Vault: They removed "cheating" from their wedding vows

Summary

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The Bert Show

Episode: Vault: They removed "cheating" from their wedding vows
Date: June 18, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this episode, The Bert Show team dives into a provocative real-life story: Governor Mark Sanford's ex-wife, Jenny Sanford, reveals in her memoir that Sanford insisted on removing the promise of fidelity from their wedding vows. The team uses this revelation to explore honesty in relationships, red flags people ignore before marriage, and societal pressures—especially for women—to accommodate partner preferences at the expense of their own boundaries.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Mark Sanford Revelation

• Jenny Sanford’s memoir ("Staying True") brings to light her husband's refusal to vow faithfulness in marriage.
• The backstory involves Sanford’s notorious affair with an Argentinian lover, which he later publicly described as his "soulmate."
  • Quote: "Afterwards he said that the woman in Argentina was his soulmate." (02:06, Male Commentator)

2. Vows, Faithfulness, and Red Flags

• Discussion: Sanford didn’t promise fidelity from day one—a red flag his wife chose to overlook.
  • Quote: "She talks about the fact that he refused to promise to be faithful... she was confused, concerned by it, but went ahead and married him with those vows anyway." (02:34, Female Commentator)
• The hosts debate the ability (and wisdom) of writing personalized vows, and whether removing fidelity is an acceptable customization.

3. Why People Ignore Warning Signs

• Comparison to other marriages where a partner makes a core stance (like not wanting kids), and the other party hopes that will change post-marriage.
  • Quote: "He told her before they got married, look, I don’t want to ever have children. Never, never, never, never... She thought, you know what? Once he gets married, he’ll soften to the idea." (04:41, Male Commentator)
• Pressure—especially for women—to acquiesce in romance, often believing love will overcome differences.
  • Quote: "It’s almost like a natural instinct that we’re going to just go along with something or make somebody happy, and we’ll disregard what we’re thinking because maybe we’re overreacting." (05:43, Female Commentator)

4. The Generational and Societal Angle

• Younger women, as discussed by a 22-year-old caller, feel compelled by societal standards to compromise more than they should.
  • Quote: "We kind of as, like, society makes us lower our standards and kind of back down... and then we get married and realize, oh, now I'm in a load of crap that I didn't want to be in." (09:10, Young Female Caller)
• The show questions whether this is a generational pattern that needs breaking.

5. Honest Self-Interest and Power Dynamics

• A male caller floats the idea that Jenny Sanford may have made a calculated choice to stay with someone powerful for the security and status it provided, drawing parallels to public couples like Bill and Hillary Clinton.
  • Quote: "She could have just been doing it to make sure that she had, you know, lived the high life, I guess you would say... women are capable of, you know, putting themselves in a position that they want to..." (11:15, Male Caller)

6. The Hosts' Reflections

• The hosts are split: some see the situation as an example of ignoring obvious red flags, others empathize with the complexity of decisions made when young or in love.
• Reference to Oprah:
  • Quote: "Oprah... said... men tell you all the time what they’re all about. They scream it to you. Women don’t listen." (08:41, Male Commentator)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On vows:
  "For somebody to tell me, look, I’m going to marry you, but I just don’t like the faithful part. I just can’t do it. Then I would be like, I don’t think I could get past that."
  — Female Commentator (04:12)

• On changing people:
  "She thought she could change him. She couldn't. They're divorced now."
  — Male Commentator (05:28)

• On gender roles:
  "Women need to stand up for what they feel. And if she had a problem with that, I don't think she stood up enough for it."
  — Female Commentator (05:43)

• On generational shifts:
  "At a younger age, you might have. I think, like, for me, it's like religion... you just think none of that stuff's going to be a big deal. None of that stuff will matter. We love each other."
  — Female Commentator (07:01)

• On self-honesty:
  "If Jenny Sanford came out and said that... I stayed because I knew that I would have a better life with him... I'd have more respect for him because you're being honest."
  — Female Commentator (11:48)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [01:31] – [02:34]: Introduction of the Mark Sanford vows story and early reactions
• [03:29] – [04:41]: Panel reaction to removing the faithfulness clause and comparisons to other “dealbreakers”
• [05:43] – [06:29]: Discussion on women’s tendency to compromise
• [07:33] – [08:41]: Commentary on ignoring red flags in youth vs. adulthood
• [09:08] – [10:44]: Caller input: standing up for yourself, generational expectations
• [11:15] – [12:02]: Male caller explores possible motives and practical outcomes in relationships of power

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Tone & Style

The tone is candid, humorous, and a bit irreverent, as the hosts mix real-life seriousness with playful banter. They approach taboo subjects—like infidelity and pre-marital honesty—with both empathy and skepticism. Guest callers add generational perspective and honesty.

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Summary

This Bert Show episode uses a headline-grabbing memoir revelation as a springboard for a lively, authentic conversation about dealbreakers in relationships, especially fidelity. The panel questions why people—especially women—ignore clear warning signs, with personal anecdotes and Socratic banter. Callers and hosts alike agree: don’t back down from your true needs—no matter what society (or love) tells you.

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Transcript

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[Host (possibly named Birch)]

The Burch Show.

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

All right, so Melissa told us in the news earlier this morning that Mark Sanford sort of back in the news because his wife now is writing a tell all book.

[Female Commentator (discussing Mark Sanford story)]

That's right. She's got a new memoir called Staying True and she's actually gonna be on an interview on 2020 on Friday night. And they're talking a little bit about this interview. And one of the things that came out was the fact that she admitted she'd made a leap of faith when she married him. Now remember, Governor Mark Sanford from South Carolina is the one that had the secret lover in Argentina and he was like hiking on the Appalachian Trail. Was his big Al at the time. So that's who this guy is. So his wife is coming out now and she talks about how, Remember also

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

because I think this is a key point. Afterwards he said that the woman in Argentina was his soulmate.

[Female Commentator (supporting views on marriage)]

That's right.

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

While he was still married to his wife.

[Female Commentator (discussing Mark Sanford story)]

That is correct.

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

And that was right before she took the kids and she said, okay, see ya, see ya. And then moved down the street.

[Host (possibly named Birch)]

He almost said it like, as an apology, like, I'm really sorry this happened, but you know, I'm gonna make things work with my wife. The girl in Argentina was my soulmate, but I understand, I'm married, so I'm gonna try to.

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

This was not some like, superficial affairs. That was my soulmate down in Argentina. Sorry, wifey.

[Female Commentator (supporting views on marriage)]

Yeah.

[Host (possibly named Birch)]

Almost like saying, it's okay.

[Female Commentator (discussing Mark Sanford story)]

I'm trying to see. Okay. They were married for 20 years before this happened. So 20 years ago when they got married. She talks about the fact that he refused to promise to be faithful because he insisted that the clause be removed from their wedding vows on being faithful to one another. And she says it bothered her. She said, but we were young, we were in love. I questioned it, but I got past it along with the other doubts I had. So she was confused, concerned by it, but went ahead and married him with those vows anyway.

[Female Commentator (discussing vows and religion)]

And were the vows in a church?

[Female Commentator (discussing Mark Sanford story)]

I don't know.

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

I just wondered why does that change things for you? If it was or was not?

[Female Commentator (discussing vows and religion)]

I just wondered like, what priest would allow that to happen?

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

That you're allowed to edit your vows like that.

[Female Commentator (discussing vows and religion)]

Yeah, that you would be able to change the, you know, change the religious ceremony to sort of suit your needs, I guess.

[Host (possibly named Birch)]

Well, you can write your own vows.

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

Is there a standard vows like in a church?

[Female Commentator (discussing vows and religion)]

A la carte vows?

[Host (possibly named Birch)]

Yeah, you can do that. You can write your vows. You can write your own vows.

[Female Commentator (discussing vows and religion)]

Okay.

[Young Female Caller/Guest (22 years old)]

All right.

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

So he just decided, look, I don't know that I'm capable of that. So let's take that out. My knee jerk reaction this morning was like, well, if she knew that. And then now we fast forward 20 years, then can't she say to herself, well, I mean, I knew. I mean, he was telling me what he was at the time and I decided to.

[Female Commentator (discussing Mark Sanford story)]

To ignore it.

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

To ignore it. But I think I softened my stance on it since 6:30 this morning. And I'll tell you why. Because I'll tell you what I was thinking of this morning.

[Host (possibly named Birch)]

Cause you came strong early.

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

I did, yeah.

[Male Caller/Guest]

He.

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

Because he didn't say, I'm going to cheat on you. He said, I don't know that I'm capable of it. And I think that is two different things.

[Female Commentator (discussing Mark Sanford story)]

People are being monogamous.

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

Right.

[Female Commentator (supporting views on marriage)]

And why get married?

[Female Commentator (discussing Mark Sanford story)]

Yeah, I would have. I would have a huge issue if that. If somebody made a stance like, you know what I want? Just that instead of saying, let's rewrite our vow, like, he could have smoothed it over better and said, let's rewrite our vows and say what we want to say to one another. Make it personal. And that way he gets away. I mean, I'm sorry to, but that's how he gets away with it. But for somebody to tell me, look, I'm going to marry you, but I just don't like the faithful part. I just can't do it. Then I would be like, I don't think I could get past that.

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

I think what I was drawing on earlier this morning was, I've told you guys, I have a friend who got married to a woman. And he told her before they got married, look, I don't want to ever have children. Never, never, never, never, never, never, never. And then never. And she said, okay, cool. That's fine. You know what? I want children. But you know what? I love you so much that I can do this. Let's go ahead and get married. So they get married, and like, a week and a half later, he goes and he gets a vasectomy. He's serious about it, man. He's like, I told you, never, never, never, never, never, never, never, never having a kid. And he said, at that point, their relationship really started to go in the tank, even though he told her, we're never having kids. And I think in her mind, she thought, you know what? Once he gets married, he'll soften to the idea.

[Female Commentator (discussing vows and religion)]

And she thought she could change him.

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

And she thought she could change him. She couldn't. They're divorced now. She lives on the west coast. He lives here. And I was drawing on that for this story, but I think it is different. Like, he didn't say, I'm not gonna be faithful. He just said, I'm not sure. I'm not capable.

[Female Commentator (supporting views on marriage)]

Well, the thing.

[Young Female Caller/Guest (22 years old)]

And.

[Female Commentator (discussing Mark Sanford story)]

Well, and the thing is, too, I feel with women that also this accommodation that we, especially when we're younger, that we feel like we have to accommodate to others. It's almost like a natural instinct that we're going to just go along with something or make somebody happy, and we'll disregard what we're thinking because maybe we're overreacting because we're taught our emotions are just out of control. But the thing is, women need to stand up for what they feel. And if she had a problem with that, I don't think she stood up enough for it. You know what I mean? And the thing with the kid thing, I have some friends, same situation, he said, I don't want kids. And she just, she married him anyway. And then it became a huge issue in their marriage. She should have stood up for herself, you know, and if it's a huge difference and she believed in something strong enough, the first reaction I had to her was, why didn't you say something? Instead of just saying, well, okay, I'll do it.

[Female Commentator (discussing vows and religion)]

Well, in her minimal, it can be a big deal. Like, you don't think like some of those things are gonna, are gonna ever present themselves as an issue, you know, like some of those things you should talk about are, you know, I don't know, you just never think that those things are gonna be a big deal when you. I totally understand what she's coming from. Like, you're young, you're in love, you think everything's gonna be perfect. You just go along with it.

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

Like now at your age, if you were gonna get married and the guy said to you, let's take those, that, that part of the vow out, would you go ahead and get married? No, no, no. The younger gen might have.

[Female Commentator (discussing vows and religion)]

Yeah, at a younger age you might have. I think like for me it's like religion, you know, like you think, oh, that doesn't matter, that's not gonna be a big deal. Or I don't really care for his family. And you're like, or whatever it may be. And I'm not saying this based on my personal experience. I'm saying it, you know, based on anybody. You just think it's. None of that stuff's going to be a big deal. None of that stuff will matter. We love each other. Doesn't matter that the in laws. I'm a Christian and he's a Buddhist, you know, or I'm a, you know, or I'm Jewish and you know, and he's Muslim. It doesn't matter. We love each other.

[Female Commentator (discussing Mark Sanford story)]

But it goes back to.

[Female Commentator (discussing vows and religion)]

And then, you know, years later it presents itself to be a major issue. You just don't think it's going to when you're young.

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

But this one isn't like, see, I can understand that, that line of sort of debate when it comes to religion, but not when it comes to infidelity. I mean, he's saying, I'm not sure I'm capable of being with just one woman. So I don't know how any woman.

[Host (possibly named Birch)]

He didn't say that.

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

He said, well, he said, I want to, essentially.

[Host (possibly named Birch)]

Right. But I think if you've been dating somebody for X number of years and you got proposed to, and then you get. You're getting married and the date set, and you're two weeks out and you're going over your vows, and he says, I don't think that the faithful part, that just seems so, like, unneeded in your mind, you go, yeah, you're right. Why do we have to put that in there? I mean, that's a given.

[Female Commentator (discussing Mark Sanford story)]

But I don't know. You don't know that that's the conversation they had.

[Host (possibly named Birch)]

I know, but I'm just saying.

[Female Commentator (discussing Mark Sanford story)]

Yeah. I just think that he is a. He is a young man, you know, anyway, just. He is a young man is able to say exactly what he wants, and a young woman doesn't feel comfortable doing that, and she ends up getting, you know, biting her in the butt in the end.

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

I think it was. You know how I love quoting Oprah because it really makes me feel like a guy. But she said. I mean, she. I have heard her say before that men tell you all the time what they're all about. They scream it to you. Women don't listen. Here's a guy saying, I'm probably gonna screw around on you. And she didn't listen. And 20 years later, he falls in love with his soulmate in Argentina. Hey, Emily. Good morning.

[Young Female Caller/Guest (22 years old)]

Hi. How are y'? All?

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

Okay. How are you?

[Young Female Caller/Guest (22 years old)]

I love you guys. I definitely agree with the girls and agree with what you just said, even though I don't know if I've heard a man quote Oprah before. But I agree. I'm 22, almost 23, and I know as a girl, we kind of as, like, society makes us lower our standards and kind of back down of what we want in a male because we feel like we can't find it. And so then we lower our standards and kind of back down, like the girls are saying. And then we get married and realize, oh, now I'm in a load of crap that I didn't want to be in. You know what I mean? I think we need to not back down, you know?

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

Well, isn't that almost a hypocritical statement? Because if you're saying you're part of a society that makes women lower their standards and you engage in relationships that aren't secure for your future, aren't you part of that society. So if you, if you don't do that, then you're sort of raising the bar for yourself.

[Young Female Caller/Guest (22 years old)]

Well, no, I'm saying that we need to go against it as women that we need to go against. And not that, not that we should continue the cycle, but that we should kind of go against this and not back down and lower our standards. Because I mean, I would have thought red flags would have gone up if she, if this man said that he wasn't, he didn't want to be faithful. Like that would have sent huge red flags in my. So, so I mean, I, I mean, I'm saying to me too that I don't think we need to back down and lower what we really want to be happy. You know what I mean?

[Female Commentator (supporting views on marriage)]

And we don't know his reasoning that he gave her for taking that out either because I think girls can be easily convinced at that young age, even now. I mean, a guy can convince you of anything or convince you to do anything, especially being that young. So we don't know what he told her could be completely different in his mind.

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

Hey, Brooke. Town fail gone. Hey Robert, you're on Q100.

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[Young Female Caller/Guest (22 years old)]

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[Male Caller/Guest]

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[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

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[Host (possibly named Birch)]

Hate you too.

[Male Caller/Guest]

Anyway, it could have been trying to secure herself, you know, with a nice future. I mean, this is the predominant man that's going to become what, a senator or whatever. And she could have just been doing it to make sure that she had, you know, lived the high life, I guess you would say. I mean, even in, you know, with Bill Clinton and Hillary that went down with them, she took and spend it and made it, you know, to her advantage. So I mean, you know, women are capable of, you know, putting themselves in a position that they want to because they know what they want to do and where they want to be with their life.

[Female Commentator (discussing Mark Sanford story)]

And if, and if Jenny Sanford came out and said that, if she said, you know what he said that. But you know what? I stayed because I knew that I would have a better life with him than other guys that I had dated. I'd have more respect for him because you're being honest. You know,

[Male Commentator (possibly a main male host)]

guess that's it.

[Female Commentator (discussing Mark Sanford story)]

And, and yeah. Sound awesome £ Jenny Sanford.

[Host (possibly named Birch)]

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