← The Breakfast Club
The Breakfast Club
INTERVIEW: Michael Jai White Talks New Film ‘Special Op: Rent-A-Cop’, Controlling Your Ego, Tyler Perry, Winning The Bruce Lee Award
00:44:52
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Podcast Host
This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.
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DJ Envy
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Charlamagne tha God
Every day I wake up.
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Joybox Advertiser
Wake your ass up.
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Charlamagne tha God
The Breakfast Club
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DJ Envy
Morning everybody. It's DJ Envy. Just hilarious. Charlemagne the Guy. We are the Breakfast Club. Lauren the Rose is here as well. We got a Special guest in the building. His new movie, Special Op, Rent a Cop, is out right now. Michael Jock. Michael J. White. Is it? Ja.
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Michael Jai White
You got it? Right. Okay.
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DJ Envy
All right.
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Charlamagne tha God
Good morning.
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DJ Envy
How you feeling, brother?
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Michael Jai White
I feel real good. Good. I feel real good being back here. I got problems now because I'm kind of loving being back.
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DJ Envy
Really?
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Michael Jai White
Yes, man. I'm from here originally.
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DJ Envy
Yeah.
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Michael Jai White
Yeah. And so walking these streets, man, it's a beautiful weather, man. It's got me like, well, that's today. Yeah.
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DJ Envy
Because tomorrow's gonna be that cold.
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Michael Jai White
Well, yesterday too. It was. It was all good, man. I'm enjoying myself.
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Charlamagne tha God
What do you miss about it?
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Michael Jai White
Just, oh, so much, man. The energy. I'm hooking up with my. My peoples from here that I hadn't seen in a long time. The fact that, you know, I traipse these streets trying to come up doing theater and all that kind of stuff, and I almost feel like. Like I sold out, you know, when I'm. I'm in LA and now I'm doing, you know, doing the other type of thing. But, man, I got my friends doing Broadway and all that kind of stuff, and I started with theater out here, right. So it made me kind of miss it. So, you know. Yeah. So, you know, I'm feeling that way,
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DJ Envy
if you don't mind. I like to go backsmith for people that don't know. How did you get into theater, into acting? What. What push you towards that?
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Michael Jai White
Well, I was a. I was always kind of doing this as a kid, right. I was doing, like, plays and I was doing, like, my own films. Like, when I was 10 years old, I was cutting together movies and stuff, but wasn't taking it serious. Like, I go to college, come out, I'm a school teacher, but I'm still dealing with, like, I'm coming out here auditioning to do different things when I'm off, you know, from teaching school. And so it got in my system. Like, I really enjoy this. And so I landed a really big, like, theatrical. I was in To Kill a Mockingbird, the first adaptation to theater, you know, off Broadway. And I was with like. Like Tony Award winners, all that kind of stuff. And so that was my trajectory. I was an actor, right? And I was doing theater and I was doing all that kind of stuff and landing stuff before going out to la. But, you know, in these streets and, you know, it's the energy and the fact that I was in it for the. The art of it, all right? And then. And so it's kind of like reliving that. Right. So. But yeah, I started out here and you know, then, you know, you know, with the whole LA thing and, you know, changing up, doing all the kind of popcorn movies and stuff like that, I always wanted to come back to roots and do more theater and do those kind of things. But, you know, it's, it's, it's. I kind of feeling nostalgic.
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DJ Envy
And when did the martial come.
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Charlamagne tha God
Yeah, I was gonna say, dida come before martial arts?
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DJ Envy
When did martial arts come in?
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Michael Jai White
Well, it's funny how people equate the two. I've been doing martial arts my whole life.
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Charlamagne tha God
Gotcha.
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Michael Jai White
It's kind of like, I don't know, like if you think about Gregory Hines was tap dancing, but he owned tap dance in every movie. But when I first came to la, I didn't want to do anything with martial arts. I want to be established as an actor because that's what I was. But I happened to do martial arts. Right. So when I started doing movies with martial arts in it, what was cool is that a lot of like people, executives, they thought, oh, he's being doubled, whatever. They didn't realize I was efficient in
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DJ Envy
that, that you could really do it.
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Michael Jai White
Right. Yeah. So. But that was by design because I didn't want to first start doing martial art movies and be on Martial Arts island and everybody think that you can't, you can't typecast it. Yeah. Because most people who do martial art movies, that's all they do. And I knew, just like with Wesley, who's done a whole lot of work, once he got known for something dealing with martial arts, he got branded like that. Right. Even though he's a fabulous actor, people tend to forget that. And a lot of times with people with me, they forget that too, to some degree. But no, I'm an actor and even when I do the stuff with martial arts and it might, you know, it might be by way of the action, I may be doing martial arts in it. But of course, people like to put you on a certain shelf till you break off of that shelf, you've mastered
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Charlamagne tha God
martial arts at a high level. It's like a seven degree black belt, I think.
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Michael Jai White
Well, I got, I got eight black belts. Right. In different varying degrees. But like, that's just a mainstay of my life, you know, But I, I apply martial arts to everything in my life, you know, you know, anything. Being a better father, being. It's about overcoming obstacles. That's what martial arts about. Even though it's kind of like people look at the fighting Aspects of it. And that kind of derails everything because everybody starts just thinking about. Because most people are insecure and they think about the fighting and, you know, whooping somebody's ass. That's only a very small part of what martial arts is designed for. You know, it's really designed for. For to develop a person overall. But, you know, so. But so I kind of use martial arts in every aspect of my life because it's about discipline.
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Charlamagne tha God
What did martial arts teach you about patience and ego that acting did?
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Michael Jai White
Oh, my God, yes. So much. It's just life taught me a lot about ego. I never seen anybody with a big ego who was happy in my life, you know, and then, you know, even in martial arts, you got the ego. Somebody going to humble your ass, right? There's always checks and balances. So I look at it like that anyway. Like, you know, again, I don't know what's the lure of being egotistical because I. I don't. I don't see it amount to anything, you know, because you're gonna have to, like, look at the world. I mean, when people kiss your ass and tell you you're wonderful, that was a good lesson to learn in the martial arts because I apply it to life. And, you know, there's people who, you know, they admire you, whatever, but they're going to, like, kind of big up you. But if your ego gets big, it's only going to hurt you. Like I said, I don't see anybody with a big ego who's happy. I just. I just never seen it. But, you know, you start to try to color the world the way you want to color because. Because of your ego. So that's why I do a lot of different martial arts, because, yeah, I have a black belt and something I put a white belt on and something else. But that's like, in. In life, man, I might know this, but let me know about this.
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DJ Envy
And what got you into martial arts as a kid? What, What?
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Michael Jai White
Insecurity, to be honest with you, you know, I was. I grew up in Brooklyn and Bridgeport, Connecticut, where, like, life was crazy. I've been on my own since I was 14. I've been through stuff that you see on movies. And I got to be the happiest person I know because I know where I came from. And so, man, when I walk around, I think about, oh, man, I remember what happened on this street. You know, I remember what happened on this street. And. And I go, man, I. Man, I got to do nothing but give back because I'M so damn lucky.
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DJ Envy
And what got you? What got you? Like, what was the person that got you into martial arts? Or what did you see? Because, you know, growing up in Brooklyn, the time you grew up in Brooklyn, Gleason's was the thing. Everybody wanted to box, right. They wanted to be Zab or they wanted to be Tyson.
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Michael Jai White
Right, right.
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DJ Envy
So it was so many things, but what got you into the actual. You know what? I want to try this.
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Michael Jai White
Well, shoot, man, as a kid going, I mean, in the Bronx, we're looking at, looking at these movies, seeing Five fingers of death.
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DJ Envy
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
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Michael Jai White
And seeing the power.
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DJ Envy
Yep, yep.
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Michael Jai White
And being this insecure kid, I wanted to create. I wanted to create, like, Like, I wanted to protect myself. I wanted to have that strength because I was sensitive. And so what do you do if you're sensitive?
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DJ Envy
You.
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Michael Jai White
Anything valuable or fragile, you put in a safe. And so in the street, I became the safe. Putting myself in martial arts, being like, you can't touch me. I gotta protect myself. Just like when I eventually played the brother Tyson, who was very similar to myself, a lot of people think that, oh, yeah, you knocked that out. I was really playing a lot of me with his voice, right. But so I understood that. And very much like him at an early age, I understood, like, the power of a pugilist. If you have the power to whip somebody's ass, what that affords you as a young man growing up in Brooklyn. Right. So I learned a lot of these lessons, and fortunately, I didn't have to develop with the whole world looking at me like Tyson did.
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DJ Envy
Right.
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Michael Jai White
You know, so, yeah, like I say, man, I'm very blessed. I, I, I got a lot of lessons and learned a lot. And, and as a, as a result, man, I'm one of the happiest people I know.
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Charlamagne tha God
You said a couple things I want to expound on. I love what you said about you can be a black belt in one thing, but then be a white belt in another. Can you expound on that?
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Michael Jai White
Yeah, man, I think that's what you should be in life, period. Man. Just like I, I love to learn. I love to learn. So, you know, it's like what Bruce Lee said, be it be an empty cup, you know? You know, empty cup, you can be filled with whatever contents there is. So there's a lot of things that, that I apply with certain martial arts principles in life, but like, like anything that gives you a certain amount of power. Just like people who might be religious leaders or what have you, you can adapt the doctrine that got you there. But if you, if you are, like, subject to your own ego, you start creating your own religion, you start creating your own thing, the insecure person that you was returns. Because when men are honored too much or got too much big ups or whatever, we tend to revert back to that. But, you know, we started out as insecure individuals in the first place. It's not like it really went away. You got to police that. Hopefully you go through something that, that teaches you those lessons so you don't make those mistakes.
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DJ Envy
But at age 14, how did you figure it out on your own because you were a kid?
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Michael Jai White
I look like a grown ass man at 14. I have not grown an inch since then.
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Charlamagne tha God
Okay?
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Michael Jai White
And I was fighting grown men. I was fighting in men's divisions, winning heavyweight. I was a heavyweight competitor.
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DJ Envy
Yeah, he could have played basketball. He's this height at 14.
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Michael Jai White
Yeah, dude, I was, yeah. In fact, somebody who came up, right? I don't know if you know Charles Smith, but we were, we at, we were like. They called us the Twin Towers, but he just kept going.
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DJ Envy
Yeah, of course.
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Michael Jai White
Play for Knicks. But yeah, so we, we grew up, like, in the same area. Right. So. But anyway, like, I, I was, I looked like a man early on, and I was like, fighting in tournaments, and I was on my own at 14, really. And because my mother, you know, bless her heart, you know, rest in peace, she was a sweet, churchgoing woman from the South. She was. She was the type of person that would say, those kids out there shooting at marijuana. I'm like, you don't shoot marijuana. But, but like, so early on, I was on my own. I just was like. And she was sweet woman. She couldn't handle somebody like me, you know, and so I was out there, I was out in the streets. I. Yeah, it's like, you know, there was part of me that was in fear. I'm like, how much does Charlamagne know about my past? They're like, you know, you know, hey, man, you know, when you was called Bam, Bam, I know somebody, I was like, I'd be like, but anyway. But just to say, man, I'm blessed. I've been through a whole lot, and now I get a chance to share my experiences, put it on screen. Because there's not many people who came where I came from, where I came from, who's in the position I am now, right? It's. It's rare. It's rare. But again, I'm. I'm walking around blessed, man.
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Charlamagne tha God
And I love what you said about Power too, right? Because you know, when you have that, that knowing that if I wanted to, I could destroy you. They also, they say true power is knowing you can destroy somebody but walking away.
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Michael Jai White
True, true. I mean it's kind of, it doesn't enter my mind, it enters a lot of other people's minds. And I go, well, bless them. I, I could be sitting down with a chairman of something or big time like producer. And I got to hear the first thing out of his mouth was like, well, I used to wrestle in college. I'm like, oh geez. So this man is thinking about like this, you know, quantifying himself. But I go, that's his, that's his deal. I'm. Some people look at me like a forearm monster, right? And I'm coming in with love, right? Really, I'm not ever thinking about anything physical or fighting or any. It never enters my mind. I know I can handle myself. But it's what other people define as a martial arts and all that kind of stuff, but. Because there's a lot of, a lot of misrepresentations out there, right, that lead with their insecurity and, but it's, it's the, the humble, peaceful, real martial artists out there that don't really get the attention that they should. I mean, rest in peace, Chuck Norris, you know, people who really follow the principles, you know, but you got, you know, some loud mouths of people who are very self aggrandizing. That, that get a lot of attention. But yeah, but it's, it's, it's deeper than that and it's deeper than that. And so, and it's about, you know, overcoming your obstacles. You just, belt levels, right? It's white, yellow, blue, all that type of stuff. Obstacles is what you're going to be facing the rest of your life. And your biggest obstacle is you overcome yourself. You can, you can conquer anything. So that's really what it is. And that's where the peace comes from. That's where I don't have to prove myself to anybody. But sometimes it makes people kind of reflect on themselves and go, you know, I don't, you know, whatever that is, I don't have that or what. Well, you know, God bless you. It's. But I'm not, I, I come in peace, you know, But a lot of people look at like, oh, he could, he could rip my throat out. I'm like, I'm sorry, you thinking about that? I'm not thinking about that. And I'd probably be the last person in the crowd who would ever go there. I'm the person that basically, like, for me to lose control. Come on, now, y' all gonna lose control before I will, you know, I know what I can do, but that's not. That doesn't even come to mind. So I'm the person that's thinking about protecting everybody in the room. Gotcha. Not hurting everybody in the room.
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Podcast Host
Have you ever had to. Like, when you go into those meetings and the guys are like, you know, talking about martial arts and perceiving you that way? Like, have you had. Had to check it, like, actually bring it into conversation? Like, hey, that's not even where I'm at. Or do you just. You're so far removed, you just kind of.
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Michael Jai White
Well, yeah, I try to just get. Get the. The conversation back on track. That's. That's really what it is because, bless them, some people just don't understand because, like I said, there's a lot of people that misrepresent what this is about and. And want to understand, well, what is this power that they. They perceive? And of course, man, I'm kicking people in the neck on in movies, right? So I forget that people are seeing that, right? I come like this and they're thinking about, man, he just did. I got too many stories about that because I forget what I do correct for a living. But I don't walk around with that. I don't think about that, right? But other people do. I can't say it's a bad thing because, I mean, it puts me where I am and makes me global, right? But, yeah, there's an assigned image of who I am because of the movies. But that's people who really know me. They know I'm a goofball. I have fun in life. My children, they ain't scared of me. It's like it's a sitcom in my house.
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DJ Envy
I was gonna ask, with the movie business, has that shifted your life a little bit? And the reason I say that is, growing up, we used to look towards movies as a big, major release, right? And I'm even looking at Michael. I don't know if you see Michael, but I couldn't imagine seeing Michael at the crib. Like, that's something I needed to see on that big screen, in the music. But it shifted so much where now, you know, you do a movie, it's no longer a major movie release, and now it's on. We know Hulu or Tubi or Netflix or, you know, BET or. How has that shifted the way that you think about movies? If it has at all.
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Michael Jai White
Well, I've shifted into. I like streaming series a lot more because they dare to be unique. And a lot of times in movies, they're so scared to give you an experience. It's so, like, formulaic, you know, so you see a lot of movies and you see the trailer, you know, you've seen the whole damn movie. But it's. I recognize that, right. And I've been blessed to be able to do my own things and produce my own stuff. And right now I got three different movies out right now. It's got Secret Between Us, that's in theaters right now. I got Oscar Shaw, which is doing really well, which is a gritty drama. And I got this goofy movie that brought me here. Like the special I Rent a Cop. Yeah. Which is a whole different thing. I was like, intending on being like a Kindergarten cop type of thing, but I'm blessed to have these three very different type of movies out at the same time, which is like, you know, lets me do, you know, work out different muscles and stuff. But, you know, so with films now, I'm doing a lot more my own, right? Writing, directing, like. Like with Hassle, Takeover and. And Trouble man, which I did with Brother Method Man. You know, from here, I get a chance to do these things that really is in my zeitgeist. And I got more movies coming out. And of course, you might know about the why that. Get Married. Three.
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Charlamagne tha God
Damn it. Three.
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Michael Jai White
And that's gonna be. Believe me, that's gonna be the best one of them all. Yeah, but, but, yeah, but, like. Yeah, I shifted. I really like a lot of. I like movies that are not so formulaic that you can't figure out from,
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Charlamagne tha God
like, day one, you were doing superhero movies, you know, way before the superhero boom. Right.
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Michael Jai White
Like, respond.
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Charlamagne tha God
Do you ever look at today's landscape and feel like you were ahead of your time?
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Michael Jai White
I don't look at things like that. I don't ever think of myself being ahead of nothing, really. I just, you know, traipse along, do my thing. Yeah, it was. It was wonderful to be the first black superhero in that, but I didn't expect that, that that was going to yield any. Any particular thing. I don't have those expectations. But, yeah, I'm. I. I'm. I'm honored to be in that. That category. Some of the superhero movies now, I'm. I'm just. I'm not really into that because I feel like they. They're kind of doing the same thing, and it's. I'm not the Target audience. It's, it's a younger audience that they're looking for.
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Charlamagne tha God
I'm 47. I love superhero movies, but it's not
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Podcast Host
for like a lot of the superhero movies. I feel like it's a cult audience. Like they grow up with you. They want.
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DJ Envy
He still buys the costumes for Halloween. Dr.
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Charlamagne tha God
I've gotten into the D.C. because of the TV series.
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Michael Jai White
Right, right, right.
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Charlamagne tha God
The Peacemaker was dope. Penguin was dope.
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Michael Jai White
Green Lantern. See, I love the TV series. Movies is, you know, I just, I'm just seeing the formula all the time, you know, so I, you know, I like the straight breast milk basically. You know, something that's going to be its own, its own thing. So, yeah, I have, I have respect for the movies that try to notch out their own kind of personality to it. But. Yeah, but, but, but somebody landing in a three point stance and then lick up. I'll turn, I'll turn the channel.
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Charlamagne tha God
The superhero landing.
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Michael Jai White
Yeah, yeah. I'm like, oh, not for me, you know. Yeah, so, yeah, yeah, I like the, I like the, the television stuff a lot more.
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Charlamagne tha God
What is the plot of why Did I Get Married three? You can't say.
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Michael Jai White
Oh, yeah, I can say a little bit, I think. I'm pretty sure. But I mean I, I gotta commend Tyler on this one because even on the onset of the script, the subject matter is stuff that I hadn't even seen in a movie before. One of the things I think I could talk about is the fact that as parents, right, we like to be exemplary role models to our children. And children don't know all the messing up that we did beforehand. And that was, that was the thing that I always thought was great about.
- [22:47]
DJ Envy
Yo, what up, y'? All, It's DJ Envy from the Breakfast Club. Now check this out. The first phone call that ever happened happened over 150 years ago. 150 years. That's before any of this. Before radio, before social media, before all the ways we stay connected. Today. That one call really started everything. And fast forward to now. It's springtime, the weather's breaking, people outside vibes are right again. Thank God. And it got me thinking. Who haven't you talked to in a minute? And you know, through all these years and all these conversations at&t has been there connecting people in meaningful ways. This is more than a story of technological innovation. It's really a story about human connection. Real people, real moments and real relationships. So we celebrate over 150 years of connection. Let this be your reminder. Don't Wait. Make that call. Send that text. Pull up on somebody you care about. Because at the end of the day, those connections, that's what really matters.
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Michael Jai White
AT&T.
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Ryan Reynolds
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- [25:44]
Michael Jai White
saw a movie that dealt with that. As parents we always do that. They don't know how messed up we were, you know. And so there's a, there's a concept of that in this movie. There's actually four concepts in this movie that could have been movies by itself. So Tyler really stepped on up on this. And I'm. You know, I'm. I try to be. I'm always honest. I'm like, it's. It's a superstition to me. I'm. I'm honest with Tyler. I consider him a friend first and foremost before anything, and I never lie to nobody. I feel like he really stepped up and in a whole lot of ways
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Charlamagne tha God
in this movie, y' all tamed it already.
- [26:20]
Michael Jai White
Yeah, it's done.
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Charlamagne tha God
Okay.
- [26:21]
Michael Jai White
Okay. It's done.
- [26:22]
Podcast Host
I saw photos.
- [26:23]
Michael Jai White
Yeah, we shot in Lake Como, Italy. And, you know, he's doing some. I'm proud of what he's doing. And y' all gonna like this.
- [26:31]
Charlamagne tha God
Jill Scott back, everybody.
- [26:33]
Michael Jai White
Jill. Jill Scott. Taraji's now. Taraji's in it? Yeah, she's in it.
- [26:37]
Charlamagne tha God
Not Janet, though.
- [26:38]
Michael Jai White
No, she. She didn't. I don't know. Yeah, well, I think people know that she's. She's not in this one. Got you. But, yeah, but Taraji, man, she kills it. Everybody kills. And there's a young audience. There's a young audience in this movie.
- [26:52]
DJ Envy
Our.
- [26:52]
Michael Jai White
Our Children, man, these young actors are killing it. I mean, Da Vinci plays my son.
- [27:01]
DJ Envy
Wow.
- [27:01]
Michael Jai White
You know, from bmf, there's, like, amazing. I mean, just even standing on set, watching them do their thing, man, I was like, this is going to be. This is going to be fire.
- [27:11]
Podcast Host
You said Tyler Perry stepped it up a few times. In what ways he stepped it up?
- [27:14]
Michael Jai White
The way he's shooting movies now is very innovative. He shoots it really in a short period of time, but keeps the energy right there. Like, a lot of times when you're doing movies, right, you Will. You. You do your scene, then you gotta pick up from that energy, like, hours later, after they change the camera angles. What he does this innovative thing to where you stay in the moment and you are in it. Right. And it preserves performances like you would not believe. And so that energy and that when you're in that moment, you stay in it. Right? So it's. You know me as a director. I. Yeah, I haven't jotted some things down, and I've kind of applied.
- [27:56]
DJ Envy
How is he able to do that without changing the lens and without moving things around? How was he able to keep y' all on energy? Because usually.
- [28:01]
Michael Jai White
Oh, my God. He's got. If you. If you're a cameraman in his. In his set, you better be in shape, because this brother would use seven Steadicams and move them joints around and keep them moving, and you don't have to wait. That's the thing. You don't have to wait for your performance.
- [28:20]
DJ Envy
So he's shooting the movie quicker, too.
- [28:22]
Michael Jai White
Oh, my God. Oh, my God. What normally would take two hours he'll do in 15 minutes because he knows editing. You know, I'm. I started. I. I did a lot of editing, too, so I understood how he was doing this. And, you know, as an actor, you're like, do we have everything? But I know he. He's got all these different things. He's really stepping up. People don't realize because people. People get used to who somebody is, and they don't realize.
- [28:46]
State Farm Advertiser
They.
- [28:47]
Michael Jai White
Yo, man, this cat is growing in. In this way that. That I see as a. As an artist that. That. I dare I say, man, I'm putting a lot of his stuff into my repertoire.
- [28:59]
Podcast Host
How does he. I don't know how much you can share, but how does he, like, end Janet Jackson's story, though, in this new one without her being there? Cause, like, I feel like we were left on a cliff of, like, how is she gonna continue her life? And, you know, she's grieving her husband
- [29:12]
Charlamagne tha God
and that was the first movie, right?
- [29:14]
Michael Jai White
No, that was the. You talking about the second.
- [29:16]
Podcast Host
That was the last. The last time we saw Janet was when she lost her husband, Correct?
- [29:19]
Charlamagne tha God
When did Malik Yoba die?
- [29:21]
Michael Jai White
Yeah, it's like, lost her husband. She helped him lose. She helped lose him regardless.
- [29:26]
Podcast Host
I'm just. I'm just saying. I just want to know, like, what's the.
- [29:29]
Charlamagne tha God
Like, the first one or second one? I don't remember.
- [29:31]
Michael Jai White
You know, sometimes I get mixed up myself, but it's. I can't. I can't really speak on that. It's not like she's gone, gone. She's like. Like. Well, I forget how we dealt with it in the. In the. In the script, but it's.
- [29:45]
Podcast Host
You know, we'll get some closure.
- [29:47]
Michael Jai White
Yeah, you definitely get close. I mean, it's like, hey, I believe there's going to be a why did I get married for? And if everybody's schedule is aligned, you going to see her again?
- [29:57]
Podcast Host
Cuz when he was. When Tyler Perry posted that script, it kind of made everybody. That's when we got excited for it, and he had originally tagged it. And when I saw the photos of y' all in Italy, she wasn't in the photo. So we were like, what the heck happened?
- [30:07]
Michael Jai White
But here. Here it is, man. We. We. Everybody. Everybody. Why focus on what's not in there.
- [30:14]
Podcast Host
You know, we stick to. You know, we love our characters. Like, I feel like we're.
- [30:19]
Michael Jai White
If that wasn't Jill, we'd be talking about Jill right now.
- [30:22]
Podcast Host
Oh, yes.
- [30:22]
Michael Jai White
If that wasn't somebody else, we'd be talking about them right now.
- [30:25]
Podcast Host
100%.
- [30:25]
Michael Jai White
But we could. But there's a percentage of people who did make it in there in a wonderful script and a wonderful movie that we could be talking about, too.
- [30:35]
Charlamagne tha God
She can kill her character in the first five minutes after what she did to her husband. Okay.
- [30:38]
State Farm Advertiser
Bam.
- [30:39]
Charlamagne tha God
To call that argument.
- [30:40]
Michael Jai White
Said this.
- [30:41]
Podcast Host
At least we get that.
- [30:43]
Michael Jai White
Because if y' all tell me she
- [30:45]
Charlamagne tha God
died in the car accident in the first five minutes, I'll be like, good. That's what she get for arguing with that man like that.
- [30:49]
Michael Jai White
Causing me sometimes. I like the fact that he can say things that I can't say.
- [30:54]
DJ Envy
You know what? I wanted to go back to 2001 for a second. Exit Wounds did a movie with DMX. How was working with DMX?
- [31:01]
Michael Jai White
Oh, wonderful, man. We became instant friends, man. Like, yeah, DMX was a really solid cat, man. Man, we. That friendship kept. Kept on. D would come into town. We would always link up. Yeah, it was real cool. It was real cool, you know? Sad to see him go. He was a really, really deep brother. You know, he had his demons that he was dealing with, but, yeah, he. He was, man.
- [31:28]
DJ Envy
He loved the martial arts, too.
- [31:29]
Michael Jai White
He loved martial arts. Yeah. Yeah. Yep.
- [31:32]
State Farm Advertiser
Yeah.
- [31:32]
Michael Jai White
Yeah, we. We. Yeah, we became cousins, basically.
- [31:36]
Charlamagne tha God
How did DMX feel about Steven Seagal?
- [31:39]
Michael Jai White
I think you might know about that. Like, I don't think anybody really dug him.
- [31:44]
Charlamagne tha God
Nobody.
- [31:44]
Michael Jai White
So it wasn't just no nobody. No. I mean, to be honest with you. Yeah. Yeah. But, you know, it's. It's. It's a sad situation with that cat, man.
- [31:54]
DJ Envy
For people that don't know what was the. The beef about, all the problems or why do people like him as much as.
- [32:00]
Charlamagne tha God
Well, I just saw you criticize his onset behavior.
- [32:01]
Michael Jai White
Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Everybody. I mean, he.
- [32:04]
DJ Envy
He.
- [32:04]
Michael Jai White
He. Yeah, it's. It unfortunate. Like, so, I mean, I was a fan early on, right. Worked with him three different times. And I don't. I don't know, like, I've. And you might forget, like, I was actually low key helping him in a lot of ways. I. I got him as his dietitian, his. His. His trainer and all these different things at one time, even without him even knowing I was designing his damn diet on. Yeah, but. But, yeah, and I tried to hook him up with his Doctor to help him out as well. So my thing was, like, you know, I tried to hold on to the images he first had, which I was a fan of in the earlier works. But like, we talked about, man, the ego, man, it don't. It don't serve nobody. I don't know why he always kind of tried to present himself like he's, you know, bad man. He's a fighter or whatever. I think it's the insecurity that started him out in this whole thing. But, man, it's like he just. I think he played himself with. Over overplaying his hand till people start going, hey, wait a minute. This don't make no sense. And, you know, it's. It's a lesson for people. You know, it kind of goes back to what I'm talking about. I don't think anybody want to trade places with that man, you know, and that's what ego gets you. That's real. Yeah.
- [33:35]
Charlamagne tha God
I was all. I was told that he would do scenes with, like, stuntmen and hurt them.
- [33:42]
Michael Jai White
Yeah.
- [33:42]
Charlamagne tha God
When it came to real martial artists, he didn't want to.
- [33:45]
Michael Jai White
No, no, no, no. I mean, yeah, it's. Yeah. Unfortunately, that's. That's the truth of the matter. See, I. I owe my allegiance to real martial artists too much to be able to brand him in the same way. No, no, he had a lot of, like, issues. And, you know, if you let him get away with stuff, he gonna get away with it, and there's people that just won't let him get away with that.
- [34:10]
Charlamagne tha God
Like, you.
- [34:11]
Michael Jai White
True, true. But, you know, that's what it is. But, you know, I always try to stay positive with the stuff, but. Yeah, but everything I talked about, it was the truth. Like, you know, doing Exit Wounds and the director and producer trying to set him up. They. They purposely made the. Our fight scene the last thing in the whole movie. Let me know. Yo, man, if you heard him, we could finish. We could finish the movie with his stunt double. But I'm like, seriously? Like, y'. All. Really? Yeah, I'm talking from the top. From the top. The producers and the director is like, yo. You know, And I'm like, really?
- [34:57]
Charlamagne tha God
Just kick him in the neck. For real?
- [34:59]
Michael Jai White
Yeah, yeah. Because people wanted to see him hurt, but I was like, I wasn't going to do that.
- [35:03]
Charlamagne tha God
You got integrity.
- [35:04]
Michael Jai White
Yeah, I gotta be who I am, man. So my thing is, I hate bullies, and I wasn't gonna be one. And that's the truth of it. And he knows. He knows what's up with that. And. And I was like, he can see the fixes. And I'm like, don't worry about nothing. He wouldn't touch me when we were doing the thing because he felt what he knew. You know, he knew if you went too far. Well, I beat him in the. In the film.
- [35:28]
DJ Envy
Right?
- [35:29]
Michael Jai White
Right. It's not like he lays a hand on me. It's set up that way. Like, Jose Silver is like, we ain't going to believe he will beat you. So they design the. The fight to be, I'm the one that knocks him down, and I leave. He. He hooks a rope ladder onto the helicopter, and I fall off the rope ladder and die. Right. Not by him beating. So in. First time in his career, like, somebody beats him, he has to outsmart me in, you know, my demise comes later on because I'm like, I don't want to kill you. I got someplace to go. So that's one of these things where, okay, he's susceptible. I'm throwing punches at him. I'm doing stuff to knock him down, so it's easy for me to slip up and like, oops, sorry about that. You know what I mean? But I'm not doing that. I'm not. I'm not trying to do that. That's. That's chicken. That's. That's not me. Even though everybody's trying to encourage that. And so I know in the rap party, right, the rap party, he's, thank you, whatever. He's respectful, all that kind of stuff, and then you go flip on me and talk about me and Van Damme or whatever, but that made him look silly. And so I really don't even have to service that. He. We ran into each other in Thailand, man to man. Apologized for all of that. Right. But still, you know, faulty. But I'm like, that's you, man. You know, you made yourself look silly. Right? And, you know, again, you know, who wants to be that cat? And everybody's clowning him now and that he brought that on himself.
- [37:12]
Charlamagne tha God
Gotcha.
- [37:13]
Michael Jai White
Yeah.
- [37:14]
Charlamagne tha God
What separates someone who trains from someone who is actually dangerous?
- [37:18]
Michael Jai White
Well, it's your issue, will. Right. I don't care what tools you got. It's what's inside. Right? So it's. It's the thing about that people don't understand about martial arts. If you. You're overcoming yourself, you can. It's your will that makes you dangerous. Really. It's that. That thing that says, I will go through fire and. And stop you and take you out. There's. There's a certain will of, Of a human being that you cannot stop me. And that's the, that. That's. What is the power in that. That I, I discipline myself, I train myself. I could push myself way deeper than society can push me, you know, and so that's what you up against. You up against a will. It's just, it goes, it extends beyond just physicality, right? One of the arts I do is called kyokushin, and it really is that. And in kyokushin, you get to your, your, your limit, your physical limit all the time, and you have to push beyond that. And so by doing that, it is your will that's doing that. It's not just something that is just a sport, whatever. It's something that derives things from you. I call it the Navy Seals of martial arts because you could do it for 20 years and not make a black belt, just like jiu jitsu is today, which I really respect a great deal. They ain't just handing out black belts in that. You really got to go through the burning sands. And so that's the thing. Society's gotten much easier, it's much softer. And so it's. It's a great thing for somebody. Sometimes you have to police yourself to really arrive at where you want to be as a man because you're not tested anymore. Back in the day, there was a rites of passage that you had to go through. You either had to go to the armed forces, you had to go all. Or just even to live life, you had to get to a place where it's like, I would die for this, you know, for true adulthood, true manhood. Well, you're not tested anymore. So you have the trappings of adulthood, right? You have the trappings because you have the age. And you tells you, yeah, I'm a full man. I'm going to do until you get. You run into adversity. And it tells you who you really are, right? But see, now, with martial arts or armed forces, anything that derives discipline, that stands for discipline, you have to go across the burning sands. And when you get to the other side of that, there's no substitute for that.
- [40:04]
DJ Envy
Well, how do you deal with. You know, you talk about that, but we talk about social media, right? Where you got people that could talk about your family, your relationships, and even say things to you that, you know, they wouldn't say to your face, but they're comfortable enough to do it on the phone because they know I ain't gonna see you.
- [40:23]
Michael Jai White
Yeah, well, you know, you have to. That's a part of me that, like, I had to grow up on. Because even in social media, early days, dude, there's. There's. There's several people that I showed up.
- [40:35]
DJ Envy
Did you really show when.
- [40:37]
Podcast Host
What year is early days?
- [40:38]
Michael Jai White
Oh, my God. There was martial artists that talk crap, and I'm like, I travel a lot more. I travel a lot. And there was times where I showed up on people's dojo and be like, let's continue this conversation. They're like, oh, oh. And it's like, no, no, no. You know, there was a part of me for a long time. It's like I had that wish a motherfucker would type of gene because there's a part of me that really enjoyed fighting. And I'm like, oh, you may knock me out. I will celebrate it. I'm like, yo, man, you were better than I thought. That's. That's something that. That's a mono a mano thing and something that I don't mind facing. But hopefully. So if you talking that hopefully you ready. You ready for that too. Right, Right. So. Because it's all good. But I actually get more upset if you don't step up. Because it's not really about an ego thing, but it's like, as a man, I don't disrespect anybody, right? And so I think I'm. You disrespect me, I'm going, okay, we can speak about this. There was times where I showed up or went out because, you know, I, you know, there's things that I consider that's important, and integrity is important to me. And so some people might be spouting off, but I'm like, we can see each other, man. And I'm open to be wrong and be like, oh, you really knew what you was talking about, you know, blessings. But it's like, let's do this. But then that happened several times where I'm going, this guy was just talking. This guy was just talking. And it's like, it was not worth my time. This could have went south. Just growing up. I just grew up with that whole, like, I'm from here. It's like, yo, we can understand each other as men and, you know, and deal with the outcome, but this world ain't made us the same cats anymore, really. But I'm still not going to take anybody, you know, short, like. But I can't invest that kind of time. It took me several times to go, yeah, that wasn't worth it. You're not. You're not dealing with somebody who Looks at things the same way. Yeah, so, but, yeah, so now I just go, bless you. I, I, I get it. You're, you're a negative person. You're looking for the negativity, and you want to spout stuff, and, you know, there it is. But, like, but sometimes I, I think that they are another person that wants to test themselves, which I can respect. But I used to think I would be called out a lot. Didn't really happen very much because I always loved to train with some of the top fighters. Like, you know, I was just with Israel Adesanya, like, two weeks ago when I was in New Zealand. You know, I love skillful people and working with them and, and testing myself.
- [43:42]
Charlamagne tha God
Izzy, get busy.
- [43:43]
Michael Jai White
Yeah, yeah, yeah. But, you know, he's got to get back on, on, on the basics now because I think, like, he's so talented that he's lost kind of like, track on some, some things. And we, we gonna train in, you know, more together in the future.
- [43:59]
Kel Penn
You'll think.
- [44:00]
Charlamagne tha God
She retired.
- [44:02]
Michael Jai White
No, he's still very. Yeah, he's, he, he, he shouldn't go out, like, now. You know, he's, he's, he, he's got, he's got aspirations, and I let him talk about, but he's not done as a fighter yet, but he's, he's heads and tails, like, more talented than the rest of the field, but sometimes kind of like Anderson Silva in my, like, you. You get a little bit ahead of yourself and you want to, like, kind of, you know, 360 dunk on people, but no, just go to the basics again, you know, and you. And, and exploit that. Well, you know, he agrees. You know, he, I, I think he. You haven't seen the last of him. And, and he's gonna, he's gonna step it up. He's gonna, he, he's gonna do what, what's necessary and, you know, kind of climb to where he needs to be.
- [44:55]
Charlamagne tha God
I love what you said even too, about meeting up with people. Right. Because that's not a matter of wanting to, you know, impose physical dominance sometimes. It's just a respect thing. I respect anything. Somebody.
- [45:07]
Michael Jai White
Yes, yes.
- [45:07]
Charlamagne tha God
I just don't respect the, over the social media, the long paragraph. You got to show me that vernacular in person. Let's have a conversation. That's it.
- [45:16]
Michael Jai White
Yeah, man. Yeah. So, so with. I've, I've, I trained with a lot of champions because there's a part of me that's like, I, I want to learn. I want to continue to learn. I, you know, it's like, I, I'm a, I'm a nerd with it, right? So, you know, with Jon Jones, man and, and Rampage Jackson, all these people who had championships, I'm here like, yeah, let's build. Let's, let's work on this. Because, you know, you're elite fighter now. I can work on my elite stuff with you. You know, so I've been like, I've been blessed with that. And so, yeah, so it's weird because some reason, like, I still feel like I'm in my 30s physically. I know that's going to change. And so on that day, you know, it's going, it's going to come. Right? But right now I'm, I'm feeling just as good as I ever did. Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, I've been, I'm blessed. So I'm using that.
- [46:06]
Charlamagne tha God
That's why people talk to you about martial arts, though. You ever seen, you don't watch superhero movies, but in Avengers, Tony Stark had the little electric shock and he poked Bruce Banner with it just to see him turn it. He said, I just want to see
- [46:15]
DJ Envy
if you do it.
- [46:16]
Charlamagne tha God
We want to see if he would turn into the Hulk. People just want to see. Yeah, but see, you can't. Want to see. You get busy.
- [46:22]
Podcast Host
You can't be trying to F around and find out with somebody that can. If you're disciplined, you know, doesn't stop. You can really put some things on you.
- [46:30]
Michael Jai White
True, true. I mean, but, but like I tell you, man, like, I've trained with a lot of champions and, and the thing I'll brag about is when I get humbled because that's when I learn stuff. Right? And you know, I mean, I was, I was training with Michael Bisbing and, and man, like the third round, I was so tired that I was like, I was, I was useless. And that taught me to always keep my, my cardio up. I have never been that out of shape since then. And that was years ago. And so, like, I learned things from that. Right. So it's a, it's about your. When you, you know, when you get humbled, you know, so. Yeah, so that's the stuff I brag about. Yeah, I'm, you know, I, you know, I got, I'm like, I say I'm a nerd with it, and, and so I try to share that while I can because one day I'm going to be with walking with a cane. Well, until then, I'm gonna enjoy what I, what I can now because, you know, I have a Chance to.
- [47:27]
Charlamagne tha God
And congratulations on your Bruce Lee Award. You're the first non Asian to win that award last year.
- [47:31]
Michael Jai White
Oh, thank you, man. Thank you. That. That meant a lot to me. Really? I didn't expect it, but. Yeah, but, you know, I used to train with Shannon Lee, Bruce Lee's daughter, and we did wushu. I. You know, it's like a kung fu that's very flowery. Very like what Jet Li does. So. Yeah, we used to train together way back under a guy named Eric Chen, who's like, you know, amazing. Like, one of the top. He was, like the top Wushu teachers in the country. And we. And I used to go to China with him. I used to travel to China with him, and he was one of my instructors when I was 14. Wow. Yes.
- [48:12]
Podcast Host
You learned a lot so young.
- [48:14]
Michael Jai White
Yeah, I was. Man, I was so blessed. I mean. Yeah, when I think about the people I train with is like, who's who in the martial arts in different branches of that. So I would go with Eric Chen to Beijing and train under Wu Bin, who was Jet Li's teacher. And so. And so I'm, you know, from that same camp and used to compete in China. So. Yeah, that's like, a blessing. You know, this is a. Like I say, I wanted to. One of the luckiest martial artists out there.
- [48:48]
Podcast Host
I saw you say, I don't know who Tony, Emmy or Oscar were, but I know who Bruce Lee is.
- [48:52]
Michael Jai White
That's true. That's what I said. Yeah. Yeah. Because, I mean, I. I ain't gonna try to. On the Oscars, but, you know, I. I never really watched those things, really. And, you know, it's weird to compare art, you know, to me, but. But, you know, with the. With the Bruce Lee Award, that. That meant something. That's.
- [49:12]
State Farm Advertiser
That's.
- [49:13]
Michael Jai White
That's my village. And so to get that award from the person who. The greatest martial artist ever to live and who's emulated every day and who's created an industry. Yeah, that. That was something that. That. It was close to my heart.
- [49:29]
Charlamagne tha God
And the train with Shannon. Shannon's dope. I had a conversation with her a few weeks ago, a nice, long conversation. Yeah, she's dope.
- [49:36]
Michael Jai White
Yeah. She's always been. She's been one of the most quality people way back, you know, so she's running the foundation and. And doing her father proud. Word. Yeah.
- [49:45]
DJ Envy
We appreciate you for joining us this morning, brother.
- [49:47]
Charlamagne tha God
Appreciate you, J. White.
- [49:49]
DJ Envy
The new movie Special Op, Rent a Cop is out right now, and thank you for joining us, brother. We appreciate it.
- [49:53]
Michael Jai White
Thank you. Let's do this again, man.
- [49:55]
DJ Envy
Next time you're in the city. Come on up, man.
- [49:56]
Michael Jai White
Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Appreciate you guys. Thank you.
- [49:59]
DJ Envy
All right. It's the Breakfast Club. Good morning.
- [50:03]
Charlamagne tha God
Every day I wake up.
- [50:04]
Joybox Advertiser
Wake your ass up.
- [50:05]
Charlamagne tha God
The Breakfast Club.
- [50:09]
Joybox Advertiser
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- [50:39]
Ryan Seacrest
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- [51:09]
Mint Mobile Advertiser
This is Jody Sweet and this is Andrea Barber from How Rude. Tandoritos Chewy has over a hundred thousand products. Food, treats, toys, beds and everything ships fast. And it's not just for dogs, cats, birds, fish, reptiles. I mean, they got everybody covered. Plus prescriptions, pet insurance and telehealth. Vet visits and vet clinics are rolling out now, which I love. So many great things. And if your pet doesn't love something, return it within a year. For life with pets, the answer is chewy. Save $20 on your first order with free shipping at chupanions.chewy.com how rude.
- [51:49]
Kel Penn
Hey everyone, it's Kel Penn. I'm inviting you to join the best sounding book club you've ever heard with my podcast, Hearsay, the Audible and I Heart Audiobook Club. Every episode I nerd out with amazing guests and dive into the the best new audiobooks available on Audible. It's the book club for your ears. Listen to Earsay, the Audible and iHeart audiobook club on the iHeartradio app or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [52:17]
Podcast Host
This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.