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Jenny Urch (2:40)

Welcome to the 1000 Hours Outside podcast. My name is Jenny Urch. I'm the founder of 1000 Hours Outside. And we are here today on launch day for Mike McLeod. Congratulations. I'm losing my voice. Okay. Congratulations, Mike, on your new books. They the Executive Function Playbook. The Executive Function Playbook in action. They're out in the world. How are you feeling?

Mike McLeod (3:02)

I am feeling a lot of emotions today, honestly, really writing these books and talking about myself and my own journey with ADHD and, you know, my childhood and my life and really just really focusing on the mission here to spread hope to parents at a time when they need it the most and also giving them an evidence based playbook because this is really what parents need today. Parents today are so drained, so burnt out, so exhausted. I really kept that mission in mind. And all the parents that we work with every single day through grow now, the parent training, the coaching, they're really the ones that inspired me to really, really nail this down. It took well over a year to write both these books and the fact that we're here today at launch day, it doesn't feel real.

Jenny Urch (3:47)

Launch day is actually, I think it's kind of. It's kind of a, like a down. It's. I don't know, it's never like what you expect. You're like, is my billboard in Times Square? No.

Mike McLeod (3:59)

Ye.

Podcast Host or Narrator (3:59)

Yes.

Mike McLeod (4:00)

So many emotions. It's so hard to nail it down. It's like, how did we finally get here? And then you also have the absolutely crippling anxiety of, oh my gosh, these books are now released to the public and people are going to read these now, like, leave reviews.

Jenny Urch (4:14)

Are they going to like it? I think it never is, like, as fireworky as you would hope. Like, you would feel like there should be fireworks going off. You're like, everyone's just going about their regular day. Nothing's really happening. But the books are phenomenal. And we've talked about the Executive Function Playbook, building independence in kids with adhd. And I finally, I read it on in an online copy but have it in hand and it is incredibly helpful. I've already had so many parents say to me, oh, I'm for sure gonna be getting those to use in my family. And the Executive Function Playbook in action, which is actually slightly bigger, is this workbook, but also activity style, because you actually have to do stuff. And I am of the type, Mike, that's sometimes like, oh, a workbook. You know, like, they're gonna have this thing on, but this is a robust. I was incredibly impressed. I thought, gosh, I could use a lot of these activities for myself. You offer parent coaching, but really the, the gist here is that, like, we have to have more skills as adults on how to help our kids and maybe we don't even know the things that they're missing. So I just found this to be incredibly robust and enlightening in terms of really understanding what's going on with our kids and how we can help them. I think it was like a, it's a beast of a book to write.

Mike McLeod (5:33)

Yes. This took the workbook, probably took triple the amount of time as the original book. And that's, that's really all part of it, you know, in creating this workbook. Number one, it's all about empowering parents and giving them hope at a time when they need it the most. But it has to be real, it has to be practical, it has to be hands on it. That's. I, I can't tell you how many parents I've spoken to that just buy workbooks with all the intentions of going through them and those sorts of things, and it never gets done. It never gets filled out. This. Right now, you and I have talked at length about the youth mental health crisis and getting kids outside and getting them off screens. And sure, that's always the first obstacle towards, you know, improving mental health and improving outcomes by giving kids their childhood back. But at the end of the day, it's always going to be so much deeper than. Because this really is all about executive functions at a time when we are simply not giving kids the experiences needed. And also the empowered parents, you know, authoritative parenting, strong parenting, structured parenting. You know, I think that term authoritative parenting scares a lot of parents because they don't want to be authoritarian or a drill sergeant or whatever it may be. Really, this is about empowering parents to be strong leaders, believe in themselves. Because these parents can't anymore pick up their phones, phone, and get yelled at by all these parenting gurus, parenting influencers. Parenting has just become too much of a science where they're having conversations with their friends about sibling fighting or homework or what to do on the weekends and how to handle boredom. Then all of a sudden they pick up their phone and it's like their phone was listening to them the whole time and they're having all these gurus yelling at them about what is best for their kids. This isn't about gentle parenting, permissive parenting, or fafo parenting like people were talking about. It's not any of that. This is about empowering parents so you can lead the way you want to lead. We're not taking a one size fits all approach anymore. This workbook is filled with papers and sheets and things for you to go through the parents, teachers, educators, the students themselves to bring structure back to your home. Because that's what's missing is structure, accountability and parents believing in themselves and the.

Jenny Urch (7:57)

Kids and are learning these skills that everybody knows you need to have but I have never considered how do you get them? So the skills are self regulation. Like can you regulate yourself without, you know, can you pause? Can you process instead of reacting impulsively? Everybody needs that skill. Are you self motivated? Especially in a world where the things are rapidly changing like can you get up? Can we're self motivated. You and I are self motivated business owners. Nobody tells you what to do. Like is your kid going to survive if that ends up being the spot that they're in? And even Cell Bloom talks about your kid will never be in want for a job if they can see a need and fill it, you know, are they self motivated to look and see what's going on in their company, you know, wherever they're working? And can they fill a need? Are they self motivated? Can they evaluate themselves? I mean, gosh, I mean this is really for all of us. But you really are talking about how for these ADHD kids, these skills are often less developed or not developed at all. Do they have self awareness? Do they understand their on others? And so then you're going through all of these different activities that help them to connect their behavior with their future. How do we help their non verbal and verbal working memories? So it is like I said, it is a beast of a book. Phenomenal ideas, tons of resources. So dispel the myth. I think with kids, if we're having different issues, they're not getting their homework done, they're fighting with their siblings, they're fighting with us, they're not putting their shoes on, it's time to go to school. All of these different things, like maybe a lot of us grew up in a day and age where you would just talk, talk, talk, talk, get it on, you didn't do it, remember this, blah blah, blah, you know, and you're getting kind of lectured at all the time. Can you talk about how that approach is not the best approach, especially for kids who have ADHD?

Mike McLeod (9:41)

That's exactly it. And Dr. Russell Barkley has the great quote of ADHD. This is not information deficit disorder. It's not that they don't know what to do or they don't know what they're doing is wrong. They're constantly living at the mercy of their own imp because of this weakness and disconnect in what I describe in the book as the foundational skills of nonverbal and verbal working memory, these imagination based skills of visual imagery, we hear about kids being stuck in the present moment. Their brains are hardwired towards instant gratification. What do we do now? What's the most stimulating thing I can do right now instead of what can I do now that benefits me later? Which for decades everyone thought that executive functioning was time management and organization. Messy backpacks, messy folders, messy rooms, can't organize, can't manage your time, those sorts of things. But when we take a look at these internal skills, the way I've broken it down in this book and in the workbook is yes, you're going to have messy backpacks and messy folders and you're not going to want to do homework. You're not going to care about school unless you're first self aware that that's even a problem. Then you have to be regulated and motivated enough to do those incredibly boring tasks of cleaning your backpack and organizing your folders. Then you have to be able to self evaluate and hey, in two periods I have science class. She's going to ask us to take out our lab notebooks. Everyone's going to do it right away. But I'm going to be the one person with dirty crinkled papers for 15 minutes and I'm not going to like the way that feels. So I better organize my backpack now. So really what this book is doing is educating parents and giving them information of why these behaviors are happening. Let's stop with these constant mindset of, of I'm failing as a parent. My kids are so disordered, my kids are so incapable. What makes ADHD and executive dysfunction so unique is that, yes, it comes across as these kids are so prompt, dependent, I have to do everything for them. If I don't step in, nothing gets done. But the real formula for building executive functions is raising the bar. Know that this child is capable of doing anything they set their minds to. And that is absolutely true for ADHD kids, teens, young adults and executive dysfunction. We keep the bar high. We do not lower it. We raise those expectations. We believe in it. When you look at Michael Phelps and Justin Timberlake and Adam Levine and Howie Mandel and all these people, these famous people with adhd, and you learn about their Parenting. It was real structured, organized, empowered parenting. And this book is rooted in the. Dr. Russell Barkley, Sarah Ward, Kristen Jacobson, Dr. George McCloskey. All of that great research done by the great, incredible people in this field who've inspired me to make sure everything's evidence based, science based, and really all about giving hope and empowering these parents.

Jenny Urch (12:41)

Yeah, you're gonna see too. If you did these things with your kids, instead of just like harping at them all the time or lecturing, you talk about like, the number one rule is less language. The language is going to cause them to push back. And then they. They're stimulated by arguing. So it's like not working. And I think sometimes that's the only tool we have. It's like, well, why don't you get your shoes on, we're going to be late. You talk, talk, talk, talk, talk. And you could just see how if you spend time as a parent in your family doing some of these activities, I think it really communicates care. Like, it really would strengthen your relationship with your child. You would just form a lot more bonds. You have all these experiences to like, have experiences and then talk about them. So I want to talk about a couple of the activities because we're going to focus today on the workbook. The books are phenomenal in tandem. The Executive Function Playbook is Building Independence in Kids with adhd. The Executive Function Playbook in Action is a book of activities and exercises to support kids with adhd. So one of the things that we want to make sure that our kids have is self regulation. So you say if there's one chapter that captures the heart of what executive function challenges look like on a daily basis, it's this one. So one of the activities is an activity called Ready Not Ready. And you say that everyone has. There's this chart that you can do. I mean, that's what I'm saying. Like, you really would have a stronger relationship with your child after doing the things in the book. You would have more understanding of yourself.

Sponsor or Ad Read Host (14:06)

You would be a better parent.

Jenny Urch (14:08)

And also you're going to strengthen the bonds within your family. Everyone has moments of being not ready. This is not a bad thing. It's just part of being human. But in these moments, we all need the same thing, space and time to return to baseline. Language makes dysregulation worse. So can you talk about this activity? One activity, there's a lot of options in the self regulation chapter, but this Ready versus not ready is helping kids to learn more about self regulation.

Mike McLeod (14:36)

First of all, I should have had you record the audiobook. Your, your voice, your voice recording this. You have the perfect voice for this. I really wish I had done that. Like here, here. Oh my gosh.

Jenny Urch (14:47)

I love that I got to record my own audiobooks. And the first one I did was until the street lights came on. Come on. I don't even know what my book, one book is all until the street lights come on. And I got it done in like half the time that it normally takes. And I was like, this is the career that I've been missing.

Mike McLeod (15:04)

You would be amazing. You have the perfect voice for it. You would never fall asleep listening to an audiobook if you were doing it. Keep you so engaged. But yeah, that, that is the perfect exercise to highlight here in this playbook in action. Because let's be honest, when it comes to ADHD and executive dysfunction, ADHD is the most misunderstood neurodevelopmental disorder in history. Dr. Russell Barkley describes it as the Rodney Dangerfield of disorders. It gets no respect. And everyone just think it's. It's attention and a lack of discipline or kids that can't sit still or kids that can't maintain their focus. This is self regulation deficit disorder. Ask any parent, ask any teacher. It's not hyperactivity and inattentiveness. It is dysregulation, an inability to regulate oneself. And that's what it's all about. And it stems from we can't just look at it as this kid has a temper or a short fuse. It starts with a lack of self awareness. And when we have the structure set in place of helping the child understand. So, for example, the child's name is Mike. What does ready Mike look like? And what does not ready Mike look like? We're not gonna vilify not ready Mike. That's okay. Adults sometimes are not ready. And this is also a part of the book is having parents externalize their self talk and be a little bit more human to their kids in terms of describing their own stresses and their own downfalls. And that those experiences, those relationships is what builds executive functions, not the lectures. So helping them build that self awareness of what do I look like when I'm not ready? All of those negative attention seeking behaviors. It's very hard for these kids to realize in the moment. The only reason I'm arguing, the only reason I'm negotiating, the only reason I'm having big behaviors is because I love having the audience. I love having the focus around me. Your kid may be crying about getting new shoes or Getting a new game or, you know, having a specific snack or dessert, whatever it is. But if it's ADHD and executive dysfunction, it gets to the point where they're not fighting to get those things. They're fighting to keep your attention. Because it is your attention that is the drug. And parents will tell me all the time, if I walk away from my son, if I walk away from my daughter, they'll tell me, you don't love me. You're not listening to me. Why are you ignoring me? They'll follow me all over the house. They'll follow me outside the house. Yeah, that's proof that your attention is a drug. We have to build the structure here, get the hope, empower the parents. When you're not ready, I want you to take a brain break. I want you to have the chance to learn to self regulate. So I'm not standing there as the audience throwing words and words and words at you, making dysregulation worse. The second I see that you are ready, Mike, you're not going to tell me. I'm going to see it. That's when I'm here for you. I can console you, I can help you, I can listen to you, I can talk to you. But take as much time as you need to be not ready. When you are ready, I am here. So building that self awareness first is the foundation to building those self regulation skills. And over time, with all the families we do from our our fully personalized parent training, this is where we see so much progress. Not just for the child, but also really taking care of that parenting burnout of just dealing with a dysregulated child all the time.

Podcast Host or Narrator (18:35)

Time.

Jenny Urch (18:36)

Yes. I love it. I mean, even in your marriage.

Mike McLeod (18:40)

Oh yeah.

Jenny Urch (18:40)

You know, these are skills. And I'm like, no one teaches this stuff.

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Jenny Urch (22:28)

Quince.com outside and in the book there's all these activities. Then you have worksheets that parents could use in their family or you could write it out. You know, this is what it looks like when I'm ready. This is what it looks like when I'm not ready. These are the things I can do. You know, there's a list of of to become ready. I can do these types of things so they start to learn themselves. I can go for a run, you know, I can swing in the hammock. I can read a book. You know, all of this you're learning about yourself and wouldn't it make your relationships so much stronger? As opposed to just lecturing all the time? You say when a kid is dysregulated, they cannot process words, logic or problem solving. It is the adult's job to step away, stay calm and allow the child space to self regulate. Repeating directions, arguing or talking only escalates the moment. So that's just one one of many activity ideas in the executive function playbook in action. Let's talk about self motivation. So one of the ones in self motivation is this concept of of positive emotional forecasting. Once again, these are good skills for everyone. Every action you take is a vote for the kind of person and the kind of Emotions you want to feel in the future, future. Everyone has a future self, a version of us. It's like, why aren't we teaching? These are the things that we really need to be teaching in school, right? Hey, you've got a future self and what you do today will impact that version of that future self. So can you talk about especially, especially because of this verbal, non verbal working memory that for self motivation a child with ADHD might have a hard time imagining that future self. And then you have activities for positive emotional forecasting.

Mike McLeod (24:10)

This is exactly it. And this is, this is where so much of the parenting stress comes in. So in creating this playbook, I wanted to take this concept of a workbook and really flip it on its head. Where a lot of parenting workbooks are all about doing the worksheets, filling them out and then being done with it. To me I describe these as structure worksheets where you fill these out, you print them out, you laminate them, and now these papers do the talking for you. There's no arguing, there's no negotiating, there's no can I do this, can I do that? It's in writing, basically in contract format in these workbooks. And part of this is helping to understand why you're describing this future emotion of motivation. Motivation is, you know, this concept of, of, of motivation and you know, best self and all of this, that all of it is really fancy terms, fancy language for emotion of the future. There is no motivation unless you have the ability to see yourself in the future accomplishing that goal or maybe even avoiding a negative consequence and feeling good about it, or maybe attaining a negative consequence, not feeling good about it, a negative future emotion. So it motivates you now to put it the work now so you can not feel that negative emotion later. Like I better get ready in the morning without driving my mom crazy or else I'll miss the bus and I won't like how that feels. So I'll let me, you know, do this correctly or I really want to go to my friend's birthday party this weekend so I better get my homework done and my chores done and make sure I don't attack my sibling so I can feel good at the birthday party this weekend kind of thing. So all emotions. So like parents, I describe the, the ADHD paradox to parents where you know, number one, it starts, you have a child with executive dysfunction, you know, executive dysfunction and executive functioning delays. So their ability to self regulate and self motivate towards non preferred tasks is a daily parenting struggle. So then parents then get stuck in the mindset of nothing gets done unless I step in. So parents continually, every day, day, morning routine, evening routine, homework, sibling fighting, social relationships, parents are no longer the parent, they're the homework secretary. And wearing a million different hats where they're no longer living their own life, they no longer have their own identity, they're just mom and homework secretary and all these other different things. Parents need to have their own life outside of their kids and they can't do that unless the kids can understand emotions of the future and how to work towards those emotions. And we've stolen like we talk about all the time, a lot of the play and a lot of the organic experiences that kids need to naturally gain those skills. But in today's ever changing world where kids are lacking the ability to motivate themselves towards any non preferred or non screen based tasks, when we follow the science in this book to really have them, you know, time blindness sounds, oh, they're just time blind. They're stuck in the moment. It's actually so much more debilitating. They're not learning from their hindsight, they're not forecasting into their foresight and they're not utilizing the past, present and future and they're not able to connect the dots between events. So the more we focus on the future, the more we build motivation now.

Jenny Urch (27:36)

Yeah, yeah. What emotions are you hoping to feel in the future? These are great conversations to have and ones I wouldn't have considered having. And you, you just, I guess you don't know what you don't know, right? Mike? Like when you have skills as an adult, you don't really realize like, well, where did that come from? What built that in my life? And if my kid doesn't have that, maybe I don't even know that they don't have it. And also once I realize that they are missing the skill or the skill is underdeveloped, how do I help them.

Sponsor or Ad Read Host (28:05)

To start develop it?

Jenny Urch (28:06)

So self motivation, there's several activities for that. And this also includes the section about being bored. For ADHD children, boredom is more than discomfort. It's often intolerable because their brains are wired to seek stimulation and instant gratification. Boredom can feel like a crisis. That's important to know. And for parents, this constant plea for stimulation also results in frustration and fatigue. So you have a lot of information in here too. Different activities in the playbook, in action on how to deal with boredom, coming up with a boredom list and really learning that you treat it like they have to treat it like building a muscle. Boredom tolerance is like a muscle muscle. It must be stretched and strengthened. It's not a bad thing. So self motivation. Okay, then self evaluation, which we actually talked about and there's a lot of crossover between them. So there's a lot of hope there, right, that if you work on self regulation that might help you with self motivation. And if you're working on self motivation, that might help you with self evaluation. I loved this idea of these videos, these self monitoring video journals.

Mike McLeod (29:08)

Yes, yes.

Jenny Urch (29:08)

Can you talk about those?

Mike McLeod (29:10)

That is one of my favorite of all the grown out practices because I not only implemented that in our fully personalized parent training for parents that sign up for the Grow now program, but it's also a very big part of our, of the school professional development. Like, okay, you're gonna push these ridiculous ed tech and one to one laptops on kids, Fine, I get it. You don't have the power to get rid of these things. But if you are going to give it to these kids, let's at least use it for good. Let's use it for some personal development and for them to be able to set goals. So really this is utilizing video journals for kids, coaching them to be their own coach. How much of executive functioning. You know, my friend Ryan, the ADHD dude, coined the term the brain coach. Verbal working memory is the brain coach. How much of executive functioning is really just a fancy term for teaching a child to be their own coach? Like I say in the main playbook, like it's like having a Bill Belichick and a Tom Coughlin, like in your head coaching you on all the time, where if you don't have that voice.

Jenny Urch (30:12)

In your head, I'm like, who are they?

Mike McLeod (30:16)

Football coaches, NFL coaches? Tom Cough, Tom Coughlin mostly.

Jenny Urch (30:21)

I figured you were going with that.

Mike McLeod (30:22)

But yeah, yeah, absolutely. But that's exactly what it is. So with the video journals, what we tend to do is, you know, on Monday or whatever, it's always very flexible. There's no rigid way of doing it. The child will record themselves using that front facing camera like a selfie, talking about what they hope to accomplish this week. What do they want their social lives to look like, their classroom lives? How do they want to treat their parents, their siblings, their homework? What do they want to accomplish? This is not adult driven. This is not the adult telling them what they need to do, whatever. This is the child looking themselves in the eyes, looking themselves in the face and talking about who do I want to be? Who am I going to become? What do I want to accomplish and most importantly, how do I want to feel tomorrow? So they record themselves, you know, talking about what's, what they want to do and throughout the week and then later on in the week, whether it's Thursday, Friday, whatever, first they watch the video they previously recorded where they talk about their goals, what they want to do, how they want to feel. Then they record a response to that video. What went well, what didn't go well, what did I accomplish? What didn't I accomplish? What got in the way? This is what builds independence. There's no executive functioning. There's no decreasing the harm that ADHD can do to an individual and their quality of life unless we focus on independence. And how much of school now with IEPs and 504s constantly promote prompt dependence. You know, it's a very scary world that kids are growing up in these days, with AI and the job market and everything happening and screen addictions and everything like you and I have talked about ad nauseam. But it's at, it's at the point now where, you know, people skills and personal development skills, those are the skills of the future, if we're totally honest. Grades and GPA and high school diploma, college diploma are becoming less and less important. And it's when you are applying to jobs, when you're 18, 19, 20, 21, 22 years old, it's your ability to work in a team, converse, work on yourself, be flexible, look someone in the ey, talk to them and work on yourself as a person and be a good teammate, be a good co worker. And we can't do that unless we find our own internal coach.

Jenny Urch (32:47)

Yeah, I love this. I'm like, I'm like, I should do this. You talked about the video journal as an alternative too, because sometimes the kids are not wanting to write and I thought it's just such. That is a good use of technology. So the question that a kid could ask, what are my goals for today? This is in the morning or at the beginning of a week. What are my goals for today? What does my perfect day look like? That's an important thing to consider. What do I want to avoid today? You know, I want to avoid a meltdown. I want to avoid fighting with this friend or whatever. The thing is, I want to avoid losing my homework. How do I want to feel at the end of the day? And then they come back, what went well today? What didn't go well? What are my goals for tomorrow? Ah, like this is such a better home environment. This is such an incredible skill. To take into the future. These are such great conversation topics to have. It's, it's so less like the lecture and you're the kid is in trouble. It's, it's so hope filled, right? Like oh, what do I want to do? How'd it go? You know, what could I change for tomorrow? You wrote, self evaluation is a critical component of executive function growth and one of the most overlooked in ADHD treatment. Children who don't regularly reflect on their choices and outcomes tend to repeat mistakes, misread their own progress, and remain dependent on adult prompts for a change. And I love this sentence. Memory is not just a record, it's a resource.

Mike McLeod (34:11)

There you go. That's exactly it. And, and when it comes to adhd, you know, so many of the parents know, so many parents today are so aware of their kids emotions, their self worth. ADHD today in 2026 should not be so closely correlated to depression, self harm and all these other really horrible things. And there's all these stats about all the negative feedback kids get. And what's so horrible about ADHD is parents just unintentionally fall into these permissive traps. If you have an ADHD child, you're a parent with ADHD yourself, chances are you have unintentionally, through no fault of your own, become permissive because of this lack of self evaluation. It's every single day is like Groundhog's day. You are dealing with the same exact behaviors every day. A lack of self awareness, a lack of self regulation and a lack of an ability to learn from the past regardless of your lectures and your consequences. And all of those things. And what you're describing is a lot of the early feedback I've gotten on these books is parents and educators and professionals have reached out and said I felt like I was reading a, like a personal development book from like Tony Robbins or Brendon Bouchard or James Clear. Atopic habits, that kind of stuff.

Podcast Host or Narrator (35:24)

Stuff.

Mike McLeod (35:24)

And that's really what this is. This is really about helping you break free of those webs and the chains of permissive parenting that you unintentionally fell into. So many parents today are walking on eggshells around their child. They get absolute rushes of anxiety in the hours before their child comes home from school where they really don't feel like they have a break anymore. The weekends are complete torture. Pulling their hair out, they feel like they have no support themselves. This book is about empowering parents, helping them to create structure. These worksheets are for the parents Some for the kids to do themselves, some for the educators to do, but they're all about printing them out. And these are the new rules of the home. These are the new practices of the home. These are the new exercises and strategies, the new toolkit. Because this is about giving parents hope and giving them their identity back. And when the child's able to self evaluate and learn from past experiences, what that really means is your parenting has gotten so much more effective.

Sponsor or Ad Read Host (36:29)

Yeah.

Jenny Urch (36:30)

And they're fun. Like what a fun thing to be able to be like what worked, you know, and, and then to sort of to see that growth over time. You can just see how families can get caught in a cycle. And you say that a lot of times ADHD kids are making the same mistakes over and over again without self evaluation. And this is a statement for all of us. Without self evaluation, there can be no real growth. Mistakes are repeated. So activities. And each section has lots of activity ideas. I'm just highlighting one from each section.

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Jenny Urch (38:07)

Okay. Self awareness. Self awareness is the gateway skill to meaningful change. It's the ability to observe and understand oneself and then you're capable of doing Better when you can do that. So in this section you're talking about our impact on others. And once again, it's time present behavior to future consequences. So there's a lot of cross over here. But everything that we say or do creates a ripple. It doesn't just affect us, it affects the people around us. For students with adhd, the gap between intention and impact is wide and often invisible. So there's you talking here about nature, but I don't, I just have a lot of notes. So as far as far as inactivity, that is in the playbook that goes along with self awareness, there's a lot of them here. But once again, you're talking about getting caught in the behavior loops. How about this one is called I liked. I just like the one about how this is going to help you with your relationships. So this one is my brain. What stimulates it? So this is activity 2.11. It, it's really good for educators too, because isn't that like how educators do everything? It's like all the content standards are always written like that, like 2.11.14. So this is activity 2.11. What stimulates the brain. And so understanding how the ADHD brain seeks stimulation is one of the most important foundations of executive function development. So you're talking about how the brain is like a phone battery that needs charging, but instead of a power outlet, the ADHD brain is seeking dopamine. And it learns very early in life how to get it. So there's healthy sources of stimulation like play and music and exercise, but there's also ones that can be harmful in the long run, like arguing, doing video games and defiance. Like this is about what charges your brain.

Mike McLeod (39:58)

Exactly. And left, left to its own devices, naturally the ADHD brain is, it's not attention deficit, it's attention seeking disorder. So left to its own devices at baseline, the ADHD brain is going to seek dopamine through screens and conflict. And obviously you and I have talked about that enough to this point. We understand screen screens and conflict and negative attention seeking. But let's take this to the next level and figure it out. Think of how empowering it is for the child, for the teen, for the young adult to start to build more self awareness of how certain things make their brain feel. So part of the disconnect Here is with ADHD. ADHD is an emotion disorder. And Dr. Russell Barkley talks about this all the time, how we have to bring emotion emotions back to the DSM and the diagnostic standards manual and recognize that the parts of the brain impacted by ADHD in structure, function and development. It's really about emotions. The anterior cingulate, the amygdala, all of these things are affected. This is an emotional disorder. So they often don't build the connection between what did I do and how did I feel. This is why you sign your kid up for karate body. And they go on Monday. It's a huge fight to get them there. They go, they have the time of their lives, they come home and then it's time to take them for the second go round. And it's a huge fight again to get them there. And it's a never ending groundhog day where you have to be really authoritative and really stick to your parenting to hold them accountable to go every time. And you can't blame these parents for at some point wanting to wave the white flag and say, forget it, you can quit, I can't do these things fights anymore. But it's very hard for these kids to recognize, hey, when I actually go to karate, I have a great time. When I go to swimming, when I do an after school activity, when I play outside with a friend instead of just doing the screens, conflict, screens, conflict. What we're doing here is building awareness of when I do, you know, when I go with plan B, plan C, plan D, it makes me feel a lot better than when I just do plan A, plan A, plan A. So the parents are building awareness for what stimulates them. The kids are building awareness. The kids and teens and young adults are building awareness for what stimulates them. And this specific activity has helped kids stop calling out in class, stop, you know, intentionally, you know, giving sort of cringy thoughts to some of their peers. Some of that social executive functioning that's also in this book and the perspective taking skills. So this can really improve classroom behavior, social relationships, making friends, keeping friends, and also building independence in the home where it's not mom and dad pushing, please go do this. Please go do this. The child themselves now recognizes, when I do this, I feel really good about myself.

Jenny Urch (42:52)

Yeah, yeah, I love that activity. What stimulates the brain? And then they're learning and they are not any longer caught in behavior loops with that are causing them to repeat the same choices without understanding why they're stuck. So you talk in this playbook in action about how this is uniquely demanding parenting. It can feel almost impossible in the face of daily meltdowns, defiance, avoidance or power struggles. It's easy to feel like nothing works or worse, that you're failing and so all of a sudden, then you have all these tools to try. And I can imagine that they would be so bonding that especially because they're going to work.

Podcast Host or Narrator (43:32)

Work.

Jenny Urch (43:32)

They're going to work. And instead of having this negative interaction all the time, you're going to start to have these positive interactions with your child. And I love that. I love the hope that you give. And that's what you talk about. This is hope for families that are struggling with adhd, whether they're struggling with them themselves as the adult. And. And it's often a combination. So one of the things that people, I would imagine, must say to you because you address this in the book, because you explicitly say this is not me mean. You say consistency is kindness. Boundaries protect your energy, they reduce conflict, they help your child grow. You are not being mean, you are being clear. Structure is not control, it's safety. Is this some of the pushback that sometimes you're getting?

Mike McLeod (44:14)

Of course, because it's, it's very unnatural, especially for parents today that are being fed all of this gentle parenting and parenting guru nonsense constantly, every time they open their phone. Many parents today are uncomfortable stepping into their parental authority. And you can't blame them for all the misinformation and pseudoscience they're getting. It feels unnatural to have to say no and then deal with those behaviors. Sometimes it's just, you know, overindulge the child to avoid conflict because their behaviors are so extreme. And these kids can be master manipulators and pull at your heartstrings, and that's really, really hard. So really, you know, what this is all about is helping parents recognize this child. Kids all together respond well to structure, rules, and accountability. There's so much today, there's never been a starker contrast between behavior at school and behavior at home. And it's gotten so crazy. We've created this concept of masking, and we've talked about this before of on social media. All you hear about is kids go to school, they mask their symptoms, they come home and they fall apart. And they fall apart, all the, all of that. And there's no science to back that up. It's just a concept that helps parents rationalize the difference in the different behaviors. But in reality, this child is responding very well to the structure at school, the rules at school, all the accountability, the avoidance of having negative emotions, of maybe being embarrassed in front of their peers or getting in trouble, whatever, and they come home where there isn't structure, there isn't accountability. They get away with everything. And kids were put on this earth to test limits. So one of the biggest things as we're focusing on ADHD hope, empowering parents, just like I've talked about all the time, that all of this therapy and counseling and talk therapy and cbt, it's not helping ADHD kids, it's not strengthening executive functions. And it's the same thing with parenting is, you know, parents are being told every day they're doing everything wrong, they're failing. But we have all the data in the world, just like we have all the data that shows kids are getting more therapy and more counseling and more socio emotional classes, but they're the most oppressed. Parents are being told all the time they're failing, they need help, they need all of this stuff. When in reality we have all the data to show parents are doing more work than ever before. They're spending more time with their kids, they're more involved to the point where they're no longer living their own life. They're only living their child's life for them. And it's leading to unintentional burnout, unintentional permissiveness that's hurting things. So if we're going to empower this child to be independent, reach their goals, build executive functions, it starts, starts with empowering parents.

Jenny Urch (47:05)

Yeah. Let's talk about some more activities that are more overarching. They probably would help with all of them. You have the family grit building challenge.

Mike McLeod (47:13)

Oh yeah.

Jenny Urch (47:13)

That includes appearance. You're about to take a drink here. But I'm like. And go. I love this idea.

Mike McLeod (47:19)

Yeah. So, so in terms of the, the grit challenge, this is really all about, you know, a lot of this is based on the great work of Dr. Angela Duckworth, who wrote the book Grit and her great work with the University of Pennsylvania out here, here in the Philadelphia region, it's really all about understanding the comfort zone. This goes back to what I was saying before in terms of am I always just staying in my comfort zone and following plan A? Plan A, plan A. How about all of us as a family hold each other accountable to coming up with something and holding each other accountable to doing something new, whether it's every quarter, every month, every three months, whatever it may be. So mom and dad work together for, you know, this fall you're going to be doing soccer and then for the daughter, you're going to be doing this after school activity. So holding each other accountable as a family. Mom and dad too, you're going to be involved. Maybe you're going to put your phone away more, you're going to read more, you're going to, you know, go to more dinner parties, you're going to be more, you're more involved with your, you're.

Jenny Urch (48:22)

Going to learn how to do something yourself. You're going to learn how to knit. I had, well, it wasn't my idea. It was this man named Dustin Nickerson and I bought the website but it's the stupidest idea and everyone's like, you can't do it. But I was like, I could learn how to crochet. And then Dustin Nickerson, who's this comedian, used the word brochet like for men. Then everyone's like, that idea is not going to go anywhere. But I did buy the website anyway. Broching.com. but you know, you have, you have to have your own, you have to. I think then you relate to your kid more. Like I'm taking piano lessons right now alongside my kids. I took piano lessons for a long time, hadn't taken them for 20 years. I'm back to taking them and I'm doing a piano competition in one month. There's like an adult division so I'm hoping to win a trophy. But then you relate to your kid more about like the, this is difficult. This teacher's telling me to do this. It's really specific. It's hard. I don't really want to go but I'm seeing the growth and so I love that. This family grit activity, it's every member of the family, it's really, it's really.

Mike McLeod (49:22)

Evening the playing field where it's not so much the parents just being like, I need you to start doing these things. It's all of us together as a family are going to try new things and what better way to improve quality of life when you start to recognize, hey, I have talents in all of these different areas. I thought I was only good at video games or only good at scrolling or only good at very specific things. Now I am now getting dopamine, I'm now getting stimulation. I'm now feeling good about myself because I have an identity outside of my comfort zone. And by parents involving themselves in this family grit based plan. This is a something that improves the quality of life of the entire family and adds more family values.

Jenny Urch (50:05)

Yeah, I mean I think of an adult as listening. It's like they could start to dream. Everybody has introduced interest that they're like, man, if I could just, I want to learn how to bake sourdough bread. I want to golf more. You know, I would Love to be better at tennis. You know, I would love to pick up this skill or that skill. I'd like to learn how to embroider and, you know, get the hat. You know, people like do embroidery on their Carhartt hats and, you know, they make it look unique. And there's so many skills and you just, you feel like you don't have the time, especially if you're exhausted because you have these demanding kids and you're like, you can't figure it out and you're stuck in these cycles. It's like if everybody makes a decision vision that for three months we're gonna go do the. I'm gonna pick the pottery wheel and what are you gonna pick? And everybody picks something that would enhance the entire environment of your home. So that's an example in here. It could be a volunteer group. You have lots of examples. What's my chosen activity? Why did I choose this? Every member. What I will do when I feel like quitting, what I hope to gain. Here's. It's all wrapped in one, right?

Mike McLeod (51:04)

You got it.

Jenny Urch (51:04)

Self evaluation. Here's your self awareness. Awareness. What do I hope to gain or feel after three months? This is a contract of commitment. Not for perfection, but for progress. This task teaches that growth comes from doing hard things, not from seeking comfort. When children see their parents following through with grit and consistency, they internalize the same resilience. I love that activity you have in this book. Okay, so along with all the activities, there's just also a lot of advice as well. I love the page about language alternatives that you could just like, have this pasted to your fridge. Okay, so the biggest thing you said at the very beginning was use less language. The number one rule of ADHD parent coaching is to use left less language. Talking too much and giving too many lectures opens the door for more arguing and negotiating. And as we know, the ADHD brain is conflict seeking. So once you start talking, you are giving the child the stage, the microphone and the spot light to start running the entire house with their emotions and behaviors, which leads to full on parenting burnout. Okay, so what do you do? So you have this activity. This is activity 6.9, use less language. So I'm going to read the one that a parent might say and then you give us the alternative.

Mike McLeod (52:16)

Love it.

Jenny Urch (52:17)

How many times do I have to tell you, Mike, you said you'd help me with the dishes and you haven't moved. I'm getting really tired of this.

Mike McLeod (52:24)

So I'm, I notice that the sink is getting Filled and I don't have enough plates to serve dinner tonight or the rest of this week. What do you think I should do?

Jenny Urch (52:36)

There we go. So all these alternatives in here, you could also just say dish Time now.

Mike McLeod (52:41)

This time now, you guys.

Jenny Urch (52:43)

Time now. How about this? You need to calm down. This is not how we act. What is going on with you?

Mike McLeod (52:48)

So one of the best things to do in that situation that I. That is really most effective with parents is don't say anything at all and hold up your two palms in the sort of the stop and chill feature, which is the gesture almost like a picture catcher, sending gestures for, like pitching signals. Is put up those two hands with signals, which is teaching the child. Going back to the previous lesson of. I see you're not ready right now. So, you know, so many parents know when they're. When they're dysregulated and your partner, your spouse says to them, I need you to calm down. It does. It has the opposite effect effect with kids, especially those with adhd. It does the exact same thing. So what we want to do there is not use the phrase calm down. We want to have a visual gesture of. Of look, I see you're not ready. Take the time you need. Come to me when you are ready. That is very empowering to the child.

Sponsor or Ad Read Host (53:42)

Yep.

Jenny Urch (53:42)

Last language. All these different ideas. The kids like, I hate school. I'm not going. You can just say, I hear you, but you're still going. You know, just last language. That's in here. Here you talk about shared experiences, how they build stronger families. Kim John Payne talks about strengthening the family base camp. I mean, this is not happening in.

Sponsor or Ad Read Host (54:00)

A lot of instances.

Jenny Urch (54:01)

There are not a lot of, you know, I. That with 1,000 hours outside, that's a lot of what's going on is you are building your. There's more robust relationships because you're doing things together. And in this day and age, and I think it's been going on for decades, it's like everyone can have their own life life. You know, the mom has this life and the dad has that life, and the kids have their separate lives. And so you have ideas in here about having shared experiences that build stronger families. Talk about the prompt hierarchy. Partner tag in. How about this whole chapter on social skills?

Mike McLeod (54:34)

Oh, yeah, okay.

Jenny Urch (54:35)

I have page 274 is real good with two stars. So can you talk about video game friends in real life?

Sponsor or Ad Read Host (54:41)

Friends?

Mike McLeod (54:42)

Yeah. So, you know, part of. We've talked about this before. A lot of the marketing around screens is that they are a social tool. They help kids connect all of those sorts of things. We now have 10, 15 years of data to show that video games and screens actually have the opposite effect. They make kids more isolated, dependent and depressed and have a very negative impact on social relationships. I have yet to talk to a parent that's expressed that getting a phone or getting video games improved social relationships, improved executive functions and improved independence. So this brings us back to that overall whole idea. So you know, you, when we talk to parents about, you know, screen time structure and things like that, this is when the emotional manipulation comes in. If I take away screens, they're going to lose all of their friends. They're going to be negatively impacted socially. What we want to do here is build some self awareness where just because I play Minecraft, Fortnite, Roblox, online games with someone, whatever it is, and I think they're my friends and I'm spending time with them, that's not a real social experience. And we now know that based on science and the social areas of the brain not being ignited and not flaring up and any of those things during those experiences. So we need to build some self awareness. This is just pure entertainment for yourself unless you are in the same room as that person reading their facial expressions, no facetime, no nothing like that, in the same room having a true shared experience. This is not a real social experience. So this is something to, for the parents to build some structure and some awareness around the importance of social relationships. Because let's be honest, food, water, shelter, relationships. What's going to prepare your child, child for, you know, for, for life beyond high school, beyond the IEP, beyond the 504, is their ability to make friends and keep friends. So they get 18 years of practice on how to make a friend and keep a friend. And we, we need to make sure we're giving that the highest of priorities.

Jenny Urch (56:48)

I actually have insight and not that it's like incredibly insightful, but it, it's different between like your situation and my situation. We have a child that's 17 years old and is going to graduate from high school. And the biggest thing that we've talked about in terms of what our next steps because we're like on the fence about college, is what does that social net look like once you graduate from high school and all of a sudden you're in the spot where you're like, oh, I really hope that this child has the skills because they're not going to be in a class with these other kids or they're not going to be in a high school basketball team anymore. And the sort of, of engines that are exist for kid, you know, preschool, really preschool all the way through 12th grade that create this situation where kids are just around other kids all the time of their same age, then they're gone. There's a nothing.

Mike McLeod (57:41)

It's terrifying.

Jenny Urch (57:42)

And whether it happens, we've talked about this with our oldest son because it's like, well, whether it happens now at 17, 18, or it happens at 21, 22, when they're done with college, it's gonna happen.

Mike McLeod (57:53)

That's exactly it. And, and you think about that jump from senior year of high school to freshman year of college and the executive functioning, the independence, the grit, the resilience needed to make that jump. It's almost unfair, it's almost unfair to ask that of that child to go from a school or a community where you literally grew up with the same people from your Same community, same zip code, same block for 18 years. And now here you are in a brand new environment. You know, some kids have had enough relationships, had enough experiences, had enough structure where they thrive on sort of that clean slate. Let me go to college and let me, you know, build a new reputation for myself, meet new people, try new things, all of those sorts of things. But in today's world where we're not giving kids organic experiences to build executive functioning skills and so much accommodation, so much unintentional helicopter parenting and permissive parenting, it's very hard for them to be successful in those environments. And we're seeing it with dropout rates and all of those sorts of things. So these 18 years to follow this playbook and even beyond, you know, I talked to many parents of young adults and failure to launch and you know, older kids, young adults following this playbook and following these things, when we have a playbook to empower parents, parents to not one size fits all, tailor it towards my family, my values, my needs. That's what prepares us for the things that life throws at us.

Jenny Urch (59:20)

Yeah. So this activity now this is towards the end of the book now this is 300 pages of activities and ideas. And they're fun, they're Hope filled. Activity 10.2 Making friends. Friendship is not just a natural occurrence. It is a skill that must be learned, practiced and refined over time. Social growth is not automatic. And you say in person. Friendships require reading, facial expressions and body language. They require adjusting behavior based on social cues. They require managing, turn taking and compromise. They require understanding how your actions impact others. Online play removes most of these elements, no eye contact, no physical presence, no shared real world experience, and therefore little to no opportunity for social growth. I want to wrap it up. You can tell us about your key camps because actually we almost never connected. Or at the beginning you were like, at camp we were supposed to.

Mike McLeod (60:13)

I was just thinking about that today.

Jenny Urch (60:15)

And you were like, are we actually doing it today or are we just talking about what it is today? And I was like, oh, I thought we were doing it today. And you're like, well, I'm at camp. They're like, we're at the pool or. Anyway, that was like our first interaction is you're actually out in the real world doing things with your kids. I want to wrap it up there, but I want to say one last thing. You talk about vasopressin, which I just learned about this past week from this man named Adam Lane Smith.

Mike McLeod (60:37)

Oh yeah.

Jenny Urch (60:38)

And this is a chemical that I never heard of about accomplishing things together. But you would talk about with the video games that. And so in talking about video games, it's releasing all these chemicals in their brain and that sometimes when they're done, they're just spent. All the chemicals have been released. And so I thought that was a really interesting thing to know. And then I love the activity about time blind where you shade in the time wedge. Yes, that was such a good one. And also I feel like our tracker charts about getting outside, I never really considered. But those also help with time blindness. Like, are we, what are we using our time for? And so if you've got kids and you're using that chart and you're like, we got outside for 15 minutes today or 30 minutes or an hour. That's helping. With kids and their time blindness. Time isn't felt by default. It's learned. Where did my time go today? How much time am I spending on the things that may I matter? What would I do differently tomorrow? So we have just scratched the surface on this incredible playbook. But as we're wrapping up and talking about making friends, and it's one of the most important skills I think that you need to have and you really think about it when your kid is one semester away from graduating. And I don't want to be dependent on them having to go to college.

Sponsor or Ad Read Host (61:44)

Solely for the social part, like, that's.

Jenny Urch (61:47)

What I don't want. But I. But there's a pressure there because you're like, well, where are they going to find their people? And do they have the skills needed to pursue a hobby to get out into the world and find people now who are probably going to be a vastly larger age range so that they have a social net and that they have these relationships that are so important for them. So tell us about your summer camps.

Mike McLeod (62:11)

Absolutely. And you know, well, you're describing at the end of the day, it's just that, that, that pit in every parent's stomach knowing I'm sending them to college, I'm sending them into real life, career beyond, and I'm not going to be there anymore. For the past 18 years, I've been saving them, helping them, talking to them. I've been their prefrontal cortex, I've been their executive functioning. Now I'm no longer there. You know, you and I are basically best friends for life now. Co hosts, you know, pioneers in ending this horrible youth mental health crisis with all these obvious things. Get rid of screens and go outside. But obviously that's the generalized, you know, know this is what needs to be done to end this crisis because it's so obvious, the rise of screens, the decline of play, kids not going outside anymore with depression rates and all those sorts of things. But this playbook and this book is all about getting to the details, taking it so far beyond screen, so far beyond just the basic overall advice. This is about creating the structure and we have all the different things in here from self awareness, regulation, motivation, evaluation, homework, sibling fighting, social, everything to nail down that structure to give you what you need as a parent so you can be yourself and your kid can be your best self. And that's exactly the mission of our summer camp which we call EF Camp, Executive Functioning Summer camp, which is an experience based, relationship based camp that gives kids real world, hands on experiences that they need to develop these skills so it's not sitting in a therapist's office and trying these different things. We take these kids all over the place. We have a camp in the Philadelphia region, Washington, D.C. falls Church, Los Angeles and many other states to come where we get, you know, a certified driver that takes us all over the place and takes us to, you know, various malls where they, where they practice money management, delayed gratification, all of the social executive functions, future planning, organizing, planning, prioritizing, problem solving, all doing it together in a group. We talk about going away to college and having a fresh slate and having to find your people. That's exactly what our camp is. My favorite thing about camp is on Monday when kids show up and they're quiet, they're timid, they're kind of walking around, spending times to themselves and then by the last day of camp, camp, they're all singing Backstreet Boys together on the. On the bus on the way home. And I have a video of the kids doing that. And I. And I have a mom who still messages me every day, saying, when my son hears this song, it makes him want to message his friends from camp and build those relationships. So everything is about quality of life, letting kids feel good about themselves. And we're moving away from all of the nonsense of talk therapy and counseling, and we're making it experience based on. Based feeling good, empowering the kids and letting them know through these experiences, they can absolutely accomplish every single dream they have ever had.

Jenny Urch (65:11)

Mike, huge congrats. Huge congrats to you. These are such important books to be out in the world. The Executive Function Playbook, Building Independence in Kids with adhd. You know, as consumers, you have to buy the books and the resources that help you so that those continue to be out into the world. It actually matter matters quite a bit. The Executive Function Playbook. Building Independence and Kids with adhd. Get it for your own home. You get it for your friends. You know, if, you know family members, if this is a struggle in their home, the parents are burnt out, you grab a copy. The. The workbook is phenomenal. I jerkingly was like a workbook.

Mike McLeod (65:50)

Yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

Jenny Urch (65:52)

I was like, oh, wow. This is way different than I expected. Just because, you know, you hear the word workbook and it's not even called a workbook, it's called a playbook. The executive function playbook and action activities and exercises to support kids with adhd. The word that I would describe it is robust. It is robust. And it's also enticing. Like, you're like, oh, I want to do that. It doesn't feel laborious. It doesn't feel like a should should. It's like, oh, no. And. And you immediately see this would help me create a better relationship with my child for the rest of our lives. And that's the hope. It's like turning something that is so demanding and so frustrating and so feeling so hopeless. And it's something that's like, oh, there's a lot of tools here and there's a lot of things to try and it's exciting. So my cute, congrats to you. These are wonderful books. I hope everybody goes out and grabs their copy. They launch this week. Congratulations and thanks for being here.

Mike McLeod (66:47)

Thank you so much, Jenny. Thank you for everything. Thank you for being such a great friend and thank you for always inspiring. Me.

Podcast Host or Narrator (66:52)

Me.

Jenny Urch (66:53)

Okay, if you are listening and thinking.

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This was helpful and practical, send this.

Jenny Urch (66:57)

Episode to someone else. A friend, a sibling, your parenting group.

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Any parent who is tired. This show grows the old fashioned way. One person sending it to one person.

Jenny Urch (67:05)

And just so you know, I run.

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This show independently from prep to recording.

Jenny Urch (67:09)

To editing to posting to marketing. So every share truly matters more than you probably realize. So if you know someone who is.

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In the thick of it, send them this episode.

Jenny Urch (67:18)

If you're thinking of someone right now, that's your cue. This is the kind of conversation that's.

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Better with a friend.

Jenny Urch (67:22)

And if you've never left a review for the show, I would love it if you did it today. Remember, eight words and some exclamation points.

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Are all you need if you aren't.

Jenny Urch (67:30)

Some super prolific writer. I read all the reviews. They encourage me to keep going and they help the right families find this message.

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One last reminder, if you want an.

Jenny Urch (67:38)

Easy next step after this episode, grab your free 2026 tracker sheet at 1000hoursoutside.com or join us in the 1000hours outside app on iOS and Android to track time outside and build momentum in a screen heavy world. I'm so glad you are here today. Until next time. May you find extraordinary moments on ordinary paths.

Podcast Host or Narrator (67:59)

Get outside, open your eyes feel that sunshine kissing your skin Throw your worries.

Mike McLeod (68:06)

Out to the wind.

Podcast Host or Narrator (68:10)

Climb some trees, skin your knees Feel that grass on your feet again get out there and.

Jenny Urch (68:17)

Take it in.

Mike McLeod (68:21)

Oh.

Podcast Host or Narrator (68:23)

It'S a beautiful world Ain't nothing on the screen that's ever going to beat this view oh heart beautiful world and I just want to share with I just want to share with you this beautiful world Such a beautiful world.