1KHO 605: Let Them Fall in Love First | Dan Blewett, This Slump Shall Pass

Summary

Podcast Summary: The 1000 Hours Outside Podcast

Episode: 1KHO 605: Let Them Fall in Love First | Dan Blewett, This Slump Shall Pass

Host: Ginny Urch
Guest: Dan Blewett (Former professional baseball player, author, and coach)
Date: October 27, 2025

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Episode Overview

This episode centers on the value of unstructured outdoor play and its foundational role in a child’s development, especially within the context of youth sports. Ginny Urch speaks with Dan Blewett, a professional baseball player turned coach, author, and mentor, about how to nurture a true love for sports in children, why free play paves the way for passion and resilience, and how parents can best support their kids through both triumph and adversity—on and off the field. The episode also explores Dan’s visual mindset book, "This Slump Shall Pass."

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Key Themes & Discussion Points

1. The Value of Free Play in Childhood & Sport

[01:05] - [02:38]

• Dan reflects on his late entry into baseball (age 8), noting his early childhood was spent outdoors catching turtles and frogs.
• He attributes his enduring passion for baseball to countless hours of backyard free play with friends and family, not early regimented training.
• Concern is voiced over the current trend of highly structured sports at very young ages (e.g., 6U and 7U). Dan worries this structure might reduce kids’ opportunity to fall in love with the game organically.

Notable Quote:
"There was a lot of free play, just backyard baseball in my childhood, and I think that was really important...I have a little bit of an issue with the lack of free play that kids are getting now in youth sports. A little troubling to me."
— Dan Blewett [01:50]

2. Challenges for Modern Parents & Navigating Youth Sports Culture

[05:59] - [10:17]

• Ginny asks about the "conundrum" parents face: balancing a late start with kids’ FOMO and the push to conform to organized leagues.
• Dan suggests backyard play as a rich alternative—providing skill-building, opportunities to sample various sports, and more individualized attention.
• He encourages all parents, especially moms, to engage in sports play regardless of their background, debunking imposter syndrome around coaching and participation.

Notable Quote:
"You can do sporting activities, backyard version of any sport, and just play with your kid. And I know you have a ton of moms listening to this podcast...don't act like there's a gender difference...go be the sports mom."
— Dan Blewett [08:36]

3. Dabbling vs. Specializing & Parent Involvement

[11:19] - [13:32]

• Both agree that early specialization is unnecessary. Many great athletes tried multiple sports as kids.
• Ginny shares her own story of coaching youth basketball for the first time with no experience, learning (and making mistakes) as she went—emphasizing enthusiasm over expertise.
• Dan stresses it’s more important for coaches and parents to foster a positive, encouraging environment than to have technical mastery.

Notable Quote:
"If you have kids just like, they can't wait to go back to basketball practice with coach Jenny, like, that's it, right? Even if you’re learning the same as they are...That’s the biggest thing that matters."
— Dan Blewett [12:26]

4. Dan’s Journey: From Athlete to Mentor & Author

[18:02] - [25:15]

• Dan discusses his transition to mentorship, driven by feedback from his YouTube audience (over 100k subscribers for baseball).
• His new book, "This Slump Shall Pass," is designed to be visually engaging and accessible, inspired by Austin Kleon’s style—“a mental skills book for all athletes of all sports.”
• The book features hand-drawn illustrations, practical chapters (e.g., on routines and personality types), and aims to make mental skills approachable for the “TikTok generation.”

Notable Quote:
"All the mental skills books that exist so far...they’re walls of words just like any other book...That’s just not how kids are now."
— Dan Blewett [19:00]

5. Letting Kids Fail, Building Grit, & Parental Boundaries

[27:39] - [36:06]

• Dan urges parents to refrain from smoothing every bump in their child’s athletic journey. Letting them fail is key to resilience.
• He likens this to his own comebacks from injury, crediting his “deep love” for baseball to early free play and a sense of ownership over his journey.
• Parents should offer support and resources, but refrain from intervening with coaches or complaining about fairness.

Notable Quote:
"There’s too many parents in sports right now trying to pave the road for their kid and make it pothole free where they're just gonna...not have the tenacity and the resilience to stick with it later."
— Dan Blewett [28:19]

6. Enduring Joy, Sampling Sports, and Adult Play

[36:34] - [40:09]

• Dan recounts finding joy in adult recreational softball, tapping into the same feelings he had as a child.
• Ginny describes her brother’s and other adults’ lasting involvement in sports—not for achievement but for social, physical, and emotional fulfillment.
• They call for a generational perspective: the true gift of sports is a lifetime of connection and well-being, not just scholarships or pro contracts.

7. Unspoken Realities of Sports: Pain, Injury, and Perseverance

[41:52] - [53:25]

• Dan shares raw vignettes from his professional career—multiple major surgeries, heartache at missing opportunities, and the daily struggle and grit required at every level.
• The reality is rarely broadcast: regular pain, sacrifice, uncertainty, and learning to manage what you cannot control.
• He advocates for coping mechanisms such as routines and mental reframing, and wants kids and parents to understand that resilience and perspective are as important as performance.

Notable Quote:
"Every athlete that’s out on the field...half of those women, two thirds of them have an ankle injury that hurts them every time they run...But it’s also like...I want to stay on this field. You know, it’s just a lot of ups and downs, a lot of hardship. But it’s also like, you build a lot of resilience and toughness."
— Dan Blewett [51:18]

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Key Topics from "This Slump Shall Pass"

[46:46] - [56:02]

• Control: Learning what you can and cannot control—coaches’ decisions, umpire calls, injury, politics, outcomes.
• Perspective: Developing a “bright-side” mentality and practicing gratitude and resilience.
• Identity: Navigating the challenge when your sport no longer defines you.
• Letting Go of Stats: Focusing on development, not numbers.
• Dealing with Haters: How to handle criticism and negativity.
• Process over Outcome: Emphasizing mastery, not control of all events.

Notable Quote:
"Sports is a proving ground to learn...like, look, I know you did everything you could and the umpire made the wrong call...As a parent, you can teach your kid to whine and complain...or you can say: you don’t control the umpire, but you can control...your habits."
— Dan Blewett [59:27]

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Memorable Moments & Quotes

• Ginny on Parent Coaching:
  "I had literally never played a game in my life. So you can learn from YouTube."
  [13:58]

• Dan on Team Dynamics:
  "You learn stuff from the good ones and the bad ones. We just need people who are encouraging and willing to learn and grow and work with the kids to just step in there and do it."
  [13:22]

• Dan on Family Memories:
  "My dad never said no to the question of, like, do you want to go play catch?...spend the time with your kid, because as you could tell, it'll mean the world to them and they won't forget it."
  [62:30], [64:40]

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Actionable Advice & Takeaways

• Let children discover joy in sports through free and unstructured outdoor play before committing to organized leagues.
• Encourage sampling multiple sports to build diverse skills and help kids find what truly excites them.
• Parents: be present, supportive, and willing to play, regardless of your confidence or expertise.
• Embrace failure and setbacks as learning opportunities, not crises to be solved by adults.
• Focus on the long-term benefits—love for the game, resilience, social bonds—not just short-term accolades.
• Teach kids to focus on controlling their effort, attitude, and preparation, not external factors.

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Closing: Favorite Outdoor Memory

[62:30] Dan shares a touching memory about his late father, who never refused an invitation to play catch.
"That's what I think about. It's a good, good memory, you know?" — Dan Blewett

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Additional Resources

• Dan Blewett's Book: This Slump Shall Pass: A Visual Guide to Mindset, Confidence, and Life for Athletes of all Sports
• Dan’s YouTube Channels: Baseball and Softball Coaching, Q&A, and skill development
• 1000 Hours Outside: Encouraging families to match outside time to kids' average annual screen time (1,200 hours/year)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [01:05] Dan’s Childhood & Late Start in Baseball
• [06:47] Parental Fears & Advice
• [10:17] Backyard Sports’ Value
• [18:34] Why Write "This Slump Shall Pass"?
• [28:19] The Need to Let Kids Fail
• [36:34] Joy in Adult Play & Lifelong Benefits
• [41:52] Professional Setbacks & Grit
• [56:02] Baseball’s Unique Complexities
• [59:27] Sports as a Proving Ground for Life
• [62:30] Favorite Childhood Memory: Playing Catch With Dad

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Overall Impression:
This episode is both heartfelt and practical, urging listeners to recenter childhood and sport around relationships, joy, and self-discovery, rather than comparison, anxiety, or early achievement. Dan Blewett’s journey illustrates the transformative power of play, parental support, and resilience—reminding us that the deepest rewards are lifelong and often found in the simplest moments outdoors.

Transcript

[A]

This episode is brought to you by Marshalls where you never have to compromise between quality and price. The buyers of Marshalls hustle hard working to bring you great deals on brand name and designer pieces because Marshalls believes everyone deserves access to the good stuff. Visit a Marshalls store near you or shop [e-mail] Here we go. Welcome to the 1000 Hours Outside podcast. My name is Ginny Urch. I'm the founder of 1000 Hours Outside and we are going to be talking today with to a professional baseball player. I don't think I've ever talked to a professional baseball player in my entire life.

[B]

Dan Blewett, welcome, welcome. Thanks for having me. Appreciate it.

[A]

So sports are a huge part of a lot of kids lives and so we've got a lot of parents that are listening in and the kids are doing youth sports and that's adding into their time outdoors, which is a wonderful thing. We talk about the benefits of sports that are organized. We talk about the benefits of sports that are organized by the kids. Like pick up games of sports. What's your story? Did you fall in love with baseball as a young kid?

[B]

Yeah, I started I guess late by today's standards. My dad was coaching my brother. We actually our backyard like butted up to a local high school so they would be like over the fence practicing at this field that we could see from our, from our back fence. And for me at like 6 or 7, I was like, nah, I'm good. I'm just going to go back into the woods and like catch turtles and frogs. And I was kind of outdoorsy, that kind of stuff. And then one day it just kind of clicked. And I started at age 8 and I was good at it. I enjoyed it. Like slugging a baseball felt fun. And then I had some early success. I had good coordination like getting bat to ball and you know, catch and throw. And then from there I just, I couldn't get enough. I just was in the backyard every day, you know, playing, you know, one on one baseball with my best friend or whatever, get the neighborhood kids over, playing catch with my dad, all that stuff. But there was a lot of free play, just backyard baseball in my childhood and I think that was really important because today, I mean kids are playing organized sports of all ages at 6U 7U and like I have a nephew and two nieces and like God love them but they're still like, I mean their attention spans and they're talking about dinosaurs picking their nose one second running to get a PB and J From the kitchen. The next it's like. And they're playing. You want these kids playing in the, in the outfield or in the infield or like playing organized sports. It, it's a little mind blowing and I have a little bit of an issue with the, the lack of, I think free play that kids are getting now in youth sports. A little troubling to me.

[A]

Yeah, it's really changed. How interesting that it worked out for you. You started at 8 and not at. For someone who has no idea, can you, I think people can, I guess get it from context, but 6U, 7U.

[B]

Yeah, that's ages 6 and under. And so, you know, 5, 5 year olds would be playing 6U, 6 year olds will be playing 7U. And I think, I think what's. So I think what's changed? And let me give you a little more about my story. But you know, so I played tons of tons of baseball, made my high school team, played varsity as a salt as a sophomore, played small division one for five years because I got a major elbow injury and a surgery. And then I played six years of professional baseball. So minor leagues, not, not like in the major leagues. But my big thing was I had a lot of elbow problems. So I had two major surgeries called Tommy John surgery. I have this big half moon scar on my elbow. I had two partial tears of that same ligament. So basically I had four injuries to my, to my elbow during my career. And I end up sitting out about four and a half years combined like you know, on the dugout while my teammates are running out there having fun. I'm in the training, training room with the trainers, like doing my rehab while they're out there on out in the sun, you know, doing their thing. And for me, I credit a lot of why I endured all that because the emotional and physical toll was really high. I believe I endured that because I just had such a deep love for it that I really developed in the backyard. And, and so I wonder today, when you start organized sports really early, whether kids really get that silly. This is my thing. Like this is fun, this is play versus like this is a regimented activity that I do, you know, and you could still like it and love it, but I think it's harder. You know, I liken it to a relationship. It's like the early, early days of a new romantic relationship. They need to be pretty easy and pretty exciting, right? Lots of smiles and giggles and fun and just like that and intoxicating feeling and it should be easy. And if it's not easy early because, you know, it's just going to get harder as you, you know, both of you grow and change and move in together and like, you add all these stresses onto life, the ups and downs, then it gets harder. But you realize, like, no, I love this person so much. Like, we're going to work through this, right? And sports are that same kind of journey. And so I wonder when kids start the. The really structured, organized sports too early, if it really makes them less suited to feel like, you know, this. Do I really want to keep working for this thing at age 13 when I have major knee pain or I have, you know, some like, growth plate inflammation and my arm just hurts all the time, do I really want to do rehab to go back to that, or do I just want to, like, go play video games or just go do something else with my friends? And so youth sports is really going through a lot of growing pains right now. And it breaks my heart a little bit because I don't think kids get the same, which why I love the, you know, the, the concept of your podcast and your work is like, can we get kids out there playing less and like, working and working baseball or working soccer or working, you know, basketball? So I think that there's a, there's a big shift going on and I think a lot of players, it's tougher for them develop the, the deep love for their sport than. Than they used to.

[A]

Oh, it's really interesting. I think there's a conundrum for parents, though, Dan, because what are you supposed to do? You know, it's like if all the other six you, you know, in your neighborhood are joining the actual team, and then there's no one around to kind of bop the ball around for your kid. And also your kid is starting like, the parents fear, like, my kid's starting to fall behind. So if you join in at 8, maybe this other kid has had 3, 3 years of instruction and your kid, you know, comes to the team and it's kind of like I don't even totally know what's going on. Like, I like baseball. I've gone to a couple of games with my dad or my mom. You know, we've thrown the ball around. What advice do you have for parents for dealing with the situation that they're in that every child is in, every family is in that they didn't create?

[B]

Yeah, I mean, I still think so. I'll give you my, my buddy as an example. One of my former teammates, he has two kids, they live in St. Louis area. He's homeschooling. So he, like, their family's very plugged in all of this. The stuff that you, you believe, which I think is great. And he plays in the backyard with his, with his kids. Like, they play backyard baseball every day, his daughter and his son. And so when you think of like, well, what do I get from organized 7U baseball? What do I get from, you know, 7U baseball in the backyard with my dad? His son is going to get like 50 at bats, right? Throwing him the wiffle ball, hits it, runs around the bases, testing his limits, seeing how fast he is. Can he make it to the next base if he gets tagged out? Like, no one cares because we're in the backyard. His teammates aren't watching, the parents aren't watching. It's this like, little proving ground. But he's getting catch and throw and swing skills every single day. Right? And that can be the same with soccer, basketball, like any sport. I don't want to limit this to baseball. That's my example. But you're right, if, if they're not doing anything sports related and then you just drop them into swim practice, they're going to have to learn to swim amongst kids who maybe are already, you know, further down that path. Now, 8 year olds aren't that good at anything, so we, everyone needs to like, temper their expectations with their fomo, right? But, you know, I, I still think, like, you can do sporting activities, backyard version of any sport, and just play with your kid. And I know you have a ton of moms listening to this podcast. Moms, you can go pitch baseballs to your son. You can be, you can go be their catcher if they want to pitch to you. Like, don't, don't act like there's a gender difference where dad's got to go do a lot of this stuff. Go be the sports mom. You know, there's tons. And I have a friend, she's a former, she's a former fast pitch pro. She played nine years in the, the mpf. And we talk about this and she's like, I'm like, why are there so many more? Why are there so many men softball coaches? Which, that's, that's fine. Like, there are many men who come from baseball and go to softball and coach successfully. She's like, honestly, men are like, oh, I played five seconds of high school baseball. I can, I can coach this, you know, elite 14U team. Or she says, you know, women, they're like, well, I only played five years professionally. Maybe I Should, maybe I should take another coaching course before I get into coaching. 14, uh, and I think there is that, like, I don't know if it's imposter syndrome or what, but I think sometimes women seem to get in this trap where, like, I don't have the credentials to do this. It's like, not, go, go play with your kids. Go learn something on a YouTube video and go, like, do that drill with them. You know, like, just jump in there. And I, you know, I used to own a baseball and softball academy and we had some moms who were very involved and it was, it was great for their kids because like, dad's traveling for business, mom's going to put on the catcher's mitt and go catch her son who's a pitcher. And, you know, I applaud that. So to, to circle back to your original question. Just backyard sports, run around, kick. And that's where you're going to figure out, like, how, wow, maybe they're not that great at catching and throwing a ball, but they love kicking the soccer ball or they love being in the water. And wow, I can really see them as a swimmer. And that's where they can sample lots of different stuff in the backyard. You can figure out what's, what's good for them, what's not. Because baseball is a very unique sport, Very unique demands. Soccer, very unique, very different demands. Right. Mentally and physically. And so I think the backyard is a really great place to just build general athleticism and coordination, but also that, you know, father, son, mother, son, mother, daughter, bond and just get out there and get moving.

[A]

I love all of this. I love it. Dan, you know, I love that you said they get 50 at bats. That was such a great thing to put in someone's head. Of course, of course. If it's just you and one kid or two kid or two kids or five kids, however many you have, going to get a lot more opportunity out there with one parent than they would be on a team with a bunch of kids. I've actually talked to quite a few people about youth sports just because it's become such an all consuming situation and parents are trying to figure that out. And I've read in a few books that a lot of incredible athletes dabbled in several sports when they were young and didn't necessarily specialize until they were a little bit older. And that helped them with all sorts of skills, I would imagine. And so that's really exciting. Okay, I never played sports at all. I did T ball, but I, I love This. I love talking to people who are so good at what they do. I play T ball and I did swim team for like a couple years, but I also coached a team once.

[B]

Just a couple years ago.

[A]

I loved it. I loved it, dan. I coached 10U basketball. I had never played basketball ever, and they needed a coach or there wouldn't be a team. And I felt like it was one of the most prized opportunities of my life. I didn't know it was going to be, but I just used YouTube and I bought some books and I definitely messed up. I messed up. And the very first game, I went out on the court during the game, her husband was like, no, no, no.

[B]

Players. Players only. Yeah.

[A]

It's like, oh, you know, the little things that you don't know. You don't know where they're supposed to sub in you, you know. I learned a lot over the course of a short season, but it really gave me such a perspective on how unique each child is because, you know, this is like they're all the same age bracket and it showed, you know, where their strengths were. I really, really enjoyed it. So the kids won a couple games. It was super exciting. So I agree with you. I think as a parent, if you're nervous about stepping into those spots of helping or just helping your own kid in the backyard for your 7U5 family baseball team in the backyard, it's really special.

[B]

Yeah. Well, I'm sure just knowing you for 13 minutes, you probably fostered a really exciting, enthusiastic, encouraging environment. And that's like three quarters of the battle in youth sports. If you have kids just like, they can't wait to go back to basketball practice with coach Jenny, like, that's it, right? Even if you're learning the same as they are, if you, if they just, hey, this is another grownup that's positive, that's encouraging, that's, you know, clapping along when I make a mistake to get back up there and take the next shot. That's the biggest thing that matters. And they'll. They'll keep getting new coaches as they go to different teams every year. They climb the ladder. They'll learn something from you and something from someone else. And, you know, you might have been one of those girls who maybe doesn't play much longer. Maybe she stops playing basketball after two more years, but she just had the most fun on your team and she's going to remember you over some coaches that had more technical skills. Like, it's a journey, you know, I have so many different coaches and you learn stuff from the good ones and the bad ones. And really, we just need people who are encouraging and willing to. To learn and grow and work with the kids to just step in there and do it.

[A]

Yeah, I really got way more out of it, Dan, than I could have ever imagined. And in fact, at the banquet, you know, there's usually like a little sports banquet at the end. Now I got choked up. I mean, I was, like, crying. It was quite an experience. I loved it. So. And I love your encouragement to step into the ring and get involved, even if you feel a little bit like an imposter syndrome. I had literally never played a game in my life. So you can learn from YouTube.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

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[B]

So.

[A]

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[B]

I was wondering if you're gonna pick up on that, because last night I was listening to your podcast just to make sure I was refreshed on, you know, your style and all that sort of stuff. And I listened to Austin Kleon's episode, so I was wondering if you're gonna make that connection. Yeah, yeah.

[A]

It's a very enticing. And it's just a really cool layout. I was really impressed. So, of the books you have, three of them are fairly related to baseball. Clean your cleats. Dear baseball gods. Pitching isn't complicated. The. This one is a little bit more overarching. Can you talk about why you decided to write this Slump Shell Pass?

[B]

Yeah, so I wanted to write a mental skills book, but I wanted to make it for all athletes of all sports. So that's what this Slump Shell Passes. And for me, I learned. I've learned so much from my YouTube channel. So I have two channels. A baseball channel, which is my biggest channel. I have 101,000 subscribers there. And then I have a softball channel, which has like 44,000. And it's really been. I, I. One of the things I think I do well on those YouTube channels is I respond to most comments now. I get the troll comments and the angry comments and like, what's wrong with you, dude? Why would you say that? Comments. But most of them are really kind and. And they ask me questions that I'm like, oh, yeah, a dad who never played baseball wouldn't know that. And that becomes like, a next video topic. And I've learned so much, and it's really brought me back to remember, just remembering and being humble about how complicated my sport is. All sports have their intricacies, but, like, baseball and softball especially are really complicated sports. Like, if you just drop in, like, you talk about running out on the basketball court. I mean, baseball and softball are just. They're. They're really messy, complex sports. So, anyway, I. I've learned so much from my YouTube audience that I want to make books that, a, make me feel like I can give back my knowledge, but b, really solve a problem that they have. And I have a lot of complicated thoughts on mental training that we could get it to, and if you into, if you want. But one of them is, like, all the mental skills books that exist so far, and many of them are wonderful. Don't get me wrong. This is not me hating on. On sort of my Industry. But they're walls of words just like any other book, right? They're dense. Your kid's got to be a really voracious and interested reader to get through one of them. That's just not how kids are now, you know.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

And so my mom, who's often my muse, she gave me two books for Christmas, like in 2022, one of which was Steal like an Artist. And I flipped through it and I'm like, this is such a good format. You know, you can sit, you know, on the bus, you could sit on the toilet. You can re flip through this book and learn a couple things. And like any person could flip through. So I'm like, this is the style. So I, I hand, I bought a Notebook of like 5, about the same size, like 5 by 8, trim size as my final book and I hand drew this book and I was like, I'm gonna do the same kind of. And then I quickly realized like, I can't even Sharpie draw a book because a lot of Austin Clan's book is like Sharpie art and like some photos, it's kind of mixed media. I was like, this doesn't work. So I realized I had to upskill. And I learned yet another Adobe app. So I learned how to do Adobe Illustrator. I took an online course and I was just like, I just need to keep this simple, illustrate the point, make it, you know, low text, kind of broken up into like little paragraphs, almost like a LinkedIn post. Although I really dislike LinkedIn posts, to be quite honest. And then a lot of imagery. So it just drives home the point. So you can just go back and forth. You feel like it's really easy to read. So I really feel like my book is, you know, a 10 year old could pick it up. Does a 10 year old need to read a mental skills training book? Probably not, but I think from like 12, 13 and up, I think it's, it's really easy to pick it up and find the chapter. There's 10 chapters that, that really speaks to you on your journey because there's a chapter about routines, about sort of like personality types in sports. You know, are you like the more reserved, introverted, like owl type, you know, the really like the big thinker kind of athlete Are you the more like hype man, high energy, like, I'm gonna rally the team. I'm so excited to be here because those are very different types of athletes and I. Those five animal styles that I put in the book in that one chapter about which like, which animal are you? I had teammates like that, right? And one guy is just like the real calm, you know, real reserved, but you put them out there on the mound or in the batter's block and like you see the teeth, right? Like, he's a real scary competitor, but like real calm otherwise. And that's kind of how I am. And then you have other teams who are just like so nice and happy and like bubbly and they're like, hey, Dan, like, hey, ready to pitch today? It's like, you're weird. I don't know, I don't, I don't relate to you, but I, I like you. And there's so. It's a cool melting pot of personalities even at the highest levels. And so anyway, like this book was just to give kids and young athletes and older athletes alike and easy to digest books. I mean, that's gonna like really make sense for the tick tock generation because as you know, it's. Yeah, it's a lot to ask to get a kid to read, you know, 50,000 words or more.

[A]

I am so impressed that you laid this out. I almost can hardly believe it. I love that you use the word upscale because that is what people are talking about in this day and age. Like, you have to be able to pivot pretty quick. I mean, this is phenomenal. It's very. The pages are unique. So even though it's got this format, sort of like Austin Kleon's, it's very. I don't even know what to say. It's like, you know, the fact that at the beginning you've got these cutouts with the people and the, like, it's you. You got this like timeline of your life with these pictures in there and like the arrows and all these little extra drawings and pieces of art. And some pages are dark and some pages are light. That's wild.

[B]

Thank you. And it's funny, you know, like again, like going back to Austin Cleon, like I just sat down and was just like drawing it, you know, and like, let's go and see how this feels. And then obviously it got completely changes. I go to, you know, the constraint of Adobe Illustrator and put formatting it into indesign and, and you look, this is, this is a self published book. Like as far as books that are going to get a mainstream publisher interested, where they're going to give you, you know, an advance and all that, that's a. You have to have a big enough profile and fit a really big need. This isn't probably this is probably too niche of a book to get a, you know, mainstream publisher, so. Which was nice because it's like, look, I have people who need this solution, right? My YouTube, like, I'm making this for people and it's going to be the thing for them, but also it allows me the full creative freedom. It's like, I can do this how I want. No one's going to tell me how this should be. And there's no rules. Right. Like, why does a mental training book have to be all text? It doesn't. It just. It just doesn't, you know, And. But right now there's like, books, there's audiobooks, or there's video, and there's not a lot of in between. And this is kind of in between. I think a lot of people now really want to push back against screens, obviously, which is wonderful. And so, yeah, let's. Let's have something available where it's sort of in transition in that middle ground where it's like, hey, this isn't all words, and it's also not a video. It's in between. And, hey, maybe you like reading. And I've had a couple parents, which is super flattering because I'm sure, you know, the only thing any author wants is for people to read their. Their work. Right?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I've had a couple of parents who say, like, this is. My kid never reads books, and they read your book and they really liked it and they still. They carry in their backpack. And I. That's really special to me. But, yeah, that was the goal, you know, and it's like, let's try to make this accessible to kids who don't necessarily. Because I didn't like to read. I was, like, forced to read in high school. I didn't like doing it. I read now because it's like, wow, I can get someone's, like, whole life experience. They're just going to give it to me if I, you know, listen to an audiobook or buy the paperback. But as a kid, that just wasn't. I was like, I'm. I'm outside all the time. Like, I get this book out of here. What am I going to sit on my couch for 10 hours? Like, get out of here, you know?

[A]

Right. Well, what's interesting is now it's not forced. I'm hearing about all sorts of high schoolers that don't force any reading. Not one book. The kids don't have to read one book. So it's like, you know, there's got to be a little Bit of that going on there. So that, like you say, by the time they become an adult and they do feel like, look, I want to learn something from someone else, and I can do this audiobook while I walk or while I practice my sport, or I can read a book, you know, whenever. I really am so impressed. Dan, you did this.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

It is tremendous. And it even has, like, a workbook section in the back. So I'm just thinking through all you would have to do to figure this out and talking about imposter syndrome to go from being a baseball player, professional baseball player, to being like, you know what I'm going to do? I'm going to write a book and do all the layout. It's really incredible.

[B]

Thank you. Yeah, you just dive in, you know, and just embrace that idea that, like, there's no rules and, like, no one is going to stop me from doing this.

[A]

So, yeah, yeah, there are no rules. Do what you want to do and fill the needs that you see are out there. So this particular book is called this, this Slump Shall Pass, A Visual Guide to Mindset Confidence in Life for Athletes of all sports. I wanted to talk about a couple of the topics in here because I feel like they actually are overarching and would be good for anyone. But one of the things you talk about is control. And so obviously this is something that relates to everyone, that there are a lot of things that are out of our control, but especially in sports and for young kids, if they're on a team, like, you don't get to control how much your coach pushes, puts you in. There's a lot of things that are out of your control and maybe seem not fair. It might seem not fair to the parent as well. Yeah, it can cause all these different problems. What advice do you give to parents and to children about that part of sports and life?

[B]

Yeah, well, let's start with parents because, I mean, I think the modern parenting style. And this is not a criticism, it's just like, we've evolved. I think parents, like, my sister's a wonderful parent, and she has the same fears. Very well, it's like, well, I don't want them to. I don't want them to. To suffer. I don't want them to go to school hungry. Like, the other day I was at her house, I slipped over and then had a. A talk farther down the road, and she was just, like, pleading with my niece, like, did you eat enough breakfast? Did you eat like you're. And I'll. You know, it's also like, maybe if she doesn't, she's gonna go to school and she's gonna be hungry and she's gonna, you know, she's gonna figure it out, right. If I don't eat in the morning, I'm going to be hungry and miserable in the middle of the day. Right. And I get it. It's purely out of love. Like, you know what's going to come if you don't eat your breakfast. You're going to be hungry and miserable and sad and not focus well at 1pm at school. And the same thing is true in sports. But unfortunately it's only going to get harder for athletes when they get older and they start to climb the ladder. If they get a deep passion for it, it gets really, really hard. So when they're young parents, you just have to like, let them fail. Like you just, hey, yeah, I know you're, I know you're on the bench, but you know, if you work a little harder, if you get a, you know, go, we can go take some swings. I'm available. I'll play catch with you. I'll kick the soccer ball around. We'll go to the basketball court. Like, if you want to get more playing time, we'll go work on it. But I'm not going to talk to your coach. You know, you can talk to your coach, but I'm not going to talk to your coach. There's too many parents in sports right now trying to pave the road for their kid and make it pothole free where they're just gonna, they're just gonna quit later or they're gonna get cut later or they're gonna not have the tenacity and the resilience to stick with it later. Because again, like I had two major elbow surgeries and I came back from both of them. My, my proudest thing, I think on my bio is that I was an all star after each one of my elbow surgeries. And so like I had to put myself back together again. No one did it for me. No one felt. No one. Like there's not a lot of sympathy to go around. It's like I just had to show up at the training room every day and do my training while my teammates are out having fun. Yeah, and that's an 18 month process and some really lonely winners and some, no one remembers you when you're hurt. They're all just running around. They come back in and like there's some, and this is, I, I, so I'm a trainer for the Positive Coaching Alliance So I do workshops for them and they have, they do so such great work. And one of their workshops is on empathy. And I gave their empathy workout the other day to a school in Virginia. And I talked about this how, you know, for someone like me who like, okay, I'm a month, you know, six of my rehab and I can only throw a ball 40ft right now, and my teammates are coming in out of the dug from the field and, and I'm just sitting the bench like I usually do because I'm, you know, still injured and there's a lot of positivity, like, hey, you know, you're going to come back, you're going to throw harder, like you're going to get, you're going to beat this. Dan, like, that's great, but like, I also, I, I believe that, but sometimes you just need someone to be like, hey man, it must be really hard just sitting here, you know, just watching us do this. You know, like, I see you show up here every day, man, and like, I know this has got to be really tough. So I just want you to, I just want to say, like, I see you and like, if you need to talk, there's like, you know, we'll talk stuff like that. Like, that's like the empathy that sometimes we lack in sports. And so it's not a world that's going to be kind. Like, the sports world is really brutal. There's not a lot of that, there's not a lot of check ins. There's not a lot of like, how are you doings? So your kids have to be tough and you can slowly build that toughness young by just letting them fail. Like, hey, like, I know you got your brains beat out in that tennis match, but you know, let's go hit some more balls. And you know, I believe you can get back up and keep doing better. So parents, you just really have to just be an observer and give them the resources and encourage them and help build their confidence without doing things for them and preventing them from failing because the failure now makes them better in the future. And all the best athletes, I mean, when you go back to Jenny, when you, when you think about why do all these former pro athletes or former collegiate athletes have kids who are as good or better than they are? Like, people start to want, like going back to my buddy, his son, his daughter, if they want to stay with baseball and softball, I'm sure they will be studs because he's teaching them all the stuff that he learned as a pro player and his and his wife was a pro softball player. Like, they're having fun, they love it. They can't wait to play in the backyard every day. And they're, you know, they're going to get little corrections. It's like, hey, if you do it this way, you're gonna hit that ball even farther over the shed. And then they do it, you know, and like that's where, that's why so many multi generational high level athletes exist. Because their parents know you've got to love it, you've got to work at it. But you'll work at it more when you love it, right? No one ever had to tell me, Dan, go for another three mile run in college. Like, I was doing workouts on my off days because I wanted to be a pro player so bad and my clock was ticking that if I didn't get to certain milestones like physically and performance wise by my senior year, I was not going to get signed by anybody, drafted by anyone. Right. So you have to again, like build that love, but allow them to fail and allow them to make it their own thing, you know? And for kids, they just need to, to find the thing that really fits them. Like for me, and this is like my full circle is, you know, I retired from baseball because of a shoulder injury. So I just got like, my childhood dream came to an end from one day to the next 22 years was just like chopped down and I was really lost. It was a big identity crisis and I didn't think I'd ever play any form of baseball again. Now I play slow pitch softball. I'm like two and a half years into that and I just play co ed well actually playing one's men, one men's team now. But I play at a low level where I just, I don't feel like I have anything to prove to anyone. I don't feel like I have to be good at. Like I, obviously I'm, I am very good. I hit, I hit bombs, Jenny.

[A]

All right, that's low pitch softball.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

People should come out and watch.

[B]

Yeah, come on out and watch. But I don't want to play high level slow pitch softball. Like I've seen what that looks like. I just don't have that competitive juice for it. Like I don't care if we win or lose. I just want to like run out. Like, I love running the bases. If you hit it over my head to the fence and I have to chase it, I love that I get to sprint after it and then I get to throw it Even farther to the cutoff man. Like every little action, I, I just experience it as a 39 year old, literally the same way I did when I was an eight year old boy. Like, oh, this is fun. That ball's coming in, I just get to whack it and then I get to book around the bases and sometimes I get to try to throw a runner out. I just get to throw as hard as I freaking want. And it's just like, and there's so much variance and it's like maybe tonight there'll be a runner on third. I'll get that deep fly ball and I'll get to catch it and try to hose him at home plate. There's always something new.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And like if you build that joy young and just love the actions of your sport and sample, like we talked about sampling different sports. Like, I just love kicking the soccer ball. I just love being in the pool. I just love playing tennis. Like, I love serving, I love the backhand. Like whatever it is, find the sport that you really love and then it's not going to feel like work. It will still feel like work. Don't get me wrong, because there's a lot of things outside your sport. The conditioning, the strength training, all the discipline that takes to be really good at it. But when you love it, like this is. So anyway, back to me with the slow pitch softball, like this is just really reminded me that like I loved just deeply. It's like a part of me throwing a ball and swinging a bat more so throwing a ball, like I need to do it and I just feel like very much like myself when I do that. So I kind of lost track of that when I was a pro, a pro pitcher, because like this is my job and it's not like the smiley laughy fun anymore. It's like the competing and like this is my life's purpose. And like when I pitch well, I feel like I'm, you know, I'm on my way. Right. But you lose track of like the, oh, that was cool what I just did. Or like, oh, I just, I didn't get the guy. But man, that was, that was a fun play, you know, and, and so you want to help parents again, like you want to help your kids find that right sport for them where they might latch on to one right away. Like, oh, I like, I like basketball. But like if they haven't tried four or five or six other sports, they might know there might, there might be one that just gives them deep, deep joy and like, and Also maybe they don't find that like again for me, I get really deep like part of my being joy from throwing a ball and swing a bat, like the rotational thing, like whatever. That's part of my DNA.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I'm lucky that I found it. But there's a, there was certainly a chance or an alternate universe in which my parents just didn't expose me to baseball. Or maybe my first coach was a brute and I hated it because of my first coach and I didn't want to do it again. Like you just don't know. But I just feel really lucky that I found the sport that just really fit me. And like even today as a grown up, I just like, I can't wait to go out and I don't care if we win or lose, but like I get my bats, I get to throw, I get to run and I have really good people around me like that. We are all in the same mindset that we're just out here having fun, competing a little bit. We rather win than lose, but we just get to be out here in the sun and be outside, you know.

[A]

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[B]

Yeah.

[A]

What are they going to be? They're probably not going to be playing sports at all. You're thinking about it just in terms of this very short stint where you're like, I hope they make division one or I hope they get a scholarship or I hope they go pro. And I read a book recently where it talked about the amount of kids who are a little league all star. Like Little League all star games have been going on for 100 years or I don't remember the statistics.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And you were like, oh gosh. I mean this has been going on a long time and it's on espn. Like how many of those kids have gone pro? And it was like 47 or so. It's so low.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So the expectation of, of where your kid's going to go with it. But to think about. So my brother does that. My, my brother, my youngest brother Luke. He does. He's been doing, I guess rec baseball for as long as I can remember. He's in his 30s. He's on this team called the Whompers. And we went and saw his game the other day and he had like a double header. Is that what it's called? Or a hitter Double header.

[B]

Double header for two. Two games. Yep.

[A]

Yeah. Double header. Okay. And I was kind of really intrigued, Dan, because I was thinking like all of these people, it's a co ed team, they could just be like home watching tv. And they're out here at this random field playing these other random teams, and what a wonderful thing to do with your time. Some of them had kids that were there watching and. And it just is fun. They did it for the enjoyment of it. My other brother plays tennis really well. Didn't grow up playing tennis at all. And as an adult now in his 40s, and he plays mixed doubles and singles, and he's out in California and it's a huge part of his life. And so I love that you brought that up like your own life, which is instead of looking at it for just at college age, which a lot of kids aren't going to make it to college age, I think 75% quit at 13 or something high. Think about it. If they're in their 20s and their 30s, and they can use this to build community and stay active and be outside, and it can just be something that they love. So I love that you brought that up. I love that you brought up that sports can be really brutal. And that's, I think, one of the things that no one talks about. They really only talk about the glory. And, you know, you hit the winning shot or you scored the home run, you hit in the home run, the grand slam that won the game. Can you talk about that hard side of it? Because if as a parent, then you're really pushing. It's interesting to hear your story and you talk about this in the book. You say that it was your dream and your desire. You wrote you had a vow, you'd made a vow. So this is, this is in the book. This Slim shall Pass. You wrote this despite my setbacks. So in your season, senior year of high. Is it high school when you got your first injury?

[B]

Well, my sophomore year of high school, I got my first partial tear of my elbow. And then my, my senior year of college, I got my first surgery. So I think in my, in the book, I'm referring to my senior year of college. College. Yeah.

[A]

Okay, so you say you sat your entire senior year season of college because of an elbow injury. Despite my setbacks, I made the vow that I'd somehow still go pro. And two years to the day after my first, my final collegiate pitch, I made my pro debut with a team in Illinois. So that's coming from inside of you. And I feel like you kind of have to have that in order to deal with the parts that are really hard.

[B]

Yeah, I mean, I don't know where the, that flame of, like, just belief in self comes from. I Think it's, I think it's built up like, I think the one, the one thing that sticks out like so my very first high school or my very first baseball coach, a man named John Resta. He, I guess I was in like, yeah, I was going into high school and I was going to try out for football and I didn't, I end up, did not end up sticking with football. I went to like a couple practices and I was like, the freshman football thing, this is not for me. And, but I remember him saying, he's like, dan, I heard you're trying out for football. If you hurt your shoulder and can't play on the USA Baseball team, I will never forgive you. And. But just to hear like that this adult, like, obviously like John was a. He was one of my favorite favorite coaches at age 8. I don't really remember anything he taught me. I mean I was, I was really young, but I just remember like that, like, oh, wait, you think I could play on the USA Baseball team? And he was completely, like, completely genuine. Like I was, I was a really good young player. It's. I started to become a little less good when I started to have arm problems and I hit high school and like, you know, other kids just like take off too. But I was always a very good player. But really when I started to have those setbacks, I started to have to work a lot harder at it. And in college I was the, I didn't get a scholarship and I was basically the last pitcher on the depth chart as a small division one. So I was. When I really realized, like, oh, I've, I have not continued on this upward path that I was when I was from like 8 to 8 to 18. But I'll give you a story. So anyway, I don't know where that belief in self came from, but I think I always have that. But I think a lot of people instill it in you and just such a drive. Yeah. And like my parents and they never told me this until way after the fact, but like when I got my second elbow surgery, so my third year in pro ball, I was leading the league in ERA in strikeouts and like batting average against which are like three very good stats. So basically I was like the best starting pitcher in this low level independent minor league team or minor league. So I made the All Star team and I was supposed to be the All Star game starter. I was like, wow, my first All Star game, I'm going to be the starting pitcher. Like that's a really big honor. A couple of Weeks before the game, I started having elbow pain. And, you know, this is from my. My surgery was like, four years later and. Or a couple of years later, and I didn't think I could ever have to need that surgery again. So I had some elbow pain. I was still pitching, but, like, my velocity was dropping, and so I was just trying to pitch through it, and I got a cortisone shot because I was like, this. This surgery couldn't have failed. That couldn't. That couldn't be the possibility. So I figured it was bone spurs. I actually. The last day, it got so intense in, like, the second or third inning of my last start that I was choosing my pitches based on which ones hurt the less because it really felt like it releases. I could kind of feel the bones spread apart in my elbow. I could. It felt like a screwdriver getting shoved into my elbow. But I was, like, committed because there were scouts in the stands. I was committed to, like, not walking off with an injury because that's the. Literally the way my college career ended. I was pitching in front of 15 scouts in the conference tournament. I felt a big sensation in my arm on a certain pitch, and then, like, five pitches later, like, I had to point at my elbow and walk off. And that's how my college career ended. And it was. It was brutal. And it ended all my aspirations of getting drafted by an MLB team and just having to walk off with all those scouts, literally with a clipboard, just, like. Basically just like, scratching my name off. So, you know, fast forward, you know, three or four years. I'm about to pitch in my first All Star Game, and then I get the MRI results two weeks before that. And he says, doctor says, dan, you know, I haven't read an MRI of a player who's torn a previously repaired ulnar collateral ligament. He said, but I'm pretty sure yours is torn. And I'm pretty sure you need Tommy John again. He's like, I'm going to refer you to a different doctor, because I've never done a revision. He said, so you need to see one of the best baseball surgeons in the country, because they're the only guys who would have done revision surgeries. Because even now, it's probably only a couple hundred people in the world have had this surgery twice. So it's a sad little group I'm in. Oh, and so I sat through my first All Star game waiting for surgery, you know, and my parents, years later, they're like, we didn't think you were going to do that. We didn't think you're going to. You're going to sign up for that again. And I was like, really? Do you not know me? Like, and they're like, it just was so hard the first. The first time, and it was so long for you to get back. And like, you. They're like, we just didn't think you'd want to do all that. All that pain again. And I was like. And I thought about it. I won't get into that story right now. But, like, I thought about it for about an hour, because when I got the news, I was in the dugout and the surgeon calls. Like, I just said, he, like, he's like, hey, I've watched your. I've seen your mri. Like, I'm pretty sure you need surgery again. I walked back into the outfield. My teammate's like, hey, what's the news? And I just, like, couldn't look at him. And I just walked off the field and just, like, found a tree and I cried. So, you know, like, those. Those moments, it goes back to the love. It's like, why am I doing this? I don't know. You know, it's like. And it's because this belief that I have this special story. And, like, as the injuries piled on, I think for me it was like, well, now they're going to make a movie about you if you make it, or whatever. You know, it's like, I can't quit now. But at some point, like, years later, my shoulder was so painful, more unlike the how hard sports are. So I wrote a novel. I'm actually shopping. I'm looking for a literary agent now. And it's a story about a minor league baseball player who's. Who's. His arm falls apart. The same time, his father is dying from cancer, and he meets a girl, and she kind of puts him on her. On his back. But, you know, in the story, it's obviously fiction. It's me pancaking two major life events together, but it's fiction. But there's a couple little scenes that are from my real life, one of which is the character. His name is Jeremy Oakton. He. His arm is in such pain that he has this little routine that he does. And this is. This is from my real life, my last season, my shoulder. I woke up on opening day. My arm was so in so much pain that as I reached over to, like, turn my phone off, like, I reached to the bedside table, I got this jolt of pain down my shoulder, and I was like, oh, God. I go in the shower and like, I can't. I can't like wash my hair. I had hair at the time with my right arm. I like literally wash my body with my left arm. And I was going to pitch that night, and that was the first game of 140 game season. I was like, okay, how am I going to do this? How am I going to get through 140 games? Somehow get healthy somehow, like, you know, in the, in the background, continue to pitch and not go on the disabled list and get healthy so that one of these teams is going to put me in their AAA system and hopefully I'll be in the major leagues by the end of the year next year. Like, that was the goal, right? And we had this stuff called hot stuff. It's this like big jar of like. It's basically like petroleum jelly with capsaicin, which is the ingredient from hot peppers that makes it hot. And it's tinted this really deep orange that's like. It's like a coral snake. It's like this stuff. It, like, it tells you that it's hot just by the color of it. Most players don't touch that stuff. Like there's a. There's a couple grades of it and no one, not many people use the really, really hot, the really hottest version. But my shoulder just hurt so much that I needed to a. Distract myself from the pain besides the dozen Advil I took every day. And so I. In like the second or third inning, I would go into the training room, I'd take my jersey off and I'd. I'd cover my arm in this hot stuff. I'd like smear it from like mid forearm all the way up to my shoulder and I rub it in. Then I'd let it sit and then I would rub more on so much that it wouldn't all. All soak into my skin. So I was like, okay, trial and error. I was like, how can I get more of this into my arm so it burns more? So I took a, an ice bag, like the same bag you get, like the grocery store, you know, for your produce. That thin bag. I cut out the bottom. I slid that basically just now plastic tube up my arm, and then I taped it at the forearm so it makes it made like a sauna suit. And so then. And within the next like 10 or 15 minutes, it would like force more of that stuff into my pores as my arm started to sweat in the bag. And I remember like being on the dugout rail, like, you know, leaning over, watching the Game and like, the fourth inning, because I would usually pitch, like, the seventh or eighth, and my arm just burned so bad that I, like, couldn't hold a conversation with a teammate. And, like, watching the game was, like, hard because I was just like, it's like if you're in the shower and the water's, like, way too hot, and you just, like, you could. You could tolerate it for a minute, be like, like, I need to turn this down. It was like that, like, for, like, just an hour or two.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

And then in the seventh inning, if they called my name, I would take off my. My jacket, I would pull down the plastic bag, pull it off like a snake skin, and I would start warming up, and I go in the game. And that was like, my opening day of my 2016 season. And after that, I was just like, how am I going to do this for 139 more games? Because, you know, I'm only going to pitch in 50 of them as a reliever, but I'm going to have to prepare to pitch in every single one of them, because that's what relievers do, right? And so that's the hardship. And no one talks about that stuff. Like, every athlete that's out on the field, you know, women's national soccer team, half of those women, two thirds of them have a. Have an ankle injury that hurts someone every time they run. Their Achilles tendon is swollen, their back is in. Like, everyone takes the field with stuff like that. Everyone. And there's a lot of toughness, and it takes a long time to learn, like, what you can play through, what you can't. And also, why would you want to do that? Like, why did I want to do this? I think it's because of the backyard baseball, you know, and the connection to, like, my dad and my family, my mom, and like, all those big things were like, I'll do this. I want to stay on this field. You know, it's just a lot of ups and downs, a lot of hardship. But it's also like, you. You built. You build a lot of resilience and toughness, and you learn that you can continue to find ways to solve problems. And you learn, like, how to be time oriented and detail oriented. And routines are one of the biggest things you learn. Like, how can I continue to smooth out my performances to have less ups and downs, which I talk about in the book. How can I be more consistent? Because at higher levels, it's not about being better. It's about being better every single day. It's about Being if you're a one to ten, you just want to be a seven and a half to an eight every single day. You don't want to be a seven one day and a nine the next day or a six one day. You want to show up every day. Like, we know what to expect out of Dan, or we know what to expect out of Kelly, our point guard. Or we know what to expect out of, you know, Judy, our. Our. Our setter, our libero. In volleyball, like, coaches need consistency, and that's what the best players are. They show up every day and they're very, very good every single day.

[A]

You put on so many topics. I think identity is one that was an interesting one. And I love that you talk about in the book the Slump Shall Pass. You talk about perspective and you talk about being able to see the bright side of things, like being that type of person that can look at these different situations, and that's a life skill. And I feel like that's what you've done. You've taken this mental toughness and the things that you've gone through, which have been unbelievably difficult. You know, these injuries, these things you don't expect, and you talk about in terms of what you can't control, injuries is just one of them. Politics. So you write. We all know that politics exist in sports. The environment, which. That was an interesting one. You know, you got to go play a game every once in a while. We'll watch football and it's like snowing. You know, you're like, wait a minute. You know, how. How do you even prepare for that, you know, to play this game now? Everybody's wet and the field's wet and the ball's wet and it's freezing cold and it's snowing. So actually, that would make you pretty resilient and with a lot of grit. You can't control other people and you can't control the outcomes. Like, that's always an interesting thing, too. Like in the March Madness, it's just one game. So, you know, you. You're a lower team, and you come up against this higher team. I mean, sometimes the lower team wins, and you just. You can't control those outcomes. And you see these collegiate athletes, these, like, tougher than tough. So impressive cry.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You can't control the outcome. So it's incredible that you've. Because I know it's hard to. I don't know, you don't really lose your. That identity, but you. You transition. And it happens young with professional Sports players often. Right. They don't necessarily last for forever. And so you're having to transition to another stage of life. And so you've taken all of this mental toughness and you do all of this coaching for sports families and for kids like these mental and physical skills that you need. So I think that's an incredible thing that you've done, taking your own experience and been able to put it out into the world in a way that helps a whole lot of people. So the book, this book is called this Slum Shall Pass. Good for any kid, good for any sports family, but just good for life as well. You have other advice in there? Like to look back and see how far you've come. I really like that. Don't let the top of the mountain feel like the bottom, which I feel like, especially if you're a really, if you're a person that really pushes yourself, that that would be an easy thing to do. Talk about letting go of statistics and statistics and focusing on development and you talk about how to deal with the haters. So, so much in this book, and this is just one of four, I am curious, what are the complexities that exist in baseball and softball that are unique to that sport?

[B]

Well, there's a lot of rules. Number one, that's like a low hanging fruit. It's. It's a much more complicated sport to watch and understand. And even I've gotten an appreciation for that. Just playing like really low levels of like kickball or. Which has the same rules as baseball basically or really low level coed softball where players don't know the rules. It's really hard to explain. Well, all right. If there's one out and it's first and second or one, one out and it's first and third, if it's a ground ball, then the third base runner on third base will run depending on if it's hit to these two fielders, but not if it's to these fielders. If it's hitting in the line drive, you need a freeze and then, you know, if it's at medium depth, you can maybe tag up and score. Like there's just lots of, there's just lots of nuance. Yeah, yeah. To running the bases especially. But as far as the sport itself, there are so many ups and downs and there's, it's so much less. The outcomes are way less in your hands in baseball and softball than most other sports. Like in basketball, you're going to take the shot that you choose to take and you're going to shoot it and wind's not going to blow it off course. It's going to go in the net based on your efforts. Right. And football, like obviously there are some weather conditions but most other sports don't have this thing. In baseball and softball which is when I release a pitch, I have no control over what happens after that. So like I commit to what pitch I want to throw and why. Like I'm throw a change up on the outside third of the plate and then I'm going to throw the best I can. Maybe it goes that spot, maybe it doesn't. I don't control whether the hitter swings at all. I don't control whether my catcher catches it or drops it. I don't control where the ball goes when the hitter hits it and then I don't control whether the fielder fields it correctly or not. And any of those things. So like you learn to, to, to understand that. You know, I'll give you an example. I, I was pitching in the ninth any of the game, two outs, we're tied. So like the winning run was on third base. Two outs and I'm a one and two count on this hitter and I'm throwing like eye level fastballs. He's just like barely hanging on. I've almost got him where I feel like I can strike him out and I throw a pitch that like would almost hit the bill of his, of his helmet. It was so high and tight and I'm like this is the pitch that I want to throw. He just like barely swings, nicks it. It goes directly over my first baseman's head. This little blooping, blooping, you know, fly ball lands in the infield dirt over my first baseman's head for the game winning hit. It just was hit in such an awkward place that the first baseman just like couldn't go back. Like it's often easier to catch a ball. It's a little bit to your one side or the other if you're going back on it. And just like that was the game winning hit this like terrible, like he hit it 89 like 104ft landed in the infield and that's a game winner. And then I've also on the same token made really bad pitches and guy hits 110 mile per hour line drive right into my shortstops mitt. So it's like did I do good when I made, when I made the good pitch and got a, and lost the game and then made a bad pitch and then got an out and there's just so much of that. And then you factor in bad hops. If you're an infielder, bad weather, you know, you got a pitch and you're sliding around the mound sometimes, you know, sometimes you bat really bad. Umpires, you just have to learn to let go of lots of things that you cannot control. Like, I make a really good pitch and it was definitely a strike, but the umpire called it a ball. I can whine about it, I can get mad about it. That's only going to make me worse. It's only going to affect me negatively on the next pitch. But it is what it is.

[A]

Think about that. Oh, my God. Which happens so much. So much.

[B]

And that's common to all sports. And that's a big thing. Parents, because I know we're running low on time, let the umpires screw your kids over, because guess what's going to happen? They're going to have a bad boss in the future, right? Who's going to make. Yeah, they're going to promote someone over your son or daughter when they definitely deserve that promotion. Or someone's going to take credit for their work in the office. Right. They may make this great presentation. Their boss presents it on their behalf, gives them no credit at all, like, whatever. There's all sorts of ways that nepotism plays out in the office. Weird office politics, you know, terrible things happen and people don't get the credit that they're due. That happens all the time in sports. Sports is a proving ground to learn. Like, look, I know you did everything you could and the umpire made the wrong call. Look, umpires are wonderful people. I am very pro umpire. But sometimes they just objectively don't make the right call. Right. And as a parent, you can teach your kid to whine and complain and blame things outside their control and people outside their control. Or you can say, hey, you know, you don't control the umpire, but you can control, you know, maybe if you had played better, like three innings earlier, you, you lost a little focus in the third, that, that, that call doesn't matter in the last inning. Right? Or, hey, like, for me as a pitcher, if I walk a hitter on a borderline pitch, well, if I hadn't thrown three balls prior to that, maybe I hadn't screwed around earlier in the count. I did. I don't get in a, in a, a zero sum, one pitch determines the, the, the outcome of the at bat. Right?

[A]

Right.

[B]

So we always forget, like, oh, the, the big mistake in the last inning, the big mistake with one minute to go, we Blame that on the whole game. It's like we played 59 minutes of soccer and we're blaming one call. In the very end, it's like. And that's not how life is either, right? Like, right. If you're, if you're late to work by two minutes and you're like, oh, if I hadn't hit that, that, that red light, or if there hadn't been road work, it's like, nah, dude, if you left 10 minutes earlier to make sure you had time for all this, that two minute slowdown wouldn't have mattered and now you wouldn't have been in trouble. Right? It's not that that didn't cause you to be late. It was your own habits that caused you to be late.

[A]

So, yeah, I love that you said it's a proving ground for learning, but only if you take those learning opportunities. And that's what some of the other books I've read have talked about. Look, it's not inherent that your kid is actually going to come out a better person, a better team player. They actually may come out worse. They might come out like a jerk. They might come out as someone who blames you. You just, you have to do it right. You have to talk about those things and take those learning opportunities and what a learning opportunity to control what you can and let go of what you can. So just a fantastic book. It's called this Slump Shall Pass. If you are a big fan of Austin Kleon, you're going to be a big fan of this. Because I've actually never seen another book that's sort of similar to that. And it's just so well done and lots to learn. Dan, what an honor to get a chance to talk to a professional baseball player. We always end our show with the same question. What's a favorite memory from your childhood? That was outside.

[B]

I'm going to get choked up. Yeah, my dad died last year, so I'm so sorry. See? So favorite memory. I'm going to get choked up. But that's okay. You know what? So my, my dad passed away last year and really grateful for the time we spent together. The first thing that comes to mind when you say that is my dad taking a bucket of balls and a Fungo bat. A Fungo bat is a. A long, skinny bat that lets it. It makes it easier for you to hit fly balls to your team because a heavy, normal bat will kind of wear you out. And as I got older, my dad couldn't throw it far enough to, to play catch with Me, because I had a. I had a good arm. And we would go on long toss. And my dad never said no to, you know, the question of, like, do you want to go play catch? And so I guess I'll picture us on this football field. I'd take the bucket of balls and I'd chuck them so far, and my dad would collect them on a bounce, put them in the bucket. Sometimes he would hit him back to me. Sometimes he would just run the bucket back. But that's what I think about. It's a good, good memory, you know? Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. Of a dad that was there. A dad that joined you in your love. A dad that took the time, which is. Not all dads. Not all dads do that. Not all dads do that with their sons, with their daughters, and take that time. And what an impactful thing for someone to listen to that. That simple act, going to the field of going to the backyard decades down the road and is a legacy that you've left. And so I think it's so important that you shared that. Dan.

[B]

Thank you. Thank you. And. And like I said earlier to all of you who might have imposter syndrome, don't think you have the skills to play with your kids. My dad, you know, when I could throw way too hard, he bought catcher's gear. And when I could throw too far to long toss with him, he bought a couple dozen more balls. And he said, I'll collect them in the bucket and I'll run them back to you so you don't have to have a cannon like your kid. You don't have to have the tennis skills. Buy more balls, buy equipment, solve the problem, spend the time with your kid, because as you could tell, it'll mean the world to them and they won't forget it.

[A]

Yeah, it's something that they'll hold on to long after. Long after you're gone. Dan, what an honor. What an honor. A professional baseball player. Who would have ever thought?

[B]

Thank you so much. This is a great interview. Appreciate it.

[A]

I just have amazed that I'm having a conversation with a professional baseball player. Fantastic. The book's fantastic. And for those who are interested specifically in softball and baseball, you have all sorts of resources for them. I'll make sure. I'll put the links in the show notes. Dan, thanks for being here.

[B]

Thank you, Jenny and Doug.

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