Luka’s worst game as a Laker + Draymond’s defensive mind

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Athletic NBA Daily – April 4, 2025

Episode Title: Luka’s Worst Game as a Laker + Draymond’s Defensive Mind
Hosts: Dave DeFore, Yovan Buha, Marcus Thompson
Release Date: April 4, 2025

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1. Introduction

In this episode of The Athletic NBA Daily, hosts Dave DeFore and Yovan Buha dive deep into a pivotal matchup between the Los Angeles Lakers and the Golden State Warriors. Additionally, the conversation shifts to Draymond Green’s exceptional defensive prowess and his candidacy for Defensive Player of the Year. Marcus Thompson joins the discussion, providing expert insights and thoughtful analysis.

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2. Lakers vs. Warriors: A Pivotal Playoff Showdown

Dave DeFore opens the discussion by highlighting the significance of the Lakers’ narrow loss to the Warriors, emphasizing its impact on playoff seeding. The Warriors are on an ascent, potentially overtaking the Lakers in the standings as the season progresses.

Key Takeaways:

• Defensive Strategies: The Warriors effectively exploited the Lakers' defensive weaknesses, particularly in transition and paint defense.
• Lakers' Offensive Struggles: Post-Luka Doncic trade, the Lakers have been inconsistent offensively, especially against teams that employ heavy switching defense.

Notable Quote:

"Post game, the Lakers, they lose to the visiting Warriors. It is not the game that the Lakers wanted to have. [03:40]"
— Dave DeFore

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3. Luka Doncic’s Disappointing Performance

One of the focal points of the episode is Luka Doncic's underwhelming performance, which is characterized as his worst game since joining the Lakers. Yovan Buha provides an in-depth analysis of how the Warriors targeted Luka defensively, limiting his effectiveness on both ends of the floor.

Discussion Points:

• Offensive Limitations: Golden State's size and perimeter athleticism made it difficult for Luka to penetrate and create scoring opportunities.
• Defensive Pressure: Warriors' defense relentlessly targeted Luka, forcing him into contested jumpers and diminishing his offensive impact.
• Luka’s Accountability: After the game, Luka took full ownership of his performance, acknowledging he let his teammates down and committing to improvement.

Notable Quotes:

"This was his worst game as a Laker. After the game, we just spoke with him and he said his performance was unacceptable... [06:15]"
— Yovan Buha

"Every time Luka touched the ball, it just took the energy out of the possession a little bit. [07:59]"
— Dave DeFore

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4. Lakers’ Offensive Dynamics and Austin Reaves’ Emergence

The conversation shifts to the Lakers' offensive strategies, particularly the effectiveness of Austin Reaves in late-game situations. Reaves has emerged as a critical asset, often stepping up when Luka underperforms.

Discussion Points:

• Two-Player Dynamics: The Lakers are exploring the balance between leveraging Luka and LeBron James versus Austin Reaves and LeBron in high-pressure moments.
• Austin Reaves’ Impact: Reaves has been identified as potentially the best third option in the league, providing consistent scoring and shot creation when needed.

Notable Quotes:

"Austin Reaves really seemed to hit every big shot that they needed. [09:04]"
— Dave DeFore

"When the ball is in one of those three players' hands, the guy they've looked best with recently has been Austin in these late game situations. [09:04]"
— Yovan Buha

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5. Draymond Green’s Defensive Mastery

A significant portion of the episode is dedicated to analyzing Draymond Green's defensive capabilities. Dave and Marcus delve into Green's technique, intelligence, and his role as a defensive anchor for the Warriors.

Key Insights:

• Defensive IQ: Draymond is lauded for his ability to read the game, preempt opponents' moves, and execute strategic defensive plays.
• Physical Prowess: Despite being 35 years old, Green maintains exceptional agility and strength, allowing him to guard multiple positions effectively.
• Systemic Impact: His leadership on defense inspires and elevates his teammates, creating a cohesive and formidable defensive unit.

Notable Quotes:

"He's incredible... I'm going to strongly consider voting for him for Defensive Player of the Year. [14:24]"
— Yovan Buha

"He's doing it with, like, Luca. He's not, like, doing it against Dennis Schroder... [30:00]"
— Marcus Thompson

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6. Draymond Green’s Defensive Player of the Year Candidacy

The hosts engage in a robust discussion about Draymond Green's qualifications for Defensive Player of the Year (DPOY). Marcus Thompson highlights Green's unique blend of physical ability and mental acuity, positioning him as a frontrunner for the award.

Discussion Points:

• Comparative Analysis: Green is compared to legends like Kevin Garnett and Rudy Gobert, emphasizing his multifaceted defense.
• League Impact: His defensive strategies have influenced team defenses league-wide, setting a benchmark for defensive excellence.
• Award Considerations: While acknowledging other strong candidates like Chet Holmgren and Evan Mobley, the consensus leans toward Green's unparalleled defensive influence as a key factor.

Notable Quotes:

"He is literally directing people where they want him to go... [30:00]"
— Marcus Thompson

"It's a tough award because as soon as we went down... [33:56]"
— Dave DeFore

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7. Conclusion and Final Thoughts

As the episode wraps up, Dave and Marcus reflect on the crucial role Draymond Green plays in the Warriors' defense and the broader NBA landscape. They underscore his potential legacy as one of the greatest defenders, possibly transcending statistics with his strategic impact on the game.

Notable Quote:

"He is doing it with, like, Luca. He's not, like, doing it against Dennis Schroder... he's the point guard. He's the middle linebacker of the defense. [30:00]"
— Dave DeFore

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Final Remarks:
This episode of The Athletic NBA Daily offers a comprehensive analysis of the Lakers’ recent struggles, Luka Doncic's challenging performance, and Draymond Green’s exceptional defensive contributions. Through expert commentary and insightful discussions, listeners gain a deeper understanding of the strategic elements shaping the current NBA season.

Transcript

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[Dave DeFore]

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[Marcus Thompson]

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[Dave DeFore]

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[Marcus Thompson]

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Subject to credit approval. Apple Card issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA Salt Lake City Branch terms and more at applecard.com as we head into.

[Jovan Buha]

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[Dave DeFore]

Good morning and welcome to the NBA Daily. Coming up, the Lakers lost to the warriors in a big pivotal matchup for playoff seating. So Yovon Buha is here to hang out and talk about it. And I sat down with Marcus Thompson to talk about Draymond Green's chances at winning defense player of the year. Good morning everybody. Good morning actually. Good night, Yovon. Appreciate you hanging out. Post game, the Lakers, they lose to the the visiting Warriors. It is not the game that the Lakers wanted to have. I'm sure they definitely wanted to win this one. They're 5 and 5 in their last 10, kind of scuffling a little bit. The warriors are ascending and actually now have a chance to really pass them in the standings by the time it's all said and done. What's your big takeaway from from the night for the Lakers? You know, a lot of warriors talk is going to be out there, the defense that they played. But for the Lakers, you know, what do you think about them?

[Yovon Buha]

I think this is the blueprint of how you want to attack the Lakers in the playoffs. I think defensively you want to switch a lot. They have really struggled since the Luca trade with their offense against switch heavy teams. They tend to mismatch hunt and on nights their jumper is falling, which actually especially late in the game as they were trying to make that comeback, it started to fall but. But for the most part it was not falling for the first three quarters. They can stagnate and they can settle for contested jumpers. Tonight they really struggled to get downhill and then once they did, I thought Golden State was very effective, their paint defense. But for the Lakers it was a lot of just side to side movements and actions rather than getting downhill and creating advantages. And I thought they did a good job early. They were posting up with Rui and LeBron and able to find some skip passes to the weak side corner. Got some offensive rebounds, actually had eight offensive rebounds through the first quarter and then from that point on were not as effective. So I think from from an offense perspective, you saw Golden State's defense really stymie them. And then when the Lakers are on defense, you got to attack them in transition. You got to be whether it's after makes or turnovers, you have to hit them in transition. That remains arguably their weakest area defensively is especially when you have a certain level of speed and athleticism, you can really attack them with early offense and transition offense. I thought Golden State did a great job of doing that. But then also within their half court sets because of the movement, because of the speed and athleticism. They were really able to capitalize on LA having to try to protect Luca defensively and just some of their shortcomings on that end. So I think Golden State, like, this is our first time seeing Luca versus the warriors with the Lakers and Jimmy versus the Lakers with the warriors and certainly some concerns on the Lakers side.

[Dave DeFore]

Yeah, I mean, I was going to say this is. The Lakers kind of looked flat and they haven't done that a lot since Luca's been there, especially when Luka and LeBron are on the court. But more than that, Luca looked kind of flat. I'm not sure if you felt like it was the defensive game plan that threw him off. Do you feel like they got him worn out? But even in that comeback stretch, you know, starting around the five minute mark of the fourth quarter, when things started rolling for the Lakers and Austin Reeves really was cooking, it seemed like every time Luca touched the ball, it just took the energy out of the possession a little bit. And that's, that's a little weird to see with him in a Laker uniform.

[Yovon Buha]

Yeah, I would say that outside of the first couple games when he was still just feeling out the group, this was his worst game as a Laker. After the game, we just spoke with him and he said his performance was unacceptable. And he took blame and ownership for his performance tonight and just said that he has to be better. And he felt like he let his teammates down tonight, the way that he played and especially offensively that, that, you know, he should have been better. So I think it was a combination of Golden State's size and athleticism on the perimeter. And like, I thought they tried to target Quentin Post at various points. Luca, Austin and LeBron and Austin had some success against him, but like, they were basically like not able to get by him. And I think that was a bit concerning. And then defensively, I actually think people are going to look at the point total and the 6 or 17 shooting. I think defensively what was more concerning for Luka tonight, where he was just relentlessly targeted by Steph and by the warriors offense and the Lakers started to try to hide him on Kavon Looney and Draymond and like whoever was the non threat as a roller or, or as a, you know, score that you wanted to involve in the action and it didn't matter. They would just run decoy actions to get Luka switched on to someone else and then they would bring that guy into the fray. So the Lakers, I think, are gonna have to figure that out because Steph is not the Only apex superstar in the west that they're going to face that's going to try to target Luca. So they're going to have to come up with a better defensive strategy than just switching everything because as we saw when you switch everything, you can pick your matchups and Golden State, what was picking on Luka tonight?

[Dave DeFore]

And if you want an idea just from the box score, I mean Steph Curry shot 14 free throws that is just so far above what you normally see from him. And it was because he was just attacking. I mean there was one time that I remember ra top my head. I mean Luca didn't even make any contact on the drive at all. And, and Steph just sets him up and goes right by him for a layup. There's going to need, they, they're going to need more effort than that out of Luca. But a guy that I thought was great, I mean Austin Reeves down the stretch, he, he just seemed to hit every big shot that they needed. This continues the trend for him. I mean he's like we talked about previously, might be the best third banana in the league, which seems like a crazy statement if you're talking six months ago. But, but now with what we've seen, I mean heading into the playoffs for this team, I mean like how do they, how do they I guess maximize this, this kind of, I would say the two playmakers and then the play finisher with LeBron where you've got Austin, Reeves and Luka, I mean is there any more they can do to kind of tap a little bit of extra offense out of it?

[Yovon Buha]

It's going to be interesting to see how that breaks down because in recent games ar Austin has been their best closer and their best shot creator and they've run a lot of Austin LeBron two man game and that's a little bit easier for them to get into rather than LeBron Luca just because with LeBron and Luka it's typically like size defenders so they're just going to switch that. But with Austin and LeBron it's often not like size defenders so they have a decision to make of they could either try to trap and then you got the short role playmaking and the 4 on 3 advantage or they can't switch that. Then either LeBron has a smaller defender on him and Austin has a bigger, slower defender on him. So the, the Austin LeBron two men game has been more of their bread and butter in late game situations outside of just Luka being Luka. So I think they're still figuring out that balance. But in terms of like when the ball is in one of those three players hands, the guy that they've actually looked the best with recently has been Austin in these late game situations. We saw it in the Chicago game, we saw it in various points of the Indiana game. So of course like he is third in the pecking order, so I want to be clear with that. But LeBron and Luka, I think if anything, like you could look for ways to play those guys off of him, you know, rather than vice versa. But the one thing though is if someone is going to be off the ball, like I, I think LeBron's actually the best catch and shoot guy among these three. So because of LeBron's versatility, I think he's gonna have the ball in his hands the least among the three. But he also is the guy who can create advantages in the post and just with his, his size and his strength. So they're still figuring out this crunch time offense and what it's going to look like. It's been interesting to see like they've largely been better defensively throughout this stretch, as we've talked about before, than offensively. And I think it's, it's starting to click that that Memphis game, all three guys had 25 plus points, eight plus assists. That was as great as they've looked offensively. But that's not a nightly thing and they're still working through that.

[Dave DeFore]

Look down the stretch of the game last night, every single time the ball didn't go to Austin Reaves, I thought it was a mistake. He just gets into what they want to do so fast. I mean, you mentioned the pace. I think Austin Reaves kind of drives their half court pace where he, he gets the ball and he's getting into creating a shot or, or getting a look or just moving the ball. And I think that's, that's hugely important. I don't want to not talk about LeBron and Steph because it's kind of insane. So Steph Curry's 37, put up 37 points. LeBron is, you know, 40, as we've talked about ad nauseam, puts up 33. We've been watching this forever at this point. What, what, what happened in the game last night that maybe you haven't seen between these two before?

[Yovon Buha]

Well, I think you, you mentioned Steph's ability to, to get to the free throw line and I thought he did a masterful job of that. I think it was kind of like a throwback where LeBron was really targeting Steph down the stretch and trying to get him switched on to him in the post. And LeBron was going back to the. The volleyball days. But I would say for the Lakers warriors matchups, this felt like the most firepower Steph has had on his side. And I think in recent years, the Lakers have tended to fare well in this matchup that they won in 2023 and then even this season they won the season series three one. But I think LA really missed Anthony Davis tonight. That's actually something. Now that we're talking this out, I think 80. What was a guy that the late like in this matchup in particular for. For as great as Draymond is defensively, 80 still got four inches on him and another 20 pounds or so and just was one of the guys, one of the few guys that. That Draymond could struggle to defend in the post and, and with the offensive rebounds and the pick and roll game, like he just brought a certain level of physicality to their offense and a paint presence that they just did not have tonight consistent or you know, last night consistently. So I, I think that was something. But it felt like for the first time in this matchup, at least over the last few years, Steph had just as much firepower on his side with Jemski and Kaminga. Yeah, Butler Moody. Like they had all these guys that, that could match the Lakers offensively, whereas the last few years it has felt more LA's had more weapons offensively, in my opinion.

[Dave DeFore]

Before we go to the break, I do want to mention Draymond Green. I talked to Marcus after the break extensively about it because he wrote a big piece on him. But you know, this was kind of a quintessential Draymond Green game. And I think if he was making a case, well, which he actually publicly is making a case for defensive players, I mean, this is a great game for that. He makes what was essentially the game ceiling steel there on Luca toward the end, but he was blowing up plays all night. What's it like to watch a guy like that? You know, you know this Lakers team as well as anybody, but I think Draymond Green knows the Lakers better than you do and maybe the even better than they know themselves sometimes. He.

[Yovon Buha]

He's incredible. You know, I. I'm fortunate enough to have a vote this year and I'm going to strongly consider voting for him for defensive player of the year. He's certainly going to be on my ballot, but just where he ends up, still have to make that decision and go through all the Film and the numbers and whatnot. But he, I mean, he's like the one thing I would also take away from tonight. What was earlier in the season, the Lakers kind of came into their small ball identity against the Warriors. There was that Christmas Day game where Austin, they're running a lot of screening actions with Austin and he was attacking Golden State, the short roll. And like from that point on they make the DFS trade, they start to build that up and then they play the warriors three times over the span of a month. And it felt like the Lakers from a small ball perspective were actually able to match, if not outplay the Warriors. And then again, AD was a part of that. But. But tonight it just felt like Golden State was controlling everything. And obviously the driving force defensively was Draymond and just his ability to. Also offensively he attacked the Lakers a bit in that third. He got hot, he hit a couple threes, he got to the rim, hit.

[Dave DeFore]

A three, was step standing wide open right next to him.

[Yovon Buha]

But, but defensively he was guarding LeBron a lot in switching and doing Draymond things. And I think he really did a good job of protecting the defensive glass, protecting the rim. And it was a big part of of why LA was forced to take so many uncharacteristic mid range jumpers because this is not a mid range heavy team. JJ Redick has basically outlawed it as a an analytics friendly coach. He does not want them taking mid range jumpers. Tonight they took a bunch of them and that was largely because of Draymond in his defense.

[Dave DeFore]

Yeah, it was perfect timing there with the crowd in the background laughing about the mid range jumpers. I really appreciate that touch. Thank you Jovan for hanging out and doing the show. Guys, stick around after the break. I promise. This show is not sponsored by Draymond Green's podcast or anything like that, but me and Marcus Thompson get a little bit nerdy. We start talking about Kevin Garnett when we're talking about Draymond Green. So stick around for that.

[Apple Card Ad]

This message is brought to you by Apple Card.

[Dave DeFore]

If you're like us on the show, you're always on triple double watch. That's why we were impressed when we learned that Apple Card was posting numbers of their own.

[Marcus Thompson]

That's right. With Apple Card, you can earn 3% daily cash back at Apple and 2% back on everything you buy using Apple.

[Dave DeFore]

Pay, not to mention 1% back on everything else. That's a stat line that any fan can appreciate.

[Marcus Thompson]

Apply for Apple Card in the Wallet app on your iPhone today and start using it right away with Apple Pay.

[Apple Card Ad]

Subject to credit approval. Apple card issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA Salt Lake City Branch terms and more at applecard.com as we head into.

[Jovan Buha]

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[Unknown]

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[Dave DeFore]

Draymond Green is making a case for Defense Player of the Year. Whether that's on the court, off the court, in the studio, on a podcast after the game, I mean, it feels like I'm hearing a lot about Draymond Green as Defensive Player of the Year, including a Nice little breakdown on the way that Draymond thinks by our guy, Marcus Thompson over at the Athletic. Marcus, before we talk about Draymond, I just gotta say this was one of my favorite pieces that I've read all year. If you're listening to this, I'm gonna link it in the show notes. I don't just think that this is, like, a must read. Like, it. It is. It is. Literally, you have to read it if you are a basketball fan. I loved the. The insight that you were able to get from Draymond, who I consider to be the greatest defender of his generation. Man, I haven't seen anybody get that out of a player ever. So, first of all, thank you for. For doing that. I loved seeing someone highlighting and almost talk about defense like they're in love with it, you know, because that's my favorite thing about. About coaching basketball. So it was really nice to see. So thank you for that. But how did you get the idea to go and sit down with Draymond and break down tape? Because it doesn't seem like Draymond would really want to do that unless he was on tv.

[Marcus Thompson]

You know, to be. To be honest, like, I've been wanting to do this for years. I mean, at least four or five years.

[Dave DeFore]

Yeah.

[Marcus Thompson]

And. But, you know, it's that reason as a. As a. As a print writer, it's just harder to execute, right? Like, hey, tell me you're gonna do this thing. Tell me how you do this thing. And I'm. Put it in words. Like, it's not really the medium for that. So to me, that was. That was always the hard part. And then he did it with. I think he did it with Doris Burke once during the finals, and I gave the orange PR guys and, you know, like, come on, man. I've been asking for that for, you know, so the difficulty was trying to figure out a way to translate this thing into a writing format, which is, you know, how I got the video idea. Just like, hey, play the screen and have him talking over the video and explaining it. So, yeah, I've always wanted to. I want to do that about, like, so much. Like, about so many things. Like, I really want to do one on pick and roll. Right. Like this.

[Dave DeFore]

Like that, though.

[Yovon Buha]

Yeah.

[Marcus Thompson]

I'm saying I would love to do that. But Draymond, he likes talking about defense, and I do feel like, even though it wasn't really a TV setting, like, he knows I pay enough attention that if I ask him the right question.

[Dave DeFore]

Right.

[Marcus Thompson]

He'll have the right. He'll have the right answer. All you gotta do is talk to him in his language, essentially. He's always down to talk about it, but you just gotta know, like, what to ask. Essentially.

[Dave DeFore]

Yeah. I love the layout because, you know, in the article, we've got the clips and then exactly what Draymond was thinking during the play, he kind of laid that out. So, you know, this is like a roundabout way of talking about Draymond as a defender. He's 35 years old. He should not be able, at his size to be able to still make the impact that he does every single game. I'm not sure. Like, there's certainly an IQ aspect to this, but there's a physical aspect to this too. And I think I probably put myself in the camp that didn't expect Draymond to age as well, but he has incredibly. And his brain is keeping him at the top of his game. Is this the smartest version of Draymond Green that you've ever seen, or have you seen him even more locked in in this?

[Marcus Thompson]

Nah, this is like, this is the smartest, mostly because he doesn't have all of these great defenders around him, right? Like, that's to be the impressive thing. Like when they were winning championships, right? He had Andrew Bogan, he had Andre Iguodala and Sean Livingston, right? Like, he had kd, like, defensively, I forgot. Yeah. Pete Clay Garden, like, our hound in the point guard, they had these pieces. Now he's working with guys like Moses Moody and, you know, Brandon Pajimski, and no real center, right? Because they don't really playing with Kavan Looney, who's a. A really good, you know, inside defender. For a guy who's six, nine. He doesn't have a seven footer next to him or a natural rim protector. So to me, this is like. I mean, I'm with you, man. Like, this dude is. If you go watch old Draymond, he was so fast, right? He just. This. It was this. It was running around and so physical and like. And explosive in his kind of way.

[Dave DeFore]

I don't.

[Marcus Thompson]

I don't. Like, he's not. He never was jumping out of the gym, but there was just a veracity about him. So when you watch him, like, 2016, Draymond, when you watch him, you could see the difference physically. So that's my thing. Like, yo, how are you doing this? It's akin to, like, you going out playing with some youngsters, right? They certainly have the athletic advantage, but you are so far ahead of them, like, intellectually of the game. Like they. It make it. It makes it hard for them to beat you. So he still got a lot of juice left. I think his. He's such a master at wielding his length, his 677 foot 2 wingspan, and he's still really strong. And as far as, like centers go, he's very agile. It's not. It's not like he's old and beat down. He's just no longer the. Just he was a small forward playing center. Like those days, it was like, now he's a power forward playing center. Right? That's a big difference. But it's. It's upstairs and it's like this. It's. It's a combination of his intellectual capacity because he said, I don't know if when you listen to it, one of the things that blew me away is I expect me to sit down with a scientist and he's going to say some stuff I didn't understand. I understood everything he said. It actually sounded pretty basic. And what he says, he doesn't think players, obviously he thinks there are dumb players in the league, but he doesn't think most players are dumb. He thinks the difference is it's not that you don't know what to do, it's how fast you process it. How fast in the moment can you process these seven things that are happening and make a decision. He's like, that's the difference. And I understood that. Having him explain some very simple things, but he's just processing like seven of them at the same time on the fly. And making decisions like that, that's the difference. And that to me is like. It's like a CPU that's just advanced, right?

[Dave DeFore]

Well, so the concept of 0.5, like 0.5 second decision making in basketball at this point, like, I think everyone knows it. We don't think as much about it on the defensive end because it's.

[Marcus Thompson]

You're.

[Dave DeFore]

You're reacting, right? So the. The offense has a natural advantage because they're the one doing the action. But with Draymond, it almost feels like he. He's already kind of pre. Chosen the. The path you're going to choose. He knows where to be. He's one of the first guys. I mean, essentially invented the scram switch, which is the switch where you see the opposing team gets a mismatch on your small. Usually happens with Steph Curry. So yes, as the inbound pass is happening, Draymond cuts across the lane and essentially, hey, let me take that spot. And then Steph hustles out. I mean, he essentially started doing that. And I'm not sure if that was a coaching decision or if that's just Draymond being Draymond and knowing where to be all the time. But I don't know that there's a single player in the. In their modern era that has gotten more out of his functional length than Draymond. You know, you think about that, that wingspan, right? Like, he plays like you could call him a small forward, but he's got arms like a center and he uses his body in that way. And so he just. He really is just this unique physical player, as well as just having the brain is.

[Marcus Thompson]

It's a.

[Dave DeFore]

It's a little bit like kg, you know, like, if I was saying KG was the greatest defender of his generation, I think Draymond took the mantle for. For his. I mean, is that a pretty good comp or is there somebody historically that you would compare him to?

[Marcus Thompson]

No, I do like. I do like the kg and I think you can't go too far back because if it's separated, KG and Draymond is they. They get out on a point guard, right? Like, you just have to be able to do that. And this day and age, you have to switch onto a guard and be able to hold your own. You cannot be a legit defender if you can't do that. And let. I mean, I do think Rudy is the exception because he's so foundational as an anchor, right? Like, he's such an elite anchor where automatically if he's on your defense, you're going to have a top level defense just because he's back there. And I do think that's part of a generation of dudes who do not like getting their shot blocked. So they don't even take the shot half the time when they're there. We're seeing this with wimby. Wimby can't be properly understood because people do not take the shot. They don't even attempt it. So I do feel like that, like, you can't go too far back with that with them.

[Dave DeFore]

Well, we value stats so much, right? Like, we're thinking about blocks and we're thinking about rebounds. We're thinking about steals.

[Marcus Thompson]

Actually, the thing that bothers the new.

[Dave DeFore]

Coach of the Grizzlies, Tuomas Isalo. In his posing, he talked about. He compared Draymond to Paolo Maldini, who was a longtime Italian national team defensive forward. He would blow and he would blow things up before they happen. I compared Victor women, yama to Deion Sanders. Right. Deion. I mean, he could have had 20 interceptions, but they just didn't throw to him. And that's kind of like Victor Women. Yama. Whereas with Draymond, he's blowing up actions in ways that you don't even notice because it's just. Oh, it's positioning. He's in the right place every single time, and if he's not, he's barked at someone else to get him there. I mean, I'll never forget the change that. That we saw, like, just from a leadership perspective defensively that he's able to. To enact in other players. I mean, Andrew Wiggins as a point of attack defender got to a totally different level. And I would argue. And you. I want you to back me up here and tell me if I'm wrong, but the Andrew Wiggins for, you know, Jimmy Butler trade probably doesn't happen if they don't feel super comfortable with Moses Moody being out there behind with Draymond behind him. Right.

[Marcus Thompson]

Actually. Actually think that's a. A secondary benefit, to be honest. I don't think they knew this. He wasn't.

[Dave DeFore]

Oh, you think it was a surprise? All right.

[Marcus Thompson]

No, it's. No, he wasn't like Moses. Big thing is ladder movement, but the one thing that's happening with Jimmy is they're just more aggressive, and Moses is the point of attack. It's like, all right, you get out there and you just hound the ball, right? Make it hard to get around, and then we'll handle on the back end. I think they've kind of found the sweet spot. People don't know this, that that's what happened with Clay. Clay wasn't a great defender. Bart Jackson was like, bro, you are blowing every rotation. Just hound the ball, right? Just hound the ball.

[Dave DeFore]

Yeah.

[Marcus Thompson]

And we'll handle what happens behind you. That, to me, that's why people like Draymond and KG can be underrated, because when they do their job the best, it means nothing happened, right? That's really, like 70% of their job is stopping things from happening. Draymond was just standing the spot, and they're like, okay, now that road man is dead. Now you don't see anything because the road man never gets the ball right because Draymond has left his man and just stood in the spot to kill the play and force you into your second action, right? And to me, that's where Draymond separates himself amongst anybody. It's not that he's just stopping the guy. He. He used to do this all the Time. To me, you would have loved it, because he'd be in the locker room saying, I'm gonna do this in the first quarter to set up when I'm gonna do in the fourth quarter. And he'd say he's gonna do it, and then it'll happen. And that's what he's doing out there. He is literally directing people where they want him to go. And he. He's doing it with, like, Luca. He's not, like, doing it against, like, Dennis Schroeder. He's like, I know what Luca wants to do, and I'm gonna take that away and I'm gonna make him go over there. Right? Like, he's doing that, like, almost, like, not, like, intentionally, but as the game plan. He's like, all right, I know this is what they want. So here's the things I'm going to do to mess that up and make them go a completely different direction as a game plan, not on a play, but systemically, that, to me, is just another level. And I think kg, those are the comps. To me, it's not going to be the Dwight Howard who just sanitarium and SWAT everything. It's going to be essentially the point guard. He's the middle linebacker of the defense. He's Ray Lewis, right? It's not. It's not how we typically think about defense.

[Dave DeFore]

Draymond gonna be a basketball coach when he's done, you think? I, I. He's got. He checks so many of the boxes. And including the way. Okay, that's fair, but including the way that you talked about how he described the stuff, I, I just thought it was very approachable. I could see. I don't know, man. With. With the nil stuff and the way boosters work. You don't think he take over at Michigan State?

[Marcus Thompson]

TV is too much money, man. Come on. What? Steven, get. You're right. Yeah. I don't know.

[Dave DeFore]

You're right. It's not Dave DeFore money, unfortunately, or, you know, unfortunately, I'm not making the Charles Barkley money. Before we go, I want to ask you, all right, if, if, if not Draymond for defense player of the year. Because, I mean, I just read this pretty good piece that lays out all the reasons why Draymond could be. Who would you choose as defense player of the year?

[Marcus Thompson]

Man, this is tough, dude. Mostly because so many of, like, normally we just go, who are the best teams defensively, right? And all those teams, they don't have, like, a guy. They got a lot of guys. Oklahoma City is the best defense in the league. Right. Can you say it's Chet? Of course, Chet is a major part of that, but also it's Lou Dort in case and Wallace. Right. And, like, how they. How they operate schematically. A part of me wants to go with Evan Mobley, but I'm not like, is he having that kind of year defensively? Like, it's tough to find these. These kind of, like, singular defensive forces. And I think that's why Draymond is in the mix, because if you look around a league, it's some great team defenses largely inspired by how he plays defense. Right. Like that.

[Dave DeFore]

Right.

[Marcus Thompson]

Just the impetus he's created for people to focus on defense. But it's really difficult. Normally we can just go to the. One of the top teams and, like, who's anchoring that defense. But these teams are so thorough defensively, like, from, you know, 1 through 7, 1 through 8. Like, it's hard to single it out. So I want to say like, a. A check, but, I mean, Chet missed a lot of times, so it's gonna be. Yeah, yeah, he missed too many times. Like, Amand Thompson's incredible. Are we really about to say, like, this is a.

[Dave DeFore]

It's a tough award because as soon as we went down. Right. The clarity that we had on the award went away. I think Jared Jackson, if Jaren hadn't gotten hurt. I think Jaren's probably the. The front runner right now. My guess is as good of your as yours. But I think Draymond, he probably should have won it a couple years ago. It wouldn't surprise me if he winds up with another one this year.

[Marcus Thompson]

Here's one that I feel like maybe to me, like, yeah, it's gonna be tough. Draymond is such a singular force. You're gonna have a hard time finding somebody who has that. That's that kind of, like, isolated impact. But I wonder. Drew Holiday.

[Dave DeFore]

No, no. No way. Not this year for sure. Maybe. Yeah. It's a lifetime achievement. Aw Award for Drew.

[Marcus Thompson]

We get, like, a monsters ball award for Drew Holiday.

[Dave DeFore]

We're not doing that. All right, that's gonna do it for the show, folks. Thanks to Marcus Thompson for staying up late in Tampa to do the show. Thanks for Jovan to sticking around post game to hang out. I'm Dave DeFore. This has been the NBA Daily. Thanks for waking up with us.