Lots to Say: Combine Measurements and Fmr NFL QB Jordan Palmer

Summary

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The Bobby Bones Show — "Lots to Say: Combine Measurements and Fmr NFL QB Jordan Palmer"

Date: March 4, 2026
Host: Bobby Bones (with Matt Cassel and Kevin)
Featured Guest: Jordan Palmer (Quarterback coach, former NFL QB)

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Episode Overview

This episode dives deep into the often-overhyped world of NFL Combine measurements, discussing how scouting hyper-focuses on "body part measurables" and whether they truly matter for football success. The centerpiece is an insightful interview with renowned quarterback coach Jordan Palmer, who talks through the evolution of QB development, mental resilience, and the reality behind the numbers that dominate draft season. The episode is both informative and lighthearted, featuring anecdotes from Bobby, Matt, and Jordan, and rounded out with current news from the Combine, trade talks, and fan questions.

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Key Discussion Points & Segments

1. The Arms Race: School Facilities and the Culture of Affluence

(02:57–06:09)

• Bobby Bones and Matt Castle marvel at how middle schools in Nashville boast massive, expensive football stadiums, far superior to what even some college and early NFL teams had.
• Matt Castle: "When I got to the pros before, they've redone all these stadiums and it's an arms race in terms of weight room, locker room. They're better than that." (04:15)
• Discussion of local wealth from music, athletes, and medical industries fueling these luxuries.
• Story about Montgomery Bell Academy receiving a $90–100 million endowment, which is "elite for a major university," not just a high school. (06:00)

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2. The Combine and Measurement "Obsession"

(06:09–13:09)

• The hosts poke fun at how every year the NFL Draft Combine zeroes in on measurements like arm length and hand size, often making or breaking a prospect's hype:
  • Highlights from the 2026 Combine: Reuben Bain Jr.'s arm and hand size, Cassius How the Edge from Texas A&M with the shortest arms, and Spencer Fano's borderline tackle arms.
  • Transition of some tackles to guard simply based on half-inch deficits in arm length.
  • Famous historical "small hand" cases: Kenny Pickett (8.5"), Jared Goff, Joe Burrow, Patrick Mahomes, and Kyler Murray.
  • Notable Quote (Matt Castle, 12:11): “Can we just stop talking about hand size and half an inch or a quarter of an inch or anything like that? It really doesn’t matter.”
• Supplemented by a comparison to NBA stars' massive hands (Kawhi Leonard, Shaq, Boban, etc.).

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3. Jordan Palmer Interview: The Reality of QB Development, Resilience, and the Process

(15:07–38:51; primary interview 15:07–38:51, with mental performance focus at 28:47–31:54, technical focus at 38:51–46:21)

Jordan’s Background & Coaching Philosophy

• Palmer details his business model (retainer-based, year-round coaching), focus on holistic QB development, and team of specialists (biomechanics, physical therapy, mental therapy).
• Works with elite prospects and established pros (Sam Darnold, Mahomes, Josh Allen, Trevor Lawrence, etc.).
• Mentoring strategy includes resilience, finding personal purpose, and handling adversity as the core pillars for a successful career.

Insights on Adversity & “Resilience Muscle”

• Sam Darnold’s up-and-down journey used as an example:
  • "The muscle that gets stronger when everybody’s booing you and roasting you on social…it’s the same muscle you use when you have to block out all the noise as the number one seed." (20:59)
• The hardest NFL trait to evaluate is how a player handles adversity, which can only be tested, not measured.
• “The inevitability of success and adversity. How well you handle those two things is actually how good you are.” (24:33)

Mental Coaching for QBs

• Palmer’s players undergo a 10-week program with therapist Tom Rodriguez, focusing on purpose, core truths, and overcoming “FOPO” — Fear Of Other People’s Opinions.
• “If you can’t say it in 25 words or less, it ain’t clear to you.” (29:13)
• The aim is not to block out outside negativity, but to be grounded in who you are.

Combine vs. Pro Day: What Really Matters?

• “At the combine you can’t help or hurt yourself that much. At pro day, you can’t help yourself a ton either — but you can hurt yourself if you lay an egg.” (31:54)
• Pro days are mainly to confirm what teams believe, not to shoot up the draft board, but a disaster there gets noticed.

This Draft Class: Depth, Experience, and Nussmeier’s Oblique

• Palmer looks past draft rankings: “I don’t look at the internet here. I just have been doing this forever. I know the people writing this stuff, and I know they don’t know what they’re talking about.” (35:18)
• He explains that what matters is not where you’re picked, but whether you can play and develop: “You don’t have to be sick to get better.” (38:51)

Evolution of QB Mechanics and Tech

• Modern biomechanics have revolutionized QB development, finally catching up to baseball and golf.
• Palmer emphasizes removing subjective instruction in favor of science-backed movement analysis.
• “None of those things [old coaching cues] mean anything. Like, your doctor wouldn’t use those terms... We've kind of removed subjectivity from this. You either did it or you didn’t.” (43:35–43:50)

Memorable Exchange

• On whether a really rich parent could hire him for youth coaching:
  • “They can hire Jared on my team… If they’re really, really rich, I got people that take their planes out here.” (46:21)

On the Annual Charity Flag Football Event

• Palmer describes his innovative charity flag football tournament, which has raised nearly $9M for 90+ charities, with superstars and celebrities playing:
  • “The margin of what goes actually back to the charities is staggering. Doesn't exist [at most events].” (47:44–51:14)

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4. Combine Results: Speed, Athleticism & Overreaction

(56:03–59:24)

• Recap: The 2026 Combine set speed records across almost all positions:
  • Defensive backs: 4.44s, wide receivers: 4.44s, running backs: 4.45s, linebackers: 4.55s, tight ends: 4.63s.
  • Bobby marvels over Arkansas QB Taylor Green’s record athleticism (4.36s 40, 43.5" vertical, furthest broad jump for a QB).
• Discussion of whether freak athleticism at the Combine translates to NFL QB success, reflecting on Anthony Richardson’s rise in 2023.

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5. NFL Current Events & Mock Draft Talk

(62:31–65:44)

• Texans trade for RB David Montgomery from Detroit; analysis of backfield depth needs and draft capital exchanged.
• Patriots minute: Kevin retracts previous pessimism — optimistic about new coach, Drake Maye, future draft focus on WR and lines.
• Quick humor about “short-arm” prospects and positional stereotypes in NFL draft rooms.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• Matt Castle (on the overfocus on measurements):

  • “Can we just stop talking about hand size and half an inch or a quarter of an inch or anything like that? It really doesn’t matter.” (12:11)

• Jordan Palmer (on player development and adversity):

  • “The muscle that gets stronger when everybody’s booing you and roasting you on social and has counted you out...that’s the same muscle you’re going to use when you head into the playoffs as the number one seed.” (20:59)

• Jordan Palmer (on modern QB coaching):

  • “None of those things mean anything. Like, your doctor wouldn’t use those terms... We've kind of removed subjectivity from this. You either did it or you didn’t do it.” (43:50)

• On his retainer QB coaching business:

  • “I don’t have a pitch deck... You don’t have to be sick to get better.” (38:51)

• Bobby Bones, joking about measurement talk:

  • "It's just like 2 T-Rexes fighting it out.” (07:33)

• Jordan Palmer, on unusually unique QB mechanics:

  • “My mind goes to Philip Rivers immediately. I can't break down what he does. I don't know how to ...simulate it.” (37:27)

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Segment Timestamps

• Opening and School Facilities Discussion: 02:57–06:09
• Combine Measurement Obsession: 06:09–13:09
• NBA/NFL Hand Size Comparison: 10:14–14:25
• Jordan Palmer Interview Start: 15:07
  • Philosophy & Relationships: 15:07–18:57
  • On Adversity/Sam Darnold: 18:57–21:55
  • Resilience & Traits Scouts Value: 21:55–24:36
  • Mental Health & Purpose for QBs: 28:47–31:54
  • Combine vs. Pro Day: 31:29–33:38
  • Thoughts on the Draft Class: 34:56–37:17
  • Mechanics, Biomechanics & Tech: 38:51–46:21
  • Coaching for Rich Kids & Charity Event: 46:21–51:14
• Combine Recap & Standout Athletes: 56:03–59:44
• Current Events & Patriots Fan Segment: 62:31–65:44

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Takeaways for Listeners

• Combine metrics can distract from what matters: Actual football skill, resilience, and mental approach outweigh minute measurement differences in real-life impact.
• QB development is holistic and year-round: Modern coaching at the elite level involves biomechanics, mental resilience, and life purpose, not just technique.
• Pro Day is a validation, not a “riser” event: You can hurt your draft stock, but rarely help it much; real evaluation happens on film and in interviews.
• Adversity reveals true potential: How a player responds to setbacks is often the difference between a bust and a long NFL career.

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(For more, revisit segments 15:07–51:14 for Jordan Palmer's deep-dive on modern QB development and mental preparation, or the opening section for a fun discussion on football culture and affluence in school athletics.)

Transcript

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[Matt Castle]

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[Jordan Palmer]

done, get ready to kick back, relax

[Matt Castle]

and enjoy the game. Shop in store or online now and earn your sundae with help from Lowe's, official partner of the NFL.

[Bobby Bones]

Lots to say with Bobby Bones and Matt Castle is a production of the NFL and iHeart podcasts.

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We got lots to say. We got lots to say. We're glad you're here and we hope you stay. Cause we got Lots to say. Yeah, we got lots to say. And here's Bobby and Matt.

[Bobby Bones]

Hey, everybody. Welcome. I went on a walk yesterday with my wife. She's very pregnant, and so we're doing lots of walking. And there is a football. I'll say stadium. It's not so much stadium, but it's a big football field with a track around it and some bleachers. At this Oak Hill school.

[Matt Castle]

Yes, the middle school.

[Bobby Bones]

Why do they have such a big football stadium for sixth graders?

[Matt Castle]

I have no idea.

[Bobby Bones]

It's unbelievable, dude.

[Matt Castle]

And it only goes sixth grade.

[Bobby Bones]

No, it's unbelievable.

[Matt Castle]

It's unbelievable.

[Bobby Bones]

It's an awesome. Yeah, everything about it is amazing. And my wife says to me, because we're looking at it, and I was just, like, appreciating how fresh it was, how new it was, how the lines are painted new. I was like, man, that Phil looks so good. She goes, that's only for up to sixth grade. Yeah. Why do they need a stadium that big?

[Jordan Palmer]

I really don't know.

[Matt Castle]

Because I was thinking the same thing. I was going, okay, they've got this incredible stadium, but you're talking about you. I guess they have a fifth and sixth grade football team, but that's like the most incredible facility for fifth and sixth graders that they're not even. They're not even going to move up and get to play on it after sixth grade. They're actually transferring to another school around here, paying more money to go to just as nice facilities.

[Bobby Bones]

I feel like it's playing football at Georgia and then going to play for the Arizona Cardinals. You're, like, going down even though you're getting older and going up. You're going to a worse facility.

[Matt Castle]

There's no doubt about it. I mean, these kids are. It's crazy, the amount of money, particularly here in Nashville. When I first got here and saw the proximity of all these schools and the wealth at all these schools and the facilities. I mean, growing up, going to public school in la, our facilities, I'm just gonna be honest with you, were terrible. Absolutely terrible. The weight room was terrible. You go to some of these schools and I'm like, these are 10 times better than what we had in college, than what I had at college at usc. And then in some cases when I. Even when I got to the pros before, they've redone all these stadiums and they've. It's an arms race in terms weight room, locker room. They're better than that. Like, when you go to NBA over there and look at that. Have you seen Their facilities. Oh, my gosh.

[Bobby Bones]

Do you think it's because the money in this town. There's a lot of artists in town, like massive country artists, music artists and athletes in this town. Do you think that's generally where it's from?

[Matt Castle]

I think some of it's from that. I think that it's also here in just Nashville itself and the medical aspect of it.

[Bobby Bones]

Like, there's a lot of money there. I don't know anybody in that business.

[Matt Castle]

There's a lot of money there. There's a lot of ex athletes here. It's just. I mean, it is a very affluent area. So, I mean, check this out. I did hear that NBA is.

[Bobby Bones]

What's NBA?

[Matt Castle]

It's an all boys school. Seventh grade, Montgomery Bell Academy.

[Bobby Bones]

Do they call it NBA though? Is. I just.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah, that's what they call it.

[Bobby Bones]

Got it. Got it.

[Matt Castle]

And there was somebody that had passed away that went to school there and left them. I think it was 90 to $100 million to go to their endowment that he had. No, no kids or anything like that.

[Jordan Palmer]

Wow.

[Matt Castle]

And he donated that to the school in his will. And I was like, okay, that'll help your endowment and help the health of your school and everything else to go along with it.

[Bobby Bones]

That would be elite for a major university to get.

[Matt Castle]

Yes.

[Bobby Bones]

Much less a high school.

[Matt Castle]

A high school.

[Bobby Bones]

Well, I saw that. That was pretty cool.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah, it's pretty cool.

[Bobby Bones]

I do have a lot of. Because now that we just had the combine and we're going to the pro days and we're gonna talk to Jordan Palmer coming up. It's all about little body parts on players. It's always every year. Oh, yeah.

[Matt Castle]

Short arms, short hands. The hands aren't big enough. They're not tall in stature. It's every little thing that they can dissect to bring a negative. Something negative toward the player. That's what they do. And that's why I always think in a lot of these cases, you can help yourself by the way you run, by the way you jump. But they're also critiquing what all the little details of trying to find something that takes away from the player. And I'm like, this isn't even real football. These are guys in shorts and in track shoes running their facets that they've been training for. They're elite athletes, there's no doubt about it. But turn on the football film and watch how they play the actual game of football. That probably will tell you a little bit more than just what we see at some of these combines, I have

[Bobby Bones]

three they're talking about this year. And then I have over the past 10 years some of those that have been noteworthy. So this year Reuben Bain Jr. Is a big one in the edge of Miami. He measured at 30 and 7 8th inch arms and 9 and an 8th inch hands. So skepticism there that his arms aren't long enough.

[Matt Castle]

Right.

[Bobby Bones]

But just imagine if Bane and Will Campbell went at each other. Small arms on small arms.

[Kevin]

I knew he was coming in conversation.

[Bobby Bones]

Then we're back to even. It's just like 2T Rex is fighting it out.

[Matt Castle]

Hey, now it's even.

[Bobby Bones]

And he's awesome.

[Matt Castle]

He also ran a what?

[Bobby Bones]

Oh, I don't know.

[Matt Castle]

I was like a four. Four, right? A four.

[Bobby Bones]

I did all small body parts.

[Matt Castle]

Small body parts.

[Bobby Bones]

If I had to go to the combine and they measured all my body parts. Shoot.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

Cassius, how the edge from Texas A and M, he had short arms, the shortest of any edge rusher at 30 and a quarter inches. And that was met because I saw him talking about it where he was saying that he knows that is something they'll pay attention to but that his technique can go up against anyone in college and even in the pros. And that's what he's really worked on. Another one is the tackle at Utah. I think you say his name. Fano. Spencer Fano. He's 32 and an eighth, which is 33 is the standard as far as the standard for the offensive tackle.

[Matt Castle]

32 and an eighth.

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Yeah.

[Matt Castle]

Oh, gosh, it's too bad.

[Bobby Bones]

And you know what happens whenever an offensive tackle has short arms? They go, looks like he'll be a guard. I mean that's usually the first thing.

[Matt Castle]

100% that is. Or, or if you're a little bit undersized at the tackle position so you're 315 instead of something else or 310. They're like, oh, well, I mean he, he's just not tall enough. He's not big enough. It's not this. And we'll move him to guard, fatten him up a little bit and they'll be fine.

[Bobby Bones]

Fatten him up like it's a turkey. Yeah.

[Matt Castle]

Oh, come on, boy. Have your protein shakes.

[Bobby Bones]

Will Campbell. Last year his arms were 32 and 5/8. So you know the 33, 34 inch benchmark.

[Matt Castle]

And again, what were the longest arms?

[Bobby Bones]

I don't have that.

[Jordan Palmer]

I didn't do big body parts.

[Matt Castle]

I would love to see from. You're talking about elite tackles. The Trent Williams of the world Some of these guys, the Joe Thomases, what were their measurables, and what did that look like compared to. Are we talking about 3 inches longer? Are we talking about 2 inches longer? Because it's always fascinating to me that 33 is seen as the kind of the cutoff. But these guys are less than an inch from being at that point or a quarter inch or a quarter of an inch.

[Bobby Bones]

If you're 32 and 5/8, they're going up. Short arms.

[Matt Castle]

Short arms.

[Kevin]

Even the longest one on mill Wagner at 34 and a half, that's the longest arm ever.

[Bobby Bones]

And it's just one of them. The other one was a 31 running all crooked.

[Matt Castle]

I always tell my wife, the inch doesn't matter.

[Bobby Bones]

I do have small hands now over the years. Kenny Pickett from 2022, I think that to me, is the most notorious case of small hands. He measured in at 8.5 inches. The THR for quarterback hands is. Do you know it?

[Jordan Palmer]

Nine.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah. I thought you were going to nine.

[Matt Castle]

I was going to nine for sure, but I didn't know if it was nine and three fours.

[Jordan Palmer]

Yeah.

[Matt Castle]

Or not. Because we're really specific on these measurables.

[Bobby Bones]

He was drafted at number 20 overall, which, by the way, Kevin, would you look up Kawhi Leonard's hands? Because I was watching. It was an exhibit with basketballs. And they had all of these great players in the NBA now and their hand print on the ball, and they all had massive hands. But Kawhi's hands made even the LeBron's hands look small.

[Jordan Palmer]

Really?

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah. We'll get to the Kawhi hands in a second. But Jared Goff in 2016, his was right at 9 inches. The Browns coach, Hugh Jackson, questioned out loud if someone with small hands could succeed in cold, wet conditions in Cleveland. Goff then appeared to miraculously grow his hands by an eighth of an inch on pro day.

[Matt Castle]

You know what? There are these little things that can happen when your strength and conditioning coaches are kind of helping facilitate. And they're taking these. These measurements of your hands and this and the other and spread it out. Yeah, you get a little extra. I mean, Diego Pavia, they said. And the thing was, what, six foot in their program at Vandy?

[Bobby Bones]

Oh, yeah.

[Matt Castle]

And then his measurable, or his measurement was 5, 10.

[Bobby Bones]

I don't think it was. I think it was 5, 9 and some. Some extra.

[Matt Castle]

Really?

[Bobby Bones]

I think so. Looking back at, like, they're doing them a solid.

[Matt Castle]

They're saying, yeah, we're gonna put you at six foot, whatever.

[Bobby Bones]

You want bud Joe Burrow's hand size? Now, this is back in 2020 draft number one, regardless. But they said that he had tiny hands. Patrick Mahomes, he had nine and a quarter. But the headlines were, well, Patrick Mahomes, small hands. Tank his NFL draft stock.

[Matt Castle]

I love it.

[Bobby Bones]

Kyler Murray. Not just hands, but height.

[Jordan Palmer]

Right.

[Matt Castle]

Just overall stature.

[Bobby Bones]

And you talk about Kyler, I think they were exaggerating his height a bit, especially at Oklahoma.

[Matt Castle]

Right.

[Bobby Bones]

But he had the smallest hands of any of the passers taken in the first round that year, yet posted the lowest fumble rate and highest Qbrookie that season. Drake May's hands, as big as he is, was just nine and an eighth, so right above the line. And Cam Ward was just nine inches.

[Matt Castle]

So can we just stop talking about hand size and half an inch or a quarter of an inch or anything like that? It really doesn't matter.

[Bobby Bones]

Jalen Melro, eight and three fourths.

[Matt Castle]

See, that's the crazy part about this time of year that I find fascinating every single year is there's so many arguments to me made to kind of tear down the player and create skepticism over whether or not he can get it done or if they gives him a reason where if they fail early on. Well, we told you. I mean, his arm length wasn't 33 inches. He's got short arms, and it starts that conversation. Well, the rookie quarterback struggled and he had multiple fumbles. Well, it was because he can't hold onto the ball in cold weather because of his hands. I mean, everybody has obviously different strengths and different physical attributes, but at the end of the day, as I said before, it's, can you play the game of football and play it consistently? And as you just mentioned, all those guys have had a tremendous amount of success.

[Bobby Bones]

What do you got?

[Kevin]

Eleven and a quarter.

[Bobby Bones]

Kwai Leonard.

[Toyota/Uber Eats/Novartis Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Kevin]

Kawhi.

[Jordan Palmer]

Wow.

[Kevin]

Shaq was 12, Bobon is 12.

[Bobby Bones]

And Kawhi, not near the size of those two guys. I'm telling you, when I saw that, his fingers went well beyond even. What? Like, if you looked up LeBron's, what

[Matt Castle]

are the biggest hands in the NBA?

[Kevin]

LeBron is 11.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah, okay, but LeBron is larger than Kawhi, right?

[Kevin]

Yeah, He's, I think, at least an inch or two taller and weighs.

[Matt Castle]

Those guys are freaks of nature.

[Bobby Bones]

Are you asking, like, the largest hands ever in the history of the world?

[Matt Castle]

No. Let's do NFL.

[Bobby Bones]

It's gotta be. If you're guessing, it's gotta be one of these massive offensive tackles, Right. If you're.

[Matt Castle]

You'd have to think so.

[Bobby Bones]

I mean, because unless it's a quarterback, like, you just think.

[Matt Castle]

Because DBs are gonna be smaller.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah, yeah. If you're like Josh Alle or some of these 6, 8, 6, 9 offensive tackles now at this point, Right. Maybe like a nose. Nose guard only. Big 300. But they're not that tall.

[Matt Castle]

They're not.

[Bobby Bones]

So the fingers won't be long.

[Matt Castle]

They got a big hands.

[Bobby Bones]

Big palms.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah, big palms.

[Jordan Palmer]

Big palms.

[Bobby Bones]

Thick, thick palm. Yeah, we Thick palms.

[Matt Castle]

Middle of America palms.

[Kevin]

This is Mo. Ali Cox, a tight end. He's got 11 and 3 quarters.

[Karissa Thompson]

Dang.

[Kevin]

And then DeForest Buckner, same thing.

[Bobby Bones]

I'd put that as my header on Twitter.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah, I've got the biggest 11 and 3/4 fingers.

[Bobby Bones]

Hit me up. We're gonna go over to Jordan Palmer, renowned quarterback coach, former NFL quarterback himself. He's worked with some of the best in the game, like Mahomes and Josh Allen, Trevor Lawrence. You know Jordan.

[Matt Castle]

I do know Jordan very well. I mean, I've known Jordan for a really long time because obviously I went to school with Carson and so I've known him since he was a kid, coming to games, dressing up in these weird outfits and all that stuff. In high school, he actually, when I used to go out and throw sometimes with Carson, he wanted to get a workout and he'd run routes for us when he was younger and all that stuff. He's a great guy, got a great football mind and has really developed into the go to guy to develop these younger quarterbacks today.

[Bobby Bones]

Here he is, Jordan Palmer. All right, one of my favorite guests is Jordan Palmer, who, by the way, Jordan, Matt and I were talking before you came on. You were drafted at a spot before Castle. A whole round before Castle was. We were celebrating that.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah, we were.

[Jordan Palmer]

Well, Bobby, one of the interesting differences between Matt and I is I actually played football in college on the team, like, and stuff, you know, like, I was more versatile.

[Matt Castle]

I was versatile.

[Jordan Palmer]

We both put on uniforms. But then I would. When they say offense, you're up. I would go on the field with my team. And then unfortunately, it flipped when we got to the NFL and legend and had probably multiple beautiful homes at this

[Matt Castle]

point, but that's what I was gonna say.

[Jordan Palmer]

I was totally better than him in college.

[Bobby Bones]

Where are you now? It looks like you're doing something footbally.

[Jordan Palmer]

Very footbally. Yeah. This is kind of the start of March. I'm not on a field right now, but this is the end of draft prep. So my guys just got back from the combine Sunday, we kind of have a week. One of them leaves tomorrow to prepare for their pro days. So first one's the 11th, second one's the 12th and the 20th and the 23rd. So in March is when the pro days. So for those who don't know, the college players go back to their campus, NFL community, the scouts, GMs, coaches, whoever, depending on who they're evaluating, comes back to that school. And I curate and run the pro day, the throwing session for the quarterbacks. It's a scripted workout. So today was kind of day two of that. We spent about a week getting ready for the pro day and then they go back to their schools for a week and work it out with their guys. But I also have like a top kid in the 27 class, high school kid. And then I've got two college guys next. So there's college guys are on spring break and so that for the next couple weeks, the spring breaks fall. I've got a really, really big and really talented, you know, college class college quarterbacks. And I operate a little differently. So cast like I. Everyone's on retainer for the year. I don't really like train guys in the off season anymore. Everyone's on retainer through the year. I'm doing in season breakdowns. I break down practice and curate individual period. And so they're kind of outsourcing quarterback development. And so I've got about 19 college starters. And so they'll all be out here at some version of the next three weeks as well.

[Matt Castle]

So these quarterbacks that you have in this draft prep that have come out of school getting ready for the actual draft, you have relationships with most of these guys or how many of these guys are coming to you for the first time leading up to the draft.

[Jordan Palmer]

This year's zero. So all four of them. Kate Klubnick from Clemson, this is my fourth year working with him on an annual basis, coming out in the off season, talking during spring ball, talking during training camp, talking during the season. Kate McNamara is the same. Jalen Daniels, this is last year was our first year. His senior year was our first year. And then M.J. rivers, it's been two years as well. And so, so that's kind of the pipeline. I've got some guys that I worked with in high school and then college and now they're in the NFL. And. And so I have a unique business and then I just do one year contracts with everybody and I've never been fired. And so if I can continue to help you get better Then let's continue to work together. And so I'm able to play a lot of roles, but it's also not me. I have a team. I have some great people. I have a biomechanics expert on human body and movement. Super helpful, plays a role. I've got a physical therapist. I also have a therapy therapist. These kids need therapy, and he helps them find their purpose in life. Conflict resolution, prioritization, those things. These kids need that. And then I've got a couple other people on the staff that help out with things as well. So it's been super fun, but it's fun to watch them go all the way through. And, you know, this year, the Super Bowl, Sam Darnold was like, super fun. Watching him, like, started working when he was 14, and so it's pretty full circle, watching being in the stands, watching that go down.

[Bobby Bones]

With Sam, I would assume there was frustration through the years because you knew what you had and who you had worked with, and that probably a lot of that was scenario based. Uh, so did you feel that through the years and then. Yeah. Must justify everything that you've been working towards once he finally won the super bowl, right?

[Jordan Palmer]

Yeah. You know, with Sam and. And there's. There's two other guys that had similar journeys that I'm in the process of finalizing our relationship. And so I'll leave the names out, but. Similar journeys, but cast on, you know, this. I mean, like, my context for this is my brother. I mean, just. You just watched all the Cincinnati years and you go, well, if he was just in this team, if he would have played in New England, if he would have, right? And then he had to go to Oakland, and that was, like, terrible, you know, and people don't realize that, like, he went 3 and 13 one year and was ballin', you know, and got hurt like four times. And then he finally arrived in Arizona, which I still wouldn't even say is like, you know, like a championship organization. But, like. And it came together. So that was my context for then having clients that I knew were really good. They're just situationally in an awful situation. So with Sam, there's kind of on the sports psychology thing side of things, I. I give a lot of my guys, like a line for the year. And for years I've been telling Sam the same thing over and over again. And it's really only I would use, say, this line to somebody who is a couple of things, talented enough to be a real guy, has the commitment and work ethic and discipline and all that stuff to get through hard times where the environment's not going to change it. And then three has the ability to envision themselves as a real guy, you know, as a champion, as a starter, as a franchise guy. Okay, so Sam is all three of those. And so for probably about three or four years there, I was reminding him year round that there will be a time and a place where all you have to do is play the best of your abilities and you'll be in every game with a chance to make a run at the end, because at the end of the day, that's kind of all you can ask for. And so for two years now, he's been in a situation where all he had to do was play to the best of his abilities. And he was in every single game and had a chance to make a run at the end twice, and he's won for two. And so that's kind of been the theme. And this past year, a big theme was basically the muscle that gets stronger when everybody's booing you and roasting you on social and has counted you out. You're either going to quit and fizzle out and be done and just accept a backup role or you're going to strengthen your resilience muscle. And Sam's resilience muscle got really, really strong. Okay. Got super jacked. Well, then that's the same muscle you're going to use when you head into the playoffs as the number one seed and have to block out all the noise and not change your routine and not buy into everybody's saying. And so the muscle that he strengthened in New York and Carolina is the one that he used in Seattle and he got a Lombardi. And I think he's going to end up with a couple based off of the organization he's in now.

[Matt Castle]

You know, you talk about that muscle and strengthening and being calloused to all the outside noise. And with these guys that are coming out this year that you're particularly working with, do you think that scouts in particular look at their experience? Have they played? Have they been through adversity? Because there's some guys like Ty Simpson that's just played one year, right, and he doesn't have the same amount of experience as, like, a Fernando Mendoza, who's been through a lot of ups and downs and all these different situations. How do you go about dealing with those guys? And do you think that's one of the valued traits that NFL scouts look at is the experience factor?

[Jordan Palmer]

Yeah, I think it is. And just the adversity how strong is your handling adversity muscle? It's just the hardest one to score some people. It's really obvious, right? You hear? I think back to Deshaun Watson. I did his draft break and all that. His childhood was so difficult and so well documented. He had talked about it so much that there was never going to be a how's this guy going to handle hard times? Question with him. But then there is guys where maybe they. Just because somebody hasn't been through hard times doesn't mean they can't. I. I mean, Castle, I think of my brother. If you think about, like, middle school, high school, and college, outside of, like, a broken collarbone and girlfriend broke up and like, there's. There wasn't, like, real. You know what I mean? Like, it wasn't. It was, you know, moderate amount of adversity compared to what a lot of people go through. So that doesn't mean that he's not going to be able to handle it. Well, I just don't have any data or information in front of me. And so I think it's the hardest thing to evaluate when you have a guy that doesn't have a bunch of well documented adversity he's been through, whether it's because they only played one year or because life's been pretty cush so far, then you got to get into the psychological element of, like, okay, but if we do. If he does, when he inevitably does go through adversity, how. How do we, you know, anticipate him handling it? And I think that the. That right there, when teams have to guess or make an educated guess on that, I think there's the. One of the lines between the bus and the guys that made it is they were whiffed on that one. These guys can figure out if somebody can't throw it or if they're too dumb to do it or if the bright. The lights are too bright for them, you can typically figure that out in this process. But the inevitability of adversity and success, because I know guys who have a success problem, they're great when their back's against the wall. It's just when everything starts going well, they screw it up. I've seen that, too. So it's essentially the inevitability of how well you handle those two things. And I spent a lot of time talking about this. The inevitability of success and adversity. How well you handle those two things is actually how good you are.

[Karissa Thompson]

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[Bobby Bones]

Com you mentioned there's therapists that you work with and that work with your guys. I think of a guy like Kate Clublick who I know from Austin because he played high school ball there and I spent a lot of time there and you know, went to Clemson and was the dude and probably, if you asked him, isn't where he wants to be as far as when whenever the mock drafts come out, you know, they don't have him in the first round. He probably was that two years ago. Like, is that something that you talk to a therapist about? Like, how do you get through that?

[Jordan Palmer]

Yeah, I. So one of, one of the things my guys do right now is they work with a guy named Tom Rodriguez. He's a therapist. He's been managing family counseling, bible based, secular, all of it. But what we do is my guys meet with him 10 times so for an hour. So 10 week individual and he's created a curriculum on helping them truly identify their purpose in life. Last night we all had dinner and everyone shared their purpose statements and it was emotional and awesome and it was the conclusion of this draft prep phase, many of them go into the NFL and continue to work with Tom. And in the process of identifying your purpose in life and bringing clarity, like, if you can't say it in 25 words or less, it ain't clear to you. Then we go through things like your five core truths. What are things that are undeniably true about you? And when you start to unpack and take inventory, These guys are 19, 20, or. No, they're not. These guys are 21, 22, 23, 24. When you start to unpack those things and essentially take inventory of what you actually think about things, most of these guys have never answered the question honestly of, why do you love football so much? Why do you care so much? Why do you try so hard at it? It's just like, we just got stuff tomorrow. Like, we just keep going. You know what I mean? I got next. I got next week, next month. And so this is a great time to really take inventory of those things. And at the end of the day, we end up spending a lot of time talking about something I call fopo, which is fear of other people's opinions, essentially what the outside world, the influence that it has over you. And so what we try and do is give guys tools to be able to stay true to who they are. At the end of the day, love themselves, right? We're all broken, and we all are sinners, and we all need to improve. But, like, at the end of the day, like, you love these things that, you know, God helped you become and these gifts that you've been given. And so we really kind of unpack those things and try and make everything grounded in truth instead of trying to address a situation like your draft stock slips or the fan base thinks you're a bum, or they traded for this guy, they clearly don't. They like somebody else better than you. These things that just end up coming up, if you play the game long enough, but not worrying about blocking things out and more about getting grounded in who you are. But you got to spend some time for these guys to really unpack and build a relationship, get honest with who they really are. And this has served some of my guys really, really well through the hard times.

[Matt Castle]

When you're going through this process, right, you've got the combine, then you're going into your pro days. Which one would you say holds more weight? Because once you say pro day is more of the tangibles, right? Your speed, your size, how high you can jump, and showing off your physical ability. But the pro Day is more relatable to the actual football and getting ready to go and how they evaluate you, particularly at the quarterback position.

[Jordan Palmer]

Yeah, I don't think at the combine you can help yourself a ton of. I also don't think you can hurt yourself a ton. Okay, so it's. I think it's less relevant. I don't think you can help yourself a ton on the pro day. I do think you can hurt yourself at the pro day if you just have the worst throwing day of your life. In Indy. I watch Justin Herbert not throw well in Indy. Boy, does that not matter. One of the purest spinners of the football. He's an all time great, right? But somebody lays an egg on their pro day on a curated, scripted, rehearsed, typically in an indoor facility. And so for my guys that are high picks, I've had a lot of first rounders come through here. You know, if they throw at the combine, they throw at the combine. I always tell these guys, Castle, I'm like, hey, by the way, this is not a big deal. If this is hard for you, trust me, the NFL is way harder than this. You know, like, if this is hard for you, like, we got. You got bigger problems. But on the pro day, we're there to confirm what, what these teams believe. When you go to first rounder and you got GMs there and head coaches and ownership there, this is about confirming. And I think about Sam Darnold. Sam Darnold, pro day, it was in sunny la. No, it was sideways rain. It was windy. And you had Cleveland at 1, the Giants at 2, the jets at 3, Andy's and Indoor, but they were at 6, the Bills at 7. You know what I mean? It was like, oh, no, no, we're not changing the date. No, we're throwing in the rain. And so that was a great one because he threw like it wasn't raining. And it was like. It was great. I'm glad. I would have ordered rain. You know, the pro day is more relevant, I think, because there's. There's more at stake.

[Bobby Bones]

You were talking earlier about the situation a player's in and where they are. And if my memory serves, you did, or you still work with Trevor Lawrence and he hasn't changed, but there's been so much change around the exact same spot. Has that led, what you think, to his success?

[Jordan Palmer]

Yeah, I think it's resilience. You know, here's a perfect example of when he played in middle school. He was the best middle schooler when he played in high school. He was the number one recruit when he went to college. He won the national championship as a true freshman. You know, his down year, I think they lost twice that year. He hadn't been through anything. And then kind of like historically had kind of like the worst rookie year ever for a high pick. You know, the Urban Meyer thing halfway through this, you know, but like it was a dumpster fire and he was playing poorly, right. And there was no, it was like a triple whammy. But the amount of internal, you know, self generated confidence that that guy has, like, I'm not surprised that at some point it all clicked. I'm not surprised that they continue to hire different coaches and bring different people around there, but it was kind of inevitable. I was not surprised when Bryce Young got benched, came back in and played well. These guys that have that unwavering self generated confidence, it's a matter of time or another way to say that is there will be a time and a place where all they have to do is play to the best of their ability and they'll be in every game with a chance to make a run at the end.

[Matt Castle]

What do you think about this draft class coming up? Guys like Garrett Nussmeier, Carson Beck, I mean Drew Aller coming off an injury late in the season, all those guys that have potential and early on in the season you're talking about first round potential. But now there's kind of like this bridge area that you don't really know where they might go. But they're also guys that have proven that they can play at a high level.

[Jordan Palmer]

Well, I mean like our first thing, we were talking about how you went seventh round and played forever. I don't, I don't like look at the Internet here. You know, I just have been doing this forever. So I know the people that are writing all this stuff, I know they don't know what they're talking about. So I, I don't know what, I don't know what's going to happen. So, so I, I don't really even know what the rankings are right now. And I, I get hired by teams, I submit my reports, but I don't look at it like this is a good draft class. There's four first round picks. This is a bad draft class. There's only one first rounder because between club Nick, Jalen Daniels is a guy that's probably going to go later and play for a long time and Carson back is first, second, third most ready to play in the NFL right now, in my opinion. I think Nuss. Nussmeier, you know, he had an. He had an injury his senior year. They've talked about it was an oblique, and it was this. No, it was misstech. No. So if you watch his junior tape, it answers all the questions that you didn't see his senior year in terms of velocity and all that stuff. So when you're talking about, like, your left oblique is bugging you on every throw, it's like, well, cool. Good luck with that. Right. And he got through it. And so there's just guys that, like, situationally would have been higher picks if X, Y and Z happen. Okay. That's their draft ranking. I'm looking at it like, can this guy play? And then in two years, can this guy start contributing? And then in four years is this guy, like, act like a vet and actually start helping the room? Because in my draft class, 07, which there's an argument to be made, is the worst in the NFL history. The guy that outplayed all of us, the guy that played the most years was undrafted quarterback Matt Moore. Not jamarcus Russell, not me, not the Heisman winner Troy Smith, not Brady Quinn. It was Matt Moore is the guy that got 16 in or whatever.

[Kevin]

Right.

[Jordan Palmer]

So I look at this class and I go, there's a bunch of vets in this class. And maybe one or two of them end up being a really good starter.

[Bobby Bones]

When working with a guy and their tools, does someone ever commence with something that is so fundamentally not right, but it's right for them?

[Jordan Palmer]

Yeah. I mean, my mind goes to Philip Rivers immediately. I can't break down what he does.

[Matt Castle]

I don't know where you don't teach that throwing motion.

[Jordan Palmer]

I don't know how to. I don't know how to, like, simulate it. Definitely see that. I've got one college guy right now that everyone would want to change. And I. But I understand the sequencing element of it. And what. And then with his body, why he's able to really kind of protect some of these joints and still create the velocity that he has. And so it's more injury prevention instead of tweaking the throwing mechanics. But we spent a lot of time talking about the movement. I believe that the majority of mechanical issues quarterbacks have stem from a movement that precedes the throw. I think this game's all about movement. Cas. My whole philosophy's changed over the last eight years. I don't believe anything I used to believe. I just spent years studying the body and how it works, and I don't have a subjective opinion about anything. Everything is based off how the body works and how movement is created, which is why all of my clients are inbound right now. I don't have a pitch deck, and so we spend an amount of time talking about movement, and so that's where the biggest changes are made. I don't believe these guys are broken and need to be fixed, but at the same time, you don't have to be sick to get better. Foreign.

[Karissa Thompson]

Hey, it's Karissa Thompson. Everything these days is fighting for your attention. Work, family, social media. And it makes it tough to figure out what should really come first. But here's something that absolutely deserves to be at the top of your list. Your Breast health. Breast cancer is the second most common cancer and the second leading cause of cancer death among women in the United States. And the rates are still rising. More women under 50 are being diagnosed too. But here's a stat that really hits home. One in two women who qualify for annual breast screenings aren't getting them. That's half. And yet when breast cancer is caught early, the survival rate is over 99%, nearly 100% for stage one before it spreads. If you're 40 or older, you should be getting screened every year. And if you're under 40, it is never too early to understand your risk. So come on now, pay the girls some attention. Head to your attention please.com to learn your breast cancer risk and what screenings you might need. Trust me, your future self will thank you. Brought to you by Novartis.

[Toyota/Uber Eats/Novartis Ad Voice]

You know how it's never really about where you're going, it's about who you're going with. Like the destination could be totally average, but if the right people are there, it becomes a great memory. Toyota really gets that. Toyota designs vehicles around real life and real people. The ones who bring everyone together and somehow make the drive part of the fun. There's room for all the stuff that comes with togetherness. Luggage, golf clubs, camping gear, plus comfortable seating, smart layouts and space that lets everyone relax. And Toyota's lineup makes it easy to find your match. The RAV4 is perfect for everyday adventures. The Grand Highlander brings serious space for up to eight, with generous legroom and expansive cargo space. The Highlander also has space for up to eight. It's ready for big moments and spontaneous ones, balancing style and flexibility. And the Sienna is built for everyday life. Carpools, road trips, snacks, spills. And it even has a built in vacuum for when things get a little too messy. Because when people are the destination. Your ride is important. Learn [e-mail] and find the vehicle that fits your people. Get almost anything you need delivered with Uber Eats. What do we mean by almost? Well, you can't get a well groomed lawn delivered, but you can get a chicken parm delivered. A day at the lake? That's a no. A Philly cheesesteak? That's a yes. An afternoon stroll? Sorry, no. A burrito bowl? Happily, yes. What about a day of sunshine? Not happening. A box of fine wines? Yes, that is happening. Delivery is on its way. Okay, how about some clear skies? No. Well then how about some french fries? Yep. A little escape? No. A delicious bowl of grapes? Yes. Yes, that. How about a freshly cut lawn? Can't help you there. But barbecued prawns? Order it and it's on its way. Get almost almost anything delivered with Ubereats. Order now. Alcohol and select markets. Product availability may vary by region. See app for details. Get almost almost anything delivered with Uber Eats. Order now.

[Tremphya Ad Voice]

For adults with Crohn's disease or ulcerative colitis symptoms, every choice matters. Tremphya offers self injection or intravenous infusion. From the start, Tremphya is administered as injections under the skin or infusions through a vein every four weeks, followed by injections under the skin every four or eight weeks. If your doctor decides that you can self inject Tremphya, proper training is required. Tremphya is a prescription medicine used to treat adults with moderately to severely active Crohn's disease and adults with moderately to severely active ulcerative colitis. Serious allergic reactions and increased risk of infections and liver problems may occur. Before treatment, your doctor should check you for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor if you have an infection, flu like symptoms, or if you need a vaccine. Explore what's possible. Ask your doctor about tremphya today. Call 1-800-526-7736 to learn more or visit tremphyradio.com.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah, talk about that evolution of the biomechanics right from the ground up the hips, all that stuff. And you talked about it a lot from the technology standpoint, being able to put somebody up on a board, film that and see how their body functions and see you talk about sequencing and how important that is where it starts with the lower half hips generating that power. But everything's on that platform. But just, just the advancement in that area from when we grew up to what it is today and what you guys are doing,

[Jordan Palmer]

it's crazy, man. Quarterback development. I'm just gonna say at The NFL level. So for sure, college and high school quarterback development is about 10 years behind baseball and 15 behind golf. I'm doing some things right now with clients, and when I talk to the staff or the GM or the whatever or the agent, they say, I've heard that what I'm doing is brilliant. I've heard the word genius. I've heard cutting edge. I've heard outside the box. And I am quick to cut them off and go, this is exactly what they do in baseball, which is way behind. This is exactly what they do in golf. These are not original thoughts. Right? But what happened in the quarterback world is everything's based off of subjectivity. Again, I'm just saying at the NFL level. So for sure, on down. Okay. It's based off of subjectivity. So Cassie and I grew up hearing things like, have a good base. Don't get too wide. Get your hips into it. Get your toe at your target. Okay? Pull that front arm down, whatever that was. Bob Johnson used to tell me, keep your elbow up. Keep that front shoulder blocked off. None of those things mean anything. Like, those aren't. Those aren't. Like, your doctor wouldn't use those terms. Just, you know, like, eat pretty good and, like, get a little bit of exercise. Like, that's not. That's not a directive. And so we've. We. We've kind of removed subjectivity from this. You either did it or you didn't do it. And so the first phase of working with us is really education, explaining, like, you go all the way through cash, you went to USC and played on multiple NFL teams, an incredible career, and may still not actually understand the body as well as my high school guys do, understand what the obliques do, where they attach, what they're responsible for. Right. Where they attach to the lat. And then now what that. So we go through the whole process. We don't even learn that. And it's kind of like you go to college and be an economics major and not know how to make money. Congratulations on your 4.0. You have no idea how to make money. Right. And so the advancement. I don't know that it's an advancement. It is. It is a huge advancement. It's totally different than what I did. I used to be told to keep my elbow up and fall through, but it's not an advancement.

[Matt Castle]

It's.

[Jordan Palmer]

This was like, what they've been doing. And so when I say, like, all my clients are on retainer for the year, for example, an NBA superstar, James Harden, when he has two or three bad nights shooting. He's not. He's not going to stick around after practice and get some shots up with the coach he's shooting. Coaches flying in tonight and they're going to address this right now. Right. And if he rolls his ankle, the trainer on the team is going to ice and stem. His trainer's flying in to address this. You play with Brady, you get where I'm going with this. So it's like, why don't quarter buy. Is Tom Brady the only guy that does that? And so that's what we do for a lot of guys is we build that system. And so it is an advancement based off. But it's an advancement by default. Right. But other sports, what I'm doing. Still behind.

[Bobby Bones]

We got two final questions. Let's say a really rich mom has a kid who's pretty good in high school. Can they just hire you?

[Jordan Palmer]

They can hire Jared on my team. He runs Summit youth division. He's amazing. He's actually played at Tennessee for four years.

[Bobby Bones]

No, really, really rich.

[Jordan Palmer]

I got people that take their planes out here.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah, you'll take them then. If.

[Matt Castle]

Really take them.

[Jordan Palmer]

If they're really, really rich. I gotta say, doesn't have a liquor.

[Bobby Bones]

Look at.

[Jordan Palmer]

You can absolutely rip it from Highland. Warren,

[Matt Castle]

you think if I would have had this type of coaching, I might have been drafted higher than you back in the day?

[Jordan Palmer]

I think if you would have started three, you would have been drafted higher than me. I don't know. You would have had. But I. We would. I would have had you over here with Mike, though, and get that baseball out of your throwing motion. That's for sure.

[Matt Castle]

That. Right, that over stride, that little overstretch.

[Jordan Palmer]

You had a lot of lateral trunk flexion, so you had to overstretch.

[Matt Castle]

That's what I was going to say.

[Jordan Palmer]

Lateral trunk flexion, which leaned that a lot. Don't recruit the oblique. And so that right leg kicks up in the air.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah, it does.

[Bobby Bones]

He says that every show when we start. Exactly what he talks about.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah. Knew that oblique was going to get me at some point.

[Bobby Bones]

Hey, are you.

[Jordan Palmer]

I remember at Minnesota, you just ripping a dig. I think it was the house call, too.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah, see, that was. Okay, just let it.

[Jordan Palmer]

Let it.

[Matt Castle]

Let it go, babe.

[Jordan Palmer]

He ripped a dig. Took it down the sideline.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah. Are you guys still doing the charity flag football tournament?

[Jordan Palmer]

We are. It's coming up March 21st in. Yeah, in about two weeks. Two and a half weeks. Dude, it's the coolest thing I. I've been on. On the board of a foundation before and I've been intimately involved with a couple of foundations for a long time. And I was blown away that you have a sold out golf tournament and, and, and record breaking, you know, donations and then you run the numbers and how expensive it is to run a golf tournament. So the margin on it, you know. And I was always blown away. I'm like, man, that's good. Like 35% margin is good. That's crazy. And so I had the idea years ago. I'm like, well flag football is like the cheapest thing to do. I wonder if we could start, you know, of like I can. I know a couple famous people and starting events. So we did it. I think it's our fifth year doing it. First year we did it at a high school. We had people buy a team for 25 grand. The money goes in the middle, all that stuff. Well, I think to date we've raised over, I think it's 8.7 million. We've worked with over 90 charities. The margin of what goes actually back to the charities is staggering. Doesn't exist. And it's become a who's who deal. From Aaron, Josh Allen, Jared Goff, Sam Darnold. Sam Darnold won it last. He's our first guy to win the celebrity flag football tournament and super bowl in the same year. It's a pretty good omen. Bryce Young, I mean we just a slew of guys, Daniel Jones, Mike Vick, we got Johnny Menzel coming this year. So it's a couple retired guys and then a lot of the best players, you know, Jordan Love come into it and it's really cool. So we, we sell the teams I believe for a quarter million and none of us make a penny on this. And I emcee the event. I always have different people. I've had Brandon Marshall MC it. I've had Hushman Zada MC it's this year it's Desmond Howard and Marcel Wiley. You're going to emcee it with me. Super fun. And it gets really competitive. So then what happened is non quarterbacks were like I want to come run. So I think Almond Ross St. Brown's been to every one, maybe one he missed. DK Metcalf was there running around last year, Puka. So we did, we just, it ends up being kind of like a who's who deal. It's super competitive and we do it at a junior college on the street, Saddleback, which is a brand new unbelievable facility. And, and yeah, and it's, it's Amazing because we don't have anything. Like we have all these. Between myself and another guy that does what I do, a team of people, you know, called 3D QB that they train a lot of quarterbacks. We're, we're both in Orange county. So there's all these superstar NFL people in Orange county all the time, but there's no like event in Orange County. They're just like dudes who live here or rent houses here. So this is like the NFL community comes to my hometown, you know, every March. And, and this year tickets are $50, which, I mean, you can't park at an NFL game for less than for 50 bucks. And, and we have vendor village, we have halftime performance. We have a kids zone, kids run around punt pass kick contest going on. We're have a kids flag event during it and it's just up close access. We have VIP tickets available. Like it's, it's VIP cabanas being sold. It is just a day and it's out here in South Lawrence County, California. And it's a lot of the biggest names in quarterback. All the money goes to charity and, and it's. Yeah, it's going to be sold out and buzzing. It's super fun.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah. Saturday, March 21st, it's Ottobeck College stadium in Orange County. That's awesome. Jordan. We always appreciate the time. You're one of our favorite guests, so we'll let you get back to your day. I feel like I'm taking him from his day like his real life.

[Matt Castle]

I mean, he should be putting the script together right now. Let's run that boot. All right, get your hips down.

[Jordan Palmer]

I'm just going to tell them, have a good base, get their elbow up and follow through.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah, follow through. Pull that front arm down. Pull that front arm down.

[Jordan Palmer]

Yep, pull it down.

[Matt Castle]

All right, Jordan, thank you, buddy.

[Bobby Bones]

Good to see you.

[Jordan Palmer]

Thanks, bud. Thanks, guys.

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[Bobby Bones]

What do you got over there, Castle? What's topic number one?

[Matt Castle]

Topic number one? I mean. Well, you got to talk about this scouting combine. I mean it was the fastest in history that they said Defensive backs averaged 4.44. Wide receivers average 4.44. Running backs average 4.45. Linebackers, this was surprising me. 4.55. Tight ends average 4.63. Did you see by the way, Sadiq

[Bobby Bones]

ran a 4.39, right?

[Kevin]

Yeah.

[Matt Castle]

Who does that as a tight end at 245? I mean some of these times were just ridiculous. Defensive line 4.83 and offense 5.1, which you think offensive linemen sometimes are. 5.1 the only quarterback group. I mean the quarterback group was the only group that did not have the best time ever, but it was the second best at 4.6. And I think a lot of that had to do with with your boy from Arkansas.

[Bobby Bones]

Well, we had two guys that flew. So our quarterback Taylor Green, who was good, he ran a 436 fastest of any quarterback. We only won two games. We only won two games, which is what's crazy. And we had a good offensive line, but our offense did score a bunch of points, but he ran a 4, 3, 6.

[Matt Castle]

And Mike Washington Jr. Your running back, he ran a 4, 3, 3.

[Bobby Bones]

We had two of the fastest guys because he was the fastest quarterback Taylor Green was and Washington was fastest running back.

[Matt Castle]

It's unbelievable.

[Bobby Bones]

Taylor Green, though, also had the highest of any quarterback and his broad jump was the furthest. But he also set records like of all time except when it's time to not matter in the combine. That's when we win.

[Matt Castle]

Taylor Green jumped a 43.5 vertical 43.5.

[Bobby Bones]

That to me, it doesn't mean anything to me because I know that is

[Matt Castle]

so explosive, it's ridiculous. I mean it. To be able to stand there with your feet on the ground and jump that high, that just means you're just a different type of, of athlete.

[Bobby Bones]

When they say the most, I go, wow, that is elite. But when you give those numbers, I've never measured a vertical, right. Guys like Kevin, have you ever measured vertical?

[Kevin]

Yeah, I mean when I played football.

[Bobby Bones]

Do you know what your number was? That's what I'm saying. Like it's not.

[Matt Castle]

Oh come on Kevin, give us the number, give us a shot.

[Bobby Bones]

So when they run 40s, like I,

[Matt Castle]

I, you've got that right.

[Bobby Bones]

Oh man. God. I mean, I don't know if I got that, but I understand it.

[Matt Castle]

I know anything that's probably above 37, I would say 37, 38, you're jumping out of the building. When you get up into the 40s, you're just a different type of athlete. There was a tight end from Vandy that jumped to 45, 45 inches. I mean it's pretty significant.

[Bobby Bones]

I believe you. But it's almost like when the news stories go, Americans leave 42 billion tons of Buffalo wings during the Super Bowl. And I'm like, I know that's a big number, but what does that mean per person? Like, I need stuff broken down.

[Matt Castle]

I, I just think Taylor Green is probably one of those guys that's captivated every GM and everybody in that building that was watching because of the freakish numbers that he put up. He set the all time records in almost all these categories.

[Bobby Bones]

He also has a good arm.

[Matt Castle]

He was, he's got a good arm,

[Bobby Bones]

he's a good quarterback.

[Matt Castle]

I wonder for him how much this is going to improve his draft socket quarterback. And at the same time are some teams going to look at him and say this guy's not just a quarterback but he's a pure athlete as well and he could help us in different ways, you know, and that's always the discussion that sometimes takes place with somebody that has those type of skill sets that, well, if he doesn't work out as a quarterback, maybe they move him to wide receiver or something like that. But I know this kid can play quarterback position.

[Bobby Bones]

I think this will get him drafted. I think he probably would have been a free agent and he got to pick where he goes and you know, he probably could have had a couple years in the league playing scout team. But I think because he's able to show how fast, how strong, how explosive he is. I think now he'll get drafted, which is great for him because he was great at Arkansas for two years. It's disappointing to me.

[Matt Castle]

I still go back to like Anthony Richardson who was out of Florida that got drafted based off of not his productivity in college. He only played one year and then I don't even know if he played that whole season. But he went out there and just

[Bobby Bones]

his athleticism was off the charts.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah, it was incredible. And to watch him throw and do all that stuff.

[Bobby Bones]

He is going to get traded. By the way, he did ask. He hasn't been traded yet. As far as I've seen.

[Kevin]

No. As far as right now, no.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah. But they did go, yeah, go ahead and look for a trade. I didn't think he was terrible. He just couldn't stay healthy.

[Matt Castle]

Right.

[Bobby Bones]

And he was great. And then he was awful. And also I think the version of the quarterback we're seeing now is come in, they'll start you immediately, then you're going to get benched and then you're going to wait and you're going to learn and then you're going to come back and if you're better the second time, then you're good.

[Matt Castle]

And you're still young enough to know that there's development to take place. But these coaches don't have time to wait. So you're going to bring in a guy like Daniel Jones to come compete with you and going to go with the guy that they think is going to give them consistency throughout the year because they don't have time for the growth model in the NFL because every team is going out there year in, year out and trying to win now or jobs are on the line, GMs, jobs are on the line. And so they're going to always try to get a guy in there that can give him the best opportunity now. And that's the tough part about guys that need time to develop which every quarterback, when you come in the league, I don't care how much experience that you've had at the college level, it's going to take some adapting and time on task for you to realize how to be a professional, how to win games in the NFL because it's really difficult.

[Bobby Bones]

BO Nick's played 20 years in college and he still needed a year. You know, he drew a pension from

[Matt Castle]

a 26 year old rookie. He's like 20, he'll be 28 this year. I was like, wow, it's getting up

[Bobby Bones]

there to crazy series.

[Matt Castle]

I I think he's up there. No, he might not be.

[Bobby Bones]

The USC basketball player is 26 who got kicked off the team.

[Kevin]

Oh, yeah?

[Bobby Bones]

What are you trying to take off for? I. I just don't think he. He's been on a lot of teams.

[Kevin]

26.

[Matt Castle]

26.

[Bobby Bones]

Usually when you see someone that's been on a whole lot of teams at college.

[Jordan Palmer]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

There's a reason they've been on a whole lot of teams.

[Jordan Palmer]

Oh, yeah.

[Matt Castle]

Some of them are chasing a little bit of that bag, but most of them are. Look, you haven't worked out. You're frustrated. I'm going to go see if I can play here. See if I can play here. See if I can play here. Hate that.

[Bobby Bones]

I want to go over to this. You posted a picture throwback to you participating in the combine, but it was a blank picture.

[Matt Castle]

That's right.

[Bobby Bones]

It was a nice little joke. Thank you. And someone asked Grok to verify if that blank photo was you. And Grok is obviously not Gronk. Grok, you familiar with Grok? He's AI.

[Matt Castle]

Oh, great.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah, yeah. And Grok said that's Matt Castle and a legit throwback from 2005, pre draft workout, solid pick, no BS.

[Matt Castle]

See that?

[Bobby Bones]

Even AI spewing with you, man.

[Matt Castle]

AI's got me, dude.

[Bobby Bones]

All right, give me one more.

[Matt Castle]

I want to talk about that Texans acquiring running back David Montgomery from the Lions. I think it's a great trade for the Houston Texans. Now, they did give up some capital here. They gave up two draft picks and gave up offensive lineman Juice Scruggs. But that combination between Gibbs and Montgomery was pretty legit. I'm interested to know why they made that trade with David Montgomery and why they felt two draft picks, I don't know exactly where they are.

[Bobby Bones]

I think they're.

[Matt Castle]

The fourth round.

[Bobby Bones]

It's a fourth round, right? At first it was just a fifth,

[Matt Castle]

fourth, then it became fourth and seventh.

[Bobby Bones]

Here's my theory. They didn't need to go and they didn't go as much with Gibbs and Montgomery last year. Two years ago, that was the. That was the move. He was a rookie last year. Montgomery played.

[Matt Castle]

But Gibbs was the guy and he's going to remain the guy.

[Bobby Bones]

And when Gibbs wasn't on the field, you were playing lesser than you were when he was on the field. So I do think they'll replenish that spot with somebody who can take 12 carries a game. But they didn't need a two headed monster there anymore. So I think that gave them the advantage of trading someone who still has a little tread on the tire. And to a team who needed a running back, no doubt, because the Texans will take every running back that was hurt. Are you hurt? We'd love to sign.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah, we're gonna sign you and then the next person's gonna hurt. They had a lot of injuries at that position. David Montgomery can still go for sure. But I agree with you because when you look at Gibbs, he's going to be your featured guy. You just need somebody to come in and spill him and somebody to hold down the fort. God forbid something was to happen to him because you've always got to have depth at that running back position because they get. It's the nature of the beast in that position. You're get banged up.

[Bobby Bones]

Kevin, anything on the. The Patriots minute over there?

[Kevin]

No, I. I kind of want to retract on something I said a couple weeks ago, actually.

[Bobby Bones]

I love a good retraction.

[Matt Castle]

Yes, Yes.

[Kevin]

I. I've been thinking about a lot guys. A lot. And after they lost super bowl, you know, we were talking about, hey, do you feel good about the future? And I was pretty down two days after losing.

[Bobby Bones]

You were emotional. Yeah.

[Kevin]

And I just want to go back and say, you know what? We got Vrabel, we got Drake May, we got a bright future. We're going to be fine. And I can't wait to see what we do next year.

[Bobby Bones]

What do you want to see them do in the draft?

[Kevin]

I'd like to see him get more receiver help. I don't know what they're going to do with Diggs. I know he's got a couple more years, but it sounds like he may or may not stick around.

[Bobby Bones]

Diggs is like one that 26 year old basketball player I was talking about.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

Like there's a reason he's been on so many teams.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah.

[Kevin]

Yeah.

[Matt Castle]

I don't think it's because of quality of play either.

[Jordan Palmer]

I agree.

[Kevin]

D line and O line too, I think are the number one and number two things. Things can't go wrong with either one. But I think we need help on both of them.

[Bobby Bones]

Well, you just said three positions. Yeah, well, who number one?

[Matt Castle]

I want to blow it all up.

[Bobby Bones]

We need linebacker.

[Kevin]

Oh, wait. Okay, never mind.

[Bobby Bones]

Draft a F in your F the first round, not a player. What position would you go to?

[Kevin]

Defensive end. Defensive lineman.

[Matt Castle]

There's a lot of them in this draft too.

[Jordan Palmer]

Boy. Yeah, that would be good.

[Matt Castle]

How would you like Arvell Reese? But there's no way you guys are going to get the top short on

[Bobby Bones]

My short arm, though. You got all the short arms. Like, that'll be your thing. You just draft the short arm guy.

[Kevin]

Exactly. We'll call the New England Short Arms.

[Matt Castle]

New England Short Arms. But you're drafting 31 too, so.

[Kevin]

Yeah, but there's some depth at defensive end.

[Matt Castle]

There's a ton of depth in this draft, particularly on the defensive side of the ball. I think it'll be a defensive driven draft. They've got great depth at the wide receiver position, but interior defensive lineman and defensive end, it's huge. Yeah. So.

[Bobby Bones]

Well, that'll do her. Thank you all. We will see you soon. Who knows when we'll see you again. Yeah.

[Jordan Palmer]

And we will.

[Bobby Bones]

That's Kevin. Let's kick off. Kevin. That's Brandon Ray. That's Matt Castle on Bobby Bones. We've had lots to say. Goodbye, everybody. Lots to say with Bobby Bones and Matt Castle is a production of the NFL and iHeart podcasts. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

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[Bobby Bones]

Psych. I'm here to remind you about something super important. Getting your breasts green.

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