Vault: He pays for sex Part 1

Summary

The Bert Show – "Vault: He Pays For Sex Part 1" (August 11, 2026)

Episode Overview

In this candid and provocative episode, The Bert Show team dives deep into the taboo subject of paying for sex, prompted by a listener’s suspicions that her roommate is a sex worker. The centerpiece of the show is a frank, open interview with "Joe Disguise," a self-identified "hobbyist" (client of escorts/providers), who offers an insider’s perspective on the world of transactional intimacy. The conversation is unapologetically real, mixing humor, social commentary, and listener call-ins, while dismantling stereotypes about the sex trade in contemporary cities.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Defining the World: Hobbyists, Providers, and Language

• Joe introduces the preferred terminology among participants:
  • “Hobbyist” is used instead of “john” or “client” for men who pay for sex, aiming for a more “politically correct” label.
  • The term “provider” is favored over “escort” or “prostitute”.
  • “We do not like to use the term prostitution... Hobbyist just sounds a lot more politically correct.” — Joe Disguise (01:58)

2. How and Where Transactions Happen

• Joe reveals that transactional sex often happens in the provider’s home, challenging the stereotype that it occurs only in seedy locations.
• Most connections are made via the Internet, specifically on websites like Craigslist and Creative Loafing.
  • “Believe it or not, you can find them anywhere. On the Internet is the most common place to do it.” — Joe Disguise (02:29)

3. First-Time Experiences Paying for Sex

• Joe describes his first experience, framed as more straightforward and less emotionally complex than traditional dating.
• He admits to initial nerves but found the interaction surprisingly “painless” once it began.
• “By the time I got done, I was like, wow, that’s pretty painless.” — Joe Disguise (04:03)

4. Comparisons to Traditional Dating

• Joe frames paying for sex as a practical and efficient alternative to dating, emphasizing emotional detachment.

  • “You are literally spending... $250, $300. And there’s no guarantee that you’re going to... score.” — Joe Disguise (04:16)

• The hosts challenge this notion, questioning the emotional impact and dignity.

  • “The admission that I couldn’t do this without paying for it as a man... would be so demoralizing.” — Host 1 (04:48)

• Joe rebuts, claiming most men ultimately have ulterior sexual motives in relationships and essentially “pay for it anyway”—through time, effort, and money.

  • “Whether you have a girlfriend, a long term committed relationship, or you’re married, you’re paying for it anyway.” — Joe Disguise (06:15)

5. Personal Impact and Perceptions

• Joe openly discusses being married in the past and his ongoing participation in the escort scene.

• He claims there's no shame or emotional distress in it for him now and frames it as a matter of choice and personal enjoyment.

• “For me now, it’s actually very enjoyable. I enjoy doing it. I enjoy, you know, being able to, I guess you would call it, pick and choose.” — Joe Disguise (07:22)

• Joe addresses stereotypes, stating many sex workers are educated, attractive, and from diverse backgrounds, not what the public imagines.

6. Prevalence of Married Providers

• Joe claims a considerable number of providers are married or have families, and the recent recession increased this trend.
• “There has been, since the recession hit, a steady rise... especially in women over 35 that have started doing this. A lot of them are married and/or have kids.” — Joe Disguise (08:17)

7. Finances: Costs and Frequency

• Joe details the financials:

  • Average Atlanta rates: $250–$300 for “A+ to B-” class providers

  • VIP/“Pornographic Star Experience (PSE)” rates: $400–$1700 per hour

  • “The lowest I’ve seen on an A plus is $400 an hour, and the highest I’ve ever seen is $1700 an hour.” — Joe Disguise (10:25)

8. Safety, Legality, and Community

• Joe discusses how "hobbyists" use private websites and rating systems to vet providers and minimize risk.
  • “There are two or three main sites... and there’s a rating system, literally... we can find out every single solitary detail about a provider.” — Joe Disguise (11:38)
• No personal addresses are shared, but physical characteristics, cleanliness, and behaviors are all documented.

9. Upcoming Listener Reactions

• Toward the end, the hosts tease further perspectives, including an escort who wants to respond and other men who regret similar experiences.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Challenging Stereotypes:

  • “Most of the providers... are people you would never know. And they're gorgeous and they're smart, they're attractive. A lot of them have degrees.” — Joe Disguise (07:24)

• About Costs:

  • “The lowest I’ve seen on an A plus is $400 an hour, and the highest I’ve ever seen is $1700 an hour.” — Joe Disguise (10:25)
  • Host 1 jokes: “That better include, like, 50 minutes of watching TV with me.” (10:55)

• Community and Protection:

  • “We actually... communicate with one another. And there’s a rating system. Literally... we can find out every single solitary detail about a provider... her dwelling, if it’s clean or not, if she smokes or not.” — Joe Disguise (11:38)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [00:53] – Show's topic setup: listener suspects roommate is a prostitute
• [01:51] – Definition of "hobbyist" and preferred language
• [02:29] – Where providers are found (Internet, Craigslist, etc.)
• [03:03] – Joe’s first experience and emotions
• [04:16] – Cost-benefit comparison with dating
• [04:48] – Host reflects on emotional impact of paying for sex
• [06:15] – Joe’s “you’re paying for it anyway” argument
• [07:22] – Positive framing from Joe about choosing transactional sex
• [08:17] – Married women and the "recession effect"
• [10:25] – Discussion of rates for different services
• [11:38] – Hobbyists’ rating system and safety protocols
• [12:44] – Transition to listener responses and upcoming calls

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Structure & Tone

The conversation is frank, irreverent, and at times humorous—classic Bert Show energy, even while handling controversial content. Joe’s detailed perspective and willingness to address tough questions give the episode depth, while the hosts’ skepticism and curiosity ensure a dynamic, multi-faceted discussion.

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Summary

This episode strips away many assumptions about sex work and challenges listeners to reconsider notions of transactional relationships, stigma, and autonomy. The cast promises further debate in Part 2, including responses from an escort and other callers, signaling a broader conversation about the complexities of sex, money, and society.

Transcript

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[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

to play social casino void where prohibited. Visit spinquest.com for more details. The Birch show we stumbled on this conversation last week. We were talking to a Birch show listener who we're going to talk to later on in the show that thinks that her roommate might be a prostitute. So one of the calls said that look, if there were guys coming over to their house, then she's, she's not a prostitute because you wouldn't do this in your own home. Well, Joe called us up and said, well, I've got some experience in this area, let me help you out. And the first thing he said is that you. Yeah, there are a lot of prostitutes and a lot of escorts that do this right out of their own homes, which I thought was really pretty surprising and disturbing.

[Host 2 (The Birch Show)]

Well, cause you wouldn't think that they would want to invite anybody in, but maybe that is the safest place for them rather than going to their clients homes.

[Mint Mobile Announcer]

Maybe.

[Host 2 (The Birch Show)]

So can you call them clients?

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

So here's Joe Disguise or hobbyists is what they're calling, right?

[Host 2 (The Birch Show)]

Yeah, that's what he said.

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

We got that right Joe. Hobbyists.

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

That is correct.

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

And a hobbyist, the definition of a hobbyist is somebody that goes out and pays for this kind of thing.

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

Yes, you. We do not like to use the term. Well first of all, of course we don't like to use the term prostitution. You know, just walk up to anybody or talk about it or even get into it with anybody and use that word. So hobbyist just sounds a lot more politically correct and yeah, we. And even now using the word escort, because it's been used so much, so we use the word provider.

[Host 2 (The Birch Show)]

Provider.

[Caller/Listener]

Neat.

So where do you find your providers?

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

Believe it or not, you can find them anywhere. On the Internet is the most common place to do it. Of course, you've heard a lot about. I'm sure Craig List, even Creative Loafing has it. So, yeah, you can find it just about, just about anywhere. But main places are on the Internet, places like that, Creative Loafing, Craigslist, they've got actual websites that promote it. So it's everywhere.

[Host 2 (The Birch Show)]

So how do you do it the very first time, what's that first experience like when you decide, I'm gonna pay for it?

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

Well, for me, the first experience was quite interesting. I had been fresh out of a relationship and had several relationships where I was just very, very frustrated. And, you know, the whole dating thing, believe it or not, it's basically date without all of the hassles of going to the restaurant or going to the bar or going to movie, whatever. And so, you know, by the time you do the math, it's actually quite amazing if you ever thought about it, you just get straight to it. So you make that call and you're nervous. I was very nervous the first time I did it. I made a call after I had found one. They're very particular about what they say in the verbiage that you use, so you have to be very, very careful with it. But driving over again, I was very, very nervous. And she was very calming. She was very relaxed about it. And that made me more relaxed. And yeah, by the time I got done, I was like, wow, that's pretty painless. And believe me when I tell you,

[Caller/Listener]

but if you paid the proper amount, it would have been painful. If that's what you wanted, get what you want.

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

Well, like I said before, if you think about it, though, if you think about it, when you go out on dates, when you're meeting someone, you're courting someone, right? You are literally spending. You may spend, you know, let's just say on a good dinner, you might spend 100 bucks, 150 bucks, you know, place like Capitol or something like that. Then if you go for drinks and nightcaps and so on and so forth, that costs money. By the time you're done, you're spending 250, $300. And there's no guarantee that you're going to, you know, that you're going to score this.

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

To me as a guy, I was talking to somebody about this after we had you on last week would be so demoralizing to me as a guy the first time that I had to pay for it, I'd cry. The admission that I can't, I couldn't do this without paying for it as a man to me would be so demoralizing and make such a statement about myself that I would have a tough time looking at myself in the mirror.

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

But let me tell you why that's not. Let me. You tell, Let me tell you exactly why that's not. Most of the time when guys and I just. Funny because I just had this discussion the other day with someone. Most of the time when you're out or you're going out on a date, there is an ulterior motive. Whether it's a first date, a third date, a fifth date, whether it's two months down the line, five months down the line, there is an ulterior motive at the end of the day and for most guys that is to eventually sleep with the person they're courting.

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

But it's so different, man. I mean, like, it's almost like you're earning that at the end of the day rather than paying.

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

No, it's not. And I'll tell you why. Because think about this. What happens and this has actually happened to me, what happens if you go through all of that numerous times and it just doesn't happen?

[Host 2 (The Birch Show)]

I mean, the only reason that these escorts or providers are sleeping with you is because you're paying for them. It's the difference between like having to sleep with you or wanting to sleep with you. You understand?

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

And I could see your argument there. But again, look at it from, from, from the standpoint I'm giving you and especially a lot of guys that have been through this, they will, you know that. Especially what I like to call seasoned guys, guys that are over 35, they understand the whole concept. It doesn't matter whether you have a girlfriend, a long term committed relationship, or you're married, you're paying for it anyway.

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

Are you, are you, are you a married guy?

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

I've been married before, yes.

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

Were you, would you call it hobbying while you, when you were married?

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

No, at the time I wasn't, I was married. I got divorced in my early 20s. I'm in my mid-30s now. But no, I've been doing it now for, continuously, for about five years late. I got into it late 20s early and they've been doing it ever since.

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

When is the last time that you achieved that goal without paying for it?

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

Without paying for it? Not even two, three days ago.

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

Two or three years ago?

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

No, no days.

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

Oh, days ago.

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

It's not. See the thing about it is for me now, it's actually very enjoyable. I enjoy doing it. I enjoy, you know, being able to, I guess you would call it, pick and choose. And believe it or not. Let me, let me, let me clear up a misconception. A lot of people think that providers are these God awful, disgusting or ugly women you find on street corners, so on and so forth. Believe it or not, most of the providers, especially in the Atlanta area, I'd say 50% or maybe little over 50% are people you would never know. And they're gorgeous and they're smart, they're attractive. A lot of them have degrees.

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

Are some of them like disease degrees?

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

College degrees?

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

Are some of them married women that their husbands don't know what they're doing during the day?

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

Oh, absolutely. Especially in the Buckhead area because I'm kind of, I'm kind of a geek, I guess you would call it in a roundabout way. And so I kind of look at ads and keep up with ads in different places. There has been, since the recession hit, a steady rise and especially in women that are over 35 that have started doing this. You'd be in, and I'm telling you, a lot of them are married and, or have kids.

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

Wow. Now does, do the husbands know what they're doing or have they made an agreement or. You might not even know this if they've made an agreement with the husband that during the day this is what you're gonna do. But when I walk in at night, God, this has like showtime written all over it at 7 o'. Clock. Then we're just gonna pretend that we both know what you do during the day.

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

I have actually, in my time, I have seen, I would gather somewhere between 30 and 40 and out of that I'd be willing to say maybe anywhere from 5 to 10%. No. So. And the thing about it is, you have to understand, especially the more upper crust providers, they make a ton of money doing this.

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

Like how much are we talking about?

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

So I mean, you know, you understand. I mean, and I'll be brutally honest with you now having, and if I were in my twenties, I couldn't say this, but getting older and now really seeing a lot of different things in life and having an understanding of it, you, you know, if, if this were something that my girlfriend did, knowing what I know now and knowing how to discern the difference between sex and love, I wouldn't Have a problem with it.

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

Really?

[Host 2 (The Birch Show)]

Do you pay over.

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

I absolutely would not have a problem with it.

[Host 2 (The Birch Show)]

Have you paid over $1,000?

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

I never have before. But I will say this. If you're talking about eventually to one person.

[Host 2 (The Birch Show)]

Yes, one person.

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

Like, over the course of a year.

[Caller/Listener]

So you've gone back to a person half a dozen times or whatever, and that's totally.

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

Absolutely. I mean, the average. The average. Now, in Atlanta, the average cost for what we call anywhere from A plus to B minus is about between 250 and 300. With the A VIPs, they're going anywhere from. The lowest I've seen on an A plus is 400 an hour, and the highest I've ever seen is 1700 an hour.

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

That better include, like, 50 minutes of watching TV with me.

[Caller/Listener]

Would you.

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

Generally, those are what we call the politically correct is pse, which is Pornographic Star Experience.

[Caller/Listener]

Oh, my gosh. It's like a dictionary. Are you ever worried about getting caught because you know what you're doing is technically illegal?

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

Yes, it is. And believe it or not, there are, as we call it, underground clubs, a kind of websites, underground clubs, brethren, as we call ourselves, that we have a way to protect ourselves. And it's a rating system.

[Caller/Listener]

A rating system. What's.

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

Absolutely.

[Caller/Listener]

What's the rating system?

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

I won't. I won't. For protection of them, I won't mention. But they're actually. And you can actually find it yourself. But there are two or three main sites that we all are members of, and we actually, through email, we communicate with one another. And there's a rating system. Literally, a rating system is called an experience system. And we can find out every single solitary detail about a provider, everything. What she looks like, how tall she is, how she performs, you know her, where her dwelling is, if it's clean or not, if she smokes or not.

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

Everything to have her, like, apartment number or house number up and everything.

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

No, no, no, no, no. No. Private information like that is ever given.

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

Yeah, come on.

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

But like, physical information, everything else.

[Host 2 (The Birch Show)]

You don't want to go to jail.

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

Everything else about her dwelling.

[Mint Mobile Announcer]

Dwelling.

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

Joe, you know how she keeps it? It's clean if it's dirty.

[Mint Mobile Announcer]

Okay, gotcha.

[Caller/Listener]

Are you talking about her house or are we talking about her parts?

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

I think we're talking about a lot of different dwellings here. Joe, let me put you on hold because we got a whole bunch of people that have questions for you.

[Joe Disguise (Guest)]

Sure.

[Host 1 (The Birch Show)]

All right, hold on. We've got an escort that wants to address some of the things that were just said, we've got some dudes that have gone through this very same experience that would never do it again. Also, we've got one dude that's upset that the women on the show are laughing at this guy. So we got a lot of real est to cover here. The bird show.