#631: SMS and meaningful customer connections with Amanda McGuckin Hager, TrueDialog

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Agile Brand with Greg Kihlström® - Episode #631: SMS and Meaningful Customer Connections with Amanda McGuckin Hager, TrueDialogue

Introduction

In Episode #631 of The Agile Brand with Greg Kihlström®, host Greg Kihlström engages in an insightful conversation with Amanda McGuggin Hager, Chief Marketing Officer at TrueDialogue. The discussion centers on the pivotal role of SMS (Short Message Service) in forging meaningful customer connections, especially in an era where traditional communication channels like email and phone calls are becoming less effective.

Guest Background

Amanda McGuggin Hager brings nearly 25 years of experience in B2B demand generation within the technology sector. Based in Austin, Texas, Amanda has navigated various levels of the tech stack, including hardware, storage, networking, applications, and databases. Recently appointed as CMO at TrueDialogue, she is spearheading efforts to revitalize the marketing function and enhance messaging strategies to better reach ideal client profiles.

“I have been a member for three years now and the amount of expertise in that group... it led me to learn more about the company, the product, specifically the executive team, and the future, the marketing opportunity.”
— Amanda McGuggin Hager [21:12]

The Power of SMS in Marketing

Amanda emphasizes the superiority of SMS over email and phone calls in creating direct and meaningful customer interactions. With over 75% of consumers preferring text messages over other forms of communication, SMS provides a more intimate and immediate channel.

“Email is much less of a direct connection and meaningful connection than it used to be.”
— Amanda McGuggin Hager [04:37]

She highlights how the saturation of inboxes and the increasing use of mobile devices for personal and business communications have diminished the effectiveness of email and phone calls. SMS, on the other hand, remains a reliable and preferred method for engaging customers.

Success Stories and Use Cases

Amanda shares a compelling case study of Brazilian Professionals, a company that sells Brazilian blowout hair care products to salons and stylists. Due to the nature of their clients' work environments—often away from desks and less likely to check emails—the company successfully leveraged SMS to:

• Share professional development opportunities
• Introduce new products
• Manage inventory refills
• Promote events and social gatherings

“SMS did truly transform the engagement she had with her customers and ultimately her revenue.”
— Amanda McGuggin Hager [07:23]

This example underscores SMS's effectiveness in scenarios where traditional channels fall short, particularly in industries where clients are frequently on the move.

Integrating SMS into Marketing Strategies

When discussing how brands should incorporate SMS into their overall communication strategies, Amanda advises positioning SMS as a complementary channel within the customer journey rather than the primary one. She recommends using SMS for time-sensitive and personal interactions, such as event invitations or real-time updates, while reserving emails and other channels for broader, less immediate communication.

“SMS as a part of that journey... break through the noise and elevate the messaging.”
— Amanda McGuggin Hager [14:32]

Amanda cautions against overusing SMS for non-essential messages like newsletters, which are better suited for email. Instead, she suggests using SMS for messages that benefit from immediacy and a personal touch.

Future Trends in SMS Marketing

Looking ahead, Amanda anticipates the continued growth of SMS marketing, particularly as younger, digitally-native generations become the primary consumer base. She points out that newer generations, who have never experienced a world without the internet, are more receptive to text-based communication.

“As we go forward in time, the future of SMS is only going to get bigger based on the people that we are trying to communicate with personally.”
— Amanda McGuggin Hager [16:35]

She believes that SMS will become increasingly integral to marketing strategies as consumer preferences evolve towards more immediate and personal communication channels.

Compliance and Regulations

Amanda addresses the importance of adhering to SMS marketing regulations to maintain compliance while innovating. Key considerations include:

• Opt-In Requirements: Ensuring legal consent through proper opt-in mechanisms with clear consent checkboxes.
• Content Restrictions: Navigating restrictions on promotional content, especially in regulated industries like CBD and marijuana.
• Carrier Regulations: Complying with carrier-specific rules to prevent promotional messages from being blocked.

“It’s not too hard. It’s not an obstacle that marketers and RevOps cannot overcome.”
— Amanda McGuggin Hager [18:25]

Amanda emphasizes that while there are compliance nuances, they are manageable and should be approached as essential elements of a successful SMS marketing strategy.

Challenges and Opportunities as CMO

In her role as CMO at TrueDialogue, Amanda faces the typical challenges of onboarding quickly and assimilating into the company's culture and operations. Having worked as a consultant with TrueDialogue for six months prior to her full-time appointment, she highlights the benefits of this period for mutual evaluation and understanding.

“Getting up to speed quickly and effectively. Sometimes it can be drinking like from a fire hose.”
— Amanda McGuggin Hager [20:25]

She identifies the primary opportunity in leveraging her extensive background in B2B technology marketing to implement innovative SMS strategies that drive engagement and revenue.

Staying Agile in Marketing

Amanda shares her approach to maintaining agility in her role, which includes:

• Continuous Learning: Staying updated with industry trends through reading, professional groups, and development training.
• Networking: Engaging with other marketers on platforms like LinkedIn and participating in professional organizations such as Pavilion.
• Hands-On Involvement: Balancing strategic oversight with operational execution to ensure practical application of new ideas.

“Having an ear to the street and understanding what's going on in the rest of the market is really important.”
— Amanda McGuggin Hager [21:48]

This blend of strategic awareness and practical involvement enables her to adapt swiftly to changes and drive continuous improvement in her marketing initiatives.

Conclusion

Amanda McGuggin Hager's insights underscore the critical role of SMS in today's marketing landscape. By positioning SMS as a complementary channel, adhering to compliance standards, and staying attuned to evolving consumer preferences, brands can harness the power of text messaging to build stronger, more meaningful connections with their customers. Her strategic approach as CMO at TrueDialogue exemplifies how agility and innovation can drive successful marketing outcomes in a rapidly changing digital environment.

Notable Quotes

• “Email is much less of a direct connection and meaningful connection than it used to be.” — Amanda McGuggin Hager [04:37]
• “SMS did truly transform the engagement she had with her customers and ultimately her revenue.” — Amanda McGuggin Hager [07:23]
• “As we go forward in time, the future of SMS is only going to get bigger based on the people that we are trying to communicate with personally.” — Amanda McGuggin Hager [16:35]
• “It’s not too hard. It’s not an obstacle that marketers and RevOps cannot overcome.” — Amanda McGuggin Hager [18:25]
• “Having an ear to the street and understanding what's going on in the rest of the market is really important.” — Amanda McGuggin Hager [21:48]

Learn More

To delve deeper into Amanda McGuggin Hager's strategies and TrueDialogue's SMS solutions, visit the show notes for relevant links and resources.

Transcript

[Domo Representative]

Wouldn't it be great if you could ask your data anything at any time? Like how are sales this quarter? How's the new marketing campaign performing? What does the overall health of the company look like? And actually get answers right away. With charts and graphics and actionable information, you can with Domo's AI and Data products platform. Domo lets you channel AI and data quickly, securely and innovatively to deliver measurable insights wherever and whenever you need them. Anyone on your team can use Domo to easily prepare, analyze, visualize, automate and distribute data, all amplified by AI. Domo goes beyond productivity. It's designed to transform your processes, helping you make smarter and faster decisions and drive real growth. All powered by Domo's trust, flexibility and years of expertise in data and AI innovation. The world's best companies rely on Domo to make smarter decisions. See how Domo can help transform yours. Learn [e-mail] that's AI.domo.com the Agile Brand.

[Greg Kilstrom]

Welcome to season seven of the Agile Brand where we discuss the trends and topics marketing leaders need to know. Stay curious, stay agile and join the top enterprise brands and martech platforms as we explore marketing technology, AI, E commerce and whatever's next for the Omnichannel customer experience. Together we'll discover what it takes to create an agile brand built for today and tomorrow and built for customers, employees and continued business growth. I'm your host Greg Kilstrom, advising Fortune 1000 brands on martech, AI and marketing operations. The Agile Brand Podcast is brought to you by Tech Systems, an industry leader in full stack technology services, talent services and real world application. For more information, go to teksystems.com to make sure you always get the latest episodes, please hit subscribe on the app you listen to podcasts on and leave us a rating so others can find us as well. Now onto the show. With over 75% of consumers preferring text messages over email or calls, are brands missing a critical opportunity to connect meaningfully with our customers? Today we're joined by Amanda McGuggin Hager, chief marketing officer at TrueDialogue, where she's leading the charge in leveraging SMS to create stronger connections between businesses and their customers. With a wealth of experience in technology marketing, Amanda recently stepped into her role.

[Co-Host]

As CMO and brings fresh perspectives on.

[Greg Kilstrom]

How brands can prioritize meaningful, timely and.

[Co-Host]

Effective communication strategies in an ever evolving digital landscape.

[Greg Kilstrom]

Welcome to the show. Amanda hi.

[Amanda McGuggin Hager]

Thank you for having me.

It's great to be here.

[Domo Representative]

Yeah.

[Greg Kilstrom]

Looking forward to talking about this with.

[Co-Host]

You, before we dive in, why don't we start with you telling us a little more about your background and your current role at TrueDialogue.

[Amanda McGuggin Hager]

Yeah.

So I've been in B2B demand generation.

For almost 25 years. I live in Austin, Texas and I.

Have had the good fortune of being surrounded by a lot of technology companies. I've worked every, every level of the tech stack. I've been in hardware, I've been in storage, I've been in networking, I've been in applications, databases. And here I am at the top of the stack in a software platform. I recently joined TrueDialogue as CMO and I'm responsible for really revitalizing the marketing function and getting our messaging into the.

Hands of our ideal client profiles.

[Greg Kilstrom]

Great, great.

[Co-Host]

Well, yeah, let's, let's dive in here. We're going to talk about a few things, but I want to start with really kind of reiterating what I was, how I started the show with just the power of SMS communication and its ability to create meaningful connections. So sms, it's a, often a direct line to customers. How do you see it creating those more meaningful connections compared to some of the other communication channels like email or calls?

[Amanda McGuggin Hager]

You know, that is a great question, I think, and you, you alluded to it in your intro. It is a direct line email. As you know, I worked in email marketing for Dell actually many years, many, many years ago. And we used to say that in email your competitors are every other email in the inbox. And that has not changed.

Right?

In fact, it's getting a little bit harder. The competition in the inbox is much more than it used to be. You may have heard about some of the changes that Google, Yahoo, Microsoft made earlier in 2024 around controlling some of that bulk messaging because it was becoming too much, right? The messaging sequencing tools have gotten easy to use. They're much more accessible and therefore creating much more competition in the inbox for our prospects and customers. So email is much less of a direct connection and meaningful connection than it used to be. Phone calls, I think with COVID and remote work, phone calls changed, right? Everyone prior to that, everyone used to.

Sit at a desk.

They would have a desk phone, a work number. After that, more and more people started.

Relying on their cell phones, so mixing.

Business and personal onto one phone and as a result stopped answering phone calls. In fact, Apple, and I'm sure Android as well, now has a setting to.

Silence unknown phone numbers and send them straight to voicemail.

So cold calling, even if it's not even a cold call. Even if you are a brand calling customers familiar with your brand and doing business with your brand, if you're calling from a number that they don't know, that phone number is likely to go to voicemail. So those two environments have changed dramatically and it pushes text to the forefront of the direct line, in my opinion. And from what I can see in the market.

[Co-Host]

Yeah, yeah.

Can you maybe share some examples or success stories where you've seen SMS transform customer engagement?

[Amanda McGuggin Hager]

Yeah. So we work with a customer called Brazilian Professionals. They sell Brazilian blowout hair care to salons and stylists across the country as a result. Well, if you think about it, stylists are not sitting at a desk. Hair salons are not at a desk.

They're not checking email.

So our customer there, our global, she's in charge of global, global sales, was using text message to get a hold of all of her customers and to share with them professional development opportunities, new products, checking on their inventory if they needed refills, and doing events, you know, socializing events to really drive her revenue.

So to me, that is an example.

Of where SMS transformed her customer engagement.

Right.

She could not make the volume of.

Phone calls that she needed to make.

It was too manual. She could not send email because of the nature of her customers not being at a desk. So in that particular case study, SMS did truly transform the engagement she had with her customers and ultimately her revenue.

[Co-Host]

Yeah, yeah.

As I mentioned, you know, research shows that 75%, I mean, you know, three quarters of consumers prefer texts from businesses over emails or calls. You mentioned some, some strong cases for more meaningful connections. You know, how should brands use this, this insight to design their communication strategies?

[Amanda McGuggin Hager]

Well, I tend to believe that if.

SMS is not part of your communication.

Stack today, then you're missing out. I do believe, like email text will be one of the table stakes for all marketing teams for communication to their markets.

[Co-Host]

Yeah, yeah.

And so are there, have you seen any scenarios or maybe even any industries where SMS might be more impactful than others?

[Amanda McGuggin Hager]

Yeah. Well, if you have purchased anything from a retail store or a retail company, then you likely have been given the opportunity to opt into their text campaigns. In fact, a lot of retail companies offer discounts to sign up, like a.

Discount code to sign up in their.

SMS campaign that they're early adopters.

Right.

They see how SMS can drive spot promotions revenue. It can even drive foot traffic into the store. I want to kind of shift away from that because everyone knows that industry use case today. I think there's opportunity for industries not using SMS today that really have the opportunity to create impact. For example, I have come from B2B technology marketing in my career and when I step back and think about how I could implement SMS in the work that I've done in my career, it's.

Very clear to me. Right.

It's a, it's a very intimate channel.

[Co-Host]

Yeah.

[Amanda McGuggin Hager]

Would I be willing to send text messages to share my company's latest market research? Yes, I would. Would I be willing to send text messages to my prospects to invite them to a webinar, A personal invitation to a webinar? Yes, I would. Would I want my sales team texting with prospects and opportunities in the pipeline? Yes, actually I would. And we're hearing more and more from B2B technology companies that sales teams are indeed doing just that. So I do think there's table stakes for SMS like retail and then there's still a lot of opportunity for industries that have not yet started looking at SMS, especially in the B2B world.

[Co-Host]

Yeah.

And I would imagine there's a lot. The timeliness is another factor here as well. Text messages are often read within minutes of receipt. Unlike some other forms of communication, some brands probably could easily benefit from this. How should brands approach the timing and tone of their SMS campaigns when they may not be used to that kind of quick response?

[Amanda McGuggin Hager]

Yeah, I think you bring up a.

Good question sort of operationally.

I think when sending text messages, especially in a B2B world, we're hearing and seeing more of this founder led branding where you have an influencer, so to speak, could be a CEO, could be the cmo, it could be a VP of product or the Chief Product officer. But more and more people are stepping into using their personal brands in the marketing. I think that tone of invite is a, you know, if I'm sharing personal, if I'm putting myself out there to share my company's research or I'm putting myself out there to invite someone to a webinar, I think that's a good use of such an intimate channel.

Right?

[Co-Host]

Yeah.

[Amanda McGuggin Hager]

Having that personal connection in that intimate channel. The good news is sms, just like.

Email and just like phone calls, is.

That there's always the ability to opt out. So if consumers or prospects are put off by that, they have the ability to remove themselves from that channel.

[Domo Representative]

Wouldn't it be great if you could ask your data anything at any time, like, how are sales this quarter, how's the new marketing campaign performing? What does the overall health of the company look like? And actually get answers right away with charts and graphics and actionable information. You can with Domo's AI and data products platform. Domo lets you channel AI and data quickly, securely and innovatively to deliver measurable insights wherever and whenever you need them. Anyone on your team can use Domo to easily prepare, analyze, visualize, automate and distribute data, all amplified by AI. Domo goes beyond productivity. It's designed to transform your processes, helping you make smarter and faster decisions and drive real growth. All powered by Domo's trust, flexibility and years of expertise in data and AI innovation. The world's best companies rely on Domo to make smarter decisions. See how Domo can help transform yours. Learn [e-mail] that's AI.domo.com.

[Co-Host]

Well, let's talk a little bit about SMS as part of the broader strategy. Certainly I think we've touched on this, but how should they think? I mean, we've talked about a few different facets of this. I mean, there's, there's timeliness, there's the, you know, everything from open rates to preference and all that. You know, how, how should a brand think about where SMS fits into their overall communications and marketing strategy? Is it, you know, is it complementary? Is it primary channel for certain types of interactions? You know, what, what are your thoughts there?

[Amanda McGuggin Hager]

Yeah, that's a great question.

I tend to see SMS as a.

Step in the customer journey.

I think many marketers out there are familiar with the customer journey and are familiar with some of these automated workflows that are prevalent in many of the marketing automation tools and CRM tools where there may be if, then flowcharts and logic built in. I tend to see SMS as a.

Part of that journey. Right.

That's a way to kind of break through the noise and elevate the messaging.

Outside of email, outside of phone calls.

But I would defer or I would sort of discourage it from being the primary channel. Much like so much of what we.

Do in marketing, there are times and.

Places for the right message.

I would not send a newsletter over.

Sms, for example, that's less timely. It's informative and it's brand awareness and it's a good thing to do. But it's not the right channel for sms. It's not the right message for sms.

[Co-Host]

Yeah.

[Amanda McGuggin Hager]

However, events, you know, those are time and date specific. So I think those are a good message for sms. I think invitations, because they're so personal. You know, if I'm a salesperson and I'm going to do a Field event in the Chicago area, texting those people, my prospects and customers in the Chicago area that I will be there and would love to see them in person. I think that's much better done over text than it would be over email.

[Co-Host]

Yeah, yeah.

What do you see as the role of automation and personalization in terms of SMS marketing?

[Amanda McGuggin Hager]

Yeah, kind of like those workflows I talked about just a moment ago. I think there's all kinds of tools.

Now to build SMS steps into some of those sequences, especially if you're using one of the major CRMs.

[Co-Host]

Yeah, yeah.

And so looking out ahead, certainly there's going to be new channels popping up and new preferences and trends with consumers as well. All of this continues to evolve. What are you seeing from a trends perspective? You know what, what do you think is going to shape the future of SMS over the next, you know, let's say two, three, four, five years?

[Amanda McGuggin Hager]

Yeah, that's a great question. I think, you know, now we're, we're talking about generations that are born with.

Screens in their hands.

I mean, not literally, but yeah, you know, I'm gen X, I think is my, my generation and we were alive before the Internet. I think the, the sort of, the 20 year olds and 25 year olds.

Don'T know a world without the Internet.

And this is the generation that is not necessarily opening emails, certainly not taking phone calls, but they will read text messages. So I tend to believe that as we go forward in time, the future of SMS is only going to get bigger based on the people that we are trying to communicate with personally. That's how I see it.

[Co-Host]

Yeah, yeah.

I think another, another component here similar to, you know, there's regulations and compliance areas for email marketing and certainly many others. How do brands ensure that they're remaining compliant with regulations with SMS and you know, while still innovating, you know, how do you, how do you look at balancing the two?

[Amanda McGuggin Hager]

That is a great question.

With sms there are some regulatory things to be aware of.

Opting in requires some legal con, you know, legal, legal content on your checkboxes.

There are some rules around offering promotions or not offering promotions.

For opt in, there are network regulations.

Put in by the carriers.

For example, even though CBD and marijuana might be legal in some states, it's not legal federally.

And so therefore if your company is based around that, the carriers will not let you use text as a promotional strategy. So there are some things to know.

Some nuances with compliance, but it's not too hard.

Right.

It's not an obstacle that marketers and, and RevOps cannot overcome. And I do think that it's important to understand those and it's important to remain compliant. As far as innovation, I think innovation comes in the messaging sent, the timing.

Sort of that campaign design. Remember, SMS is just a channel of communications.

It's a channel to get your marketing and your campaign and your messaging, your.

Offers out into the hands of your customers and your prospects.

And I think that's where the innovation really comes in. And using. Using the channel in new ways with new messages.

[Co-Host]

Yeah.

And so, you know, the last thing I want to talk about with you is, you know, first, you've recently stepped into your role as CMO at True Dialogue. I wanted to talk a little bit about that and just, you know, as someone new to that role, what unique challenges and opportunities have you encountered?

[Amanda McGuggin Hager]

I had the good fortune of working as a consultant with this company for probably six months before I came on full time.

And I think it was a great way for both of us, myself and the company and the executives at the company to kind of just check each other out, see how we work, see what our values are, what our, you.

Know, our operating models.

And I'm really fortunate for it. It was a great experience. It led me to learn more about the company, the product, specifically the executive team, and the future, the marketing opportunity. So, you know, I feel very fortunate that that was how this, this role turned out. You know, the challenges, I think are not unique. It's getting up to speed quickly and effectively. Sometimes it can be drinking like from a fire hose. I. There was so much as a consultant that I was not included in on.

That I didn't see until I became.

A full time CMO here. So it can be a lot to absorb and to take in, but I think it's like that with every job.

[Greg Kilstrom]

Sure, sure.

[Co-Host]

But, yeah, no, it's, but it's, it's important. And you know, I know those CMOs out there or those, those new particular CMOs out there, you know, can probably benefit from just, you know, thinking through that in that way. Well, well, Amanda, thanks so much for, for joining today. Really appreciate your insights here. One last question before we go though, something I like to ask everybody. What do you do to stay agile in your role, your. Your role as cmo, and how do you find a way to do it consistently?

[Amanda McGuggin Hager]

That is a great question.

I learned very early in my career. I read an article that just said.

A lot of executives read a lot.

Um, and so I do try and.

Stay on top of the headlines. I'm, you know, scrolling through LinkedIn to see what some other marketers are doing and talking about. I belong to a professional group called Pavilion that I have loved and adored. I have been a member for three years now and the amount of expertise in that group. They offer schools, if you will, sort.

Of professional development training classes.

And I've taken at least five of them just to see what's going on.

In the world and to see how.

The market is looking at marketing and operations and looking for new efficiencies. So I think kind of having an.

Ear to the street and understanding what's going on in the rest of the.

Market is really important. And then sort of jumping between that 50,000 foot view and being operationally consistent.

Right.

So actually doing the work, getting my hands dirty, you know, rolling up my sleeves, whatever it might be, getting into.

The work to see how those things.

Can be applied practically.

[Co-Host]

Yeah, yeah, that's great. Well again, I'd like to thank Amanda McGuggin Hager for joining the show. You can learn more about Amanda and true dialogue by following the links in the show notes.

[Greg Kilstrom]

Thanks again for listening to the Agile Brand brought to you by Tech Systems. If you enjoyed the show, please take a minute to subscribe and leave us a rating so that others can find the show as well. You can access more episodes of the show@theagile brand.com that's theagile brand.com and contact me. If you're interested in consulting or advisory services or are looking for a speaker for your next event, go to www.gregkilstrom.com that's G R E G K I H L S t r o m.com the Agile brand is produced by Missing Link, a Latina owned, strategy driven, creatively fueled production co op. From ideation to creation, they craft human connections through intelligent, engaging and informative content. Until next time, stay curious and stay agile.

[Amanda McGuggin Hager]

The Agile Brand.