BOBBYCAST - Switchfoot Lead Singer Jon Foreman on Almost Breaking Up Before “Meant to Live” Getting Dropped & Bad Financial Decisions

Summary

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Podcast Summary: The Bobbycast – Switchfoot Lead Singer Jon Foreman

Episode: "Jon Foreman on Almost Breaking Up Before ‘Meant to Live’, Getting Dropped & Bad Financial Decisions"
Host: Bobby Bones | Guest: Jon Foreman (Switchfoot)
Release Date: April 9, 2026

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Overview

This Bobbycast episode features an in-depth conversation with Jon Foreman, lead singer and songwriter of the Grammy-winning band Switchfoot. With the band’s 14th studio album, Festival Forever, on the horizon (releasing June 26th), Jon opens up about nearly breaking up as a band before their big break, getting dropped by their label before "Meant to Live" changed everything, making tough financial choices, and the philosophy and memories that have shaped Switchfoot’s enduring journey. The discussion is marked by warmth, humor, candor, and stories about music, surfing, travel, artistry, and the roots of creative inspiration.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. First Impressions and Audience Perspectives

• Jon Foreman’s Arrival: Jon shares he had almost no advance information before joining the podcast.
  • “The only text I received was like five minutes before.” (01:14)
• Bobby’s Wife’s Switchfoot Memories: Bobby notes that people’s introduction to Switchfoot varies widely by age and life experience (e.g., his wife knows Switchfoot from A Walk to Remember soundtrack).
  • “My wife’s Switchfoot and my Switchfoot are completely different.” (01:54)
• Cultural Cross-Sections: Jon agrees, noting how people relate to bands or songs based on movies, side projects, or specific eras.

2. The “Almost-Breakup” Moment & Early Band History

• Pre-Fame Struggles: Before recording their fourth album, the band was considering breaking up.
  • “Let’s make one last record and then we’ll break up and get real jobs.” (05:43)
• Getting Dropped by Sony: Just before the record with “Meant to Live” was released, Switchfoot was dropped by Sony.
  • “Right before the record came out, we got dropped by Sony Records... That was my experience of that season.” (06:22)
• DIY Touring: Jon recalls the '90s/2000s indie grind: cramped vans, rented vehicles, eating ramen, relentless miles, and viewing “cred” as a badge of honor.
  • “They tour in a minivan and they eat ramen and that's so cool. They do that for their art.” (07:11)
• Early Ambitions: The initial dream was simply to break even on a self-funded record—selling 230 copies was “success.” (08:20)
• Band Name Origins: Switchfoot was originally called "etc", then “Chin Up”, then finally "Switchfoot," referring to surfing. (09:36–10:01)

3. Travel, Surfing, and Life Experiences

• Travel Draft – Favorite Destinations: Bobby and Jon take turns sharing the places that left deep personal marks:
  • Bobby: Grand Canyon, Eiffel Tower (Paris), Japan (“realizing universal human connection”)
  • Jon: Uluwatu (Bali surfing site), India (“like landing on a Star Wars planet”), Italy (“wandering with wife, no agenda, savoring tastes and simple experiences”) (12:12, 13:25–25:11)
• On Surfing and Band Camaraderie: Surfing is central to Switchfoot’s story and ethos, providing bonding and perspective outside the grind of music-making.
  • “Surfing and music are both kind of... you do it because you love it.” (33:35)

4. Breakthrough & "Meant to Live" Era

• Why Sony Dropped Them: An executive attended their NY show, left during “Dare You to Move,” and promptly rejected them.
  • “He walked out second song... did not like us.” (35:06)
• Blessing in Disguise: Getting moved to Sony’s indie imprint (RED) resulted in more attention, freedom, and ultimately the breakthrough.
  • “They were hungry and excited, and they were like, let's go. We love this. We love you guys and you're our priority.” (35:54)
• The Resonance of “Meant to Live”: Jon reflects how the lyrics still feel prescient and connect powerfully with fans:
  • “There’s several lines in it that feel more poignant now and almost prescient than when I wrote them. 'We want more than the wars of our Fathers.'” (37:02)

5. The Mystery of a Hit & Artistic Integrity

• Making Hits: Both agree there is no formula.
  • “You can do everything right and it’s still not connect... you could do everything wrong and it connect like freaking crazy.” (41:08–42:13)
• Humanity & Imperfection in Music: Jon’s favorite album is Kind of Blue by Miles Davis, representing the value of capturing human essence, spontaneity, and imperfection in music.
  • “When I hear a perfect album, I want to feel like there’s humans making the music.” (43:16)

6. Bad Financial Decisions & Industry Lessons

• Early Contracts: The band’s first publishing deal was $7,000 per album for all publishing rights—a huge financial mistake in hindsight, but Jon expresses gratitude for where it eventually led.
  • “You can either be bitter and like, ugh... or you can say no. I love where I live. I love I get to talk about music with you [...] You can’t change one thing without changing everything.” (49:56–51:34)

7. New Music & Finding ‘Home’

• New Album – Festival Forever: The band’s upcoming album is described as a return to their roots and the feeling that made them love music as teenagers.
  • "[This] feels like it’s a return to home... Let’s make that album for the 14-year-old kid who picked up a guitar." (54:10)
• Single “Wake Up Mr. Crow”: Discussed similarities to their past song “Stars,” and the intentional motifs threaded through the new record. (54:38–55:38)

8. Music, Family, and Personal Taste

• Bobby’s Relationship to Coffee & Social Rituals: Bobby admits to loving everything about coffee culture except coffee itself, which Jon likens to loving the ritual of smoking but not the act. (55:39–58:16)
• “Seeding” Kids’ Musical Taste: Jon shares he would let his daughter pick records as a toddler, guiding her early playlists and experiences (63:07), reflecting on the role of music in childhood and parenting.

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Memorable Quotes

• On the “Almost-Breakup” Before Their Breakthrough:
  • “Let’s make one last record and then we’ll break up and get real jobs.” – Jon Foreman (05:43)
• On Resonance and Music:
  • “Music is... you’re dealing with resonance. Some things resonate with me... and it feels like it sticks with me and begins to move me in a way. I think ‘Meant to Live’ did that for a lot of people.” – Jon Foreman (37:02)
• On Artistic Imperfection:
  • “I think imperfections need to be there. I resonate with something that feels human.” – Jon Foreman (42:44)
• On Travel and Cultural Connection:
  • “Going to Japan made me feel like, man, maybe I shouldn’t listen to the news so much... God damn it, we’re all the same. Just chasing the same thing.” – Bobby Bones (19:19)
• On Letting Go of Bitterness:
  • “You can’t change one thing without changing everything.” – Jon Foreman (51:29)
• On What Nice Means:
  • “Nice is an interesting adjective... I want to be kind. I want to be honest... Sometimes nice can shave off all the... but I’m coming to you with, you know, some scruff.” – Jon Foreman (70:00)

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Notable Segments & Timestamps

• Introduction & How People Know Switchfoot – 01:11–04:45
• Early 2000s: Struggles, ‘Meant to Live’ Breakthrough, and Almost Breaking Up – 05:17–07:06
• Living in Vans and Early Dream of Breaking Even – 07:06–09:23
• Travel “Draft” (Swapping Favorite Destinations and Memories) – 11:14–25:11
• On Getting Dropped by Sony & Red Label Success – 35:03–36:58
• Deep Dive: Meaning of “Meant to Live” and Hit Song ‘Resonance’ – 37:02–39:54
• Industry and Artistry: Why Some Songs Connect – 41:01–43:39
• Miles Davis, Imperfection & Humanity in Records – 43:16–44:53
• Financial Mistakes & No Regrets – 49:56–51:34
• Discussing New Album & Returning Home Musically – 54:09–54:38
• Coffee, Rituals & Parenting Through Music – 55:39–64:18
• How to Influence Your Kids’ Tastes – 63:07–64:18
• Bobby’s Impression of Jon & Reflection on Niceness – 69:54–71:10

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Final Thoughts

This episode is a warm, reflective, and candid conversation about what it means to persist in music, make mistakes, find meaning, and chase authentic resonance rather than fleeting trends. Jon Foreman’s outlook is one of gratitude, resilience, and artistry. Fans and newcomers alike will find resonant lessons not just about the music business, but about creativity, connection, and the imperfect journey of chasing what you love.

Transcript

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[Bobby Bones]

Did anybody tell you anything about me coming into this room at all?

[John Foreman]

The only text I received was like five minutes before.

[Bobby Bones]

Did you know you were coming?

[John Foreman]

No. No.

[Bobby Bones]

So you're just straying. You just follow feet and you came here and you didn't know what you're walking into?

[John Foreman]

Yeah, kind of didn't know. I knew you were affiliated with sports and the Dancing with the Stars and that was kind of it.

[Bobby Bones]

Our guest today is John Foreman, the lead of Switch Foot. I'm a big Switchfoot fan. We were meant to live for so much more. That one in I dare you to move. I sing them perfectly too. He's a Grammy winning songwriter and the voice behind some of the most well known songs in alternative rock. As the lead singer of Switch Foot, he has led the band through 10 million albums sold. Crazy. Nearly three decades of touring and after five years, the band is back with their 14th studio album, Festival Forever. Now that comes out June 26th. I think you're gonna love it. If you like Switchfoot, which I do. They got a brand new single, wake up Mr. Crow. They're going on tour and this is just a fun conversation about traveling and I know nothing about surfing. Surfing and music. So here he is, John Foreman, the lead singer of Switchfoot. John, good to see you, man. Yeah, I've been a fan for a long Time I was coming in and I left my radio show, and I was coming over, and I was with my wife, and I said, hey, do you know Switchfoot? And she said, yeah. She goes, I know a lot of Switchfoot songs. She's like 11 years younger than I am, 11 and a half or so. And I said, what do you know? And she said, walk to Remember. And I was like, no, I think you're talking about the wrong band. And she was like, no, you. And I said, I don't know you. And so we listened to you. So our Switch foots are different. My wife's switch foot and my switch foot are completely different because that's where she was. She knows, you know, she's probably seven songs deep on you guys, which is significant for any band. And I was. I didn't even know you guys were in the movie A Walk. I don't think I've ever seen A Walk to Remember.

[John Foreman]

Yeah, Yeah, I know. It is funny because we. We had a ton of songs in that movie, and yet that movie feels like it represents a totally different cross section than, say, the songs we played, you know, two nights ago in Jersey. Like, the songs that we would. I don't. We haven't played you live in a long, but, yeah, I still love those songs as well. It just feels like a different band almost.

[Bobby Bones]

Is there a type of person that knows you for a different thing?

[John Foreman]

I mean, that's the funny thing. So I'm in this other band, Fiction Family, that nobody knows about, with Sean Watkins from Nickel Creek and a couple other guys. And this guy, I'm singing and in Switch Foot, or I'm singing a solo show, and this guy comes up to me and he's like, are you in a band? And I'm like, I think I know where it's going. You know? He's like, Fiction Family, right? You know? And I'm like, yeah, that's me. You got me.

[Bobby Bones]

It's funny how even with people that would come up to me, they'll know me. I can tell by their age and their age, their age and their sex what they know me from, right? Like, if it's a dude and he's in his 40s to 50s, he probably listens to, like, my NFL show. If it's an old lady, she saw me on Dancing with the Stars. If it's like a family American, like, I can tell when they're coming up what they know me from. And I just thought it was wild. Cause again, I've been a fan of you guys Forever. I did not know you were in the movie. And my wife knows you just from that. And she's like, I'm a massive fan because of that.

[John Foreman]

That's fun. My daughter, probably. Yeah, she would know you from Dancing with the Stars, so she would feel.

[Bobby Bones]

I apologize to her for that. Yeah, for me, yeah. Most people that didn't know me, Dancing with the Stars didn't really enjoy me on Dancing with the Stars.

[John Foreman]

That takes some cojones, though, man. My wife's always like, you could do that. And I'm like, no, I wouldn't. I don't think I ever. Would they ever ask you to do it? If they have. I blocked it out. I don't think I. Like I said, that takes something special and I don't know that I have it. So, hats off.

[Bobby Bones]

I have a friend that was at a festival and I think it was in, like, West Texas, 2002 or 2003, and you guys were playing a five o' clock slot. And I think it was after Meant to live@hit MTV. And he told me that there were like 20,000 people there for a 5 o' clock slot because that song had popped so hard because it had landed on mtv. Does that sound familiar to you?

[John Foreman]

Yeah, that was a wild time. The whole experience of that was surreal on a lot of levels because you go from playing for 20 people that could kind of care less, you know, to playing for a lot more than that. And almost overnight, it felt like there was a big shift. Yeah, that was a strange period because that was our fourth record and we made it with the attitude that, you know, let's make one last record and then we'll break up and get real jobs.

[Bobby Bones]

No way.

[John Foreman]

So, yeah, that was like. That was the mindset. Let's just give it all we have. And. And we were, you know, independent at the time, and we recorded this record up in LA in a week. And, you know, had, of course, you have high hopes. You want to get it out there. But right before the record came out, we got dropped by Sony Records. And so, I mean, everything. If you're. If you're thinking through your life at the age of, you know, 23 or so, you're not thinking, oh, this is where everything turns around. You're thinking, okay, well, that's cool. That was a good run. Let's go back to college. And. Yeah, so that was. That was my experience of that season.

[Bobby Bones]

The first three records that you put out, were you guys just grinding in a van?

[John Foreman]

Yeah, we would. So there was this thing in the 90s and early 2000s, called CRED. And if, like, you wanted to get cred, and the only way you could get cred was by doing it the hard way. So it was not seen as some sort of flaw. It was seen as, whoa. Those guys, they tour in a minivan and they eat ramen and that's so cool. They do that for their art. I don't know that nowadays it's cool, but that's the way we saw it. So we would pack all our stuff in the minivan and we'd drive across the country. A lot of times it was a rental, rented minivan. And we're a three piece at the time. And we'd turn the car in with thousands of miles. At the end of the tour, the guy checking us in is like, this has to be a mistake. You guys put 2,000 miles on this thing. So, yeah, that was the early days.

[Bobby Bones]

When you started. Were you just playing like in your town or was the idea, let's just start booking shows immediately?

[John Foreman]

So the dream, when I was in high school, the dream was to break even on an album that we paid to record. So I spent all, you know, took all my busboy money from working at the restaurant and spent it all on the studio. And I did the math. We needed to sell like 230 copies of this album. And then we break even. And so we had our sights real high. We wanted to sell 230 copies. And when we did it, that was success, you know, we did. You know, I think my brother and I were pretty resourceful. We love the hustle. And it felt like we were kind of cheating the system, that we were actually breaking even with rock and roll. But we had no thought of thinking, like, oh, this could actually. You could get a mortgage on a house with this kind of thing. You know, it was like, no, this is. You have to graduate college and get a real job.

[Bobby Bones]

So you would record your albums at a small studio in California.

[John Foreman]

We did the first few there. The first Switch Foot record. We were actually recorded here in Nashville.

[Bobby Bones]

So what were you before Switchway?

[John Foreman]

We were a band called etc.

[Bobby Bones]

Were you. Etc. Or did you spell it all the way out?

[John Foreman]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

How many of those guys are the guys that ended up being a Switch?

[John Foreman]

My brother, myself, and a drummer who he left to go back to the East Coast. And our drummer now, Chad, we said, hey, you should join our band. And he was like, well, let's start a new one. And so that's.

[Bobby Bones]

That's why the Name changed.

[John Foreman]

Well, we. Yeah, we switched names. We had another name in between called Chin up, and we thought that that was too hard to say, and somehow Switch Foot is easier, which it's not. I had a lot of speech therapy as a K. I don't know why we picked a Dave Switch Foot. It's. It's. Yeah, but it's. That's. That's what we thought was a better idea.

[Bobby Bones]

I don't know how to surf. I'm from Arkansas. Water makes me uncomfortable still. So I'm not a water guy.

[John Foreman]

Okay. Salt or. Or fresh? Either. Both.

[Bobby Bones]

Land. Land.

[John Foreman]

Okay. Either way. Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

Just generally speaking.

[John Foreman]

Land. Do you like being near the water?

[Bobby Bones]

Nah.

[John Foreman]

Not even like sitting at a lake or. Okay, fair enough.

[Bobby Bones]

If. If I am, I need to be doing something. I need to be doing some kind of activity. I just never grew up on water, and my wife loves the beach. Most people love the beach.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

I just. I. At this point in my life, I just like some good WI Fi.

[John Foreman]

Okay. You know, what about. Okay, what about the mountain or, like a field or the streams or any of that? Do anything.

[Bobby Bones]

I've been to some cool places. Yeah, if you say, what?

[Lost Concert Goer]

Wow.

[Bobby Bones]

Let's go back and forth. Coolest places we've ever been, things we've seen.

[John Foreman]

Okay.

[Bobby Bones]

This would be a fun exercise. I remember the first time I saw the Grand Canyon. I was blown away. I could not believe how grand it actually was.

[John Foreman]

It's one of those things that lives up to the name, right?

[Bobby Bones]

Yes. Very few do. And I remember seeing the Grand Canyon and I had a show on Nat Geo where I had to go and clean the sky bridge underneath that clear thing people stand on. And so I'm on a single. It sucked because I hate heights.

[John Foreman]

That's crazy.

[Bobby Bones]

It sucked. It was the worst thing ever. You cleaned that thing from underneath on a rope.

[John Foreman]

Oh, my gosh. Okay, now I've got some watching material for tonight.

[Bobby Bones]

I hated it. It was the first episode. And you knew I didn't die because there were like eight episodes if they put it on.

[John Foreman]

Well, because you're here with me now.

[Bobby Bones]

But golly, the Grand Canyon was awesome. And I used that word like it was meant. It was awesome. I could not believe it. I'd never seen anything physically like that before. So that's going to be in my draft. We'll do three each. Grand Canyon number one, pick, you're up.

[John Foreman]

Okay. This one holds a special place in my heart. There's this place called Uluwatu in Bali, and it's a Surfing spot that is legendary and been there many times and it is stunning. I mean, the secret's out on it. It's no longer like this hidden thing. I think Richard Branson and a bunch of people have houses, Oprah or whoever on the top of it. But it's like this 400 foot cliff that just goes straight down into the water. And then that entire coast is exposed to huge Indian Ocean monsoon season swells. And so some of the best waves, there's this cave that you walk through to get to the ocean. So you go down these stairs that are connected only at the bottom and the top and there's monkeys that live in the caves. And then you paddle out through the cave into the ocean and it's just this living reef and these world class waves firing off in front of you. So that's a special place in my heart.

[Bobby Bones]

Did you know, I'm assuming the lore of it before you got there and then when you got there, did it live up to it even though you'd heard about it?

[John Foreman]

Yeah. So being a surfer, it's funny because surfing, it's a very egalitarian sport where if you get to the spot and you want to paddle out, go for it. It's not like the super bowl where you have to get drafted and make your way there. There's no one checking credentials or anything like that. But every, you know, I'd say probably 90% of the surfers around the world would know what we're talking about. And so, yeah, it absolutely lived up to the hype.

[Bobby Bones]

My number two is going to be because I had seen it on television my whole life and growing up I lived in trailer park, so I never really thought I'd get to leave the state, much less the country. And it really wasn't that big. But just seeing the Eiffel Tower in person was the coolest thing to me because it was like I was getting to experience things farther away than I ever thought I would get to experience things.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

So it meant that to me.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

So to drive because you, I'm assuming you've been to Paris.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

And I love this. I've been there twice now. We love it.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

And we have. My wife and I have great memories of being there. And I remember the first time we were driving in, we weren't driving. Somebody was driving us and seeing like the top of it and you get. And I just had this like overwhelming feeling of like, I'm not, I don't have to be that kid anymore.

[John Foreman]

Wow.

[Bobby Bones]

Because I'm Getting to see things I never thought I would get to see and something I only thought that felt fictional even.

[John Foreman]

Yeah, almost. Those are those moments where it feels like. It's almost like a mythical interplay where you're like, oh, yeah, I've read Harry Potter. And then, oh, no, it's real. You know, like.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah, that to me, because of the meaning to it, I'm gonna put that as my number two. Seeing the Eiffel Tower. And then you get to basically go up to it. We didn't go up in it, but, you know, we have a big picture of the picture in our house, of us in front of it. That means more to me than just that old structure behind us. To me, it's something I never thought I would get to see in person. Getting to see it in person.

[John Foreman]

Yeah, I love that. Okay, so my number two, I think the thing. So this is going to be more of just a feeling that I have in an entire country. So when I'm in India, we've been to India several times, and there's just this magnificent claustrophobic explosion of color and smell and people and taste and everything is there. It feels otherworldly where you think to yourself, okay, I've arrived on some sort of Star wars planet, and this is the way this planet behaves. Because there's no way this is. Is this really Earth, you know, so

[Bobby Bones]

safe to you there?

[John Foreman]

I do. Well, I've found that in most cultures, the. It's the brackish water. If we're going to go with a salt water, fresh water analogy, that is. That feels like the places that are dangerous. So, like, for example, the border between Mexico and the US I never feel safe near the border, but the further south you get into Mexico, the more safe you feel. I feel the same thing in India. Like, the further you get away from the tourist spots, the more you just feel like, oh, I can relax. But I never felt like I was letting my guard down because it's such an abrasive affront on every one of your senses all at once.

[Bobby Bones]

He does have me on my list, but when I went to Haiti, I kind of felt that way.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

Like, the further I got out of town. Yes, My heart could rest a little. My resting heart rate actually fell a bit because in town there's people. There's people are holding guns. But once you get out, I feel like everybody was a little more chill. Like everybody wasn't condensed.

[John Foreman]

Yes.

[Bobby Bones]

So I don't totally relate. India's always been something that I guess I have Friends that have been. And one of my friends went. Landed in the airport, was like, I'm not doing it.

[John Foreman]

Came home. I get that it's a very visceral, affronting feeling where you're completely engulfed in humans and not an always pleasant way, you know, But I do think maybe being around crowds all the time at festivals or whatever, maybe that helps a little bit with that kind of feeling thing. Okay. You got to go one more third one.

[Bobby Bones]

Mine are going to be because of the way they make me feel.

[John Foreman]

Okay.

[Bobby Bones]

I went to Japan, and this was when I felt like, as different as everybody is, we're all the same.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

I went all the way around the freaking world.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

And I would see families doing family things.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

People solo. Doing solo people things. Dads, religious. Everything that felt like it was supposed to be so different from what we're taught, but it was just the same. Like, there are universal languages that we all share, regardless of our cultures that we grew up in and that we're so bound to each other by them, even if we constantly fight it or we're taught we're not the same. Going to Japan made me feel like, man, maybe I shouldn't listen to the news so much. Like, that's the feeling I got there because I felt like I was exactly like them.

[John Foreman]

Wow.

[Bobby Bones]

When my whole life I had been told that we're from different cultures, so we're so different. They use chopsticks, we use forks. We're.

[John Foreman]

They're crazy. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

But in reality, what I learned by, like, being there was, God damn it. We're all the same. Just chasing the same thing. Same dreams, same core values.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

And that is how I felt about just being in Japan in general, because it felt so foreign, because it looked so different and it was so far.

[John Foreman]

Oh, yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

And there were, like, two versions of it. There's, like, the Japan that was, like, super chill, and there's like, space age Japan. And I was like, this is like the Jetsons.

[John Foreman]

Oh, crazy.

[Bobby Bones]

And there's Japanese music playing over. I had no idea. And I was learning, trying to say the words like, konichiwa. And I was, you know, arigato. And I was saying the things I was trying as hard as I could, and they were so appreciative that I was trying. And I remember just having, like, a sense of man. Earth's kind of cool. Like, I shouldn't fall into the traps that divide.

[John Foreman]

That's good. I love that. And I do think that travel is. Is probably the best education you know, and yeah, I have a friend from Taiwan who grew up here, moved there, super smart guy, like double major math and computer science in three years. And he's out to Taiwan and then and he comes and visits and he comes back to America and he's like, man, I thought like, he's like, same thing. He's like, I was reading the news and I was like, I thought America was blown up or something. But then I realized I talk to people back home in America and I'm like, oh no, everything's fine. People are people and they still love each other and they still love their family and they still are trying their best. And yeah, I do think maybe the thing that sells the news often is the scandalous things in the margins. And for the most part, you know, people are generally aiming for the right thing, you know, so that's a. That's a good point. Let's take a quick pause for a message from our sponsor.

[Lost Concert Goer]

We're lost. And the concert starts soon. I wanted to get there early. I'm gonna ask that man for directions. Hi there. We're trying to get to the amphitheater.

[Helpful Local]

Well, you're gonna take a left at the old oak tree at this here road. Nah, I'm just kidding. Let me get my phone out.

[Lost Concert Goer]

How is there signal out here?

[Helpful Local]

T Mobile and US Cellular are coming together. So the network out here is huge. We get the same great signal as the city, saving a boatload with benefits. And there's a five year price guarantee too. Okay, here's the turn.

[Lost Concert Goer]

Actually, can you pull up the way to a T Mobile store?

[T Mobile/US Cellular Advertiser]

America's best network just got bigger. Switch to T Mobile today and get built in benefits the other guys leave out, plus our five year price guarantee. And now T Mobile is available at US Cellular stores in hermiston. Best mobile network based on analysis by Ooklove Speed test intelligence data. Second half of 2025. Bigger network. The combination of T Mobile's and US Cellular's network footprints will enhance the T Mobile network's coverage price guarantee on talk text and data exclusions like taxes and fees apply. See t mobile.com for details.

[Liberty Mutual Advertiser]

And Doug, there's nowhere I wouldn't go to help someone customize and save on car insurance with Liberty Mutual. Even if it means sitting front row at a comedy show.

[Podcast Host]

Hey, everyone, check out this guy and his bird. What is this, your first date?

[Liberty Mutual Advertiser]

Oh, no. We help people customize and save on car insurance with Liberty Mutual together. We're married. Me to a human, him to a bird.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, the bird looks out of your league anyways.

[Liberty Mutual Advertiser]

Only pay for what you [e-mail] Liberty.

[John Foreman]

Liberty.

[Podcast Host]

Liberty.

[John Foreman]

Liberty.

[Podcast Host]

On the Serving Pancakes podcast, conversations about volleyball go beyond the court. Today we have a little best friend compatibility test. Okay, how long have we been best friends for? Since the day we met. As the League1 volleyball season heads towards its final stretch, there's no better time to tune in. We really are like yin and yang, vodka and tequila. You'll hear unfiltered analysis, behind the scenes stories and conversations with leaders making an impact across the sport. Today we have Logan Lednecki. I feel like our fan base in general is very connected. Just like a comforting feeling getting to play at home. Whether you're following the final push of love season or just love the game, serving Pancakes brings you closer to the action and the people shaping the future of volleyball. Jordan Thompson had that microphone. Oh, God forbid we make mistakes or cuss at our coach like one time or two times. Open your free iHeartradio app search serving Pancakes. And listen. Now this has been Serving Pancakes. And we'll catch you on the flip side. Okay. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of iHeart Women's Sports.

[John Foreman]

And we're back on the Bobbycast.

[Bobby Bones]

All right, hit me with your three.

[John Foreman]

Okay. Number three. I got so distracted by the story, I wasn't even thinking about it. Okay, so if we're gonna go with number three. I had the privilege of going to Italy with my wife and it was a trip that had no agenda. And. And it was a very, you know, pre kids. And I will never forget the tastes. You know, you talk about the feeling that you had. Never forget the tastes. It was. We just kind of wandered. We had no plan. We just get an Airbnb. This is, you know, back in the day and every day was just kind of a new adventure. And it felt like I was. I was. Because of the way we did it. So on kind of a micro level, there was no, we're gonna do this and this and this. I felt like we kind of sunk down to the level of what it might have been like on foot. You know, we didn't have a car. We were just walking from place to place. That'd probably be my third most memorable place on the planet.

[Bobby Bones]

We went to Italy and I started just going places because, like I said, I never went anywhere. And then I had made money and I was single forever, so I was like, I'm gonna. And I started chasing things from television.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

Like, I only went to Japan because Jesse and the Rippers from Full House played there, of course. Right.

[John Foreman]

Why wouldn't you?

[Bobby Bones]

I only went to Hawaii because of the Ready Bunch.

[John Foreman]

There it is.

[Bobby Bones]

I only went to London because of friends, like, and I went a lot of these places by myself, even.

[John Foreman]

Wow, that's great.

[Bobby Bones]

Because I was just like, I want to see stuff.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

And when I met my wife, that's when I actually started traveling with somebody. And we've been married almost five years now. And we went to Italy. We've gone twice now. But I would hear people talk about that and go, you can eat whatever you want. You don't even gain weight. And I was like, urban legend. Not real, fake. Then we went, you can eat whatever you want because there are no preservatives. They're not like us. We're packaging up Ding Dongs for seven months before we eat them. They make their stuff to be eat right then. And you can eat all the stuff here that you can't eat because it'll sit in you forever. And I compared it to Chinese food. Here you go. You get stuffed on Chinese food. Hours later, you're like, where did it go?

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

That's how, like, the thick the breads were in Italy.

[John Foreman]

Oh, yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

And I was like, this is a. Everybody was, right.

[John Foreman]

Yes.

[Bobby Bones]

Italy was awesome.

[John Foreman]

Yeah. Italy is amazing.

[Bobby Bones]

We did a cooking class in someone's house.

[John Foreman]

Oh, that sounds like.

[Bobby Bones]

We totally embraced it. I'm not an embracer. My wife is an embracer.

[John Foreman]

Okay.

[Bobby Bones]

And she said we should really experience this. Like, let's not go to. Because we. We did Florence, which is freaking crazy, because I wanted to see art. Like, I like the stuff. It's like the water. Like, I don't like the water for the sake of the water. I don't want to go to the town for the sake of the. Like, I want to do stuff.

[John Foreman]

Yes. Yeah. Yeah. So you're like, my mom has the list. Do you have the list?

[Bobby Bones]

Very much. Like, things I want to do. We got to check them off.

[John Foreman]

So, you know, it's super funny since I used to be the kid who was like, mom, quit it. Like, we're here. We're in Hawaii. Like, why do we have to have a list? You know, let's just unfold and see what happens. And now my wife is so far that way that I freaking have a list because she's, you know, I'm like, oh, my God.

[Bobby Bones]

Somebody's gotta be the list.

[John Foreman]

Somebody's gotta. Oh, dude. Do I have to be the list person? Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

We went out to A lady's house. And she found us on some Angie's List. Italy. I don't know what they have over there, but some version of that.

[John Foreman]

Angina.

[Bobby Bones]

Angina's list. And so we travel like 20 miles out of Florence and went to her house and stayed the whole day. And she just, like. She's just a lady, just taught us how to cook and we made pasta. It was really one of those experiences that I wasn't looking forward to, but I'm so grateful that I listened to my wife and we did it.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

Because it's still, like, so special in my heart.

[John Foreman]

Wow. And so do you have like those memory, like the. All the. All the recipes on lock? Can you.

[Bobby Bones]

She does. She's a great cook. She knows how there's. Once a year we do homemade. All the homemade noodles and stuff, because we learned how to do that. And it's a process, like, it takes hours to do. So I'll commit to her once a year to do it. But I think she learned two things from her specifically that she does really well, and they're mostly improvements on pasta.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah. I'm also not a pasta guy.

[John Foreman]

Well, yeah, I mean, but the sauces, you know, it's. It's right where like, we're like. I've never tasted that before. How did you do that? It's all so fresh, I guess, right?

[Bobby Bones]

It's all. It's all so fresh.

[John Foreman]

Just chop the pine nuts right then and. Yeah, all of it.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah. So Italy, to me, I have great memories there of that. And again, just chasing television shows because that's why I went places.

[John Foreman]

So, you know, it's funny for me, I had that same experience of travel. You know, just if they book us a show there, it'd say, yeah, let's go. I mean, even if it was a break even or we'd lose a little money. Our very first tour was in the uk. We got booked on a couple festivals and we found out that the touring and surfing, they go hand in hand. Music and surfing because they both require travel. And so while we're in London, we had like four days left before we needed to fly home. And we found out there were waves in France that a swell was hitting. So we checked out of our hotel and went to Central park with all our gear and tried to sleep during the day. Like, sleep on our gear so no one could steal it. But sleeping in, we're at Hyde park or wherever in London. This band shows up to play, like, marching band. We're like trying to sleep like, it was comical. And so now we haven't slept at all. We're wired, and we're trying to now make it through London at night and not get mugged with all our instruments at, like, subways and getting kicked out of places. But by checking out of our hotel for those four days, we saved enough money to get the Chunnel over and surf in France. And so those are, like. Those are core memories for us as a band to think through. Yeah. And I wouldn't trade it now. My travel is still a beautiful thing, but having kids, I feel like a new understanding of what home means. Because when you're 22 and you've dropped out of college and you're living at home, travel means success, you know? But then as you grow older, being home means success. Because I love my kids, I love my wife, I want to be there. So, yeah, it totally changes the perspective. And then when I get a chance, I can actually bring my kids with me. I brought my son to Alaska. We toured up there this summer. And, yeah, I want to pass on that education to them.

[Bobby Bones]

The first time that I had been to Hawaii, I was in my 30s. I went by myself. It was America. I don't think I had a passport at that time, so I stayed in the States. But I went where the time zone was off because I had to finish a book. And if my time zone was way different than everybody else's, then I wouldn't be in the wheel. The emails weren't coming. There were like four or five hours every day where I did not have to worry about that. And so I went to Hawaii by myself and. And I was staying at a hotel. I was just riding. And again, Hawaii is a weird place for me to go, but the Brady Bunch went and, you know, they had that bad luck mask. They threw it back in the ocean, so I just wanted to go and see it.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

So.

[John Foreman]

And this is Oahu.

[Bobby Bones]

Well, first it was Honolulu. So I bounced around a little bit, even by myself.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

So first, because I didn't know what I was doing, I just went to Honolulu and stayed at a hotel. And I thought, I need to go do something, even by myself. And so I went to, like, the dole.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

Where they make the pineapple. I don't. I guess they don't make pineapples, but they, you know, they don't plant.

[John Foreman]

Yeah. Right in the center.

[Bobby Bones]

And so. And then I went and hiked. I did a mountain by myself. And I remember asking somebody to take a picture, and they were, like, looking for the other people to be in the picture. And I was like, nope, just me. And so, you know, so you hold your arms out wide and you take a picture. And so I thought I should do something on the water. And I went down and I don't know how to surf, and I wasn't gonna take surf lessons, but I thought, I'll go and get one of those, like, paddleboards. Stand up, stand up paddleboards. And I'll go and at least get on the water and have an experience doing that. And so I go and I'm on and strap that thing to me so the board doesn't fly off. But everybody's looking at me really weird, and I'm like, either I'm killing this and they're amazed at a rookie, or I'm doing something really wrong. And so, like, I'm up, I'm standing up on the board. I'm exactly where I'm supposed to be. But people are, like, looking at me and then a little of me is like, oh, they may recognize me. I got a couple things going, maybe, and it wasn't that. And so finally a guy that, I think he was giving lessons to other people, he comes up and he's very nice, and he said, hey, man, that strap is not for your wrist, it's for your ankle. So it's a strap that you see.

[John Foreman]

Yes, yes. The leash.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah, yeah. So I had it on my wrist.

[John Foreman]

I mean, you know, different strokes.

[Bobby Bones]

That's why everybody was staring at me.

[John Foreman]

That's really good. I was really like. I mean, it doesn't go. You could have gone neck or, you

[Bobby Bones]

know, I could have gone neck.

[John Foreman]

Yeah, Maybe like a sweatband or.

[Bobby Bones]

My head's too big for the sweatband, but I could have gone neck. But I did wrist. Was surfing. What brought you guys as the band together initially?

[John Foreman]

So kind of. I definitely think it's what's kept us together as a band. It's for people that don't participate. It sounds funny, but yeah, we were on surf teams in high school and college. And I always joke, ucsd, the college we went to, is well known for, you know, math and science is not. They don't have a football team. But I will say our surf team's much better than ucla. And, yeah, that was kind of. We'd go surfing, we'd make music. But, you know, surfing and music are both kind of. You do it because you love it. You're not thinking, I'm going to crush it financially with this occupation. You know, surfing is a blast. It's a passion, it's a lifestyle. It's a way to connect with nature, yourself, other people. But you're never thinking, oh, this is going to make me some money. I think the same thing holds true with songs where I think songs are the scaffolding for the soul. They get me to places I could never get to otherwise. And yet the same approach was until our fourth record. We had that approach where it's like, oh, of course we're never gonna make money with this, but we're gonna pour our life into it because it's beautiful.

[Bobby Bones]

So why did you guys get dropped at that fourth record?

[John Foreman]

We played a show in New York for the head of Sony, and he walked out second song after saying a couple expletives and did not like us and thought we were not a good band.

[Bobby Bones]

So he saw you play and dropped you based off a song?

[John Foreman]

Actually, I think he walked out during a song called dare you to move, which ended up being one of our bigger songs. Yeah. So we finished the show and we're thinking, man, that went pretty good, right? And our manager's like, no, it did not. I don't think it went well at all. And I think you guys got dropped, and it ended up being the best thing that could have happened to us.

[Bobby Bones]

Why?

[John Foreman]

Because we were then relegated to this, basically the farm team of Sony, which was Red. And on Sony, tons of money, tons of power, tons of clout, but we would have been one of a bunch of other bands. And we were in a very small ship in a big pond, and on Red, they were hungry and excited, and they were like, let's go. We love this. We love you guys and you're our priority. And so we would just basically. Basically, you know, we'd travel around the country playing for folks, you know, we'd play our show in the evening and play for the radio station in the morning. And halfway through the tour, that's kind of when the aggregate sum of people started to change, you know? And, yeah, so that was a big turning point for us, and I don't think it would have happened on Sony. So that's what I mean. It was a blessing in disguise.

[Bobby Bones]

What was the success story story of Meant to Live?

[John Foreman]

Meant to Live was a song that is. It still feels true for me. And when I say was, I feel like I should say is. It still is a song that feels like it resonates. There's several lines in it that feel more poignant now and almost prescient than when I wrote them. We want more than the wars of our Fathers. That line every night when I sing that, especially now, and being a dad, that feels. Feels like a very poignant line. And I feel like it resonated with people. Music is, you know, to state the obvious, you're dealing with resonance. And you know that note that you hit in the shower where it just keeps going on forever, and you think, wow, my voice is amazing. You know, you found what's called the resonant frequency of the room, where all matter will have a resonant frequency at which it will vibrate. Say a truck drives by and your window starts rattling. That's because the truck hit the frequency at which your window rattles. Right. So I think that music not only on a physical level of resonance, but also with the lyrical level. Some things resonate with me. Like I hear a poem or I read a book or a phrase, and it feels like it sticks with me and begins to move me in a way. I think Meant to Live did that for a lot of people where it resonated with them and it felt like that fist in the air kind of moment where they want to sing along with it.

[Bobby Bones]

Was there a television performance or was it MTV or was it a radio? Like, what was kind of the lever that actually, like, pop that song?

[John Foreman]

Well, I mean, we did all of them. You mentioned, you know, we were talking about the Beastie Boys on Letterman. Yeah, we did Letterman, we did Leno, we did mtv. There was one moment where the last minute we were added to a radio show at Madison Square Garden in New York City. And it was a last minute thing. And so. And they said, hey, we want you to go out and play a couple songs just acoustic, just you. And so. And it was. And now that I'm thinking of it, it was very odd. William Hung.

[Bobby Bones]

Oh, I remember.

[John Foreman]

William Hung was the ash. She immediately before us. Yes.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah, she bangs. American bangs.

[John Foreman]

But you've got like Destiny's Child and Maroon 5 and all these people. Everyone's backstage. Oh, and also the Donald Trump was there as the Apprentice. Right. So, like, it's a cast of characters.

[Bobby Bones]

Was it Z100?

[John Foreman]

Yes. Yeah, yeah. Z100. And so I remember walking on stage with just an acoustic guitar and. And playing meant to live on the acoustic guitar and having the entire Madison Square Guardian Garden singing along with me. And that was a moment where I thought, wow, they all know this song. That's incredible. And those are moments that I feel like that is why I do what I do. Whether it's an arena or 14 people backstage or it could be. I do after shows where the show will finish and I'll go to the parking lot in the back and send out a tweet or Instagram and say, hey, let's keep the night going, where multiple people are all singing the same thing. When I was in high school, going to the punk show or church or wherever, it felt like, oh, I resonate with this. I feel like I belong somewhere. And in that moment at msg, it felt like, oh, I'm a part of something bigger.

[Bobby Bones]

Resonating is interesting. I just got off a call where I was being interviewed about an artist that's killing it right now.

[John Foreman]

And.

[Bobby Bones]

And they're like, why do you think she's making it? And I said, well, first, her songs are good, and also the people she wrote with and sonic. And I said, you can have all 11 things, though, and it still not work. If you could predict it, if you could predict what worked, I think this job would be a lot easier, I said, because I know I could list all 11 of these things that I just said that's working for her that other people have done. And for some reason, it did not work. I said, but you know what? Funny you said that. You said, but you know why it's working is because it resonates with people. Like, people either hear stories of themselves or somebody they care about or root for. Like, there's something that they're connecting to this artist's music and this artist's song. And that was literally the conversation that I had with the Wall Street Journal that was talking about music. And it's such a. An odd thing because, again, you can do everything right and it's still not connect.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

And then you could do everything wrong and it connect like freaking crazy.

[John Foreman]

Yes.

[Bobby Bones]

Because it would be like a video going viral that someone is just like crappily shooting and holding up versus Hugh

[John Foreman]

Banks or she bang William Hung. I think that's a great example where you're like, okay, so why is that the song that everyone wants to hear right now?

[Bobby Bones]

And if you could predict it or if you were good enough to just do it every time, you would.

[Liberty Mutual Advertiser]

Would.

[Bobby Bones]

But really, you can't.

[John Foreman]

Right.

[Bobby Bones]

There's no way to produce the perfect from the beginning. There's no way to produce the perfect song.

[John Foreman]

Well, because I think imperfections need to be there. I think that's where the human component comes in. Like, I resonate with something that feels human to me. And to be human, to air is to human. Right. So to be human. So we think, like, okay, so. So we're looking. I'm looking at Miles Davis Kind of Blue. It's a perfect album.

[Bobby Bones]

Hold that record up. This is a segment we do work and we donate all these records eventually. So we have people bring in records that mean a lot to them. And you've brought in Miles Davis Kind of Blue. Why'd you bring that in?

[John Foreman]

Okay, so this is my favorite album. I think it's a perfect album. But it is a deeply human record because you have these incredible artists, you know, masters of their craft, playing the song for the first or the second time. Most of the songs on here are first or second takes, and I think that's where humanity comes in. I have all these conversations with my friends that play jazz. They talk about the bell curve, where you have at the beginning, you're so excited about the song. Your interest, your human connection with the song is at a peak, but your aptitude to play the song is pretty low. These guys, not so much. But maybe the second take, third take, fourth take, your aptitude gets better and better. You know, it better and better. So you now 10th take in. It's rote, it's all mapped out. But your interest and your human connection with the song has gone down because you've done it 10 times. You just are kind of bored. So like, usually like the fifth or sixth take, you're like, okay, or fourth. It depends on what's happening. But I think that's when I. When I hear a perfect album, I want to feel like there's humans that are making the music, you know, because that's what resonates with me is the humanity. And this, that's. That's what I feel like in this. What's perfect about it is that it's the first or second take, you feel them kind of, you feel the song unfolding and it's. Nothing is forced about it.

[Bobby Bones]

How did you start listening to Miles Davis?

[John Foreman]

I played trumpet in junior high and so, yeah, I think this is a unique album though, in the jazz world. I mean, I think it's the most. The best selling jazz album of all time. So it definitely not only resonated with me, but with a lot of people. But I think it is. You know, you talk about a feeling that you had in Japan. Music is almost that thing for a lot of us where it's like a smell, where it takes you somewhere. And this album takes me to a place that I want to go again and again. It's a serene place that feels tranquil, it feels human, but there's space for me there to, you know, for my own thoughts to unfold. A lot of jazz, incredible though it may be, is so filled with notes and things that are flying by you that you really have to pay attention. And this is an album where it just kind of lets you drift again. We're back to the ocean, but maybe you're just kind of letting it take you where it goes and you feel comfortable there. The Bobby cast. We'll be right back.

[Lost Concert Goer]

We're lost and the concert starts soon. I wanted to get there early. I'm gonna ask that man for direction. Hi there. We're trying to get to the amphitheater.

[Helpful Local]

Well, you're going to take a left at the old oak tree at this here road. Nah, I'm just kidding. Let me get my phone out.

[Lost Concert Goer]

How is there signal out here?

[Helpful Local]

T Mobile and US Cellular are coming together. So the network out here is huge. We get the same great signal as the city, saving a boatload with benefits. And there's a five year price guarantee, too. Okay, here's the turn.

[Lost Concert Goer]

Actually, can you pull up the wait to a T Mobile store?

[T Mobile/US Cellular Advertiser]

America's best network just got bigger. Switch to T Mobile today and get built in benefits the other guys leave out. Plus our five year price guarantee. And now T Mobile is available at US Cellular stores in Hermiston. Best mobile network based on analysis by Oklo Speed test intelligence data. Second half of 2025. Bigger network. The combination of T Mobile's and US Cellular's network footprints will enhance the T Mobile network's coverage price guarantee on talk text and data exclusions like taxes and fees apply. See t mobile.com for details.

[Liberty Mutual Advertiser]

And Doug, there's nowhere I wouldn't go to help someone customize and save on car insurance with Liberty Mutual. Even if it means sitting front row at a comedy show.

[Podcast Host]

Hey, everyone, check out this guy and his bird. What is this, your first date?

[Bobby Bones]

Oh, no.

[Liberty Mutual Advertiser]

We help people customize and save on car insurance with Liberty Mutual Together. We're married. Me to a human, him to a bird.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, the bird looks out of your league.

[Liberty Mutual Advertiser]

Anyways, Only pay for what you [e-mail] Liberty.

[John Foreman]

Liberty.

[Podcast Host]

Liberty.

[John Foreman]

Liberty.

[Podcast Host]

On the Serving Pancakes podcast, conversations about volleyball go beyond the court. Today we have a little best friend compatibility test. Okay, how long have we been best friends for? Since the day we met. As the League1 volleyball season heads towards its final stretch, there's no better time to tune in. We really are like yin and yang. Vodka and tequila. You'll hear unfiltered Analysis, behind the scenes stories and conversations with leaders making an impact across the sport. Today we have Logan Lanecki. I feel like our fan base, place in general is very connected. Just like a comforting feeling getting to play at home. Whether you're following the final push of love season or just love the game, serving pancakes brings you closer to the action and the people shaping the future of volleyball. Jordan Thompson had that microphone. Oh, God forbid we make mistakes or cuss at our coach like one time or two times. Open your free iHeartradio app search serving Pancakes and listen. Now this has been serving pancakes. And we'll catch you on the flip side.

[John Foreman]

Okay.

[Podcast Host]

Presented by Capital One, founding partner of iHeart Women's Sports.

[John Foreman]

This is the Bobby cast.

[Bobby Bones]

Flea also played the trumpet from Chili Peppers.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

And he just did a jazz record.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

And he talked about how nervous he was and how after all those 40 years playing with Chili Peppers at the highest level, that he still felt like he did not have it in him to pull off a successful jazz record that would be respected.

[John Foreman]

Yeah. And I mean, imposter syndrome is at every level. Right. Where you're always like, I don't know, maybe, I'm not sure. But when you delve into jazz, that's when you know there's layers of mastery and everyone can see right through it. If you're faking it, you know, whatever

[Bobby Bones]

happened with the guy that said we're dropping switch foot.

[John Foreman]

So he. Oh, man.

[Bobby Bones]

Cause it turned out bad decision.

[John Foreman]

Yeah. So after we sold 2 million copies, he brought us back over and took a picture and talked about artist development and all of these things.

[Bobby Bones]

Of course he did.

[John Foreman]

But it was this thing where I don't, like, even now, I don't have any ill will, or I think he was trying his best. I think that's a tough position to be in, that I don't want his job. And. And you can't change one thing without changing everything. So I love the fact that I get to make music now. I mean, we've done so many dumb things as a band. We've signed record deals. The very first record deal we signed as a band gave us $7,000 every record for our entire publishing. So $7,000 per album for publishing. That was for the first six albums. So, I mean, these are things that you look back on and you're like, oh, that's a horrible financial decision. We had a lawyer look at it, found out he's actually was also doing the legal stuff. But all these things, you can either be bitter and like, ugh Disgruntled. Think about all the numbers. Or you can say no. I mean, I love where I live. I love I get to talk about music with you. We got to talk about Miles Davis. And none of this would happen if we hadn't assigned that deal. I mean, sure, maybe a different deal, maybe I meet a different woman, maybe, but you can't change one thing without changing everything. So I'm trying to be content and fully present to the moment I'm in.

[Bobby Bones]

Did you feel the pressure with Dare you to Move after Meant To Live? Was that, oh my God, we got one. And it was a crazy journey to get one.

[John Foreman]

Yeah, well, the funny thing. Okay, so here's a funny story about Meant to Live and Dare youe To Move. Dare youe to Move appeared on the album before that in Switchfoot's catalog, which is an album called Learning to Breathe. And that was a song that we thought, wow, this is such a beautiful song. We're gonna play it first on the ALB and. But it was the same kind of thing where the record label we were on at the time was like, yeah, pretty good song. Then nothing happened with it. But it took, you know, we were like, we still think it's a great song when we were going to put it on another album. And so we put it on this one beautiful letdown. And that's when people thought it was a great song. So. But it is that thing where perspective is. It changes everything, right? So like people will say, well, it's not a hit like Meant to Live or Dare you to Move. And in the back of my mind I'm like, well, those aren't hits either. Songs that people thought weren't hits. And what is a hit? I think, you know, ultimately, again, we're talking about resonance. So it's like, well, what moves you? If it moves you? Then go like, we just came out with a single, wake up Mr. Crow. And it, it's all the things that maybe you would say, hey, this is not where music's at. But our goal was to resonate with that 14 year old kid who picked up a guitar and started playing Zeppelin. We were like, let's make that album. And so then it becomes kind of irrelevant what anyone says, because you feel it from here.

[Bobby Bones]

The album comes out in June.

[John Foreman]

That's correct. 6. 26. 26.

[Bobby Bones]

Is there a meaning behind that or just remember the date.

[John Foreman]

We came up with all sorts of meanings once we found out what the date was. Yeah, yeah. Reverse engineer. Oh, yeah. Lots of meanings. Yeah, yeah. 13 lucky 13 double it. And two. Yeah. It's a palindrome, all of it. Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

It's been five years, huh? Since.

[John Foreman]

It's been a long time. Yeah. We came out with the record. The last record we made was recorded like. Like the height of COVID There's so much tension and I mean, the world has. The tension is still there. But I felt like this album

[Bobby Bones]

feels

[John Foreman]

like as a band, you try on all sorts of different jackets. You're like, oh, this feels good. I like this. And as a songwriter, you're always looking for new places. Like a traveler. Right. This album feels like it's a return to home. Where you think, oh, this jacket feels nice. I'm comfortable in this. And again, that. Having the compass of. Well, what's gonna make that 14 year old kid want to pick up the guitar? Let's make that record.

[Bobby Bones]

Not the same at all. But your new single. I really like Stars from you guys. Yes, to me they feel a bit similar. And again, not the same. Not saying they're the same. This is, you know, I'm a moron. But like, that song kind of made me feel like Stars made me feel.

[John Foreman]

Yes, it does have a similar. They're both drop D and they both have a similar movement in the melody that's presented on the guitar. I totally agree. Oh, good, good, good. And we even thought about, like, I want to make an intro that has one as the intro and then you go into the other. I think that'd be really fun.

[Bobby Bones]

Ah, good. I love when I'm nodding, so.

[John Foreman]

No, you're not. And actually that particular song is a motif that. That riff that appears in different forms. There's an upside down version of it in a different song, and then it comes back at it again. It's kind of feels like. Like an intentional thread to weave through the whole record.

[Bobby Bones]

Are you a coffee guy?

[John Foreman]

I love coffee.

[Bobby Bones]

I'm trying to get there.

[John Foreman]

Okay.

[Bobby Bones]

I hate coffee.

[John Foreman]

Do you like tea?

[Bobby Bones]

Sweet tea.

[John Foreman]

Okay.

[Bobby Bones]

Only you.

[John Foreman]

I mean, I love it. You're hitting all the boxes. Like, you know, like, it's just. I feel like we're on the opposite side on a lot of things. Like, let's go to the beach. No, let's have some coffee. No, let's have some sweet tea. I love that. That's so good.

[Bobby Bones]

I have been trying to will myself into liking coffee.

[John Foreman]

Okay.

[Bobby Bones]

Because I do understand why people like coffee.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

I just. It just does not taste good to me.

[John Foreman]

Do you like. Okay, let's go back. Do you like coffee shops?

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah, I Like a vibe of a coffee shop especially. I like the music in a coffee shop.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

I like coffee house radio.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

I like all of that. I like everything.

[John Foreman]

Like pastries all. Okay.

[Bobby Bones]

I like everything about coffee except the coffee.

[John Foreman]

Okay, that's fair. It's kind of like me with smoking. Like I love the idea of stepping outside and breathing for like five minutes couple times a day and, and just hanging with somebody and talking. I just don't like the idea of, you know, smoking, but I love the, you know. So I feel like this is the same, same concept.

[Bobby Bones]

I'm trying to drink coffee to make myself like it. I just can't do it.

[John Foreman]

Well, is there. Have you tried like kombucha or maybe mate. Okay.

[Bobby Bones]

And I love kombucha.

[John Foreman]

Could you disguise it? Like put some kombucha in like a coffee cup and just.

[Bobby Bones]

But then I feel like I'm not doing it. Like if I'm doing all that work because I'm, I'm trying to do it so I socially can just while everybody's drinking coffee. Because I've never, I've never had alcohol ever. I've never tasted alcohol. So since I can't do that, I never did bars and stuff.

[John Foreman]

Okay.

[Bobby Bones]

Well, I'm older now. I do coffee.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

But nobody, I just, I can't get

[John Foreman]

there coffee, less coffee.

[Bobby Bones]

But again, it's like non alcoholic beer.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

I don't want to drink non coffee coffee. The point of coffee is like for that I just didn't know if you could. If you were a coffee guy or not.

[John Foreman]

I love coffee. I really do. And I think coffee, coffee. Like when I show up in a new place, I look on Yelp for coffee shops and there's usually like two or three in a section of town. And that's where I go. And it feels like coffee community conversation. I like all that culture. It all feels right there.

[Bobby Bones]

Love all that. Except the coffee part.

[John Foreman]

Except for the coffee. Well, yeah. I mean you can like kind of second hand coffee and I do it

[Bobby Bones]

and that's mostly what I do.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

And I can even do like an espresso shot. Really? In something. Like it needs to be dumped over a cake. I need a whole cake with one shot. Done.

[John Foreman]

That's my dog. She's like, you know, she'll have like the whatever the latte with four donuts and everything.

[Bobby Bones]

That's exactly how I have to. Do you have kids? How many kids?

[John Foreman]

I have two. I have a 14 year old daughter and a 7 year old son. Your story of coffee Reminds me of Vegemite. I was convinced I was going to move to Australia and go to college there. And I was like, well, their version of a pbj and I'm going to be on a budget because I'm in Australia is Vegemite sandwich. Could never figure out how to like Vegemite.

[Bobby Bones]

It's pretty disgusting.

[John Foreman]

And so that's why I never went to Australia, you know.

[Bobby Bones]

You never went?

[John Foreman]

I, I never studied there.

[Bobby Bones]

Oh, got it. Kept you out of Australia. There's so many things.

[John Foreman]

No, yeah, I can't, I can't stand it. Yeah, no, I, I went there as an exchange student when I was in high school. And then I'm like, dude, I'm coming back. I'm gonna fall in love with Vegemite night. And. Yeah, never worked out. Let's take a quick pause for a message from our sponsor.

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[Helpful Local]

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[Lost Concert Goer]

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[Helpful Local]

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[Lost Concert Goer]

Actually, can you pull up the way to a T Mobile store?

[T Mobile/US Cellular Advertiser]

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[Podcast Host]

With Verbil's last minute deals, you can save over $50 on your spring getaway. So whether it's a mountain escape city break or a week at the beach, there's still time to get Great this discounts book your next day Now. Average savings $72. Select homes only on the serving pancakes podcast, conversations about volleyball go beyond the court. Today we have a little best friend compatibility test. Okay, how long have we been best friends for? Since the day we met. As the League1 volleyball season heads towards its final stretch. There's no better time to tune in. We really are like yin and yang, vodka and tequila. You'll hear unfiltered analysis, behind the scenes stories and conversations with leaders making an impact across the sport. Today we have Logan Ledneck, and I feel like our fan base in general is very connected. Just like a comforting feeling getting to play at home. Whether you're following the final push of love season or just love the game, serving pancakes brings you closer to the action and the people shaping the future of volleyball. Jordan Thompson had that microphone out. God forbid we make mistakes or cuss at our coach. Like, when talking. Open your free iHeartradio app, search serving Pancakes and listen. Now, this has been serving pancakes. And we'll catch you on the flip side.

[John Foreman]

Okay.

[Podcast Host]

Presented by Capital One, founding partner of iHeart Women's Sports.

[John Foreman]

And we're back on the Bobbycast.

[Bobby Bones]

I was asking about your kids, if you want, if they love music.

[John Foreman]

They do. And I. So my friend is a. An artist, visual artist. And his definition of an artist is someone who appreciates beauty visually, can take it in and appreciate it because he says, you know, replicating something with your hands or creating something that's a form of art, but even just taking it in, that's the highest form of artistry. And I feel like the same is true with music because I have both my kids, they love it. They take it in and they'll play different instruments. But I think too about kids that have autism or on the spectrum in different ways that may never be able to replicate a song or create it with their fingers, but the music moves them in ways that maybe doesn't move anyone else in the room. So, yeah, they love music and they feel it on that level. I think most kids do.

[Bobby Bones]

I'm in the. I ask about your kids. We had a baby like two weeks ago. First baby.

[John Foreman]

Congrats.

[Bobby Bones]

Thank you.

[John Foreman]

That's incredible.

[Bobby Bones]

And so now I'm just deciding what scientifically I want to do to her to make her like, you know, it's a science experiment.

[John Foreman]

Yes. Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

And so, like, what do I want to make her like?

[John Foreman]

Well, I will say this. You stack the deck. I had all the playlists up until like 5 or 6 or 7. You hold all the cards. So, like, I would even take my daughter to record stores before she could talk. There's a space, there's a spot called Lou's Records. All the records that you want, right. And I would pick. I'd go through and pick albums that I wanted. I'd say, okay, you want Miles Davis or do you want, you know, this. This Bob Dylan record? And it. Hold them up, both up to her. And she would be like. And I'd be like, okay, put this one down. And then I'd pick up a David Bowie record. Which one do you want? And so ultimately, she would pick what we would get, and then we'd go home and put it on and we'd listen to it. And that was kind of one of our traditions. And the other thing, I mean, with Spotify or anything, you are seeding the field. You're saying, this is music and it can be whatever you think good music is. And that's what she's going to have as her foundational element of what she loves, which is pretty awesome. Awesome.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah. I'm looking forward to that. I'm not gonna get her into coffee, though.

[John Foreman]

No. Coffee, Yeah. I mean, so she's gonna be like, getting coffee in the back alley. Like, you know, my dad doesn't let. No, I'm doing this. But yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

Two final questions for you. So talking about music, like, what. What was it that you listened to as a kid that you still find that if you're putting music on, you still turn it on because it makes you feel comfortable.

[John Foreman]

Oh. So Aretha was. My mom and dad are both musicians, and so music was always on a lot of records. And my mom had a. Like, mostly male artists, looking back. And my mom didn't really tolerate too many female singers. She was very particular. She loved Motown. But so Aretha was one of the voices that felt like, you know, almost like a mother kind of tone. For me, it just felt like, you know, that's what heaven sounds like. So Aretha feels like my childhood.

[Bobby Bones]

Final question. Well, let me say this first, before we get to the final question. We mentioned it already. The new album, Forever now, comes out June 26. There's a lot of reasons for that date. Like we talked about.

[John Foreman]

Yes.

[Bobby Bones]

Wake up. Mr. Crow is out now. And I'm not crazy for thinking that felt a little bit like stars, at least to me.

[John Foreman]

Yes. Made me feel.

[Bobby Bones]

I was nervous about. I was nervous about saying I feel it.

[John Foreman]

Okay, good.

[Bobby Bones]

Thank you. Thank you. And I'd like for you to be honest with you.

[John Foreman]

I could show you why it feels similar.

[Bobby Bones]

Please do grab.

[John Foreman]

That's tuned.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah.

[John Foreman]

Okay. So the. Yeah, so this is. They're both in drop D, which is definitely like the 14 year old tuning, where you're like, yeah, 14 year old. I love that. Sounds heavy. So stars it has that. Right. And then the. So it has a drop d droning. And they're also very similar BPMs, and they have that a lot. A lot of the dissonance. So, yeah, they're brothers or sisters. I don't know the gender, but they're

[Bobby Bones]

one of those two at least strong cousins. Yeah, I have double cousins. Ever heard of that?

[John Foreman]

Ooh, is that an Arkansas thing or. I don't know what double cousins are. I'm sorry.

[Bobby Bones]

So my mom and her sister. Two sisters. Married my biological dad and his brother.

[John Foreman]

No way.

[Bobby Bones]

So two sisters married two brothers. So all offspring, we're all doubled up. Like everybody related to me is related to them.

[John Foreman]

So the people that live in the alley behind me when I was writing meant to live. Same thing. They're brothers that married two sisters. Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

So we're almost incest, but not quite.

[John Foreman]

No, no, no Incest. No, not at all.

[Bobby Bones]

No, I agree. I just said almost. The tree goes up with no branches come out, but it's not.

[John Foreman]

Oh, my gosh. But almost feels. Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

You can almost walk off the cliff, but you didn't fall off the cliff and die. That's where we are.

[John Foreman]

Okay. Okay. Yeah, yeah. Almost. Almost. Almost.

[Bobby Bones]

Final question, and please be honest with me here, because I had asked. Hey, I wonder what John's like. Cause I'm always curious of an impression before I get to make my first impression. I like to tell you what that is. Did anybody tell you anything about me coming into this room at all?

[John Foreman]

The only text I received was like five minutes before.

[Bobby Bones]

Did you know you were coming?

[John Foreman]

No. No.

[Bobby Bones]

So you're just stringed. You just follow feet and you came here and you didn't know what you're walking into?

[John Foreman]

Yeah, kind of didn't know. I knew. I was like. I knew you were affiliated with sports and the Dancing with the Stars, and that was kind of it.

[Bobby Bones]

That's hilarious, because that's like my eighth and ninth jobs.

[John Foreman]

Okay. All right.

[Bobby Bones]

So that's what I'm saying. Okay, good. So what.

[John Foreman]

What.

[Bobby Bones]

What information did you have before you walked in here at all?

[John Foreman]

I can read you the text message, if that's okay.

[Bobby Bones]

I hope it's, like, strikingly good looking.

[John Foreman]

It's very attractive.

[Bobby Bones]

Super funny.

[John Foreman]

He smells great.

[Bobby Bones]

Yes, Yes.

[John Foreman]

I don't know why that was relevant, but yeah. Okay. It says for the sake of posterity pretending you've never heard of Bobby Bones for a second. Well known radio host in the country space has a syndicated morning show on iHeartRadio. He's also done some Hosting. He's on American Idol as a coach. One Dancing with the Stars and kind of all over the place. Interview should be fairly straightforward. Hit me up if you have any questions, Chris, and I will see you there shortly. All right. So that was what I knew.

[Bobby Bones]

Do you know what this is on?

[John Foreman]

No.

[Bobby Bones]

Okay, so this is a show on Netflix. Okay, I'm glad.

[John Foreman]

I didn't know.

[Bobby Bones]

By the way, I'm Bobby. Nice to meet you, John.

[John Foreman]

Yeah, great to meet you. I was like, yeah, that sounds fun. I love talking about music and I heard about the vinyl component. I'm like, yeah, that sounds great.

[Bobby Bones]

Did you enjoy this? I.

[John Foreman]

It. Love, loved it.

[Bobby Bones]

Okay.

[John Foreman]

I loved it. I mean, what's not to love? We got to talk about our favorite spots on the planet and Miles Davis.

[Bobby Bones]

Okay.

[John Foreman]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

What I was.

[John Foreman]

You got to teach me some dance moves now.

[Bobby Bones]

No, you don't want that.

[John Foreman]

Okay.

[Bobby Bones]

You will somehow get worse if I teach you anything. Dancing. What I was told was, John is so nice, it's going to blow you away. That was what I was told about you coming in here.

[John Foreman]

Okay.

[Bobby Bones]

When I say that, how does that make you feel?

[John Foreman]

Nice is an interesting adjective. I agree.

[Bobby Bones]

I agree.

[John Foreman]

I appreciate being kind. And yet niceness is actually something I'm trying to figure out, come to terms with.

[Bobby Bones]

Nice doesn't always resonate with me, but I think it was meant in a way of, you're really going to like him because he's a very kind and he'll be generous guy. I think that's what the sentiment was.

[John Foreman]

Yes.

[Bobby Bones]

And met fully. You're the Grand Canyon. You're better than the Grand Canyon. Like I expected. And then, whoa, look at this thing. Like, it was that.

[John Foreman]

Wow. Okay, I'll take it.

[Bobby Bones]

Yes.

[John Foreman]

Like India status. Grand Canyon.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah, for sure.

[John Foreman]

Okay.

[Bobby Bones]

But, yeah, I have trouble with nice because there are people that are nice, but it doesn't feel genuine.

[John Foreman]

Yeah, well. And it's that thing where. Yeah, I think, yeah, there's a lot there. But I think for me, yeah, nice is a strange one. And I think I'm trying to present myself. I want to be kind. I want to be honest. I want to be. And I think sometimes nice can shave off all the. But I'm coming to you with, you know, some scruff. So here we go.

[Bobby Bones]

I've really enjoyed this.

[John Foreman]

I have, too. Thank you for your time.

[Bobby Bones]

This has been awesome. And we talked about the record before you got here. Congratulations. And I'm just a big fan, so. I've been a big fan for a long time. So for me. This is thrilling to be able to sit and spend this time with you and not totally swing and miss on stars.

[John Foreman]

Let's go.

[Bobby Bones]

Yes. Yes. All right. There he is. John, thanks for your time, man.

[John Foreman]

All right. Thank you. Thanks for listening to a Bobbycast production.

[Podcast Host]

This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.