The Al Franken Podcast

Episode: Mark Leibovich on Trump’s Chaos!

Date: February 15, 2026
Guest: Mark Leibovich (Staff Writer for The Atlantic)
Host: Al Franken

Episode Overview

Al Franken welcomes journalist Mark Leibovich for a wide-ranging, candid, and frequently exasperated conversation about the sustained chaos of Donald Trump’s presidency, especially as he enters his second term. The duo dive deep into recent policy moves, authoritarian tactics, public reactions, racism, and corruption, while also exploring the present and future of the Democratic Party. The episode has a mix of biting humor, political analysis, and somber warnings about the state of American democracy.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Trump’s Recent Moves: Climate, Immigration, and Authoritarianism

[01:33 – 10:13]

Repealing EPA’s Climate Finding:
Trump eliminated the EPA’s 2009 finding that climate change is dangerous, terminating the federal ability to regulate greenhouse gases.

"So, big victory for fossil fuels and bad news for everyone else on the planet. Except for really old people, I suppose. Unless they die in a heat wave next summer." — Al Franken [03:21]
Government Shutdown Looms:
Republican hardliners threaten a shutdown over resistance to basic oversight like body cams and badges.
Immigration Enforcement:
Border czar Tom Homan announces the ‘immigration surge’ in Minnesota is ending, after questionable high-profile actions.

"Well, Homan gave no specific timeline or really policy changes, so we Minnesotans will believe it when we see it." — Al Franken [04:36]
Trump at the National Prayer Breakfast:
Trump delivers a rambling, self-aggrandizing, conspiratorial, and authoritarian-tinged speech.

“75 minutes of rambling narcissism, conspiracy theories, lies, bigotry, and so on.” — Al Franken quoting Peter Winter [05:36] “He referred to his critics as lunatics and compared them to dictators and The Gestapo... and praised El Salvador’s authoritarian president Bukele for his, quote, very strong prisons.” — Al Franken [06:08]
Standing Ovation for Authoritarian Rants:
Reflects a troubling level of support from key constituencies ("They liked what they heard." — Mark Leibovich [06:56]).

2. Legal Overreach and Failed Prosecutions

[07:01 – 09:23]

Failed Indictments Against Democrats:
U.S. attorney Jeanine Pirro unsuccessfully sought to indict Democrats for telling the military not to follow illegal orders.

“It is very, very hard not to get an indictment from a grand jury... usually you get an indictment.” — Mark Leibovich [07:42] “...these are some weak, if not just purely comical, cases.” — Mark Leibovich [08:43]

3. Conspiracy Theories and Elections

[09:23 – 13:00]

Trump’s Conspiracies About 2020 Election:
Repeats claims of satellites and foreign interference while forgetting he was president during 2020.

“Donald Trump would have been president while all this was going on... How could he allow all that to happen?” — Mark Leibovich [10:13]
Save America Act:
Trump’s push for restrictive voting laws—mandatory ID, sharp limits on absentee voting—targeting marginalized groups.

"21 million Americans don’t have either [passport or birth certificate], according to the Brennan Center." — Al Franken [11:52] “This is not going to happen. Right. The Republicans are going to pass this in the House and then Democrats will stop it in the Senate.” — Al Franken [12:16]

4. Trump’s Use of Power and Corruption

[13:00 – 30:53]

Supreme Court Gives Trump Immunity:
Trump blocks $16B for New Jersey-New York tunnel, offers to release funds if Penn Station and tunnels are named after him.

"Get as many things named after me as possible, you know, settle all personal grievances." — Mark Leibovich [14:17]
Immigration Policy:
Despite "closing the border," Trump's numbers on immigration remain underwater due to unpopular enforcement tactics and abuses.

“He closed the border, too. I mean, you know, I think Americans have been—we’re pretty happy to see... number of immigrants... ground to a halt. What they don’t like is the ICE stuff...” — Mark Leibovich [15:05]
Super Bowl Halftime Show Tirade:
Trump rants about Bad Bunny’s performance, injecting nativism and racism.

“The Super Bowl halftime show is absolutely terrible. One of the worst ever—all caps... And the dancing is disgusting, especially for young children.” — Al Franken quoting Trump [17:31] “But it’s so racist.” — Al Franken [19:48] “No, it was nativistic.” — Mark Leibovich [19:49]
Trump’s Personal History of Racism:
From housing discrimination to attacks on the Central Park Five, “shithole countries,” and recent racist memes.

“There is a litany and, you know, we see it all the time. What really even now kind of stopped me in my tracks was that meme of the Obamas as monkeys... so over the top, even a handful of Republicans had to condemn it.” — Mark Leibovich [21:04]
New Forms of Corruption:
Trump administration’s unprecedented profiteering—cryptocurrency ventures, foreign money, rollback of regulations for donor benefits.

“Do Americans mind that the President is making, and his family are making billions of dollars in the White House?” — Al Franken [28:12]

“It’s the definition of corruption. But then, you know, there are new, exciting definitions that we see every week.” — Mark Leibovich [27:59]

5. Media, Democracy, and Accountability

[30:53 – 35:19]

Washington Post Downsizing:
Jeff Bezos has cut staff nearly in half despite enormous personal wealth.

“If you have $250 billion, why not just keep the full staff?” — Al Franken [31:49] “It's, it's tragic... Even after they leave for other jobs... people who work there... felt very loyal to the place... And now, they've just basically been cut in half and gutted.” — Mark Leibovich [31:35]
Editorial Independence and Compromises:
Speculation about Bezos making changes to protect Amazon post-Trump.

6. Epstein Files Scandal

[35:19 – 43:06]

Delayed Transparency & Lack of Indictments:
Pam Bondi’s DOJ has released millions of files but heavily redacts names and has not indicted any key players.

“No one has been indicted for any of this stuff.” — Mark Leibovich [36:47]
Callousness to Survivors:
Bondi ignored Epstein abuse survivors in hearings, presumably out of fear of appearing weak to Trump.

“If I turn around and do any kind of acknowledgment here, it will look weak and the President will be angry with me. They're basically following the script of complete callousness.” — Mark Leibovich [38:26]
Showboating & Partisan Attacks:
Bondi’s behavior is “audience of one” politics, performing only for Trump.

“I can’t imagine that’s persuading any voters, if that's even what this is about.” — Mark Leibovich [40:54]
Democratic & Republican Pressure:
The initial bipartisan support for transparency in these files has faded, and Republicans have largely moved on.

“Maybe this is what the administration was counting on. It's just a whole lot of outrage at once, and it's hard for people to process this.” — Mark Leibovich [42:21]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

On Trump’s Chaotic Rule:

“Every day there are new viral videos out there... the video that's available is an extremely powerful tool for people who, not only oppose this, but who want to get the word out about it.” — Mark Leibovich [26:07]
On Corruption:

"The first check and balance of a president is, is the president’s own decency and conscience and patriotism..." — Mark Leibovich [30:10]
On Democratic Party’s Challenges:

“Democrats have not, I would say until maybe recently, waged a particularly effective fight against what Trump has done and the abuses.” — Mark Leibovich [50:10]
On Working-Class Voters:

“Obama won working-class voters by a huge 22 points... against Kamala, Trump carried it by a couple.” — Al Franken [53:14]
On the Future:

“These wilderness periods are hard to talk about and hard to quantify.” — Mark Leibovich [61:44]
On Election Integrity:

"He said recently he wants to nationalize elections, which, you know, doesn't make a lot of sense, but... it's authoritarian, really at the definition of authoritarian in some ways." — Mark Leibovich [63:22]

Important Segment Timestamps

| Time | Subject | |----------|-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 01:33 | Introduction, climate deregulation, government shutdown, Trump administration | | 05:25 | Trump’s Prayer Breakfast speech, conspiracy theories, authoritarian praise | | 07:01 | Failed indictments, grand juries, legal overreach | | 09:23 | Election conspiracy theories, "Save America Act" voting restrictions | | 13:00 | SCOTUS immunity, Gateway Project, personal aggrandizement | | 17:31 | Super Bowl, Trump’s nativism and racism | | 20:04 | Trump’s racist history, recent racist memes | | 27:29 | Corruption: nursing homes, crypto ventures | | 30:53 | Media cuts: Washington Post, Bezos’ priorities | | 35:19 | Epstein files, congressional hearings, survivor testimony | | 48:08 | Democratic Party post-2024, Ken Martin interview | | 53:00 | Working class vote shifts, Democratic identity crisis | | 56:00 | Texas and Maine Senate races, new Democratic candidates | | 60:08 | Democrats’ chances to retake House, warning against complacency | | 63:04 | Election integrity, threats of federalizing elections |

Tone and Style

The episode is saturated with a mix of gallows humor, blunt language, and open frustration at the state of American politics. Both Franken and Leibovich are sarcastic but never unserious about the dangers discussed. The analysis is both bleakly comic and sharply analytical, reflecting their backgrounds in political reporting and satire.

Concluding Reflections

The conversation yields profound concern for democracy, the rule of law, and basic decency. Both guests emphasize how Trump’s behavior is not only breaking norms but actively corroding core institutions.
The Democratic Party’s struggles with its own identity, message, and coalition-building are diagnosed as severe but potentially rebounding in the short term, bolstered less by their own strength than by revulsion toward Trump’s GOP.
The undercurrent is urgency: vigilance is essential, and outcomes in 2026 and beyond are far from assured.

The Al Franken Podcast

Episode: Mark Leibovich on Trump’s Chaos!

Date: February 15, 2026
Guest: Mark Leibovich (Staff Writer for The Atlantic)
Host: Al Franken

Episode Overview

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Trump’s Recent Moves: Climate, Immigration, and Authoritarianism

[01:33 – 10:13]

Repealing EPA’s Climate Finding:
Trump eliminated the EPA’s 2009 finding that climate change is dangerous, terminating the federal ability to regulate greenhouse gases.

"So, big victory for fossil fuels and bad news for everyone else on the planet. Except for really old people, I suppose. Unless they die in a heat wave next summer." — Al Franken [03:21]
Government Shutdown Looms:
Republican hardliners threaten a shutdown over resistance to basic oversight like body cams and badges.
Immigration Enforcement:
Border czar Tom Homan announces the ‘immigration surge’ in Minnesota is ending, after questionable high-profile actions.

"Well, Homan gave no specific timeline or really policy changes, so we Minnesotans will believe it when we see it." — Al Franken [04:36]
Trump at the National Prayer Breakfast:
Trump delivers a rambling, self-aggrandizing, conspiratorial, and authoritarian-tinged speech.

“75 minutes of rambling narcissism, conspiracy theories, lies, bigotry, and so on.” — Al Franken quoting Peter Winter [05:36] “He referred to his critics as lunatics and compared them to dictators and The Gestapo... and praised El Salvador’s authoritarian president Bukele for his, quote, very strong prisons.” — Al Franken [06:08]
Standing Ovation for Authoritarian Rants:
Reflects a troubling level of support from key constituencies ("They liked what they heard." — Mark Leibovich [06:56]).

2. Legal Overreach and Failed Prosecutions

[07:01 – 09:23]

Failed Indictments Against Democrats:
U.S. attorney Jeanine Pirro unsuccessfully sought to indict Democrats for telling the military not to follow illegal orders.

“It is very, very hard not to get an indictment from a grand jury... usually you get an indictment.” — Mark Leibovich [07:42] “...these are some weak, if not just purely comical, cases.” — Mark Leibovich [08:43]

3. Conspiracy Theories and Elections

[09:23 – 13:00]

Trump’s Conspiracies About 2020 Election:
Repeats claims of satellites and foreign interference while forgetting he was president during 2020.

“Donald Trump would have been president while all this was going on... How could he allow all that to happen?” — Mark Leibovich [10:13]
Save America Act:
Trump’s push for restrictive voting laws—mandatory ID, sharp limits on absentee voting—targeting marginalized groups.

"21 million Americans don’t have either [passport or birth certificate], according to the Brennan Center." — Al Franken [11:52] “This is not going to happen. Right. The Republicans are going to pass this in the House and then Democrats will stop it in the Senate.” — Al Franken [12:16]

4. Trump’s Use of Power and Corruption

[13:00 – 30:53]

Supreme Court Gives Trump Immunity:
Trump blocks $16B for New Jersey-New York tunnel, offers to release funds if Penn Station and tunnels are named after him.

"Get as many things named after me as possible, you know, settle all personal grievances." — Mark Leibovich [14:17]
Immigration Policy:
Despite "closing the border," Trump's numbers on immigration remain underwater due to unpopular enforcement tactics and abuses.

“He closed the border, too. I mean, you know, I think Americans have been—we’re pretty happy to see... number of immigrants... ground to a halt. What they don’t like is the ICE stuff...” — Mark Leibovich [15:05]
Super Bowl Halftime Show Tirade:
Trump rants about Bad Bunny’s performance, injecting nativism and racism.

“The Super Bowl halftime show is absolutely terrible. One of the worst ever—all caps... And the dancing is disgusting, especially for young children.” — Al Franken quoting Trump [17:31] “But it’s so racist.” — Al Franken [19:48] “No, it was nativistic.” — Mark Leibovich [19:49]
Trump’s Personal History of Racism:
From housing discrimination to attacks on the Central Park Five, “shithole countries,” and recent racist memes.

“There is a litany and, you know, we see it all the time. What really even now kind of stopped me in my tracks was that meme of the Obamas as monkeys... so over the top, even a handful of Republicans had to condemn it.” — Mark Leibovich [21:04]
New Forms of Corruption:
Trump administration’s unprecedented profiteering—cryptocurrency ventures, foreign money, rollback of regulations for donor benefits.

“Do Americans mind that the President is making, and his family are making billions of dollars in the White House?” — Al Franken [28:12]

“It’s the definition of corruption. But then, you know, there are new, exciting definitions that we see every week.” — Mark Leibovich [27:59]

5. Media, Democracy, and Accountability

[30:53 – 35:19]

Washington Post Downsizing:
Jeff Bezos has cut staff nearly in half despite enormous personal wealth.

“If you have $250 billion, why not just keep the full staff?” — Al Franken [31:49] “It's, it's tragic... Even after they leave for other jobs... people who work there... felt very loyal to the place... And now, they've just basically been cut in half and gutted.” — Mark Leibovich [31:35]
Editorial Independence and Compromises:
Speculation about Bezos making changes to protect Amazon post-Trump.

6. Epstein Files Scandal

[35:19 – 43:06]

Delayed Transparency & Lack of Indictments:
Pam Bondi’s DOJ has released millions of files but heavily redacts names and has not indicted any key players.

“No one has been indicted for any of this stuff.” — Mark Leibovich [36:47]
Callousness to Survivors:
Bondi ignored Epstein abuse survivors in hearings, presumably out of fear of appearing weak to Trump.

“If I turn around and do any kind of acknowledgment here, it will look weak and the President will be angry with me. They're basically following the script of complete callousness.” — Mark Leibovich [38:26]
Showboating & Partisan Attacks:
Bondi’s behavior is “audience of one” politics, performing only for Trump.

“I can’t imagine that’s persuading any voters, if that's even what this is about.” — Mark Leibovich [40:54]
Democratic & Republican Pressure:
The initial bipartisan support for transparency in these files has faded, and Republicans have largely moved on.

“Maybe this is what the administration was counting on. It's just a whole lot of outrage at once, and it's hard for people to process this.” — Mark Leibovich [42:21]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

On Trump’s Chaotic Rule:

“Every day there are new viral videos out there... the video that's available is an extremely powerful tool for people who, not only oppose this, but who want to get the word out about it.” — Mark Leibovich [26:07]
On Corruption:

"The first check and balance of a president is, is the president’s own decency and conscience and patriotism..." — Mark Leibovich [30:10]
On Democratic Party’s Challenges:

“Democrats have not, I would say until maybe recently, waged a particularly effective fight against what Trump has done and the abuses.” — Mark Leibovich [50:10]
On Working-Class Voters:

“Obama won working-class voters by a huge 22 points... against Kamala, Trump carried it by a couple.” — Al Franken [53:14]
On the Future:

“These wilderness periods are hard to talk about and hard to quantify.” — Mark Leibovich [61:44]
On Election Integrity:

"He said recently he wants to nationalize elections, which, you know, doesn't make a lot of sense, but... it's authoritarian, really at the definition of authoritarian in some ways." — Mark Leibovich [63:22]

Important Segment Timestamps

Tone and Style

Concluding Reflections

The conversation yields profound concern for democracy, the rule of law, and basic decency. Both guests emphasize how Trump’s behavior is not only breaking norms but actively corroding core institutions.
The Democratic Party’s struggles with its own identity, message, and coalition-building are diagnosed as severe but potentially rebounding in the short term, bolstered less by their own strength than by revulsion toward Trump’s GOP.
The undercurrent is urgency: vigilance is essential, and outcomes in 2026 and beyond are far from assured.

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Mark Leibovich on Trump’s Chaos!

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Summary

The Al Franken Podcast

Episode: Mark Leibovich on Trump’s Chaos!

Episode Overview

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Trump’s Recent Moves: Climate, Immigration, and Authoritarianism

2. Legal Overreach and Failed Prosecutions

3. Conspiracy Theories and Elections

4. Trump’s Use of Power and Corruption

5. Media, Democracy, and Accountability

6. Epstein Files Scandal

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

Important Segment Timestamps

Tone and Style

Concluding Reflections

Summary

The Al Franken Podcast

Episode: Mark Leibovich on Trump’s Chaos!

Episode Overview

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Trump’s Recent Moves: Climate, Immigration, and Authoritarianism

2. Legal Overreach and Failed Prosecutions

3. Conspiracy Theories and Elections

4. Trump’s Use of Power and Corruption

5. Media, Democracy, and Accountability

6. Epstein Files Scandal

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

Important Segment Timestamps

Tone and Style

Concluding Reflections