Dave DeFore (3:03)

Good morning and welcome to the NBA Daily for December 15, 2025. I'm Dave DeFore. Coming up, I sat down for 30 minutes with Sam Amick, had him empty the notebook on everything he's hearing on trade season. Welcome to our trade season primer. Good morning everybody. Hey Sam, how are you?

Sam Amick (3:23)

Good morning, Dave. Good to see you, my friend. Been a while.

Dave DeFore (3:25)

Yeah, not busy time of year. I mean, listen, you probably are busy all year, I guess you get August and that's about it.

Sam Amick (3:33)

Late July, August and then we kind of ramp up into September. But this is certainly, it's funny, you keep running into random people in your, in your life there. How are the holidays going? And I enjoy the holiday season, but the first thought is always like, it's pretty intense on the NBA front but, but it's a good problem to have.

Dave DeFore (3:50)

Yeah. Trying to explain to people that I am super, super, super busy for the first like two and a half months and then once we get to mid January I have like a normal life. You know, I can start to, you know, I don't have to watch The Orlando Magic versus the Charlotte Hornets at 4:30 in the afternoon. You know what I mean? I can, I can read about it after. Sam, it's trade season. December 15th. We're here finally. It seems like every single season this, this date arrives sooner, you know, at least in our hearts. Like there's a bunch of guys that we feel like could be on the move. But before we get to that, I just want to start with your take on the season so far. We're at like the quarterway mark. How do you feel about how the season's going? Anything jumped out to you that, that you've kind of been drawn to or are there any teams or players that stand out?

Sam Amick (4:40)

I mean there's a lot I, I think just the, but man, the headline and the elephant in the room is just, you know, you talk about jumping out okc, jumping out the way that they have. You knew they were going to be, you know, the, the title front runners again. You knew that. Common sense tells you they're going to be even better than before, you know, having that championship under their belt and the experience that comes with it. But to see what they've done without Jalen Williams for most of it, to be on pace to break the warriors regular season record for wins, it's Just remarkable stuff. And I know this is a little premature, but I feel like we're getting potentially to this space where in terms of the league wide ramifications, you know, it's, it's very, you know, fair to say, man, is this a dynasty in the making. And that is the type of thing that, you know, the last time we lived through that was with the warriors. And, and you see potentially this chilling effect on the rest of the NBA in terms of team building. And I know we're going to end up talking about trade stuff, but I, I wonder what, you know, impact that is having already on the way that all these different teams are thinking. Because if you are kind of quietly giving up hope that you can actually catch the Thunder, then does that change the timeline of your strategy? Does that change the way that you move? It would make sense for the answer to be yes, because they've just been that good.

Dave DeFore (6:04)

How much are you hearing teams talk about their, the Thunder draft stockpile, right? Like that's like the real weapon that they've got to, to extend this dynasty. Of course they've got all these good young players and they continue to find them. I mean, A.J. mitchell just looks like a star actually, and he's on the cheapest contract in the league. But the, the draft picks are the nightmare to me, for everyone else. I mean, Oklahoma City could legitimately wind up with the number one pick in next year's draft and be on the back of a back to back championship run. And I, I think, you know, that is a disaster a little bit for competitive balance in the league.

Sam Amick (6:44)

It is, but it's not, it's funny because that word, you know, or that phrase, Dave, competitive balance again, we heard that with the warriors, right, when they got Kevin Durant. It was unfair. The free agency, you know, the cap spike that led to Kevin being able to sign with the warriors, that was an outlier. And that was where people, I think, had a reasonable argument to say, well, this is, you know, unfair competitive balance. This is not that. This is just incredible management by Sam Presti and his front office staff to a degree where they are really the only team in the NBA that again, through their own merit has a cheat code in relation to this current salary cap situation and the CBA and the way that the league works right now. Everybody else is, you know, picture at a premium, having a hard time, you know, figuring out the aprons and the Thunder, knowing that inevitably they will lose some of their, if not their core guys, then their role players because of the, the Finances that they have this incredible, you know, hall of draft picks waiting in, in the wing. And like you said too, the idea that, I mean, you're talking about potentially three first round picks with Clippers, Sixers and Jazz next year coming their way, depending on how the standings fall. It's, it's unfair. But again, this is not the type of unfair where they got gifted anything. They, they did this.

Dave DeFore (7:59)

Yeah, it's not like baseball, right? Like they're going out outspending someone or, or something like that. They just planned ahead. Look, you mentioned the chilling effect, and I want to go back to that because I'm curious how that's going to affect the player movement and especially for veterans. You know, you hear about Dallas maybe wanting to move Anthony Davis, move Klay Thompson, but if teams are thinking we just are going to keep the powder dry and we're going to maybe hope that OKC runs into some bad luck or, or whatever else, like, is it going to mean that some of these teams that might want to pivot are stuck in their current situation?

Sam Amick (8:35)

Again, it might, you know, you can call it stuck or you can call it like extending their Runway or their timeline. Dallas is a good example in my backyard. I'll use the Kings as a good example. I'm really curious to see what they do because if they felt closer to being competitive, then maybe they're willing to, you know, move one of their core guys, whether it's Tomato Sabonis or Zach Levine with a pick attached to get, you know, like Levine, for example, like, he's very hard to move. Well, they have zero interest in attaching a pick because they need to think about their future. And you have to, like, again, you have to think about a longer timeline. I think a world exists where a player like that, and this example applies to a lot of teams where, all right, we have two high priced years left with this particular player. Are we going to be desperate to get them off our books and compromise some of our other kind of building tools in the process, or will we be very patient and just let him come off the books naturally after next season? Those are the types of questions that to some degree are impacted by the Thunder's dominance. And, you know, it's not the case for everybody. I wrote this, you know, today. Shameless plug Dave had a lot of fun doing our front office rankings at the Athletic. We do it every year. It's the second time we've done it and not surprisingly, OKC was at the top. But I wrote about the Rockets, for example, and how their legacy is interesting. You know, Rafael Stone, their gm, worked under Daryl Morey previously, before Daryl went to Philly. And this Rockets team in this group is doing a similar thing to what they did a decade ago when they were one of the only teams that was actually coming for the neck, so to speak, of the reigning champion. And it was the, the warriors back then with the Rockets trying to take them off their throne. And now, you know, it's the Rockets going after the Thunder because, you know, they went out and got kd. They'd been aggressive. So the chilling effect doesn't apply to everybody. But unless you are a Houston or a Denver or a New York or one of these teams near the top, you know, I think you start second guessing the strategy here a bit.

Dave DeFore (10:39)

Yeah. And then let's not forget that the spurs have so much young talent and Victor Wyama that there's a chance that the spurs maybe catch OKC to a certain degree. However they can be caught. I don't even know what that, what that looks like. You know, by next year, these guys, they might have five stars in their starting lineup. I, I just, they're just on another level. Speaking of teams waiting for guys to come off the books, I got, I got you here. We got to talk about the Clippers. It's fiasco after fiasco for this team. I mean, the season itself has just been a disaster, especially compared to the, the promise, I think, that they had come coming out of last year. They pushed the Nuggets to seven games. The Nuggets push the Thunder to seven games. You know, you start doing the math right, and you say, hey, maybe we, we're a little bit better than we thought. But it turns out they outperformed the roster last year. But everyone is thinking about 20, 27. But what do the Clippers do now? You know, this, this. There's so much weirdness around the team. I mean, Lawrence Frank's getting an extension. It's. It seems like everything is the opposite of the way it should be going.

Sam Amick (11:49)

No, that's fair. I, I don't know how to break it down other than it's, it's, it's, you know, it is a disaster. Basketball wise. They had high expectations for this year. Now, in. In the interest of not being hypocritical, because we get things wrong all the time in the media, I will share with you that. Man. Dave, when the Clippers came through my neck of the woods in the preseason, and it was preseason, but you can get a feel for teams and they put a beating on the Kings. You know, I looked at that roster and I was a believer. I thought they were going to be good. And fast forward to, you know, obviously here in mid December and everything has come off the tracks. Certainly part of it is health related. Kawhi was out for quite some time, but even once they got Kawhi back, it has not worked. The Chris Paul, you know, situation controversy drama that I think exposed a lot of warts that we knew existed within the Clippers culture, but it just reminded you that they still exist. And what I'm referring to there is you can say what you want about Chris's leadership style, but the lack of leadership and the void in that department is, I think, the root issue of what led to, you know, what happened there and that, you know, you got a guy in Kawhi who is, you know, obviously legendarily quiet and soft spoken and certainly a, like, I'm going to show you and not tell you type of leader, that's not the end of the world. But you put him next to James Harden, who, you know, has been lauded for a lot of things, has had a historic career, but has never been known as a, you know, as a, you know, leading the troops type of guy. The thing that strikes me about the Clippers and confuses me is just how they, they just stubbornly stick to their plan no matter the results. And you know, you mentioned the reporting from R. Joe Varden at the Athletic that, that there's a lot of people around the league indicating that the Clippers front office is on track to get extensions. You know, that again, just from a common sense standpoint that runs a little counter to the like, even, even if that ultimately happened, you know, to do that in the middle of a league investigation when you have pretty serious salary cap circ convention accusations coming your way, the optics of that are strange. You know, that that investigation hasn't even ended yet and you're extending the relationship with the group that is front and center. I mean, there's a lot of layers to it, but it's bad. And then just the cherry on top is, oh, by the way, the All Star Game is in your arena this year. So all of your, you know, like, even life in general, you know, all of your issues coming to the fore when the spotlight is brightest for the world to see is not ideal.

Dave DeFore (14:26)

Yeah, you know, it's coincidental that they don't expect the results of the investigation until after the All Star break. I don't know, it's kind of imagine it's amazing how that works out.

Sam Amick (14:36)

Guys.

Dave DeFore (14:36)

Stick around after the break. Gonna get Sam to empty the notebook, let him, let us know what he's hearing about the trade market.

Andrew Schlecht (14:50)

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Dave DeFore (19:39)

Okay, Sam, you're our national NBA insider. Let me inside the Notebook. Tell me what's going to happen now that the books are open. Guys can be traded, you know Jonathan Kaminga, is he going to the Kings?

Sam Amick (19:52)

Yeah, we'll see, Dave. I mean, it's funny because this December 15th date certainly inspires, with good reason, a real uptick in not only conversations around the league, you know, because as you know, so many contracts that were signed in the summer are now eligible to be moved. And, and the pie of, you know what is available is suddenly larger. But so it, it fires up the rumor mill to a pretty serious degree. But the movement still doesn't come for a minute like so, you know, it's going to take a while for the market, I think to evolve, but we have plenty of different situations to monitor. Obviously, the Kaminga one you mentioned, we've been tracking since, I mean, really past couple years. But it came to a head last summer when, you know, he's in the staring contest with the warriors and restricted free agency, ends up signing a two year, 48 and a half million dollar deal that was structured in a way that everybody involved knew that they would likely trade him around this time heading into February. The part that you probably didn't necessarily see coming is that he's had this roller coaster season with the Warriors. In the first 10 games or so, he was the type of player that they had always hoped he would be. And you started actually hearing from warriors people that maybe we don't want to trade them. But that part ultimately changed. He has not played as well. He's, you know, looking@dnp cds now from Steve Kerr, who has not changed his framing of Kaminga's situation at all in terms of like, here are my expectations and if he doesn't reach them, he's not going to play. So the, the thing for me is with Kaminga, the Kings certainly still have interest. You know, Phoenix was involved last summer as well, although they're in a different spot now than I think they were even a couple months back. I don't know where he lands because I think leverage wise, the warriors have lost a bit with Kaminga struggles. So if you're the Kings, you're going to try to come in low and I don't know what that deal looks like. I don't think Malik Monk would be part of it like he was before, but I think it's, it's going to be tricky to find a deal there. All kinds of other situations we could jump into. I think the one that's.

Dave DeFore (21:55)

I got one to ask you about that just makes no sense to me. Apparently Giannis is interested in going to the Chicago Bulls, but the Bulls are not interested. I mean, is that, Come on, that can't be real.

Sam Amick (22:07)

Yeah, I mean, I, I don't ever want to, you know, like any other, you know, media members, I don't have that confirmed information. Yes, that is a head scratcher when it comes to, I mean, for one, here's, here's something I know for a fact and this has been reported the Bulls have shown a consistent interest in Damon Sabonis over the years. Right, right. So let me get this straight. You're telling me yes to Dom Giannis?

Dave DeFore (22:32)

I, I don't they have a type?

Sam Amick (22:34)

Yeah, he's not, he's not from the Balkans. I, I so, yeah, I think that with Giannis, the shift should be towards New York. That remains the focus. You know, last summer, when Giannis and his camp did raise the prospect of going to New York, and, and, you know, you call it a trade request or a trade inquiry, whatever you want to call it, he expressed an interest in playing in New York, but the timing of it was so late in the summer, you know, they had already signed Mikhail Bridges to an extension that made, you know, that type of a deal even more difficult to do. All of the different puzzle pieces didn't fit. There was no way that was going to go anywhere, and it didn't. But it did reveal, you know, what he saw in New York. But the other part of that was the Knicks really looked at their team and said, we think we're title contenders. And so tracking that throughout this season has been interesting because, you know, there's an inverse relationship between how the Knicks see themselves and then the prospects of, you know, do they have a desire to go get Giannis? So last night, you know, they take care of business against Toronto, they get to the semifinals of the NBA Cup. They're playing well right now. So internally, I'm very curious to hear, what is that Giannis conversation? Do they still have as much belief in this current team as they did back in August and September? Because that's going to dictate how hard they potentially push for Giannis. On the Milwaukee side, it's been messy in terms of, you know, the ESPN report indicating that, that the two sides were suddenly talking about possibly parting ways. Again, some pushback on that, reporting from both sides, some gray area about, like, you know, yes, everybody knows that you're reaching this fork in the road that we've been kind of inching towards for years now, but it's just almost like nobody wants to be the bad guy here and say the thing which is, we're going to trade you, or I want to be traded. And so they keep doing this awkward dance.

Dave DeFore (24:36)

I mean, the team that makes the most sense here, if we're, like, surveying the market, is the Atlanta Hawks. They've got the Bucks picks, they've got that Pelicans pick. They've got the young talent. And, I mean, frankly, Rich Paul on his podcast said that the Bucks should be trying to trade for his client, Jalen Johnson, who's from Milwaukee. So, I mean, there's a lot of synergy, I think, between those two teams, and if you're Atlanta, it makes so much sense. Giannis puts you in the title picture.

Sam Amick (25:04)

He does. He just. Again, we gotta start with, what does Giannis want? Right. He's not going to pull the curtain back and tell anybody right now. But again, we already know the New York thing. We need clarity on Atlanta because, yes, you know, in a vacuum or just kind of objectively, you can look at the Hawks and say, that makes a lot of sense. But every team that has Giannis interest will start with, like, it does not matter if he doesn't want to go there, because it has now reached a point where he can opt out. Not this coming summer, but the next summer.

Dave DeFore (25:32)

It's.

Sam Amick (25:33)

There's, you know, there's a. Timeline wise, it's a short enough Runway that Giannis is in control. If he doesn't want to come to your team, you don't want to do it, because you're going to have to give up too much, and then he's going to bounce at the first chance he has. The Hawks thing, just in terms of additional context, is I don't know exactly what this means, but it's worth remembering that his agent, longtime agent Alex Haratzis from Octagon, interviewed for the Hawks GM position that ultimately went to Onis Salah when he got elevated in his current role. Now, I. My understanding is that Alex wasn't a finalist. It was just a conversation. But when that happened, there certainly were people assuming that if you're the Hawks, that part of that calculus was, you know, if we got Alex here, would that help us with Giannis down the road? Those are the types of, you know, it sounds like an HBO show and a political thing, but those are the types of things that sometimes happen, that.

Dave DeFore (26:27)

It'S a relationship business.

Sam Amick (26:28)

Yeah, no question. So you got to know how Giannis feels about Atlanta, but it does make some sense. Jalen Johnson in Milwaukee would be the type of young star who you could sell the Bucks fans and. And, you know, help them kind of mop up their tears after losing Giannis and get excited about a young guy coming their way.

Dave DeFore (26:47)

Yeah, you definitely could do a lot worse. I mean, will the entire market wait until there's clarity on Giannis before we start, you know, to see or hear more about, you know, Anthony Davis and Klay Thompson and maybe even, you know, John Morant? You know, if he winds up being.

Sam Amick (27:03)

Actually available, I mean, maybe to some degree, but I just don't really think that the Giannis group, so to speak, is all that large, you know, because even the teams that could do it, you know, we talked in the last segment about okc, they could do it. You know, to steal the great line that you referenced off air from our guy Andrew schleicht, you know, Mr. Thunder himself was like, well, what are they gonna do? Go win the championship even harder? You know, like, they are incredible. They don't need Giannis. So I would say that's a no on okc. The indications I've gotten another team. San Antonio has the means to go after him and potentially get something done. You know, things could always change. The early indications that I've gotten is that's not in the cards. So I'm going to say no to the spurs right now. The warriors are another one that's been tied to Giannis for a long time. Again, that goes back to the question, does he want to be in Golden State, in San Francisco with the Warriors? I don't have total clarity on that, but there's no smoke there, to my knowledge. And, in fact, I. I've chatted with some of their core players about, you know, the intel and, like, you know, and then, to be clear, not number 30, so I don't know what number 30s intel is, but, you know, the indication was, yeah, we don't have any reason to think that he's trying to get here, so the list to. To make or to answer your question, might not be that long. If you've got New York in there, you got. I think Miami's worth watching. That's another one that checks a lot of boxes. But it's not so many teams that I think it's going to chill the market and. And hold things up all that much.

Dave DeFore (28:36)

Okay, so who's the next biggest guy that. That we may see moved? I mean, is it. Is it Anthony Davis? I mean, it does seem like he fits in a lot of different places. You know, like, center. Center position is a little bit. I don't know. It's shallow right now. And I feel like Anthony Davis, especially when he's playing, like he has been here lately, when he's healthy, I think he could be a game changer for one of these contenders.

Sam Amick (28:58)

Yeah. I mean, with ad, I think the landscape is a little bit tricky because he's only 32 years old, but with the health history and honestly, even the inconsistency when healthy at times there's still question marks around AD coming into camp, overweight, making people wonder about where his head is at and his post Lakers, NBA life, those are not things that would compel you to feel comfortable signing him to an extension this coming summer, which is what he is certainly in pursuit of now. The Mavs have already signaled that they want to let the season play out and, and are not comfortable committing to anything anytime soon. But if he gets moved, you know, and, and the Raptors have been mentioned and the Hawks and the Bulls, like you have to resolve that situation now. You don't have to. You could just let him play it out. But that's probably going to impact, you know, what you have to give up in return. That, to me is where it's tricky. I'm not saying I don't see AD getting moved. I think some of the interest from the teams that I mentioned has been a bit overstated, but that's also just the time of year that we're in. And so, I mean, AD is front and center. You know, you mentioned Klay Thompson, you know, not as much of a game changing player at this point in his career, but certainly collateral damage in the Luka Doncic deal and everything else that has happened since then. So I think Clay would love to be in a more competitive situation. You know, I wrote recently, Dave, about the John Morant situation in Memphis and, and how I was actually a bit surprised when I spent a little time around the Grizzlies that it seemed like he was more engaged with his teammates and the coaching staff than I had anticipated. And, and the messaging out of Memphis from the top on down is that they're trying to work through it as opposed to cutting the cord and moving on from the John Moran era. So I think that combined with concern around the league for just what comes with Jaw, that combination, like I'd be surprised if jaw gets moved. I can't remember a year where we've had so many high profile guys who seemingly are discontented to some extent in their situations, but it might not kind of, you know, reach that tipping point where something happens right now. Know there's noise around LaMelo Ball in Charlotte. That's real noise. Like it's worth watching. But I don't know that somebody benched a couple times. Right.

Dave DeFore (31:23)

You know, and frankly deservedly so. If I, if I was Charles, I would be sick of dealing with that, you know, and there's a reason why they're closing games with some of these younger guys even than Lamelo, because It's just these are the guys that the Hornets can trust. You know, Trey Young, throw him into that. Into that bucket.

Sam Amick (31:43)

Yeah.

Dave DeFore (31:44)

Is there a team that you feel like they need to make a move like one of the contenders? Right. Like Minnesota comes to mind for me. Right. Point guard. What are they going to do?

Sam Amick (31:56)

It's interesting. I reported a while back that they were one of the teams monitoring the John Morant situation. You know, that I think is still. Again, I'm already handicapping that is unlikely for anybody, and that certainly would include Minnesota. But Tim Conley, their president of basketball operations, is on the short list of most aggressive executives in the league. He went out and paid a steep freight to get Rudy Gobert. He has made moves all the way through his tenure that were pretty bold. And so I don't know what it looks like, but I'd be surprised if Tim stood pat at the deadline. You know, one name I've heard with Minnesota a bit is Kobe White. That could be of interest. You know, so that's probably worth watching, but they absolutely are a team that came in with title contending aspirations. You know, our John Krasinski, the expert on all things Wolves in Minnesota, wrote a great piece about Anthony Edwards going into the year. It just made you feel like he was about to level up and go ahead and find a way to join that top three or five group of most elite players in the league. And he's got the numbers and he's been doing his thing, but the winning is not there.

Dave DeFore (33:06)

Yeah.

Sam Amick (33:06)

And. And they have struggled. So I. I think, you know, before some of this smoke to, you know, as far as things in Minnesota looked at, you know, they were in on Kevin Durant trying to make that happen. This is just kind of how they move. So I'm with you for sure. I think they. They're trying to do something.

Dave DeFore (33:21)

Yeah. I mean, look, I. I know Oklahoma City is scary to everyone, but I do think, like, scared money doesn't make any. And I think that a team like Minnesota that has all these pieces, they. You could see a world where in a playoff series, they could win. Right. Anthony Edwards could be the best player in a series, even with Shay Gilgis Alexander for. For seven games. So, I don't know. I hope nobody's scared because I'd like to see some competitive basketball, man.

Sam Amick (33:44)

That's where. I mean that. That's what ant's trying to do, really, if you want to zero in on just one guy, because I, you know, I covered that Wolves Thunder series. That was pretty one sided. And you walk out of there going, oh, boy. Like, SGA is up here and ant is down here. Like, that's just a reality of. Of when it mattered most. That's how it looked.

Dave DeFore (34:02)

Yeah. All right. Thank you, Sam, for hanging out with me and setting us up for trade season. I appreciate it. We're gonna hang out in Vegas. NBA.

Sam Amick (34:10)

So that's it, brother.

Dave DeFore (34:12)

Thank you guys for listening. I'm Dave DeFore. This has been the NBA Daily. Thanks for waking up with us. With no fees or minimums on checking accounts, it's no wonder the Capital one bank guy is so passionate about banking with Capital One. If he were here, he wouldn't just tell you about no fees or minimums. He'd also talk about how most people Capital One cafes are open seven days a week to assist with your banking needs. Yep. Even on weekends, it's pretty much all he talks about. In a good way. What's in your wallet terms apply. See capitalone.com bank capital1, NA member, FDIC.

Andrew Schlecht (35:09)

Guys, thanks for helping me carry my Christmas tree.

Sam Amick (35:11)

Zoe, this thing weighs a ton. Drew, ski lift with your legs, man.

Andrew Schlecht (35:14)

Santa. Santa, did you get my letter?

Dave DeFore (35:16)

He's talking to you, Bridges.

Sam Amick (35:18)

I'm not. Of course.

Andrew Schlecht (35:19)

Course he did. Right, Santa?

Sam Amick (35:21)

You know my elf Drew here, He handles the nice list. And elf.

Dave DeFore (35:24)

I'm six' three.

Sam Amick (35:25)

What everyone wants is iPhone 17 and at T Mobile, you can get it on them.

Dave DeFore (35:29)

That center stage front camera is amazing for group selfies.

Andrew Schlecht (35:32)

Right, Mrs. Claus?

Dave DeFore (35:34)

I'm Mrs. Claus's much younger sister. And AT T Mobile, there's no trade in needed when you switch, so you.

Sam Amick (35:39)

Can keep your old phone or give it as a gift.

Andrew Schlecht (35:41)

And the best part, you can make.

Dave DeFore (35:43)

The switch to T mobile from your.

Andrew Schlecht (35:44)

Phone in just 15 minutes. Nice. My side of the tree is slipping.

Sam Amick (35:47)

Kimber. The holidays are better.

Dave DeFore (35:49)

AT T Mobile, switch in just 15 minutes and get iPhone 17 on us with no trade in needed. And now T mobile is available in US cellular stores with 3, 4 monthly bill credits for well qualified customers plus tax and $35 device connection charge credits and imbalance due if you pay off earlier. Cancel financing agreement. 256 gigs. $830. Eligible for it in a new line. $100 plus a month plan with auto payments, taxes and fees required. Check out 15 minutes or less per line.

Sam Amick (36:08)

Visit t mobile.com I'm Anna Lynn Guzik, founder of the anti nihilist foundation, publisher of the Conversationalist. We're truly independent nonprofit media. No overlords, no corporate agenda.

Andrew Schlecht (36:21)

Just stories that matter, from climate justice.

Sam Amick (36:24)

To reproductive freedom to fighting back against kleptocracy. Now we're bringing those stories and voices.

Andrew Schlecht (36:31)

Directly to you with season two of the Conversationalist Podcast. Subscribe now, wherever you get your podcasts.

Dave DeFore (36:40)

If you're an H Vac technician and a call comes in, Grainger knows that you need a partner that helps you find the right product fast and hassle free. And you know that when the first problem of the day is a clanking blower motor, there's no need to break a sweat. With Grainger's easy to use website and product details, you're confident you'll soon have everything humming right along. Call 1-800-GRAINGER Click grainger.com or just stop by Grainger for the ones who get it done.