You Know There’s More for You — But You Don’t Know How to Get It

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Balance Theory with Erika De Pellegrin

Episode: "You Know There’s More for You — But You Don’t Know How to Get It"
Date: May 4, 2025
Guest: Rochelle Fox (Founder of Mindspo & Manifesti)

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Episode Overview

This episode of The Balance Theory dives deep into what happens when you know you’re made for more but feel stuck on how to get there. Host Erika De Pellegrin chats with Rochelle Fox, a meditation teacher and entrepreneur who transformed her life after overcoming PTSD and depression. Together, they explore the power of mindset, practical strategies for change, managing comparison, reframing “success,” and how presence and ambition can (and must) coexist.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Rochelle’s Journey: From DJ to Meditation Mentor

[02:53–09:55]

• Rochelle shares her start a decade ago in Australia’s nightlife/entertainment industry, living a glamorous but unfulfilling double life.
• After struggling with anxiety, depression, and an eating disorder, she was diagnosed with PTSD—a catalyst for change.
• Meditation became her “lifeline,” but initially, she lived a double life: DJ by night, meditation evangelist by day.
• The pivotal “fresh page perspective” came after watching Brian Tracy’s video on starting over, inspiring her to quit DJing and teach meditation.

“Knowing what you now know, if you could start all over again, what would you do differently?”
– Rochelle Fox referencing Brian Tracy’s prompt [08:03]

2. The Importance of Giving Yourself Permission to Evolve

[09:55–12:33]

• Both Erika and Rochelle emphasize that everyone goes through times of misalignment, even in successful careers.
• Letting yourself experiment, be more than your job title, and try new paths without needing to monetize everything is crucial.

“Just do it for yourself... it’s really important to just let yourself experiment.”
– Erika [11:48]

3. What to Do Before Leaving the Wrong Job

[12:33–15:25]

• Rochelle advises reconnecting with your inner child: “What would make 7-year-old me proud?”
• Adults tend to overthink; returning to playfulness and curiosity unleashes new possibilities.
• Erika explores the tension between dreaming and practical constraints.
• Both agree you should create practical plans before big leaps—e.g., a savings buffer (“I quit fund”), a transition plan, and starting your dream while still in your job.

4. Navigating Triggers and Comparison

[17:20–28:09]

• Rochelle notes being triggered by seeing more established/older meditation teachers—prompting self-doubt, but also leading her to pave her own way.
• Triggers are reframed as gifts; curiosity about why certain people or situations elicit strong reactions is key to growth.
• Both highlight the importance of not comparing your day one to someone else’s day 1000.

“If you’re triggered by someone, it’s because it’s activating something within you.”
– Rochelle [17:21]

• Environment matters: moving from Australia to Dubai helped Erika see different mindsets about abundance and success.

5. Abundance Mindset vs. Scarcity and Tall Poppy Syndrome

[28:09–36:34]

• Comparing cultures: in Australia (“tall poppy syndrome”) people often cut ambitious peers down, while in Dubai, the environment is more supportive and abundant.
• Rochelle explores how criticizing others’ success blocks your own abundance.

"If you see someone with the thing you want and judge them, you’re sending the wrong message to the universe."
– Rochelle [30:02]

• Erika adds that even if your surrounding culture is limiting, you can shift your mindset internally.

6. Practical Strategies for Upleveling Your Mindset

[36:34–44:01]

• Rochelle introduces the “Elevator” method—find digital or real-life mentors who elevate you (“most of my friends are authors or YouTubers I haven’t met”).
• Curate your “digital diet” by unfollowing social media that makes you feel less-than; intentionally choose inputs that inspire.
• You become the sum of your five key influences—including the content you consume.

“Does this person light me up or do they pull me down? Your phone is a dangerous and also a beautiful place of potential.”
– Rochelle [41:00]

7. Redefining Success: It’s About Presence, Not Productivity

[46:00–55:13]

• Common mistake: equating success with ticked-off to-do lists or hustle.
• Rochelle’s new metric: daily presence—being fully engaged with your senses and self in the moment.

“For me, success is a feeling. I measure success in how much presence I have every single day.”
– Rochelle [46:48]

• She shares how chasing traditional metrics led to emptiness, while moments of true presence—even during struggles—bring fulfillment.
• “Why do you want what you want?”—Ask yourself why five times to uncover root motivations.
• Rochelle admits her drive to write a book came from wanting to feel “intelligent” after wrestling with dyslexia as a child.

8. Can Ambition and Balance Coexist?

[55:48–61:01]

• Erika describes feeling her ambition and need for balance were at odds; Rochelle explains it’s about redefining each for yourself.
• Exercise: Rewrite your personal definitions for “ambition,” “balance,” “success” etc., so they can work synergistically.

“Make your own dictionary... Redefine what ambition means to you as an adult, not based on your pre-programmed subconscious.”
– Rochelle [58:50]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Triggers & Comparison:
  “Not comparing your day one to someone else’s day 1,000... What you’re seeing in them is activating something in you.”
  – Rochelle [17:00]

• On Environment vs. Mindset:
  “Dubai makes me feel like I’m sitting down with a good, wise friend, where I say, ‘this is what I’m gonna do this year’—and Dubai says, ‘why can’t you do it in six months?’”
  – Rochelle [28:48]

• On Digital Influence:
  “Mute, block, remove, unfollow... There’s a mute button for a reason. You have one shot at being you.”
  – Rochelle [41:00]

• On Internal vs. External Change:
  “If nothing changes inside of us, nothing’s going to change outside of us.”
  – Rochelle [45:23]

• On Success:
  “Success isn’t a tick box. You can achieve something and still feel completely and utterly empty.”
  – Rochelle [46:09]

• On Self-Redefinition:
  “Make your own dictionary... Redefine what ambition means to you.”
  – Rochelle [58:50]

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Important Timestamps

• [02:53] Rochelle’s backstory in nightlife, diagnosis, and intro to meditation
• [08:03] The “fresh page perspective” and career pivot
• [12:33] Advice for leaving an unfulfilling job — ask: “What would make your 7-year-old self proud?”
• [17:20] How comparison and triggers can be growth tools
• [28:09–31:41] Abundance, tall poppy syndrome, and abundance-blocking mindsets
• [36:34–44:01] The digital diet, elevating your “circle,” and changing your influences
• [46:00] Rethinking success metrics: from productivity to presence
• [55:48] The tension (and bridge) between ambition and mindfulness
• [58:50] How to redefine words and concepts for yourself to integrate “balance” and “ambition”

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Actionable Takeaways

• To find your “more,” reconnect with your inner child’s sense of wonder and possibility.
• Don’t compare your starting line with someone else’s finish; create your own definitions of success.
• Begin your next chapter before you’re “ready”—even if it means starting small or on the side.
• If your environment doesn’t model abundance or support, curate virtual mentors and clean up your “digital diet.”
• Success isn’t what you achieve—it’s how present you are in your journey.
• If you feel stuck, ask "Why?" repeatedly to find your true motivations.
• Regularly update your definitions for “ambition,” “balance,” and “success” so they serve you—not limit you.

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Closing Reflection

This episode is a permission slip to dream, redefine, and begin—even if it feels messy and non-linear. With wisdom and warmth, Rochelle Fox and Erika De Pellegrin normalize the uncertainty of knowing you’re meant for more and provide both practical tools and mindset shifts so you can move toward the life you desire—balanced, present, and ambitious.

Transcript

[Rochelle Fox]

Literally spent, like, the last thousand dollars in my bank account to go and do this meditation course. The best money that I ever spent, because that meditation course literally saved my life.

[Host Intro]

From DJ Dex to Deep Healing, today's guest turned her pain into purpose. After overcoming depression and PTSD through meditation, she founded Mindspo and Manifesti, helping thousands transform their inner world. Get ready to meet our guest today, Rochelle Fox.

[Rochelle Fox]

Say you want to a Ferrari, right? You want a Ferrari. And you see another person driving a Ferrari, and in your head you're thinking, oh, yeah, he must have a small package, because look at him in that car. He's obviously compensating for something. If that's your mental mentality, what. What message are you sending to the universe? You're sending a message to the universe that says that's a negative thing.

[Eric]

What's one success metric that you think everyone needs to stop using?

[Rochelle Fox]

I hate to say it, but how productive they feel they are every single day.

[Eric]

So you mean, like, to do list.

[Rochelle Fox]

How much they got done, how many things they ticked off? The.

[Eric]

So what's a success metric that you would say is quite unconventional that you use today?

[Rochelle Fox]

For me, I measure success and how much.

[Eric]

Rachelle, welcome to the Balance Theory.

[Rochelle Fox]

Thank you so much for having me.

[Eric]

No, it's a pleasure. I feel like this interview or this meeting has been very serendipitous. So for context for the listeners, we were trying to align to connect in Australia when I was touring there, but you were writing your book at the time, and it didn't work out. And then it just so happened you were flying through Dubai and you were staying literally not in the same suburb, like, literally in the next building. So it's been really nice for me to actually get to know you before we've jumped on the show. And I'm just really excited to have this chat. So thanks for being here.

[Rochelle Fox]

It's. You know what? It's so amazing when I meet other Australians that are expats and just kind of creating a life that is, like, different and unique and their own authentic expression, and I've just really enjoyed it. So thank you so much for having me. And I made a new friend.

[Eric]

Yeah.

[Rochelle Fox]

Which is the most exciting thing. I think that's, like, a really, really beautiful thing about this, like, life. If I can go through and make new friends along the way.

[Eric]

Yeah, you made a couple Australian unicorns in the wild. Yeah, I'd love to get into. So the other day, you shared the long version of kind of your story and your journey to getting you to where you are today. And there are a lot of things I want to kind of dissect and go into from your story. So I'd love for you to share with the listeners, maybe in a shorter version because we don't have much on coffees on the way, the story of you and where you were working, let's say 10 years ago, because I know for you was in a period where you felt a misalignment, and then that pivot or what you felt during that time has brought you to where you are today. So can you please take us back all those years ago?

[Rochelle Fox]

10 years ago. So 10 years ago, I was living in Australia. I was living in Kings Cross, which is kind of like the nightclub district of Australia.

[Eric]

It was.

[Rochelle Fox]

Yeah, it was. Well, now it's become very pg. It's very like families and very chilled. But I was living there and I was in the entertainment industry. So I was what I would call a slushy. I was modeling, blogging, doing, oh, what's called DJing, like, all the things. Like, there was just so many different aspects of like, the entertainment industry that I was in. And I was kind of in this like, fast paced world of glitz and glamour and Sydney events and running around. And I was doing what I love in the sense of I was performing and speaking and connecting with people. But deep down, there was a lot of things that were going on with me that a lot of people didn't like, see and I wasn't showing to the world. And it was around that time that I also got diagnosed with ptsd, which is post traumatic stress disorder. And when I got that diagnosis, it made a lot of sense to me as to, like, the things that were going on in my life. I had anxiety, depression and eating disorder. I was by my own definition what I would call a mental health mixed bag. Not broken, but just a lot of things going on. And when I got that diagnosis of having ptsd, I was like, okay, something, something's got to change. And I ended up telling one of my friends that, you know, I've, you know, got ptsd. And then he was talking to my partner, soul, and they suggested that I go and try meditation. And I was like, meditation, the thing that monks do on a mountaintop. I've tried everything under the sun to try and fix myself. Nothing's worked as if the meditation thing's gonna work. Like, I thought they were crazy, but I, you know, kind of said, you know what, like, let's give it a go. One day I just decided to Go and book a course. So I literally spent like the last thousand dollars in my bank account to go and do this meditation course. And it was like the best money that I ever spent because that meditation course literally saved my life. And it kind of took me in a completely new direction. But at first, what. Even though I learned meditation and I started kind of understanding that I'm not my thoughts. My thoughts are just things. I'm not the voice inside my head. Just because I think a horrible self deprecating thought doesn't mean that it's me. I, I didn't quite get fully out of my own story and I would say my own. For quite a few years I stayed in the entertainment industry doing my thing. So like I said, I was DJing and doing the blogging and doing the modeling and I was just living this very, very fast paced life. But at the same time I was kind of living this kind of double life. So I'd be DJing and doing like an event and then I would be talking to someone and they'd be like, oh, I'm gonna get the Sunday scaries. Like I've just had such a huge night tonight. And they'd be telling me about, you know, how they're going through this and that and I'd be, have you tried meditation? They'd be like, why is this DJ telling me about meditation? I was like, you should really try meditating. I swear it's gonna change your life. So I felt like a meditation salesperson.

[Eric]

In the cross.

[Rochelle Fox]

Yeah, in the cross. Doing this like kind of entertainment job. And I, at my blog, that was a fashion blog at the time I started doing these things called happiness posts. I was like, how can I kind of share the thing that's changing my life that I'm like so passionate about this wellness journey that I'm on and how can I mix it with this fast paced kind of fashion, music, entertainment, lifestyle? And I kind of struggled with that for a while, but was doing this sort of hybrid life and then I had this like key moment. So do you want me to tell you about the moment that I decided to become meditation teacher?

[Eric]

Because yeah, for sure.

[Rochelle Fox]

I think that is probably going to resonate with so many listeners. I think in life there are so many times where we're at a crossroads. We're at that point where we know something needs to change, but we don't exactly know what. And sometimes things happen in life that just feels so, I want to say like magical, where it's just like a fork in the road. Where you're like, wow, I feel like I've seen the other side. I feel like I've seen something else that I could go do. So it was New year's Eve, around 2016, and I was fully into my DJing career and I was living this really kind of easy lifestyle where I was getting paid really good money to go and play DJing gigs. And I thought that this was going to be my life. Like I'm just going to be doing DJing and entertainment industry stuff and like I was going to be in this world, but at the same time I was feeling really deeply unhappy. And I watched this video from this great personal development og. If you haven't heard of him, everyone should go and check him out. His name's Brian Tracy and he had this video on YouTube and he. It was this video that basically asked you a question. And the question was, knowing what you now know, if you could start all over again, what would you do differently? Taking everything to ground zero. If you could start it all again and you didn't have to have any consequences and you could just turn, like, turn a fresh page, I now call it my fresh page perspective. You could turn a fresh page and you could do it all over again, what would you do differently?

[Eric]

Wow.

[Rochelle Fox]

And it's New Year's Eve, sitting there with that question. And this voice came to me, which was this voice that I know I sound crazy when I say I have voices in my head. Let's all get clear. We all have voices in our head. I, ever since I started meditating, I started to develop this voice. It's a voice that speaks to me without words. It's like an inner knowing, like a heart centered pull. And that voice came to me and it said, you would quit DJing, you'd quit all the entertainment industry stuff, you'd just let it go and you'll become a meditation teacher and, and I'd be meditating for this stage for around four or five years. And it had, this had been like a huge part of my life, but I'd never thought about making it my career. But in that moment it made so much sense because I wasn't talking to everyone about the fashion and the DJing and the like, the, the lifestyle stuff. That wasn't what I would naturally talk to people about. If I sat down and had a coffee with you, I would talk to you about your mental health. I would say, how are you going? What's been happening? Oh, you're going through that. Yeah, I went through that as well. Have you tried this? Have you tried that? Oh, have you tried this? Herb? Like, I was so interest interested in wellness, and it was in that moment I decided to quit my DJ duo, which I was doing a DJ duo of my really good friend back. Back in the day. And I decided to kind of just go rip the band aid off, stop everything. And I went and started studying and kind of going on what has been like a really long quest of stepping into what I am now, which is I teach meditation and personal growth and wellness, and I'm sort of still a hybrid doing many different things.

[Eric]

Slushy.

[Rochelle Fox]

Still a slushy. I don't. You know what? I have a really hard time with labels, and I think that that's a. You know, your podcast is all about balance and finding balance. Sometimes I feel like we're trying to balance everything, and I don't know if I could be put in a box. I don't know if you can be put in a box. Like, we're all just these beautiful expressions of spirit doing all these different things. So, yeah, that. That's probably a bit longer than what you're expecting.

[Eric]

No, that's beautiful because you've touched on so many different things. I want to say that that experience of being in a job and just feeling like you're made for more or that there's just something out of whack, there's something that's not adding up for you is such a common experience. It's something I speak to people about all the time, and it's something I myself have experienced firsthand. For the listeners, they would have heard me share this a lot. But, you know, I had the same experience back in corporate. I did the whole five years at uni, studying law, became a lawyer, worked in an office, had a really good job, and I sat there thinking, is this it? And I had these curiosities. And I had a very, actually similar silver lining moment that I shared with you the other day where it was, honestly, the only way I can describe it is this inner knowing. And it was the moment my husband looked at me and said, I think you should start a podcast. At the time, it was not even a concrete thought of mine. It wasn't even something I had thought of once before that I was like, oh, maybe I should do this one day. Never thought of it. He said it, and it was like the sea had parted. And I was like, I see this path for myself. And I totally agree with what you said, that we shouldn't have a label. And I don't just mean that in a general sense. I mean that even if you love what you do. Right. We so accustomed to saying, hi, I'm Eric, I'm a lawyer. Right. We define ourselves based on what we do, not who we are. And the reality is no single job, I don't care if you have your own business and you've created your own job. No single job can cater, can possibly cater for all of our interests. So it's so important to actually let yourself venture off and experiment and do different things first and foremost. I think anyway, without that pressure of, is this going to be a side hustle? Is this going to be a business? I have the worst tendency. Last year I started doing pottery.

[Rochelle Fox]

Oh.

[Eric]

Because I was spending so much money buying them when I was traveling, like ceramics. And I was like, there's a studio down the road. I'm just gonna go on a Saturday, do something artistic. The second I got good at it, I was like, I wonder if I can make an Instagram and like sell this stuff. And I was like, you know what? Just do it for yourself. Like, some things naturally evolve into businesses and side hustles. And that's great. But I think in the initial outset, especially if you're feeling that lack within, it's really important to just let yourself experiment.

[Rochelle Fox]

Yeah.

[Eric]

But I want to ask you, what's the one thing people should be doing before they're leaving a job that doesn't feel right for them? Anything they should be thinking about, a question they should ask themselves, something they should consider. Is there any kind of bits of advice you'd give in that regard?

[Rochelle Fox]

What would make your 7 year old self proud? I would touch back in with your inner child and ask, like, what would make 7 year old me lighter? What would 7 year old me look up and go, wow, that's so cool that we're doing that now? Because I think we adult a little bit too hard. I don't want to adult hard anymore. I'm done with adulting. I like to get back into, like the essence of my inner child. I think life should be fun. I think it should be a game, I think it should be an exploration. And I think sometimes we take things a little too seriously. And when we're in that place of quitting a job or making a big change, it can feel so adult and it doesn't feel like play. And I think when we can get back into that sense of play and that sense of curiosity, that's when we're going to allow ourselves to start to dream without the lid on to start to dream without all the, oh, you should do this. Oh, this is why you shouldn't do like that. Why? Who said should? Who said what? Do you remember when you were seven and you and someone would say, you should do it like this? You'd be like, no, I'm just going to do it like that. Or you're a toddler and you're just like, no, I don't like that. You were so about your desires and, and what lit you up. You knew what you liked because you weren't programmed yet. Your subconscious wasn't weighed down with all of these, like, scary things that could happen. You were just what I call. I always describe it. I'd like to rephrase the concept of what if. I think a lot of people, and I wrote about this, my book, but a lot of people use the concept of what if? Like, oh, what if it all goes wrong? What if it doesn't work out? In my world, what if is like the quantum world of possibilities. What if it all works out? What if it is the right choice? What if you meet the love of your life? What if you take the risk? Like, if you could just get into that place of expansion and that place of, like, what if anything could be possible and rather than focusing on everything that could go wrong, focus on everything that could go right.

[Eric]

That's a beautiful reframe. I think, though, sometimes it's difficult. Like you said, like we adults, a bit too hard. You know, we think about responsibilities and the cost of living. Some people have rent, some. Some people have mortgages. Like, those practical aspects, I think sometimes can weigh down the dreaminess of, you know, wanting to do different things. Was there anything practical you actually had to do from that standpoint of making that big choice before you made a big shift? Because I feel if you can get the. The, like the mindset is 100 something, you need to shift. And I actually really love that reprogramming of the what if. And it's something easy people can catch themselves out on, right? If you, if you catch yourself thinking, what if it's the worst decision of my life, switch it to what if? It's the best decision. Right? It's a great, like, practical thing people can do on the spot. But in terms of actually, what's the word? Like buffering out that decision or that step, was there anything you had to do in the real world that didn't involve your mindset to safeguard that move 100%?

[Rochelle Fox]

I do think sometimes what we can do is we can use our current job or our current situation as a stepping stone to get where we want to go. And when I made that decision, although it was like a hard and fast decision, I'm quitting, I still had some commitments that I had to follow through with, and I had to kind of set myself up and be like, okay, how much money do I have saved to be able to do this? And I had to kind of make, like, a practical plan for myself. I do think sometimes when it comes to making these big decisions, a lot of people think that, oh, I have to. If I can't make the decision now, if I can't quit everything now, or if I have to keep going, then I'm never going to be able to do it. It's like, well, no. Make your escape plan.

[Eric]

Yeah.

[Rochelle Fox]

You know what I mean? Like, think about it and zoom out and be like, well, if you could just do these things differently for the next year, if you could adjust these finances, if you assign these hours to, like, putting in the work to learn a side hustle or an extra skill, you could upskill yourself. Imagine where you could be in a year from now. For example, you started your podcast when you were working full time, correct?

[Eric]

Yes.

[Rochelle Fox]

Right. So you started your dream while you were still in your 9 to 5. And I think a lot of people, they don't give themselves permission to start that dream or to make that step when they're still in that old position. You started becoming the version of you that you are right here, right now, standing in front of me. Before anyone gave you the permission slip, before you took the big risk, you just started doing it. You started becoming what I call, like, a method actor. You were like, I'm just gonna show up. I'm gonna start the podcast. And I think that it's in that starting and in making that first step, no matter where you are, that you're gonna start to feel some changes by making that decision and just kind of taking it one step at a time.

[Eric]

Yeah.

[Rochelle Fox]

Not comparing your day one to someone else's day. 1,000.

[Eric]

Yeah. That's the worst thing to do.

[Rochelle Fox]

Sure. It's you against you. Like, this is huge. I think that. Look at where someone else is. They're like, why can't I be there right now? Well, you're not there right now because you're where you are right now. And where they are isn't where you're going. You're going somewhere else. Completely different.

[Eric]

Yeah.

[Rochelle Fox]

What you're seeing in them is activating something in you. It's not like this is something that I really want people to understand. I think when you look at someone and you get triggered by them and you're like, oh wow, that person's doing that thing. Oh, that's making me feel this about myself. And you can start to get really small. I really always remind people if you're triggered by someone, it's because it's activating something within you. There's something within you that can become a version of that person or that is able to do that, but you're not fulfilling that for yourself yet. It's like that little seven year old version is in front of yourself going like, ah, pulling you. And it's. And it's an activating feeling.

[Eric]

Yeah.

[Rochelle Fox]

And I think that they're the biggest gifts.

[Eric]

Yes. I'd love to go into that deeper. But just before I do, I want to add two things. So great example. Using me. Actually that's very true. And I think the biggest thing I can impart on people just based on my own experience is I gave myself permission to be more than my job title. Right. Because I was so focused on. I've studied to be a lawyer, I'm now working as a lawyer, you know, in corporate as well. They expect their life to be your life and it just wasn't true for me. And so I gave myself permission to grow arms and legs off of that version of who I was.

[Rochelle Fox]

I love that analogy.

[Eric]

Yeah. The second thing I've had a guest on before and she shared something which is quite cool called an I quit fund. So, you know, often it's a lot easier to save if you have something you're saving for. Like imagine you're saving for a holiday. Right. You save like that. You're like, yeah, I'm going to put the money aside. It's very clear. I know, I know where I'm going. But if you're in that sticky position of I can't take the leap just yet or I need, you know, six to 12 months of finances, then start an I quit fund which starts to give you that buffer. You know, you start planning for that period.

[Rochelle Fox]

I was 26 when I made my leap, so I didn't really have many dependencies.

[Eric]

I was like, fair enough. Yeah. I mean what. Everyone kind of has these realizations or moments. You know, there's a range of ages that are listening to this show right now. Some might be the beginning of the career and then some might be halfway through. So I think no matter where you are, like just having a plan.

[Rochelle Fox]

Yeah.

[Eric]

And then backing that with the mindset. Because fear is another thing that plays a big role. Like you know, the whole what if thing. So two very practical things, your mindset and then the practical tools. Triggers though, this is a huge one that I've learned so much about in the last few years to a point where I still get triggered. I'm not a perfect human, you know, it happens. And everyone's experiences and belief systems and subconscious, from what I've learned, means that you may get triggered by different things. And that could be as simple as I'm working towards something and I see someone else getting it and it triggers me why? Right? I always say these moments are the best gift of curiosity that you can give to yourself. Like if you want to talk about getting to know yourself, it's not about when you're so proud of yourself and you're so happy. Like those moments are great, but the moments where you feel yourself being judgmental, jealous, there's nothing to be ashamed of. It's more a moment of pause and reflection One of my favorite ways to nourish my body from the inside out, support my energy, immunity and gut health is through having bone broth every week. Now I used to make this religiously every single weekend. But between running my legal consulting business, this podcast, preparing to be a mom, finding from 8 to 24, sometimes 48 hours every single weekend to make myself a weekly bone broth has become a little bit unrealistic. That's why I'm so grateful that I found the Nutra Organics bone broth range. They offer both powders and concentrates from paleo and vegan friendly options, all made with the highest quality Australian grass fed beef bones and certified organic pasture raised chicken bones. They're packed with all the immune and gut supporting benefits of a slow simmering broth, just minus the time commitment. And honestly, they taste amazing. I typically like to sip a little bit first thing in the morning, otherwise I just add a teaspoon into some plain rice for a bit more flavor on my curries or my soups for an instant gut loving and immunity boosting hit. If you're looking for a trusted and time saving way to start nourishing yourself from the inside out. The Nutra Organics bone broth range is honestly a game changer and right now you can get 15% off, head to nutraorganics.com the link is also in the show notes and use the code the Balance Theory at checkout. Let's get back into today's episode. I'd Love to ask you, can you share a moment with me recently, maybe in the last couple of years, where you've been triggered and what it taught you about yourself?

[Rochelle Fox]

Oh, I've been triggered in the last few years. When I first got into becoming a meditation teacher and I wanted to pursue this career, I was really triggered by everyone's age that was doing the job that I wanted to do because I they were older. So I looked at like, okay, I'm going to become a meditation teacher. And I had this fire in my belly. I'm like, yeah, I'm gonna do this. This is exactly what I meant to do. But then I looked at the evidence of other people that were meditation teachers, and everyone's a monk or they're a lot older than me, or they're a clinical psychologist that's become a meditation teacher. No one had the exact path or was kind of similar to me. And I started to feel really inadequate with my own experience that, you know, could I just, you know, step into this role even though I'm, you know, not in my 50s or 60s or 40s, like at the time, I'm like 26, like, who am I to tell people how to find inner Peace as a 26 year old? And when I looked at all the examples in Korea, it felt incredibly confusing that, like, is this actually possible for me? Will people take me seriously? And it was a really big trigger for me to step into really embodying everything that I wanted to teach. It was like, where can I show up and be fully embodied as a meditation teacher? How can I really take on this role and make it like who I am and how can I do it in a way that is unique to me? Where am I not allowing myself to be authentic? Because I started to feel that I had to become someone else in order to become who I wanted to be. And then I actually started to realize in the process of that. Hang on a second. I actually just need to be me. Because I was struggling when I first heard about meditation, because I didn't know anyone that was my age that was meditating or that was interpersonal development. Like, when I started, it was 2012. Right. And this is very, very different to the last. Yeah, this is so different to the landscape that we're in right now. And I just felt really like there was no examples. And that was very triggering for me. But I use that trigger as a way to go, well, hang on a second. How about I just be the person that other people are looking for that are my age? How can I deliver meditation and personal growth and talk about spirituality and manifestation and all these woo topics in a way that's relatable and practical and make people realize that you don't have to be amongst sitting on a mountaintop to talk about meditation and that, you know, there are so many ways that you can explore these topics that are not necessarily in the traditional like way and that you can find spirituality in a way that is authentic to you and you can't expect someone else to tell you what your connection with God or the divine or whatever it is that you want to call it. That's something that is so personal. And I really use that insecurity that I had as a way to really find my authenticity and actually for a way for me to just to crack open and be my authentic self. And we ended up making Mindspur, which is my meditation school. Our big thing is, like, we just want to make meditation cool. It's not about who you are or what you do. Anyone can meditate. We can teach anyone to meditate from any religion and any spiritual denomination. You could be atheists. I don't care. I don't care who you are, what you are. You can just come and learn this trick and you can make it mean something to you. And your connection to spirit, the divine, or your connection with meditation doesn't even have to be a spiritual connection or personal growth. It's just your experience.

[Eric]

Yeah.

[Rochelle Fox]

And everyone's experience is welcome here. And I think that that for me, that trigger and feeling so insecure helped me actually find my authentic voice in it. And it was just like a real big kind of kicker to be like. But yeah, other times I've been triggered. Oh, God. Like, I've been. I was trying to think about this question when you were asking me, and I. You probably edited it out, but there was a long, oh, pause. I've been triggered. I think as a woman, we can get triggered by other people as well. You know, we see another woman doing something. I think people that seem to do it all in like, motherhood, career, everything that triggered something in me in the sense of, like, if I chose that path, for me, would that be possible? And it makes me think about my own balance of things. And it really makes me think about, you know, would I be able to do things the way that I want to if I was to take that next step in life.

[Eric]

Yeah.

[Rochelle Fox]

So that can be triggering as well. Just to make us think deeper about what it is that we want and how we want to live our lives. Lives.

[Eric]

Yeah. I think two things have, like, kind of come up for me here. I think the first is this tendency we all have to Compare our day one to someone's day 1000, and you really, really, really don't know what's gone into somebody getting where they are, whether it's happened overnight, whether it's happened over four years. You really just don't know the backstory. Like a really good example is my YouTube channel grew significantly in 2024, but I was podcasting for three years before that, right. So I always say, like, I put in all that time I upskilled as a host. I understood what I want to talk about to actually get to that point where then my channel was at a certain value level that a lot of people found it and wanted to, you know, come on and listen to a lot of people. It happened so quickly. It happened in six months. But, you know, you never know what people have put into things, what, how they've worked on themselves to actually get to that point. And this. And the second thing is the whole comparison thing. Right. But it is really interesting when you have these kind of. We call them negative emotions, but I just think emotions are there to guide us as to the way we think and feel about the world. And so if you can bring this curiosity and really just whether it's journaling, whether it's meditating with. I'm a bit of a thinker, right? I'm like, back in the day, I would have been a philosopher for sure. Like, I like to sit there and just be super introspective and like, talk to myself. And when you really just think about. Does allow you to explore your deepest fears. Like, you know, is that. Is that a life that's possible for me? Why don't I think that's possible for me? I think I used to have a lot of this around money as well. Because I grew up from, you know, a moderate family. We weren't. We weren't extremely well off and. And we certainly weren't poor. Like, we were. We were fine, kind of average in the middle. But, you know, growing up in a city like Dubai and having different kind of financial aspirations, I always had these limitations around, like, I don't need that. I don't need more than my means. Or like, if I was to get it, I should. I should. I should, you know, donate it or do something different.

[Rochelle Fox]

Dubai is an amazing place to see where your scarcity mindset is. Like, Dubai has. Yeah. Triggers. I heard the first time I came to Dubai was during the Pandemic I was like, oh, all right. We're gonna have to up the money blueprint in this city. Yeah. And it's a beautiful place because it shows you all the. All the ways that you don't think things are possible for you.

[Eric]

Yeah.

[Rochelle Fox]

It's such an activator. So I love this. This city I like. I love coming here because it activates the heck out of me. It makes me feel like. I read on the Instagram caption the other day, Dubai makes me feel like it is sitting down with a good, wise friend, where I say, this is what I'm gonna do this year. And then Dubai turns around and goes, why can't you do it in six months?

[Eric]

Yeah.

[Rochelle Fox]

That's how I feel Dubai is. It's like, and why can't you do it in three months? You know what I mean? And why don't. Why are you using your money? Why aren't you getting investment? Like, it makes it go. And that's so beautiful, though, because it puts you. I always say that places have energy attached to them. I think that every place in the world has a specific energy and it will activate something within you. And it's not the same energy for every single person. It depends on where you are in your life. But Dubai, for me, is the abundance activator. It's the entrepreneurial activator. It's the, why aren't you supporting this person? It's the network. It's this beautiful melting pot of, like, people and culture and blows your mind. And it's such a beautiful place to be because it. It really opens me up to something possible. And I love being here and seeing other people's successes. Yeah, I get that's. We come from Australia, and I'm not sure if you've talked about tall Poppy syndrome on this podcast.

[Eric]

Definitely.

[Rochelle Fox]

I. I like to not focus on tall Poppy syndrome. And for anyone that's, like, has never heard Aussies talk about tall Poppy syndrome, it's basically where Australians, like, neg other people and kind of cut other people down that are being more successful. And rather than having a culture of someone's success and helping other people out, we have this weird culture. Don't we have, like, squishing people in.

[Eric]

Australia, keeping everyone at the same level?

[Rochelle Fox]

Yeah, it's wild. I don't get it. I hate it. I'm not about it. I send people love that are in that mentality, but that's not how I do my life. And the thing I love about this city is, you know, I'm someone that fully believes in manifestation and the power of, you know, you get what you give, and you're in this reciprocal relationship with the universe. And I fully believe that it. In life, you cannot manifest success for yourself. Say you want a Ferrari, right? You want a Ferrari. And you see another person driving a Ferrari, and in your head you're thinking, oh, yeah, he must have a small package, because look at him in that car. He's obviously compensating for something. If that's your mental mentality when you're looking at other people in successful cars or in the car that you want, what. What message are you sending to the universe? You're sending a message to the universe that says that that's a negative thing. That person has insecurity, that person's conversating for something. Whereas at the same time, you want that, but you're not actually. Or you desire it. You're not actually saying, that's what I want to create for myself. So you gotta, like, look at how you react to these certain things, and you've gotta, like, start congratulating and celebrating people that have what it is that you desire, because that's you actually sending out that energy to that thing, saying, hey, I celebrate your abundance. I want you to be successful. And the universe goes, oh, success is a good thing for you. Abundance is a good thing for you. Oh, you're a match for that. That's. Yeah, that's huge. And in. In Australia, that's a bit of a struggle sometimes. Here, everyone wants to help you. Like, we caught up and we're just swapping ideas and you're telling me, hey, I'll hook you up with this podcast studio. Like, this is an abundance mindset because you're in Dubai. You're in the land of just like, hey, you scratch my back, I'll scratch your back back.

[Eric]

You know, this is such an interesting conversation, and I do want to say that because there's a lot of people that are Australian in Australia listening to this. And I think from conversations I've had with people from the uk, it seems that, like, places like London or smaller country towns have the same kind of mentality. What I want to say to those people listening is, I was there.

[Rochelle Fox]

Yeah, same.

[Eric]

And it's not your fault, because it's a societal thing and it's the way you grow up.

[Rochelle Fox]

It's your subconscious programming. It's. It's literally the energy of us.

[Eric]

Yes, it's. But I don't think you like, because I. What I'm. What I'm trying to get at is I don't want this conversation to kind of spark that people are doomed. Right. If they live there.

[Rochelle Fox]

Oh no.

[Eric]

For me, this is an empowering opportunity. Because if you're not say, looking to move overseas, when you move overseas, it's like a very dramatic contrast, right? Because you have a reality that's so different from the reality that you know from back at home. But if you have no intentions of leaving and you're in this culture or this society where this tall puppy syndrome exists, you feel like people aren't cheering each other on. It's not supportive. You have dreams that exceed those around you. You don't see people doing things that you want immediately in your circle, etc. It's a very interesting opportunity for you to reflect on what do you actually are you are you. Are your responses mirroring the things that you're not liking? Because when I reflect back, honestly, I wanted more. I wanted to be in an abundant mindset, but I actually didn't have that right. I was craving this thing. But if I genuinely think about the way I would look at millionaires, billionaires, people with cars, and I am really not a huge materialistic person, that doesn't mean I don't value those things and it doesn't mean I don't want a comfortable life. But it's a very good, good way for you to kind of vibe check where you sit with money and abundance. Right. I think that's the most evident thing in life that you can, you can think of that you see in other people. Yeah, you can't see their abundant mindset. You can't see their gratitude. You know, like things like that are more internal.

[Rochelle Fox]

See, I would say the thing, the big leap for me, I would say, is that an abundance mindset transcends money. Abundance is just having an overflow of more. Right? It is just having that you can pour from your cup. And you pouring from your cup isn't going to empty your cup because you've just got so much to give. For me, an abundance mindset is seeing just how much beauty there is in the world. Like walking around and like being grateful for everything that you have in front of you. It's being grateful and gracious with your kindness. It's allowing yourself to be in that overflow and believing that just because someone else's light is shining or that someone else has an opportunity that that isn't taking away from your own. That to me is an abundance mindset. It's realizing that there is enough to go around and Being in that mindset that, that the universe is abundant and that if I desire it and I work for it and I align with it and I surrender it, then I'm going to be able to create that for myself. And someone else's success is just a mirror of what is possible for me. And that transcends wealth. And the thing I would say to that is, I agree with you. I never want someone to think that, oh, gosh, I'm in Oz now, I'm doomed for life because everyone here has tall poppy syndrome. No, I, I go to Australia now all the time and I visit. I don't, I don't have tall poppy syndrome. Like, like showing up in my life at all. I have beautiful friends. I have the most supportive community of people because I'm just not in that competitive mindset. I'm in that I'll scratch your back, you'll scratch mine. And you just have to look at and ask yourself, like, where are you participating in that cultural phenomenon? And when you stop participating, when you stop giving attention and focusing on the things that you actually want to, like, distance yourself from, when you remove yourself from those conversations or those gossiping people or those programs or the environment that is kind of keeping you stuck in that program, when you change your environment, when you change your surroundings, when you shift, things begin to shift around you, Your inner world creates your outer world. So if you're not seeing it in your outer world, then ask yourself, where is it showing up in your inner world? Where are you having those little snide comments about like, well, you know, she's like this. And you know, those are the things that you need to watch out for. And then ask yourself, like, where are you not allowing yourself to have that abundance, to be in that abundance, to believe that it's possible for you?

[Eric]

Yeah.

[Rochelle Fox]

And to celebrate other people that you can see it's possible for them. I remember when I started shifting this within myself, I just started making a lot of friends that were, you know, ahead of me or doing similar things to me. And rather than being in that, like, competitive energy or like, what can I get? Or I'm just making this friend to get this thing. But when I was just in this, like, curiosity of like, wow, I'm so curious about what you're doing and this is amazing. And ah, I asked you the other day, oh, you're starting this. Oh, that's so interesting. When you're just curious and you're willing to give and you're willing to, you know, ask other people about their journey and learn from it, then you're going to just excel.

[Eric]

Yeah.

[Rochelle Fox]

Yeah.

[Eric]

I think this is powerful, especially for those people that find themselves in those situations to really reflect on how am I participating and then where you identify. Like, for me, it was happening a lot in social circles.

[Rochelle Fox]

I'm like, oh, well, these are the.

[Eric]

People I hang out with. These. The conversations I'm having. Like, what am I gonna do? Sit there and not talk? What am I gonna do? Sit at home and do nothing? But what was so interesting was when you just start flipping your internal world, like you were saying, and you start deciding how much of your energy you give to those conversations or not, what kinds of things you talk to people about or not, what kind of things you bring up, where you draw your attention. It's actually magic the way it's reflected the opportunity. I always say the opportunities you get are a direct correlation with the way you think and feel about yourself.

[Rochelle Fox]

Yep.

[Eric]

The friendships, like the people you meet. It was like these people were literally just being thrown at me, like people I was connecting with through podcasting. Or I would just meet this random person who's like, oh, actually, yeah, we're hiring for. And I was looking for a job. Like, these crazy synchronicities start to happen when you start to shift out of, well, I'm in this situation, I can't do anything about it. You know, moving overseas and changing your environment is a really, like, I think, extreme way. Although I found it's been such an incredible way to kind of reset everything for me and help me really reflect on what's true for me or not in a society. I grew up kind of just accepting it was the way it was. But if you're there, there are ways to do it.

[Rochelle Fox]

Yeah. Can I give you a practical one that I use?

[Eric]

Yes.

[Rochelle Fox]

So I wrote about this in my book Magnetic and I call it Elevators. Right. So I believe that one of the most powerful things that we can adapt in life is having a growth. Growth based mindset rather than a fixed base mindset. So a fixed mindset is saying that I'm only capable of this. So it's like fixing your potential. So you are talking about things in limitations, Whereas a growth based mindset is opening yourself up for growth and for opportunity to be able to do things. You can expand, you can improve, realizing that everything can be improved through practice, through showing up, through putting in time and effort and energy. And I think a lot of the time when it comes to abundance and scarcity, a lot of people feel scarcity. Because they have a fixed base mindset on areas where they really realize that actually you could have a growth based mindset. They think, well, my income is fixed, my life is fixed. This is just how things are. And I would like to challenge you and say that you might have a fixed income right now, but does that mean you're always going to have a fixed income? No. Right. Money is fluid. Money is always changing and expanding. It is water, right? It's currency, it's a current, it's always moving. When you think about money, think about water. It is something that is always in flux. And when you realize that you can do many different things in order to generate more money, you can start investing. Doesn't matter how much money you have, you can start investing with anything. You can start investing with $1, right? And then you could say, I've started investing. You do not have to be a millionaire to start investing. Right? You can start doing these little things where you are right now. You could start a side hustle, you could start learning a skill that eventually could make you more money. You could upskill yourself and then potentially get a promotion. There are all these things you could do. So when you realize that you can actually grow in that area, that's so exciting. So that's fixing growth mindset. And the next thing I would ask people to do is say, okay, you're in whatever situation you are and you feel like there's no one around you that is inspiring or elevating or in an abundance mindset, and you're feeling that kind of tall poppy syndrome. I would say, who can you find that is elevating? Who has a growth mindset in the area that you want to grow in? This can be people dead or alive that you can get access to through books, programs, podcasts, courses, conversations. Go and find someone that you feel is really inspiring and become their friend. And when I say become their friend, most of my friends have never met me. Their books and they're YouTubers, these are people that never met me. I have such a good friendship with them. It's a parasocial relationship. It's one sided. But hey, I know how they think. I know how they process things. I know so much about them and I have adapted their mindset and they've inspired me and influenced me in so many ways because I realized that I don't have to have a physical connection with someone to be able to be impacted by them. Look at your phone. Your phone is a dangerous and also a beautiful place of potential. But if you are looking at things that are pulling you down and keeping you small and keeping you in comparison, then you are feeding yourself something that is going to make you sick, right? Your phone. You have what is called a digital diet, right? Just as you were eating crap all the time and you weren't looking after yourself, you're going to feel like if you're consuming crap all the time and you're looking at things that aren't uplifting you, you're going to feel like, right? Our digital diet is so important. So look at your phone, look at the people that you're following, and ask yourself, does this person light me up or do they pull me down? Mute block. Remove unfriend, unfollow. Do what you need to do. Don't get personal about it. If it's a friend and you're like, oh, I don't know. If I'm like, there's a. There's a mute button for a reason, right? That's a discreet way. Yeah, it's a discreet, beautiful. Hi, I'm here, but I'm not consuming you right now, right? Like, if you were, if you were at breakfast, having something every single day, which is what most people do, they scroll first thing in the morning. If you were eating something every single day that made you feel unwell, would you keep eating it? No, you'd be an idiot, right? People listening to this podcast aren't doing that. So why are you following that person that is making you feel a certain kind of way or that that isn't. You know where you want to go. So just do these practical things and then find your elevator and then just bathe in their knowledge, Start to think like them, listen to them, get their mindset downloaded into your mindset. And you will find through changing your inner world and changing those influences digitally, you're going to start to shift so much inside of yourself. And then by creating that space, maybe unfollowing people, spending a little less time with those people that maybe aren't lifting you up, up. Maybe you can love them from afar. There's many people I love from afar, right? And I love them deeply, but from afar, right? You can love people and still have time and energy for people, but maybe they don't have the access that they used to have to you. And that's okay because you've only got one shot at you. This is your one life, your one shot at you. You don't get to do it again. So you've got to make sure that you're around the people that are helping you get to where you want to go and that are inspiring you and that are, you know, just not keeping you somewhere where you know that. Hang on a second. I know I'm meant for more. I know that there's something else that's possible for me.

[Eric]

Yeah, I couldn't agree more. And I think, you know, before we're talking about triggers and it comes to like jealousy or comparison, the phone is like the most instant way of accessing those triggers. So as you're scrolling, notice how you feel. Right. This could also be a good way for you to, to get curious with yourself. Like if someone's making you feel worse about yourself or less accomplished as a human. Like, can you switch the what if right dialogue in your head to hey, this is actually something that's possible for me. This is something that could be true for me. I'm so inspired by this person versus, you know, I feel less or less than. Because I haven't achieved what they've achieved. I always actually say, you know that saying you're the sum of the five people around you. I always say you need to actually include your, the content creators you consume category. So it might be your best friend, your partner, a colleague, and then two content creators. Because especially with something like podcasts, YouTube channels, like you're spending a lot of time listening and downloading people's way of.

[Rochelle Fox]

Thinking and these people have access to in a hypnotic state. Yeah, because most of the time you're listening to these people when you're just like allowing it to play in the background. So it's feeling, you're relaxed. Like when you're on the phone and you start getting sleepy and you're tired, you're really relaxed. Oh, you might start changing your brain waves. You're getting into theta zone and then you're just consuming and then you're just programming your mind with scarcity. Especially like an algorithm. Like if I ever get on like a really disempowering algorithm where it's just making fun of everything and it's kind of nagging a lot of things and you just kind of, kind of painting doom and gloom, immediately I'm like, what did I do for too long on here? I need to blow this up. I need to reframe reading. Rather I'll just go watch a whole bunch of cat videos or I'll just go on like a motivational Tyro Tyro. Or I'll just start looking on like friends photos. Be like, bring me back to my friends and family Instagram right I don't want to, I don't want to look at whatever you put me on.

[Eric]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But that's my biggest thing for people is to not limit your yourself to the five people around you, to physical people, but actually think about the content creators, the TV shows, like things you consume 247 that could also be feeding that because that's also an opportunity. Right. You could have one physical person and four creators that empower you and you can do that temporarily. Right. So that's an opportunity and I think something interesting for everyone listening to just really reflect on to start helping them create a little bit more of a life.

[Rochelle Fox]

You don't need to move to Dubai is a great place, but you do not need to move to Dubai. You don't have to move here to change your life. You can change your life right now. Right? It's not it like although places hold energy and they can activate us in beautiful ways. You know, at the end of the day, if nothing changes inside of us, nothing's going to change outside of us. There are people that come here and they don't ever open up their mind. You've got to be in that opening mindset. Y yeah.

[Eric]

So empowering. I want to move on to kind of the way we think about success. What's one success metric that you think everyone needs to stop using?

[Rochelle Fox]

I hate to say it, but how productive they feel they are every single day.

[Eric]

Like, do you mean like to do list?

[Rochelle Fox]

How much they got done, how many things they ticked off the list?

[Eric]

Why is that?

[Rochelle Fox]

Because I think ticking things off the list is a beautiful way to feel like we're getting ahead. But I think what we have to realize that success isn't just about getting ahead. Success is actually like a feeling. It's a state of being. And just because you get a lot of things done and you get to the top of the mountain, it doesn't mean that you're going to feel successful. Success isn't just like a tick box. It's not a top of the mountain. We feel that we're going to get successful when we get that thing. But no, it's actually like a deeper feeling. It's not just achieving something. You can achieve something and still feel completely and utterly empty.

[Eric]

So what's a success metric that you would say is quite unconventional that you use today?

[Rochelle Fox]

For me, I measure success and how much presence I have every single day. So how present and here I am.

[Eric]

That's beautiful. How do you measure that? Like you're just how you feel about the interaction, like, you're here, you're. You're not wandering off. Like, with thoughts. Like, how do you actually quantify that?

[Rochelle Fox]

That for me, it is just like a deep feeling of using my five senses to be anchored in this moment. So what can I taste, what can I touch, what can I smell? Like, am I fully, physically here for you? And have I fully arrived in this conversation? Am I in Dubai or am I still in Australia? In my head, right? It's. It's allowing myself to be not only physically here, but spiritually here and mentally here and allowing all of me to be present. So for me, presence is also not hiding myself behind a mask. I was really good at that, having ptsd. I'm someone that got really, really good from a very, very young age at pretending to be someone that I wasn't. And I can put on a hi, how you going? I. I can do that if I really need to. Yeah, I can pull that because I learned as a kid how to do that because it was my protector part. Right? I never really show people all of me, but for me, presence is being all of me. It's allowing all of me to be present, allowing all of me to be here and allowing all of it to be okay to be here. Every emotion, every high, every low, every pause at every moment that I can't think of something, not getting annoyed at myself or judging myself, just allowing myself to be in this full moment with you, with me, and just enjoy it. Because I think that there are so many times in my life, right, I say this and it's like, oh, that sounds really nice and wise. This is coming from a girl that used to have. Have so much anxiety that I didn't know what was up or down. I was so in my head, I was never fully in the moment and I was so scattered. And I have gone through this process of living life in many different ways. I've lived life in a really fast way. I've lived life in a really glamorous way. I've lived life in a really hustling way where I've had done so many things. I've been very success orientated and had all the metrics and had all the goals.

[Eric]

Goals.

[Rochelle Fox]

And these days, yeah, I have goals. I have things that I want to achieve. I have many dreams and aspirations. I'm a big dreamer. That's one thing about me. I'm definitely a 10x kind of girl, but at the same time, I don't want to get there and not actually be there. Yeah, I want to get there and be there.

[Eric]

Yeah.

[Rochelle Fox]

And I want to not just get there and then get. Be there, but I want to have been there and enjoyed getting there there in the process. Because corny as hell. But the journey is the destination and there is a reason. We have heard that from a really young age. And I challenge you. Sometimes we hear these things like the journey is the destination. You go, yeah, cool. I've heard this in a million one podcast. That sounds really corny. That's great. But there is a reason why this sort of quote is repeated so many times. It's because there are so many people that have gotten to the top and they realize that if they only just enjoy the process of getting there a little bit more. The moments that I've had that have felt like the most challenging. When I recorded my first ever course, right. I have this course, the mindset meditation course. The first time I ever recorded it, I did an all nighter and I had a teleprompter that we had handmade with like a TV and a mirror. And we had like done the whole set by ourselves. We were filming on this like canon, what was it like a Canon DSL like camera. Like we were bootstrapping the whole thing. But I remember being so present for this process and it was so sticky taped together. It was so unprofessional in so many ways. It was so budget. But it was just this moment of me trying to fulfill my dreams and do the best that I could at that time. And those moments are the moments I look back on and I have like a massive smile on my face. I'm like, wow. Like that was such a moment in time where I was just, I was just going for it, I was just enjoying myself. I was just taking a leap. And those moments where I've been truly present in my journey are so valuable. And I, for example, I had this retreat, I do a lot of retreats, like meditation and self development retreats. And I've done a lot of retreats in Bali. And there was this chapter in my life where we rented this giant house called the Mindspur Mansion in Bali. And we had this house that we'd renovated and we were running back to back retreats and I ran 12 retreats in one year.

[Eric]

Wow.

[Rochelle Fox]

For anyone who hasn't run a retreat before, that's a lot of energy. Like the meditation teacher that was like on full blast and. And I had a few retreats there where I would say that I wasn't fully, entirely present. There were times where I felt Like, I had it become monotonous and it was a bit of a rat race. And only now looking back can I notice that energy at the time. I'm like, yeah, I'm present, I'm meditating, I'm doing my thing. Yeah, I'm teaching. I look back, I'm like, wow, you were really just in hyperspeed and you weren't being fully there, fully present. And in those moments, I realized guys wanting it to stop, wanting to get through it, wanting it to end. I was just kind of like in this monotonous, kind of like, oh, when's the next thing? Meanwhile, I'm in Bali in a mega mansion, living someone's like dream life in the jungle with all these beautiful lights and doing all these things and it was gorgeous. So the thing is, it doesn't matter if it's a desk job and, or it's like an amazing moment and a peak experience where you're living your dream career. Your level of presence completely changes how you show up, up. And for me as well, when it comes to success, it's success to me is like a feeling. It's not necessarily like an achievement. It's everything that we want in life. You want it because you want a feeling. You don't want it because you want the thing you desire a feeling that's something that you deeply desire. So people want to have kids and they think, oh, it's the kids, probably you, you really want that experience of family. You want that experience of love and connection and building something with your significant other. Maybe it's legacy. People think that they want a sports car. Maybe you want status. Maybe you want to feel important. Maybe you want to feel abundant. Maybe you want to feel like you made it because you never felt good enough. Maybe that one is actually coming from a feeling of not having enough. So I think it's a really interesting thing to ask yourself. What do you actually desire? Why do you want the things that you want, not the things that you want? What's the actual feeling? An exercise I have for that is I ask people why five times. Yeah, why? Why again? Why again? And just keep asking yourself and be honest with yourself. Because like on a podcast conversation or you're talking to someone, you're a coach, you might not want to say, I actually want status. I want to feel important. One of the reasons I wrote my book, if I go down to deep seated reasons, I have dyslexia. I've had dyslexia my whole entire life and I have a hard time reading Writing, seeing things, even visually. Reading my book sometimes is a bit of a challenge, depending on how tired I am. I want to be smart, deeply. I felt so unsmart. So un. Educated. Yeah. Just unsmart. If that's a word, it's unsmart. A word.

[Eric]

Unintelligent, maybe.

[Rochelle Fox]

Unintelligent. Unsmart. Unintelligent. Dyslexic. I was unsmart. But I literally, for so much of my high schooling and so much of my young years, that was this. This thing that I wanted to feel intelligent. I wanted people to recognize that I had something to say and then I could articulate my thoughts and feelings and that this, you know, I. I was able to communicate and that I had so much desire to communicate, but I just had struggles with it. And that was something that was driving me to write my book.

[Eric]

Book, yeah.

[Rochelle Fox]

Which is so interesting because I could say, yeah, I wanted to. And there's all these other reasons. Right. But then there are some core deep reasons or feelings that I was looking for in that success.

[Eric]

So interesting.

[Rochelle Fox]

Like this for me, the. I said to my literary agent towards the end, she's like, how are you going? How do you feel about the book? I said, I've already got everything that I want out of writing the book. She's like, really? What? I was like, yeah. Because I pro. I proved to myself I can do it, I can write, I'm a writer. I like, I've deleted that whole story inside my head. And yes, sometimes it frustrates the hell of me when I can't spell something. I still struggle spelling dyslexia. Sometimes I'm like, why did we make dyslexia such a hard word to spell?

[Eric]

That's true.

[Rochelle Fox]

Honestly, I could have a word with people about that, but I think it. Yeah. Coming back to it's a feeling.

[Eric]

Yeah. And I think the best part about acknowledging it's a feeling is we can appreciate how unique it is to everyone. Right. I think it's so unique to success, it's easy to paint it as a stock standard blueprint, but it means something so different the older I'm getting. My definition's changing now, you know, like, if I look in the future, for me, it's having a family and homegrown veggies and actually a really simple life where I have financial freedom from the point of view where I'm not having to be plugged in to have to be or have to do anything. Right. The financial freedom to have a simple life.

[Rochelle Fox]

Can I get an advanced dinner Invitation to the simple life.

[Eric]

Absolutely.

[Rochelle Fox]

I'm so there. I can't wait. You told me on the car here that you haven't been cooking, but you cook. And I was like, I've got a new. That cook.

[Eric]

Yeah, no, I. I love cooking. And, yeah, that's. That's a part of where I want to go. Before we wrap it up, though, I want to ask you about something which is kind of you've brought to light through what you've just shared. So one big reason why I started this podcast, and it's called the Balance Theory, is I always struggled with this want and desire to feel some sense of balance and groundedness in my life, let's even call it presence. But I'm a very ambitious person, and in my head, the two couldn't coexist. Right. If you're ambitious and you want things and you're striving, you've got to be hustling, right? I feel like I don't know if that's an Australia thing. I don't know if it's an our generation thing, but I was in this, like, have to hustle and do nothing but the hustle. But I had this massive craving for balance. And so my whole drive and mission with this show is to encourage people to dream big, to have big goals, but to also acknowledge that being present and knowing your priorities and having those front and center will actually, actually accelerate your ambition. But my question to you is, why do we feel like mindfulness and ambition can't coexist?

[Rochelle Fox]

It's a great question. I think when you zoom out and you really think about these two ideas of let's talk about them as from a language perspective, and we think about how we relate to these words. So when I say the word ambition to you, do you think of anything to do with anyone being present or mindful or what's your vision like? The. The visual that you get when I.

[Eric]

Say the word ambition, Knee jerk reaction is just like hustling, striving, sweat, blood and tears.

[Rochelle Fox]

And when I say mindfulness to you, what is the visual representation of the word mindfulness that's coming up in your subconscious mind?

[Eric]

Monk on top of a hill.

[Rochelle Fox]

So our subconscious mind is formed around the age of seven, right? We, from the ages of zero to seven, we have all these programs and things that we install inside our mind. And all of these, These different things that happen create different meanings in our life. Every word that you have, everything that you describe in life, you have a meaningful, right? If I say podcast, what does Podcast represent for you? Just this.

[Eric]

Yeah, this.

[Rochelle Fox]

Right. Right now. Podcast, right. If I say success, what does success represent to you?

[Eric]

Freedom.

[Rochelle Fox]

Freedom, right. If I said success to someone else, it might say money. We all have different meanings that we assign to different things. And I would say that you need to redefine in your mind, everyone. If you want to have these two things coexist, you need to make a new definition of what ambition means for you as an adult. Not the pre programmed subconscious meaning that you've assigned to it through all the media that you've watched and all the movies that you've seen and all the things that you've downloaded that you've never questioned, that you just assigned in, you need to say from today, I am deciding to redescribe ambition. And an exercise for that is if you have a word that you feel doesn't have a balance with you and you feel like you're struggling with, write a new definition.

[Eric]

Love that.

[Rochelle Fox]

Just write a whole entire new definition of what it means to you. Make your own dictionary. I have honestly, my own dictionary for different things.

[Eric]

It doesn't have dyslexia in.

[Rochelle Fox]

I might not be able to spell every word in my dictionary, but I know what they mean. But I have these different meanings for different words and they, they mean different things to me because I have reinvented what they mean mean for me. So I would say to you, these two things can exist. It's just that you've decided that they're separate from one another. Whereas ambition, having ambition to you could mean being someone ambitious that also has a balance of mindfulness and wellness and success. All these different things, they can coexist. You've just got to redefine that meaning for you.

[Eric]

Yeah, I love that. That's really powerful.

[Rochelle Fox]

Oh, thank you.

[Eric]

It's. You know, when I actually think about it, like me starting this show was me rewriting my definition of ambition and success because to me, me, and just like many of the listeners, that's why they resonate with the show. If you can make time for your priorities, if they are front and center and your routine and your schedule is governed around those things, if you make the most important things and most important things, go work 16 hour days, do what you got to do. But to me, ambition is fueled by my priorities, which represent my balance. It's not about up having this equilibrium in my time where I have time to sit and look outside the window for five hours a day and I have to spend the same time at home that I do at Work, you know, it's not about equilibrium. It's about clarity on what it means to you and then organizing your time so that the most important things are the most important things. So that's an incredibly profound exercise and it doesn't even apply to the two words we've just shared, like anything, anything. Balance, success.

[Rochelle Fox]

For me, success, presence, that's like a huge thing for me. When I think about me being successful. If I'm going to call myself successful, I've got to be present. There has to be presence in there. Otherwise I'm just going to be this scatterbrained meditation teacher at the top of the thing with a best selling book being like, hey, look at me, I.

[Eric]

Got to the top.

[Rochelle Fox]

But I'm wired as heck and having five coffees to try and stay alive and do all the podcast interviews. Heck no. Oh, that book.

[Eric]

So speaking of the book.

[Rochelle Fox]

Yeah.

[Eric]

I just want to show everyone how beautiful the COVID is because I really love it. I said it would, it would be magnetic to me on a bookshelf, that's for sure. Where can people get their hands on a copy?

[Rochelle Fox]

So it is out now. It is being translated all around the world. So I believe it actually comes out in Dubai in Arabic in mid this year. So June, July, it's on Amazon. You can just go on Amazon, search magnetic, Rochelle Fox, you'll find it there and all the different translations all around the world. It will be out there to be out in bookstores as well. But yeah, it's been my absolute labor of love. And yeah, it's been a journey to, to write it and I'm so excited for people to read it and I, I can't wait to just hear how it impacts people's lives. And presence is a very big part of that book. So it's called like the Secret to Manifesting, you know, magnetic the Secret to Manifesting Health, Wealth, Love and Happiness. And I always say that I wrote a manifestation book because I really wanted to write a meditation book, but I wanted to, you know, do it in a way where people would maybe pay attention. So, yeah, I always feel like I'm an undercover secret agent for meditation.

[Eric]

I love that. We should be very proud of yourself.

[Rochelle Fox]

Thank you.

[Eric]

This is beautiful. I can't wait to personally read it. And I'm going to put a link to Amazon so it's accessible to many people around the world so they can get their hands on it. But I want to thank you so much for coming here and downloading your wisdom, for sharing parts of your book. Which I know are going to be fleshed out much more within the chapters within these pages. And just for living a really authentic life. Because that in and of itself is so inspiring to people who aware maybe you and I were a few years ago and really lost in like searching for what's more aligned for them. And I think that when you just hear people's stories and they're genuine people and it's just really inspiring experience. So thank you so much.

[Rochelle Fox]

Yeah, I want to thank you for being a new friend. I think that it's not very often that, you know, I think I make a lot of new friends in the industry, but. But sometimes you meet people and you just get so excited. You're like, oh, I'm going to know this one for a while. And I think, yeah, locked in. It's so incredible to make a new Australian friend. And I'm just so excited just for this podcast to grow. And if people haven't subscribed already, they should because you have some amazing conversations on this like, like channel. It's insane. I was like going through today and I realized there are some people that I follow that I haven't actually seen that were on your podcast. And I was like, oh my gosh, I need to listen to this interview. So yeah, I think that it's just so cool and I really appreciate you having me on on.

[Eric]

Thank you so much and thanks for throwing in the subscribe CTA because I always forget. So please subscribe if you enjoyed this conversation and I'll see you guys all next week with another interview. Until then, stay balanced.

[Host Intro]

At Capella University. Learning online doesn't mean learning alone. You'll get support from people who care about your success, like your enrollment specialist who gets to know you and the goals you'd like to achieve. You'll also get a designated academic coach who's with you throughout your entire program. Plus, career coaches are available to help you navigate your professional goals. A different future is closer than you think with Capella University. Learn more at Capella Eduardo.