Contender Draft + Playoff Preview | Slam N Jam

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Athletic NBA Daily – "Contender Draft + Playoff Preview | Slam N Jam"

Release Date: April 19, 2025

Hosts: The Athletic’s Dave DuFour, Zena Keita, and Esfandiar Baraheni
Guest: Dan Devine of Yahoo Sports

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1. Top NBA Stories of the Week

Phoenix Suns’ Turbulent End to the Season Dan Devine highlights the Phoenix Suns' disappointing conclusion to the 2024-25 regular season. Despite holding the league’s highest payroll, the Suns missed the play-in tournament, finishing tied with the Portland Trail Blazers at 36-46. This led to the swift dismissal of coach Mike Budenholzer, marking the Suns' eighth head coach in 11 seasons. Owner Matt Ishbia remains defiant, assuring fans of future championships. Devine notes, “The expectation is that Kevin Durant will be traded this summer,” [02:59] indicating significant roster changes ahead.

Utah Jazz and Washington Wizards’ Struggles The Utah Jazz secured the worst record in the league with 17 wins, narrowly avoiding the position after the Wizards’ buzzer-beater victory over Miami ([02:59]). The Wizards themselves ended the season with an average scoring margin of minus 12.4, the third-worst in NBA history. This drastic downturn places both teams under intense scrutiny as the playoffs approach.

Dallas Mavericks’ Surprising Turn of Events The Mavericks experienced a tumultuous week. Nico Harrison’s unusual interview sans cameras led to widespread speculation about the Luca trade. Rick Welts’ comparison of the Luca trade to Golden State’s trade of Monte Ellis for Andrew Bogut only intensified fan frustrations. Despite the off-court drama, the Mavericks delivered a commanding 91-0 win against the Sacramento Kings, reigniting hope among their fanbase.

Sacramento Kings’ Front Office Shakeup In response to missing the playoffs for the second consecutive season, the Kings parted ways with GM Monte McNair, hiring Scott Perry from the Kings’ front office and previously with the Knicks ([02:59]). Reports suggest McNair’s reluctance to fire Coach Mike Brown and his hesitance in key trades contributed to his exit.

Chicago Bulls’ Playoff Absence and Future Prospects The Bulls missed the playoffs, mirroring last year’s struggles. However, Devine points out a silver lining: “The Bulls end up having their first-round pick because they acquired the unprotected part of that pick back in the Lavine trade.” This strategic move provides potential for rebuilding and future optimization.

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2. Surprise Teams and Their Impact

Dan Devine introduces the concept of "surprise teams" — those exceeding preseason expectations by at least 10 wins. This season saw three such teams:

1. Detroit Pistons: Surpassing an over-under of 24.5 with 44 wins, tying the second-largest discrepancy since the 1999-2000 season.
2. Portland Trail Blazers: Exceeded their 22.5-win expectation by securing 36 wins.
3. Chicago Bulls: Surprised by winning 39 games against a 27.5-win projection.

Devine regrets not selecting any of these teams in his own predictions, praising their unexpected performances and setting up a newfound resource for fans to track surprise teams at tinyurl.com/surpriseteams.

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3. Championship Draft Game

An engaging segment where hosts and guest Dan Devine participate in a championship draft, selecting teams they believe have the best chance to win the title. The draft operates as a snake format with three rounds, totaling nine team picks.

Dan Devine’s Picks:

1. Boston Celtics ([32:33]) – Favored for their health and historical success.
2. Sacramento Kings (N/A) – Conflicted but recognizes their potential.

Hosts’ Picks:

• Andrew Schlecht selects the Oklahoma City Thunder ([34:22]) for their MVP and deep roster.
• Zena Keita opts for the Golden State Warriors ([34:48]) and later the Los Angeles Lakers ([37:31]).
• Esfandiar Baraheni chooses the Milwaukee Bucks ([40:46]) for Giannis Antetokounmpo’s outstanding performance.

The segment concludes with Dan securing a victory in the trivia game, showcasing his knowledge and engaging banter with the hosts.

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4. In-Depth Playoff Matchup Analysis

Chicago Bulls vs. Detroit Pistons Dan and the guest discuss the Bulls’ playoff absence and the Pistons’ potential struggles. Devine expresses skepticism about the Bulls’ ability to break their cycle of mediocrity, emphasizing concerns over roster stability and long-term vision.

Sacramento Kings’ Front Office Changes Further discussion on the Kings’ management overhaul, highlighting the implications of Scott Perry’s appointment and the potential strategic shifts required to make the team competitive.

Magic vs. Boston Celtics The Celtics’ confident stance against the Magic, including tactical insights such as player ejections and key player performances, particularly Trey Young’s strategic moves during high-stakes moments ([07:50]).

Nuggets vs. Clippers Playoff Prediction Devine grapples with predicting the outcome between the Nuggets and Clippers, acknowledging the defensive prowess of the Clippers versus the offensive firepower of the Nuggets. He remains undecided, remarking, “I think you can... That's a coin flip to me.” ([27:18]).

Indiana Pacers vs. Milwaukee Bucks Zena Keita advocates for the Bucks due to Giannis Antetokounmpo’s exceptional season, while Dan Devine counters by supporting the Indiana Pacers, emphasizing their balanced team and defensive strength ([44:24]).

Golden State Warriors vs. Houston Rockets A thorough analysis of the Warriors’ defensive strategies against the Rockets’ unique playstyle. Devine praises the Warriors’ adaptability and defensive efficiency, expressing confidence in their ability to counter the Rockets' offensive tactics ([54:32]).

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5. Notable Quotes and Insights

• Matt Ishbia on Suns’ Future:
  “The Suns would win championships.” ([02:59])

• Dan Devine on Surprise Teams:
  “We were spoiled this year because we ended up getting three surprise teams.” ([08:11])

• Dan Devine on Bulls’ Future Decisions:
  “If I'm looking at spot track correctly, after next season, they're set up to have Nicola Vucevic, Kevin Herder, Zach Collins, Kobe White, IO Dasunmu, and Javon Carter all come off the books.” ([19:19])

• Zena Keita on Chris Paul’s Potential Move:
  “Chris Paul is basically like an itinerant preacher spreading the gospel of good basketball across the NBA landscape.” ([27:33])

• Dan Devine on Championship Draft Strategy:
  “If OKC has, like, a cold shooting series, I think either of these teams could beat OKC.” ([39:37])

• Zena Keita on Indiana Pacers’ Defensive Strength:
  “They have really worked out the offensive balance with Pascal Siakam who has one of the better all NBA cases that nobody's talking about.” ([44:24])

• Zena Keita on Golden State’s Defense vs. Rockets:
  “Devotees to Fred Van Vliet, he's one of the quietly most important players in the bracket right now.” ([55:46])

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6. Trivia Showdown: Andrew vs. Dan

The episode culminates in a lively trivia contest between host Andrew Schlecht and guest Dan Devine, testing their knowledge on the recent NBA season. Despite challenging questions, Dan Devine emerges victorious with a final score of 5-1, showcasing his deep understanding of the league’s intricacies and providing entertaining moments for listeners.

Highlighted Trivia Moments:

• Question on Players with 100+ Dunks and Threes:
  "Only one guy in the entire league." – Correct Answer: OG Anunoby ([60:27])

• Question on Players with 100+ Shot Blocks:
  “James Harden” and Magic Johnson were discussed as potential answers, highlighting the difficulty of the question ([64:43])

• Question on Most Frequently Worn Jersey Number:
  The correct answer was number 8 ([70:58])

• Final Question on Career Turnovers:
  Identifying Magic Johnson and James Harden as the players with the most 300+ turnover seasons ([72:26])

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7. Conclusion and Final Thoughts

Dan Devine wraps up the episode by reflecting on the intensifying playoffs, the importance of strategic team decisions, and the unpredictable nature of the NBA postseason. The hosts encourage listeners to engage with the podcast on various platforms, leaving reviews and subscribing for more in-depth basketball analysis.

Key Takeaways:

• The Suns’ management instability could signal major shifts in the upcoming season.
• Surprise teams like Detroit Pistons, Portland Trail Blazers, and Chicago Bulls offer intriguing narratives.
• The championship draft game underscores differing opinions on team strengths and playoff potentials.
• Playoff matchups remain highly volatile, with significant implications for team trajectories.

Listeners gain a comprehensive understanding of the current NBA landscape, enriched by expert analysis, playful interactions, and insightful discussions from both The Athletic's seasoned hosts and their knowledgeable guest.

Transcript

[Host 1]

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[Host 2]

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[Dan Devine]

Well Andrew, our top story this week was the end of the 2425 regular season. The Phoenix Suns, owners of the league's highest payroll, missed the play in completely, finishing tied with the Portland Trailblazers at 36 and 46. In response, the Suns quickly moved to fire coach Mike Budenholzer, who was only hired last summer. Now, assuming Devin Booker is still a son next season, their next coach will be his eighth head coach in 11 NBA seasons. Matt Ishbia met with the media this week and was defiant, promising that the Suns would win championships. Quote with an S at the end Another word with an s at the end is picks, which the Suns do not have until I'm like 45. The expectation is that Kevin Durant will be traded this summer, and while many have assumed Houston would be a likely suitor, Mark Stein reported this week that a Katy trade would be unlikely for the Rockets because he does not fit with team's timeline. Now it took all the way until game 82 to decide who would finish the season with the worst record and this year's reverse champion was the Utah Jazz, who finished with 17 wins, only three more than last year's Pistons team. The Jazz secured the worst record after the Wizards got a dramatic win in the final game of the season, a 119 to 118 win in Miami that ended on an impossible Bub Carrington floater at the buzzer. The Wizards finished the season with an average scoring margin of minus 12.4 that is third worst in NBA history behind only the seven win Bobcats and the 9293 Dallas Mavericks. Now, speaking of the Mavs as we do every week, some good news finally happened for Mavs fans this week, but not before the Mavericks franchise could make something bad happen. First, the day before the Mavs 910 playing game against the Kings, Nico Harrison offered to sit down with the local media for an interview with the stipulation that there would be no cameras or recordings made of the interview. Thankfully, he did not exclude writing utensils and so the entire interview was still widely available. When asked about Mavs fans biggest misunderstanding regarding the Luca trade, Harrison said, quote defense wins championships. When asked about how creating a three to four year window after trading away the team's future first was in the best long term interest of the team, Harrison said, quote Defense wins championships. When asked why he didn't believe the team he built last season, which went to the NBA Finals, was a contender, Harrison said, quote Defense wins championships. Somehow, none of those answers were as bad as MAV CEO Rick Welts comparing the Luca trade to Golden State trading Monte Ellis for Andrew Bogut. The second trade comparison is many weeks from the Mavs, where it's unclear which side of the trade they think they are. Third thankfully for Mavs fans, however, the week wasn't all bad as the Mavs completely demolished the Kings in Sacramento, getting up by as many as many as 25 points before coasting to the win. Now, two years after ending their 16 year playoff drought, the Kings lost to the Mavs, locked in their second consecutive season missing the playoffs. The Kings responded by agreeing to part ways with GM Monte McNair, quickly hiring Scott Perry as GM, who was previously in the Kings front office and was most recently with the Knicks. The athletic Sam Amick reported that McNair didn't want to fire Mike Brown, which is why we didn't see anything from the Kings after Brown was fired. Amick also reported that McNair may have not been behind either the DeRozan signing or the Levine trade. Now Levine's old team, the Chicago Bulls, are also out of the playoffs after similarly getting destroyed by a ten seed at home. The good news though for Bulls fans is they will have their first round pick because they acquired the unprotected part of that pick back in the lavine trade. So as of Friday morning we know the matchups for two more playoff series in the East. The 2, 7 matchup is going to be between the Celtics and the Magic after Orlando beat Atlanta in a game during which Trey Young was ejected after picking up two quick texts for pranking the refs after throwing an aggressive chess pass to one ref, he immediately did the trick where you pretend to pass it to someone, spin it back to yourself. When the other ref asked for the ball, he was ejected. But you know, honestly after the ref's performance in the Warriors Grizzlies game, maybe they need to be pranked every once in a while because Warriors Grizz it was a it came down to a five second call on an inbounds play at the end of the game that ended up ending the game is set up a Golden State Houston 27 matchup in the West. But the two minute report revealed that in those final 120 seconds the refs made four separate errors in the game now the 18 matchups will be decided on Friday night, all leading to the first day of the NBA playoffs on Saturday. Listen to this. On Saturday we get Bucks, Pacers, Nuggets, Clippers, Pistons, Knicks and Lakers. Wolves. Wow, that is a Saturday. And those are the top stories this week.

[Host 1]

Wow, what a week. What a week. Right before the playoffs. Just so much, so many unnecessary things happening from NBA owners this week. It was almost, it's almost too good. Al. Let's, let's give us a prize. Team update. And this surprise team update is brought to you by our good friends@beta MGM.

[Dan Devine]

Yes, this is very exciting because last year we didn't have any surprise teams. That doesn't happen that often. In fact, the 992000 season, there's only been four seasons without at least one surprise team. But we were spoiled this year because we ended up getting three surprise teams. And as a reminder, that is a team who won at least 10 more games than they're over under. So who got it this season? Detroit. Obvious over under was 24 and a half. They won 44 games. That gap 19 and a half games. That is tied for the second biggest gap among all surprise teams going back to the 992000 season. In fact, one of the teams they are tied with for second is the 0102 Detroit Pistons. This was Carl Carlisle's first year as coach. The team had Ben Wallace, Jerry Stackhouse. They similarly had a 19 they they and a half more games than they're over under. The other two teams, Portland Trailblazers over under preseason 22 and a half end up winning 36 games. Very impressive. And then in what I would say is like the least surprising surprise team ever, The Chicago Bulls. 27 and a half preseason over under. They win 39 games. Now for all these teams I do the difference between their previous year wins and their current year wins. Never been a surprise team. That the number was zero. Where the Bulls end up being a surprise team despite winning the exact same amount of games they had scored in the previous season, which is just a great stat for the Bulls and I feel like is very representative of the season the Bulls had. So those are three surprise teams. Very exciting. I don't know how me and Andrew managed to not pick any of those three teams. Very bad job we did. And shout out to the listener again who made us the surprise team website which you can go look [e-mail] backslash surprise teams. Now one more thing Andrew, before we get to our guest this week. Back right around The All Star game, we picked a few names who we thought might make a post All Star break leap. And I wanted to do a first and second team all post All Star break leaps. It's a mouthful. So my second team, Shane Sharp. One of my picks, Zachary Steph Castle, Aaron Neesmith and Cade Cunningham. That's. That's my second team. Okay, first team. I'm going to go in a little bit more depth. First we got Quentin Grimes, which was also one of my picks. He had maybe the funniest pre to post splits 11, 4 and 2, pre 23, 5 and 5. Post all star break.

[Host 1]

What.

[Dan Devine]

What's really funny though is if you look at net rating, like how the team played when he was on the court. Pre allstar break minus 0.6. Post all star break minus 14.6. Because he was playing on the Sixers, of course.

[Host 1]

Wow.

[Dan Devine]

Now, his true shooting percentage basically was unchanged. This was just a guy, which actually is very impressive because he got a lot more usage and he was still able to maintain his efficiency. Quentin Grimes might just be a good player, so it'll be very interesting to see what he gets this summer. Second name Denny Abdia. We talk about him a lot. Pre All Star Break 15, 6 and 3. Post All Star Break 23, 10 and 5. His net rating swing minus 5.2 to plus 5.8. He was huge. And then some names that I just wasn't thinking of. We're going to get to an obvious name, but some names I wasn't thinking of. Tyrese Haliburton. Now, if you just look at the counting stats, it doesn't seem that significant. 18, 4, 9 to 21, 4 and 11. But his true shooting went from 59% to 68%. Post all star break and the net rating swing went to plus 1.2 to plus 12.7. He was obviously a big part of the Pacers being one of the better second half in the league. Another name I wasn't really thinking about. Paulo Banchero. Pre All Star Break 23, 7 and 5. Post All Star Break 29, 8 and 5. His true shooting jumped from 51% to 58%. And in case you're wondering, average true shooting this year was around 57 and a half. So Paulo post All Star break got his true shooting, his efficiency above average and his net rating swing went from minus 6.7 to plus 4.6. And then the last name, the one you're expecting, also an insane jump. Josh Giddy. 12, 7 and 6 to 21, 11 and 9. Similarly, his true shooting 54% to 62% and his net rating swing minus 6.5 to plus 9.9. Wow. Once again, our first team, Josh Giddy, Paul Benchero, Tyrese Halberton, Denny Abdia, and Quentin Grime. So congrats to all those guys.

[Host 1]

And in hindsight, they all make sense. But at the time, like, at the time, there wasn't a ton of confidence that Josh Giddy was like, going to turn this ship around, you know?

[Dan Devine]

Right? Yeah, absolutely.

[Host 1]

But yeah, looking at it now, you're like, how can it be so dumb not to pick him? You know, that is definitely how it felt. Okay, we are going to take a quick break and after this we're going to talk to our I got Dan Devine from Yahoo. Sports. We'll be right back. This message is brought to you by Apple Card.

[Host 2]

If you're like us on the show, you're always on triple double watch. That's why we were impressed when we learned that Apple Card was posting numbers of their own. That's right, with Apple Card, you can earn 3% daily cash back at Apple and 2% back on everything you buy using Apple Pay, not to mention 1% back on everything else. That's a stat line that any fan can appreciate. Apply for Apple Card in the Wallet app on your iPhone today and start using it right away with Apple Pay.

[Host 1]

Subject to credit approval. Apple Card issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA, Salt Lake City branch terms and [e-mail] as we head into the playoffs.

[Host 3]

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[Host 3]

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[Host 1]

All right, Al. It is my pleasure to welcome Dan Devine onto the show from Yahoo. Sports. He writes, he does podcasts.

[Host 2]

That's it.

[Host 1]

Really excited to have those two things.

[Host 2]

No more.

[Host 1]

Do not expect anything else. That's right. Okay.

[Host 2]

I don't bake. I'm not a great knitter. Yeah, this is it. I write.

[Host 1]

Do you bake, by the way?

[Host 2]

I have baked before. I wouldn't say at like a high level.

[Host 1]

Okay.

[Host 2]

But you know, it's. If you want like a big cookie that looks like a pie or something, I can do that. I can do like a simple thing that's got some chocolate chips in there. A banana bread. I can give you a banana bread. Won't be like the best one you ever had, but I can get in there. The point is writing podcasting, somewhere far below that. Baking.

[Host 1]

Baking. Okay, you mentioned it as if you were slightly insulted that I didn't mention it.

[Host 2]

So I'm a little bit mad. I'm starting the conversation angry.

[Host 1]

Yeah. So let's, let's, let's keep it angry and talk about these two nine seeds who were both convincingly beaten at home by the ten seeds. For Chicago. They beat their preseason over under by 11 and a half games. Was there anything that you saw this season from the Bulls that gives you hope that they can get off this treadmill of mediocrity anytime soon?

[Host 2]

I also, I love that in his postseason presser, Arturis Karnishevus said that he was like, oh, I think you guys predicted us for 28. We went 39. So actually it's like, we did it, guys. It's, you know, hang the banner of the mission accomplish right behind me. So. All right, we'll start with the positive. I think that there's a lot to be excited about with Matas Buzelis. I think that like, he was deeply unscared for a 20 year old who had like been playing in G league ignite last year. That's good. He showed a way to like, he could impact winning. He could attack the basket. There's stuff to get excited about with him. That's cool. The Josh Giddy question is like, is the fact that you shot 38% from 3 on decent volume, like, is that the new normal or an outlier? Because you didn't do that before and now you did it. So like, if you, if that's the new normal, then paying you becomes more palatable and then you're maybe an easier person to build around. I, I'm a little skeptical of that. I think there's reason to be skeptical of it. But what we saw, like we knew that he would put up numbers given the ball. I think he was like third or fourth in the league in touches per game after the Levine trade. So like they cleared the Runway and he took the ball and he ran with it. That's a mixed metaphor. But he could shoot too now. And so if he can keep doing that, that's good. But the, the big thing to me is like, this feels like an inflection point because you've got some decisions to make financially. Like there's a, you move off the DeRozan contract, you move off the Zach Levine contract. And if I'm looking at spot track correctly, after next season, they're set up to have Nicola Vucevic, Kevin Herder, Zach Collins, Kobe White, IO Dasunmu and Javon Carter all come off the books after next season and they got a club option on Lonzo. So you could like clear everything off and say we're going to start fresh. And this is an opportunity for us to say what kind of teams we want to be, what, what the identity of a team we want to build. And what I think they're going to do is pay Josh Giddy a lot of money, extend Kobe, White, maybe extend IO Dasunmu, not have a center after next year and kind of keep chasing 38 wins. And so like, that's the part that I'm worried about. I think there's an opportunity for a big vision. I just don't know that I see it.

[Dan Devine]

Yeah, that makes sense. And I think we are both worried in the same way for Bulls fans. So the other nine seed Sacramento Kings, their season only ended on Wednesday. They already have fired their GM. Well, mutually agreed to part ways with GM Monty McNair hired a new GM, Scott Perry. Now, subsequent reporting has come out from Sam Amick that McNair didn't want to fire Mike Brown. He also may have not been too keen on adding DeRozan or Zach LaVine. What were your thoughts on the events of the last few days in Sacramento?

[Host 2]

Oh, the. My first thought was, you know, I like Sam a lot. I'm a friend of Sam's. I don't know who Sam's sources are. I would never deign to ask, but if I was Monty McNair, I might want it to be out there that none of that stuff was my idea. So don't blame me. As I'm on the way out the door, that's the first thing I thought. I was like, huh, I wonder if Shmanty Schmichnaer was the one who made that phone call. And then the other thought I had was, it's. It's an old movie, so forgive me, but Copland, the movie, Cop Land. Robert. I think Brian De Palma directed it. Robert De Niro? No, James Mangold, maybe. Robert De Niro. He's a Internal affairs detective. And Sylvester Stallone comes to him like, hey, I didn't help you before. I want to help you now. And De Niro says in so many words, you had a chance and you blew it. There was an opportunity here. You had an identity. I just talked about the identity thing with the Bulls. You had a style of play. You had a way. Things were. You got the fans excited. It was resonating. There was a whole. There was a beam. There was a whole thing. And like. But it was also, like, we understand this might not win us a championship, but it's good and it's cool and we're excited about it. And in, like, 18 months, you just completely trash canned all of it. And I don't get why. I don't like for who? For what? Like, I can. In a vacuum, in the individual decisions, like, you need more talent. Because last year you were about the same level of team, but the west got better. You needed more talent. DeMar DeRozan is talented. He might have been the best player you could get. I get it. You were flailing and not as good as you hoped you'd be. And you'd lost a couple of games, including one, embarrassingly, at the end, you fire Mike Brown. I don't love it, but I get it. And you just. You need. Again, now you're at the point where Darren Fox wants out because you kind of hung that whole thing around his neck. So, okay, you make a trade, and you get back an all star score in Zach Levine and you're like, okay, I get it. But again, vision. What are we trying to build? Are we trying to build a previous failure version of the Bulls plus Demanda Sabonis? And then for what? So I look at it and I just say, like, the. The bad team stay bad a lot of times because the people making decisions feel like they're just cats chasing a laser pointer. And. And they don't have, like, a goal in mind, really. And I would. It would bum me out a lot if the beam was just like the universe's biggest laser pointer.

[Dan Devine]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Oh, it's so good. That's almost too good.

[Host 2]

Again, guys, I don't bake, but I write and I podcast, so here we go. I got this for you.

[Host 1]

The guy can write and he can podcast.

[Dan Devine]

I was wondering because, you know, demonic Sabonis, he was asked about what this team needs. In his ex interview. He said, the biggest thing is this team needs a point guard. He was very direct. Imagine that. Are there any real. Because they've kind of boxed themselves in a little bit by taking on this Levine contract. Are there any realistic point guard targets that you can think of that might be a good fit for this team?

[Host 2]

Everybody knows this, but it's worth saying out loud into a microphone. Being here, like three years after you had both D'Aaron Fox and Tyrese Halliburton feels insane. Just like, you know, bananas, monkey paw kind of stuff. This isn't an answer. Like, it's not like a long term solution. But I have this. This thing that I love and I have loved for the recent years. It's kind of like Chris Paul is basically like an itinerant preacher spreading the gospel of good basketball across the NBA landscape. One year at a time.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Host 2]

What if you. I mean, and Chris Paul has said, like, he's like, I don't know. I'll think about it this off season, but I think I might want to keep playing if he wants to leave San Antonio. And, like, I would totally be fine if he didn't. But, like, say he's like, no, I'll go back to California. It's like a 45 minute flight back to my home. What if you gave Chris Paul the mid level exception and were like, fix it or organize us. Figure out how to get everybody where they will, like, mentor Devin Carter and Keon Ellis and like, show everybody where to stand and what they're supposed to do when they get there. And like, then when, you know, in a year when you've made your 13 million or whatever, and you hear the sound of someone else calling you from, you know, another state across the NBA landscape. You, you know, put your bindle on your shoulder and you keep walking out that way. Like, I like the idea of you need somebody who is just like an organizing principal, who's like, I don't need to be the guy scoring every. I mean, you had the scorer and you let him go. You had the guy who was just like instant injection of offensive efficiency. You moved him because you needed to decongest the logjam and give it team to one like, all right, who just organizes it and says, you go there, you go there. I get you shots, I teach you how to screen for me, I teach you how to work the other end of it. We work from there. I think that makes some sense. And also maybe just gets Sabonis a lot of easy like pocket pass buckets. And he likes that. The lower wattage, not as exciting version of that is like if you can get like a buy low Tyus Jones to do a similar kind of job, like organize, don't really get in the way too much. Hit some shots when the ball comes to you. High turnover or efficiency. High assist, low turnover maybe. But like, I don't know, maybe I'm missing the big swing, but it seems like there's not really anybody in their price range or with their asset collection that is going to like completely revolutionize everything. So, yeah, you know, Chris Paul, basketball preacher, let's do it.

[Dan Devine]

I love that idea especially, I mean, he played all 82 games for the spurs. So you feel, you're feeling good going into it. It's not like you feel like, oh my gosh, this guy's. I mean, he is very old, but he just proved to us that he can still do it. So I just want that idea.

[Host 2]

I want more decision makers with gray beards. I mentioned this on the big number with Tom Haberster. Like, one of my favorite things about LeBron and Draymond this year is that they're just like embracing it. Like full gray beard. I need more guys doing that. And I feel like Chris Paul doesn't seem like he's in danger of that, but maybe we get to salt and pepper in year 40, 41. So that's, that's part of my, my, my self motivation for that one.

[Host 1]

All right, let's move on from these losers and talk about some playoff matchups.

[Host 2]

I thought you were going to kick me out. All right, let's move on from. See you later, Dan.

[Host 1]

Since you're not as good at baking as I thought you were. Please get out. So let's talk about the. These four matchups that we know about. Nuggets, Clippers, Lakers, Wolves, Pacers, Bucks and Knicks Pistons. Is there a series that you have, like, changed your mind on over the last week or one that you're just, like, going back and forth with?

[Host 2]

Yeah, to me, it's Clippers, Nuggets, and it's not. You know, I don't know that there's like, a nitty gritty. Like, I was deep in the film and I thought of this. Like, I think the Clippers are better, and I think they've been a better team for like, two and a half months. Basically, since Kawhi got to, like, full minute load, which was, I think, the beginning of February or right around the trade deadline. They've just been better. Like, they've been awesome. I think they finished with, like, 18 of 21. Like, they've been really good for, like, two and a half months now. And the Nuggets haven't. I mean, see Michael Malone and Calvin Booth, but they have Jokic. And so, like, I. I think all of the matchup components point to the Clippers, but then I'm like, there. There is no matchup. Com. There's no answer for Jokic. So to me, I look at it. I think you can. That's a coin flip to me. But that was. That's the one I look at. I'm like, you're going to be wrong kind of no matter what. So. But then again, we're in the MVP season where you're wrong no matter what you do anyway, so at least we can just, like, sit. I can sit and live in that wrongness no matter what. It's great. I love it. I love the way this feels.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Dan Devine]

So on the flip side, ignoring Boston, Orlando, because I'm assuming you feel pretty confident about that series, Magic and 4. Are any of these. Yes, exactly. Are any of these other series, like, you feel just locked in? Like, you feel like it's a particularly good matchup for one of these teams? No.

[Host 2]

Like, I really. I lack my confidence in this. But it's. It's weird. It's almost. It's the other way for me because I feel like I'm. I'm seeing and hearing a lot of confidence in the Knicks to kind of, like, pat the Pistons on the head and dispense with them. And I don't. I don't think so. I don't think it's going to be quite so easy. I like there's, I've heard, I feel like I'm hearing and reading a lot of Nixon 5 and that feels to me much more like Nixon 7 or maybe even Pistons in 6. Like I think the concern that I would have if I was a Knicks fan was do you have an answer for Cade Cunningham in the pick and roll? Like he destroyed Carl Anthony, Towns, Pesh, Precious Achua, whoever was playing center for the Knicks in drop all every time they played. He was awesome. He had like 52% of his threes. He had walked into pull ups. He, when you the the big came up, he just dropped a pocket passer, a lob to Isaiah Stewart or Jalen Durant. Like he has the answers to that test. Do the Knicks have another test to give to him? I'm not so sure about that. And so that's the one that gives me pause. I feel like I'm seeing a lot of confidence in that and I do not share it, but maybe I'm too low relative to consensus there.

[Dan Devine]

Well, Dan is now time for an intermission. An intermission. We're going to ask you some more questions, but we're taking a short break to play a game, sort of. It's a championship draft. Okay. So we like to do this every week during the playoffs just to kind of get a read on how we're feeling about all these teams. So I'm going to show you what is now appearing on the screen for Dan is a beautiful Excel spreadsheet that I made with all the teams. And just in case you're out there wondering, yes, those are all the accurate team colors. I did pull them from the Internet.

[Host 1]

They're all correct. Wow, look at this.

[Dan Devine]

Thank you very much.

[Host 2]

Out here pulling the pan out on folks. It's incredible.

[Dan Devine]

That's right. So the way this is going to work, we're only going to do three rounds. So we're only going to pick nine teams total. And the goal for this is to genuinely pick the teams that you think have the best chance to win the title.

[Host 2]

Okay.

[Dan Devine]

Okay. So it is a snake draft though. So if you're in the one spot, you draft one and then you have to wait a while. If you're in the three spot, you get three and four. So Dan, because you're a guest, I'm going to let you choose. Which spot would you like to draft from?

[Host 2]

You know what, I'll take the hot corner. I'll take the third.

[Dan Devine]

Okay. Andrew, where would you like to draft from? First or second?

[Host 1]

I'LL take second.

[Dan Devine]

All right, great. So you guys want me to go first? Yes, we do.

[Host 2]

Yes, we do.

[Dan Devine]

Well, I had a feeling this would happen, and I'm already locked in, and it is the Boston Celtics.

[Host 1]

Okay.

[Host 2]

Okay.

[Dan Devine]

Yes, I am a Thunder fan, but I think the west is obviously much harder than the East. And if I'm just going based on what team I think is most likely to make the Finals, I feel like I'm going to go with Boston. Obviously, Cleveland's a great team. They're a great team. But I think if. Even if it got to the point where it was Boston, OKC in the finals, I still think I would lean Boston just because they've done it before, because they're going into this playoffs healthy. That makes me feel good about them. So I. Well, I'm starting off with Boston, which means, Andrew, I have a pretty good idea of who you're going to pick Second.

[Host 1]

You have now cornered me into being the homer, which is great. I knew you were going to do this. I knew you were going to do this. After I decided to go second, I was like, oh, no. I'm going to have to be the one to say it. Oklahoma City Thunder, plus 12.7 net rating, 68 games. I mean, there are, like, so many. They've got the mvp. They have one of the deepest rosters in the NBA. The bracket, if you look at it, has broken pretty well for okc, too. So, yeah, I think you got to go with the Thunder. And it's a bold pick, the number one team. So bold.

[Dan Devine]

Spicy. Now, Dan, before you answer, in case anyone isn't watching on YouTube, if you wanted to pick. Because we're recording this on Friday, if you wanted to pick one of the eight seeds, you can get two for one here. Okay, I'll give you a Memphis and Dallas or the Hawks and the Heat. It's up to you. Just letting you know, putting that out.

[Host 2]

There, the flavor that you gain outweighs the risk. No, I appreciate the offer, but I'm going to steer clear of that one. No, the. Okay. You know, the value wise. I'll take the Cavs with my. My first choice here.

[Dan Devine]

Now. It gets spicy.

[Host 2]

It does, because I'm. Look, I. And Andrew, you brought up the. The bracket, the way it's fallen, and I would say I feel. I don't feel super confident or super great about any of this. So I'm gonna go with. You know what? I have to go with the courage of my convictions with what I wrote. I started in my preview of the series I'm gonna take the Golden State Warriors, I'm gonna take.

[Host 1]

Okay, talk to me.

[Host 2]

Because I think they're gonna beat the Rockets and I think that whichever team comes out of Lakers, Wolves, I like Golden State. In the matchup against either one of those teams, I think that the, the. I think in a small ball series against the Lakers, I think the warriors have answers to those questions. I think in a high stakes. Who do you trust more in a seven game series against a Wolves team that's like Ant and then Rudy Gobert and Julius Randall and on and on and on, you know, shouts out to Mike Conley, no shade to the legend. I think the Warriors I could see a path. So if I'm having to pick like, I don't like either Nuggets or Clippers over Thunder, I don't like either Pacers or Bucks over Cavs and I'm kind of like cannibalizing myself there since I just took the Cavs. So my long shot here or my other gambit, my moonshot would be the warriors kind of making it all the way through. So we're going to go with that.

[Dan Devine]

I do agree with you on the, the second round matchups because I've even read like from Lakers fans that they don't love the matchup with the Warriors. What do you think about that first round matchup? Like are you, are you pretty confident in the warriors going against Houston?

[Host 2]

It's not so much that I'm. That I. Well, it's the right way to phrase it. I don't want it to be like a denigration of the Rockets. It's as much as it is that that like I have one of my boomer takes is like I have to see you do it once to believe it. And I've seen Steph and Draymond and Kerr deal with the bigger, more athletic, more physical team and find answers and break them down over the course of a seven game series. And I've seen Jimmy just tilt a matchup against a favorite. I've seen those things more often. I also saw, I mean I think one thing we're kind of for or that I've been surprised. I've seen it like, haven't seen as much conversation about it. The warriors did this two years ago or three years ago to Ime Udoka. Like the, like this, this was the story of that Celtics finals. Was that like by the end the bigger, more athletic, younger, stronger, more physical team was broken by guarding Steph for two weeks. And so like, you know, Past performance does not guarantee future results. But I look at that and I'm like, I. I've seen this work this way, and so I'd bet. I'd rather bet on that than the other way. But of course, in two weeks, I could just be looking like a complete jackass. But you know what else is new?

[Dan Devine]

All right, Andrew, who would you like for your second pick? Still a lot of good names on the board. What a great playoffs.

[Host 1]

There's still some good names. I think I'm going to take the Lakers.

[Dan Devine]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

With this spot, i1, you have LeBron James and Luka Doncic on this team. Like to two of the better decision makers. And you just see this very often. Like, teams are going to pack the paint against this team, and it's about finding the corners. And you have like, two of the best minds in the game that will get all the way to the rim and they will make a move that looks like a shot, but then they will just zip it to the corner. And it's so impressive. And now it's. It's on the shoulders of these guys to hit shots from the corners for sure. But if they can get hot similar to what the Mavericks did last year, then you're going to have a chance to make a run. I do worry about their size on the interior, and they've done a really good job of packing the paint with lots of guys and doing a lot of recovery stuff similar to okc. I think that JJ Redick has talked so much about how he's such a big fan of Mark Degnalt, and you start to see, like, some of the stuff that Mark does and some of the stuff the Lakers are doing. And so I want. I wonder about the sustainability of their defense. We've seen it, like, Wax and Wayne over the last, like, stretch after they got. Luka has been really strong, and then they've had weeks where it's not looked good at all. And so I just wonder, for a sustained playoff run, can they actually keep it together for that long? Because it's so taxing on all these guys. Like, Jared Vanderbilt is going to be just completely worn out by the end of this thing. But I, I do wonder about that. But if they can keep the defense up. You obviously have two guys that can deliver and clutch moments. I think that this, to me, is the. The next best team. And they also don't have to play OKC until the conference finals. And so you. You just never know if you can get there. You just never know.

[Dan Devine]

Well, you guys have set this up beautifully for me because Dan mentioned that he was struggling most with. With Nuggets, Clippers. That's the series that I'm struggling the most with. So I don't even have to decide. I can just take both of them. Nuggets, Clippers. I'm guaranteed one of my teams will make it past the first round.

[Host 2]

That's a really good point. I'll note for the record that you didn't present that as an option. When you gave me the play in teams, you said, yeah, no, you can get four teams for the price of two. You didn't suggest the. I take the both ends of a series. I see how this goes. You bring in the guest and then you treat them like garbage. I see how it works.

[Dan Devine]

There is some strategy to this. Yeah. I just feel like either of these teams, you know, if OKC has, like, a cold shooting series, I think either of these teams could beat okc. As of right now, I'm more scared of the Clippers because they've always had a good defense, and now it feels like their offense is starting to click. With Kawhi playing a lot better and then with the Nuggets, like, if that starting lineup's healthy and they're all playing close to 40 minutes a night, like, that's a really good team. I know that they've, like, stumbled down the stretch, fired their coach, fired their gm, but if those five are healthy, that is going to be a really good lineup in the playoffs. So. So I'm still nervous about both of those teams, and I know that one of them's going to make it to the second round. So that's my final pick. Andrew, who's your final pick? Now you got to really start working now. You got to really start coming up with some good reasons for some of these teams.

[Host 1]

Yeah, there's some rough ones left, I think, and I feel. I do not feel confident about saying these next words. I think I'm going to take the Milwaukee Bucks if. If only because of Giannis Antetokounmpo, who has had a ridiculous season. He's been so good. And with the good news of Dame returning to the lineup sometime soon, I think that you. You just have a puncher's chance, I think, out in the Eastern Conference. And we know that when. If you get Giannis to the Finals, even if he gets severely hurt, he's just going to somehow come back and be amazing. So I'll go with the Bucks. I. I do not have any sort of, like, true conviction about this Milwaukee Bucks team or their, the way that they've been coached this year. But when you have a guy who has clearly been the third best player this season in the NBA and probably in a normal season would be the best player in the NBA, I have to, I have to give it to him. So I'll go Milwaukee.

[Dan Devine]

So Dan, this sets up your final pick. Which fan base would you like to give a glimmer of hope to?

[Host 2]

Well, the first thing I just want to say. Cause I get where you're coming from with the Giannis pick or the Bucks, but really a Giannis pick. Giannis and Dame on the floor together about 2,700 possessions this year plus 5.4 points per hundred. So not like, I mean good but not like great.

[Host 1]

Sounds like a stat from an amateur baker to me.

[Host 2]

Okay. That's right. I don't know ball. I base. I, I barely know baking. So I was prepared even before the Dame stuff to pick the Pacers in that series. Anyway, so I'm going to take the Indiana Pacers on the other side of this match for a couple of reasons. One, yeah, it's wonderful news to hear that Damian Lillard, the situation with the, the blood clotting appears to have resolved. I'm not entirely clear on how that has happened, but I hope it has and I hope everyone stays safe and healthy. It's still not totally clear when he comes back in the series and at what level he hasn't played in several weeks and you're throwing him right into the fire in a playoff series against a team that's really good. And I think that the Pacers, because people sort of glaze over when they see Indiana, I think they maybe don't realize that's a 50 win team. That though if you, if the version of them you think you know is the one from last year, this one's not the same. This one plays defense and better than you remember them. They're not quite as fast, they're not quite as elite offensively, but they're better balanced. And Tyrese Halliburton has been about as good in the second half of the season as he was in the first half of last year when everyone was like, is he going to make all NBA first team? Plus they, you know, they've really worked out the offensive balance with Pascal Siakam who has one of the better all NBA cases that nobody's talking about. And he's not going to make it, but he's been really, really good this year. They are deep. They go and they use that depth because they pressure you all over the floor. I feel like Dame's going to come back and have to like, deal with Andrew Nemhardt 94ft for, you know, or TJ McConnell or Andrew Niest. Like they're gonna. They're just gonna keep. Or Aaron Eastwood, rather. They're gonna keep throwing bodies at you. Ben Shepard is going to get shifts. Like they have guys they can just keep throwing at you. And yeah, Giannis is probably going to average like 34 and 18 in the series, but I think the Pacers are just a better team, top to bottom both ways. And so I think if they get past the Bucs, this is the part that I don't love because I did pick the Cavs with my first.

[Dan Devine]

Good. You're guaranteeing a conference finalist.

[Host 2]

See, here we go again. I don't know, but yeah, right. It would get me as a conference finalist. And if you told me that the Cavs fell short because the Pacers beat him in a seven game series, it would not stun me. So I feel like I'm getting both ends of that. I'm staying away from the part where I've got pick somebody who's not the Celtics out of the bottom half of that bracket. And yeah, it gives me. It gives me an opportunity there. So there we go. There's my Indiana pitch. The people of Indiana, of course, have always loved me and supported me, and so here I am providing that same love and support to them.

[Dan Devine]

All right, well, thank you for playing that game with us, Dan, but it's now time to get back to questions.

[Host 2]

Okay, serious business now. No more games.

[Dan Devine]

That was just an intermission.

[Host 2]

Come on.

[Dan Devine]

Now, over at Yahoo, you and Ben Rohrbach, you did a preview. Looking at one key matchup in each series, which of those key matchups are you most interested in seeing play out over the next couple weeks?

[Host 2]

Well, first, can I give you like a little behind the bts, a little behind the curtain on the content game? What we really did was Ben and I wrote previews for each series, and then our bosses like, subdivided apart from each of the previews and made that into a different piece of content. Like in the thing from the Big short where it's like yesterday's fish becomes tomorrow's soup. So. But yes, we did do that. We did all that work for real. It just was split up twice. And you know, I'm going to give shouts out to Ben because Ben doesn't get enough shouts out and he wrote the Lakers will as preview. I Think his point of like Anthony Edwards versus wherever they think the weakest link on that defense is. I think that's going to be fascinating. You guys just talked about the lack of interior defensive half. But also, you know, we've seen like the last playoff series, we saw Luka Doncic in the Celtics put him under the microscope over and over again. And yeah, I mean, that was not why the Celtics won that series, but we saw that be a strategy to go against Luca with that. Right. We've seen Austin Reaves get put under the microscope by teams when they're looking for a place to poke at. We've seen, you know, LeBron James is 40 years old and I don't think they're going to like try to run pick and roll at LeBron, but you know, how do. What does Chris Finch have in mind? What did that. Was that Wolves offense have in mind for making him work, for finding the weak spots? Can they shoot enough, as you mentioned, with the paint packing, are they going to be able to like, take them out of that and find some ways for Ant to actually get downhill and get to the paint? I think that the way they're going to manipulate that or try to work with that, I'm really interested to see how that works, what they think their best pathway to points is. And just focusing on Ant more specifically. He, you know, we've talked or there's been the discussion of. He struggles with double teams. If you blitz him, you crank up the heat on him, you trap him. He doesn't want to really off the ball. He wants to get downhill and score right? Like, and if I could do that, like Anthony Edwards could do that, I would want to do that too. But this is like in the hero's journey of a player. Like, you make the playoffs, you then make your run in the playoffs. You have the. You run up against your sort of your weak link, your. Your Achilles heel. And then you got to show that you can sort of evolve with it. So if that's what the Lakers are going to do, if they're going to throw two at him, if they're going to try to blitz it out of his hands, try to make somebody else beat him, is he patient enough for that? Does he trust it enough? Can those teammates reward that trust? Does this become a series where instead of ant scoring 40 every night, ants getting nine assists tonight? I don't know. But I'm interested to see what they. What questions the Lakers make him answer and what his answers for it are. So that's the One that I'm sort of most interested in from the group that we put together.

[Host 1]

Let's talk about maybe the biggest snub from. From our little draft here, the Knicks. The Knicks did go 1 and 3 against Detroit in the regular season. Mitchell Robinson did not play in any of those matchups. However, how big of a factor do you think that he could be in this series?

[Host 2]

I think he could be a really big factor. You know, I talked about the struggles that they've had in the pick and roll against Cade Cunningham. Mitch is way better at like being up toward the level and has the wingspan to play too. To be able to influence the ball handler without losing track of the big rolling behind him and to be able to like re time out the pass and get up to deflect it. Kat's not so great at that stuff. He's obviously he's like better athletically overall. But that specific version of applying his length and his size and his physicality never been his strong suit. And Mitch Mitchell Robinson before he got hurt last season was having the best defensive season of his career. Not because he was blocking so many shots, but because I was. Your colleague Fred Katz wrote at the Athletic. He was just playing that like ground bound. I'm getting. I'm keeping you from getting to comfortable places and forcing like foul line floaters and jumpers that are lower percentage shots. Like he's really good at that. He has looked healthy since he came back. He's down in weight too. I think he's playing at like 269, 270 he had said, which he was up near 290 when he came back last year and clearly wasn't moving as well. That's a. That if he's able to play, you know, stay healthy, play at that level and play increased minutes, that could really be be helpful on this at the specific problem that the Knicks have had defensively. The other thing is on the offensive end, he's one of the best offensive rebounders in the league. He made a previous JB Bickerstaff team in Cleveland absolutely miserable a few years ago in the first round series that they played by just being a relentless offensive rebounder. If he's a. If they play two bigs, which is something that it's funny because Tom Thibodeau loves doing it, but he has not loved doing it with this team. Maybe it's just because he didn't try. You know, they're the keeping Mitch on a pitch count, not necessarily wanting to exhaust that in the regular season. If they're able to play two bigs and have cat space. And then Robinson attacking the glass. That could be a big problem for a Piston scene. That's not a great defensive rebounding team. Could put, you know, maybe some more fouls on Isaiah Stewart, some more fouls on Jalen Duran, more pressure on that front court and create extra possessions. You tilt the possession game in your favor. That's a way. The Knicks were very, very good at that before they. This has not really been their identity this season, but it's a, it's a wild card and a trick up their sleeve that I think it'll be interesting to see how much they play.

[Dan Devine]

I wanted to go back to Wolves Lakers because you mentioned Wolves offense versus Lakers defense. I'm really interested in the other side because the Wolves defense, not as elite as they were last year, but we've seen individual games where that defense has looked just as terrifying as it was last year. I mean, Thunder fans will remember a game right before All Star break where Rudy Gobert, Julius Randle were out and they played these small ball lineups that were just terrifying defensively. And so I'm interested in your thoughts on how they match up defensively against this Lakers team.

[Host 2]

Yeah, it'll be interesting because I think that one of the big, like talking points in recent years of NBA playoff discourse, what a lovely thing is like, well, Gobert gets played off the floor against teams that go small. And that has never totally been true and has always been more based on the very loud highlights of teams hitting threes against him when he's tried to cover everybody or Luka doing it and then cursing at him in like, you know, four different languages at the end of last year's game. So I think if you're talking about them playing a lot of like Jared Vanderbilt and Rui Hachimura and you know, guys, you know, or Jackson Hayes, obviously. But if the Lakers go smaller, there's still places that I think Rudy Gobert can guard. I think he can. He can like stay in the corner or, you know, it's. It's a little bit of like, I'm going to make Rui Hachimura shoot me out of this. I'm going to make Jared Vanderbilt like back cut and dunk me out of this. And I think that. So I think that's interesting to me. Like, I. If Chris Finch, I mean, they still finished 6th in points allow per possession. They were right there in terms of their defensive efficiency over the full season. Hasn't felt like it, but that's they were there all season. And then if they. If they do go smaller. Yeah, like what. What do those lineups look like? Randle kind of never played five in New York. Like, Tibbs really didn't trust it. He didn't trust the rebounding of it. He didn't trust. Even when they did bring in OG Anunoby, they only overlapped very briefly. But, like, when you did have a guard, your yard kind of guy, they. He really didn't trust it too much. So is Finch more willing to go with it if he. If he sees, like, this is a way for us to spread. Spread the floor, but also match up physically with a lot of, like, six, eight burly guys? I think the. The point of attack, defenders, obviously. Jaden McDaniels is fantastic. Anthony Edwards can be fantastic. When he. When he dials it up, the concern to me will be a little bit less of, like, what do you do about Gobert and maybe what do you do about Mike Conley? Because I think that's a button where they're like, yeah, they're going to look at him and say, that is the smallest guy on the court. He is going to be put into every screen and roll for Luca, for LeBron. We're going to try to hunt him and punish him. Dante DiVincenzo is a pretty interesting answer for that. Right? Like, that's a guy who's bigger and is more rugged and can handle himself on some of those switches. But then you're taking. Arguably, you're not even arguably, you're taking your best playmaker, your most. Your steadiest pair of hands off the floor. And we know how tough crunch time has been for the Milwaukee offense and how they've gone through the lulls where they struggle to score and get good shots up. So it's going to be. It's a cat and mouse game, and it's going to be the game of whack a mole. Can you hit something hard enough that we got to react to it and take something that helps us off the table, then how do we respond to it?

[Host 1]

It.

[Host 2]

I think that's a pretty fascinating question. But Finch has also been pretty comfortable saying, like, there's no sacred cows on this team. Right. Like, if we need. Outside of aunt, basically, if we need to put somebody on the bench because we think this gives us the best chance of winning that possession in that game, like, he'll do it. So whether that's Conley, whether that's Gobert, what that needs to be, I think they're At a point where they're saying it's all hands on deck. This is a really brutal matchup against two of the most difficult guys to game plan against in the world. And you know, whatever we, whatever gives us the best chance on any given night, I think that's what we're going with.

[Host 1]

I discussed the warriors, but we really didn't talk about Houston, who is one of the weirdest teams. And like, that might be why we don't want to talk about them. Just because they don't have like the formula that most like winning playoff teams have. But they're the number two seed, they've had a great season, they have clear identity. If you were to give Houston, like, let's say Houston makes it through round one, what gets them there?

[Host 2]

Defense and physicality to start with. Right? Like, I mean, IME Udoka basically built the whole plane out of Eme Udoka's attitude. This is like the black box version of the concentrate of we are. We beat the heck out of you. We make you feel us on every possession and we are attitudinally disposed to just like make you hurt every possession. And to be able to do it with Dylan Brooks and Amen Thompson and Tari Eason off the bench. Fred Van Vliet, no picnic to deal with the point of attack. Even though he's small, he is handsy and he's a fire hydrant and like. And then Sengun deserves a ton of credit for the improvements he's made. Like, if he wasn't improving on the defensive end, if he wasn't somebody that Udoka trusted to play big minutes constantly, he wouldn't have gotten to the point where he was making all star teams. Going to be an all NBA consideration, all that stuff. Like you're a top four defense with him playing that minute's low. He's doing something right. You know, I think the reason they're so weird and so difficult to talk about is you're like, but they're not good at offense. But they're also kind of good at offense. Like they, it feels like they shouldn't be because the only guy. I think there's only one guy shooting over 36% from three on the team. And it's Dylan Brooks who no one really trusts as a three point shooter.

[Host 1]

Totally. Yeah.

[Host 2]

And they're like bad. They're bottom third of the league, shooting everywhere. Like, they're bad at the rim, they're bad in mid range and they're bad from three. And yet they're like 11th or 12th in offensive efficiency. Because they hammer the offensive glass, especially when they play with their two bigs, which has been talked about a lot. I don't know how much they're going to get away with. Shangun Adams against the warriors, they did it a little bit in that game a couple weeks ago. Seven games against Steph Curry. I don't know. That seems dicey to me, but maybe. But all the wings hit the glass too. Like, no, everybody does it. So they rebound. They're number one in the league in offensive rebounding rate, number one in the league in second chance. Second chance points up near the top of the league in points in the paint. They are constantly making you feel them in the paint. That's a big part of it. And they never turn the ball over or they rarely turn the ball over. And that's Van Vliet. Like, he is one of the sort of quietly most important players in the bracket right now, to me, because, like, it's gonna. I think the Golden State defense has been sensational since Jimmy got there with Draymond making that late season surge. All that and a lot of it is they turn you over. And when the Rockets have Van Vliet on the floor, they're really good at avoiding turnovers. And when they don't have him on the floor, they're not. And so can you avoid giving up the ball? Get shots on goal, get the advantage in the possession game? That's if you get. If you can tell me it by the end of the season. But end of the series. Yeah, the warriors are going to take five fewer shots a game than the Rockets every game. I think Houston probably advances, but I think that the challenge is going to be can you keep that up against what this warriors defense has turned into? And that's going to be pretty tricky.

[Dan Devine]

Well, Dan, thank you for answering all our questions about what is looking at very exciting playoffs. Yeah, that's it. That's it. You're done. Except for. Except now you have to play Andrew versus the Beat, our weekly trivia show where Andrew goes head to head against a beat writer, or in this case, Dan Devine of Yahoo.

[Host 2]

Sports.

[Dan Devine]

So this week, Andrew versus the Beat. All the questions are about the season. We just saw the 24, 25 regular season.

[Host 2]

Okay, okay.

[Dan Devine]

It just happened. It's probably going to be really easy questions. So how this works, Dan, you're going to give me a question or a number between one and eight and it will correspond to a question. If you get it right, you'll get at least Two points. If you get it wrong, Andrew will have a chance to steal for one. And then we'll go back and forth until all the questions have been asked and answered. So to start us off, I just need a number between one and eight.

[Host 2]

Answer is number three. John Stark. Superstar. Let's go.

[Dan Devine]

Question number three. There were 11 players who played in all 82 games this season. And we're going to name them all. So how this works, Dan, you're going to give me a name, then Andrew will give me a name and we'll go back and forth until one of you stumbles. So 11 players who played in all 82 games this season.

[Host 2]

We're going to start with Mikhail Bridges.

[Dan Devine]

Kale Bridges. He's on the list. Andrew.

[Host 1]

Chris. Paul. Paul.

[Dan Devine]

He's on the list. Also. I mentioned him earlier. Cheater. Back to Dan eater.

[Host 2]

No, I was. I mean, I was gonna do the same thing.

[Dan Devine]

But you would have been the cheater.

[Host 2]

Then I would have been the cheater. Crap.

[Host 1]

I know. That's how I feel now. It's like those are two easy ones.

[Host 2]

There was a rookie. I thought there was somebody. I'm gonna be wrong. Stefan Castle.

[Dan Devine]

Stefan Castle is not on the list. Andrew, did you have any other guesses?

[Host 1]

Goodness, no. I don't know.

[Dan Devine]

No. You can't even throw out one name just for fun. Andrew.

[Host 1]

Just feel like I'm gonna be wrong.

[Host 2]

It's okay to be wrong. I just was wrong.

[Host 1]

Did Jalen Green do it?

[Dan Devine]

He did. There you go.

[Host 2]

Very good.

[Dan Devine]

Jaden McDaniels for the Wolves. Bub Carrington might have been the rookie you were thinking of.

[Host 2]

That was the rookie I was thinking of. Damn.

[Dan Devine]

Jared Allen, Malik Beasley, Harrison Barnes. Two Spurs. Harry B. Wow. Akil Alexander Walker. Actually. Julian Champagne. Three spurs, three games and yet not.

[Host 2]

The one that I named. It's incredible.

[Dan Devine]

In the unit. Okay, Andrew, board is yours.

[Host 1]

Number one question.

[Dan Devine]

Number one. In honor of Dunks and Threes dot com. Great website. There was only one player this season who had 100 plus dunks and 100 plus made three pointers. Who was it? Only one guy in the entire league.

[Host 1]

Wow. This is a great question.

[Dan Devine]

Thank you. I don't readily have very excited when there was only one guy who did it.

[Host 1]

A hundred dunks is a lot of dunks.

[Dan Devine]

It's a lot of dunks. Lots of dunks.

[Host 1]

Shoot. Goodness. It's probably a big man. Did Jaren Jackson do it?

[Dan Devine]

Jaren Jackson. He did not do it, Andrew. So, Dan, you have a chance to steal.

[Host 2]

I'm gonna go with my. My gut here. Is it Victor Wembanyama?

[Dan Devine]

So it's not. But after I did this question, I was like, wait a second. Wimby had to have done that. How did he not do that? And he had 91 dunks. Seriously, before he got injured.

[Host 2]

Does Andrew get a chance to steal back?

[Dan Devine]

No. But if you guys want to throw out a name, if you guys had other names you were thinking of, Is it OG Anunoby? It is OG Anunoby.

[Host 1]

Damn.

[Dan Devine]

It should go with my gut, and.

[Host 2]

I should have gone with my brain.

[Dan Devine]

Yeah, that makes sense now. Actually, I'm looking here. Let's see what Jaren Jackson. Because he definitely had enough threes.

[Host 1]

There's no way he had enough dunks. Now that I'm thinking about it. I don't even remember him dunking this lefty.

[Host 2]

Push shots.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Host 2]

The limit does not exist.

[Host 1]

Do those count as dunks?

[Host 2]

Yes.

[Dan Devine]

So you think he had maybe. Maybe one dunk? Why is his.

[Host 1]

There's just. I. I bet you he had a very low number of dunks. I felt really dumb after saying it.

[Dan Devine]

That's okay, Andrew.

[Host 2]

Don't feel kind to yourself. You don't have to feel that way. That's all right.

[Dan Devine]

Yeah, you did. You did a great job. It's a good. It was a good guess. Okay. It was a good guess.

[Host 1]

It probably was.

[Dan Devine]

He had 31 dunks. Okay, maybe not so good. Okay.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Dan Devine]

Okay.

[Host 1]

Back to about how I felt. Yeah.

[Dan Devine]

Then you control the board.

[Host 2]

We're gonna go with number seven, Carmelo Anthony. Let's go.

[Dan Devine]

Question Number seven, Carmelo Anthony. Oh, speaking of dunks, this Eastern Conference team had fewer dunks than any other team in the league this season. So I did narrow it down for you.

[Host 2]

Conference.

[Dan Devine]

You have a 1 in 15 shot here. Conference. Fewest dunks in the league.

[Host 2]

Us dunks in the league. The Nets.

[Dan Devine]

Brooklyn Nets. That is incorrect. Andrew, any guesses?

[Host 1]

Huh? Eastern Conference team with not many dunks.

[Host 2]

Oh, okay. I didn't look it up. I have a guess, though. After he's done.

[Dan Devine]

Okay.

[Host 1]

After I get it wrong.

[Host 2]

Exactly. Guess I'm trying to rattle your cage, brother. After he gets it wrong. I'm in there like swimwear there.

[Dan Devine]

But hey, Dan, guess what? I looked it up. Brooklyn Nets, second fewest.

[Host 2]

Wow.

[Dan Devine]

That's how close you were.

[Host 2]

I'm, like, pretty locked in, but I'm not all the way locked in. So there we go. That's why. That's the issue. I didn't lock in quite enough.

[Dan Devine]

Guesses.

[Host 1]

I don't feel good about any. Anything right now, I'm being quite honest.

[Host 2]

That's the vibe you want heading into the postseason. I feel good about nothing. I'm tired and exhausted, and I ate everything.

[Host 1]

I don't know. Miami. I don't know who it is.

[Dan Devine]

Miami. No, Dan, you have a guess just.

[Host 2]

Based on shot profile. The Boston Celtics.

[Dan Devine]

No, it was actually one of the teams we talked about earlier that was knocked out already. The Chicago Bulls.

[Host 2]

Oh, okay.

[Dan Devine]

Chicago Bulls. Not a lot of double.

[Host 1]

That makes sense.

[Dan Devine]

Not a lot of dunkers. Okay, Andrew Border Shores.

[Host 1]

Number two.

[Dan Devine]

Question number two. Where is it? Okay, only two players had their shot blocked more than a hundred times this season. Who are they? And you get one point per correct answer. So only two players had their shot blocked more than a hundred times this season.

[Host 1]

Wow. A hundred times. Blocked.

[Dan Devine]

100 times. Blocked more than one.

[Host 2]

A lot of shots up to be able to get 100 shots blocked.

[Host 1]

Yeah, I was gonna say.

[Dan Devine]

Don't give it away, Dan. You're giving them. Giving them. You're helping them out. These are hints. No, Andrew. Incorrect. All right, Dan, you have a chance to steal. You could get two points here, Dan, if you could get both of these names.

[Host 2]

If only I don't get this shot blocked. RJ Barrett.

[Dan Devine]

RJ Barrett, also.

[Host 1]

I like that answer, though.

[Dan Devine]

I like the idea of it.

[Host 2]

He gets blocked a lot. He hasn't. He's not an explosive leaper above the rim.

[Dan Devine]

I wonder if that was because he ended up not playing a ton of games. Because that's the other thing. You kind of have to play a ton of games for this.

[Host 2]

Yes. Oh, that's a good point. I was thinking it's like. Yeah, he was getting a lot of shots up when he was. But here. Yeah, the volume.

[Dan Devine]

The volume, Yes. I think one of these names will make sense to you. Jalen Green. Yeah, kind of makes sense.

[Host 1]

You play all 82.

[Dan Devine]

He played all 82. And the other one, Kate Cunningham. Oh, was the other name.

[Host 2]

So the funny thing about their rivals, we. It was a. I think it was. It might have been the old show that I did with Jake Fisher. No cap room last season. And we talked. It was during the Pistons being awful. And I was like, here's the worry. What if Kate is kind of just like, you know, a, like, shishi version of RJ Barrett? And because I think I was looking at the same kind of thing, I'm like. Like, the finishing numbers on the inside aren't good. He doesn't do it. He gets. He gets blocked a lot. And then you Know that got, you know, deposited into a trash can with that take this year. But. But it's funny that they're always connected in my brain when we're doing a podcast.

[Dan Devine]

All right, Dan, there are four questions left. I'm gonna nail me down by one round.

[Host 2]

We're Gonna go number eight, J.R. smith. Let's go.

[Dan Devine]

In number eight, there was only one player to make more than one heave this season, aka a shot beyond half court. That player also attempted 10 more heaves than the next closest player. Who was it?

[Host 2]

Is it Nikola Jokic?

[Dan Devine]

That is correct, Dan, for two points, man. All right, Dan is on the board.

[Host 1]

Dang it. I only know that because my buddy Fred Katz is obsessed with it, and I've had many conversations with him about it.

[Dan Devine]

Okay, Andrew, three questions left board is yours.

[Host 1]

Four.

[Dan Devine]

Question number four. There were 26 players who did not record a single free throw make this season. Name one.

[Host 1]

Wow.

[Dan Devine]

I mean, I'm being pretty generous here. 26 names. You only got to give me one. You know, they just can't have made a free throw. They could have taken one, but they better not have made it.

[Host 1]

No. Made free throws.

[Dan Devine]

Yeah. So you both need to get on the court.

[Host 1]

There's no minimum amount of minutes.

[Dan Devine]

No minimum. But it's still a risk. Because even if you know a guy who hasn't played a few minutes, what if he got one free throw?

[Host 1]

My gosh. I am. I. I am thinking about Isaiah Hartenstein not making a three, but I'm not sure that I have memory.

[Dan Devine]

I almost did a question about that and then remembered that you knew that and were obsessed with it.

[Host 1]

Oh, I've been. I have been so obsessed with it. I. I might be the only person in the arena that is like, fist pumping when he takes and misses a three. Like, I. I wanted him to get to the. I wanted him to get to 23 so bad.

[Host 2]

Volume.

[Dan Devine]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Did. Did not have the volume. This is me stalling because I have no answer to this question.

[Dan Devine]

No answer. Well, I mean, how many players are the NBA? Probably over 400.

[Host 1]

What about. What about Markief Morris?

[Dan Devine]

Marke Morris? Let me look down my list. Is Markief Morris on this list? He is not. Andrew missed the question. He at least had one free throw. So, Dan, you could steal a point here.

[Host 2]

Moses Brown.

[Dan Devine]

Moses Brown. Let me look down my list. Look down my list. Look down my list. He is not on the list as well. Now some names you could have gotten. Something will make sense. Joe Ingles, P.J. tucker. Kind of makes sense.

[Host 2]

I miss P.J.

[Dan Devine]

Tucker, James Johnson, you know, some of these, like, old vets at the very end of the bench kind of guys. Some other names that you'll know. Mac McClung. That would have been a great pull if you had gotten.

[Host 2]

My daughter asked me the other night, like, that guy that won the dunk contest, what's up with him? And I was like, I haven't really been keeping up on Osceola.

[Host 1]

I'm sorry, Nothing.

[Dan Devine]

Not making free throws. Jaleel Okafor played three minutes this season. Did not.

[Host 1]

He's been a G league stud this year. Old, upside down. Oh, yeah.

[Dan Devine]

Played in the league this year. Amani Bates, Jacob Todd Bates.

[Host 1]

Didn't make a free throw.

[Dan Devine]

He did not.

[Host 1]

Wow.

[Dan Devine]

So those are just a sampling of the names. I'll be honest. A lot of these names never seen in my life. But I don't want to reveal my stupidity by saying them. So. Okay, so Dan, you're head by 1. Two questions left. 5.

[Host 2]

I was extremely lost on where the point situation was, but I love it. We're going to go with number five. Let's go.

[Dan Devine]

Question number five. The most frequently worn jersey number this season had 28 different players wear it at some point this season. What is that jersey number? Now, before you answer, Dan, you get to choose who answers first. You could make Andrew answer first and then you could go higher or lower. Or you could answer first and Andrew go higher or lower. However, if Andrew, if you make him answer and he gets it exactly correct, he would get a bonus point. Something to think about that.

[Host 2]

You know what? I'm not. I'm not trying to back my way into success, so I'm just gonna go with it.

[Dan Devine]

Wow.

[Host 2]

Okay, let's go with number. Let's go with number 23.

[Dan Devine]

Number 23. Andrew, would you like to go higher than 23 or lower than 23?

[Host 1]

Oh, I was thinking 23 or 33, but I also also thought about one. I'll go. I'll go higher.

[Dan Devine]

Correct number was eight.

[Host 2]

Wow.

[Dan Devine]

Which means Dan gets the points. Commanding four to one lead.

[Host 2]

That's bad.

[Dan Devine]

That's bad for you. Real bad for you, Andrew. Yeah, the. Actually, actually the second most frequently worn jersey number 00, 23 was up there. And so it was like 22 or 20, 24. Okay, Andrew, last question. You can't win the week, but you could get it within one, which would be really exciting. Okay, so Trae Young had 355 turnovers this season, which led the league. It is the fourth time Trae Young has recorded a 300 plus turnover season that puts him sixth all time for most 300 plus turnover seasons. Now tied for the most are these two players who have each done that seven times each. They do get one point per correct answer.

[Host 2]

Sir.

[Host 1]

That is a lot of turnovers.

[Dan Devine]

It's a lot of turnovers.

[Host 1]

300 plus turnovers.

[Dan Devine]

300 plus.

[Host 1]

But he's passing a lot. Somebody's got the ball a lot. Who would that be?

[Dan Devine]

Seven unique seasons with 300 plus turnovers.

[Host 1]

What about Rajon Rondo?

[Dan Devine]

Rajan Rondo? No. Interesting choice. Andrew.

[Host 2]

I like it.

[Dan Devine]

Choice. Dan, you have any guesses?

[Host 2]

I think I like James hard.

[Dan Devine]

Put it to Andrew here. James Harden. Yes. In fact he got his seventh this season.

[Host 1]

Shout out.

[Host 2]

Congratulations.

[Dan Devine]

Congrats. Can you name the other player?

[Host 2]

Russell Westbrook.

[Dan Devine]

Great guess. He does have six. And I actually came up with this question thinking I'd trap Andrew into saying Russell Westbrook, but it is actually Magic Johnson. So the week ends. Dan, you did great. Five to one one. Andrew versus the beat. Congratulations.

[Host 2]

Thank you so much. I feel incredible. I didn't anticipate, I knew that I would be happy that I did the show. I didn't know that I would come out as a winner. This is huge for me heading into a pretty raucous and busy couple of months. So this is incredible. Thank you so much.

[Dan Devine]

We are a podcast of extremes because you either leave feeling really good about yourself or feeling absolutely terrible and wondering if the fans of your team are going to come and attack you and tell you how dumb you are. One or the other.

[Host 2]

That's my secret captain. I always have people doing that to me. So really there's no downside to it. I will say, I think when I think about those polls and those I was going to think about Andrew being like, oh God, I don't know.

[Dan Devine]

I don't know.

[Host 2]

I have a number and it's like it's all brother. It's all, it's all confetti. We just gotta, we can't squeeze it too tight. We gotta let it just fly around the room and it's gonna be all right.

[Host 1]

Well, now Dan does three things. He's a writer, he's a podcaster, and he's a trivia winner. So go check him out at Yahoo Sports. Dan, thanks so much for coming on.

[Host 2]

My pleasure, guys. I had a blast. Thanks for having me.

[Host 1]

Huge thanks to Dan Devine for coming on the show today. Hey, if you leave us a five star review on Apple podcasts, we will read it on the show. We don't have any to read, so please get after it. Leave us 5 star reviews on Apple Podcasts. You can also comment on the show on Spotify. And please, please, please, please subscribe to our show on YouTube and leave comments on the YouTube page. You can walk, you can watch this show. So if you really just want to watch me in agony this week with Dan Devine on Trivia, you can watch. You can watch it on your TV if you'd like. I hope you guys have a great day, enjoy the playoffs, and we'll talk to you guys again next week.