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- [00:02]
Adrian
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- [01:21]
Brittany
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- [02:54]
Chris
This message is brought to you by Apple Card. Apply for Apple Card today and start earning up to 3% daily cash back on everyday purchases. And that daily cash can even grow automatically when you open a high Yield savings account through Apple Card. What are you waiting for? Visit Apple Co CardCalculator today and to see how much daily cash you can earn. Subject to credit approval Savings available to Apple Card owners subject to eligibility Savings in Apple Card by Goldman Sachs Bank USA Member FDIC terms and more@applecard.com welcome to the Saturday Slammin Jam here on the Athletic NBA Daily Daily. On today's show we're talking NBA Cup Aftermath Defensive Player of the Year odds and Scott Agnes joins the show to talk about the Indiana Pacers. But to start us off, al, tell me about the top stories this week.
- [04:01]
David
Well Andrew, our top story this week was the crowning of the 2024 NBA cup champion, the Milwaukee Bucks. The Bucks were led by two time NBA MVP and one time NBA Cup MVP Giannis Anetokounmpo who put up a 26:19:10 line with three blocks in the 97 to 81 win over the Oklahoma City Thunder. That's right, 97 to 81. The Thunder shot 34% from the field and 15% from three. The last time OKC had that bad of a game. Me and Andrew were arguing about whether Alexei Pokhusevsky would be a Hall of Famer or just a multi time All Star. For the Bucks. It wasn't just another memorable elimination game performance for Giannis. It was also the second NBA cup championship for summer free agent signing Taurean Prince and assistant coach Darvin Ham. Will we get a ham man three peat next season? Speaking of three peats, the Chicago Bulls have won three in a row, including a shocker on Thursday night, a 117 to 108 win over the Celtics in Boston. After losing only four home games all of last season, the Celtics have already lost four this and it's not even Christmas. Zach Lavine led the Bulls with 36 points, another strong performance in what has been a bounce back season for him. Could that bounce back lead to a trade? Well, this week the Athletic Sam Amick reported that the Denver Nuggets have expressed significant interest in Lavine. A deal with that would likely involve Michael Porter Jr. In the meantime, the Bulls are now 13 and 15 9th in the east with the 12th ranked offense and 23rd ranked defense per Cleaning the glass. Now potential trades are fun, but what about rail trades? Well, we had two this week, first kind of a minor one in Indiana as the Pacers sent a 2031 second round pick swap to the Heat for Thomas Bryant. Not not super exciting. A second more exciting trade though followed with the Golden State warriors sending D Anthony Melton, Reese Beakman and three second round picks to the Brooklyn Nets for Dennis schroeder and a 2025 second. Now the warriors are in need of some offensive help in those non Steph minutes and also just need in need of help more generally because since starting 123 the warriors have lost 11 of their last 13, including a 14493 destruction at the hands of the Grizzlies in Memphis on Thursday night. The 51 point loss was the fifth biggest loss in warriors franchise history and in his first game as a Warrior, Dennis Schroeder did get the start, but he went 2 of 12 for 5 points. The Grizzlies, meanwhile, are 19 and 9 second in the West. Now, in a week without many basketball games and not a lot to talk about, it was a particularly bad time to publicly steal a PlayStation 5 from a child. But that's exactly what these Charlotte Hornets decided to do. So glad you're During a loss to the Sixers, Hugo the Hornet, dressed as Santa Claus, a character best known for giving presents and not committing theft, gave a child a PS5. Shortly after the child had exited the court, the PS5 was taken away and replaced with a jersey that cannot play video games such as the 2024 game of the Year. Balatro. I love Balatro. Anytime you hear Andrew talking on the podcast, I'm playing Balatro. The Hornets were widely criticized and in response have pledged to give the kid a PS5 and a VIP experience to a future Hornets game. The hornets have lost 13 of their last 15 from a franchise acting like they're broke to a franchise showing how easy it is to get fans to like you. Phoenix Suns owner Matt Ishbia announced this week that the Suns would be implementing a two dollar value menu. For just $2, you'll be able to buy a hot dog, a water, a soda, a bag of chips or even some popcorn. What a deal. At a time when franchise values are soaring into the multiple billions, it's nice when it doesn't feel like your billionaire owner is trying to extract every last dollar out of You Suns fans get to watch the games for free on tv and then they can enjoy a meal at the game for under 10 bucks. The potential downside for Ishbia's plan is a drop in the bucket for the billionaire, and any owner who is not following Ishbia's lead should feel like a loser. You got. Yeah, yeah, we're going to shame them into it. You got all that money and you still got to charge little old me $6 for a ice cold Dasani? Well, guess what, billionaires? When I'm done, I'm filling it up with bathroom water. Free refills, losers. Finally this week, you got to give the Clippers some credit who may have weathered this storm without Kawhi better than anyone could have ever expected. After beating Dallas on Thursday, without Luke and Kyrie, they moved to 16 and 12, their first place in the Pacific Division, sixth in the West. And more importantly, we got news this week that Kawhi is back to playing five on five contact basketball. And while he has been ruled out of this current road trip, his return may be sooner than later, which is great news for the Clippers. Now one player who won't be returning soon is rookie Jared McCain, who underwent surgery this week for a torn meniscus. And to make matters worse for the Sixers, Joel Embiid suffered a sinus fracture this week after being hit in the face by Bennett Matheran. Derek Bodnar posted a wild stat from a 2020 study. He found there have been 53 facial fractures in the NBA over the previous 34 years, which includes 15 orbital bone fractures and one sinus fracture. Embiid, all on his own, has now had two orbital bone fractures and one sinus fracture since 2018, the freakiest run of freak injuries we've ever seen. Now, the good news is that as of Friday morning, Joel Embiid is already questionable for the game against Charlotte, so he should be back soon. And those are the top stories this week. Andrew.
- [09:54]
Chris
Wonderful top stories. I love that you threw the concession one in there. I thought that was. I mean, that was kind of a fascinating story. This week. The BET MGM Line of the week is the Defensive Player of the year odds, which I think are strange. I would say Victor Wimanyama is at a minus 250 to win this award. And then Jaren Jackson Jr goes all the way up to plus 450. Evan Mobley plus 1800. Rudy Gobert plus 2500. Draymond Green plus 2500. You get to Shay, the Thunder have the number one defense in the NBA he's plus 2500. And honestly, him having the best odds to win this award is laughable. Shea is a really good defender, but him having the best odds to win this on the best defense in the NBA is ludicrous. Lou Dort is plus 3500 as well as Jalen Suggs and Bam out of bio. I just don't know. I think people preseason had decided that like Victor when Benyama was going to be the guy to win it. Right now The spurs are 19th in defense. I just don't know how you can justify giving somebody the defensive player of the year awards who has a bottom 11 defense in the NBA. I just don't know how you do that when this award has been given to Rudy Gobert, Jaren Jackson, Marcus Smart, Rudy Gobert again when he was with Utah, Giannis, Rudy, Rudy, Draymond Green, Kawhi Leonard twice in a row. Like all these guys played for top flight defenses in the NBA. And I know that Wimby's stats are great, I know the on offs are incredible. But I just don't know how at the end of the day you're going to give this to him. And maybe it's because there's not a lot of buzz about this award and no one's really come out and said who they think it should be. But I think it's just really interesting that he is like the placeholder for this award when his team is not having the success on the court.
- [11:49]
David
Yeah, it, it has gotten more interesting because you know, I'm looking at PBP stats right now when he's on the court. The spurs defensive rating is a 1 10, which is solid. But like if, if you're looking at the league as a whole, that would slot in around the seventh best defense in the league. So it's not like they've been some uber elite defense when he's on the court. Now on the other hand, last Friday night I got to go watch Victor Wembanyama in person for the first time. And like seeing him in person, I had a great seat. Shout out to Blake for the great seats. It, it really is wild what he does. He's defensively.
- [12:27]
Chris
Yeah.
- [12:27]
David
The way he changes the calculus for the other team on defense is. And you saw it on, I don't know if you saw this clip on Thursday night, the game against the Hawks where Trey Young shot a floater over the back of the pack for. Just to try to avoid Wimby.
- [12:44]
Chris
Yes.
- [12:45]
David
So like I get it from that Perspective. But I do feel like by the end of the seasons, the stats, even if it's not a team wide stat, but the stats with him on the court should be absolutely elite for him to win this award. If they are really hovering around like the 20th best defense, like when he's on the court, they need to be obviously the best defense in the league for me to really buy into this idea, like, I get it when I'm watching him, but at the same time, like a 110 defensive rating, like that. That's cool. That's cool. But I don't feel like that is like, okay, automatic. He should be a minus 250 to win this award. But it does feel like that's where this is headed. I. Yeah, going back to the preseason now, I do think, you know, if Chet had stayed healthy, like we. We even saw it in those first couple of games, his odds were climbing. They were getting a lot closer to each other. Maybe that would have been more of a race, but as much as a player like Jaren Jackson Jr. Might end up deserving it, you know, if the, if the Grizzlies end up being a top five defense, it's just hard to imagine him getting the award at this point because Wemby feels like such a foregone conclusion.
- [13:50]
Chris
It better. It better not be a foregone conclusion. Memphis is fifth in defense right now. Like, he's. He's a worthy candidate. So is Jalen Suggs and Lugan Dort, but they don't get the credit because they're guards for some reason. You know, like the Marcus Smart one was the anomaly. But, like, Dort and Suggs have been two of the best defenders in the NBA this season, and I think they should get a lot more credit. Also, there's no rep from the Houston Rockets who have the number two defense. You know, I mean, that. That, to me, it's a. It's a little bit crazy because defense is not. It's. This is an individual award. It's. It's not really. Defense is tough to evaluate because it's not an individual thing. It's based on scheme. It's based on whatever's going on. And I think that it's easier to give it to a big man because they have these stats that look good. But when we're talking about the best defenders in the NBA, in my opinion, it should be Jalen Suggs and it should be Lugan Stort at the top of this, because they have. To me, those are the two guys having the best Defensive years in the league. If you're going to give it to a big, give it to Jaren. Like, that would be the guy. Or even Evan Mobley would be fine with me. But to say that like, and Victor Wembanyama is going to have his time. The spurs are going to eventually be a good team, but let's not pretend that he's having the best season of any of these guys because the, the team stats should dictate what happens here. And like, I just don't.
- [15:17]
David
Or even just the, the, the on stats, like when this player on the court. Although all those players you just mentioned. Because I've been looking it up as you've been talking, whether it's Suggs Mobley, Jaren Jackson Jr. All of those teams have a better defensive rating when those players are on the court than the spurs do when Wemby's on the court. Yeah. So, yeah, I, I just want, I get the eye test argument because I saw it for myself, but I would like to see the stats catch up a little bit to that. Yeah. Because you could never say that about Gobert. Like when Google Bear was on the court for these last couple, you know, seasons when he was winning defensive player of the year awards, they were always an elite, elite defense.
- [15:54]
Chris
It was overwhelming. It was overwhelming. So, like, I just, I think that, yes, he's going to have his day because he is that good, but don't give it to him just because you think you. Because you want to be early. That's what this feels like. It's like, let's get early to the WIMBY party and you're going to leave guys that are actually defensive player of the years in the dust because you want to be early on somebody. That to me should not happen.
- [16:18]
David
I don't like, I didn't, I didn't. I didn't know you were so passionate about this.
- [16:21]
Chris
I just don't like it, man. I just don't like it.
- [16:24]
David
This is exciting. Okay, it's now time for our favorites of the week. Andrew. Starting off with our favorite quote. And for me, the NBA officially announced their new All Star Game format. They're doing four teams, eight players each, three teams of all stars, one team of rising stars. Chuck Kenny, Shaq and Candace Parker are the coaches. Personally, I'm excited. I will say that this format for the rising stars games has made it much more interesting to me to watch. Now, the NBA chose this week of the NBA cup to make the announcement. Maybe trying to generate a little buzz, get people talking. Well, within minutes of the announcement, Kevin Durant was asked about the changes and said, quote, I hate it. I absolutely hate it. Now listen, that's not a good quote. It shouldn't be my favorite. In fact, it's a bad quote. He shouldn't have said it. But it did make me laugh because you could not script a worse rollout for this league. And it just kind of summed up this current funk the NBA is in where they just can't seem to do anything right. They can't get out of their own way. The story, no matter what it is, is always going to skew negative. And usually the negativity is coming from inside the house. So it did make me laugh, though. I hate it. I absolutely hate it. It's just so direct and explicit. He's not even like beating around the bush at all.
- [17:38]
Chris
Nope, nope. It's funny to me that it's, it's, it's a funny strategy to use because I don't think it's going to necessarily get them what they want. It's like, it's like you like having a cake that you're like, this cake. We know this cake is not good. It's not going to go. But what if we cut it into smaller pieces and then gave you the cake? Would you like it then? Still not going to like the cake. These guys still aren't going to try. They're obviously not going to try again. It's like, why are we, I don't know, I just say, I have the game, just play it. Who cares? I don't think anybody is sitting down and being like, man, just hate this All Star Game. It's, it's, it's mostly media and it's mostly the players. I don't think anybody else cares. I really don't.
- [18:29]
David
I will say though, the whole idea with the Elam ending was that, yeah, okay, even if, even if this game sucks, we will get a game winning shot. We will guarantee a game winning shot. Now they have guaranteed multiple game winning shots and I bet at least one of those is genuinely interesting to watch. Like, one of those shots will be a close game and it will be cool. So I get the calculus of, can we rig this to at least generate more moments? Because that's ultimately all this is going to be. The All Star Game is a series of highlights for most people. And so I do think this will generate more highlights and for that reason is a good idea. But Kevin Durant hates it. Absolutely hates it.
- [19:11]
Chris
That's really funny. It's really funny. I have a couple quotes. I just thought this was really funny from Mark Dignott last night. He's been pretty frustrated with the lack of foul calls that J Dub has gotten for the Thunder all season. And then last night he was talking to the media after the game, and he said, here's a statistic. Jalen Williams and I both had the same amount of free throws tonight. We both shot zero. And all I did was call a couple timeouts, called some plays, clapped a couple times, and when we scored and he was in the third of the defense for 48 minutes, I just thought that was just really funny. It's like a. It's a. Like a boiling point for him and for the team. And I get it. Like, Jalen does generate a lot of contact, and because he's so strong sometimes, like, he just doesn't look like he's taking on the contact, and so he doesn't get the calls. And so I just wonder if it's gonna end up making him a more of a complainer and then people won't like him as much because he's gonna have to complain to get the calls. It's just something I'm monitoring because he stayed after the game to talk to the officials about it last night in Orlando. So just something to monitor with him because he's just an outrageously likable guy. But I just wonder if the. The officiating is going to force him to be less likable because of that. My next one, this is just a fun one. If. If you've been watching games and you see these coaches challenges, there are. There are some officials that are very bland about it. There are some that, like, don't quite know what to say when they get up there, and they kind of fumble over their words a little bit. But there's one that stands above the rest, and that's Bill Kennedy. And he is so funny. He had this one Thursday night at the Kings game, and I just. I just want to share it with you guys. I just hope that you enjoy the. The stylings of Bill Kennedy at the mic after reviewing the play. The defensive foul that was called on number 23 has been overturned. Unfortunately, the foul is now on number nine, and the Lakers will retain possession of the ball on the side. The coach's challenge is successful. He is so funny to me. He, like, he paused. He does dramatic pauses to let the crowd boo. He's like, unfortunately, the foul call was on number nine. Like, he is just so funny about it and is. I think he's just he's the best in the league at this. There's, there's nobody better than Bill Kennedy at this. And I think he, he deserves some credit here because he just continues to show up and uses it as a way to perform. And there's no doubt about it. You see it across the NBA all the time. It's getting shared on Twitter and on Reddit and everything. But I just had to mention it because I love anytime that there's a challenge and Bill Kennedy is the one to step up to the mic. You know you're getting more entertainment. So shout out Bill Kennedy on not just that particular one, but almost everyone that he does is very funny.
- [22:20]
David
So that brings us to our favorite stat this week. And for me, I'm going to Charlotte and looking at LaMelo Ball's usage now. I knew he was having a crazy statistical season. He's averaging 30 points per game, but I didn't realize how much he is doing this season. His usage percentage is 39.3% now. That is the highest in the league. It is also the third highest ever. The only two players who have ever had higher usage percentages were James Harden, Russell Westbrook, and those guys only did it once. He's taking 24.4 shots per game. The last time someone did that was Harden in 1819 and before that it was Kobe in 0506. Now isn't that wild? No, it's.
- [23:07]
Chris
That's the Smush Parker Lakers too. I mean, come on.
- [23:12]
David
I know. And I was. I obviously, I remember that as like a bad season and I went back and they still won like 45 games. Kobe was just that good. Shout out Chris Mim this Lamelo season I don't think is going to be as memorable as those seasons because The Hornets are 7 and 20. But what LaMelo is doing in Charlotte does deserve to be mentioned because it is wild. I mean his previous points per per game high was like 23 or 24 points and he's up to 30 points per game. And it's, it's really interesting if you go look at some of his play type data, like he's taking double, he's double the amount of isolation possessions that he's ever taken in his career. He's not very good at them either. He's actually pretty inefficient on isolations, but just every play type is more than he's ever done before and I just didn't realize that was going on in Charlotte.
- [24:07]
Chris
My, my stat is just honestly looking at the box score from this Golden State warriors game, specifically, just looking at Golden State's box score, it looks like a first quarter box score, honestly. Like, it just is insane that this was like an entire game. Steph Curry did not make a field goal.07 from the field ended up with two points. Draymond Green did not make a field goal. He was 04 in this game. Dennis Schroeder did get the start. Kaminga is coming off the bench again. I guess the Kaminga era is over as a starter. I don't know. It's just a really, just a goofy box score to look at. And this came from Reddit. The last time that Steph was held without a field goal, March 8, 2018, he played 2 minutes and 23 seconds. March 11, 2012, he played 9 minutes and 13 seconds. And then February 29, 2012, he only played only 3 seconds in the game. So this was just a very, very odd performance from a team that had some rest. They had like the energy of a new guy coming in and Dennis Schroeder, and they laid about the craziest egg that you could think of. And then at the end of the game, did you see Brandon Pajimski go for the layup at the end of the game, which. Which gave Pajimski a career high 21 points? He it and it pulled them within 51. It was just a like, bizarre move. It's like, even if, even if you knew you're doing that to get your career high, don't do it in that game because now it just becomes like this memory in everybody's mind about you as a player. It's just strange. Like the whole night was strange, all the stats were strange. Just bizarre. Just a bizarre game that I don't think anybody really expected.
- [25:49]
David
Andrew, it wouldn't have been a memory if you would just shut up about it. Okay? Brandon, he could have had his career high if you would just stop talking about it.
- [25:56]
Chris
I will never forget. I will never forget Pajimsky, who like went for the layups like to pull within 51. But Jimski, that's bizarre. Just a bizarre game.
- [26:08]
David
And shout out to Reddit user Gridiron K for that Steph stat.
- [26:11]
Chris
That's right, shout out Gridiron K. Next.
- [26:14]
David
Up, our favorite player this week. Now, there's been a lot of talk about this player off the court, wondering where he's going to go, how much money he should make, whether he's worth it at his age, but for one night, forgot all about those things and just watch Jimmy Butler have a crazy game against Detroit. His final line, 35, 19 and 10. With four steals in 44 minutes, the Heat were down 16. The only reason this game was still on my screen because YouTube TV has that multi view. Otherwise I would have turned it off. The heat, we're down 16 with 5 1/2 minutes left in this game. Jimmy and Tyler Hero bring them all the way back. They force overtime, they get up by six in overtime and then they eventually lose to a Tim Hardaway Jr. Heater. I think he hit three threes in a row. It was an incredibly fun game. As a neutral observer, I would have gone been going crazy as a fan of either of those teams. Oh my God. But it was also a great reminder of how dominant Jimmy Butler can still be. He is still so good when he, when it is peak Jimmy peak, Jimmy is still very good.
- [27:18]
Chris
Yeah, J J, Jimmy is a really good player that if they do end up trading him is going to help somebody immensely in the playoffs. I'm just like, can, can he just stay in the Eastern Conference? Like all the teams he would be great go to are out west and it's just man, like can we not already see that this is, this is a little imbalanced and now we want to send Jimmy Butler to the Western Conference and him be in the playoffs in the West. It's just, to me it just is insane. Stay out east, just stay with Miami. Jimmy. Mine is Giannis. I mean just what a performance at the cup for Giannis. You know, he had 32, 14 and nine with a stealing four blocks against Atlanta, just dominant. And then against OKC he had 26, 19 and 10 with two steals and three blocks and was just the, I mean the, the comparisons to Shaq happen and like you just can't help but talk about it when you're sitting there watching him in person just annihilate these guys. Particularly this. His spin move looks faster than ever to me. There's just no way to stop him. You're either going to foul him and he's going to get an and one because he's so fast or you're just, he's just going to score. You almost have. Those are your two choices. It's like do you just let him score or do you try to stop him and let him get the and one when he's on that spin. It's just unbelievable watching this guy and, and the thing to me that really stuck out in that game and Xena did a really good job pointing this out on the NBA Daily was just the passing because the Thunder were ready with to form a wall to keep him from getting into the paint. And it was those secondary, the secondary playmaking that would happen that just really changed the game. And to me I think that he looks like the best player in the world right now on a team that's really good. I know Jokic is having a great season. I think Giannis does not get the credit that he deserves a lot of times and he clearly is on a mission and he looks like a better player. Eric Naim has talked about the, just the improvement as a mid range shooter for him and just his continued improvementality and the guy is just an absolute monster and I think that he doesn't quite get the credit he deserves just because he has suffered injuries that have happened around the playoffs and it just makes you kind of forget him. But if he can stay healthy and I hope he does just because I want some battles in the Eastern Conference and not just the Celtics mowing through the Eastern Conference again. Like let's, let's get some battles, let's let Giannis battle with the Celtics because he's a real problem and I just don't know, I don't know who is like a good defensive matchup for him. He is, he is just an absolute beast and when he's passing and hitting his midi like that, I just don't know how you stop the guy. So my, my guy's Giannis for sure.
- [30:17]
David
Yeah. Give us healthy bucks because it's been a, it's been a minute in the playoffs. Healthy bucks. Okay. And finally our favorite moment this week. And for me it's not one single moment, but this was a really fun Russell Westbrook week. I didn't know if we'd get fun Westbrook weeks like this ever again. He got a standing ovation from Nuggets fans late in the Clippers game when he checked out after a steal and emphatic dunk that put an exclamation point on that win. He put up 18, 9 and 10 as a starter against the Kings on 8 of 13 shooting and what was probably his best all around game this season. And then in the loss to the Blazers on Thursday night, he puts up 19, 4 and 7 on 8 of 12 shooting. Now granted, he was the defender on a shot you're about to talk about. So it's not like it was a perfect week, but Ricky O'Donnell wrote a great article about Russ on Espionation titled Russell Westbrook is writing a perfect closing chapter with the Nuggets. It's all about the little things Russ is doing to provide value for the Nuggets this season. And I'm obviously biased as a Thunder fan, but it was just nice to see him have a week like this at this point in his career, because it's hard not to root for a guy who plays with this much energy.
- [31:24]
Chris
Yeah, he was not the problem for the Nuggets last night, I can tell you that. He certainly was not. Yeah, my key moment was the end of that game. It was just. It was weird because it's a game that we have all seen before many times, but it just didn't play out in the way that it typically does. Um, the Nuggets were down 17 going into the fourth quarter, and they rallied and there was a point where they were. They were up by two after this big time block from Russ and then an MPJ dunk at the other end and they went up two. And it just. That's a moment in a game because there. I think it's. We're under a minute now and I. You just think, okay, this is when the Nuggets just take hold of the game. And the Nuggets themselves have done this many times this season where it's a team that's inferior to them. They let them get this big lead and they fight back and they win the game at the end. This happens all the time with the Nuggets, and this one did not go their way. And Shane Sharp hit two free throws that tied it up. And then just the shot from Simons there was really tough, like on the move, almost in the mid range, bank shot moving toward out of bounds. And he. I mean, it was just a tough shot, like right at the buzzer too. You know, a lot of these shots are not like at the buzzer, you know, necessarily. And so to see him hit that shot, like right at the buzzer, you know. Denver outscored Portland 3722 in the fourth quarter. Yeah, it. It just felt like all. All momentum was just crushed for the Portland Trailblazers. And credit to Anthony. Anthony Simons is having. He's a really good player having a pretty good scoring season and a guy that I don't know if the Blazers want to build around him or not, but if. If he was somehow, and I don't know if this is the role that he would necessarily want, but if he was like some scoring guard off the bench for a really good team, like he could help a team win championship, like he's that good of a Score. I don't know if he wants to take that role or not, but, you know, Simons is a really, really nice player and he showed even in that moment that, you know, he can go create. And, and Russ had been good defensively. I know that Russ has not been a good defender or at least known as a good defender, but, you know, he, he contested that. Well, it was just a, a better offensive play from Simons and so that was just a, a wild, wild moment last night.
- [33:48]
David
Yeah, Simons, he's, he, he's frustrating to me because a couple years ago when he had that run in January where he was just like unconscious and he was so just feel like he, he's never quite gotten back to that. And this year the issue has been his three point shooting. Like, it's just down. He's shooting 33% on high volume, on really good volume after shooting, you know, 39 last year, 38 the year before, 41 the year before. So if he can get that shooting back to where it was, I, I think we'll start seeing him like he's, he's averaging 17.7 points per game this year, which for him is down. Like last year he averaged almost 23 points per game. And on this Blazers team, he should absolutely be back up there. And I think if his three point shooting comes back around, he will get back up there by the end of the season. But yeah, he's just been a frustrating player for me because I keep wanting to see like the next step from Anthony Simons and it just hasn't totally happened yet. And maybe it won't happen with the Blazers. Maybe like you said, it'll happen on, you know, if he gets traded on another team. I really like him though, as an offensive player.
- [34:51]
Chris
It's a great player. I just think that he may be in an outsized role, which is like not that big of a deal. It happens to players all the time that are in these kinds of situations. And if he can just find the right role and the right team for him, I think that he could really flourish. So I'd be interested to see where his career goes. Something else that I'm interested in is the Indiana Pacers, and we're going to talk about them with Scott Agnes right after this. Quick break.
- [35:19]
David
All right, Andrew, it is time for the Wheel of Fandom, the weekly segment where we spin a wheel, it lands on a team, and we become fans of that team for the next week. And last week, the wheel landed on the Indiana Pacers, who broke the Wheel of fandom curse. They won all three of their games this week against Philly, New Orleans and Phoenix. They have won four of their last five. Don't ask who the one loss was to. And now our 13 and 15 eighth in the East. According to Cleaning the Glass, the pacers have the 14th ranked offense and 23rd ranked defense. Andrew, if our favorite team is the Pacers, who is our guest?
- [35:56]
Chris
It's Scott Agnes. You can find him at the Fieldhouse Files substack. He also has a podcast. Scott, thank you so much for joining us today.
- [36:06]
Ethan
Hey guys, good to be on with you.
- [36:07]
Chris
So after losing four in a row in early December, the Pacers have now won four of five including that really impressive road win against the Suns. Does it feel like this team has finally broken out of this early season Funko after like having some of like the biggest improvements during that during this.
- [36:22]
Ethan
Current stretch for sure because there was a lot going on even going back to really training camp and then leading into the first game of the season where in his first five minutes stint James Wiseman, who may have been your backup center this season from third string, ruptures his Achilles and then 10 days later your true backup center and Isaiah Jackson suffers in Achilles. I don't think this team has had more than one Achilles that I know of in like the last 15 years and to have two in the first 10 days of the season, that is complete shock right there. Then it's almost like a trickle down effect or like it becomes contagious, I don't know. But their top three wing defenders and they're not a great defensive team as it is, their top three wing defenders suffer injuries and so now they have a big setback there. Compound that with the first their start of the schedule which was road heavy for most part. Now though it's we're going to get our right now is the true barometer, Andrew. Right now we're really going to have a feel for this team after the next three weeks. They're on a road trip right now before Christmas, go back out on the road, come home for a couple playoff teams. So we'll know exactly where this team is and how they are doing probably by about January 8th or 10th.
- [37:37]
David
You mentioned the backup centers and the Pacers did make a trade this week to get Thomas Bryant. He only played five minutes in the game against the Suns. Are you expecting him to have a like kind of traditional backup center role on this team or do you think he'll maybe just be more of like an end of a bench guy.
- [37:53]
Ethan
No, I do expect him to be a backup center because they didn't have that. They only had Miles Turner, which some would even argue he's not even a traditional center. Right. He's playing more away from the bat, away from the basket. He's not a great rebounder. He's become a better rebounder. And that's probably the biggest flaw, if you simplify it, is this team is not a good rebounding team. Secondly though, it's probably defense and that's what it's been probably for the last three or four years now. They've gotten better. You alluded to the fact they're ranked 23rd in defensive rating right now. I think like 10 days ago they were 29th. So they have been much better over these last couple of weeks. I think Cor correlating with that fact is Andrew Nemhard the guard coming back and, and he's been such an influence already. He's not a guy that's going to put up the numbers or have the double doubles or a 30 point night necessarily. Now in his rookie year we saw what he did, a game winning shot against the Lakers and I think he did have like a big performance in Golden State, which is notable because they're playing in Golden State next week. But Andrew Nemhard's returns probably been the biggest factor in the recent success. And then to the greater point here, I think they've done a much better job now of starting to settle in, get a little bit more comfortable with what they are.
- [39:05]
David
Yeah, that defense. So I'm looking at cleaning the glass. In the last two weeks over this four and one period, they've been the ninth ranked defense so that's definitely helped them jump up. So Tyres Halberton, he has been a, a story through the early season even as he's been finding more consistency. It's hard not to think about the player he was at the beginning of last season. I was wondering how you think about that stretch now. Like is your expectation that he's eventually going to get back to that level?
- [39:31]
Ethan
I think to an extent. The challenges back then, right. They were flying under the radar both as a team and as a player. What we're seeing more so now is team scheming against it, especially this physicality that everybody is talking about. Tyrese hadn't complained about it. He says, you know, I love basketball so this is good for the game. Rick stood up on his behalf and saying, hey look, I'm trying to get a technical out there certain games because you know this Team is out here swarming him from half court where he can't even move like, it's like a defensive end is all over him, not able to get the ball. And again, to reference Andrew Nemhard, him returning to the lineup helps alleviate that stress and pressure for him to be the only ball handler other than TJ McConnell primarily when he's out there. But you go back to what's working right now, I think a lot of it is Tyrese clicking a little bit and they've had multiple instances here in the last two weeks, which I think is a big factor of having three and four days between games. Right. We just had that with the NBA cup. And Tyrese for the most part has not really had significant time off for the last two years. That's a big factor that I always try to emphasize. He played with the USA World Team, World cup team, went right into the magical season last year, felt pressure all season long not just to show up for his team, but for himself by playing the 65 games and eventually qualifying for all NBA. And he later after the fact admitted, yeah, of course I was not going to miss it as many games as I needed to. I was going to make sure I got those 65 games in. Well, he had that hamstring injury in January. Then he had another injury in the playoffs that kept him out of the final two conference finals games. Then he had a couple more injuries during Team USA and his training to get ready for this season. So he has not been completely healthy and therefore also didn't have a. A beneficial off season, I'd argue. Right. Like where you're working on your game, where you're balancing rest with working on things that maybe counters to how teams are defending you. So Tyrese clicking has has been significant and yes, I do think he'll get back to more of what he was. But I think you add Pascal Siakam into the equation and he's kind of that best player at the moment.
- [41:43]
Chris
I'm interested in what you think about Benedict Matheran. He's always been a productive player, but last season people seemed to sour on him a bit in part of the on off numbers and all of that looked pretty bad in this season. However, the Pacers have been good in his minutes. His efficiency scoring, even his rebounding is up quite a bit. Where have you seen his biggest improvements from last year to this year?
- [42:05]
Ethan
Yeah, so he's been the one benefactor of all those wings being out because he would have been been playing off the bench, but instead here he's now getting the starting role and starting minutes. And so first of all, I think Andrew, the number one thing has been his rebounding many games now he's, he's chasing after the almost stealing rebounds like we, we previously saw here several years ago with Lance Stevenson and Ben would just go get him. And you can tell that it's been said, but you can also visibly tell that's been one of the things that the coaching points have made a point on. The other thing is I think his vision and utilizing that vision has been much improved. He's used to being the best player out on the floor. He's used to being the focal player who can put his head down, drive to the basket, laid in. Well, oftentimes the best is just moving it around the perimeter, just keeping the ball moving. And so I think some of his passes in his vision and just utilizing it, it's always been there. I just don't think he's ever went to. It has been the other thing and all along he continues to be kind of the best player on this roster. Getting to the basketball, drawing contact and getting to the foul line.
- [43:08]
David
So Scott, it's that time of year where every fan base starts making fake trades and I'm assuming Pacers fans are no different. You kind of alluded to it earlier, but what like player archetypes would you be looking for when you're thinking about potential trade targets for the Pacers?
- [43:23]
Ethan
This is easy. It's the most coveted position. Six foot eight wing. That's what they need. They need a Paul Jordan.
- [43:29]
David
Okay, well that's easy.
- [43:30]
Ethan
It makes it easy for Pacer fans. I so I continue to reference it, but that's the type of guy George reference a little bit of everything.
- [43:38]
David
Okay. Is there anyone like is has Pacers fans thrown out any names that seem like semi realistic?
- [43:46]
Ethan
Not in particular. We just.
- [43:47]
Chris
It's.
- [43:48]
Ethan
Yeah, to me it's just Al. It's just a running joke that whoever you play that is probably a 6 foot 8 wing is going to go off. So you know, it's Scotty Barnes one night and Kevin Durant the other night and I mean he's obviously taller, but at least 6 foot 8. Those guys have tremendous success. So. So also that's why they struggle with the more quote unquote modern teams like Toronto, Orlando, who has just full of size and athleticism and length. They give the Pacers all kinds of fits for that reason. So filling in that gap at the three spot would be their number one focus.
- [44:23]
Chris
So Alex and I were both Fans of Jairus Walker during the draft process like a lot of people were and we've been a little surprised at how few minutes that he's gotten or at least the few minutes he got his rookie season. He's played a little bit more this season. What have been your impressions of his game and where he's at?
- [44:40]
Ethan
Yeah, I would say offensively come along better than I thought to this point, especially his three point shot. So last year the challenge in all this is he was drafted to fill a need and then one month later they acquired Obi Toppin and six months later they acquired Pascal Siakam. Those two guys obviously fill in the fourth spot. So here's this 19 year old rookie who has a lot to learn, who played in a very different system under Kelvin Sampson at Houston. That required much different things of him and he acknowledged like there was a steep learning curve and trying to break old habits, especially what he could do defensively at Houston vs what the Pacers are trying to impress upon him and force them to do and, and all those sorts of things. So defensively I think I expected more and I've gotten less and offensively conversely, I think that's where he really benefited in particular from his significant time last year in the G league is he didn't hesitate from three and now he's shooting I think about 40% from distance. But you would like to see more from him, demand more from him. And the hope coming into this season guys was okay. We know there's not many minutes at the four spot starting at summer league. They, they tried him at the three spot and said going into the season for you to get on the floor you're probably going to have to play more at the three because that's the spot of need. Right. And so that was one of his emphasis for the first couple of months leading into training camp.
- [46:01]
David
Have there been any signs that he could potentially fill that role defensively in terms of guarding those big wings?
- [46:08]
Ethan
Not, not, not, not specifically, no. I would say there's bright points but as many as of those there are. There is also some questionable like what do you do, what you're in the wrong spot or you didn't fall away your man and little things like that. So I don't think there's anything convincing one way or another which probably speaks to his lack of experience and his age a little bit. And again like Mather and he benefited from these early minutes that were made available due to injury. I will mention too here going into, you know, any season here in the last probably decade, the one position the Pacers had not had to worry about was center. And so it's notable that this season, that's probably been their biggest issue because of the injuries. But here's why it's even more notable. Isaiah Jackson, who suffered that Achilles injury, he's in a contract year. They didn't have an agreement coming off his rookie extension. Secondly, Miles Turner, they could not, by CBA rules, negotiate at all. So that window has to wait till free agency after he did a renegotiation and extend over like a year and a half ago. So the Pacers will enter free agency without a center under the Ross on their roster, which is different from, you know, when. When Pacer fans were like, do we really want to see Turner and Sabonis? And. And because of that, several years ago, neither player was really able to maximize their efforts. So that's something I'm significantly watching here in the next six months as well. Because also, if you're in this position and you don't want to bring back Miles, or maybe you can't afford him because the luxury taxes may be something else we need to get into, then you would trade off that player. But right now, they don't have that benefit right now, just due to health and youth.
- [47:48]
David
Yeah. What are the expectations for a potential contract for Miles Turner? Because I feel like for so long, for every other fan base, he's been that unicorn type that feels gettable, you know, and. And this is the first time when he's actually going to be like unrestricted free agent. Right. Any. Anyone could go after him. I mean, is your expectant expectation that he's going to get paid a lot by the Pacers just because he is so unique?
- [48:12]
Ethan
Well, here's the challenge in that they are right against the up against the luxury tax now. That's where, if anything, I could see them making moves is to offload a contract or two. Because the Pacers front office essentially chose to run it back this season. They liked what they saw last year. Obviously, the team had success. I call it a little bit of fool's gold, though, given the injuries. But they definitely outperformed anybody's expectation. The goal was to get to the playoffs again for the first time in about a half dozen years, and they reached the conference finals. But in terms of Miles, I think this is probably that last significant contract for him. And if you're him, you're probably pushing for 25, 27 million. I think you look at a guy like Isaiah Hartenstein who just Got that, for example, and they faced him in the playoffs. But if you're the Pacers, you have to have significant reservations giving that much, given your current status, how you're not a contending team right now, how you have two max contracts already with Tyrese and Siakam, and on top of that, Halliburton's contract is a supermax, which takes another 10 million or so roughly, from the availability. So there's. There's no simple equation here. And I'll. I'm curious how far the Pacers will be willing to go.
- [49:24]
David
Well, Scott, thank you for answering all of our Pacers questions. It is now time to play Andrew versus the Beat. Pacers edition. Now, Andrew versus the Beat. Every week we have Andrew go head to head against an NBA beat writer. This week. Scott. Agnes. Now, Scott, I've come up with eight questions, all about the Pacers. Some are easy, some are hard. You're gonna give me a number between 1 and 8, and it'll correspond to a question. If you get it right, you'll get at least two points. If you get it wrong, Andrew will have a chance to steal for one. Now, we will go back and forth until all questions are asked and answered. So to start us off, I just need a number between 1 and 8.
- [50:00]
Ethan
3.
- [50:01]
David
Question number 3. Indiana is shooting 44.4% on corner threes this season per clean the glass, which is the second highest percentage in the league. This team in Indiana's division leads the league in corner three percentage at 49.3%. That is the difference between one and two.
- [50:25]
Chris
Oh, my word.
- [50:27]
David
So, Scott, this is a team in.
- [50:28]
Ethan
Is it on me?
- [50:29]
David
Yes, it is. Your question.
- [50:31]
Ethan
I'll take Cleveland.
- [50:33]
David
That is incorrect. Andrew, you have a chance to steal.
- [50:40]
Chris
Oh, boy. Cleveland was the obvious answer in my brain as well. Chicago.
- [50:50]
David
Andrew, that is also incorrect. The correct answer was the NBA cup champions, the Milwaukee Bucks.
- [50:59]
Chris
Oh, okay.
- [51:00]
Ethan
I hesitated with them, to be clear, just because of. They took a while to get going here. So I figure that number wasn't quite there yet.
- [51:08]
David
I wonder if it's like all taurine prince. I didn't actually look it up.
- [51:13]
Ethan
Yeah.
- [51:15]
David
Okay. Andrew, board is yours.
- [51:18]
Chris
Number one.
- [51:20]
David
Question number one, The Pacers are one of two teams to have beaten both teams that appeared in last year's finals. They've already beaten the Celtics and the Mavs. Who is the only other team to have also done that? Beaten the Celtics and the Mavs.
- [51:35]
Chris
Beaten the Celtics and the Mavs. Oh, boy.
- [51:39]
David
I think Celtics. What do they got? Five losses?
- [51:43]
Chris
Yeah.
- [51:44]
David
Six Losses. Yeah, I forgot they lost to the Bulls. Oh, six losses.
- [51:49]
Chris
I'm wondering if this. I can't remember if this team beat the Mavericks or not. Is it Memphis? I know that Memphis has beaten the Celtics.
- [51:58]
David
I do remember that. But that is not the team. Andrew, Memphis has not beaten Dallas. Scott, do you have any guesses?
- [52:05]
Ethan
I have no idea why they come to mind sitting on the brain. Maybe because they're such a disruptor for the Pacers. But I say Charlotte.
- [52:12]
David
Charlotte is definitely a disruptor. That is incorrect. That would be wildly impressive though. The correct answer is the Golden State warriors back when they were 12 and 3 once upon a time. Okay, Scott, the board is yours.
- [52:28]
Ethan
Let's just go with two, please.
- [52:30]
David
Question number two. The Pacers are taking the highest percentage of their shots from the mid range since the 201920 season. Who led the Pacers in mid range shots per game in the 201920 season?
- [52:45]
Chris
Oh my gosh. What a question.
- [52:49]
Ethan
Malcolm Brogdon would be my guess.
- [52:52]
David
That is incorrect. Andrew, board is yours.
- [53:01]
Chris
I don't know. T.J. warren. I don't know.
- [53:07]
David
Yeah, Andrew, that is absolutely correct. Of course it was bubble. Warren. Bubble. T.J. warren. So you get a point for that. All right, Andrew, the board is yours and you're on the board with one point.
- [53:20]
Chris
Okay, number four.
- [53:22]
David
Pascal Siakam's 25 points against the Suns on Thursday night was important for one reason. The Pacers now have a 20 point per game score as Siakam crossed the threshold and is now averaging 20.1 points per game. That leaves only three NBA teams who do not have any players averaging 20 points per game. How many can you name? Andrew? Yeah, one point per. Correct answer.
- [53:49]
Chris
One per. Okay, what about Utah?
- [53:53]
David
Utah is one. That is correct. Andrew.
- [53:57]
Chris
Okay, I kind of want to stay in the Northwest Division. Although I don't know if this team. I can't remember if this player has scored 20 points or not. I'll say the. The Blazers.
- [54:13]
David
Andrew, that is correct.
- [54:16]
Chris
Yes. Okay, you say there's one more team.
- [54:22]
David
There's one more team. You could get all three.
- [54:27]
Chris
Who doesn't have a Bona star.
- [54:30]
David
A.J. green is shooting 64 from the corner. Or Milwaukee.
- [54:35]
Chris
Oh, well, duh. He's been a. He's been a monster shooter. He hit that moon ball three. That was like heavily contested in at the cup. That was crazy impressive. What about Brooklyn?
- [54:50]
David
Brooklyn? Andrew, that is incorrect. How could you forget about Cam Thomas, Andrew?
- [54:58]
Chris
Oh, how could I. Dang it.
- [54:59]
David
How could you forget? Scott, do you have any guesses for the last Team.
- [55:03]
Chris
That's so dumb.
- [55:05]
Ethan
Oh, my original inclination was New Orleans just because everybody's been in and out of that roster. Has anyone played enough to do 20 points per game? So I'll lean into that.
- [55:17]
David
It's a good guess. This one was the toughest one because it doesn't sound real. It is. The Houston Rockets. Houston Rockets. They have two guys right below Jalen Green. Albert Shangoon.
- [55:28]
Chris
Interesting.
- [55:28]
David
No. 1 at 20. Okay, Scott, the board is yours.
- [55:33]
Ethan
Okay, I'll go. Let's just go down. The list was five.
- [55:37]
David
Okay. Among Pacers who have played at least 20 games this season, which player has the lowest average shot distance? In other words, the average shot this player takes is closer to the basket than any other player on the team.
- [55:52]
Ethan
But has played at least 20 games.
- [55:55]
Chris
Correct. Huh? Let's play 20 games.
- [56:04]
Ethan
That's the hardest part in all this. It's like otherwise James Wiseman. Like Moses Brown.
- [56:09]
Chris
Right, Moses?
- [56:15]
Ethan
This is great radio. It's got to be a wing, right?
- [56:23]
David
Closest to the basket.
- [56:26]
Ethan
I have no good guess.
- [56:31]
David
Well, you can always just throw out a Pacer.
- [56:33]
Ethan
Yeah.
- [56:34]
David
There's always a chance.
- [56:37]
Ethan
Jairus Walker.
- [56:39]
David
Jerus Walker. He has played 28 games. Let me look up his average shot distance. That is incorrect.
- [56:46]
Ethan
I figured there's no way.
- [56:48]
David
Yeah, he's a 16.8ft. Andrew, what is your guess?
- [56:53]
Chris
Ben ma.
- [56:55]
David
Ben Math. 12.4ft. No, this player, his average shot is only from eight feet away from the basket. It is T.J. mcConnell.
- [57:05]
Ethan
Oh, duh.
- [57:06]
Chris
That's so bad. Yeah.
- [57:08]
Ethan
Everything is layups in those. Yes. That was bad. Yeah.
- [57:12]
Chris
God, that rocks. That's amazing.
- [57:14]
David
When you. When you hear the name, it's like, oh, yes, obviously. Okay, Andrew, the board is yours.
- [57:22]
Chris
6.
- [57:23]
David
6. The Pacers traded for Thomas Bryant this week. What is Thomas Bryant's career high in points? Now you get to choose who answers first. You can make Scott answer first, and then you go higher or lower. Or you can answer first and Scott will go higher or lower.
- [57:39]
Chris
Okay. I will say 33.
- [57:47]
David
Okay. Andrew has set the bar at 33 points for Thomas Bryant's career high.
- [57:53]
Chris
I've been going too low in the past weeks, and I feel now. That feels like uncomfortably high, to be honest.
- [58:00]
Ethan
But I always go back to Andrew. There's a reason this question was asked.
- [58:05]
Chris
Yeah.
- [58:05]
Ethan
What is the anomaly here? I'll. I'll go lower, even though I don't feel good about it.
- [58:11]
David
Andrew, you were within two points of the correct answer, and the correct answer was 31, which means Scott gets the points. All right, so it is now three to one.
- [58:26]
Chris
Shoot.
- [58:26]
David
Scott, you have control the board. If you get this next question, you will tie it up.
- [58:29]
Ethan
Let's do seven, please.
- [58:32]
David
All right. While Tyrese Halliburton hasn't gotten off to the start he wanted this season, he did have a game against the Pelicans where he hit nine three pointers. The third time in his career that he has done that. There are only two other Pacers in franchise history who have hit at least nine threes in a game. Who are they? And you do get one point per correct answer.
- [58:52]
Ethan
Paul George for one.
- [58:55]
David
That is correct. Can you get the other name? And I will say there are a lot of reasonable, interesting.
- [59:04]
Chris
Yeah, there's. There's some like low hanging fruit here with some of these guys.
- [59:08]
Ethan
There's one massive game. I remember C.J. miles going off. I don't think he hit quite this many.
- [59:14]
Chris
C.J. miles?
- [59:16]
Ethan
Yeah, it was in Washington.
- [59:17]
Chris
What a poll.
- [59:18]
Ethan
Victor Oladipo. I don't think he pushed to nine is my only hesitation there.
- [59:24]
Chris
Nine is a lot. Nine is a lot of made threes.
- [59:27]
David
Yeah. I will say there was a big cutoff between eight and nine. There were like eight players who had hit eight, but only three.
- [59:34]
Ethan
That track nine.
- [59:36]
Chris
Okay.
- [59:36]
Ethan
Oh, I feel like this just happened in the last few years, too. Who am I missing? Let's just go with Victor.
- [59:47]
David
I guess that is incorrect. Andrew, you have a chance to steal what name?
- [59:55]
Chris
But are you going to go with Buddy?
- [59:58]
David
Makes a lot of sense, but also wrong. It was actually a name that you mentioned earlier. It was T.J. warren.
- [60:06]
Ethan
Oh, yes, he did have that one.
- [60:11]
David
All right, so the game is three to two. Andrew, you have to get this last question right to win the game. If Scott gets it right, it will lead to a tie, which will lead to sudden death.
- [60:22]
Chris
Okay.
- [60:22]
David
Benedict Matheran is getting back to the line again this season, averaging five free throw attempts per game. The second time he's done that in his career. Since 1990, there have only been nine pacers to average five free throw attempts per game over the course of a season. And we're going to name them all. So how this works, Andrew will give me a name and then Scott will give me a name. We'll go back and forth until one of you stumbles. So all this player has to do is over the course of a season, average at least five free throw attempts per game.
- [60:53]
Chris
Okay.
- [60:54]
David
They just had to do it at least once.
- [60:59]
Chris
Who? What about Domas?
- [61:02]
David
Demonic Sabonis? He is on the list. Andrew, over to Scott.
- [61:10]
Ethan
I would Think Reggie did once.
- [61:13]
David
Reggie is on the list. Yes. He did it multiple times, I believe. Andrew.
- [61:20]
Chris
What about PG Paul George?
- [61:24]
David
He's on the list. Andrew. Back to Scott.
- [61:28]
Ethan
Danny Granger.
- [61:30]
David
Danny Granger is on the list. Back to Andrew.
- [61:36]
Chris
Oh, boy.
- [61:38]
David
Now it's getting interesting.
- [61:40]
Chris
This is getting interesting. What about Victor Oladipo?
- [61:46]
David
Victor Oladipo. Andrew. He is not on the list. Andrew. Scott. Do you have any other guesses?
- [61:55]
Ethan
So you said five players in total in franchise history.
- [61:59]
David
It's nine, so there's actually five left. There's five times left. It could be, yeah. Other ideas?
- [62:05]
Ethan
Do we go back to A.B. no. Those ABA days were good.
- [62:11]
David
Yeah. This is only since 1990, though. Oh, so this is. Yeah, yeah, fair enough. Previous to that.
- [62:17]
Ethan
Just like, to give them credit, I guess. Right.
- [62:19]
Chris
Did Jermaine do it?
- [62:22]
Ethan
MVP. Yeah.
- [62:23]
David
Jermaine O'Neill is on the list. Any other names you guys want to throw out while I try to come up with a sudden death question?
- [62:32]
Ethan
Oh.
- [62:35]
Chris
You said Granger. What about psycho? T, P?
- [62:40]
Ethan
Shout out to Tyler Handsboro right there.
- [62:43]
David
No. So the older names, the really older names. Detliff Shrimp.
- [62:47]
Ethan
Yep.
- [62:48]
David
Did it. Michael Williams, which I don't think you would have ever gotten.
- [62:51]
Chris
I would not have gotten that.
- [62:52]
David
And then did it once. Jeff Teague. And then Teague. Jeff Teague did it once. And then the other name. Meta World Peace, which. That one.
- [63:05]
Chris
Interesting. Interesting.
- [63:07]
David
Okay, that means. That means the score is tied three to three. So we're going to go into sudden death.
- [63:14]
Chris
Oh, boy. Okay.
- [63:15]
David
And for sudden death, we are going to do the franchise top 10 in most triple doubles. Okay. Franchise top 10 in most triple doubles. And I'm going to let Scott guess first, and then Andrew will guess and we'll go back and forth.
- [63:35]
Chris
Oh, no. I am not gonna do. Not gonna do good in this.
- [63:41]
Ethan
Let me have the. Let me. We'll start with Tyrese, obviously.
- [63:46]
David
Tyrese Halliburton. Now. Okay, I am going to have to check on this. I wish I hadn't have asked this question now because the. The person. The person. The people, the guys who are number 10, there's like five of them tied for two, so I wonder if he. Because he is not on the list, but I wonder if he actually did make the list. So I am talking right now because I'm doing a stat head search, and I'm going to find this out right now. Don't worry, Andrew. It's not going to take any time at all because stat head is always super quick. I'm there. Tyrese Halliburton. Has only had one triple double in his career. Scott. I am sorry. In his career. So he is not in the top 10 list. Which means, Andrew, to win the week, you just need to name one Pacer.
- [64:39]
Chris
One of my favorite Pacers of all time. He surely had one. I'll be. I will be so mad at myself. I will not forgive myself the entire weekend.
- [64:48]
David
To be clear, he needs to have two.
- [64:50]
Ethan
Yeah, that's where I messed up. I thought we were doing any Pacer with a triple double.
- [64:54]
Chris
I think he's. He had to have had multiple. He had to have had multiple. And I just would love to just hear his name one more time on this podcast. And that's Elaine Stevenson. Lance Stevenson.
- [65:04]
David
Ooh, Lance Stevenson. Lance Stevenson, in his career had five triple doubles. Andrew, five triple doubles. Congrats on the win. And even more fun than that, he did it all in one season. Five triple doubles.
- [65:21]
Chris
Seriously?
- [65:22]
David
Yeah. Now that the franchise leader, I think it was 13, 14. Yeah.
- [65:28]
Ethan
All Star land season. Sir Lancelot season.
- [65:32]
Chris
Sir Lancelot season.
- [65:34]
David
Demonic Sabonis. He had 18. So he. He is the.
- [65:39]
Chris
Oh, wow.
- [65:39]
David
Is the franchise leader by a mile. But some other guys. Detliff Shrimp, Vern Fleming, of course, Vern. You can't forget about Verne. Mark Jackson, Mickey Johnson, Chuck Person, Jamal Tinsley, Paul George. And T.J. mcConnell has had two.
- [65:56]
Chris
Oh, T.J. man. Go check out Scott's work at the field house files on substack. Scott, thank you so much for coming on.
- [66:04]
Ethan
Absolutely. Thanks, guys. This is fun.
- [66:07]
David
All right, Andrew. That was Pacers week, and the Pacers broke the curse. They won all three games. Maybe the wheel is turning.
- [66:14]
Chris
Unreal.
- [66:15]
David
Could be exciting. Could be exciting. Now, this next one is going to be a big one this next week because we're not doing a show the week of Christmas, which means whatever team we land on, it's going to get two solid weeks.
- [66:27]
Chris
They'll actually get three weeks because we're going to. We're going to do a. We're going to do a draft show the week of New Year's. So this is. This is even bigger than you thought, Al.
- [66:37]
David
Three weeks. Okay, I hope. I pray that it is a good team or just interesting. I'm just looking for an interesting.
- [66:45]
Chris
Interesting. Yeah.
- [66:46]
David
Let's see what we get. We're spinning the wheel. Our next wheel of fandom team will be the Charlotte Hornets. Charlotte Hornets.
- [67:04]
Chris
All right. Oh, boy.
- [67:06]
David
Three weeks.
- [67:07]
Chris
Charlotte Hornets fandom. Oh, man, that is. That is really funny. That is.
- [67:17]
David
Yeah.
- [67:17]
Chris
The.
- [67:19]
David
Their last game, they lost to the Wizards.
- [67:21]
Chris
Yeah. They did, I guess. Good news. It can't get. It can't get any worse. Maybe.
- [67:27]
David
Hey, they play a game at OKC on the 28th. So you'll be there?
- [67:32]
Chris
Listen, I'll get to go see them in person.
- [67:34]
David
To see them in person. That's exciting.
- [67:35]
Chris
That's right. That is exciting.
- [67:37]
David
Exciting. Yeah, they play pretty rare for the Wheel. You know what? They actually got a revenge game against the Wizards the day after Christmas, so that's something to look forward to. Wow. This is actually a pretty nice part of their schedule. They also get. It's on Chicago.
- [67:51]
Chris
It's on the road. It's on the road, Al. I don't get to watch them in. It's. It's at Charlotte. It's at Charlotte, unfortunately. Maybe up there you could.
- [68:01]
David
You could fly out there. I've heard Charlotte's a beautiful city.
- [68:03]
Chris
I would love to.
- [68:04]
David
Charlotte.
- [68:04]
Chris
Would love to go to Charlotte. Would love.
- [68:05]
David
Maybe we should do a little trip together. We should, three days after Christmas, leave our families and go watch the Hornets.
- [68:12]
Chris
Let's do it. Why are you doing this? What's the Wheel of fandom? You know, we're just.
- [68:18]
David
Well, hey, maybe this will be what the Hornets need to get back on track. Hey, they've got three weeks of Wheel helping them. Okay?
- [68:27]
Chris
That's right. Or maybe the wrath of the Wheel is back.
- [68:30]
David
Maybe we're about to find out.
- [68:32]
Chris
To destroy the Charlotte team. Hey, leave us a five star review on Apple Podcasts or read it on the show. Hey, if you leave it for the NBA Daily as well, we're going to read on the show because those guys have been doing a phenomenal job. If you were listening to the show while we were in Las Vegas, they just did such a great job of covering the cup and everything going on there. So please subscribe. Yesterday was a great show with John Krasinski and Jovan Buha. Yovan discussed, you know, trade targets for the Lakers. I thought that was really interesting. The return of Karl Anthony Towns with John. Just like the weirdness of Julius Randall. Really, really good stuff. So be sure to check that out. This one comes from Christoph 47511. Just stumbled onto this podcast a few months ago and I love it. Having a show each morning to look forward to. So much fun. All the hosts are thoughtful and interesting to listen to. Thank you. And go spurs, go. Thank you so much for leaving that review. Very much appreciate that. Please leave us more 5 star reviews and we will read them on the show. I got one more from Ty$Cube with a K5 stars, phenomenal show. Best NBA podcast by far. Great music, great energy, great league wide balance. I make it my first listen every day. Thank you so much for those reviews. So if you're not listening to the athletic NBA daily every day, it's pretty simple. It's pretty it's a bite size pod in your feed every day. We like to have beat writers from across the country on to kind of give insights on their teams. And you know Dave, Xena and S do a great job. So be sure to check that out. Hope you guys enjoy the weekend and the basketball again. We will not be back next week because of Christmas. Have a Merry Christmas, enjoy the basketball games and we will talk to you guys again in two weeks. As we head into the playoffs. It's safe to assume there will be a few calls made by the refs that will be hard to accept. But you know what isn't hard to accept? Discover. Believe it or not, Discover is accepted at 99 of places that take credit cards nationwide. You heard that right, 99%. So make a good call for your wallet and get Discover. Based on the February 2024 Nielsen report. Learn more at discover.com credit card this.
- [70:54]
Fiona
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Ethan
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Chris
Here's a show that we recommend.
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David
Hey guys, we have an exciting announcement about our podcast. For the past seven years, the Holderness Family Podcast has been the most favorite thing we do. We love getting to talk to experts. We love having meaningful conversations, just the two of us. And we also love hearing from you. But the thing we love most is being a place where you can laugh. A lot has changed in the last seven years and we feel very lucky that our audience is growing older with us. So in this in the spirit of that, we are relaunching our podcast. We are excited to introduce Laugh Lines with Kim and Penn Holderness. The Laugh Lines podcast will be all about aging together better and also being able to laugh about getting older. We hope you'll join us. Search Laugh Lines with Kim and Penn Holderness New episodes every Tuesday.
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Chris
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- [72:46]
Ethan
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