158 - Elton John - Captain Fantastic & The Brown Dirt Cowboy - Mike Portnoy

Summary

Podcast Summary: The 500 with Josh Adam Meyers – Episode 158: Elton John’s Captain Fantastic & The Brown Dirt Cowboy Featuring Mike Portnoy

Release Date: May 28, 2025

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Introduction

In Episode 158 of The 500 with Josh Adam Meyers, hosted by Josh Adam Meyers of Next Chapter Podcasts, the spotlight shines on Elton John's seminal album, Captain Fantastic & The Brown Dirt Cowboy. Joining Josh is renowned drummer Mike Portnoy from Dream Theater, who offers an in-depth analysis and personal insights into the album's significance within Rolling Stone Magazine’s list of the 500 Greatest Albums of All Time.

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Album Overview and Significance

Josh introduces Captain Fantastic & The Brown Dirt Cowboy as the 158th entry on the list, highlighting its place in Elton John's illustrious career.

Mike Portnoy ([02:58]):
"Elton John is one of the greatest songwriters and rock stars of all time. Captain Fantastic is a concept album that delves into his and Bernie Taupin's early struggles before their soaring success."

Mike emphasizes the album's autobiographical nature, noting that it was written in chronological order—a unique approach that provides a narrative flow reflecting their journey in the music industry.

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Discussion of Key Tracks

"Captain Fantastic and The Brown Dirt Cowboy"

The episode begins with the title track, setting the tone for the album's exploration of Elton and Bernie's early partnership.

Josh Adam Myers ([06:00]):
"The opening track characterizes Elton as Captain Fantastic and Bernie as the Brown Dirt Cowboy, symbolizing their roles in the wild west of rock and roll."

Mike Portnoy ([38:06]):
"It's a great opener. It starts slow, almost country-like, before ramping up into a rocker, effectively telling the story of their partnership."

"Someone Saved My Life Tonight"

Recognized as one of Elton John's masterpieces, this song delves into his personal struggles and pivotal life decisions.

Josh Adam Myers ([25:37]):
"This song is phenomenal—a masterpiece. It deals with a time when Elton was considering marriage but realized he wasn't ready and ultimately chose a different path."

Mike Portnoy ([50:10]):
"Absolutely, it's one of the greatest songs Elton and Bernie ever wrote. The ascending chromatic chord progression and perfect melody make it a standout track."

"Bitter Fingers"

Though not one of the main singles, "Bitter Fingers" offers a glimpse into the pressures faced within the music industry.

Mike Portnoy ([60:20]):
"It's a throwaway track for me, but it captures the experience of struggling with record label pressures. Musically, it shifts between triplet and eighth-note fields, showcasing Elton's versatility."

"We All Fall in Love Sometimes" & "Curtains"

These tracks close the album with emotional depth and musical restraint, solidifying the album's legacy.

Josh Adam Myers ([73:29]):
"Despite a rough reception at the time, songs like 'Curtains' showcase Elton's ability to craft deeply personal and musically intricate pieces."

Mike Portnoy ([87:50]):
"Curtains is possibly Elton's unsung masterpiece. It's a perfect closer, offering a coda that ties the entire album together with its restrained orchestration and beautiful drumming."

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Album Artwork and Influences

The intricate album cover, designed by pop artist Alan Aldridge, draws inspiration from Hieronymus Bosch's The Garden of Earthly Delights. Both hosts admire the visual storytelling that complements the album's lyrical themes.

Josh Adam Myers ([18:56]):
"The cover art is so detailed and ties perfectly with the album's narrative. It truly is a collector’s gem with its original LP package including booklets and a scrapbook of Elton and Bernie’s past."

Mike Portnoy ([23:05]):
"Having the original vinyl from the 70s, complete with booklets and a gatefold poster, adds immense value. It’s a testament to the era's dedication to album artistry."

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Mike Portnoy’s Musical Insights and Personal Anecdotes

Mike shares his admiration for the album's musicality, particularly praising drummer Nigel Olson's tasteful and strategic drumming style.

Mike Portnoy ([43:30]):
"Nigel Olson is one of the most underrated rock drummers of the 70s. His ability to play behind the beat adds a unique texture to the songs."

He also discusses his experiences with touring and filling in for other drummers, illustrating the challenges and camaraderie within the music community.

Mike Portnoy ([64:58]):
"I love touring and connecting with fans. One of my worst experiences was dislocating my wrist during a gig in Munich, but the support from fans and the band helped me push through."

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Album’s Place in the Rolling Stone’s 500

Both hosts agree on the album’s enduring legacy and its rightful place on the list, praising its storytelling, musical complexity, and emotional depth.

Josh Adam Myers ([104:10]):
"This album is like the White Album for Elton John—eclectic, ambitious, and filled with both masterpieces and deeper cuts that fans cherish."

Mike Portnoy ([105:35]):
"To me, Captain Fantastic is comparable to Radiohead’s The Bends. It's a perfect blend of accessible tracks and experimental endeavors, making it a pivotal work in Elton's discography."

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Conclusion and Recommendations

Mike Portnoy highly recommends Captain Fantastic & The Brown Dirt Cowboy as essential listening for Elton John fans and music enthusiasts alike. He likens the album to other legendary works, emphasizing its importance in understanding Elton and Bernie’s early career and their impact on music.

Mike Portnoy ([105:57]):
"If you’re new to Elton John, start with Goodbye Yellow Brick Road, but Captain Fantastic is a close second that offers deeper insight into his artistry and partnership with Bernie."

Josh Adam Myers ([105:39]):
"Absolutely agree. This album is a treasure trove for anyone looking to explore Elton John's rich musical legacy."

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Notable Quotes

• Mike Portnoy ([38:06]):
  "It's a great opener. It starts slow, almost country-like, before ramping up into a rocker, effectively telling the story of their partnership."

• Josh Adam Myers ([25:37]):
  "This song is phenomenal—a masterpiece. It deals with a time when Elton was considering marriage but realized he wasn't ready and ultimately chose a different path."

• Mike Portnoy ([50:10]):
  "Absolutely, it's one of the greatest songs Elton and Bernie ever wrote. The ascending chromatic chord progression and perfect melody make it a standout track."

• Mike Portnoy ([43:30]):
  "Nigel Olson is one of the most underrated rock drummers of the 70s. His ability to play behind the beat adds a unique texture to the songs."

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Final Thoughts

The 500 with Josh Adam Meyers Episode 158 offers a comprehensive and heartfelt exploration of Elton John's Captain Fantastic & The Brown Dirt Cowboy. With Mike Portnoy’s expert insights and personal anecdotes, listeners gain a deeper appreciation for the album’s craftsmanship and its place in music history. Whether you’re an Elton John aficionado or new to his music, this episode serves as a compelling guide through one of his most significant works.

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Stay tuned for next week's episode, where Josh and his guests delve into Joy Division’s classics. Subscribe to The 500 with Josh Adam Meyers on your favorite podcast platform and join the conversation with music lovers everywhere!

Transcript

[Josh Adam Myers]

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[Mike Portnoy]

Summer'S here and Nordstrom.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Has everything you need for your best dress season ever. From beach days and weddings to weekend getaways in your everyday wardrobe, discover stylish options under $100 from tons of your favorite brands like Mango Skims, Princess Polly, and Madewell. It's easy, too, with free shipping and free returns in store. Order pickup and more. Shop today in stores [e-mail] or download the Nordstrom app. This show is brought to you by Distro Kid. Bring your music to the masses. The 500 the 500J been walking us down through that 2012 edition, so it ain't nothing too new. 500s want to go and in need of a friend. The king of peace for angelo. Talking the 500 until the end Talking the 500 until the end with my man JL on the 500 Talking the 500 until the end. Someone saved my life tonight Sugar bear.

[Mike Portnoy]

You almost had your hook to me didn't you dear?

[Josh Adam Myers]

You nearly had me roll some ties all about hypnotized Sweet cradle whispered in.

[Mike Portnoy]

My ear you're a butterfly.

[Josh Adam Myers]

And butterfly that is. Someone saved my life tonight. It's by Elton John from the 1975 record Captain Fantastic and the Brown Dirt Cowboy. That is a mouthful of an album name. It's also number 158 out of 500 on the 500 with me, Josh, Adam Ives. What's up, y' all? I'm a comic. I'm going through Rolling Stone magazine's list of the 500 greatest albums. Come and join the movement as we skadoodle down. I mean, it's. I think we're right here. I'm taping this on May 27, 2025. Obviously, three years from now, it's over. Last episode three years from now. What am I gonna do afterwards, I guess, take a week off probably. But that's crazy, dude. That is crazy. Tell everybody, man. I mean, we're getting into the thick of these great records. We're having so much fun. And I mean, the guests we've been having are just incredible. Big ups. Emily, this one's a code blue. No code blue. I talking about code red on the Kagan scale. But having Paul Stanley last week from Kiss, that was incredible. Thank you for all the help. DJ Morty Coyle and Wayne Federman and my buddy Ronnie from the Muffs who did Big Star. And then this week, it just keeps getting better. And we got a lot of great episodes coming up, so tell everybody. Come see me on the road this weekend. I will be at the Port in Fells point in Baltimore, Maryland, doing four shows, May 30 and May 31. And then I got more dates to announce, hopefully. But come see me. The fall's filling up, but right now I'm just, you know, stuff when you can't sell tickets, dude, you know, I can't guarantee sellouts and. And, you know, the show's great, I think. I think people have a good time, but when you can't guarantee a sellout, man, you know, and. And you're like, I've had a drop show. Sometimes it just sucks, dude. And yeah, you would hopefully would get better. And it will. I know it will. I gotta stay positive. A lot of cool coming up. I think so. Yeah, man. If you're in Baltimore, if you're in Maryland, come see me May 30th and 31st at the port in Baltimore, Maryland. Subscribe to the Patreon because me, Morty and Wayne and then jt sometimes we can make it. We have Master Fleece Theater. So much fun. Patreon.com backslash the 500 podcast. Subscribe to the YouTube and my YouTube. YouTube.com backslash the 500 Podcast. YouTube.com backslash Josh Adamire 79, which is also my Venmo. So send me Venmo request and support, because you'll get merch. Patreon.com backslash the 500 podcast guys, support the show. We love you. Be a part of the fleece army. It means everything. All right, this week, what do we got? Elton Jizzle. I mean, one of the best. And now we're starting to get to the thick. This is a very not complicated record, but I think it's all discussed in the episode with our guest. But it's like sometimes you wonder. It's like, should this One be on here. There's great music on it, but should it be on here? Is it one of the 500 greatest albums of all time? That is what I talked to today with my guest, the drummer from Dream Theater, Mike Portnoy. I can't express how awesome it is when I start the podcast and within two seconds I'm like, this guy rules. He will be helping us throughout eternity on the rest of these on albums that he fucks with, because we talk all about that and we're going to be getting a little Mike Portnoy blurbs moving forward through mankind of the 500. So dig this episode because this one's fun. Rate, review, and most importantly, subscribe to the 500 and listen free on all platforms or anywhere you get your podcasts. If you're listening on Apple, please leave us a positive review. Get rid of the negative ones. So if you never left one and you love the podcast, please leave a five star rating and a review on Apple. Follow me at Josh Adam Myers on all social media at the 500 podcast on all social media, Josh adamyers.com For tickets, email the podcast@500podcast gmail.com Follow the Facebook group run by Crazy Evan. And for all things 500, go to the website the500podcast.com. All right, y' all, not left to say, but here we go. We're number 158 out of 500 with Elton John's Captain Fantastic and the Brown Dirt Kaboy birding. Now.

[Mike Portnoy]

You gotta take Jack Black and Tenacious D's advice. Always hit record.

[Josh Adam Myers]

I said that. I just said that. I say that all the time. And I liked. Dude, gosh darn it. I loved that little interaction at the beginning. So. All right, so whoever is. If whoever's editing this. Oh, I didn't even hit record. All right, well, never mind. I feel so much better. Thank you. I feel seen. Damn it, people.

[Mike Portnoy]

Ms. Gold. We were talking. It was gold, man. Irreplaceable. Could never be reenacted.

[Josh Adam Myers]

It was the best, Mike.

[Mike Portnoy]

It really wasn't that easy.

[Josh Adam Myers]

How many Kagans did it take? How many Kagans did it take to put this interview together?

[Mike Portnoy]

Yeah, both of them.

[Josh Adam Myers]

We gotta shout out the Kagans.

[Mike Portnoy]

Come on. Yeah, well, actually, to be honest, Amanda and her sister been trying to. Trying to find the right album for me for the longest time. And out of a fight, a list of 500 albums. You would think it would be bigger and a little easier to find some common ground, but.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Seven Kagans on the Kagan scale. It's like the popcorns. Yeah, it's so funny. I, I, we, We gotta keep using that. How many. I'm like, what's the Kagan scale? Scale of vegan dude? Well, I'll say this because obviously, immediately I'm like, oh, this dude rules. And, and you get that. You know, it's, it's hard to get that, Mike, when we're doing them online. And we've gotten to the point now, at least, where what we're using the, there's no real lack in the, you know, the, the timing. So making a joke or whatever it is, it can go through and it hits immediately. You know what I mean? And I can get your vibe and you can get mine, and it's great. It can be difficult. And so what's so great is immediately when even with the headphone thing, I was like, oh, this dude's awesome. We're great. We're good to go because Emily will be pushing people. And by the way, Emily, I know you're listening. I'm not shitting on you whatsoever. We love you. We think you're great. You're literally keeping the show going. And so, all due respect with what I'm about to say, there is love behind it. But, but she'll push for people a lot of time. And she's been pushing for you. And dude, obviously, like, I'm a musician fan. I'm a fan of the art. You know, I love drumming. And so, you know, like, even when I told Bill Burr that I was sitting down with you today because he's a drummer, he was stoked to know that, you know, that we, that we were jamming. And, and that being said, there's a couple people that she's pushed for. And I'm just gonna tell this story because it's funny. Is Jared. I'm gonna talk about. What's his name? The guy from when we did Lou Reed. Remember Lou Reed? We were doing it with, With Penn. Oh, Pen. From Penn and Teller.

[Mike Portnoy]

Yeah, yeah, Penn Jillette.

[Josh Adam Myers]

So Penn Jillette, brilliant comedian. I mean, literally, in the, in the top. And you talk about, like, the top hundred comics of all time. He is definitely somebody that would be in there. I have all the respect from. In the world. On the Kagan level, we're talking code red. Like, she wanted this guy so bad. And, And, I mean, it's like we're dealing with it and this, that, the other thing. And this is why I was also shocked. So to everybody listening when Jeremiah and Mike just only popped up on my screen, I was texting like, where is everybody? Am I late? And you guys were there, and it was like, me and Jeremiah and we're talking and I'm venting because it's like, dude, in the fucking this and that.

[Mike Portnoy]

That.

[Josh Adam Myers]

And it's like, if for some reason, m's just, you know, sucking the dick of this recording of this guest and you. But at that moment, Penn clicks in and he hears me going, sucking the dick. And he. And we're like. He's like. He goes sucking the dick of this guy. I mean, but we. We. We were very happy. It was just. But he was like, once again, he was just a cool guy, so he rolled with it. But it was like, figure of speech. Figure of speech. Yeah. People use that. I'm happy to do it.

[Mike Portnoy]

I mean, personally, there's nothing I hate more than just traditional interviews. I love talking about other bands, other albums, movies, TV music lists. I mean, that's. That's what I'm all about. I mean, I'm a music fan. This is my music room. And you can see. You can see I'm just a collector and a fan. And I could sit here and talk albums and music and bands with you guys all day. That's my favorite thing on earth.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Do you pinch yourself? Do you pinch yourself when you. When you get to sit back and realize that, you know, I know you're just a Jewish kid from New York and, you know, to know that, dude, like, you did it. You. You wanted life like you. And it's not even like you're the. The most famous guy in the world or the richest guy, but you're rich in. I mean, look at your room, dude. You've got every little. Every little doodad you could ever ask for, and you get to do this. Like, I constantly have to remind myself how great my life is when. When it doesn't seem like it in so many ways because one little thing might not be going right. And you're like, oh, God. It's just this. Because I got the Jewish mom that's like, you know, her motto is God hates us. So, like, so, you know, I mean, it's like you.

[Mike Portnoy]

I played on a song called God Hates us with Avenge Sevenfold. So, yeah, it's in my repertoire.

[Josh Adam Myers]

That's perfect. My mom co wrote it.

[Mike Portnoy]

Yeah.

[Josh Adam Myers]

My back hurts. My back hurts. The doctors can't find what's wrong with me. Fibromyalgia. Fibromyalgia. Can we. Did we hit record on that? That's a hit. So, yeah. So why. So out of all the records on the Kagan scale that, that we wanted to get you for, how did you end up being here for Elton John and not nothing. Not for nothing. I understand Elton's the, you know, he's one of the greatest songwriters, one of the greatest rock stars of all time. But, but also, I don't.

[Mike Portnoy]

It's an unlikely alliance.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

[Mike Portnoy]

Yeah. I'm just a, a big, big fan of most stuff from the 60s and 70s. I mean, that, that's my sweet spot. That's when I grew up. That's when I was a kid. You know, we're going to talk about Captain Fantastic. That album came out when I was 8 years old and I was listening to it in real time back then. You know, that's when I was listening. So, you know, this music, this album, Elton in general and a lot of other artists from that era are, have a huge, huge sweet spot for me. And I know like Emily and Amanda have been trying to get me on the show and they keep submitting albums and honestly the Rolling Stone Top 500 Albums is going to be a lot of things in there that I inevitably don't like. You know, I'm not like, I'm not a Dylan fan or a band fan or a dead fan. So, you know, they kept popping out these, these possibilities and possible albums to talk about. They just weren't in my wheelhouse. And then I guess I wore Captain Fantastic shirt recently when I did Drumeo and Drumeo videos are. They all go viral. They, they all get millions and millions of hits. So I guess wearing a Captain Fantastic shirt on that, they realized that I was a fan of the album. And then it clicked when they saw it on the list and here we are.

[Josh Adam Myers]

I love it. Drumeo is the, is that that thing where it's like they bring you in and then they play the music without the drums and then you, you skadoodle over it. What was your, what was your groove and what was your song?

[Mike Portnoy]

They have, they have two, two series. One is where they play you a song without the drumming and you create your own drums. And then the other thing they have is when they play you a song with drums and you have to learn it as fast as possible. So the learning as fast as possible thing, I did a tool song and they, a 12 minute Tool song which was like the biggest drum challenge they ever gave anybody. And it was, it took me like five hours to learn this song on the spot with cameras rolling. So that was a real challenge. But the other series that I did with them, where you have to create your own drums, they gave me two that were both fun. One was a Nickelback song, and one was a. A Taylor Swift song. It has to be a song that you never heard before. And nobody could believe that I had never heard this Taylor Swift song because they pulled up the video and it had something like 30 billion views or something like that. None of which were me. And I never. I never. I never heard Taylor Swift. So anyway, that I happened to be wearing a Captain Fantastic shirt when I was given that challenge, and that video went viral with millions and millions of views. And I guess that's how they. They realized I was a fan of this album. But, yeah, Drumeo's. Drumeo's the. These days, like, every video they put out is just pure entertain, entertainment and educational and great, great viewing.

[Josh Adam Myers]

The stuff that I've seen has been really cool. Like, I watched, like, the Mars Voltage drummer, the new one, like, go over like this, and you're like, oh, it's cool to see their interpretation of what they think that would be. How did you. Did you. What did you do? Do you remember the Taylor Swift songs? I'm actually curious.

[Mike Portnoy]

Like, yeah, it was Shake it off, which now I know is a huge song, but I just don't. I don't listen to pop music, you know? Like, I guess I heard the song in a supermarket one day or an elevator one day. Inevitably, I heard it in the background, but it never. I never knew who it was. Never knew, never paid attention. And I'm like, they could have given me a Beyonce song. They could have given me a Kanye song. I wouldn't have known any of those as well. I'm just not hip to that kind of stuff, you know?

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, the. That's the one Taylor Swift song that I know. I know, like, two of them. Well, three of them because of my niece. But, yeah, dude, Shake It Off. You really are under a rock that you might have no Internet there. Like, you know, it's like. It's just. I am just. It's my bunker. We know nothing. Like, that's exactly. Did you go hardcore with it? How did you.

[Mike Portnoy]

Well, they think they give you the song and you don't know what it is you're listening to. So even after playing it for me, I still didn't know it was Taylor Swift. And they're, like, laughing at me for being so clueless. I thought it was some, like, Disneyland song, like Japanese Disneyland theme song or something like that. I. You know, I don't know. I'd never. Never heard of it. But yeah, I went off. I just kind of added all crazy double bass, fast double bass parts, and, you know, did my thing and it was fun and people loved it. It was.

[Josh Adam Myers]

I'm gonna check it out. I'm so stoked to watch that. Yeah. So. So obviously we're talking about Elton John today. Captain. Make sure I get all this right. Captain Fantastic in the brown dirt Cowboy. Where do you. Where do you put this? I have the vinyl right here, which might be. Which might be one of the coolest. And I want to make sure I give this guy a shout out who made the album cover, because it really is so intricate. Cover art designed by pop artist Alan Aldridge, drawing fantastic imagery from the Renaissance painting the Garden of Earthly Delights by. I'm not gonna get this name right. Hera Harmonious Bosch. I that up. The original LP package also includes two booklets, a lyrics booklet, another booklet. You got all that. You've got all the doodads.

[Mike Portnoy]

This is my original vinyl from the 70s. I mean, this is the original pressing from when I was a kid. And it came with two booklets, one of the lyrics, and all the lyrics have images and photos and stuff that go with each song. Kind of like what he did with Goodbye Yellow Book Road a few years earlier. But this is really cool with its own booklet, and then it's got a scrapbook with all pictures from Elton and Bernie Taupin's past. Because this album is kind of audio. Audio. Yeah. Autobiographical.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yes.

[Mike Portnoy]

It is struggling as young artists and musicians. So it's got the scrapbook and it also came. I still have the original poster as well, with the gatefold, the full image as a gateway. Yeah. Which. Which way am I going?

[Josh Adam Myers]

I see it.

[Mike Portnoy]

No, we got it.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, go more. Yeah, More. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, we see it. That's. That's incredible. That just shows you just, you know.

[Mike Portnoy]

Vinyl used to be. Back then.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah.

[Mike Portnoy]

I remember you'd buy. Buy Kiss albums. They'd come with pop ups and paper guns and posters and booklets. I mean, they really gave you all the cool stuff back then in the.

[Josh Adam Myers]

70S, my dad didn't have a. My dad had a bunch of like, jazz records. But you. Of the records I remember him having was Black Moses by Isaac Hayes. And. And I. If you unfolded it, it was literally Moses. It was. It was Isaac Hayes as, like in, like a. In like a. A shroud or what do you call that, A cloak. And. And kind of like with his arms out and it was like almost in like a cross. And it was, it was, it was so cool. Like I put that up on my wall. But, but really it's just it, it's when seeing that and thinking of what I just said, it makes me realize. And everybody realized probably just how, how it, the, the, the albums that you get now are just, it's not even, most people aren't even getting the record. They're just getting the download of it.

[Mike Portnoy]

And you're getting a, a thumbnail on your phone and that's it.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Exactly. Yeah, it's, it's Morty, our guy that helps me with every episode. Big shout out to DJ Morty Coyle, who was going to join us today, but the timing didn't work out. He, he says, can you be, you know, can you can be proud of your record collection? Can you be proud of your MP3 collection? You know, like.

[Mike Portnoy]

Right.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Can you look at that and be like, look at all these millions of tracks that I have or I have, you know, a hundred records like that. It's, there's something really beautiful about that. And I think absolutely. When you talk about even, you know, we were just like looking at the album cover, you know, and how amazing most people don't do that anymore. I was going to ask you just to start off, if you, if you want to talk about what are your favorite album covers, you know, not from just your, you can include what some of your. That's been in there. But you know, first let's start with you. What's your favorite album cover from any of the bands that you've performed on?

[Mike Portnoy]

Well, I've, I've been real fortunate to work with some legendary guys. I mean Dream Theater's been working with Hugh Sime for decades now and you did every Rush album and he's, you know, he's done so many classic legendary albums to the years. So we have a great relationship with you, Sime. But we were also fortunate in the 90s to work with Storm Ferguson who did all the Pink Floyd covers and Led Zeppelin covers. And actually I, in the other room, I have hanging in my wall, in one of the walls in the other room a hand drawn artwork for the COVID that Storm Thurkerson did. He did our album called Falling Into Infinity and he hand drew all of these covers as submitted as possible covers. And I have in the other room, it's the hand drawn cover for Falling Into Infinity and then a hand drawn cover that he also submitted as another poss passed on the other One. And Pink Floyd ended up using it a few years later for a greatest hits package. So I have the original hand drawn cover that Pink Floyd ended up using as well. So I would have to say it's Storm Thurguson did not do my favorite Dream Theater cover. But the fact that I had a chance to work with him and, and awesome. It was. Was amazing because he did all, you know, he did wish you were here and the Wall. Well, actually he didn't do the Wall, but he did Dark side of the Moon and Animals and Adam Hart Mother, all the classic Floyd albums. He did the Zeppelin albums and he's just an absolute legend. So, yeah, I see it, I see it.

[Josh Adam Myers]

So you're saying Falling into infinity. He did the album cover. He's done the. That's the guy that did the album covers for Pink Floyd. Because I see it. I see that like, momentary lapse of reason type thing. You know what I mean? With all the beds. Just. Even this, the way it look, it looks like a Pink Floyd album cover. It's really red.

[Mike Portnoy]

Totally.

[Josh Adam Myers]

That's so cool to have that style. Who are you? So would you say that, that, that he's the guy that's done like, if you had to say, you know, this is my favorite album cover of all time. Doesn't have to be Dream theater. Doesn't have to be yours. What are you picking? What do you.

[Mike Portnoy]

Honestly? All. All honesty. This is definitely up there. This is one of them. I think this album cover is insane.

[Josh Adam Myers]

And.

[Mike Portnoy]

And it, like I showed before, it's a gatefold, so it's really double, you know.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, that's, that's.

[Mike Portnoy]

And this guy, what was his name, like you said, Alan Aldridge. He did. At the time, when this came out in the mid-70s, I had these two Beatles illustrated lyrics books that he did. And he illustrated like, well, he did most of the illustrations. There was a few different artists that were a part of this book, but this Beatles illustrated lyrics books were incredible. And as a kid I would just sit there and read the lyrics and look at these images. He did different images for every song in the Beatles catalog. And those were two of my favorite books when I was a kid in the 70s. So when this came out, it's like, oh, I totally recognize the style. I mean, this was. You know. But yeah, this has so much detail. I mean, this so. And everything even beyond just the artwork itself. I love the way that Captain Fantastic has its own logo here. This little thing like a comic book from the edge of the earth to Your Town, which is from the lyrics, you know, you have Bernie Taupin in the. On the back cover. So honestly, this would have to be one of my favorite album covers of all time. It's definitely up there.

[Josh Adam Myers]

It really is beautiful. I wanted. I just lost the thing that I just had up. Let me pull this up because I want to make sure I get all this stuff out. How much do you know about this record and kind of where Elton's at, you know, Because I'm not. I'm not gonna lie. Like, I have everything written down. And I mean, I'm. I'm about as much of an Elton historian, you know, I'm not gonna say as anybody, but I went through, like, kind of like a. The. Like the run through with my. My writer. But do you. Do you. Because I. I can talk or you could talk. Do you know, kind of where he's at in his career and, you know, so do you want to. Why don't you kind of give us a little what you know about this, and then I'll fill in the details of what we have under album essentials.

[Mike Portnoy]

All right. Well. Well, truth be told, full disclose, full disclosure, my favorite Elton album of all time is Good by Elbrook road, which was two. Two years before this in 73.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah.

[Mike Portnoy]

And that Goodbye Yellow Brick Road is in my top five of all time, of all records of all time. So that's a. A big, big one for me. So what's beating it?

[Josh Adam Myers]

What's beating that? Like, what are.

[Mike Portnoy]

What are your top five? My top five is sergeant Pepper. Yep. Tommy the Who's Tommy? Pink Floyd's the Wall, Bowie's Ziggy Stardust and Goodbye Elbrook Road. That's my top five of classics. I also have a top five of modern albums as well, but that's my top five of the classics.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, sure. That's. You know what's so cool? It's like whenever. When I went to my first day of film school and they went through everybody's favorite movie and everybody's like the Godfather and this. Like, you're. You're the purist. You're like. You know what I mean? You're going with. They're great records. So I'm not, like, saying that they're not, but it's like you recognize that they are the great. And it's like. And they deserve to be up there. People ask me and I'd be like, mine's Babe. I love the movie about the talking pig. That's my favorite movie of all time.

[Mike Portnoy]

Well, what's your. What would be your top five of all time?

[Josh Adam Myers]

I mean, it's. So we just did one of them, which is Radiohead. Okay, Computer. Because it's just.

[Mike Portnoy]

That's in my top five of modern albums.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Absolutely. That. Because that was like. I would say that. I would say. And I've said this a million times. I say Guns and Roses, Appetite for Destruction. You know, this one is just a wild card because it's. It. But it's. It just changed my life, which was Stone Temple Pilots, Core, because I was one way. And then I heard Scott's voice and I was like, I'm gonna do that. So it's. It's more. It's not even so much that it's the greatest record in what I would call, like, what music critics at all. Because music critics hated Stone Temple Pilots. But it was just such a big record for me where I listened to it and listened to it, listen to it. And I don't really listen to it that often anymore. But it was like, man, the obsession, like Wu Tang entered the 36 chambers. Like Jeremiah with me and our friends. That was like. That was it for a. For like two years. We. We were obsessed with that record. And. Yeah, but I mean, you know, then those are good. These. They're. They're all.

[Mike Portnoy]

Let me give you my Modern Five, because this, My Modern Five is. Is. Okay, Computer. Radiohead, like you said, Jellyfish, Spilt Milk, which is one of the greatest albums ever made. Just like sonically, like a modern day sergeant Pepper.

[Josh Adam Myers]

So many people I know that I respect musically say that. So you're not the first. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Mike Portnoy]

Beastie Boys, Paul's Boutique, which is. Which is the Sergeant Pepper of hip hop.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yes.

[Mike Portnoy]

The first Mr. Bungle album. Mike Patton and Mr. Bungle, which is like a progressive avant garde masterpiece, and then a little. Little different from everything else, is Muse's Absolution. I absolutely. I love Absolution by Music.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Such a great record.

[Mike Portnoy]

I just.

[Josh Adam Myers]

I love. I do. Oh, dude. Mike, we're so right here. I gotta ask because. And I know we'll get to some of these questions later, because I am going to ask you some stuff about your career as well. But it's like, you know, did you talk to Dave about kind of jumping in and starting to play drums? Did you actually maybe say, hey, man, maybe I could play drums in Mr. Bungle? When they were doing the. When they were doing the Return, what was it? The Revenge of the Easter Bunny tour? Like, I could see you doing that. I mean, oh, God, I would have.

[Mike Portnoy]

I mean, to play with those guys would be a dream. I. I was so psyched when I heard that Dave and Scott Ian were brought into the band for that, you know.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah.

[Mike Portnoy]

And I texted both of those guys immediately, like, guys, you're playing with, like, one of my favorite bands of all time. What a freaking honor. I couldn't wait to see them live with that lineup. And I've seen him many times now with that lineup, but I saw the. The OG Bungle lineup in the. In the 90s.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Mike Portnoy]

They are just so insane. Incredible, dude.

[Josh Adam Myers]

I love it. All right. I didn't mean to cut you off. I get. I go on, you know, tangents. I always find it interesting to find out, especially for someone like you. It's like. Like, I gotta know your favorites. All right, so where were we? Elton John, Goodbye, Yellow Brick Road. You know, I know you want to take it, or we can.

[Mike Portnoy]

Sure. Yellow Brick Road came out in 73. To me, that's his masterpiece double album. But then he put out caribou in 74, and then this came out, Captain Fantastic in 70. I would consider Captain Fantastic his second greatest album. It's my second favorite of his. And as far as where he was at at this time, you got to realize he was massive. Around. Around the same time in 75 is when he.

[Josh Adam Myers]

He.

[Mike Portnoy]

He was in Tommy doing Pinball Wizard. He played the pinball wizard and Tommy and also was on the soundtrack with his version of the song. So that was around the same time also his song with John Lennon, Whatever gets you through the night. John Lennon's Walls and Bridges album came out around the same time, so he had a big hit with that. And John Lennon's last live appearance ever was playing with Elton. I think it might have been that same year. 75. So 75 was a big, big year for Elton. Then Captain Fantastic comes out. It's a concept album about his and Bernie Taupin's early career, before they were successful, and the struggles they went through in the late 60s. And another interesting thing about it, it was written in chronological order, so the sequence you're getting with this album is the order that they wrote the songs, which is. I mean, I've made almost 100 albums in my life at this point. I don't recall ever doing that. That's a very unique thing to do.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Why do you think they did that?

[Mike Portnoy]

I don't know. I mean, they'd have to answer. But I guess maybe when. When Elton was writing the music, he felt a flow or maybe when Bernie. Maybe it was because when Bernie wrote the lyrics, which is also within itself an unusual thing, the fact that Elton didn't write his own lyrics and had an outside lyricist. You know, some bands like King Crimson or Kal Harem, they had that. They had an outside lyricist, but it was more common back then than now. But still, the fact that, like, Elton didn't write the lyrics to Candle in the Wind or didn't write the lyrics to, you know, Benny and the jets, it's. It's. It's a weird thing to think about. He would just write the music and then Bernie would write the. The lyrics. So maybe in answer to the question about why was it chronological? Maybe Bernie just felt it told the story in the order that he wrote it. And I don't know, but I. I suppose there's some further.

[Josh Adam Myers]

It could be, you know, Mike. It could be, you know, because, like, going through what the songs are about, maybe it was like he was handing them as he wrote the song, he handed that one to him and he's like, this is what I'm thinking about first, because. What is it? Let me. Let me pull up. I want to go by tracks, too, you know, but, yeah, it comes with a partnership. Then you have the story of the music industry and blah, blah. It's just maybe that was the way he was laying it out. Which is so fascinating too, because there's some of this stuff that is like, you know, that. That is so personal to Elton that Bernie, like, you know, nails right. It's just. It really is impressive.

[Mike Portnoy]

Bernie had to write from Elton's, you know, from Elton's point of view. And a lot like he wrote Someone Saved My Life Tonight. He wrote the lyrics about a relationship that Elton was in. So he had to, you know, he had to know Elton's situations and personal, you know, you know, scenarios that he's going through in his life to write from his perspective. And for Elton to deliver these lyrics as if they're his own, you know, he, you know, Bernie has to nail it. But it's really. It's so unusual to have an outside writer like this that is so, so much a part of all of these hits, you know, and it was throughout Elton's entire career, you know, this band. And another thing that of note is that this was the last album with this band, which was Elton's classic early 70s band with Nigel Olson on drums, Davey Johnston on guitar, D. Murray on bass. I mean, this was a classic lineup that made good by Elbrick Road and all These classic albums. And this was the last one of this lineup. You could see him here in the. In the inside of the booklet.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, yeah, dude, you nailed everything that I had, every single thing. And also another big factor.

[Mike Portnoy]

I can't tell which direction I'm going.

[Josh Adam Myers]

No, yeah, we got you, dude.

[Mike Portnoy]

There we go.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Direction.

[Mike Portnoy]

But yeah, this was a classic lineup. So you're hearing his band. It was more than just Elton and Bernie. This was a real band at this point. After this, I think Elton started working with different studio musicians. But this was the last time that it was a real band making an album together. And the story goes, I know this from Goodbye Yellow Brook Road. You know, Dee and Davey and Nigel, the three other guys in the band would do all the background vocals and the story, legend has it, like they would when they were making Goodbye Elbrook Road. They would lay down the music in the day. Then Elton would go home, fuck off. And the three of them would stay late night in the studio, creating all the background vocals and harmonies and made this wall of harmonies that you hear on all these old classic songs. So that the band was really critical to. To hit to Elton's sound at this period in the mid-70s.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Why do you think. And I mean, I don't know if you know this and maybe Jer, if you might have to look this up, but why did he not work with them after this, do you know? Or Davey.

[Mike Portnoy]

Davey Johnson stayed with him for a while on guitar. He stayed with him, but the main thing was that he let. He fired Nigel and D, the rhythm section, both of whom would have been with him on like those great early albums, Mad Men across the Water and Hunky Chateau. And. Yeah, I don't know why. Who knows?

[Josh Adam Myers]

Who knows? This was also the first album to debut at number one.

[Mike Portnoy]

Wow.

[Josh Adam Myers]

It's the first time an album did that. It stayed in that position for seven weeks. It was so. He was so hot at the time that the advance orders for the album were over a million. So he really was like. Like, this is massive. Yeah, he was massive. And. And I know we have like massive stars now, but there's. It feels. It just feels a lot pure about these guys in the 70s.

[Mike Portnoy]

And even the massive stars now have been doing it for 30 years to get to the level they're at. Guns N Roses, I mean, Guns and Roses were huge coming out of the gates. Metallica were huge after a few years. But they weren't playing stadiums until 20 years in, whereas Elton is playing stadiums. There's that famous footage of him playing Dodger Stadium dressed in the sequence, like, Dodger uniform. I mean, he was doing stadiums. And there were other bands doing stadiums too. Crosby, Stills and Nash were playing stadiums, you know, in the early seventies. And so odd. The Eagles and, you know, Bowie, you know, it was. It was a different era. You know, you don't get musicians like that now in 2025. And like I said, the ones that are playing stadiums today, like Guns N Roses and Metallica, you know, they're 40 years in at this point.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah. Yeah. I wonder if we missed anything, because you literally nailed everything that. That I had gone over with with my. My buddy Morty. Because I go through these, like, powwows to, like, get me, like, tuned in, because there's so much stuff that, like, you know, we don't want to miss. So let's talk about some of the songs. Let's, you know, let's. Let's dive into some of the songs and. And please, like, I got. I have only some facts and you tell me what you like, you tell me what you don't like. This was my first time listening to this record all the way through the. For. I listened to it about a year ago because I was getting bored. So I went. I went deep down into the list and I was like, let me. Let me, you know, take a look at this. The only song that is a. Is a single or was. Is probably one of his hits and probably one of his. I mean, it's one of the best songs I think he's ever written is Somebody Saved My Life Tonight. I mean, that is, like, phenomenal piece. It's a masterpiece. And we'll get to that. So it opens with Captain Fantastic and the Brown Dirt Cowboy. The song's about Elton John, characterized as Captain Fantastic, and his songwriting partner, Bernie Taupin, who is the Brown Dirt Cowboy. Interestingly, John and Bernie said that they grew into these roles over the years, unintentionally becoming the characters that Bernie wrote about them in this song. Thoughts on it? What do you like? What do you dislike? You tell me.

[Mike Portnoy]

It's. It's a great opener. It's a little measured, though. It comes in kind of slow. Almost feels like a country song when it starts off, like a slide guitar kind of sound and. But then it eventually starts to rock and it's a bit of a rocker. I look at. See these albums. I still look at albums from the 70s in terms of side A and side B. And yeah, in. Back in those days, you were able to have, you know, now you have to have an album opener and album closer. Back then, you were able to have two album openers, two album closers because you could have one on each side. So this was the album opener for side A. More of a rocker and kind of just setting the tone for telling the story of these two guys, you know, Captain Fantastic and the Brown Dirt Cowboys, like Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid. You know, it's these two guys that are in the wild, wild west of rock and roll music and trying to make it, make a living out of it. But I think it's a good tune. Nothing special. You know, it's not my favorite track on the album, but I think it's a good way to start it.

[Josh Adam Myers]

It is a good way to start. It's also, like you said, it's about their partnership of how they came together. And you've had so many projects. You know, most people know you from Dream Theater. Who is your Bernie, who's your collaborator? Like, you know, who do you look for? Like, you know, what do you look for in a collaborator?

[Mike Portnoy]

I've had, I'd say the two. I've had two big ones in my career. One within all of my years within Dream Theater and then one outside all of my years at Dream Theater. I would say within Dream Theater. My. My partner in crime is definitely John Petrucci, guitar player in Dream Theater. He and I, you know, formed the band along with our bass player back when we were teenagers in the 80s back at Berklee College of Music. And here we are 40 years later. So John Petrucci and myself are definitely the. The partnership in the band. We're kind of the James Hetfield and Lars Ulrich of Dream Theater or, you know, similar that guitar drum relationship. Similar like Dimebag and Vinnie Paul or Eddie and Alex Van Halen. I think John and I have a very similar guitar drum relationship. And also all throughout the 2000s, we co produced all the Dream Theater albums. So we made all those creative decisions together as co producers. So within Dream Theater, I would say that's the strongest partnership I've ever had outside of Dream Theater. I was, you know, I left the band for 13 years and over those 13 years, I made 40 or 50 different albums with different bands and projects. And most of them were with Neil Morse. And Neil Morse kind of became my partner in crime. More like. More of like a Lennon McCartney duo, you know, in the Prague universe. All the bands that Neil and I formed together, which were Transatlantic, Flying Colors, Neil Morse Band, you know, we were in multiple bands together and we're Kind of partners in crime in all those bands as well. So I've been fortunate to have some really great musical partners throughout, you know, the last 40 years.

[Josh Adam Myers]

What do you look for? Like, what, what makes these guys so special? Like, what do you connect with? Or is it just you're both, like, always, like one of those things where you're like, oh my God, like you're just inside my head or.

[Mike Portnoy]

Well, with John Petrucci, I mean, the music we make in Dream Theater, you know, we, we were kind of the gatekeepers of the band for so many years. Having formed it when we were teenagers and going for decades together, we were very protective over, you know, what the band should sound like and what the band should do, the music we should make, how it should be perceived and unveiled. So he and I had very similar mindsets in terms of how we ran Dream Theater and how we protected it, the brand. With Neil Morris, it's more of a musical relationship. He's just, just one of the most prolific artists I've ever met. He'll literally wake up every day with, you know, a new song in his head. Sometimes it could be a 15, 20 minute epic that he just wrote in his sleep the night before. So he's a songwriting machine. So he and I really click on that level in terms of, you know, being able to tap into his incredible proficiency as a songwriter. And then also we're, you know, we're big music fans. We love the Beatles, we love. Yes. All the Prague bands and the 60s bands, you know, so we were able to kind of put together different bands and just collaborate on a. On a really adventurous level. Just that love for music.

[Josh Adam Myers]

What is the, what is the. Is there a song that you would say is your best, you know, oh, this shows our, our, where we, you know, when we form like Voltron, it's on this, right?

[Mike Portnoy]

Oh, I mean, the music I make is with the bands I'm a part of is epic. It's long shit. It's like 2020 minute songs with a million parts and a million time signatures. So those, you know, those big epics are the ones that kind of COVID a lot of ground. You know, there's a lot of simple songs in the, in my catalog as well. But to me, usually those are just trying to go in one direction. I think the big epic tunes, you know, if you look at dream theaters, epic songs like Octavarium or Change of Seasons or the latest album we just put out, we have a song, you know, 20 minute song that's, you know, an Epic. So those are the ones that I think that have the most, you know, in, in them. The most, the most bang for the buck.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, there. Is there a better partnership? Like, who are the greatest partnerships? You would say Lennon McCartney. McCartney, obviously. Yeah. Let me finish. I was about to say that. Lennon McCartney, you know, Bernie Elton Page and Plant.

[Mike Portnoy]

Page and Plant, Asian Plant, Nick and Keith.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Nick and Keith.

[Mike Portnoy]

Roger and Pete.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Roger and P. That's a good one. Trying to think of a funny one.

[Mike Portnoy]

A great one that ended up, you know, ending with so much animosity would be Roger Waters and David Gilmore. You know, although, although Roger would tell you, and Roger really ran the ship on his own all those years. But, you know, you, you had David Sink. You have Gilmore's voice and his incredible guitar playing and all those albums which balanced it out, you know.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah. You know, I, I just, I. It's so funny because it's like Roger just takes so much credit and, and, but it's like you, you can't listen to his music without hearing the David Gilmore portions. Whether it's his voice or it's that incredible guitar solo sound, it's like, it's just a bummer that that one fell apart. And it's like, you know, the fact that, you know, we even got what we did out of him knowing, you know, just how they both are. Right. One of the best and most boring, not boring, but David Gilmore blew me away. I just saw Madison Square Garden three times and it's like just, it was, it was the most low energy show. He did not play the hits. He, he did give you, he gave you enough. But I really feel like he was doing it all for himself, which I kind of respected. But then you go to see Roger Waters and it's just like it flying at you.

[Mike Portnoy]

That shows you the difference in their partnership, the yin and yang of it. You know, Roger was always the big concept guy. He was the guy that had the flying pigs and the, and the wall that gets built up and knocked down and, you know, Dark side of the Moon. It was all his vision. He had that creative vision and like he was the big concept guy, whereas Gilmore was the voice and the melody in the band, you know.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah.

[Mike Portnoy]

And, you know, I'm a Roger guy, you know, when push comes to shove, if I have to pick one or the other. But honestly, both of them are at their best with each other. Nothing could beat those big four albums from the 70s, you know, dark side, wish you were here, Animals in the Wall. I mean, those four are just the four of the greatest albums of all time. So yeah, and they couldn't have been made without both of those guys.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Sure. 100 hey everybody. So you guys have probably heard me talk about how I've been in bands my whole life. I love writing songs and performing in front of crowds. Just. Just like with comedy as a musician, it can be kind of hard to cut through the noise and really stand out as an artist. I feel like half the music projects I've been in have ended just because we couldn't figure out the answer to that eternal question of how do we get people to hear us? But then again, that was before there was Distrokid. Distrokid is a digital music distribution service that brings your sound to the masses. It's a one stop shop for getting your songs on itunes, Spotify, Apple Music, YouTube Music, Amazon, Deezer, Tidal, and many more. What's Deezer? I never even heard of Deezer. How many of them are there? I know all that. That's like the holy grail of streaming services though. And getting paid. They want to. We want to get you paid for your music. That's huge because a lot of bands go broke before they get big. But Distrokid collects earnings and payments and sends 100% of these earnings to artists minus banking fees and applicable taxes. And that's just one of the tons of benefits of using Distrokid. You can send big files to anyone with their Instant Share feature. You can use the Hyper Follow feature to promote your release and get pre saves on your song. You can even create personal landing pages for yourself, your band, your brand, and whatever you like. It has a free Spotify Canvas generator too, to generate your own Spotify Canvas for your songs. And the Mixia feature instantly masters your tracks for higher quality audio. So if you're ready to bring your band to the next level, it's time to check out Distrokid. The Distrokid app is now available on iOS and Android. Go to the app or Play Store to download it. Listeners of this show can get 30% off their first year by going to distrokid.com 500 that's distrokid.com VIP the 500 for 30% off your first year. Dig it. Eczema isn't always obvious, but it's real. And so is the relief from Ebglis. After an initial dosing phase of 16 weeks, about 4 in 10 people taking eggs achieved itch, relief and clear or almost clear skin. And most of those people Maintain skin that's still more clear at one year with monthly dosing. EBGLYS Librekizumab LBKZ a 250mg per 2ml injection, is a prescription medicine used to treat adults and children 12 years of age and older who weigh at least 88 pounds or 40 kilograms with moderate to severe eczema, also called atopic dermatitis, that is not well controlled with prescription therapies used on the skin or topicals or who cannot use topical therapies. EBGLIS can be used with or without topical corticosteroids. Don't use if you're allergic to ebglis. Allergic reactions can occur that can be severe eye problems. Tell your doctor if you have new or worsening eye problems, you should not receive a live vaccine when treated with Epglis. Before starting Epglis, tell your doctor if you have a parasitic infection searching for real relief. Ask your doctor about epglis and visit epglis.lily.com or call 1-800-lilyrx or 1-800-545-5979. All right. Tower of Babel.

[Mike Portnoy]

It could be Babel, because actually, when thinking about the song, it's. He's singing about Cain and Abel, I think, or something like that. Or. So maybe it's Babel or Babel. I'm not sure.

[Josh Adam Myers]

But yeah, it's a story of the music industry, the pitfalls, the successes. It's the. It's like he. Morty, because we're all Jewish, he wanted me to say, recognizing the chutzpah at trying to reach God. The chutzpah. Realizing that mishpaka.

[Mike Portnoy]

I guess it is the Tower of Babel. I guess that's. That's actually how it's pronounced because he's.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah.

[Mike Portnoy]

I mean, at least in the context of the lyrics, it is. But I don't know. Who the hell knows.

[Josh Adam Myers]

I really like this song. I really liked this. I love. I love any story, you know, I love the story of. Of excess. I love the story of debauchery. I love. I love all of that. You know what I mean? I think that's why. Oh, no, I just set off my. I'm not going to say any of my A, L, E X A by saying, what excess. Yeah, I mean, thoughts on the song? What do you love? What do you dislike? I mean, it's. It's a good song.

[Mike Portnoy]

The thing about this album, it's. There's. There's the ones, you know, and then there's the ones you don't know. And, and there's a handful of tracks on this album that are kind of underrated classics. This is one of them. This and the. The couple that follow are more under the radar kind of songs. Deeper album cuts that he wouldn't ever really play normally out of the context of this album, but this is a great one. When he did play this album in its entirety about 20 years ago and for some reason left this one off the set, really. This and the songwriting on side too. He left off the 2005 live version, which is a weird choice. I don't know why, because this, this actually happens to be one of my favorite of the. Yeah. Of the deeper cuts, you know, it.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Doesn'T make sense why he would leave this off. That's. That's pretty interesting. Now, you started in the 80s and like we talked about earlier, I love Gnr. You know, what was your road to excess? Like, you know, do you, do you have tales of debauchery? Like. You know.

[Mike Portnoy]

I do, I do personally. But I mean I, you know, I made my career in Dream Theater, which is, you know, arguably the most boring band in metal, you know, you know, personally. Personally, that is, you know, it's just a bunch of musos musicians and our audience are the same. So we're not exactly the Motley Crue of Prague. You know, we made our career out of writing these, you know, Prague songs that were tailor made for musicians in the van of a band like in the vein of a band like Rush or. Yes. Or whatever like that. So honestly, the debauchery came for me personally because I. I'm an alcoholic, an addict.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah.

[Mike Portnoy]

Go through many, many years of recovery to get back on track. So personally, I was the guy in the band that would always hang out with the opening band or the crew guys and have fun with those guys. And then when I got sober in the. In the early 2000s, you know, the band was very, very helpful and supportive of that. But there wasn't too much debauchery, you know, it was just. Yeah, we're not Guns N' Roses. A Motley Crue where we're the Rush of, of. Of this era and generation did, did.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Now I gotta ask. And you don't talk about it at all, but you know, was it. You know, there's always this because I'm an addict. And there was that moment, that first set back, sober, clear headed compared to being on stage on Percocets and Opiates and stuff, which made me feel invincible and made Me do this? Was it a. Was it a hard. Were you nervous? I mean, obviously there's no way you can't be, but it's like, you know, but really with. I mean, I don't want to. I'm gonna put the words in your head because with music, it's like, you know, the music, it's like you practice it. You do this. With stand up comedy, it's way different because you have to connect with audience and you could say something they might not like. The way you look like, were you. Was there a. Was there like a moment of like, all right, here we go. Or, you know, I hope this goes well.

[Mike Portnoy]

Well, when I first got sober, yeah, it was a huge adjustment. I had never done anything so sober at that point, you know, because I've been drinking since I was a preteen. So, you know, at that point when I got sober at 33, you know, I had never had a conversation at a party sober. I had never, you know, been in the recording studio sober. I'd never been on stage sober, you know, so, you know, it was a huge adjustment at first, but actually then I found once I got over that hump, that I was clearer and cleaner and better and sharper than ever before. So, you know, that fear then suddenly turned into excitement. Excitement, yeah, and courage. You know, it was suddenly, you know, confident about it. But yeah, you know, before I got sober, like, my years drinking on the road was like, at first I would say, well, I wouldn't drink until after the show. Then it was. Then it became, okay, well, I'll only drink before the encore. Then it became, all right, I'm only gonna drink during the. The guitar solo in the middle of the show. Then it was like, all right, well, I'm only gonna drink right before the show. You know, Next thing you knew, you know, you're getting wasted before the opening band. You know, it was just. Yeah, it just. Everything was a. Was progressive at that point, you know, it's crazy.

[Josh Adam Myers]

It's crazy that what we try to do as addicts to like, yeah, it's fine. Yeah, I just had that experience with smoking cigarettes because I'm not, I'm. I'm. I don't drink. I don't do coke, I don't take pills. I smoke grass at the end of the night every once in a while. I don't even like it. It's more just a. When my anxiety's going crazy just to bring me down. But I have no, It's. I'm not an addict at all. With it. But nicotine. I quit vaping when I was on tour because of my voice and I started smoking spliffs, like, and then. And just like you said, I'm only going to smoke a spliff after the show. And then because of the nicotine in it, it was like, all right, well then I'm. And then I started putting less and less weed and next thing you know, I'm just smoking cigarettes. Right? And I was like, I'm only going to smoke when I walk the dog. All right, I'm only going to do. And then next, you know, I'm waking up and I'm smoking a cigarette, so. Exactly. It's crazy. Dude. Do you think Elton's music. Because he was using during this time, right?

[Mike Portnoy]

I think so, yeah. I mean, he famously got sober, you know, a long, long time ago. So. But I think, you know, it's pretty well known that he was pretty excessive in the 70s, at the height of his game in the 70s. And you know, the stories of him and John. John Lennon and their lost weekends and things like that. So. Yeah, I'm not sure when he got sober, but I know he went through his. His tough period as well in the 70s.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah. I. I wonder if like, you know, his music suffered at all. But I mean, it's. Is this music in you. You're more of a fan, you might know, is music in the 80s as good as the music in the 70s or is that set.

[Mike Portnoy]

I don't think anybody for that was around in the 60s and 70s. Their music was as good in the 80s. None.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Mike Portnoy]

Name any band and. And I think their best music was in the 6th and the 70s.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, it was a stupid question. I'm sorry.

[Mike Portnoy]

Yeah.

[Josh Adam Myers]

I'm such an idiot. I feel like. I feel like Philip Seymour Hoffman and Boogie Nights.

[Mike Portnoy]

So stupid. Which, by the way, talking about lists, that's my number one film of all time.

[Josh Adam Myers]

One of the greatest movies ever made. Like we saw an opening night in Washington, D.C. paul Thomas Anderson, he made. He made the Ben Hur of the industry.

[Mike Portnoy]

His next one too. Magnolia. Magnolia. Boogie Nights are the top of my all time favorite, favorite list.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Really? Really? Those are your. You know what? You know what? And I, I talk about this a lot. And I just talked about in the last episode, you know what? Movie rule. Well, all right, I'm going way off topic, but I've just recently put this as my favorite movie ever. Aliens.

[Mike Portnoy]

Aliens with the S. Cameron, I.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Because you gotta judge your favorite movie and record as a record or a movie. I can listen to any moment of the day, in any mood, and I can watch it. And I just. And dude, I've fallen in. I loved Aliens. It was in my top 20 and decades.

[Mike Portnoy]

You know, it's been a while.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Portnoy.

[Mike Portnoy]

I'll revisit it. I'm telling you, I have the. I have the Blu Ray box of them all. And I know Fincher. Ridley Scott did the first, Fincher did the third, but the Cameron one is.

[Josh Adam Myers]

But those, dude. But that's the biggest bag drop of all time. Where you. You who the executives in control at 20th Century Fox that made Alien, which is a perfect horror slasher movie, got James Cameron to do Part two, which is arguably one of the greatest action adventure movies of all time. It's so quotable. When she comes out at the end in the big machine and says, get away from you. You. I get like, chills. I almost choke up because I love it that much. And then they. It up so bad with Alien 3, because Fincher's.

[Mike Portnoy]

But Master Mastermind, but no, but he.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Who's a brilliant director, but he. That's not his movie. That's the executive's movie. Which we're going to get to in another question where we talk about notes from executives. And so let's. So let's. Because, I mean, we're supposed to be talking about Elton John and we're talking about Boogie Nights and Aliens. There's a guy in his basement right now. Like, talk about Bitter Fingers. You totally, totally. All right. Bitter Fingers. Record companies. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. That's what a perfect segue. I'm talking about Alien 3. The record company saying they need to write songs for other people and then saying they don't want to. That's basically what I got from this. And I think that's what Morty had told me, what it's about. Thoughts on Bitter Fingers or you want to add to that or what do you think?

[Mike Portnoy]

To me, it's. It's part of the. The middle of side one, which is a lot of this album. It reminds me of like in around that time. This is the same year that Queen made A Night at the Opera and bands like Queen or Elton. With this album, every song is kind of capturing a different thing. One could be a country song. One could be like this song with the tack piano kind of reminds me of like a rag, Ragtime kind of. I don't know. It's. You know, albums like this and Night at the Opera, or even the White Album, for that matter, are Mixing genres and genre hopping from song to song. So to me, Bitter Fingers is just another kind of deep album cut. Not one of my favorites on the album. I love. If you want to talk about it, like, from a musical standpoint, I love that the verses are in a triplet field, but then it goes to the chorus, eighth note field. So if you're a musician, that's a pretty cool aspect, that it's constantly shifting between triplets.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, yeah.

[Mike Portnoy]

Which is a cool thing. But other than that, to me, it's one of the throwaways on this album, you know, it's not one of my favorites. This. Same with the next track as well. Tell me, what is the next one? And. And it's. That's another one that's kind of in that vein for me.

[Josh Adam Myers]

So I'll make this. We sum both those up. But I. I have two questions I really want to ask you because, you know, just like Neil from Rush, you know, they have their signature things. You have the Mike Portnoy drum fill, like, you know, and being that this song is about them not wanting to write stuff for other people, what is that like seeing people cover Dream theater and try to cover your shit? What was the first time seeing someone cover one of your songs? Do you remember it?

[Mike Portnoy]

It was. It was. I mean, our breakthrough album happened in 92 Images and Words, and we had a song called Pull Me Under. And it was around then that we started to, you know, get some popularity and notoriety. It was around then that we used to start to see Dream theater cover bands as well. So it's the early to mid-90s, I think. The first one I saw was a Japanese dream theater cover band called Lifting Shadows. It was like the mid-90s. And then also I got a video of a band from Australia doing all Dream theater covers. And the drummer at that time in this Dream Theater cover band was a drummer named Virgil Donati. Virgil went on to become a very, very famous drummer in his own right, playing with Steve Vai and such. But he started well, at least the first way I heard of him was in this Dream Theater cover band. But, yeah, to me, that's. What a compliment. What are the ultimate compliment when you have people that love your music that much that want to cover it. And. And as far as my style goes, yeah, there's the. The Portnoy Phil, which is now almost like it's become kind of something that I have to joke about at this point. It's become such a cliche of my style that it's. You Know, it's just, it's just become my thing for. For lack of a better word. But you know, when you see what you do reaching other musicians, it's the ultimate compliment really is.

[Josh Adam Myers]

It really is.

[Mike Portnoy]

And like, like you said, I'm not a household name. You know, people that you've probably had on the show are, you know, are more household names, more commercial. But the thing with Dream Theater fans, they're so freaking fanatical and devoted. They, our fan base have gave us this career that we're able to have kind of under the radar of. Of popular music, you know, Rolling Stone magazine, I never acknowledged us. MTV barely acknowledged us in the 90s. We kind of made our career off of touring relentlessly for 40 years, you know, at this point and. But anyway, as far as Bitter Fingers and a label trying to change you and stuff like that, we went through. We had an album that we made that was the one that Storm Ferguson did the COVID for that you pulled up earlier, Falling Into Infinity. That album was made under tremendous pressure from the Lab and they, they kind of held us at bay for a couple years making that record, refusing to give us the green light until we delivered some singles to them. So that was a really, really painful experience. That was so frustrating at. To the point where I was ready to walk out and quit because it was so frustrating. And then we ultimately, we ultimately threw down the gauntlet and had our manager say get the fuck out of the way or else, the band's breaking up. And then we ended up making a record, Scenes From Our Memory, which pretty much revitalized and re reinvigorated us and the fan base. So if Bitter Fingers is about falling prey to the pressures of record company pressures, I mean I wrote about it on that Falling Into Infinity album. A so called Burning. Burning My Soul is all about that. Just Let Me Breathe on the same album is about that. So I wrote a lot of lyrics during that period about those kind of frustrations so I could relate to. To that subject matter.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Good. And then. And then because we will just skip over when the Tell me when the whistle blows. But it is about touring. One of my favorite things to ask comics is your worst gig. Like what's your. Do you want first? Do you like touring? I'm assuming you do because the fans are so die hard and there's got to be. It's got to be so exhilarating to go out there and play your music. I mean that's, it's so. It's just, it's palpable like just inside of you and your drums and the guitars and the shredding. It's like. I mean, I'm not. Not saying you are Iron Maiden, but I've gone to see Iron Maiden so many times. And the best parts of the shows are when. When the. When the three guitarists are. Are just cutting up and the drummer's going off, you know, so. So it's like a stupid question. Do you like touring? And then also, what, What. What's your worst concert or touring experience or your, you know, do you have one?

[Mike Portnoy]

Well, I love touring. I love the fans. There's nothing more exciting than those three hours on stage that we play. And, you know, and our fans make it possible for us to play places like Wembley Stadium or Radio City. Musical and mammoth places without radio play. So thank God for these amazing fans. But I've had some, you know, had my share of Spinal Tap moments. Sure. I remember we were playing a gig in Munich, Germany, in the late 90s, and it was the end of the show, last song of the main set, and I guess I just bit off more than I could chew with a drum fill. I just thought I was going to pull off this invincible fill of 128th note. And all of a sudden I felt this cramp in my right arm. And I thought it was just a cramp. I looked down and the palm of my hand is facing upwards.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Oh, my gosh.

[Mike Portnoy]

I literally dislocated my wrist from just, I don't know, biting off more than I could chew with this drum fill. And my hand was facing upwards. So my drum tech literally had to bang my wrist into place, come up behind the drums with a bucket of ice. I had to put it in the bucket of ice, finish the show.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Def Leppard. You went deaf Leopard style.

[Mike Portnoy]

Exactly.

[Josh Adam Myers]

And.

[Mike Portnoy]

And then rushed right to the hospital and had to do the rest of the tour in a. In a brace. But, yeah, that was probably the. One of the worst experiences. And I had another experience like that in the mid-90s in Toronto where my back cramped up during the show and we had to stop the show because I was stuck. I couldn't move. And we had to see if there was any chiropractors in the audience and had to pull them out of the audience to come work on me backstage for 15 minutes.

[Josh Adam Myers]

How Rad is that to be the chiropractor? That's a huge. Like you said, your fans are fans. They aren't just like, yeah, I'm going to it. Like, I'm like. Like, I Like your music. I'll definitely go to a show. I would love to see you guys live. But it's like you said, dude, the people that like Dream Theater love. It's like the people that love Cannibal Corpse love it. And Rush, same thing. All the bands you can think of where the musicians are incredible. And so. And so to be that chiropractor.

[Mike Portnoy]

Yeah.

[Josh Adam Myers]

He's been waiting his whole moment.

[Mike Portnoy]

Yeah, exactly.

[Josh Adam Myers]

It's insane. I, I. Do you stay in touch with him ever? You know, Never seen him again.

[Mike Portnoy]

Yeah, I never saw him again. I don't think. I had to. I had to have a. I had to have root canal done in Greece once. Emergency root canal. And luckily we found a dentist that was a fan and was able to. To get me in and meet me and. And did all the root canal for free and everything. All he wanted was backstage passes to come to the show. And of course, we took care of that. But. Yeah, so when you're on the road, you come across these people that can sometimes be very helpful, helpful fans. You know, did the guy that.

[Josh Adam Myers]

The root canal guy goes, so why don't you tell me about. What was you thinking while you did. Imogen Words.

[Mike Portnoy]

Hold on.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Spit real quick. Okay. Yeah.

[Mike Portnoy]

I was having visions of Dustin Hoffman and Marathon man, you know, orange with my eyes, you know, peeled. In the hands of a family.

[Josh Adam Myers]

German. A Jew and a German.

[Mike Portnoy]

He was. Greece. It was in. He was in Greece. Yeah. Greek dentist.

[Josh Adam Myers]

You think he tried to feed you? He's like, no, please. All right, let's get to them. Let's get to the chunky song.

[Mike Portnoy]

I'll talk about the next song. Because this, the next song to me is. Is this is the crown jewel of this album.

[Josh Adam Myers]

This is why I think the song is. Are the albums on the list? Because, by the way, this record, we always go over this at the end. This record did not survive the 2020 re rank. This is.

[Mike Portnoy]

Oh, really?

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, it did not. This did not make it on the cut. Someone Saved My Life Tonight might be my favorite Elton John song, and it's only recently that it got bumped up to that top thing. I. I mean, just. Even just the words, the way that he's like, you know, damn it. Like, I love those. Like, it's. I'm not smart enough to describe the feeling that I get while listening to this song, but it really is. It's just perfect thoughts. What do you want to add?

[Mike Portnoy]

Absolute masterpiece. One of the greatest songs Elton and Bernie ever wrote. The thing about Elton's writing, man, I just love his sense of melody and chord progressions. He always. He writes these songs with these incredible progressions. You know, you listen to Goodbye Ayl Brick Road or Funeral For a Friend, you know, he. The key changes and the melodies and the progressions. And this song is a perfect example of that. The ascending chromatic progression, like, if you analyze the song structure to this, the chord progressions is constantly ascending, chromatically, building, building, building. And it's just a perfectly written song. And I got to give a lot of props, not only on this song, but there's several on this album. The drummer, Nigel Olson, one of the most underrated rock drummers of the 70s. Absolute. The most tasty, tasteful drummer. And he always plays the perfect thing for the song and finds the perfect place to enter. This song is a great example. The whole first half of the song, he's just playing time on the cymbals. The first verse, first chorus, second verse. He doesn't enter till the B section of the second verse. The drums don't even come in with a groove till halfway through the second verse, which is such a unorthodox place to enter. You know, I. If I was playing this song, I may have entered on the first chorus or whatever that. But he comes in halfway through the second verse, like, who the fuck does that? And he does it. He does this later on in the album as well. The song that closes the album, Curtains. Same thing. But he had this incredible knack for when to enter a song and is such a tasty drummer, and I love that. This song also, once again, I'm bringing up Dream Theaters Falling into Infinity album. We talked about the album artwork. We talked about the compromises with the label with that album. But also on that album is a song called Anna Lee, where some of us like to call Analy. But that was. It was ripped off specifically from Someone Saved My Life Tonight, the beginning, Bob, direct, rip off. And Elton John was a big influence on Derek Sherinian, our Kiwa player, during that period of the band. And this song was definitely a blatant homage. Love it. Annalie was a blatant homage to Someone Saved My Life.

[Josh Adam Myers]

I love it. I love it. So. So the story, Jeremiah, if you don't know this, the song deals with a time in Elton's life when he was going to get married to a woman named Linda Woodrow.

[Mike Portnoy]

A woman, mind you.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's. That's the thing is it's, you know, he was gay, and I think he was already pretty much out or was He. Was he out to the world or not? Sure. Probably to his friends for sure. Because they were like, what are you. They're like, what are you doing? You like dick? You like dick and butt, dude? You don't like vagina titties? Yeah, dude. And I love it. I love how Adam, the guy that collects the notes, goes, he was gay, so that would have been a big mistake. Like in 91. Elton explained, I was gonna get married once when I was younger, and I went out and got drunk with Long John Baldry. Who is he? I think. No, I think he was the manager of the. Of Queen that they. That screwed them over. Morty said that. That he kept bringing up that guy's name. We were talking.

[Mike Portnoy]

Maybe that's the guy that Death on Two Legs was written about.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Probably. Yes. Yes. And Bernie and John said I shouldn't get married. I knew he was right, but I didn't know how to get out of it. So I got drunk and went home and said, I'm not getting married. Sugar Bear in the lyrics refers to Long John Baldry, who recalls. Apparently I gave Elton some very good advice when he was in a pickle, and he wrote a song about it. But I still can't figure out what the song is about. Linda was devastated. It says also, he tried to kill himself. That's another thing, too. But it was like, really? Show me. Like, it wasn't like he put his head in the oven, but he left the windows open. Like, I. I'm. I just remember hearing Morty say a bunch of stuff about that. So. So, yeah, that is. You know, despite the epiphany and the song, the first time Elton got married, he wasn't. It was. It was to a woman. So he did get married.

[Mike Portnoy]

Same with Bowie. David Bowie married Angie Bowie back in the 70s. And Freddie Mercury also was, I think married or had a longtime girlfriend back then. So I guess that was the thing. If you were gay, you weren't. If you weren't out of the closet yet or maybe bisexual. But both Elton Bowie and Freddie Mercury, all three of them are examples that. That had that situation.

[Josh Adam Myers]

It's called a mustache. Right to the world. Beard. Beard. It's a beard. It's a beard. Yeah, I. I get it. You know what I mean? Like, dude, I'm not gonna name names, but there's comedians that we know. Well, no, I think. Do we talk about it and maybe we should cut this part. But like, with Swarty, like. Like, he. He can't. You know, he's. He's Gay. And he talks about it and on stage, but he's like. He still gets weird because it's like fans, straight fans get like, oh, like. And it just. It's still just mind blowing. No, in the 70s, way different than now. But yeah, dude, this might be. I don't know. This might be. Oh, oh, here's a good question. This is a really good question I should ask you. So he got the advice from. From Big John. What is. Is there a moment, a certain type of state of mind, whatever you were in, where you got. What's the best advice that you ever got, Mike?

[Mike Portnoy]

Well, well, I think it was. It wasn't advice I got, but I think Rush went through a similar situation that Dream Theater went through before. They, you know, after Caress of Steel, they almost broke up because of the industry pressures, and then they told them to fuck off and they made 2112 and they were revitalized. Same. It wasn't direct advice, but it was a good leading by example for Dream Theater. When we went through this falling into infinity period and almost broke up and we're being controlled by the label, we kind of took that Rush example and told everybody to fuck off, let us make the record we want to make. And we ended up making Scenes for Memory, which ended up becoming probably one of our biggest records. So I think that was. That was a good lesson that we learned about sticking to your guns and, you know, really, you know, follow your heart and don't. Don't be pushed around by the powers that be in this crazy industry.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Totally into that because I think it's very connected to one of the. The facts that Adam wrote here about the fact that it was 6 minutes and 45 seconds long.

[Mike Portnoy]

The track was the only single on the album.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, the. Twice as long as a typical single at that time. But John refused to let it be edited down and.

[Mike Portnoy]

But it was a little different back then. Think look at some of the other hits from around 75. You had Bohemian Rhapsody, which was the longest song on that album. You had Carry On, Wayward Son. You had, you know, Boston had like, long time and, you know, so there were bands that were pushing the envelope and were getting away with longer singles back then. You know, look at, like, if you see a list of the top 10 greatest radio tracks of all time, you'll see Layla Freebird, Stairway to Heaven, you're gonna get all those. The big long songs. Hey Jude. So, you know, certain artists with balls would put out these long songs as singles and get away with it.

[Josh Adam Myers]

The artists just have the fight with the record label that was trying to push.

[Mike Portnoy]

Well, yeah, you had to have that kind of power to do that, you know?

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, yeah. Yep, yep, yep, yep. I love it. It's such a great song. And then the record, you know.

[Mike Portnoy]

Well, then we have side, too, because back then it was. It was side one and side two.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Side two, side. Gotta get me a meal ticket. It's about trying to make it in the music industry again, about being hungry.

[Mike Portnoy]

This was one of my favorite tracks on the album when I was a kid. This was, like, the rocker on the album. And he had his previous hits on, like, the album before. On Caribou, he had. The Back was a big single, and Saturday Night's all right for Fighting was a big single off of Goodbye Albrecht Road. So this was in that vein. It's almost the same. Same groove and tempo as Saturday Night or Back or. Or Love Lies Bleeding from Goodbye Elbrook Road. So I think this was, like, modeled after, you know, those rockers. And like I said earlier, you know, it was a way to model side A and side B. You know, you have an opening track for each side. This was a great opening track for side B coming out of the gates of the rocker. And, yeah, this was one of my favorites when I was a kid, just because I loved the back and I love Saturday Nights. All right, for Fighting. I just fell into that. That category for this is kind of like that song for this album.

[Josh Adam Myers]

What about Better Off Dead? What do you think about Better Off Dead? I mean, according to Barry. But who wrote Barry Toberman biography out? And this song was inspired by his and Bernie's experience in the West End. After recording at the Dick James studio late into the night, they'd go to a burger bar where some of the clientele looked Better Off Dead. So. And then, of course, there's a movie named after this with John Cusack. We should get him on the podcast. Why have we got John Cusack?

[Mike Portnoy]

Come on, he's a big music fan. He loves Beastie Boys. He loves, you know.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Are you serious?

[Mike Portnoy]

Yeah, I'm pretty sure if you see the Beastie Boys movie of them at Madison Square Garden, there's footage of him in the audience rapping every line.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Dude. Because we've got. We've got the. The Sergeant Pepper of Beastie Boys coming up.

[Mike Portnoy]

I wanted that one.

[Josh Adam Myers]

But you're doing.

[Mike Portnoy]

Yeah. I'm not gonna get greedy. I'm not gonna get greedy.

[Josh Adam Myers]

You're coming back, dude. Don't worry, boo. You're. You're. You're Code Red. Your code Red on the Kagan scale. You're coming back, dude.

[Mike Portnoy]

Yeah, John Cusack. I just saw a video. Oh, may. It was him or Ben Stiller. I think it was both of them in this Beasties Boy movies. Ben Stiller and John Cusack were both famously in this Beastie Boys movie, if I'm remembering correctly.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Jer, do the research. Googling. Better off dead. You know, I. We wrote this question and I don't, it's. I don't want to show disrespect to the people that, that we're going to talk about this, but it's like not to be too on the nose, but you have been a ringer brought in when there are vacancies in bands. And you know, we're friends with Josh Freeze. He's been on the show a few times and he had to take a big role stepping in to fill in for Taylor for playing with, with Foo Fighters. And like, so not even so much what it's like when somebody passes away, but how does that work with filling in? Like when you did with Avenge Sevenfold, like, how do you, you know, like, what's it like walking into that situation?

[Mike Portnoy]

Well, I've had two situations filling in for drummers that passed. One was with Avenged Sevenfold and one was with Twisted Sister. And in both of those cases, I was called to come in and fill the shoes of their drummers that passed away tragically. And in both of those cases, I'm being hired to do a job in a service. I'm not coming in there to push myself or my style on these bands with their music. I'm coming in there to pay respects to their fallen drummer. So in the case of Avenged and Twisted Sister, I learned the songs as closely as possible to pay respects to those drummers, the Rev and AJ Pirro, respectively. And that was my gig. That was my job. And I wasn't there to give opinions about the set list or try to, you know, play songs my way. And, and I assume it's similar with Josh with the Foo Fighters or anybody else that's been called into a situation like that. And then I've had other situations where I've been called in for one off gigs. I've done one off gigs with Stone Sour, Overkill, Fates Warning, Humphries McGee, all kinds of different bands. Where in those cases, if it's a one off, obviously you. It's harder to spend so much time to learn a whole set of songs exact. If you're just doing a one off. You know, with Twisted or Avenged, it's for a long world tour you got to really put in the work and the dedication. Whereas with these one offs you got to kind of sometimes get in there at short notice and just do the best you can. But because I'm such a big music fan and lover, in the case of like Avenged or Twisted, I knew most of those songs already from being a fan of those bands. So that, that definitely helps with the gig, you know, when you. When you know some of the songs to begin with.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah. What's. What's been one that like you know, not messy like the. The hardest to jump into. And it's not even about the death of the situation, but it's just like where you were like all right. I either you don't know the songs or. And you really had to like was there ones where you were like going in you were like, I hope this goes well.

[Mike Portnoy]

Well, the hardest part drumming of any fill in gig I've done was probably with. With the band Fates Warning. Which are. They're old, old friends of mine. We've been friends for almost 40 years at this point and they're. They toured with Dream Theater. Very similar stylistically Retreater. But their drummer that I was filling in for, Mark Zonder, had a very specific style. And you know, it's one thing if I'm going to go up and play a Twisted Sister song, you know, it's. It's a little more of a basic style but. But Mark Zonder style of Fates Warning was very specific and very stylized that it's hard to fake. And a lot of their fans even picked up with the way. Some of. Some of the times I had to simplify some of the things just to just to be able to get through the gig, you know, as a one off gig, you know, learning a whole set list for a one time thing is it's a little harder to. I'm not a sight reader or somebody can write chart out the parts like the way somebody like Kenny Arnoff could. I'm just not that kind of a guy. So I would say the gig with Fates was probably the most challenging in terms of learning drum parts. But once again, once again I knew the songs for the most part. So I just played the songs rather than playing the drummers parts.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Have you ever had done a gig where you're just like cheesing through it because you're so excited, you're having so much fun? Like maybe it's just from the excitement of Like, I can't believe I'm playing with these people. Or it's just like Twist. Yeah.

[Mike Portnoy]

Once I started playing with Twisted, I mean, there's pictures of me in my high school yearbook wearing Twisted Sister shirts because I grew up on Long island in the 70s and early 80s when they were the low, you know, the. The hottest band on Long Island. Playing the club circuit. It was way before all the mtv, you know, hits. So it's getting on stage to be able to be hearing, you know, it's a long way to the top if you want to. Rock and roll is the. The intro music that they, you know, were using in the club days in the 70s. Hearing that and then hearing. Would you please welcome Twist. Twisted Sister, you know, the 17 year old kid in me was like, here we go. Yeah, Yeah.

[Josh Adam Myers]

I can imagine. All right, let's get through these last couple writing. It's about the process of writing thoughts.

[Mike Portnoy]

Yeah, this is a throwaway. This is one of the ones that he didn't revisit in 2005 when they redid it. This one's a little too Jimmy Buffett for me. I don't know. But that brings us to the last two. The last two are pretty much the bread and butter of this album. Someone say My Life Tonight is the masterpiece on the album. But these last two. We All Fall In Love Sometimes and Curtains, basically it's chopped into two songs, but if you're listening to it, it's one 10 minute song broken up into two. And I don't know if you want to go one at a time, but as far as I.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Let's do, let's do, let's, let's get. Give them each the respect they deserve. We all fall in love sometimes I don't know if I have any. This is about. This is one of the most obscure songs off the record. It's one of the most memorable though. Speaking in 2013, Elton said, I cry when I sing this song. Because I was in love with Bernie. Yeah. Because he's the person I was looking for my entire life. My. My little soulmate. We come so far and we were still very naive. I was gay by that time. He was married, but he was person that more than anything I loved in the relationship we had was so odd because it was not tied to the hip. Thank God I wasn't tied to the hip because we wouldn't have lasted that relationship is most important relationship of my entire life. You think, you think it's the most important relationship in your entire life? You've made billions of dollars together. Yeah. I mean, that's. That's insane. Just the way I told that to somebody recently. I don't know where we were talking about it, but I said something about, oh, because we were talking about the Internet and how easy it is to find people now. And it's just like he opened up a magazine and there it was, and he reached out, and next thing you know, you have Candle in the Wind. I mean, that's crazy. That's crazy.

[Mike Portnoy]

Yeah.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah. I mean, your thoughts, obviously, you. You said it better than. Than I could have, but it's like talking about these closers. But what do you. What do you think, you know, and how do you want to, you know, to dig into these?

[Mike Portnoy]

I. I think this we all love. Fall In Love sometimes is. Is as beautiful as Someone Saved My Life Tonight. It's very similar the way that side one and side two both open with rockers, side one and side two both closed with ballads. So it's similar placement in the. In the track listing as Someone Saved My Life Tonight closing the A side, this is this, and Curtains are closing the B side. But it's a very similar type of song. Beautiful chords, beautiful melodies, beautiful drumming by Nigel Olson. Once again, another brilliant entrance when he chooses to enter the song. And the thing about Nigel's drumming, this song and Curtains talk about drummers that play without click tracks. I mean, this is a perfect example. Albums like this are not made anymore. Nigel is so behind the beat and pulling back the tempo. Every time the chorus kicks in for this song, you could feel. Feel the tempo coming back. You know, you hear drummers like Charlie Watts or Stuart Copeland that would push the beat and get ahead of the beat. Nigel Olson was one of the greatest drummers in pulling back the beat, pulling back the tempo, playing behind the beat. And this song and Curtains, the two that close this album, are great examples of that. Just really tasteful playing for the song. Such amazing drumming, so. Also has a great, great guitar solo by Davey Johnston. But this. And I don't know if you want to go right into Curtains, but this connects into Curtains and.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, it does.

[Mike Portnoy]

It's absolutely beautiful. Curtains to me, is probably Elton John's unsung masterpiece. I think it's one of his greatest songs that's so forgotten about because it's almost like a coda. Not only do we all fall in love, it's almost like a coda for the entire album. And I don't know if you know the musical term coda, but it's Almost like another song to trail off and become like the end vamp.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah.

[Mike Portnoy]

To not only the song that precedes it, but to the entire album that precedes it. And Curtains is just a lesson in musical restraint. It's almost like the whole song is just two chords back and forth, back and forth, just building, building, building, building. The anticipation of when Nigel's going to enter with those drums, when the melody is going to develop. This whole song is just a lesson in musical restraint. And the build and the anticipation is one. It's just one of my favorite forgotten songs of Elton's. It's just a perfect, perfect closer to this incredible album.

[Josh Adam Myers]

You ready to hear something that might blow your mind? Elton describes this song as crap.

[Mike Portnoy]

Wow.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Wow. I don't know where he got says in Susan Black's Elton. Elton. Sorry. I just queef Elton John his own words.

[Mike Portnoy]

Some people's garbage or other people's, you know, disagree.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, obviously. I mean, you're. Yeah, I. I mean, it doesn't say why it says Curt. Go ahead, go ahead.

[Mike Portnoy]

There's not much to it musically. Musically, like I just said, it's just almost two chords over and over, so maybe that's why he didn't feel there was much there. But to me, it was about the orchestration of the rest of the band members. I'm shocked to hear that, though, because to me, this is the. This is like one of those songs, like, if he meets an Elton John fan in the street and he's a real Elton John fan, he's gonna love this song. He's gonna know. He's gonna know about Curtains, you know? Yeah, that's. It's like one of those ones that, like, if you're. If you're a. A hardcore fan, you're gonna know about D. Murray's bass playing, you're gonna know about Ray Cooper's percussion playing, and. And you're gonna know about Curtains. You know, these are the elements that were. Are so critical and crucial to what makes Elton and Bernie so amazing.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, I. I mean, I think it's, you know, it's probably one of them, if not my. I mean, I love Somebody Saved My Life Tonight so much. So that's my favorite song, obviously. But like Curtains, the ending is what really made me go. Because I was just so set on. Yeah, the album's okay. I mean, why is it on here? I go, I guess it's Somebody Saved my Life. Ah. Maybe it's the story. And then you get to the ending and you get These two incredible songs. It's nutty that he would describe it as crap, but like, I think you really gave a good option of probably why. So my questions for you, and I'm just going to backtrack to. We all fall in love sometimes. So it's about keeping going. The desire with being in love. And a lot of times in love, people play plateau. What keeps you in love with music?

[Mike Portnoy]

I'm just always going to be a fan. No matter what I'm doing, no matter how successful I get with my personal career, I'm still that 13 year old kid listening to Kiss albums in my bedroom back in 1976. It's just, I'll never not be that. So music still inspires me. And it doesn't matter if it's a classic from the 60s or 70s like Elton or Pink Floyd or the who or anybody else we're talking about here or modern bands like Radiohead or Ben Folds Five or, or you know, Coldplay or whatever. There's so many modern bands that move me as well and, and make music and albums that move me. I, I, I'm just addicted to music. It really.

[Josh Adam Myers]

What about, but what about creating? I mean like more like. Yeah, yeah. What it keeps thinking is. Yeah, like what keeps you going? You've done so much. You've, you guys, you said your career has been 40 years at this point. I mean, what keeps you, Is it the exploring? Is it because I feel like you figured it out. You're a master of your, of your craft.

[Mike Portnoy]

It's. I surround myself with musicians that inspire me. I mean, I spent 25 years in dream Theater the first round. Then I came back and now we're, you know, celebrating our 40th anniversary. But just coming back to these guys after being away, that inspires me. When we're making this latest album, Parasomnia, you know, it is the band's 16th album, but it's very inspired. We are inspired by each other. You know, we hadn't written together in a while, so that really inspired us. Being back together, knowing that the fans are going to be excited by this lineup being back together. You know, the fan base, the fan base's anticipation, that is a big part of it. The years I was out of Dream Theater, I was out for all those years and doing dozens and dozens of different bands, working with everybody from Paul Gilbert to Billy Sheehan to Richie Katson to Steve Morse and to, you know, the guys in Megadeth and Testament in the thrash band and doing classic rock bands with the music with The Winery Dogs. Each one of those bands had different lineups of different musicians. That inspired me and invigorated me to be able to write music with Steve Morse. You know, to me, that was a dream come true being a Dregs fan. So, yeah, to me, that's what keeps me going. You know, I'm 40 years into my career professionally, but it's, it's a cross between the musicians I work with and the fans that support it. Those are the two elements that just keep me going.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, totally. I was a perfect way to explain it because I was trying to. It's. You get to a certain place and, you know, it's. It's like you see some of these comedians or even actors and, or you see someone like, like Daniel Day Lewis, who is such a master of his craft, and then he stops and you're like, but God, you know, like, just.

[Mike Portnoy]

Announced today he's coming back after a seven year layover. Oh, just announced. He really? Yeah, his, his son is directing a film, so he agreed to act in it. So he's coming out of retirement. Just.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, but I want to, I want to.

[Mike Portnoy]

There Will Be Blood. Yeah.

[Josh Adam Myers]

I just watched Gangs in New York when I was on the road in, in Tulsa, and I was like, it was the best part of the whole goddamn trip, you know, and, and it's, it's one of those things where you're like, why would you stop? You know? But I guess at a certain point for someone like him, it's like he's just done it. And also he like probably lives as those characters. And that's got to be taxing on him to like suddenly, you know, to be Abraham Lincoln for four months, you know.

[Mike Portnoy]

But to me, there's still, there's always little goals. You know, you look at Daniel Day Lewis, okay, he worked with Scorsese, he worked with P.T. anderson, you know, and I feel like that, like I've worked with this producer, I've worked at that artwork guy, or I've played this venue, I've played Madison Square Garden, I've played Wembley arena, played the Buddha Cut in Japan. So it's these milestones that keep me going. Like, I still never played Royal Albert hall in, in London, you know, or there's a, you know, I never played National Coliseum on Long island, which is my hometown. So there's like these little, little benchmarks that still keep you going and keep, keep you to wanting more, to still like, try to achieve that little goal, you know?

[Josh Adam Myers]

Do you guys talk about it? So, like, you Said the Nassau Coliseum. I mean, do you guys. Do you say to them, like, hey, why don't we throw with a little skadoodle in Long Island?

[Mike Portnoy]

Like, when is this airing? Is. Is. Do you know when this is airing?

[Josh Adam Myers]

This is. This is. Jer. When does this one come out? Yeah.

[Mike Portnoy]

By the time this airs, our US Tour for the fall will be announced, and we're playing Nassau Coliseum for the first time. There you go. I mean, that's where I saw everybody from Pink Floyd to the stones to Paul McCartney to kiss when I was a kid. So it's these little benchmarks, you know, that keep you going. Like, we've never played there after 40 years, and now we finally are, you know, congratulations, dude. It's things like that that just keep you inspired, you know?

[Josh Adam Myers]

I mean, I. I'll pull it up right here. I look at it every day when the Rock Venues 9:30 Club in Washington, D.C. is like, I, me and Jeremiah have seen a million bands there. Exactly. I sold it out, you know, with the help of the D.C. improv. And. And. But we. The second I did that, it's like. And we forget. We get so caught up in our of life, you know, we hold on to the. The. The. To the losses more than we hold on to the wins. And so, you know, and if you would have told me as a little kid, I would have played the 9:30 club, or like, you would have told the little kid listening to Kiss records, hey, that Coliseum that you're seeing Pink Floyd at, you're gonna play here. It's. That's amazing, man. So, so congrats. And then this is a weird way to end before we do our final questions, but being curtains, this is. Maybe this is too on the nose. It's the last song we've asked this question. A lot of people, what song would you want played at your funeral?

[Mike Portnoy]

Oh, wow. Well, we're talking Elton. I got, you know, I gotta say Funeral for a Friend by Elton John, opening track off of Goodbye Elbrook Road, which Dream Theater covered on our EP A Change of Seasons. There's a cover of us doing Love Lies Bleeding and Funeral for a Friend. And I mean, that. That's the answer I have to give at this moment, just because we're talking Elton. Yeah, and it happens to be one of my favorite songs of all time as well, so I have to go with that one.

[Josh Adam Myers]

But if not Crazy by Buck Cherry. Huh?

[Mike Portnoy]

Crazy. Crazy Horses by the Osmonds.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Dude, this was so great. This is the code red on the Kagan scale. Is well deserved. You will be coming back, I hope. Man, we really had a blast. Before we do the final. The final questions. Promote. Anything you want to promote. You mentioned the tour, but album, anything, just go ahead and just drop it here. We'll say it at the beginning too.

[Mike Portnoy]

Okay? Just. I'm in the middle of a year and a half tour cycle with Dream Theater started October of last year and it's going to go till spring of next year. We've just been touring the world. South America, Europe, North America. We've already done all three of those markets. And now we're about to head back to Europe for the summer, doing all the metal festivals, playing with everybody from. From Maiden to Priest to Scorpions to Muse. You know, it's just the metal festivals over there all summer long are just so awesome. So we'll be doing that throughout June and July as well as playing some cool shows of our own. Another Bucket list venue, we're playing at Pompeii where Pink Floyd played it in 50 years ago. So once again, another venue bucket list for Dream Theater that we're doing this summer. And then in the fall, we have our next North American leg in September and October, which will be playing our new album Parasomnia in its entirety, as well as another set of catalog classics. And we'll be going on the Parasomnia tour through spring of next year. And it's just. It's my first time back with the band in a while and, you know, the. The reception from the fans on me coming back and the reunion of this lineup has just been so overwhelming and so emotional each and every show. It's just been so great.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Oh, I bet, man, I'm definitely gonna come to one of the shows. So are you playing all these incredible festivals and you couldn't have said it better. Do the Europeans, they know and they love music differently than. Than Americans do, You know, like, I'd much rather go to a festival in Europe than go to Coachella, regardless of the lineup. It's just if you really want to be around music fans, who are you most excited to be on the same bill with? Is there a band that you're like, oh, man, I know you had mentioned Muse, but I'm assuming you might have played with them before or like, actually.

[Mike Portnoy]

They'Re of the ones that we haven't played with before. We've. We've played with Maiden many times. We've, you know, we've toured with Megadeth and, you know, the list goes on and on. Yes. And all these bands but yeah, playing. Playing with Muse is going to be really cool. Playing with with Judas Priest is going to be cool too. And Andy Sne, the guy who's been playing guitar for Glenn Tifton, he actually mixed our latest album so it'll be great to see him. He's part of the Dream Theater family. Extended family. But yeah, playing with Priest will be great. We have a show with Aveng which will be interesting being, you know, I played with them for a while.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah.

[Mike Portnoy]

But every one of these festivals are going to be amazing. I. I love getting to hang with all the bands because I'm friends with so many and so many people in other bands and Dream Theater a lot of time does these evening with tours or just us for three hours a night. So when we get to do these festivals and I get to hang and play with so many other bands that I'm friends with, it's. It's such a blast and I love it.

[Josh Adam Myers]

I can't agree with you more. I'm. I'm so happy for you, man. And I'm so happy you came on. We asked these questions to everybody. Favorite song on the record on Captain Fantastic. Captain Fantastical.

[Mike Portnoy]

It has to. I mean as much as I have love for Curtains, as we've already talked about, Someone Saved My Life Tonight is just one of the best written songs of all time. It's the melody and the progression is just a masterpiece. So I'd have to go with that.

[Josh Adam Myers]

It is. Is there anything that you skip over the.

[Mike Portnoy]

The writing and what was Curtains and. And not curtains. Excuse me. Writing and. And Bitter Fingers or Take the wheels. Tell me when the wheels. I mean those are. Those to me are the throwaway tracks, to be honest.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Okay. Can you to this record?

[Mike Portnoy]

Well, yeah, apparently you can bisexually as well. To either a man or a woman. Apparently. I don't know. There's not. There's not much. I don't know.

[Josh Adam Myers]

It's not a record.

[Mike Portnoy]

Yeah.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Do you think. Can you. Can you. If what? Right. Because knowing your music. What if. What is the Dream Theater album? You think that you could to. If you had. I mean it must be odd for you because you know what's going on and you know we were like really. We were hungry that day.

[Mike Portnoy]

Well, the songs were. Are so long. You better have stamina if you're gonna to a Dream Theater song or album. I mean, you know, the albums are made up of 1520 minute songs so you better not be a one pump wonder.

[Josh Adam Myers]

I don't even know if I could at this age of 45. I don't think I can make it through the, the like track two or three maybe you wouldn't even get to the first verse.

[Mike Portnoy]

You wouldn't even get to the vocals.

[Josh Adam Myers]

It's like before I, I, I want to say this because Morty wrote this to me. He said and I. Before we have you sum up the record record. He wanted me to say, I think an important, well, two things. He wants to give a shout out to Richie Coen who is the guitar player in the winery Dogs right with you. And he believes he's from Philadelphia. So you can say speaking of. Oh, we didn't talk about Philadelphia fina. But Morty wants to give a shout out to your boy.

[Mike Portnoy]

That's a bonus track anyway. It wasn't on the original.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Which a great song too. And then it says I think it's important about this record is that it really shows the integrity of the partnership. The lyrics and the musicality are not patronizing to the audience. The mission statement of writing about the early days and chronological fashion, it's still being a huge success is a testament to their progress. Even now, Elton still votes a certain amount of time, a certain amount of time live. To him playing with his band as a musician, which a lot of other artists might have stopped doing just to be performing their hits. Elton is also a big proponent of showcasing new talent and under represented talent. That's an admirable quality in a legacy musician who doesn't really need to do that. Yeah, he's, he's something else, man. What would be your elevator pitch, Mike, to get someone to, to listen to this record? How do you sum it up?

[Mike Portnoy]

Well, it's my second favorite of his. That's not much, that's not much of a sales pitch because Goodbye Elbr Road is to me, you know, from start to finish, a masterpiece. This one has its, its ebb and flow. It's, it's. But you know, the highs on this album are amazing and I think it's just a great, great time capsule for 1975 when, when Elton was just sitting on top of the world and you know, he was the pinball wizard with the who and he was whatever gets you through the night with John Lennon. And you know, he was just sitting on top of the world at this place and time and it was the last album of this, of this incredible band. And to me it goes beyond just Elton and Bernie, you know, that the band was so important for this album and the ones that preceded it. So, so it's my second favorite Elton album, and that's saying a lot, being he's been doing this for almost 60 years at this point.

[Josh Adam Myers]

It really is, you know, I don't know. Would you say if you're an Elton fan, this is the first record to dive into. How would you set somebody off into an Elton run if they've never listened to Elton? What would you lead them into first?

[Mike Portnoy]

Goodbye Elbrook Road. That, to me, is. That to me, is his masterpiece from top to bottom. I mean, it has one of the most perfect albums, sides ever. I know we're not talking about that album, but the side one, Funeral for a Friend, Love Lies, Bleeding, Candle on the Wind, Benny and the Jets. Are you kidding me?

[Josh Adam Myers]

Go for it.

[Mike Portnoy]

I mean, and then keep going. Now we have the title track. You have Saturday Nights. All right. For fighting. So to me, Yellow Brick Road is. Is the quintessential Elton album. With this being the runner up.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, this is.

[Mike Portnoy]

This is like, you know. You know, you're talking Beatles, sergeant Pepper's the masterpiece. But then you got to also. Also talk about the White Album as a runner up. You're talking about Radiohead. You're gonna say, okay, computer. But then you can't dismiss the Bends. The Benz is the runner up, you know, and this is like that for. For. For Elton.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah. What would you. What would you say this is if you had to compare this to the Beatles? Is this their White Album?

[Mike Portnoy]

I think so. Because it's eclectic and not every song on it is great. Not every song in the White Album is great. You have Wild Honey Pie and. And Obla Diablada and some, you know, Maxwell's. No, no, Maxwell's. Abbey Road. But anyway, Abby Road's filled with these kind of clunkers, these in between songs. And I think this is similar in that respect. But the highs on this are. Are real high.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Yeah, they really are.

[Mike Portnoy]

So it's similar in that respect.

[Josh Adam Myers]

So wait, now what. What. What radio headwind record would you say this is?

[Mike Portnoy]

I would say this is the Bends. You know, the Ben.

[Josh Adam Myers]

This is the Benz.

[Mike Portnoy]

Oh, okay.

[Josh Adam Myers]

All right. I thought you were. I thought you were saying that. No, no, it's like. What is. What would be his kid.

[Mike Portnoy]

Do you prefer Kid A or do you prefer the best?

[Josh Adam Myers]

I think Kid A is A. I think Kid A is A. Is a better record, but I think, okay, Computer is their best record. Well, no, let me do. No, no, let me phrase that. I think. I think, okay, Computer is their best record, I think. And I think Kid A is Their best record. I think they. It's a mess, I think. I think Kid A is. Is a. I. I love okay Computer more than I love Kid A, but I think Kid A is like. Like, I would give somebody. I would give. Yeah, I think I would give somebody okay Computer to listen to first. If I was going to say listen. Well, really, the bends, I guess you got to go.

[Mike Portnoy]

The Benz is my number two for Radiohead, because the Benz is more like Revolver. Revolver was this group of amazing songs, and then they exploded experimentally with sergeant Pepper. It's the same with the Benz. Group of amazing songs. But then they got into the studio, experimentation with okay Computer. And then, in my opinion, they went too far with Kid A.

[Josh Adam Myers]

And.

[Mike Portnoy]

And to me, that's like. That's like their White album, to be honest. Really hit or miss moments. I would take it as the number two.

[Josh Adam Myers]

For me, I think King of Limbs is where they went too far. You're like, all right, guys, tone it down, dude. Like, second half of the record saves that, right? Dude, I was. I know we're so, like, off topic, but I was. I was DJing at a strip club during that time. When King of Limbs came out, it was a day shift. And. And I remember King of Limbs. I downloaded it and I put it on while girls were getting lap dances. And it's just like. I mean, you can't even. You can't mush a dick to that. There's no beat to it.

[Mike Portnoy]

I just see an interview with. I just saw an interview with somebody, and they were saying the most awkward thing in the world was their music being played in a strip club because it was just so.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Who.

[Mike Portnoy]

Oh, who was that? Damn it. Anyway, way.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Either way, you're coming back, dude. You're coming.

[Mike Portnoy]

There's some amazing albums on this. On this top 500 that I. I mean, and. And I'm not the Prague guy. I would, like. I could sit here and talk to you about the first Clash album or London Calling or. Or the. Or never mind the bollocks. I could talk to you about that or a Radiohead album. So it's. It's not. I'm just not the Prague guy, you know? Don't worry.

[Josh Adam Myers]

You're not coming on for anything that. That feels that way. We're going to make sure that you're back. You are. You are a code red on the Kagan scale. She's actually texting me right now. She's like, how'd it go? And I'm like, dude, this guy. I mean, he's a holocaust denier. He's crazy.

[Mike Portnoy]

Dude.

[Josh Adam Myers]

Thank you, buddy. This was great, man.

[Mike Portnoy]

Thank you, man. My pleasure, man. I hope you do it again.

[Josh Adam Myers]

What did I tell you? What I tell you? The one and only Mike Portnoy. Follow him on Instagram at Mike Portnoy Facebook Mike Port Portnoy official and check out Dream Theater and all of their new music. And for new music pick this week, brought to you in part by Distro, Kid is in the arms of Morpheus off of Dream Theater's latest album, Paris Somnia. And you can find links to the music on our website, the500podcast.com. And if you were in a band and you were directly influenced by one of these albums or artists and you want your music Featured on the 500 podcast, send your song to 500podcastgmail.com. All right, next week, Joy Division closer at 157. Dig into it, y' all. See you then. Sam it.

[Mike Portnoy]

Sam it.

[Josh Adam Myers]

The 500 keeping it flee see for the fleece nation on the 500 the 500 next chapter podcast.