Vault: Nobody Understands Her Rivalry With This Woman

Summary

The Bert Show: Vault — "Nobody Understands Her Rivalry With This Woman"

Date: June 10, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode centers on a candid and emotionally honest conversation among The Bert Show cast—featuring Bert, Melissa, Jen, Joanna, and callers—about female rivalry, insecurities, and the complex feelings that can arise when you find yourself in (often unspoken) competition with another woman. Producer Joanna opens up about her ongoing sense of rivalry with a particular woman in her circle, and the discussion branches out into broader social dynamics, generational insights, and supportive interventions from listeners and even Joanna’s mother. The tone is humorously raw but deeply empathetic, aiming to debunk stereotypes and surface authentic feelings about friendship, envy, and self-worth.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Joanna’s Rivalry and Insecurities (01:30–05:41)

• Setting the Scene:
  Bert notes that Joanna has expressed feelings of competition toward a particular woman, despite the fact that neither is competing for the same things—both have boyfriends, careers, etc.
• Joanna clarifies:
  • She feels insecure around this woman, who seems to "have everything going for her" (02:21).
  • The woman has never been mean or exclusionary, making the insecurity an internal battle.
• Joanna's admission:

  “I just think that, you know, I have insecurities like every other girl, and this girl just really touches on a lot of my insecurities... And that's just my insecurity.” — Joanna (02:21)

• Male vs. Female Comparison:
  Melissa observes that while guys may channel jealousy into learning or networking from successful peers, women may internalize those feelings—prompting Joanna to reflect on how she can grow from the experience.

2. The Debate: Is This a Universal Female Experience? (05:42–07:13)

• Jen objects:
  • Pushes back on the assertion that "all women do this."
  • Advocates for embracing the success and attractiveness of other women as an invitation for friendship, not rivalry.

  “I certainly don't walk around my life comparing myself to other women...” — Jen (05:46)

• Discussion on "Frenemy" Dynamics:
  The group explores how it feels to compete with someone in your inner circle, even when the competition is unspoken.

3. Personal Anecdotes & Callers Weigh In (07:14–13:55)

• Joanna describes her high school "arch nemesis":
  • Shares specific stories about always coming "second" to the same girl—from pageants to jobs—who now even works in Joanna's office.
• Caller 1’s emotional response:
  • Expresses frustration toward Joanna’s insecurity, echoing why she has fewer female friends.

  “It makes you ugly, sweetheart. And you’re not... Please stop that.” — Caller 1 (08:31)

• Melissa asks about the roots:
  • Wonders if this jealousy is connected to women who focus on beauty or social status.
• Joanna clarifies her jealousy:
  • It’s about security and not just looks: “She has a diploma to go back on. And it’s not just about… I mean, yeah, she’s a beautiful girl and that helps... But it’s really more about security.” (10:54–11:34)

4. Maturing Beyond Insecurity (12:21–13:55)

• Caller 3 offers perspective:
  • Remembers feeling similarly in her 20s, but notes that life experience has reversed her point of view.
  • Shares how the friend she once envied now envies her for her independence and career.

  “Everybody needs to realize that the grass is brown everywhere.” — Show Host (13:14)

5. Joanna’s Mom Calls In — Emotional Support (13:56–16:38)

• Joanna’s mother comforts her:
  • Takes ownership for raising Joanna to feel beautiful but acknowledges the world is full of beautiful people.
  • Emphasizes inner beauty and reassures Joanna she can always return to school if she desires more security.

  “Outside looks, Joanna, doesn’t mean anything... you are beautiful. Inside, Joanna.” — Joanna’s Mom (14:05–14:58)

  • Gets emotional, stressing that every person has insecurities and encourages Joanna not to compare herself to others.
• Lighthearted moment:
  • Hosts joke about her mother’s wisdom being tied to her accent.
  • Humorous aside as her mother credits the rival’s makeup for her appearance:

    “She always looks good because she always got makeup on...” — Joanna’s Mom (16:38)

6. Group Reflection and Takeaways (16:52–end)

• Melissa’s conclusion:
  • Calls for more support and teamwork among women.

  “Instead of this jealousy… I just want to see more teamwork amongst women.” — Melissa (16:58)

• Final quip:
  • Joanna assures she does have lots of girlfriends.
  • A co-host jokingly teases:

    “Yes, but all of them are ugly.” — Caller 2 (17:13)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Joanna: “I just think that, you know, I have insecurities like every other girl, and this girl just really touches on a lot of my insecurities...” (02:21)
• Jen: “I certainly don't walk around my life comparing myself to other women. And I certainly wouldn't exclude someone from my group because I thought she was talented or beautiful or smart or funny...” (05:46)
• Caller 1: “It makes you ugly, sweetheart. And you're not... Please stop that.” (08:31)
• Joanna: “Because I just... that's my insecurity. I didn't go to college. I didn't get a four year degree. I don't have a backup in case this doesn't work out. This girl does.” (10:54)
• Show Host: “Everybody needs to realize that the grass is brown everywhere.” (13:14)
• Joanna’s Mom: “...outside looks, Joanna, doesn’t mean anything. All right? I want you to stop worrying about that... you are beautiful. Inside, Joanna.” (14:05)
• Melissa: “Instead of this jealousy... I just want to see more teamwork amongst women.” (16:58)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 01:30 — Main discussion kicks off: Joanna’s rivalry surfaced
• 02:21 — Joanna articulates her insecurity
• 05:42 — Jen’s pushback against the “all women do this” idea
• 07:14 — Joanna’s high school and office “arch nemesis” story
• 08:31 — Caller 1’s passionate critique
• 10:54 — Joanna admits the core of her jealousy: security, not just looks
• 13:14 — “Grass is brown everywhere” perspective
• 13:56 — Joanna’s mom’s heartfelt support and advice
• 16:58 — Melissa’s call for teamwork among women and final group reflections

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Overall Tone

The episode blends humor, honesty, and genuine self-examination. The banter is sharp and fast, but when emotions surface—especially Joanna’s tears and her mom’s intervention—the show pivots to deep empathy. The hosts and callers challenge each other's assumptions, gently mock, and ultimately come together to encourage self-acceptance and solidarity—framing insecurities as common, but not inevitable or insurmountable.

Transcript

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[Show Host]

the Birch show so, Melissa, you weren't here last week when Jen Hobby actually on the air was starting to get mad at producer Joanna.

[Melissa]

Okay.

[Show Host]

She really was. You don't see about what you don't see. Jen lose it quite often, but she was. She was she on the borderline.

[Jen]

I was teetering, yeah. Because I just didn't quite understand it. Joanna was talking about this girl who they are friends with and how she felt like she was in kind of constant competition with her. Right.

[Show Host]

Remember they were supposed to go to the lake or something?

[Melissa]

Yeah, the one that she disinvites to things.

[Joanna]

I don't disinvite her. I just don't accept the invocation to her.

[Melissa]

She doesn't. That means that you would have initially invited her. I see. Semantics. Anyway, And I was just.

[Jen]

I just didn't quite understand what they were competing over because they both have boyfriends, and Joanna's in love with her boyfriend Jason, and they're gonna get married, and they both have, you know, great careers going on, and they aren't going after the same job.

[Caller 1]

No.

[Joanna]

But I just think that, you know, I have insecurities like every other girl, and this girl just really touches on a lot of my insecurities, and I've just never encountered someone who I feel has everything going for them, you know, And. And that's just. That's just insecurity that I have.

[Show Host]

And again, she has never done anything to make you feel insecure. She's never been mean, never said a nasty word.

[Melissa]

So why can't you be happy for her?

[Joanna]

I am. No, I'm totally happy for her. But inside, I'm insecure when I'm around her.

[Melissa]

Okay.

[Joanna]

Yes.

[Melissa]

Okay.

[Show Host]

Because she really. She's, like, physically, she thinks that she's better looking than Joanna. She thinks that career wise, she's already set in her career, so she's got everything Joanna wants.

[Joanna]

Got that going.

[Show Host]

And she's got better mic technique than Joanna.

[Joanna]

Sorry, I didn't realize it was falling apart.

[Melissa]

Okay, so. And so.

[Joanna]

And so this past weekend, we went snowboarding, and I was a little hesitant to go snowboard snowboarding because we were gonna be hanging out with her all weekend. And I just knew that, you know, all of my insecurities were going to just be there all weekend long. I was gonna be constantly comparing myself to her. I think she's beautiful. I think she's funny. I think she's smart, and I think she's smart.

[Caller 2]

You think all of those things about yourself, too.

[Joanna]

Not necessarily.

[Caller 2]

Yes, you do.

[Joanna]

I mean, I think I'm a cute girl, and I think I'm pretty funny. I make people laugh every now and again. It's okay to be confident.

[Melissa]

You can tell Jeff. Yes, I think I'm beautiful. I think I'm smart.

[Show Host]

But she's not. She's at a different level in all of these categories. You come in second place to her.

[Joanna]

Yes, absolutely. Second place, definitely. But anyway, so we went snowboarding, and I was really nervous, and I didn't want to go, but we went and I had a good time. I mean, you know, the first day we were snowboarding together, and it was fun because she was snowboarding, and she's not very good at it. So it was fun because we were all on the ground and we were all falling, and I had a Good time. But the second day she was skiing and I was snowboarding and she's really good at skiing. And I was so mad because I was like, I want to ski now because I want to be good like her. So it's like again, she's better than me in skiing. And it really got to me. I'm just very competitive.

[Melissa]

What is fascinating to me about just the observation because I, I mean, I assume that when Jen said she didn't understand because I don't see, I don't look at women that way. My friends don't look at women that way. So I'm assuming it's. Most women don't do this with each other. However, I want to say in your case, what fascinates me is if there is a guy who there are guys are jealous of other guys for sure and hate them. But then there's this opportunity that some guys want to hang out with people that are more successful than them so that they learn something from them. So I wonder if you can kind of convert that into she seems more talented in your perception, she seems more talented, then maybe you could learn something from her rather than be kind of self deprecating about her.

[Joanna]

Well, absolutely, yeah. And I completely agree with you. I think that you should surround yourself with successful people because I think that that's going to help you in the long run. You know, you are who you are surrounded by in a sense. But I guess what I didn't understand is that I, I have insecurities. I guess what I didn't understand with Jen was why were you were getting so angry with me? Because I, I think we all have insecurities. I'm just being vocal.

[Jen]

I don't think I was getting angry with you. I was getting angry with the sentiment in the room that all women do this. That was the part that was frustrating to me is like we may all have insecurities about ourselves, but I certainly don't walk around my life comparing myself to other women. And I certainly wouldn't exclude someone from my group because I thought she was talented or beautiful or smart or funny or all of those things, I would be like, that's somebody I wanna hang out with. That's somebody I wanna be around. So I think the sentiment in the room with the guys, especially sort of your side, like, oh, all women feel this way. And I just, well, it's not the

[Show Host]

first time we've heard it. It's like, I think it was.

[Jen]

I don't, I don't agree. I don't think all women feel that way.

[Show Host]

I think it was Jeff that said one week, and that. That was Jessica, that she walked into, like, a mall, right. And she walks by a woman really quickly, and she wanted you to, like, check her butt out to see if she compared.

[Caller 2]

Yeah, it's. That's not.

[Joanna's Mom]

We.

[Caller 2]

I can't remember why we were talking about that, but that's not. It was when we were on vacation. But that's. I think that's two totally different things. I think because Jessica didn't know that

[Show Host]

woman, but she still saw a woman that she perceived to be better looking than she was, and she walked up to her, made you check both of their booties to make sure hers looked better.

[Caller 2]

Yeah, but I think. And I'm not trying to put words in Jen's mouth, which is true, she did that. But I think it's different to have somebody in your circle that you consider a friend or a potential friend, but have her be an enemy. I'd like to create the word frenemy.

[Show Host]

You've got this thing with somebody here in the office also. Like, you are in competition with somebody here in the office, and they don't even know that you're in competition with them.

[Joanna]

No, that one's different. It's not somebody in the office. It's this girl that I went to high school with, and I call her my arch nemesis, because everything she goes after and I go after, she gets over me. So I was. It was a joke. I mean, it's just so funny because we went to high school together, and we both went after, like, the Miss North Gwinnett Pageant, and she won. And then, you know, she was like, homecoming queen and I wasn't. And then we both went after this Georgia lottery thing, and she won it over me. And then now she works in this office, and I'm like, I swear I can't get away from this girl.

[Show Host]

Hey, Lisa.

[Melissa]

Good morning.

[Show Host]

You're on Q and A. Hi.

[Caller 1]

Good morning. Just real quick. Joanna, you're so beautiful. I'm so frustrated with you right now. This is the reason why I don't have a lot of girlfriends. Who cares what she looks like? Who cares if she's better? Get over it. You're so beautiful. This is why a lot of. I don't have a lot of girlfriends because of that. It's just these insecurities. Just be happy for her, and if she's a good friend to you, then be her friend.

[Caller 3]

This is.

[Caller 1]

This is why I have so many guy friends, because girls.

[Melissa]

But you've Reiterated that you don't have many girlfriends. Do you think that all girls act like this?

[Caller 1]

Just about. I mean, I have like a handful of good girlfriends that are not jealous of me. I'm not jealous of them. I'm not jealous of any girl. You know, I guess because I'm just secure within myself. But it's just. It's so frustrating to hear girls do this to themselves, you know, and that's why you should never be, like, jealous of somebody else, because you just never know what's going on in their heads. Just like right now. I mean, I look at Joanna, I'm like, oh my gosh, she's so gorgeous. But look at her insecurities. It makes you ugly, sweetheart. And you're not. You're not an ugly person. Please stop that. Please.

[Melissa]

I mean, the comment I have to make is because I've never had that situation. I've never been jealous of another girl. I've never. None of my girlfriends and I from junior high all the way to now have never, you know, been this way. But I'm not the traditional, like, pretty girl who would go for a North Georgia pageant or go for, you know, any of these things. So I'm curious if this has to do with women who traditionally, and tell me if I'm right or wrong, traditionally focus on their looks only because most of my friends are not the beauty queens. They're not the ones that want to be the beauty queens. And it's not that they're not beautiful, but the thing is, I think what makes a woman beautiful is all parts of a woman. And I think that to me, the less attractive women are the ones that only focus on their looks and only focus on their status in society. And it seems that this happens with women like that.

[Show Host]

Joanna, do you put more value into looks? Your looks, do you think then other women put into their looks? No, I get a lot of your self worth from your looks.

[Joanna]

No, I think initially, you know, people look at you and they're like, oh, she's a pretty girl. But I think. I definitely think that your personality and how you treat other people and things like that and, you know, whether you have a good sense of humor and all that goes into it, I think that holds more value.

[Melissa]

But what are you jealous of? Of this other girl? I mean, I'm just. It just seems that it's. It's. Everybody talks about beauty and I just. And I'm wondering if when you focus on beauty, it becomes the shallow thing that causes this drama.

[Joanna]

I guess I'm Jealous of her because she went to college and she has a degree. I'm jealous of her because she has a great paying job. You know, she's not struggling like I struggle, which I know this because I've talked to her. She doesn't struggle every day like I do. She. And I hate getting upset about it because it's stupid to get upset about it.

[Show Host]

Why are you breaking up about it?

[Joanna]

Because I just. Because that's my insecurity. I didn't go to college. I didn't get a four year degree. I don't have a backup in case this doesn't work out. This girl does. She has a backup if tomorrow her boyfriend leaves her. And it goes back to months ago when I talked about my insecurity with Jason. I guess I'm jealous of that security. I have not had security in so long and it frustrates me. And that girl does. She has it. She has a diploma that she can hang on her wall. And if tomorrow it all falls apart, she has that diploma to go back on. And it's not just about. I mean, yeah, she's a beautiful girl and that helps. It helps to be beautiful, smart and funny. I mean, come on.

[Show Host]

But it's really more about security for

[Joanna]

you than it is all this security that I feel like she has around her. And I hate to say that I would. I don't exclude her from my group of friends. I would never do that. I'm not that mean of a person. But we don't really extend invitations to her. No. And I mean, but if she got

[Melissa]

invited, I mean, I don't like go

[Joanna]

out of my way to say, hey, come out with us. Plus, she lives in another state now, so it's a little different.

[Show Host]

But like, when her name comes up, you'll be like, oh, she's really gotta go.

[Joanna]

No, I mean, kind of, I guess.

[Show Host]

The hand.

[Joanna]

Yeah, I mean, it's just. It's hard to be around someone who you feel like just has it all, but you have the same things. It's just different things than she has. I mean, you have a great job, you have great friends, a great family. So if you ever. If you ever fell back, you have a family, you have Jason to rely on. You're absolutely right. And just. Just different things. She could be jealous of you in a completely different thing.

[Show Host]

Hey, Aubrey. Good Morning. You're on Q100.

[Caller 3]

Good morning.

[Show Host]

Hey.

[Caller 3]

Hey. I was just going to say, at first I was kind of getting a little frustrated as well as some of the other callers. But then I remembered I'm in my 30s, and when I was in my 20s, I remember feeling this way about a lot of girls I was friends with. And then as I've matured and grown up and had some life experience, I've realized it's different things that may define you. And there was one particular girl in college that's kind of like Joanna's describing that right out of college, got married, had a husband, had a great career, started having kids. I was single. I didn't really follow the same path, and I was really insecure about that. And I had followed up with her, and now she's staying home with her children. Has been for quite some time. And I was talking to her recently, and she was just talking about kind of being a little bit jealous of me because I do have a career, and I've had a lot of life experience separate from her husband and the life that I used to envy when I was in my 20s.

[Show Host]

Everybody needs to realize that the grass is brown everywhere.

[Joanna]

Well, and I think.

[Melissa]

I mean, I think that for women who do do this, I mean, obviously there's some. Because they're calling up, you know, even though I agree with Jen that I never experienced this, but I do think it's sad, because insecurity, you know, you punish yourself and you punish opportunities around you because of it. I mean, I know it sounds cliche to be confident in yourself, but there is something to that, you know, like, you know, just because her, like the last caller, just because she may end up being unhappy eventually in her life still does not solve the problem. I mean, you know. You know what I mean? Like, this girl has nothing to do with your insecurity. It's your insecurity. She just happens to touch upon it, you know? And it's, here's Joanna's mom.

[Show Host]

Let's get her.

[Melissa]

Okay.

[Show Host]

Hey, Joanna's mom. Good morning.

[Joanna's Mom]

Good morning. How are you, everybody? Joanna. Joanna.

[Joanna]

Yes.

[Joanna's Mom]

I think part of this is my fault about her insecurities, because I'm always told my daughter, she was the most beautiful girl in the world. Then when she went out to the world and she found out there's more people there, they're more beautiful than you are. But the outside looks, Joanna, doesn't mean anything, all right? I want you to stop worrying about that. I don't know what's going on in your. In your little brain now, but you are beautiful.

[Caller 2]

Your brain's not little.

[Show Host]

She's gonna obsess over that on the Internet.

[Joanna's Mom]

You are just. I mean, I have. I'm so proud of my children. I mean, every time Joanna comes to visit me at work, I just take her every. All over the school because I want people to see. See her. Because she is beautiful. She's gorgeous. Not just outside. Inside. You are a beautiful girl. Inside, Joanna.

[Joanna]

Thank you.

[Joanna's Mom]

You don't need to be. Everybody has insecurities, okay? It's not just you. Everybody does.

[Show Host]

Jeff does not. He's the only one.

[Joanna's Mom]

You know, even man does have insecurities. All right? And you're gonna make me cry now because I don't want you to be unhappy because you are my life, baby. I want you to be happy. I want you to be a strong woman. And about college degree, you have a. We can solve that problem. Go back to college, get your degree. I got married young. I didn't get a college degree. Then when I was in my 40s, I turned around and did something about that. And you can do it, but you don't need to be worrying about other people being more successful. You're going to be what you're going to be. Okay?

[Joanna]

Okay?

[Joanna's Mom]

And you cannot compare yourself to anybody.

[Show Host]

And again, I would submit that your mom is wiser than other women because she has an accent.

[Joanna's Mom]

I mean, Joanna, you just. I don't know what's wrong with you, baby. Maybe because you are what, 25.5inches shorter than she is.

[Show Host]

I feel that I'm jealous for her, too.

[Joanna]

Thank you.

[Joanna's Mom]

I don't like to hear you talking about it like that because that made me sad. And I thought I make a. Oh, that's so sweet. But it made me sad. You don't want to see your children being secure. You want to be. You want to see your children be happy.

[Caller 2]

Have you seen a picture of this girl that she's talking about?

[Joanna's Mom]

Yes, she is a very pretty girl, but she. I mean, don't take. I don't want to be one of those moms, you know? But she is a pretty girl.

[Show Host]

Is she prettier than Joanne?

[Melissa]

Oh, stop.

[Joanna's Mom]

Period.

[Melissa]

I'll stop this. This is exactly what I was talking about.

[Joanna's Mom]

Normal, pretty girl. She is just always. She always look good because she always got makeup on it. All right? And then she makes sure that she has her makeup on when they take her pictures.

[Melissa]

That is such a mother thing.

[Joanna's Mom]

She's showing me.

[Melissa]

I could never walk into my mother's house without makeup on.

[Joanna]

Thank you, Mom.

[Melissa]

Yeah, I just want to see more teamwork amongst women, you know, like, instead of this jealousy. So when a girl says, I don't have any girlfriends. Red flag.

[Joanna]

But I do.

[Melissa]

I. I was talking about that.

[Joanna]

Okay. No, my friends are beautiful. Thank you. I don't want anybody to think I'm, like, this mean person who doesn't have girlfriends. I have lots of girlfriends, but.

[Caller 2]

Yes, but all of them are ugly. The Bird Show.