INTERVIEW: Anita Kopacz Talks 'The 'Sinners,' Ryan Coogler, Sacred Trinity, ‘Daughter Of Three Waters’ Trilogy + More

Summary

The Breakfast Club – Interview with Anita Kopacz Episode Date: March 18, 2026
Podcast Network: The Black Effect Podcast Network and iHeartPodcasts
Special Guest: Anita Kopacz

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Overview

In this deeply engaging and insightful episode, The Breakfast Club welcomes back author and spiritual guide Anita Kopacz. She discusses her acclaimed ‘Daughter Of Three Waters’ trilogy (including Shallow Waters and The Wind on Her Tongue), the creative and cultural inspiration behind her work, the pivotal influence of African spirituality (specifically the Orisha tradition), and how her stories are designed as empowering love letters to Black women. The conversation expands to the success of Ryan Coogler’s Sinners film, the resurgence of ancestral spiritual traditions, her family’s beekeeping journey, and holistic approaches to healing and self-discovery.

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Episode Highlights

1. Welcome and Updates (03:08–04:00)

• Hosts DJ Envy, Jess Hilarious, and Charlamagne tha God warmly reintroduce Anita Kopacz.

• Anita shares her excitement about being back:

  "I feel so blessed to be in here, and I could tell you all are having fun." — Anita Kopacz (03:15)

• Discussion begins on the paperback release of The Wind on Her Tongue, now featuring contest-winning artwork and poems. (03:34–03:50)

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2. The ‘Daughter Of Three Waters’ Trilogy and African Spirituality (04:08–06:27)

• Anita explains the trilogy’s foundation in Orisha mythology:

  • Shallow Waters centers on Yemeya, the Black mermaid/mother figure.
  • The Wind on Her Tongue focuses on Oya, goddess of storms and transformation.
  • The upcoming third book will feature Oshun, Orisha of sweetness and art.

• Insights on the cultural moment: referencing Ryan Coogler’s Sinners and how Orisha archetypes appear in Pop Culture, particularly through casting and storytelling.

  "It's like this energy... Black people are really remembering who we are, where our ancestors are from, and our spirituality... The more and more we connect to that, the more and more unstoppable we are." — Anita Kopacz (05:41)

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3. Sinners, Spiritual Resonance, and Twin Souls (06:27–08:51)

• Lauren LaRose draws parallels between Kopacz’s books and Sinners castings, noting archetypal alignments.
• Anita speaks to the emotional impact of seeing Orisha mythologies translated in film and literature, viewing Ryan Coogler as a creative twin soul.
• She shares:

  "When I feel something deeply, I'm just like crying... For me, it just feels like I'm seeing someone speaking my language; there's something that awakens." — Anita Kopacz (07:47)

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4. Writing African Spirituality in Fiction (08:51–10:06)

• Charlamagne asks what inspired Anita to write about African spiritual traditions.

  "I feel like the spirits chose me... For most of us who are daughters and sons of the Diaspora, I was taught that [the Orishas] was demonic... But the more I did, the more it felt like home." — Anita Kopacz (08:56–09:51)

• Anita candidly discusses her initial fear and growing respect for the Orishas.

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5. Personal Spiritual Journey & Community Support (10:06–12:38)

• Anita recounts her introduction to the Orishas by actor Lee Thompson Young and the powerful spiritual role of Yemeya.

• Shares the story of how her first book found its home with Charlamagne’s imprint, highlighting faith, synchronicity, and community support.

  "It was 2020... As soon as I decided [to self-publish], that's when Yadi... asked the ocean, 'what should Anita do?' and the answer was, give it to Charlamagne." — Anita Kopacz (11:25–12:08)

  "I read it on my laptop. It was Covid... Yo, this is amazing. This needs to be in the world... It just felt very Black." — Charlamagne tha God (12:38)

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6. Cultural Reclamation and Remembering (13:05–14:33)

• Discussion on the resurgence of African spirituality in public consciousness, through both art and spiritual practice.

  "This religion survived underground for hundreds of years... The fact that it did and it's in us. When people read my stories, it's a remembering, because you can feel it in your bones." — Anita Kopacz (13:05)

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7. Ancestral Connection and Spiritual Practices (14:47–19:27)

• How to connect with ancestors:

  • Use family photos and memories, start by talking to ancestors you knew in life (16:38)
  • Emphasizes the role of imagination in spirituality.

  "Imagination is really important in your spirituality... Go with the imagination." — Anita Kopacz (17:10)

• Psychedelic experiences (ayahuasca, mushrooms) discussed as a tool for self-discovery, but not necessary for everyone.

  "Once you have done shrooms or ayahuasca, you can connect to that part of yourself... through meditation or just allowing yourself to move back into that space." — Anita Kopacz (18:41)

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8. The Power and Meaning of Orishas (20:22–24:46)

• Deeper dive into Oya ("The Wind on Her Tongue"):

  • Symbolizes transformation and the misunderstood ‘angry Black woman’ trope.
  • Uplifting the real-life legacies of figures like Marie Laveau and Mary Ellen Pleasant (21:48).

  "She’s just so fucking powerful, that's how people experience her." — Anita Kopacz (20:44)

• The trilogy as a “love letter to Black women” (24:46).

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9. Traditions, Community, and Cultural Erasure (30:14–35:20)

• Rediscovering lost or overlooked traditions:

  • Monthly gatherings learning skills from elders (herbalism, spiritual baths, cooking).
  • The "seeking" ritual of Gullah Geechee youth.
  • Travel research in the South and connecting to the land (Charleston, SC, and ancestral skills).

  "If I walk into a forest, I don't know what any plant is... So we got all our friends together... and learned something our grandmothers taught us." — Anita Kopacz (30:30)

  "The Gullah Geechee have this practice called seeking... children go out into the forest alone for days until they have a vision." — Anita Kopacz (31:44)

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10. Fasting and Holistic Healing (35:41–40:01)

• Discussion on fasting, discipline, and holistic well-being as spiritual tools.

• Anita relates her family and community’s approach to holistic healing and the legacy of nurturing Black women.

  "My sister was just telling me... There's a line in the Bible that has been taken out, where it says, 'to heal yourself, all you need to do is fast.'" — Anita Kopacz (36:59)

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11. Sacred Trinity in the Trilogy (40:46–44:12)

• Anita details how her trilogy mirrors the “Sacred Trinity” — reframing Father/Son/Holy Spirit as Mother/Daughter/Holy Spirit within the Orisha context:

  • Shallow Waters – Mother (Yemeya)
  • The Wind on Her Tongue – Daughter (Oya)
  • Book Three – Holy Spirit (Oshun)

  "If you are a daughter of Yemeya and Oshun, they call you the daughter of two waters... but there's three of them... So it's a daughter of three waters, because Oya is a storm, there's rain, transformation..." — Anita Kopacz (41:24)

• Anita describes writing the trilogy, the careful process of choosing readers, and how her father is currently helping ensure historical accuracy for Book Three (43:38–44:45).

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12. Vision and Impact (45:27–46:31)

• Anita shares her hopes for the trilogy's impact:

  "I want people to feel transformed and go out and do what they came here to do in this world... I would love for the IP to turn into movies, TV, plays." — Anita Kopacz (45:40, 46:32)

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13. Beekeeping, Healing, and Black Land Traditions (46:48–52:16)

• Anita’s sister discusses creating Lomar Farm in New York, inspired by a documentary on honeybee decline (47:44).

• Education about bees as medicine (honey, venom, propolis all medicinal).

• The importance of being connected to the land, and how beekeeping is another way to reclaim ancestral knowledge and health.

  "Honeybees are medicine and we need them... we've forgotten how to connect with the land. Beekeeping is helping me connect with the land and the healing that the land has for us." — Lomar Farm Beekeeper (48:52, 50:46)

• Bee-related product recommendations and connection to family names/themes (52:01–52:13).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “All of my books are a love letter to Black women. It’s really like, when you read it, it’s like, I see you.” — Anita Kopacz (24:46)
• “When people read my stories, it’s a remembering—because you can feel it in your bones. You’re like, oh wait, I know this story from somewhere.” — Anita Kopacz (13:13)
• "[Orisha spirituality] was taught as demonic, but the more and more I did, the more it felt like home." — Anita Kopacz (09:51)
• “She’s just so fucking powerful, that’s how people experience her.” — Anita Kopacz, on Oya (20:44)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 03:08 – Anita Kopacz welcomed by The Breakfast Club.
• 04:18 – Overview of the Daughter of Three Waters trilogy.
• 06:27 – Ryan Coogler’s Sinners, Orishas in pop culture.
• 08:56 – Writing African spirituality through fiction.
• 11:25 – Anita’s publication journey and Charlamagne’s involvement.
• 13:05 – Cultural remembering and longing for ancestral roots.
• 16:38 – Practical steps to connect with ancestors.
• 20:22 – Oya, transformation, and Black women’s power.
• 30:30 – Rediscovered Black traditions and monthly gatherings.
• 40:46 – Trinity in the trilogy: mother, daughter, holy spirit.
• 45:40 – Anita’s vision for her book’s impact.
• 47:44 – Beekeeping at Lomar Farm; bees as medicine.

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Final Thoughts

This episode is both a spiritual journey and a cultural homecoming—a multilayered discussion on reclaiming lost traditions, healing, the visionary power of Black women, and the beauty of African spirituality woven into everyday life. Through Anita Kopacz’s storytelling, practical wisdom, and community engagement, listeners are urged to explore their roots, nurture ancestral wisdom, and embrace their transformative potential.

Recommended Listening For:

• Fans of African mythology, Orisha spirituality, and Black speculative fiction
• Readers who enjoy stories of empowerment and cultural reclamation
• Anyone seeking to deepen their spiritual practice or reconnect with ancestral traditions

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Explore More:

• Shallow Waters & The Wind on Her Tongue by Anita Kopacz (available in hardcover and paperback)
• Lomar Farm (honey, candles, and community events): lamarfarm.com

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End of Summary

Transcript

[Anita Kopak]

This is an iHeart podcast.

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[DJ Envy]

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[Commercial Narrator]

Hold up.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Every day, I wake up. Wake your ass up. The Breakfast Club. Y' all finished or y' all done?

[DJ Envy]

Morning, everybody. It's DJ Envy. Just hilarious. Charlemagne, the guy. We are the breakfast club. Lauren LaRose is here as well. We got a special guest in the building. She's back. Ladies and gentlemen, Miss Anita Kopak.

[Anita Kopak]

Welcome back. I'm so happy to be back. Thank you so much for having me.

[DJ Envy]

How you feeling? Yes.

[Charlamagne tha God]

How's your day?

[Anita Kopak]

Amazing. Amazing. I feel so blessed to be in here, and I could tell you all are having fun. So I love to be in places where I know people love what they're doing.

[Charlamagne tha God]

The Wind on Her Tongue is your second release in the trilogy, right? Yes, but it's out in paperback now.

[Anita Kopak]

It is. It is.

[Charlamagne tha God]

What is the difference between the paperback and the hardcover experience?

[Anita Kopak]

So what I'm really excited about with the paperback is that we have the results for the art contest.

[Felicia]

Right.

[Anita Kopak]

That. And then there was a couple of poems, and so those are in the paperback. And, you know, I was able to. To correct a few things that I had forgotten in here. That was great to have just a few, you know, more corrections in there.

[Charlamagne tha God]

I love the world that you're building with the Daughter of Three Waters trilogy. The first book was Shallow Waters. This is the Wind on Her Tongue. Just explain to people what those two books are and what the trilogy is going to be.

[Anita Kopak]

Yes. So all of my books are about the orishas, which I don't know if you all noticed, but last night. Or not last night. Sorry.

[Charlamagne tha God]

At the Oscars.

[Anita Kopak]

At the Oscars, that Michael B. Jordan that he won for Best Actor for his Smoke and Stack.

[Lomar Farm Beekeeper]

Right.

[Anita Kopak]

And they are created from the ibeji, which are the orisha. So he won an Oscar for. For playing an orisha. And it's the twin orisha.

[Felicia]

Wow.

[Anita Kopak]

The twin orisha is the ibeji. And so the ibeji are actually in this book. I'm gonna put this in.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Oh, she putting her glasses on.

[Anita Kopak]

I'm getting old now. So let me just read this part. The end note of this book. So I say there are many different stories about Oya, but according to popular legend, after nine miscarriages and stillbirths, Oya made a sacrifice on a cloth with the color of the rainbow. She then gave Birth to four sets of living twins and a ninth child. In Yoruba myth, twins are called ibeji, meaning born two times. The theme of the rainbow and ibeji are closely linked to Oya. So we have ibeji in here. I always say that me and Ryan Coogler are like twin souls with our writing, if I do say so myself. But, you know, there's a lot of similarities in the works that we're putting out there. And you had sent me, you know, the. The videos from Brazil where they were doing those huge floats to the orishas. And it's like this energy, like people are really black. People are really remembering who we are and our. Where our ancestors are from and our spirituality. And I think the more and more we connect to that, the more and more unstoppable we are.

[Lauren LaRose]

I was going to say, I'm just. Now I'm like, looking. I'm looking at the cast and I'm looking at what you're talking about with the different energies, and they have. So, like Annie or Mary, who was the white woman who came in and started dating one of the brothers played by Hailee Seinfeld. She's Ocean.

[Charlamagne tha God]

That's crazy.

[Lauren LaRose]

Like, it's literally everything we talked with you about before was literally the movie. Like, the cast members all themselves like it. I never made that comparison until you said it.

[Charlamagne tha God]

It says key Orisha, connections and Sinners.

[Lauren LaRose]

Yeah. So Ocean was played by Mary Oshun. I'm sorry, one me, Wunmi Mosaku, who played Annie. She's Oya as a female warrior. Yes. And she's the warrior.

[Anita Kopak]

And then she carries the like and has the miscarriage. Yes.

[Felicia]

Have you met Ryan Coogler?

[Anita Kopak]

I have not met him. Not yet. So we got to figure that out.

[Felicia]

Wow.

[Anita Kopak]

No, but I did. I don't. You don't know this. I finished the third book.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Okay.

[DJ Envy]

Wow.

[Anita Kopak]

And so it doesn't come out until next year, so there's still the process of editing and everything you got to do as an author, all the fun stuff. But the third one is about Oshun,

[Felicia]

so I just want to know what was. Because I know you saw Sinners, obviously. Right. The first time you saw it 10 times. Well, all 10 times. What was your thoughts? Like what?

[Anita Kopak]

As soon as I saw it, I was like, first of all, with all of his films, I end up crying. I'm an emotional being. And so when I feel something deeply, I'm just like, crying. And my daughters are like, what? What are you crying about? And there were so Many things that were similar. The fact that he brought in, like, the. How the. The Chinese people mixed in with the black people, I have that within this as well. And the. The storyline of the woman being the witchy woman. Right. That is all powerful in the spirit world. I have that. And so for me, it just feels like I'm seeing someone speaking my language, and then there's something that awakens, that feels so familiar, and I feel like so many people are feeling that with sinners, and I love it. And I'm just. I'm excited for more and more and more people to read my books.

[Charlamagne tha God]

What inspired you to write about African spiritual traditions through. Through fiction?

[Anita Kopak]

So, you know, what is interesting is that I feel like the spirits chose me. Like, it didn't feel like I had a choice. It was like, at the time, the first time I wrote my first book, Shallow Waters, I was the editor in chief of Heart and Soul magazine, so I was doing health and wellness for black people. And this story just kept coming up. It was like this woman, who. Which I didn't realize was Yemeya at first, was just sitting at the edge of my bed telling me this story. And I'm like, what is this? What is this? And for most of us who are daughters and sons of the Diaspora, I was taught that it was demonic, right. To even look into it or ask about it or figure, you know, read about it. And so. But the more and more I did, the more it felt like home, and the more it felt like I was with my ancestors. And I'm like, what? Well, who told me this was demonic?

[Felicia]

Were you afraid of her? I was, yeah.

[Anita Kopak]

Yes. I mean, you know, like Yemeya, Oya, that, you know, they're. They're intense. They're intense spirits. So I guess I would say I have respect. Yeah, I have respect.

[DJ Envy]

I know you spoke about it before. I was gonna say, I know you spoke about it before, but what got you into that deep dive of viewing things?

[Anita Kopak]

So it was actually Yemen. Yeah, because my friend Lee took Thompson Young, who's passed away now.

[DJ Envy]

Rest in peace.

[Anita Kopak]

Yes, rest in peace. He was telling me about the orishas, and he told me that about Yemeya, that she watched over our souls as our ancestors went over the Middle Passage. And she was a black mermaid. And I was like, what? A black mermaid? Hold up. What is this? And so he told me all these stories. He was a priest of Oshun, and. And I am not in the religion, but I think one of the things that's really beautiful for me about that is that I'm coming at it from a place of curiosity and of, you know, research and, you know, like, if I was raised in it, I think it would just feel more, like, normal. Like, oh, yeah, that's just what we do, you know? And so I guess it's that curiosity. When he was telling me about. Yeah, I was so excited about that.

[DJ Envy]

So when you tried to. When you published the book, how difficult was it at first to get a publisher? We know Charlamagne published it, but before that, was it very difficult telling somebody the story and having them understand that?

[Anita Kopak]

So I didn't really go on that journey yet, but I. It was. It was 2020, and all of the things were happening, and I was like, you know what? This is the time for the story. And so I was like, I. I don't know how to do it, but I'm going to self publish. And as soon as I decided that, that's when Yadi, amazing friend, who is a part of the Goddess Wisdom Council with me, my sister, and Cora, and basically, Yadi was like, I went to the ocean or the shower. We still haven't figured it out. Some water. And. And I asked like, yeme, yeah, like, what? So she's the mother of us all, the mother of the ocean.

[Felicia]

And.

[Anita Kopak]

And she was like, you know, like, what should I need to do to be able to get this book out there? And the answer was, give it to Charlemagne. At that time, he did not have. I didn't even have a book imprint, his imprint, yet.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Never even mentioned it to nobody. Nothing.

[Anita Kopak]

And so she was like, I need it. And she's yachty, can tell things, she knows things. And so she was like, can I send it to Charlemagne? I was like, sure, sure. Within two days. He was like, do not sign with anyone else. He's like, I'm putting this out.

[Charlamagne tha God]

I was sitting in the backyard. I read it on my laptop. It was Covid. We weren't. We weren't moving around or nothing. I'm just like, yo, this is amazing. This needs to be in the world. Like, you know, this just. You know, because it's like, racism is colorism, but then it's classism, but then it's magic. Like, it just felt very black.

[Felicia]

Yes.

[Lauren LaRose]

As an author of these type of stories that people act like we have to shun away from, how did the success of sinners and everything they did in the box office make you feel for, like, what your future is about to look like?

[Anita Kopak]

Oh, it made me feel great. It was. It was it felt. I felt almost the same way as I did when I saw, like, the things that you sent me in Brazil with these huge, amazing floats. If you all haven't seen that, see the floats of the orishas from Brazil. And to me, it just feels like, yes, people are opening up to it. We're seeing like, what these, how deep these stories go. This religion survived underground for hundreds of years because if people practiced it in the open, they would be killed, they would be beaten, whatever it was. So it had to survive underground. And so the fact that it did and it's in us. Like, to me, I feel like when people read my stories, it's a remembering because you can feel it in your bones. You can feel it in your bones. You're like, oh, wait, I know this story from somewhere. But where?

[Charlamagne tha God]

Why do you think people are reconnecting with their ancestral spirituality?

[Anita Kopak]

Oh, because it's time. I mean, those motherfuckers are eating babies. You know, like, it's like you, you see, oh my gosh, they're doing these spiritual, like, things to make. Give them power. We know that we have our own. And I feel like that connection to me, I know as soon as that came out for me, as soon as I read the files, I looked at my altar and I was like, I need to dust that shit off.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Well, we have our own. That's rooted in righteousness, though.

[Anita Kopak]

That's right.

[Charlamagne tha God]

We're not eating babies.

[Anita Kopak]

No, exactly. Yes, thank you for the clarification. No, it's rooted in righteousness, in being a better person every day.

[DJ Envy]

How important is it to connect to your ancestors?

[Anita Kopak]

Well, for me, it's non negotiable. I mean, before I was even really interested in this, I always would talk to my grandmother, grandfather, and Lee now on the other side. But so many, to me, it feels like that's a part of us connecting to our wisdom because they're a part of us. And then there was this one time that I did ayahuasca in Peru, and my ancestors came to me and they basically told me that you are the living blood. You are the one that can exact change in this world right now. And because I think, you know, for me, I would look to them, like, venerate them, like they're so much better than me, but they're like, you're the one that's in the world that can make the changes. We can give you the suggestions, but you're there making the changes.

[Felicia]

How does one connect with their ancestors? Right? You see how you were called? You didn't know what was happening at first. Right. You said, it's always been said that it was demonic or something like that, and it scared you for a while, but once you really just embraced was powerful. It was the impact that it had on you. How does one get there? Because I haven't done ayahuasca. I do shrooms and that brings me enlightenment and clarity when I'm looking for certain answers or when I feel like I'm stuck and in a place. But I also heard you have to be called to do a ayahuasca as well. That's not something that you just go have fun doing like you, you know, and it's a whole thing. It's totally different from shrooms, you know, Although I. I get clarity with that too. But how do you connect with your ancestors?

[Anita Kopak]

It's so easy. You have a picture of your grandma, just look at her and talk to her like she's here. And to me that's. I start with the ones that I knew in life because then I feel like I can have that type of conversation and I'm getting all emotional cuz I'm thinking of our grandmothers. Amazing, amazing women we call. Baba was our Polish grandmother and then granny was our Katyian grandmother.

[Felicia]

So.

[Anita Kopak]

And just talking to them like they're here. And sometimes, you know, imagination is really important in your spirituality because sometimes you could feel like, oh, I'm imagining that I can hear them talking to me, but there's no way go with the imagination.

[Felicia]

Now. I had an experience very similar to that when I shroomed and me. And I have a little sister, she's 11 years younger than me and we were hugging. She was shroom. She was shrooming too. And we were hugging and we were in my home. Right? But it was like we went through time when we were hugging. I was my mother, she was me. And then I was my grandmother and she was my mother, and then I was her and she was me. But she was telling me that it was okay, like I didn't know what it was. I wasn't afraid of it. I just didn't know. I wanted to go back and I wanted to because I wanted to talk to my grandmother. I lost my grandmother at a very young age. I was her favorite and she was mine too. And I just had so many things to ask her before she left as my mom's mom. And I was. I just, I wanted to get back to that moment. But I don't want to have to shroom to do it all the time, because shroom's nasty. My stomach was hurting. And then you'd be high too long. But, but that one part, like, I was really, really happy to have connected with her, but like I said, we were going through time, but I wanted, I want to be able to do that without all the, the like being high. Like, I want to be able to, to do that.

[Anita Kopak]

Well, the beautiful thing about that is that once, once you have done something like. And some people don't need anything at all to connect with that. Right. But once you have done shrooms or ayahuasca, you can connect to that part of yourself that has been in that place, whether it's through meditation or just, you know, allowing yourself to move back into that space and, and, and really get back into that place. Because when you think about it, it's. It's like, it's like your mind getting out of the way.

[Felicia]

Yeah.

[Anita Kopak]

And then you're moving through your heart or through your. It's more of an embodiment. And then where is this journey taking you?

[Felicia]

Right.

[Anita Kopak]

So that's. And I feel like that's a part of these books. These books are like that, They're a journey. Like if you. And when you read this, it is a journey and you'll feel that. Speaking of Oshun, for the. I'm not saying the name of the book, but the third one that's coming out on Black Privilege Publishing.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Yes, ma', am.

[Anita Kopak]

Next year. So Oshun is the Orisha of the sweet things in Life of Honey. And I brought gifts for you all from my sisters Lomar farm. So she's a beekeeper and honey. And so these are hand poured candles that.

[Lauren LaRose]

Oh my gosh.

[Anita Kopak]

Yes, they're. You're gonna be addicted. I'm sorry.

[Charlamagne tha God]

No, My wife loves those.

[Anita Kopak]

She. Yes, she does. I already told her I'm bringing her one.

[Charlamagne tha God]

What does, what does Oya represent in the wind on her tongue.

[Anita Kopak]

So Oya represents transformation power. For me, it was the energy of the. The quote unquote, angry black woman and going deeper into that trope and seeing what is there. And as I did, it was like, oh no, she's just so fucking powerful that that's how people experience her.

[State Farm Advertiser]

So.

[Anita Kopak]

So I have the story of her coming into her power. So she's younger and so you kind of see where the anger comes from, how she was treated. A lot of the characters within the book, Marie Laveau, Mary Ellen Pleasant, they're all people. So those are historical figures and they were demonized women who were demonized and they did amazing things in this world. And I was, you know, for, for me, I was like, how come I didn't learn about them in school? And it's really, I mean, I think a big part was that they were voodoo priestesses, both of them. And, you know, voodoo has been demonized. And these women, if you look up what Mary Ellen Pleasant, she like owned half of San Francisco, a black woman, started the bank of California, which is Wells Fargo.

[DJ Envy]

Wow.

[Anita Kopak]

And I mean, she, she was a beast. And now she, I guess also was known as the civil rights leader of, of California. And it's, it's like, how did I not learn about her?

[Charlamagne tha God]

I'm glad you did that because, you know, like you said, all your struggles with controlling her power, right? But it is meant to symbolize what black women struggle with in everyday life. And the thing I always, you know, tell black women, like, you know, they say I don't want to be looked at as the angry black woman. But what if you are angry? Your therapist always tells you to feel your feels, right? So why not lean into that if that's how you're feeling in that moment?

[Anita Kopak]

Yeah, well, it's because there is that whole trope about it and it's like, oh my gosh, am I falling into that trope? But it's really is like, yes, feel your feels, express them. And that is a part of us remembering who we really are. And that's not. We're not always angry, right? Like, that's not. Yes, we're angry because there's fucked up shit that's happening. But we are a people who know how to get in touch with our joy no matter what we are going through. And so yes, we can be in our joy. We can be on our deep spiritual being. And you know, for me, having a black mother is one of the most blessed experiences that I can ever have because of how deep her compassion is. And you know, I go out into the world after that and I'm like, whoa, is this what the world is like? Oh, going back to my mama.

[Lauren LaRose]

That's why it's so crazy. Like when people had a conversation about like, how black women should deal with it, treat each other, and they're always like, we should be somewhat, much more kind to each other. I think it's crazy that like, you even have to talk to, especially intergenerationally to you even have to say that because it's like, what type of love and or not did you not come from? Because, like, like, if. Why don't you Feel that for a person that is right there with you, and that's how you were brought up and you were born, like, you know what I mean? Like, in your household, that's what. That's what you're given, even on the worst day. Like, why do you have to be taught that once you get back into the world?

[Anita Kopak]

Yeah, well, not everybody. And there's so many people who weren't taught with that same type of love. So it is. Right. Like, it. It is a lesson once you get out into the world.

[Lauren LaRose]

Yeah.

[Felicia]

But every. Everybody's household is not, you know, loving either. You know what I mean? Cause it's generational trauma, you know, that. That actually weighs heavily in people house. And a lot of women aren't able to teach their daughters how to love because they weren't loved or that. You know what I mean? It just goes back. So.

[Anita Kopak]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Lauren LaRose]

How do you. When. When black women read this book and they. And they look at Oya, right? How do you talk to them about even if that trope comes, how they still stay in their, like, power and not, like, because you. Once it comes, you're. You're then trying to fight it, and then you forget all about who you are. Right. So how do you talk black women through that?

[Anita Kopak]

Yeah, well, all of my books are a love letter to black women. Right. So these. These are just like. It's. It's really, like, when you read it, it's like, I see you. I see you. And so it's kind of just sticking with it. Right. Like, if you are feeling angry. Okay, what am I angry about? Sometimes even saying that to yourself out loud, what am I angry about? That helps, because it might be like, oh, dang. I'm just angry because that person cut me off. And then. Then my mind is starting to think of all the other things I'm angry about, because I already got angry from one thing. And so, you know, talking to ourselves helps. And I feel like just really continuing to learn ourselves, allow ourselves to be the main character in the story, because we know all of us want to give and give and give to everyone. And so it's like, really like, okay, if I'm the main character, what is it that I need right now?

[Charlamagne tha God]

When you say talk to yourself, what should you be saying?

[DJ Envy]

What up, everybody? It's DJ Emmy from the Breakfast Club. Now, you know, me and my wife, married 24 years and together over 30. And yes, we still speak on the phone every day. I mean, the early days, I didn't have a cell phone. I couldn't afford a cell phone and the cell phones were like the size of a a man's purse. But anyway, I love speaking to my wife over the phone. People say we talk too much, but that's my best friend. Why shouldn't we be able to talk all the time? All day long? 24,7 but did you know that 2026 will mark the 150th anniversary of the first ever phone call. It took place March 10, 1876. And that call sparked it all for the first long distance phone lines, the first lines across America, the first line across the Atlantic, the first round the world called, the first commercial cell Service, the first 911 system. AT&T has been connecting people for 150 years in so many different ways. Thank God we have cell phones. I can connect to my moms, my pops and my whole family. Thank you. AT&T.

[Anita Kopak]

Connecting changes everything.

[DJ Envy]

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[State Farm Advertiser]

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[DJ Envy]

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[Commercial Narrator]

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[Anita Kopak]

No, just kidding,

[Felicia]

right?

[Anita Kopak]

No. But I do. I, I'll talk. If I begin to feel anxiety, I'll be like, what am I anxious about? And I'll say it out loud. And then sometimes it'll just be like, oh my gosh, I'm anxious. Anxious because I think that I'm gonna look crazy when I go on this show or something, you know, like the I. And once I say it out loud, I'm like, that's silly. You know, like kind of talking to myself as if that's the, the inner child, you know, speaking their insecurities.

[DJ Envy]

What traditions did you discover or find out about that you feel like as a community we miss out on or we forgot about or we don't do. And I'm black. I'm not Dominican. I am black. I am not Dominican.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Fully black community. What do you mean exactly?

[DJ Envy]

Okay, continue.

[Anita Kopak]

Okay, well, for me, one thing that I have done with my sister and with a few of our friends, we read the book the Conjuring of America, which was actually very similar to the wind on her tongue. It was like the real version. Like she talked about Marie Laveau and she talked a lot about herbalism and how black people, like, they're the ones who brought in all of the herbal medicines, right? So they had the medicines that worked. And I Was like, wow, I feel so disconnected. Like, if I walk into a forest, I don't know what any plant is. And so what we did is we got all of our friends together, and once a month, we learned something that our grandmothers taught us. And so we've learned spiritual baths. We've learned how to make hot sauce. We've learned all kinds of different things. And so I think community and gathering and teaching one little thing. I mean, when I went to South Carolina. Oh, my gosh. Have you guys gone to the African American Museum?

[Felicia]

No, I have not yet.

[Charlamagne tha God]

They don't care about black history, Yo.

[Anita Kopak]

Yo.

[Felicia]

I really do.

[DJ Envy]

Yo.

[Felicia]

I do.

[Anita Kopak]

It's so good. It's so good. And one of the things that I learned that I. It's not gonna be a spoiler. I did put it into the new book, but. But was about seeking, which I didn't realize. So the Gullah Geechee have this practice called seeking, where children from, like, 7 to 11, they go out into the forest alone for days until they have a vision. And when they have that vision, they come back with that vision. So they have to know what plants you can eat. They have to know what plants cure things. So by seven, these children are out there knowing, knowing. And I was like, what? I had a similar thing in Shallow Waters where, because I knew indigenous children did that. And so I had put that in Shallow Waters. I had no idea that the Gullah Geechee did that. I learned a lot.

[Charlamagne tha God]

What called you to Charleston, Because I remember when you hit me and said you wanted to go down there, like, to do research for your third book, like, what. What. What called you to the. To the Holy City?

[Anita Kopak]

So it was the. The third book, which is about ocean. I'm not going to say the name. So it takes place in Buford and St. Helena. And so I was like, well, you know what? I've never been there. I was like, I need to kind of feel the land, the earth. When I got down there, the trees were talking to me.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Absolutely.

[Anita Kopak]

I had never, ever seen trees that looked like that with the moss hanging

[Charlamagne tha God]

over the stone highway.

[Anita Kopak]

Yep. On a road. Oh, it was amazing. And so when I was there, I learned that, you know, all of the money that the enslaved people made for the south was through rice, indigo, and cotton and all of these skills. They brought the. The enslaved Africans over who had those skills, who knew how to do the rice in the. In the swamp land, specifically pick them.

[Charlamagne tha God]

They weren't just grabbing random people, like, exactly.

[Anita Kopak]

So they're like, okay, you know, how to do this. And then took them and it's. It was. I was mind blown, like, in so many different ways. I did a tour with this woman called the grave woman. Her name is Joelle. And so she took me to a rice field where they're also like, you know, just make sure there's. When you're walking, there's no snakes and. Oh, let me tell you. Let me tell you. We walked by an alligator. The people in the south are not scared of alligators. They're not scared. Like, they walked by like it was nothing. They would freak out.

[Charlamagne tha God]

I was like, don't bother them, they won't bother you.

[Felicia]

Right?

[Charlamagne tha God]

Yeah.

[Lauren LaRose]

I hate when people from the south say that. Not normal.

[Anita Kopak]

Nobody bit. It's like a dinosaur.

[Felicia]

Alligators, not normal to us.

[Anita Kopak]

It's like a huge alligator.

[Felicia]

Did you jump? Were you scared? Did you just.

[Anita Kopak]

I was horrified. And they were like, the. The father. The girl's father was like, yeah, we used to swim with them. Oh, it's like, oh, swimming.

[Charlamagne tha God]

I never did all that.

[DJ Envy]

Yeah,

[Lauren LaRose]

they were black.

[Anita Kopak]

They're black.

[Lauren LaRose]

Oh, wow.

[Anita Kopak]

They're black. They're not scared. Like, not. They're like, of the land, like the Gullah Geechee. So with the Gullah Geechee, they were somewhat isolated in certain islands, so they were able to keep so much of their traditions. And. And so, yeah, it's like you saying

[Felicia]

the alligators was black.

[Anita Kopak]

No.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Oh, Lord have mercy. That's why you got to go to the International African American Museum.

[Felicia]

No, I am.

[DJ Envy]

No, because.

[Felicia]

No, no. The people. Yes, ma'. Am.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Queen of fool. Got her on a 21 day detox day.

[DJ Envy]

Number one, though, don't get it twisted.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Day three.

[Anita Kopak]

You can say you started yesterday.

[Felicia]

No, I went Sunday and I started Sunday.

[DJ Envy]

But you smoked yesterday.

[Felicia]

No, no, I'm letting it go slowly but surely. You can't just change.

[Anita Kopak]

What are you doing the fast for? Just.

[Felicia]

Just for, like, she don't know. Health and wellness, you know what I mean? Like, I want. Like, I want to go on that holistic journey of health. Like, my diet is messed up. You know, I want to be able to kill the cravings that I have for weed. You know what I mean? But it's not just weed. It's just even what I consume. You know what I mean? What I'm watching, what I'm listening to. I wake up on my phone before I go to sleep on my phone. I wake up angry sometimes. And I realize it's because of what you watched before you went to sleep. You know, my Dreams are crazy, like, and not all the time, but a little bit too frequent for me. I'm 34 years old. I'm not.

[Charlamagne tha God]

I gotta be too frequent for all of us.

[Felicia]

You know what I'm saying? Yeah. You know, but it's just a different way of living, you know, Optimal health. I want that, and I want that for my kids, too, you know, and my husband. Like, I really, really want that for my family. And if you can. If you can be. You know, we already got everything we need here, right. To heal ourselves. I want to be able to heal my family. You know what I'm saying? I want to be able to do that, and I want my kids to be able to heal their kids.

[Charlamagne tha God]

So you're sick of.

[Felicia]

Not sick of myself. Shut up.

[Anita Kopak]

No, but that's important. That's important. And. And my sister was just telling me that there is a line in the Bible that, in many Bibles that has been taken out of where it says, to heal yourself, all you need to do is fast. And it's taken out. Like, she showed me one Bible where it was in and another one where it's, like, taken out. I can't tell you which someone will be able to tell you which line it is, but I can't tell you.

[Lauren LaRose]

A lot of churches, though, they teach. I mean, they do fast together in the church. But I know in my church, like, they.

[Felicia]

You.

[Lauren LaRose]

Fasting is kind of like what Jess is kind of talking about, where it's like, you take that time of just discipline and, like, in those moments, you, like, talk yourself through things and just have some real, like, hard moments that make it. You change after the fast happens.

[Felicia]

Yeah, it's very challenging. Even on my third day, like, it's very challenging because fasting is not just about, like, not eating. What you want is. It's really not. Not watching the shows you like, not

[Anita Kopak]

talking to the people, you know.

[Felicia]

No sex. No. Like, it's very strict. It's a very strict way to discipline yourself.

[Anita Kopak]

Yeah.

[DJ Envy]

You know, you're going no sex for 30 days.

[Felicia]

What?

[Charlamagne tha God]

What.

[Felicia]

What else?

[Charlamagne tha God]

Oh, she married to a Mexican. I don't see that happening either.

[Felicia]

You do.

[Anita Kopak]

You do have to do no sex when you. When there's a whole facet you have to do before you do. Ayahuasca, too.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Yeah. You had to do three weeks. Yeah, we had to do three weeks. Eating clean.

[Anita Kopak]

Yeah.

[Charlamagne tha God]

No sex for three weeks.

[Felicia]

Even if you marry.

[Lauren LaRose]

Like, you.

[DJ Envy]

Even if you marry. Sounds crazy.

[Felicia]

Yes.

[Anita Kopak]

Yeah.

[Felicia]

Gotcha.

[Anita Kopak]

And, you know, as far as, like, guiding people through things like that, with the. With the Goddess Wisdom Council, that I'm a part of this group with me, my sister Yadi and this woman named Cora, we take people on retreats. Charlemagne has support, supported that in so many ways, because I. I want to basically create spaces where women of color, people of color, can come and experience a beautiful space where all you have to think about is your healing.

[Felicia]

Yeah.

[Anita Kopak]

And we have monthly calls called the Leap. And so it's kind of like a community that is more of, like, you know, people who can meet once a month, and we do, like, group coaching with them. And then we're about to start a mastermin, where if. A legacy mastermind, and that can be. Where if someone has, like, a project that they've been thinking about. So to me, that's where fasting comes in. Because sometimes you can't even see what it is that you want to do.

[Felicia]

And.

[Anita Kopak]

And it's like, well, what is the legacy? What is the legacy that I want to leave behind? And so if you do some fasting, then this clarity comes because only you know that you're the only one who got that call. And, you know, if it's. If it's fuzzy.

[Felicia]

Yeah, it's the purpose thing right now. Right. Like, you don't know what it is. And I thought that was, like, a bad thing to not know your purpose. You know what I mean? But, yeah, I can't. I can't see it. It's foggy. That's why I want to stop doing a lot of things that I'm doing to get the clarity for it.

[Anita Kopak]

And sometimes our purpose is just as simple as to love. Right. Like, that's. That's one of my purposes. I know that is one of my purposes is to. To love deeply, to love the people around me deeply. And also I feel like a part of my ministry is black women. Like, I just love black women. And I feel, you know, just thinking of my daughters, and I love my son as well, of course, but just thinking of, like, to me, if. If black women are healed, like, it's. That's why even with, like, micro loans, if you give it to black women, you know that the whole community is going to be served because they're not going to just take care of themselves. They're going to take care of the people around them.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Can we talk about the sacred Trinity? Because that's what this. That's what this book series represents. Shallow waters was the mother. The wind on her tongue is the daughter. And the next book will be the Holy Spirit. But tell me, what is the Sacred Trinity?

[Anita Kopak]

Yes, the Sacred Trinity for most people is the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost, right? And so within my books, I'm not. I don't want to tell too much about what's happening in the third one, but I have the mother, the daughter, and the Holy Spirit. So I have the mother, which is Yemeya, she is the black mermaid, right? The mother of us all. And then the daughter who is Oya. So she is the. The daughter in the flesh. And then I have the Holy Spirit, which is going to be ocean, which is the sweet things in life, the muse, the artist, and these, the daughter of three waters within the Cuban practice of the IFA religion. So when the enslaved Africans were dropped off at different parts places in the Americas, they. Different parts of the religion sprung up. So in Cuba, in Brazil, right? So in Brazil, it's Condomble. In Cuba it's Santeria, right? Lukumi ifa. Right. Like, there's many different versions, but it's all from ifa. And so within Cuba, if you're a daughter of Yemeya and Oshun, they call you the daughter of two waters. And usually you're only a daughter of one Orisha. So when I was thinking of these books, I'm like, oh, but there's three of them. There's three of them. And I was like, it's a daughter of three waters because Oya is a storm, there's rain, transformation. She is powerful. And so that's really where that holy Trinity came in. And I'm super excited. I'm so excited. I've been calling my dad every morning early and been reading him, like, chapter by chapter. And he's. He's an anesthesiologist, right? So he's. I always think of him as super analytical and scientific. Oh, my gosh, he's helping me so much.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Why your father in particular?

[Anita Kopak]

So he was. I had. I had sent it to him, and he was like, I can't see it too well right now. Like he was having a hard time seeing it. And I was like, well, I read the book to my sister Ivana, who's back here, who is my ibc, my twin. And I always reach, like, she's the one who I usually read the book to. She gives me the feedback. I know which way to go. She. If she gets a feeling of what's going to come next, she tells me, and, you know, you've written book? Have you guys written books?

[Charlamagne tha God]

Yeah, justice wrote one.

[Anita Kopak]

So, you know, it's a process. It is hard. Like, as far as, like, sticking to it, writing a full novel. Right. And so to me, I think of them as, like, kind of like infants. And so it's. I have to be really careful who I share my words with because someone might say something that feels like a stab, and then I'm sitting and I can't write for the rest of the day. Right. I did say I was sensitive, right?

[Felicia]

You did.

[Anita Kopak]

And so I'm super careful with who I share with. And so I was like, I am going to call my dad and read this to him. And he has helped me because all of them. This next one takes place in 1909. And so he's helping me stay true to that time. Like, well, would. They would have said that during that time. Did they have a toothbrush? Right? And I'm like, oh, I didn't even look right? And I saw that, you know, only the elite had toothbrushes during that time. And so.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Damn.

[Anita Kopak]

I know.

[Felicia]

How long does it take for you to. How long did the third book actually take to write?

[Anita Kopak]

Yeah, it did not take long, which was interesting because the way I did it, which was very different from the other ways, was that I woke up early, early in the morning and just wrote a little bit every day. And so I would say I started writing around November, and now it's March. Right. And so it was really, I would say, the quickest one, even though I felt like I didn't feel like I was writing a lot because it just felt like I'd wake up in the morning, write some, and then go throughout the day.

[Charlamagne tha God]

I love, you know, the Daughter three Water series. What do you. When it's all said and done right? Like, what do you want these books to do to people? Not just, how do you want it to be received. What do you want them to do to people?

[Anita Kopak]

I want people to feel transformed and go out and do what they came here to do in this world. And I know that might be a big, tall order, but I do. I want that to be the inspiration. And I went to go see, like, a sneak performance of Dreamgirls that's gonna be coming on Broadway.

[Felicia]

Nice.

[Anita Kopak]

The way that made me feel. Oh, I would be so happy if my books made people feel that way. Because I sat there. My cousin Alyssa is in it, and I sat there, and it was the first time I felt unworthy of sitting in an audience seat.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Really?

[Anita Kopak]

Wow, y'.

[State Farm Advertiser]

All.

[Anita Kopak]

When it comes out. When it comes out, y' all have to see it. It's so good. And so I feel like that type of artistry. I hope that my book can do that. And I would love for the IP to turn into movies.

[Felicia]

Tv.

[Anita Kopak]

It will plays. And so it is. Yes. From your lips to God's ear. Yeah.

[DJ Envy]

Well, if you haven't picked it up, pick up the paperback. Release the wind and hard tongue and

[Charlamagne tha God]

go get shallow waters too. Shallow waters is the mother. Okay. The wind on her tongue is the daughter.

[DJ Envy]

And.

[Anita Kopak]

Yeah.

[DJ Envy]

Tell them about your sister's. She's a beekeeper.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Tell them about the.

[DJ Envy]

The bee farm.

[Anita Kopak]

Yes, it is.

[Charlamagne tha God]

I know, but beekeepers are very interesting

[Felicia]

to me, though, like that.

[Charlamagne tha God]

No, that's very interesting to me because honey fire too.

[DJ Envy]

It should be interesting to you too, because when you open the land and them bees come him.

[Charlamagne tha God]

I've been to the farm.

[Lauren LaRose]

Where is he?

[Anita Kopak]

Where is your farm? His wife loves the candles.

[Felicia]

What do you want to know?

[DJ Envy]

Well. Well, first of all, how did you get into being a beekeeper? How did that happen?

[Lauren LaRose]

Can we get another mic?

[DJ Envy]

Yeah, hold on. We'll get you another mic. So you can sit down and everything.

[Felicia]

Yes, like that is very important. People don't eat.

[Anita Kopak]

It is.

[Felicia]

Pay attention.

[DJ Envy]

Is your bag. You guys can move it.

[Felicia]

Yep, absolutely.

[Anita Kopak]

You can put it right there.

[Felicia]

Yeah, you.

[Lomar Farm Beekeeper]

And then what do I just.

[Anita Kopak]

I'm gonna give you an item.

[Felicia]

Okay.

[Anita Kopak]

Thank you so much.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Absolutely.

[DJ Envy]

So how did you get into being a beekeeper?

[Lomar Farm Beekeeper]

Yeah, so I. My husband and I and our two daughters lived in Harlem and we decided to move out to Palisades, New York. And at the same time, we found a six acre farm. And we also saw a documentary called More Than Honey, which talked about the decline in honeybees. So we wanted to revive the property as well as sort of help the bees at the same time. And so we started keeping bees and we became obsessed. We started loving it and learning more about what they do for us in the world. We thought we could help them and they can help us. So sort of a synergetic relationship.

[DJ Envy]

If anybody out there is against the law, just want to tell you it is against the law. If there's a honey beehive and you kill it, you're going to jail.

[Anita Kopak]

You shouldn't want to kill it.

[Felicia]

I know this. Yes, yes.

[Anita Kopak]

No. Yeah, listen, if you have a beehive,

[DJ Envy]

she'll come and get it.

[Anita Kopak]

Call me. She literally can go in, get the hive and then put it into one of the boxes if. I don't know if you still do that. But yeah, it's. She's. Gangsta.

[Felicia]

Yeah.

[DJ Envy]

How many times have you been stung? I'm sorry, Jeff.

[Felicia]

No, it's okay. He said, how many times have you been stung?

[DJ Envy]

Yes. Because I'm curious. It's amazing to me.

[Lomar Farm Beekeeper]

A lot, a lot. But bees are so amazing. Even the venom is medicine. So any. Anytime I get stung, I'm like, okay. It actually helps with arthritis. It's also been tested to help some certain breast cancer. So. So every time I get stung, I'm like, okay, this is. This is medicine. And also the honey is medicine. The propolis is medicine.

[Felicia]

The.

[Lomar Farm Beekeeper]

I mean, everything about the bee is medicine to us.

[Felicia]

We need them.

[Lauren LaRose]

Yeah. I was going to ask you what was the importance of. Of the work that you do in the space with the bees, but here in the healing part of it, do you have people that farm for that specifically?

[Anita Kopak]

I don't, because it's not open to the public.

[Lomar Farm Beekeeper]

But we do have community time where we will have a farm to table dinner to benefit our Palisades library. And if there are people that I

[Anita Kopak]

know that you know that want to

[Lomar Farm Beekeeper]

reach out, I would do it. I would have them come to the farm.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Go look up lamarfarms.com yes, Lamar Farm. Real quick.

[Felicia]

Did you ever see the movie Beekeeper? So I was watching it, and I love Jason State the Man. Felicia Rashad, by the way, movie is great, right? So he was a beekeeper in the movie. And I was talking to, like, somebody I know, and I was telling them, like, yo, he. Because they was joking about him always, like, having a odd job, like, you know, because he kills and everything. But he was protecting the bees, right? And Phyllisa Rashad had a farm, and so they was all like, nah, yo, it's just a movie about him killing them. Like, no, he was protecting the bees because the bees are for healing. Like, every part of the bee, even the venom, everything, like you just said. I was explaining that I ain't know about the breast cancer part, but I did know, like, arthritis and the bones, it helps with, you know, sickness. Niggas tried to tell me I was lying. I'm like, yo, for real. The bee is like one of the.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Because you always lying. It's not because of this bee thing. Don't blame.

[Anita Kopak]

I wasn't lying.

[Felicia]

Yeah, because people don't understand, you know, they just think, you know, oh, it's the bee. Kill it, you know?

[Lomar Farm Beekeeper]

No, because honeybees are medicine and we need them. And it's kind of part of what Anita was saying, and it's like, we've forgotten how to connect with the land. And being a part of that, you know, beekeeping is. Is helping me connect with the land and the healing that the land has for us. It's all here for us.

[Felicia]

Thank you.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Can you explain the difference between massage candles and beeswax candles?

[Anita Kopak]

So our massage candles are made with shea butter.

[Lomar Farm Beekeeper]

It's made with a special mix that you can put on your skin. And you just heat it up and put it on your skin. It's also.

[Anita Kopak]

It's so sexy. You light it and, like, let it melt, and then you blow it out, and then you could pour it either on yourself or your partner. Yes.

[DJ Envy]

Okay.

[Lomar Farm Beekeeper]

The regular beeswax candles. Actually, beeswax, when they're burned, is also medicinal. They act as an air purifier, so it releases negative ions into the air, connects to the positive ions, which is like dust allergy, allergens, and just bring them down out of the air. So that's the regular beeswax.

[Charlamagne tha God]

And then on the website, you have honey, but then you have raw honey.

[Felicia]

Honey.

[Anita Kopak]

It's all raw honey.

[Charlamagne tha God]

All raw honey.

[Felicia]

Okay.

[Anita Kopak]

Yeah.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Okay. And they got soap and body oil.

[DJ Envy]

So we can order from you. So I ain't gotta go to store and get honey anymore. I can order from you?

[Charlamagne tha God]

Absolutely.

[Lomar Farm Beekeeper]

This is a candle.

[Lauren LaRose]

This is.

[Lomar Farm Beekeeper]

This is a beeswax candle. That. This one. Anita brought ones.

[Anita Kopak]

I did. I went in.

[Lomar Farm Beekeeper]

This is our best seller, Wild Mountain Honey Candle. So this has, like, a very strong honey scent. So it's. Yeah.

[DJ Envy]

And Jess, tell it. Tell her your daughter's name. Jess.

[Felicia]

My daughter name is Marley.

[Anita Kopak]

Oh, my gosh. Are you serious?

[Felicia]

Oh, my gosh.

[Lomar Farm Beekeeper]

That's why Lola and Marley.

[Lauren LaRose]

Oh, I love it.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Yes.

[Felicia]

Okay, so this is mine. I knew that the bees were important.

[Anita Kopak]

I wanted to make sure Lauren was going to be here, too.

[DJ Envy]

Thank you so much for joining us, ladies.

[Felicia]

We appreciate you.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Go get shallow water. Go get the wind on her tongue, man. Available both of them in hardcover and paperback.

[DJ Envy]

Ms. Anita Colpax. Thank you so much. It's the Breakfast Club.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Good morning.

[Lomar Farm Beekeeper]

Thank you.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Every day I wake up. Wake your ass up. The Breakfast Club.

[DJ Envy]

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[Commercial Narrator]

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[Charlamagne tha God]

Friends like these the Murder of Skylar Neese is now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney911.

[Anita Kopak]

Do you have an emergency?

[Charlamagne tha God]

I have a 16 year old daughter.

[Anita Kopak]

Can't get a hold of her. I am scared to death. We wanted to talk to Skyler's friends.

[Charlamagne tha God]

They're not telling the full story. The truth is gruesomely horrific.

[Commercial Narrator]

How could you do this to your best friend?

[Anita Kopak]

There's a darker secret that's not been said.

[Charlamagne tha God]

Watch the new Hulu original series Friends like the Murder of Skylar Nese on Hulu and Hulu on Disney for bundle subscribers terms apply.

[Anita Kopak]

This is an iHeart podcast.

[Commercial Narrator]

Guaranteed Human.