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- [00:01]
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- [00:58]
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Terms apply.
- [00:59]
Law Murray
Lounge access is subject to change.
- [01:00]
Capital One Terms Announcer
See capitalone.com for details.
- [01:02]
Dave Dufour
We will answer your call as soon as we can.
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- [02:25]
Dave Dufour
Good morning and welcome to the NBA Daily presented by Ebay. I'm Dave Dufour, here with Zena Keda and Law Murray. For our Western Conference preview, we've done all 30 teams. Now we're going to tell you who's going to win the West. Good morning everybody. Good morning guys. Welcome back. Season starts next week.
- [02:47]
Zena Keda
What's up Dave?
- [02:48]
Dave Dufour
We're Back to work.
- [02:49]
Zena Keda
We are back to work. We're in the trenches again.
- [02:52]
Dave Dufour
And Zena, by the way, just never quit working all summer. Xena, obviously, just finishing up the WNBA season with on no offseason. And Law, you know, Law, every summer you do the video series where you kind of get me fired up for, for the next season. So you just can't stop working.
- [03:12]
Law Murray
I mean, it's not work when you like what you do. And I, I, I love what I do. So I'm happy that my public service to myself is also extended to you, Dave.
- [03:27]
Dave Dufour
Appreciate you, man. Like, as well as you guys may know, Law covers the, the Clippers for us over at the Athletic. He's also going to be doing more Lakers coverage because I think, I mean, that team, and we're about to talk about him here in the Western Conference preview. I think that team is, you know, with Luca and LeBron on the squad, you know, they need a little bit more attention. But I actually think that team might be pretty good this year, so it's going to be cool to have Law covering them. Guys, let's, let's jump right in. And you know, we were trying to figure out how to do this. We didn't just want to talk about the teams. We just did that for the last month. Right. Like, we, we know these teams pretty well. I think I want to talk about how this all plays out in the west and in the NBA, having the best player, you know, on your team tends to, to help you be a better team. And out west, we, they have all the talent. All of the top players in the league are out west. This is why if Giannis gets traded, he cannot go to a Western Conference team. Got to keep some of that talent in the East. Zena, who are your top five players out West? I mean, I, I don't want to throw, you know, throw the spotlight on you immediately, but like, it feels like we're probably going to have a universal top three, if I'm guessing right.
- [04:39]
Zena Keda
Yeah, I'm, you know, Nikola Jokic, Denver Nuggets, Shay Gildrich Alexander and Luka Doncic, you know, Los Angeles Lakers. Now, I also included some younger talent in Anthony Edwards and Victor Webanyama to round out my top five.
- [04:55]
Dave Dufour
Wow. Victor Wemanyama, top five in the West. Law, what do you, what do you think about that one?
- [05:01]
Law Murray
Okay, so I got four of Zena's five.
- [05:05]
Zena Keda
I knew the victor one would be a toss up. So I'm ready to hear what you guys thoughts are.
- [05:10]
Law Murray
And that's my flip I mean, I'm gonna go. I mean Shay is the reigning everything scoring champion, mvp, finals mvp. And Jokic had arguably his best season, didn't result in an MVP award. Luka has everything to get back after how last year went. And Anthony Edwards is the most likely guy to challenge for a spot on the MVP ballot. Wemby, I'm not putting there yet. I just feel like Stephen Curry, what we saw from him last year, he still strikes the fear of God into a lot of these coaches hearts and he is for me, he's that guy. And I wasn't considering Wemby in top five. I was thinking of Kevin Durant, but I feel like I got to put Steph in there because you, you can remember what Steph did in the playoffs this past spring. I don't think you can remember anything Kevin Durant did in the playoffs for at least a couple of years.
- [06:13]
Dave Dufour
I tend to agree with your list law. You know, I didn't want to just come out here and be the Steph homer that I am, but.
- [06:21]
Zena Keda
Well, that's what I was trying to avoid. Dave, I know you were trying to.
- [06:25]
Law Murray
Your efforts are appreciated.
- [06:26]
Dave Dufour
Xena, I would say this though. Wemby in the, in the top five in the west though is not, it's not really that hot of a take. It's maybe it's a projection and there's a great chance that by the end of this season, I mean by mid season we, you know, we've been watching him in the preseason and he looks ridiculous. We know what his or at least the theoretical se ceiling of all the stuff that he brings to the table. I don't think that that's crazy by any stretch. I think that for sure at the end of the season we're all going to feel this way. I mean, well, we talked a little bit about MVP earlier in the week. I mean there's a world in which Wemby is in the MVP mix.
- [07:09]
Law Murray
That's an Antonio's first team needs Wemmy to be really, really good to survive even the bottom five of the West. Like he needs to be available. He needs to be great on both ends of the floor. We know what his defensive impact is and for Wimy, it's a matter of cleaning up the the offense and being the hub of everything that San Antonio does. This is Mitch Johnson's first training camp. You know, this time last year everyone was thinking that it was going to be, you know, Greg Pavage coaching Chris Paul. You know, things really got off track in a hurry. For San Antonio. And so that gives Wemby an opportunity to show some things that. That he hasn't shown. And if he has the kind of season that his ceiling projects him to have, then he'll absolutely be in that conversation. But the key is he's got to actually be available and actually produce and do it.
- [08:04]
Zena Keda
Now, I got a question for you guys.
- [08:06]
Dave Dufour
Oh, go ahead.
- [08:07]
Zena Keda
Because, of course, the Steph Curry conversation for me was like, okay, I'm looking at the top five. I chose Nucleok. It's Luca, Shay, Anthony, and Wemby. And we're seeing the top five players in the west in my list at least, really show up on both sides of the ball.
- [08:23]
Dave Dufour
Right, right.
- [08:25]
Zena Keda
Like, there's a. There's activity on both sides of the ball, particularly the Wemby aspect of, you know, averaging a double double 23 and 11 also lead, like, top of the league in stocks. That, for me, is enough to show both sides of ball. Now, the veterans that I was thinking about, because we've seen what Kawhi Leonard's been doing in this preseason. Right. We know what Steph Curry is capable of. We know what LeBron is capable of. But again, these are gentlemen that are on the older side, and I don't know if they can provide that activity on both sides of the ball in the way that these five can. And that's what I'm trying to see. When you talk about the top five players, best players, I. I'm. I'm now looking, like, at a balanced attack. Are you really great and striking the fear of God in people offensively and also really helpful on defense. I mean, Ant Edwards is a dog on defense. Shay goes Alexander a dog on defense. Nickel, Jokic, an unbelievable rim protector. Obviously, we know what Wemby does, and Luca gets his hands in there like. Like, the deflections are there. So that's what made me go, hmm. So my question is, if we are looking at the older generation, include Kevin Durant, Steph LeBron, who would you guys have out of that group?
- [09:41]
Dave Dufour
How would we rank them? Yeah, I mean, that's pretty easy to me. I. I'd go, Steph. God. Well, we got to see what LeBron looks like, because, you know, going into a season with an injury is a.
- [09:51]
Law Murray
First, especially that injury.
- [09:54]
Dave Dufour
That injury. Right. It's kind of an old man injury, so. But Kevin Durant is still, again, he rolls out of bet, and he can give you 30 a night. So it just. I think that. That he is going to age pretty well. I mean, it's probably like a Dirk Nowitzki style aging curve with him where he can, you know, shoot jumpers until he's in his 40s. You know, obviously Steph is degree of difficulty is very high, so. Okay, I'm curious. I want to swing this to the top because the, the bottom of the five, that's like where the debate is. But what about the top? You know, Jokic is kind of the, the guy that we all say is the best in the world and has been. I mean, Law, you just mentioned he had his best season and didn't win MVP because Shea won. What would Shea have to do to overtake Jokic as the best player in the world? Does he have a chance? I mean, could Luka even maybe leapfrog Shay and Jokic this season? Like, what, what does that look like?
- [10:53]
Law Murray
I think all those guys have very, very clear weaknesses, despite how great they are. Xena, I'm, I'm not going to co sign Nicole Yokage's rim protection like that team. I'm very interested to see how Denver defends this year. They were, they were a bad defense last year, like point blank. Like what I give Jokic credit for defensively is how great his hands are. And yes, yes, if you do miss a shot against Denver, I mean the rebounding is at least when Jokic is on the floor is really good. But I'm very interested to see, especially with a new coaching staff, how Denver is going to go about defending better. And I, and I just saw Denver Sunday night at Intuit Dome. They look like they're going to try and beat the hell out of teams. Like they look like they're just going to be very aggressive. Ball pressure, ball pressure. And that includes Nikola. That is also going to put them in positions where they're going to give up a whole crazy amount of good looks when they don't get steals. But I think they're going to be very aggressive. I look at a guy like Shea, his clear weakness is not as defined as Nikola or Luca. Luca, we've been talking about his lack of defensive intensity for pretty much his entire career. Shay plays on the top defense in basketball, so that's not his issue with Shay. It's a matter of how good is that pull up three. How consistent can it be? He, it's, it's great for him that he's so good in the mid range that he gets to the line at a high rate and makes his free throws that he's able to just, you know, like a good route runner in, in Football, like, not the biggest, not the fastest, but that twitch gets him open, right? It separates. That's Shea's superpower. But there's a world in which Shai can be that more confident with the pull up three. You know, he takes a specific pull up three when he does that little half jab, and then he goes and rises up. That's his comfort three. That's like LeBron when he stares at his hand, basically, and right and pulls up on the left side. You know, the str for greatness three needs to get more comfortable with that pull up three and more comfortable in the playoff setting. When that thing rises, if that thing ever approaches 40%, that's when Shay can claim that he is an even more unstoppable force than even Nikola Jokic.
- [13:18]
Dave Dufour
See, that's the thing with Luca, right? Luca is. It's a little bit of Steph, but with the ball in his hands where he's scary, you know, 35ft in, and he's scary in multiple ways. You know, you try to scheme to guard Luka Doncic, and I will just tell you guys, it is a nightmare experience. You're trying to decide, do you push him right? Do you push him left? Right? So he's better shooter going left. He's a really good shooter, and he's a better passer going right, and he's a really great passer. And so I think that when you look at what they've done around him, Ayton, I'm a believer that that's going to work out. I think. I still think they got to add some shooting, but if Luka defends at all this year, and remember, we're talking skinny Luca now motivated. Luca insulted Luca from last year. Right? Like, if he defends it all, I think that there's a world where we're talking about Luka as the best player in the world, too. They have to win, you know, obviously, and he. He'll have to put up numbers, but he's. He's in the. He. He's got the skill for it. You know, it's not a. It's not a talent issue with him. I think it's just a effort all the time on the other side of the ball and winning, you know, you got to figure that out. Okay, so. So back to the women Yama thing, because I do think this is interesting. Is he the most likely guy to break into this sort of conversation to, you know, who be a top 10 player after this season, a top five in the West? Is he the most Likely guy in the West?
- [14:46]
Zena Keda
Absolutely. I mean, obviously.
- [14:47]
Dave Dufour
Yeah.
- [14:48]
Zena Keda
Yeah. I think we were already seeing the evidence of it early on. Like the game got slow to him. It was already slow to him. I would even say having seen him that very first summer league game, which he was not good in, you could already see that. The movement, the way that he's evaluating the game, the way that he's adjusting in real time, like he was already doing that. My thing is for Victor is he's finally going to have a year of full health and he's going to have some talent around him. He's got a crazy packed backcourt, all of which want to play the pick and roll game with him. We've already seen, you know, Dylan Harper and him have a great preseason, particularly Utah. I feel bad that they had to be the stage to already show us what they're capable of doing in terms of what the spurs are trying to do with the pick and roll game running in transition. But you have Dylan Harper that can play with him. You've got de' Aaron Fox that obviously is gonna be able to run the floor with him. I don't know what the shooting is gonna look like around Victor Yama, but remember Victor Webanyama put up more threes last year than he did two pointers. So this is an opportunity for him to show off his stretch five capability. He's going to have to be really good, as Law said. And what happens in those cases is the same thing that we see with Luca, it's the same thing that we've seen with LeBron, it's the same thing we've seen with Steph. When you are that required greatness has to come out. Like, you've got to elevate your game. You've got to be able to push forward everyone around you. And I think that that's why Victor Webanyama, knowing what's at stake, knowing that they've got all these pieces around him now and moves have been made to try and elevate the Spurs. I absolutely think that he's going to break into this conversation out of, if not out of just sheer skill development, out of necessity and needing, like needing.
- [16:26]
Dave Dufour
To Law, who do you think is going to break out in the West? Like, what player is going to come out of nowhere and maybe not be top five know, in the west or top 10 in the NBA. But like, who. Who's going to surprise us this year? Who's going to be the guy?
- [16:41]
Law Murray
Well, there's going to be a cheek pick and then there's a guy that I don't, I don't even know if he's 100% starting based on this preseason. I think everyone's on him in like, Zena.
- [16:51]
Dave Dufour
I'm pretty sure we're all, yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [16:54]
Law Murray
Like, he's probably your easiest, most improved player candidate right now. It's, it's year three, so it's not as frowned upon to consider him. And I mean, he's not an All Star yet, so he's in position, especially with Fred Van Vliet's ACL injury, to be everything that you thought he'd be coming out of overtime elite, you know, as a playmaker who didn't need to shoot it, great. But if that dude does shoot it competently, watch out because he has every other tool. You know, like, someone's got to get the ball to Shingu, someone's got to get the ball to Kevin Durant. And Reed shepherd is just going to hope to, you know, tread water, you know, after the rookie season he had, he's got to show that he's a viable rotation player in the NBA. Amend showed a lot last year. He was so good that they didn't have Jabari Smith Jr go back to the starting lineup once Jabari got healthy mid season. So that's the easy breakout candidate. The one guy that I feel like I just hope Portland does the right thing here based off of how they finished last season is Zeni Abdial. Like, that dude put up crazy numbers. Once they got Simons Ayton and Jeremy Grant out the paint, they just were like built the whole thing out of Danny Abdia and just let him cook and that guy gets a free throw line at a high rate. I love those players because fouls are not just about the grift. You know, it's not about just foul merchantry. You got to have talent and a physical advantage built in to have pro defenders and pro schemes foul you to the point where you're getting there as often double times, double digit times a game, as often as you might never get there at all. Denny Abdia, as a playmaker, as a, as a shot creator and with his size to go along with that skill and the fact that he is willing to defend. He spent his whole career in Washington and then the first half of Portland trying to show that he can defend at a respectable level. Like, that guy is really good. It took a while, but that's where you talk about when you talk about breakout guys. I just hope Portland doesn't mess around and bring him off the bench to start the year. He's your best player, probably.
- [19:09]
Dave Dufour
Zena, you got any breakout candidates for this?
- [19:13]
Zena Keda
The funny thing is, is that Law just laid out both of mine. I mean, of course we've been talking about Amin Thompson, Fred Van Vliet. Injury is going to put him in a position in which he can be a ball handler, offensive attention taker. And we know his athleticism. We also know that like the, the growth like propulsion of Ahmed Thompson and even his brother Asar. But we've just seen how quickly they've been able to adjust within season. So I already know he's probably been working on, you know, in the off season on his shot. I didn't see much of that during the preseason at on display. But guess what hasn't dropped his defense, his athleticism. And that's just going to continue to be a, you know, a boon for him. Now when it comes to Denny aia, that's. This is exactly what I was thinking because I was like, when I think about breakout star, I'm thinking about who's putting up 30 points a night. And we're like, whoa, who. Who's that? Like, wait, what's going on? And last year, Denny AIA put up 30 to 40 points eight times last year casually. And these were the nights that Anthony Simons wasn't playing or, you know, deandre Ayton wasn't playing. And guess what? Both of them are gone now. The focal point is on Danny Abia. He can do as he pleases. And we've got Scoot Anderson starting the season out. You know, obviously there's no. Drew Holiday is going to be in the mix, obviously a little bit older, but he's going to be setting up Denny. Denny's going to get to do what he wants in Portland. And I just feel like that's going to be opportunities for buckets on buckets on buckets. And there's one more that's actually on the Rockets as well. And I don't know if I could count it as a breakout, but I think like Alper and Shangun could have a breakout season as well. Especially when you've got the space to operate because a Kevin Durant might be on the floor with you, you know, taking up some attention. I absolutely think that Alperin Shangun is also in that category too.
- [21:08]
Dave Dufour
Yeah, I can see that. Especially, I mean, he was so good in Euro Basket. His body looks pretty good, right? Like, and a lot of young guys do see, you know, the breakout potential sometimes is that get your Body straight, right? Like we're, we're hoping for that with Zion and Luka. To, to me, I think a guy that, that is probably overlooked if you're thinking this way, because we watched him win a championship. Chet Holmgren has a real chance to feel like. Like he's. We're going to feel differently about him. I think at the end of the season. You know, he missed half of last year, but that playoff run that he had defensively was amazing. I think he'll be in the mix for defensive player of the year this year. Probably have a shot at being an all Star. And Law, you're, you'll. I mean, I know you love Chet, but big thing I want to see out of Chet this year is way more confidence shooting that three. I want to see him get it up fast, man. Like that's the thing that holds him back that long. Load up time. Similar to what you were saying with Shea, right? That one little tweak if he just gets it up fast and if he could hit it 35, 36%, right, like League average, all of a sudden it changes the game for them and, and their offense gets so much easier to create. Everything gets easier for, for J Dub and for Shea. But I think Chet is a guy who, who's going to break out this season.
- [22:25]
Law Murray
You know, the interesting thing about the OKC Thunder, they won a championship, they went through their playoff run and J dub was a 30% three point shooter in the playoffs. Shay was a 28 three point shooter in the playoffs. Shell was just under 30% in the playoffs. They are better shooters and players than that. Jdub had the best excuse. Dude's playing with a torn ligament in his wrist, right? And I wonder if he'll be ready for ring night. But you know, I outlined Shay. It's like she was getting three pointers blocked by Miles Turner, like. But that guy also, only he played more playoff games or he played the full playoffs, but he missed 50 games. I saw that dude dropped to the floor in November. I was, I was there for that in Oklahoma City. And that was a scary moment. You know, that was a weird injury, a very rare injury. He was able to make it back and when he came back, it was a different team. He was playing with Isaiah Hartenstein. That is something where, you know, OKC won a lot of games without having the roster that they thought that they were going to have for the majority of the season. So the opportunity, I mean, Shet is the most physically talented guy on that team. Again, I talked about Shay and how he doesn't have special, you know, obvious physical traits, you know, as far as the size and the speed and the. And the vertical or any of that. Or any of that. That D. Shay is shed is 7ft tall with handles, and I want to see him weaponize that. It's the same thing with Wimy. I want to see these guys weaponize their skill to put more pressure on the defenses that they are facing. And I know Wimy shoots it from 30.
- [24:05]
Dave Dufour
Why Chad has to shoot it, right? This is why he's got to shoot it, because he needs the. The defenders to come out and close out so that he can attack and put the. Put the ball on the. On the ground. We're seeing some of that. I mean, we saw some of that from him last year. We saw some of it in the playoffs with Wemby. What we've seen from him in the preseason doing that, we. We see the extra meat that he's got on his body. You know, he's dropping his shoulder now. I don't know if Chet will ever have that, but he's a really. He's got good touch and especially driving to the basket. I. I think that if. If the shot starts to drop and those defenders have to come out, it's. I mean, he's an all star, right? Like, that's. That's the difference. Like, he will score at a much higher rate. Anybody else you guys got before we go to break? Nobody outside of the box that was.
- [24:56]
Law Murray
That was already scraping it. I just feel like a lot of these guys have to have the. Either have the ball or have a particular role. And the thing with the west is it's a lot of guys that we know. You know, like, so many of these go, what's your. One more, Xena.
- [25:12]
Dave Dufour
Go ahead, Zena.
- [25:14]
Zena Keda
Austin Reeves. And the main reason why is because one reading about, you know, LeBron being out, and we don't know how long he's going to be out. Luca can't play 48 minutes, right? And the time that he's going to be off the floor, it's going to be Austin Reeves that's going to have to step up and be the offensive production for this team. And he's capable of it. We've seen him do it, and we. I think he has the confidence to do it. He has the swagger to do it. He obviously has the skill to do it, but he could potentially. Who knows what happens with LeBron, especially with them now saying, and this is what I was talking about when I Was reading about. They're taking their time with getting him back on the floor, so who knows how long that's going to take. That could now be a duo or at least, you know, a second unit leader for the Lakers. That catapults him into, I don't know, more. More production than we've ever seen out of Austin Reeves.
- [26:10]
Dave Dufour
Oh, yeah, he's going to be the number two option on that team while lebron's out for sure. And we know how much Luca draws doubles teams and how much attention he draws. I think that's a good call. I mean, Austin. Austin Reeves is about to make some money. This season is the real thing. And the Lakers probably are going to be too.
- [26:27]
Zena Keda
That's fast.
- [26:27]
Dave Dufour
Yeah, they're not gonna be too pumped next summer. All right, guys, we're gonna take a quick break and we're gonna come back and we're gonna try to figure out who's gonna win the west.
- [26:40]
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Law Murray
Nice.
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Dave Dufour
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- [29:22]
Dave Dufour
Okay guys, so we know that the Utah Jazz not gonna make the playoffs. I don't even know if they're gonna win 20 games to be honest with you. It's probably gonna be another rough season but at least there's a silver lining that they've got a little bit of young talent there. Who outside of the Jazz guys is going to miss the play in who are going to be the other team sitting at home when the playoffs start?
- [29:45]
Zena Keda
Law I started with my best five so you start with this one.
- [29:48]
Dave Dufour
There you go Lawrence.
- [29:49]
Zena Keda
I want to see if I I tie up with you.
- [29:51]
Law Murray
Well, to be clear, I do have Utah 15. These next four. These next four were were not easy for me to put together but I'm going to just say Phoenix, New Orleans, Portland and Dallas.
- [30:11]
Dave Dufour
Wow. Dallas. Now Dallas I I will say this for a team that does not have much ball handling at all, at least go. That's how I felt coming into training camp. I have changed my opinion on the Mavericks maybe the most of the handful of teams that are struggling to find creation. Cooper Flag looks like he's going to be able to handle and and and distribute day one in the NBA and I didn't, I didn't think that was going to be a thing. Number two, Dallas is huge. That is a ma. It's a massive advantage to be as big as they are. I mean they're they're four or five rotation is kind of insane and I even without saying Cooper Flag's going to Be in the four or five mix. They are really big. I think that. So there's a. There's an argument to be made. You can big your way into the play in, you know, you rebound everything. They're going to have a good defense. D' Angelo Russell, if he's good enough. I. I don't know, man. Oh, that's tough.
- [31:14]
Law Murray
It is.
- [31:15]
Zena Keda
Okay, well, we got to hear your breakdown. Why? Why I think everything. So I, I am very similar to you. Three out of four. So similar to you were to my best five. But the Dallas aspect in the not making the play in break it down.
- [31:31]
Law Murray
I just for one, I don't think Kyrie's coming back. If he does come back. I don't. You're not getting all star Kyrie. I think you're getting. How can I, how can I play and you know, load manage Kyrie? I, I just, I'm not planning on Kyrie Irving figuring significantly into the success of his team. You know, that's one. I think a guard play is not good. Like I don't. I, I just don't. I'm not confident and you know, it's about. Matter of DLO is your one true guard who is trustworthy handling the basketball. His backup is Jaden Hardy to start the season. Jaden Hardy is a shot first guy.
- [32:13]
Dave Dufour
You're.
- [32:13]
Law Murray
You're going to be asking Cooper Flag to do a lot and I think he's capable of it. This is not a Cooper Flag assessment, the Dallas Mavericks assessment. And because they have Cooper Flag, I think there's a real elephant in the room and that is they need to get off of Anthony Davis sooner rather than later. I, I just feel like the best position for Coop Flag is to play to four and then AD is taking up that space. Even if AD was at the five, it would be like, okay, you still should probably think about the asset here. Anthony Davis is, yeah, getting. He is. Is on the other side of 30 now injury prone etc. But I feel like spacing will be an issue. I feel like ball handling will be an issue and I feel like their perimeter defense is going to be an issue. I watched Dallas try and defend last year with AD playing super motivated with a bunch of the guys who they're going to have in their rotation and they got lit up by certain teams. That Memphis Grizzlies team that got absolutely road smacked by the Thunder had no problem with that same Mavericks team in the playing tournament. I just, I just feel like there's a lot of ways where this thing goes south for Dallas. And that's really what it's going to take. Like, yeah, there's going to be a good team that doesn't make the play and tournament, at least a good team on paper. But it's going to take some extenuating circumstances that sends their season sideways. I think Dallas is a lot more vulnerable than any of these other teams based on who's already hurt and who might likely be hurt based off of some of the guys on their team.
- [33:44]
Dave Dufour
Yeah, now that's a great call actually, because Anthony Davis thing is, the injuries are always something you have to think about. He's coming into the season off of an eye surgery and 15 pounds heavy in camp, which is to me is a. That's a bad sign, bad idea. Whatever justification anyone gives for it. I like that take of moving off Anthony Davis. I actually felt that way when they won the lottery. You know, you can have Cooper flag and Derek live was a pretty good start to a rebuild, you know, if that's where you're at. And it makes a lot more sense from a fit standpoint, especially because I think Derek Lively, we. We may not see it this year. I think he's got the ability to stretch the floor competently. And so now all of a sudden, now you've got a four or five combination that not only can defend and rebound, but they can do some stuff on the offensive side too. So I actually, I like that take maybe, I mean, maybe that'll happen this year. I don't. I don't know. Maybe Anthony Davis is the biggest name move this season. And all of a sudden you have a whole different thing happening in Dallas. Xena, you. You said that that was the only team that you. You had the difference. Who did you have missing?
- [34:55]
Zena Keda
I got Sacramento Kings.
- [34:57]
Dave Dufour
I'm with you. Yeah, I am with you. Xena. I do not believe in anything they are doing.
- [35:05]
Zena Keda
The stagnation you. They haven't moved anyone onto this team or off this team that is going to make a difference. Yes, I'm happy that Dennis Schroeder has found once again a new team to join, but I don't think that that's going to be enough. One, the defensive aspect, I mean, they're. They're not good defensively. They don't have closers in this, in the, in the way that we. I know we have DeMar DeRozan, we have Zach Levine, don't get me wrong. But we don't have closers in the sense that winners, I guess that can win significant games that will count towards, you know, trying to get to games that mean something towards the end of the season. Yeah, I don't see that in DeMar DeRozan. I don't see that in Zach Levine, Demonta Sabonis. Like, there's no, there's been nothing that has changed about the rotational depth. That, to me, makes me feel like, oh, the Kings are going to be the Kangs this year. I'm, I'm just not moved by them, unfortunately.
- [36:02]
Dave Dufour
I'm with you. Well, like, that team is kind of like a, it's a, to call it a mess isn't even fair. Right. It's, it's a odd amalgamation of players. You know, Sabonis sets the ceiling for them that they were never going to overcome. And then they, they somehow made themselves even more weird with the Levine and DeRozan additions over the last couple years. And now, you know, Malik Monk is essentially sidelined. I don't know. It's a weird team. I don't believe in them at all.
- [36:31]
Zena Keda
Sideline, too.
- [36:32]
Dave Dufour
I, yeah, I don't believe in them at all.
- [36:35]
Law Murray
Yeah, I think that now I do have the Kings and the Grizzlies missing the playoffs.
- [36:39]
Dave Dufour
So now the Grizzlies. That's an interesting one because I was going to ask you, is Ty Jerome good enough? If Job misses a bunch of time.
- [36:50]
Law Murray
Man, it's, well, it's going to be Ty jerome, Scottie Pippen Jr. Just, they're going to, they're going to be different offensively this year. I just feel like they went the extreme in terms of not having any pick and roll, and I think it was great to start the year. They took teams by surprise like that. Grizzlies team was number two in the west for a good part of the early start of the season, and then they just forgot how to be good teams.
- [37:18]
Zena Keda
Yeah.
- [37:19]
Law Murray
And they got off of Taylor and I just, you know, Ty Jerome is coming from the team that ran the most pick and roll and was, and Ty Jerome was a big part of that because he was so efficient playing that way. I'm interested to see what Memphis does. Like, Memphis has a lot of injuries right now, as they usually do, but they also have a lot of players who are going to be useful, and I wonder how much that surprises surprises teams. And I'm, again, I, I am pretty confident about who I feel like will miss the playoffs. Like, I, I, I think Memphis is out. Sacramento's out. The thing with Sacramento, they're a weird team and they don't make any damn sense whatsoever. But they have a bunch of dudes who are going to show up every night and score points. And I think that might mean something like Sacramento is going to be a frustrating team because they're going, you saw with Doug Christie, how many five game win streaks, five game losing streaks that they have. Like the Kings are just, they're going to look like how the Chicago Bulls look with Zach and tomorrow, right down to the playing tournament loss. The only difference is they won't be losing to the Miami Heat. That's. That's it. That's it.
- [38:32]
Zena Keda
I think with Memphis. I'm intrigued what's going to happen with Memphis because I do think that Ty Jerome is now going to have a very loose leash to go off and score in the way that we would see him in clutch moments for Cleveland and come in when Donovan or Darius Garland had to sit down and put up buckets in bunches, right? So now he has the free will to kind of do that and we'll see how Iesala uses him. But what I liked about Memphis Law, we were talking about last year when they were like number two, they were running, they were chaos on the floor, right? Like you could not figure out where Ja Morant, how far into the paint he was gonna go, how the Zach Eady, you know, him and pick and roll was gonna work. Like how everyone was moving around. The biggest thing is they lost Desmond. And so now I'm like, where's that outside shooting? Where's that threat going to come from that allows that pick and roll to evolve, that allows that movement to make sense. And that's where I don't think Ty Jerome is a replacement for. Obviously he's not supposed to be that replacement, so.
- [39:31]
Dave Dufour
Well, yeah, last year his off the dribble three point shooting was, I mean, the best of his career. Desmond Bain, like that's what Memphis is going to miss a lot from Desmond is that he would just, he could. He's a gunner. I just am not believing that Ty Jerome off one good season is going to go and be this person that can be a steady hand for, for Memphis. I just, he's going to go play with worse players, you know, and he's playing in a more competitive conference. And so, you know, what he did in Cleveland last year, you know, it's one season small sample size for me. And so I just am not, not necessarily a believer that that's going to work out. And look, I would say this. If you're Memphis and you were going to have a down year and be in the lottery, this might be the year to do it because you don't have. You don't have the, the pieces to compete on paper, period. Right. Like, maybe they have a crazy season that we don't expect, but they did just on purpose take a step back by trading Desmond Bain for those draft picks. So I, I wouldn't be shocked. Yeah. If they wind up missing the playoffs. Okay, so we talked about the bottom five. Let's talk about the top five. OKC just won the title. They won 68 games. And we all kind of feel like they might be better this year. They're definitely coming into the season. They're going to be healthier. We. We assume because they were pretty unhealthy last year, all things considered. Denver improved and, you know, they pushed OKC to seven games in the conference finals last year. I'm assuming we all agree those are the top two teams in the West.
- [41:04]
Law Murray
I agree with OKC being one. I do not Denver top five. But not. They're not. They're not. Wow. Okay, wait.
- [41:14]
Zena Keda
I got a question for you, Law. You just said that you saw Denver play it into a dome against the Clippers. I'm assuming this is the game where they kept the starters in basically till.
- [41:22]
Law Murray
The fourth quarter almost. Well, both teams definitely punted the fourth quarter, but Denver had their starters in to begin the third.
- [41:33]
Zena Keda
They got pretty quick. It was. It was a battle between Denver and the Clippers the other night in preseason.
- [41:40]
Dave Dufour
Zena was texting about this game, by the way.
- [41:42]
Zena Keda
She was like, they were.
- [41:43]
Dave Dufour
They were.
- [41:44]
Zena Keda
They weren't playing in the fourth quarter, but they kept them in significantly through the third. And I was like, oh, they're. They're actually playing for a real regular season game right now. It was incredibly competitive, and I'm looking like Denver. The fact that you are still in the throes of it with the Clippers makes me a little bit. I don't know, I question just how much they're going to separate themselves in that number one, that number two position. So I still. I'm with Law. I think that, yes, they're definitely going to be the top five just out of sheer weapons that they have available to them and the familiarity that they're going to have available to them, the depth that they now have and they've added to their roster. But I'm still looking at the fact that a team like the Houston Rockets was number two in the west last year off of sheer effort and just making everyone's.
- [42:35]
Dave Dufour
They lost Dylan Brooks. That's. I'M lower on their regular season because Fred Van Vliet's out and they lost Dylan Brooks and those two guys. You want to talk about competing 80, 80 games a season.
- [42:48]
Law Murray
Those guys were the culture changers.
- [42:51]
Zena Keda
That's true. But you get Jabari Smith Jr. Now for a full season and he's elevated, right. You get tardies and like you get the terror twins fully terrorized, right. Like ready to like fully charged to go terrorize some folks. You get Ahmed Thompson another year older, another year more. I just, I just feel like there's, there's still.
- [43:09]
Dave Dufour
Is that your two seat? Is that your two seed? Who's your two seed?
- [43:15]
Law Murray
My, my two seed is right now. I mean right now. Like I actually did grades and I'm like locking this in. The Clippers are my two seed.
- [43:25]
Dave Dufour
Wow.
- [43:26]
Zena Keda
I'm telling you, I was watching.
- [43:30]
Dave Dufour
Easily could have made the conference finals last year.
- [43:33]
Zena Keda
Mm.
- [43:38]
Law Murray
I mean aspiration Aside, they have 11 grown ass men on the, on their team. Like no one's going to be asked to do too much. They have the quote unquote injury protection that when all it z How often do you hear if healthy I like this team. If, if everything goes perfect, there's. That doesn't exist for these teams. You have to build your team to say these are our top five guys that we want to have in our starting lineup and these are the next five guys who they're going to play every night probably no matter what. The rest of your team are the protection of your team. They are the floor of your team when you are missing one of your top 10 players and someone else has to play and be quote unquote important at their job. All of a sudden how good is your team then? And the Clippers are. They have a built in guy no matter who winds up being that 11th guy who it's like they're going to be ready. And so last year we saw a Clippers team that if you saw them before Kawhi came back, they were relying on guys that you were like, you know, forget rotation player, how are they even in the league? And you know what? They were in the playoffs with a playoff rotation of at least one guy who they thought was going to figure prominently. Ben Simmons isn't in the league anymore.
- [45:10]
Dave Dufour
Right.
- [45:10]
Law Murray
Like Brook Lopez and John Collins are replacing guys who are not on fully guaranteed standard contracts to date. Chris Paul is another guy. You basically that's a third guy. And then they brought back the guys that they needed to. I don't trust them in the playoffs. But in the regular season, I think they're going to get arguably their highest seat that they've ever gotten under Toronto.
- [45:36]
Dave Dufour
That's a good take. I like it.
- [45:37]
Zena Keda
They're just stacked. They're just stacked. And also, we're looking at teams that have familiarity, right? And the Jamal Murray, Nikola Jokic comparison, obviously their team has been together and they brought back Bruce Brown. They have the pieces that have been together to find success. You're looking at this team. Evitza Zubats and James Harden, to me, are like the best guard, big duo in the West. Like, they, they, to me, their familiarity with each other, how they're able to play off of each other. Avita Zubots, like, I, I have a lot of respect for Ivita Zubots. He probably is probably one of my favorite centers, but you've got all of that and Anik Batum watching them. They were huge. You talk about Dallas being big.
- [46:22]
Dave Dufour
I mean. Oh, yeah.
- [46:23]
Zena Keda
Don Collins was like, switching with Brook Lopez out on the perimeter on guarded post screens. Like, this is a big team that you're going to have to play in front of. And I'm, I'm excited about the Clippers, but I think, yeah, I think the Clippers, the Rock, the Rockets and Denver are like a toss up for my number two.
- [46:43]
Dave Dufour
I would say so. Okay, so we've got, we. We all agree is OKC in, in some order? Okc, Clippers, Nuggets, Rockets.
- [46:54]
Law Murray
I don't have the Rockets, bro.
- [46:55]
Dave Dufour
You don't have the Rockets in the top?
- [46:57]
Law Murray
I got a team we haven't talked about at all. My number three Golden State warriors right now.
- [47:04]
Dave Dufour
What? Okay. They are geriatric. You're gonna have to really help me here. Regular season, man. They are. What number did you for the regular season?
- [47:16]
Zena Keda
Third.
- [47:16]
Law Murray
I got, I got, I got Golden State. Three. I'm looking at. Okay, here, here's what I'm looking at.
- [47:23]
Zena Keda
I'm mad at it. Let's go.
- [47:24]
Law Murray
Jimmy Butler, Draymond Green, Steph Curry, when they got together, they were significantly more powerful than the team that you saw before they acquired Jimmy. It's the matter of complimentary talent and planning for that team to be together from the beginning of the season. And now you have Al Horford, you know, and I don't care if Al starts or not. Like, Alice keeps himself in good enough shape where he doesn't play the kind of game that you're, like, worrying if he's going to fall completely off the cliff, like, he's going to shoot threes. He's going to pass, he's going to. He's going to defend, he's going to stay out the way. He's not going to do anything in the paint, which is huge for them because you have Draymond and Jimmy, two guys who can't confidently shoot. Okay. Like they're going to shoot, but Jimmy needs to be in the mid range for his jump shots and Draymond needs all kinds of space to get his three off. Like, you need a guy now or. And you need someone like. I like Quinn Post a lot. You know, I think Quentin Post is Diet Vic, which is great considering where you got him in the draft.
- [48:25]
Zena Keda
The way Quentin Post gets his three up, that's how Chuck Coleman needs to his three up.
- [48:30]
Dave Dufour
A breakout guy. By the way, if. If the warriors have this good of a season, Post could be a breakout guy.
- [48:35]
Law Murray
Yeah. It's like they have the personnel to be powerful for parts of team. And mind you, the west is not. You saw how the west was last year. Yes, the Rocks were the two seed. The Rockets looked a lot closer to the Pack than a two seed. That was. We're on the OKC Thunder. No OKC in fourth quarters.
- [48:58]
Dave Dufour
Exactly.
- [48:59]
Law Murray
Like. And that's how the west is for me. Outside of okc, again, I feel like some order of Clippers, Warriors, Nuggets, Lakers, Rockets. There are Timberwolves. They're going to be jumped up like, yeah, it's five, six seeds, but I wouldn't be surprised if it's separated by like five games. Two through two through seven. Might be a five game separator.
- [49:20]
Dave Dufour
Yeah.
- [49:22]
Law Murray
And that's how we have to look at this. The numbers are whatever, but they're going to be. It's going to be. You're going to wake up every week and you're going to have to just throw your cards in the air because they might be all over the place. That's how the west standings are going to be. That's why. That's what makes the west fun, is that you can't loaf in there and act like it's the regular season. You can take a night off because you do that, you'll. You'll fall four spots in a week.
- [49:49]
Dave Dufour
I've got, I've got Minnesota in my top five. You know, they've just got guys again. Rudy Gobert, that gives you this high, this high floor defensively. Right. Julius Randle just offensively gives you a pretty high floor. I just, I feel like this is a team that they just got enough guys that they can get 50 wins. You know, this is a 50 win team. They've got enough dudes that just kind of gets them in the mix and they'll be competing to have home court. I think, you know, Anthony Edwards, we talked about him as a top five player in the West. I think this is the year that he's probably in the MVP mix, but legitimately in the MVP mix. Not too early. You know, it seems like he's gonna have the ball in his hands even more because their point guard situation to start the season isn't great. Yeah, that's, that's kind of how I see the west shaken out. Zenith, was it? Did we kind of cross the same list there?
- [50:43]
Zena Keda
I think, I think so. I had the warriors in my top six, Timberwolves were in my top five.
- [50:50]
Dave Dufour
Yeah.
- [50:50]
Zena Keda
But I ain't gonna lie. The Lakers teetering, like, I really think they're right on the cusp there. I love particularly, I mean, we don't know what's going to happen with LeBron. We know the Luke LeBron team is awesome, but I just like what they've done defensively on their perimeter. Especially like we're getting Jerry Vanderbilt healthy. Yeah, like that's great for, for the Lakers. I, I love the athleticism that they're putting out there. So I feel like the Lakers, it's going to be tough, but Timberwolves, Warriors, Lakers, toss up.
- [51:22]
Dave Dufour
I think the West, I mean, it's so competitive. It's. There's a lot of really good teams. All right, here's the question, guys. Well, I'm going to give it to you first. Who's coming out of the West?
- [51:36]
Law Murray
I got okc. I just feel like they were really good last year. They got through hell in the playoffs in both conferences. The Nuggets in a seven game series, the Pacers in a seven game series. They're young, they care about each other. Cara is so much a factor in basketball that we do not talk about. We'll talk about chemistry, we'll talk about adversity, we'll talk about dissension. The drama is what sells. But you, you see, when teams get along, you don't want to talk about that as much. It's not as interesting. You get Draymond Green on the pod saying it's corny that guys go and, you know, surround each other post game after they just beat some teams ass. Like OKC is going to be that team where the disease of more does not phase them as much as some other teams. I'm not saying they'll win the Championship. I don't think I'm ready to say that yet, but I think they get out the West. I. I just think that they were the rare team that won, being really good, and have the opportunity to have so much improvement from some of their best players. Look at the warriors from 10 years ago. Again, I don't think they win 70 games. West is too good for that, and I don't think it's smart to be going all out like that. But they're deep and they have a lot of talent, and they still have areas of improvement. I think that's just going to be. That's going to mean something in the spring, probably more than the regular season.
- [53:07]
Dave Dufour
I. I do think they can win 70 games. They just have so many guys and they compete every single night. So I actually think they can win 70 games. Zena, who. Who's coming out of the West?
- [53:22]
Zena Keda
I. I'm struggling with this one because Law, you know, you lay out really great arguments, and every time I talk to you, I'm like, well, maybe what I was thinking, actually. And I really do like the OKC's pick, particularly because as you were talking about, just their guys getting better. Like, something that we underestimate a lot with OKC is their player development. Right? Like, we know that that's what they do as an organization really well from their G League team. And I just. Even their stars are going to get developed and gain more capability. But you got a year of tape, and there's a difference between being number one in the west and getting through the playoffs and coming out the West. And I think Denver does have the tools. They've got the know how, they've got the veteranship and they've got Jokic. And I just feel as if he's not going to allow them to not make it out of the West. Again.
- [54:24]
Dave Dufour
Not a hot take, Xena. That's. That's me. I'm with Denver. I think that Jokic, with these guys especially, they just improved their team so much, and they already pushed OKC to 7. It's almost impossible now to repeat as champions in the NBA. And Xena, you keep bringing up tape. And this is true. I mean, I think when you watch the way OKC won last year, like, that's not the easiest way to score points, right? Like, a lot of turnovers, a lot of transition. They were being figured out in the playoffs. And this isn't to say they're not changing things up. We're going to do things differently. But the thing that made them Such an overwhelming force teams did catch up to and so I'm curious to see how it looks by the playoffs. And again, if these guys develop not even that much further because they're already really good players. This is okc. I could see them getting back and repeating like they are going to be a problem for years and this is a team that I think is going to be competitive for a really long time. They're managed so smart and these players are so young. But this just feels like it's going to be a Jokic year.
- [55:30]
Zena Keda
Denver lost in the Western Conference files two years in a row in seven games. Like that is disrespectful for Minnesota to do it to you and then OKC to do it to you right after you won the finals. I, I feel like there's just too. The chip is just getting bigger and bigger on their shoulder.
- [55:49]
Law Murray
The thing with Denver, we remember that these series went seven. We know that they are. They can. They can beat you in games if you sleep but when they lose, they lose bad in the playoffs. OKC destroyed them in games the year before. Minnesota down on the road to a team that no one gave them a chance to and they had the to that point biggest comeback in a game seven ever. You know Denver has this ceiling because of Jokic, but I'm really just concerned about what the heck does this team do defensively. You have to defend, you have to give yourself a chance.
- [56:30]
Zena Keda
But to be fair though, Law they were particularly bad defensively on the perimeter. Like their paint defense was still in the top third of the league. Like they weren't terribly in the paint. It was just a factor of that. They didn't have external powers that be.
- [56:47]
Dave Dufour
Outside point of attack is rough for them. Jamal Murray, you can pick on them. And then last year you had MPJ and I don't know. I think Cam Johnson is going to be a pretty big upgrade there. But I, I will say this.
- [56:58]
Zena Keda
You bring Tim Hardaway and you bring in Bruce Brown. I feel like there's. I, I do feel like they shored up a little bit. It's not crazy but they did help the main part of their defense that got them at 22 in the league and it was their perimeter, mainly defense.
- [57:11]
Dave Dufour
It's a. It's a make or break season for Jamal Murray in my opinion. But that's a. That's a different podcast than than this one. Any before we get out of here, any hot takes on the West. Are we all too low on the Lakers? Have I been too low on The Warriors. I mean, I. I mean, I think.
- [57:29]
Law Murray
The Lakers are going to be fifth in the West. I don't know. That's a hot take or what. I just feel like they are going to be closer to where they probably should have been last year. The Lakers were third. But to my point about the west being bunched together, the Lakers point differential was not consummate of a third seed. There was more of a team that was happy to be out of the play in tournament. And so I think they're. They're headed for an interesting season. No matter what happens with LeBron, Luca is going to be on a high. LeBron might be on the low. Xena, you brought up a great point about Austin. Like. Like that that team is probably going to just sit there in the middle of things.
- [58:13]
Zena Keda
That's real. That's right.
- [58:15]
Dave Dufour
Well, I'll tell you, the one team.
- [58:16]
Zena Keda
I think we're a little too low on.
- [58:19]
Dave Dufour
Spurs, maybe. We'll see what happens with Wemby. All right, that's going to do it for our Western conference preview. Thank you to Law Murray for hopping in with us. Guys, go and check him out at the Athletic. For Law Murray and Zena Keda, I'm Dave Dufour, and this has been the NBA Daily. Thanks for hanging out.
- [59:01]
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- [59:02]
Law Murray
Yes.
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We're earning unlimited 3% cash back on dining and entertainment with a Capital One Saver Card. So let's just get one of everything.
- [59:09]
Capital One Terms Announcer
Everything.
- [59:10]
Dave Dufour
Fire everything.
- [59:11]
Law Murray
The Capital One Saver card is at table 27, and they're earning unlimited 3% cash back. Yes, chef.
- [59:18]
T-Mobile Announcer 2
This is so nice.
- [59:19]
Dave Dufour
Had a feeling you'd want 3% cash back on dessert.
- [59:22]
T-Mobile Announcer 2
Ooh, tiramisu.
- [59:23]
Dave Dufour
Earn unlimited 3% cash back on dining and entertainment with the Capital One Saver Card. Capital one, what's in your wallet?
- [59:29]
Capital One Terms Announcer
Terms apply. See capitalone.com for details.
- [59:32]
T-Mobile Announcer 1
Morning, Zoe. Got donuts.
- [59:34]
T-Mobile Announcer 2
Jeff Bridges, why are you still living above our garage?
- [59:37]
T-Mobile Announcer 1
Well, I dig the mattress, and I want to be in a T mobile commerc like you. Teach me, Saldana.
- [59:43]
T-Mobile Announcer 2
Oh, no, I'm not really prepared. I couldn't possibly at T Mob. We'll get the new iPhone 17 Pro on them. It's designed to be the most powerful iPhone yet and has the ultimate pro camera system.
- [59:55]
Dave Dufour
Wow.
- [59:56]
T-Mobile Announcer 1
Impressive. Let me try. T mobile is the best place to get iPhone 17 Pro because they've got the best network.
- [60:03]
Dave Dufour
Nice.
- [60:03]
T-Mobile Announcer 2
Jeffrey, you heard them.
- [60:04]
T-Mobile Announcer 1
T mobile is the best place to.
- [60:06]
Dave Dufour
Get the new iPhone. IPhone 17 Pro on us with eligible.
- [60:09]
T-Mobile Announcer 1
Traded in any condition. So what are we having for launch?
- [60:13]
T-Mobile Announcer 2
Dude my work here is done.
- [60:15]
Capital One Terms Announcer
The 24 month bill credit is on experience beyond for well qualified customers plus tax and $35 device connection charge credit sended balance due if you pay off earlier. Cancel Finance Agreement. IPhone 17 Pro 256 gigs $1099.99 A new line minimum $100 plus a month Plan with auto pay plus taxes and fees required. Best mobile network in the US based on analysis by Oaklove Speed Test Intelligence data 1H 2025 Visit T mobile.com hi.
- [60:32]
Robert Mays
This is Robert Mays from the Athletic the new Peloton Cross Training Tread plus is built to take your training. I've had a peloton for the past five years. It has completely changed the way that I work out. It's completely retrained my relationship to exercise. It's in our basement. I use it virtually every single day. I'm a huge fan of the platform. I'm a huge fan of the library of classes that are offered. I cannot recommend the program enough if you're looking for a way to change your workout routine and really lock in to improving yourself physically. Powered by Peloton iq, it plans your workouts, tracks your progress, corrects your form and gives you real time coaching so you can push harder and see real results. And with a swivel screen, you can go from running to strength training with one smooth spin. Keeping your routine balanced and your body ready for anything. Let yourself run, lift, flex, push and go. Explore the new peloton cross training tread +@1peloton.com.