25W: Why Bobby Chose a Non-SEC Team to Win the NCAA Tournament + Steven Rinella on Handling a Grizzly Charge + Worst Teams to Be a Fan Of

Summary

The Bobby Bones Show Episode 25W: Why Bobby Chose a Non-SEC Team to Win the NCAA Tournament + Steven Rinella on Handling a Grizzly Charge + Worst Teams to Be a Fan Of Release Date: March 17, 2025

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1. Introduction

In this engaging episode of The Bobby Bones Show, hosts Greg Rosenthal and Daniel Jeremiah dive deep into a variety of topics ranging from NCAA Tournament strategies to wildlife encounters and the challenges of supporting underperforming sports teams. The episode also features valuable insights from renowned outdoor enthusiast Steven Rinella.

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2. Choosing a Non-SEC Team to Win the NCAA Tournament

Discussion Highlights:

Greg Rosenthal and Daniel Jeremiah kick off the episode by discussing the intricacies of the NCAA Tournament, specifically focusing on the strategic decision to support a non-SEC team.

• DraftKings Pick Six Promotion: The hosts mention leveraging player statistics over team performance to maximize betting success with DraftKings Pick Six.
  • Greg Rosenthal (03:09): “If you're struggling to choose which team will pull off an upset, forget about the teams. Focus on player stats to rack up big cash prizes with DraftKings Pick Six.”

Fan Engagement and Betting Strategies:

The conversation shifts to the excitement of March Madness and the evolving landscape of sports betting.

• Personal Anecdotes and Strategies:
  • Daniel Jeremiah (05:09): “I love it. March Madness is the best.”
  • Greg Rosenthal (08:32): “It's basketball. It's the greatest. Just pick a team to win it all.”

The hosts engage in a playful betting game, selecting various teams and discussing their prospects, emphasizing the unpredictability and thrill of the tournament.

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3. Interview with Steven Rinella on Handling a Grizzly Charge

Guest Introduction:

Greg Rosenthal introduces Steven Rinella, a New York Times bestselling author and founder of the outdoor lifestyle brand MeatEater. They delve into Rinella's extensive experience with wildlife and his latest project, Hunting History.

• Greg Rosenthal (16:07): “Steven Rinella is an avid hunter, writer, wild foods enthusiast... He has a new show called Hunting History with Steven Rinella.”

Handling Grizzly Encounters:

Rinella shares his harrowing experience with a grizzly charge on Fognack Island, Alaska, highlighting the psychological and physical challenges faced during such encounters.

• Steven Rinella (22:46): “We were eating lunch under a tree when a bear charged at us... my buddy Dirt rode the bear downhill for about 15 yards.”

Bear Spray vs. Firearms:

A significant portion of the discussion centers on the effectiveness of bear spray compared to firearms in deterring bear attacks.

• Rinella (25:44): “Aim low with spray... you don't need to be accurate, you just need to be in the right direction.”

Greg shares his concerns about bear spray usability in high-stress situations, to which Rinella provides practical advice based on real-life incidents.

• Greg Rosenthal (26:30): “If a bear was attacking, would you have sprayed the spray at all or would you just go full gun?”
• Rinella (30:57): “There's a very compelling case to be made that spray is better, especially if you're not a super experienced marksman with a pistol.”

Historical Hunting Practices:

Rinella delves into the evolution of hunting techniques, comparing modern methods with those of ancient hunters and indigenous practices.

• Rinella (31:46): “The technologies have changed, but so is the human response to animals. It's a rich field of inquiry.”

DB Cooper Mystery:

Rinella discusses his fascination with the DB Cooper case, exploring theories about Cooper’s survival after his parachute jump.

• Rinella (35:08): “After working on that episode and hanging around parachuters... there's no reason to think he wasn't fine.”

The conversation highlights the enduring mystery of DB Cooper and Rinella’s perspective on the likelihood of his survival.

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4. Worst Teams to Be a Fan Of

Analysis of Underperforming NFL and MLB Teams:

Greg Rosenthal and Daniel Jeremiah transition to a lighter yet relatable topic: identifying the worst teams to support across major sports leagues. They evaluate teams based on performance relative to expectations, draft decisions, roster talent, and fan morale.

NFL Teams:

1. Tennessee Titans

   • Greg Rosenthal (53:58): “Performance versus expectations has been fluctuating. The Titans have had fluctuating success and unmet playoff expectations.”
   • Issues include inconsistent draft picks and underperformance of key players like Trayvon Burks.

2. Cleveland Browns

   • Greg Rosenthal (54:52): “They have a history of unmet expectations and poor draft decisions.”
   • Notable mention of veteran quarterback Mark Sanchez’s struggles.

3. New York Jets

   • Daniel Jeremiah (50:14): “Draft inconsistency and struggles with early round picks have plagued the Jets.”
   • Discussion on the impact of coaching and organizational instability.

4. Detroit Lions

   • Daniel Jeremiah (59:08): “The Lions have suffered decades of poor performance, including an infamous 0-16 season in 2008.”
   • Despite loyal fan support, the team’s lack of success makes it a challenging fandom.

MLB Teams:

1. Kansas City Royals

   • Greg Rosenthal (51:26): “As a small-market team, they struggle to compete financially with bigger franchises like the Yankees and Dodgers.”

2. Pittsburgh Pirates

   • Ongoing struggles in performance and competitiveness within the league.

NBA Teams:

1. Charlotte Hornets

   • Daniel Jeremiah (52:50): “Charlotte has been particularly tough to support, with consistent underperformance.”

2. Atlanta Hawks

   • Greg Rosenthal (53:42): “The Hawks have always been a mediocre team, rarely making a significant impact despite having talented players like Trae Young.”

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5. Closing Remarks and Promotions

The episode wraps up with the hosts reiterating promotional content for DraftKings Pick Six and other sponsored segments. They encourage listeners to stay engaged with the show for ongoing sports insights and betting strategies.

• Greg Rosenthal (64:08): “If you're betting all on playing games, good luck. Don't put all your money on playing games.”

Final Thoughts:

Greg and Daniel emphasize the importance of informed betting and maintaining passion for sports despite team performance challenges. Their candid discussions provide both entertainment and valuable insights for sports enthusiasts and bettors alike.

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Notable Quotes

• Greg Rosenthal (03:09): “If you're struggling to choose which team will pull off an upset, forget about the teams. Focus on player stats to rack up big cash prizes with DraftKings Pick Six.”
• Daniel Jeremiah (05:09): “I love it. March Madness is the best.”
• Steven Rinella (22:46): “My buddy Dirt rode the bear downhill for about 15 yards.”
• Rinella (25:44): “Aim low with spray... you don't need to be accurate, you just need to be in the right direction.”
• Greg Rosenthal (53:58): “Performance versus expectations has been fluctuating. The Titans have had fluctuating success and unmet playoff expectations.”
• Daniel Jeremiah (50:14): “Draft inconsistency and struggles with early round picks have plagued the Jets.”
• Greg Rosenthal (54:52): “They have a history of unmet expectations and poor draft decisions.”

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This comprehensive summary encapsulates the diverse range of discussions in Episode 25W of The Bobby Bones Show, providing listeners with key insights into NCAA Tournament strategies, wildlife management, and the tribulations of supporting less successful sports teams.

Transcript

[Greg Rosenthal]

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[Daniel Jeremiah]

What's up everyone?

[Greg Rosenthal]

It's Greg Rosenthal and I'm teaming up with the King of Spring, Daniel Jeremiah.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

He requires me to say that we're.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Going to be bringing you 40s and free agents, the only podcast you'll need this NFL draft season. From DJs mock drafts to my top 101 free agents will have it covered for you with all new episodes every Thursday keeping you up to date as.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

We head to to the NFL Draft.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Listen to 40s and free agents starting on March 6th on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcast.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Reality TV and social media have love all wrong. So what really makes relationships last?

[Young Pueblo]

On this episode of Dope Labs, poet.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

And relationship expert Young Pueblo breaks down the psychology of love and provides eye opening insights and advice we all need. You should not be postponing your happiness. Your greatest happiness is not necessarily going to like come from a relationship. Your partner should add to your happiness, but your happiness is really coming from within you. Listen to Dope labs on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Greg Rosenthal]

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[Daniel Jeremiah]

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[Greg Rosenthal]

It's Kevin here. Just wanted to hop on here real quick. Let you know before you get started with this episode that we did record this before the Cooper flag injury this past weekend. It looks like he'll be okay to play, but you should know that we did record this prior to the injury happening in the injury news. With that being said though, enjoy the episode. This is a podcast called 25 Whistles.

[Young Pueblo]

Talking basketball and they all wear a whistle yet stupid. But what did you expect?

[Greg Rosenthal]

It's a podcast called 25 Whistles.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

25 Whistles, sir.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Blow the whistle there. Ready? Yes sir. Yes sir. It's the great. Wait. My my tune's wrong. I got the music down. It's the most wonderful time of the year. I agree with you this weekend the Thursday, Friday, especially the Thursday, Friday, Saturday and Sunday are still cool. Yes, the first full four day week is awesome. It's the best.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Well and we're lucky because we kind of have all hours where we can watch the first games.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Well, I get up a second me every year just so I can stay home. So every year I get every year for that reason. And the Thursday, Friday, if you can just get a couple games that are going in the direction of looking like an upset because you got like true tvt, you got the little things up in the corner. It's everywhere. There have been years where it's sucked and there are no upsets anywhere. And those mild fun. But man, if you just get a couple it's so awesome because you can just flip around. And thankfully YouTube TV, they settled their little deal with Paramount. You guys YouTube TVers, I love it. Aside from basketball, isn't it the greatest? Everything. Everything. And this is not a commercial. No, no, no. But if you're a sports fan, you decide if you're getting paid right now. No, I'm just. He was like really thinking about it here. No, I was thinking of YouTube TV wants to, you know. Yeah. What's up, guys? Anyways, if you're a sports fan, it's the best. Casey, your thoughts on YouTube TV?

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I love it. I mean, for NFL Sunday ticket, the four games. But yes, March Madness is the best. Especially, yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Sunday ticket because they moved over there.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

And I haven't got to experience it March Madness yet because you get to do the four screens generally. But oh my gosh, I'm going to have a boner for like, like a basketball weekend. My father in law listens to this. And so I pulled back right when I was about to say that joke and then I want to tell you what happened in my head right there. This is all happening within about 0.3 seconds. I was going to say, man, I get such a boner watching college basketball. Can you imagine four games at once? That's like, call your doctor if it's up for four hours. And I was just going to make that analogy. Then at the same time I thought, I know my father in law listens to a lot of this, so maybe I don't want to make a boner reference. But then I thought, I don't want to not be me. And he wouldn't want me to not be me. Correct. Even though he probably was like, do you need to make the boner reference. All that was 0.3 in my head and I still said it, but it was like this. And I had a boner for it.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

What I've learned is because, like, my mother in law listens too.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Oh, really? Yes.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

And I've done the same thing where I'm like, ooh, should I say that my mother in law's listening? But what I've learned is they're cool, man, because they love us for who we are. And my mother in law never mentions things wherever I talk about her or anything like that, but I know she knows it, so I think she's okay with it. She doesn't act any different. She still loves me and she still listens.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Yeah. I don't question if he loves me any less. Until now. Great. My wife doesn't listen to anything. And that's not her being not supportive. That's her when I get home going, bro, I'm with you for nine hours.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Correct.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Why do I want to hear you do the same crap you do here at home then? And I'm like, I still. I'm like, eh, I get it.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

It is different you though. Like, it's a different you when you get home, then it's worse, though.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Got it.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah, got it.

[Greg Rosenthal]

And also, she doesn't really care about sports. Like this.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

But, like, it does. And he may not hear this. I'm sure he can't listen to everything because I now have 47 podcasts, which is way too many. But he'll message me and say, hey, I heard you talking to whomever is listening to this song. Like, I rarely can feel a compliment and genuinely feel it, and it makes me feel good. But he was listening to me. Maybe with Matt Jenkins. We just did. He was. Yeah. And he said, oh, KC2. I got another call, but he literally texted me. He was like, I was listening to your Matt Jenkins thing, and he wasn't saying it. Like, hey, I'm listening to you talk to Matt Jenkins. Look at me. I'm looking. I'm listening to you. He just sent a reference about it. Like, I was deeply complimented. And I don't really know that feeling of support because my life, I didn't have.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

I'm not saying that, like, I was unsupported because there weren't people pushing against me, but I just didn't have that. And so that's weird that even me to having a boner conversation triggers all the memory of, like, how, like, touched. I know how touched I get when that, like, that happens.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

And I don't know that he'll hear this, and I hope to God he doesn't now at this point, I hope he does it. Hope he doesn't, but we are here. It's. It's basketball. It's the greatest.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

It's the best.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Just pick a team to win it all.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Oh, man.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Because we're not going to break down. I get bored when people go down every. Every, everything. Let's just pick one team. Do you guys want to all put five bucks in? Yeah.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yes.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Yeah.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Let's do it.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Yeah. So, Mike, do you want in or no? I'll go in. Okay. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6. I don't need your money right now, Reed. But we'll just all do it. Reach up and change on the table.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

So if we have multiple picks, you.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Get one pick to one at all.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Right? But if, like, multiple people pick the.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Same team, you'll split the money.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Okay, so.

[Greg Rosenthal]

But everybody have your answer written down. So you cannot change it.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I got it.

[Greg Rosenthal]

And if you want to do more than five, you can. We can do 10, but that's two teams. No, it's one team. But it'd be worth a Little more. In case we split.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Let's do 10 bucks.

[Greg Rosenthal]

I. I have learned my wife will say sometimes, hey, you can't use other people's money. If, like, we go to dinner and I'm like, I want to do all this advertising and I plan to pay for everything. But then some people be like, we don't want you to pay for everything all the time. And she's like, you have to consider that. That people get tired. People don't like it when you pay for their meal all the time.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Well, that's not true.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Yeah. I don't know. I'm not saying like it. They feel like they're burdening you.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yes.

[Greg Rosenthal]

And I'm like, I enjoy it because one people paid for my meals my whole life. And now that I have money, I love doing it. So I have to think about other people before I just go, let's not get to $10. So if you would like to knock it to $10, we can I vote $10. 10, buddy. Good.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Oh, Reed's crying. Oh, I'm ready. Let's go. 20. What are you talking about, Mike? 10. Okay, 10 is good. Okay. So we have 60 bucks total.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Let's go, baby.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Pick your one team and Kevin Duke. You suck. You suck, dude. We hate you. Cooper flag, baby.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

And I can't change mine. Change it now.

[Greg Rosenthal]

No, changing it. I should have pulled out all the low seeds and we should have picked somebody like a 8 or below. We made still to do that real quick. Okay. Okay. Duke sucks. They're actually really good. Those what sucks?

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Cooper flags.

[Greg Rosenthal]

And they've got two nasty freshmen. And Cooper. Yeah. Mike going to Auburn. That's good.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Mike Read.

[Greg Rosenthal]

I'm gonna go Florida. Good pay. Good pick. Eddie.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I'm splitting the money with Kevin. I'm going Duke.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Let's go, Blue Devils. I'm sweeping, man. Which and I broom in the Auburn.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

So I'm wondering what that meant.

[Greg Rosenthal]

We're gonna be splitting that up good with that. Okay, how about this? Okay, how about this? Pick a team. Did Casey go? Yeah, he did, didn't he?

[Daniel Jeremiah]

No, I didn't go. Okay.

[Greg Rosenthal]

I love Duke.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I was just saying.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Oh, my bad. I thought that meant you had Duke. Who do you have?

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I gotta go a little contrarian here. St. John's baby. Rick Patino. I like this team.

[Greg Rosenthal]

It's the New York.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Ricky P. Over here.

[Greg Rosenthal]

I'd like to apologize for not going. I thought you picked Duke. I'd like to apologize.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

It's okay. It's all right.

[Greg Rosenthal]

It's all right. Okay.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

He's such a New York pick.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Pick a team. We all have to agree to the team being a mid or lower, and whomever's team goes the furthest will do a $5 bet. Okay. You guys all good with that one?

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yes.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Yeah. Okay.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Don't look at my team.

[Greg Rosenthal]

So, like, out of the running. Duke, Auburn, Florida, Houston, Bama, Tennessee, Michigan State, St. John's Iowa State, Kentucky, Texas Tech, Maryland. Those are kind of all out of it.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

You didn't say the team.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Well, I'm still might, though. But just looking at the bracket here. Go ahead.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

You want me to go first?

[Greg Rosenthal]

Yep.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I'm gonna go Texas A and M. Why?

[Greg Rosenthal]

Oh, they played. I like A and M. Because they cannot shoot. They do not play offense. It's like they don't even want the ball. They just give it back on defense. God dang. They play hard.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

They do play really hard.

[Greg Rosenthal]

They do. I like Texas A and M. They play hard. I like it.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

And they have a player with a last name, Garcia, so I'm all in.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Oh, nice, Kevin. I'm gonna go Arizona. Yeah, that's good. Yeah, I like it. Okay. I accept it. You guys don't have to accept it.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

But no, Arizona is accepted.

[Greg Rosenthal]

And I, I. What sucks is I already eliminated Texas Tech, and that was my boy. I wish I wouldn't have eliminated him. Okay, Castlin, go ahead. Casey.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I'm going to go with Louisville. That's good.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Don't. That's not how you say it look. Louisville. Yeah. We're not New York if you're going to be. Yeah.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Hey, Louisville.

[Young Pueblo]

Louisville.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Lou. Louisville.

[Greg Rosenthal]

No, kind of Louis. Lou.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Louisville.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Louisville.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Louisville.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Lou. Louisville.

[Young Pueblo]

Louisville.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Louisville.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Sounds like you guys have something stuck in your mind.

[Greg Rosenthal]

We got to teach them here. Louisville.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Louisville.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Yes. Ok. Okay. Read. Can I go Gonzaga? I think so, right?

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah, I think so. Gonzaga.

[Greg Rosenthal]

I'm just trying to. Yeah. Yeah, I think. I think that's fine.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Or Maryland.

[Greg Rosenthal]

One of the two. I think one. I'm gonna go Gonzaga. Gonzaga. Okay. I'm gonna go. I gotta go sec. Just because I've watched them play so much. I'm gonna go Missouri.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I have not seen them play.

[Greg Rosenthal]

I have. Or Michigan. I was gonna pick Michigan, too, because Arkansas play Michigan and they're good and I like Dusty. Dusty. I'm gonna go Michigan. I go Michigan. Oh, we're not at the sec. I know. Well, but I had to pick a team Arkansas played and we beat them, and I'm just not picking Arkansas because I don't want to attach anything to that.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Okay, okay.

[Greg Rosenthal]

So everybody good there? All right. Boom. Are you struggling to choose which team to pull off an upset this tournament season? Then you got to check out DraftKings pick six. All you have to do is focus on the players to score more or less of a stat and you can win big. So let's say Jani Broom, Auburn. That's our dude. Points, rebounds, like you can pick. The best part is it's available in most states, including states you can't do DraftKings sportsbooks. Some of them like Missouri, California, Texas, Georgia, a whole bunch more. It is awesome. Download the new DraftKings Pick Six app and use the code Bobby Sports Gambling.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Problem Call 1-800-Gambler Help is available for problem gambling. Call 888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org in Connecticut. Must be 18. Age and eligibility restrictions vary by jurisdiction. Pick Six not available everywhere, including New York and Ontario. Void we're prohibited one per new customer bonus awarded as non withdrawable Pick Six credits that expire in 14 days. Limited time offers. See [e-mail] promos Geico's motorcycle expertise gives me the coverage I need like 24.

[Young Pueblo]

Seven claims I'm on cloud nine.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Clouds are wholly unable to support the weight of an adult human. What's happening? Furthermore, clouds are not numbered. Even if you procured a jetpack and searched, you'd find no cloud numbered nine. However, at that altitude, you'd likely befriend a flock of migrating snow geese. Geese who'd encourage you to leave your 24.7geico motorcycle claims insurance behind, as they would take you in and even share their dinner of crickets and clovers with you. GEICO assumes no liability for any indigestion that may occur from a clover cricket dinner. Geico expertise for your motorcycle.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I'm Mary Kay McBrayer, host of the podcast the Greatest True Crime Stories Ever Told. Join me every week as I tell some of the most enthralling true crime stories about women who are not just victims, but heroes or villains, or often somewhere in between. Listen to the greatest true crime stories ever told on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Hi, I'm Bob Pittman, chairman and CEO of iHeartMedia. I'm excited to share my podcast with you. Math and Stories from the Frontiers of Marketing. This week I'm talking to the CEO of Moderna, Stephan Bonsell, about how he led his team through unprecedented times to create, test, and distribute a COVID vaccine to all in less than a year.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

It becomes a human decision to decide to throw by the window your business.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Strategy and to do what you think.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Is the right thing for the world.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Join me as we uncover innovations in data and analytics, the math and the ever important creative spark, the magic. Listen to math and stories from the frontiers of Marketing on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. This guy massive. He's an avid hunter, writer, wild foods enthusiast. Stephen Rinella, I love this interview so much. He's a New York Times best selling author because he's an expert. He's a TV host. He's the founder of the outdoor lifestyle and media brand Meat Eater. He has a new show that's been launched called Hunting History with Steven Rinella. It is an eight part series diving into a bunch of American history in the wilderness. So go check that out. You'll see the in our notes. But I thought this would be fun. This ended up being awesome. You can follow Stephen on Instagram evenrunnella. Here he is, Steven Rinella. Hey Stephen, thanks for the time. I have a lot to talk about with you. First of all, I will receive a bit of crap from people. I grew up in Arkansas. I had a 410 at 9 years old and I was kind of just allowed to hunt, mostly rabbit or squirrel. Like 410 was my first gun. And people were like, you had a gun at 9 or 10? And I talk about how it was a tool more than a lot of people see it as a weapon for you. When did you get your first gun? When could you hunt by yourself?

[Young Pueblo]

Oh man. You know, it's funny you bring that up because we used to be like, I remember kids. I remember this one kid in particular that moved. I grew up in west Michigan and I remember this one kid that moved from like out of town into our area, you know, and I remember his mom just being astounded, like horrified that kids would ride around on bikes with.22s slung over there, slung over their back. You know, like we, oh, it's just, we just roamed around as little kids hunting. You know, it was all back then it was just tons of woods around that area. I don't even remember. You know, I hate to say it. Well, they changed the rules now. So it's actually we would, we would start hunting before you were legally allowed to hunt, which sounds bad. But then the state went and changed the rules, so. And now it wouldn't be that it was illegal. They moved the ages back but we just started hunting early. My dad liked it. He liked. He wanted us to be out in the woods, and he thought if you were doing that, then that's what you ought to be doing.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Similar where, again, I was born in the 80s, so there weren't as many rules. And again, I'm from a town of 700 people in rural Arkansas. So the rules were just different based on lifestyle. But it was, hey, once you're like 10, get a hunter's Ed card. But I was already hunting, so hunter's Ed was easy. So I got my card. But that was like the stamp of. You're now able to say you're hunting because you have your hunter's Ed card. And then it became a license type thing. I don't even know what the law is. Like, how. What is the law to actually have a gun and hunt now.

[Young Pueblo]

Well, man, they keep moving it back. I love it. Because again, let's take Michigan. I can speak to a bunch of different states where I've had some exposure. But in Michigan, it was be. It would be that you couldn't hunt small game till you're 12. Okay? You could hunt archery deer. So you'd hunt deer with a boa at 12, and you couldn't hunt deer with a rifle till you were 14. Now they've gotten rid of all that stuff. Now it's up to the parent, which is what it should be. The state where I live in Montana, and in Montana, a kid has to be 10 to do, you know, to legally hunt. Right. But I also take my kids to my buddy's place to hunt turkeys in the spring in Wisconsin. In there, it's up to the parent, but it's. It's that they have to be mentored, so they have to be with a license hunter of a certain age. Right. Who's within arm's reach of them, which. And then they can start on their own a little bit earlier. So it's a really nice thing that's happened over the years. Like, you tend to think of everything getting more restrictive and, you know, less freedoms. But in this case, the states. Most states have really done a good job of allowing kids earlier entry into the sport as long as they're being mentored, which I think is great. Like, you can hunt two years in Montana with a mentor before you have to take hunter safety. So it really helps you get your kids out early. I get my kids hunting early, man, I don't want it. It'll never be, like, surprising to them. You know, they just grew up around it, right? That's how I like to do it.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Stephen? Yeah. You bring up a good point about the kids kind of like going out early. What I experienced with my kids was, you know, them seeing an animal die for the first time and how they receive that, you know, very differently. Some kids are like, wow, okay, cool, we got a bird. Some are like, that bird just died. How do you do that with your kid? How did that happen with your kids?

[Young Pueblo]

We again, say it. I had to say, I did with them what happened with me, which is I just took them out early. They've always been around it. You know, I'll tell people, like, I could. I. I could take something. Anything I take. If I take something in my hands. If we're out in the woods and I take something in my hands and I tell my kid, I said, hey, check this out. Hold your hand out. They're gonna, like, put their hand out and take what I handle. Like, you can't startle them, you know, they're not. You can't startle them because I've always exposed them to stuff. They're very comfortable in the outdoors, and they're. They. They have a lot of trust in me. And if I tell them something's cool, they know it's cool. If I say we ought to be nervous right now, you know, about grizzlies or whatever, they know we ought to be nervous right now. If I'd say that there's nothing to worry about, they trust me, that there's nothing to worry about. And that comes from having them out at a young age and show and demonstrating to them, like, a level of competency in the outdoors, you know. So I don't mean to, like, I. I don't wanna. I usually find that the people that are most critical about their kids have the best kids. Like, the people that complain the most about their kids have the best kids. And I could complain about my kids all day long. And if you want me to, I'll do that for an hour. But there's certain things that are cool about them. And one of the things is that they're really comfortable around hunting. They're very comfortable around life and death. As my buddy says, life and death on the farm, you know, and they know. They know about life and they know about death.

[Greg Rosenthal]

You bring up a grizzly as an example, but one charged you right? In Alaska. Can you. And I've heard the story, but can you tell the listeners that are listening now a bit of that story?

[Young Pueblo]

Yeah, I've had a couple I've had a couple grizzly charges. I've never been. Maybe I got touched by one, but I don't really know. And I think the one you're talking about is we. I was hunting on a fognack island, and I'm sure a lot of your listeners have heard of Kodiak Island. There's just a. In Alaska, there's a very narrow straight that separates Kodiak and a fognack, and we're hunting on a fognack island. And I had gotten an elk a couple days earlier, and we hung half the elk up in a big spruce tree and we went back to fetch it. Just kind of stupidly. I don't really know why. I, I, I, I felt that nothing had found the elk yet. And so we sat to eat lunch under the tree, me and my buddies that I was with. And while we were there, a bear came in and came in hard. My, my one body. He had his pistol and a pepper spray sitting on each side of them. But when that bear came in, it happened so fast. He smoked it across the face with a pair of trekking poles. I twisted my ankle up bad. I, I don't know. I feel like his foot landed on my ankle, but I'm not totally positive. But what's crazy is my buddy Dirt got knocked over by the bear. And, and I'm not kidding you, man. He Dirt rode the bear straight downhill for about 15 yards. I mean, rode, he rode on the bear. I thought the bear had him. I thought it was holding him. And so we all ran down the hill, but dirt came squirting back up out of the alders, running back the other way. And, dude, it was. It kind of messed with me a little bit psychologically for a while, to be honest with you. It was so close. It was so close.

[Greg Rosenthal]

I had a show on Nat Geo for a while, and we went up, we flew into Bozeman, then we drove into the park and probably two or three hours out of Bozeman, and we were traveling around with sheep herders because the predators come in at night and try to eat the sheep. And so we were. So that's what we were doing. We were with them. I was kind of learning about what their job was and how they'd be out for months at a time. But, you know, they had equipped me with things in case. And we did end up seeing a bear. It was far. It was with night vision, so we knew where not to go. But they equipped me, they gave me bear spray, and we didn't have grizzlies. In Arkansas, we had black bears and we have grizzlies. So they said, okay, if a bear attacks you, here's the bear spray. Shoot it at the ground, and then the bear will come through the ground and stop. It felt to me like when I was 11 and they said spray cologne in the air and walk through it. I felt like there was no way that this bear spray shooting into the ground was going to stop a bear. So if you were me and a bear was attacking, would you have sprayed the spray at all or would you just go full gun? Like, what do you know about bear spray?

[Young Pueblo]

What I think what they're. What they're meaning? Well, what I know about bear sprays. I've been in two instances where people have gotten hosed by spray, me and another person, but I haven't. I haven't hosed a bear that yet. I've shot in front of bears, you know, shot in front of them to try to spook them. But what I think what they're getting at is aim low with. With spray. You know, you want to get till that bear's like 20 yards. If he's coming and he's coming and he gets to 20 yards, what they're saying is hose down in front of him so that you're not blowing it back over the top of them, but you're blowing it. I would think you're aiming. If he's coming, you're aiming down at his feet.

[Greg Rosenthal]

You know, if he's coming, I'm running and peeing everywhere.

[Young Pueblo]

Yeah, yeah, because you're putting out a cloud of that stuff, right? And man, I know. So I interviewed a. A girl one time that was getting mauled by a grizzly, and she had her spray on her chest. She was a grizzly bear researcher. She had her spray on her chest and the bear got her down and it actually got one of its. One of its canines and through pop through her skull. But she had her spray on her chest and was. Without even being able to see, the bear was able to take that spray on her chest and shoot it, like over her own shoulder and got it in the face and it dropped her. I interviewed another dude that last year, he got mauled. All he managed to do is get his spray out before the bear hit him. And the bear was mauling him and he was trying to cover, so he had to spread. There's like a ring on your spray. It looks like a. Like a trigger guard. It's like a little handle. And he had A spray, like, hanging from that ring. Like, here's a. People that watch, like, I'm holding a suppressor, but picture that it had a ring on it. So he's holding the canister like this, and he goes to protect. They always tell you to protect the back of your neck with your hands if you're getting mauled. And he goes to protect the back of his neck, but he's got that spray on there, like a ring. And that bear bit through the spray and hosed itself by biting the spray and got a mouthful of that and dropped him and ran off. And what's hilarious, dude, is my kids lost one of my sprays last summer. And later, me and my wife find the spray laying this place where we camp. We find where they drop the spray. And the spray is erupted, and it's got four big bite marks in, like, a bear found that and bit. Because there's something about the. There's something about the smell of it that in small doses is attractive to him. I'll never get it, man. But it bit that sucker. So he must have got a face full. He must have got a base full of that junk.

[Greg Rosenthal]

My fear was, because they'll be in, like, action movies where they have, like, the rocket launcher and the person that doesn't know how to use it holds it up and they end up shooting backwards. That happens. My fear was, if a bear's coming at me, okay. And I end up spraying myself because of the can. Luckily, never had to use it. But they also said, like, don't shoot a bear, because you will get in trouble if you shoot a bear, unless you can actually prove you're being attacked or threatened. And I thought, if there's anywhere near me, like, something's getting shot me or it, like something's getting shot. But that was their big lesson, was the reason we say this is because we can't have people shooting bears.

[Young Pueblo]

Well, they do investigate it, but, I mean, every year, you know, every. Like, in the state I live in, you know, we got a thousand grizzly bears right in this area. You know, I mean, we could argue all day about the exact numbers, but we got grizzly bears. We have 10 times as many black bears, which never kill anybody in Montana. But every year, grizzlies dust off one or two people in Montana. And every year, people dust off a handful of grizzlies, and. And they get killed by. A lot of times you get killed by bow hunters who are hunting elk and. And they'll investigate it, but oftentimes it's totally legitimate, man. It's like you know, you're. You get hit or you got one coming at you. But yeah, they'll come out. The U. S. Fish and wildlife service will investigate the incidents. They'll find out if you were jumpy, you know, if it was going away at 40 yards and it was walking away and you shoot it. Yeah, you're going to be in trouble because you just got too jumpy. Yeah, that thing's coming at you and it's five yards away. No one's going to. They're not going to blame you. But people got to be cool headed. That's the thing about spray. Like it's. People argue that in my world, like people argue this all day long. Do people like this ruins friendships this argument of pistols versus bear spray. But like it does seem there's a very compelling case to be made that spray is better. Especially if you're not like a super experienced marksman with a pistol. Because with spray you don't need to be accurate, you just need to be in the right, in the right direction, you know, with your show hunting bare lips.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Well yeah, it also feels to me like you know, bird shot or buckshot versus a slug or a rifle. Right. Like you, if you got one shot for me, I'm not going to be as good of a shot as some of my friends. So I want that spread to be as wide as possible. And that's basically what the bear spray is versus a pistol or rifle.

[Young Pueblo]

Yeah, everybody likes to think there is some commando with their pistol. You know, I don't.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Yeah, no hunting history. What's interesting to me is how people hunted before we existed. I grew up in Arkansas where there's a lot of native American. There are arrowheads just randomly in places. And to me it was wild how they would create arrows. Like to you because you've spent so much time studying this, documenting this, you've made this into a show. Like what is the technology that now we look at and go how in the heck do they do that? But they were able to be effective hunting.

[Young Pueblo]

You know I was having this discussion the other day with a historian who spends a lot of time working on questions around what would it have been like for the first humans to come into the new world? Like what would have been like the first people to touch. Touch the ground and what is now the states. And there's this idea that these hunters, these ice age hunters, we call them Clovis hunters now or other names that these ice age hunters were able to wipe out Mammoths using spears. And you'd say, well, how in the world is that possible? But picture it like this, that like the mammoths had never seen anybody before, you know, so we get accustomed now to wildlife that has a pretty good familiarity with, with humans. You know, you'll see that, you'll see with all these different species that they have a pretty good sense of what is a safe distance from people. Compare that to accounts that you read of like whalers being the first people to ever step foot on some island. Like even in the early 1900s, late 1800s, like whalers would be the first people to arrive at an island. And look what they describe. They describe, you walk up and literally pick up wildlife. Birds land on you. Things exhibit zero fear of people. I'm not detracting from the skill sets of these ancient hunters, but they were in a different set of circumstances dealing with wildlife that had a different sense of what the threat the humans presented, you know, so now if you're bow hunting elk, it might be really challenging to get 40 yards from an elk that's had some hunting pressure put on it, right? But maybe a few hundred years ago it was pretty easy to get, maybe it was challenging to get four or five yards away from an elk, right? So the technologies have changed, but so is the, the response, the human response to animals. It's a real rich field of inquiry, man. And that's just like one element. The other element of it is, is that if you live in a lot of states now and you're like a big deer hunter, you might only have a 10 day deer season. So you could, you could identify as a deer hunter and you might read about deer hunting and dream about deer hunting. But when it comes down to it, you deer hunt 10 days, you know, for some people. Now imagine that. Imagine that you Deer hunted 200 days a year in the same areas that your father hunted 200 days a year for 40 years in the same area that your grandfather hunted two days a year or 200 days a year for 40 years. Imagine the body of knowledge that you would have accumulated. So, like our ideas about hunting and tactical understandings of it are probably just like nothing compared to people that lived a hunter gatherer lifestyle. And I've been fortunate to travel in South America with, you know, indigenous hunter gatherers. And I'm telling you, you can't keep up with them. Mentally, you can't keep up with them.

[Greg Rosenthal]

I was going through, and I don't, I definitely don't want to spoil anything in the work that You've done. But I've been fascinated with DB Cooper. Like, I can envision the drawing that has existed in my. I can just see it, the drawing of him and what they think he looked like and how he did it and how he jumped out of the plane. Do you think he survived?

[Young Pueblo]

You know what? I went in. We did, yeah, we did a hunting history episode on DB Cooper. We just focused on that question because a lot of it, like, like our focus is always on these areas of. Of mysteries that have a wilderness component. They have like a survival component or a hunter gatherer component. And with DB Cooper, we got into that, that this jump, the. The jump zone. So just for people, for a quick recap, in the 1970s, there was this. There was this like, epidemic of skyjackings, is the only unsolved skyjacking in US History where a guy gets on a plane, takes hostages, demands money, gets the money, jumps out of a plane, never to be seen again, jumps out. In Washington, the FBI identified a drop zone based on all these different inputs. And it was like rugged, mountainous terrain, heavily forested. I always, just as a passive, like, you know, D.B. cooper, observer reader. I always thought, there's no way the guy lived. You know, he jumped out at night, he didn't pack his own shoot. I just thought the reason they never found him is he was burrowed into the muck and moss somewhere and that was it, right? But, man, after working on that episode and hanging around with, you know, parachuters that have done like 12, 000 jumps, military paratroopers, dude, these people that really know that world, they're like, no, there's no reason to think he wasn't fine. They just like, why no land in a tree? Don't matter land. Like, they're like, he definitely is fine. It really changed my idea. So then it brings up the next question, is what happened to him when he hit the ground and what did he do?

[Greg Rosenthal]

Well, they found money too, like, like parts of dollar bills in the area, but they didn't.

[Young Pueblo]

Well, yeah. Yeah, dude. Yeah, they did.

[Greg Rosenthal]

What are you not saying? What do you. What are you trying to not say right now? What do you. What do you think?

[Young Pueblo]

No, no, no, they did. It was the money way away from there in the Columbia or way away from the FBI's drop zone. A kid was clearing out a place to make a fire on the beach on the Columbia river, on a mud bar. He's cleared out a little place to make a fire and finds a stack of rotten twenty dollar bills. And this is in the eighties. If you look at the FBI's drop zone, okay, what the FBI determined to be the drop zone, if DB Cooper had dropped that money either in the air, threw it out of the plane, whatever, like, landed, lost it, whatever, and you put it into a creek, and there's a lot of rivers and creeks there, and you put it in a creek, it would not have washed to the place where it was deposited in a gravel bar. So either the drop zone is all the way off. Either it's way off and he dropped it, or whatever the hell happened, or someone after the fact, someone later after the fact, went and buried that stuff. There a guy I interview and hang out with in there who is a real. He's like a citizen sleuth type that has really dedicated himself to the DB Cooper mystery. He thinks that the FBI's drop zone was off, and they were way off, and that D.B. cooper buried that stuff in the gravel bar. What's funny now? When I went to the spot. When you go to the spot, you're sitting nine feet below where they found the money. So if you said, where'd you find the money? It was nine feet over your head, because that gravel bar is gone now. The Columbia river ate it.

[Greg Rosenthal]

It.

[Young Pueblo]

So, dude, it's like. It is such a rab hole, man. You can't. It don't. Like, dude, if you get into the whole DB Cooper thing and you start unraveling all the things, it'll. It'll kill you. I mean, it'll kill you because it's too. It's too much. It's such a perfect. It's like the perfect mystery. It's the gift that keeps giving the show.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Hunting History with Stephen Rilla. It's eight episodes. He's teaming up with historians and archaeologists and a really cool cast of outdoor professionals. And it's very much storytelling. And I think that's what, you know, having consumed your content in different ways, I think that's what's a bit different about this, is it feels to me like this is a new element because there is so much storytelling involved.

[Young Pueblo]

Yeah, it is, man. And when we were looking at all these stories, like, we did a great one on the Donner Party, too.

[Greg Rosenthal]

That's crazy.

[Young Pueblo]

Look at all these stories.

[Greg Rosenthal]

The Donner Party's crazy. Will you just give a brief description of that so people know what you're talking about?

[Young Pueblo]

Oh, yeah. I was telling this, Tom. I was telling the story to my kids last night over dinner. So in 1846, people are familiar with the Oregon Trail right. Well, in 1846, this big group of families, they all leave Missouri, and they're traveling together over the Oregon Trail. And this group of them, these are kind of loose groupings of families, but this group of them under this. Under the leadership of this patriarch, this Donner fellow, they decided to take a thing called Hastings Cut off, which is supposed to be a shortcut to California. In fact, it's like a long cut. It's worse conditions. And. And now we understand with. You know, now that you can look at a map, it's actually longer. So it's like a longer, worse route billed as a shortcut, so that when they get to the. They have to cross the Sierra Nevada. Picture, this is the mountain range that separates, like, Nevada from California. Great, you know, great skiing destination. Now they have to cross the Sierra Nevada. There's early blizzard, there's early snowstorm, and it catches them way up in the mountains. It's early enough in the year. They think that maybe it'll melt off and they'll be able to continue on their way. But it just gets worse and worse to the point where eventually they can't even backtrack. They can't go back the way they came, and they get stuck there. What they're really famous for is they're famous for cannibalism. So if you make a joke about the Donner Party today, like, Donner family dinner, right, it winds up being it's a cannibalism joke. They did resort to cannibalism. However, there's, like, this thing. And I knew all that outline, right? But here's. Here's what I didn't. I never thought about. And I have three kids. Over half of the people in the Donner Party were little kids, were children. And children were wound up being of the survivors. Over half of the Donner Party survived, and children were far more likely than the adults to survive the ordeal. So you could look at the Donner Party as this American horror story about these people committing this atrocity of cannibalism. Or you could look at it like this, which is the conclusion I come away with. You could look at it like this. It was people, family, doing everything possible, and I mean everything possible to keep their children alive. Very different, like, ways of looking at something. And when I got done, I'm like, dude, I'm gonna stop making jokes about. I'm gonna stop making Donner Party cannibalism jokes, man. There was a harrowing thing. And it's. And it's. They get kind of blamed for it, you know, but, dude, it was a freak blizzard and people had successfully crossed the Sierra Nevada. Had successfully crossed later in the year than they did. It was just. They were just victims of horrible luck and something really bad happened. They weren't like, they weren't dumb. They weren't desperate. I mean, they got desperate, but they were, you know, it's like this heroic tale that has been just kind of abused over the years.

[Greg Rosenthal]

I think I'd like to encourage everybody to check it out. Hunting History with Steven Rinella and follow Stephen Evan Rilla on Instagram. Really appreciate the half hour he spent with us. Stephen, great stories, Big fan. And again, who the heck was DB Cooper? Even I think I've watched so many doc, many documentaries. Documentaries. I've watched TikToks on people's theories, all of it.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I didn't know who you guys were talking about, but I'm all in now.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Do you see the picture of them, though? Does that you recognize that?

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I didn't even look at it. I'm all in, though. When we're done with this, I'm all in.

[Young Pueblo]

Can I tell you one last funny thing?

[Greg Rosenthal]

Yes, sir.

[Young Pueblo]

So after, like, while working on that DB Cooper deal later, I get a message from a guy who sends me some pictures of the FBI guy, the FBI agent who was prepping the people to do the. The composite drawing. So the picture you're talking about of what he supposedly looks like, it was so funny, is the drawing looks astonishingly similar to the FBI agent, like he was the last guy they talked to. And it's almost like they described the last dude they spoke with.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

That is weird.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Steve, appreciate you, man. Hope you have a great day. Good luck with the series and hopefully I'll run it to you somewhere, man.

[Young Pueblo]

No, I'd like to meet you sometime, man, but I'll let you go now. Take care.

[Greg Rosenthal]

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[Greg Rosenthal]

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[Young Pueblo]

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[Daniel Jeremiah]

To throw by the window your business.

[Greg Rosenthal]

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[Daniel Jeremiah]

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[Greg Rosenthal]

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[Daniel Jeremiah]

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[Greg Rosenthal]

I saw where 247 sports had the five worst NFL teams to be a fan of, according to science, so.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

According to science, yeah. Okay.

[Greg Rosenthal]

So they use a lot of different things. Performance relative to expectations, draft decisions, roster talent, fan morale. So before I read you this, and we can go any sport, this will be NFL. This will be. In conclusion, what team does it suck to be a fan of? And I will go first. Well, I have two. The Arkansas Razorbacks.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Anytime we get a blip, it goes away quick. And then. I've been a Chicago Cubs fan my whole life. We had it in 2016. That was great. But it's very difficult up until that point. It's been difficult since. That's a. I'm a selfish. I'm a loser in sports. With my sports teams, I'm a loser. So I'll put them up on the list. The Razorbacks. Yeah. I didn't choose it.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

It shows you.

[Greg Rosenthal]

It shows me. And I. If anything, I am consistent. And I start crying. You know, I stay with my people. So. I will never not be a Cubs fan. I will never not be an Arkansas Razorback fan. But it's been tough. Eddie, are you going with the Cowboys?

[Daniel Jeremiah]

No. No. I love being a Cowboys fan, but.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Hard to be a fan is the question.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

It's very difficult to be a fan. One, because America hates you. Like, people just hate us. People hate Cowboys fans.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Why do you think that is, though? No, you don't just exist. We do exist, but you don't just exist. I was gonna ask, but you kind of answered the question. Cause that's not true. Why do you think people hate Cowboys fans?

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I think the whole America's team, we're always, you know. And the media covers us all the time.

[Greg Rosenthal]

That's part of it, yes. Absolutely.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Even if we're bad, they cover how bad we are. Like, bad decisions. They cover the bad decisions. I don't know, man. And we're always just there, like, primetime, too. TV puts us at primetime. I think the whole media, sports talk, all them want the Cowboys as far as topics go. But fans, they're just like, shut up. Our team's way better than the Cowboys. And you never cover us.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Yeah. I think Cowboys fans, they have a sense of importance when they really don't, as far as how good the team has been. But that team gets clicks and views, so they get shoved in everybody's face, even when they're bad. So then people resent them.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Like, I think my son got mad in the season because we got game of the week or something and it was like us and the Giants. Like, how is this the game of the week?

[Greg Rosenthal]

But it's also people like you going, I don't get it. I don't get. We just exist. That's just not true.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

We do exist.

[Greg Rosenthal]

You're shoved down everybody's throats. And if you could just admit.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Is that our fault?

[Greg Rosenthal]

But if you could admit. I know, it's annoying. Everybody wants to talk about is Cowboys and we suck, it would be different. But Cowboys fans have a sense of belonging when they don't really belong.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I guess it's kind of cool though, that, like, they cover us anyway. Like, even if we're bad and we're hurting and whatever, it's still kind of cool that people still talk about the.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Cowboys because they get clicks.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah, but that has nothing to do with us. We're just living.

[Greg Rosenthal]

That's not true. You're not just living, though. You're America's team. You say it's Casey.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Well, I mean, I got to go with the New York freaking Jets. It's New York in the winter. The field sucks. The owner sucks. He got an F in the grading thing. Yeah, it's.

[Greg Rosenthal]

It's.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I feel like we're the number one thing on this list. You're not number one on that. No. Oh, okay. Brown have to be number one.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Browns are number one.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

NFL wise. Let's go baseball then. Real quick. It sucks to be a fan of I'm gonna go Kansas City. Oh, they get small market team.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

No love.

[Greg Rosenthal]

They don't spend money. Baseball does not have a salary cap, so they'll have to pay extra taxes. But the Yankees can spend all they want, The Dodgers can spend all they want, and they do. And so luxury tax is different than a cap. And in the NBA they have different, like, aprons, right?

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

But baseball, you just spend all you want, get all you want, and then you'll pay a little luxury tax on it. It's wild. And that's why the teams like the Yankees and the Dodgers. I say Yankees, they don't win World Series, but they're always in the mix.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

We're relevant. Yeah, yeah, yeah. What about the AI Him. What about the A's? Like, they still share a field.

[Greg Rosenthal]

The A'S aren't even. The A's are moving.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I think they're officially.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Yeah, that's how much that's tough.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Yeah.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

That's got to be hard. Like if you're a lifelong Ace fan.

[Greg Rosenthal]

So the A's exist, but they're not in Oakland anymore. It's going to be Las Vegas.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Vegas, yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Sacramento.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

All their teams are gone now. Right. Because the Raiders and the Warriors. I mean, let's be. Let's be real, though. It's Oakland. Like, what were they doing with a team anyway? Like San Francisco? I understand you're a big market. Oakland.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Don't be a hater, dude. Don't be a hater. Oakland. So I go Royals. You know, the Indians can be tough. They've had some good teams, but that can be tough if they don't spend money. These small market teams in baseball, like Pittsburgh, the Pirates. Good one. Yeah. Basketball.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Charlotte.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Oh, Charlotte. Terrible. I'd hate to be a Charlotte fan. I'd hate to be a Pelicans fan. Yeah. And the Pelicans, it's not their fault they missed on Zion. Because they didn't miss. They had to drive Zion. They got lucky enough to get the number one overall pick and that set them back.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

So it would suck to be a Pelicans fan, have the Hawks anything. I mean, Trey Young keeps them in that mediocre where he goes and scores 40, but they don't win. Like, every once in a while he'll go to New York and, you know, beat the Knicks and choke himself.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah, yeah. Let's yell at Spike Lee.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Atlanta will be a tough, tough basketball team to be a fan of because they really. They don't suck. They're the Steelers of the NBA where they don't suck enough. They finally did get a top pick this last year, and it was the worst draft ever.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

And they have. And they have, you know, as of right now, one of the top three picks for next year. But the spurs own their pick, so. Yeah, it'd be tough to be a Hawks fan.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Trailblazers, too. I feel like it's been pretty rough.

[Greg Rosenthal]

And you're so disconnected up there, which is why players really don't want to go up there. Yeah, that would be tough. And then football. All these are football. Ready? Number five, the Tennessee Titans. We know this, but we don't expect anything at this point. Who.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Who's their best player? Like right now. Right now. I thought about that. I'm like, man, I can't name someone on superstar.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Yeah. The cornerback that came From Kansas City.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah. Snead.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Yeah.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Sneed's good. Oh, yeah. Okay.

[Greg Rosenthal]

But again, football has so many freaking positions that unless you're more than a casual, you're not even going to know that their colors look slow. Everything's about the Titans.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Turquoise.

[Greg Rosenthal]

How's the kicker for the Titans? I don't even know the kicker.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I can tell you now with the whole science factor, though, what's like.

[Greg Rosenthal]

So performance versus expectations. The Titans have had fluctuating success with recent seasons, not meeting heightened expectations set by previous year's playoff appearances. So anytime they play well, they tend to not play as well. The next year draft decision. Some first round picks have not delivered the anticipated impact affecting the team's competitiveness. I would look back when they traded A.J.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Brown.

[Young Pueblo]

A.J.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Brown. And they ended up drafting Traylon Burks from Arkansas, and he's been hurt the whole time.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

It's been a day like they lost a guy. I mean, they got a pick and they used that to draft somebody.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

An AJ Brown clone.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Didn't work out.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Roster talent. They've had players like Derek Henry, but other areas like offensive line, have kept Henry from flourishing. And now he doesn't play with them. And he goes to the freaking Ravens and crushes.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

That's a great.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Looks like he's 25 years old.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

And fan morale. The Nashville fan base is dedicated, but has faced disappointment due to unmet expectations and playoff shortcomings.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I bought tickets for five bucks, man.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Oh, that's five bucks a pop. That's bad. And sometimes there will be games. I drive by the stadium here during game day. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's cold. And I'm like, who would ever go sit in that terrible team? I thought once I got on the NFL Network show and a.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Good morning football.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Good morning football. Yes. I was thinking Monday morning quarterback. Good morning football. And I was talking about the Titans and how bad they were, and I was just going off. I was just doing a bit, you know, And I don't know if it ever got back to them, but if it did, we ain't gonna be welcomed over there anymore. Yeah. I was just riffing.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

You see Zach Mettenberger, the old quarterback for the Titans, is now coaching, I believe, Father Ryan high school. But he's so. In this picture where they announce them, you may look this up, Mike. It's one of those Christian private schools. He's covered in tattoos on his arms, and everybody's just going to town. I'm like, this is not Christian. This is not Christian. He's got tattoo.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

If it's Father Ryan, it's a Catholic school, I think.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Unbelievable that people were looking at his tattoos and going, that does not represent. What year are we in?

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I know. That's ridiculous.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Father Ryan. High school. I felt bad for him. You got an NFL quarterback coming to coach and you got these parents going, he can't coach our Christian school. Look at his tattoos.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

That's ridiculous.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Is this 1922? Is this sailor on leave getting tattoos out at the port?

[Daniel Jeremiah]

It sounds like it.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Crazy. Now, number four, the commanders, but they are on the way up. The team has experienced limited postseason success in recent decades, but generally underperforming.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

And they should be happy from last year.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Dan Snyder sucked as an owner. That's what this is. That's just Dan Snyder sucking. They have a new owner now, so that's why you're actually seeing the team play well. New leadership. Next up, the jets at three.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Okay. Sorry, Casey. It's all right. I had a feeling.

[Greg Rosenthal]

A lot of draft inconsistency and struggles with early round picks.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah. We have drafted a bunch of defensive players that have not panned out. I remember Dee Milliner, the cornerback from Alabama, was supposed to be a stud. He was. Didn't turn out to be much. Yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Jamal Adams starts crying now, too. Yeah, it's Casey and I just crying in this whole segment.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

You know, my kids asked me about Mark Sanchez. Like, Sanchez. Yeah, that's what we believed. They're like, what kind of quarterback was he? And I'm like, I don't know. Like, I don't really remember ended the ball.

[Greg Rosenthal]

But I would say he's one of the quarterbacks that probably never had the ability to show how good of a quarterback he was because the people around him weren't good.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

If you get drafted into a, you know, a bad organization, it almost doesn't matter because you see that with guys like, you know, Bryce Young, Baker Mayfield, Sam Darnold, where they go in and they suck and you're like, well, they're losers. But then they go somewhere else. Not Bryce Young yet. New coach came in, but they go somewhere else and they play pretty good to really good. And you're going, man, it's all about where you land. Like, you have to have the skills, but it's all about where you land. And Sanchez took him to the AFC.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Two years in a row. Yeah, yeah. In the. In the beginning of his career. But then when we had to actually rely on him to do something, he couldn't do it. And then we had Tebow. I don't know if you guys remember. We had, like, the Tebow Sanchez duel connection thingy. They played at the same time. Yeah. Rex Ryan picked up Tebow after Denver. I can't recall what year, but, yeah, we've. We've done a lot of experimenting, blocking that out. Failures.

[Greg Rosenthal]

I can't recall. Block the trauma.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Trauma in his head.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Cleveland's at one who thinks it, too. What's the one football team I left out, do you think?

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Jacksonville. Jacksonville's got to be tough.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Not top five. Probably not been around long enough. Overall, like, you don't have a lot of grandparents that were Jaguar fans that have passed it down because they didn't exist.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah, yeah, true. Okay.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Chargers, a lot of disappointment, but no, the team's good. Now Detroit. Yeah.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Oh, yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

We forget how terrible they have been for decades because of what Dan Campbell's been able to do, but the Lions have a history of unmet expectations. They went 0. 16 in 2008. They've had high draft picks, man. They drafted wide receivers, like, every year for a while. It was just one after the other. Calvin Johnson was awesome. Matthew Stafford was good. But they'd never had real success. Decades without a Super bowl appearance. And I shout out lion fans for remaining a Lion fan because that have been tough. Oh, and 16 guys.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Brutal, man.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Yeah, I remember that season.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

And Orlowski, he didn't get the safety going in the ends. Going backwards.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Yeah. And it, like, didn't even know he ran out. Like, ran all the way back and they came back in.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Do you see Orlovsky at the super bowl walking around? Radio Rogue. He's. He's really tall. Like, really tall. You can see him towering over people. I'm like, wow. I had no idea he was that tall.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Orlovsky. He was with the Colts when he did that, right?

[Daniel Jeremiah]

He was. I think it was the Lions. I think it was that season.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Maybe you're right.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

All that bad play. Yeah, all that bad play blends together. I did not see Orlovsky, but those guys are big. It's like, even Matt Castle, he's like six four.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I know.

[Greg Rosenthal]

You don't even think of a guy being that big because he just looks average on screen. And they're Giants. Okay. Anybody read any teams that are terrible that you feel bad for their fans? I just feel like I would hate to live in Wisconsin. So now we're going at the whole state.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yeah.

[Greg Rosenthal]

We're just. No reason. No reason whatsoever.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Packers.

[Greg Rosenthal]

I like what's going pretty good. Why do. Why would you hate Wisconsin? To be honest, I. I can't say that. I've never even been there. You know, I just imagine it's super flat.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

A lot of corn, a lot of cheese.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Cold.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

It's not flat really. It's a little hilly. Especially when you get out in that. That milk country.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Yeah. I have no response. I don't remember being flat or hilly. I know the people are super nice. There's a lot of cheese.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Yes.

[Greg Rosenthal]

And it's way cold, so. Anywhere cold. Not a fan of as far as, like, living there, but I feel like that was not very kind of you to pick on Wisconsin for no reason. It just. That's what came to my mind.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I picked on Oakland, so I apologize, too. That's my bad.

[Greg Rosenthal]

But you've been to Oakland, haven't you? No.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Never been.

[Greg Rosenthal]

No, I've been to Oakland.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Been in San Francisco.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Yeah, I've been to Oakland.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

What's it like over there?

[Greg Rosenthal]

You know? Not my favorite. I'll be honest with you, not my favorite at all.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

I'm Mary Kay McBrayer, host of the podcast the Greatest True Crime Stories Ever Told. Join me every week as I tell some of the most enthralling true crime stories about women who are not just victims, but heroes or villains, or often somewhere in between. Listen to the greatest true crime stories ever told on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Hi, I'm Bob Pittman, chairman and CEO of iHeartMedia. I'm excited to share my podcast with you, Math and Stories from the frontiers of Marketing. This week, I'm talking to the CEO of Moderna, Stephane Bonsell, about how he led his team through unprecedented times to create, test and distribute a COVID vaccine, all in less than a year. It becomes a human decision to decide.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

To throw by the window your business.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Strategy and to do what you think.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Is the right thing for the world.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Join me as we uncover innovations in data and analytics, the math, and the ever important creative spark, the magic. Listen to math and stories from the frontiers of Marketing on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Love at first swipe? I highly doubt it. What's your biggest red flag?

[Greg Rosenthal]

No, no, no.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

What' ultimate green flag? These days, reality TV and social media have us thinking love is instant. We're marrying strangers at first sight. We're finding love through walls, or we're even judging people by balloon pops. But what really makes a relationship last? On this episode of Dope Labs, Poet Author and relationship expert Young Pueblo breaks down the psychology and biology of loving better and he provides eye opening insights and advice that we all need. It's a big realization moment that you should not be postponing your happiness. Like your greatest happiness is not necessarily going to like come from a relationship, your partner. They should add to your happiness, but your happiness is really coming from within you. Listen to Dope labs on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Good luck everybody. We'll be back before the game start, but good luck everybody.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Thank you.

[Greg Rosenthal]

I guess if you're betting all on the playing games, good luck, then don't, don't put all your money in the playing games. You know the first four. Yeah, yeah, yeah. All right. Thank you guys. Eddie, blow the whistle. We're out of here.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Here we go. It's coming.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Thank you guys. See you later on.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Geico's motorcycle expertise gives me the coverage I need. Like 247 claims I'm on cloud nine.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Clouds are wholly unable to support the weight of an adult human. What's happening? Furthermore, clouds are not numbered. Even if you procured a jetpack and searched, you'd find no cloud numbered nine. However, at that altitude, you'd likely befriend a flock of migrating snow geese. Geese who'd encourage you to leave your 24.7geico motorcycle claims insurance behind as they would take you in and even share their dinner of crickets and clovers with you. Geico assumes no liability for any indigestion that may occur from a clover cricket dinner. Geico expertise for your motorcycle.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

What's up, everyone?

[Greg Rosenthal]

It's Greg Rosenthal and I'm teaming up with the King of Spring, Daniel Jeremiah.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

He requires me to say that we're.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Going to be bringing you 40s and free agents the only podcast you'll need.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

This NFL draft season.

[Greg Rosenthal]

From DJs mock drafts to my top 101, free agents will have it covered for you with all new episodes every Thursday keeping you up to date as.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

We head to the NFL Draft.

[Greg Rosenthal]

Listen to 40s and free agents starting on March 6th on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

Love at first swipe? I highly doubt it. Reality TV and social media have love all wrong. So what really makes relationships last?

[Young Pueblo]

On this episode of Dope Labs, poet.

[Daniel Jeremiah]

And relationship expert Young Pueblo breaks down the psychology of love. Improvise I insights and advice we all need. It's a big realization moment that you should not be postponing your happiness, like your greatest happiness is not necessarily going to like come from a relationship, your partner, they should add to your happiness, but your happiness is really coming from within you listen to Dope labs on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.