Episode 383 - Goodbye 2024!

Summary

The Beauty Brains: Episode 383 - Goodbye 2024!

Release Date: December 31, 2024
Hosts: Valerie George and Perry Romanowski
Description: In this end-of-year episode, Valerie and Perry reflect on their accomplishments and challenges from 2024, discuss notable beauty industry trends, address listener questions, and share their goals for 2025.

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**1. Personal Reflections and Achievements

Valerie’s Move to Texas and Lab Setup

Valerie shares significant professional milestones, including her relocation to Texas and the establishment of a new lab space. She describes the extensive work involved in setting up the laboratory, emphasizing the transformation from her previous setup in California.

Valerie (00:54): "We've redone the floors. We ripped down a ton of drywall. We only have about 20% of the drywall left to demolish and hang."

Despite encountering unexpected challenges, such as an unidentified animal causing disturbances within the walls, Valerie remains optimistic about the lab's potential for future formulating projects.

Valerie (08:16): "And now our gas line is ripped up. But it means the cats can’t come because it's kind of blocked their way."

Perry’s Yearly Spreadsheet and Personal Goals

Perry discusses his meticulous habit of maintaining a yearly spreadsheet since 2003, tracking daily activities and goals. Highlighting his dedication, he mentions maintaining a 16-year streak of daily running, learning Spanish, and his recent travels to Argentina and Brazil.

Perry (05:20): "I have like 20, 20 plus years of. And I write down, like, every day, I write down just a little note of what I did and who I saw."

Additionally, Perry shares his election as SEC Vice President Elect, celebrating this professional achievement with Valerie.

Perry (07:37): "I'm so excited. I'm going to be running next year, so hopefully, I can be alongside you."

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**2. Highlights of 2024 in the Cosmetic Industry

Lawsuits and Regulatory Changes

The episode delves into the increasing number of lawsuits within the beauty industry, highlighting cases against major brands like Sephora and Johnson & Johnson. Valerie underscores the importance of truthful marketing to mitigate legal risks.

Valerie (20:40): "Just be truthful, and you'll reduce the risk of these lawsuits."

Perry reflects on a specific lawsuit involving PVP in styling gels, emphasizing the ongoing scrutiny beauty companies face regarding ingredient safety.

Perry (21:46): "They sue all the companies for the same things."

Talc Restrictions and Alternatives

The conversation touches on the decline of talc in beauty products, noting its ban in the EU and upcoming FDA testing guidelines in the US to ensure asbestos-free talc.

Valerie (22:12): "I think we'll see talc go by the wayside."

Perry speculates on the economic implications, suggesting that replacements for talc may increase product costs.

Perry (22:34): "It'll probably cost people more money because those replacements tend to be more expensive."

Celebrity Beauty Lines

The hosts discuss various celebrity-driven beauty lines launched in 2024, including Serena Williams' tennis ball-inspired makeup line and LeBron James’ foray into cosmetics. Valerie expresses mixed feelings about Beyonce’s beauty line, referencing previous discussions on the topic.

Valerie (23:56): "I was just really disappointed."

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**3. Listener Q&A: Tranexamic Acid and Estrogen Creams

Tranexamic Acid for Hyperpigmentation

Listener Lydia poses questions regarding tranexamic acid’s efficacy in treating hyperpigmentation, referencing claims made by Dr. Michelle Wong (Lab Muffin Beauty) about its skin penetration challenges. Valerie and Perry, along with their co-host Laura, address these concerns by citing multiple studies that demonstrate tranexamic acid’s effectiveness when properly formulated.

Laura (31:34): "Tranexamic acid is valuable for a couple of things. One, it treats existing pigmentation and can prevent new pigmentation from occurring."

Valerie emphasizes the importance of using tranexamic acid in combination with other ingredients to enhance skin penetration and efficacy.

Valerie (35:35): "Use it with niacinamide, put it at, you know, a pH of 6 to 7."

Estrogen Creams on the Face

Lydia also inquires about the trend of applying estrogen creams to the face for beauty purposes. The hosts express skepticism and caution, highlighting the lack of scientific evidence supporting such practices and the potential risks involved.

Laura (37:18): "I would just pass or I... would consult my doctor first."

Perry (38:00): "Overall, I just think it's a bad idea."

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**4. Goals and Aspirations for 2025

Perry’s Thematic Approach: Produce More, Consume Less

Perry introduces his 2025 theme aimed at increasing productivity while reducing consumption. He plans to focus on creating more content and moments while minimizing time spent on passive activities like watching TV or scrolling through TikTok.

Perry (17:19): "Produce more, consume less."

Valerie’s Personal Objectives

Valerie outlines her goals for the coming year, which include dedicating more time to reading, decluttering personal items, and enhancing her presence on social media platforms despite previous challenges and commitments.

Valerie (17:19): "My goal is to read the books... give it to people who want these things."

Joint Ambitions for The Beauty Brains

Both hosts express enthusiasm for expanding the podcast’s reach in 2025, aiming to increase episode frequency and incorporate video elements to engage a broader audience.

Perry (16:30): "I'd love to add a video element to it."

Valerie (16:53): "Frank comes in, he's tongue popping me. It's like, oh, gosh, that's right."

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**5. Closing Remarks and Community Engagement

Gratitude to Listeners

Valerie and Perry extend heartfelt thanks to their listeners for their support throughout the year, acknowledging that the community’s engagement is the cornerstone of the podcast’s success.

Valerie (41:15): "Your questions and feedback and the enthusiasm that has really made doing this fun for us."

Encouraging Reviews and Support

They encourage listeners to leave reviews on platforms like Apple Podcasts and Spotify to help grow the show's audience. Additionally, they highlight the importance of Patreon support for covering the podcast’s operational costs, offering patrons benefits such as prioritized question answers and episode transcripts.

Valerie (42:48): "The Beauty Brains are also on Patreon... your support is truly appreciated."

Upcoming Plans and Sign-Off

Looking ahead, the hosts reiterate their commitment to answering more beauty-related questions and enhancing the podcast’s content. They bid farewell with wishes for a joyful 2025.

Perry (44:44): "Have a Happy and joyful 2025."

Valerie (44:47): "See you guys next year."

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Notable Quotes

• Valerie on Tranexamic Acid:

  "Tranexamic acid significantly improved existing freckles while preventing new ones from forming over daily use over 12 weeks." (31:34)

• Perry on Produce More, Consume Less:

  "Produce more, consume less. I've got to create more stuff or create more moments and watch less TV." (17:19)

• Valerie on Lawsuits:

  "Just be truthful, and you'll reduce the risk of these lawsuits." (20:40)

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Conclusion

Episode 383 of The Beauty Brains serves as a comprehensive reflection on the past year in both the hosts’ personal lives and the wider cosmetic industry. Through candid discussions, they provide valuable insights into industry trends, endorse scientifically-backed beauty practices, and foster a sense of community with their listeners. As they look forward to 2025, Valerie and Perry remain committed to delivering evidence-based beauty advice while navigating the evolving landscape of cosmetic science.

Transcript

[Valerie George]

Hi, I'm Valerie, and you're listening to the Beauty Brains. Welcome to the Beauty Brains, a show where real cosmetic chemists answer your beauty product questions and give you an insider's look at the cosmetic industry. This is episode 383, our final episode of 2024. I'm your host, Valerie George, and with me today is Peri Romanowski. Hi, Perry.

[Perry Romanowski]

Hello, Valerie. 24 is already over. Wow.

[Valerie George]

Over. And because it's our end of the year show, we're going to keep it short because I know people would rather be celebrating than listening to us.

[Perry Romanowski]

Well, I'm sure they're listening to us on the background while they're cleaning up for their big party that they're going to have at New Year's Eve tonight. Right.

[Valerie George]

They want to get us in, that's for sure. So first, let's cut to our inane chit chat.

[Perry Romanowski]

Well, you know, for the first time in, like, forever, I'm, like, hosting a little get together tonight for New Year's Eve.

[Valerie George]

What are you doing? Cards? Euchre.

[Perry Romanowski]

Well, you know what? I was coming up with games, and we're gonna do a scissors, paper, rock tournament.

[Valerie George]

Wow. You say scissors, paper, rock, not rock, paper, scissors.

[Perry Romanowski]

You know what? I was looking this up. Yes, I know most Americans say rock, paper, scissors, but that really is. I just think that's wrong.

[Valerie George]

Just like you think flossing your teeth after brushing is wrong. We're just two different people.

[Perry Romanowski]

What did you do before? No, you see, when you say it, like when you're playing the game, you go, scissors, paper, rock. The K sound at the end of that is a nice stopper. Right. When you go, rock, paper, scissors, like the S sort of lingers. So, like, grammatically it's just the better way to say it.

[Valerie George]

Yeah, I could see that, but I just don't think that you're gonna change habits.

[Perry Romanowski]

Well, that's true, but I was looking this up on Wikipedia and it turns out, because I'm like, where did I get this scissors, paper, rock? Because that's how I've always said it. But, you know, in America, people say, what is it? Rock, paper, scissors.

[Valerie George]

Yeah, yeah.

[Perry Romanowski]

Well, I was looking at Wikipedia. You know where else they say scissors, paper, rock, Australia. Okay, so that's probably where I got.

[Valerie George]

It from your trips to Australia?

[Perry Romanowski]

No, no, I just. The culture of Australia somehow impinged into my brain as I was growing up as a youth.

[Valerie George]

All right, well, I prefer rock, paper, scissors because it makes a better rock, paper, scissors. You know, you can jive with it. A little better.

[Perry Romanowski]

Sure, sure. I just like the ending of Scissors, Paper, Rock. That K is like. It's a period or it's an exclamation point.

[Valerie George]

I can tell. What favorite hand motion is yours?

[Perry Romanowski]

Well, I'm actually quite skilled at the game and I will choose based on my reading of the opponent, so.

[Valerie George]

Very interesting. Well, I look forward to hearing how your tournament has gone.

[Perry Romanowski]

Should be fun. And how are you chiming in the new year?

[Valerie George]

Well, I'm not a big New Year's Eve person. As a child, I would tear down the decorations at 12:01am, clean up and go to bed.

[Perry Romanowski]

Wow.

[Valerie George]

It's just, you know, it's not my night. I like to go go to bed at the same time every night and get my seven and a half hours of sleep. So we'll be staying home. I have my favorite snacks that I do every year. I do a little cheese tray with ketchup and horseradish and pizza rolls. You can't have a New Year's Eve party without pizza rolls.

[Perry Romanowski]

Huh? Pizza rolls?

[Valerie George]

Yeah, Totino's pizza rolls. They're the best.

[Perry Romanowski]

Wow.

[Valerie George]

And.

[Perry Romanowski]

And they're not a paid sponsor or anything, but.

[Valerie George]

They're not. But I was thinking the other day, I feel like they changed their recipe over the years because they used to be a greasy when you would take them out of the oven, and now they're just kind of like a little drier.

[Perry Romanowski]

You know, it's interesting that companies will change something like that. Even in the beauty industry, companies make those tiny changes. But why do they do that?

[Valerie George]

Well, I'm gonna guess the answer was trans fats or something like that. Something in the crust that probably wasn't good for you has been restricted. Maybe they were cutting costs, I don't know. But I just feel like the breaded port portion is a little drier, and I feel like there's less of a need to vent. Pizza rolls, 101. You don't pop one in your mouth. You have to vent the corner so you don't get a steam explosion and.

[Perry Romanowski]

Sure. So you don't burn yourself.

[Valerie George]

Since the drier bread portion that I've experienced, I have to vent them less.

[Perry Romanowski]

Huh. Well, that is very interesting. So they might have changed the temperature at which the middle gets by changing the composition. Wow.

[Valerie George]

I'm not a food scientist, although I think it's very interesting. But if anyone works for Totino's brand, whatever the company is, please reach out to me. Thank you.

[Perry Romanowski]

You know, you might not be a food scientist, but if you start mixing stuff up in your kitchen and eating and just post it on the Internet. You could just call yourself a food scientist.

[Valerie George]

I think that's what a lot of people in cosmetic science do. Oh, goodness. You know, we're very big goals people. So let's talk about 2024 and what your accomplishments were.

[Perry Romanowski]

Well, every year I put together a spreadsheet of my year. I've been doing that since 2003.

[Lydia]

Wow.

[Perry Romanowski]

I have like 20, 20 plus years of. And I write down, like, every day, I write down just a little note of what I did and who I saw.

[Valerie George]

So it's your diary, but in an Excel format.

[Perry Romanowski]

Yeah, but it's only like. It's like a Twitter format, essentially. It's just like a one line. But, yeah, I guess you could look at it that. But then I have all my goal tracking things, so I have my running. So I did run every single day this year, keeping up my streak over 16 years now.

[Valerie George]

Wow, that's great.

[Perry Romanowski]

Juggled every day. You know, I learned a little Spanish.

[Valerie George]

All right, all right. Was that in preparation for your trips to South America?

[Perry Romanowski]

Yes, we went to Argentina and the. The Spanish seemed like it would be helpful, so. Yeah, and it kind of was. Although I have to say, duolingo. I don't really need the word computadore. Who am I going to get? Where can I get a computer?

[Valerie George]

They're going to be like, this guy is not a native Spanish speaker.

[Perry Romanowski]

And like, every five lessons, they're bringing out the word computer dory. Like, okay, I get it. Can I advance here?

[Valerie George]

Oh, my goodness. Well, yeah, I had some accomplishments this year, basically. If you guys recall, I moved to Texas at the very end of last year, just around Thanksgiving 2023. And it's been very different. The lab space we moved into is also going to be a part manufacturing. And it. You know, I let Mr. Cosmetic Chemist come see it before.

[Perry Romanowski]

Sure.

[Valerie George]

I was still in la, he was here, and he was like.

[Perry Romanowski]

He was the scout for you?

[Valerie George]

Yeah. And he was like, it's fine. Well, I cried the first time I ever came in here because, oh, no, I saw all the work ahead of me. But nonetheless, we've redone the floors. We ripped down a ton of drywall. We only have about 20% of the drywall left to demolish and hang. We've done all this work ourselves with some of our family members. We got the office and the conference room and the bathroom and the kitchen totally set up. So that's ready to go. And I feel pretty good about that.

[Perry Romanowski]

Yeah, that is quite an accomplishment. Now you have a lab, and so you're able to do formulating for people and such there. Oh, yeah.

[Valerie George]

I had a lab in California as well. Yeah. A lot of people think I work out of my kitchen, which is super offensive because I am a professional. I have insurance. I have a lawyer. You know, it's like, I. It's the real deal. I'm set up. Yeah. But we've been fully set up since pretty much December of last year, and then kind of shutting things down and moving things, depending on what area we were doing construction in.

[Perry Romanowski]

Well, that is a huge accomplishment. I know how much effort that is to just set up a lab. And now you had to take one down and set one up, so that's great.

[Valerie George]

Yeah. Yeah. So that felt pretty good. But we have a lot of work to do. I think a dead animal has passed away.

[Lydia]

Oh, no.

[Valerie George]

In the walls. And so what better way to say, hey, rip down the drywall you have yet to rip down and find the source? And we did that over Christmas, except we can't find the source.

[Perry Romanowski]

Oh, so maybe there wasn't one.

[Valerie George]

I don't know. You know, I had some people from Texas sniff the air, and they were like, yes, something has passed away in your wall. Oh, but who knows? It could have been in the vent. We also had the vent replaced because it was ripped, and maybe the animal got in there and it kind of cleared up after that, so who knows?

[Perry Romanowski]

Well, lots of formulating will be going on in the coming years.

[Valerie George]

Yes.

[Perry Romanowski]

Well, the other accomplishment, I guess I did was, like, I got elected for SEC Vice President elect, so there's that.

[Valerie George]

Oh, congratulations. I'm so excited. I'm going to be running next year, so hopefully I can be alongside you.

[Perry Romanowski]

That would be great. Well, you're still on the board, so.

[Valerie George]

I am.

[Perry Romanowski]

And then we did a lot of traveling. Argentina, China, Brazil.

[Valerie George]

I was a little frozen this year because maybe you guys don't remember this, but my dog Frank, who is a boxer husky psycho. Ate my passport.

[Perry Romanowski]

Oh, that's right. Yes.

[Valerie George]

So all my traveling was in the US we did a ton of road trips.

[Perry Romanowski]

I remember you talking. You came to Chicago, actually, and we. You were telling me about. That was, like, last March.

[Valerie George]

Exactly. Yeah. But no, I flew a lot in the U.S. you know, I travel a lot for work, so it's like going to the east coast, going to Florida, going to the Midwest, going to California plenty of times, so. And I already have lots of travel stacking up in January.

[Perry Romanowski]

Who knew that Being a cosmetic chemist was so travel y Y. All right, so we had some accomplishments.

[Lydia]

Yay.

[Valerie George]

Now, talk about your failure. You were about to say something and you said, oh, that's not an accomplishment.

[Perry Romanowski]

Well, I was going. I was going to read 70 books this year, but I only did 56. You know what happened? All these podcasts get in the way. I listen to too many podcasts, and.

[Valerie George]

I've got enough books, and there's only so many waking hours in the day.

[Perry Romanowski]

There is only so much. Yeah. And, you know, I do listen to podcasts on double speed, because I can do that, but I don't like to listen to a book on double speed, so.

[Valerie George]

No, I'm like 1.5.

[Perry Romanowski]

Right.

[Valerie George]

Yeah, me too, if it's really boring. 1.75.

[Perry Romanowski]

But me, too. Well, how do you feel about starting books and then just stopping?

[Valerie George]

No, you're not allowed to do that. You're not allowed.

[Perry Romanowski]

I know.

[Valerie George]

You have to stick it through.

[Perry Romanowski]

There's so many books out there, though. It's hard to give up. But I got a lot of books for Christmas. I think the one I'm reading, I'm actually reading a few. But the one I'm reading now is called the End of Everything, which is about the physics of what will happen to the universe at the end of time.

[Valerie George]

Oh, wow, What a heavy book.

[Perry Romanowski]

Fascinating, but it's done in a light, airy kind of way, so it's kind of fun.

[Valerie George]

Well, I had this big vision of, like, reading 52 books, you know, pace of one a week. I said that, something I think I could do. And basically, I'm not gonna lie, it didn't happen. I had the intent of going to a remote position, Pacific island, this December.

[Perry Romanowski]

That's right.

[Valerie George]

For two weeks. And I had a big old stack of books I was going to bring with me, and unfortunately, I had to cancel the trip. And, you know, I wasn't able to do anything during that time. But I did read a couple of the books off that list, and the stack is still there. And I think I'm going to really dedicate more time this year. 52's way ambitious, so I'm going to say like 12. That's one a month.

[Perry Romanowski]

Yeah, one a month. That is. That is better. You know, these things are just kind of arbitrary. Anyway. Another one of my regrets, which is it's. I never seem to get this, but every year on January 2, I weigh myself and I give myself a goal weight for the end of the year. And every year on December 31st, I weigh myself.

[Valerie George]

And so how'd that work out?

[Perry Romanowski]

I, like, gain two pounds, which is, you know, I always have this thought, I need to lose £15.

[Valerie George]

Yeah. Well, £2 could just be last night's dinner.

[Perry Romanowski]

Of course. Of course. Yeah. That's my pound variation. Could be £5. As much like I could go weigh myself, go for a run, and come back and be five pounds lighter. So essentially it's unchanged.

[Valerie George]

Well, I Going back to some accomplishments. You know, I didn't talk about any personal accomplishments, but I had some medical stuff going on a couple years ago over the last couple years, and I put on some weight for the medicine, and I lost the weight this year.

[Perry Romanowski]

Wow.

[Valerie George]

Yeah.

[Perry Romanowski]

Wow. Well, congratulations.

[Valerie George]

Yeah.

[Perry Romanowski]

If that was your goal.

[Valerie George]

It was definitely my goal to get that off because I fell, as you may remember, in August. I, like, tore stuff in my ankle and my knee and hurt my hip.

[Perry Romanowski]

Oh, man.

[Valerie George]

And it was great to get the weight off because, you know, 30 pounds is a lot for your leg.

[Perry Romanowski]

That is a lot. Yeah, for sure. Wow. £30. That's a significant amount. But you look good.

[Valerie George]

Thank you. Yeah. And it's great to be back to my pre medicine weight.

[Perry Romanowski]

I think another accomplishment that I had. I kept all the porch kitties happy and safe.

[Valerie George]

Pretty kitty hasn't been able to come around, nor her kittens, because they're ripping up the gas lines in front of the building so we have no heat. It's like the last thing I needed for this year. In the lab, we've had wasps, carpenter ants, lizards, flooding, broken roof, you name it. Something's gone wrong. Oh, we had several H vac issues, and now our gas line is ripped up. But it means the cats can't come because it's kind of blocked their way. So I hope they're getting food.

[Perry Romanowski]

They are resourceful, those outdoor cats. But I think maybe in the coming year, I should try to get some of them placed in regular homes. Yeah, it's probably safer.

[Valerie George]

Yeah, it's better for them.

[Perry Romanowski]

Although they seem to like outside.

[Valerie George]

Well, let's talk goals. What do we want to do in 2025, which I feel like is gonna be a pretty good year.

[Perry Romanowski]

Yeah. Well, I always feel like the next year is gonna be good.

[Valerie George]

Well, I feel. I feel extra this way, and I haven't felt that way for a few years. It's been a very rough few years for me personally. Profession, Professionally, it's been fine. You know, lots of work. But, you know, this lab space is in. The move to Texas has been really hard, but I just Know in my heart it's going to be a great year. So let's talk for the beauty brains.

[Perry Romanowski]

All right, well, this year I was doing the numbers. You know, how many episodes we did? 26, 29.

[Valerie George]

Not great. We usually are on a pace for, like, 40. Right.

[Perry Romanowski]

This is number 30. No, I mean, previously we. I think last year we did 29 also. So.

[Valerie George]

Okay.

[Perry Romanowski]

The same as last year.

[Valerie George]

I'd like to do 40. That gives us one break per month.

[Perry Romanowski]

I would. I would love to do 40 now. Let's see now, of those 29 episodes.

[Valerie George]

Okay.

[Perry Romanowski]

How many questions do you think we answered?

[Valerie George]

120.

[Perry Romanowski]

Good guess. No. 187 questions.

[Valerie George]

Wow. Does this include the people who asked double questions in one question?

[Perry Romanowski]

No, that just is. That's. We answered questions from 187 different people, I guess.

[Valerie George]

Wow. Okay, very.

[Perry Romanowski]

Suppose there were some people. There were some people who doubled up questions.

[Valerie George]

Yeah.

[Perry Romanowski]

They asked one episode another, so. So maybe it's that. But 187 questions. Yeah. So that was fun. And, you know, the. The main topics were skin, skin questions, hair questions. We also did questions about technologies, then the industry. We talked about question there, and there were a bunch of brands that we were asked about. So. So we, you know, covered a lot. A lot of stuff.

[Valerie George]

I felt like it was a good variety, and I think we can do it. I think we can do 40 episodes.

[Perry Romanowski]

I agree. We could do it. You know, I'd love to add a video element to it because, you know, all the kids are using YouTube for their podcast.

[Valerie George]

Does this mean I have to brush my hair?

[Perry Romanowski]

I don't know.

[Valerie George]

I guess the choice would be mine.

[Perry Romanowski]

Right? Right. That is one of the challenges, because it's a lot easier to sit in front of a microphone and look disheveled when you have to, you know, have to shower before I podcast.

[Valerie George]

Yeah. Frank comes in, he's tongue popping me. It's like, oh, gosh, that's right. But that would be really cool.

[Perry Romanowski]

We will definitely this year add a video element. And we've also said that we're going to be more active on social media. We have that goal anyway.

[Valerie George]

That is a goal. Yes.

[Perry Romanowski]

And of course, I'll have my personal goals of book reading and running and juggling and, you know, traveling. So, yeah, all of those things.

[Valerie George]

My goal is to read the books. It's also to, you know, shed some of my personal items that, you know, you just accumulate a lot of stuff as the year goes on. Like your university sends you a mug or you pick up stuff at a trade show. And so it could be very easy to throw it all away. My goal is to, you know, give it to people who want these things.

[Perry Romanowski]

Well, that, that is cool now, you know, I thought rather than doing an entire list of goals, I think I was going to try this year to be more. I mean, I'm going to do my regular goals that I always do. But this year I'm going to pick a theme and see if I can stick to it. But my theme for the 2025 is produce more, consume less. I've got to create more stuff or create more moments and watch less TV and you know, watch less, you know, TikTok videos or whatever. But that's going to be kind of my, my, my theme for 2025, produce more, consume less.

[Valerie George]

I think that's really great. You know, I was thinking earlier, like, gosh, I wish I could spend a lot more time on Instagram. I have the Instagram handle cosmetic chemist. So I was one of the first cosmetic chemists on Instagram talking about life, you know, ingredient stuff and little things on the job and all that kind of stuff. And I really got away from it in the last couple years because I think the online landscape has really changed. And you know, I don't like pointing out like, oh, well, look at this, that person's wrong, I'm right. You know, I just, you know, I think it's become a very negative space in terms of online science communication. But I would like to get out there more and to share some of my knowledge with people. So I think that could be, it could be neat, but that probably won't happen. I'm, you know, the reason I can't be on there also, aside from the fact just like the energy, you know, I'm not into is I have a lot of projects and we have three big hair color projects coming up in the first quarter, you know, several big brands that we do work for for other hair care related stuff. So there's just no time.

[Perry Romanowski]

You know, it's difficult to be a cosmetic chemist doing that job and also be a online cosmetic chemist creating content. And so often what you do is somebody will focus more on one or the other. And so if you're not doing the job of the cosmetic chemist, you're doing more of the job of the science communicator. And they're two really different kinds of jobs.

[Valerie George]

Being online is very hard and it really is a full time job endeavor.

[Perry Romanowski]

I think it's also not a lot of chemistry there. It's just A lot of communication and, you know, interaction, but. And it's fun, you know, creating stuff and video editing and audio editing, but it's not formulating.

[Valerie George]

No, that's for sure. And it stinks that I can't share what I do online because I have, you know, all these, like, agreements saying I won't do that kind of stuff. Pretty much.

[Perry Romanowski]

Those darn NDAs.

[Valerie George]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Perry Romanowski]

All right. Well, one of the areas that we covered a lot this year were news. Do you remember some of the news stories? I think some of the ones that I remember most vividly were the lawsuits.

[Valerie George]

There were a lot of lawsuits in the headlines this year. And this has been a growing pain for a lot of the customers that I have. Because you have these legal eagles out there looking for loopholes, semantics, the letter of the law, taking what you said literally. And guess what? They can sue you for it. And it's, you know, very frustrating because these people do it for a living. They sue all the companies for the same things. But, yeah, I think we'll continue to see more of those types of stories, which for me is interesting because it just reinforces, like, just be. Stop the marketing babble about your products and just be truthful. And you'll reduce the risk of these lawsuits.

[Perry Romanowski]

Yeah, I'm not sure that it will reduce them much, but they'll certainly have to come up with dumber things to sue people about. I know I was contacted last year or the year before by a lawyer who wanted to sue a big company because their styling gel was causing flakes, because they used PvP.

[Valerie George]

But that's what happens. Yeah, that's how PVP works.

[Perry Romanowski]

Right. And I also said everybody uses PvP, so are you gonna sue everybody? But as you know, they're always looking for expert cosmetic chemists to be their expert witness.

[Valerie George]

Exactly.

[Perry Romanowski]

Well, there were three that I remember distinctly. Sephora. They had their lawsuit about being their clean beauty claims, and they won that one.

[Valerie George]

That's unfortunate.

[Perry Romanowski]

Well, they were kind of.

[Valerie George]

I mean, they were in the right for the lawsuit. Correct. But I could see what the person's intent was.

[Perry Romanowski]

Right. Then there was that lawsuit of the natural one. We just talked about that a few weeks ago with Dr. Squatch and Johnson and Johnson. They settled their $6 billion settlement or something.

[Valerie George]

Our talc corner disappeared. Remember we used to have talc corner in our beauty news. There was always something going on. And now that talc has been pretty much. It's actually been banned in the EU and maybe uk, I'm not sure. But the FDA has announced some talc testing guidelines for asbestos to make sure that any talc being used in the US Is stringently tested. But I think we'll see talc go by the wayside.

[Perry Romanowski]

There have been enough things that can replace it, so that's true. It'll probably cost people more money because those replacements tend to be more expensive. And I'm sure talc will go somewhere else, but, yeah, baby powder is not gonna be the same for sure. Now, we saw a bunch of celebrities launch products this year. Do you remember. Do you remember the one sports star male that launched a line?

[Valerie George]

Oh, the male. I remember Venus Williams launched her line, and it was like the color of tennis ball falls.

[Perry Romanowski]

No, that wasn't Venus. That was a young.

[Valerie George]

Oh, Serena. That was Serena. But no, but there was also a second tennis star that launched their stuff.

[Perry Romanowski]

Yeah.

[Valerie George]

Hold on, let me look this up.

[Lydia]

Some millennial.

[Perry Romanowski]

Yeah, yeah.

[Valerie George]

Sloane Stevens. But Serena's line is also the color of tennis balls.

[Perry Romanowski]

Right, okay. So that was very clever. But there was a male superstar who launched a line this year that I remember about. But I was looking back on our.

[Valerie George]

Gosh, you know, I'm gonna be honest, Perry. My brain has totally disappeared over the last. It's a thing. It's like soup right now.

[Laura]

Who?

[Valerie George]

I mean, I even took Mr. Cosmetic Chemist's phone to work today, and he called me from my phone and was like, do you have the right phone? And I was like, what? That's what happens at the end of the year. So who was it? I just don't remember.

[Perry Romanowski]

He just turned 40. LeBron James.

[Valerie George]

Oh, yeah.

[Perry Romanowski]

Early in February. LeBron James.

[Valerie George]

I wonder how it's doing. I haven't heard much about.

[Perry Romanowski]

Yeah. And of course, Beyonce launched her line.

[Valerie George]

Which I have thoughts about. I've shared them, especially in the episode with Sara Bellum, and I was just really disappointed.

[Perry Romanowski]

Well, they can't all be hits, but you know what can't be hits? All of these great questions that we've answered this year. Do you remember some of the ones that we did? I'm gonna drop in some of our favorites to fill up some of the show. But what were some of your favorites this year?

[Valerie George]

I really thought it was interesting because I didn't realize this was a trend. And maybe this was, like, on TikTok, and I'm just, like, totally unaware. But someone had asked why people were putting estrogen cream on their face.

[Perry Romanowski]

Oh, yeah.

[Valerie George]

And I was like, what? That's like putting. You just don't put prescription stuff on your face. You just Don't.

[Perry Romanowski]

Right. It also seemed very strange that there's all this worry about hormone disruptors and being unsafe, and yet someone's just gonna put estrogen on their face. Is a hormone.

[Valerie George]

The things people will do for beauty.

[Perry Romanowski]

It seemed very strange.

[Valerie George]

What about you?

[Perry Romanowski]

And of course. Well, I remember the. Remember that tranexamic acid one about hyperpigmentation? That one caused a bit of a stir.

[Valerie George]

You know it did. And you know, I think that's okay. Everyone's entitled to a difference of opinion. We do read a of scientific papers. I think it was insinuated that not all scientists know how to read them, which I can assure you we do. But I think it's okay to have a difference of opinion, and that's people's rights.

[Perry Romanowski]

Yeah. And in fact, you and I, we often have a difference of opinion about whether anti aging products work or not.

[Valerie George]

You know, vitamin C.

[Perry Romanowski]

Oh, we love vitamin C. Come on. So, yeah, I'm gonna go through and put in some of our favorite questions and fill the rest there.

[Valerie George]

And we hope you guys agree that they were pretty good ones as well.

[Perry Romanowski]

Yeah. Or at least there were some amusing moments. Although, remember that. Remember that story around April Fool's Day where a company launched a gold hair dye? Was that the color of their products?

[Valerie George]

Was that. That was an April Fool's joke?

[Perry Romanowski]

It was. Velveteen launched their limited gold hair edition.

[Valerie George]

No, Velveeta.

[Perry Romanowski]

That's right, Velveeta.

[Valerie George]

Oh, that's right. Oh, gosh, that was a good one. You know, I thought of a really good April Fool's joke for our Beauty brains fans the other day, but I should have written it down. I forgot.

[Perry Romanowski]

It should write it down. You know, there's an app called My Mind.

[Valerie George]

Okay.

[Perry Romanowski]

Just click, click on it, and it just saves whatever. And your mind is there on the cloud.

[Valerie George]

Do you use it?

[Perry Romanowski]

I do, although it filled up, so my mind is filled.

[Valerie George]

Your mind is very full.

[Perry Romanowski]

Unless I pay for more, they're not gonna let me fill my mind.

[Valerie George]

You know, I have a notebook where you could, like, put these letters on it. Some people had gotten them at work, and I got one and I wrote welcome to my Mind on it. It's a very scary place.

[Perry Romanowski]

Oh, Mr.

[Valerie George]

Cosmetic chemist says he doesn't want to be in my mind.

[Perry Romanowski]

So sometimes, you know, my friend, she just got one of the. Or she was. She brought. She stayed with us the other day and she brought her Kindle. But this Kindle, you can write on it.

[Valerie George]

Okay.

[Perry Romanowski]

And so she journals every day. And so she's got her entire handwritten journal stored digitally and she can like search it and stuff.

[Valerie George]

I hope that device is secure and she's not putting her deepest, darkest secrets in there.

[Perry Romanowski]

That's a, that's a good, good point. I mean, I guess if it's not connected to the Internet. That's right. You're not a big fan of all this technology.

[Valerie George]

I'm not. I'm not.

[Lydia]

Valerie, we got lots of questions from patrons. So actually all the questions today come from our patrons. And if you want to support the show on Patreon, just go to patreon.com thebeautybrains and subscribe at any level.

[Laura]

This is not so we can go buy Lamborghinis, everyone.

[Valerie George]

First of all, we like Ferraris. I'm just kidding.

[Laura]

But it does help cover basic costs for the show, web hosting, etc. So we appreciate your support.

[Lydia]

Absolutely. All right, our first question comes to us from Lydia. We teased this one last week. Hello, Perry and Valerie, thank you for all you do. I do have a couple of questions. I heard Valerie discussing her positive experience with tranexamic acid for hyperpigmentation on episode 366. I then began to do a little research on it and came across a segment by Dr. Michelle Wong, aka Lab Muffin Beauty. She is a chemistry PhD science educator and cosmetic chemist. She said that because tranexamic acid contains an amine that remains positively charged at any ph under 10 that then that makes tranexamic acid molecule nearly impossible to penetrate the skin. She said that positively charged AHAs cannot effectively enter the skin. She hypothesized that any dark spot reduction from the tranexamic acid topical treatment is due to other ingredients and not the tranexamic acid. What are your thoughts on her perspective? Did I misunderstand the explanation? And then she says for another hyperpigmentation, what are your thoughts on the effectiveness of a combination of azelaic acid, niacinamide and vitamin C as the actives in one cream? Would these play nice together and be effective? All right, that's Lydia. Thank you both for so much, your excellent advice and a great dash of humor. Lydia. Well, Valerie, you were called out by.

[Perry Romanowski]

Name in this one.

[Lydia]

I do remember you talking about your tranexamic acid that you like.

[Laura]

Well, I don't think tranexamic acid is different from any other skin active molecule in that things that are really active and tend to work. You have to get into the skin, not many things passively and actively penetrate through the stratum corneum actually is designed.

[Valerie George]

To prevent that from happening.

[Laura]

So a product has to be formulated with a delivery system in mind. And tranexamic is no exception to that. The PKA that lab muffin Dr. Michelle Wong was talking about relates to the point at which a molecule has a positive, a neutral or a negative charge. And PKA is only one property that is taken into consideration when we're talking about skin penetration. There's other things, such as the dimensions, the way the molecule is shaped in 3D, its molecular weight, its hydrophilic lipophilic propensity to penetrate into the skin, as well as the anatomy and physiology of the skin and what other products it's formulated with. So to say that just because it has a high PKA and it's not going to go in. I saw the post.

[Valerie George]

I personally thought it was clickbait to.

[Laura]

Get you to click on it. I think there's a lot of other factors that go into formulating products. In addition, there's a lot of literature out there that shows tranexamic acid does work. Some of the studies are done alone, some of them are done in combination with other skin lightening therapies, and some of the studies are done on showing how to improve the penetration. But that's literally no different than any other molecule on the market. Vitamin C, retinoids. You know, there's a lot of work focused on the skin delivery aspect. And so to say, well, it doesn't work, doesn't mean anything. Salicylic acid works above a neutral ph to do all the things it could.

[Valerie George]

Do at a low ph. So I totally wouldn't put a lot.

[Laura]

Of weight in that. It's really about the product and the way that it has been used. And in fact, if you'd like, Perry, I could go through a little bit of some of the, you know, things that I think are great about tranexamic acid. If you want me to do some of the studies.

[Lydia]

Yeah. I will mention that I looked through a study at tranexamic acid and they showed evidence of it working topically. And while Michelle has looked at the chemistry of it, looking at the chemistry and then predicting what's going to happen in real life when it's used, those are kind of different things because sometimes surprising things happen. You know, there are people who say hyaluronic acid can't penetrate because it's over 500 Dalton, but then there are some studies that show that it penetrates when it shouldn't. So you can't always predict Just from.

[Valerie George]

What the one aspect, there's a specific.

[Laura]

Log number that tells you its propensity to penetrate into skin.

[Lydia]

Right. And if you have all that data, you also don't know you have to actually do the study to see. And you know, the power is in, the proof is in the pudding. Or as they would say, if you do a study where tranexamic acid topically applied is applied for a few months and you see hyperpigmentation reduction, maybe it's doing something well.

[Laura]

Tranexamic acid is valuable for a couple things. One, it treats existing pigmentation and can prevent new pigmentation from occurring because it reacts on two different pigmentation pathways in the body. There was one 2007 study looking at 5% tranexamic acid against a 3% hydroquinone cream on Indian skin. And researchers found that the tranexamic acid significantly improved existing freckles while preventing new ones from forming over daily use over 12 weeks. I like this study because not all skin lightening agents can be used on darker Fitzpatrick skin types, but tranexamic acid is one of them that certainly can. There was Another study, a 5% solution of tranexamic acid that also looked at its ability to reduce post acne inflammatory marks. And the tranexamic acid performed quite well. Again, just a 5% solution alone, no other skin lighteners. And then patients with mild melasma also benefited from a 2% solution of tranexamic acid. This 2% tranexamic acid cream was applied to 23 participants with mild melasma for 12 weeks. Out of 23, 22 saw statistically significant benefit of skin lightening. And this was, this was with tranexamic acid alone. It's also been widely studied with other skin lighteners. It has a great synergy with them because skin lighteners work on different pathways for reducing skin pigmentation. It's been studied with hydroquinone, it's been studied with water soluble forms of vitamin C, arbutin, niacinamide. And in fact it actually has a really great synergy with tranexamic acid. You don't need a tranexamic acid product to be a low ph. It's really ph independant.

[Valerie George]

So I always like to say use.

[Laura]

It with niacinamide, put it at, you know, a ph of 6 to 7, which is really important for the niacinamide. But the subjects in this study saw with just 2% niacinamide, 2% tranexamic acid in an SPF 15 cream twice daily saw a tremendous decrease in skin melanin content and difference in skin pigmentation just in eight weeks.

[Valerie George]

So I thought that was pretty cool as well.

[Laura]

All skin lighteners take a pretty significant time to work. There's also one Korean publication that looks at tranexamic acid in conjunction with polydaten, a resveratrol precursor. And they also showed some skin lightening. It has some synergy with the licorice root extracts, the glycerizates. So there's lots of information available out there. Tranexamic acid alone, tranexamic acid with other lighteners. And these are real cosmetic preparations applied to skin over 4 week to 12 week studies. And I say it works.

[Valerie George]

Hi, Valerie and Perry, have you heard.

[Laura]

Of the trend of putting estrogen cream on your face and skin? If so, any thoughts?

[Valerie George]

Keep up the great work.

[Laura]

An adoring patron on Patreon Laura.

[Lydia]

Estrogen cream on your face. So I looked into this a bit and indeed there are companies selling estrogen products that are infused with estrogen as creams.

[Perry Romanowski]

And there's no evidence that I found.

[Lydia]

At least scientifically published evidence that it's doing anything positive at all.

[Valerie George]

Anything positive at all is a key.

[Laura]

Phrase there, because topical estrogen, it does penetrate into your skin.

[Valerie George]

Topical creams are applied all the time, are prescribed all the time for people going through menopause.

[Perry Romanowski]

Sure.

[Laura]

People who have a hormonal imbalance, but.

[Valerie George]

It'S prescribed by a doctor.

[Laura]

It's usually made at a compounding pharmacy.

[Valerie George]

Or some other outlet, but you wouldn't.

[Laura]

Ever use it for beauty. You can also get an estrogen cream, but it's usually applied vaginally if you.

[Valerie George]

Have a dry vagina or other symptoms.

[Laura]

Related to menopause or thinning skin down there. But in a face cream, I mean, no way we're talking a drug active here.

[Perry Romanowski]

Yeah.

[Lydia]

So how do you think this ends.

[Perry Romanowski]

Up as a thing?

[Laura]

Well, if I had to get inside somebody's mind.

[Lydia]

The mind of a marketer.

[Laura]

I was going to say the mind of someone who saw this on Facebook and decided to buy it and apply it. Please don't do that. If I had to get inside someone's mind. Estrogen is a hormone of youth.

[Lydia]

Right.

[Laura]

A hormone of fertility.

[Perry Romanowski]

Sure.

[Laura]

And so if you are having aging skin, you might just think, you know what estrogen is a hormone that's in young people, or it's something that's in young people, or it's a hormone of fertility. I probably would think, you know what.

[Valerie George]

Let me Just put a little bit.

[Laura]

On my skin and see if it.

[Valerie George]

Helps restore a youthful look to my face.

[Perry Romanowski]

Yeah, I mean, it's not far fetched. Right. And you could see a marketer saying.

[Lydia]

Well, if people already believe this, then let's just make a product with it.

[Perry Romanowski]

In there and see if we get anyone to buy it.

[Laura]

Now, should companies be producing and selling.

[Valerie George]

A product like this?

[Perry Romanowski]

It does seem kind of dubious in.

[Lydia]

That when you hear about non clean cosmetics and things, they always talk about.

[Perry Romanowski]

How they're estrogen disruptors or something. And wouldn't putting estrogen be disrupting the whole system somehow?

[Valerie George]

Yeah. Oops.

[Perry Romanowski]

Yeah.

[Lydia]

So let's not put methylparaben on there because we're afraid of whatever it might do, the estrogen system.

[Perry Romanowski]

But we'll put a ton of estrogen right there and not care. I don't know.

[Valerie George]

Also, like, I don't know if the FDA allows that because I mean, technically.

[Laura]

I think it's a drug when it's.

[Valerie George]

Applied topically at least the creams you.

[Laura]

Get from your doctor have an extremely low dose to them and that's really doing physiological changes in your body.

[Valerie George]

So I would be hard pressed to.

[Laura]

Believe that the FDA would be okay with someone putting estrogen or estiol, I think is another analog of it that people are putting in creams. I would be shocked if that's allowed.

[Perry Romanowski]

Yeah, I suspect they might just do.

[Lydia]

Some sort of estrogen analog, you know, and make people not, not really say they're putting estrogen in, but make people.

[Perry Romanowski]

On social media believe that that's what's going on.

[Laura]

Overall, I just think it's a bad idea.

[Perry Romanowski]

Yeah.

[Laura]

And I do not recommend purchasing it.

[Valerie George]

Because I doubt you could get it.

[Laura]

Through any legitimate channels. And if you could, that's also of concern. And by legitimate channels, I don't mean Facebook, Amazon, ebay.

[Perry Romanowski]

Right.

[Valerie George]

Craigslist, a thrift store, a farmer's market. I probably would just pass or I.

[Laura]

Would consult my doctor first.

[Valerie George]

Well, Beauty Rains fans, as we close out the last episode of this year, Perry and I wanted to take a moment to thank you guys, each and every one of you, for being a part of our Beauty Brains community and supporting the show.

[Perry Romanowski]

That's right. Your questions and feedback and the enthusiasm that has really made doing this fun for us. And that's why we keep doing it, because we keep getting questions and we keep, we're interested enough in the answers that hey, we'll keep doing it in the coming years.

[Valerie George]

And actually we couldn't do it without you because the show is based on questions, not guests. So, like, we literally need you guys. So whether you guys have tuned in because you want to explore the latest questions that we're answering, all the things that are happening in our world of cosmetic science, maybe you just want to get updates on porch kitties and lab kitties. Maybe you just think we're, like, really funny, because I think we're pretty funny and you want to laugh along with us. Or maybe, and I'm very sorry if, you know, if you had to endure all the horrible Perry's use of AI over this year, hopefully you've shared episodes.

[Perry Romanowski]

With friends that was really only two or three shows too many.

[Valerie George]

By the way, no matter how you've listened to the show or what your reasons were for tuning in, you guys have really helped us grow and connect in ways we never imagined. And it's so cool when people say, hey, I heard on the last episode, and I'm like, what? You listen to the show? So thank you guys so much.

[Perry Romanowski]

You know, my fun moment this year, I was in Bangkok, and someone came up to me and says, I love your show. And then they also were like, we're waiting for the next one because we hadn't done a show for, like, three weeks or something. And then.

[Valerie George]

I know. Isn't the pressure real?

[Perry Romanowski]

Yeah, yeah, sorry. Sometimes it's a challenge to get us both in the same room at the same time and record, but as we go into this new year, we are. I'm not gonna read that. That's just stupid. See, that's AI.

[Valerie George]

I'm like, wow, Perry, AI.

[Perry Romanowski]

Yeah. AI is doing it. All right, well, thanks for listening.

[Valerie George]

If you get a chance, head over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a review that's going to help other people find the show and ensure we have a full docket of beauty questions to answer.

[Perry Romanowski]

You can also leave a review on Spotify or a comment on Spotify. I look at the Spotify comments. Speaking of comments, if you have a question, you can just record it on your smartphone and email it to [e-mail] or you can just use the form in the show notes in this episode. So we. We have that, too.

[Valerie George]

The Beauty Brains are also on Patreon, if you guys noticed. I thanked you guys for being a part of the show because it really is your questions that fuel the episodes, not guests or annoying ads. But there are basic costs of the show that are required for us to pay in order to keep the show going, and so your support is truly appreciated. If you want to give at any level, we really thank you for that. You can head over to patreon.com thebeautybrains.

[Perry Romanowski]

And subscribe and subscribers get their questions answered in a higher priority and a transcript of the show. Speaking of transcript, you can also follow us on social media, on Instagram, we're hebeautybrains 2018. We're on Twitter or X or X Twitter. We're heauty brains. We also have Blue sky and we got at the Beautybrains there. And we have a Facebook page and TikTok. We've never really used TikTok much, although we have an account there.

[Valerie George]

Yeah, I can't figure out how it works. So basically, when we followed those new, you know, pledged our New Year's resolutions of like, we're gonna be more active on social media, what we really meant is Instagram and X.

[Perry Romanowski]

That's right. And now Blue Sky. I've been to X and it's just too disgusting.

[Valerie George]

You're gonna have to figure Blue sky out. I'm too old for this stuff. All right, well, thanks again for listening, everyone. And remember, be brainy about your beauty.

[Perry Romanowski]

And have a Happy and joyful 2025.

[Valerie George]

See you guys next year.

[Perry Romanowski]

Thanks, everyone.

[Valerie George]

K.