Should the Thunder be worried?

Summary

The Athletic NBA Daily – Episode: Should the Thunder be Worried?
Release Date: May 6, 2025

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Introduction

In this episode of The Athletic NBA Daily, hosts Dave DuFour and Zena Keita delve into a whirlwind of playoff action, focusing primarily on the unexpected outcomes in the second round. The episode zeroes in on the New York Knicks' stunning upset over the Boston Celtics and the Oklahoma City Thunder's narrow loss to the Denver Nuggets. With insightful analysis from NBA reporters Andrew Schleck and Alex Caruso, listeners are treated to a comprehensive breakdown of key performances, strategic decisions, and what these games mean for the teams' playoff trajectories.

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Knicks vs. Celtics: A Nail-Biting Overtime Thriller

Game Overview: The Knicks delivered a thrilling performance against the Celtics, overturning a 20-point deficit to win in overtime with a final score of 108-105. Key players like Jalen Brunson and Mikel Bridges were pivotal in securing the victory.

Key Discussions:

• Three-Point Shooting Woes:

  • Zena Keita highlights the Celtics' inefficiency from beyond the arc, noting, "They finished the game 15 out of 60 from three" (03:00). This poor shooting was a critical factor in their downfall.
  • Alex Caruso adds, "It's hard to win basketball games if you're going to miss 45 threes" (02:59), emphasizing the importance of perimeter shooting in modern NBA play.

• Defensive Intensity:

  • The Knicks' defensive prowess was evident as they limited the Celtics' offensive options by targeting Jalen Brunson and Karl-Anthony Towns, putting both in foul trouble early on.
  • Andrew Schleck commends the Knicks' defense, stating, "They just have to get to the ball faster. They have to be more decisive" (22:35).

• Player Performances:

  • Jalen Brunson and Mikel Bridges both dropped 29 points each, with Brunson particularly shining in clutch moments.
  • Alex Caruso praises Josh Hart's contribution, noting, "With Josh Hart wasn't out on the floor doing what he did for the Knicks, they weren't pulling out this win" (07:40).

• Strategic Missteps:

  • Zena criticizes the Celtics' second-half strategy of excessive three-point attempts without consideration for play resets: "It felt like rushed. It was one pass. Get a shot up" (04:48).
  • The decision to remove Karl-Anthony Towns in the second quarter is questioned by Zena: "I think that that's a mistake" (07:40).

Notable Quotes:

• Zena Keita: "When Carl Anthony Towns is the center, that's the time to go to the basket" (04:00).
• Andrew Schleck: "There is game two, and in fact, there's game three and game four as well. And so, they understand the moment and they've got to learn through these things" (27:45).

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Thunder vs. Nuggets: A Heartbreaker on Home Court

Game Overview: The Oklahoma City Thunder faced a tough loss against the Denver Nuggets, with the final play being a game-winning three-pointer by Aaron Gordon. The Thunder's lack of playoff experience was evident as they struggled to execute crucial plays down the stretch.

Key Discussions:

• Critical Mistakes:

  • Andrew Schleck points out multiple errors by the Thunder, including excessive fouling and missed free throws: "They fouled too much down the stretch" (17:53).
  • Alex Caruso highlights the Thunder's inability to capitalize on turnovers, despite their generally solid performance: "They weren't able to capitalize on those mistakes as much as you thought they'd be able to" (22:35).

• Jokic’s Dominance:

  • Denver's Nikola Jokic showcased his MVP caliber by accumulating 42 points, 22 rebounds, and six assists, making it challenging for the Thunder to contain him: "He just needs more efficient, you know, offensive players out of both of those guys" (20:31).

• Player Performances:

  • Aaron Gordon's game-winning shot was a focal point, with Alex Caruso remarking on its unexpected nature: "Aaron Gordon could barely explain this to Stephanie Reddy" (12:55).
  • The Thunder's younger players, such as Jalen Williams and Chet Holmgren, struggled with shooting efficiency: "JW goes to 2 of 9 from 3" (20:59).

• Coaching Decisions:

  • Mark Daigneault's coaching strategies came under scrutiny, especially his decision to foul in the backcourt and the handling of challenge plays: "Mark is... Has now been in a situation where he is, you know, effectively lost a game for the Thunder" (26:34).

Notable Quotes:

• Andrew Schleck: "This is what playoff basketball is all about. This is how you want it back and forth" (30:06).
• Zena Keita: "You gotta beat Jokic four times out of six" (28:56).

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Strategic Insights and Player Highlights

• Defensive Strategies:

  • Both teams showcased different defensive approaches. The Knicks emphasized physicality and hustle, while the Thunder struggled with defensive rebounding and second-chance opportunities.

• Offensive Execution:

  • The Knicks' ability to execute under pressure contrasted sharply with the Thunder's inefficiencies, particularly in shooting and free-throw attempts.

• Emerging Stars:

  • Alex Caruso emerged as a standout off-the-bench performer for the Nuggets, contributing significantly to their narrow victory: "This was supposed to be the Caruso game... Both kind of out of character" (13:18).

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Conclusions and Future Implications

The episode concludes with a discussion on the implications of these games for the remaining playoff series:

• Knicks' Momentum:

  • The Knicks' victory over the Celtics positions them as formidable contenders, demonstrating resilience and strategic execution.

• Thunder's Learning Curve:

  • Despite the loss, the Thunder have the potential to learn and adapt, though their lack of playoff experience remains a concern.

• Nuggets' Confidence:

  • The Nuggets, buoyed by their win and strong performances from key players, seem poised to advance further, but facing the Thunder could still present challenges.

Final Thoughts: Dave DuFour wraps up the episode by acknowledging the excitement of the playoffs and hinting at the upcoming Avalanche series, leaving listeners eagerly anticipating the next day's action.

Closing Quote:

• Dave DuFour: "This has been the NBA Daily. Thanks for waking up with us." (30:46)

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Key Takeaways

• Celtics' Shooting Struggles: Ineffective three-point shooting was a critical downfall in their loss to the Knicks.
• Thunder's Execution Issues: Excessive fouling and missed free throws contributed to the Thunder's narrow defeat against the Nuggets.
• Emerging Performances: Players like Jalen Brunson, Mikel Bridges, and Alex Caruso were instrumental in their teams' successes.
• Coaching Decisions Matter: Strategic choices, particularly in high-pressure moments, significantly impacted game outcomes.
• Playoff Experience is Crucial: The Nuggets' experience shone through, highlighting the Thunder's need to adapt and learn quickly.

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This episode of The Athletic NBA Daily offers an in-depth analysis of pivotal playoff games, providing fans with a nuanced understanding of team performances, strategic decisions, and individual player impacts. Whether you're a casual listener or a dedicated basketball enthusiast, the episode delivers valuable insights into the unfolding drama of the 2025 NBA playoffs.

Transcript

[Dave DuFour]

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[Andrew Schleck]

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[Zena Keda]

Good morning and welcome to the NBA Daily. Coming up, a crazy night of playoff basketball. The Knicks upset the Celtics. We got Andrew Schlecht here to talk about the thunder blowing of Game one at home to the Nuggets. Good morning everybody. Good morning Xena.

[Alex Caruso]

Good morning Dave. Man.

[Zena Keda]

How about. Yeah. Second round is coming out. Throwing haymakers. So far all of the home teams have dropped game one. We're going to have obviously the warriors going to play the Timberwolves tonight for game one of that series. We'll see if that holds. But you know, the Celtics had a 20 point lead last night, Xena. And I thought that was it. I thought the game was over. And then all of a sudden One of those EP Celtics droughts just kicked in. They finished the game 15 out of 60 from three. And that's the first number I'm going to point to. Aside from the final score which was 108105. The Knicks get a big win in overtime. But it's hard to win basketball games if you're going to miss 45 threes. Xena.

[Alex Caruso]

Yeah. Especially in the fourth quarter. Going four of 22. And it's important to note the Celtics took 97 shots in this game.

[Zena Keda]

Yeah.

[Alex Caruso]

And 60 of them were from three. Like this is. This is what they do. But they didn't do it well. And you've been sitting at home waiting for the Knicks to finish that grueling series with the Detroit Pistons. And yet somehow the Knicks enter Boston and find a way to play those Tom Thibodeau minutes and win. Playing hard ball basketball, just going after every loose ball, jumping higher, running faster. Every single aspect of their game was just who wanted it more. Shout out to Mikel Bridges. Shout out to OGN. And Obi dropped 29 points alongside what we always know Jalen Brunson to do. Who also had 29 points just cooking in the clutch. It was on. Bravo.

[Dave DuFour]

Bravo.

[Andrew Schleck]

Next.

[Zena Keda]

Bravo. You know, you gotta. I'll point to this first half of this game. I thought Boston came out. You could see their game plan. We're going to attack Jalen Brunson going to attack Carl Anthony Towns. Put both of those guys in foul trouble. Smart. Right? It limits their offensive options at the other end. But then Boston just did this thing in the second half where they just started chucking threes and they were already shooting a lot of threes. But this felt like rushed. It was one pass. Get a shot up. What? You know, even like off an offensive rebound. You know, usually you'd get a reset. It was sometimes guys just dribbling straight to the three point line and firing up a shot instead of attacking the basket. Look, when Carl Anthony Towns is the center, that's the time to go to the basket. Like get to the rim, you know. Mitchell Robinson did a much better Job protecting the rim. But he wasn't. He didn't play all that much. Zena. I just can't understand why the Celtics, you know, they won't just put their head down and drive, but we should swing this. And give some credit to the Knicks because they did mount the comeback. And fourth quarter, Jalen Brunson steps up big, and he nearly won the game, you know, with a floater at the end of regulation. But he does force overtime, but just by, you know, doing what he does, hit tough shots, got to the free throw line, and, you know, with the Celtics, they just. They just didn't stop shooting threes. It just, you know, I hate to sound like a broken record here, but it does seem like they let this one slip away kind of by being stubborn. It's a little bit like tin cup. You know, he makes the bad shot and they're just like, well, keep. Keep giving the ball. So, you know, between that. So Jalen Brunson, though, down the stretch was awesome in this game, but Mikhail Bridges in overtime, what he did defensively, he was just involved in every single. He steals, the inbound pass. You know, Fred Katz wrote about him adding physicality back in for his defense. I think we saw that a lot.

[Alex Caruso]

Absolutely. The physicality is exactly what made Boston uncomfortable all throughout this game, but particularly the way that they played in the half court. It's as if they took a tip from the Pistons into this series because you saw them shrink the floor. Everything that New York did in terms of making Boston feel as if they had to play closer to the basket. Without Kristaps Porzingis, those threes weren't happening, and they couldn't find any success inside the paint. And I want to say Josh Hart, 53 minutes, right. We can give a lot of credit to Jalen Brunson. We can give a lot of credit to, you know, Mikel Bridges, who hit major shots, including one in overtime. Anunoby down the stretch, unbelievable as well. But Josh Hart, with the rebounding effort, with the hustle, 50, 50 balls and the defense that he played, it was the. The game saver, in my opinion. If Josh Hart wasn't out on the floor doing what he did for the Knicks, they weren't pulling out this win.

[Zena Keda]

Yeah, there's times where he's. He's their best center sometimes. Yeah, he had 11 rebounds in the game. You know, again, Carl Anthony Towns, I mean, he picks up his fifth foul pretty late in the game, but, you know, having that early foul trouble. Tom Thibodeau kind of Fouls him out in the second quarter and just takes him off the court. I think that that's a mistake. Right? You know, the Knicks probably don't have the deficit that they, that they face going into the second half if Carl Anthony Towns is out there. But you know, again, the Boston game plan seemed pretty clear. Go after Brunson, go after Cat. And then they just abandoned it. And the, and frankly, the Knicks took advantage, just continued to pressure on defense. Boston started throwing the ball away a little bit. Knicks got out, ran, scored some points, but you know, a 20 point deficit to be able to come back from that force overtime. They just had all the momentum and, and even the TD Garden crowd. Xena. It was there seemed like there were a lot of Knicks fans, but there were a lot of Knicks fans there.

[Alex Caruso]

Yeah, there they traveled well. They absolutely traveled well. And that was the part that you felt as if you could see it and read it on their faces. Like the Boston Celtics, like they felt and looked defeated and the crowd felt defeated even down to the last play when Mikel Bridges gets the steal away from Jalen Brown. The crowd that was right, like the floor seat holders that were right there, they didn't even react. They were kind of like, well, guess this is it. Like there was no, there was no. You got it, Jalen. Like get the ball back and get something going. It was, they were already defeated in the overtime and really going into the fourth quarter, Knicks, you know, we thought this was going to be an easy walk for the Celtics. We thought the Celtics were going to come in rested. They made all, all of us pundits that talked about rest and having been able to your series early, make us look dumb because the Knicks came in and they were like, oh, really? I'm gonna keep talking about these minutes, these Tibo minutes. We're, we're ready if anything, we're conditioned. We're ready for this. And they went seven deep and killed it.

[Zena Keda]

I, we, we should note 17 of 31 from the free throw line for the Knicks, 3 of 10 for Mitchell Robinson. It was a big point of contention because Joe Missoula goes to the hack of Mitch to get Mitchell Robinson on the free throw line. I, I think that I don't like this theme.

[Alex Caruso]

A lot of teams doing this hack of stuff. I get it, I get it. It's just interesting that it's becoming such a basketball play.

[Zena Keda]

Xena. You know, it feels unethical, right? It's sort of like fouling up three, which, you know, we also saw that bite the Oklahoma City Thunder in the rear end in their game. Right. So maybe the ethical hoops just kind of winning out a little bit. Let's talk, let's move on to, to OKC Denver because that was a crazy game and I want to talk about it a little bit from the Denver side before we get to Andrew. After the break, the Nuggets pick up a big win. That felt like they weren't going to get it. We were actually talking a little bit in our group chat about how this was like a noble loss almost for the Nuggets, you know, in, in the, the closing, you know, quarter, we're like, hey, you know what, you probably feel pretty good about that. You know, you, you've maybe picked up a few things and then they come and they steal the victory from the jaws of the feet and, and down the stretch, the one guy who's making plays, it feels like the ball kept finding him. Russell Westbrook makes the game winning assist to Aaron Gordon, you know, and it just felt like a little bit of poetic, I don't know what we want to say storytelling there that Russ makes the pass instead of taking it to the basket. Remember, he's, you know, we've seen him blow layups in clutch positions before. Aaron Gordon gets a second game winner in the playoffs. Just feels like the Nuggets, you know, again, they. Jokic does so much to keep him in these games and then every now and then one of these role player guys steps up.

[Alex Caruso]

Yeah, it was actually really funny to see that play played out very similarly to the way that yo. The Denver Nuggets got back in this game. You saw Jokic say we cannot do well in this half court defense with what OKC was throwing out at them. So every time Jokic was getting the rebound early in the third and fourth quarter, he was just throwing it out. That water polo aspect of him keeping the ball high and getting the ball to the outlets was working. And Russell Westbrook being as fast and speedy as he is, he was usually that outlet pass and it was the exact same type of play that you saw at the end of the game. Russell Westbrook breaking out immediately, finding his open man and Aaron Gordon knocking down the three, especially those two. Those two were the ones that missed the two shots that could have put them up in the fourth quarter. So the fact that they paired up for this momentous win was really dope and perfectly serendipitous. It just. Everything was perfect. My favorite part was Aaron Gordon could barely explain this to Stephanie Reddy. Yeah, after his postgame interview, he was as speechless as I was watching it. Like he tried to gather his thoughts when she said, why did you go for a three knowing you were only down one? And it took him a second to gather eventually that the right guy will find the right shot. Essentially. That's I'm paraphrasing, but that's what he got to. But he looked like a deer in headlights. He couldn't believe what he did.

[Zena Keda]

I wish he would have just said, well, you know, I had a little bit of a brain fart there. I mean, the truth is, like, you know, I mean, he catches the ball in transition with 3 seconds left and he's wide open and it's in stride. I mean, it's a great shot. If this is like, great job. Any other point of the game and he does nail it. But, man, my man, my coach, brain flips on there. It's like it's a layup, you know.

[Alex Caruso]

But, but, but think about how well OKC defended the paint, right, all night. And it's so crazy. We're going to talk about this with Andrew, I'm sure, but this was supposed to be the Caruso game. We were supposed to be talking about Caruso, and here we are now talking about Aaron Gordon hitting another buzzer beating shot. The first one was a dunk, never before happened. And then the second one, now a three in transition. Both kind of out of character. I mean, the second one at least out of character for Aaron Gordon, so pretty dope.

[Zena Keda]

All right, Zeno, it's one game. It's only one game. The Nuggets had to come back and win it. If you're okc, are you worried?

[Alex Caruso]

No, I'm not. Because there's no way. There's no way that, you know, Jalen Williams plays as bad, J Dub plays as bad as he did. You're gonna find a way to get out of the foul trouble that Chet Holmgren and Isaiah Hartenstein found themselves in early. You saw that it impacted their ability to protect the rim. And so towards the second half of the game, all Jokic had to do, he became the Denver Jokic's. He just did it himself, finding a way into the paint. And you even saw Denver giving the ball in the free throw line. And everyone would kind of just stand there with their hands at their chest like, all right, I'm ready if you kick it out, but let's let you do you. And so those guys getting in foul trouble early. You're going to see Dagnal find some creative way to ensure that those guys aren't in foul trouble. J Dub's going to play. Come back and play. Be the Batman or be the Robins of the Batman of Shay. I'm not. I'm not concerned. If anything, it's fuel. We'll see what happens.

[Zena Keda]

I don't know. I don't know. We're going to talk to Andrew Schlect about it after the break and see if he's worried. I don't know. I bet he's not either.

[Dave DuFour]

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[Andrew Schleck]

As.

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[Zena Keda]

The Thunder drop game one and lose home court advantage. And you were in the building to talk about it. Andrew Schleck here hanging out with us.

[Alex Caruso]

What the hell happened in okc?

[Zena Keda]

We were shocked. What, what happened?

[Andrew Schleck]

That was a very jarring sequence. It really didn't feel like Denver was going to win that game until literally the shot went down from the wing right over here.

[Zena Keda]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schleck]

From Aaron Gordon. It felt like the Thunder were just gonna like, like they're hanging on by a thread right at the end of this game. I think they were out executed, you know, by a team that's way more experienced than them. And like the thing about like this matchup specifically is that the Thunder have almost every advantage except experience. Like, that's the only thing. And when it came down the stretch of this game, they were completely out executed. From the 6 minute and 28 second mark of the fourth quarter until the end of the game, they're outscored 26 to 11. And a lot of that was just execution. It's foul. They fouled too much down the stretch. They put the Nuggets on the line, like too easily. Like, they didn't earn a lot of the fouls. The Nuggets didn't. The Thunder just gave it to them. And then that last, the last sequence, the strategy, I mean, and everybody felt it. Like you could feel the nervousness in the arena, like when they fouled with the 10 seconds left, or I guess it was maybe 14 seconds left. It was like, are we sure? Like, I think everybody in the arena felt like, are you sure this is what you should be doing? Because really, let him bring the ball up the court, take five or six seconds off the clock and then foul if you want to execute that strategy. And so I just think that there's just these little tiny things that the Thunder did. And it was for the Thunder, it was death by a thousand cuts tonight. It wasn't. There wasn't one mistake. Like, I think there was the obvious one mistake. But missing free throws, missing a ton of wide open threes. I mean, they started the game missing five wide open corner threes. You know, it's like those things that just come back to bite you and allow the Nuggets to hang around.

[Zena Keda]

Offensive rebounds. I mean, Jokic and Aaron Gordon had 12 combined offensive rebounds. This is a team. I mean, you can't give Jokic a second chance. And honestly, that really is what cost him the game? I mean, you mentioned the free throws down the stretch. Jokic just being able to put his head down and bully his way into the lane where someone basically had to foul him to keep him from scoring. I mean, you know, he's the best in the world. And this is why this sort of game is why he elevates all these other guys, puts up just an absurd stat line. 42 points, 22 rebounds, six assists. Game two. Like, how do they answer for Jokic?

[Andrew Schleck]

Yeah, it's a great, great question. I think one of the things that the Thunder tried to do tonight was to, to make him a score and not necessarily a guy that's, that's going to be spraying the ball out. And they did a pretty good job of that, I would say. One that got to keep him off the free throw line like that. That was, that was a problem. You know, they had, they had their hands reached. I think he shot two twice. He had free throws on three point shots. You can't do that. Yeah, you can't.

[Zena Keda]

You gotta know he's coming with the rip through.

[Andrew Schleck]

It's tiny things that you're. That you cannot do when it comes to Jokic. I thought they did an okay job on him. I thought they did okay. But overall, the execution just from beginning to end was sloppy. They were not sharp. There were at times where they were up like eight and I was like, man, it feels like the Thunder should be up 28 right now.

[Zena Keda]

Exactly. Yeah.

[Alex Caruso]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schleck]

And it's just little things for them.

[Alex Caruso]

Well, what's so weird about, like, you know, you talk about being sloppy. This was a really characteristic game for OKC when it comes to their ability to not turn the ball over. They only had nine turnovers and only allowed five points off those turnovers. On the opposite end, Denver had eight, 18 turnovers and OKC was able to get 23 points out of that. So it felt as if this was a characteristic game for okc. However, they weren't able to capitalize on those mistakes as much as you thought they'd be able to do that because they, because of the foul discrepancy. Now I'm wondering who's at the tip of the snake that had them a little bit discombobulated because I'm looking at J Dub, right?

[Andrew Schleck]

Yeah.

[Alex Caruso]

Jay will like Jayla Williams not coming out and playing in the same way that he probably should have alongside his Shay Gilders Alexander. But then you had Alex Caruso step up. So it's like the, the storyline has been all Season long that OKC has depth. Even when they're making mistakes in their starters, they can go to their bench. Where to you was the problem other than execution on defense, what was the issue that OKC was not able to capitalize on the mistakes that Denver made?

[Andrew Schleck]

It was really just the rebounding. Like, honestly, like the. The defensive rebounding was a complete mess tonight. And I think that. I think that the physicality that Denver brought from the very beginning of the game, the Thunder, I felt like they matched it at times. I don't want to say like they never matched it, but when it came to, like, second and third efforts, that was Denver all night. Because the Thunder, I think their first effort was amazing. For the most part, they caused a lot of misses for the Nuggets, but when it came to, like, second, third efforts, that was Aaron Gordon. That was Jokic. I mean, how many, like, taps did we see after a missed shot from the Nuggets? I mean, that. That's what it is for the Thunder is like, they need to box out. Like, the Thunder are smaller, which showed tonight. And it's. It's really. It's a matchup of size versus speed for them. And they just have to get to the ball faster. Like, they just have to get to the ball faster. They have to be more decisive. And they just weren't either one of those things tonight.

[Zena Keda]

Yeah, we thought this was going to be what we called the Alex Caruso game. He was insane off the bench. And now in hindsight, if he hadn't been so incredible off the bench, then the Nuggets probably have a much easier night. You know, he comes off the bench, gives you 20 points. And coming into this series, Andrew, you know, we talked about who was going to be the second best player for both of these teams. I didn't expect it to be Alex Russo in night one. I thought, you know, Jalen Williams or Chad Holmgren, I mean, what do you need to see out of them, like, going forward if Oklahoma City is going to. Going to beat the Nuggets?

[Andrew Schleck]

Yeah, I mean, like, Chet and JW have to be better. Like, just flat out, like, they have got to be better. They've got to make shots. Like, JW goes to 2 of 9 from 3. Check goes over 3 from 3. Like, you're probably not going to win when Those guys go 2 of 12 from. From three and then they. They miss a total of four free throws as well. Like, it's just a lot of, like, small details for them. I thought, I thought defensively they were okay. You know, they had six blocks between the two of them, but when it comes to those guys, like, they have to score. Like, they, they went. She went 5 of 11, Jada went 5 of 20. Like, sometimes it's just as simple as, like, you can't go 5 of 20. You can't, you can't have 16 points on 20 shots and still win a game. Like, they, they just need more efficient, you know, offensive players out of both of those guys. You know, that's, that's what it comes down to. And then you have Isaiah Joe coming off the bench. He's their first sub. Like, the guy could not make a shot. He's 004. He only played 13 minutes. But they're, he. They're generating wide open shots for these guys. Like, there's nothing really wrong with the offense. It's just that they're just not making shots. And like, sometimes, like, basketball is just that way. It's like you want to find. Yeah, yeah.

[Zena Keda]

You know, it was kind of like.

[Andrew Schleck]

But open, open threes. I mean, like, if you go back and look at these shots like that, that's one I can't really be critical of. Like, but you got to make them.

[Alex Caruso]

Yeah. You talked a little bit about the experience of the players, but let's talk about what Mark Dagnaut was talking about after the game. Because of course, you look at that foul that caused Denver to get to the free throw line and have time on the back end to get a rebound and get a shot up, right? And Mark Dagna instructed his team to foul. Maybe not as quick as they did, but they ultimately end up fouling in the backcourt, which allows Denver to have that time. But then there's also the challenge call that ends up with Jokic going to the line. A challenge call that Shay Gildas Alexander told him not to. To take because he knew he had pulled on Jokic first. Was there anything out of Dagna in terms of, like, lessons learned that he's going to take into.

[Zena Keda]

The light's too bright for Mark Dagno. That's, that's.

[Andrew Schleck]

Yeah, a challenge play. I was sitting like right here for the game and could see Shay, like pulling.

[Zena Keda]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schleck]

Like, literally bear hugged him and it was like, stop twirling that finger.

[Alex Caruso]

You know, it was.

[Andrew Schleck]

Yeah. I mean, listen, like, Mark has to be better. I think that's one of like, the biggest takeaways for me is that Mark is. Has now been in a situation where he is, you know, effectively lost a game for the Thunder. And like, how can he be better. How can he learn from this? You know, it's a. It's a part of, you know, like, the ethos of the Thunder to kind of learn from your mistakes and, like, you have to kind of go through it. And nobody got up at the podium was somber tonight. Like, we know this is. It's game one if you lose game one, like, there is game two, and in fact, there's game three and game four as well. And so we, like, they. I think that they understand the moment and they've got to learn through these things. I mean, for the Thunder, the only thing that was missing was actually going through it. Like, that's the only thing that was missing for them. Like, they have the roster, they have the mvp, they've got the defense, they have the regular season record, they have all of that, but they don't have playoff experience. And the Nuggets do like those guys do, and they've executed at a high level for a very long time. And so now it's like, time for the Thunder, like, okay, can you actually get that experience during this series? Like, can they get it?

[Alex Caruso]

I mean, that's getting battle tested.

[Andrew Schleck]

That's going to be the question.

[Zena Keda]

Well, one of the questions we're going to get answered about this team is how do they respond to getting punched in the mouth? I mean, this is a bad loss for them, right? So we're gonna get to see in game two, we're gonna get some answers there. And then the Nuggets, you know, they're coming off this series. They're. They're really playing with house money. Remember? Like, they cleaned house.

[Andrew Schleck]

No.

[Zena Keda]

No GMs, no coach. They were, you know, it looked like when they were down 2:1 to the Clippers, you know, I'm talking to some of my friends in Denver media, and they're like, readying the obituary. And now all of a sudden, it feels like they're just. Just have all this momentum. I don't know, Andrew, you know. You know how this basketball stuff works. It feels. I don't know. We're about to get an Avalanche. Should the Thunder be worried?

[Andrew Schleck]

Should they be worried? Yeah, why not? I mean, you lost the game. You lost the game. You should have won.

[Zena Keda]

Like, you gotta beat Jokic four times out of six.

[Andrew Schleck]

Yeah.

[Alex Caruso]

You gotta say no. I said no only because I thought that you can't get a game out of Jalen Williams like you got last night again. But that's. That's interesting. I'm interesting. Now you're making me think.

[Andrew Schleck]

Wait why shouldn't they? Like, like, what does that mean? What am I. What am I. What am I admitting to when I'm saying they should be worried? I guess.

[Alex Caruso]

I guess I'm just saying, like, I feel like I don't want to completely discount what the Thunder has built up over the course of the season. I feel like this is a. I don't want to call it a fluke because it's Denver and we know that they're capable of doing this. But I'm looking. I'm looking at both these series that we watched last night. New York Knicks versus Celtics and also Denver versus okc. And it is the road team that has come in and went won. But I'm also looking at the minutes that this road. These road teams have put in to get this first win.

[Andrew Schleck]

Yeah.

[Alex Caruso]

And is that sustainable? So I don't know. I feel like I don't. I don't want to give too much credit to these wins. However, you. You might be right. They might need to be worried.

[Andrew Schleck]

This is still anybody's series.

[Alex Caruso]

Just clear.

[Andrew Schleck]

Like, it's just. It's just game one. Like, Thunder win game two, they win game three, then we're flipping it back over. Like, should Denver be worried?

[Zena Keda]

That obituary again.

[Andrew Schleck]

This is how playoffs. This is how you want it, though. Like, honestly, if you're an NBA fan, like, this is what you want. Like, you want it back and forth. You don't want anybody just mowing over a conference. Like, you want to see adversity.

[Zena Keda]

Yeah. I don't know if we've ever had a second round where, you know, have you have three teams, three road teams win game one, and we've got a really good chance with the warriors going to Minnesota for all four. You know, that's going to be a close series, too.

[Andrew Schleck]

I don't know.

[Zena Keda]

It's been a fun playoff so far. I don't need to tell people who are listening because, you know, I think we're all watching along, but, yeah, what a game. All right, we're going to get out of here. Andrew. Thanks for hanging out. That's going to do it for the show, folks. For Andrew Schleck and Zena Keda, I'm Dave Duor. This has been the NBA Daily. Thanks for waking up with us.