INTERVIEW: Pete Buttigieg On Full-time Fatherhood, Airport Regulations, Epstein Files, Presidential Polls +More

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Breakfast Club – Interview with Pete Buttigieg

Episode Title: INTERVIEW: Pete Buttigieg On Full-time Fatherhood, Airport Regulations, Epstein Files, Presidential Polls +More
Release Date: July 24, 2025
Host: DJ Envy, Jess Hilarious, Charlamagne Tha God
Guest: Pete Buttigieg

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Introduction

The episode begins with the energetic hosts, DJ Envy, Charlamagne Tha God, and Just Hilarious, warmly welcoming former U.S. Secretary of Transportation and political figure, Pete Buttigieg. The conversation swiftly transitions from light-hearted banter about personal grooming habits post-White House to deeper discussions on fatherhood, public policy, and current political climates.

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Full-time Fatherhood

Pete Buttigieg shares his transition into full-time fatherhood, highlighting the joys and challenges of raising mixed-race children.

• Embracing Change:
  "This is the first time in 15 years that I've neither been in office nor on the ballot, and I'm making the most of that." [05:06]

• Navigating Racial Identity:
  Pete discusses the introspection involved in raising children with different racial identities, emphasizing the importance of providing diverse mentors and role models.
  "As they grow older, there's going to be dimensions of their lives that I will do everything I can as a father to make sure that they succeed." [03:01]

• Practical Challenges:
  The conversation delves into the practical aspects of caring for his children, such as managing their hair care routines—a topic that becomes a source of humor among the hosts.
  "We're doing the conditioner and then the leave-in conditioner tonight and then in the morning. It is a journey." [45:33]

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Airport Regulations and Aviation Safety

Pete provides an in-depth analysis of the current state of U.S. airport infrastructure and aviation safety, addressing misconceptions and industry challenges.

• Debunking Myths About DEI Grants:
  When confronted with critiques blaming him for airport issues due to DEI grants, Pete clarifies the actual allocation and benefits of these funds.
  "We're talking about fixing roads and bridges that happen to go into a black neighborhood or a low-income area. Meanwhile, we'll talk about aviation." [11:21]

• Air Traffic Control Workforce:
  Pete highlights his administration's efforts to grow the air traffic control workforce, contrary to claims of decline.
  "I'm pretty sure I'm the first Secretary of Transportation in 30 years or more to have the air traffic control workforce growing instead of shrinking on his watch." [12:00]

• Safety Improvements:
  Emphasizing advancements, he points out improvements in infrastructure projects aimed at enhancing safety, such as modernizing taxiway geometries.
  "We set up funding to take a road that's getting washed out every year and move it to where it's not going to be as vulnerable." [14:03]

• Aviation vs. Private Plane Crashes:
  The discussion contrasts the safety standards between commercial and private aviation, advocating for enhanced safety checks across all aircraft.
  "There's a higher standard for a jumbo jet that's got 300 people on it than for recreational planes." [18:54]

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Epstein Files and Political Accountability

A significant portion of the interview revolves around the controversial Epstein files and the political ramifications of their handling.

• Government Shutdown Over Epstein Files:
  Pete expresses frustration over the House of Representatives being shut down to block the release of Epstein files.
  "The Republicans just shut down the United States House of Representatives for two months to avoid having to vote on Donald Trump blocking the Epstein files." [31:59]

• Accountability and Transparency:
  He urges continuous scrutiny and transparency regarding Epstein's connections, highlighting the need for accountability regardless of political affiliations.
  "Anybody who's an abuser, anybody who's committed—like, of course, right." [34:15]

• Critique of Media and Government Actions:
  Pete criticizes the New York Post's reporting and the broader trend of media platforming without accountability.
  "It's very telling that none of the people who were throwing stones in that article actually put their name to their quote." [16:26]

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Presidential Polls and Future Political Aspirations

The conversation shifts to Pete's current political standing and future ambitions within the Democratic Party.

• Current Polling and Campaign Strategy:
  While acknowledging a polling percentage around 13%, Pete remains focused on personal growth and family life rather than obsessively tracking polls.
  "I try not to look at that too much." [44:43]

• Party Unity and Diversity of Thought:
  He advocates for a big-tent Democratic Party that embraces diverse perspectives and robust policy discussions rather than succumbing to uniformity.
  "I want to live in a country where there's lots of different perspectives, different values, different ideas." [28:37]

• Future of the Democratic Party:
  Pete envisions a future where younger, politically moderate to left-leaning leaders can coexist within the party, each contributing authentically to the party's message.
  "We're always gonna be a big tent party." [41:43]

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Addressing National Challenges and Policy Priorities

Pete outlines key policy areas that he believes the Democratic Party needs to address to stay relevant and effective.

• Infrastructure and Technological Advancements:
  Stressing the importance of modernizing infrastructure, he underscores the necessity of technological integration to enhance safety and efficiency in transportation.
  "Infrastructure matters. I just made a point of making sure everybody knew if it was the airline that was responsible, they had to own it and they had to pay up." [16:01]

• AI Development and Economic Impact:
  Highlighting the disruptive potential of artificial intelligence, Pete calls for proactive measures to prepare the workforce and communities for rapid technological changes.
  "This AI development... is going to affect how all of us, it already is." [39:47]

• Electoral Integrity:
  He voices concerns over electoral manipulations, such as redrawing maps in states like Texas, and emphasizes the need for fair and free elections.
  "Things they could do to manipulate the election in a really sinister way." [43:13]

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Concluding Remarks

As the interview wraps up, the hosts express their appreciation for Pete's candidness and continuous engagement with the public outside of campaign seasons. Pete reiterates his commitment to speaking out on critical issues and supporting the Democratic Party's growth and effectiveness.

• Commitment to Advocacy:
  "I am definitely doing now and gonna keep doing is speak out about this stuff and try to show versus telling." [44:18]

• Appreciation from the Hosts:
  The hosts commend Pete for his ongoing communication efforts, emphasizing the rarity of politicians maintaining consistent public dialogue.
  "We truly appreciate it because... you never stop talking to our audience." [45:09]

---

Notable Quotes

1. On Fatherhood:
   "It's the best, hardest thing in my life." — Pete Buttigieg [03:51]

2. On Media Platforms:
   "If President Trump was going on this show to reach listeners and viewers, why wouldn't we be putting forward a different set of ideas?" — DJ Envy [08:15]

3. On Diversity:
   "The opposite of diversity is uniformity. And I don't want to live in a country with more uniformity." — DJ Envy [28:37]

4. On Political Strategy:
   "Our version has to be 10 times better." — DJ Envy [43:16]

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Conclusion

This episode of The Breakfast Club offers an insightful and multifaceted discussion with Pete Buttigieg, touching upon personal life changes, critical public policy issues, and the evolving landscape of American politics. Through candid conversations and thoughtful analysis, the episode provides listeners with a comprehensive understanding of the challenges and aspirations shaping Buttigieg's post-administrative career and his vision for the future of the Democratic Party.

Transcript

[DJ Envy]

This is an iHeart podcast.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

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[DJ Envy]

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[Charlamagne Tha God]

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[DJ Envy]

Hold up.

[Just Hilarious]

Every day I wake up. Wake your ass up. The Breakfast Club.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Morning, everybody. It's DJ Envy. Just hilarious. Charlamagne, the guy. We are the Breakfast Club. We got a special guest in the building.

[Just Hilarious]

Yes, indeed.

[DJ Envy]

He's back.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Pete Buttigieg. Welcome back. Morning. Now you got out the White House and got a bid immediately. You didn't have that bid last time.

[DJ Envy]

No. You know, there were very few days that I didn't have to shave the whole time that I was in office. And then suddenly I didn't have to worry about that. So I started out just not shaving every day. And then we went on a vacation. I came back with a beard. I thought, I'm gonna keep this for a while. Chastain's very pro. My daughter doesn't like it. She keeps telling me to shave it because she says it's too scratchy when I kiss her goodnight. But her brother hasn't weighed in yet, so he might be the swing vote in the household. We'll see.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

He's the swing vote now. Do they make you. Do they tell you look clean when for the White House because you're on television? Do they say that?

[DJ Envy]

I don't think they have to. You just, you know. I don't think I was ever told to shave. Not since I was in the military. Anyway. Then it was a thing. In fact, I remember when the. When there was the first Trump government shutdown, I saw all the guys in my reserve unit a few weeks later, a football game, and everybody had beards all of a sudden because we could. Because we didn't have to shave for that. But no, it's interesting, right? I think in the 19th century to be in politics, you had to have a beard. It was a thing, right?

[Just Hilarious]

Yeah.

[DJ Envy]

And then almost nobody did anyway. What's that?

[Just Hilarious]

I haven't seen you wear a tie.

[DJ Envy]

Since you know, when I got home from work, I always, first thing I did was, even when I got in the car on the way out from the office, the tie had to go. I was like, I don't know, I just wanted to breathe a little more. So I'm happy to not have to wear a tie as much.

[Just Hilarious]

You know, I saw you on the flavor podcast with my guy, Andrew Schultz. I didn't know that you had mixed race kids. I don't know why I didn't know that.

[DJ Envy]

Yeah, you know, we don't put a lot of pictures of them on the Internet or, you know, there's a lot of privacy, obviously goes into that. But, yeah, they're about to turn four. They keep at like, every day they ask me, is it my birthday? They're. They've just transformed our lives in so many ways. It's been amazing.

[Just Hilarious]

And I saw you say, you know, you ask yourself constantly, how can I be a good dad for kids who have a different racial identity than I do? How can I help them navigate that? And for whatever reason, there was a little bit of backlash to those comments. And I don't know why I thought those are great questions to ask yourself.

[DJ Envy]

I mean, you know, I was, I was just talking about how I feel about it. And yeah, I think anytime you talk about something that sensitive, somebody's ready to pounce, somebody's ready to pick it apart and, and tear you up over it. But, yeah, obviously, you know, we're white. Our kids are mixed race. They're going to be, as they grow older, there's going to be dimensions of their lives that I will do everything I can as a father, as a loving father, to make sure that they succeed. But there will be parts of their lives that I can't really draw on personal experience to help guide them through. And so it's a lot of making sure that they have mentors and role models, other examples in their lives to help them navigate all of that. But it's just been such a blessing and it's a new challenge every day. But it's the best, hardest thing in my life.

[Just Hilarious]

Who are some of those people who. The black friends you call.

[DJ Envy]

Oh, you wouldn't believe. So the advice that came in from the first moment, I had a Navy buddy who saw a couple of pictures of them from a thing we were at the White House on and said, we got to talk about hair and immediately wanted to make sure that because just hair products alone and by the way, being a girl to dad was, was intimidating to begin with. Right. And then there's everything that. That comes with that. Finding the right products for. For Gus, our little guy, for Penelope, our daughter. Just learning all of that. Like, you know, nobody in my immediate family of white relatives.

[Pete Buttigieg]

Yeah.

[DJ Envy]

Knows a lot about that, but lots of friends do.

[Just Hilarious]

You don't know how to breed.

[DJ Envy]

I got you. I gotta figure it out.

[Pete Buttigieg]

Cantu olive oil, Shea Moisture. And then get the wide tooth comb. Don't get the small teeth comb because that's gonna pull a hair out. Yeah, because we got thicker hair.

[DJ Envy]

Yeah, we learned that the hard. The Cantu. And then we got the young king. For him, it's like a three step sequence. It's. It's. It's the leave in conditioner. Then you got the oils, right?

[Pete Buttigieg]

Yes. Leave in is good.

[DJ Envy]

And then there's. There's the essential oil and then there's. There's the curling cream. Although by step three now he's. He's a little older, but he was really fighting us on the third step. He's like, you learning, though.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

You learn to be.

[Just Hilarious]

Now we got to get Pete some money. I do not want you or your husband playing him. Cheering hair. No Pete.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

So you do her hair every day?

[DJ Envy]

Yeah. Well, Chaston does it more often than I do because I know I can't.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Do my daughter's hair and I know Charlamagne can't do his daughter's hair. Can you, Charlamagne?

[Pete Buttigieg]

Hell no, he's not.

[Just Hilarious]

I don't know if Justin can. I need to see the hair. Round of applause. I don't know what the hair look like.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

You're right. You're right. You right.

[Just Hilarious]

Jesus.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

I love it, though. I was gonna say before you walked in, it's funny. Jess was like, so what is Pete doing now? And I was like, that is a good question. What is Pete doing now that you're out the White House, besides being a dad and a husband? So what are you doing now?

[DJ Envy]

So being a dad and husband is number one for the. And it's the first time in a while that I've been able to put the kind of time in it that I want to. This is the first time in 15 years that I haven't either been in office or on the ballot, and I'm making the most of that. But, you know, this is obviously not a time in the life of our country where you can just sit still or kind of hang out and not be involved. So I'm speaking out, continuing to go on podcasts, go on tv, write. I've got a Substack where I'm writing thoughts on some of the issues that are coming up. Thinking about doing a book.

[Pete Buttigieg]

Nice.

[DJ Envy]

So keeping busy. But I have to say, at a personal level, it's been good not to be on that treadmill. Washington just, I'm not saying I don't. I miss the impact we were able to have. I miss getting up in the morning and knowing that, you know, I could make a decision that could make a whole city better off right through a transportation project we were doing or something like that. I miss that. But. But I don't miss the negativity. I don't miss the way that Washington is so inward looking. It was always about, what did this senator have for breakfast? What are you going to do to keep these people happy that most people have never even heard of? But that kind of thing. I don't miss.

[Just Hilarious]

What made you not seek the Senate seat in Michigan?

[DJ Envy]

Well, for one thing, it was thinking about the family being at home for the first time in a long time. And I remember one day that was really kind of the decision day in a way when I'd kind of set for myself, like, what are we going to do? Was talking about it with Chastain and then it was bedtime. And the way story time works in our house is we get into one of their twin beds and daughter's on my right. Gus, our son is on my left. And I was reading, I don't know, Cat in the Hat or something and he just started curling up, fell asleep on my chest. And I thought that that's a vote. Like he's telling me something about where I'm needed most. And I also thought, you know, the message I want to get out there, I don't have to be in the United States Senate to do that. Obviously I care about who the next senator is. I'm going to be very active in supporting a good candidate for Senate because so much for our state and our country depends on us, us having a good senator to replace Debbie Stab. Now who's. And, oh, sorry, Gary, Gary Peters, who's retiring. But I just didn't think that had to be me.

[Just Hilarious]

Why do you think it was so much backlash for you going on the Flagrant podcast?

[DJ Envy]

Well, in a way, it's reliving what it was like a few years ago when I started to go on Fox News a lot. So a lot of people in my party said, you can't do that. You're, you know, you're participating in this right wing media system that's, you know, that's not giving people good information. And my response was always, you know, I can't blame somebody for not agreeing with my positions if they've never heard them. So, of course, I got to go on right wing media. Now, you fast forward a few years to these podcasts and flagrant, by the way, I don't consider flagrant to be right wing media, but that's the whole point, right? A lot of these podcasts, a lot of these shows, they're not for people who are looking to get politics in their face all the time, but they are where a lot of people get their information or get exposed to people with political ideas. And I thought, okay, if President Trump was going on this show to reach listeners and viewers, why wouldn't we be putting forward a different set of ideas? Especially because when I got there and I was talking to these guys, many of whom voted a different way than I did, we agreed a lot on what was happening next, on the problem with tilting the tax code to favor the rich. And that was before the bill passed. Now the bill passed. We know, and we've seen it. Problems with cutting services, making it harder to get your phone call answered on Social Security, all of these things. Right. So we could just have a conversation. And yeah, I think some people still, you know, I remember a few people saying, like, why are you platforming these guys who have said something offensive? And I'm just thinking, like, they're platforming me. It's their show.

[Just Hilarious]

It's the stupidest thing when people say, how are you platform? How you. They already have a huge platform, so why not go on there and, you know, let people hear what it is you have to say. Give people another, you know, option.

[DJ Envy]

Right? Yeah. Especially because fewer and fewer people are getting their news from traditional sources. I spent part of the spring teaching at the University of Chicago. There's an institute of politics there that David Axelrod set up. He asked me to spend time with the students there.

[Just Hilarious]

I think I came right after you.

[DJ Envy]

Oh, were you there?

[Just Hilarious]

I think I came right after you.

[DJ Envy]

They said, did you have a good time?

[Just Hilarious]

Oh, I loved it.

[DJ Envy]

I think it's a great experience. And. And you learn so much talking to these students. One things I. One of the things I would often do is to kind of show of hands. Just where do you get your information? The number of students who said television news was zero, like literally zero out of the students said they just, like, sat the way I was when I was growing up or still do sometimes, like, turn on a TV show and Watch it. Right. They might see something from tv, go into their feedback, get clipped. But in terms of where people are getting our information, we got to find people where they are.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

I wanted to ask, go back about your previous duties. The airports seemed like the airport's gotten a lot worse. Why do you think that is? Or are we just hearing about it more and these are the problems that have been having for the last 10, 20 years?

[Just Hilarious]

Well, I read an article yesterday. They blamed it on you, Pete. Of course they said that. Of course I said under you, the Department of transportation allocated over $80 billion for DEI GR.

[DJ Envy]

Okay.

[Just Hilarious]

Instead of putting money into.

[DJ Envy]

Yeah.

[Just Hilarious]

So the actual airlines.

[DJ Envy]

Yeah.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

The airports.

[DJ Envy]

Airports, obviously, I think that's bullshit. Let's break it down. First of all, quote, unquote, DEI grants, we're talking about transportation funding that they're now getting rid of. So Milwaukee, 6th street, we funded a project, $34 million to help make a set of improvements to a very dangerous street where there've been a lot of crashes. And that has divided the community. We provided funding. They're also going to improve the sewer while they're at it. I mean, this is bread and butter stuff that's going to make the city better off. Trump administration killed that grant because the application talked about equity. It talked about one of the reasons for funding this project being that that neighborhood had been underinvested in. There was a project in Missoula, Montana, connecting East Missoula across Highway 200. By the way, the Republican senator from Montana supported that project and wrote me a letter saying we ought to fund it. And we did. This administration killed it just because it was part of a program that mentions equity. So when they talk about, quote, unquote, DEI grants, often they're talking about fixing roads and bridges that happen to go into a black neighborhood or a low income area. Meanwhile, we'll talk about aviation. I'm pretty sure I'm the first Secretary of transportation in 30 years or more to have the air traffic control workforce growing instead of shrinking on his watch. And that was hard because we've been losing air traffic controllers. They've been retiring. It's just been hard to get as many to come in as we're going out. I don't know whether that number is still going up now. I know that from the beginning they all got an email saying you should think about taking a buyout and quit your job. Then they, they were told that email was never for them. So I don't know exactly what's going on over there now. What I know is that we left the air traffic control system better than we found it, but it's still got a lot of problems. And so the answer to your question is really, it's both. There are new problems that we're seeing, you know, that I'm seeing just as a now I'm, you know, regular member of the traveling public. But there are some issues that have been in the making for 10, 20, 30 years. We did what we could to improve it. But honestly, my successor, who I obviously disagree with on lots of things, I want him to succeed on this. I mean, for one thing, I fly a lot, but also for the sake of the country, I want them to succeed in improving that.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

But it seems like a lot of the problems that we've been having, especially when we see these floods and these storms, are problems that we keep seeing. Right. You know, you look at areas in Texas or even New Jersey, they flood the same every time. So it's just like, why can't we fix those problems? It's not like it's new problems. These are problems that are reoccurring.

[DJ Envy]

So what we did was we set up funding to do things like take a road that's getting washed out every year, and instead of putting it back the exact same every time and putting a bunch of money into that, move it to where it's not going to be as vulnerable. They're going after that kind of thing, too, because they're systematically deleting any reference to climate change or sustainability from anything in the government. And what that means is I think these projects are in danger.

[Just Hilarious]

The $80 billion that was allocated, they said 400 awards from 2021 to 2024. What did that actually go to? Because they're calling it DEI grants. But where did it go? What did it go to?

[DJ Envy]

Yeah, so I don't know how they got the 80 number, 80 billion numbers, but I can tell you, I mean, if maybe if you're counting like any project that was connected in any way to taking care of people who had been underinvested, and that'd be one way to do it, because we had this whole idea of making sure that a good share of the grant money went to neighborhoods or communities that were cut out in the past. But again, there are these specific projects. East Toledo, we did a project to connect East Toledo to downtown Toledo, get people across this high crash corridor where they were having dozens of crashes. And it came under the heading of reconnecting communities or reconnecting neighborhoods, which this administration considers woke. So they're trying to cut it. To me, it's definitely important that it's going to a disadvantaged area. It's also just a good project. It's a good safety project. So they want to call it dei. I would call it good policy. And this. This war on anything that has anything remotely to do with diversity, I think has gone to such an extreme. People are starting to feel it because it's starting to come for them.

[Just Hilarious]

So how would you respond to people who have concerns that these equity initiatives delayed urgent aviation upgrades?

[DJ Envy]

It's just not true. I mean, you know, the person who launched the contract, for example, to modernize the tech backbone of the. That was me. We did that. It's a big agency. We did a lot of things. We did roads, we did bridges, we did aviation, we did port. I mean, you know, you can do a lot of things at the same time. That's what we did.

[Just Hilarious]

Now, all of this is coming from the New York Post. So this came out yesterday, so I'm giving you a chance.

[DJ Envy]

Oh, yeah. So that. That specific article, actually, it's. It's. I can't believe I'm saying this, but I would actually say it's worth reading. Because if you read it, you'll see a bunch of anonymous people, mostly from the airline industry, complaining with no kind of specific facts or figures, followed by a whole bunch of. Which, like the Post does, they put it at the bottom of the article. A whole bunch of facts and figures showing something different, which was our response. But, yeah, obviously the airline industry was not a big fan of mine. Right, Because I was a tough regulator. I mean, we moved the rule to make sure that you can get your money back if your flight gets significantly delayed. We had really tough penalties on airlines that were holding back on people's refunds. We pushed them on things like disability, making sure if they mangle your wheelchair that they have to take care of you. The current administration froze that rule. That's something we pushed on. So obviously, my replacement is an airline lobbyist or he was an airline lobbyist. Obviously, the airline industry is happier with the new guy who was an airline lobbyist than with somebody like me who is a tough regulator. But that's the kind of inside baseball that drives these articles. And I think it's very telling that none of the people who were. Who were throwing stones in that article actually put their name to their quote.

[Just Hilarious]

So earlier this year, when, like, you know, there was, like, plane crashes and stuff, is there a part of you that's like, I hate to See that? But I. I told you so.

[DJ Envy]

Look, you know, aviation's still safer than driving or any other form of transportation. But it's the nightmare scenario for anybody who cares about transportation. Definitely anybody who ever had the job. I had to have a plane crash happen in this country. One of the things that was really important to me was during my time in office, we had 4 billion employments, 4 billion times that somebody got onto a commercial passenger airline, and zero crash fatalities. And it's everybody's job to keep that up. And I do worry about what will happen if you got air traffic controllers who are being distracted by all this political nonsense, getting an email telling them that they're going to get bought out, then being told that doesn't apply to them firing it people like they did on day one. Of course I'm worried about that.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

I always wanted to know, and maybe you can help people out. You hear more private planes crashing than commercial planes. Is that because the regulate, I guess, whatever, the regulations are less lenient?

[DJ Envy]

Yeah.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Why is that?

[DJ Envy]

Yeah, there is a higher standard for a jumbo jet that's got 300 people on it than for recreational plane where somebody's flying a Cessna or even a private jet. And I think, look, that, you know, if you think about how we manage risk, that makes sense up to a point. But there's also got to be a floor, there's got to be a baseline that no matter what, if you have an airplane in the national airspace, it's got to have these safety checks.

[Just Hilarious]

You said once that most flight delays stem from weather and airline issues, not infrastructure.

[DJ Envy]

Yeah, infrastructure or air traffic control. That is usually number three. So if you think about why or when are you most likely to get to have a problem? Yeah, weather's number one. A lot of times it's the airlines, especially when I was there, A lot of times the airlines didn't have enough staff. They've improved that. Then you go down the list. Then you get to more issues around infrastructure, technology. If there's not enough air traffic controllers on duty, the. The airport will respond by reducing the number of flights that can come or go so that it's safe. That's what happened to a lot of people at Newark. So it's a factor. It's not the number one factor.

[Just Hilarious]

So how confident are you that infrastructure, I guess, plays a minimal role?

[DJ Envy]

I wouldn't say minimal. I mean, one of the reasons we pushed so hard to get that infrastructure bill done was to make improvements. Right. Things like stuff you might never notice when you're on a plane like taxiway geometry. So, so it's, it's making sure that the way the taxiway is lined up makes it less likely that two planes would ever be at risk of, of colliding. Things like whether a plane has to wait to take off by lining up at the end of the Runway or whether it can go around it. These, you know, these kind of engine, super technical engineering questions that can actually really have an effect on safety. And that matters. The technology matters. Look, some of these control towers, I mean, I went into these towers, they make it work with some pretty antiquated systems. I mean, we're talking about dramatically older computer equipment than anything in this room, for example. Now they've gotten, they've gotten the results. But that, of course, that system is going to show its age over time. The airports themselves, that's why we push so much money into the airports to improve them. And America should have better airports than we have. In some cases, we've, we've upped our game. Look at LaGuardia, right? I came into LaGuardia yesterday. Really, really impressive. What? Especially if you remember what it used to. Yeah, planes is another story. That's, you know, that's down to the, to the airlines to keep their fleet up to date and everything in between. But, but yeah, no, don't get me wrong. The infrastructure matters. I just made a point of making sure everybody knew if it was the airline that was responsible, they had to own it and they had to pay up.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Did you ever look into other nations? Like, you know, when you go to other countries? I see a lot of times they have things that, preventative things like if the ground is too cold, they have things that they spray onto the ground that's connected to the ground to make sure there's no ice or if it's too hot. I feel like we should have some of that with as much money as we spend as much money that we have. Why don't we? And do you look at those other nations to see how their infrastructure works?

[DJ Envy]

Oh, for sure, yeah. You can learn so much going to other countries. I mean, you look at Japan and the train system they have there and by the way, their high speed train, they've had that since the 60s. This is not some newfangled technology, which is why we pushed to get that done in the US There's Las Vegas projects going out to Southern California that should be done in this decade.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Why are we so behind?

[Just Hilarious]

Why are we so ghetto America? Just ghetto compared to other places?

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Why, bro, they have this thing where to avoid ice that is connected, it almost heats the road so it's not slippery in these other places. And I'm like, how we don't have that, you know, it's just the weirdest thing.

[DJ Envy]

You know, we, we did. I remember one project, it was in New Hampshire where they already had a power plant and there's a way to connect it up to, to route some of the heat. They were just venting the heat through the cooling tower and there was a way to put that in the sidewalk. And then it saved the city taxpayer money to clear the roads. So there have been things like that going on. I think the bottom line is you get what you pay for. And America has had a problem with investing in shared things or public things for a long time.

[Just Hilarious]

So where's this money going? When you hear about the, you know, the money that you allocated or the money Biden allocated, the infrastructure, but where does the money go?

[DJ Envy]

What's going to be exactly this kind of stuff, right? The Portal North Bridge is well underway in New Jersey. I don't know, you know, a lot of the projects I signed off on, I don't know their fate. But I'll tell you, every day when I'm taking the kids to school or to camp, I pass by a project that, that we signed off on. In my time, these things take a while, right? So I signed off on it probably two or three years ago. Now the workers are there installing it. Characteristically, right. For a three year old boy, Gus is like, why is that worker not working? That's an excavator. Like there's a role. Like we look at it every day and I see it taking shape. But these things take shape over three years, five years, not one year.

[Just Hilarious]

You know, the Post says that reportedly you remarked that modernizing air traffic control might simply allow airlines to fly more planes. Like, could you elaborate on that?

[DJ Envy]

Yeah, that's not a thing that I said.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Hey, what up y'?

[DJ Envy]

All?

[Charlamagne Tha God]

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[DJ Envy]

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[Charlamagne Tha God]

Appointed seats are optional features.

[DJ Envy]

I mean the least of our problems was airlines wanting to add flight. Our big problem actually was airlines couldn't keep up with the flights that they themselves had scheduled. And then if we caught them in unrealistic scheduling, we're going to enforce on them. But now what I will say is we should have good alternatives. So you should be able to get a flight, but you should also be able to take a good train. You should have a safe, effective highway so that people have more options and not less. Same with transit. Right. Yesterday from Laguardia, I took the bus, the M70 I think it is. And then, then you get to the subway, which was fine. But in, in most countries, if you're.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Busing now, before Pete.

[DJ Envy]

Oh, they never. Yeah, well, this thing, I was always pro transit, but they wouldn't let me do transit most of the time, you know, they wanted me to be in the vehicle and security protocols. I get it. But he thinks you, Paul.

[Just Hilarious]

Pete, it's not like you was rich before. He really think you poor now.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

I didn't say that. I didn't say that people for would come in, you know, be, you know, he come in the truck and all that, but now he was an elected official.

[DJ Envy]

Not elected official, but a little more low key now. But my point is in most countries, most modern countries, you're in the biggest or one of the biggest cities in that country and you get to the airport, you're going to have a one seat ride to downtown. Right. We're one of the very few places where you don't have that. We should.

[Just Hilarious]

Why do people get so mad at equity and initiative programs? Like, like why, like why is that such a thing? Like why can the New York Post, you know, post this article and put this headline and then people say that is a detriment to Pete Buttigieg and anything he wants to do in the future politically, like, you know, especially like if you ran a national campaign.

[DJ Envy]

Look, I think for years there has been this Politics of saying that if you do anything to try to make a situation more fair for black people, usually for black people, that's going to make it worse. Right. If you care about recruiting more black people to have a chance to get a job, then you're somehow lowering standards. When that's not. That's not what we were doing when we were going to HBCUs saying we want you to apply to work at the FAA or work at US dot. We were saying we want to let you know this job exists and show you the path so that you can meet that same high standard that everybody has to meet. But there's a lot to be gained by characterizing it as something else. Right. This idea that anything that we do to. To deal with those fairness issues is at your expense. These numbers that they're throwing around in the post. Right. Make it sound like that money went to somebody else and it didn't go to you. They're trying to do the same thing with Medicaid. They're trying to make people feel like, well, this is just for lazy people who shouldn't be on Medicaid when we know for a fact, because they did this in Arkansas, that what winds up happening is it kicks off people who are eligible should be getting the Medicaid, but they get buried in paperwork and that stops them from getting their benefits. There's this. It's a classic kind of pitting people against each other. Look, I get that sometimes these, honestly, in their vocabulary and their style, some of these programs got out of hand. I've sat through some trainings that just made it seem. They seem like something out of a Republican caricature of what Democrats do. But they've now taken it so far to the other extreme that people in Toledo or Missoula, Montana or Milwaukee aren't going to get their roads or their sewers fixed. Because the Trump administration and the Republicans thought that the program that funded it had something to do with diversity. Right? That's hurting everybody. Where when you do this right, everybody's better off and nobody's worse off.

[Just Hilarious]

What's wrong? I guess my old thing, what's wrong with diversity? America is a diverse nation. Diversity built this country.

[DJ Envy]

Look, the opposite of diversity is uniformity. And I don't want to live in a country with more uniformity. I want to live a country where there's lots of different perspectives, different values, different ideas, different politics. But what we are headed toward now is more uniformity. Look at what just happened with cbs, right?

[Just Hilarious]

Oh, my God.

[DJ Envy]

You've Got somebody canceled who happens to be one of the most effective critics of the president. That's right. Working for a corporation that happens to have business in front of the government because they're trying to get their merger.

[Just Hilarious]

That's right.

[DJ Envy]

This is not that complicated to figure out all the pieces coming together, and the net effect of it is one less voice on the air that's different than the person running the government. But the thing is, in my experience, that's never been what people left, right, or center want in this country. I mean, if anything, it was my conservative and libertarian friends that I'd be arguing with over beers in college who would talk about things like the government trying to impose censorship on people, or federal agents snatching people off the streets or any of these things. I used to think of those as a libertarian fever dream that was never going to happen. Now we see it happening under a president who claims to be conservative. So I would like to believe that one thing we could agree on as a country is we want less uniformity and more diversity of thought, more support for all the different things that different people. I mean, again, you spend a minute in New York City and it's exhilarating to see all of the different kind of styles and backgrounds, and you know that with that comes different ideas, that that's part of what makes America great.

[Just Hilarious]

I think it's hard. It's hard to have these conversations because when you use words like authoritarian strategy, a lot of people don't even really understand what that is. And when you can say, oh, yeah, Colbert got canceled, but you know he was losing a lot of money for the network, you can just chalk it up to something else. But then you gotta look at PBS being defunded and NPR being defunded, Wall Street Journal, you know, being sued. This is all in a matter of, like, days.

[DJ Envy]

This is systematic, right? And they're doing basically any place where there is independence, whether they're talking about PBS or a law firm or university, any place that is independent is being put in a position where they have to look over their shoulder because they might do something that's inconvenient for the government. And again, when I say that, I sound like my libertarian buddies 20 years ago, but that's what's happening. And left, right and center, we should be able to come together and say, wait a minute, we don't. I don't care. Wherever you come down on, like, taxes or Medicare or abortion, like, all of us should be able to agree that we don't want that. And that if we move in that direction, if we live in the kind of country where a TV show or a university could get shut down because the government doesn't like them, this isn't America anymore.

[Just Hilarious]

How do you feel about the Epstein files? I feel that Democrats should never stop talking about the Epstein files. I think it is the one thing that builds a bridge between Democrats and that MAGA base they've been trying to reach ever since Trump won reelection.

[DJ Envy]

I think that's right. Look, I think there's some folks who might say this is a distraction or this isn't the bread and butter of what we care about. But what I would say is, or let's say what you really care about is legislation, policy. That's your thing. You see all these headlines about Epstein, but you think to yourself, what I care about is how the Congress is dealing with health care, taxes, et cetera. Okay, well, Congress just got shut down. The Republicans just shut down the United States House of Representatives for two months in order to avoid having to vote on Donald Trump blocking the Epstein files. So even if you don't give a shit about the news story or the sensationalism of it, this now affects you because one of your branches of government is not operational between now and September, because Speaker Mike Johnson and the Republicans would rather shut that branch of government down than let the Epstein files come out. Let that sink in. It's also another example, among many, many examples of Donald Trump saying he's going to do something on day one, and then something very different happens, right? Said he's going to lower prices on day one. Opposite happened. He's pushing him up with tariffs, said he's going to bring peace to the Middle east on day one, get peace with Russia on day one. I don't know if anybody really took him seriously on that, but that's what he says. And then he says, day one, these Epstein files are going to come out. Because at the time, it was in his interest to pretend that he was going to do that, and now it is in his interest to block those files coming out. And I don't think it's unreasonable to ask why.

[Just Hilarious]

Why do you think the Biden administration never put him up?

[DJ Envy]

I don't know. I was not close to the, you know, the DOJ or how any of that worked. I know some. A lot of stuff came out, but if there was really more and I don't know, but they, they were waving around these binders right, at press conferences.

[Just Hilarious]

You think it would be Mutually Assured Destruction?

[DJ Envy]

Could be. I mean, look, we already know that there were Democrats, Republicans, like, there are all kinds of people mixed up with this guy, right? I think most Americans say, okay, let the chips fall where they may. Like, we gotta know.

[Just Hilarious]

Yeah, get rid of everybody. Get rid of all of them.

[DJ Envy]

Anybody who's an abuser, anybody who's committed, like, of course. Right. And it does feel like something in this moment where none of us can agree on much, that all of us can agree on that. And it's especially weird with Trump, right, because it's not some wild liberal conspiracy claim that he was involved with Jeffrey Epstein. There's pictures, pictures still coming out now after all these years. Not to mention the pictures and footage that were there years ago. And not just him, like, shaking hands, getting his picture taken with the guy, but, like, ogling women with him. Right? Like dancing with, like, grooving with him. Now we find out he was at his wedding. So obviously there's something there. It's not even arguable that there's something there. So I think you're right that we should be pounding on that, even if it's not a central policy priority of the party.

[Just Hilarious]

I asked some other people that were in the Biden administration why they didn't, you know, release it. And they said that they don't dwell in conspiracy. And I'm like, well, now you're not dwelling in conspiracy. You're talking about an obvious cover up. And this is the first time that I've seen Trump supporters be agitated and angry about anything. So to me, this should be. Democrats should treat this issue the way Republicans treated transgenders in women's sports. Never stop talking about it. Never.

[DJ Envy]

Yeah, I mean, why let it go, right, when there's obviously something to it? And again, it's affecting the entire government now because we don't have a House of Representatives, because the speaker sent them home because he didn't want to do anything to impact Trump's ability to block these files.

[Just Hilarious]

That's crazy. What is their reasoning? I saw that, you know, they're taking a reason, but what is their reasoning?

[DJ Envy]

I think their reasoning is they don't want to deal with it.

[Just Hilarious]

I don't know. What did they say to people?

[DJ Envy]

I don't even know. I mean, maybe they said, actually, that's a good question. I haven't even seen them, let alone a convincing explanation. I haven't seen any. Well, why would they bother, Right? We all know why. So there's just no reason to even bother coming up with an excuse.

[Pete Buttigieg]

What are your thoughts on former US President Obama saying that the Democrats need to toughen up, you know, and take action.

[DJ Envy]

What are your thoughts on that? I think he's right. Although that just reminds me of one other thing, right, which is the distraction machine. So Trump says, we're gonna release the files. We're gonna release the files. We're gonna release the files. And he says, we're not gonna release the files. And people are mad, including maga, saying, wait a minute, you said you were gonna release this information, and you're not like, we're going to arrest Obama? What? That has nothing to do with anything. But it's the distraction machine. But, yeah, as to what President Obama actually said, look, we have to be a party that is not pulling punches, that is ready to call things out for what they are internally and externally. I think people want to know that somebody's fighting for them. At the same time, my personal theory of politics is you don't have to be a dick about it. And what I mean by that is that when I encounter people in actual real life who voted the other way, relatives or even somebody who might come up and say hello in an airport or something, I'm more likely to have somebody come up and say, I'm from the other party, but it's nice running into you, than to come up and give me the finger or something like that. Why would that be? Because, look, we're humans and for the most part, don't want to. In real life, we're actually around each other. We don't want it to be any uglier than it has to be. And yet you go online, you go on tv, you get into those spaces, and it's different. Right. So I think that the challenge for us is we should never back down from a good fight over what the right thing to do is and what the wrong thing to do is. But I think we can also demonstrate a way to do it that's actually inviting people into our coalition saying, like, we want you. And maybe you don't agree with us on 10% of the stuff or 30% of the stuff, or maybe you voted the other way last time. All the more reason we want you with us this time around. And we need to be inviting. Where I think people have viewed us as kind of frankly, scolding, like we're scolding people for not being up on the latest cultural developments or not being the right kind of progressive or whatever it is. That has to change, too.

[Just Hilarious]

My biggest problem with Democrats, is they. It's like everything they're saying now, you should have been saying two, three years ago like we've been saying Democrats was cowards. So, yeah, yes, y' all should have been toughened up. You know, Jake Tapper with the Original Sin. And you read that book and you see everybody knew that there was, that Biden was too old to run, but nobody said anything. But now everybody wants to speak up. His press secretary, Corinne Jean Pierre, saying she's an independent now. And, you know, I'm like, yo, why weren't y' all saying this two, three years ago? All these things that y' all are saying, we the people had been saying.

[DJ Envy]

I would say also, there are a lot of things we were fighting for then that we're fighting for now. The Medicaid stuff is a good example. The transportation stuff. Right. I was, you know, sometimes we were taking hits for people thinking we were caring too much about taking care of neighborhoods that were underinvested in or hurt in the past. I believed it was the right thing to do then. I believe it's the right thing to do now. But, yeah, we have to show a level of toughness in order to be just, in order to be credible, I think. And in order to go up against these guys who obviously, you can fault them for all kinds of things, but they definitely project toughness.

[Just Hilarious]

They won the culture war. Like, every time I hear Democrats talk, they talk about the work that they've done, which is true. But what do you do when the work isn't enough?

[DJ Envy]

Yeah, well, look, I think that we need to bring it back to everyday life, and culture is part of that. But so are just the basics of policy. Like right now, it's going to be harder to buy a house because Donald Trump just added to the deficit in order to get tax cuts for billionaires. And that means that interest rates are going to be higher. Right now it is growing more difficult to get health care because premiums just went up because how Republicans changed the Obamacare subsidies. You don't have to be a policy buff for these things to hit you. And by the way, I think all these things that have happened are small compared to what's about to happen. This AI development that's happening right now is not just something people should care about if they're interested in tech. This is not just like a nerdy fascination. This is going to affect how all of us, it already is, right? Maybe in useful ways, like you ask ChatGPT for anything. But also in terms of jobs starting to dramatically change. Right. This is a level. I mean, we lived through One version of this, in the 90s, when I was growing up in Indiana and trade and automation happened, it changed what was going on in the auto industry. I think that this will be 10 times or 100 times more disruptive. And if Democrats are caught up in yesterday's culture war or defending institutions that were getting pretty old and trying to look like the protectors of a status quo that wasn't serving anybody well, instead of offering some kind of answers for how you're supposed to make a living and how you're supposed to fit into your community when you've got technology changing everything, if we don't have answers on that, then we're definitely gonna be left behind.

[Just Hilarious]

So what does the future of the party look like then? Like, is it more Pete Buttigieg or is it more Mondani? Is it more Josh Apero or is it more aoc? Like, what does it look like?

[DJ Envy]

I mean, look, we're always gonna be a big tent party. I think my style is different from some of the others in the party, and that's fine. Like, we're each going to be putting forward the version of the message that's truest to who we are. And I think that a younger generation of leaders, many of whom are politically moderate, some of them are politically pretty far left. What they have in common is they are who they are. You can feel it. You can just see it. That, I think, is the future of the party.

[Just Hilarious]

My last question. Republicans clearly are fumbling the ball. Trump is clearly fumbling the ball. Do Democrats have the proper team now to recover the fumble and actually score?

[DJ Envy]

Was only one way to find out. But that moment is on us, right? And it's gonna get harder. I mean, they're even changing the rules. They know they're fumbling the ball because right now, the Trump administration is trying to get Texas to change the way the maps are drawn so that they don't lose the House, because they think they're gonna lose the House. Right? So we can see signs that there's a huge opportunity here. But Democrats also need to figure out that we're not playing normal Democrat, Republican, left, right. Politics, like we all grew up with. This is. The media environment's different. The state of mind of the American people is different. The game is different. It's. I don't want to torture your metaphor, but it's like they fumble the ball, and we need to figure out whether we're actually. Whether this actually suddenly turned into a game of football instead of soccer instead of football or something. We don't even know if it's gonna.

[Just Hilarious]

Be a free and fair election in 26 or 28.

[DJ Envy]

Yeah. And again, look at what they're doing in Texas. Right. So never mind. You know, things they could do to manipulate the election in a really sinister way. Like this is a way to manipulate the election in broad daylight. If they change the maps in Texas, which, by the way, could technically be legal, that doesn't require anybody going in and tampering with a voting machine. It doesn't require anybody changing election results. And yet it's changes what happens. And there's a reason why they are thinking about resorting to that. So, you know, we can't be. My side can't be precious about all of the norms and routines that we were used to and expect to win. There are things we're not going to do. We're not going to lie. We're not going to demonize unpopular minority groups in order to get ahead. Like, we're not going to do the things they do. But that means that our version has to be 10 times better.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Pete Buttigieg, ladies and gentlemen. So what's next for Pete Buttigieg? What do you have?

[Just Hilarious]

Your eyes say he's running for president in 2028. Come on, stop. Cut it out.

[DJ Envy]

It's 2025. You gotta give me at least one year to not be running for anything and not be in office so I can drop the kids off at school and be a human being and then we'll figure it out. But what I am definitely doing now and gonna keep doing is speak out about this stuff and try to show versus telling. A way of fighting for what's right that I think our party would benefit from.

[Just Hilarious]

I think you're polling at what, 13% right now?

[DJ Envy]

Depends whose poll you look at, but yeah.

[Just Hilarious]

Do you keep. Do you look at stuff like that? That was crazy, Pete. But you're pulling that 13%. That's a pretty good number.

[DJ Envy]

I try not to look at that too much.

[Just Hilarious]

Yeah.

[DJ Envy]

Yeah, gotcha.

[Just Hilarious]

Well, Pete, you shouldn't look at other polls. Pete, you're married, first of all.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Oh, my goodness.

[Pete Buttigieg]

Paul's a gay man. Just chill out, though.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Shut up.

[Just Hilarious]

He said it.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

No, Pete's like, I don't why I keep coming back. I don't know why. I don't know why.

[Just Hilarious]

We appreciate it whenever you come, Pete. I tell you this all the time, man, but, you know, you never stop talking to our audience. And that means something, you know, because I feel like. Like politicians only come around when they want something. They only come around when it's a campaign season. The fact that you come and just, you know, keep us abreast of what's going on all the time, we. I truly do appreciate it.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Appreciate it.

[Just Hilarious]

Absolutely.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

That's right.

[Pete Buttigieg]

And then don't forget those hair steps because I want to see if it works.

[DJ Envy]

We're doing, we're doing the, the conditioner and then the leave in conditioner tonight and then in the morning. It is, it is a journey.

[Pete Buttigieg]

Oh, that's good.

[DJ Envy]

I know.

[Pete Buttigieg]

It's a whole job. It's a whole job.

[Just Hilarious]

All right.

[Pete Buttigieg]

Because you got to detangle and all that. So look.

[DJ Envy]

Yeah, we should talk after this. Actually, I have a couple questions.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

All right. People to judge. It's the Breakfast Club. Good morning.

[Just Hilarious]

Wake that ass up early in the morning. The Breakfast Club.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Meetings, deadlines, emails. Don't you wish you could escape the chaos? That's where the all new Nissan Murano comes in. With available features like the relaxing massaging seats to ease stress and the beautiful skyline views that bring in natural light. It's like cruising in your personal oasis. And if you need to set a vibe, 64 colors of personalized lighting and a Bose premium sound system have you covered. Hands down, the all new Nissan Murano is your stress free getaway. Sometimes the greatest rush isn't rushing at all. Drive the all new Nissan Murano today.

[DJ Envy]

Panoramic moonroof, ambient lighting, bows and massaging.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Leather appointed seats are optional features.

[Pete Buttigieg]

This is an iHeart podcast.

[Just Hilarious]

Rest.