Vault: Do holidays expose how people view unmarried couples?

Summary

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The Bert Show

Episode: Vault: Do holidays expose how people view unmarried couples?

Date: May 29, 2026

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Overview

This episode of The Bert Show takes a candid look at how holidays—specifically Christmas—put a spotlight on the status of unmarried couples, including those who live together, are in long-term relationships, or cannot legally marry. The hosts share personal stories and listener calls that reveal the complexities around holiday planning, family expectations, and the struggle for unmarried couples to carve out their own traditions and sense of priority.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Core Dilemma: Unmarried Couples and Holiday Priorities

[01:32 - 04:15]

• Host 1 opens up about recurring holiday frustrations stemming from not being married to his partner, Katie. Despite being together for four years, family traditions and expectations often push their couple time to the margins.
• There's a sense of being "pulled in so many different directions" by family, with the unmarried status making it more difficult to assert their relationship as a primary unit during the holidays.

“Just because you’re not married, why is it that a couple cannot dictate to people, ‘Look, we have our own Christmas celebration, and then the family comes second’?”
– Host 1, [03:54]

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2. Does Marriage Change the Dynamic?

[04:15 - 05:11]

• Host 3 notes that families may not take unmarried relationships as seriously, having seen "so many women and so many guys come and go over the years." The implication: official marital status signals permanence worth reorganizing traditions for.
• Host 1 argues, after four years, they should have "earned" their time as a couple.

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3. What Actually Triggers Autonomy: Marriage or Kids?

[05:11 - 06:32]

• Host 4 suggests it's neither marriage nor togetherness, but actually having children that shifts family expectations. Couples with kids are finally able to establish their own holiday traditions; the family "tides" change, and others work around them.
• A tongue-in-cheek suggestion is made: “So maybe you guys just need to have a baby...”

“It seems then they can start their own traditions... all of a sudden they’re in charge because they have kids now.”
– Host 4, [05:42]

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4. Listener Experiences: Reinforcing or Refuting the Pattern

A. Married but Still Second Place
[06:32 - 07:34]

• Shelly calls in, married three years, but still finds her birth family expects to come first. Her experience challenges the idea that marriage alone flips the switch.

“My family still expects that I’m supposed to put my spouse’s family last and they come first.”
– Shelly, [06:45]

B. Cohabiting Partners that Are Still “That Boy”
[08:40 - 09:24]

• Andrea shares that despite living with her boyfriend for three years, her mom refers to him as "that boy" and expects her to celebrate primarily with her family. Andrea believes her mother might regard her partner differently if they were married.

“My mom is still very much—‘Are you coming to have Christmas Eve by yourself or are you bringing that boy?’”
– Andrea, [08:48]

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5. The Toll of Extended Family Obligations

[07:34 - 08:40]

• The hosts recount the story of Tracy and Scott, whose holiday season involves driving hundreds of miles to multiple family gatherings—a logistical headache that did not disappear even after marriage, but was somewhat complicated by having a baby.

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6. Setting Boundaries—and Struggling to Get on the Same Page

[09:27 - 09:58]

• Host 1 reflects on the essential challenge: “It’s up to us to set the boundaries. I’ve realized that Katie and I are not on the same page about those boundaries.”
• Host 2 (Melissa) notes the factor of geographic proximity, drawing from her own experiences—living far from family can ease or intensify these conflicts, depending.

“It’s like, why am I last?”
– Host 1, [09:58]

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On being marginalized as a couple:
  “We’re trying to coordinate... but my planning is always what Katie and I are going to do first. And then... my family’s a little more used to me letting them know that they’re second when it comes to Christmas. But I don’t think Katie has that in her head... because we’re just dating.”
  – Host 1, [02:55]

• On the difference kids make:
  “Once the couple has kids... they get to dictate where Christmas morning is gonna be and how they’re gonna do the gifting and how they’re gonna do their own traditions...”
  – Host 4, [05:42]

• On asserting couple priority:
  “I don’t want to have Christmas on the 26th or the 23rd or whenever so that we can accommodate other people in our lives. If we’re going to start our own traditions and start our own life, I feel like we have earned it.”
  – Host 1, [07:00]

• Listener reality check:
  “If you have any advice, let me know how that goes. I need it.”
  – Andrea, [09:07]

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Segment Timestamps

• [01:32] – Host 1 introduces the holiday friction with Katie and the problem of not being married
• [04:15] – Are families waiting for the “official” status before giving a couple autonomy?
• [05:11] – The real “switch” is having kids, not just being married
• [06:32] – Shelly shares that marriage did not automatically change her family’s expectations
• [07:34] – The Tracy & Scott saga: the never-ending tour of family gatherings
• [08:40] – Andrea’s struggle for her long-term partner to be seen as “family”
• [09:27] – Hosts reflect on personal boundary-setting and mismatched couple priorities
• [09:58] – Host 1’s final reflection: “Why am I last?”

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Tone & Style

The conversation is frank and relatable, peppered with humor and a little exasperation. The hosts and callers reveal genuine struggles, but keep the discussion light, funny, and authentic.

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Takeaways

• Marital status is a significant factor in how families distribute holiday attention and prioritize couple time—though sometimes, even marriage or cohabitation doesn’t shift expectations.
• Having children is a more reliable “tipping point” for establishing new traditions and asserting autonomy.
• Regardless of legal status, the key to holiday happiness for couples is boundary setting and communication, though even this can be difficult when partners aren’t aligned.
• Unmarried couples often feel like afterthoughts in family holiday planning, which can cause friction and feelings of marginalization.

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This episode is essential listening for anyone in a long-term, unmarried relationship navigating the holiday season—or anyone who wonders why it’s so complicated.

Transcript

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[Host 1 (Possibly Male, Discussing Relationship Issues)]

don't see eye to eye on some. Well, there's a lot of things Katie and I don't see eye to eye on because we're very different people. But I do think that's why our relationship works. But this, this in particular just kind of is a little friction this Christmas based on something from last Christmas. So. And I think it has everything to do with the fact that we're not married. And what disturbs me is the fact that, you know, in Georgia we can never get married. So I don't know if this will ever change. So it's kind of something I want to ask or present to people who are in a Relationship who aren't married over the holidays.

[Host 2 (Melissa)]

Never. Melissa.

[Host 1 (Possibly Male, Discussing Relationship Issues)]

I mean, if DC approves it, this may cause us to move to DC to get married for this. Because I feel like over the holidays people have a disrespect for couples who are not married. And it's not just outside. I think it's couples themselves on them being their priority for Christmas to where families pull them in so many different directions. And if you're not married and you feel obligated to do whatever the family tells you to do. And what I'm talking about is last year, Christmas Eve was spent with Katie's family, I believe. I've been trying to think. I think it was Christmas Eve we spent with Katie's family, which was great. I mean, I enjoy her family. I love her family. And then Christmas morning, I think it was the night before on Christmas Eve that Katie said, oh, by the way, I'm going to be going to have breakfast with my grandparents today or tomorrow morning. I, I and so, and she was going to go with, you know, just tradition, her and, you know, some of her family to go have breakfast with her grandparents early. And I think it was the case that she didn't want me to have to get up early. And then I was having to get prepared for us to go to Nashville and stuff. So it was more of a scheduling thing, but it was just the announcement the night before that I'm going to breakfast. So we had Christmas Eve with her family dinner, and she comes from a divorced family, so it was one side for Christmas Eve is the other side for Christmas morning. And, and I felt like, well, where do we fit in to this? You know, where is our Christmas? So I thought about this the other day and haven't brought it up to her because Christmas still a week away, but because we're doing, trying to do logistic things because my family's obviously not here, they're in Nashville. So we're trying to coordinate with them when we're going to get together. But my planning is always, you know, what Katie and I are going to do first. And then, you know, I tell my family, my family's, you know, a little more used to me letting them know that they're second when it comes to Christmas. But I don't think Katie has that in her head and I don't think her, her family has that in her head because we're just dating. So. And I made a comment to, I made this comment to a friend who said, oh, well, that happened when we were, you know, dating. But once we got married, everything changed. And I thought, but we can't. We can't get married. So I just feel like. I just feel like, you know, just because you're not married, why is it that a couple cannot dictate to people? Look, we have our own Christmas celebration, and then the family comes second.

[Host 3 (Commentator on Relationship Status)]

Um, I think there are two different debates here. There's the one that you guys can't get married, which really changes everything. But I think that if you're the family and you're watching your daughter or you're watching your sister, what have you, They've probably seen so many women and so many guys come and go over the years that even though they're in a very serious relationship now, since it's not in officially committed status, it's still not taken as seriously.

[Host 1 (Possibly Male, Discussing Relationship Issues)]

But we've been together for four years. I mean, I just think we have earned our time.

[Host 2 (Melissa)]

If you weren't a slut, then it would be so much easier.

[Host 1 (Possibly Male, Discussing Relationship Issues)]

You know, I see what he's saying is like, but, you know, you. But with us and with gay couples and with couples who don't. I mean, it's not just a gay thing. There's plenty of straight couples who don't want to get married. And so I just think that just, you know, what is the border in which you, you know, where the family automatically knows? Okay, what. I don't know what y' all are doing or when y' all are doing your Christmas, but when are we gonna get together? You know, it just seems like we're. I'm last.

[Host 4 (Commentator on Family and Kids)]

I would even say that it's not necessarily married couples. It's once you have kids. Because I have friends that are married without children that are still expected to do the rounds and, you know, run all over the place and make the. Make it about the families and everything else. But then once the. Once the couple has kids, it seems then they can start their own traditions. Then the family then, like, the tides change and the family has to come to them because they plan their traditions around the kids.

[Host 1 (Possibly Male, Discussing Relationship Issues)]

It's not just. It's not me want to be with the family. It's me wanting to be with Katie. It's me and Katie by ourselves.

[Host 4 (Commentator on Family and Kids)]

Right, exactly. And being at home and not have to be on anybody else's skin and that kind of thing. But I feel like that doesn't even turn until you have children. Cause I've watched it with my friends who have kids now, and they were running around ragged. It wasn't Christmas morning. Wasn't for the two of them, it was for, you know, going to this house or going to that house or whatever else. And then once they had children, it's like now they get to dictate where Christmas morning is gonna be and, you know, how they're gonna do the gifting and how they're gonna do their own traditions and where they're gonna have breakfast and dinner and when they're gonna go to church and all that kind of stuff. And it's like all of a sudden they're in charge because they have kids now and then the grandparents and everything else, like starts to default to their own traditions. So maybe you guys just need to have a baby and.

[Host 1 (Possibly Male, Discussing Relationship Issues)]

Yeah, that's the one reason to have the baby. Yes.

[Host 4 (Commentator on Family and Kids)]

Christmas.

[Host 2 (Melissa)]

Hey, Shelly, welcome to the bird show.

[Guest (Shelly)]

Good morning.

[Host 2 (Melissa)]

Good morning.

[Guest (Shelly)]

I wanted to comment on that. You know, Melissa, I really don't know that it has anything to do with being married per se. I've been married for three years.

[Host 1 (Possibly Male, Discussing Relationship Issues)]

Okay.

[Guest (Shelly)]

My family still expects that I'm supposed to put my spouse's family last and they come first.

[Host 1 (Possibly Male, Discussing Relationship Issues)]

Yeah, I just, I am a traditionalist. I love family. I mean, I love my family, I love Katie's family. So it has nothing to do with not wanting to be around them. It's my. I just find that and, you know, and I put a lot of responsibility on Katie that, you know, and last year that's where I, you know, we had a conversation about it last year. I felt like that, you know, there needs to be time for us because I don't want to with my four year girlfriend. I don't want to have Christmas on the 26th or the 23rd or whenever so that we can accommodate the other people in our lives. It's like, well, if we're going to start our own traditions and start our own life, I feel like we're now again, after four years, I feel like we have earned it.

[Host 2 (Melissa)]

The worst case I've ever seen is Tracy and Scott. And we talk about this every year. I think they travel like one year. I think they told us like 200 miles, but not like to a destination or like 100 miles somewhere and back.

[Host 1 (Possibly Male, Discussing Relationship Issues)]

Like, oh, it's here and it's just around town.

[Host 2 (Melissa)]

Tracy, if she's here already, she'll come down and explain it or whatever. But like they go to Athens and back on Christmas Eve, then like to Woodstock, then to Athens, then back to Woodstock, then to somewhere else because they just have grandparents and divorced families and this and that, and they do the same thing. And I remember when they got married, Tracy thinking it was gonna stop, and it didn't.

[Host 1 (Possibly Male, Discussing Relationship Issues)]

But I wanna ask Tracy. When did Scott and Tracy have their personal time?

[Host 4 (Commentator on Family and Kids)]

Did they wait, it's this year because they have a baby?

[Host 2 (Melissa)]

Uh, they're doing it again. I think they did it on Thanksgiving. And again, everybody wants to see the baby.

[Host 1 (Possibly Male, Discussing Relationship Issues)]

Well, the thing is, I don't want to confuse things. Even if it's Christmas Day and we travel around, I'm fine with that. It's just. Do couples have the personal time in which they say, christmas Eve is ours, Christmas morning is ours, and then we travel around? The thing is, Katie and I don't have the personal time. We don't have that, you know.

[Host 2 (Melissa)]

Hey, Andrea. Yes, how are you? Welcome to the show.

[Guest (Shelly)]

Good. How are y'? All?

[Host 1 (Possibly Male, Discussing Relationship Issues)]

Good.

[Guest (Shelly)]

Yeah. I'm going through the same thing right now. I've been with my boyfriend for three years and we live together, so it's not like we're just doing the whole dating thing. And my mom is still very much. Are you coming to have Christmas Eve by yourself or are you bringing that boy? And I'm like, mom, he's not that boy anymore. And if you were married, good luck with that. If you have any advice, let me know how that goes. I need it.

[Host 1 (Possibly Male, Discussing Relationship Issues)]

Do you think if you were married, your mother would say something different?

[Guest (Shelly)]

Honestly, I do. Just because, I don't know, she's ready for me to get married, ready for me to have kids. And I think, yeah, she's. I'm like, mom, one step at a time, right?

[Host 1 (Possibly Male, Discussing Relationship Issues)]

Thank you.

[Host 2 (Melissa)]

Thank you.

[Host 1 (Possibly Male, Discussing Relationship Issues)]

Good luck.

[Host 2 (Melissa)]

Yeah, that's. That's. That's gonna be.

[Host 1 (Possibly Male, Discussing Relationship Issues)]

I mean, it's. It's up to us to set the boundaries. I just. The thing is, I've realized that Katie and I are not on the same page about those boundaries.

[Host 2 (Melissa)]

You know, I remember when Jessica and I were living. I think part of it too, is proximity of family. Cause your family's farther away. Yeah, like, I remember that too. When I was living in Arizona with Jessica, she was like, okay. And then we woke up Christmas morning, and I thought we were gonna hang out and I was gonna make breakfast and it was gonna be like, okay, well, let's go over to my parents house first, then we'll come back and do our presents. And I'm like, what?

[Host 1 (Possibly Male, Discussing Relationship Issues)]

Yeah. Huh? Same thing. It's like, why am I last?

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