← The Abigail Peugh Podcast
The Abigail Peugh Podcast
52. The Truth About Niching Down — Does It Really Boost Digital Product Sales?
00:24:18
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- [00:00]
Amanda
Foreign.
- [00:04]
Abigail Pugh
You're listening to an episode of the Abigail Pugh podcast with, you guessed it, Abigail Pugh. I'm an introverted mama who took my online business from zero to seven figures in 15 months, selling my own digital products on social media. And guess what? I did it all with my 3 year old daughter no less than 3ft away from me at all times. Now I'm bringing you everything I've learned about building a wildly profitable online business that supports your life while allowing you to truly live it. Get ready for raw, honest conversations with entrepreneurs making thousands per month selling their own digital products and people just like you who ditch self doubt to create the life they've always wanted. If you're ready to make more money, have more impact and still have time for the things that matter most, you're in the right place. Grab your sneakers, head out on your hot girl walk, and let's dive in. Today's guest is a perfect example of how niching down really can help you make so much more impact and money from your digital product. Amanda is an award winning chef turned online instructor. She founded Baking for Business, an online platform dedicated to helping bakers and food entrepreneurs worldwide create multiple income streams through baking and y'all. Her work has been featured by brands like Meta, Fox News, Dance Store, which is. It's just incredible. So Amanda, welcome to the show. I'm so excited to have you.
- [01:24]
Amanda
Abigail, I'm so excited to be here. Thank you so much for allowing me to come on your platform.
- [01:30]
Abigail Pugh
Yeah, absolutely. So I love to kind of just get these guest episodes started with kind of where you started with digital products, why you got into it, and then we'll dive into a little bit more of how you've really niched down, which I'm obsessed with your business and how you've niched it down. So let us know kind of just how you got started.
- [01:47]
Amanda
Yeah, absolutely. So around 2011, I went back to school for culinary arts. I wanted to change my passion. And after that I graduated from food service management. And what happened was shortly after managing a lot of other corporate bakeries like Great American Cookie Company and Sam's Club, I decided to create my own bakery from home. And a lot of people may not know because when you hear bakery, you usually think of walk in places that you can go. However, there is a law called cottage laws which allow people to operate baking businesses from their home. And so I started a cottage bakery which was amazing. And that really took off. And what I would do is I would go on Periscope and I would just share about my day. I would share my sales. It was really just a blessing. In my first taste of entrepreneurship, I had a lot of wonderful celebrity clients and corporate places that I was baking for. And as I would share all these things, other bakers would ask me, how is it that you're selling out? How did you do this? How do you market yourself? And for me, it always came natural because everything I learned from corporate America, I just applied in my small baking business. And I think sometimes that's one of the things with people. They don't approach a small business with that big box mindset. But to me, I marketed it just the same. And so as I started to share and answer those questions, I'm sure, as you know, they had more questions.
- [03:17]
Abigail Pugh
Yep.
- [03:18]
Amanda
And so eventually, those questions turned into coaching calls, coaching calls turned into a membership, and now it really is. Honestly, it is just a passion of mine. And so now I'm really blessed, through digital products, to share with other bakers and food entrepreneurs how they can start, grow, and run their own baking businesses if they desire.
- [03:40]
Abigail Pugh
I love that. Okay, so two questions. Number one, are you allowed to tell us any of the celebrities that you baked for?
- [03:46]
Amanda
Oh, yeah, absolutely.
- [03:47]
Abigail Pugh
I'm so curious.
- [03:48]
Amanda
Yes. I'm in Louisiana, so Lil Wayne, rapper.
- [03:53]
Abigail Pugh
Oh, my gosh.
- [03:54]
Amanda
Juvenile Brian McKnight, R&B singer Gina Neely, who's a Food Network personality. Oh, gosh. Marvin Sapp, Christian singer Lane Hardy, who won America's Got Talent. So, yeah, lots of cool people.
- [04:11]
Abigail Pugh
Oh, my gosh. And it's so funny that you brought up the cottage law. There was, like, this big drama about, like, in the TikTok world, in, like, the sourdough, some girl on TikTok started like, did you. Did you follow all that? She started, like, a TikTok, like, sourdough bakery. And people were convinced that she was only doing it to, like, show how to market it, to then sell a course on how to start a bakery. Because people in the local town were like, no way. Like, we. She doesn't even sell this. They all had different stories, and there was so much drama. And I'm like, I don't live in this town. I don't make my own sourdough. But the way I was addicted to this story. And so I knew exactly what a cottage law is because of that TikTok drama.
- [04:54]
Amanda
Yes. Yes, girl. That. That was definite drama. And I. I hate that for our I know. Community, because normally when people teach, they're teaching from a place of. I've accomplished this so let me. Let me bring you in. Yeah, but. But anyone can fact, check me. Google, check me there. There's nothing I teach, honey, that I have not done for myself.
- [05:16]
Abigail Pugh
I love it. And I feel like that's. That's the best way to do it. Obviously, like, there's some things, like if you're going to be a doctor and you're going to teach doctors, you got to. That's different. Right. And there's some niches where, like, people learn through school and then they go on to teach it. But I truly believe with digital products and personal branding, that teaching something that you have learned from experience, that's what people want. Like, they don't want to read a book and be like, okay, this is what the book says. They want someone who did something a year ago that they want to do now, where they're like, hey, what? What did you do? I know we have this option and this option. Which one did you choose and why? And kind of just being in someone's brain that has been where they're at and gotten to where they want to go. Now tell us a little bit about your first digital product, how the launch went and kind of. Yeah. How you kind of got started with the first one.
- [06:04]
Amanda
Yeah. So my first digital product was a pound cake recipe. And so a pound cake is a. A very popular Southern cake. They're a lot more dense than regular cakes. Again, I'm in Louisiana, so being down here in the South. But it was a recipe that my mom had gave me that I loved. And so that was kind of what I started the basis of my business from, because I started my business shortly after I had lost my mother. And so that was a recipe that was near and dear to me that I shared with a lot of people. People in my community loved it. And so my mom would always take alcohol and she would put it in the pound cakes, and that made it different. So when I started a baking business, what I know from marketing, I said, okay, I can use this as my unique value proposition. And so I started adding alcohol to all of my desserts. And that was my specialty, was alcohol infused. And so my first product, people were like, I have to have that cake. Like, what is that? It was a cake that I made with Hennessy cognac.
- [07:04]
Abigail Pugh
Oh, my gosh. And you're making me hungry.
- [07:07]
Amanda
I know, right? And so. And at first, you know, in the beginning, I'm like, wait a minute, I don't want to give y'all my damn recipe. Because, you know, like, yeah, it's mine. But once I started to share it and I saw people from all over, from other towns who were like, you know, I booked out this weekend and because of this I was able to buy groceries or my business was struggling. And now, like, my clients keep asking me for this. They loved it. That was when I was like, oh, wow, you know, the sun really is big enough for us all. And that was my first digital product. It was a alcohol infused pound cake recipe and I still sell them to this day.
- [07:48]
Abigail Pugh
Oh, my gosh. So you sold it mainly to other bakers who wanted to use the recipe. Oh, my gosh. I love that because I feel like so many times people are so scared to let other people in their industry learn from them.
- [08:00]
Amanda
Yeah.
- [08:00]
Abigail Pugh
And it's just like, I totally agree with you. Like, there's room for everyone. I truly, truly believe that. Now, what did you price it as? And do you remember how many you sold, like, in the first day? The first week? I feel I, like, know exactly how many I sold on my first day launching a digital product.
- [08:16]
Amanda
Oh, absolutely. That first week, I had made $5,000.
- [08:20]
Abigail Pugh
Oh, wow.
- [08:21]
Amanda
And it's gone on to, I mean, to, to make me lots of money. And I love it. But you're right, a lot of people do have those mindsets. As a baker myself, I would have had to make hundreds of cakes.
- [08:34]
Abigail Pugh
Oh, yeah.
- [08:35]
Amanda
Like, for a month in order to get that. So I had opened my cart, you know, I had launched it for a whole week. I in my cart. I always close on a Friday because I say, it's payday. I know you got money, so. And when, when I saw that 5k from just one recipe, I was like, oh, wow, this is really a blessing.
- [08:54]
Abigail Pugh
Yeah. What did you price it at when you first launched?
- [08:57]
Amanda
That one was 37, I believe.
- [08:59]
Abigail Pugh
Oh, awesome. For one recipe. Oh, my gosh, that's amazing.
- [09:01]
Amanda
One recipe. And I showed them different ways of how to make it, how to incorporate it, how to do the glaze. In the beginning, I didn't know much then about platforms, so I taught it in a free Facebook group, Gotcha. And they, they loved it.
- [09:18]
Abigail Pugh
That's amazing. It's just so wild how we, like, talk ourselves down on products and how we're like, it's not worth this. And then I meet you and you're like, I sold one recipe for 37 bucks. I'm like, I love it. It's worth it. If you provide the implementation. That's. I think that's the biggest thing right now with digital products is people don't just need education anymore. You can get education anywhere. Like now that we have ChatGPT, especially not saying it's all equal in good education. But there's so much out there for free that I think right now the biggest thing that sets digital products apart is the implementation. And I feel like that's why people had no problem spending $37 on one recipe. I also think it's different when you're marketing to other bakers who can then use that to help them grow their business, which I think is so genius that you kind of didn't just decide to market to everybody who wanted to bake. Like, you have a clear. Like, if you're a baker and you want to monetize with digital products, I'm your girl. So tell us a little bit about how you kind of decided on sticking with that niche and moving forward with it rather than kind of speaking to everyone.
- [10:21]
Amanda
Yeah, for me, it was just more so about my mission because like I stated, when I started my home baking business, it was at a time when I was living paycheck to paycheck. I had lost my mom in a fire. And so in losing her, we were actually homeless. So I literally, when I tell you I started with nothing. I literally started with nothing. And so I always tell people that. So for me, selling my baked goods in my community, that was just my passion. So again, you're right. Like, anyone can do a recipe maybe for fun, but I wanted to sell to other women who were like me, who were using their baking business as a way to bring money into their income, whether it be a stay at home mom who wanted extra income or another wife or something like that. So I never really had a desire to speak to. To speak to anyone else. Once I found my people, that was it. And I'm comfortable with that.
- [11:20]
Abigail Pugh
Yep. And I'm so sorry about your mom. That's so awful. I. It's so hard when life just like hits you with the hardest things. But I feel like so many times, so many businesses are built from rock bottom and it really just makes you kind of look at life and be like, am I going to just give up and stay at rock bottom or take this awful situation and turn it into something that like, I'm proud of. And like you said, every time someone makes this recipe, like a part of your mom lives on and a part of her recipe, and I just love that so, so much. Like, it means so much more. The impact that you're having means so much more when it comes from a place like this. So I love that. Thank you for sharing that with us. Okay, so you launched your first digital product, and then after that I feel like it kind of turned into something bigger with like a school and online stuff, just like a lot going on. Tell us kind of the journey that you took from that first one to what it has turned into now. Because I feel like a lot of people think that they need to start their digital product business with like their bread and butter main offer, the one that's gonna be like the. The thing they're known for. And I actually don't recommend that. I recommend spending a year just like putting out offers that you're excited about and trying and testing and seeing what you're good at, what your audience responds to, and then kind of figuring out what your main thing is going to be from there. So tell us a little bit about how you got to where you're on out from. A pound cake recipe like, this is incredible.
- [12:48]
Amanda
Yeah, absolutely. I totally agree with you 100%, Abigail. And one of the things I always tell my students is that, you know, we're in business to serve others. And sometimes that serving comes from looking, watching, and learning. And so as people bake their recipes, they would share pictures, they would share photos and maybe the box, things like that. And my mind starts going off again. Coming from the corporate world, so wanting to pour love into people, I'm like, okay, you could have used a better box. You could have branded a little better. You might want to work on your photography. All these different things, like your label, like, this is a representation. Then I started noticing that, okay, people really do need more business support because I can give you an amazing recipe, but if you post it, even if you nail the recipe and it tastes delicious, if you do not know how to market the recipe or market the product, probably because you're struggling with marketing yourself, then I know that there's a lot more underlining conditions. And so I would pay attention to things like that. And that's when it more so became business for me because I love bacon. As creatives, we're always in our thing. So we love our thing, we're doing our thing. But if you're not doing your thing to the best of your ability, then I'm looking for how can you improve. And so as I would give them feedback, I noticed that a lot of those things were the back end again, the business portion. And I started off with a membership which I had with a partner, priced myself extremely low, as we love to do right as we love to do. We struggled for five years to grow it. And then I said, you know what? I know this thing has potential. And I was afraid to leave and I was scared. But after five years, I left with nothing. And I started all over the partnership. I left the partnership with absolutely nothing, with zero. And I started all over again. And I said, I can do this. And so January 16, 2021, I launched baking for Business and I created a membership. And I said, I don't just want to be like your recipe girl. I want to grow with you, I want to check in with you, I want to talk to you. I want feedb. I want you to show me pictures of what you're doing. Like, I'm really. I'm really in love and passionate about my students. I was like, I need more of that personal connection. The membership took off and it's amazing. Now we're at over 400 members in multiple countries. And it's something that I've just been growing ever since. But it came from looking at how they use the recipe, seeing what it was that they needed, and answering their need versus just, well, let me just write more and more recipes.
- [15:29]
Abigail Pugh
Absolutely. And I think it's so important too, to kind of realize that when you launch your first digital product, right. Like, you're essentially always creating more problems for your ideal customer. And not in a bad way, because people figure one thing out and then they're ready for the next step. Right. And so it gives you the opportunity to say, okay, hey, I saw that people made this recipe. It looks, you know, it looks like they made it perfectly, but their photography was awful. And they have no freebie. They have no way. An easy way for people to sign up to get it. Like, there's just so many other things going on. So that first digital product is such a good way to like, it's really like market research, honestly, to see what are people struggling with when they take this recipe, what are they going to do with it, how are they going to market it? So I love that you turned that kind of into your entire business. Now, is your membership your main offer right now?
- [16:17]
Amanda
Yes, my membership is my. My main offer right now at the moment. And then I also have other standalone courses that are equally important. Like, now I teach my students, you know, how to create their own digital products so they can have some of the same success I have. But at the core, for me, it's all about helping them grow their business.
- [16:37]
Abigail Pugh
I love that. What's the pricing on your membership?
- [16:39]
Amanda
The membership is 37amonth.
- [16:41]
Abigail Pugh
Oh, that's awesome. That's great. I love that you also moved into teaching them even more niche, like teaching bakers how to create and sell their own digital product. Because I am a firm believer that any niche can create a digital product. And I know some of them are, like, harder than others, of course, but I truly believe that, like, there's something digital that you can create in your business to help bring in more revenue without necessarily trading a ton of your time. Like, I don't like when people say you don't trade time for money with digital products. Because I'm like, you're still working.
- [17:14]
Amanda
Yeah.
- [17:15]
Abigail Pugh
It's not the same as like a 9 to 5 where you are saying, I will work 9 to 5 if you pay me this amount of money. Obviously it's different and you have more time flexibility, but there's still time and energy poured into what you are creating. So I love that. Now, I would love to talk a little bit more about niching down. I was talking to her about this earlier how I think a lot of people are really afraid to niche down. Whereas, like, if somebody found my page and Amanda's page and let's say they were a baker, immediately they're going to want to buy from Amanda instead of me because we both teach digital products. But she's so niche down to just bakers that the baker sees themselves in her. Right. They're like, oh, my gosh, this is my girl. She is a baker as well. She has done things that I've done, and now I want to turn it into digital. So I just want this to be a little reminder for you guys that if you're afraid to niche down, if you're like, well, I want to speak to everyone, like, I want to help all moms do xyz, I would encourage you to, like, push a little bit deeper and niche down just a little bit more. Because if you're speaking to everyone, truly, you're speaking to no one. And I feel like I say that all the time, but you have to niche down in this day and age. And even your recipe with the alcohol, like, that was another niche down, in my opinion, and another, like, very unique selling point. So just looking for ways to be different without necessarily reinventing the entire wheel. Yeah, we don't have to reinvent the wheel. Like, people have done things and you're able to kind of not replicate it exactly, but kind of take a little piece of their success and be like, hey, how can I put my own spin on this now? I'D love to hear from you. If someone is just starting out with digital products, kind of any words of encouragement for them, One piece of advice maybe to just help them push through that fear and that doubt. I feel like a lot of people right now are just overthinking everything and I feel like you didn't have the opportunity to overthink. You were just like, hey, I need to do this, so I'm just gonna go for it. So any pieces of advice for them?
- [19:12]
Amanda
Absolutely. I always say to just do it, and it may sound so cliche, but just do it. Because you get better as you go. But also understand that everything you've gone through in life, I always believe that your test is your testimony. So like you stated about niching down, you're going to find your people and people buy from people that they relate to. So even though you may want to sell to all moms or all bakers or all other people, there's always going to be something that someone sees in you that they relate to, and that's just going to help you to niche down even further. But put the product out there and let your students tell you what they need more of before you sit down and try to come up with an entire path of all the things you think a person needs. Because you're not buying the product, the consumer is buying the product. So put the product out there, allow them to give you feedback and pour into you. Because at the end of the day, me personally, digital products are all about service. It's how I take whatever gifts that I have, just like you take the gifts that you have and we serve our people. I can't serve you if I'm thinking for you.
- [20:22]
Abigail Pugh
Yep.
- [20:23]
Amanda
It has to be a give and take. I have to listen to you and allow you to tell me what it is that you want from me, what it is that you're struggling with. And so we don't do that until we put out the very first product. Then the feedback starts rolling in.
- [20:36]
Abigail Pugh
I 100% agree. When I first started, I kind of convinced my brain I need to have everything lined up. And I. I feel like I'm pretty tight. B. I didn't have everything lined up. And then as I was listening to my audience, I let them build out my product suite. I was like, what do you guys want next? I didn't even have to ask them. It was like, as I was sharing my journey, they were like, how are you doing this? And I said, okay, like, let me show you how. Let me just show you what I'm doing and take you along for the ride now. Okay. I love that. Is there any embarrassing story? I feel like I have so many of these. That kind of happened to you along the way. I feel also like people are so afraid to mess up, and it's like, we all make mistakes. We all do things wrong in business, and that's how you learn, girl.
- [21:20]
Amanda
Yes, this is. This is probably. This is embarrassing. And it is ghetto as all outdoors. But I literally.
- [21:27]
Abigail Pugh
I knew you'd have a good one.
- [21:28]
Amanda
I literally remember one of my first classes. And when I tell you guys, go for it. Just go for it. Like I stated, I was teaching in Facebook groups because they're free. Like, we would create a private group and. And please don't do that. Y'all get Stan. Like, you need processes, right? We do better when we know better. And I remember on a live one time, and I'm just baking, doing my thing, and then you literally hear shots fired. Because, again, y'all, when I first started, I was in the hood. I tell everybod, the Lord has brought me a mighty long way. This is why you need to do. And I was like, damn, are they shooting? But I'm on a live. I'm on a live. So you can't do anything. Oh, my gosh. It's embarrassing. It's crazy. You laugh it off and fast forward. Yes, I no longer live in the hood. I've taken the money from my digital products, and I move into a nice, cozy area. But again, if I waited for things to be perfect, I had an Android, so my students used to tease me about my Android. I would put my phone in a cup before I got a tripod. Yep, things don't have to be perfect. You don't need all the things. You don't have to have all the fancy gadgets. What I had was a willingness and a heart to show up, and my students saw that, and so we baked through it all. Through the gunshots, through it all, we just baked sentences.
- [22:54]
Abigail Pugh
I did not think I would be hearing on this call, but this was so good.
- [22:57]
Amanda
Shots, fire. I'm telling you.
- [23:01]
Abigail Pugh
Oh, my gosh, Amanda, you are so much fun. Thank you so much for coming on the show. Can you just let anyone who might be a baker know where they can find you on Instagram? Of course. I will tag everything down below. And the best offer to start with with you. If somebody is listening to this, they're a baker, and they're like, oh, my gosh, I love this girl. I want to work with her.
- [23:20]
Amanda
Oh absolutely. You can find me at Baking for Business on Instagram and baking for business.com and if you want to take your grandma's recipe or maybe your Aunt Susie's recipe you stole and make money with it, I would love for you to start off in the entrepreneur community which is the monthly membership. But if you have recipes and you're ready to scale and get out of the kitchen and sell them, then the digital product community for bakers would be the best place to start.
- [23:49]
Abigail Pugh
Amazing. Thank you so much you guys. Thank you for listening. I love you. Mean it. Go take your hot girl walk, maybe eat some pound cake if you have any around you and we'll see you next week. Thank you so much for hanging out with me and my guests today. If you learned anything from our episode, I would love it if you could share it over on your Instagram stories and tag me at Abigail Pugh until next time. Love you. Mean it.