Anthony Edwards says the Wolves are soft | Who is Tyrese Martin?

Summary

The Athletic NBA Daily – Episode: Anthony Edwards says the Wolves are soft | Who is Tyrese Martin?

Release Date: November 28, 2024
Hosts: Dave DeFore, Zena Keita, and Esfandiar Baraheni
Guests: James Edwards, The Athletic’s New York Knicks Beat Writer

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1. Introduction

The episode opens with hosts Dave DeFore and Andrew Schlecht delving into recent NBA developments, kicking off with the Minnesota Timberwolves' struggles and the Sacramento Kings' recent victory. As Thanksgiving approaches, the conversation naturally transitions into team performances and internal dynamics within the league's teams.

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2. Minnesota Timberwolves vs. Sacramento Kings: A Tough Loss for the Wolves

Dave DeFore (02:27):
"The Kings managed to eat because the Wolves were their opponent last night, and the Wolves are down really bad."

The hosts discuss the Sacramento Kings' crucial win over the Timberwolves, highlighting the Wolves' consistent underperformance. Minnesota's inability to capitalize on Devonis Anunoby's five fouls and their general lack of cohesion are scrutinized.

Andrew Schlecht (04:00):
"This game is about the return of Malik Monk. He had 11 points and five assists in the fourth quarter, which really made the difference."

Malik Monk's impactful return and Jay Crowder's unexpected contribution from the Kings are emphasized as key factors in securing the win against the Wolves.

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3. Anthony Edwards Criticizes the Timberwolves’ Internal Cohesion

Anthony Edwards (06:11):
"We soft as hell like a team internally. We can't talk to each other. Just a bunch of little kids."

Edwards openly criticizes the Timberwolves' internal dynamics, suggesting a lack of maturity and communication within the team. This candid admission raises concerns about the team's leadership and long-term viability.

Dave DeFore (06:09):
"They're elite at nothing. That's a huge issue for them."

DeFore expands on Edwards' comments, comparing the Wolves unfavorably even to a struggling team like the Philadelphia 76ers, emphasizing the Wolves' lack of internal strength and unity.

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4. Houston Rockets: Talent vs. Organization

Dave DeFore (08:04):
"The Rockets are fantastic to watch with amazing athletes like Amen Thompson, but their offense disappears when it matters most."

The Houston Rockets receive attention for their athleticism and individual talents, particularly Jalen Green's impressive 41-point game. However, inconsistencies in their offensive organization, especially during critical moments, are highlighted as areas needing improvement.

Andrew Schlecht (09:54):
"It's confusing who they're supposed to go to because it's somebody's night. Jalen Green last night was not good for them."

The lack of a clear offensive leader and reliance on sporadic performances from players like Shai Gilgeous-Alexander are discussed as hindrances to the Rockets' progress.

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5. Cleveland Cavaliers’ Struggles and Atlanta Hawks’ Dominance

Dave DeFore (11:03):
"For the second week in a row, the Cavs lost a game. They are no longer any good."

The Cavaliers' disappointing back-to-back losses are dissected, with particular focus on their inability to contend against high-performing teams like the Atlanta Hawks. Trey Young's stellar performance against the Cavs underscores the Hawks' potential as a play-in spoiler.

Andrew Schlecht (11:42):
"The bench production from the Hawks was key. Double digits from almost everyone made it difficult to lose."

The depth of the Hawks' roster and their cohesive team effort are credited with their recent success against the Cavaliers.

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6. Introducing Tyrese Martin: The Breakout Star

Andrew Schlecht (12:33):
"Tyrese Martin, in 28 minutes tonight, was 8 of 10 from three, scoring 30 points. He didn't score 30 points once in college."

Tyrese Martin emerges as a surprising breakout star, leading his team to victory against the Phoenix Suns with an exceptional shooting performance. His ability to seamlessly integrate into the Brooklyn Nets' offensive framework despite his limited prior recognition is praised.

Dave DeFore (13:06):
"Great coaching, but Cam Thomas is out for a month. We'll see if they can keep it up."

The discussion acknowledges the coaching staff's role in Martin's development while also noting potential challenges, such as Cam Thomas's absence, that may impact the team's momentum.

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7. New York Knicks: Offensive Prowess Meets Defensive Fragility

James Edwards (13:58):
"The Knicks have been crushing offensively, but they struggle against teams that switch defensively."

James Edwards analyzes the Knicks' offensive strengths juxtaposed with their defensive weaknesses, particularly against teams employing switching defenses. The team's overreliance on mid-range shots and lack of effective perimeter defense are identified as critical issues.

Andrew Schlecht (16:28):
"Mikhail Bridges is shooting well in the mid-range but struggles with three-pointers and getting to the rim."

The performance of key Knicks players like Mikhail Bridges is scrutinized, highlighting inconsistencies in their shooting and defensive assignments under Tom Thibodeau's system.

Dave DeFore (19:41):
"They need to figure out how to utilize Mikhail Bridges more effectively, possibly as a playmaker."

DeFore suggests strategic adjustments to maximize Bridges' potential, advocating for a more versatile role that complements the team's defensive schemes.

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8. Draft Trends: The Shift Towards Multi-Skilled Players

Dave DeFore (27:03):
"Outside of Tyrese Martin, what trends do you see in the last five draft classes that NBA teams have been chasing?"

Responding to a listener's question, the hosts explore the evolving preferences in NBA drafts, emphasizing the increasing demand for versatile players with multiple skills beyond just height or athleticism.

Andrew Schlecht (28:08):
"Teams are looking for players with rhythm, feel, and multiple skills. It's not enough to have one singular skill anymore."

The conversation highlights the necessity for players to possess a blend of playmaking, shooting, and defensive abilities to thrive in the modern NBA landscape.

Dave DeFore (30:00):
"Players who know how to play basketball, whether they're tall or not, are becoming more valuable."

DeFore underscores the importance of basketball IQ and the ability to adapt to various roles within a team, transcending traditional positional constraints.

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9. Closing Remarks and Holiday Wishes

As the episode nears its end, the hosts share personal anecdotes about holiday traditions and extend Thanksgiving wishes to listeners, wrapping up with a nod to upcoming discussions on drafting trends and team strategies.

Dave DeFore (31:06):
"Have a happy and safe Thanksgiving out there. I'm thankful for Andrew Schlecht. Good to have you, buddy."

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Anthony Edwards on Timberwolves' Team Dynamics (06:11):
  "We soft as hell like a team internally. We can't talk to each other. Just a bunch of little kids."

• Andrew Schlecht on Tyrese Martin's Performance (12:33):
  "Tyrese Martin, in 28 minutes tonight, was 8 of 10 from three, scoring 30 points. He didn't score 30 points once in college."

• Dave DeFore on Rockets' Offensive Challenges (08:04):
  "The Rockets are fantastic to watch with amazing athletes like Amen Thompson, but their offense disappears when it matters most."

• James Edwards on Knicks' Defensive Issues (13:58):
  "The Knicks have been crushing offensively, but they struggle against teams that switch defensively."

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Conclusions and Insights

This episode of The Athletic NBA Daily provides an in-depth analysis of several NBA teams' performances, internal dynamics, and strategic challenges. Anthony Edwards' blunt critique of the Timberwolves highlights significant internal issues that could hinder the team's future prospects. Meanwhile, the emergence of Tyrese Martin as a standout player introduces a new narrative of under-the-radar talent making impactful debuts.

The discussion on the New York Knicks sheds light on the complexities of balancing offensive prowess with defensive responsibilities, particularly against adaptive defensive strategies employed by rival teams. Additionally, the exploration of draft trends emphasizes a shift towards valuing multi-skilled players who can adapt to the evolving demands of modern basketball.

Overall, the episode offers listeners a comprehensive overview of current NBA landscapes, player performances, and strategic considerations shaping the season's trajectory.

Transcript

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[Dave DeFore]

Good morning and welcome to the NBA Daily. Happy Thanksgiving Everybody. I'm Dave DeFore here with Andrew Schlecht. Coming up. Oh, the Wolves are down bad, but the Kings got a win. Finally we got James Edwards on to talk about the Knicks. So of course they lost last night and Andrew and I are going to bat around the concept of what NBA teams are drafting for. Good morning everybody. Good Morning, Andrew. Andrew, you already start prepping for Thanksgiving.

[Andrew Schlecht]

The before or what?

[Apple Card]

Without a doubt. We've got. We've got some pies in the oven as we speak here at midnight Central Standard Time.

[Andrew Schlecht]

We are.

[Apple Card]

We are getting ready.

[Dave DeFore]

That's awesome.

[Apple Card]

I.

[Dave DeFore]

You know what? I have very little cooking to do. I just get to show up and eat. It is nice. Speaking of eating, the Kings managed to eat because the Wolves were their opponent last night, and the Wolves are down really bad. The Kings had been losing. I mean, they lost six straight, so they really needed to win. But the Wolves and their vibes that we've been hitting just day after day on the show, they also needed to win. And the Kings pull this out. They were down 10 in this game, Andrew, pretty late, and it's just the same old thing we keep seeing from the Wolves where they fall apart. But the Kings took advantage. They were able to score. I mean, Devonis Bonus, you know, had five fouls, and somehow the Wolves weren't able to take advantage. But also, he. He was able to play around five fouls and still be effective. I mean, I. I just think the Kings really won that game.

[Apple Card]

Yeah, he. He had fouled out of three previous games in Minnesota. Like, this has been a. A problem for Demon Sabonis and give him just tons of credit. He played really well. And this game, to me, is. Is about the return of Malik Monk. If we're talking about the Kings. Yeah, they've missed him desperately. They lost four in a row. He'd come back against the Thunder. Didn't look quite right. He was even kind of limping around. But in the fourth quarter alone, he had 11 points and five assists, which really was the difference maker there. You had nine points from Fox in the fourth quarter as well. Those two really helped deliver this game. Also, Jay Crowder.

[Dave DeFore]

Yeah.

[Apple Card]

Raise your hand if you knew that Jay Crowder was on the Kings, because the Kings didn't even know that yesterday. They brought him off the scrap heap, and he actually played pretty well. Like, what they need is just a physical veteran, which is what they've missed in Harrison Barnes. And we've talked about that here on the show is like, they just need somebody competent to take that spot. They're just not getting that enough. And especially without DeMar DeRozan, who's out with a back problem. Like, yeah, you. You need that veteran presence. And at least for one night, it was Jay Crowder. Yeah.

[Dave DeFore]

They're a team where, you know, if the Rockets do decide to start trading guys away to consolidate A little bit. If Dylan Brooks was available, man, he would fit perfectly. Right. Like for what they need, they just kind of need that guy who will be a volume three point shooter and just go be a dog as much as you can be a dog. You know, on defense on that.

[Apple Card]

I don't know that I go offering up Dylan Brooks to other teams but you know, like somebody else don't do that.

[Dave DeFore]

I mean, well, on the other side of this matchup. Okay, we just had John Krasinski on yesterday. We know the vibes are bad. I don't know Andrew, if we knew that they were this bad. I'm going to just get. Look, we got the super producer over in the uk. He's going to throw the quote in. Anthony Edwards said that this team is a bunch of front runners. Said they're playing like children. Said they're soft. Ah, it's not great.

[Apple Card]

No. Let's start at that quote right now.

[Anthony Edwards]

Right now. Me and Mike was talking about, I think it's we soft as hell like as a team internally, like, you know what I mean? Like not to the other team but like internally like we soft, like we can't talk to each other. Just a bunch of little kids. It's just like we playing with a bunch of little kids. Like everybody, like the whole team, we just can't talk to each other.

[Apple Card]

You know, Dave, this is outrageously concerning to me because this is, this is about the internal leadership within the Wolves and it seems to be fragile, fractured at. At best.

[Dave DeFore]

Yeah.

[Apple Card]

As to like who. Who they are. I think it is good that Ant is admitting this, not good that he's admitting it to the media. In my opinion. You know, these, these are the kinds of conversations that he's having with media in front of everybody that typically happen behind closed doors.

[Dave DeFore]

And it seems to the media.

[Apple Card]

Yeah. And then it's eventually leaked and then somebody wants to beat up whoever leaked it to the media. But I think that this, it's, it is really interesting to see does and Krasinski pointed this out beautifully a couple nights ago where it feels like that first Rudy Gobert year where the entire season it felt like they made a bad move, which is the cat trade and they're never going to recover from it. And now it's still the thing that they have going for them. It's still early in the season and their record isn't so bad. It's not like Sixers bad at this point where they can't recover from it. I think that they'll be fine. But as far as a championship contender, I think the. The maturity of the team and the lack of a point guard are the two things that are going to hurt them the most. And right now I think that, you know, the maturity is like, squarely in front of everybody's face right now. Especially with all the comments from Aunt last night.

[Dave DeFore]

They're elite at nothing. That's one of the things for me that. That is a huge issue for them. And then to hear this stuff again, I actually think this is worse than the Sixers situation for multiple reasons. But the number one is when I look at the Sixers, I can say, you know what? It wouldn't be this bad if Paul George and Joel Embiid were healthy. Okay, sure, I understand. Here is the reason why things are falling apart there. And, you know, it's almost like a bless their heart situation. We just like to make fun of this stuff, but with the Wolves, this is internal. And now we know it's internal. And they clearly, they're not communicating amongst themselves. I don't know. That's a. That's a big problem, you know, and I'm sure a bunch of teams are paying attention to that because the west is too competitive. Speaking of, hey, the Houston Rockets won another game where they almost fumbled it at the finish. Andrew, this is beginning to look. They are fantastic to watch. They have amazing athletes. I mean, Amen Thompson does something every single game that makes my eyes just bug out. But they're playing the Sixers, and we just said, Sixers down bad. No Paul George, no Embiid. And now the Rockets are on a back to back. They're on the road. There's all these reasonings, okay? Late game, they get a bad whistle, I think on the Dylan Brooks foul call on Maxi, they go to overtime. But all the lead up to that, where they were just doing nothing, I mean, they, they scored. I think they went six or seven minutes without scoring. And then finally in overtime, Alperin Chengun has to do the thing that he's been doing. Put him on his back. Now, look, people are gonna say Jalen Green had 41 points in the game. He did, and he was great. But when it came time to get something done, their offense just disappears. And if this team's gonna make the next leap, that's the next step for them. Andrew, I think they gotta figure out a way to be more organized without just saying, hey, Alp, go get us a bucket.

[Apple Card]

Yeah. I mean, it's. It's all about. And this is, this is where they are Right now, it's like finding like, who's the man? You know, you watch a lot of other teams and it's very clear who the man is. You know, even for the Sixers, who. I mean, Tyrese maxey in the second half at 28 points in this one, he was clearly the man. In this one, Jalen Green should have been the man, but they continually did not go to him down the stretch. It was. It's just confusing, I think, who they're supposed to go to because it's. It's somebody's night. I mean, Jalen Green last night was not good for them.

[Dave DeFore]

Yeah.

[Apple Card]

Has 41 tonight. I mean, it's just. It bounces around. Who is the guy?

[Dave DeFore]

I mean, there's nights where Shingoon isn't even closing games.

[Apple Card]

Exactly, exactly.

[Dave DeFore]

It's very confusing. I don't know if it's a coaching issue.

[Apple Card]

This is where they are in their process, which is totally fine. Like, this is a young team that a lot of young guys, and they're trying to figure out who they are and winning while doing that, which I think is. Is pretty crucial for them. And eventually they're going to be able to consolidate a lot of these players into a really good player, I think. And then I think they already have a really nice foundation there in Houston. So I really like what they're cooking with.

[Dave DeFore]

Yeah. For the second week in a row, Andrew, the Cavs lost a game. They are no longer any good because, you know, not a good story, actually. They. They lost to the Hawks. 1, 35, 24. The Hawks just. I mean, they shot the lights out. They hit 20 threes. But Trey Young man, 20 points, 22 assists, and he hits a crazy shot to put the game away at the end. And this is the thing that I love about that Hawks team when. When Trey Young is playing like that. Like, they look like a team that could be a spoiler in the play in. You know what I mean? They could. They could take out one of these teams. If the Bucks is somehow in the play end, you could see them win in one of those games.

[Apple Card]

Yeah, I mean, that. That shot was a complete dagger. And the. The big difference to me in this game was just the bench production that the Hawks got. I mean, you got almost double digits from Everybody that played.9 from Kobe Buffkin, but you got. From bogdanovich, you had 17. From DeAndre Hunter, you had 26 and then 10 points from Inyaka Kong Wu. When you're getting that kind of production off your bench, it's it's difficult to lose games.

[Dave DeFore]

Yeah.

[Apple Card]

And so you had Trey Young closing this. This one out, but I think that he was just really buoyed by his teammates in this one.

[Dave DeFore]

I mean, again, I. I really like that team.

[James Edwards]

And.

[Dave DeFore]

And, you know, I gotta ask you, before we get out of here, a very important question. Who is Tyrese Martin and what did he do to the Phoenix Suns? Like, I. I didn't catch this game, Andrew.

[Apple Card]

Listen, Dave. Tyrese Martin, who. If. If you have heard his name before tonight, you are like a NBA G League sicko, and I applaud you. But Tyrese Martin, in 28 minutes tonight, was 8 of 10 from 3. He scored 30 points. Dave. He didn't score 30 points one time in college. That's amazing, let alone in the NBA. He had 33 total points in his NBA career up until tonight. He had 30 tonight. Just an unbelievable showing from a guy that no one's ever heard of.

[Dave DeFore]

That's awesome.

[Apple Card]

They beat the Phoenix Suns with Kevin Durant and Bradley Beal and Devin Booker in the lineup. And, you know, I have to give the credit to the Brooklyn Nets coaching staff and obviously the shooting of Tyrese Martin, but just the fact that you can just plug a guy in like this, it shows that they have, like, a foundation of just a general offense that you can just plug guys into, which is really helpful. Not every team. I look at this roster, and I think this Nets roster is clearly not what they want. This is clearly not the way they want to win, but they are winning this way because they have good coaching and they have a good developmental staff, and those two things can carry you a long way. Eventually, they're going to completely pull the plug on this thing. They're going to go try to get the number one pick, but for now, it's just kind of fun. They're floating around 500, and we're getting to talk about Tyrese Martin somehow.

[Dave DeFore]

It's awesome. Great coaching. But Cam Thomas, you know, he's going to be out for a month, so, you know, we'll see if they can keep it up. I do love this team, though. Too good to tank. So they're going to have to figure something out. Guys, stick around. After the break, we got James Edwards to talk about that Knicks loss and how. How do they only score 15 points in the first quarter? The NBA Daily Curse continues. So that means we, of course, we've got James Edwards, New York Knicks beat writer at the Athletic, on the show joining us. Since the Knicks got blown out last night, 15 points in the first quarter. James, this team has just been crushing offensively, but they saw switching defense last night and look like they hadn't seen one since opening night. What the heck happened with them?

[Andrew Schlecht]

It's a fascinating thing with this team. If you look at their record, I think they're 10 and 8, 10 and 9 and half or close to half have come against teams that switch. Like you mentioned Boston on opening night, they had no issue putting Drew on cat. Another one that comes to mind is Houston. They had no issue putting Dylan Brooks on cat and switching everything. And then tonight, same example, when they play teams that not only just switch, but play with some heart like those teams do, there's hard pressed to find a team that plays harder than Houston, hard pressed to find a team that plays harder than Boston and even Dallas. Dallas has been crushing defensively too this year. They just look like they don't know what to do with the ball. A lot of ISO, they don't really get it moving side to side. They don't play out in transition because the defense isn't that good right now. They, they shoot well at the rim, but they don't take a lot of shots at the rim. Not a lot. It's not a great ISO team. Brunson obviously has the ability to score at a high level with isolations, but he's not a guy that's breaking guys down off the dribble and getting all the way to the rim.

[Apple Card]

Right.

[Andrew Schlecht]

He's usually getting floaters or awkward shots. So this is the second time. Well, and this is the third time since November 10th that they've shot 32 or three less threes in a game. One against Indiana, one against Philly. I believe the Indiana. I can't. Maybe both. I can't remember if both of them were wins. I know the Philly one was when I can't remember Indiana, but they, I think they got to what, 30 tonight, 29 tonight from three point attempts. They just really struggle to get up threes against switching teams. And I think a lot of it is they don't know, do I take my man? Do I. They don't really move as much. The cutting's not as crisp as it is against non switching teams. They just look really disoriented.

[Apple Card]

Yeah, I, the question that I've had about the Knicks all season is just like from your perspective, what's going on with Mikhail Bridges? He, he, he played okay tonight. I thought offensively he was okay. Still, like, doesn't get to the free throw line, doesn't Seem to be in rhythm. There's even defensively he's not been the guy that I thought that he would be for New York. Like what. What's going on there from your perspective?

[Andrew Schlecht]

There's a couple things. And our colleague Fred Katz wrote a good piece last week on the weird season Mikhail Bridges has happened because I agree the best way to describe it is weird. If you look at his two point numbers, like he's shooting the mid range as good as anybody in the league, right. But above the break threes, he's in the teens and I wonder if like the hitch in his shot has something to do with the further distance threes as he's shot and better. He shoots much better in the corners and obviously as we know that's much shorter distance than than on the wings. And then he doesn't get to the hole off the dribble. All his baskets and he had one last night against Dallas, but that was like the first in a while. Usually a lot of his shots at the rim come off cutting. He's not a guy that's breaking guys off the dribble and getting to the rim. And when he does isolate, he tends to always, even if he has a lane to the, to the basket, he usually stops and shoot a mid range jump shot.

[Dave DeFore]

Like that little pull up.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah, he shoots. He really likes that. And asked him about it a few weeks ago and he said playing with two of the greatest mid range shooters of all time like helped like rubbed off on him a little bit. And I do agree with him too. He talked about in the playoffs like it's very key to like be able to get any type of shot. But it's like throughout the course of the regular season you can never make too many of those shots. Dwayne Casey used to say you can never make too many mid range shots to overcome the math game in today's NBA. And yeah, for the in the next case it's showing to be true. Like they shoot a lot of mid range shots. The offense is phenomenal. I want to make sure that's clear. But there are times when the offense is very efficient and it doesn't matter because teams shoot more threes than they do right. And they make more threes. So McHale's had a weird season. I agree defensively as well. He just doesn't really get through screens well. Like you watch OG Anunobu, who's one of the best in the league at doing it and then you watch Mikhail, it's like he takes the long way.

[Dave DeFore]

Around and that's new though. He's always been really good at navigating screens. He just, he just isn't as. It's not that he's not as skinny because he's still skinny, but he's not as skinny getting around screens for some reason. And I been able to figure that out.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Very weird season. I think the defense has been like something that he earned the label early. I think the last few years it's not been to the all NBA level that I think most, if you ask most people that he, he possesses, he, he still has the capabilities of being a really good defender. I just don't think we've seen it that much. And OG's has. When you look at how OG Anunobi is a great defender. Yeah, I would say if you pick a weakness in OG's defensive abilities, it's guarding smaller guards, right? So you get Mikhail, you think he can take those assignments, you can play OG off ball and let him do what he does. But Mikhail's just really struggled staying in front of him, getting around screens. And it's been a big issue for the Knicks, especially when they don't have like a pure rim protector down there anymore. With Mitchell. Yeah, Mitchell Robinson out. No Isaiah Hardenstein.

[Dave DeFore]

I mean part of this is I actually think that Mikael Bridges in a Tom Thibodeau defense like kind of is a man without a role to a certain degree because OG does so much of the help stuff. But they got to figure out something to use him and make him more valuable. Maybe they figure out like a playmaker center field role for him. But on the offensive side, OG Anunoby has actually had a really great season. Had a 40 point game the other night. Now didn't shoot the ball very well against the Mavs. But you know, you start to look at what OG's doing as a play finisher and you think, well, maybe Mikel could just be doing more of that. But like think about it, you know, couldn't Mikhail do some of what's been working for OG Anunoby?

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah, you would think so. I think one thing that they do have in common is the cutting. I think OG cuts with more frequency. I think OG is a little bit more physical and does get to the rim a little bit more. But I think the big difference between them is OG shooting a career high on, on threes above the break and Kale shooting a career low. And I think that's really what's opened up OG's game. He's always had the cutting Having cat and that spacing like just kind of accentuates it more. But the fact that he's shooting so well from everywhere on three has really bumped his number up, numbers up and allowed him to have a few big games.

[Dave DeFore]

The grenades he's tossing guys at the end of the shot clock, man, like this is like Damian Lillard getting fouled on threes, boosting his three point percentage at this point with this grenade thing. Like it's getting ridiculous.

[Andrew Schlecht]

No, it is a lot. That's a great point. A lot of grenades. And I still think OG passes up a lot of threes where he has a little bit of room and he should let it fly and still hesitates. But he's making them listen. I don't. The offense is really, really good. I still think there's like some things that are a bit concerning. Like the fact that they don't get to the rim much is, I think more on personnel than it is Tom Thibodeau, because we know Tom is very much analytically driven. But I think that says more about the personnel. Jalen Brunson likes to get to the mid range. Mikel Bridges, I didn't know this, but apparently only likes to take mid range shots. OG has been a great post up player, but he's not like a guy that's going to break you down off the dribble and blow past you and get to the rim. Cats usually playing out at the perimeter, then they're also, because of that they're not getting to the free throw line. So for as efficient as the offense has been, it could be even more efficient, I guess, which is scary because it's on pace to be like one of the best offenses ever. But I do think that at some point it's going to come back to bite them. You just, if you're not going to defend well, you can't score that many twos and win against the really good teams a la Boston. Like you look at the games that they lost, they shot tremendously on twos. The other team outshot them from three. And that's just kind of been the weird story because they're not defending well and not always getting up the most amount of threes that they, that they possibly can because they do struggle with things like switching.

[Apple Card]

Yeah, yeah, I, when you, when I'm watching this game first, like it was not much of a game. So you start thinking about other things. So I started thinking about, you know, the Jalen Brunson connection and then when I was thinking about bringing you on the show. I started thinking about Quentin Grimes because there's obviously, like, a Knicks Mavs connection here, but there's also this. This stop in the middle in Detroit where somehow the Detroit Pistons just gifted Quentin Grimes for nothing to the Dallas Mavericks summer. And I just keep thinking, how and why did this happen? Like what? Like he was obviously a player that. I mean, they got to basically salaried up a player, and they get back a player who I think is more helpful to them than what Tim Hardaway Jr. Was. Explain to me how this happened, James, because I just can't. I can't get there.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah. I'm not sure I'll have an answer for you, but I. What I think was. Was part of the logic. Obviously, when the trade happened, there was a different front office in place. Troy Weaver and company were running the program. Then Trajan Langdon comes in. If people recall, Quentin barely played in Detroit. Really struggled with a knee injury, which I think he had coming from New York. I can't remember if he. I don't even think he. Like, once the trade happened, I think it took him a while to play. Then he tried to play and was like 2 for 25 from 3 and then sat out. And it was. His time in Detroit wasn't the most efficient, even though I thought he had some good moments defensively.

[Apple Card]

Sure.

[Andrew Schlecht]

And I think part of it is getting the ex. The big expiring of Tim as opposed to Quentin, which allowed to consider resigning. Right. And I think. Yeah, I think they were very. I don't know why they had to give up Quentin to take on Tim. Right. But they could have maybe kept both. But maybe they looked at it as like, we have a lot of guards we want to develop, and I'm not sure there's enough room there. I'd rather they'd rather have the veteran leadership of Tim as opposed to taking another young guy who's only. What? Quentin's in his fourth year, fifth year, and trying to give him minutes. And then you're fighting with a sar, you're fighting with Ron Holland, you're fighting with Ivy, you're fighting with Sasser. Like, they had a lot of young guards, but to help usher in this new era, they go for the veteran and Tim Hardaway. So I don't really have a reason why they didn't keep both. I just know that Quinton's time in Detroit wasn't ideal given the injuries and. And things of that nature. But weirdly, it's kind of worked out for both teams. I know Detroit got popped last night. But what they're 8 and 12 and I think Tim has had a couple of moments here and there for them while Grimes has been really solid and talked to some Mavs people last night at the game and they said he's really embraced the defensive end. They've really. He's really embraced kind of his role.

[Apple Card]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schlecht]

And he seems to be in a good spot. He's a good player. He's just. It's always been health with him and he's work.

[Dave DeFore]

He's working perfectly there is that that guard off the bench and I mean got the start in this one 21 points, you know, revenge game. Right. Maybe against. Against the Knicks. I don't know.

[Tyrese Martin]

We.

[Dave DeFore]

We're looking for stuff here. It's November, you know. Go and read.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Quinn's been solid.

[Dave DeFore]

Oh yes, he has been. Yeah, go and read him over at the at James Edwards. He covers the Knicks. Also, some of the most interesting stories in and around the NBA that you're ever going to read come from James Edwards. James, have a happy Thanksgiving. Have a good trip home. Be safe. Talk to you soon. Guys. Stick around. After the break, Andrew and I are going to talk about some recent trends in drafts and what we've seen teams looking for foreign of course over on the website we got the post up go and leave your questions. We're looking for a basketball question and a non basketball question but just a basketball question tonight because kind of went deep on some other stuff. But Andrew, this is super up your alley because it's a draft question. I know you're going to love it. Outside of Tyrese Martin, what sort of trends do you see in the last five draft classes that NBA teams have been chasing this drafting a tall athletic wing who can't shoot actually pan out. And that's from John M. Who subscriber over on the website.

[Apple Card]

Shout out to John M. For this question. It's a great one. Now guys that can't shoot. Now here's the deal with the draft is that you have to be able to do a lot of things to make it in the NBA today. I think about a guy like Jabari Smith who's. Who's a good player who I think will be in the NBA for a long time. But why is he not taking off like some of the other guys in the class have? Well, he doesn't have like the multiple skills. He doesn't have the ball handling. He doesn't have the playmaking that some of these guys have. And I think those two skills for no matter how big you are, like those. Those two are going to translate. And that's what I think teams are looking for is just like rhythm. Feel like those things are always going to be helpful to a team. And I think that there are teams looking for those kind of guys. I mean, you can look in the 23 class like the Thompson twins. Those are guys that have that. Anthony Black went high in that draft. Even Koulibaly, we've seen that from him in this one. And I think those are definitely skills that people are looking for. And you just can't have one singular skill anymore.

[Dave DeFore]

Yeah, you definitely can't.

[Apple Card]

You just can't. And you have to be on a very specific team. I think about the guy guys who are three and D only that are actually surviving in this version of the NBA. Like, you almost have to play for the Mavericks, you know, I mean, and.

[Dave DeFore]

Even then, like, I mean, Clay is probably defending harder this season than he's had to in a couple.

[Apple Card]

Sure.

[Dave DeFore]

You know, just by virtue of the way that the league is. I mean, three. It's no longer three and D anymore. It's three and D and at least two dribbles and a decision, you know, like Danny Green when he first started out, he might not make it into a rotation now, you know, these guys are just there on a different level. And, you know, the top of the draft is kind of where you were thinking, but it for me, like the role player section of the draft. I mean, again, Tyrese Martin make the joke, but you have to be able to stick threes. But it's about. I think what you find is these guys that in Dalton Connect might be a guy that we look to more. Ryan Dunn, like these guys that played a little bit longer who know how to. Well, Dalton connect doesn't know how to defend, but Ryan Dunn does. So you get these guys who know how to do something. Well, Dalton Connect, he's so experienced in an offense that, you know, you see him comfortably. You know, he can pump and attack and attack a closeout. He knows how to move the ball. So I think that's something that I'm noticing. You know, you see guys who just know how to play basketball, whether they're tall. I mean, Kojimski, look at a guy like him. I mean, Dante Divincenzo, guys that size and White weren't going to get drafted. You know, it's just that just wasn't going to happen. And now they're able to break through because, you know, number one, being able to shoot the three Number two, being able to offensive rebound. Number three, being able to play defense the way they do. So, you know, it's, I would say this being 64 is no longer a death sentence for a prospect.

[Apple Card]

Yeah. Still though, players that are tall and have good length.

[LinkedIn Sales Navigator]

Yes.

[Apple Card]

Will always, you will always reach for those guys. You will always take the saloon or the Ron Holland or the Cody Williams of the world just because it is hard to find guys that size in the NBA that can do multiple things. So I think teams will continue to reach for those kinds of players, certainly. But it's, it's more about skill than it ever has been in the NBA and especially with the drafts. It's, it's multiple skills and it's a playing with a particular rhythm that I see NBA teams really going for.

[Dave DeFore]

All right, now I got a non NBA question for you. Do you decorate for the holidays on Thanksgiving or do you start it later on December?

[Apple Card]

Oh, I did today.

[Dave DeFore]

Oh, before Thanksgiving you have.

[Apple Card]

I put two trees up today, Dave. I don't know if you're disappointed in me or not. I don't really care.

[Dave DeFore]

Pretty early.

[Apple Card]

You know what, listen, I've got kids at home and I want to cherish the holiday season as much as I can. Okay. So if you think I'm a big loser for it.

[Dave DeFore]

Not at all. Get the eggnog, turn on the Mariah Carey. Everybody have a very happy and safe Thanksgiving out there. I'm thankful for Andrew Schleicht. Good to have you, buddy. For Andrew Select, I'm Dave Dufour and this has been the NBA Daily. Thanks for waking up with us.

[LinkedIn Sales Navigator]

As we head into the playoffs, it's safe to assume there will be a few calls made by the refs that will be hard to accept. But you know what? What isn't hard to accept? Discover. Believe it or not, Discover is accepted at 99% of places that take credit cards nationwide. You heard that right, 99%. So make a good call for your wallet and get Discover. Based on the February 2024 Nielsen report. Learn more at discover.com credit card this.

[Tyrese Martin]

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[Apple Card]

ACAST powers the World's Best Podcasts Here's a show that we recommend.

[James Edwards]

Hey folks, it's Marc Maron from WTF. It's been more than 15 years now, and I'm still talking to all kinds of people in my garage every week. Sometimes it's Bill Burr, sometimes it's Ariana Grande. She just looks at me because she's always going like, dad, it's not that big a deal. Yeah. I go, sorry, I lost my temper. I go, I still love you. You know, Daddy has issues.

[Tyrese Martin]

Are you afraid of it?

[Apple Card]

Of death?

[Dave DeFore]

Death?

[Apple Card]

Well, I don't.

[Dave DeFore]

I think about it all the time.

[Apple Card]

How are we here already?

[James Edwards]

Listen to WTF with Marc Maron twice a week on your favorite podcast app. Or get more WTF with a WTF subscription. Just go to wtfpod.com and click on WTF.

[Apple Card]

Acast helps creators launch, grow, and monetize their podcasts everywhere. Acast.com.