Subject Lines That Stop the Scroll: Jay Schwedelson’s Secrets Revealed

Summary

Summary of "Subject Lines That Stop the Scroll: Jay Schwedelson’s Secrets Revealed" on The Amy Porterfield Show

Podcast Information:

• Title: The Amy Porterfield Show
• Host: Amy Porterfield
• Guest: Jay Schwedelson
• Episode Title: Subject Lines That Stop the Scroll: Jay Schwedelson’s Secrets Revealed
• Release Date: April 22, 2025

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1. Introduction to Personalized Email Marketing

The episode kicks off with Amy Porterfield addressing common fears among marketers regarding email unsubscribes. She shares a revealing statistic: “Over 90% of unsubscribes are from people who have not opened or clicked on one of your emails in over six months” (00:11). This sets the stage for a deep dive into the importance of targeting the right audience and embracing personalization in email marketing.

2. The Impact of Personal vs. Brand Newsletters

Jay Schwedelson recounts his journey into online marketing, highlighting the pivotal moment when he connected with Marie Forleo at an event (00:35). This personal story underscores the power of building authentic relationships, a theme that permeates the discussion on email newsletters.

Amy elaborates on the stark differences between brand newsletters and personal newsletters. She states, “Personal newsletters have a 48% higher average open rate than brand newsletters,” emphasizing the superior engagement that comes from a personalized touch (10:22). Furthermore, she highlights that offers within personal newsletters achieve a “30% higher click-through rate” compared to those from brand newsletters (11:43).

3. Key Strategies for Personalization

Amy stresses the importance of transforming newsletters from generic brand communications to personal, relatable messages. She recommends starting a second newsletter that emanates from an individual rather than the brand itself. “The secret sauce about email marketing is that you really want to have the from name change depending on what you’re sending out,” she explains (12:50).

One notable tip she shares is treating the "From Name" as an extension of the subject line, which can increase open rates by up to 20% when tailored to the content being promoted (13:41). For example, instead of sending an email from “Nutrition Network,” use “Nutrition Network Events” to align with the email’s purpose.

4. Enhancing Email Performance: Open Rates and Click Throughs

Amy provides actionable advice on improving both open and click-through rates. She advises keeping text blocks concise—no more than four lines—to maintain reader engagement (20:14). Additionally, incorporating elements like “3-minute read” prompts can significantly boost click-through rates by making the content feel manageable and time-efficient (20:32).

5. Using AI in Personalizing Newsletters

While Amy is a proponent of AI in marketing, she cautions against over-reliance, noting that AI can sometimes make communications feel impersonal. However, she leverages AI to generate content ideas that mirror her personal tone, enhancing the newsletter’s authenticity (22:44).

6. Overcoming Email Deliverability Challenges

Addressing common deliverability issues, Amy recommends regular database maintenance through validation services like Zero Bounce to cleanse email lists of inactive or invalid addresses (35:43). This practice is crucial for maintaining high engagement rates and ensuring emails reach their intended recipients.

7. Growing Your Email List: Effective Tactics

Amy shares innovative strategies for email list growth, emphasizing the importance of simplicity in sign-up forms. “Just collect the email address,” she advises, explaining that additional fields can deter potential subscribers (40:26). She also highlights the effectiveness of strategic content naming—titles like “The Ultimate Guide” or “Cheat Sheets” significantly enhance lead magnet appeal (42:31).

8. Measuring Email Marketing Success

Beyond open and click-through rates, Amy stresses the importance of tracking subscriber interactions to refine targeting strategies. By tagging users based on their engagement with specific content, marketers can create highly tailored segments for future campaigns, thereby increasing relevance and conversion rates (44:03).

9. Leveraging Live Events for Email Marketing Growth

Transitioning to the role of live events in email marketing, Amy discusses the transformation of virtual events post-COVID. She introduces the concept of “Earned On Demand,” where access to event replays is contingent upon active participation, thereby ensuring higher engagement rates (47:08). She also criticizes the traditional webinar format, advocating instead for event promotion that focuses on the topic rather than the medium (48:17).

Amy promotes her upcoming virtual event, Eventtastic, a two-day free event centered on event marketing. Featuring keynote speakers like Andy Cohen from Bravo, Eventtastic aims to provide valuable insights while fostering community engagement (49:44).

10. Conclusion and Takeaways

In closing, Amy reiterates the critical role of personalization in email marketing. She encourages marketers to embrace authentic communication, maintain clean email lists, and utilize strategic content approaches to enhance engagement and conversions. The episode concludes with an enthusiastic endorsement of Eventtastic, promising an enriching experience for attendees looking to elevate their event marketing strategies.

Notable Quotes:

• Amy Porterfield (00:11): “Over 90% of unsubscribes are from people who have not opened or clicked on one of your emails in over six months.”

• Amy Porterfield (10:22): “Personal newsletters have a 48% higher average open rate than brand newsletters.”

• Amy Porterfield (12:50): “The secret sauce about email marketing is that you really want to have the from name change depending on what you’re sending out.”

• Amy Porterfield (20:14): “You really don’t want to have more than four lines. I like having three lines in any text block.”

• Amy Porterfield (22:44): “Can this be made more personal? Can this feel a little better?”

• Amy Porterfield (35:43): “Every year we take our databases, we give it to Zero Bounce, and they put it through their tool.”

• Amy Porterfield (42:31): “Instead of a tip sheet, “insider tip sheet,” forget it. The thing goes into the stratosphere in terms of people wanting to consume it.”

• Amy Porterfield (44:03): “Tagging users based on their engagement allows us to create highly tailored segments for future campaigns.”

• Amy Porterfield (48:17): “Nobody wants to have another webinar in their calendar. They just don’t.”

Final Thoughts:

This episode offers a wealth of insights into the evolving landscape of email marketing, emphasizing the necessity of personalization and strategic content management. Jay Schwedelson’s expertise complements Amy Porterfield’s strategies, providing listeners with actionable takeaways to enhance their own email marketing efforts. Whether it’s optimizing subject lines, refining newsletter formats, or leveraging live events, the discussions are geared towards fostering deeper connections and achieving sustainable business growth.

Transcript

[Amy Porterfield]

Hey there.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Welcome to the Amy Porterfield Show.

[Amy Porterfield]

People get nervous about unsubscribes, and then we react to the loudest voice in the room, which is a horrible thing to do. So here's a stat that you want to plant in your mind. Over 90% of unsubscribes people say, take me off your list. Are from people who have not opened or clicked on one of your emails in over six months. These are not your people. People are allowed to move on. People allowed to change their lives.

[Jay Schwedelson]

First, I want you to know that I just recorded this entire intro with no audio. Yeah, I did the whole seven minute intro. I was on a roll and then I went to Riverside to make sure it was saved correctly and there's no audio. So I just tell you this to say if that's ever happened to you. Tech issues are a nightmare and I'm really frustrated. But, you know, second time's a charm. So here we are. I want to take you back to 17 years ago. Yeah, 17 years ago, I was still at my corporate job, living in San Diego. I was already planning to leave. I was already starting to think of, how can I be my own boss? What could I create? What am I going to do? I had already started my exit plan, but I wasn't exactly sure when it was all going to come together. And so around that time, I signed up for my very first online marketing event. Frank Kern was the host of this event. And I didn't know Frank at the time, but I was so excited. I paid for the ticket with my own money because I was going there to learn how to start my own business. And I thought, you know what? I got to get in the room. I got to get in the room, meet some new people, figure out, like, who I need to know in order to get the kind of education that I needed in order to start this online business. And I just knew I needed to be in proximity. So even though I'm an introvert, I found myself in a massive hallway that opened up to this ballroom for this event. But in this massive hallway, all the doors were closed because I was the first one to arrive to this event. No one was there yet. Now, the Amy today is not the first person to arrive at an event. The Amy, 17 years ago. Oh, heck, yeah, she was. Someone recently called me a teacher's pet, which I thought was a compliment. Like, yeah, I always sat at the front of the room. I tried to get good grades, I raised my hand, asked all the questions, cringe. But that's not really who I am today. However, back in the day, I was the first one there. I found myself in this big empty hallway, super nervous about my first Internet marketing event. And a woman came in, and she was early as well. And we started to chat. We instantly connected, and we were chatting about our businesses. And she was asking me all these questions. And so I told her, I'm thinking about starting my own business. I don't know what I'm going to do yet, but I wanted to be at this event. I wanted to learn from the best. And so she kept asking me all these questions. And then finally she said, okay, hold on. And she grabbed her notebook, scribbled down her website, ripped it out of the notebook, and kind of shoved it into my face. And she said, go to my website after this event. You'll see. I have a free guide all about how to start doing. I think it was video at the time. She was teaching people how to make your videos great or something with starting a business. So she's like, go there, download my free guide. You're going to love it. It's just what you need. I remember this moment so vividly in my mind. I remember it one because it was Marie Forleo, and we have been friends for 17 years now. My very first mastermind I ever paid for was Marie's Mastermind. I became a B school affiliate for many, many years. Love that program. So it's kind of fun to think where we met and where I was in my life when we met. But also, I loved how personal she made growing her business. And really, to this day, if you were in a hallway with Marie, she'd probably do the same thing. She's still that same girl, which I love. But I love that she made it so personal. She asked me all these questions about me. She knew exactly what I needed, and then, boom, she gave me a solution. And the reason I was thinking of this story today is because today's episode is about personalizing your marketing, specifically your email marketing. Even more specific, your email newsletter. And I want to talk about the difference between a brand newsletter and a personalized newsletter and what that looks like and why personalization has become so incredibly important in today's landscape. And I'll just tell you one reason. AI I love AI I support it. I use it every day. My team uses it. But it also makes people cynical. Am I talking to a bot or am I talking to a human? Is that really you dming me, Amy, or is it manychat? I mean, people are very, very cynical and they don't trust like they used to. And so really understanding what needs to happen for your audience to trust you is an important conversation we need to continue to have. But I can promise you personalizing your marketing, and it goes both ways. Making people feel seen and heard and allowing people to see and hear you as the mentor, the guide, the coach, the trainer. I think both ways are really important. So having a personalized newsletter, allowing people into your world is one way to build that trust and create real relationships with your audience. So here's the deal. I don't yet have a personalized newsletter. You can bet that I want to have one. And it's. It's in the works, down the pipeline. And because I don't teach anything that I don't do, I wanted to bring in an expert. And this expert happens to be a very good friend of mine. His name is Jay Schwedelson. And every time I get on a call with him, he just makes me laugh. I think he's one of the funniest guys I know. But he's also incredibly talented. So you might have heard me talk about one of his websites that is insanely popular. It's called Subject line dot com. If you're not using it, then thank me later. You're going to be addicted. I will never, ever send an email out that I haven't ran through subjectline.com. it has actually helped over 15 million people test subject lines. Okay, I actually said that wrong and I should edit it out, but I'm not going to. It's had 15 million tested subject lines ran through it. I might have been 10,000 of those, but 15 million. Yeah. So they tool. It knows what it's doing. It's so good. So he's the creator of Subject Line.com and he's also the founder of Guru Media Hub, which hosts the world's largest email marketing conference, which is totally free, by the way. It's had over 50,000 people attend annually. And here's the cool thing. If you're looking for a brand new online marketing podcast, don't you dare go anywhere from this one. But if you want another, another one, he has a podcast called do this. Not that. It's one of the top five marketing podcasts in the US and it's known for blending pop culture, humor, and then data driven marketing. So one of the things that I love about Jay is he loves reality tv, he loves pop culture. So every time I talk to him, that is essentially what we are talking about. So I Love his podcast. Highly recommended. And Jay lives in Boca Raton, Florida. Okay, listen, I had to look this up because I thought that's where the Golden Girls lived. And so when I think of Boca, I think of, like, a big, really cool retirement community with, what do they call them? Snowbirds that go to Florida in the winter. So I feel like Jay lives among, like, the Golden Girls. But I looked it up. Do you know where the Golden Girls really lived? Can you guess? Like, say it out loud. Where do you think the Golden Girls lived? They lived in Miami, Florida. So also, did you know that they were in their 40s when they were recording that? Which really blows my mind. I thought they were much, much older, so I don't know. Anyway, Boca Raton is not where the Golden Girls lived. But guess what? It is where Jay lives. So it won't make you wait any longer. Let's welcome my very good friend, Jay Schwedelson. Listen, I've got to tell on myself because for the last 15 minutes, you have seen me stumble through this technology. I couldn't get my camera to work, and then I couldn't get my mic to work. Then I got up and down, up and down. And then Scout started barking so loud we had to stop three times. So thank you for being so patient.

[Amy Porterfield]

I am so happy that all happened because I'm always like, when I have issues, I'm like, I bet you. I bet you Amy Porterfield doesn't have issues. And here you're having the same problems I do. So this is great news.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Oh, my friend, if you only knew how many issues I have over here. So again, you've been wonderful for the last 15 minutes. So why don't we get the show started now?

[Amy Porterfield]

Let's do it.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Okay, let's do it. So first of all, you've been on the show before. You are the email marketing expert that I go to. Like, I want to ask you a million questions, but you've been on the show once, so my audience probably knows you well. But give me a little intro just in case we have some new listeners.

[Amy Porterfield]

Okay? Sure. So my main hustle is I have an agency, a demand gen agency, about 100 person company in South Florida. But I'm mostly known for this website I got called subject line.com, which is a free site that people go to and use. And then we also put on lots of crazy big free events. But enough about me, who cares? I just want to get into the fun, cool, interesting stuff.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Okay, well, we're gonna go there. We're gonna get there right now. But for the record, I'm a huge fan of Subjectline.com I tell every single student of mine to use it and my team uses it as well. So I recommend it to all of you. So there's our first plug because it is good.

[Amy Porterfield]

I appreciate you.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Okay, so let's start by getting on the same page with today's topic. Personalization in email marketing. So what does it actually mean? And why are personal newsletters outperforming traditional brand emails? Like, what's making them so much more effective right now?

[Amy Porterfield]

First of all, this is such a great topic because the world has really changed quite a bit. There's something called AI. I don't know if you've heard of it, but it's out there.

[Jay Schwedelson]

I don't know. I don't know what that is.

[Amy Porterfield]

What's happened is there's this tidal wave of generic garbage content and we feel less and less connected with brands. We feel less and less connected with the things that we're signing up for. So this idea of personal newsletters, newsletters that are coming from a person are crushing. In the last six months, for example, personal newsletters have a 48% higher average open rate, the percentage of people opening up the email. Then do brand email newsletters. I'll give you a great example. So you have a newsletter, okay? Your newsletter comes from you, Amy Porterfield. Now if that newsletter instead came from digital course academy would be fine, but would everyone feel as connected to you? No, they wouldn't. You know when they get that newsletter? When I get it and I see your name in my inbox, I know it's not really you, but I feel like it's you. And I open it up and that tone, the way that you write it sounds like you. And here's the secret sauce that it's not just about getting the email open because you change that little from name, but the offers that you put inside newsletters that come from a person rather than a brand, those same offers head to head, you get a 30% higher click through rate on offers that are within your newsletter that come from a personal newsletter rather than a brand newsletter. Because the world has shifted, that we want to feel connected.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Okay, did you wait, did you say.

[Amy Porterfield]

35%, 30% increase on clicks. So if you stick an offer in your newsletter, okay, and it's coming from your brand or you stick an offer in your newsletter and it's coming from a person, when it comes from a person, the click through rate rises by 30% and all you did was change how you're sending it. And that tone.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Okay, that's huge. Now, here's the thing. I send an email out every Tuesday, but my email, it's essentially just a newsletter for the podcast. Hey, I've got a new podcast episode. Here's what's in it. Here's why you want to listen. And then in the PS I tend to add some personal links to things I'm loving right now, but I don't look at that as a real newsletter. But I'm interested in changing it to a newsletter. So I want to know from you, like, what makes a newsletter a personal newsletter? Okay. One, it's coming from me, but what are the must have elements to make it successful from day one if I were to start from scratch? Like, is there a framework to follow to make these emails really effective? Because for the record, you have one. You've got to talk about some of the success you've seen on yours, because it's incredible.

[Amy Porterfield]

Yeah. And I think so. Once taking a step back, people are like, well, I like the newsletter I'm sending right now. It comes from my brand. I don't want to change it and blow everything up and have it come from me as a person, because I like it. And what you really want to think about is, instead of saying, I'm going to change it, you can have a second newsletter, okay? You take the same database, your same database, okay? You keep sending out on Thursdays your Nutrition Network newsletters, but now on Tuesdays, you're going to add in another newsletter to the same database, and it's going to come from Jenny Smith, because you're Jenny Smith, okay? And that newsletter is going to be personal in nature. It's going to have a different tone. And here's the secret sauce about email marketing that I think almost everybody sleeps on. When you send out your email to me, the email address that you send it from, the actual email address is infoimyporterfield.com that's your email address.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Yes.

[Amy Porterfield]

Now, when it shows on my inbox, it says Amy Porterfield. Right? Because when you're sending out, you're putting that from name to be Amy Porterfield. You could have that from name. Literally say anything. It doesn't matter what platform you use. It takes five seconds, okay? It could say Howdy Doody. It doesn't matter. All right? And the reason that that matters, the reason that that from name is so powerful, you should change it depending on what you're sending out. It does not hurt your deliverability it doesn't change. Go to the inbox, whatever. Why do I say that? So now you have the second newsletter that's newsletters are going to go from Jenny Smith. Same email address, though. Okay, and let me go on a side tangent here for a second with this From Name thing, because I think it's among the most powerful things, email marketing that we're not thinking about. Let's say, okay, let's put the newsletter to the side. Now I have promotional emails I'm sending out. Everybody sends out their promotional email. And the from name will be Nutrition Network. Okay? That's what will be from. And then you'll have your subject line, whatever. That's not the game anymore. Every time you hit send, you want to change the From Name. It's a creative writing contest. Literally, in any platform you use, there's gonna be a field that says From Name. It sometimes it's called a friendly from or the alias. So let's say you're promoting an event you don't want to come from. Nutrition Network. It should say Nutrition Network events. Nutrition Network Big news, Nutrition Network Live. When you tie your offer in the From Name field to the offer of what you're promoting, okay, your open rates, your. The percentage of people opening every email goes up by 20%. So you really want to think about the From Name as basically the start of your subject line because that's how we're consuming the email. And so going back to the newsletter, start a second newsletter, okay. And have it come from you as a person. Right? And the amount of extra opens, extra engagement is off the charts.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Okay. Never even heard of this. So, Jay, I have never done that. I will absolutely be exploring this. This is why I love to talk to you because you always have tips to get that open rate up, to get that click rate up, to get the engagement overall up. So, my friends, if you're listening right now, keep listening because we have more of this. And I have a section of like how to hack your email marketing where we're going to do a rapid fire. So all your questions are going to be answered today, but we're staying on this personal newsletter because I'm fascinated and I know a lot of my listeners, they're either already sending out a personal newsletter or they want to. So this next question, it kind of blends like the company and the personality. So we've talked about how brands should be tapping into personalities within their teams to build real connections. And I fully get that part. But what's the best way you found to blend this type of like personal storytelling with marketing content in a newsletter because it's still a business at the end of the day. So how do you blend those two?

[Amy Porterfield]

Well, first of all, it's so important to get comfortable being uncomfortable. You can't have a personal newsletter that is just basically a promotional email or a regular newsletter in disguise. You have to let yourself be seen in that newsletter. So it. First of all, it starts with the body copy, right? You're going to have little different content blocks. And instead of it saying the latest trends in the nutrition sector, right. It went to your personal newsletter. It's going to say, this thing really blew my mind. You got to check this out. And then you get into the content block. It's more like you're having a conversation with somebody. But with personal newsletters and newsletters in general, you have to give people a reason that they want to open it. And the reason is not going to be because you have a new webinar. It's not going to be because you have some sort of new tip sheet. That is not the reason they are open it. They're going to open it because they feel connected to you. So I'll tell you about my newsletter. And this was a game changer for my business. So I had a newsletter and my personal newsletter. I would send it out. It would do fine. And then randomly, one time, on the bottom of my newsletter, I wrote this sentence. I said, not that anybody asked, but I'm listening to Yacht rock right now. And I watched the Bachelor last night and it was a terrible episode. Okay? I don't know why I included that. I hit send.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Two very random things. For the record, I don't know what.

[Amy Porterfield]

Moment I was having. I'm like, what is going on? I hit send. And then usually you get a handful of people replying to the thing or nobody, holy cow, we got flooded. Nobody was asking me about my business. Of course. They were like, I saw the Bachelor too. That guy's a clown. I love yacht rock. What else do you listen to? I'm like, what is going on? Right? And then the next newsletter, I went deeper. So fast forward. I mean, get. Sending my newsletter out for years now. And I have a section at the bottom of my newsletter called since you didn't ask. And in that section, I talk about the most ridiculous things. I talk about whoever is being a fool on, you know, love is blind or the and Bachelorette. I talk about going to the supermarket and I can't stand anybody that's there. They drive Me crazy. I talk about getting Botox for my wife because she's a dermatologist. I'll talk about anything that's going on in my life, right? Because people feel connected to that. They feel connected to that. I guarantee you, if you had in your newsletter, Amy Porterfield, a section at the bottom. Because I know you're going to be possibly getting many cows at some point in your life. You mentioned podcast.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Many cows are coming my way.

[Amy Porterfield]

Many cows. If you had a section of your newsletter at the bottom that said mini cow update, everybody would open up that newsletter in school, right to the bottom and be like, I need to know what's going on with Amy's mini cows. Right? Because you feel connected. And it's that little thing. It doesn't seem like it's a lot, but then anything I put in there as an offer, it does incredibly well. Because people like, I gotta check this out. I want to read more. I want to be connected. And it's this idea of getting comfortable being uncomfortable. Because in my real life, in my regular life, I don't tell anybody anything. I avoid people. I don't like going out to dinner with them. They annoy me. But in my newsletter, I like to share what's going on.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Okay, well, this is good to know. I learn more about you every single time we get on a call. So good to know. So I'm glad you brought up the offers because obviously we're learning the more personalization, the better opportunity you're going to have for people to click on that offer and check it out. So I love that. So I want to get into that a little bit more so we realize that that personality coming through on a newsletter is essential. But newsletters also need to drive revenue, like you said. So you've given us a few strategies, but what other strategies have you seen that work best for turning those engaged newsletter subscribers into actual buyers? Because you do a good job with that in your email newsletter as well.

[Amy Porterfield]

I appreciate that. So one thing is to not be visually boring. I think it's one of the biggest fails in newsletters. What do I mean by that? When you open up a newsletter and you see a big text block, right? Imagine you get a text from, like, a friend during the day, and it's a giant text block. You look at you like, whoa, I don't know what that says. I will look at that later.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Absolutely.

[Amy Porterfield]

I mean, I don't have time for it over that. That hot messes, right? But when you get an email and you open it up and there's a big text block. You just like, I'm done. I don't even care if it says I want a billion dollars. I'm not looking at that. Because visually, it's kind of boring. It feels like work and it's in your subconscious. So what you want to think about, very importantly, is you really don't want to have more than four lines. I like having three lines and any text block that I have, that's really, really critical. So that's one element that I always want to think about. The other thing is if you're trying to bring back people right to your site in some way, you want them to check something out, there's going to be longer copy there about whatever it is that you're promoting, selling, doing whatever. In your text blocks in your newsletter, you want to put brackets at the end of your text blocks that say something like the number three. Like three min read three minutes, dot, dot, dot, read. Okay. And you want to tell people that when they click on this link, they only have to invest two minutes or three minutes of their time because they want to know nobody has time for anything. And when you actually put that in there, two min read, three men read, whatever. As part of the end of your text block, click through. Rates rise by about 15% just by doing that. So you want to think about the experience that somebody has when they're in your newsletter.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Okay. Again, have never done that. So essentially, if I want them to go read an article or go check out even a sales page or anything like that, where I'm going to tell them how long it will take them to actually consume that content on the other side of the link.

[Amy Porterfield]

Totally. And I mean, think about for yourself right before you were going to click on that thing, maybe you're not thinking about it consciously, but you're like, all right, do I really have time for this? I mean, I'm about to go do something else. But when it says two men read, you're like, all right, I have 120 seconds. I could dedicate that to this. And then that is when you jump into stuff and these, you know, email marketing in general, there's never going to be one thing that you do that's going to change everything. It's a series of very little things that add up. And this is one of those little, little things that could be a game changer.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Oh, absolutely. Okay. So that is a yes, we're doing that. And then I was so curious. Do you use AI for your newsletter? What part does AI play in enhancing this personalization strategy that you're recommending here. Or does it?

[Amy Porterfield]

So what I do is I take all of our newsletters. I take all my newsletters and they're. We dump them in. Okay. And we actually say, can you also come up with content ideas similar to this tone? And that's somewhat helpful because you can teach AI to think like you. And in terms of an idea generator, that's great. And then sometimes we'll stick all the copy in there and say, can this be made more personal? Can this feel a little better? But you talk about personalization, and I want to give one personalization tip that I think is kind of a myth. And it's a mess. And it's all out there. And it's related to the subject line because, you know, I love subject lines lines. So a lot of times when we talk about personalization, email people think it means that you're going to put the person's first name in the subject line. Like you'll send it out, It'll say, jay, check out our latest newsletter. That is total garbage. Okay. That used to work. That worked 10 years ago.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Great. Because I'm using it. So thanks for nothing.

[Amy Porterfield]

Now I feel really, really, really bad.

[Jay Schwedelson]

You just literally told me I'm an idiot.

[Amy Porterfield]

Thanks. You're brilliant. So sorry.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Well, I'm. I'm holding my breath. What is working? And if I'm not doing that, what am I doing?

[Amy Porterfield]

Okay. So the reason it no longer works, putting the person's first name in the subject line is that so many people do it. That doesn't stand out anymore. Right. It literally gets you almost no lift anymore because it's everywhere. But the personalization that works is this idea that you always want to have in your mind is tell the person who they are as fast as humanly possible. What do I mean by that? Let's say you are a fitness coach or something like that. Okay. You want to tell these people that you are communicating to this population of people who they are, what are they? Oh, they're fitness enthusiasts. Great. This, the subject line would send, say, big update just for fitness enthusiasts. And then I get that email and I'm like, wait a minute, I'm a fitness enthusiast. This is for me. I got to check that out. The faster somebody can see themselves in that subject line. Oh, this is for active investors only. I'm an active investor. I have to check that out. This is really popular in Miami. Oh, I live near Miami. I need to check that out. When you personalize the subject Line with interest or life stages. You know, this is for new business owners. New business owners need to check this out. Interest or life stage or geography as your subject line, personalization element. It will lift your open rates by over 30% because instantly the person goes, oh, this is for me and not for everybody else. So personalization is not what it was, you know, five, 10 years ago. It has changed.

[Jay Schwedelson]

I was going to end this section because we're going to go into all the challenges my students are having with email marketing right now. So we're. We're going to go into that next. But I have one more question that kind of puts you on the spot. You already gave us a lot of tips, but, Jay, what have I not asked you? I've never done a newsletter like this, so I wasn't exactly sure what to ask you or what people should stay away from. What are some final tips for a personalized newsletter? To get more open rates, get more clicks, get more sales, that maybe I didn't ask.

[Amy Porterfield]

I think if you're going to go down the personal newsletter route and I can't recommend strongly enough is to have a little bit of thick skin. You're going to get unsubscribes. People are like, ah, this isn't this. What is this? Right? You get people like, oh, I don't want to know about that, okay? And people get nervous about unsubscribes. People get nervous about nasty grams. They're like, oh, you're a terrible person, whatever it is. And then we react to the loudest voice in the room, which is a horrible thing to do. It's a. So here's a stat that you want to plant in your mind, okay? Over 90% of unsubscribes people say take me off your list are from people who have not opened or clicked on one of your emails in over six months. These are not your people. People are allowed to move on. People are allowed to change their lives. So you're going to get massive benefit from going down this personal newsletter path, but you're also going to get a little bit more of that uncomfortable. Take me off your list. Why are you sending me this? And you have to just be ready for it. And you have to manage your own expectation because that doesn't mean you're on the wrong pat. It just means that you're actually standing out for the first time. Okay? And these people are like, you know what? You're not my jam. And that's okay.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Yes, that's actually a really great point. I get you made me think of one more question. So in your personal newsletter, because some people are listening and they haven't seen yours yet. So in your personal newsletter, most of the content around email marketing and strategies for online businesses, that stuff's not personal, right?

[Amy Porterfield]

Right. No, yeah, so, so yeah, my content is strategies, tips and all that type of stuff. And then inserted in like, probably every third text block would be an offer of some kind. Oh, check out the podcast, check out our webinar, check out whatever nonsense. So we insert it in like every like third block. But the tone, how you write it is really the difference maker. I mean your newsletter is the same way. You almost feel like you hear Amy, you know, you, your voice while you're reading it and that's how you have to write it. You can't just send it out and use the exact same copy, the exact same tone as your regular brand one because it's not going to resonate, it's going to fall flat and people are like, what is going on here? So writing in that personal tone. But yeah, I have all the tips, but it's written still in a, in a first person way.

[Jay Schwedelson]

When do you send your email newsletter?

[Amy Porterfield]

I'm horrible. Okay, so my newsletter is, should go out, you know, every Thursday. But it doesn't. But I'm going to give you one newsletter tip that I think everyone sleeps on. You should do it. Everybody should do on this planet. I'm gonna get a lot of heat for it. Don't care any newsletter out there when you put together, even if you keep it as your brand newer, fine. Everybody puts a lot of time and energy into their newsletter, right? And I'm derelict with always getting my out on the perfect day and time. I know that because it takes so much time to do, right? But what do we all do? We hit send and they go, thank God I don't have to do this for another oh my God. Onto the next right. Oh my God. And that's it. But to tell you the truth, that's not enough. You want to send out your newsletter a second time to the non openers and you want to do it a very specific way. So when you send out your newsletter, let's say on a Thursday, great, you got out the door. Now it's Sunday and Sunday's a great day for your resender your newsletter, by the way. So you know, it's Sunday and everybody who hasn't opened up that, that newsletter from the first send, right, you got a 40% open rate of the first one, but you have 60% of people didn't open it on Sunday. You send out the exact same newsletter, exact same copy to them on Sunday but you change the subject line and you be very direct about the fact that you know they didn't open it and you make that subject line say something like literally dot that, that I think you missed this or oh, you scrolled past this and you make it very intentional that they missed the first send. And when you send out that second newsletter, touch to the non openers within three days, okay. On average you're going to get about another 20 to 25% of people opening up your email. Overall, it costs you nothing. And it takes so much time to put this newsletter together. To send it out once is a crime. It's an absolute crime. So to me that's probably the number one tactic I would do in email newsletter marketing. Period.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Okay, done that one. Jay, you're going to be very happy to hear we do that one. But I don't know if it's on a Sunday so I actually want to kind of play around with that to see if it is. So I think that would be fantastic. Okay, do you send out not promotional but do you send any other value packed emails during the week? So if Thursday is the day you're supposed to be sending it, are you doing anything Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday or Friday?

[Amy Porterfield]

We have an email going out every single day. The only one that comes from me is, is my personal newsletter. But then we have other, we have an event notification thing. We have a different, we have a, we have a brand newsletter. We literally have an email that goes out every single day of the week. But we mess with that from name a lot. It's that from, you know, it's interesting. If you go to your inbox, you look at Apple, okay, get, take all the emails you get from Apple and you will see you don't get all the emails just from Apple. It comes from Apple Card, it comes from Apple tv, it comes from Apple's app store. They're messing with that from name. So when you're getting all like five emails in one day from Apple you don't feel like hey, why is Apple sending me so much stuff? You think you're getting it from those five different things. And when, when I do that with mine, right? You don't think oh Jay's annoying. Which you might but you're really doing, you're saying oh, this is a different thing. This is about his events, this is about his agency, this is about whatever. So Using that from Name, it actually gives you a license to be able to send out more to your database because the recipient doesn't feel like it's all the same thing.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Now, if I sign up for your newsletter, am I going to see all those emails? Jay, I don't think I've seen you email me every single day.

[Amy Porterfield]

Well, you're on probably some of my lists, not all of my. I'll add you to all of my lists.

[Jay Schwedelson]

So you do add me to all of it. So you do. You do segmenting, which would make sense for what you do in your business. Okay, great. Okay, so now's the time to tell everybody. Where do they go to sign up for your newsletter?

[Amy Porterfield]

If you just go to my entire, full, long, Horribly Ridiculous Name, jschweddelson.com youm will find my newsletter button right there. And also, if you sign up on subjectline.com, you'll eventually get sucked into my newsletter universe as well. Well, so subject line.com and JSON.com is where you could sign up for all the updates on Love is Blind, the Bachelor Universe, and everything else stupid that I'm involved with.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Well, you know, I care about it all just for one time because it's a hard last name. Spell it for me.

[Amy Porterfield]

Oh, that's nice. S, C, H, W, E, D, E, L, S, O, N. And I couldn't spell that until I was, like, in seventh grade. So this, you know, it's a tough.

[Jay Schwedelson]

It's a tough one. In the first time we were on a call together, you made me say your last name, and I was terrified. Before the record. I nailed it.

[Amy Porterfield]

You did nail it. You did nail it.

[Jay Schwedelson]

So that's good stuff. Okay, so I was on Jay's show. I've been on Jay's show a few times. And one of the things I really love about your show is that we did just different sections so we could literally change the whole topic and we went somewhere else. So that's exactly what we're doing on this show with you as well, because you gave me the idea. So we are changing up our topic here because I want to talk about email list growth hacks that go beyond just starting your email. So, you know, on this podcast, I'm going beyond how to start an email list, how to grow your email list from scratch, all of that. You're talking to people today that they have lists of 10,000, 20,000, 60,000 people on their list. But, Jay, they're struggling. They're struggling with open rates. They're struggling with Click through rates. And specifically, one of my students said to me, amy, I cannot not land in that dang promo tab. Like, what am I doing wrong? And she's tried all these things, Jay. So can you talk about how to stay out of that pesky promo tab?

[Amy Porterfield]

Yeah. So this is a great topic. And I'm going to tell everybody right now, don't get out of the promo tab. What? I'm going to tell you why.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Okay, talking about.

[Amy Porterfield]

I'm going to tell you why. Because first of all, we all only have so much time in the day and this is a waste of energy. I'm going to give you the data as to why it's a waste of energy. Okay? Your issue, whatever your issue is your email, it's not getting the sponsor you want open, whatever it is, not because of the promo tab. And here is the reality of that. First of all, the promotions tab, there's one for Gmail, right? This is a tab where all your promotional email goes. And there's one for Apple now, right? They have these categorizations where your emails can go in their promotions tab. Apple released that in the last year or so. Now, the promotions tab is still part of the inbox. People think it's the junk folder. It's not. It's part of the inbox. Now, the kicker is, do people actually even really use the promotions tab? And here's the Data. Less than 30% of Gmail users have it turned on. And that number has been shrinking less and less people actually have it turned on. So less than 30% of people do have it turned on on Apple. It's even a fraction of that. You're talking about like 10% right now that have that categorization on. So it's a very small population. But here's the wild part of the people that do have it turned on. 50% of them check it daily. And it's wild because if you think about the promotions tab, when you go into it, it's like going to the mall. When you go to the mall, you're in buying mode. You're like, I'm in the mall. What am I buying? Right? And when you go to the promotions tab, you're not lost. You're not like, where am I? Am I lost? What's happening? No, you clicked on it because you're looking for offers, you're looking for stuff, right? So literally 50% of these people that have it turned on are going in there every single day looking for stuff and offers and opportunities. So trying to get out of it is a major pain in the butt. It really is. And it doesn't work. I don't care what anybody tells you. All the tricks, all the whatever, it will work for like a minute and then it won't work again. You're going to chase your tail. You got bigger issues to work on to get that engagement. Forget the promotions tab. It is not your problem.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Okay, then what is my problem?

[Amy Porterfield]

Your problem. Okay, so a few fold. So let's say you, you, you've dropped. Let's say you used to get, you know, a 40% open rate. Now you got a 20 open rate. And you're like, what am I doing wrong? All this stuff. So a few things. Number one, you want to put your data every year, once a year, through a validation service. I'm not paid by any of these companies. I'm not an affiliate with any of them. I'll tell you who I use. I use a company called Zero Bounce. Okay? What that means is every year we take our databases, we give it to Zero Bounce, and they put it through their tool. It's very inexpensive. I'm talking about like hundreds of dollars for very large lists. And what it does is it will validate the email addresses that you have. It will remove spam traps which could be holding back your performance. It'll remove all the bad stuff. And usually that removal of those bad things that you don't know in your database, okay, that's usually going to solve a lot of your problems. Now let's say that doesn't solve your problem and you want to do that at least once a year. It's kind of like putting your, your clothes to the laundromat or a car wash. You got to do that. That's like table stakes now. But then if you're still having issues, what I would say is take your file, okay? And take anybody who has not opened or clicked on one of your emails in over six months and just sideline them for a minute. Don't include them on the next few cents. Put them off to the side and take all your engaged people, the people that have an opening and clicking, whatever, and do your regular sends that you're doing to them. If you don't see a massive difference in engagement, you don't see everything just skyrocket. Oh, my God. We are crushing it with our Engage database, which you very likely will see that. But if you don't, that's when you know, okay, I do have a major problem because this is a subset of people that really dig my Content that love our stuff and now they're not open and clicking. Oh, let's talk to our platform. Let's get. Really dig into this. But before you raise all these flags and all this stuff, see if you actually have a problem.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Okay. These are great tips. I think that was very doable. I'm a big fan of affiliate marketing and I really think you should be an affiliate for that company. You know, zero bounce is what you said, zero bounce.

[Amy Porterfield]

But I like not because I want people. And this looks. There's a million companies out there. There really are. And I think it's such an important thing to do. I don't want anybody to think that I have a bias here saying, go and work with this. Because I don't, I don't. There's nothing in it for me other than people getting better deliverability because it is holding back so much performance.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Got it. So I'm going to say it. It's amyporterfield.com forward slash, zero bounce. Just joking. I've never even used the company, but you can bet I will because that, that's a good tip. Okay, so that's open rates. Let's talk about click through rates. What tips do you have to increase click through rates?

[Amy Porterfield]

Okay, well, the problem is once we get that email opened, what are those buttons? What are we doing? Like, how are we getting people to actually interact with everything? And then the questions always become, number one, should I have a text link? Should I have a rectangle which I. Yes, you want to have everything. Okay. But the biggest issue that we have is we get excited when we send out an email. We have an offer email. What do we do? We like, oh, I'm not only going to put in the. The links to the offer, I'm going to have links going here, there and all over the place, which is ridiculous. Anytime you hit send, you're hoping something happens, right? Like, I have this offer. I hope this one thing happens. There should be no other thing that you can do in that email except get to the offer page for that thing, whatever it is. Why do you have social sharing links in your promotional emails? Is the goal to get somebody to follow you on Instagram? Is the goal of that email to get somebody to go to your YouTube page? Why are they there? The goal for that one email is to get them to interact with that offer. So you want to think about every conduit to response every link in that message only going that offer destination page. Even the logo. Okay. In your message, believe it or not, the logo in your email will get about 20% of all the clicks every time you hit send. Yeah, because you get that email and you're looking around, which I click on, and you click on it, and I guarantee you the logo in your message, whatever email it is, is probably going to your homepage and not your offer page. One in five clicks are just going to the wrong place. So think about every conduit that you have and drive it to that one location, and you will see an exponential change in the consumption of your offers.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Okay, that's fantastic. And then so we talked open rates, click through rates. I would love to know what do you do to grow your email list? You are the best of the best, and you have a very big email list. So what do you do to grow your email list? What's working for you?

[Amy Porterfield]

I'll tell you one tactic that I. I've only started doing the last probably two years, which is every call that I'm on, I know this is a small thing, but it actually matters. Every call that I go on with anybody, okay, I will say to them, and I have my team do this as well. Hey, we have this amazing newsletter. Would it be okay? Can we add you to that list? We'd love to get you whatever. And they'll be like, oh, yeah, sure, absolutely. And then we get off the call and we add them. And you don't realize it, but every single day, maybe you have five to ten calls, okay? And then the end of the month, maybe you've done, I don't know, a hundred phone calls. And maybe on those calls, you've had two to three people. And now at the end of the month, you have a couple hundred people. But these aren't regular people. Okay? You're having a call with somebody that is really relevant to your business, or else you wouldn't have had a call with them. All right? And these are people that can amplify what you're doing. You want to be thinking about, I need to be adding people all the time in every moment of my life, especially these kind of like, VIP people. So on every call that you do, you want to say, hey, would you mind? Can I add you to my list? And make sure anybody that's representing you does the exact same thing. And instantly you have it set up to do that because it will amplify you. You'll get more business from that, because these are the people you need. The other thing, and you do a great job of this is that one field data collection. Okay? When somebody goes anywhere, however, you're collecting your people, signing up for your newsletter, getting on your list. Just collect the wanted field, the email address. Yes, that's it. Get the one.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Oh, wait, not even first name.

[Amy Porterfield]

I wouldn't just. I'm a fan of. Just get that email address. And here's why. Every additional field that you ask somebody, you lose, on average about 10% of people signing up. Okay. Get everything else later on. Okay, you don't need it now. Yes, you want. There's a big difference in marketing between what you want and what you need. Okay? It doesn't matter what you want. It's what you can get later on that matters. So have that one field make it as easy as humanly possible to join your list, and you're going to see growth.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Okay? I love this. And do you grow your email list by like checklists, guides, quizzes? Do you use all the stuff that we use?

[Amy Porterfield]

Yeah, 100%. So content is everything. And the weird part is one word here or there can change your content consumption. So what do I mean by that? Instead of, you know, the guide for, you know, fitness pros or whatever, just by adding things like, for example, the ultimate guide, when you call something the ultimate guide versus just a guide, exponential difference. I mean, the amount of people sign up for is un. Believable. Or instead of a tip sheet, insider tip sheet, forget it. The thing goes into the stratosphere in terms of people wanting to consume it. Because I want to be an insider. I want the ultimate thing. So thinking about every word, especially the first word, is going to be a game changer. And I, I use every type of content format in terms of getting it downloaded that you could possibly imagine. Like right now, for example, we've, we're completely done with white papers. I don't even know how to read a white paper. I'm not smart enough for that. So they're dead to me. Infographics from 1985, I don't know what those are. They're dead to me. Ebooks have really gone on the back burner. Nobody reads an e book, really. Right. So you want to think about what is hot right now. The hottest stuff right now are blueprints are doing really, really well, cheat sheets and checklists. And really, at the end of the day, they're all the same thing. They really are. But you know what, you kind of, you have to kind of test through all of it.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Okay, final question with email marketing, growth and hacks. So you're measuring open rates, you're measuring click through rates. But to make sure that you are attracting the right people and they're going to convert. What else should I be measuring?

[Amy Porterfield]

I think, of course you're going to measure the backend stuff, all of that. But one of the things I don't know that everybody's looking at, which is when you're sending out your email and you have different information, let's say your newsletter or whatever you're sending out, and the content block is about a particular thing. So let's say you are that nutrition company, whatever, and you have a content block in there that's about. This is for marathon running or something. Who knows? Something very specific. Now, later on, anybody that clicked on that content block. Right. That specific topic, you want to make sure that they're tagged with that topic in your CRM. Because then down the road you're like, okay, we have a product for, you know, runners who run long distances, as opposed to people that just, you know, are trying to go to the gym for the first time. It's a new segment. And because you have tagged all the people that clicked on that, that content piece, you now have a segment. Okay. That you can then turn around and market to. It doesn't matter what your industry. You know, if you're targeting small business owners, are they clicking on how to do their billing better? Are they trying to. Are they clicking on HR stuff? Whatever it is, you want to make sure that you are categorizing and tagging in your databases. Okay. What people are raising their hand, saying that they're interested in by the activity that they're doing in the emails that you're sending out, because those segments are then gold for future offers down the road. And that's something we look at all the time that I don't think enough people are really paying attention to.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Okay, that's fantastic. I would have not known that. I really feel like I'm a smart marketer, but every time you come on the show, I'm like, I know nothing. So thanks for all the information.

[Amy Porterfield]

You literally wrote the book.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Does It Feel Like It Today? So, okay, we're moving into our final section. So we went over personalized newsletters, some of those email growth strategies and hacks. Now I want to take a very sharp turn because you're doing something that not a lot of people are fully embracing, and that is you've been leaning into actual live events. They're summits, they're online. But live events have kind of become your thing. I've spoken at a few of them. They're really popular. Lots of people. You always get a really good keynote, which is so cool. I want to talk about that too, because I'm like, where are you getting these amazing keynotes? So why, why live events? Why are you leaning into those right now?

[Amy Porterfield]

You know, coming out of COVID virtual events got really stained. They really did. And it's because what everybody did coming out of COVID was everyone that was putting on in person events, they quickly like, oh, we got to make it virtual. And they tried to, you know, recreate just the same thing they were doing in person online. And it didn't work. And so everyone stopped doing these virtual events when we were like, you know what? There's a better way to do them. If we can make them more fun, more engaging, something that you want to attend, something that you feel part of, we think people will come. And that's what we did. And we also got rid of, believe it or Not, On Demand. I think On Demand is ruining virtual events because you just. You feel like. It's like, you know, how often do you register for something with no intention of going? You just get the On Demand link, and then nobody watched the On Demand link. Like, like literally nobody.

[Jay Schwedelson]

And I think I say that about webinar replays. I don't. Enough people watch those either. So, yeah, so we actually stopped doing replays. And then my last launch.

[Amy Porterfield]

That's exactly right. Right. It's like, because of Netflix, we just think it's always going to be there, so screw it. We don't, you know, who cares, right? So what we now do is something called Earned On Demand, which in order to get the On Demand link, you have to show up to our virtual events, which are usually two days for at least one hour. And if you show up for one hour, it triggers the On Demand link. So, you know, you have to kind of like pay to play almost. And our events are all free. Everything I do is 100% free. So getting people to show up for free stuff is even harder than when they pay and they feel invested. So this earned On Demand idea has worked out really, really well. But to your point, we try to treat them very, very differently. And I'll give you an example of something that we would never do with our. Like, we rob webinars. Okay. So a lot of your listeners put on webinars. And I think one of the biggest mistakes in promoting a webinar is what everybody does. What, what do we all do in that subject line? You're promoting a webinar. We start the subject line with the word webinar, it's like webinar colon, blah, blah, blah, blah. You might as well start the subject line and say boring colon, blah, blah, blah, blah.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Yes. Don't click here.

[Amy Porterfield]

Right? Please, please ignore this. This is vomit. I mean, you don't. Nobody wants to have another webinar in their calendar. They just don't. Right? So we have to stop thinking about promoting the format, the vehicle of what it is that we're talking about. It doesn't matter that it's a webinar. It doesn't even matter. It's a live event. You promote the topic to get people excited. Right. The ultimate email marketing tips. Right. The ultimate thing for small business owners. Then they open it up. What is it? Oh, it's going to be this 60 minute webinar, 30 minute webinar, blah, blah, blah, whatever it is that is so, so important. And then the other thing is time. You know, we talked about that tip before. With two minute read, three minute read, we keep our sessions really, really short. And I think it's important. Even if you're not doing a giant live event, if you're doing a webinar, we see it in the data. When you promote your event as a 30 minute event as opposed to a 60 minute event, we see just a massive increase in registration rate because people like, I can give 30 minutes, I can't give 60 minutes. And if you can't get it out in 30 minutes, you're ridiculous. You can get out whatever you have to do in 30 minutes, but you want to promote it as 30 minutes. So if you're not testing the length of time and you putting that aggressively in your, in your messaging, I think you're missing out. Yeah. So we have one of our crazy events coming up, as a matter of fact.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Okay, you do. Where I'm actually really excited because it's called eventtastic. So this is the first event you've done about events. So tell me about that.

[Amy Porterfield]

Yeah. So to your point, we think we do things so differently that we're like, you know what, we got to put on an event about events. So fantastic. It's a virtual event. It is free. It's two days. It's for anybody that puts on small events, big events, in person events, online events, webinars, if you want to get better at public speaking, anything related to events. And it's going to be wild. Amy, you're going to be there. I cannot thank you enough for doing this. She's going to be sharing about her events and webinars and then we try to keep it fun. So, for example, we have Andy Cohen from Bravo. Okay. He's keynoting this thing. And why did we get Andy? Because he puts on BravoCon. So he's an event marketer. And we said to Andy, go, listen, this thing's about events. He's like, I'm in. This is gonna be awesome. So eventtastic is gonna be great.

[Jay Schwedelson]

You and I love reality tv. So when you told me it was Andy Cohen, I was like, why aren't you doing this in person? So I get to meet him. So I don't even like to go to live events in person, but I would show up for that one. So what a great keynote speaker. I think that is so fantastic. And I'm assuming events like this help you grow your email list, especially if they're free 100%.

[Amy Porterfield]

Yeah. I mean, that is the secret sauce, right? We're all about everyone's signing up, signing up, signing up. And it allowed us to grow our database massively. I'm a big fan of free. I think this idea of just always, you know, charging for stuff, I'm trying to build a big tent, right? And if you're trying to grow your database, do whatever. You have to give some thought leadership. You have to establish yourself in that category. And you're not going to do that if you keep it really small. So it's one thing. If down the road you've grown a big database and now you want to monetize that and you want to kind of pull out from that and charge for stuff, great. But if you're going into a new category or it's a new topic or it's new, whatever. So, like, for example, event marketing and Eventastic, it's brand new for us. So I can't go in there and be like, hi, I have no credibility here. Please give me $500 for a ticket. They'd be like, what? What are you talking about?

[Jay Schwedelson]

So it's called Eventtastic. It's completely free. Where do they go, Jay, to sign up?

[Amy Porterfield]

Oh, appreciate that. So eventtastic.com. so I haven't said this right yet, but it's event astic, so it's got one one t. So fantastic dot com. And I, first of all, thank you so much for speaking at this, especially the first year. I think I know you're going to crush it. It's going to be super fun.

[Jay Schwedelson]

It's going to be fantastic. And there are so many other people speaking at this event that have done incredible things with online events, in person events. And I love that you're mixing it up, like webinars, summits, workshops in person. Like, I think that that's so cool. So you're going to get a lot out of this. So eventtastic.com make sure to sign up. I'll be there. Can't wait to see you, Jay. It's always a pleasure. I literally selfishly ask you to come on the show for my own email marketing strategies, and then I just happen to let my audience listen as well. So I always have an ulterior motive to this. So thank you so much.

[Amy Porterfield]

Well, I love this show genuinely. I've been a listener forever. You are just doing amazing things for so many people. So it's an honor to be here. So thanks for including me.

[Jay Schwedelson]

Thank you, my friend. Have a good day. Take care.

[Amy Porterfield]

Bye.