co-host]

Why would you do.

[Johnny Law]

I felt really bad about that.

[Host]

Didn't like him back then or now?

[Johnny Law]

No, they really like him now.

[Host]

Oh, well, that's all right.

[Co-host]

What are you doing back then to cause people to hate you so much?

[Gidham]

It was a horrific asshole.

[Co-host]

What were some of the things you.

[Gidham]

Did that, like, I was just. I would not do what I was told. Like, I.

[Co-host]

So what would you do then?

[Gidham]

The exact Opposite.

[Co-host]

Okay, give us an example of what you did that. I want to know what.

[Host]

It was a strong word.

[Co-host]

Yeah, but it's correct, especially for everyone to be unified in it.

[Gidham]

I, I had a problem with my, with my junior counselor so much that my counselor made him put me on his back and carry him around a field to try to make sure this.

[Co-host]

Wasn'T a gay camp.

[Johnny Law]

They used to do this, this run or something. They would, they would be running somewhere.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

Because we had this whole conversation with the counselor and everyone in the camp would be running and Gidem would just stop and say, I'm done and refuse to run anymore. Right. So in order to kind of create some type of accountability and bonding, the counselor was instructed to pick, get him up, put him on his back and keep running so he could stay with the group. But he would just, you know, he would just basically say, how heavy was this?

[Host]

Weren't you 17?

[Gidham]

No, this was probably going to. When I was about 16 or 15.

[Co-host]

So you have a grown man on your back?

[Johnny Law]

No, no, no, he's A grown man is carrying.

[Gidham]

Oh, yeah, yeah, he's carrying me because.

[Johnny Law]

He'S refusing to run.

[Co-host]

Oh my gosh.

[Host]

Why would you.

[Co-host]

And you were okay with this? Like you were okay with having to crawl on some man's back?

[Gidham]

Just so I don' so much, but Colin told me to do it did.

[Co-host]

Somehow by the end of the race, were you facing, like face to face? You were making out as running around the field.

[Host]

They should have just put a, a Kentucky Fried chicken bucket on a, on a fishing pole and dangled it in front of him.

[Gidham]

So that's the, the photo from the.

[Host]

Wow.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Host]

So wait, when this guy would carry you about. So he told you the story? You got the story?

[Johnny Law]

I got the story. Get him. Was there.

[Host]

So if. Yeah, but he doesn't want to tell it.

[Co-host]

I could tell.

[Gidham]

I was also drinking.

[Host]

So, so, so when, when they carried him, he would just be like, nah, I'm done.

[Johnny Law]

And then who?

[Host]

The guy that had to carry him was there.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Host]

So did you ask questions? We like, what's it like to carry this loaf?

[Johnny Law]

So he was just like, he's like, I didn't want to do it. He goes. But Colin thought it would be a good idea to kind of make, force him to kind of be a part of what was happening. And then I think they assumed that, well, this is what kid wants to be carried by another man. Like eventually he'll get off and just run.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

What kid.

[Host]

What kid wants, wants to get shamed about how office. The mess he is. We get to week what, kid? We can do whatever you want. We can say it any way you want.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah. This is a pattern of behavior.

[Host]

Yeah. No, it's not even a pattern. It's just the behavior. Yeah.

[Co-host]

Yeah.

[Host]

So.

[Johnny Law]

So they. They tried lots of different things, but he was, by all accounts, campers and counselors, very, very different.

[Co-host]

Now, why did you like it, the camp, so much if this was the kind of behavior and attitude you were.

Permeating, like, universally low.

[Gidham]

I did have some friends. They just didn't happen to be there, like, Baba Sunday.

[Co-host]

This the guy?

Oh, this is the guy that went to Thanksgiving or something with his eyes.

Open from Africa or something.

[Gidham]

Nigeria. Nigeria, yeah.

[Host]

Thought it was the name of a.

[Co-host]

Tree for a second.

[Gidham]

No. Babatunde. Yes. Like, I had some friends that.

[Co-host]

He's going by the name of Steve Davidson right now. He's why your credit's so fucked up. Stole away back then.

[Gidham]

So I had a small, like, insular group of friends, and that's kind of who I would hang out with.

[Host]

But would you say. Did you get the sense, Johnny Law, that he was like that every year and every year he'd come back and be like, motherfucker, this guy's back.

[Johnny Law]

It's so. I don't know that. I don't know that there was, like, any improvement that was so big from year to year that the counselors weren't like. Like a little bit of.

[Host]

Are there any other examples? Did you gather any other facts?

[Johnny Law]

Well, there was another one where. So everyone has chores that they to do, right. And, you know, you spin a wheel or whatever and you've got to do those chores that's assigned to you. And so people are, you know, sweeping the cat.

[Co-host]

You have to do this too.

[Johnny Law]

No, no, no, no. This is in the past.

[Co-host]

Oh, in the past. Okay.

[Johnny Law]

So, you know, one kid has to sweep, another kid has to do. Take the trash out, another kid has to clean the bathrooms or whatever. And everyone gets. Everyone gets sometimes, you know, the end of the stick, you gotta clean the bathroom. He refused to clean the bathroom, did not clean the bathroom, would not clean the bathroom. Not because of where. Why I wouldn't want to clean the bathroom is. It's disgusting. There's filth in there. No, it's because the cleaner that they chose to use was a cleaner that he didn't like. He thought it was.

[Gidham]

Well, you, you know, it was Bon Amy. It was like a powdered cleaner.

[Co-host]

I remember that.

[Gidham]

And yeah, like, the smell of it. And, like, the fact it would bubble when it would get wet. Like, I was constantly afraid I was going to get burned.

[Host]

Wow.

[Gidham]

And stuff. So, like, I would. So what I would do is I would try to trade off. There was a job called runner, which before every meal.

[Co-host]

There's an irony for you.

[Gidham]

15 minutes before every meal is runners called and you.

[Co-host]

Where's Dick Whacker? He'll have to carry me while I do the runner.

[Gidham]

So you would go. You would go to the dining hall and set up.

[Host]

Me up Dick?

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, Mount them, Dick.

[Gidham]

You would go to the dining hall and set up the. The table for. For the meal?

[Host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

And then during the meal, you would go get the food, get replenishments, stuff like that.

[Host]

And you'd complain while you did that.

[Gidham]

No, no. That's the job I love.

[Host]

Okay.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

So again. But it is.

[Gidham]

But I would trade for bathroom. And then Colin would be like, no, you have to. One time a session trying to teach you.

[Host]

They're trying to teach you lessons.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah. Not receptive.

[Co-host]

But the. No, he has. From the whole time I've known him, he has waxed poetically. And the amount of admiration and affection he has for anybody who attended that camp spoke about them as if they were the salt of the earth. So I like you. I would assume that when he gets there, he's walking into the campsite like Norm.

[Johnny Law]

That's what I thought from Cheers.

[Co-host]

And it wasn't the case, though.

[Johnny Law]

No, it wasn't Norm. It was the mailman. Cliff. Cliff. He was Cliff.

[Gidham]

He was Cliff.

[Co-host]

Oh, you made it great.

So why do you.

[Johnny Law]

But people. I should say people really like him.

[Host]

Now, juxtap.

[Co-host]

Why do you look back on it with such fondness if you weren't really doing in and like, kind of being.

[Gidham]

I had a great time even being.

[Co-host]

Like, refusing to participate.

[Gidham]

Yeah, I had a great time. Like, I.

[Co-host]

You didn't realize everybody was mad at you and annoying.

[Gidham]

Not really. Nor did I probably care. So as long as I was doing.

[Host]

My ignorance is bliss. I'm sweating him. At least.

[Gidham]

I'm swimming, I'm fishing. I'm, you know, doing carried around.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

Doing my. I'm doing my video, I'm doing my robotics. I'm doing my knowledge.

[Co-host]

Guys are popping and jiving there when you're doing the robot.

[Gidham]

No, no, no, no. We had a robotic slap.

[Co-host]

Oh.

[Gidham]

So, like, we were the robots and stuff.

[Co-host]

The science of breaking 80s that you.

Guys had a cardboard box that you were spinning around on. So what's the first night like?

[Johnny Law]

So you have to. You have to choose.

[Co-host]

And he picked up the tab for you to call, right?

[Johnny Law]

He did. Which was incredibly generous.

[Co-host]

How much was the tab? 200 bucks, right?

[Gidham]

Yeah. Plus I bought him a T shirt.

[Co-host]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

I will treasure it. Thank you. So we get there the first night, we gotta unpack the car. We gotta pick where we're sleeping. And right away, like, as I see him get out of the car, I see, like, four phones spill out onto my seat next to me. I'm like, what in the world? What is each one of these functions? Because you don't. There's barely any service up there.

[Host]

Sure.

[Johnny Law]

You barely are using one phone. Why do we have four phones there? I didn't say anything because I was like, you know what?

[Host]

Did you get an answer?

[Johnny Law]

Eventually I got an answer.

[Host]

Okay.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah. And then. So we all pack out. We go to car.

[Gidham]

The.

[Johnny Law]

Like, the. The cabin. We have to pick places to sleep. One's already been selected. So I pick one near a window, and he picks one the furthest away because he's concerned about how loud. How loud the snoring is going to be. And then we go and we get some dinner. This was very concerning. We got. I love camp food. Right? It's great. It's nostalgic. It's fun. They gave us spaghetti and meat sauce.

[Gidham]

Really good meat sauce. Like, so you can see the chunks of ground beef in it.

[Host]

Yeah. Okay.

[Gidham]

John.

[Co-host]

He does not agree with that.

[Gidham]

And garlic bread.

[Co-host]

He does not agree with the assessment.

[Host]

It was good meat.

[Johnny Law]

Perfectly edible.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

And I'm not. I'm not some, like, food snob. I'm no Ming Chen who's trying everything out there in the world. This was like. It was all right. You know, it's like they give you the. The. The pasta comes dry, and then you put. Put on a little sauce that's like a. Yeah. About how it goes.

[Host]

Okay.

[Johnny Law]

Not great.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

He turns to me and he goes, you know, this is probably the best meal I've had in about three months.

[Co-host]

And I.

And I'm like, that's by choice, though.

[Johnny Law]

I'm like, get him. How is that possible? It's like.

[Gidham]

Like, it was like. It was the perfect amount. You were doing it. So it's a perfect amount of pasta to sauce ratio. The garlic bread, I love.

[Johnny Law]

But it did depress me when you said that.

[Gidham]

But it's also. It's going back in my brain of, like, I could taste that garlic bread again. So, like, all those good memories are coming forward.

[Johnny Law]

Okay.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

Okay. So it was More than just the food, then hopefully it was the nostalgia.

[Host]

Glaring at him over a fire.

[Johnny Law]

Because I brought this up. I brought this up to other people at the camp because I thought maybe they would get a similar reaction to get them be like, maybe it's just a thing. Maybe like this pasta and spaghetti, it's like that's the meal. And, like, not at all. Like, this guy Jack was like, what? So this was terrible.

[Co-host]

Now, do you attack the.

[Gidham]

The.

[Co-host]

The dining hall like you do at China Buffet, or do you, like. You, like, go up multiple times?

[Gidham]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. We went through at least two plates of. Two pans of spaghetti. Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

It's all you can eat.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

Well, I mean, you paid for it for that. You better. You better make it worth your while.

[Gidham]

I was all you can eat when I was a camper there, but I still managed to lose weight. So then after dinner was. What did we do? Oh, we went fishing.

[Johnny Law]

We did. We went fishing. We caught some fish.

[Host]

Oh, that's nice. Yeah.

[Gidham]

Didn't catch as many as I. You know, it was a little. It was a little slow.

[Johnny Law]

I think the first night was slow.

[Host]

So Lake Lakeside. Little lakeside fishing.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Host]

And they provide the poles and the bait.

[Johnny Law]

I brought. I brought all that.

[Host]

Okay.

[Co-host]

Johnny don't use.

[Gidham]

Oh, my.

[Co-host]

He's not gonna use those old poles.

Poles from the 60s.

[Gidham]

Well, no, they don't.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

They don't provide you poles. But. But if you ever seen Chuck set up for, like, when he films.

[Co-host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

Johnny's is double that and all fishing stuff. Like, he's popping open canisters. It's like, no, no, this is not the right lake gear. This is the right lake gear.

[Co-host]

And when you. What you catch, do you keep or.

[Johnny Law]

You throw it back for something like this? I throw back. Yeah. The only time I'll keep something very limited is if I have a legal striper and I'm with my buddy who we can cook at his place, or if it's a particularly great trout in an. In an area that has lots of trout. Right.

[Host]

Either way, you're gonna eat it that night.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah. Oh, yeah.

[Host]

That's great.

[Co-host]

And I'm. When does the drinking start?

[Host]

Blow past the fishing already.

[Co-host]

I imagine he's drinking while he's fishing.

[Gidham]

That.

[Johnny Law]

No, no, no, no, no, no, no. He is disciplined. Yeah.

[Co-host]

You want to hook someone in the eye with a drunken cast.

[Johnny Law]

There is a time and a place for drinking at this.

[Gidham]

Right?

[Host]

Okay.

[Co-host]

Oh, really?

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

There's limit. There's the time frame. You can only drink.

[Johnny Law]

Well, no, like, it's just. No one is really drinking up until the fire.

[Gidham]

Oh, no, there was. If you're looking at. There was people who had them in koozies. Yeah. It was kind of hidden. Not me, though.

[Johnny Law]

I don't think they were really embracing the spirit then.

[Host]

How long has it been since you've been fishing?

[Gidham]

Bright Rice was the last time Fry tries. Yeah.

[Host]

And did you catch something then?

[Gidham]

No, nobody caught anything.

[Host]

How much did you get? How much did you catch this time?

[Co-host]

Good amount.

That was the only photos I got.

[Host]

Wow.

[Gidham]

If you count.

[Co-host]

They kept showing me pictures of all.

[Gidham]

The fish I caught about at least 10 bait fish. And then that resulted in probably about six or seven actual.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, we were constantly.

[Gidham]

And there was a couple that they threw the hook at the last possible second. So.

[Co-host]

Yeah.

[Host]

And then. Is it just the two of you fishing or you were fishing in a group?

[Johnny Law]

Just us.

[Host]

So how long you fishing? And walk me through that comment. Like, you know, that's man bonding time. That's like searching out the universe.

[Gidham]

He was like, do you mind if. Do you mind if we go fishing? I'm like, yeah, I want to go fishing. Like, I don't. If I'm fishing, I don't care if I'm actually fishing.

[Co-host]

Fishing.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

Like, it's just being out there.

[Host]

But did you feel, Johnny Law, that you got to the real get him in that time? Because it's very difficult. I've known this man at this point 15 years, and I still only feel like I own the flashes.

[Johnny Law]

I've peeled a layer of the onion away.

[Host]

Right.

[Johnny Law]

I don't know if I'm at the deepest layer now. He's crying, but I'm certainly peeling it away. And he is just a really sweet, great guy. That's what it comes down to.

[Host]

He is.

[Johnny Law]

And it was also great to see him in a situation where for whatever negativity existed at that camp. Just the opposite this time. These guys loved him by the end of it.

[Gidham]

And that was new to you.

[Co-host]

He's not refusing to do shit anymore, right?

[Johnny Law]

No, he's. He's not a burden.

[Co-host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

Rotating games. I refuse to do.

[Host]

Well, not those people.

[Johnny Law]

Well, yeah, but they even said you don't have to do every everything, you know? So there was a point in time where they're like, oh, we're saying setting ups are rotating. It was the first day. It was like they were doing for an hour.

[Gidham]

It was the second day. That's when we went fishing.

[Johnny Law]

And they were like, well, let's just go.

[Co-host]

Well, the guy that carried You. Was he there this weekend?

[Gidham]

Yes.

[Co-host]

So you didn't want to say, hey man, let me climb on.

[Gidham]

Let's take a. Let's take a. I didn't remember until he told me.

[Co-host]

He collapses and dies.

[Gidham]

He tries to. No, I did not.

[Host]

I did not like just snap in the wrong way.

[Gidham]

He asked me at the campfire. He's like, do you remember when Colin made me carry you around the soccer field? And I was like, no, I really don't remember that at all.

[Co-host]

Now I feel like that's something I remember.

How could you not remember that? Like, is. Do you have like a tumor or something removed?

[Gidham]

I, I just, I, I now remember every single thing that happened.

[Co-host]

If a grown man carried me around his back as a punisher.

[Gidham]

Well, Jack's only like two years.

[Co-host]

I would never forget it.

[Gidham]

He's only two years older than me. He's not really a grown, grown man.

[Co-host]

Okay, you're 17. He was 19.

[Gidham]

Yeah, he could have went.

[Co-host]

He could have gone off to war.

[Gidham]

Or he was 15. Or I was 15 and he was 17. Okay. Yeah.

[Co-host]

All right, all right. Even then I can't imagine me ever forgetting the day. The smell, the feeling of his sticky, sweaty body is. I have to hold on to it.

Because you're lazy. Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

You don't even have to forget it.

[Co-host]

And you're like, that's a black spot. I don't know what happened. For me, it didn't happen.

[Gidham]

I like, I remember a lot of fights. Like you got in the fistbutts. No, no. Headbutt. Well, no, I did get a. I had a camp ride in like, his name was Brett Fulton. And one day we got into like a little bit of an argument and he ended up kicking me in the balls.

[Co-host]

What'd you do?

[Gidham]

I went down and everyone else at the cab was like, Brett, run until he recovers. Just get away from him.

[Co-host]

Were you the type that would like get all red faced and like out of control?

[Gidham]

In like what kind of sense? Spaz.

[Co-host]

Yeah, like a spaz.

Basically just swinging your arms.

Yeah, like swinging. Like crying and shit at the same time.

[Gidham]

I think I was like more of a grappler. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Co-host]

So you're a wrestler, right?

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

Was Brett there this weekend?

[Gidham]

No.

[Co-host]

Okay. He could have got his ass back.

Johnny kicked him in the nuts in front of his family.

Hold him down, Johnny.

[Gidham]

So, so then after fishing was.

[Johnny Law]

Well, well, you gave it dinner too.

[Host]

Digging through the trash for the spaghetti raccoons.

[Johnny Law]

Out of the way, John.

[Co-host]

You got a thermos?

[Host]

I. To Want to.

[Co-host]

I want to pour this meat sauce in there.

[Host]

This will stay good for the rest of the weekend.

[Johnny Law]

So there's another. So I think it may have been right before we fish, but, you know, G took me around the property a little bit.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

And was explaining, you know, hey, this is the cabin that I stayed in. Or this is where the old robotics or the computer lab was. And then we walk up on this kind of condemned looking building. Like, you can tell it's in total disrepair. It looks like the building the camp wanted to forget.

[Host]

Okay.

[Johnny Law]

And we walked in.

[Host]

What type of building? Like a cabin.

[Johnny Law]

I couldn't tell. We had to walk in. It looked like a cabin.

[Co-host]

You were allowed to go into it.

[Johnny Law]

We went into it.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

And what I see. What I see are these.

[Gidham]

No door.

[Johnny Law]

It looks like a place you'd bring cattle into with little spickets on top.

[Host]

Oh, my God.

[Gidham]

No, no, no, no.

[Co-host]

That's where the meat sauce came from.

[Gidham]

The first half of this room is.

[Host]

Chunks of meat blocking up the nozzles again. I told you.

[Gidham]

So you come in and you're looking at a wall, except for, like two doors at either end.

[Host]

It's like the showers at, like, Auschwitz.

[Johnny Law]

That's what it reminded me.

[Host]

That's what it sounds like you're describing.

[Johnny Law]

I didn't want to say it, but that's exactly what it reminded me.

[Gidham]

With benches. And then when you go around to the other side, it has those wood lattice work. It's adjusted. The whole back end of the cabin is exposed with those wood lattice work. You can see out and people could see in.

[Johnny Law]

If you were to ask someone, what's that building? We don't speak of that building.

[Host]

Yeah, right. National shame.

[Co-host]

So what'd you guys do in there?

[Johnny Law]

Well, we walked in and I. And he kind of, you know, gave me.

[Gidham]

I already explained it to you on the way out.

[Host]

This is where they put bars of soap in a towel.

[Johnny Law]

And it was like, well, this is where we all would come to shower. And I said, oh, okay. You know, and hey, listen, that time period, you know, kids in gym, they, you know, they'd all shower together.

[Host]

I'd never do that. And I'm older than him.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, I didn't do that.

[Co-host]

I'd be like, you guys didn't partake in a shower in Jim the.

I looked around at the camp.

[Johnny Law]

No, no, me neither. We were at the age where there probably were so many, you know, sexual assault lawsuits that had already come about, that the school was.

[Co-host]

Hey, were there any Sanduskies at the camp that you thought of.

[Gidham]

Okay, there we go.

[Co-host]

Sorry, it just dipped out all of a sudden.

Were there any Sandusky's at the camp?

[Gidham]

No. No.

[Co-host]

Nobody even thought. I'm like, that guy might be a Sandusky.

[Johnny Law]

But. But there was some. There was some what I would consider code name Sandusky, questionable practices. Okay.

[Co-host]

In the shower.

[Johnny Law]

In the shower. Because what was done was the kids would be kind of corralled in.

[Gidham]

We would go by cabins.

[Co-host]

So wait a minute, don't tell me the counselors got to watch.

[Johnny Law]

They watched.

[Gidham]

Oh, my God. One particular. Not the counselor.

[Co-host]

This was a gay camp.

[Johnny Law]

One particular.

[Host]

You don't remember God carrying you? There's a lot of things you don't remember, buddy.

[Gidham]

I remember the shower cabin.

[Co-host]

I mean, it's Camp Dick Whacker, for Christ sake.

[Johnny Law]

And so there was an individual who was tasked with watching. Now that's not the shit job. I think this guy. I think this guy liked the job. I think that.

[Gidham]

Was either Don or Neil who did this. Well, and they would check you in and they would make sure you were at least cleaning yourself. Like, I'm not sure they, like they were intently staring at you.

[Co-host]

Got you right now.

[Gidham]

Looking for.

[Host]

We're in the same way saying, you don't want to put the wrong impression of these people out there.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Host]

So we should be very.

[Gidham]

We already got one extra. We already got one new listener from the listening. No more.

[Co-host]

Oh, no.

[Host]

So. So we should be very clear that we're just making jokes that there were no.

[Co-host]

That is a rough job though.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

So that's not the job everybody wants.

I'd rather clean out the shower.

Get a little odder.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah. Because it's. It's fine if you want to have someone in. In the shower, near the shower to make sure, you know, there's no funny business going on. There's no harassing and stuff. But you don't. I don't know that you need to be physically witnessing it. You could be like the room over.

[Host]

Sure.

[Gidham]

Well, he was by that door because that's also where there was no controls on the showers for the temperature. Mr. Wacker would actually. There was like a main.

[Co-host]

Total control.

[Gidham]

Like there was a main control of it all.

[Co-host]

He could control it.

[Gidham]

Yeah. It was in like, it was in a low lock cabin. So that's where he would stand. And like, if everyone was like, oh, it's getting too cold, he would turn the hot water off.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah. He's like, neil, let's make these boys dance.

[Host]

All right.

[Co-host]

Okay.

[Gidham]

But it's like. It's eight. It's like eight showers. And again, there's no partition.

[Host]

So you remember showering there?

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Host]

You remembered Bucks and balls all over the place.

[Co-host]

So did you guys. Did you guys ever pull up Porkies and look through. You know, when you look through the.

At other guys.

[Johnny Law]

You didn't have to.

[Host]

Stand next to him.

[Co-host]

You just got that job.

There's that thing called the Porky's I look through.

[Gidham]

Peephole.

[Co-host]

Yeah, peephole.

There's no such thing as a peephole in a shower. What's it called? Like, I guess the.

Oh, like a drain hole or something.

Drain hole or something.

Yeah.

[Host]

I don't know. Something like a pipe that went through.

[Co-host]

I forget on the poster of Porky.

[Gidham]

So. But, but again, it's. It's like eight shower heads all in a row and there's no partition, so it's not like you could. And he's at one end. And plus again, the back. The back wall and sidewall are open wood, so you can see.

[Co-host]

You know, it's important to say though, in there, in. This is like those guys who ran that camp grew up in a period where taking showers together was not a big deal. And all of a sudden, like here come the 80s or the 90s and all of a sudden these.

Such a big deal.

He was watching children shower, like, oh, I'm too modest.

[Gidham]

He was a little skied out that when I was. When I was wrestling, we would take showers together and the coach would be in there that is showering with us, so. Because he was sweaty as well.

[Co-host]

But it's a different.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, it was a different coach showering.

[Host]

It's notable.

[Gidham]

But again, it's all out in the open.

[Co-host]

These guys went to war. These are like these guys who were running the camp, you know, they probably were a nom and. Right.

[Johnny Law]

I don't know.

[Gidham]

Let's say yes.

[Johnny Law]

But at what age? At what age? Because my understanding was this practice at the camp continued throughout. Throughout your time there.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

Then. So if, If. If the person is there to monitor, to make sure that, you know, these little kids are washing themselves and actually cleaning and being hygienic. Don't you think that maybe you don't need to do that for a 17 year old?

[Host]

Well, that's a point I hadn't thought of yet.

[Gidham]

Yeah. So. But this is what I was telling him is that when I got older, when I was. My last two years there, we were in cabin 17. We got special permission before reveille. To go and take a shower by ourselves. Just the whole entire cabin.

[Johnny Law]

You and one other guy?

[Gidham]

No, no, like the whole entire cabin. So it's a bunch of again, it's a bunch of us guys. Nobody, nobody's supervising.

[Co-host]

Okay, but let me ask you this though. Is it also weird that as soon as there was no more showers, they let the building fall into decay? They're like, oh well if I can't fucking watch boys play shower and play with sudsy up, I'm going to let it fucking just fall to disarray. Well, I think it's because doorless you no upkeep whatsoever. Because there's no reason to.

[Gidham]

I think with the, I think with the no front door and the back wall being open, it's exposed more to the weather like the winters.

[Co-host]

But nobody cared enough to like to preserve it. They're like it, it's no sense. I think it's still let it rot.

[Johnny Law]

I don't think. I don't know that you fully explained what that back wall looks like. So there's showers in the middle.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

And so everyone's standing in this room. The back wall is lattice. It's like see through. So anyone that's walking around in that area.

[Host]

But the same point though then probably secret shenanigans can't really go on.

[Johnny Law]

Which is why you don't need to have a guy watching, I think in general.

[Co-host]

Were there rumors of secret shenanigans going on when you were at camp? Do you recall aside from the carrying.

[Gidham]

The guy around, some of the counselors had daughters who were there. And like we would joke that they would be out in the bushes staring at us like we were some fucking Adonis's. To me, Reverse porkies. Yeah.

[Host]

Now get him. Do you remember in Forrest Gump, Forrest bought Jenny's house and tore it down. Okay, do we need to do that for this shower building? Do you need us to make it go far, far away?

[Gidham]

No, I don't want anything in this camp destroyed. It is okay again when you come there, except for the, the main house being changed a little I guess because of ADA stuff and them adding a porch. It's literally this. It is the same cabin, the same bunk beds that was there when I was there in the 90s and people were there in the 80s said they were there. So it is like this chunk of this chunk of place that has just been ripped out of time and just exists.

[Johnny Law]

Sure.

[Gidham]

Like once you pass the main gate, bam.

[Host]

I get it.

[Co-host]

Back in the 90s.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

Back in the 80s back in the 70s.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Host]

The older you get, the rarer that is. Yeah, yeah, I understand.

[Gidham]

It's just so quiet. Like, again, you're in a valley.

[Host]

What about the four cell phones, though? Are they going off, like, every two seconds?

[Gidham]

No, we had WI fi, but the WI fi was really, really, really bad.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, it was bad.

[Host]

Why four phones, though?

[Johnny Law]

That's. That's the thing. I. From what I gathered, one phone is good because it is connected to a Google voice. One phone he can text with, one phone is a flip phone, which is what he likes to call with because he gets too distracted from the other phones. And then another phone I think is one that his dad gave him and he just kind of uses it as a storage device. Is that correct?

[Gidham]

No, that's the one that runs all my weird apps.

[Johnny Law]

Okay. All right, so there you go.

[Co-host]

What kind of weird apps? What are you talking about?

[Gidham]

Like, if I have to. Like, if I have to install an app for, like, some Bluetooth device, I put it on there so that it's not really, like, it can't crash my main phone.

[Johnny Law]

But here's the question. You really didn't give me an answer when we were in the car. If I get a new phone and I give you my old phone, it's still. It's a good phone.

[Co-host]

He'll have five phones.

[Johnny Law]

Will you. Will you just get rid of the other phones and just use the phone?

[Gidham]

No, I might get. Since that's an Apple.

[Co-host]

This is a hoarder.

[Gidham]

Since that's an Apple, I might get rid of the Apple phone and replace it with that one. I will upgrade.

[Johnny Law]

Why do you think you're the. You're the only person that needs this many phones, but everyone else is getting by with just one.

[Co-host]

Because you can't throw anything out.

[Johnny Law]

I know.

[Co-host]

Yeah. So when does the drinking start?

[Johnny Law]

Drinking starts at you at night for us.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Host]

What's the drink?

[Co-host]

Yeah. And how much do you bring?

[Gidham]

Well, I was smart this time. Last. Last time I brought. I brought extras just in case somebody wanted to share some natties with me. And apparently other people have taste and didn't want to. So my last night there, I had five natties left and I drank three, and I was feeling good. I was like, let me take a fourth. And then after the fourth, I was like, I don't want to take just one beer home. Let me drink a fifth.

[Co-host]

So he's filthy.

[Gidham]

And I was hungover for two days.

[Co-host]

Filthy drunk.

[Johnny Law]

This was. Well, this was the last time.

[Gidham]

This was the last Time he did.

[Johnny Law]

Listen, he. He was totally appropriate. Never, never was he, like, you know, out of control. But he definitely was drunk.

[Host]

Yeah. Both the nights got a little tuned.

[Johnny Law]

Up because one of those natties is something like three beers. So, like, one Natty daddy is like three beers.

[Host]

How many. How many Natty daddy did you drink?

[Johnny Law]

I had over the course of the. Of the whole weekend. I tried one.

[Host]

So what were you drinking otherwise?

[Johnny Law]

I brought. So a friend of mine whose wedding I was in gave me a bottle of scotch. I don't really keep alcohol at all that much, so I just brought it up. I said, anyone can have. So the first night, a ton of people came and we all had a couple glasses and it was nice. Yeah.

[Host]

All right.

[Johnny Law]

But. Yeah, but get them. Is get him. Can put them down, man. I was impressed.

[Co-host]

He's paying a price for it.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

Oh, no, no. That's day two that I'm paying the price for it.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

I was gonna say, can he put him down anymore if he's suffering for the next couple days. You were too old.

[Johnny Law]

Hey, you know what? The first night we. We were, you know, drinking in the game room or whatever.

[Gidham]

Did we leave the game room? Do you remember the game room?

[Johnny Law]

I knew it.

[Gidham]

Game room.

[Johnny Law]

I don't remember the time, but I certainly.

[Co-host]

Certainly in the game room.

[Johnny Law]

Like pool. It looked like board games. Yeah, stuff like that. Ping pong tables.

[Co-host]

Yes.

[Gidham]

There was an air hockey. That's like the newest thing. Was the air hockey. A piano.

[Co-host]

Piano.

[Gidham]

A little wooden.

[Co-host]

Can you play the piano, Jones?

[Johnny Law]

A little bit, but not. I knew you could. I knew.

[Host]

Of course he can a little bit. You know, he can play anything he wants.

[Johnny Law]

But, you know, I don't remember what time we went back to the. To the cabin, but I definitely remember going back to the cabin, but I think that part is missing from your memory. Right.

[Gidham]

I kind of remember stumbling back.

[Host]

Okay, what was your first instance of being like, what the fuck am I doing here?

[Johnny Law]

I never had that feeling.

[Host]

Never had.

[Johnny Law]

I really never did.

[Host]

Oh, that's great.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah. I'll be honest. I'm trying to bring out some of the crazier things about Gidham and Gidham's life, but the reality is we had a great time and Giddum and I have a lot of the same interests. And like what? Well, we. We like. I love fishing. He likes to fish. I like outdoor stuff. He likes and he does. Like, Like, I would be one of those guys that goes around to flea markets.

[Host]

Sure.

[Johnny Law]

Like, if I didn't have a job and other stuff going on in my life, I would want to do that. I'd want to, like, have a company where I resell, you know, stuff that I find at flea market. That stuff is really fun for me, so.

[Host]

Okay.

[Johnny Law]

We do have some of that in common.

[Host]

Did you guys talk about that?

[Johnny Law]

A little, but not too much.

[Gidham]

So then. So we went to sleep.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

A little.

[Gidham]

Little rough for me in the next morning, but I got over it.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

Why?

[Co-host]

Because you're hungover?

[Gidham]

No, no, I just had. I. I fell asleep the wrong way. I. I. I had attached a fan to the. To the bunk.

[Co-host]

Right.

[Gidham]

A box fan. And I. Instead of falling asleep with my feet to the fan, I fell asleep with my head to the fan. So, like, I woke up, like, halfway through the night. Like, my entire head is, like, completely dried out, so. Which is kind of what I sound. Like this. So then I had to flip around, and then I missed. I know. I missed Reveley.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, you did.

[Gidham]

But it was a little tough to hear the Bugle.

[Co-host]

What's Reveley? When the bugle.

[Gidham]

Oh, yeah. Everything is. Everything in camp is run by Bugles. Yeah.

[Co-host]

Okay, so that means you have to get up, or you don't choose to sleep through it.

[Gidham]

No. No. You don't choose to sleep through Reveley.

[Johnny Law]

Well, I mean, in this particular situation, you could certainly just say, I'm just gonna sleep through it. I mean, you're not. They don't have the same control as they did.

[Co-host]

Time to shower, Johnny.

[Gidham]

Yeah. You know what time you guys get.

[Co-host]

Up on Saturday morning? Like 6:00am no, no.

[Johnny Law]

Like, 8. 8. 8.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

You woke up.

[Johnny Law]

I woke you up because I thought you'd want to go get breakfast.

[Gidham]

Well, no, it's flagpole first, because we. We raise. We raise and lower the flag every day and night.

[Co-host]

So whose job was that?

[Gidham]

Color guards.

[Co-host]

Not you?

[Gidham]

No. Okay, well, if it was. If it was our cabin's turn to be color guard, it would be rotated throughout the session of who did it. So I did do it a couple times, but I didn't drop it. No.

[Johnny Law]

Never, ever.

[Gidham]

Never forget, because we were. We were. We were. We were graded.

[Co-host]

You dropped that flag, didn't you?

[Gidham]

No, I did not. It's a little never. It was color guard's job. Like, if it started raining, color guard had to leave wherever they were going and take down the flag and put.

[Host]

In the game room.

[Gidham]

Game room.

[Co-host]

So when does the competition start?

[Johnny Law]

Ooh. Yeah.

[Gidham]

Well, they briefly gave us an overview of the competition the night before, but.

[Johnny Law]

Saturday was the day.

[Co-host]

What are Some of the things that you could compete in for hot.

[Host]

You're hungover.

[Co-host]

Ribbons. Why are you fucking drinking when you know competitions are the next day? Don't you have enough discipline to fucking not drink when you know there's a ribbon on a line?

[Johnny Law]

You'll see the footage, Walt. But I don't know that he took it as seriously. Maybe as he should.

[Co-host]

I told his ass I wanted him to come home with multiple trophies and ribbons.

[Johnny Law]

He tried really hard, but I don't know that there was a lot of prep.

[Gidham]

Yeah, there really wasn't.

[Co-host]

So what are some of the things that you guys could vie for for trophies and ribbons? Were there trophies or just ribbons?

[Gidham]

Just. Just ribbons.

[Johnny Law]

Ribbons.

[Co-host]

Oh, they cheaped out, huh?

[Gidham]

Yeah. Oh, come on, man.

[Co-host]

You know how much a ribbon costs over a trophy? A ribbon is probably a quarter. A trophy is at least 20 bucks.

[Gidham]

So this is the first part of the events. Yeah.

[Co-host]

No comments.

[Gidham]

I'm not gonna dis my camp. I love my camp. There's salt of the earth. Eat.

[Host]

You get a. You get a ribbon for eating two bowls of cereal.

[Johnny Law]

So we should explain lawyers jumping right in? Don't answer that.

[Gidham]

Get him.

[Host]

I got this.

[Johnny Law]

Get him, please. Yes, these are individual events, but they're all individual events as part of a relay. So a person understood from every team. Once all of this is completed, the relay is over. Totally understand the team that finishes first.

[Host]

Okay, so it's a lot of that.

[Johnny Law]

Only one page.

[Host]

That looks exhausting to me.

[Gidham]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Co-host]

So, Johnny, how dialed into are you into these events? Are you like, you know, are you Newt Rockne or are you more like. You know, I'm. This is. This is just silly. I just.

[Gidham]

He was the first name on the list, number one.

[Johnny Law]

I was like, let me pick the thing that I know I can do, right? I wasn't gonna be like, oh, this sounds funny. I was like, no, I want to win.

[Co-host]

I want to win.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, and I want to win. But more importantly, I don't even care about the whole. Really? I want to win my event.

[Co-host]

And this is why I was so happy he. Gideon was bringing you, because you are basically a ringer. I told him that this is your chance to go back to that camp and in everybody, motherfucker's face. Whoever dissed you or teased you, rightfully so it seems, you know, this is a chance.

[Gidham]

If they were there for the exact four years you were.

[Co-host]

This is the Revenge Tour 2025 for. Get him. Steve Davis. He up every that ever with him.

[Johnny Law]

That's exactly what I was Ben.

[Co-host]

Whoever that was that kicked in the balls.

[Gidham]

Brett Fulton.

[Co-host]

Brett. Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

Guess what? My lawyer's here with me this time.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

Try kicking me in the balls.

So what's the first thing you guys gotta take?

[Johnny Law]

I did the canoe around the island.

[Host]

Okay.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

Now, are you a two man canal?

[Johnny Law]

It's me and then this other kid who happened to want to do it.

[Co-host]

Kid or adult?

[Johnny Law]

He was probably 14.

[Gidham]

Split us up. So sometimes families were on both teams.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Host]

Did smoke him?

[Johnny Law]

No, no, he was this kid, 14, and then it was two grown men we were against. Where's.

[Co-host]

Why isn't he in the canoe?

[Johnny Law]

Well, you have.

[Co-host]

You.

[Johnny Law]

You can't do.

[Co-host]

It's at the bottom of the. You can only do a couple.

[Gidham]

Oh, well, we're getting there. We're getting there.

[Johnny Law]

You can only do like one or two events because you won't be able to get around to them fast enough. And you have to let everyone do something. So the actual relay, it's like, you know, you could have some terrible people on your team. What's your event?

[Gidham]

The kids were doing the baton running.

[Co-host]

What's your canoe experience?

[Gidham]

Have you.

[Johnny Law]

I cano. I own two canoes. I canoe a lot.

[Co-host]

So you got this.

[Johnny Law]

I'm like, I'm ready to.

[Co-host]

You're just, you're, you're just sizing up the competition. Like I thought loser.

[Johnny Law]

And I thought the kid that I was with, great kid. This kid that I was with, really nice kid. He looked like he was an athlete. I was like, all right, we're going to. Cuz the two guys also looked like they were pretty athletes.

[Co-host]

You didn't tell them that, right?

[Johnny Law]

Cuz that's kicked out of camp. We saved that talk for.

[Gidham]

There's a meal for that.

[Co-host]

You know, you're.

You did quite a job out there.

All right, so you got to pop off that shirt.

[Host]

Let's canoe.

[Gidham]

Let's hit the shower cabin.

[Co-host]

We haven't even canoed yet. It's time to hit the showers. So. But he looks like an athlete, but he's not. It sounds like he is an athlete.

[Johnny Law]

I think it's just. I don't think he's really happy or doesn't care because the first thing that happens, I get in the back to steer the canoe. That's where you want to be if you. You, you know, want to steer it. And he gets in the front and he does the. He does these really choppy little strokes. That beer, that's almost like he's slapping the water. Which means he's just soaking me this whole time.

[Gidham]

So there's. There's Johnny. Okay.

[Co-host]

All right, we see him.

[Johnny Law]

So.

[Co-host]

So you gotta do all the work.

[Johnny Law]

So I'm doing basically all the work.

[Co-host]

You don't tell him, like, hey, this is.

[Johnny Law]

No, no, no. Because it's too short of a. I'm like, positive. Yeah, Doing a great job. Keep going, Keep going. Yeah.

[Host]

Did you win?

[Johnny Law]

We did.

[Host]

All right.

[Johnny Law]

All right.

[Host]

Not bad.

[Co-host]

All right, so you get. So there's one of these ribbons I'm looking at for that.

[Johnny Law]

Well, you don't get a ribbon for the individual.

[Co-host]

Okay.

[Gidham]

So overall.

[Co-host]

Okay, so what's your next competition or what's next?

[Johnny Law]

Now I'm. I'm done. Now I have to go and kind of monitor the other competition. So Gidem has two coming up.

[Host]

Sunken canoe. What's that?

[Gidham]

We take a five gallon bucket and fill the canoe full of water. Then we get into it and paddle across the lake.

[Host]

You're not doing that.

[Johnny Law]

Yes, he's doing it. Why does John do that? Actually, you're right. He's not doing it. Okay, gotcha.

[Co-host]

Why on earth would you allow yourself to do that and not John?

[Gidham]

Because I've done this before. I did this before at summer camp.

[Johnny Law]

He was adamant that this was the one that he should be doing.

[Gidham]

And again, I have fond memories of this, but those fond memories are 30 years in the past. So in those intervening 30 years, the foam that holds most canoes up if they get filled with water has long since degraded and I've gotten a little fatter.

[Johnny Law]

I'm sure it was the foam.

[Gidham]

No, no, because we. We pull. We pull the canoe out. I get in, it instantly sinks to the bottom. So you're halfway there. And so then Colin tries again. Colin's in the. In the front. Colin, my old count, my old camp counselor.

[Co-host]

Okay.

[Gidham]

He gets in. And as soon as he gets in and moves it just either way, either side, the canoe just pitches over. So it's just.

[Co-host]

And you're at the bottom of the lake.

[Host]

My phones.

[Gidham]

No, no, no. Yeah, I made sure I didn't have my phones on me. I had shoes on because I didn't want to step on.

[Co-host]

Did Johnny jump in and save you and give you mouth to mouth?

[Johnny Law]

I was videoing.

[Gidham]

We had like, he didn't have to wear life vest for canoeing, but we had to wear them for sunken canoe.

[Co-host]

Okay.

[Gidham]

So thankfully. So both teams are flattering though. And eventually we get about. We get into the deep end of the swimming area and they're like, okay, okay. You don't have to be in the canoe. You can just grab the canoe and pull it along. So now it is me, Colin and I holding on to the kid with one hand and trying to paddle with our front hands. And now I'm wearing shoes instead of bare feet. So I'm having trouble.

[Co-host]

Is your heart ready to pound out of your chest?

Are you just.

Has Johnny got nine? One. He's just waiting. One.

[Gidham]

I was expecting the Coast Guard to have to come in and, like, were you worried?

[Johnny Law]

I was actually so worried because he. It was, you know, toward the middle of it, he was getting to the point where he was sinking down while he was swimming so that his mouth was, like, half covered, so he'd be breathing heavy, and water would just be spewing out of his mouth the whole.

[Co-host]

Time like some lake creature trying to surface.

[Johnny Law]

Covered in leeches and bags. Jax, Jack, one of the guys, his wife was standing next to me, and she's like, oh, is he okay? I go, he's magnificent.

[Gidham]

I was checking on him, too. It's the one we. We ordered mounts. We were. We were gonna have mounts for, like, this whole entire thing to record some GoPros, but they never arrived.

[Co-host]

Well, thank God you didn't bring the GoPros in the water, though.

[Gidham]

Well, no, they had. They had. Oh, they're waterproof. They were waterproof, and they. That's when we needed the mounts. But I'm like. It would just be me going, are you okay? But at one point. Point he kind of steered away, and I couldn't see the dock. Now in my head, we had advanced 50ft. And then he corrects, and I'm like, oh, my God. And we have to keep the baton with us so that, you know, I.

[Host]

Mean, it sounds like a great weekend.

[Gidham]

It was. But then we. I get to the. I get to the end. I finally. Could. We get the canoe to the dock. I could finally feel something under my feet. And so I get out of the water. I thought I was going to throw up. Luckily, it was just a burp.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

But then. And so I start going towards the serial eating. I start going to the serial eating, but meanwhile, my baton runner is way ahead of me, and someone has to just set three tables. And I am not moving quickly.

[Johnny Law]

No.

[Gidham]

I am, like, at a.

[Johnny Law]

It's like, have you ever seen an astronaut that's been out in, like, the. For months? And then they get back home and they can't really walk, and it's like, yeah, they're adjusting to gravity. I mean, it Was. Yeah, but where is.

[Host]

They're. They're national heroes. This just tried to move a canoe 20ft.

[Gidham]

No, it wasn't 20ft. It was long.

[Host]

56.

[Co-host]

So what happened with the cereal?

[Johnny Law]

It was.

[Gidham]

It was from. It was from there to there.

[Co-host]

So, okay, what happened at the cereal eating contest?

[Gidham]

I. Well, so what they did was they sent a guy. They sent a guy ahead of me who was actually able to run, and he's like, I'll set it up for you, and if you don't make it, I'll start doing the cereal either.

[Co-host]

That's the kind of picture that's like. You see it and you're like, that's when I realized I needed to go on a diet.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

Mouthful of cereal and scooping it in.

[Johnny Law]

This picture isn't really capturing just how intense the moment was because. And hopefully you'll see video. But he was. His whole body is shaking at this point because he's so out of breath. And at the same time, he is shoving.

[Host]

What type of cereal can't you tap out?

[Co-host]

Like, can't he fuck tag team in you in this?

[Johnny Law]

I. I was.

[Gidham]

Well, there's Johnny right there holding the camera.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

Okay. You can't tap in and. And take over.

[Johnny Law]

Listen, I thought if there was going to be a medical emergency, let's make sure we get it on film.

[Host]

You know, if you're gonna go, what.

[Co-host]

A way to go.

[Johnny Law]

Right, Right.

[Co-host]

You have to shove his cereal into his.

[Johnny Law]

In the place. In the place where he loves doing.

[Host]

The thing that he loves just hanging off his balls.

[Gidham]

And by this point. By this point, Johnny had already found three problems with the. With the waivers we had signed.

[Johnny Law]

Oh, yeah. Oh, really?

[Co-host]

Were you just waiting?

[Gidham]

You're counting your money.

[Co-host]

It's like, wow, I'm gonna take this camp for everything that they have emotional distress.

[Gidham]

Oh, yeah.

[Co-host]

So did you win cereal?

[Gidham]

Yes.

[Co-host]

Yeah.

[Host]

All right.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

I knew no one could out eat you.

[Gidham]

No.

[Co-host]

No way. So you guys are. Now. You won Canoe with one series. What's next?

[Gidham]

Let's see. Frisbee toss. This is all not us anymore.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

So we kind of just.

[Co-host]

Okay. We don't care about. You know, we went Whacker and his crew. We only care about you.

[Gidham]

No, it's Jack Trachtenberg and his crew. But he has to correct me. I'm sorry.

[Johnny Law]

Well, yeah, well, Jack Trachtenberg, Whacker and Tracker.

[Co-host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

So I.

[Co-host]

Sounds like a legal team.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, I know, right?

[Gidham]

So I went and sat on the front porch in the shade just to try to get My heart rate back down a somewhat normal under 200.

[Co-host]

So what's the next thing you guys partake in?

[Gidham]

It was pretty much the fire at the end.

[Johnny Law]

The fire at the end.

[Co-host]

Oh, my God. Oh.

So you gonna do any of the rest of this?

You gotta start a fire.

[Johnny Law]

Because they had to let everyone else do events.

[Gidham]

So we got what we got. A big advantage was, was playing card stacking. So we had a guy who was really good at stacking cards and he managed to do it like 40 seconds. And then this guy couldn't do it it. So he had to wait five minutes to continue on. Okay, so we now we at this point, we have a four minute lead.

[Johnny Law]

This is also the guy who has two partners.

[Gidham]

Yes.

[Johnny Law]

You know, really? He's the guy?

[Co-host]

He's the man. Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

I mean, he's stacking.

[Host]

One of them. That blonde chick?

[Johnny Law]

No, no, she's pretty.

[Gidham]

No, that's Jack's wife.

[Johnny Law]

That's Jack's wife. That's what I was talking.

[Host]

Nice job. Jack.

[Gidham]

Jack.

[Johnny Law]

Great guy.

[Co-host]

She named her son no. Dick Whacker?

[Johnny Law]

No, no. Different family.

[Co-host]

Totally different family.

Oh, all right.

[Gidham]

See, we're trying to get to the. I know there's a fire photo here.

[Co-host]

Oh, wow.

[Gidham]

Yeah, There we go. So there I am blowing on the fire. So we got to start the fire first. I go down in my.

[Host]

Well my heart with the alcohol on his breath.

[Johnny Law]

Once I saw the types of breaths that were being taken, I quickly shifted from working on the fire to getting video of everything.

[Gidham]

You have to admit, I was pretty good.

[Johnny Law]

You were doing fine.

[Co-host]

You guys got video and we're gonna make cut that video into a Patreon video coming whenever we get it out.

[Gidham]

But like here I'm holding my beer because I at one point like the firefly back. But we ended up losing that and that.

[Co-host]

Is that why your eyebrows look so weird?

[Gidham]

Is it? I would not be surprised.

[Host]

I thought you had a four minute head start.

[Gidham]

We did, but we had to boil water to a full rolling.

[Host]

Boil oil and so start a fire. You guys sure you're doing it wrong?

[Gidham]

Well, that's what the problem was.

[Co-host]

You have your Zippo.

[Gidham]

We. The fire was started, but the problem was the it was improperly stacked.

[Host]

Who stacked it?

[Gidham]

I did not stack it.

[Host]

Who stacked it?

[Gidham]

I don't remember who was.

[Johnny Law]

Whomever was there before Stacker.

[Co-host]

Stacker did it.

[Host]

Fucking bullshit.

[Gidham]

But they put logs on top and that blocked some of the heat from getting to the fire. So they ended up getting the water boiling first and got to the Flagpole to raise their flag. So.

[Co-host]

Looks fun. Starting a fire in 95 degree weather.

[Gidham]

I don't think it was. I don't think it was that hot.

[Co-host]

So you guys lost the first thing you. You tried to enter?

[Johnny Law]

We did. We got second place.

[Co-host]

Second. So one of these ribbons is second place?

[Gidham]

Yeah, the red one.

[Co-host]

So this would be a silver.

[Johnny Law]

A silver.

[Co-host]

This was the Olympics.

[Johnny Law]

There is no bronze.

[Co-host]

Which one's the. The red one?

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

Second place.

[Johnny Law]

Second place.

[Co-host]

Camp Watonka.

[Johnny Law]

Yep.

[Gidham]

But it was very close.

[Co-host]

So how much did that. That chafe your ass though? Because it would have ruined the whole weekend.

[Gidham]

Was it a blue ribbon?

[Johnny Law]

The first one? I poisoned all the.

[Co-host]

Everyone eat that meat sauce now. Tastes funny, right?

[Gidham]

And for lunch. For lunch before this we had was make. We make your own tacos.

[Johnny Law]

Yes. That was the best lunch, I think of the whole. The whole trip.

[Host]

Crispy tacos or soft tacos?

[Gidham]

Soft tacos.

[Host]

All right.

[Gidham]

Nice fresh ground beef. I was cheese. I had about four. So like, that's why when I got out of the water, I'm like, something's coming out.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

And then I had to go eat cereal.

[Co-host]

Oh, I thought you like cereal.

[Gidham]

I do.

[Co-host]

What kind of cereal was it?

[Gidham]

Rice Krispies.

[Co-host]

Rice Krispies, yeah.

[Host]

Milk on a hot day after you've been running around.

[Co-host]

Was it whole milk?

[Gidham]

Yeah, I like whole milk.

[Co-host]

Yeah, me too.

[Gidham]

So then after this week now, we didn't do rest hour. Then we did rotating games and that's when we went and really went to.

[Host]

People listening at home. There are pictures up on the TV now. And it really does look beautiful.

[Co-host]

Yeah, looks nice.

[Host]

It looks like very difficult not to have a very peaceful, very scenic. Yeah, it really is gorgeous.

[Johnny Law]

It's beautiful. It's a beautiful property.

[Host]

The lake's beautiful. Yeah, I could see why. You guys. Everything I'm seeing in these photos looks great.

[Johnny Law]

I would go back in a second.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

Yeah. So what's the green award for then? I got. You guys have three ribbons here.

[Johnny Law]

This is for. This is for showing up.

[Co-host]

You know, you guys shouldn't have put this on.

[Johnny Law]

That's right.

[Host]

I know this is what you bring into us, a second place ribbon.

[Co-host]

But there's a brown ribbon.

[Johnny Law]

That's right.

[Co-host]

Is that for someone blew up the bathroom?

[Johnny Law]

Excellence in fishing.

[Co-host]

Excellence.

[Gidham]

Only two ribbon.

[Co-host]

You're a ringer in that one, though.

[Gidham]

The only two fishing ribbons awarded that this entire reunion.

[Host]

What was the other one?

[Co-host]

Oh, you both got them. Oh, these are Johnny's and yours. Okay, so Johnny gets to go home with these, right?

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Host]

Oh, shit.

[Co-host]

Johnny, you should wear.

[Johnny Law]

I've already called my framer.

[Co-host]

You should wear all three of these ribbons whenever you're in court.

[Johnny Law]

I think I will.

[Gidham]

Oh, I told him, I said he's got to put these next to his diploma.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Host]

You're gonna pass those on to your. To your child one day.

[Johnny Law]

I will.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

I participated.

So how did they measure who gets the ribbon for fishing? Is it by weight?

[Johnny Law]

It's more fish. It's more. By asking the person who's in charge of the ribbons if we could maybe have a ribbon for fishing.

[Gidham]

Okay. I was gonna say it's because we were bragging about all the fish we caught.

[Johnny Law]

To be fair, we definitely caught the most amount of fish of anyone. There was no proof of it.

[Co-host]

When they came around.

[Johnny Law]

When they were seeing us, they were awesome. This. This particular guy. This particular guy was also around and would see us catching fish.

[Host]

What type fish are you holding up there?

[Johnny Law]

That's a largemouth bass.

[Host]

Largemouth bass.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

He caught his. The biggest perch.

[Johnny Law]

I got the. Caught the biggest perch I've ever caught.

[Co-host]

All right.

[Johnny Law]

Caught some bluegill. Got some, I think. Crappy. Caught some.

[Gidham]

Oh, that's what I. Isn't that what I caught? Yeah, yeah.

[Host]

They stock this lake or it's just natural, I guess.

[Gidham]

It was stocked at one time and now it's just gotcha like this. Yeah. So there's pickerel, largemouth bass, smallmouth bass, crappie, bluegills, perch.

[Co-host]

Perch.

[Gidham]

Perch. He said some kind of catfish.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, yeah.

[Co-host]

Do they. Do they stock this lake or these naturally occurring fish?

[Gidham]

They stocked it at one time.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

And they just let it go.

[Host]

The thing is, that's a question I just asked.

[Johnny Law]

Yes.

[Co-host]

Oh, did you?

[Host]

They just spent a minute answering.

[Johnny Law]

I'm sorry, the thing with bats.

[Co-host]

I was looking at that fish and listening to Johnny.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

I lost time. I lost like a minute.

That's concerning.

Yeah, tell me about it.

[Host]

I know. I wasn't gonna say anything until you gave me that look and I was like, oh, maybe we should point this, guys.

[Co-host]

When are we going to start this podcast?

[Johnny Law]

Where am I?

[Gidham]

Who are you? Mary Path.

[Host]

Did I win this?

[Co-host]

Kidnapped.

I can't believe I participated. I won.

[Host]

O.

[Co-host]

All right, well, so that's Saturday. Is there anything else happen on Saturday?

[Johnny Law]

We went. I went fly fishing Saturday.

[Gidham]

Oh, that was Saturday morning.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

We went to the river instead of the lake.

[Co-host]

Oh, so it's only like 10am.

[Gidham]

This is. This is the. This is the last fish we caught.

[Johnny Law]

We did other fishing, though. We did Some. I did some fly fishing. Fishing along the river.

[Host]

Catch anything there?

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, caught some small fish there. It was beautiful.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

Yeah. That was the first thing we did when we got up. We're like, yeah, we're just gonna go fishing.

[Co-host]

And.

[Host]

What are you guys talking about? Like, what's the. What are you guys rapping about?

[Johnny Law]

Everything and everything.

[Gidham]

Talking. Yeah. I don't. I'm not a big. I wasn't having any luck river fishing, so I eventually just kind of gave up and was, like, trying to record him. But then it got. The water started getting a little deeper. I had phones in my pocket.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

So I ended up. I bushwhacked through the. Like, the tall grass, and I found a cut through, and I. I took all my phones out and everything, and I waited back down the river to cut to get back to him, and I. He was just leaving at that time, so. But it worked out because that was right before.

[Johnny Law]

It was perfect.

[Co-host]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

And. And I will say this. Get him. I know. Get him. Gets a lot of flack for maybe talking a lot, having a lot of opinions and correcting people. I know that in the past, that's been something. Things brought up. He's a great fishing partner. Because in a fishing partner, you need someone who's happy for long bursts of silence. And he was perfect.

[Co-host]

Really?

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, he was.

[Co-host]

How come I don't get those long bursts of silence? We're at the office.

[Gidham]

Then fish with me. But as you said, when I posted that photo, I could smell that from here. So that was my first fish.

[Co-host]

That fish is anemic in him.

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

It's pretty small.

[Co-host]

Why are you even taking a picture of that?

[Gidham]

This is the first fish I caught. All right.

[Co-host]

Right.

[Gidham]

But then I turned that. I put a big, giant hook through it and was trying to catch other fish, which didn't. I think it was. We were just at the end of the day for the fish, like, they were going deeper and they weren't really hitting. But the next day when we went. They really. Yeah, yeah. So. So then we had the closing campfire.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, they did a great job.

[Gidham]

Well, no, we had dinner. Dinner was hamburgers. No, it was hamburgers and hot dogs.

[Johnny Law]

Like a barbecue outside.

[Gidham]

Yeah, barbecue outside.

[Co-host]

Kind of meat you were talking about. Talking about about 90% lean. Or was it like 60% lean, these hamburgers? It sounds like they probably, by the looks of they didn't spend any money on trophies that they put it towards the food.

[Gidham]

Again, if you saw the amount of ground beef that was in the meat sauce and the tacos, like it was.

[Co-host]

Good meat, good grade. Okay, all right.

[Johnny Law]

Best meat.

[Co-host]

Now, were there campfire sing alongs and stuff? Did you guys do that kind of thing?

[Johnny Law]

No, no, thankfully. Some scary stories it was. There were people that shared stories.

[Gidham]

The first night.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, the first night.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

The second night they gave out the awards. And then there was this other older.

[Gidham]

Gentleman, Joe Macy, that's him right there.

[Johnny Law]

Who gave a speech, a very, very nice, sweet speech about the camp.

[Gidham]

Joe Macy was my mortal enemy my first couple of years there. How come he kicked me off? He was the rifle ranger.

[Co-host]

Kicked me in the balls. I think everybody there kicked him in the balls.

[Host]

That guy right there giving a speech kicked you off. Off a team?

[Gidham]

A field trip.

[Host]

Okay.

[Gidham]

They kicked me off a field trip. And again when we went there, there was no. You couldn't call your parents.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

But if you were on a field trip and there was a pay phone there, you could call your parents.

[Host]

Okay.

[Gidham]

So you would angle for a field trip at least once. Once a session. They gave you a certain amount of points and you could choose so many.

[Host]

Why did he throw you off the field trip?

[Gidham]

Because some kids were acting up and he turned around and he spotted me and I wasn't one of the kids acting up, but I had this reputation and he thought I was part of it and he just kicked me off the trip.

[Co-host]

Right.

[Gidham]

And it just. And now this is. This. I think this is Action Park. So we would send like three buses up to Action Park.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

So now there's nobody else at camp. And I am devastated that I can't talk to my father, my mother, my grandmother.

[Co-host]

Right.

[Gidham]

And it just. Yeah. And then like later on we were talking about it in our cabin and people who were there were like, no, he didn't do anything.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

So. But then I hated this guy afterwards and he hated me.

[Host]

I think you've talked about this guy before.

[Co-host]

Yeah, I feel like I've heard.

[Gidham]

Yeah, we made up. We made up up the previous.

[Co-host]

And you guys are copacetic now or things.

[Gidham]

You're tight.

[Co-host]

I was going to say you should have drunkenly interrupted his speech.

[Johnny Law]

Oh, no.

[Host]

I've got a few things to say.

[Johnny Law]

Hey, Macy, I don't know if you.

[Gidham]

Noticed, I was just.

[Johnny Law]

Oh, I definitely noticed.

[Gidham]

Yeah, I was crying.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, I noticed. I didn't want to, you know.

[Co-host]

Crying about what though?

[Johnny Law]

He, he was moved because the speech was talking about. And I think it's happening again.

[Host]

He's crying right now.

[Johnny Law]

He, he gave a very nice speech, basically saying that you Know, know. Just because the camp isn't here as it was before, just because we are not necessarily campers anymore, you have that memory. And for that instance, you're back at camp.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

You know, when you think about it, all of a sudden you find yourself back at camp.

[Host]

Did you start crying?

[Johnny Law]

No, no.

[Host]

What is a skate camp?

[Johnny Law]

Come on. Save that for the shower room, boys.

[Gidham]

The game room.

[Host]

Wow.

[Co-host]

Did you guys do any science?

[Gidham]

No. All those cabins have long been since locked up.

[Co-host]

The robotics cabin is closed up.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

So kind of robots did you guys build anything? Looks like Herbie or did you remember.

[Gidham]

It was a robo named Hero. Like it would be on Mr. Wizard. It was like this square box that had like one robotic arm. Like we would.

[Host]

No.

[Co-host]

So how advanced sensed were these robotics though that. Because that seems crazy in the 90s to have a robotic cabin like we do.

[Gidham]

This is the hero robot. Like you could program it to do certain things.

[Co-host]

It looks like a Dalek from.

[Gidham]

Well, yeah, they were released in 82. We were still working on it.

[Co-host]

Guys, could any of your robots do anything cool like shoot any kind of lasers or anything?

[Gidham]

No, no, no, we. We programmed them to like detect colors and stuff like that. You know, you were doing like programming, like if, you know, if this sensor gets crossed, then this, this action happens. So like you would make. We made things that would like you would put LEGO bricks on a conveyor belt and it would detect the color and then move it to a certain other conveyor belt. So.

[Johnny Law]

Wow.

[Gidham]

Yeah, you gotta remember this is a camp.

[Co-host]

Not impressed.

[Gidham]

This is a camp for kids like age.

[Co-host]

I said, you guys.

[Gidham]

And then.

[Co-host]

And NASA didn't come and fucking poach you young fucking geniuses.

[Gidham]

But we had. Oh yeah, video class. So like we were, you know, working with video cameras and editing and stuff like that and.

[Co-host]

So is it happening again next year?

[Gidham]

No, no. Well, he's. Joe said two years, but it's probably gonna be two or three years.

[Co-host]

Yeah, well, I think they can't get it together once every year.

[Gidham]

I think it's too much. It's fatigue. Yeah. Like, you know, and then if you miss it, you're kind of. Maybe you don't want to go the next year because you missed it. But I think it gives people enough time to plan ahead. Like I'm gonna. I'm gonna cut out this. Carve out this section of time. So.

[Co-host]

Yeah, I tell Johnny Law for next time.

[Johnny Law]

I'll be there, man.

[Co-host]

Yeah, it was great.

[Gidham]

I'm saying he might be there on.

[Host]

His part of the Family now.

[Johnny Law]

I loved it. Yeah, I had a great time.

[Gidham]

Now, what was your, what was Your name officially?

[Johnny Law]

John 2 in camp, John 2 in cabin 5. Cabin 5. Yeah.

[Host]

Did you now, Johnny, like when you're at the campfire, any of the wives, like start giving you looks like pointing towards the, like nodding off towards the woods or anything?

[Johnny Law]

No, they didn't, they didn't do that.

[Gidham]

Yeah, no, he had a. He had a. Was she like 4 or 5 years old?

[Johnny Law]

Oh, yeah, she was adorable.

[Gidham]

Yeah, she was just like latched onto him.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

And then we were fishing and her and her family were kayaking. She came up and she saw him almost catch a fish.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

And then she wanted him to catch a fish so that she could hug it and kiss it.

[Co-host]

She was adorable.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

So I caught her a little bait fish and showed it to kiss it. Yeah, no, no, she, she petted it. Then she's like, goodbye.

[Johnny Law]

And the mother was like, stay away from the man.

[Gidham]

And she said goodbye. I put the fish in the water and she turns away and the father and I are looking and instantly like a bash just comes up and just grabs it.

[Host]

Oh, wow.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, it was awesome.

[Host]

Jeez.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, no, it was, it was the most wholesome weekend I have had in a very long time. Yeah.

[Host]

Any other story, any good stories about get him as a child come out or. There were.

[Johnny Law]

Not as a child, but I think that last night Gidham really, in a heartfelt way said, you know, all of these counselors here and stuff like that really shaped who he is today, which is, which is an improvement for sure.

[Gidham]

Oh, no, no, no.

[Johnny Law]

Don't say jail on what he was like, you know, as a kid. I mean, all the counselors were like, yeah, you're way better now. You know, I would hope so.

[Co-host]

Like a 45 year old man versus a 13 year old kid. Yeah, I'd hope so.

[Johnny Law]

He's not on medication and I think they were tired. I honestly think they were touched by when what you said. It was nice.

[Gidham]

So when then we got into a giant legal argument.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, we did, because there were a bunch of lawyers there.

[Gidham]

Really?

[Johnny Law]

Multiple lawyers.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

Like I, I was, I was loving.

[Gidham]

It and I was loving this.

[Johnny Law]

I, I don't, I didn't have any, you know, idea who was going to be there. But this one guy, Jack was there who was a tax attorney and you know, I think, great guy. I really hit it off with this guy. And then there was some, another lawyer there and Jack and I kind of had one position on something. He had a Little different. It was. It was a fun night. Yeah.

[Host]

Yeah. Little verbal jousting.

[Gidham]

Yeah. Oh, yeah. The guy ended up leaving.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

So I think next time, I. You should have Johnny give the closing campfire speech.

[Johnny Law]

I don't know if he has that kind of juice.

[Gidham]

No, I don't think. Yeah. If it's a choice between me and Joe Macy, everyone's gonna go with Joe Macy.

[Co-host]

Joe Macy already spoke, but more.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

Why he gives the closing speech every time. Yeah.

[Host]

How old is he?

[Johnny Law]

He's the elder statesman for sure.

[Gidham]

Pretty old.

[Host]

We got to start thinking about.

[Gidham]

Well, he's Possession seven, so that's Colin and that's Jack. That's Jack's wife.

[Host]

All right, look at this.

[Co-host]

Who's that buff dude right there?

[Johnny Law]

That's the guy I beat at the canoe race all steroided out.

[Co-host]

It didn't help him, did it?

[Johnny Law]

No, not a bit.

[Co-host]

Well, his roids didn't help him get to the other side of the lake. He's not listening to this, is he?

[Gidham]

I don't know.

[Johnny Law]

That's gonna kill us.

[Gidham]

As I think the second night he was, people really started asking about the podcast.

[Co-host]

Why did you even tell them about a podcast?

[Johnny Law]

Well, because people would ask what he was doing. Like, they'd ask what kind of job.

[Co-host]

He's a fucking fake fucking career.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah. I'm an architect.

[Gidham]

I'm a publisher.

[Co-host]

You don't have a fake career at the ready.

[Gidham]

Well, I had to explain why he was my lawyer, and I was like, he defended me in a case, but.

[Johnny Law]

It really came up, I think, with like, when they asked, like, what are you doing? Because you could easily just be like, oh, he's just. He's a lawyer, and that could be the end of it.

[Co-host]

Yeah, right.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

What were you doing that you had to explain what you were doing?

[Gidham]

Two jobs, you were just asking people, just catching up.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, yeah. Like, what are you. Oh, what are you up to these days? What do you do? You know, that kind of thing.

[Gidham]

Like, the guy who was in. The guy who was in our cabin, Justin. He used to work in radio. I forget what he's doing now. We had a discussion about this. I was a little groggy.

[Co-host]

How much these conversations mean.

[Gidham]

No, it's a little groggy, but he. His boss wants him to start a podcast, so.

[Host]

Oh, boy.

[Co-host]

Everybody's got a podcast.

[Gidham]

Somebody, like, we were sharing, like, you know, he's like. He's like, no, he wants me to do it in this glass conference room, and I'm trying to tell him You. So when you.

[Co-host]

When you have to explain what you do, what. What do you say then?

[Gidham]

I work for a podcast.

[Co-host]

Do you tell them what your title is and everything?

[Gidham]

Yeah, I said I'm an an. I'm an ancillary member and I helped you, like, the setup and stuff.

[Johnny Law]

Okay.

[Gidham]

Like, oh, if you're watching Practical Jokers.

[Co-host]

Yes.

[Gidham]

You know Brian Quinn? Yes. He's on our podcast.

[Co-host]

Really? You dropped that. Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

Oh, he dropped it.

[Host]

And then Sunday morning, it's time to go home.

[Gidham]

Sunday, we wanted to go river fishing again.

[Host]

Okay.

[Gidham]

Because now that I found this little cut through, it was like a, you know, like a real cut through down to the river. And it was a part where the river comes around so it gets really wide and deep and slow. It would have been perfect for him to.

[Johnny Law]

I would have liked to have gone there.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Host]

But they said, no, no, no.

[Gidham]

We got up and just in the distance, you kind of hear three thunder.

[Host]

Okay.

[Gidham]

And we take the. The picture in the front of the cab and we start eating breakfast. And then it just.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah. Poured.

[Gidham]

Calms down. That was it. And I mean, lightning. Just.

[Co-host]

Just.

[Gidham]

Just horrible. So, like, everyone just, you know, because we couldn't drive the cars in front of the cabins, we had to take everything back to our cars.

[Host]

Okay. So it started raining, so you can really. Gotcha. Okay.

[Co-host]

That's really.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

I think I lost some more time. Q. Q.

[Johnny Law]

The skies turned to dark.

[Host]

The river was wide and deep, and the cars drove around the building.

[Johnny Law]

How much we wanted to go up there.

[Gidham]

I didn't want to get swept away by torrential flood.

[Host]

And then.

[Gidham]

Oh, we went on the evening hike.

[Johnny Law]

We did.

[Gidham]

We went Saturday night. Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

To a beautiful waterfall. Yeah.

[Gidham]

He was checking with me, so. You sure you want to go on this hike? You don't have to go on this hike. I want to go on the hike.

[Johnny Law]

Well, you.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

You were, you know, hobbling. You were in. Yeah.

[Gidham]

And you got to see some good fishing spots over there if you eventually do go back.

[Johnny Law]

I would love to. Yeah.

[Co-host]

Do you think you'll ever go back?

[Johnny Law]

I honestly, I would see if I could rent out, like, one of the cabins on some off time, some people.

[Co-host]

Which is fun. You think?

[Johnny Law]

I. It can't be that much. I mean, for. For. For a whole cabin.

[Co-host]

What's the far. Right from here? What's. What's the top time to get there?

[Johnny Law]

Two, two and a half hours from here.

[Co-host]

Oh, okay. So it's not that close.

[Host]

Yeah, it's not too bad though.

[Johnny Law]

But yeah, I would Totally. I would totally rent out a cabin there and bring some buddies and go fishing, because there was great fishing.

[Host]

It is beautiful. It's hard to get around that, man. They picked a great spot to put this camp on.

[Gidham]

So there's the ropes. Where's the ropes course?

[Host]

We're looking at a drone footage.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

Did you do the rope course?

[Gidham]

No, no. See, this is the part we wanted to go fishing.

[Co-host]

That is some brown water, probably.

[Johnny Law]

It's actually a lot clearer. It's. The stone is dark.

[Host]

I mean, wow, guys.

[Gidham]

No, I was gonna.

[Co-host]

What an adventure.

[Gidham]

He. He had a tennis elbow.

[Johnny Law]

I have tennis elbow.

[Gidham]

Yeah. So he couldn't do the ropes course, so we went fishing instead.

[Host]

Okay.

[Gidham]

Yeah.

[Host]

A lot of fishing.

[Gidham]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Co-host]

Your elbow looks really a lot. Looks very similar to Gidham's elbow.

[Johnny Law]

I gotta go to the doctor right now, which.

[Gidham]

That seems pretty high, so it might have just rained recently.

[Host]

So what? It's the main takeaway. Johnny Law, like, what did you learn about Gideon? Like, what. What peek in did you get?

[Johnny Law]

Like, I. Well, I. You know, the big thing that I learned was that Gidham's youth. I think he dealt with a lot of negativity pointed in his direction and the fact that he is the way that he is today, which I think is a. Maybe getting more well adjusted and just a kind person. This is a person who could easily have lots of resentment. I feel like, in his life, I mean, just between some family stuff and how his friends have treated him, he's made huge strides, which is encouraging because that means that he can make even bigger strides going forward. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Host]

I think that's.

[Johnny Law]

That's my big takeaway. It wasn't just a fishing trip. It was really.

[Host]

He said before, as much as he can be a lazy, you know, employee, he's a great guy. He's a great guy and he cares, you know, and who knows if, like, let's say, get him had been born now and they had different programs and stuff like that, to have him adjust a little bit more, it'd be better. But, I mean, it's hard to argue with your way. You worked out. Walt really took you under his wing, and any progress you made has got to be attributed to Walt.

[Co-host]

No.

[Gidham]

Well, I think they. Again, they started it, you know, back then. And then it's, you know, I latched on to people, I think, who can help me, and, you know, they. They help me.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, I will. One last remark for me, I guess, is that that I found a really interesting common link. I think between everything that get him does. No. And it really is this hyper, hyper sense of nostalgia and emotion tied to objects, everything. So I feel like that is a huge part of your life where you. You can't. You can't move forward because you think you're throwing the past away. And. Yeah.

[Host]

No sense of Buddhist impermanence in this guy.

[Johnny Law]

No, no. I'd love to see one phone. I really would. Yeah.

[Co-host]

Knock him down to one phone.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Host]

Even two.

[Johnny Law]

Even two would be better.

[Co-host]

If you could have his number of phones, you'd be ahead of the game.

[Gidham]

Game.

[Host]

Yeah. Yeah. Well. But again, he's doing fine. Like, what's, What's. What's he wanting for?

[Co-host]

Well, how would. How much longer do we got?

[Host]

Not. Would you be wanting for if you.

[Johnny Law]

Were in his position.

[Host]

What is he wanting for?

[Co-host]

Was this episode brought to everyone. Commercial free for commercial free, baby.

[Host]

Sponsors heard about the showers.

[Co-host]

How many times did they mention Sandusky?

[Host]

Oh, wow.

[Co-host]

And now you. Now I asked you before we turn on the mics, I was like, we have to get the green screen down today. And you were like, well, I don't know if I can get to it because I'm in bad shape. And you were going to allude to what happened. Why are you in bad shape?

[Gidham]

Shape because of the.

[Co-host]

The underwater canoe.

[Gidham]

The underwater canoe, y'. All.

[Co-host]

You're all sore and shit.

[Gidham]

I. Yeah. Oh, okay.

[Co-host]

Yeah. He's all.

[Johnny Law]

When. When you watch. Yeah, when you watch this video of him, there's going to be no question as to why that green screen is still up there.

[Host]

Okay, Just. Just want to point out that the green screen is held onto the walls with 15 clips, giant alligator clips that you could take down in.

[Gidham]

I. I'm.

[Host]

I'm dreading less than a minute.

[Gidham]

I'm. No, I'm dreading, like, that step up. It's on a. I'll do it.

[Co-host]

I'll do it.

[Gidham]

But I'll do it. I'll do it.

[Co-host]

But the.

[Gidham]

No, it's just because it has to come down and then go back up. So you do today.

[Host]

It's called a job.

[Co-host]

It's wild. It is insane.

[Gidham]

It's crazy as.

[Co-host]

But it has to go back up within a day. Don't you understand?

[Host]

My next work day, it has to go up.

[Gidham]

I didn't say I wouldn't do it. I'm just thinking it's.

[Host]

You're specifically saying you won't do it?

[Gidham]

No, no, I'm saying, like, it's just going to take a little longer than it normally does.

[Host]

Oh, my God. All right. Wow.

[Co-host]

All right, well, I mean, now you're off back to Boston, huh?

[Johnny Law]

Back to Boston?

[Host]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

Is that like. It's got to be rough, huh? I mean, now you got to go back to the old nine to five.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Host]

You know, this is your last hurrah. This was your last.

[Johnny Law]

God, you're depressing me now.

[Host]

Guys, dad, life. You have to. This.

[Johnny Law]

No. Yeah. I'll be. I'll be honest. My life at home is very like, I. My job is great in the sense that I can kind of come and go as I please as long as things get done. I fish a ton up there.

[Co-host]

Okay.

[Johnny Law]

My wife fully supports my fishing. It means I'm not.

[Co-host]

So you don't have to. You don't have any. Like, you want to go away on a short notice over a weekend? It's not really an issue. It's never an issue.

[Johnny Law]

Never.

[Co-host]

You gotta talk to my buddy Tom. Tom.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah. Is it an issue?

[Co-host]

Yeah, Tom needs some. Oh, my God.

[Johnny Law]

So. So since Q West, right. The beginning of April.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

To now, I have not been home one weekend.

[Host]

Whoa.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah. Because of tons of different things that have happened. Some of it works. It's brutal, man. I'm like so excited to do nothing, you know.

[Co-host]

Tom Miles text number, you know, is.

[Johnny Law]

The phone number I. I have Tom.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Gidham]

You got.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

You guys gotta get. You gotta start helping. You helped get him out this weekend. Now you point your.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah.

[Co-host]

Your. Your wisdom towards Tom so he can get a weekend away from home.

[Johnny Law]

Well, right now, I mean, Tom's got it right. I feel like sometimes it's. I'd much rather sometimes just be relaxing at home. I think I over commit to stuff a lot of the time.

[Host]

So if you're gone three weeks, three weekends, four weekends a month.

[Co-host]

And this is a heavy travel for you too. Like it takes what, four hours to get here from Boston, then another two to the kids camp.

[Johnny Law]

Yeah, but I. But I. I work in fun stuff. So I came down the day before and I did some saltwater fishing. Gotcha. Like near right above. Like where New Jersey and New York kind of meet. There's some saltwater fishing to do down there, so I did that. So it's a more leisurely thing.

[Host]

Oh, do you want on a.

[Johnny Law]

No, I just went out. I. I brought a surf rod, really long rod and.

[Co-host]

Yeah.

[Johnny Law]

So I try to work in, you know, fun.

[Host]

Some manly going on.

[Gidham]

You.

[Host]

I know.

[Co-host]

I'm not doing any of it.

[Host]

Me neither.

[Co-host]

What about you, Walt? You doing any manly?

I went to a comic book show at the mall this weekend. I thought that was pretty manly.

[Host]

It's pretty good. That's not bad.

[Co-host]

What mall? What mall is Whipping Center?

Center had a comic book show. They tatted as a comic book show, but it was 90% Pokemon cards. Pokemon cards over the.

They're back, man.

Oh, all right. Tell him, Steve. Dave.