Ryland Stiles (2:58)

I'm super excited to be here. I really appreciate you guys having me on. Love the show. Was excited to hear about the show getting put together this year and so I've been listening ever since.

Dave Defour (3:05)

That's awesome, man. You know, we've been having a blast covering the, the entire league and especially this Oklahoma City Thunder team. I mean, obviously the first year of the new show and this has sort of been the team of the show. 68 wins. I feels like every single episode we've got a nugget or two on the Thunder. What's it been like for you covering this Thunder team? I know that you're, you're a Thunder fan, you know, that's how you got your start. But what's it been like covering this Thunder team?

Ryland Stiles (3:34)

It's been wild to see them grow into the team that everyone kind of danced around them being. Once they went and traded for Alex Caruso, once they went and signed Isaiah Hardenstein, they were looked upon as the favorites in the West. But if I, if I told you that whenever Chet breaks his hip on November 10, that they'd still be the favorites in the west at the end of it, whenever they've won 68 games. Now, I don't think anybody would have thought that because at that time they didn't have a single big man healthy. So the ride of the season I think might get lost nationally of what all this team had to go through to get the 68 wins. Because in July, 68 wins was a bit much. But like 60 wins in the one seed was not a stretch at all. But to get to 68 with all that they dealt with, it's been really impressive to watch this team come together and fight through some adversity.

Esperahenny (4:16)

Rollin, what has been the vibes in the city over the last couple years as this team starts to build out? Because we're in Oklahoma right now, we're seeing the excitement, it's palpable. For the finals. The streetcars are all, there's a massive.

Dave Defour (4:29)

Flag hanging up like on the side.

Esperahenny (4:34)

Thunder flags. It's incredible. But I guess from your perspective, what have you noticed in terms of like the hype around this team over the last couple of years and especially this season?

Ryland Stiles (4:44)

Yeah, there's certainly way more engagement, way more attentiveness to the Thunder this season around the city. And of course they're starting to build back their global brand that they once had. But around the city specifically, I, I, I think that it's just a better understanding of it all now because in 2012 everything was so new. You just thought you were expected to win at that point with how young this NBA audience was because like the, the big deal was like Dallas, like the Mavericks were, were a team people followed. I followed them before the Thunder got here, but a lot of people just ignored the NBA entirely. It was more of a college town. And so when 2012 happened, it's just like, oh, this is what you do in the NBA. You win games and you go to the finals. It's all, it's all fun and joy. And now that you've seen the other side of the, of the picture, so to say, with this city, it's a greater appreciation for this team. It's a better understanding of how difficult that this was and, and how non guaranteed it is. Even just you saw it within this season of when Chad splatter on the floor. I'll reference it again. You, you never would have thought that it would go this great for them post that happening and it's, and they've been able to do it. So I think that there's a more, a higher level of engagement from the fan base, but also a higher level of awareness, understanding of appreciation what they're watching since it's not their first time and it's not so new to them.

Dave Defour (5:57)

It feels like, you know, with such a short tank. Right. Let's call it what it was. It was a tank, but it was a short one. It was a very fast turnaround and rebuild after coming off the years of greatness. I mean you have three hall of Famers when you, when you arrive to town, pretty much. And that's epic. Do you think, like, was there any worry that during the tank, like if it goes on one season too long, oh no, we're gonna lose the fan base because I know like it's Oklahoma football out here first. Right. So, you know, obviously that's who they're competing with. So was there any concern there with the tank that if it didn't happen fast, if they didn't turn this thing around, that they could kind of lose momentum locally.

Ryland Stiles (6:34)

Yeah, I don't think that that concern ever truly gained traction because of Sam Presti and because of what you have in place. But had you seen a different front office in place where you didn't have that same certainty of that they're going to figure this thing out, there would have been that concern because it's, it's quick that you would be discarded, I think with if you were to turn this into a five, six, seven year rebuild. But instead it ends up being a true two year rebuild and they, they couldn't have picked a better time where you weren't even allowed to have fans in the stands for their first season and then their second season you had a smattering of fans out there and then now they're back. Once, once fans are back in the building, they're back in the play and they're back in the postseason and you're watching this young team grow. And I think that the Thunder have consistently done things the right way to keep their fan base where they made it very obvious within the rules because they couldn't outright say that they're tanking. But how many GMs will take out a not bed in the Oklahoma and go into such great detail of what exactly Sam's looking to do, the exact players he's wanting to find and the exact team he wants to build. And then to watch as this team got built and you realize how much it's not a happy accident. Like these players fit that exact archetype that he wrote about in 2019. And it's been, it's come to fruition now. I think that it also helped to usher out the Paul George and Russell Westbrook era with that spunky, fun Chris Paul team to where it's like, okay, this isn't all bad. And then it did get all bad, but again, the fans weren't allowed in the stand. So like the, the, the swiftness of the rebuild certainly helped Also, you know, you not being too hot right now helps a little bit too. But like there could have been an alternate universe where you'd have had to do a lot of rebuilding of your community, much less your team had this spiral on. But it didn't.

Esperahenny (8:15)

I'm glad you brought up the community aspect because Jalen Williams today was talking about the fact that sometimes playing in OKC sort of feels like being on a famous high school team, like a really elite high school team in the sense that everybody is so tied in and bought into the community and you look around and it's like everybody, like we said, has the OKC flags draped everywhere. But then there's also this sense of like the team understands the community and and is so bought into like being a part of that underdog mentality that it somehow translates into the on court product of them just hustling after every deflection, hustling after every loose ball. Does that resonate? Like is that something that actually exists or am I just making that up?

Ryland Stiles (8:57)

Well, I think that all we can do is take the players words for it and they all say the right things and say what it means to them of like Shay after winning game five and winning his first conference finals and going to his first finals, he says that it was important to him and he had extra motivation to be able to do this in front of his home crowd and give them what they deserve. And that he mentioned that after the game seven in Denver one thing that stuck out to him was like it'd be unfair to. It'd be unfair for us to let this season end for the fans because they are the ones who are out here every day. We cannot let this season in for them. And so they always have treated the fan base as if it's a huge deal. So I think we have to believe them and say that it is because JDub is right. Like if they could get off work whenever the this team is flying out of cities, like whenever they're flying out to Indiana, at whatever time they're going to fly out, 3pm or whatever on a Tuesday, they'd be out there sending them off like they're going to State and they always are going to welcome them home no matter how late it is. I mean they stood through a downpour the other day to welcome them home at the airport like that. That stuff is unique to okc and I thought that Jada made a great point to also point out it goes deeper than just that into like now that they're stars. They did that whenever they lost the play in tournament. They do that at the, at the draft intro pressures. We all know that like these teams will draft players on Thursday and then fly them in Saturday and have a press conference outside those hotels where those press conference are at whenever. These guys haven't done anything for the franchise yet. They're out there like supporting them and trying to love on them and get autographs and stuff like that. And so I think that that embrace is different because of what this market is where there is no other pro sports team, there is no other main attraction besides OU football, which is also not 100% of the state. It's most of the state, but some people like osu. So it's like this is the thing where everyone across the entire state loves and wraps their arms around.

Dave Defour (10:37)

You know, there's something of. We've been all hand wringing about the small market finals, not us, because you know, like to me, I care about the basketball. But the truth is there's a, there's a powerful emotional connection that the small markets are allowed to have and especially when they're built like the Thunder. You look at the Pacers, right? They've got a similar thing there. And even though they do have another pro sports team, it does feel like the fans there connect with the Pacers on a more, we can say it, I think a more local level, right? Like it feels like these are more real people than maybe the New York Knicks or the Lakers just because they are, you know, stars, right? Like it's a little bit different when you see these guys up close and then you come to OKC and if, if you guys are listening, you haven't been to OKC to see a game. It's actually one of the best arenas in the NBA to watch basketball. I got the chance.

Esperahenny (11:24)

The seats are comfort.

Dave Defour (11:25)

Friend of mine, yeah, I took a friend of mine to see Steph Curry for the first time he'd ever seen him live against Oklahoma City Thunder. And we were sitting in the, you know, nice lower bowl seats and it is for real, one of the best fan experiences and that ties into the whole community aspect. It does seem like the Thunder are very locked in. And again, this is the blessing of the small market rather than the curse. To me, I want to get into the basketball part of this. But first I got to take a quick break, guys. Stick around. We'll be right back after the break.

Advertiser (12:01)

This message is brought to you by Apple Card. For a limited time, get a new Apple card and get $150 bonus daily cash when you spend $150 or more at Nike in your first 30 days using your new Apple Card with Apple Pay. Visit Apple co nikepromo for important offer details. Subject to credit approval. Offer valid only for new Apple Card accounts open by June 15, 2025. To qualify, you must spend $150 or more on Nike purchases within the U.S. offer may not be available elsewhere. Additional terms and limitations apply. As we head into the playoffs, it's safe to assume there will be a few calls made by the refs that will be hard to accept. But you know what isn't hard to accept? Discovery. Believe it or not, Discover is accepted at 99% of places that take credit cards nationwide. You heard that right, 99%. So make a good call for your wallet and get Discover based on the.

Advertiser (12:58)

February 2024 Nielsen report. Learn more at discover.com credit card as.

Advertiser (13:02)

You'Ve probably heard by now, we've teamed up with BetMGM. This season we'll be using BetMGM lines to make all of our picks and we'll have special offers for our listeners each week. If you haven't signed up for BetMGM yet, use bonus code TheAthletic and you'll get a one year subscription to the Athletic plus up to a 1500 dollar first bet offer on your first wager with BetMGM. Here's how it works. Download the BetMGM app and sign up using bonus code TheAthletic. Make your first deposit of at least $10. Place your first bet on any game and claim your voucher for a one year subscription to the Athletic.

Advertiser (13:38)

See betmgm.com for terms. U.S. promotional offers not available in D.C. mississippi, New York, Nevada, Ontario or Puerto Rico gambling problem call 1-800- gambler available in the U.S. call 877-8-HOPE NY or text HOPE NY 467-369 in New York, call 1-800- NEXT STEP in Arizona, 1-800-327-5050 Massachusetts 1, 800, bets off in Iowa, 1-800-270-7117 for confidential help in Michigan, 1-800-981-0023 in Puerto Rico, first bet offer for new customers only in partnership with Kansas Crossing Casino and Hotel.

Advertiser (14:02)

Don't forget, if you haven't signed up for BetMGM yet, use bonus code the Athletic and you'll get a one year subscription to the Athletic plus up to a $1,500 first bet offer on your first wager.

Dave Defour (14:28)

Okay Ryland, you have dove about as deep as anyone on the Thunder. You know, for the last five years. You're looking at this series just like we are. What's the surprise going to be in the finals?

Ryland Stiles (14:43)

I think that there's two surprises, one on each end of the floor for the Thunder. How does Indiana defend sga and then how did the Thunder defend the Pacers and the Thunder's defense of the Pacers? Like, I think a lot of people just throw that historically great defense line out there and Kind of use that as their preview of the series. Yes, they're historically great and this third defense is awesome. And I'm not going to be the one to question how good they are, but what's been their. Their one thing that they do let up because Mark's been open and honest about how in the modern NBA it's impossible to take everything away. These players are too good. For two straight years they've conceded wide open corner threes. And if the Pacers can keep the turnovers down, which is a great stat, that they're the best turnover keeping team if they keep those down. And I really trust Halbert as a playmaker, but also I think it's underrated a little bit, is when he gets the ball out of his hands. I like a lot of the Pacers as secondary playmakers to keep the ball moving and then break down some rotations on top of the rotations that you willingly surrender to the corners. In the end, I can get red hot from three. And does that force a young head coach, first time in this setting, to completely change what's been his identity and this team's identity for two seasons and stay home on those guys and shift how they defend or do they double down on it or does it actually work right out of the gate? I think that the stress test of Mark's identity will be here today because you saw it last year. You can boil down that Maverick series to a few different things. Most notably the Thunder not having a backup center. But also they got burned by letting guys shoot from the corners. And they didn't get burned with that same format by Denver. They didn't get burned with that same format by Minnesota. So will they get burned this time against Indiana, who's been shooting the ball from three better than those two teams have by a long shot in these postseason. In this postseason. And then how the Pacers defend the SGA with all the different ways Ric Carlisle can approach it with the different ways that he's approached it this season against guys like, I don't think you can just treat him like Donovan Mitchell and just tell him to knock himself out and go score as much as he wants because he's much better than Donovan Mitchell. But by that same token, do you crossmatch Miles Turner onto Lou Dort and just say if Lou Dort kills us and if he's our PJ Washington, we'll live with it? Or and leave him at the rim? You put trust Nimhard on him. How much do you want to help? I think that ideally, if I was Ricard, I. I'd keep Turner at the rim and just if Ludor wins to the finals, then it was never meant to be. I would keep Halliburton in the corner, in the deep corner and then have our three best defenders, Nimhard being point of attack on Shay and then our other two best defenders like, like A N Smith and A. Siakam on the slots to kind of dig in and gap on Shay whenever he tries to get to the elbow. And I have the pickup point be lower. I would not pick Shay up anywhere before he gets to the free throw line. Extended area. I think that you saw Minnesota in the tail of that series, their big win in game three, they picked him up much lower. Why they didn't do it besides game three, like why they didn't do it outside of game three, I'll never know. Honestly.

Esperahenny (17:32)

Denver did something similar too. And obviously crowding SGA and forcing obviously the rest of the other guys to beat him. You talked about identity and I think that's a really important part to this is like which one of these teams is going to concede first. And one of the points that I think of is OKC's malleability to go five out with Chet or go double big. Whereas with Indiana it's like, all right, you have the Miles, Miles Turner, Pascal Siakam look, but you also can go smaller with an obi top and Pascal Siakamuk. So do you think this is going to be a series where they lean more on Chet at the five versus running that double big lineup to kind of keep up with Indiana even though they both run tons on both sides of the floor?

Ryland Stiles (18:18)

Yeah. I could see this being a situation like the Minnesota series where the Thunder start double bigs every game. That's their starting lineup. Yeah. But I think one of the final buzzer sounds and you review the minutes and the rotation.

Unknown (18:30)

Their.

Ryland Stiles (18:30)

Their starting lineup in minutes played was actually Chad Holmgren to five by himself. So the, the double bigs were starters in name only. I think that these are. This is going to be how this series goes where the. The Thunder are better off with just one center on the floor at a time. The Thunder can also throw their small ball lineup out there, which is Caruso and. And Kenrich and see if anything sticks with that and scale up Dub and scale up Caruso. That that's helped them in the past. But I do think that at the end of the day they'll be better off with just one center on the floor at A time.

Dave Defour (18:59)

So I have Miles Turner as my X factor for the series. I, I just think that, you know, when you look at the run that they've been on in the playoffs and the way that he's been used, I mean he's been very important and he's the trickiest guy. I think for OKC to guard his ability to stretch the floor the way they like to bring him up as a trailer, obviously OKC needs to get their bigs back and get them into the paint. Who do you think they're going to guard him with? I, because I, I, I've been racking my brain. I've thought, you know, maybe they could put Shea on him, you know, like and let him play little center field off the ball. But then you got to worry about the post up mismatch. So how do they attack Miles Turner? Like what are they going to do there?

Ryland Stiles (19:35)

I think it's so interesting. I would probably in the double big lineups, I, I would probably have Hartenstein on him and just hope that the length of Hartenstein can contest the threes and, and kind of make up for the ground. He has to concede by, by positioning himself a bit further off of the three point line to make up for drives, opportunities and post ups from Turner. But in a single big lineups I, I could see it being chat and having dubbed the scale up to defend Siakam and then kind of it's, it's a seamless fit from there. You have dort onto Halliburton, you have Kayson as that center field type of look. You have sga, you know, on Nimhard and you kind of have a better idea of how everything fits perfectly. Which is why I think the East Point that they're going to have to run a lot of single big coverages. But for their main starting lineup first possession tomorrow tonight I think that it will be, it'll be chat onto onto him or heart onto him.

Esperahenny (20:29)

Man, I wouldn't even be surprised if they throw Caruso on Pascal. You know, for sure that's the right.

Ryland Stiles (20:34)

Because that I think that the Pascal assignment will be Caruso. Dub those two guys primarily.

Esperahenny (20:40)

Yeah. And to me, like, you know, you mentioned Miles Turner being your X factor. I think the way that Pascal gets his game going in this series might also be another X factor because we're talking about how close can Indiana really make it, right? How are you winning on the margins? The three point shooting is one factor. The lineup variance is one factor. And then obviously the bigs which I think Pascal is dead in the middle of because the way he can kind of attack mismatches is such an important part of Indiana's offense. Are there mismatches on this OKC defense? I don't think there is. And on top of that you have guys you can comfortably switch them out to. You have Caruso, you have J Dub. I guess the question I have for you, Rylan, is like if you were on the Pacers coaching staff, how are you attacking this OKC defense?

Ryland Stiles (21:30)

Yeah, well, I mean I, I'm an undefeated upwards head coach, so if Rick wants to cut me a check, I'd be more than happy to join the club and get a quarter zip going. But I, I, I think that if you are the Pacers, it has to be of course ball security and sticking to that identity of the Pacers. But you have to have the five out spacing as your shell. You have to have Halliburton making a quick decision to hit Siakam on the short roll and then Siakam is my X factor because if he's able to get a clean catch point and handle the Thunder swarming into the post on him, which is what they've done to every single big for the last two years, and then make the extra pass to the slot or to the corner, that's going to be wide open shot after a wide open shot. And against a historically great defense, that's kind of all you can do is trust the shot quality and trust the open looks. And even if it's not the exact guys who you would prefer to have shooting, you at least prefer the shot quality versus trying to force anything else. But obviously if Halberton can get going as an individual score, that would be huge. But just looking at the, the design sets and designed ways in which that you can attack this team, that would be it. It's kind of is kind of using their advantages, which is swarming in ball pressure to make them disadvantages against okc. But that's, that's kind of about it which is why it's, it's kind of leaning so much toward Oklahoma City because who would Halliburton call to the ball and want to have an isolation attempt against, against his Thunder team. So you're going to have to rely on the others and, and you need the others to have big games which to Indiana's credit they've had a lot of big games from their rotational players.

Dave Defour (23:01)

And if Indiana goes small with Pascal at the 5, it honestly which is a little bit of a wrinkle that they that they can bust out. OKC is even better off to go up against that because Caruso can play up and all these other guys. I'm assuming that you've got the Thunder winning this thing. Do you want to give us a pred on the way out?

Ryland Stiles (23:20)

Yeah, I'll give you the prediction. I think it's Thunder and six. I think that the five and the four is a bit too discrediting of the Pacers. I think that the three point shot is the great equalizer and there's going to be a couple of games where there's just nothing the Thunder could have done. Like they are going to lose that game because of how hot Indiana is. I look back to like that Minnesota game four, which could have pushed the Minnesota series to a six game series. You got 20 points from everybody not named Julius Randle and Anthony Edwards and I trust that that Siakam and Halliburton will play at least a little bit better than Julius Randle and Anthony Edwards did. That's a very low bar to clear and that will get them a couple of wins when their other players step up. But of course the Thunder have been the best team in basketball all season long, so it'll eventually go their way, which is why you play the seven game series. I think it will be Thunder and six though.

Esperahenny (24:07)

Robin, one more thing. Can you break down your, your Elvis little background here for people who might be watching on YouTube? What is, what is the Elvis background insp by?

Ryland Stiles (24:17)

Yeah, I love Elvis. This poster right here is all of his album covers ever. I have a few of his movie posters, like Roused about, which is my favorite Elvis movie. I have a girl. Happy. Live a little. Love a little. And then I have a, I have a President Reagan poster here too for some reason. But I, I do just love Elvis. I think Elvis is great. I've seen, I've seen 25 of his 33 movies to this point.

Dave Defour (24:39)

Wow.

Ryland Stiles (24:40)

Wow.

Esperahenny (24:41)

That's awesome.

Ryland Stiles (24:43)

Oh, my favorite Elvis song I would have to say is probably this is a. This is a very tough one. It's like picking your favorite child. I would say this is harder than.

Esperahenny (24:51)

The OKC prediction right here.

Ryland Stiles (24:56)

The basketball stuff was very easy. But just pretend it's a. It's a very underrated number on his. On his less famous country album. So I would say just pretend that's a deep cut.

Dave Defour (25:06)

If you're watching on YouTube, tell us your favorite Elvis song in the comments for Rylan. Rylan, thank you so much for joining us. That's gonna do it for the show fol Finals tonight. Enjoy. I am so excited for this particular NBA Finals. Ryland Styles. Go and check him out. He hosts Locked on Thunder. He writes about the Thunder over at Sports Illustrated. He's going to be covering the Finals. Does a really great job and he's funny, which is so hard to do, to know hoops and to be funny. So thank you again for joining us. For Ryan Styles Esperahenny I'm Dave Dufour and this has been the NBA Daily. Enjoy the Finals SA.

Paige (26:07)

Hi, it's Paige from Giggly Squad. Let's be real. Cat dads are in their golden era. Temptations, America's number one cat treat brand, is celebrating how seriously irresistible these guys are. They've got sensitivity, snack, timing, precision and their cats adore them. Add in a handful of Temptations treats and boom, you've got a certified cat dad show. More love to the cat dad in your life with Temptations Cat Treats and tag your fave moments with catdadsighting. You know we're dying to see them.

Unknown (26:36)

This podcast is brought to you by Aura. Imagine waking up to find your bank account drained, bills for loans you never took out, a warrant for your arrest. All because someone stole your identity. Hackers aren't waiting. Why are you? That's why we're thrilled to partner with Aura. Your personal data is a goldmine for hackers and Aura helps lock it down. Aura monitors the dark web, blocks data brokers from selling your information. Includes a VPN for private browsing and a password manager to secure your accounts before criminals break in. For a limited time, Aura is offering our listeners a 14 day free trial plus a dark web scan to check if your personal information has been leaked. All for free@aura.com safety that's aura.com safety to sign up and start protecting yourself and your loved ones. That's a u r a.com safety. Terms apply. Check the site for details.

Unknown (27:28)

Get this Adults with financial literacy skills have 82% more wealth than those who don't. From swimming lessons to piano classes, us parents invest in so many things to enrich our kids lives. But are we investing in their future financial success? With Greenlight you can teach your kids financial literacy skills like earning, saving and investing. And this investment costs less than their after school treat. Start prioritizing their financial education and future today with a risk free trial@greenlight.com listen greenlight.com listen.