Scott Fuller on Why Substance Beats Style in Graphic Design

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Angry Designer – “Scott Fuller on Why Substance Beats Style in Graphic Design”

Date: September 4, 2025
Host: Massimo (with Sean & Jude)
Guest: Scott Fuller (The Studio Temporary)

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Episode Theme & Purpose

In this episode, The Angry Designer welcomes celebrated designer and educator Scott Fuller to discuss what it really means to build a fulfilling creative career—through substance over style, resilience, and the hard truths behind creative success. Listeners journey through Scott’s unconventional path, early struggles, big wins, and philosophies on design, mentorship, and the constant evolution creative professionals face.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Scott Fuller’s Background: An Unlikely Start

• Family and Early Interests:
  Scott grew up in a blue-collar family—dad a machinist, mom an elementary school teacher (“My dad is a machinist. My mom was a elementary school teacher. I grew up around racing…” [02:02])—with a childhood filled with sports and creative instincts, like drawing for classmates.
• Path to Design:
  Though academically focused (calculus, trig, physics), Scott only took his first art class in his senior year of high school:

  “I had never taken an art class before… but I fell in love.” ([02:37])
  He entered college at 16, originally for mechanical engineering, before sneaking away from the engineering tour to the art department and finding his true calling.

Early Career: Struggles and the Value of Hardship

• First Design Experiences:
  Scott’s discovery of the logic and creativity of logo design mapped perfectly to his analytic background. He thrived in design classes and became “obsessed” with logos.
  • His inspiration came from legendary designers and design mentors such as Chip Kidd and Steph Guy Spieler (designer of the NBC logo) ([05:46]).
• Tough Beginnings:
  Scott graduated in 2008 during the Great Recession. Despite a solid internship, a job offer vanished due to client losses. He held various jobs—UPS grunt, machine shop worker, and more, often being laid off and at one point, faced eviction:

  “I remember just that stuck with me for years to the point where it became unhealthy. Obsession comes with a cost and no one talks about that.” ([21:24])

• Family Support:
  Despite hardship, Scott credits his wife and family for steadfast support.

Building The Studio Temporary

• The Origin Story:
  After leaving a trucking firm, Scott started his studio in the back of an old sign shop—“good design wherever I happened to be” ([19:39]). The humorous (yet apt) name stuck.
  • He worked day and night, balancing daytime jobs with building his studio (“I had an 8 to 5 and a 9 to 5.” [20:39])
  • Despite rejection and instability, Scott persisted, developing a reputation for his distinctive approach and forming a strong brand vision.

The Importance of Substance Over Style

• Longevity in Design:
  Scott was influenced by mentors who prioritized timelessness over trends:

  “I want to make stuff that's going to last, stuff that never has to be redesigned.” ([11:28])

• Personal Philosophy:
  Rather than approaching each project with a fixed style, Scott grounds his work in the needs and identity of the client, with an emphasis on clarity, boldness, and enduring solutions.

  “I push substance over style. It might come out a certain way, but if it fits the substance of it—it works.” ([51:44])

Pivotal Moments & Notable Projects

• Hawks/ESPN Project:
  Scott’s expertise landed him work with ESPN—but he stood his ground on ethical credit and process:

  “If you’re going to cobble this together… whose name are you putting on it? Because it won’t be mine.” ([42:26])

  • This resulted in a pivotal project with the Atlanta Hawks, creating the identity for their NBA 2K esports team—a rare honor not given to Nike’s agency as with every other team. His unique approach and “portfolio poster” won him the contract ([45:05]).
• Collaborations:
  Noteworthy collaborations include branding work with Killer Mike (Run the Jewels) and TI, and a strong presence in Atlanta’s arts and music scene.

Key Career Wisdom: Perseverance and Authenticity

• Hardship as Teacher:

  “There’s no question that hardship defines who we become… Running the agency almost seems like peanuts compared to the shit that you went through.” ([33:52])

• Not Fitting In:
  Scott encourages listeners to embrace their individuality, recounting a pivotal decision to turn down a dream job that didn’t value interns or align with his values.

  “Just because you don't fit somewhere, even though you love the work, that's okay.” ([37:05])

Mentorship, Teaching, and the Next Generation

• Scott on Mentoring:
  “I've been an adjunct professor…for the last four years. I've been doing mentorship for last six years... My current studio manager was one of my mentees.” ([52:21], [53:30])
• Challenges Facing New Designers:
  Scott warns against shortcut culture, especially around social media “process” posts and reliance on AI:

  “What they don't realize is there's all these years of learning and doing… It's not an algorithm that gets you to that point.” ([57:27])

• AI & Creative Practice:
  He’s not anti-AI, but insists creativity must come first:

  “My biggest issue … is how early it's being used in the process… You threw it all away because you weren't willing to put in the time to actually design this out and to fail.” ([59:10]) “I want to see the mess ups. Your sketches are for you … so mess up and be okay with it.” ([61:03])

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Scott on discovering design:

  “My first class was a design class. I fell in love. I said, this is what I'm gonna do for the rest of my life. And I knew it after 10 minutes.” ([03:39])

• On resilience and obsession:

  “Obsession comes with a cost and no one talks about that.” ([21:24])

• Turning down a dream, upholding self-respect:

  “I turned it down … because I was always going to resent them for that.” ([36:35])

• Client collaboration wisdom:

  “It's a collaborative process, and we have to treat it as such.” ([48:46])

• Advice to young designers:

  “I never want to get to a point where I feel like I've made it, because that’s the plateau of my career.” ([59:03])

• The importance of the creative process over tools:

  “Your sketches are for you, they're not for your client. So mess up and be okay with it.” ([61:08])

• On persistence:

  “Dad basically saying, if you make it to five years, there's no stopping you.” ([56:15])

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Scott’s Background and Path to Design – [02:02] to [07:12]
• Early Struggles, First Jobs and Starting Out – [09:13] to [19:39]
• Creation and Ethos of The Studio Temporary – [19:39] to [24:10]
• In-House Design and Facing Toxic Work Environments – [25:17] to [29:47]
• Going Solo & Hardship Lessons – [29:47] to [33:29]
• Foundational Beliefs: Substance Over Style – [51:32] to [52:16]
• High Points: Atlanta Hawks, Collaborating with Killer Mike & TI – [41:25] to [49:57]
• Mentorship, Teaching, and Critique of Modern Design Trends – [52:21] to [61:45]
• Advice for New Designers & Reflections on Learning – [56:28] to [61:58]

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Tone & Atmosphere

This episode is candid, warm, and empowering, with plenty of laughter and camaraderie. Scott’s authenticity shines through stories of failure, triumph, and humility. The hosts maintain a casual, occasionally cheeky tone, but there’s a deep respect for hard-won experience and self-awareness.

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Takeaways for Designers

• Resilience matters more than talent; hardship forges character.
• True design is about solving problems, not following trends.
• It’s okay not to fit in—find where you belong and own your story.
• Don’t shortcut the design process—embrace mistakes, invest in growth.
• Client collaboration improves outcomes; ego gets in the way.
• AI and technology are tools, not solutions—original thought is irreplaceable.

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Where to Find Scott Fuller

• The Studio Temporary
• Instagram/Twitter: @studiotemporary
• Streetwear brand: stayiconicbrand.com

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“There’s no question that hardship defines who we become.” – Sean ([35:01])
Stay creative, stay angry, and stay iconic!

Transcript

[Massimo]

You're listening to the Angry Designer podcast, where we help frustrated graphic designers crush industry chaos, ditch social BS and build badass, rewarding careers that actually pay now. Powered by Wix Studio. Mr. Scott. Oh, man, I appreciate it was really looking forward this. Because again, you know, didn't talk too much prior. Think just started foreign.

[Sean]

Actually mutually following each other like six months ago.

[Scott Fuller]

About six months ago. Yeah. Right.

[Sean]

And I'm just like, who the hell is this guy? And, and I mean, holy. It's like we've become friends now. I'm, I think this is actually we, we. We've grown into a funny little group, it seems. And this is really cool.

[Scott Fuller]

So.

[Sean]

And, and I intentionally didn't ask you too much outside of your normal life because I knew we were going to get onto this, but up until now I've just been.

[Scott Fuller]

I just thought it's just because you, you weren't friendly or something. I'm like, this guy doesn't. I'm asking him all this stuff about him. He's not dating. I'm like, he just doesn't care. It's like, whatever. But then I find out there's a reason behind it. So. There's always a reason. It's like, I'm still upset, but, you know, whatever.

[Jude]

That's all right.

[Sean]

You're still stuck with us for another day.

[Massimo]

So.

[Sean]

So, and, and again. And it's funny because even this morning, because, I mean, okay, what I knew prior to this was, I'm like, oh, God, he's an educator.

[Massimo]

All right.

[Sean]

And this. And we all know I got issues with that, which is. Which is no big issue, but no big deal. But then we started talking more about family. And then this morning we touched on some things and I was like, this, this is exactly who our listeners, who angry designers like, come to the show to listen to. You know, of course they, they'll go and they'll enjoy, you know, some of the big famous people and all the shiny people and all the, the rants. But it's like the good true stories are the ones that resonate best with people.

[Scott Fuller]

So.

[Sean]

So, yeah, let's start, buddy.

[Scott Fuller]

Like, let's start.

[Sean]

Let's just go. So, okay, where did we start? I mean, again, we talked about starting at the university level or even before that, if you want to.

[Scott Fuller]

Okay. Yeah. I mean, just, you know, typical artists. I mean, I, you know, I started drawing when I was a kid. I liked it and I drew it for other kids and, you know, just a bunch of different things. I. My dad is a. Is A machinist. My mom was a elementary school teacher. I grew up around racing. I grew up playing basketball and baseball and street hockey and. And whatnot. Riding bikes in the Culdesac and, you know, jumping over stuff that was always fun.

[Sean]

When did the creative. Creative vibe kick?

[Scott Fuller]

So I would say the real bug probably kicked in about high school, my senior year. I had never taken an art class before.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And I decided I'd give it a shot. I just needed a couple extra credits. And I fell in love. The crazy thing was my scholarship when I got out of college, out of high school, was for mechanical engineering. So I'm not kidding. So high school, I did trig, physics, calculus, the whole bit. I was ready to go.

[Massimo]

Right.

[Scott Fuller]

I graduated high school at 16 and went straight to college. But right before that, I went and did one more little just go through tour of the college and everything. I snuck away from the engineering group after about two minutes and spent the next two days in the art department. And I was like, yeah, this is what I'm gonna do. Wow. So first two years were pen and pencil, painting, different stuff like that. I was very good at it. But I was bored.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

I being bored to death. I was literally two mouse clicks away from blowing that all up and just going and doing mechanical engineering. I'm not kidding. Wow. So I said, I'm gonna give it one more semester. And my first class was a design class. And I fell in love. I said, this is what I'm gonna do for the rest of my life. And I knew it after 10 minutes.

[Massimo]

Wow.

[Scott Fuller]

And that's.

[Sean]

So what was it about the design portion that.

[Scott Fuller]

So when I. When I was doing all the work and everything like that, when I did the painting, the drawing and everything, I'm looking at something and drawing. Looking at something and painting it. And I'm just doing it in different, you know. You know, in different ways. And I'm like, I'm. I never felt like I was actually creating anything.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

So when I found art, I found. Or when I found design, one of the first things they talked about was logo design. They started talking about all these, you know, OG designers and everything. And I was just dumbfounded. I said, I didn't even know this world existed.

[Massimo]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And now I can't get enough of it.

[Sean]

So what's cool about that is it's like it. You can almost see how your past world of, you know, trig and math and all that, actually. Because if you would have said, you know, composition or layout a little different, but Logo design, you know, the true masters. It was so mathematical, even though it was so, you know, visual. So beautiful. So I could see how that, all in a sudden would be so sexy coming from your past.

[Scott Fuller]

Yeah. And I loved it. I mean, my first. My first three logo designs, I think I got, like, A's on all three of them. And I'd never done a logo before.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And it was just. I was obsessed.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

My first. Right after that, right between my junior and senior year, I went to my first ever design conference, which was a how conference.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

In 2007. Now, I want you to think about this. In 2007, 7, 17, 18 years ago now, a student ticket, no workshops, was $650 in 2007.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

It was insane. But I remember going in there and meeting my first talk that I ever heard was Chip Kid.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Who's just freaking amazing. I've had a chance to talk to him like. Like, message him, like, over the years, whatnot. He's like, yeah, if you're ever up in New York and you just want to check out, just let me know. I'm like, oh, my gosh. This guy is. I love this guy so much. But the second talk changed my entire career. And that was Steph Guy Spieler.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

The guy who did the NBC logo. The stuff that he was. So he's in his 80s now, man. He was one of my first mentors.

[Massimo]

Yep.

[Scott Fuller]

And I learned from him, and it was unbelievable. So when I came out of school, so we're talking 2008 to about middle of 2012, everything was sustainability. Right. Everything was green, organic.

[Sean]

All the paper.

[Massimo]

We had brown. Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Browning and craft.

[Sean]

Craft.

[Scott Fuller]

And everything was handcrafted. That's. Well, no, the handcrafted started in 2012.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

I mean, it was bad. I saw a sign that said a handcrafted car wash, and I was like, it's like, so you telling me when my dad sent me outside to wash his truck, you know, I could have charged $50 for, you know, but anyway.

[Sean]

Only if you had shorts on.

[Massimo]

Okay.

[Scott Fuller]

There it is. But, you know, so going from that, I. My first book that I got was the. The trademark book from Schema Geismar. Right. And that spoke to me in a way that no other designer had at that point.

[Massimo]

Right.

[Scott Fuller]

And it just fit along with everything that I believed about work, about design, about that. So I'm like, all right, I'm going to take this and I'm going to start playing around with this and then doing that. And then I went to other Sources. And I was getting cobbling little things about, like, brand audits and, like, talking to clients and all this type of stuff. And for probably two or three years, I'm like, piecing together who I am, how I want to approach this. And it really hasn't changed much in 15 years.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

You know, even from the, even from the beginning, I just got better at it.

[Massimo]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

But the personal thing was like, being. Having a personal aspect to everything was a huge part of it. But that's where I really got my start was the moment I sat down in his talk.

[Massimo]

Yeah, I knew.

[Sean]

So your parents, you said that you. They came, you know, you were going to be a mechanical engineer. You told me the environment. What, what, did they have any sort of life shock when you told them, hey, guess what? I'm going to give up something stable like engineering and just be an artist?

[Scott Fuller]

They. Yeah, I mean, everybody. Everybody got the same. Everybody kind of had the same thing. And what was funny is I only told a handful of people before I went up. So I was the valedictorian of my, my high school. So I went up there. Yeah, me and the other guy who graduated. So I would have been anyway, but it's a 4.0, so I'm like, yeah, let's go. So. So I got up there and I remember saying, like, yeah, I'm headed off to college and this is going to be my major. And you could literally hear the air being sucked out of the room.

[Massimo]

Yeah, I know, right?

[Scott Fuller]

You know, but I remember, I remember my art teacher and the principal, who was actually the husband and wife or whatever, they actually came up to me afterwards and they're like, yeah, you got this. Yeah, I'm really, really, really happy for you.

[Sean]

Very cool. That's good. That's good.

[Scott Fuller]

That, Yeah, I was very happy.

[Sean]

So then, so you're in college and you've got the bug and you're. And you're. You're blasting through this. Okay, what happened next.

[Scott Fuller]

Man? Met my wife in college, which was great. She's a musician. She's a musician. She plays flute.

[Sean]

Very cool.

[Scott Fuller]

Some piano as well. Amazing. We met. Met my junior year and started dating my senior year. And then we got married in 2008. Now 2008 ended up being a pretty rough year, being the recession and everything. So when I got out of college, I started interning at this agency in Atlanta right there in the middle of downtown. It was fantastic. I loved. Was so funny. You know, I look at what interns get to do today, like, right off the bat. And I'm like, you're all a bunch of wusses. I know every single dadgum one year.

[Sean]

You have no idea how good you have.

[Scott Fuller]

So 2008, I didn't know. Forget the fact that I didn't know I had a desk. I didn't know I had a chair. I was in the back with Pantone swatches, X Acto knives, spray glue, you know, Scotch tape. And all I was doing was making stuff for presentation for the first month. Had no clue that I. Like, I said, forget a desk. I didn't even know I had a chair. Right. And then finally I get about a month in, and they're like, oh, hey, come back here. There was somebody else back there in my space. And I'm like, this is my space. What are you doing? You know what's going on? It's like, oh, we need you to come over here. So then I take about a week or so. They put me in on little tasks here and there to learn the system. And then they gave me a client. They gave me an account as an intern. As an intern. So I had them. I had traffic. I sat right across from the traffic manager, Rhonda, who was amazing. And then I had my two art directors next to me. And then. And then Kendra, creative director, was like. Was like a couple rows away. It was a small agency. It was maybe like 12 people. 12, 13 people. And it was amazing. And designed this logo, you know, did the presentation and everything. That was my first professional logo. And they're still using it 17 years later.

[Sean]

That's amazing, too.

[Scott Fuller]

So when I. When I got into design, this whole idea of, like, I want to make something, the. The timeless aspect from. From Steph's talk was the one that really spoke. Stuck with me.

[Massimo]

Yes.

[Scott Fuller]

So I said, yeah, this is what I want to do. I want to make stuff that's going to last, stuff that never has to be redesigned.

[Sean]

Yeah, that's amazing. So 2008, tough time with the recession and everything.

[Scott Fuller]

So when I was coming down, towards the end of my internship, they were like, we want to bring you on. Bring you on. And I'm like, this is great. I'm getting married in a couple months. This is amazing. And I'm stoked. And.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And then kid didn't come till three years later, but we had. I was so excited. And then in 24 hours, they lost their number two client. Like, just out of the blue.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

So very different conversation. So then I'm out of work, no job, married, getting married in Two months like that I'm grump boy for ups, like helping them with like their Christmas delivery. I worked too much. I worked so much the first day I could only work two hours the rest of the week. They were like, oh, we can't have them on the truck for that long. And I'm like, why don't you ask me about that? You know, I kind of need the money.

[Massimo]

Kind of need it.

[Scott Fuller]

I mean, it was nuts. And then went from there to like a grunt boy at a machine shop. I mean, I worked in a machine shop ever since I was a little, little kid, you know, helping my dad out and everything. But I'm cutting material, I'm driving forklifts and I'm, you know, just. It's the dirty, nasty, like dangerous type of thing, right. And then two months after we got married, I got laid off from that. And then I got like, I'm in another place and I'm building crates for cylinders, you know. And then I'm working second shift over here, which is, I hate second shift. It's like, just give me third shift at that point. I mean, it was so bad because you go in at 2:30 and you leave at 11.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And then you get home and you sleep. If you oversleep, you've got like two hours at home.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And then you're right back at it. It was, it was not fun. And then, you know, I'm working in a screen printing shop where I'm the only one who speaks English as their first language. That was hysterical. Oh yeah. We got paid in cash every week. Down to the penny. Down to the penny. It's like you got X amount of dollars and 17 cents. And I'm like.

[Jude]

No rounding up or no rounding up.

[Sean]

How do you come to that?

[Scott Fuller]

No rounding up. No rounding up. And it's just like, you know. And then I was there for a little while and then I'm at an Apple store and not even a real one. A third party went up. I couldn't.

[Sean]

It was called where they also pay cash.

[Scott Fuller]

Yeah. It was called peachmac. I couldn't even get a job at a real Apple store. I was using design as a sales pitch. Let me tell you what I can do on this computer just to show you how powerful it was.

[Jude]

Yeah, that's awesome.

[Scott Fuller]

That's what it was. Yeah, that's what I thought too, you know, but it was crazy because I actually, I'm actually really good with people. I'm good at selling. I've always been good at sales. So I Mean, you know, I sold you guys on having me on here. Yeah, we quickly regretting that. You know, you sold me that. Sean was a cool guy.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

I mean, you guys are good at this too.

[Jude]

You had to sit.

[Scott Fuller]

Hello. Come on. I did. I kind of did. It was really, really fun. We'll have. We'll have to. We'll have to reenact our first in person meeting. So if you're. So for those of you who don't have video, we're all wearing black.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

We all have beards and we all have thick frame black glasses and we're wearing. Two of us are wearing hats. Sean has evolved to wearing a beanie, right?

[Sean]

Beanie, yes.

[Scott Fuller]

Proper thug. So we got in. We got in there and I saw these guys and I'm like, look, I'm going to stand to the right. Then mask is going to stand right there. And then Sean's going to stand over here and it's going to look like the next 30 years of my evolution.

[Sean]

Goes from red beard to gray beard.

[Scott Fuller]

Beard to white beard. Oh, my gosh.

[Jude]

Slouched over and, you know.

[Scott Fuller]

Oh, man, it was great.

[Massimo]

The future.

[Scott Fuller]

So. So Peach Mac. So Peach Mac. I was actually one of the top salesmen in the company. Like, we were going through and we're going, well. And then the. This guy came in, ran a trucking company in. Up in truckers row in Atlanta and found out I did design. He was like, I might have some freelance work for it, which I was doing on the side. So I said, all right, let's do it. So I go up there, I take a half day, I'm gonna meet this guy, go up there, and he tells me that he actually doesn't have any freelance work for me. And in my mind, I'm of course pissed off. I'm like, I took it half a day. I need the money. Like, what's going on? He goes, no, no, no, no. And I'm saying all this in my head, right? And I just went, I see. You know, And I'm like, keep going. You know, and then he goes, no, I want to hire you full time. I want you to run, like, all our design. Everything that comes out of here. That's packaging, that's catalogs, that's branding, that's everything.

[Jude]

Holy shit.

[Scott Fuller]

So I went from. I basically quadrupled what I was making.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Now I'll never forget that day because that evening we found out that my wife was pregnant with my son.

[Massimo]

Wow.

[Scott Fuller]

All of that happened in one day. And here's the Fun. Here's the other funny part. So I went in the next day to tell them, tell my boss, you know, and tell the whole team, you know, I'm gonna be a dad. Everybody's freaking out. And then I gotta. My boss pulls me aside. He's like, man, this couldn't come at a better time. He said, let me tell you something. He's like, we want to make you. I was basically gonna be made like number two at the store.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

He's like, wanna make you do that. We wanna do that. Someone said. I said, mike, you're gonna hate me right now, but I gotta bounce. So I told him. I was like, yeah, this is actually my two week notice. Cause I actually got offered a thing. And he was like, he was bummed. So I had another person there at the store who we were like going. It was like rivals, sales rivals. And then after, after Black Friday, we weren't rivals anymore. At least not by the numbers. So I remember my last day, they came up to me and said, well, you know, guess you know, you just couldn't hack it. So, you know, I'm the number. You know, they're going to be the number two now. And I said, the only reason that you have it is because I turned it down. Yeah, leave him. And then left. Gone. I never saw them again. But that was like the best, like mic drop or whatever. And I was like, I've been waiting five months to say this to you. It was great. Worked there for a couple of years. Had a great time. During that time is when I started the studio.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

In the back of an old sign shop. I was working on a little restaurant project right there in my hometown. And this little, little sign shop was like a five minute walk from where my wife and I lived at the time and had a great little back area, you know, this awesome little workshop. It's about the size of this booth. It wasn't much of anything.

[Massimo]

Yeah, yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

But I loved it.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And I was like, can I use it? Work here when you're not here? You know, it was this old school guy, right?

[Massimo]

Yeah, yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And we got to know each other and he's like, I came in one day and he just handed me a key. He's like, these are my hours. He said, your hours are whenever I'm not here.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Nice. Just that little area. Just that little room.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

So the first night that I was there, I called it the studio temporary, just as a joke.

[Sean]

That's actually really cool.

[Scott Fuller]

So it's got a good buzz during that time? Well, during that. During that time, it was like the period of Nomad designers, Right. Because we were. Which Starbucks do you work at? Which Starbucks did you go to? Which Starbucks did you get transient? Well, there weren't a lot of, like, just solo coffee shops at the time.

[Massimo]

You're right.

[Scott Fuller]

Right. So I was like, I'm gonna be here one week, I'm gonna be here the next week, I'm gonna be. Whatever. So for a couple months, you know, that place was the studio temporary. And then I read an interview by Alan Fletcher and he was asked, what's the most important tool in your studio? And his answer was, my head. Which is phenomenal.

[Sean]

Yeah, it's a good answer.

[Scott Fuller]

So I went back to studio that night and I came up with my first tagline, which was good design. Wherever I happened to be nice. And the studio temporary stuck. It started out as a joke, and no one's laughing now.

[Massimo]

Yeah, right.

[Scott Fuller]

Awesome.

[Jude]

Sweet.

[Scott Fuller]

And then the trucking company, I'm still doing, I'm still working there, but I was at the studio every night.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Starting my own. Trying to start my own stuff, doing my own thing, working on my own stuff, growing my own stuff. Yeah.

[Sean]

Early memories, though. Like, I remember, you know, when we started, we had a tiny office above an oil garage. You know, we could smell the oil fumes. The joke was that the oil fumes is what kept us creative. And I just remember I can see.

[Scott Fuller]

The effects now too.

[Sean]

But it's just those, you know, the late nights, you know, the doing it, you know, like hours were nothing. It didn't matter at that point.

[Scott Fuller]

What was it? I had a. I had a. What is it? I had a. What was it? Like a 8 to 5 and a. And a 9 to 5.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Literally, though, I, you know.

[Massimo]

Great.

[Scott Fuller]

Geez. It was. It was wild. But I mean, I'd go there and.

[Sean]

You were doing anything you had to do.

[Scott Fuller]

Whatever I had to do. And so a year later, I got. I basically worked myself out of a job at the trucking company. It's like they could pay you. They could pay somebody half of what they were paying me to do what I was doing at that point. Yeah, I wasn't happy about it at all, but, you know, so I left there and then it was just horrific. We were trying to get work here, trying to get work there. Nothing was coming in. And then we came home one night to an eviction notice on our door. We had three days wait at your house? The studio apartment that my wife and I and my one year old Son.

[Sean]

Were in no way.

[Scott Fuller]

You talk about something. That image of my wife and I just kind of sitting in the middle of our empty thing right before we handed the keys over. I remember just that stuck with me for years to the point where it became unhealthy. One of the things I talk about in my talk is obsession comes with a cost and no one talks about that. And there were things that I probably could have done, there were things that I probably should have done, honestly. And I had to grow a lot from that as well. And that's the one thing I can say that we've never had to worry about is making rent or making payments or doing anything like that. Now, the last couple years have been not fun at all. But you know, I have an amazing wife, an amazing family who's stuck there by me. I'm so happy that she did. And you know, it was crazy. And then I remember I was working at a Minuteman Press a couple years later and interesting, interesting thing. And out of the blue, I randomly got a call from a financial firm. It had like 200 people, but they had a full in house design team, video copywriting, design, web develop, dev, everything. And this called me up out of the blue. We'd like for you to come up here and interview for senior designer. And I was like, I didn't even know you guys existed. You know, it's like, what's going on? So I go up there and I have, I have the interview and everything like that. And you know, they were like hip, right? So that meant I could keep my beard. They told me this is some of the things that they told me in the interview.

[Sean]

That was the real reason. They're like, we need someone who keeps your beard really creative.

[Scott Fuller]

And you can keep your beard, you can keep wearing your hat.

[Sean]

Oh, nice.

[Scott Fuller]

During the, you know, during the thing. And I was like, well, that's great. And then it's like, now the only other thing is you can't freelance while you're here. And I said, yeah, no, that's not going to happen. I said, I'll sign whatever you want me to sign and then I'm still going to go do it anyway because that's not anything that you guys can stop me.

[Massimo]

Yeah, yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

I said, you know, so I said.

[Sean]

You didn't, you didn't close down Studio Temporary?

[Scott Fuller]

No. Here's the crazy thing. Folks didn't know that I was working at that trucking company.

[Massimo]

Yep.

[Scott Fuller]

Until five years later, I online, I was studio temporary. At conferences, I was studio temporary. I Never. When I got that job at Impact.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

I never ever put that on my LinkedIn or anywhere else. There were no pictures of me at work. It was just studio temporary. I was, I was a little secret. I was having client meetings during. So during my lunch breaks Monday through. So Monday through Thursday we do our own thing. Every Friday the team would go out and have. And have a, and have lunch, which I love that.

[Jude]

Yeah, that's good.

[Scott Fuller]

But Monday through Thursday it was a working lunch every time. What I would do is I'd have client meetings, calls during my lunch break. Amazing. Actually, you guys are going to love this. I got interviewed for a podcast during my lunch break back in 2014. That's funny. I had an hour lunch break. I took a 10 minute nap and recorded a 45 minute podcast in my car during my lunch break in the uncompanied property. So we did that. And you know, it was so crazy because at that agency, you know, at the in house thing, I was 29 years old and I was the second oldest person on the team.

[Massimo]

Geez.

[Scott Fuller]

By like four, what is it? The oldest person was like six months older than me. But we were the oldest people there by like five, four and five years. It was a young team.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

So I remember I came in and I already had a, a lot of clout. I had done a lot of stuff. So when I came in, I remember the creative director, that guy, I remember him being so happy to have me here and like everybody like he's, you know, this is going to be fun. And everybody was super welcoming the first month or so there. And then I remember somehow somebody got a hold of one of my talks and they played it at the, at the office. Oh shit. And I was like, wow, this is kind of cool. And then I remember the creative director basically saying it's like, yeah, this guy could do all yalls jobs. And I was like, are you serious? You are? And from that day on.

[Massimo]

Cool. Yeah. No, not good.

[Scott Fuller]

No, no, it wasn't not good. Oh, because they're all young kids there. So they're like, this guy's gonna coming in and he's gonna take over all of our, all the cool stuff that we're.

[Jude]

Were they all shitty to you then after that.

[Scott Fuller]

Oh, for the next 11 months.

[Sean]

So here he thought he was like, you know, doing something teachable.

[Scott Fuller]

I didn't even ask him to do it. I'm like, dude, I even told him, I'm like, don't play that.

[Jude]

Do this.

[Scott Fuller]

This is not what I'm here For I'm just here to work.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

You know, and, like, I have this great. And then they hand me this huge project, like, right when I get there, because I've been doing these type of projects for years.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And everybody else had to be there for, like, a year before they could do something like that.

[Massimo]

Right, Right.

[Scott Fuller]

So I did the project. I killed it. It was one of the best in, like, their history.

[Jude]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

I never got to touch another one the entire time I was there. Another big project like that the entire time I was there. Wow.

[Massimo]

Really?

[Scott Fuller]

Yep. I was told 10 months later, I finally had enough. I'm like, look, I'm going to be here for, you know, another maybe, like, a couple years or something, and then I'm finally going to jump out on my own.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

So I'm just taking it on the chin. I'm like, I'm just going to go in. I'm going to do this, and know that I have studio temporary waiting on me at lunch. And when I get off of work, so I'm like, I just shut my mouth and just going. After 10 months, I'm like, yeah, I'm not going to deal with this anymore. So I went. And then I'm like, what is this? You know, I'm. There's no reason for this. And then I was like, oh, you're not a team player, and you're not this. And I'm like, you know, that's a lie.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

You know, and I'll. And you can bring whoever in there, and I'll say that to their face. I'm like, that is the biggest load of crap I've ever. I've ever heard in my life. So we. You know, they're like, oh, well, we'll try this. We'll try that. You know? And then about a month later, our. The guy who ran our team considered him to be some sort of himself, to be, like, some sort of Don Draper, whatever, you know, sitting back, you know.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Yeah. He cost the company something to the tune of about, I don't know, about $50 million or something. Here's what was so bad they canned him, but they couldn't. They kicked him out, but they couldn't, like, officially make him leave for, like, two weeks. So they actually set him up at a folding table and a desk in front of the elevator. I'm not kidding.

[Jude]

That's.

[Scott Fuller]

They made. That was his. That was his office for the two weeks. It's like, you're gonna be here for two weeks. Can you imagine?

[Sean]

That'll teach Him.

[Scott Fuller]

That was basically the equivalent of the dunce cap in the corner. I was like, I just walked past them and I'm just sitting there like, what? So they ended up laying off, like 20% of the company in two days. Wow. So the day before, I had had my one year thing, and in one year you get a raise, you get all this bunch of stuff, and I got all gold stars. The next day I get brought in and. Hey, Scott, can we. We just need to run something by you real quick. Okay, cool. I go back there and there's hr. That guy from hr, that's not. And my creative director and two pieces of paper on the table. I knew it. Now I made friends with the HR guy, like day one.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Smart. And he told me afterwards. He was like, I tried to text you.

[Massimo]

Oh.

[Scott Fuller]

But they literally walked me. And he's like, I couldn't. Just so you can know what was coming. The moment I walked in, I knew what was coming.

[Jude]

Yeah, it's. That's obvious.

[Scott Fuller]

My creative director wouldn't even look me in the face. It was like, you're this, you're this, you're this, you're this. It was the exact opposite of everything that they had told me less than 24 hours before.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

So I made him, like, now you, like, you have to look me in the face and say this. I stood up.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

I'm like, I. It was not a great conversation. No. So I walked out of there. I was supposed to meet my wife and little boy for lunch that day. I walked out holding a cardboard box of my stuff. So we're in the car. We're in the car. And my wife says, this had happened to me throughout my career where things would happen at the company and some of the higher earners or stuff like that would be let go or something would happen and this would happen or whatnot. So my wife said, if you're going to start your company, do it now. We have a little bit of. We have a little bit of a cushion. And that way if anything goes wrong, it was something that you did.

[Massimo]

Nice. Oh, nice.

[Sean]

No pressure.

[Scott Fuller]

No, it's. That's fine taking. I'm fine taking responsibility. Yeah.

[Massimo]

That's the thing.

[Jude]

And you won't have a fucking HR guy or someone who's going to shake.

[Massimo]

You in the back. Back.

[Scott Fuller]

Right. So. Well, yeah. So I called in about. What is it?

[Jude]

He was over your shoulder, that guy again.

[Scott Fuller]

Him again. I really should have thrown something at James yesterday. I really should have done that.

[Sean]

So we thought being beside Alan Peters would be a good thing.

[Jude]

Yeah, yeah, he's, he's a, yeah, he's a rowdy guy over there.

[Scott Fuller]

Oh, man. Him and his bag. But you know, so Anyway, we did 45 minutes after I walked out of there, I had five meetings with new clients.

[Jude]

Nice. And now you don't have to hide. It's not on your lunch. You can go full on.

[Scott Fuller]

And here's the thing, the moment that you fully go out on your own, it's like the whole world gets an email, gets an email alert.

[Jude]

Yeah, yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

All of a sudden it's like, wait, what is all this stuff that's happening? All this work, all this new stuff. And all of a sudden my work went from like here's one, here's two to like one. Two, like all this buff and it's like, what is happening? And then just went for it. And now a word from our sponsor.

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[Sean]

So now you've gone through all this how and it starting your agency. Regardless what kind of problems and hardships we have, probably nothing compared to everything you've gone through at that point. Like now, it's just a matter. The hardest thing is to just find work exactly right and which in retrospect seems so much easier, but, you know, hardship defines who we become.

[Massimo]

Yeah. Right.

[Sean]

And at this point, like, you know, running the agency almost seems like peanuts compared to the shit that you went.

[Scott Fuller]

Just seems like it's kind of an afterthought at that.

[Sean]

Right, right.

[Jude]

It's probably right there. You know, you were. You were born to do this kind of thing, right? Which is the perseverance part of it.

[Scott Fuller]

That's. Yeah.

[Jude]

You know, like, you hit all this shit. Some people would be just like, ah, this, you know, but you just, like, knuckled down and said, no, I know what's gonna happen. I know what I'm gonna do.

[Scott Fuller]

You know, and maybe I didn't do it in the most healthy way at times, but, you know, who does?

[Jude]

I mean, we don't have a roadmap.

[Scott Fuller]

For this, but it's been. It's been. It's been great. You know, I mean, I've. I've had some. Some fun successes. I've had some great. I got stories upon stories, man.

[Jude]

But we'll do a podcast series. So ups and down the first five.

[Scott Fuller]

Years, and then 2010, or 2020-20, 25 lost years, you know, and then, man, as much time as I've spent with you guys, this could be an entire episode itself, you know, But. But yeah, so that's awesome. That is a great show.

[Sean]

So there's no question. There's no question that hardship defines who we become. And you said something earlier on one of that that maybe, maybe you skipped. And if it is intentional, tell me. But it was. You said you got accepted to four Design three, your top three choices, all in Atlanta. So you'd think that that would be your highest high.

[Scott Fuller]

And then that was in 2008, and I couldn't afford to go to any one of them. I lost my job and everything like that. So it's like, I got a family to feed. Yeah, no, I can't. I can't do that. And it just wasn't possible. And then. Oh, there was another one. I got an internship at the age at the time, the agency that I wanted to work at. It was a small place. I was going to be like, number, like the fifth person ever there, right? No, fourth.

[Massimo]

Oh, wow.

[Scott Fuller]

Right. So there was the founders and then. And then their, like, main designer. And then I was going to be like them before, but it was an internship now. The internship that I did at my first studio was amazing. I got paid great. I got paid time and a half. I could expense stuff as an intern. It was unbelievable. This agency, they said, we'd love to offer you that. And I'm freaking out. And then they. I said, all right, how do we do pay? He's like, oh, we don't pay our interns. We just give them a gas stipend.

[Jude]

That's it.

[Scott Fuller]

This is a four month internship. Wow. This is a four month internship. So I. I turned them down. Wow. I turned it down.

[Jude]

Even though this was the dream gig.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Because. For you. Because I was always going to resent them for that.

[Massimo]

Yeah, you're right. You're right.

[Scott Fuller]

And then it turned out that while. Now, here's the thing. The. The two founders have been friends of mine for, you know, 18 years.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

They've. They've been there for advice, They've been there for different things like that. They've even sent some work my way.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

But one of the things that I found out, you know, I look at the time, you know, as a young designer, and even I'm just looking at the type of work they put out. What I wasn't thinking about was the culture.

[Massimo]

Ah.

[Scott Fuller]

And it turns out I wouldn't have been a good fit. And that's okay.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Just because you don't fit somewhere, even though you love the work, that's okay.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

You know, you're gonna have. You're gonna have things like that, but it worked out.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

You know, but. But yeah, a lot of people aren't.

[Sean]

Confident with that, and so they try to mask who they are. And this has been a very common theme that we've had. You know, a lot of people, they're not true to themselves.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Sean]

And, you know, it's. It's okay, like you said, not to fit everywhere. It's okay not to be liked by everybody. You know, not everybody's going to want to work with us. Not everybody wants to be on this podcast because, you know, our style, our approach is a little bit different. And that's okay.

[Scott Fuller]

It's okay.

[Sean]

And again, I think that was a pivotal moment in my life. It was so freeing. And it sounds like it was the.

[Scott Fuller]

Exact same experience with you, you know, and then.

[Sean]

It doesn't make us bad people.

[Scott Fuller]

No.

[Sean]

It doesn't make us, you know, poor what we do.

[Scott Fuller]

It's like I'm not. I'm not willing to put myself in a situation where I discovered I wasn't. It just wasn't going to be a fit.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And then there's going to be conflict. There's going to be back and forth, there's going to Be all kind of stuff going on. So. Yeah, you know, why would I want to do that anyway?

[Massimo]

Right.

[Scott Fuller]

You know, I don't want to sacrifice that just to say that I was there.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Sean]

You know, absolutely. So, so now, now you've got your awesome studio. So now the highs of the studio, there's obviously lows. Yeah, we've talked a lot enough about lows in this. But now you've now got your place and, and it's just, I mean your work is fucking awesome.

[Scott Fuller]

I appreciate that.

[Massimo]

Okay. It is.

[Sean]

And again, I was so excited to.

[Scott Fuller]

Like, I'm like, I love this guy.

[Sean]

It's so. And I need one of those hats.

[Scott Fuller]

Thank you. Thank you. There we go.

[Sean]

Okay. Agency highs.

[Scott Fuller]

Agency highs. Oh man. First couple years were a little, are a little hit and miss just because I'm trying this, I'm trying that. You know, some of the projects were a little here, some of them are there and I'm still getting out on, you know, figuring out who I am. And man, I remember 2018. Oh no, 2016 was the year things really turned around. So my, my, after my first year I got an office space in this hundred year old building in the middle of downtown Atlanta for free.

[Jude]

All the bricks and stuff like that.

[Scott Fuller]

For free.

[Massimo]

For free.

[Scott Fuller]

I was there for three and a half years. I never paid a penny in rent. But I just did work for him. A ton of work for him. The first project that I did was the, the sign that got hand painted on the front of the building. 100 year old building in the middle of downtown Atlanta. Yeah, I designed shirts and posters. There was a basement that you could see from the, like a base open basement that you could see from the street. Little area had like gates around it and it's like just the sidewalk and then the street, right?

[Massimo]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And they put a ping pong table out there. I designed an entire mural down there. It's like Atlanta's only subterranean ping pong or table tennis stadium. And like did type and like all type of stuff so people could look down in there and it was like I was like a stadium thing and just see that.

[Massimo]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And, and just a ton of stuff. I got to work in this. I started working in the startup industry, got to know all the tech guys. I got to just do all type of stuff over and over and over again. Things that I never would have had an opportunity to do. And I had my own space which is very to where people could kind of come in and see what my brain was like. Yeah, always interesting. But I had stuff all I had scary place. I had stuff all over the walls, books everywhere, you know, old pieces of like ephemera and whatnot. And people would come in and a one hour meeting would turn into two, three hours because we were looking at all this stuff and getting all these ideas and everything, and it was amazing. But 2018 was when everything went amazing. I got asked by ESPN to do this project. So back in 2018, when LeBron was leaving Cleveland for the second time in LA and Philly, a couple billboards popped up, basically saying, like, hey, LeBron, come and, you know, come here or whatnot. So ESPN got the idea that we should hire one designer who's actually an NBA fan from each city to design a billboard.

[Jude]

Oh, sweet.

[Scott Fuller]

So they. And they're going to put it on online and do whatever. So they asked me to be a part of it. Well, the copywriters were running the creative, not the actual creatives. So everything was kitschy and cliche. And one, like, I put out this awesome stuff and they threw it back, like, what is this? And I'm like, you know, so we finally decided on one and I was actually happy with it. You know, I was using like old Migos lyrics and stuff like that, you know, and it was, it was great. And so two weeks go by and everything's coming out. Like a couple days later I get a call from ESPN and they go, so we want you to send all the files over that you have like all the variations. So your versions, all the, all the other versions as well. All the ones that got turned down too. And I said, why? Why? I said, why? And I said, I thought we'd already signed off. It's like, we're going to take some of this and we're going to cobble this together and do with that. And I said, and who's. I said, and whose name are you putting on it? I said, because it won't be mine.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

I said, that is not how this works. And they were like, well, we do this. I said, we've been done for two weeks. Yeah. Why didn't you call me then?

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

I said, so I'm not going to do it. I said, so I'm pull. I said, so I'm pulling my work. I said, you cannot use any of it. I said. And they were like, what are we going to do? I said, I don't care. I said, but I'm not going to do this. I said. They were like, well, do you know of anybody who can do the work. And I said, I do, but I'm trying to decide if I want to send them to you. I said, so go find your own designers. But. So I'll probably never work with ESPN again. But, you know, whatever. But here's the thing. Here's what came out of it, though. So I posted that piece. It was the Hawks. It was like this awesome, like, super awesome hawk with like the Larry o' Brien trophy and everything. And I put it on Instagram and I tagged the Hawks. About two months later, I get a email from the executive creative director of the Hawks. We have a project we think you'd be the perfect fit for. Can you come and meet us tomorrow? The studio that I was in, in. In the Switch Arts building was a block and a half from Hawks headquarters.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

So I just walked there.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

So the. So, so miss. Ms. Selena, the amazing receptionist. She was. She ran that place. Look, I'm just going to say it. She ran that place. So our running. Jo, do you need me to validate your parking? And I'd pull my shoe off and be like, yeah, here you go. You know, so that was like our. That was like our. Our standing joke every time I went there. So they, they came in, they were like, we want you to design the identity for our esports team. Now they. They started NBA 2K esports league. And they were treating it like a portion of each one of the NBA franchises.

[Massimo]

Cool.

[Scott Fuller]

Nike. Nike's agency designed everything. The identity, the low, the trophy, and 29 out of the 30 NBA teams.

[Massimo]

Holy.

[Jude]

Except for one of the 30.

[Scott Fuller]

Except for one. And that was the Hawks. And that was sweet. They turned, they. They turned. They turned them down and said, we want to do local.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And they brought me in. Awesome. So they told me. This is the funny thing. They told me to bring my portfolio with me. This is 2018. I haven't brought my portfolio anywhere in almost nine years. Right.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

You know, Pina Zangaro isn't around anymore, so, you know, what am I going to do? So I had made this huge 24 by 36 poster. Had like 220 pieces of design on there. Big checkered thing, screen printed. Had like a little blind emboss down at the bottom of, like, my seal, you know, it was amazing.

[Massimo]

Yes.

[Scott Fuller]

And I had. So it was. I had one that was red paper and then it was just black and white checkered all over the whole thing. So I brought that one.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And they were like, we're up on the top floor, corner office, CMO's office. It was Melissa Proctor, amazing CMO. Shirley Zhang, the creative director. And we were sitting up there, and they said, all right, well, do you have something for us to look at? And I said, well, I couldn't find all my old sleeves to put all my work in and my portfolio, so I brought you something better. So I rolled this huge 24 by 36 poster, beautiful. Out on her desk, paper weighted on the end. And I said, all right, there's over 200 pieces of design on here. Ask point to any one of them. I'll tell you when I did it, who I did it for, and a funny story to go with it. Now, bear in mind, I only had a funny story for about a third of them, so I'm taking a bit of a risk. So I'm, like, going to reuse that.

[Sean]

Funny story, though, for a while.

[Scott Fuller]

So it's like, well, this is the same funny story. They were very similar people, you know, so. So anyway, five minutes later, I got the job.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And here was the other funny thing. They were like. They asked if they could keep the poster. Sweet. I said, if you look on the back of the poster, I've already signed it to you guys.

[Sean]

Oh, that's really cool.

[Scott Fuller]

Before. Before I got there.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

I said, if you. I said, just flip it over. And it was like to. To Melissa and. And Shirley, you know, whatever. Because I just assumed I was going to get it.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

So we went there, designed that. It was phenomenal. We had this one point where I sent in what we thought was the final version. And if you ever work with an NBA team, the. The last, you know, the last, you know, level you have to go through the final boss. Right. Is legal.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

You send something off to legal, it is two weeks. Not a week and a half, not 13 days. Two weeks on the dot, every time, which is amazing. So we had what we thought was the final version. It was this beautiful, like, just very angular thing, had the head kind of off to the side, you know, and everybody was like, everybody approved. The NBA loved it. The management loved it. The owner loved it. Everybody loved it. We sent it off to legal, and from what I understand, it was like, yes, yes, yes, yes. Look, slightly German. Oh, jeez. Which we know what that means. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So I remember I was on. So I was there. I was there while they. They had the call. And I remember, yeah, everybody was, like, insanely pissed.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

So. But it was only the head. So I had to go back and design, like, 30 different. 30 different heads just for this Just for this hawk. But it ended up being better.

[Massimo]

Oh.

[Scott Fuller]

Oh, cool. It ended up being much better.

[Sean]

You know, when you have those parameters, it does force.

[Scott Fuller]

This is this. And this is something I want you all to think about, too. And, you know, and other designers, you know, one of the things you. You haven't really heard from me, other than the, you know, even the ESPN thing, it wasn't really like this horror story. It was just, you know, no, this is not going to happen.

[Massimo]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

I don't really talk a lot about, you know, horror stories because I learned from that experience that just because I think it's great and just because everybody else does, but the final. First, who has the final say, has something to say about it, I can't immediately dismiss it because it made it better. Much better. Like, infinitely better. To the point that I'm actually so happy it happened, actually.

[Jude]

There you go.

[Scott Fuller]

It's a collaborative process, and we have to treat it as such.

[Sean]

A lot of designers struggle with that because they had this. And I wouldn't say it's intentional ego. Maybe it's been fed to them. Maybe it's just, you know, the impression designers have. But they don't want to collaborate. They want. They want expert status from day one, and they think collaboration is a sign of weakness because the client should accept what you give them. That's not a reality.

[Scott Fuller]

It's not a reality. Not at all. It's not our process.

[Sean]

Collaborative from the start. Maybe a little too much, but that's the whole point. And I mean, again, that's. That's attractive.

[Jude]

So nine times out of 10, that's exactly the case that's going to happen. You're going to send something out. There's something that you may have not thought about.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Jude]

And then somebody's going to point that out, and you're like, oh, okay.

[Massimo]

Yeah. You're like, okay.

[Jude]

Then you go back to it, and it's like, as another challenge, another problem.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Jude]

And it's like. And it makes it better every time.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

So from there is when I met Killer Mike of Run the Jewels. Amazing guy. We ended up collaborating on his barbershop and then on Bankhead Seafood, where we also collaborated with TI So I've been friends and, like, collaborators with Killer Mike and TI for about the last six years or so.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

You know, awesome. It was. It's been a lot of fun. You know, it. And I just remember, like, we'll randomly, like. Like, I could FaceTime him at 1 in the morning or something, and he'd Be like, what's going on, Scott? What you doing? You know, like, he's. His birthday party's in, you know, unbelievably on 420. That was when he was born.

[Sean]

Wow.

[Scott Fuller]

It was crazy.

[Jude]

It was a fate, right?

[Scott Fuller]

Yeah, something like that. But we just got designed. Done designing a bunch of packaging for the. For his barbershop where I go, yeah, I've been going for a long.

[Sean]

Good looks good, my friend.

[Scott Fuller]

And that's all going to be unveiled at his party. And I'm looking forward to it because I'll be there as well.

[Jude]

How, How.

[Sean]

How would you describe your style? You definitely have a style, and I think that's why I appreciate. Because you, you know, you.

[Massimo]

You.

[Sean]

You look at a piece and he's like, no, that's Scott's, man. That's Scott.

[Scott Fuller]

That Scott Puller's face. One of the things that I've heard a lot is less of style and more of an execution. It's like, I've seen this done in a certain way.

[Massimo]

Yes.

[Scott Fuller]

Like. Like this thought behind it and what you can read into, and it's like, that's how we know it's studio temporary, which I've started to get that a lot lately, which has been a lot of which has been really cool with the style. I would say, you know, it's not based off of any trend or fad. It's something that is, you know, unique and original to each client, which I love. I'm sure. I do err on the bolder side, but it's. I don't mind it.

[Sean]

No, dude, that's what you find for.

[Scott Fuller]

You know, But I try to. I try to make something that fits. I try to make something that works for the client that I'm doing, because I don't. What I don't do is I don't. I push substance over style.

[Massimo]

Is.

[Scott Fuller]

Is. Is how it. So it might come out a certain way, but if it fits the substance of it, you know. But it's. It's been fun. It's been fun. It's something that I've worked on a lot over the years. You know, 80% of the people that I learned design from are dead.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

You know?

[Massimo]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

I've got books and first editions and stuff just like, sagging my shelves at home, you know, And I go through there and I'm like, I'm not looking to. I'm not looking to design what they designed. I want to know how they did it.

[Massimo]

Yes.

[Scott Fuller]

I want to know how they did this. Move. I want to know why they did this, why it's effective.

[Massimo]

Yep, yep.

[Scott Fuller]

Right. And that's huge. And then you. You know, and then I got into teaching. I've been an adjunct professor at Portfolio center and now Miami AD School in Atlanta for the last four years. And then you get AI in there and everything like that, and it's just messed up a couple of my students. Without a doubt.

[Massimo]

Yeah, no doubt.

[Scott Fuller]

You know, so.

[Sean]

So you're so young and in your studio. I still got a lot of Runway to go.

[Scott Fuller]

A lot of Runway.

[Sean]

What's the future look like?

[Scott Fuller]

I'm kind of figuring that out now.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

I have a studio manager for the last year. This is the first time it's ever been anybody other than me.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

For the first nine years, it was just me.

[Sean]

That's actually a big accomplishment, to be honest.

[Scott Fuller]

Yeah, that was a mistake. But.

[Sean]

So it seems like a reoccurring theme for you, buddy.

[Scott Fuller]

Well, you know. I know.

[Massimo]

Damn it.

[Sean]

Another lesson I have to learn.

[Scott Fuller]

I know, I know. But I'm looking to bring in my first couple of interns apprentice to kind of do some stuff. I've been doing mentorship for last six years or whatnot through, like, AIGA and stuff like that. My current studio manager is actually. Was actually one of my. My mentees.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

From. From 2020, actually. And she's fantastic. Absolutely fantastic. Ash has been a huge part of the studio for the last year. She is the one who made it possible for me to bring all my. My merch and stuff here for Iconic, a little streetwear brand. You know, she put everything in its place.

[Jude]

Yeah.

[Massimo]

Nice.

[Scott Fuller]

And then brought me this awesome trunk and all this stuff and put my stickers all over it and was like, here, this is this for you. And I'm like, yeah, yeah. It's amazing. You know, I would have gotten, like, three boxes and, like, a bag and, like, a target bag or whatever and, like, brought all my stuff. And, you know, but it was just. It was just. It's just been a blast. I think I'm looking to. In the next couple of years, I'm looking to. To bring on a couple designers I'm.

[Sean]

Looking to and teach now internally versus teaching externally, which is really cool.

[Scott Fuller]

And that's the thing, you know, people might look at the way I do and whatnot and think, like, man, what is it like? You know, it's like, one thing to work with this guy. What it's going to be like to work for him.

[Massimo]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

You know, for me, I just. The Little details are king for me.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

So I need somebody who knows to look for the little things and how much that matters. Somebody who's not afraid to do the. You know, Like, I've worked for a music festival for the last six years. I do everything.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Everything for them. Even all the, like, the little mailers and all the little stuff and all the tags and all the different things like that. You know, I could pass it off to somebody, but it's like, no, I want to make sure that this is done right.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

You know, and I want something that Somebody that has that same dedication.

[Massimo]

Right.

[Scott Fuller]

You know?

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And just a willingness to learn. But I also want somebody that's going to challenge me as well. Somebody that's. I'm not looking for the. I'm not looking for another version of me.

[Massimo]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Or we would kill each other. Like, that's the thing, you know, If I tried to work. If I tried to work with me, that would be a massive problem. We would just implode, you know, so. So that's something that I'm. I'm really looking forward to. You know, hopefully that doesn't scare anybody off, but it'll. It's going to be fun. You know, we've got some other, you know, revenue streams and whatnot we're looking at, and it's going to be. It's. It's going to be a lot of fun. I'm very excited about the future. You know, 10 years is crazy. I remember getting to five years, and my dad basically saying, if you make it to five years, there's no stopping you. And I remember I called him on my fifth anniversary. I said, dad, I just hit five years. He said, yeah, you're there. Let's go.

[Massimo]

You made it there.

[Scott Fuller]

You made it. So there's a lot of that coming, but we'll see.

[Massimo]

Yeah. Oh, man.

[Scott Fuller]

We'll see.

[Sean]

All right, let's wrap this up with. Since. Since the teaching, the mentorship is such a big deal.

[Scott Fuller]

Yes.

[Sean]

What is the future, in your opinion, for young, new designers look like? Take that question any way you want.

[Scott Fuller]

Oh, I can take it a couple different ways. No, I would say, honestly, there is more available to students now than was ever. I mean, there are one of my buddies. I mean, he's in his. He's in. He's like 24, 25 years old. He's done more at 25 than I did at 35.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

It was insane.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And I'm so proud of him for it. And he's. He's Killing it.

[Massimo]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

You know, he's, you know, I mean, he's. He's doing some fantastic work, and he's doing it the right way, which I'm really happy about. I think, for me, this is gonna. This is probably gonna be a little bit of a hot take, but I think people. Look at the social media designers.

[Massimo]

Yep.

[Scott Fuller]

The people that really put some of that stuff out there. Here's the quick process and here's that. And I have zero issue with any of that. But what happens sometimes, especially when you're just starting out, we're just going to go straight to that. But what they don't realize is there's all these years of learning and doing and whatnot. It's not an algorithm that gets you to that point. It's not a quick video that gets you to that point.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

You know, I've. And I think that's. Everything's. Everything can be just. Just taken like. Like a pill. And it's just like, oh, I'm just going to be this. I'm. And why are you doing this? Well, I want to get all these views on TikTok.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Why? That's not why I'm doing this.

[Massimo]

Reason. Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

This. Ha. This is a. This is not the end goal. This is a result.

[Massimo]

Yes.

[Scott Fuller]

Of all of this. This is half of a. Half of a percent.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Of what you've worked on up to this point.

[Massimo]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Right. I'm still learning. I'm still. I flew up to. To. To Brooklyn a month ago to take a workshop with Lance Wyman.

[Massimo]

Cool.

[Scott Fuller]

Nice. The biggest and probably the biggest influence on my career. And I got to spend a day with this guy. That's cool, dude. It was unbelievable. And I learned a lot.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

You know. Yeah, yeah. And it was just. It was incredible. But I'm like, I never want to get to a point where I feel like I've made it, because that's immediate. Right. There is the plateau of my career. I'll never go past further past that, no matter what I do.

[Massimo]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

It's a mindset. Right. So, like, AI and stuff like that. I don't have an issue with that.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

My biggest. With AI itself, what I have an issue with is how early it's being used in the process.

[Massimo]

Yeah. Oh, good call.

[Scott Fuller]

I'll give you an example. One of my students was working. We were looking over everybody's shoulder and everything, like, on their screens. She had this amazing concept for I teach Identity design and symbol design, and she had this amazing concept These great sketches. And it was making me laugh. I was like, I love this thing. I love the cheekiness and everything about this. I love it. All these great sketches had no clue how to really, truly use Illustrator at all.

[Massimo]

Yes.

[Scott Fuller]

So what she was doing is she would go and put in the AI prompt in Illustrator and then she just started picking stuff and then designing around that. And it looked nothing like her sketches.

[Massimo]

Yep.

[Scott Fuller]

And I stopped everything. The entire class. I said, everybody, put down your laptops and close them.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Take out your pencils and your papers and listen.

[Massimo]

Yeah, yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And I.

[Sean]

Blasted her.

[Scott Fuller]

No, no. I blasted the entire class.

[Massimo]

Yeah. Oh, good.

[Scott Fuller]

I said, I'm seeing this way too much.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

This is insane.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

It is cheating. It is. That could be somebody else's work.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

You know, like, I don't. It was just ridiculous. And I'm sitting there. You did all of this and you threw it all away because you weren't willing to put in the time to actually design this out and to fail and to do this. In my class, I don't let them use Procreate or an iPad. All their sketches must be on paper. With pen. With pen. Because I want to see the mess ups.

[Sean]

And you see the mess.

[Scott Fuller]

I want to see that. It's like your sketches are for you, they're not for your client.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

So mess up and be okay with it.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

You know, and just. It's. It's been crazy like that. So, like, with that, I don't have an issue with it. I just have an issue with how early it's being used.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Fair. Fair. So I don't know. I'm kind of an old hat when it comes to that type of stuff.

[Jude]

That's cool.

[Sean]

Well, no, it makes sense, right?

[Scott Fuller]

It's.

[Sean]

You're not saying don't do it.

[Scott Fuller]

I'm not saying don't do it.

[Sean]

Don't have to do the thinking for you. Because it actually doesn't think.

[Scott Fuller]

Because here's the thing. If you and I put in the exact same prompts, we're going to get a lot of the exact same stuff.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Fair, Fair.

[Sean]

Absolutely.

[Scott Fuller]

So why would I want to do that?

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And it's not about defining a style or anything like that. It's about figuring out what's the answer to this problem.

[Massimo]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

And there you go.

[Massimo]

Yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Sweet.

[Jude]

There's your closing music, bud.

[Scott Fuller]

Right? Closing music. Oh, man.

[Jude]

So important to the Angry Designer podcast. We got a.

[Sean]

We have music. We got a band for you.

[Scott Fuller]

I love it. I love it.

[Sean]

Dude, it's been a pleasure getting to.

[Scott Fuller]

Know you past couple days.

[Sean]

I feel like I have, like, a new brother in this, right? Like, it's been such a great time.

[Scott Fuller]

You got a new brother, he's got a new son. I mean, this is like.

[Jude]

All right, off you go.

[Sean]

Up you go to your room. Where can everybody find you?

[Scott Fuller]

Okay, Go to the studio temporary.com and then I'm studio temporary on Instagram, Twitter, and then check out my streetwear brand@stay iconicbrand.com or walk, you know, 15ft that way and get you something. And I'm talking to you guys, too. No, but it's good. I've had a really good time. It's been a lot of fun. It's so funny because we're on, like, this angry designer podcast, and I feel like we spent the whole time talking about, like, all this super, like, deep stuff.

[Massimo]

Yeah, yeah.

[Scott Fuller]

Like, we didn't start, like, laughing and, like, insulting each other until, like, the closing. So I feel like we have to come on and do, like, a round two and just, like, go at each.

[Jude]

We should have. We should have been recording all our conversations up until this point. I have been.

[Scott Fuller]

Oh, yeah, we've had a lot of.

[Sean]

Really good ones up until this.

[Jude]

Dudes in the business.

[Massimo]

I know, right? This has been amazing.

[Jude]

I love telling and all that.

[Scott Fuller]

I was like, oh, man. I mean, I could end it with that joke that I told him. Maybe not. We won't do that one little.

[Jude]

A little.

[Scott Fuller]

A little mystery. We'll keep. We'll keep the mystery. You'll just have to meet me and to find out, you know, ask for.

[Jude]

The jokes if you beat Scott.

[Scott Fuller]

I love it. I love it. Seriously, though, love you guys. Thanks for everything. Friend for life. Yeah, absolutely. However long or short. However long or short that is.

[Sean]

Let's just not.

[Scott Fuller]

That's why I'm getting all the jokes out now, man. I don't know if I'll ever see Sean again, you know?

[Massimo]

Oh, my God.

[Scott Fuller]

That's amazing. I love it.

[Jude]

Ripper snappers. I swear. Jeez.

[Scott Fuller]

Oh, my gosh. Nobody's gonna use that word after he's gone. It's gonna be amazing.

[Sean]

All right, everybody, I hope you guys got so much out of this episode, because, honestly, I mean, through hardship comes so much glory. And honestly, your story is amazing. And. And, I mean, you know, I thought I went through some troubles, but what you went through, Jude, is. Is iconic, and it's perfect for who you've become.

[Scott Fuller]

Yeah, I appreciate it.

[Jude]

And you're humble, too.

[Massimo]

Like, you.

[Jude]

You realize where you come from. And you're not going to forget all that, right?

[Scott Fuller]

No, Absolutely.

[Massimo]

Yeah. All right.

[Sean]

With that being said, my name is Massimo.

[Jude]

And my name is Sean.

[Scott Fuller]

And you are Scott Fuller. Stay creative and stay angry and stay iconic.

[Massimo]

Happy.