The Autism Little Learners Podcast

Episode #80 – Autism Little Learners Membership: Member Interviews Part 2

Host: Tara Phillips
Guests: Laura Wing (Special Education Teacher & Parent), Jordan Datto (Early Childhood Special Education Teacher)
Aired: July 23, 2024

Episode Overview

In this inspiring episode, Tara Phillips spotlights two standout members of the Autism Little Learners (ALL) Membership: Laura Wing and Jordan Datto. Both are special education teachers, and Laura brings a parent’s perspective as well. The episode dives into their journeys, challenges, and practical classroom strategies that have made a real impact on young autistic learners. The discussion centers on the power of community, evidence-based support, and creating neurodiversity-affirming, connected environments for children.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Introduction to Guests and Their Roles

[00:00 – 02:06]

• Tara introduces Jordan Datto, highlighting her active engagement in the membership community and on coaching calls.
• Jordan shares her experience teaching children ages 3–5 since 2017, noting her role often evolves year to year (itinerant, half-day, full day, and soon kindergarteners).
  • Notable quote:

    "I feel like my admin is like, yeah, just do what you want... That’s why I love you guys. Autism Little Learners, I have a community where I feel like what I'm doing is validated." – Jordan [03:01]

2. Why Jordan Joined the Membership

[03:18 – 05:41]

• Jordan describes feeling overwhelmed with changing classroom expectations and a lack of clear guidance.
• She found ALL while searching for resources and was drawn by having easy access to high-quality materials and a supportive learning community.
  • Notable quote:

    "It’s not just on Teachers Pay Teachers... I can access everything I want whenever I want for a small fee monthly, which is maybe I don’t get coffee every morning." – Jordan [03:42]

3. The Value of Community and Coaching

[05:41 – 06:41]

• Jordan explains how attending coaching calls and challenges helped her implement strategies in the classroom.
• The ALL community keeps her accountable and consistently exposes her to new (or sometimes forgotten) strategies.

4. Practical Strategies: Video Modeling Success

[07:02 – 10:28]

• Jordan highlights implementing video modeling after ALL training, specifically using a favorite toy to model transitions (e.g., coming inside after recess, handwashing, practicing toileting steps).
• Describes a successful moment when a student spontaneously followed her modeling—before she even showed them the recorded video.
  • Notable quote:

    "In your training, you’re like, just pull out a toy, like their favorite toy, and do it in the moment or whenever you can... My para’s like, Jordan, he's following you!" – Jordan [08:10]
    "It kind of takes the pressure off of the kids. They don’t have to perform." – Tara [09:46]

5. Challenges and Evolving Philosophy

[11:43 – 13:36]

• Jordan discusses that her main challenges are internal: feeling confident about her philosophy, not the students’ behaviors.
• Emphasizes the importance of respectful, neurodiversity-affirming approaches and evolving practices over time.
  • Notable quote:

    "It’s not the students that are hard. It’s you inside, feeling like you're doing the right thing." – Tara [12:25]
    "With the neurodiversity movement, I have changed how I have interacted with kids for 25 years... none of us are perfect, and we do the best we can." – Tara [12:39]

6. Advice for Prospective Members

[13:36 – 15:03]

• Jordan encourages others to join for the sense of connection and evidence-based support.
• Stresses how ALL bridges philosophical gaps that can be isolating in school settings, and that it’s equally valuable for educators and parents.
  • Notable quote:

    "I feel so connected within the membership and that missing piece... I know here that I am doing the right thing." – Jordan [13:36]

7. Laura Wing’s Story: Teacher and Adoptive Parent

[16:57 – 23:17]

• Laura introduces herself as a special education teacher and parent from Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario.
• Shares her journey teaching in different special education contexts, including launching a self-contained communication class for autistic students in March 2024.
• Powerful story of welcoming Lucas, her now-son, into their home during the pandemic, soon entering adoption. Lucas is nonverbal but communicates using multiple methods (PECS, gestures, facial expressions).
  • Notable quote:

    "He is nonverbal, we’ll say, but he does have a few words... but he is like rocking the communication methods of all kinds. ... He definitely talks with his eyes and his smile.” – Laura [19:15]
    "Our whole method is multimodal communication. Everyone asks me, is he going to talk? And I say, well, he does. He already does." – Laura [20:05]
    "Mouth words aren't the only way to communicate." – Tara [20:24]

8. Finding Autism Little Learners: Alignment and Community

[20:45 – 24:07]

• Laura joined ALL after discovering a fundamentals of communication workshop, which confirmed and enhanced her own philosophy.
• Emphasized the impact of regular face-to-face coaching calls—“worth the membership right then and there.”
  • Notable quote:

    "The fact that we can share our struggles, our successes, and people validate or give you advice... you’re listening and going, well, I could use that." – Laura [24:09]

9. Community as Lifeline

[25:07 – 26:34]

• Tara and Laura reflect on how ALL provides a vital network, especially when teachers feel isolated as the only autism specialist in their district.
  • Notable quote:

    "Sometimes special educators feel like they’re on an island." – Tara [16:02]
    "It's nice to be a part of a community of people who are like you... Not everyone understands it or gets it." – Laura [25:09]

10. Practical Applications and Successes in Laura’s Classroom

[26:50 – 31:39]

• Laura details implementing individualized visual schedules and color-coded tables for easy predictability, starting with simple routines and gradually increasing complexity.
• Describes the profound impact of the “All Done Bucket” and “Wait Mat” for transitions and teaching independence.
  • Notable quote:

    "Start with one visual... by April we put two or three... by June, all I’d say was, ‘OK, go check your schedule,’ and they’d do it independently." – Laura [26:50]
    "Kids love the Wait Mat. It has been magic." – Laura [30:34]
    “Even people who come into my class are like, wow, I can’t believe how well that works. I know. Amazing—magic.” – Laura [32:07]

11. Navigating Challenges and Rethinking Tradition

[32:27 – 39:33]

• Laura highlights adjusting expectations, taking time to observe and listen, knowing when to “step back” instead of pushing forward.
• Draws from Tara’s podcast (e.g., “Rethinking Hand-Over-Hand”) to let children lead, focus on modeling, predictable routines, and relationships.
  • Notable quote:

    "Let go of what we think should happen and just, you know, take the OWL approach: Observe, Watch, Listen. ... We don’t have to force it." – Laura [32:27]
    "Doing the same things over and over... then one day they just do it." – Laura [33:43]
    "We want them to come to school. We want them to love school." – Laura [33:43]
    "Parents are overjoyed because their child wants to go to school. They’re happy..." – Laura [35:37]

12. The Power of Flexibility and Connection

[38:01 – 39:58]

• Stories illustrating the importance of creative, student-led adaptation (e.g., switching from name tracing to preferred activities to build skills in joyful ways).
• Rethinking “power struggles;” focusing on avoiding forced compliance in favor of meaningful engagement and trusting relationships.
  • Notable quote:

    "The old way would be, well, I’m going to hand over hand and make him do this, even if he’s upset... instead of really backing up and being OK with taking the steps." – Tara [39:33]
    "It has to be a happy experience for them. Relationships—that’s the only thing that matters." – Tara [40:01]

13. Advice for Educators and Parents

[40:22 – 42:20]

• Laura’s recommendation to join ALL: invaluable resources, time-saving visuals, and supportive podcasts.
• Encourages using ALL resources not just for teachers but also for sharing with parents and paraprofessionals.
  • Notable quote:

    "Just join and it'll be one of the best investments you’ve ever made. Honestly, it’s the best monthly payment I have." – Laura [40:22]
    "You have to share the wealth. You just have to spread it because it's too good not to." – Laura [42:01]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Motivation for Membership:

  “I feel so connected within the membership and that missing piece… I know here that I am doing the right thing.” – Jordan [13:36]

• Celebrating Small Steps:

  “By the end of the year, he was washing his hands... And really interested in playing in the water in the sink.” – Jordan (about a student’s progress) [10:28]

• Philosophy of Support:

  "Let go of what we think should happen…take the OWL approach: observe, watch, listen." – Laura [32:27]

• Real Impact:

  “Parents are just overjoyed because their child wants to go to school. They’re happy, and parents are happy. ... We’ve established that in three months. In September, it’s go time!” – Laura [35:37]

• Encouragement:

  “Just join and it'll be one of the best investments you’ve ever made. … The resources at your fingertips. … It saves so much time.” – Laura [40:22]

Segment Timestamps

• 00:00–02:06 – Tara introduces guests, focus of episode.
• 02:06–06:41 – Jordan’s background and joining the membership.
• 06:41–10:28 – Live classroom strategies: video modeling and visuals.
• 10:28–13:36 – Internal challenges and evolving philosophies.
• 13:36–15:03 – Advice for prospective members.
• 16:57–23:17 – Laura’s introduction and personal journey as a teacher/parent.
• 23:17–26:34 – Discovering ALL, the importance of coaching community.
• 26:50–31:39 – Visual schedules, color-coding, and predictable routines.
• 31:39–32:27 – Tools for transitions: Wait Mat and All Done Bucket.
• 32:27–40:01 – Navigating challenges, flexible practice, focus on relationships.
• 40:22–42:20 – Laura’s advice and sharing resources.
• 42:49–End – Closing remarks.

Summary Tone

This episode radiates warmth, practicality, and celebration of neurodiversity-affirming education. Tara, Jordan, and Laura speak candidly about the complexities and joys of early childhood autism support—offering actionable ideas, empathetic reflection, and deep encouragement for anyone supporting young autistic children.

For Listeners

Whether you’re a special educator, speech language pathologist, paraprofessional, or parent, this episode offers a blend of actionable strategies, validation, and real-world examples to inspire and empower your work with young autistic learners. Community, flexible approaches, and authentic relationships are at the heart of helping children thrive.

Connect with Tara & Autism Little Learners

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Recommended episodes & resources mentioned:

• Video Modeling, Visual Schedules, Wait Mat, All Done Bucket
• ALL Membership Community and Podcast
• Free Visual Support Starter Set: autismlittlelearners.com/visuals