Lots to Say: FOX CFB Bruce Feldman and the NFL Combine

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Lots to Say: FOX CFB Bruce Feldman and the NFL Combine" on The Bobby Bones Show

Episode Information:

• Title: Lots to Say: FOX CFB Bruce Feldman and the NFL Combine
• Host/Author: Premiere Networks
• Release Date: February 19, 2025

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1. Introduction and Host Banter

The episode kicks off with light-hearted banter between hosts Bobby Bones and Matt Castle, where they discuss Bobby's nostalgic jersey and Matt's humorous attempts at rapping. This playful exchange sets a relaxed tone before delving into the episode's main content.

Notable Quotes:

• Bobby Bones (02:04): "You look good."
• Matt Castle (02:26): "I don’t know. I got this off eBay."

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2. Introduction of Guest: Bruce Feldman

As the hosts transition, they introduce their special guest, Bruce Feldman, a renowned FOX College Football (CFB) analyst. Bruce is set to provide expert insights into the upcoming NFL Combine, a pivotal event for college football players aspiring to enter the NFL.

Notable Quotes:

• Bobby Bones (07:13): "We have Bruce Feldman coming up in a little bit, and Bruce Feldman is going to talk a bunch about the NFL combine, which will be super cool as it's coming up."

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3. Deep Dive into the NFL Combine

a. Travis Hunter: Overexposure and Talent Bruce begins by discussing Travis Hunter, highlighting his exceptional talent and the potential impact of his overexposure. Despite criticisms of overexposure, Bruce emphasizes Hunter's remarkable endurance and versatility on the field.

Notable Quotes:

• Bruce Feldman (14:21): "I think he's a remarkable talent... his gas tank is insane."
• Bruce Feldman (16:07): "There's going to be ability for him to play some both ways... I think it's a longer season. It's a much more physical brand of football."

b. Abdul Carter: Draft Prospects The conversation shifts to Abdul Carter, where Bruce assesses his draft prospects. He suggests that Carter's combination of size, strength, and disruptive abilities will make him a high draft pick, regardless of team needs.

Notable Quotes:

• Bruce Feldman (17:24): "I think it's probably the latter. ... he just doesn't see that many guys who have his traits and also have the film that he has."

c. Quarterback Draft Class Analysis Bruce provides an overview of this year's quarterback draft class, comparing it to previous years and evaluating key players like Cam Ward and Shedeur Sanders. He notes that while Cam Ward stands out due to his athleticism and arm strength, the overall quarterback class has notable inconsistencies.

Notable Quotes:

• Bruce Feldman (18:54): "I think Cam is the most talented of the quarterbacks... his decision making sometimes can have people scratching their heads with Shedeur."
• Bruce Feldman (19:28): "I think you look at this quarterback draft and there's nobody who you look at and go, man, that guy doesn't have big concerns."

d. Underrated Draft Prospects: Mike Green Bruce highlights Mike Green from Marshall as a potential first-round pick who might fly under the radar. He praises Green's athleticism and disruptive playstyle, suggesting he has the traits that scouts highly value.

Notable Quotes:

• Bruce Feldman (21:10): "Mike Green from Marshall... he should be a top 20 pick just based off of what he brings to the table athletically and how twitchy he is."

e. Saquon Barkley: Character and Leadership The discussion shifts to Saquon Barkley, where Bruce commends Barkley's humility and leadership both on and off the field. He shares anecdotes that illustrate Barkley's likable nature and dedication to helping teammates.

Notable Quotes:

• Bruce Feldman (22:25): "He has this really cool vibe about him... there's something very natural about him."

f. Kellen Moore: Transition to Coaching Bruce reflects on Kellen Moore's career trajectory, noting his transition from player to coach. He commends Moore's intelligence and down-to-earth demeanor, predicting a successful coaching career in the NFL.

Notable Quotes:

• Bruce Feldman (24:14): "Kellen's an easy guy to root for... they're very smart and genuinely humble."

g. Jeremiah Smith: Top Ranked Player Bruce discusses Jeremiah Smith, ranking him highly in his "Freaks List" due to Smith's exceptional size, athleticism, and maturity. He anticipates Smith being a top draft pick in the future.

Notable Quotes:

• Bruce Feldman (26:52): "Jeremiah Smith is really wired differently... he just has an uncanny maturity and drive."

h. Criteria for the Freaks List Bruce elaborates on his "Freaks List," explaining the criteria he uses to evaluate standout players. He emphasizes athleticism, unique traits, and the potential to excel at the professional level.

Notable Quotes:

• Bruce Feldman (28:15): "It's something that's such a fun project because I learned so much about it..."

i. College Coaches Transitioning to the NFL Bruce discusses the trend of college coaches moving to the NFL, citing Chip Kelly as a prominent example. He analyzes the challenges these coaches face when adapting to the professional league.

Notable Quotes:

• Bruce Feldman (29:52): "It wouldn't shock me if Steve Sarkeesian did... but the NFL is a different reality."

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4. Personal Stories and Insights

a. Matt Castle on Being a Backup Quarterback Matt shares his experiences as a backup quarterback, offering strategies for succeeding in a role with limited playing time. He emphasizes the importance of leveraging offseason opportunities and mental preparation.

Notable Quotes:

• Matt Castle (44:37): "The toughest challenge for any backup is that you don't get the reps during the regular season."
• Matt Castle (47:30): "The best backups are guys that have had some experience playing because they're not too overwhelmed by the moment."

b. Bobby Bones’ Experience on American Idol Bobby recounts his unexpected stint as a guest host on American Idol, detailing how he was thrust into the role and the support he received from Ryan Seacrest. This segment highlights Bobby's versatility and adaptability.

Notable Quotes:

• Bobby Bones (35:17): "I was pretty quick. I like to freestyle a little bit."
• Bobby Bones (52:24): "Ryan gets sick. There's only ever been one guest host of American Idol. It was me."

c. Goat Stories Segment In a new segment titled "Goat Stories," Matt shares a memorable anecdote about playing alongside Tom Brady, describing Brady's resilience despite a severe injury.

Notable Quotes:

• Matt Castle (40:08): "The greatest goat I know that I played with, obviously Tom Brady."
• Matt Castle (43:14): "That's a goat move."

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5. Fun Segments: Best Sports Movies of All Time

The hosts engage in a lively discussion about their favorite sports movies, each presenting their top picks. Matt champions classics like The Natural and Hoosiers, while Bobby shares his preferences including Talladega Nights and Remember the Titans. This segment adds a cultural and nostalgic layer to the episode.

Notable Quotes:

• Matt Castle (58:50): "The Natural... that's for sure."
• Bobby Bones (62:22): "Talladega Nights at 5."

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6. Closing Remarks and Listener Engagement

The episode concludes with the hosts encouraging listeners to check out Bruce Feldman's work, subscribe to their podcast, and engage through reviews and social media shares. Bobby humorously showcases Matt's jersey, adding a final touch of camaraderie.

Notable Quotes:

• Bobby Bones (69:14): "Thanks to Bruce Feldman for coming on. ... please subscribe and rate us. Review us, but only if it's good."

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Conclusion

In this episode of The Bobby Bones Show, listeners are treated to an in-depth analysis of the NFL Combine with expert Bruce Feldman, supplemented by personal anecdotes from the hosts. The blend of professional insights and relatable stories creates an engaging and informative listening experience, catering to both football enthusiasts and casual fans alike.

Transcript

[Bobby Bones]

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[Matt Castle]

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[Bobby Bones]

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Lots to say with Bobby Bones and Matt Castle is a production of the NFL and iHeart podcasts. We got lots to say. We got lots to say? We're glad you're here and we hope you stay. Cause we got lots to say. Yeah, we got lots to say. Now here's Bobby and Matt. I'm in my number 16 Matt Castle jersey today. Feeling pretty good.

[Matt Castle]

You look good. Didn't. When I saw you walking right outside, I was like, that is savage right there.

[Bobby Bones]

You thought it was a mirror. You thought it was you.

[Matt Castle]

I did. Rocking the 16. You fill it out better than I do.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah, I look pretty good, don't I?

[Matt Castle]

This is old school. I still want to know where you found that. Is that Reebok?

[Bobby Bones]

This?

[Matt Castle]

Oh, that is old school. Yeah, it's got Reebok right there. Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

I don't know. I got this off ebay.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

So I went and I just looked for an old. I thought it'd be funny to have a Matt Castle Patriots jersey, and so I found it and it still smells like Amazon or ebay or whatever it is, eBay smells bad. Amazon smells fine. Right, Reed? Because Amazon's new ebay comes from someone's house, right?

[Matt Castle]

And then if you get an Amazon package, it's in plastic.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah, good point. I smell like ebay right now.

[Matt Castle]

You smell like ebay.

[Bobby Bones]

Because I haven't washed it.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah, don't wash it.

[Bobby Bones]

I just put it on.

[Matt Castle]

No, just rock it hard.

[Bobby Bones]

Gotta wear it. I wear it to bed every night. It's my favorite.

[Matt Castle]

That's your nightie.

[Bobby Bones]

Did you keep any stuff?

[Matt Castle]

You know what? I have a helmet from every place I played, other than when I had my short stint in Buffalo. Didn't have really time to actually get the helmet or jersey or something like that. And then Dallas is the one I wish I would have picked up because Dallas was my childhood, like, team. You know what I mean? My dad grew up in Texas, all that stuff. And through the 90s, that's what I grew up watching. So I was pretty pissed off that I actually get a jersey or a helmet. I still could go back and probably call the trainer and stuff like that, but.

[Bobby Bones]

But don't have to remake it then, right? You don't.

[Matt Castle]

I know. I wanted it, you know, because it's pretty cool. After season, they give you the option to buy your jerseys, buy your helmet, and do that, and you can actually have it as a collector's item. And it's really not for you as much as it is for, like, as your kids get older. My kids will run in and throw in my helmets. They get. I still have my old shoulder pads. My son, who's in fifth grade and played his first year at school in tackle football, was rocking my pads this year. I was like, dude, I bet you they've come up with better pads at this point. No, he's like, no, dad, they. Fifth grade.

[Bobby Bones]

That's pretty cool, though. It was pretty cool. That's pretty cool.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah, it was pretty cool. I mean, but the funny part is he played offensive line, and he still had, like, you know, the little back strap that goes down. Yeah, he had that hanging down because I used to wear the rib cage here, but I'd have a little back strap. So he had that. And as an offensive lineman, I was like, well, makes you look a little bit girthier. You look good.

[Bobby Bones]

Did you ever wear the neck brace?

[Matt Castle]

No. Oh, actually, this is a funny story. My first year, I played Pop Warner. I was like, 9, 10 years old. So my mom and my dad, like, they were a little bit worried about me going out for the first time. So I show up to practice for the first padded practice. I had a neck roll. I had elbow pads. I might even had shin pads on. I had every pad you could possibly get. And the coach looks at me and goes, castle, I thought you wanted to play quarterback. I was like, I do, coach. And they go, take all that crap off right now. I literally showed up with a neck roll. Like, I was like, what are we doing here?

[Bobby Bones]

The neck roll was so legit. Like, old school legit.

[Matt Castle]

All thought. I just remember all thought with like, the cowboy collar and he'd wear it up over. I was like, dude, what a G.

[Bobby Bones]

I have a couple updates. Number one. So I watched Roddick play in his pickleball tournament on espn.

[Matt Castle]

Did you?

[Bobby Bones]

It was on Sunday. So he played Agassi in singles at first and Agassiz an awesome player at single. I think Agassi plays pickleball a lot, where Andy never plays pickleball until it's time to play. So Andy lost that first match. And so then they played a doubles match. It was Andre Agassi and his wife, Steffi Graff, versus Andy and a female tennis player I wasn't super familiar with younger. And they end up winning that one. Three, two. So then they go to, like, a sudden death deal, and they would switch different teammates. And Andy played really well, but his teammate, who was John isner, who's like 6 foot 8, hadn't played much pickleball. John kind of sucked, and they ended up losing the tournament.

[Matt Castle]

You know, he's devastated, too, because he is ultra competitive.

[Bobby Bones]

Oh, yeah, Andy. I'm sure he's eating his fist right now.

[Matt Castle]

Oh, so mad.

[Bobby Bones]

And it was on television. So, you know, I'm sure that wasn't good. So there. That's. That's update number one.

[Matt Castle]

So did Agassi actually end up.

[Bobby Bones]

He won the whole thing.

[Matt Castle]

So he took home the purse, baby.

[Bobby Bones]

Him. It says Agassi because he won the singles, but it was definitely a team thing. Him and Steffi Graf and Marty Fish won their team. Okay, but it's like 38 degrees here today as we're doing this, like, so cold. What's the degree we can start playing pickleball because it gave me the itch again.

[Matt Castle]

You know what? There was an indoor place. You know, you kind of have to go indoors around this time of year.

[Bobby Bones]

But I don't have an indoor place.

[Matt Castle]

38, 40. I'd say 40. You could get out there with a sweat. Sweat shirt on and some sweatpants and start paddling it up.

[Bobby Bones]

We're Ready.

[Matt Castle]

Right.

[Bobby Bones]

Read.

[Matt Castle]

Let's do it.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah. I mean, we're ready at the edge. I watched on television, I was like, I can do this. I can play with these guys. Although probably not.

[Matt Castle]

No, I think you could, because I need to see your game, because I don't have.

[Bobby Bones]

I haven't made a lot of my game.

[Matt Castle]

You told me last week that you wanted to go pro in pickleball.

[Bobby Bones]

I do, but I wanted to go pro in baseball when I was 90 as well.

[Matt Castle]

But I think that this is a different type of sport. They're not going to be throwing six at you.

[Bobby Bones]

Okay, fair enough. Okay, fair enough. I don't know. I'm feeling, like, pretty confident. My jersey here today.

[Matt Castle]

I know he's got the swag.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah, I'm looking pretty good. We have Bruce Feldman coming up in a little bit, and Bruce Feldman is going to talk a bunch about the NFL combine, which will be super cool as it's coming up. You did a pro day, but you never did combine, right?

[Matt Castle]

Right. For some reason, I lost my invite. Maybe it was because I didn't start a game in college. And they kind of. You know, when you go to the NFL combine, you have somewhat of a resume, so I knew I wasn't going there. But the. The fact that we had the pro day. All these schools have pro days as well. And a lot of these guys in the upper echelon, maybe in the first round, won't always do all the drills. They might not even throw at the combine, but they wait until they get to their pro day because it's their showcase. They're familiar with a lot of the guys running routes, so maybe have a better outing that way. And so you have two opportunities to impress scouts. But obviously the NFL combine is something that I know is treasured by most front office people and personnel because they get to sit down in front of you. And don't get me wrong, the interviews are 15, 20 minutes from what I understand. But they're trying to get to know you, grill you a little bit with, with personal questions if you've had a pass. If not also, maybe even it's the football iq. Get up on the board and want to break down some film, write up a few plays, see how much. How your. How your brain processes. And I think it's different now because so many of these guys are coming out. There's schools that you go to to learn exactly, exactly what they're going to ask you at the combine.

[Bobby Bones]

So I took an ACT course to take an ACT test. Is it A bit like that. You go and you go to class in order to pass the combine, they.

[Matt Castle]

Get the answers to the test.

[Bobby Bones]

That's pretty good.

[Matt Castle]

So they're going to. And even, like executives that used to work in the NFL put on a lot of these seminars. So these kids and these agents, they hook them up with their. Them so that they can prep and go into these meetings and kill it. You know what I mean? So they're prepared for questions. So it's a little bit different for these guys because I don't think that they're truly getting just that individual raw out of college. These guys have been prepped, they're ready to go, and it's a professional deal now.

[Bobby Bones]

Did you get interviewed before the draft at all?

[Matt Castle]

Well, I did have private workouts. So after the pro day, I had about five different private workouts. Cincinnati Bengals, San Diego Chargers, the Raiders, a few others. And so what they did would. They'd come to school and we'd go out and do a workout. But it wasn't so much about the workout as much as it was when we'd go in to the classroom. They'd put on some game film. They asked me what the call was, what was our check, what we're going through in our mind pre snap versus post snap. Describe this defensive structure for me. They might even draw up a play, then go watch the film and say, can you draw that same play up that we talked about? Now draw it up first, you know, a different coverage. So they want to kind of get a better understanding for just your overall knowledge of the game and at the same time, your retention rate and see what you do and how you react in those moments. So that was something that was new to me because I had no prep for any of this stuff. I just went in and answered the questions to the best of my ability. And some of it's intimidating when you're sitting there with a coordinator and they're saying, you know, run this play or draw this play up. But it's completely different terminology. So you try to simplify it in your terms. But I think that they all went pretty well.

[Bobby Bones]

Would they do the thing where they give you a bunch and then like, two hours later, see how much when you mentioned retention, is that what you're talking about? Like, would they give you some sort of playbook to memorize or concepts to know and then come back and test you on it later in the day?

[Matt Castle]

So that's. That's what I was talking about. Like, before we'd even go up and kind of break down films. Some guys would have you up on. On the board whiteboard and they're drawing up defenses or they're drawing up a particular concept. How they would call it, what the protection scheme was Hot side adjust.

[Bobby Bones]

Right. So they're teaching you first and then checking you later to see remembered that.

[Matt Castle]

Right. So they're teaching you and then you're sitting there seeing the concept. But then after you watch say 30, 40 minutes of film, can you draw up that same play?

[Bobby Bones]

Got it.

[Matt Castle]

How did you call the play? What was our protection scheme? Was it a six man protection scheme? Was a seven man protection scheme? Is there something that would get you in trouble here? What's your hots? What's your side of just. So they're just challenging you to see your retention rate. And also can you go and be able to articulate what was being taught to you?

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah, I don't remember what you just said. That's my retention rate. My retention rate is so low. I. What is your name? Oh, yeah, I look at my jersey. I'm Castle. That's right. You're Matt Castle.

[Matt Castle]

And the great part is you can always, you know, some of these coaches come in and this is the first time meeting them and you get through halfway through a workout and you're like, gosh, I forgot the coach's name. Exactly. But you can always. It's fail proof, coach. Hey, coach, how you doing?

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah, that's.

[Matt Castle]

That's the beautiful part about it.

[Bobby Bones]

All right, Bruce Feldman. Coming up here on lots to say.

[Matt Castle]

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[Bobby Bones]

Hey Bruce, thanks for hanging out with us today. We have lots of questions about players at the combine. I think I want to start with Travis Hunter and he's been so front and center for so long. Are people is the lack of interest because of the overexposure happening and how good is he?

[Bruce Feldman]

I think he's a remarkable talent. I mean he was the guy coming out of high school as the number one ranked overall recruit in the country. Followed Dion to Jackson State and decommitted from Florida State and from the time he's got got to Colorado he has been a dominant player. I think the thing that's most remarkable to me about him is his gas tank is insane. And what I mean by that is to make the big plays and the wow plays, you know, 100 snaps into a game, 90 snaps, 111 snaps into a game is insane. I mean we've seen guys, whether it's Champ Bailey or Charles Woodson dabble in playing a little bit of offense. He is always arguably one of like the five best receivers in college football and he was arguably the best cornerback in college football. Talking to Robert Livingston, his defense coordinator at CU who spent a decade plus in the NFL with the Bengals versus a scout and then as a safeties coach, he's just kind of blown away by his, you know, he is just one of these guys. There's no stiff stiffness to him at all. His ability to change direction and burst on the ball is remarkable. His football smarts is, is, you know, really, really high level as well. He's not the biggest thickest guy you see him, he's 61 and probably 185 runs. Well, he's not going to run 4 to 5 but his burst is what's is what's pretty special. His ability to change direction is really special and it is just again, his ability to not get tired and make great plays. That's something college football has not ever seen before.

[Matt Castle]

Bruce, when you talk about Travis Hunter, where do you see him playing when he goes to the NFL? Do you think he'll be more of a premier cornerback or do you think that there's going to be the ability for him to play both ways?

[Bruce Feldman]

I think there's going to be ability for him to play some both ways. I can't imagine, you know, because there's so much of being involved in meetings and everything for preparation wise to see somebody go and play, you know, most of the game on both sides of the ball. I just think it's a longer season. It's a much more physical brand of football. I mean he's not in the Big 12 now. He's. If you're going to the NFL, my guess is he will be more of a cornerback, but I think you will see him get chances at receiver. I think the part that's going to be interesting is, you know, how much of a difference does he make if he's, if he's playing on that side of the ball as well. But I would expect him to be more of a cornerback in the NFL. But again, a lot of people doubted that he was able to do what he proved that he could do when he won the Heisman. So, you know, I could see him getting some reps at receiver. I just don't think he will get as anywhere near as much as he has.

[Bobby Bones]

Let's switch to Abdul Carter, who looks like a maniac. Will a team draft him high because they need the position or just because he is a monster?

[Bruce Feldman]

I think it's probably the latter. You know, I mean, look, everybody's always looking for people who can be disruptive and get after quarterbacks. You see what Micah Parsons has done with the Cowboys there. This guy played at linebacker and then was shifted to defensive end this past year and I thought was one of the most impressive games he had was coming off injury in the playoff where he was banged up and he was still really disruptive. Made a ton of plays. His burst, you know, he will test very well. He's a, you know, 255 pounds and he's going to run in the four fours and I think we had him in the opener. They played against West Virginia. West Virginia has a really good offensive lineman and Wyatt Milo, who did a good job when he was up against him, but everybody else Couldn't handle him. And I think he will be somebody I think is going to be really hard to pass up in the top five, whether it's a huge need or not a need at all. I just think that you just don't see that many guys who have his traits and also have the film that he has. You'll. You'll occasionally see some really freaky athletes who are more athlete than they are player. I think he's, he's both of those things though.

[Matt Castle]

When you look at this year's draft class as particularly at the QB position, obviously a lot of people have their opinions about where it ranks compared to last year's draft class. What do you think about some of the guys coming out? Cam Ward, Shador Sanders in particular?

[Bruce Feldman]

I think Cam is the most talented of the quarterbacks. He has the bigger arm. He's a little more of a dynamic athlete now. He play his decision making sometimes can. Can have people scratching their heads with Shador. He played behind a much worse offensive line. I think Shedeur is really smart. He's accurate. His arm is good. I don't think he's quite as athletic as Cam Ward is. You know, if you told me who had the better chance to be in the first pick in the draft, I think it's probably Cam Ward.

[Bobby Bones]

Jackson Dart. Does he have a chance to pop into that first round?

[Bruce Feldman]

He does. I mean, the things with him talking to coaches who played him. He is really, really tough. I mean, you know, to a fault. He's pretty athletic, his arm is good. I don't think there's. Except for maybe his toughness, I'm not sure that there's anything that, that scouts will, will really kind of rave about. But it's a bad quarterback draft. I mean, you know, our draft analyst at the Athletic, Dane Brugler had two guys in the top 50among quarterbacks, just two. And Shador was 25th. And you know, there's other guys who. Tyler Schuck from Louisville is big and he's pretty athletic and he's got a really live army, but he's much older and he's had injury issues. You have Jalen Milroe who has a big arm from Alabama. He's super fast. He's got some, a lot of wild plays on his film, but he also is really inconsistent. And so I think you, you look at this quarterback draft and there's, there's nobody who you look at and go, man, that guy doesn't have big concerns. And I could see this could be one of Those drafts where none of the quarterbacks look like they're going to be like a Pro bowl caliber player down the road, it just, I mean, it wouldn't surprise me if, if one of those guys is supposed, certainly Cam Ward ended up becoming a really good starter. But it also wouldn't shock me if, if none of them ended up being that.

[Matt Castle]

Who's one of the guys this year that might get drafted in the first round that we probably haven't heard about? It doesn't have the same notoriety that some of these other guys that we just talked about might have. Do you have a name out there that you might think, hey, this guy could pop for sure. And I could see it happening.

[Bruce Feldman]

Yeah, Mike Green from Marshall. He started out at Virginia and his, his coach at the time, now he's no longer that coach. Charles Huff is now the head coach at Southern Miss. But Huff had been at Penn State as an assistant, been at Alabama. He knows what big time players look like. And I remember him telling me before the season, this guy is really, really special. And you know, he was around Will Anderson at Alabama when he was an assistant and he's a little different, but he's really twitchy and you saw him be very disruptive and very impressive in, you know, in the all Star games, you know, whatever, a month ago at the Senior bowl. He's pretty like, if you told me he went in the top 20, I would not be surprised. And he's a guy most college football fans like. He was on our freaks list in the beginning of the year, but I don't think most college fans know much about him because he was at Marshall and we, our crew at Fox, we had a game against Marshall was at Ohio State and I know from talking to the Ohio State coaches, they were very concerned about him because you watch him on film and he's pretty special. I mean he's, he should be a top 20 pick just based off of what he brings to the table athletically and how, how twitchy he is.

[Bobby Bones]

I was reading your column on Saquon Barkley and his origin story and he seems like such a likable guy, not just from your column but also when he's like pulling the ball guy over the fence at the parade and like you read a lot of stuff that he's done to help the, the running back from the Giants who went in as a rookie this year. You know, he reached out over DM and like worked with him. So has Saquon always been a guy that people rooted for?

[Bruce Feldman]

I think so he just has a really cool air about him. You know, I remember doing a. We did a feature on him, and then like, when I was working on it, this is back when I. When he was at Penn State, at some point, I just said, you know, randomly, I was like, well, you were always like the best player, like, in your area, right? And, you know, because it's not like he's from. I mean, the area he's from is good football, but it's not like it's cranking out Division 1 players and four and five star guys. And he goes, no, I actually wasn't. I was like, you weren't? And he was like, no, it was this other guy. And he mentioned the kid's name. And I was like, where's that player now? And he was like, oh, he's here. And I was like, being here's here at Penn State. And then I asked somebody, they're like, if he's here, he's not on the football team. And turned out the guy was just a regular student. And Saquon was so humble. And I think that's the thing you keep hearing over and over again, is there's like, no, no, like, entitlement to him, everything. He just has this really cool vibe about him that, you know, whether you know his backstory or not, whether you spend a lot of time with him or not, you know, you could sit across from him and just like, I like this guy, you know, kind of thing where there's something very, very natural about him. And I think. So the things you're talking about and with the ball boy after the, you know, at the. At the victory parade and all these other stories, you kind of hear anecdotally, like, yeah, he's really easy to root for because of. Because of just how he seems to be wired.

[Matt Castle]

Talking about another guy, an ex team in mind, Kellen Moore, who you recently talked about on your. I mean, on your podcast, did you always envision that this was the path that he was going to take when you covered him at Boise?

[Bruce Feldman]

Yeah, I didn't know if he'd be an NFL head coach or a college head coach, but he was so. It's funny, like, back in the day, like, the combine has changed a little and how it's run in the last, like, five, six years. But it used to be they would put, you know, the guys project in first or second or third round, would get like, the podiums like the GMs and the head coach do, and then the guys who are like, the. Afterthoughts at the combine who, you know, are late round picks, they get to sit at the smaller tables and whoever they may be by themselves, you know, maybe, you know, in the, in Kellen's case, I knew him a little because I had covered some of his games. So I sat down and talked to him for a while and was, you know, I just had always, you know, we had some mutual friends and now I work with Chris Peterson, you know, his mentor. And he's a guy you always like, kind of was like, oh, he's super smart. He obviously didn't have a big arm. He wasn't super athletic or, you know, the prototype physically. But, you know, coaches, kids saw the game differently and everything. And so at some point our kids, like my wife's from Dallas, and we, our son was at Cowboys football camp when he was in second or third grade. And Kellen was there because his son was roughly the same age. We spent the day together and just kind of reconnected. His first time I'd seen him in about 10 years. And he's also a guy who's really, really down to earth. And the coaches I know who've been around him all say that it was cool for me to see. You know, we'd visit him when he was in ox, start with the Cowboys, and then the next year he and Doug Nussmeier, you know, his quarterbacks coach went to the Chargers and they were obviously, that was a struggling year. It was right before the head coach got fired. And you know, he has Justin Herbert and then he goes to the Eagles and then they really leaned into the run game and it was cool to see that evolution and the payoff. And you know, in this regard, similar to Saquon, he's. Kellen's an easy guy to root for if you, if you've met him, because you think he's just a genuine, like, very humble, you know, like smaller coaches I know have developed relationships with him and it's like they think it's cool that they're talking to an NFL offense coordinator who has time to pick their brain. And so those are guys you definitely, you know, find yourself pulling for.

[Bobby Bones]

I was looking at your freaks list column and you had Jeremiah Smith at number seven. Is he the youngest, highest ranked player you've ever had?

[Bruce Feldman]

He's not. Because the guy who was number one this year was also number one last year when he was a true freshman. And that's Nick Harbor. And Nick harbor is a elite, elite sprinter, but he's also 6 5, 240 pounds. And he was a big recruit for Shane Beamer at South Carolina. And Nick Harbor's a solid player, but Jeremiah Smith is, you know, I think if he was in this draft, he would be going first. If you, you have to see him in person to realize how big he is. You know, he's every bit of 228 pounds and six, three plus and he's more dynamic and explosive than Marvin Harrison Jr. And quite a bit bigger and stronger. And so to say that he's the best one that Brian Hartline has had at Ohio State is a big statement because we know who those receivers are. But the guy is just really wired differently. And I know from, you know, meeting people close to him. This past season I did a big story for the Athletic on him. He just has like an uncanny maturity and drive that kids at that level almost never have at that position. So, you know, lucky for the Buckeyes, they're going to, he can't go to the NFL for two more years.

[Matt Castle]

I love the freaks list. I honestly read it and love seeing the background of all these kids. How long does it take you to put this list together? What's the criteria and why haven't Bobby and I ever been on it? True.

[Bobby Bones]

Good question.

[Matt Castle]

Good question.

[Bruce Feldman]

It is a good question. So I usually start kind of compiling stuff around now and then. It picks up speed after spring football. And you know, I've been doing it for over 20 years now. And I think a big part of it has been the relationship I've developed with a lot of strength coaches because those are the guys who have been really the core of this. And I get help from sides and some coach, as I know, certainly. And now, you know, pro scouts as when I was once I first started doing sideline reporting, you know, I'd be on the field hour and two hours before the game. And that's when scouts are out there too. And so they, you know, you kind of share notes. The Senior bowl staff, Jim Nagy's people have been great resource and so I love working on it. And you know, it's funny just thinking back to like what you were looking for and everything like this. And so if it's a player who you know, like as, you know, the quarterbacks, there's a lot of times where it's a multi sport guy who just happens to eventually settle at that position. Right. But you know, there's certainly players who are like, okay, that's the guy everybody raves about inside the program. He may not be the best football player but that, you know, there's some freakish quality about him and those. That's how the list started. And it's been really cool to see how it's been received. And it's something that, like, I don't want to call it like, a labor of love because that implies it's like, really, really working, you know, at it. But it's. It's such a fun project because I learned so much about it, and it's been neat to see how people inside the NFL world have taken notice for it. So I'm grateful that. That the fans. Fans seem to like it.

[Bobby Bones]

Final question. Chip Kelly going to the NFL. You see any other college coaches on the horizon to make that jump? Now, Chip's been back and forth, so it's not like his first jump to the NFL, but. But that's big news for him to leave that job he just took at Ohio State and, And jump up again. Any other college coaches you see can make that jump in the next couple years.

[Bruce Feldman]

It wouldn't shock me if Steve Sarkeesian did because, like what you just said, Chip had been in the NFL and Sark had been in the NFL as an. As an offense coordinator with the Falcons. He's a really good offensive coach. You know, if they were to win a national title with Arch this year, maybe that would be okay. Been there, done that. Time to move on to the NFL because, you know, you know, you know, as opposed to, like, where Bill Belichick is at right now. I think for a lot of college coaches, I know, you know, I'm going to go to the combine next week and run into a lot of old college coaches who do not miss college football at all. I'm not saying NFL guys don't go back, but sometimes that's their best option at that time to go do it. And I just think it's such a grind where it's at. And also you see guys like Jeff Halfley, really smart coach who did really well as. As Ryan Day's defensive coordinator. And then he went to B.C. and I was like, oh, he's going to kill it there. He really struggled. And then he went to the packers this year and has done really well. And it feels like he's like, one step away from getting an NFL head coaching job. And you have more of an off. You have more of a life in the, you know, in the spring and in the summer, whereas in the college, it's just a constant grind of. Of just. There's a lot of, like, really screwy stuff. That you're dealing with. Not saying that the NFL is not easy to be a head coach or even, you know, a position coach or a coordinator, but I just think it's like, it's a different reality, and I think it will be attractive. Like, I could see Sark. It wouldn't shock me if it's someday. Ryan Day had, you know, decided, hey, I want to go back to the NFL, because he'd been there with Chip as an assistant. But I think one thing to keep in mind now is, like, you know, I work with Urban Meyer. Urban had never been in the NFL. He went to the Jaguars, and it was a disaster. You know, Steve Spurr, never been in the NFL, went to the NFL, was a disaster. Lou Holt, same thing. Like when you have guys who have. Don't know that world and they end up in it and they think they're going to be like, you know, king, king of the castle. They are, you know, in over their head, and they don't even know it until it's too late. And I think that's why it's like, you know, not surprised. Jim Harbaugh had a really good first season with the Chargers because he spent 15 years there as a. As a. As a player, and then he, like, did really well. Took the 49ers to the super bowl pretty fast. Like, he knew what that's like. Most college guys, they think they know, but they don't unless they've actually been there.

[Bobby Bones]

You guys can check out all Bruce's work. Bruce Feldman.com and his podcast, the Audible with Stu and Bruce. The last episode, you guys were talking about Kellen Moore. I think that was super interesting that people can dial in on that if they want to hear more about that. Bruce, thank you so much for the time. Follow Bruce on Twitter Bruce Feldman, CFB and looking forward to seeing what you have to write after the combine. That's my favorite, is when you're up there with those guys. So thank you again for the time. We hope to see you soon.

[Bruce Feldman]

My pleasure. Thank you, guys.

[Matt Castle]

I see you.

[Bobby Bones]

I did not know you were a big hip hop guy.

[Matt Castle]

Oh, growing up, you know, I was in the San Fernando Valley, Louisiana. It was rap. Was it, man? Hip hop, Dr. Dre, Snoop Dogg. Kind of grew up listening to all those guys. But then my brother was big into Wu Tang, and I got into, like, Wu Tang. And then it was like that East coast, west coast, Tupac, Biggie. I mean, you have the legends of the game that were right before your eyes. Like, when you're growing up. And so I was big into hip hop culture for sure.

[Bobby Bones]

Do you wear the clothes?

[Matt Castle]

Don't kid yourself. I used to have cross colors. Okay. I look like the biggest idiot ever. I went to public school, would wear cross colors. And you know those cross colors back in the day, they had like the jeans with like a Bugs Bunny on the side and stuff like that.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah.

[Matt Castle]

I thought I looked so tight, but then I looked back and I was like, what was I wearing? I'm so glad that that has gone out of style, the baggy jeans and all that stuff. Because, you know, you do it as a kid because you're influenced by everything that you see. But then you look back and you go, gosh, we looked so stupid.

[Bobby Bones]

Your kids will have that, though. Just different.

[Matt Castle]

Different. Yeah, I'm okay with the tight, tighter pants.

[Bobby Bones]

You mean now?

[Bruce Feldman]

Just generally speaking.

[Matt Castle]

Just generally speaking.

[Bobby Bones]

When I was 24, I signed a record deal as a hip hop artist.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah. What was your hip hop artist name?

[Bobby Bones]

That's the part that's funny.

[Matt Castle]

Yes.

[Bobby Bones]

So I want to tell you the whole story about how it happened. So I never really fancied myself a rapper, nor has any rapper ever said they fancied anything. Right. It's not really a term rappers use to fancy themselves doing anything, But I was pretty quick. And I like to freestyle a little bit. Mostly it was like funny poetry, more than it felt like rapping. And so I remember once my friend Eddie had his guitar, and he was not part of the show yet. He did not become part of the show till we moved to Nashville. But he was playing his guitar and we were doing like a Bob Marley, you know, no woman, no cry. And I was doing this rap thing over the top of it, just goofing around. But we had a guest that was coming in, and the guest was a potential pop star named Carly Patterson, who had been an Olympic gold medalist for the United States.

[Matt Castle]

Okay.

[Bobby Bones]

And so they were turning these Olympic gold medalists when they had their shine time, if they could sing. They wanted to turn them into something to sell records. And so she was out there with her record guy. I really wasn't thinking about it, but he heard me rap over this song. And so after we do the interview, he thought I was trying to be a rapper, which I wasn't. He was like, do you want to sing or rap over on this song as I feature with Carly?

[Matt Castle]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

And I was like, yeah, sure, why not? So I signed a deal. I'll tell you the name in a minute. So.

[Matt Castle]

So much anticipation right now, so I.

[Bobby Bones]

Started to just rap a little bit locally. I was living in Austin, Texas. I think I was voted the second best rapper in Austin, Texas.

[Matt Castle]

Come on.

[Bobby Bones]

In The Austin Chronicle, which is their monthly music publication. You know, not bad for somebody who really doesn't do it.

[Matt Castle]

Not bad.

[Bobby Bones]

The second best rapper in Austin. It wasn't like Atlanta or New York or la, but.

[Matt Castle]

But Houston's got a rap. I mean, Austin's got a rap.

[Bobby Bones]

Not even Houston. Not even Houston, though.

[Matt Castle]

Austin. Whatever it might be.

[Bobby Bones]

So number one, I think it was a guy named Franchise. And number two, it was me, Captain Caucasian.

[Matt Castle]

Captain Caucasian. I mean, you dug deep for that one, huh?

[Bobby Bones]

Or not at all. I mean.

[Matt Castle]

Or not at all.

[Bobby Bones]

I just picked the thing right on the nose that made the most sense.

[Matt Castle]

Captain Caucasian. Captain Caucasian was on the ones and twos.

[Bobby Bones]

Second best rapper in Austin, Texas. Probably 2004, 2005. Wow. That was my brief foray into hip hop.

[Matt Castle]

Did. What about if I just give you a little beat, could you bust me some?

[Bobby Bones]

No, because there's no way I could live up. And that's. That's a terrible beat.

[Matt Castle]

I know. It's awful.

[Bobby Bones]

It's only going plus beats.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

So, yeah, Captain Caucasian was a thing.

[Matt Castle]

For a minute, but that is amazing.

[Bobby Bones]

Every once in a while, he. He comes out, but never as Captain Caucasian.

[Matt Castle]

Never not.

[Bobby Bones]

I never welcome Captain Caucasian.

[Matt Castle]

So you put that to bed pretty quick. I mean, how long did you go and actually, you recorded something, right?

[Bobby Bones]

I did the song with her.

[Matt Castle]

Right.

[Bobby Bones]

And so then I was like, you know, I. I. No, we're not really. It's very brief. It's a very brief part of my life.

[Matt Castle]

That is amazing. Part of your life, though, that you got signed to do a rap music. I never would have guessed that, Captain Caucasian.

[Bobby Bones]

Thank you.

[Matt Castle]

I'm getting a jersey with that. Put on the.

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[Bobby Bones]

Now I'd like to debut a new segment called Goat Stories. We do get to talk to a lot of really cool people, people that probably have great stories being around or playing with different goats of different games.

[Matt Castle]

Yes.

[Bobby Bones]

So we're going to start with you. And I love this. So let's do Goat stories. You go first. What goat would you like to tell a story about?

[Matt Castle]

I mean, the greatest goat I know that I played with, obviously Tom Brady. So it's kind of hard to, to not go that direction. Great goat story. I mean, I remember this is my rookie year and we're playing Tampa Bay at home and this is the clinch the division. And so we're about third quarter in the game. He comes off and he's standing up on the sideline. I see him, he starts wincing like. And I was like, what is going on with this guy right now? And I said, tommy, you okay? He's like, yeah, I just got a lot of pain down low. Long story short, we ended up winning that game. But we go into the locker room, his locker's next to me, and we're getting, you know, we're getting undressed. And he's like, oh my God. His left testicle was the size of a grapefruit. Did it look like a helmet? It was. So he had a sports hernia and that's why he was wincing on the sideline. And this thing was blown up like a balloon, dude. And I was like, oh, my God. I went and got the trainer. Trainer comes in, they go in and I don't know what the heck they had to do, but he had a sports hernia that had opened up and was leaking fluid down into that area. So I was like, this is right before we're about to start playoffs. So I'm like, what is going to go on with this? So he either can have it surgically repaired or he has to wait if he can manage the pain. And they would have to drain the thing. Oh, right. So he's sitting there and he goes and he practices with. Obviously they were being very cautious throughout the week, but we go in and he goes and plays in the playoffs now. I was like, what are you going to do about this? And all he said was, I'm going to put on two jockstraps. So we went in and played in the playoffs and this guy has a severe tear in a hernia that is. Could possibly lead to some serious complications. But he goes out and balls out in the first round. I think we lost to Denver. That was the game that Jake Plummer and those guys, they ended up beating us in Denver that year, my rookie year. But at the same time, just watching him go through that and then also understanding that he wasn't going to come off the field regardless of the situation, I was like, dude, you're a pretty badass guy.

[Bobby Bones]

Does that go on the injury report if you have a sports hernia?

[Matt Castle]

I would think that they would have. Well, nowadays they do. Back then, you could put anything on. Like Tom Brady was on the injury report for 15 years with a shoulder. Like, they just put him on every week for whatever reason. I don't understand why. But then everything's changed. You have to now send in the injury report early. You can get fined. You can do have all these different penalties that are associated with not reporting injuries.

[Bobby Bones]

And I'm not saying this being funny, but his testicle was so large, you could see it just sitting next to him.

[Matt Castle]

It was already black and blue.

[Bobby Bones]

Oh, my God. Like, that hurts thinking about it.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah, guys, like, if you. When I tell that story, everybody's like, oh, what? I was like, yeah, yeah. Pretty wild.

[Bobby Bones]

That's a goat.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah, that's a goat right there. And just manned up and said, I'll double jock strap it. We're good boys.

[Bobby Bones]

And having to run lopsided a little bit too.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

Because all that's not the same.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah. And you have to drop back. Like, that's. That's all you do is drop back, you're getting hit, whatever it might be. You're feeling that thing non stop.

[Bobby Bones]

So I looked it up. A sports hernia, also called an athletic publgia. Soft tissue injury in the groin or lower abdomen. Typically caused by repetitive twisting, cutting or explosive movements. Common in sports like football, hockey and soccer. It involves tears or strains in the muscles, tendons or ligaments in the lower abdominal wall or groin. Sharp groin pain, which worsens with activity. Yeah, it doesn't heal on its own easily and severe cases may require surgery to repair the tissue. If someone suspects they have a sports hernia, they should see a doctor. And it's often misdiagnosed as a groin strain. So he played with that, he played.

[Matt Castle]

With that for, for the next three weeks. Like that was week 15, I think going into 16. He played the first quarter against Miami which was a use pointless game because we had already clinched and so then he went into playoffs. We beat the drum out of, I think it was the jets that year and then went to Denver and lost in Denver. But I mean it was wild to see him go through that and then at the same time just act like nothing was happening. He was one of the toughest sobs I've ever been around.

[Bobby Bones]

How do you get better as a backup?

[Matt Castle]

It's a good question. I mean the toughest challenge for any backup is that you don't get the reps during the regular season. So you have to take advantage of when you get into camp in the off season because you're rotated in, you're going to get a fair share of reps. When I say fair share, it's still weighted toward the starter, especially as season starts to ramp up. But you get a ton of reps and then you're also playing in those preseason games, a majority of those preseason games. So you have to take advantage of that. Now as soon as you get in the season though, you basically are down to maybe a rep here. They might throw you a bone here or there, but you're going over doing nine on seven drills which is a run drill. And so you'll, you'll go and do the run drill while the starting quarterbacks usually throwing routes on air and all that stuff. And then the hardest thing I believe for most backup quarterbacks is because you run scout team, scout team is you're basically giving a look of the opposing offenses plays and they're drawn up each and every day. But a lot of times they want you to throw the ball to a particular area, they want you to challenge a certain Corner or get this safety to make sure he's over the top. So you're going to throw it regardless of in your mind. Half the time you're sitting there going, I'd never throw that ball. Looking at this defense. But they want you to do that to get them the rep and to make sure that they're in the right position. So you have to guard yourself against that because you can create bad habits, right? Forcing the ball, fitting balls into windows that normally you wouldn't, or not really going through a progression like you would normally because they want you to throw it to a particular area. So you've, you've got to challenge yourself and understand like look, you're just giving them a look for what they need to see. But then when you get into those team periods, it's so important for every backup. And I would do it, I would try to call the play because we'd call the plays in like we were in a game. And so I try to call the play out loud, look at, make sure that I make the appropriate mic point and then I'm going through the progression. But it's more of you doing those mental reps and that's the challenging part. Sometimes when you see guys midway through the year come in and all of a sudden they struggle the first few weeks, well, they're just now getting time on task again. With these guys, you're in and out of the huddle and there is no substitute for game speed. Right. You can't, you can't simulate that in practice. And so when you get on the field in those circumstances, a lot of times it's like it's a wake up call once again that the, everything is at a whole nother level than what you've experienced before. So it is a challenge. But I think the best backups, one are guys that have had some experience playing because they're not too overwhelmed by the moment. And then number two are guys that can put in extra work. And what by that I mean you have to study that much harder. I feel like as a backup, because you've got to really know what the game plan is, what your checks are and be able to operate at that level when you get in the game or if you get in the game.

[Bobby Bones]

Is there a staying after school element to it where you can stay after practice and work on things with some of the other players as a backup or is it over when it's over in the day?

[Matt Castle]

No, normally after practice you, you get some time in between the end of practice going in you can get treatment. A lot of guys shower. Some guys will even get a workout. And so you get like that 45 minute to an hour. And a lot of times I'd keep the young guys, practice squad players and stuff like that, just to work on certain routes, just to continue to work your footwork, your rhythm, because you don't always get, get that those reps during practice. In addition to that, there's sometimes where there's guys like the tight end room, they want to catch some extra balls or something like that, and they'll ask you to come throw to them, which is valuable reps in itself to be able to get reps with guys that are going to be playing.

[Bobby Bones]

One other question about this before I go to my goat story, but if you're the backup, how much does the starting quarterback depend on you? And I'm sure it's different in every relationship and is it ever not a great relationship where somebody feels threatened by the backup?

[Matt Castle]

I believe there's a lot of those circumstances where a young guy comes in and it's all about the temperament and the personality of the guy coming in. And when I say that, it's is this guy going to come in and he's immediately going to make you feel threatened and like kind of standoffish, not want to be part of the group, be above the group, you know what I mean? There's always that certain type of dynamic. There's not always that certain type of dynamic, but there is that, especially when you bring a young guy in. Now, I've been blessed everywhere that I've been that the guys understand the room. We spend so much time with each other that as long as you guys are a cohesive group and you're all cheering for one another, we're not competing against one another. You're. When you're competing, you're competing to be the best that you can be out on the field when you get your opportunity. But when the other guy's in, look, you want to see him do well, you don't want to see him go out there and fail. And I was lucky because I went to a situation when I got to New England with Tom Brady. He's not threatened by some seventh round dude. He just came off his third super bowl in four years, so it made it for such an easy transition. And he was so cool and was a mentor to me. I got there, he asked me if I wanted to become his workout partner. We started working out together, pushing each other, and so that dynamic was outstanding. And so it's always there's a happy, happy or a fine line, I should say, between guys that want to take your job and go about it that way and have a little bit of an ego involved versus guys that just like, hey, if I get my opportunity, I'm gonna go out there and try to ball out to the best of my ability. But when you're out there, I'm. I'm your boy, dude. I got your back. I'm gonna be your biggest cheerleader, so to speak.

[Bobby Bones]

Dang, that's cool. My goat story would be. I spent a lot of time with Ryan Seacrest. He's basically the Tom Brady of the broadcasting.

[Matt Castle]

Seriously?

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah. He's the. I mean, of our generation. He is the greatest, right? I think everybody, decade or so, you have the Casey Kasems or the. You can go down the line. They're very famous broadcasters. And I spent four years on American Idol, and they brought me in. And I think it was weird at first as. For two reasons. One, Ryan had started doing Ryan and Kelly, which was Regis and Kelly. And then Ryan takes that job, and it was Ryan and Kelly after Michael and Kelly, just so we have all the names, it was Regis and Kelly. Then it was Michael, Strain and Kelly. Then it was Ryan and Kelly. And so Ryan was living in New York a lot and having to fly back to LA to do idle. So they bring me in in case, one, Ryan gets sick or couldn't be there. And two, I think partially in case he did not re. Sign a contract.

[Matt Castle]

Got it.

[Bobby Bones]

So it was, if he doesn't resign, we'll just go to Ryan junior varsity.

[Matt Castle]

Which was me, not junior varsity. Bro, you've already made it. If they contracted you to come in, stop.

[Bobby Bones]

And they did contract me. And I know it was a bit awkward maybe for him at first. For me, I was just naive and dumb, and I was just like, let's go. I'm gonna be on American Idol. And they brought me in at first to just mentor the contestants on the basic stuff, but then I started to get more and more camera time because I was talking about, like, life with them. And they had similar stories that I did. Like, had never been to a big city, had, you know, come from certain backgrounds. And so then they started to put me in places where when Ryan couldn't get back from New York to la, they would go, hey, go do this in the crowd. This is what Ryan normally does in the pre. So. So then I was doing that and filling in more and more, unbeknownst to me, as I was told it started to get a little awkward because he was still going through a contract negotiation. And I have the greatest respect for Ryan. He's always been awesome to me. I didn't know this was a factor at all.

[Matt Castle]

So he was a cool dude, though. So you guys got along?

[Bobby Bones]

We got along great. I did not know that this was an element at play.

[Matt Castle]

Right.

[Bobby Bones]

So they bring me in. The first year that I'm on the show, they pay me union minimum, which is like $2,000 an episode, and they had no idea that I was flying in from Nashville. So I was losing money.

[Matt Castle]

Oh, man.

[Bobby Bones]

To come in and shoot. But I didn't want to be a problem.

[Matt Castle]

Right.

[Bobby Bones]

So if I'm like, no, I'm staying at a hotel. I need hotel. I need airfare. My job was in my mind. Get there, impress them, show them that I'm reliable, and I'm also really good in that order that they're going to want to extend me. And so they did. And my contract for the next three years after that was seven figures every year. So I lost money year one. But for the next three years I was on the show, it was over a million dollars every year, and it went up. It was awesome, right?

[Matt Castle]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

So I learned of the dynamic from the producers, and they're like, you know, Ryan's in negotiation. Ryan got sick. There's only ever been one guest host of American Idol. It was me. So Ryan gets sick.

[Matt Castle]

Really? Of all the years, there's been one guest host?

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah.

[Matt Castle]

And you are it.

[Bobby Bones]

I'm in.

[Matt Castle]

Knuckles.

[Bobby Bones]

Knuckles.

[Matt Castle]

He got it.

Knuckles.

[Bobby Bones]

So Ryan and season one that they had two different hosts, but of the same show that he left, and then it was just Ryan. So Ryan gets sick. They call me, like, 30 minutes before the show's on. They're like, hey, we got to take you from mentoring, and you need to go down and host the show. And it's not bigger than me, but there's 30 minutes. I need to know, like, stage direction more than I need to know how to host.

[Matt Castle]

Like, camera? Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

Like, what camera am I looking not to walk into? There's a lot of celebrity guests and stuff that are coming in. And so we're five minutes out from the show, and I remember looking up at the big American Idol sign, and I was like, dang, this is legit. Like, I'm gonna do this. It's gonna be super cool. I go on. I give myself an A minus. I kind of crushed.

[Matt Castle]

Crushed.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah. Because the moment wasn't too big for me. Right so get off stage and feeling pretty good. They give me these big thing of flowers. They're like, man, thank you. You filled in 30 minutes. Whatever. I go to bed, wake up the next morning. I'm doing my radio show, and Ryan sends me a. A massive box with a pair of. And I know. Shoes with a pair of Jordans, Like, Jordan ones that were about a thousand dollars. And they said, hey, thanks for filling my shoes last night. And I was like, that's super cool. And Ryan, I hadn't spent any real time together. Just briefly. Briefly, Briefly.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

So I thought that was super cool because I started to feel a little weird about filling in. That's his show.

[Matt Castle]

That's amazing, though, right?

[Bobby Bones]

So we finished that season, and in passing, we would see each other, but it was very quick. He'd come in, I'd be flying out. We do the live show and get out. We finally, the next season, we go to Hawaii at the beginning of every year to do the Hawaii version at the, like, Disney Hawaiian Hotel.

[Matt Castle]

Right.

[Bobby Bones]

Disney, you know, owned American Idol and that Hawaiian part. You really can't go anywhere. You're trapped out there.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

You know, for four or five days. And I'm sitting down by the beach, and Ryan comes up, and he's like, hey, man, I know we haven't really got a lot of time to talk. He was like, but I want to make sure that. Because I know you're starting to make really good money now. I want to make sure you're taken care of financially. Like, I want to get you with the right money people. Like, that was. That was his way of going, hey, I want to look out for you. And you're going to have a lot of weird things. And I know that this money is kind of new, but I want to make sure you know what you're doing with money. And I thought that was the coolest thing to do.

[Matt Castle]

So cool.

[Bobby Bones]

Like, the shoes, that's fun and super neat. But for somebody to come up and go, hey, let me make sure you're not getting taken advantage of.

[Matt Castle]

Right.

[Bobby Bones]

Like, I thought that was super legit.

[Matt Castle]

Especially in that industry. Right.

[Bobby Bones]

Dude, it is so cut. I mean, it's like yours. It's so cutthroat.

[Matt Castle]

Right.

[Bobby Bones]

And everybody is out to get everybody.

[Matt Castle]

Everybody's got their hand out.

[Bobby Bones]

And for him to come and do that and go, I want to make sure you're taken care of. I thought that was super cool.

[Matt Castle]

That is a goat.

[Bobby Bones]

That's a goat move.

[Matt Castle]

That's a goat move.

[Bobby Bones]

A guy that's super secure, knows he's the best and just wants to make sure that whomever else that's after him doesn't get taken advantage of and possibly ways that he was early on.

[Matt Castle]

Right. Pass it forward. Right.

[Bobby Bones]

So that was. That's my goat story.

[Matt Castle]

That's a pretty cool story right there. And do you still have the Jordan?

[Bobby Bones]

I do, yeah.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

They're my secrets.

[Matt Castle]

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[Bobby Bones]

Let's do best force movies of all time.

[Matt Castle]

Best sports movies of all time. I love this category.

[Bobby Bones]

Top five you want to go? You can go first if you want. Go five to one. Do you have them already in your head?

[Matt Castle]

I do, but I don't know if I can go five to one versus just give you my five top. I mean number one, I'm Gonna start at one.

[Bobby Bones]

Okay, go.

[Matt Castle]

The Natural.

[Bobby Bones]

Baseball.

[Matt Castle]

Baseball. I was a big baseball guy growing up and all that stuff. And the Natural Robert Redfern that, you know, hitting it into the. The lights and the explosion at the end. That's for sure.

[Bobby Bones]

One, I've never seen the Natural.

[Matt Castle]

Are you serious? I mean, Captain Caucasian has been out on the ones and twos.

[Bobby Bones]

I mean, so I've never seen the Natural. I've never. And I'm a massive baseball fan, but I've never seen the Natural.

[Matt Castle]

That is one of the greatest baseball. It is, to me, the greatest baseball movie of all time. Okay, so the Natural Bullderm is number two. Because I think it really is genuinely depicts like minor league baseball. Both my brothers played it. But growing up watching that show and then going and seeing them in these different cities, it's an awesome movie. I love, love that movie. Number three, I'm going to go with Remember the Titans? I mean, I really like Remember the Titans. I thought it was an outstanding movie. Inspirational as well. Number four, I'm going to go with the Miracle. The Miracle is outstanding.

[Bobby Bones]

The movie's good. I've just, I've just heard real life, what really happened.

[Matt Castle]

I know. Well, I don't want to hear that. I watched the movie and I felt good about it when I left.

[Bobby Bones]

Good point.

[Matt Castle]

And it was really well done. And obviously the Americans versus the Russians, the Cold War, everything else going on. And number five, I gotta go with Hoosiers. Hoosiers is like one of the all time great. Just sports movies in general.

[Bobby Bones]

I liked Miracle a lot.

[Matt Castle]

Did you see half the movies that I just said?

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah, I've seen Miracle. The thing is, they really focused it on that Russia game when we still had Sweden to play after like that.

[Matt Castle]

Nobody cares about that.

[Bobby Bones]

Right, Right. And then secondly, I've been whispered to that there was some gambling involved in that Russian.

[Matt Castle]

Oh. Oh, your KGB friends came over and told you?

[Bobby Bones]

I have no KGB friends. But you know, I've had some people whisper to me that that's probably why Russia did not play as well.

[Matt Castle]

Really?

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah. Like people that I trust.

[Matt Castle]

I don't mean to pivot from this conversation, but did you see any of the highlights from the USA Canada game?

[Bobby Bones]

It was awesome. The first 10 seconds. Fight.

[Matt Castle]

How great was it?

[Bobby Bones]

It was the greatest.

[Matt Castle]

I was like, dude, this is amazing.

[Bobby Bones]

I don't even watch hockey.

[Matt Castle]

This is why I watch hockey.

[Bobby Bones]

Well, I don't even watch hockey. And I watched it because it gave me something to root for, like a home.

[Matt Castle]

Right. It was pride.

[Bobby Bones]

Which is different than the All Star Game where it's like Chuck versus Shaq. What do I give a crap?

[Matt Castle]

Yeah. I could care less.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah, right.

[Matt Castle]

I just want to see these incredible athletes go out and put on a performance, which they did. But that right off the get go.

[Bobby Bones]

They booed the national anthem.

[Matt Castle]

The national anthem, exactly.

[Bobby Bones]

I love it because it was done in a sports way.

[Matt Castle]

Right.

[Bobby Bones]

Meaning if I were. If. If, let's say Arkansas and USC were playing and you played the USC song before the boo. It was done as that. I felt like more than anything else, for sure, like two teams playing. So, yeah, I loved it.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

And I don't even. I don't even know. I have no hockey knowledge and I still thought it was super cool.

[Matt Castle]

Zero. And the two guys that got off, got right into it, right off the jump were two brothers. Brothers.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah.

[Matt Castle]

And their dad played and they had some clip from him way back in the day that it set off the same thing when he played like a full fist fight. I was like, this is legendary right now. I don't mean to interrupt, but I did have to bring that up.

[Bobby Bones]

You interrupted nothing. Number five for me. See, our lists are a bit different because I have Talladega Nights at number five.

[Matt Castle]

I was going to say, where are we going with this? Are we going. Because there are comedies out there. I love Talladega Nights.

[Bobby Bones]

And whenever I came up with my list, there were two I couldn't keep out and they were comedies. But I have Talladega Nights at 5.

[Matt Castle]

Love it.

[Bobby Bones]

I have Remember the Titans at 4. I have Waterboy at 3.

[Matt Castle]

Water Boy. I mean, is that Bobby?

[Bobby Bones]

It's awesome.

[Matt Castle]

I mean, it's so good.

[Bobby Bones]

I love Water Boy. I have Rocky 4 at 2.

[Matt Castle]

Oh, Rocky 4. Rocky should have been probably up there.

[Bobby Bones]

And I enjoyed most of the rockies, but Rocky 4, to me, growing up as a kid, born in the 80s and he was a Russian, and it was like he was the guy with all the fancy drugs and equipment. Rocky's just out there beating chickens. Like, I mean, I related to that.

[Matt Castle]

Yeah. Beating chickens. And then at the same time, I mean, could anybody take the punishment that Rocky did realistically through. I mean, he got pummeled for how many rounds?

[Bobby Bones]

And his. His buddy got killed. Very beginning of it. Spoiler alert. Spoiler, everybody. Apollo Creed goes down early and by. Goes down, dies.

[Matt Castle]

That was pretty disappointing.

[Bobby Bones]

That's pretty disappointing. And then number one was the sandlot.

[Matt Castle]

Sandlot. Great movie. I watched that with the boys just a little while ago.

[Bobby Bones]

They still.

[Matt Castle]

They love it.

[Bobby Bones]

It holds up.

[Matt Castle]

It holds up. Holds true. I mean, just that. That little group of boys and then the different dynamics that they had. I mean, what is it? Rodriguez was their studio. Was that their stud hitter?

[Bobby Bones]

Benny. Yeah, yeah. Benny the Jet.

[Matt Castle]

Benny the Jet.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah, yeah.

[Matt Castle]

Benny the Jet. And then also they had to go get the ball from the Beast. I mean, that whole thing was amazing. I love it. So you kind of went. You went a little bit of comedy, which I get. And then the Sandlot itself is an outstanding movie, especially for us growing up. From a youth standpoint. I just remember that movie being all time great.

[Bobby Bones]

Almost pick Rookie of the year.

[Matt Castle]

Yes.

[Bobby Bones]

Familiar with Rookie of the Year?

[Bruce Feldman]

Oh, yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

Henry Rongardner.

[Matt Castle]

Because the Cubs.

[Bobby Bones]

Yes, that was why I'm massive Cubs fan. So I almost picked Rookie of the Year, but then I haven't really watched any of these back. Maybe Rocky 4 I've seen more than once. Nah, probably Water Boy. But I don't like to watch movies normally. Yeah, I'll watch them once, identify that I love them, and then never watch them again.

[Matt Castle]

You know, I'm getting to the age now that I'm starting to recycle some of these movies because you've watched them a long time ago, but now the kids are getting old enough to where you can watch them with your kids, and it's like, oh, it's a little bit nostalgic for you. And you sit there like, we. We watched Little Giants, right?

[Bobby Bones]

Oh, that was awesome. The annexation of Puerto Rico.

[Matt Castle]

Annexation of Puerto Rico. The toilet paper running through. Oh, got to envision him catching toilet paper. You know, I mean, like, that's a good one. It was a great movie. But watching those back, because I haven't watched those since I was a kid. But then to come back, it still holds, like, its weight today. And you're sitting there watching with your kids, and your kids are fascinated by it, and they're like. And obviously, from a film standpoint, it's much different watching it. It looks like it's from the 1990s or the early 2000s and now. But these kids, they sit there and they're mesmerized by it, and they're like, this is greatest movie ever.

[Bobby Bones]

Al Bundy was the bad coach.

[Matt Castle]

Yes. And he played a good one.

[Bobby Bones]

Little Shop of Horrors was the good coach. What was his name? Oh, gosh, Feed Me Seymour. It was the same guy. He's Canadian.

[Matt Castle]

The fact that you knew he's Canadian is great, too.

[Bobby Bones]

Wait, so, like, his wife died and he disappeared just to raise his kids? For, like, 15 years.

[Matt Castle]

Really?

[Bobby Bones]

Rick Moranis? Honey, I shrunk the kids.

[Matt Castle]

Yes. Honey, that was a great movie.

[Bobby Bones]

Same guy? Yeah, same guy. Okay. So it's interesting what you said earlier. I was thinking about this, how you don't have any of your cowboy stuff, right? That's America's team. So when I went on to find this jersey, I was just gonna gift you this. I got a game issue jersey. They gave you?

[Matt Castle]

Really?

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah. Kept it in the bag. This is a game issue jersey.

[Matt Castle]

Come on. What are the chances that you.

[Bobby Bones]

That's the weirdest thing, because when you said that, I literally bought that to give to you because I didn't know what you had from the Cowboys, and I saw it with, like, a dealer, had it open, like, pull it out. This was in your locker. You didn't wear it, but they issue multiple jerseys.

[Matt Castle]

Are you serious?

[Bobby Bones]

I swear to God.

[Matt Castle]

Dude. Where the.

[Bobby Bones]

It's the weird. I know when you said that, I was like, what in the world?

[Matt Castle]

We're just hitting on both ways, dude. Like, all wavelengths.

[Bobby Bones]

So that is.

[Matt Castle]

That is sick, bro. I really appreciate that. I mean, are you kidding me?

[Bobby Bones]

That's pretty cool, huh?

[Matt Castle]

I really do appreciate.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah.

[Matt Castle]

This is the wonder.

[Bobby Bones]

It's the. When he said that, that's the weirdest thing, because I literally bought it to give to you because it was a real jersey. And when you said that, I was like, dude, this is bizarre. That's wild.

[Matt Castle]

It is bizarre. And I was. When you just said that, I was like, no way. And then you just brought this out. Dude, that is amazing. You got to put it on a match. Do we have.

[Bobby Bones]

Well, your headphones are gonna. Your wife take this off first?

[Matt Castle]

No, no.

[Bobby Bones]

The wire is gonna get caught in the jersey.

[Matt Castle]

Like, I got my helmet on.

[Bobby Bones]

Oh, no.

[Bruce Feldman]

He's reliving his days.

[Bobby Bones]

Nothing. That's not gonna work.

[Matt Castle]

Oh, yeah.

[Bobby Bones]

Dang.

[Matt Castle]

I forgot how tight these things were.

[Bobby Bones]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Matt Castle]

There you go. Dude, look at this. I mean, what a thought.

[Bobby Bones]

Look at this guy.

[Matt Castle]

What a thoughtful gift.

[Bobby Bones]

So explain to me what happens. So they put jerseys in. In your locker and you don't use some of them?

[Matt Castle]

Well, mine were probably clean most of the time. No. Well, I don't know if we don't use them or what, but I know that I. I started, I think, six games that year, so, I mean, it got messed up a little bit. But this looks.

[Bobby Bones]

That's a clean one.

[Matt Castle]

That is to save this just in case I rip my jersey or something.

[Bobby Bones]

That is what it is.

[Matt Castle]

This is Sick. I mean, we got rocking the 16 cowboys.

[Bobby Bones]

Now you have it. Now you have it.

[Matt Castle]

We got double 16 today. Feeling pretty good about this.

[Bobby Bones]

Come on, check this out. Tell us we don't look good. You look great, boys.

[Matt Castle]

Tell me, Bobby, who would you rather.

[Bobby Bones]

Have start for you today? Matt Castle. Patriots. And Matt Castle, Cowboys. Patriots. Come on.

[Matt Castle]

Definitely go with the 11 and 5.

[Bobby Bones]

Thanks to Bruce Feldman for coming on. Thanks to Kickoff. Kevin. Thanks to Reed Yarberry. We appreciate you guys listening. Please subscribe and rate us. Review us, but only if it's good. We could really. We're a new startup podcast. We would love if you guys rated us and reviewed us because it would help us. It would move us up the algorithm. We'll be honest, at this point, we're begging for anything. So thank you guys for listening and share us on your Instagram story too, if you don't mind. That would be super cool as well. You got two Matt Castle. A Matt Castle. Hey, the 16 brothers.

[Matt Castle]

We're brothers, we're happy, and we're what?

[Bobby Bones]

Why 16, by the way?

[Matt Castle]

Honestly, I walked into the locker room my rookie year, and they said, you're number 16. I said, great, great. Love it. I'll rock it.

[Bobby Bones]

All right, we're in.

[Matt Castle]

Wasn't too much thought process behind it.

[Bobby Bones]

From a pair of 16s. We'll see you guys next week on Lots to say. Bye, everybody.

[Bruce Feldman]

Foreign.

[Bobby Bones]

Lots to say with Bobby Bones and Matt Castle is a production of the NFL and iHeart podcasts. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

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