The Astrology Podcast

Episode: The Magi and Astrology in the Nativity Story
Date: January 21, 2026
Host: Chris Brennan
Guest: Rev. Lindsay Turner

Overview of the Episode

In this episode, Chris Brennan interviews astrologer and theologian Reverend Lindsay Turner on the connections between astrology and the nativity story in Christianity, focusing on the Magi and the “Star of Bethlehem.” The conversation explores the history and literature of the Gospel of Matthew, the technical astrological terms embedded in the narrative, the ancient roots of Magi/astrologers, and the subsequent tension and reconciliation between astrology and Christian tradition. The episode also considers broader issues of myth, history, and meaning—touching on ancient, medieval, and modern interpretations.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Significance of Epiphany and the Magi

• Epiphany/Three Kings Day: January 6 in many Christian traditions, marking the end of Christmas and celebrating Jesus’s presentation to the world via the Magi.
• Theme of Unveiling: The Greek root epiphanine (to appear, to shine) parallels the appearance of the guiding star and astrological motifs.
  • [00:50] Lindsay: “A lot about stars in the astrological tradition too, in this context. What appeared on the horizon that really drew these Magi to this place in this story?”

2. The Nativity Story and the Gospel of Matthew

• Matthew’s Motives: Written decades after Jesus’s death (30s CE; Matthew written around the 70s–80s CE), Matthew often links Jesus’s life events back to Hebrew biblical prophecies.
  • [05:54] Chris: “He’s constantly... to create something that connects back to a story or a prophecy... even though sometimes it's recontextualizing predictions that were meant for Israel and making them prophecies about Jesus."
• Reading as History vs. Literature: The story can be analyzed as an attempt at historical reconstruction or as purposeful literature conveying theological messages.
  • [03:26] Lindsay: “I think it's really helpful to... explore if this is a depiction of a historical event... but there's also another approach... to look at this story as literature... to convey a message through this literature.”

3. Reading and Analyzing the Magi Passage (Matthew 2:1–12)

• Magi = Astrologers: Textual annotations directly identify the Magi as “astrologers from the east”.
• The Star “at its rising”: The Greek “anatole” is both a direction (east) and a technical astrological term for planetary risings, possibly a heliacal rising.
  • [08:05] Lindsay (reading): “Magi or astrologers from the east... we observed his star in the east, or at its rising, and have come to pay him homage.”

Notable Quotes:

• [11:18] Chris: “It’s obvious in context that these are meant to be astrologers that are following some sort of astrological sign or omen that is telling them that somebody important has been born.”
• [15:43] Chris: “…‘Magi’ is almost being used somewhat interchangeably to refer to astrologers from the East.”

4. Ancient Contexts: Astrological Roots and Terms

• Origins of "Magi": Magi were Median priests with Zoroastrian connections; the term later became a catch-all for magicians, ritualists, and astrologers from the East.
• Astrology and Authority: Nativity omens, royal birth charts, and alignment of planetary positions were considered signs of kingly legitimacy.
  • [13:08] Lindsay: “The information that the authors chose to share was very intentional... trying to tell us something about the nature of this person.”

Technical Terms and Literary Devices:

• Anatole ("at its rising"):
  • [18:45] Chris: “As a technical term in Hellenistic astrology... it can mean... rising over the eastern horizon... or making a heliacal rising, which is when a planet emerges from under the beams of the sun.”
• Use of Astrological Language in Scripture:
  • [18:05] Lindsay: “I've seen crossover between technical words used in texts and the New Testament Greek, which is really exciting.”

5. Theories About the “Star of Bethlehem”

• Comet, Conjunctions, Stellia, Supernovae: Ancient and modern astrologers/scholars have speculated various astronomical events for the Star – each with advocates, including comets, major planetary conjunctions, and rare aspects.
  • [22:10] Chris: “Interpretations have been all over the place, but a lot of it depends on the astrologers are making certain assumptions going into it about what it could have been...”
• Did the event have to be visible to everyone, or only astrologers? Raises questions of secret knowledge vs. universal omens.
  • [24:33] Lindsay: “Was it something that everyone could see? ...Or did you have to have special astrological knowledge?”

6. Astrology, Divination, and Legitimacy in Christianity

• Matthew’s Astrologers as Legitimizers: The Magi’s journey mirrors the process of astrologers legitimizing the birth of royals.
• Christian Astrological Motifs: Astrology appears not just at the birth (Star and Magi) but also death (Gospel references to eclipses at the crucifixion).
  • [27:27] Chris: “Matthew is saying that there was this major astrological event... at the death of Jesus as well—of an eclipse of some sort.”
• Animosity and Reinterpretation: Later Christian writers tried to reinterpret, downplay, or explain away the pro-astrological aspects in the Gospels.
  • [33:08] Chris: “Later Christian authors attempted to say that... they gave up astrology... But to me, that's always been a clear example of just later Christians attempting to cope and attempting to downplay the fact..."

Memorable Exchange:

• [34:28] Lindsay: “In the Greek, the term repentance means to turn around, literally… That might be where that correlation comes from—‘they repented of being astrologers.’”
• [36:13] Chris: “They did offer him the gifts, which themselves… like the gold and frankincense and myrrh have symbolic significance.”

7. Astrological Symbolism in the Nativity

• Cancer, the “Manger,” and Thema Mundi: Lindsay brings up mythic references that link the “manger” with the Cancer constellation, suggesting an underlying esoteric or astrological layer in the nativity narrative.
  • [39:47] Lindsay: “Cancer is thought to have been placed among the stars by Hera... Their distinguishing sign is the manger Praesepium... So when I was reading this, I was like, this is kind of blowing my mind...”
• Thema mundi (“birth chart of the world”) as a possible subtext.
• [40:23] Chris: “The Thema mundi for the Hellenistic astrologers did play such a big role... some astrologers treat it as the nativity of God itself..."

8. History, Myth, Literature: What “Truth” Means

• Date of Jesus’s Birth: No biblical date; Dec. 25th established in the 4th century (linked to Sol Invictus and Saturnalia).
• Historical Factuality vs. Mythic Truth: Lindsay argues that mythic stories retain power and truth even if not literally historical.
  • [41:41] Lindsay: “Just because something isn't, like, factual doesn't mean it isn't true... It's myth... larger than life... has elements of magic.”

9. Astrology, Christianity, and Authority – Ancient Tensions

• Astrology & Fate vs. Free Will: Ancient Christianity’s focus on free will clashed with the fatalism in Hellenistic astrology.
  • [65:21] Chris: “...a lot of Christian thinkers thought that the notion of free will was really important...a core Christian theological doctrine, right?”
• Social Rebellion and Identity: Early Christians challenged socially determined fates.
  • [66:56] Lindsay: “There was an element of social rebellion... In Christ you are neither slave nor free, male nor female...”

10. Astrology’s Ongoing Role in the Christian Tradition (and its Reconciliation)

• Continued Practices: Even now, many Christian traditions incorporate astrological or divinatory practices, sometimes unknowingly.
  • [31:43] Lindsay: “In current liberal church traditions, a lot of them will chalk over the doors during epiphany... also do a form of divination called star words...”
• Stigma Remains: Many remain “in the closet” about astrological interests due to denominational strictures.
  • [80:50] Lindsay: “...still for a lot of people... have to remain in the closet about it, like, would lose their entire career if they were to be found out.”
• Modern Christian Astrologers: Figures like Kepler, Lilly, and Theophilus of Edessa show a historical precedent for Christian astrology.
  • [75:29] Chris: “...many famous Christian astrologers... William Lilly... Johannes Kepler... Theophilus of Edessa... major figures.”

11. Astrology as a Bridge Between Science and Religion

• Mercury, Mediation, and Synthesis: Astrology occupies a “Mercurial” role, as a bridge between polarities—religion and science, fate and free will.
  • [93:32] Chris: “...astrology has a foot in both camps and... could potentially connect both. Which is perhaps its greatest appeal.”

Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:30–01:41 — Discussion of Epiphany and Greek roots of the word; star as symbol.
• 08:05–10:28 — Lindsay reads and analyzes the Magi passage from Matthew.
• 15:43–19:26 — Magi as astrologers; technical astrological language; “anatole/rising.”
• 20:10–23:42 — Theories about the Star of Bethlehem (comet, conjunctions, etc.).
• 27:27–31:22 — Astrological omens at Jesus's death; narrative function of eclipses.
• 33:08–36:39 — How later Christianity coped with astrology in its traditions.
• 39:47–41:33 — Lindsay on Cancer/manger astrological symbolism.
• 54:35–55:47 — Early Christian text selection; political motives; women's stories left out.
• 65:21–68:38 — Ancient Christian debates over fate, free will, and astrology.
• 72:57–74:42 — Using astrology for ethical Christian living.
• 77:23–78:09 — Saturnalia and Sol Invictus as roots for Christmas in Christian liturgy.
• 80:50–82:31 — The lingering stigma for astrologers in Christian contexts.
• 93:32–94:35 — Astrology as a liminal bridge; the Mercurial archetype.

Notable Quotes

• “Do you think it would be useful to read the passage from Matthew?” — Lindsay (07:32)
• “The term that's used here for rising, anatole... It can mean either rising over the eastern horizon... or making a heliacal rising.” — Chris (18:45)
• “Just because something isn't, like, factual doesn't mean it isn't true.” — Lindsay (41:41)
• “I sense this allergy that Christians often have where they want the story to be totally unique and just like to not come from something else... But that sanitizes it and removes so much of the context.” — Lindsay (45:11)
• “As astrologers, there's this whole other side about the predictive element... And I think there's an element there where some of the notions about providence in Christianity, I think, are amicable to what astrology represents.” — Chris (70:18)
• “Our inheritance, the sky—just like the earth is our inheritance... to commune and communicate with the sky and with the divine is good and holy and right.” — Lindsay (59:12)
• “Astrology was ruled by Mercury... Mercury was always this in-between figure... astrology has a foot in both camps...” — Chris (93:51)

Concluding Thoughts

• The episode provides a nuanced, scholarly yet accessible exploration of how astrology is woven into the early Christian narrative, especially in the story of the Magi.
• It highlights the complexities behind the reconciliation (and tension) between astrology and Christianity across history.
• The discussion is informed by textual analysis, ancient context, and an understanding that myth, literature, and history serve different but complementary purposes in meaning-making.
• Astrology, rather than being antithetical, remains deeply entangled with Christian history, symbolism, and cultural practices—both in antiquity and today.

For Further Reading and Contact

• Rev. Lindsay Turner: Website: badpastor.me
• Chris Brennan: Host of The Astrology Podcast; author of Hellenistic Astrology

This summary skips ads and outro credits, focusing on the episode’s rich discussion and insights for listeners exploring astrology’s place in spiritual, historical, and literary contexts.