Thunder Take Control After Dominant Game Five Win Over Spurs

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Athletic NBA Daily

Episode: Thunder Take Control After Dominant Game Five Win Over Spurs

Date: May 27, 2026
Host: Dave DuFour with Esfandiar Baraheni and Andrew Schlecht

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Episode Overview

This episode recaps Game 5 of the Western Conference Finals between the Oklahoma City Thunder and the San Antonio Spurs, in which the Thunder seized a 127-114 victory to lead the series 3-2. The hosts analyze the key factors behind Oklahoma City’s dominant performance, the Spurs’ struggles—particularly from Victor Wembanyama—and discuss how experience, energy, and tactical tweaks are shaping the series. They preview Game 6 and debate whether the series is destined for an epic Game 7.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Energy, Experience, and Aggression

• Thunder’s Edge: The Thunder’s consistent energy and experienced approach set them apart in Game 5.
  • “The difference in energy between the Thunder and Spurs from game to game has been noticeable. And it feels right now like this spurs team only actually has it every other game.” (Dave Dufour, 02:18)
• Youth and Fatigue for Spurs: Spurs’ youth and lack of playoff stamina—especially for Victor Wembanyama—are showing.
  • “This is the longest season of Victor Wembanyama's career, and this is his worst game of the playoffs.” (Dave Dufour, 02:18)

2. Incremental Adjustments Over Grand Strategies

• Small Tweaks: At this point in the series, it’s about minor adjustments rather than overhaul strategies.
  • “At this point we've played this team 10 times. There's not a lot of big, earth-shattering adjustments... more like little tweaks here and there.” (Basketball Analyst 1, 03:29)
• Thunder’s Tweaked Rotation: Noted changes in player rotation and aggressive passing/defense.
  • Kenrich Williams’ minutes are highlighted as a subtle, effective shift.

3. Flow Disrupted by Officiating

• Unified Fan Frustration: Both fanbases were united in criticizing referees—an unusual mid-series camaraderie.
  • “Both fan bases were hating on the refs… this was not the best officiated game.” (Basketball Analyst 2, 05:12)
• Impact on Spurs: The stop-and-start nature particularly disrupted the Spurs’ up-tempo game.
  • “I thought [the whistles] ruined the flow of the game. I thought for the spurs more than the Thunder.” (Dave Dufour, 06:03)
• 70 Free Throws: Over-officiating resulted in 70 total free throws, stalling game rhythm. (06:03-06:23)

4. Shooting & Role Player Impact

• Thunder Bench Steps Up: Secondary players hit big threes, not just the stars.
  • “Outside of SGA who knocked down two threes and Lou Dort... eleven of their 14 threes tonight were everybody else.” (Dave Dufour, 06:23)
• Isaiah Hartenstein’s Offensive X-Factor: His ability to hit floaters pulled Wembanyama away from the rim, opening the Thunder’s offense (06:23-07:46).

5. Mental Warfare and Wembanyama’s Decline

• Diminished Mystique: Early-series Thunder jitters facing Wembanyama are fading.
  • “That game one, Wemby affected every shot just by his presence. The Thunder now have [grown comfortable].” (Basketball Analyst 1, 08:17)
• Wembanyama Worn Down: Not only physically but mentally—a clear step down from his Game 1 dominance.
  • “He skipped his post-game media availability.” (Basketball Analyst 2, 11:00)
• Chet Holmgren’s Adjustment: Aggressive offensive approach signaled growth and set an early tone for the Thunder (08:49-09:48).

6. Physicality & Officiating Narrative

• Castle’s Comments: Stephon Castle (Spurs) questioned the physicality allowed for each team.
  • “Steph Castle said after the game that they are afforded a level of physicality that sometimes we do not have...” (Dave Dufour, 13:11)
• Hosts’ Rebuttal: The show’s consensus was that both teams bring heavy physicality; officiating was inconsistent rather than biased.
  • “I feel like both teams bring the same level of physicality in every game... It would be silly to actually believe officials controlled this game.” (Basketball Analyst 1, 13:50-15:43)
• Physicality vs. Basketball Discourse: The hosts express frustration that foul debates overshadow the high-level chess match on the court (15:43-17:19).

7. Previewing Game 6

• Spurs' Inconsistency: Spurs seem to alternate good and bad games; missing players are having a clear impact (19:08-19:53).
  • “Fox looked hampered. Dylan Harper again… hasn't quite looked the same since he suffered that adductor strain.” (Basketball Analyst 2, 19:08)
• Wembanyama Needs Big Numbers: Spurs’ fate relies heavily on Wemby scoring near 30+ points (20:00-21:41).
  • “In the two wins for the Spurs... he dropped 41 and 33. The other two times he scores under 30 points... it’s not enough.” (Dave Dufour, 20:00)
• Role Player Margin: Spurs don’t get enough from others; Thunder’s depth and bench impact the outcome.

8. Isaiah Hartenstein and Alex Caruso’s Value

• “Secret to the Series”: Hartenstein’s relentlessness and Caruso’s all-around impact praised.
  • “Isaiah Hartenstein has been amazing in this series. He was excellent in Game 5. He had 16 points, had 11 rebounds... it feels like he gets to every single 50–50 ball.” (Basketball Analyst 2, 24:34)
• Steadying Veterans: Both players, added last offseason, raise the Thunder’s physicality and championship mettle (25:59-27:47).

9. Will the Series Go Seven?

• Unpredictability Acknowledged: Despite OKC’s control, the crew predicts a Game 7 is likely.
  • “The minute that you think you’ve figured out this series is the moment that you’re wrong because that’s how it’s felt every single game.” (Basketball Analyst 1, 28:53)

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Notable Quotes

• On the Spurs' Running Out of Gas:
  • “This is the longest season of Victor Wembanyama’s career, and this is his worst game of the playoffs.” (Dave DuFour, 02:18)
• On Playoff Fan Base Psychology:
  • “Every time the Thunder win, feels like they’re never going to lose again. And every time the Thunder lose, it feels like they’re never going to win again.” (Basketball Analyst 1, 03:29)
• On Rookie Nerves Disappearing:
  • “[Wembanyama] affected every shot just by his presence. And the Thunder now have… more comfort shooting over him.” (Basketball Analyst 1, 08:17)
• On Role Players Mattering:
  • “Eleven of their 14 threes tonight were everybody else... Jared McCain, Alex Caruso, Kendrick Williams and Jaylen Williams.” (Dave DuFour, 06:23)
• On Officiating Fatigue:
  • “I don’t want 70 free throws in a basketball game. That’s not fun to watch.” (Basketball Analyst 2, 15:43)
• On Game 6 Outlook:
  • “He can’t score 20 points in game six. They need more than that... In the two wins he scored over 30. The other times, it’s just not enough.” (Basketball Analyst 2 and Dave DuFour, 19:53-20:00)
• On the Series Deserving More:
  • “Deserve a seven-game series of this, you know.” (Dave DuFour, 29:14)

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Important Timestamps

• 01:34: Show opens and Thunder-Spurs Game 5 context set
• 02:18: Thunder’s energy and Spurs’ fatigue; Wembanyama’s worst playoff game
• 03:29: Thunder adjustments are mental, not tactical; effect of energy and aggression
• 05:12: Both fanbases united in criticism of officiating
• 06:03–06:23: Analysis of free throw glut and impact on game flow
• 06:23–07:46: Thunder’s secondary shooters and Hartenstein’s impact
• 08:17–09:48: Wembanyama’s diminished intimidation, Chet’s improved offensive aggression
• 11:00: Wembanyama skips post-game media, suggesting mental/physical fatigue
• 13:11–15:43: Castle’s comments about physicality, officiating consistency debate
• 17:19–17:33: Transition to break, reflecting on rivalry and series intensity
• 19:08–21:41: Game 6 preview—Spurs’ issues, Wemby’s scoring necessity
• 24:34–27:47: Hartenstein and Caruso’s veteran influence; Thunder’s bench
• 28:49–29:14: Hosts agree series is headed for Game 7

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Memorable Moments

• Wembanyama’s Fatigue and Frustration: Skipping post-game media, a notable sign of Spurs’ mounting pressure. (11:00)
• “Ivan Drago” Debate: Lighthearted riff on Rocky IV nicknames and their relevance to Wembanyama (“They’ve worn him down, right?” 09:49–10:41)
• Thunder’s Role Player Glow-Up: Specific credit for Alex Caruso and Isaiah Hartenstein, whose hustle stats and intangible plays turned the series. (24:34–27:47)
• Playoff Paranoia: The perennial uncertainty of who actually has control in this series, despite what any given game result may suggest. (“The minute that you think that you’ve figured out this series is the moment that you’re wrong...” 28:53)

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Conclusion

The hosts agree that Game 5 was a showcase of the Thunder’s depth, mentality, and steady veteran influence as the Spurs showed signs of burnout and inexperience. While the Thunder are now one win from the NBA Finals, the unpredictability of the series, combined with continual tactical tweaks and emotional swings, suggests that a dramatic Game 7 remains likely.

“Deserve a seven-game series of this, you know.”
— Dave DuFour (29:14)

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For listeners and non-listeners alike, this episode offers deep insight into the tactical chess of high-level playoff basketball—with just enough unpredictability left for at least one more classic showdown.

Transcript

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[Basketball Analyst 2]

Good morning and welcome to the NBA Daily for May 27, 2026. I'm Dave Dufour and those cheers are for me. I'm here with S. Baraheni and Andrew Schleckt. Coming up, the Thunder take a 32 lead back to San Antonio. We're gonna going to talk all about it. Good morning everybody. What's up guys? Andrew, is there horse going on behind you? Is it knockout? What's the game that the.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Listen there. There are children of the of of the employees playing ball over here.

[Dave Dufour]

That's awesome.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Everybody's, everybody's pumped here in OKC and

[Basketball Analyst 2]

everybody got to celebrate tonight, right?

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Like everybody's balling, everybody's balling here right now, right?

[Basketball Analyst 2]

Big, big thunder. 127, 114. I look, I think my initial takeaway from this where I'll start is that the difference in energy between the Thunder and Spurs from game to game has been noticeable. And it feels right now like this spurs team only actually has it every other game. They just don't have whether it's they don't have the depth they don't have, they don't have the legs. I mean, they are so young. And we always talk about the, you know, young guys running into a wall. This is the longest season of Victor Weyama's career, and this is his worst game of the playoffs. First game in this series where he has a negative plus minus. But the Thunder, I think that this is where the experience really plays out. The Thunder looked ready every single game and even in the ones that they lose, you know, it isn't, it isn't a thing where you can say, oh, they didn't have the juice. It looked, they look slow. Sometimes you just, you know, the other team hits shots and you don't. But in game five, I really thought that the, the number one difference was energy. I, I thought the Thunder just had it and the spurs had none.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Yeah, I, I was talking to Chad after the game. I was like, what, what were the major adjustments that you guys made in this one? And they were like, well, like at this point we've played this team 10 times. Like there's not like a lot of like big like earth shattering adjustments that you're gonna make, you know, moving forward. It's more like little tweaks here and there. Like the rotation was changed tonight for the Thunder, but it was really more about just the mindset and like playing together and like, it's as simple as that for the Thunder. You know, talked to multiple guys about it and it was like, it's really just our aggressive approach, which we did not have. He said they, they're gonna pressure us, you know, big time. And it's like, how do you respond to that pressure? How are you responding? How, how are aggressive are you going to be with the pass, which the Thunder were just a much better passing team. They were really good in the half court during this game. And so like to me it was like their energy and aggression defensively and then offensively too, like they were just the aggressor in this one. And it feels like they've been kind of like taking turns being the aggressor here. You know, every, every game that you feel like one team has figured it out, that definitely has not been the case. And I, yeah, I think like for both fan bases, like every time like the Thunder win feels like they're never gonna lose again. And every time the Thunder lose, it feels like they're never gonna win again. Like, that's just kind of how this series has felt.

[Dave Dufour]

It's so fun to listen to the reactions of the fan bases after every game because to your point, it's like spurs fans are like, we got them figured out. They can't beat us anymore. SGA is locked up. It's over. And then on the other side, the unity tonight, fans.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

The unity tonight was so good. Both fan bases asked. They were hating on the refs. They were together, you know, even look when the spurs had that one stretch where the refs they, you know, they missed the goaltend, what was the next mistake that they made? Oh, they missed the ball

[Dave Dufour]

and then the challenge call and they missed challenge.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

Mitch Johnson gets a technical. Thunder fans in. In our discord were they were honestly and they were compassionate about it. They were like, wow, this is pretty rough because I mean, let's be honest, this was not the best officiated game. And sorry to cut you off there

[Dave Dufour]

S. But like I did think 70 free throws, man.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

Yeah. I mean again, you mentioned like the difference in, in the dialogue of the two fan bases, but I think they were combined on this one. Like they were right.

[Dave Dufour]

Yeah.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

And it ruined the flow of the game. I thought for the spurs more than the Thunder, again, that's what that experience comes in. You know, the spurs really want to get out and run and try to score and transition. Their half court offense is not great. Like they don't have this great, these great shooters to space them out and ask like that's a huge problem for them because like the Thunder, they got Alex Caruso, you know they got Alex

[Dave Dufour]

Caruso, they have Jared McCain, they have a bunch of these bench guys who absolutely turned up tonight. I mean outside of SGA who knocked down two threes and Lou Dortmund who knocked down one single three. Eleven of their 14 threes tonight were everybody else. It was Jared McCain, it was Alex Caruso, it was the two Williams is. And Kendrick Williams and Jaylen Williams and Kayson Wallace. Like those guys coming down and knocking down shots. We talked about what the difference is, game plan wise. I think it's so incremental now at this point in the series. Like Isaiah Hartenstein being able to hit floaters over Wemby has changed the defensive scheme for the spurs in a way where Wemby has to be a little bit further away from the basket, just a few feet away. And that's allowed the Thunder to attack a little bit more on drives which has created more opportunities for their three point shooters. It's like this cascading effect of a few inches here and there can determine a game. And so yeah, you're seeing the Thunder knock down the shots. But also truthfully, I think It's. It's one of those things where it's like execution reigns supreme over everything else that we're seeing. Whether it's physicality, whether it's knocking down your threes, whether it's forcing turnovers. Whoever is able to dictate, like, what style we're playing tonight is. Is going to win the game. That's what it is right now.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Well, I was going to say it felt like game one. It felt like there was like these like mental games that existed between Wemby and the Thunder, and it feels like those have like gone down every single game.

[Dave Dufour]

You know, Jalen Williams is looking back at him, you know.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Yes. And he was actually asked about that post game and he didn't remember it. He was like, I don't remember.

[Dave Dufour]

He's like, he just blacked out.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Yeah, I guess so. He's like, I don't, I don't remember that happening. Which was really funny. But yeah, it did feel like that game won. Wemby affected every shot just by like, his presence. And the Thunder now have like. Like you said, Hartenstein is more comfortable shooting over him. Chet, while, like, Chet didn't have like the best game of his life here.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

No, it was the best game of the series though, by far.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

But I would say, like, his offensive aggression was so much better. And I was like, what?

[Dave Dufour]

Especially to start the game, right?

[Basketball Analyst 2]

Yeah.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Yeah. I was like, what changed for you? He's like, well, he's like, it didn't really help me to not be aggressive in these past few games. And he was like, I just really decided that, like, I really just have to be aggressive and just live with whatever, you know, happens with it.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

Yeah.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

And he was much better. He was six of nine from the field. You would hope that he'd get more shot attempts than that, but just the fact that he was willing to take some of these like, mid range jumpers, like his first bucket was an offensive rebound, then a mid range jumper, like, those were impactful just to start the game. And it kind of set the tone for the Thunder to be a little bit more aggressive. It took Shay some time to get it going. He was pretty bad. He even talked about it post game that like, this was like one of his worst, like, starts to a game that he's ever had. And he eventually got it together. He shot a ton of free throws, obviously 16 of 17 from the free throw line, but then he got his jumper to fall late, hit two threes, and, you know, that was kind of what closed the door on the Spurs.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

There's a little bit of Rocky versus Ivan Drago, I think with. With Wemby, right?

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Yeah. Ivan.

[Dave Dufour]

It's Ivan Drago, isn't it?

[Basketball Analyst 2]

Drago.

[Dave Dufour]

Yeah, it's. It's.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

I. Come on, we're pronouncing this properly. Not what they say in the movie. Relax. Okay, so, so wait, what's. What's Rocky?

[Basketball Analyst 1]

What in the world does that mean?

[Dave Dufour]

How would they call him Ivan Drago do he dies?

[Basketball Analyst 2]

Do you think Russians pronounce Ivon Ivan Russian?

[Dave Dufour]

Podcast fans, please let us know

[Basketball Analyst 1]

what

[Basketball Analyst 2]

Ivan Drago for you guys.

[Dave Dufour]

Thank you.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

There's this point where he. Where he only hurts him. He hurts him.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

What?

[Basketball Analyst 2]

And, and I think with Wimy, it's, it's. They've worn him down, right? And he's hurt and now they get to gain that confidence from knowing, okay, we can attack him a little bit.

[Dave Dufour]

From attacking him. Yes.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

Alex Caruso has been a guy like he's just been attacking non nonstop. And you know, to. To speak to the mental part, just saw this that Wimy not in the building. So I didn't know this, but Wimy skipped his post game media availability.

[Dave Dufour]

Interesting.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

It was a weird wy game. A bad Wimy game.

[Dave Dufour]

It was a bad Wimy game and

[Basketball Analyst 2]

he skipped the post game media.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Uhuh.

[Dave Dufour]

Maybe there were too many blue lights post game and he wanted. He was. It ran out on blue light time. You know what I mean? So I mean, I'm assuming.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

I'm assuming he also like is starting to get ready for game six because again, he looks worn down at this point.

[Dave Dufour]

He does.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

Andrew, you were talking about how much more he affected the game in game one versus this one. And I mean, yeah, it has declined game to game because I just think that physically he's not there yet, this guy. I mean, he just doesn't have the. The stamina from. From night. Not just night to night. It's the. It's the day off in between. They don't have enough time for the intensity of the series. And you're playing a team that is extremely familiar with you. And by game five of a series, you know, I guess he's a little less scary because you've seen him so many times. He has been so effective. And Drago. Yeah, listen, he's not. He's not perfect. No one. No one's a perfect basketball player. And I don't know, they've done a really good job. I think also Steph Castle s. You were telling me that. Yeah, he made some Comments after the game. It seems like right now we're seeing some of the inexperience maybe lead to some frustration. And I think the Thunder and, And their. They've been there before. We said this about the Thunder last year. They haven't done it right. They haven't been there before. Well, they did it and I think that we're starting to see the difference between that now.

[Dave Dufour]

Yeah, the way that they played today. I mean, the game plan just in general to your point about pulling out and changing the rotation with Kenridge Williams coming in for the first time, you know, I mean, his ability to just like, roll the dice on guys. Mark Dagnau is coaching a clinic right now. And when it comes to physicality, you mentioned it. Steph Castle said after the game that they are afforded a level of physicality that sometimes we do not have on the other side of the ball. Now, Steph Castle had five fouls.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Did he say sometimes? Did he say.

[Dave Dufour]

He said. He said at times. He said at times. At times he. Steph Castle had five fouls. Truthfully, a couple of those fouls were like, very silly fouls from him. But. But then the other ones were, you know, the, the very typical ball pressure that we've been seeing basically all series from him. He's done a pretty good job on sga, considering SGA is. Is the talent that he is. What do you guys think about Steph Castle's comments about physicality? Are the Spurs. Is this being rigged towards the big market Oklahoma City Thunder?

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Yeah, I mean, to me, I hate that this is becoming part of the discourse in this particular series because both teams play very physical and both teams are. I mean, really, it comes down to, like, how are the officials allowing this physicality? They did not allow as much physicality in this one as they have in past games. And like, it's really about the officiating crew. But I, I feel like both teams bring like the same level of physicality in every game. Like, there's just like a lot of. There's a lot of grabbing from both sides. There's like a lot of pushing from both sides.

[Dave Dufour]

Both teams get away with stuff.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

Also, though, early on they were. They were even in foul calls. And I think again, this is where that experience comes out for the Thunder. I think the Thunder just adjusted to the whistle better. You know, you mentioned Steph. Steph Castle, some of the, some of the fouls. Some of those weren't called fouls even in game four. Right?

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Sure.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

And the Thunder are just, again, they were able to adjust faster. And that's what it comes down to. Once you get to Game 5 of a playoff series, you know, you've got to play better, you've got to hit your shots and you have to adjust to the whistle as it goes. And the Thunder were just quicker to do it. The physicality in this series has been, I would say probably the most over talked about aspect of it. Sure. And it certainly is important and has played a part, but it's been equal, you know, the equal amounts of physicality. Whatever you think about the officiating, which I have some big time problems with a lot of it, I think that both teams have been allowed to play defense actually, and that what we don't want is what we got last night. I don't want, I don't want 70 free throws in a basketball game that's not fun to watch.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

I wouldn't say that like the officiating has like determined outcomes of games. No, but, but has it been great? It's not been great. It's been inconsistent. Which is like not what you want. Like that, that to me is like not what you want out of a playoff series. But I don't know that either team is walking away from any of these games saying the officials were the ones who changed the entire game. And I don't hear anybody like inside the walls of any of this building saying that like the officials were the ones that controlled this game. It would be silly to like actually believe that to be true. However, like we're seeing like what I hope is the beginning of like a heated rivalry that exists because like these teams don't like each other. They're super physical with each other. They, they both have counters to one another that we have seen that like, can really like stop, you know, one team or the other, which has been really fun to like see. It's, it's very much like a chess match between these two squads because they have, they both have great coaching, they both have great players, they both have like intense defenders, especially on the perimeter. They have great defenders on the inside too. It's just been, it's just been a joy to watch and I hate that like things like fouls, things like physicality falling down, all of these things have become like the storylines within this when we actually have good basketball. That's happened in this series. Like, I, I don't understand why people on the Internet can't just enjoy basketball anymore.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

That's a maybe greater societal problem for another day. But we're going to take a quick break and come back and look ahead to game six.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

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[Basketball Analyst 2]

Okay, looking ahead to Game 6. Like I said, I feel like we're at the point where the spurs guys, they really only have it every other game, you know, and, and I'm not going to, I'm not going to say that this was a load management game, but it wound up being one when you consider the effort that it looked like they were putting out. Outside of Stefan Castle and Julian Sh and Keldon Johnson, I can't tell you that the other guys were were going as hard as they could. Fox looked hampered. Dylan Harper again, he hasn't quite looked the same since he suffered that adductor strain. He hasn't been getting to the paint the same way. And Victor women Yama just, he just looks worn down. One of the things that Mitch Johnson said after the game was he can't score 20 points in Game 6. They need more than that.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Yep.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

What's the number? What does we need to hit 30? You've got, you've got a stat for me Here.

[Dave Dufour]

Yeah, I do have a little bit of a stat here. So basically in game one, he dropped 41. In game three, he dropped 33. Or sorry, in game four he dropped 33. Those are the two wins for the Spurs. The other two times he scores under 30 points. In game five tonight, obviously he scores 20 points. So it's just, it's not enough. They need a level of usage of offensive usage from Wembanyama that I, I think truthfully is like around 30 points per game. And that comes down to. To your point, Dave De' Aaron Fox not being 100%, Dylan Harper not giving them enough right now. And you're. You're not going to rely on Devin Vassell who's had good games in the series to be a secondary scoring option for you. That's why Wemby, the offensive load is there. It's. It's very similar to what SGA is dealing with on the other side. With Jalen Williams and A.J. mitchell out, it's like so much of the offensive load and creation load is on him. You know what you're going to get from those guys. Andrew was just talking about how Shai has struggled especially to start game five. You kind of know what you're going to get from your two stars for the most part now it wasn't a good Wemby game. It's the other guys who have to show up. It's like Ken Bissell hit his shots at home. Can Champagne continue a good shooting night from Game 5? Can Harper knock down a couple? Can Keldon Johnson and Carter Bryant give you a couple? Like that's, that's honestly the margin at this point is which role players will show up more. Wemby having a big game will be good. That will be a major factor for them. But at the end of the day, it's the other guys who have to also contribute.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Yeah. And I do think that like too offensively for them, they did a better job of taking care of the ball. They had fewer turnovers than the Thunder did. But I also think that offensively they weren't aggressive enough, which there's like this balance that needs to exist for the spurs to beat the Thunder and like not turning the ball over good but like at the expense of being aggressive enough, not great for them. And so it's just really the Thunder put make you make decisions that one way or another you don't really like. Like oftentimes like bad teams will turn the ball over too much because they know that they have to get into Their offensive sets a lot faster and they just have to play a lot faster. But when you do that, you give the, you just cough the ball up a lot more. But when you're more deliberate with it, like the spurs were tonight, they didn't turn the ball over. But I don't feel like they got as quality of shots and I don't feel like their possessions were better.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

Yeah, this is where the, this is where the, the free throws really work against them because they're seeing a completely set thunder defense on so many more possessions. I mean, it just, it does disrupt what they want to do. They don't have that knockdown shooting. I did think Dylan Harper over dribbled a lot in this game and you know, it was, it was one of the worst turnover games that he had. What did he wind up with? Three turnovers. Okay. Yeah, but he, you know, some of them were just not, they were not in, in his character.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Right.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

This is not what we're used to seeing from him. He's got a really tight handle. He was getting picked and I think that's a byproduct of not being able to get by anyone right now. He can't get to the paint. And so I, I wonder again, what do they do to get Wemby the ball on the move? He. They can't get the high post up. They're not able to get him underneath the same way. You know, the lobs just have dried up again. And I wonder, you know, what, what sort of actions can they be running? Just get him the ball on the move and at least put pressure on the defense, go to the free throw line. You know, I mean, Wemby also has done a good job in this series of, of drawing fouls. It's almost impossible to put your arm out and not hit him. I mean, he's got limbs everywhere and so I wonder if we don't see that more in game six. Also, you know, I would love to see him just get some regular old post ups on a, you know, big to big screen, something, anything to just make it easier so that he can catch the ball moving and get into a post up.

[Dave Dufour]

The other thing with Wemby is like when his three point shot isn't falling, like he was 05 from three tonight and a couple of those were short. When that's not falling, teams are going to let him shoot the ball more consistently. Right. And so that spacing isn't necessarily there for him to attack downhill more often.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

He has a tendency to do that when he when he is tired. Right.

[Dave Dufour]

When he's settling. Yeah, absolutely.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

And. And I think that that again, that's a. It's a little bit of chicken and egg. He's settling because he's tired. They're happy to let him settle. And so he just continues to. To settle. And. And then the other guy that we haven't talked about him yet, but he's really been the secret to the series. Isaiah Hartenstein has been amazing in this series. He was excellent in Game 5. He had 16 points, had 11 rebounds. The biggest thing with him is it feels like he gets to every single 50, 50 ball that he's competing with Wemby with. And. And again, it's that conditioning that he's got. He's been the secret to the series. Outside of Alex, Alex Jerusalem hadn't been.

[Dave Dufour]

I was going to say Alex Caruso might be the other secret to this.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

He has been a secret, though. He's been the second best player for them for this entire series. And again, like, you know, 47% from three on. How many points a game?

[Dave Dufour]

S. 16 points per game.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

Yeah, and he had a. And he had a. A zero point game in there. So, yeah, I don't think that's much of a secret. But Hartenstein and the job that he's done, just putting pressure on Wemby on both ends. The floater, you know, he's. He makes him contest the floater. It's. It's. You know, there's something to that. There's a lot of centers. You don't have to guard them at 10ft out. And Hardenstein, that's an extra jump that Wemby does almost every single time. I sometimes think to myself, there's no point in jumping. You know, that's a dunk for Hartenstein.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Yeah. I mean, both the guys you mentioned were Hardenstein plus 24, Alex Crusoe plus 18 in this one. The two best marks on the team. And both those guys, when they brought them in, it was to up the level of physicality, and it was to kind of like, help, like, morph the character of this Thunder team. You know, I think we all remember the way they played against the Dallas Mavericks a few years ago. Like, they were just, like, lacking these, like, championship level plays. Like this aggressive mentality. Like, they just didn't have it every night. You'd get it in spurts, but you didn't have it every night.

[Dave Dufour]

Sounds a lot like the spurs that we just described.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Yeah, yeah, without a doubt. Like, I think that having those two who were Brought in both in the same off season, one via trade, one via free agency have really helped kind of change this team. And this team is still young. Like those are like two of the veterans on this team. They're like two of like, kind of like the guiding lights for the Thunder. Like they kind of help propel them to a spot where they need to be. Because you look at guys like Jerick McCain started tonight, he played 33 minutes. We're talking about a second year guard that is not experienced much at all in the NBA. Chet Holmgren is still an unfinished product. Even though like we've talked about how he's gotten better case and Wallace is still on his rookie scale deal. I mean Jalen Williams is still. I mean there's guys in the draft this year that are younger than J. Will. You know, like these are young guy or older than J. Will. Sorry. These are young guys that still kind of need to be propelled. And the Thunder, bringing those two in was not only influential in their championship, you know, run last year, but that's still carrying through this year even though they won the title together.

[Dave Dufour]

They can't lose Isaiah Hartenstein this summer. They can't do it. It's. It's an. They. I do not think they have what it takes to replace and Isaiah Hartenstein. I know that's for, for this summer.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

He's gonna get a, he's gonna just sign a longer term deal for less money. I mean that.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Yeah.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

Why would you break up a good thing? You know, you're, you're one game away from your second consecutive finals. You're the favorite to make the finals now for sure statistically. And you know, once you get there, you got a really great shot of, of going back to back. I, I don't, I don't think any players on the Thunder should be thinking about leaving. As a matter of fact, should all be hoping that they don't get traded somehow. You know, if something crazy happens, Sam might get like eight first round draft pick offers for Isaiah Joe or something because people are like, oh wait, secret guys on the Thunder are going to be good. Okay, let's, let's look at game six. Is it, is it over or are we going seven?

[Basketball Analyst 1]

No, no, we're going seven.

[Dave Dufour]

I'm. It's going seven. Yeah.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

I think that I, I would, I would say that like the minute that you think that you figured out this series is the moment that you're wrong because that's how it's felt every single game here. So I would probably err. On the side that this will go seven, that we'll be back here Saturday night in okc, sitting in this spot.

[Dave Dufour]

Deserve a seven game series of this, you know.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Wow, that's. That sounds very entitled.

[Dave Dufour]

S. Yeah, I'm an entitled NBA fan. What do you want me to do?

[Basketball Analyst 2]

What about the Knicks? Do the knicks deserve a 7 series? I made the joke, I made the joke on the show last night or yesterday that the Knicks, if this goes seven, they should just fly down in a ten, game seven.

[Dave Dufour]

Ah, that's good. I would like.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

That would be, that would be amazing. Set courtside. It'd be the biggest celebrities to sit court side. No, K.C.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

i mean, come on, just wear the full jumpsuit. Like it's, like it's AAU and you know, you're sizing up your opponent. That would be.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

Let's look.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

You know, they, they love wrestling. Everyone loves wrestling now. So let's, let's add a little bit of that wrestling production value.

[Basketball Analyst 1]

I will say, like one, one thing that did change for the Thunder and the rotation is like there was no Isaiah Joe and no Aaron Wiggins tonight. And those guys, both those guys played a pretty big role in game four in San Antonio. And they just opted to just like give basic. They played nine guys in this one, which has been not really a Thunder thing, is like they like to play 10, 11, 12 guys. That's just been part of their strategy. And the fact that they really leaned heavily on several of the starters, plus Jared McCain, plus, you know, Alex Caruso and Casey Wallace, like those were their guys tonight. And then Kendrick Williams and J. Will were the other two that played a big role for them. That was a little bit of a change from, from what they did in the previous game because. Yeah. And it was. Obviously worked for them in this one. It doesn't mean that that's how they're going to go in game six, but certainly that's. That was one of like the, the catalysts for the win tonight.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

Yeah, well, we'll see what the big adjustment from the spurs is. I think the number one thing is just you gotta play harder than you did in game five, period.

[Dave Dufour]

And I, I think you will. I think Wemby will have a bit better game than four of 15.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

Oh, I guarantee he's gonna shoot more than 15 times.

[Dave Dufour]

Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

You know, that's, that's the job. You want to be a star, you got to be a star at the end.

[Dave Dufour]

Like game one was career defining for him. He had that 40 point game. It was incredible. This is now season on the line, right? You know you have a chance to to maybe push it to seven and go to the NBA Finals. What are you made of? Right? This is the superstar stuff that, that we're talking about with women.

[Basketball Analyst 2]

Yeah. Yep. That's going to do it for the show, folks. Thank you to Andrew Schlecht for staying up late with us. For Esperahenny and Andrew schlecht, I'm Dave Duke 4 and this has been the NBA Daily. Thanks for waking up with us. Thanks for listening. Make sure you hit the subscribe or follow button so you never miss an episode. If you enjoyed it, drop a like leave a rating or let us know in the comments. Thank you guys for waking up with us.

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