INTERVIEW: James Talarico Talks Texas Senate Election, Ken Paxton, Jasmine Crockett, Support for Black Voters & Businesses, Democrats vs. Republicans, Faith & Spirituality + More

Summary

The Breakfast Club Podcast
Episode: Interview with James Talarico: Texas Senate Election, Ken Paxton, Black Voters & Businesses, Democrats vs. Republicans, Faith, & More
Date: August 5, 2026
Host: The Black Effect Podcast Network & iHeartPodcasts
Guests: DJ Envy, Jess Hilarious, Charlamagne Tha God, Angela Rye, and James Talarico

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Episode Overview

In this episode, the Breakfast Club hosts James Talarico, the Democratic nominee for the 2026 U.S. Senate election in Texas. The conversation dives into Talarico's background, campaign strategies, issues around voting rights, race relations within the Democratic Party, Texas politics, economic and justice reform, as well as the unique role of faith and spirituality in his public life. Talarico also addresses controversial topics ranging from marijuana legalization to America’s Israel policy.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. James Talarico's Path to Politics and Motivation

[02:35–06:32]

• Began as a middle school teacher in San Antonio, witnessing firsthand how funding cuts impacted students.
• Experience led to activism and running for office in his hometown of Round Rock, TX, flipping a deep-red district.
• Proud of having “passed 60 bipartisan bills” focused mainly on education and, more recently, voting rights, healthcare, and public policy at the state level.
• On why he ran for Senate: “So many of these fights that I’ve been leading at the State House…are now more urgent than ever at the federal level.”

2. Voting Rights, Gerrymandering, and Redistricting

[06:32–11:41]

• Describes “the most aggressive attack on Black political power since Jim Crow.”
• The Texas Democratic caucus broke quorum and fled the state to block GOP redistricting (“They called the Texas Rangers to find us…” [07:05]).
• Advocates for passing the John Lewis Voting Rights Act and restoring federal protections.
• “If you rob people of their voting rights...you’re essentially cheating. They’re trying to steal an election.” [10:00]
• Critiques mid-decade redistricting as undemocratic manipulation.

3. Coalition Building & Relationship with Jasmine Crockett

[11:41–17:31]

• Discusses working closely with Jasmine Crockett, another young, progressive state legislator and their friendship.
• Addressed online attacks and dog whistles against Crockett post-primary: “Anyone who is sowing division within our coalition is hurting my chances, hurting all of our chances to win.” [16:45]
• Commends Crockett’s prompt and public endorsement after losing the primary: “If I’m being honest, I don’t know if I could have done that the morning after.” [16:03]

4. Democratic Party Strategy and Texas’ Political Shift

[17:31–23:38]

• Emphasizes the need for a “big tent” and practical politics, drawing lessons from LBJ: “You have to see the world from the mountaintop and…from the weeds, and you need to marry those two things together.” [19:22]
• On why Texas is “pink,” not deep red: GOP margins have steadily shrunk.
• Notes competitive polling against Ken Paxton and describes a motivated, youthful base: “Thousands of Texans are showing up at our events. So many young people–their first political event ever.” [23:39]
• Texas’ restrictive voting laws hurt turnout, especially among young and marginalized voters.

5. Corruption, Marijuana, and Corporate Influence

[25:11–27:29]

• Texas recently banned THC products–Talarico is firmly pro-legalization: “This ban is a gift to the drug cartels because Texans are going to keep smoking weed…instead of supporting a local small business, they’re going to go get it on the black market.” [27:00]
• Points to “corruption”—Big Beer and Big Tobacco lobbyists—as driving the ban.
• Believes policies should be about “making people’s lives easier, not harder.” [27:28]

6. Systemic Reform: Electoral College, Supreme Court, & Gerrymandering

[27:53–31:19]

• Praises VP Kamala Harris for promoting Electoral College reform, Supreme Court expansion, and D.C./Puerto Rico statehood.
• Advocates a national ban on gerrymandering: “Until we fix that systemically...we’re not going to see progress on all the other issues.”

7. A Black Agenda: Maternal Mortality, HBCUs, and Black Entrepreneurship

[31:19–37:53]

• Maternal mortality crisis especially urgent for Black women: “Harris county is the deadliest place for a Black woman to give birth in the entire country…” [31:41]
• Supports greatly increased funding for HBCUs.
• Emphasizes the need for federal entrepreneurial grants for Black business owners to address lack of generational wealth (“We could do that in the public sector and then we would reap the benefits.” [36:33])

8. Criticism and Authenticity

[37:53–39:39]

• Addresses criticism labeling him as a “leftist lab experiment”: “I speak my mind…I think what people are hungry for is just someone who’s gonna speak the truth.” [38:06]
• On alleged political grooming for higher office: “The US Senate is the job I want…I’m not going to be applying for any other jobs.” [39:39]

9. On Israel, Gaza, and U.S. Foreign Policy

[40:01–44:55]

• Would not vote to send weapons to Netanyahu’s government, conditioning all aid on halting violence against Palestinians: “My job as a US Senator would be to stop what’s happening…use every bit of our nation’s diplomatic and financial leverage to protect the lives of Palestinians.” [40:38]
• On AIPAC’s influence: “I do think…the influence of AIPAC in our elections has a chilling effect.” [43:14]
• Argues big PACs (AIPAC, OpenAI, etc.) “create a chilling effect” on elected officials’ honesty.

10. Justice Reform and Reality TV Policing

[45:24–48:19]

• Talks about justice reform inspired by the Javier Ambler case (an unarmed Black man killed by police documented on Live PD): “We passed Javier Ambler’s law, which bans reality TV policing in the state of Texas.” [46:31]
• On the flaws of such programming: “[Shows like these] increase the number of violent interactions…because it’s good for ratings.” [47:40]
• On Carmelo Anthony trial and jury composition: “There were no Black members of the jury…and that’s the only evidence you need to prove this system is not working for Black Texans.” [45:32]

11. Texas’ Identity & the Value of Competition

[50:07–55:38]

• Affirms Texas’ complexity: “I honestly think the best color for Texas is purple. Competition is good for policymaking…competition keeps politicians on their toes in both parties.” [50:41]
• Pushes back against the idea that today’s competition breeds only extremism: “When politicians feel the need to actually compete for every vote, that leads to better policymaking and less craziness.” [53:51]

12. Faith, Spirituality, and Politics

[55:38–65:48]

• Says Democrats made a “huge mistake” ceding faith to the right: “We should bring our faith traditions, our moralities, our philosophies, our ethics, our worldviews to our politics.” [55:48]
• Critiques white Christian nationalism and emphasizes the need to “love all neighbors” and call out manipulation of religion: “Love is not shrinking from confrontation…you have to force conflict in order to heal conflict.” [60:18]
• On the line between public expression of faith and imposition: “I am never going to force my religion, my faith, down the throats of my neighbors…But I will talk about how my faith motivates my public service.” [61:51]
• Invokes Matthew 25, parable of the sheep and goats: “What you did for the least of these is what you did for me…if we claim to follow Jesus…then we need to love our neighbors, not just through our words, but through our actions, through our public policy.” [63:33]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On breaking quorum in Texas:
  “We left the state of Texas…to prevent them from getting quorum…They called the Texas Rangers on us.” – James Talarico [07:05]

• On voting rights:
  “This is the most aggressive attack on Black political power since Jim Crow…what they’re doing is robbing people of rights that are inherent to them as human beings.” – James Talarico [07:01, 09:47]

• On coalition and online attacks:
  “Anyone who is sowing division within our coalition is hurting my chances…hurting all of our chances to win.” – James Talarico [16:45]

• On marijuana policy:
  “This bill, this ban is a gift to the drug cartels because Texans are going to keep smoking weed…instead of supporting a local small business, they’re going to get it on the black market.” – James Talarico [27:00]

• On influence of money and AIPAC:
  “The influence of AIPAC in our elections has a chilling effect…and people don’t feel like they can speak their minds because they’re worried AIPAC is going to drop hundreds of millions of dollars in their race.” – James Talarico [43:14]

• On justice and reality TV policing:
  “We passed Javier Ambler’s law, which bans reality TV policing in the state of Texas…these shows increase the number of violent interactions because it’s good for ratings.” – James Talarico [46:31, 47:40]

• On faith and politics:
  “We should bring our faith traditions…to our politics…If we claim to follow Jesus, if we claim to be Christians, then we need to love our neighbors, not just through words, but through our actions, through our public policy.” – James Talarico [55:48, 63:33]

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• James Talarico’s political motivation and background: [02:35–06:32]
• Voting rights and breaking quorum: [06:32–11:41]
• Coalition building post-primary with Jasmine Crockett: [11:41–17:31]
• Texas’ political landscape and Democratic strategy: [17:31–23:38]
• THC ban and policy on marijuana: [25:11–27:29]
• Systemic reform (Electoral College, gerrymandering): [27:53–31:19]
• A Black agenda: maternal mortality, HBCUs, business: [31:19–37:53]
• On authenticity and criticism: [37:53–39:39]
• Israel, Gaza, and political money: [40:01–44:55]
• Justice reform and policing TV shows: [45:24–48:19]
• Texas as a purple state: [50:07–55:38]
• Faith, spirituality, and public life: [55:38–65:48]

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Conclusion

James Talarico’s appearance on The Breakfast Club provided a comprehensive look at his vision—for Texas and the nation—rooted in a blend of pragmatic policy, coalition building, fierce defense of civil rights, economic empowerment for Black Texans, and a frank embrace of faith as a grounding force in politics. Talarico’s candor on intra-party debates, social media toxicity, and the ongoing battle for Texas' political future—all delivered with self-reflective honesty—make this episode a valuable listen for anyone interested in the next wave of Democratic politics and the unique challenges/opportunities in Texas.

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For more insights or to get involved, Talarico directs listeners to jamestalarico.com and closes with a message:
"If you're feeling a little hopeless, if you're doom scrolling, action is the best antidote to that despair. You can't wring your hands when you're rolling up your sleeves." [65:59]

Transcript

[Podcast Host]

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[James Talarico]

Paul Verze here and I want to talk to you about Paul's best podcast. Will Farrow, Big Money Players Network and iHeartRadio. I sit down each week with a special guest and we discuss the absolute best of things.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Pete dav, it's that.

[DJ Envy]

And then there's everything else.

[James Talarico]

Dude, his whole life has sounded like the first drop of a roller coaster. I mean, I can't even tell you, Paul, how crazy it was. It was insane. Listen to Paul's best podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[DJ Envy]

Morning everybody. It's DJ Envy. Just hilarious. Charlamagne the guy we are the Breakfast Club. Our sis, Angela Rye is here with us this morning.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Angela who?

[DJ Envy]

I said Angela Rye is here.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Angela, hi.

[Political Commentator]

Wow.

[DJ Envy]

Sis. Angela, Ry is with us this morning, and we got a special guest in the building. We have James Talarico. Welcome.

[James Talarico]

Thanks for having me.

[DJ Envy]

How are you feeling this morning?

[James Talarico]

Feeling good. Thank you all for, for the, the invitation.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Absolutely. James is the Democratic nominee in the 2026 U.S. senate election in Texas. Now, I told somebody you was coming up here and they said, oh, his internals must show he's down bad with black people.

[James Talarico]

Is that the case actually shows the opposite. You know, the polling that we've seen, both private and public, shows us outperforming recent Democratic nominees in Texas with black voters. But we have a lot more work to do, and we got to keep our foot on the gas because it's going to take all of us to, to win this race, including Jasmine Crockett. I haven't polled Congressman Crockett, but you know, she has been out there campaigning for down ballot candidates all over the state of Texas, kind of shining a spotlight on candidates who don't get to come on the Breakfast Club, but are still running really important races all over the state. And so this is very much a team effort to make this happen. And it really feels like this is probably the best shot we've had in 30 years.

[DJ Envy]

Now, let's start from the beginning. I'd like to start from the beginning. What got you into politics? Why are you here? What made you say, this is what I want to do, this is why I want to help people?

[James Talarico]

Well, before I was a politician, I was a public school teacher. I taught 6th grade language arts at Rhodes Middle School on the west side of San Antonio. I always say that teaching middle school is the best preparation for politics. If you can handle the drama of a middle school classroom, you can handle the drama of the Texas House or the U.S. senate. And the west side of San Antonio is one of the poorest zip codes in the state of Texas. I entered the classroom in the fall of 2011, right after the state legislature in Texas cut $5 billion from public schools. So as a brand new teacher, I saw the impact of those of those cuts firsthand. At one point, I had 45 students in one classroom. There weren't enough desks for all those kids. And so I had students sitting on the air conditioning unit. And that, you know, got me mad. I mean, this is the wealthiest country in human history. This is the 21st century, and you've got kids sitting on the air conditioning unit. So I, when I left the classroom, I led an education nonprofit that was helping schools like mine in central Texas. And Then when a seat in that same legislature opened up in my hometown of Round Rock, Texas, I threw my hat in the ring. I was 28 years old. I hadn't never run for office before. I was a Democrat running in a Trump district in a county that was so red it hadn't voted for a Democrat for president since Jimmy Carter. And so I was told by all the powers that be in the Democratic Party that the race was lost cause, that I shouldn't spend any time or effort on this project. But my neighbors and I in Williamson county, we believed it was possible. We ran an aggressive campaign, an authentic campaign, an unorthodox campaign at times. And on election night, we flipped that district with 51% of the vote. And now I'm in my fourth term in the Texas House. I've gotten to pass major policies through the legislature. It's not an easy place to work as a Democrat, as you can imagine. Like, we don't have either chamber, we don't have the governor's mansion, we don't have any agency. But I've been able to pass 60 bipartisan bills, many of them around education, helping schools like the one I taught in, helping students like mine all over the state. And now so many of these fights that I've been leading at the state House for education, for voting rights, for healthcare access, all those are. Those fights are now more urgent than ever at the federal level. We've seen a full frontal assault on public education in D.C. too. So that's what motivated me to step up and throw my hat in the ring again for this U.S. senate seat.

[Political Commentator]

You all, you talked about voting rights, you rose to some prominence nationally with the voting rights issues taking place in Texas. Really, where I believe conservatives tested out the ability to start to take away seats. Mid, mid decade redistricting. Can you talk a little bit about how you would continue in this fight as a senator? Of course, all of the Voting Rights act sections that have given us black fol protection are gutted.

[James Talarico]

That's right.

[Political Commentator]

So what would you do to ensure that we regain some of our voting rights?

[James Talarico]

Yeah, I mean, this is the most aggressive attack on black political power since Jim Crow. And I know it sounds like a big statement to make, but I mean, you look at the last 12 months, you look at these Supreme Court cases, you look at this racist redistricting map in Texas, and I say racist because it is systematically diluting the voting power of black and brown Texans. And when you look at now how the districts are drawn, a white Texan has a Lot more political power. Their vote matters more than the vote of our black and brown neighbors. And it's why last year, a year ago yesterday, my colleagues and I in the Texas House took the extraordinary step of breaking quorum. And what that for those that don't follow legislative politics, in order to conduct business on the floor of the House, you have to have something called a quorum, which is a certain number of members present in order to start the day. And what we did is, my colleagues and I, we left the state of Texas, we went up to Illinois in order to prevent them from getting quorum. So they couldn't, they couldn't take up these new maps because we were gone. And they actually, they, they, they called the Texas Rangers on us to find us and, and arrest us and bring us back to the Capitol. We got bomb threats and death threats when we were up in Chicago. But we did it not because it's necessarily a sustainable legislative tactic. Like we're a part time legislature in Texas. Our, our members have families and kids and aging parents that they've got to get back to. We have, you know, jobs that we got to get back to. But the goal strategically was to shine a national spotlight on those maps because when they first kind of got introduced last summer, no one was talking about it. And by breaking quorum, suddenly the whole national media was talking about this redistricting power grab. And then you saw California and Virginia and other states get in the fight to try to try to level the playing field and cancel out the stolen seats in Texas. And so I'm really proud of what we did. But to answer your question, the first thing that we have to do when we win this seat, when we have a government that actually serves people, we have to pass the John Lewis Voting Rights Act. We have to restore federal voting rights protections. Because my faith is very important to me and I believe that these rights are God given. I don't think these rights come from politicians because if they come from politicians, it means politicians can take them away. I think they are inherent to each person, to each citizen.

[Political Commentator]

They have to get them away.

[James Talarico]

Well, yeah, but so I'm saying like what they are doing is robbing people of rights that are inherent to them as human beings. That, that the ability to shape your own destiny, the ability for all of us to shape our own destiny, that that comes from something a lot bigger than, than any elected official or any political party. And it's why it's a red line, right? We can disagree on budget policy, we can disagree on education Policy. But if you rob people of their voting rights, that means we don't have a shot in the next election to make our case and change the power structure. And so you're essentially, you mentioned mid decade, and this is also confusing for folks who don't obsess about politics. But you're supposed to to adjust district boundaries at the beginning of every decade after we get a census because population changes and you want to adjust the districts. Right. If you've got a place that's growing rapidly or a place that's declining, you got to adjust. So everybody has one vote, one person, one vote. But what they're doing in Texas is they are redrawing the lines in the middle of the decade, which is unprecedented. I mean, it's like changing the rules after halftime because you're worried the other team's going to win the game. I mean, it's cheating. Like that's, that's the real word for it is they are cheating. They're trying to steal an election. And I think more politicians should say that they're cheating.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Yes, just like that.

[James Talarico]

Yeah. I mean, I made the joke about middle school being good preparation, but it's actually true. Like as a middle school teacher, I had to boil down complicated things. So a bunch of 11 year olds who didn't want to be there, who were forced to be there by law, would understand what I was talking about. And, you know, people are busy. Like, people have jobs, they've got lives, they got families to take care of and they don't have time to obsess on over politics and watch all the coverage. And so they just want to know, like, simply, what are you talking about? What are you going to do for me and my family? And I'm trying to speak as plainly as I can about some of these issues that we're facing.

[Political Commentator]

I think some of the issues around the mid decade redistricting is what kind of created the fever pitch around your primary. When I think about a quorum breaker, I also think about Jasmine Crockett who did that in the state house. And so I'm curious, when she was in the state house, were you all friends? Did you all ally around some pieces of policy, some legislation?

[James Talarico]

We were, you know, partly because like we were some of the only young people in the state house, like everybody else is, like my grandparents age. And so she and I bonded immediately because we were younger. I think we were also, we tended to be the troublemakers in the house. And from the moment she walked onto the floor, actually before she walked on the floor, because I'd followed her campaign. Like, I saw what a star she was. You can just tell she still is. She still is. She still is. And it was so apparent from those. Those, you know, that first campaign and her first time in the Texas House. And so, yeah, we were friends. And then she got elected to Congress, and then the Senate primary, and it was, I think, even more painful, at least for me, because of that friendship. Primaries always suck because they're kind of in the coalition, in the family, and. And. And they can. They can be really painful because there's not a ton of policy differences. Right? So it's more like, how are you going to campaign? And. And. And those tactical questions and then personalities, and it just gets really, really ugly, especially now with social media. But I'm still a huge fan.

[Political Commentator]

And so to that point, two weeks ago, you were at a town hall. I know Keith Edwards came up. Rogue DNC came up, folks who were adamant about attacking Jasmine online. And you said that you wanted them to keep Jasmine's name out of their mouths. The primary's over. Do you wish you would have said that sooner?

[James Talarico]

The first day that the congresswoman got in the race, I put out a video on social media, sent it to our 50,000 volunteers, sent it to our entire campaign staff, every person who worked for the campaign. And you go back and watch it. It was in December. And I said that Congresswoman Crockett is my friend. She is a leader, and she deserves our utmost respect. And then I kept repeating it throughout the campaign because I kept seeing this vitriol on social media. And obviously, I can't police every single comment section, but I can show leadership. And, you know, I look back, and it's possible I could have showed more leadership, because, again, this is so much bigger than me. It's so much bigger than Congresswoman Crockett. I mean, we have to win this race. People are dying in our state because of policies that have been passed by the extremists in Texas. And so this is a lot bigger than any of us. And people online, especially people who don't live in Texas, who are just, like, pushing their own agenda or trying to make some kind of political point at our expense. I'm like, we don't have time for that. We have to win to help our people in Texas. And so whatever agenda you have, whatever clicks or likes you're trying to get on social media, take that elsewhere, because we have work to do in Texas.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

But it does help your campaign. Right? I want you to really Answer this question. If you saw these coded, I guess, racial dog whistles that were undermining Jasmine Crockett, it doesn't really behoove you to step out there and be like, hey, don't do that, because you still want to win. Right.

[James Talarico]

Well, so I would disagree, because attacks on the congresswoman, I think, make it harder for us to win this general election because the whole coalition has to be together. Like in Texas. There's no way for any one of our communities to win this election alone. And so we need black Texans to win this race. And then if, you know, when we win this race in November, I'll represent the most African Americans of any senator in the country. And so all these attacks have, I think, hurt our campaign. They have hurt our coalition, They've hurt our chances of winning in November. I still think we're going to win, but this has made it harder, I would say, because that was one of

[Interviewer/Co-host]

the racial dog whistles that they said that she wasn't electable. Like, you could win statewide, but she couldn't.

[James Talarico]

Yep. And I got asked about this on the View on national television, and they asked me point blank, like, do you think Congresswoman Crockett is electable? I said, absolutely. And I said, you know, if she wins this primary, like, I'm gonna be behind her 1000%.

[DJ Envy]

What's your relationship now?

[James Talarico]

Obviously, the primary was. Was difficult. We've exchanged some messages. I was blown away by the fact that the morning after the primary, I mean, like, early the next morning, Congressman Crockett was out there with a statement endorsing me and the entire ticket. If I'm being very honest, I don't know if I. If I could have done that the morning after. Right. I would. Probably had to take a day before I was ready to. To come out and really. And do that. Yeah.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

I mean, it's hard because you said, you know, it's all about winning this,

[James Talarico]

of course, but, I mean. But we're all still human beings.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Yeah.

[James Talarico]

Right. Like, you can know the work is important, and it can still hurt you personally.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

That's what I meant when I said, you know, when you see her being attacked.

[James Talarico]

Yeah.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

It. It. Does it help your campaign when that happens? Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

I don't know.

[James Talarico]

I. I just. I. I really think that anyone who is sowing division within our coalition is. Is hurting my chances, hurting all of our chances to win. But, I mean, she. She. She put all of that behind the. The work. And she came out that morning and endorsed. The entire ticket, endorsed me. And then now she's been campaigning all over the state for these down ballot candidates. And still in the fight, like she, once she has a job. Right. She, she's a sitting congresswoman. She could also just like, you know, take a breather and take a beat and walk away for a little bit. I don't think any of us would blame her for doing that, but she's out there hitting the trail and like

[Political Commentator]

raising money and blaming her for doing what they see as not campaigning hard enough for you.

[James Talarico]

And I think, again, I think that's wrong.

[Political Commentator]

It's a. I think it's representative of what is happening within the Democratic Party. So there's now dsa, there's establishment Democrats and all of those divides. How do you plan to bring all of those folks into a big tent, which you will absolutely need to win in the general in Texas?

[James Talarico]

Yes. You know, this is LBJ's Senate seat that I'm running for. We were talking about the Voting Rights act that was signed into law by a Texas Democrat, by a Texas teacher, by Lyndon Johnson. I think lbj, he brought together two things that right now are being pitted against each other in the party. One is a bold moral imagination about how we could transform the country, not people. Every time Democrats get in power, at least over the last few decades, it's all like incremental nibbling around the edges. LBJ was not nibbling around the edges. I mean, Medicare, Medicaid, head Start, Title 1, Voting Rights Act, Civil Rights act, public television. I mean, the ambition of the Great Society is really unrivaled in modern times.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

He also had black people on his

[Political Commentator]

head, I was just about to say.

[James Talarico]

Exactly. And he was smart enough. He was smart enough to listen to the activists and the organizers who were pushing him. Right.

[Political Commentator]

Virtually.

[James Talarico]

Yeah, well, politicians were a stubborn breed, and you've got to push politicians. I've told people in Texas, I am your megaphone. But you have to speak into it. Right. Like I am there as your representative. And it only works if there's a real relationship between you and the people you're seeking to serve. But the other thing he LBJ brought was a practical politics of winning, which is, I think, something you're hearing the Democratic Party. It's like there are folks who want to win and there are folks who want to change the country. And I guess my thing is those two things are not mutually exclusive.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Right.

[James Talarico]

You need both. You have to kind of see the world from the mountaintop, and you've got to see the world from the weeds, and you need to marry those two things together in order to actually get stuff done. That's what LBJ did in partnership with Dr. King and Andrew Young and Jesse Jackson. I mean, I think you have to, we have to get the party back to that place because I honestly think we're going to get one more shot as a party before working people in this country, black, white and brown, aren't going to trust us again to fight for them.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

And that's only because Trump is so bad. Right?

[James Talarico]

I mean, people are. I would agree with that because people are. You know, a lot of folks in Texas voted for Donald Trump in last election because they thought he was going to get the economy back on track. Like, they didn't like how he talked to people. They didn't like January 6th, but they remembered the economy of 2017, of 2018, 2019. And that was a good economy. And, you know, I would say that was Barack Obama's economy. But, you know, Donald Trump was presiding over it, and people were desperate to get back to a place where they could afford groceries and gas and insurance and healthcare. And so they took a chance on Trump. And I don't blame them for that. Like, there were so especially young people in our state, some of them, I mean, President Trump is really the only leader they've, they've really known for a long time. And I think now a lot of them are, are seeing that the administration has done the opposite, right? On tariffs, the war in Iran. I mean, all that stuff has been driving up prices all over the state of Texas. It's been, it's been making this affordability crisis even worse. And so now they're, a lot of people are feeling disillusioned, right, because they put their faith in, in the president. He's let them down. You know, they thought he was going to release the Epstein files. He did the opposite. And so now they're just kind of, they're in a weird place. And what I'm trying to do is welcome them into this movement that we're building in Texas.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Is Texas. You know, it's always portrayed as deep red, right? Is it actually conservative, or is it just a state where Democrats haven't figured out how to communicate with enough voters?

[James Talarico]

Well, so if you look at the last 15, 20 years of statewide election results in Texas, you will see an unmistakable trend line toward more competitive elections. And that's not true for, you know, you think about Florida was a swing state. Now it's not Ohio moving in the wrong direction, but Texas is very much in the vein of Georgia and Arizona. Right. Sunbelt states, incredibly diverse, rapidly growing. And, and those two states, Georgia and Arizona, they were hopelessly red until they weren't. The challenge is Texas is a lot bigger than both of those states. Right. The entire population of Georgia is equal to the entire population of Dallas Fort Worth. So if you think about all the, you think about the number of Georgia's and Arizona's that can fit into Texas, you start to see, see the, the, the scope of the challenge that we face. But yeah, I mean, Republicans, when I was growing up in Texas, they would win by 25, 30 points. Now they're winning by single digits. So I would say that Texas, just by the numbers, is a pink state.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Why are you convinced this moment is different? Like how we know this is not Beto O' Rourke 2.0?

[James Talarico]

Well, you know, in 2018, Beto got within two and a half points of beating Ted Cruz. That was the last Trump midterm that we've had. This is the second Trump midterm in 2026. I think the backlash, honestly the bipartisan backlash to the extremism and the corruption in our government is bigger than it was in 2018. And then I didn't think it was possible to find a candidate worse than Ted Cruz, but I think we found him in Ken Paxton. So I think the stars are aligning to finally allow us to end 30 years of one party rule in our state. And I think Texans are hungry for it. I mean, Republicans control everything, right, at every level of government. And Texans are really angry about the state of this economy. They're angry about data centers, they're angry about these tariffs, and they're looking for change. And, and we're, we're providing a hopeful vision for people to get behind. And it's why we're leading in every poll that's come out this month against Ken Paxton. We've never seen a Texas Democrat leading in polls like this.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

So in the last three, right?

[James Talarico]

Yeah, I mean, I think, yeah, might have been the last four or five, but so it's matching the, the energy on the ground that I'm seeing. I mean, we've had thousands of Texans showing up at our events. They've been hitting capacity. So many young people showing up at the events who say it's the first political event they've ever attended. And then you have the hard data like these polls that just show that there is a coalition forming. But again, we have to keep our foot on the gas. They are going to throw everything they've got at me. They're going to drop, you know, $200 million to try to stop us. So we're in a really good position right now. But we cannot take anything for granted. And we have to make sure that people have the knowledge and the skills and the tools to actually overcome some of this voter suppression. Because it's really hard to vote in Texas. It's one of the hardest places to vote in the country. It's why we have the second lowest voter turnout rate. You have to register a whole month in advance for the election. I had messages on TikTok and Instagram from young folks in the primary who were like, I was really excited to go and vote and I didn't realize I had to register a month ago. So anybody listening in Texas, make sure you register to vote because you can't do it the day of. And there's no online voter registration. You have to change your registration every time you move, which really hurts young people. So there are just a lot of systemic barriers that people have to overcome. And, and we're going to have to do the organizing work on the ground. We have 59,000 volunteers on the campaign, but we're gonna need to do that in every community to make sure that folks can fulfill those God given rights.

[DJ Envy]

What's important that people are not talking about more? You talk about the THC on your social media, about banning thc, but what's important that people are not talking about? That's important to you and important to people?

[James Talarico]

No, no, no. I'm for legalizing weed. I'm talking about Texas officially banned thc.

[DJ Envy]

And he's like, it's not gonna stop.

[James Talarico]

And I don't think people, I don't think people are aware that this is really happening. It just, I mean, the law just went into effect. But THC products are virtually banned in the state of Texas. I mean, now it's a felony to have Delta 8. I mean, even DUIs. I mean, you have to have a, you have to have three DUIs to get a felony. And now just having Delta 8 can get you that felony. So I mean, like, it's, it's, it's insane. And, and I mentioned corruption. This is because of corruption. Think about what industries are most worried about THC products being readily available.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Big.

[James Talarico]

Big Beer, Big Tobacco. Right? And so they were the ones pushing this THC ban because it hurts their bottom line. Right? And, and a lot of research shows that thc, cannabis, these products are safer and less addictive than beer or tobacco. And so to me, this is a Prime example of what corruption looks like when you've got big industries buying politicians and pushing bills that harm people but benefit them financially. And I think a lot of Texans, a lot of young Texans, a lot of our veterans, they use THC products for ptsd. Seniors use it. Yeah.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Send the Bible to Burning Bush.

[James Talarico]

Well, I mean, I mean, I mean,

[Political Commentator]

we're not the Burning Bush.

[James Talarico]

Well, well, I mean, they, they legalized hemp in Texas. I think it was six years ago. And this is now a booming industry in our state. I mean, these are local small businesses. This bill, this ban is a gift to the drug cartels because Texans are going to keep smoking weed. They're going to keep eating edibles. They're not going to stop because some politicians told them to. But now, instead of supporting a local small business, they're going to go get it on the black market.

[DJ Envy]

They don't know what they're getting, what they're smoking, what's in it, and.

[James Talarico]

Right, right, right. I mean, it's, it's. It just drives me crazy when you have these policies that, that clearly don't serve people, actively hurt people. I mean, things are so hard right now. Like, Texans can't afford the basics. They can't get ahead no matter how hard they work or how much they save. And you're going to ban a product that gives them a little bit of peace. Like, it just, it just drives me crazy. We should be trying to make people's lives easier, not making their lives harder. Like, that's the, that's the line.

[Political Commentator]

Sorry. We know cost of living is a huge issue for every American, but there are also some big picture ideas you keep referencing young people in particular who want to hear. Recently, Madam Vice President Kamala Harris appeared at the Urban League, and she mentioned some things that many of us have been touting for a little bit. Eddie, I think we have that sound.

[James Talarico]

We need to revisit the Electoral College.

[Political Commentator]

We need to revisit the point of expanding the court to 13 justices. Like we have 13 district courts. We need to revisit if they so

[James Talarico]

want statehood for Puerto Rico and D.C. yes.

[Political Commentator]

So, yeah, I think it's great.

[James Talarico]

Yeah. I mean, really happy that the vice president is, is calling for these systemic political reforms. And I mentioned the John Lewis Voting Rights act, but I, I think those measures she, she talked about should be part of that package. And I think I would add one more. And I know the vice president supports this because she was a big supporter of, of our quorum break last summer. A national ban to End gerrymandering nationwide in red states and blue states. Because this, I don't think people realize this, this issue of redistricting, of gerrymandering, of drawing district lines, and you draw these districts into these crazy shapes in order to manufacture an outcome. What ends up happening is that most lawmakers at the federal level, at the state level are in either deep red seats that, that are always going to vote for Republicans or deep blue seats that are always going to vote for Democrats. And so in those districts which are now the majority of districts, your only threat as a politician, your only threat to your reelection is from your most either far right flank in a Republican primary or the far left flank in the Democratic primary. And so the incentives that's in front of any elected official is to really just appeal to the most extreme elements in your party. Like if you, if you have a district like the one that I won in Williamson county, that's a 50, 50 swing district, then you've got to appeal to a broad coalition of people. You got to kind of speak to, to mainstream issues that are really impacting folks. But, like, the reason you see crazy stuff in Texas, like, I had to, I'm on the Public Education Committee. There was a bill to. I can't believe I'm saying this, but a bill to go after furries in schools. There was this Internet rumor that students were dressing up as cats in public schools and in Jersey, too. Yeah. And that. That they were giving. The rumor was that public schools in Texas were giving students litter boxes in the school. It wasn't true. There were no documented cases in Texas of that happening. But they wrote a whole bill to go after this problem of furries in schools, and it's because it's a red meat issue in these Republican primaries. So the reason you're seeing such crazy stuff in our politics is because the system itself encourages extremism. And until we fix that systemically, until we do some of the things the vice president was talking about, until we pass the Voting Rights act, until we fix the system itself, we're not going to see progress on all the other issues we care about education and healthcare and jobs and housing. So I'm a big believer in political reform. Like. Like the vice president's talking about.

[Political Commentator]

You mentioned voting rights several times. When you consider a black agenda to urge black voters in Texas to support your campaign, what are some of the things beyond justice reform, beyond thc, beyond SNAP benefits and food stamps, that you would encourage black voters to pay attention to regarding your platform?

[James Talarico]

Well, I mean, we've talked about some of the issues that all Texans are struggling with, including housing.

[Political Commentator]

But I mean, specifically black.

[James Talarico]

Yes. So there's those issues, and then there are the issues that concern black Texans in particular. And so in addition to the ones we've talked about the maternal mortality crisis in Texas, which is three times deadlier for black women. Harris county, home to Houston, is the deadliest place for a black woman to give birth in the entire country. And so we've rolled out a comprehensive plan to combat that crisis at the federal level. I worked with my colleague, Representative Tony Rose. Shout out to Tony Rose in Dallas. She passed a historic bill at the state Capitol to increase postpartum coverage on Medicaid to now one year to help new mothers, particularly new black mothers, tend to their health and the health of their newborn.

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[James Talarico]

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[James Talarico]

That's a state policy. But at the federal level, we could guarantee universal paid family leave for every mother, including every black mother. We could improve provider training, we could improve data collection. We could, we could end some of these maternal care deserts in Texas, you know, in Texas, a huge state, by requiring insurance companies to, to cover doulas and midwife services. So there's so much we could do at the federal level to combat this, this crisis. The second I would, you know, I've been touring HBCUs across the state. We held a town hall at Prairie View A and M. And then I gave the, the commencement address at Paul Quinn College, which is the oldest HBCU in Texas. And there is a funding gap between HBCUs and institutions with a similar number of low income students. And imagine if we brought HBCU funding up to parity. You know, what schools like Prairie View and, and Texas Southern and Paul Quinn could accomplish, could do if we gave them the funding that they needed. And, and so some of these, these issues that, that we've been hearing about, meeting with black business leaders and black faith leaders, they're all now being incorporated into our platform because there are issues that affect all Texans and then there are issues that impact black Texans in particular.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

I didn't hear nothing about like upward mobility just for like black working class people. You know, the things you named are great, but just what do you plan to do? Just for working class black people in Texas?

[James Talarico]

Yeah, you know, they've been attacking black businesses in Texas. There's a, a program called Hub, which is for historically underutilized businesses. Helps kind of level the playing field for black entrepreneurs. And they have attacked that program, they've defunded that program. In Texas. So I hear all the time, especially from young black Texans who are entrepreneurs who have a great idea for business and they can't access capital. And so I think at the federal level we can ensure that we're providing entrepreneurial grants to the next great business leaders in our community. I mean, you think about Tesla, you think about the Internet, those were only possible because government, the public sector, invested in those private companies and gave them the startup they needed. And we could do that with young black entrepreneurs across our state who have great ideas and want to start a business. And they don't have access to that capital that they need. They don't have generational wealth, they don't have a rich dad who can cut a check, they don't have a network of rich friends that can invest in that company. We could do that in the public sector and then we would reap the benefits. I mean, I don't think anyone thinks the small amount of money we invested in Tesla or invested in R and D to get the Internet, those investments paid off many times over. And I think the same could be true investing in young entrepreneurs and in black owned businesses across the state.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

What do you say to people who said you were created in a labor. What I've seen that I saw, it says from arguing God is non binary to grieving over protecting the unborn, it's clear Talarico is a leftist lab experiment gone wrong.

[James Talarico]

Oh, interesting. You know, I speak my mind and I did over my four terms in the State House. And I don't always say everything perfectly. I've certainly missed the mark on some things that I've said in the past. But at least people can, they can count on me for actually speaking the truth, for saying what I think. There's a lot of politicians who don't ever say anything because they're too worried about offending someone or messing up. But I think what people are hungry for is just someone who's gonna, who's gonna speak the truth, who's gonna speak their mind, who's gonna be honest about how they feel about things. And so, yeah, I mean, there are some things that I've, that I've said over my four terms that I probably would say differently if I could go back. But I think what has been consistent throughout my entire time is who I fight for and how I fight. And I think that's what Texans are desperate for right now. They just want someone who's going to actually fight for them. And in this race, the alternative is Ken Paxton, who is the most corrupt politician in our state who has a history of serving himself, of enriching himself on the public diamond. And I'll put my record up against Ken Paxton's career of corruption any day.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Yeah, I've just heard people say that they feel like you're being, I guess, groomed. Right? Like if you do well in the Senate, you might be on the. Be vice president in 2028, but if you actually win, you might run for president in 2028.

[James Talarico]

I'm gonna be, God willing, the US senator from Texas for the next six years, and that's the job I want. That's the job I'm going to have and not going to be applying for any other jobs. I hopefully, if all this goes well, we'll be running for reelection to the. To the US Senate six years from now.

[Political Commentator]

To Lenard's point, you. Any, any candidate on a national stage is being forced to contend with the genocide in Gaza. And I think what is remarkable is in most cases, including in interviews you've done, the statement is made. Israel has a right to defend itself. As a senator, you will have to vote on whether or not Israel should receive military aid. How would you vote on whether or not the country gives Israel military aid?

[James Talarico]

Yeah, I would not vote to send weapons to the Netanyahu government.

[Political Commentator]

But what about military aid? Like, is it more broader?

[James Talarico]

Yeah, I think all of that needs to be conditioned on ending the death and the destruction in Gaza and the West Bank. I've been very outspoken on this issue from the beginning of the campaign.

[Political Commentator]

But you're specific to say death and destruction and not genocide. Why is that?

[James Talarico]

Well, you know, I know that the legal term genocide is being litigated in the International Criminal Court, and certainly there's evidence to bring those charges. And, and I think the United States should abide by whatever ruling is that the court comes to. But I think as a US Senator, my job would be to take action. Right. My job would not be to litigate what terms are used. My job would be to stop what's happening. And that's why I've said I would use every bit of our nation's diplomatic and financial leverage to protect the lives of Palestinians. And my North Star on this, on this issue is always protecting innocent life. Obviously, what happened on October 7th was horrific. And I grieve for the lost Israeli lives. And I grieve for the lost Palestinian lives. When I first got in the race, I was asked about this the first week of the campaign, and I quoted a theologian who said, I screamed at God, for. For the starving children, until I realized the starving children was God screaming at me. And God is screaming at all of us in Gaza and in the west bank. And we have to heed those cries. And it demands action. And so I've gotten some heat for saying that I would stop those weapon sales and condition that military aid. But I think we all have to meet this. This moral moment. And our country is complicit in what's happening. And I know, at least I, for one, can't stand by and do nothing while it's happening.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Why is it so hard for some elected officials to criticize Bibi Netanyahu?

[James Talarico]

I don't know. I mean, I have no problem criticizing any leader, certainly any foreign leader. And I don't.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

You know, I think sometimes when people think they're criticizing Bibi, that's an indictment of all of Israel or

[James Talarico]

all of our Jewish neighbors right here in this country. And I've stood by the Jewish community in my state, in my community in Central Texas, every time they've faced antisemitism, just like I've stood by our Muslim neighbors when they're facing Islamophobia.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

But isn't that ridiculous? I can be pro America, anti Trump.

[James Talarico]

Oh, absolutely. But, I mean, let's back to the issue of corruption. Be honest. I do think the influence of AIPAC in our elections has a chilling effect. And people don't feel like they can speak their minds because they're worried AIPAC is going to drop, you know, hundreds of millions of dollars in their race, usually not even talking about the issue of Israel or issues that Jewish Americans face. These are usually completely separate issues that they're campaigning on. So I do think the reason I keep going back to money and politics and corruption is I do think it's the rot at the core of our broken system. And until you fix that system, like the vice president is. Is proposing, until you get the big money out of our politics, until you ban corporate PACs and super PACs, we're not going to be able to, one, have elected officials who can speak their mind. Two, we're not gonna be able to make progress on all those issues that we care about, whether they're here or abroad. So I think every. I always think you just follow the money, and everything comes back to the influence of these giant packs on our political process. Same is true of AI I mean, there are a lot of candidates around the country who are being very careful about what they say on AI because they're worried these giant AI companies are going to drop hundreds of millions of dollars against them. So you just. We have to have a democratic, small d democratic system where. Where candidates can say what they think and then be judged on that. But right now it's. It's basically these giant packs, whether it's APAC, whether it's OpenAI that are. That are creating a chilling effect, and then people, you know, can't speak their mind.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Why small D?

[James Talarico]

Well, capital D. Democratic party would be the party I belong to, but democracy is beyond any political party. Oh, this guy's a jerk.

[DJ Envy]

You know that, right? Why?

[James Talarico]

Small day middle school is the best preparation for politics.

[Advertisement Voice]

Okay.

[James Talarico]

Including Charlamagne. Charlamagne's a good student, and I'm not giving up on him. Yeah, he's got. He's got potential.

[DJ Envy]

He just woke up. Question. Now you talk.

[James Talarico]

No, I know you said in your

[DJ Envy]

state of Texas, we've seen what happened with Carmelo Anthony, and you said it was a tragedy.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Yeah.

[DJ Envy]

What did you mean by that?

[James Talarico]

Well, I've done a lot of work in the state house on justice reform, and right now we've got a system that doesn't serve all Americans equally. And we know that black Texans have been. Have not gotten the justice they deserve in many cases. And, you know, I'm not an expert on this particular case, but I know that there were no black members of the jury. And to me, that's. That's the only evidence you need to really prove that this system is not working for black Texans. And so I'm going to keep doing the work I did in the state house trying to reform this system. One of the bills that I passed was after the murder of one of my constituents. His name was Javier Ambler. Unarmed black men who was killed by the Williamson County Sheriff's Department. He was pulled over for not dimming his brights. He told the officers that night that he had a heart condition. They tased him so many times, he died right in front of them. The whole thing was filmed for a reality TV show called Live pd, kind of like Cops. And so I worked with Javier's family, his sister Kimberly, and we went office by office in the state House, Republicans and Democrats alike. And we passed Javier Ambler's law, which bans reality TV policing in the state of Texas. So no longer can a show like Live PD or Cops contract with a law enforcement agency in Texas. And that's just one small reform. That same session, the George Floyd act, which would have had many more significant reforms to policing in the state of Texas, didn't even get a hearing. Didn't even get.

[DJ Envy]

Why was the taping important for you to ban and not banning the fact that they tased this gentleman with a bad.

[James Talarico]

Yeah, so these. We absolutely. Like I said, the George Floyd act would have had a lot more of the reform to actual policing. But the reason we went after these shows is because Kimberly and I started to dig into some of the research on these reality TV policing programs, and the evidence is very clear that these shows increase the number of violent interactions.

[DJ Envy]

Copy. Performative.

[James Talarico]

Correct. Because it's good for ratings.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Right.

[James Talarico]

Like, you treat one of your black constituents respectfully. That's not good tv. And so these shows, and. And I. I think these, the producers actively encourage more violence, more aggression. And then my constituents, like Javier Ambler, are the ones who pay the ultimate price for that. And so, again, this was just one reform. But if we can. If we can go piece by piece and try to. Try to make this system actually work for everybody, including every black Texan, then we can have a. We can have true public safety.

[DJ Envy]

Did you get backlash for saying Carmelo Anthony verdict was a tragedy at all?

[James Talarico]

Yes.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Yeah.

[James Talarico]

I mean, in this day and age, like, you're always gonna get backlash for. For whatever. Yeah. And at the end of the day, I have to. I have to look myself in the mirror. At the end of the day, I've got to be comfortable with the race that I ran, and I've got to be true to myself. And my gut is that Texans are hungry for someone who believes what they believe and is authentic and is grounded and rooted in something deeper than partisanship or politics. And so even if they disagree with me on. On an issue, I hope they can sense that it is genuine and that I'm here to serve them. I'm going to do that as authentically as I possibly can.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Do you get backlash from AIPAC for not taking their money?

[James Talarico]

Thankfully, AIPAC has not spent against me in this race. But I had. You know, I was. You know, I talked about it. You know, sometimes it's painful. On the campaign trail, after I spoke out on Gaza, there was an article that said I was anti Semitic, which was very painful to me, given the work I've done, done with the Jewish community in Texas. You know, I. I have so much love and respect for the Jewish tradition. It's what gave birth to my religious tradition. And so to be called anti Semitic because of my criticisms of Benjamin Netanyahu is painful for me personally. But again, this is just part of the territory. No one asked me to run for the U.S. senate. No one made me do this. I stepped up to run, and it's such an honor to do this. And there's so much energy and excitement around the campaign that it makes all that other stuff definitely worth it. But, you know, you gotta, you gotta be ready for the slings and arrows that, that come with, with the territory. So.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

And I heard you on Joe Rogan. That's one of the first time I heard of you. But, you know, Joe also on Tuesday warned liberals that moving to Texas and turning the state blue would ruin the delicate balance for everybody, including liberal Texans. The liberals that want to turn Texas blue, like, don't. You're going to ruin it. He said many coastal elites and coastal snobs often have this idea of it being filled with rednecks and rednecks and ignorant people and foolish people. It's not that way at all. Especially Austin. Austin is like one of the most liberal, easygoing, progressive cities. But even the progressives here, they're like, more reasonable. What do you think of that?

[James Talarico]

I. I think he's right, that that balance is key here. I've said, you know, that my party talks about turning Texas blue. The Republicans talk about turning Texas red. I honestly think the best color for Texas is purple. And what I mean by that is, is competition is good for policymaking, like so. When I first got elected in Williamson County, I was part of a group of legislators who flipped districts. There were 12 of us who flipped Republican districts to blue in that election. And after that shock, after Beto got within two and a half points in the very next legislative session, a few months later, in 2019, suddenly the Republican majority, they were still in charge, although it was closer. Suddenly they were all about funding public schools and expanding health care. And they certainly, suddenly, they weren't going after, you know, marginalized groups, and they weren't doing the culture war stuff. They were on their best behavior because there was a competitive election. Right? Competition keeps politicians on their toes in both parties. Because, let's be very honest, I don't mean to draw a false equivalence, but you've seen the Democratic Party get very complacent and not fight for people in the way that we should. And that's often because there's not enough competition. I just think competition is good for sports, it's good for business, and it's good for politics.

[Political Commentator]

And I think a purple statement, I think I would have agreed with you in 2005, maybe even 2012. But 2013, there was a significant change in Our country's politics as Shelby versus Holder. That's where the attack on voting rights, which was traditionally a bipartisan vote in the House and the Senate, like overwhelmingly bipartisan. Now the type of Republican politics that we're seeing are mirroring fascism and authoritarianism and no checks and balances for the executive branch, allowing this president to violate the emoluments clause. So what type of competition are we talking about here? I think we're talking about two different kinds of Republicans maybe.

[James Talarico]

And I would say that that extremism is a direct result of, of a lack of competition because these, these extremists in their districts, they don't feel any need to moderate, they don't feel any need to appeal to folks in the middle or folks in the Democratic Party. All they have to do is please their farthest right flank. All they gotta do is please the folks on Fox News or I'm gonna

[Political Commentator]

push back on you even more. So once Donald Trump came into office, there was this again, all out assault on DEI Democrats, large, especially establishment Democrats, response to that. Even some in the socialist side who haven't dealt with their racism said, we agree with you, there shouldn't be dei so much so that we can look at the spending from the autopsy report in campaigns which has been a problem for a very long time. I don't know how you're doing with spending with black outlets, black staff, black vendors, but it's something to look at. Definitely at some point you have to acknowledge like the competition has made them go against any idea of a rainbow coalition and against any, of, any idea of diversity. So that type of competition actually isn't helpful at all.

[James Talarico]

Well, I think in Texas, I mean, if you're, if we're going to win a statewide race, then we've got to have the entire coalition with us. And so alienating, you know, parts of that coalition actually make us less competitive. And so I can't speak to other states or their districts what their politics are like. But I know in Texas that if we had a real competitive landscape statewide, then you would have, you wouldn't. You know, Ken Paxton has spent his career waging war against black Texans on a whole host of issues from healthcare to voting rights. If he was actually worried about whether or not he could win a statewide election in Texas, I think you wouldn't see those kind of attacks. And in fact, I think I'm being proven right just this week because these polls that we were talking about earlier showing Ken Paxton behind in this race, to me, suddenly he's Talking about affordability. Suddenly he's talking about healthcare. And it's kind of funny to watch him. It looks like he's, you know, speaking French or something. It doesn't come naturally. But. But he is trying to. He's trying to speak to people outside of his base because he feels the heat of that competition. And obviously, Texas is different as a state because you can't gerrymander the state lines like you can a congressional district. But in my experience, when politicians feel that heat, when they feel the need to actually compete for every vote, that leads to better policymaking and less craziness. Now, it's not always true, but that has been a trend I've observed in the legislature, and I do think it would be so good for Texas. Good at every level, too. Not just the senate race, but the state legislature, local government, school boards. If there's now a competitive environment where every politician is having to compete to win an election, to appeal to the broad swath of the electorate, I think that's going to lead to better public policy outcomes.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

You've become one of the few Democrats who's comfortable quoting scripture. Do you think Democrats abandoned faith, or did Republicans just become better marketers?

[Podcast Host]

Both.

[James Talarico]

And this happened about 50 years ago. I think what happened is that Democrats, they confused two things. One is the separation of church and state, which is in our First Amendment. I'm the fiercest champion for the separation of church and state in the Texas legislature. I'm a. I'm a Christian, and I know that the most dangerous form of government is theocracy. The only thing worse than a tyrant is a tyrant who thinks they're on a mission from God. They've confused that separation of church and state with a separation of faith and politics. We should have the first. We don't need the second. We should bring our faith traditions, our moralities, our philosophies, our ethics, our worldviews to our politics. And if you don't, then your politics becomes kind of spiritually impoverished. You think about the civil rights movement, you think about the farm workers movement, you think about the labor movement. These were movements that were rooted in spirituality, in religion. I mean, the civil rights movement was an explicitly Christian movement in the American south. And that did a few things. One, it allowed the people in those movements to sustain the work over time. Because if you're just worried about the next election or the current news cycle and you lose, then you get burnt out. But if you're playing a long game, if you're kind of on an intern on an eternal timeline. If you're working for something greater than what we see right in front of us, then that pushes you forward. And then it also allows people to connect with your movement at a deeper level. Because these traditions, they're things that we share, right? If you're like, I think about all the people I went to high school with who are, you know, pretty conservative Republicans, like, we went to the same churches, and we share the same Bible stories, the same teachings, the same values. And if I can connect with my neighbors at that level, not on a R versus D level or a blue versus red level, or even a policy level, but at that. That values level, to me, that's so much more powerful, it's much more sustainable than if you're just running a partisan, partisan race. And so I think Democrats made a huge mistake in ceding religion to the other side, and we've seen the disastrous consequences of it. I mean, so it's so apparent, like, when people hear me talking about Jesus or quoting scripture, they assume I'm a Republican, which is kind of wild. I mean, in the 20th century, you had, you know, Dr. King and. And Dolores Huerta and. And Mr. Rogers. You had people who were using their faith. Jimmy Carter using their faith to love their neighbors. And it's just been so long since we've had that kind of Christianity in our politics. I think people are really hungry for that. And I'll just say no party has a monopoly on faith. Faith is deeper than any political party.

[Political Commentator]

But I was just gonna say, on this point, there is a white nationalist movement happening in the church. And so you're talking about shared values. Are those values really shared, or have they manipulated them just like they did with the transatlantic slave trade? I don't know that the values are actually shared.

[James Talarico]

It's both, I think. There are some teachings that I think still resonate with a lot of people, even people who have been conned by this white Christian nationalist movement. Anyway, I've been the most vocal critic of theocracy in the state legislature, and I fought against the bills that would have been forced every teacher to post the Ten Commandments, would have taught Christian Bible stories exclusively to our youngest school children as absolute truth. I fought against those, even though my faith is central in my life. Even my granddad was a Baptist preacher. Even though I'm in seminary, studying to become a minister myself one day, I am called to love all of my neighbors, not just my neighbors who look like me, not just my neighbors who pray like me, not just my neighbors who vote like me, I'm called to love all of my neighbors because all of my neighbors bear that divine image. We don't always live up to that divine image, me included, but we all do bear that image. And if we can get back to a place where we can see that in each other, even see it in our enemies, that's how we save this. This experiment in democracy in this country.

[Political Commentator]

Can you do that without calling out the ways in which they're manipulating faith? Like, there are pastors that are like, oh, there should be votes by household. A woman shouldn't vote.

[James Talarico]

You got to call it out. And we've been calling it out. Yeah, you. Love is not. Is not shrinking from a fight or shrinking from confrontation. In my view, that's the opposite of love. Right. If you truly love someone or if you love this. This state or this country, then. Then you have to look bullies in the eye, and you've got to speak truth to power. I mean, that's what Jesus showed us Christians how to do. I mean, we always think of Jesus as being this gentle, kind guy, but he. He flipped over the tables in the temple. He walked into the seat of power and flipped over those tables of injustice. And. And I started this campaign with that Bible story because I wanted to remind us that sometimes love calls us to speak truth to power. It sometimes calls for confrontation. You have to force conflict in order to heal conflict. And so it's why I've been so outspoken in my criticism, on theological grounds, of this Christian nationalist movement. And I think we need a senator who has experience in this fight and who can call out this theocratic movement not just on constitutional grounds, not just on political grounds, but on those theological grounds.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

I just got a couple more questions about that. Right. Because you have been outspoken against Christian nationalism. Where's the line between expressing your faith publicly and using faith as a political weapon?

[James Talarico]

Yeah, it's such an important line to be aware of. And it's back to that point about the institutional separation of church and state. I am never going to force my religion, my faith, down the throats of my neighbors, my Muslim and Jewish and Hindu and Buddhist and atheist neighbors, because that's not love. I don't want anyone doing that to me, so why would I do that to my neighbors?

[Podcast Host]

We have.

[James Talarico]

If you're interested in learning about my faith tradition, we got churches on every corner in Texas, and we'd love to have you on any Sunday. But the schoolhouse, the courthouse, the state House is not the place to do that. But I will talk about how my faith influences my views. I will talk about how my faith motivates my public service because I want to be honest about that. I can only show up as me. I can't pretend to be somebody else. And my faith is, is at the core of my life and of my public service. And I want to be honest about that with people. And I hope I can do it in a way that is sensitive to the religious trauma that a lot of people have. Right. A lot of people have been hurt by organized religion, and we should be upfront about that. So I'm trying to be as sensitive and as responsible as I can be while still being as honest as I need to be about what motivates me in this work.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

I wouldn't have a problem with people bringing their spirituality or religion into politics if they actually lived like that for real. Right? Like, you know, if you're going to say, what would Jesus do? Like, really think about that when you're denying some of these kids, you know, food or, you know, money to porn. Disenfranchised areas, like, I wouldn't have no problem if they actually lived up to, you know, Jesus's teachings.

[James Talarico]

Well, and, and if they were honest about where they fall short, because we all fall short, right? We're all imperfect Christians. We're all imperfect people, and we should be very honest about that. It's. Why do not judge is such a common commandment in the Christian scriptures. Because humility is necessary in order to do this work. But I agree with you. I mean, I would ask your, your listeners, your viewers, even those who aren't religious, to go back and read Matthew 25, the parable of the sheep and the goats. I know it sounds like a strange name for a story, but it's a fascinating story because at the end of the world, Jesus gathers all of us as people and all of us as nations, as communities. There's a lot of folks who will say, well, those are only commandments for individual people, right? Charity. But we don't need to guarantee healthcare, because that's not true. But you go back and read the story. He's gathering the people and the nations, us as individuals, us as communities. And he's going to say to some of us, depart from me, for I was hungry and you didn't give me something to eat. I was sick and you didn't heal me. I was a stranger and you didn't welcome me. And those of us who get that stern talking to are going to say, christ, when did we see you hungry? When did we see you sick. When did we see you as a stranger? And then he's going to tell us what you did for the least of these is what you did for me. And that story to me should speak to us in this moment. Because what would, what would Jesus say if he walked onto the floor of the U.S. senate? I think he would say, I was hungry and you kicked me off food stamps. I was sick and you kicked me off Medicaid. I was a stranger and you deported me and my family. So these teachings from 2000 years ago should, should wake us up in this moment. And if we claim to follow Jesus, if we claim to be Christians, then we need to love our neighbors, not just through our words, but through our actions, through our public policy. And that's what I'm trying to do by running for the seat. And I hope I can do it in the US Senate strong.

[DJ Envy]

There you have it, ladies and gentlemen.

[James Talarico]

I appreciate it.

[DJ Envy]

Thank you for joining us this morning.

[James Talarico]

Thank you.

[DJ Envy]

You good, Miss Rod?

[Political Commentator]

Yes. Amen.

[DJ Envy]

Okay. James Talarico.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Any business to do?

[James Talarico]

If people want to join us, they can go to our website, jamestellarico.com Sign up to volunteer. We're gonna need door knockers, we're gonna need folks on phone banks, we're gonna need folks sending text messages. Even if you've never volunteered before, we will teach you how to do it. And if you're feeling a little hopeless, if you're doom scrolling action is the best antidote to that despair. There was an organizer friend who told me, you can't wring your hands when you're rolling up your sleeves. So let's all get to work. Let's do that work in Texas and across the country. And it's an honor to do that work with everybody.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

Can I ask you one question?

[James Talarico]

Yeah, please.

[Interviewer/Co-host]

If Jesus came back today, which political party do you think would be most uncomfortable with them?

[James Talarico]

I think both political parties would be deeply uncomfortable. I think Jesus is far more radical than any political party. And when I say radical, I don't mean extreme. The word radical comes from the Latin word for root. So Jesus goes to the root of our problems and he calls us to a deeper love, a deeper justice, a deeper peace. And so I think he would challenge both political parties to keep working toward a more radical vision for democracy, more rights, more opportunities for more of our neighbors.

[DJ Envy]

Well, James Talarico, thank you for joining us.

[James Talarico]

Thank you.

[DJ Envy]

Breakfast Club. Good morning.

[Podcast Host]

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