INTERVIEW: Reuben Vincent & 9th Wonder On Preserving Classic Hip Hop, Vocabulary vs Virality, New Album + More

Summary

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Podcast Summary

Podcast: The Breakfast Club

Episode: INTERVIEW: Reuben Vincent & 9th Wonder On Preserving Classic Hip Hop, Vocabulary vs Virality, New Album + More
Date: October 24, 2025
Hosts: DJ Envy, Jess Hilarious, Charlamagne Tha God
Guests: Reuben Vincent, 9th Wonder

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Episode Overview

This lively episode features acclaimed hip hop producer 9th Wonder and rising rapper Reuben Vincent discussing the intergenerational connections in hip hop, the making of Reuben’s new album Welcome Home, the tension between lyricism and virality in modern rap, and their collective hopes for hip hop’s future. The conversation flows seamlessly between nostalgic insights on classic rap validation, mentorship in the music industry, and real talk about authenticity, creative discipline, and representing one’s truth amid the rapidly changing musical landscape.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Bridging Generations in Hip Hop

• 9th Wonder and Reuben Vincent emphasize the importance of OG producers working with younger, lyrically-minded artists.
• The duo’s collaboration is about direct mentorship and synergy, not just remotely exchanging beats.
  Reuben Vincent:

  "We really sat in the studio with each other...I moved in the studio for six months, sleeping on the couch...this is the first of its kind for sure." (03:00)

Intergenerational Communication & Mentorship

• 9th Wonder’s background as a college professor gives him a unique lens on generational shifts and youth culture.
• Both guests stress that learning from older generations is vital, and that real innovation comes from absorbing wisdom—not from rejecting it. Reuben Vincent:

  "It's only right that you go tap in with the pioneers who’ve been there before, 'cause they the only ones that can tell you." (06:24)

Lyricism vs. Virality

• The hosts and guests debate whether there’s still room for lyricists at the top of the current rap game, at a time when catchy or viral songs dominate.
• 9th Wonder argues that, historically, validation in hip hop came from cultural milestones (TV shows, magazine covers, barbershop discussions) and not just commercial metrics. 9th Wonder:

  "If you were on Rap City, Yo! MTV Raps...The Source, Double XL, Essence magazine...if you were in the hair salons, the barbershop...that’s validation enough. You made it." (07:12)

• Reuben highlights the need for lyricists to know how to make complete songs, with songwriting and choruses, not just display technical ability. Reuben Vincent:

  "I want to make records that you gonna play Monday through Friday...or at the party, you know what I mean?" (09:08)

Songwriting, Creative Process & Real-Life Inspiration

• The making of Reuben’s album involved unique synergy—literally sharing living and creative spaces.

• Life events—like Reuben’s experience falling in love—influenced the vibe and content. 9th Wonder tailored the production to match these emotional shifts. 9th Wonder:

  "You always gotta catch them where they are...all my beats started to turn a certain way for him to talk about what he wanted to talk about..." (11:36)

• Reuben’s upbringing, heritage, and cultural background are central to his art:

  "I talk about my upbringing, my heritage, being from West Africa, seeing my uncles, talk about the war...my desires and aspirations, me coming from an HBCU. I talk about embracing the black woman, I talk about my mother..." (38:26)

Cultural Roots, Musical Influences & Education

• Reuben shares a rich musical discovery journey, from family exposure to 90s icons (Tupac, Biggie, Nas) to the YouTube rabbit hole of classic albums.
• Influences from both the golden era and the blog era (Kanye, Joey Badass, Kendrick, Cole, Wale) shape his artistry.

The Q-Tip Family Tree & The Evolution of Hip Hop Sound

• 9th Wonder breaks down the influence of Q-Tip (A Tribe Called Quest) on modern hip hop and neo-soul, linking Tribe’s jazz sampling to Outkast, Roots, Badu, Kanye, and more. 9th Wonder:

  "Q Tip was one of the first ones to not sample funk and soul only...that euphoric feel...Bonita Applebaum is like the tree of life for everything after it." (22:07)

“Boxed” Musical Identities

• Discussion on how, in the past, fans could enjoy everything from Tribe to Mobb Deep, but now listeners (and even artists) are expected to pick a “lane.”

The Challenge of Music Overload

• The group laments the streaming era, where 700,000 new songs hit platforms weekly, making it difficult for listeners to engage deeply with albums as they once did.
• 9th Wonder shares the tradition of sharing albums and sourcing recommendations based on magazine “mics” or tape trading.

Teaching Hip Hop: The Classroom vs Studio

• 9th Wonder draws direct parallels between his work as a professor and as a producer—adapting his communication to different personalities, learning styles, and life goals. 9th Wonder:

  "The classroom has taught me how to communicate, dog. Like, it has really taught me how to communicate. You can't talk to every artist the same way. They don't learn the same way." (29:57)

Authenticity & Truth in Modern Hip Hop

• Reuben’s mission is grounded in honest storytelling, rejecting industry pressures to front or adopt a fabricated persona. Reuben Vincent:

  "I'm telling you my real human experience, my real story ... I feel like honesty is going to take me further than being something I'm not. That's why I went with my real name for my artist name." (38:26)

• 9th Wonder: There must be room for the full range of black experiences—nobody’s story should be excluded.

  "We need a balance, man. I cannot stop a kid from telling their story, whatever that story is." (40:09)

The Importance of Preserving Black Musical Legacies

• The hosts and guests discuss the lack of institutional honor for classic hip hop artists compared to rock or country, emphasizing that reverence for legends must come from within the culture. 9th Wonder:

  "We cannot abandon who got us here and who continues to still do music. It's up to us. We cannot wait on anybody else to do it but us, bro." (44:03)

• DJs and young tastemakers are essential in keeping the culture fresh and honoring both elders and innovators.

Lessons in Discipline & Staying the Course

• Reuben credits 9th Wonder’s hardest lesson:

  "Don't listen to people who ain't never did it...Staying the course is another hard thing." (48:02)

• Staying true to oneself and being patient pays off in an industry luring young artists with shortcuts to fleeting fame.

Owning Your Lane & Redefining Eras

• Reuben wants to be “a bridge” but on his own terms, bringing a new energy while honoring the lineage.

  "I'm not trying to recreate that. I'm trying to make a Reuben Vincent 2025." (50:14)

Embracing Vulnerability and Black Femininity in Rap

• 9th Wonder praises Reuben for his unique, positive way of talking about black women in his music, filling a gap left by shifting hip hop trends.

  "I think it's the way he talks about black women. That's something that is left." (51:45)

The Super Bowl Debate: Could Nas Headline?

• The table debates whether Nas could successfully perform at the Super Bowl, weighing song choices and cultural relevance.

Perspective on Hip Hop’s Timeline

• Both emphasize the need for “elders” (not just “old heads”) to give the new generation space, support, and respect. 9th Wonder:

  "We are 25 years apart. This can work. And music can be made with this. That's the biggest thing I want to get across." (63:11)

• Reuben:

  "Show up as yourself and perform at a high level regardless of who you are...And that's exactly what this album is about." (63:11)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Creative Discipline:
  "Stay the course. If you continue to be yourself...There's been times where I'm like, man, it's not working out...maybe I just need to quit...And a week later, Swizz Beatz hits my phone."
  – Reuben Vincent (48:02)

• On Tradition and Innovation:
  "I'm not trying to do what folks did in the 90s...I'm trying to give y'all the same feeling y'all felt when y'all heard ATLians and Aquemini. But I'm trying to make a Reuben Vincent 2025."
  – Reuben Vincent (50:14)

• On the Feeling in Music:
  "It's the feeling, y'all. It's called the feeling. That's what we try to do on this album, is create a feeling."
  – 9th Wonder (41:48)

• On Preserving Legacy:
  "We cannot abandon who got us here and who continues to still do music. It's up to us. We cannot wait on anybody else to do it but us, bro."
  – 9th Wonder (44:03)

• On Bridging Generations:
  "There's not a division, man. We have more in common than you think, especially if you're on the same wavelength...Old heads and elders is two different things."
  – 9th Wonder (61:35)

• On Authenticity:
  "Show up as yourself and perform at a high level regardless of who you are."
  – Reuben Vincent (63:11)

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Important Timestamps

• 03:00 – Reuben moved into 9th’s studio for six months: real creative synergy.
• 06:24 – Reuben on the importance of learning from those before you.
• 09:08 – Reuben on making songs people want to actually play.
• 11:36 – How real life (falling in love) changed the album’s direction.
• 19:00 – Reuben explains why he plays the “long game,” not just chasing viral hits.
• 22:07 – 9th Wonder breaks down Q-Tip’s influence.
• 29:57 – 9th Wonder on teaching and what the classroom has taught him about reaching new generations.
• 38:26 – Reuben describes the truths his music aims to tell.
• 41:48 – The need to restore the “feeling” in black music.
• 44:03 – Preserving hip hop’s legends: the culture’s responsibility.
• 48:02 – Reuben on discipline: “don’t listen to people who ain’t never did it.”
• 50:14 – Reuben on reframing his “bridge” status in hip hop.
• 51:45 – 9th Wonder explains what makes Reuben’s lane unique.
• 61:35 – The collaborators’ message back to hip hop culture: Music bridges generations.

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Final Reflections

Welcome Home is more than an album—it's positioned as a statement on cross-generational dialogue and the endurance of authentic artistry in hip hop. Reuben Vincent, under the mentorship of 9th Wonder, seeks to break molds, embrace vulnerability, and offer a new blueprint for what young lyricists can achieve. Both guests challenge hip hop gatekeepers to honor tradition while letting the next wave shine, advocating for an honest, inclusive, and feeling-driven culture for all.

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Transcript

[Podcast Host / Announcer]

This is an iHeart podcast.

[Reuben Vincent]

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[Podcast Host / Announcer]

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[DJ Envy]

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[9th Wonder]

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[Charlamagne Tha God]

Not follow my example.

[DJ Envy]

Listen to Crimeless Hillbilly Heist on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcast.

[Podcast Advertiser / Narrator]

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[Reuben Vincent]

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[Podcast Advertiser / Narrator]

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[9th Wonder]

Hold up. Every day I wake up. Wake your ass up.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

The Breakfast Club.

[Reuben Vincent]

Morning everybody.

[DJ Envy]

It's DJ Envy. Just hilarious. Charlemagne the guy. We are the Breakfast Club. We got some special guests in the building.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Yes indeed.

[DJ Envy]

We got the brother, ninth Wonder. He's back. And Reuben Vincent back. What's up guys? How y' all feeling, man?

[9th Wonder]

How's everything?

[Reuben Vincent]

All is well, man.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

I love seeing this because I always feel like the young younger lyricists need to get with the OG veteran producers like somebody like Knife and create magic.

[Reuben Vincent]

Absolutely.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

I don't think that there's and I could be wrong, but I don't think that there's anybody that can, you know, do for Reuben what a knife could sound wise.

[9th Wonder]

What you think? Ru?

[Reuben Vincent]

I agree. Just being real. I mean, I don't think it's been done on this level, you know what I mean? I feel like, you know, there's been few folks that might have did records, but it's either sending the beats off and then they over there. Like we really sat in the studio with each other, you know what I mean? It was. I moved in the studio for six months, sleeping on the couch. So it was like, you know, he going to his crib. But I wake up, go to the gym, he pull up at 12 o' clock. And we just really, the synergy was there, you know what I mean? So I think this is the first of his kind for sure.

[DJ Envy]

Nyan, when do you have the time? Because you're also a professor. Like, when do you have the time? I've seen Knight so many times and it really never has to do with music. It's always I'm at school speaking or something like that.

[9th Wonder]

Or basketball.

[DJ Envy]

Or basketball.

[9th Wonder]

One or two. Yeah, yeah.

[DJ Envy]

When do you have the time, brother?

[9th Wonder]

Man, that's the beauty about living in North Carolina, dog. Like, there's no rat race to run, really. And so I kind of, you know, I teach twice a week. I teach at Duke on Wednesdays and Wake Forest University on Thursdays. But outside of that, the rest of the week is either comprised of doing stuff with basketball or just making music. And so that's how I deal with it. But I think the biggest thing between me and him is, well, teaching has helped me do that too. Teaching has helped me understand the next generation way more than anybody else. Most people only deal with like 17, 18, well, 18, 19, 20 year olds. That's like family members, blah, blah, blah. And they use those people to like put a blanket on how every 18 year old acts. Me, I've been looking at 18 year olds and 22 year olds since, what, 19 years now. This is my 19 year teaching. So an 18 year old in 2006 and an 18 year old in 2016 and an 18 year old in 2025. Them three different 18 year olds, of course. So I kind of look at it that way. But the thing about me and him is a lot of people don't think that these two generations can't communicate, well, facts. And that's kind of. We debunked that with this. I mean, even when I first met him, that's how it's been. But we kind of, you know, getting away as far as time. Yeah, man, I just. I'm just real focused. Charlamagne know, I'm just real focused on what I do, what I need to do. I like serving the culture all the time. And, yeah, man, if I'm not helping the culture, then I'm taking away from it.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

I feel like with hip hop, though, you know, young men like Reuben are trying to do what y' all already did. So they gotta come to you for that sign. You can't say, man, I want to make an illmatic. I want to make something that sound like Reasonable Doubt. I want to make something that sound like if I first Little Brother album, like, you gotta come to the people who did that, then.

[Reuben Vincent]

Yeah, man, I think it's each one teach one, you know what I mean? And, you know, they talk about, you know, the. They say it didn't exist, but the Willie lynch letter. But, you know what I'm saying, it's real common to what really happens, you know what I'm saying? From breaking generations apart and separating us. But I had my father. We didn't live in the same house, but he always used to pick me up on weekends. So I know how to take a person's counsel, you know what I mean? And I also, too, is like, I'm a sponge, you know what I mean? So it's like, I'm willing to learn, you know what I mean? Where I feel like, you know, people might. Some people my age, they'll be turned off and try to, like, you know, cool. But I think for me, it's just like, I want to know. And then also, too, they were our age when they were making the Illmatics. They were our age when they was making the reasonable doubts, you know what I mean? They make it seem like now, me being 24 and me being, like, having depth to my lyrics or wisdom is like.

[9th Wonder]

Like, whoa.

[Reuben Vincent]

You know what I mean? Like, oh, you. You sound like a old nigga. But it's like, I'm dead at 25. Yeah, exactly. So it's like, yo, like, it's not uncommon, you know what I mean? And it's only right that, you know, you go tap in with the pioneers who've been there before, because they the only ones that can tell you, you know what I mean? You sitting and listening to somebody who ain't never done. It don't make no sense to me.

[DJ Envy]

Is there a place for lyricists in this game to be at the top of the game?

[Reuben Vincent]

Right?

[DJ Envy]

And the reason I say that is you mentioned. You mentioned Jay, you mentioned Nas. You know, you could talk Pac, you can talk Big. Yeah, they were lyricists, but they were top. And people respected them as being the top. You can look at outkast and even Ti like, they were a top. But now it seems like that lyricist, they put in a box.

[9th Wonder]

You know, with Outkast, man, we have to understand with outkast, it took a couple of albums for everybody to truly respect outkast.

[Reuben Vincent]

Correct.

[9th Wonder]

It wasn't from the South. I mean, Southern Playlistic. Okay. You know what happened to Source Awards then? Atlns. It wasn't until they got to Equeminae and Stankonia that everybody was like, okay. You know what I mean? But even with Big and Jay, that's kind of where hip hop was taking a turn. You know, before that, hip hop wasn't as commercial everywhere, like, whatever. But when Big and Jay came, especially when Jay came on them, dmx. And now we're looking at hip hop, more people that don't look like us is listening to hip hop way more than ever. You know what I mean? So that's kind of what that was. But I think it's. Man, I'm gonna say this, man, I just love and I remember. I know we all do remember, when the culture was ours, we had our own validation points. If you were on Rap City, um, tv, Raps, Arsenio Hall Show, Soul Train, in the back of the Jet magazine, the albums, the singles they showed your house in Ebony. If you were on those cover of the Source. The COVID of the Source, Essence magazine, double xl. If you were in the hair salons, the barbershop, the music. If you went outside with your homies after church and played whatever, you was listening in the car. If you were in all those places at one time, that's validation enough. You made it.

[DJ Envy]

Yeah, that's right.

[9th Wonder]

You made it. You know what I mean?

[DJ Envy]

You made it.

[9th Wonder]

Yeah, and. And not trying to say, cause I'm here. This is one of the few last rites of passages for people. Y' all look like us. You know what I mean? And you gotta come through here to be validated. We need more of that. You know what I'm saying? So when we say mainstream, top of the game. This is a part of the top of the game right here to me.

[Reuben Vincent]

And I also feel like when you talk about lyricists.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Thank you. Too nice for that.

[Reuben Vincent]

I also feel like when you talk about lyricists, you gotta know how to make a song. You know what I mean? And I think that's the biggest thing with this album that people gonna see from me, like, we was just talking about it where they was like, what was the turning point for you? Where a lot of people we did a listening on Friday and everybody was like, yo, you really, like, showed your songwriting, you know, on here and like, you have choruses and it's like, now I could tell you a lot of time it was just me in the studio, you know what I mean? By myself. So I feel like a lot of the lyricists at this time is still proving they trying to rap on they records and they not giving nothing that people can relate to or people can feel is always, I'm just trying to show you I can do this crazy wordplay like, nah, I want to make records that you gonna play Monday through Friday. When you on the way to work, when you on the way to school, you getting ready, you know what I mean? Or even before the party, you know what I'm saying? Or at the party, you know what I mean? And I think this album, that was the example, and I feel like that's the only way a lyricist can really reach them heights is if they know how to make a record.

[DJ Envy]

And they gotta be taught, right? You watch Nas and Nas will tell you, I don't know if it was tragedy, but taught em how to make a song, right? Like, this is the components to making song.

[Reuben Vincent]

I love Big.

[DJ Envy]

Big is probably my favorite artist ever. Him and Jay. But I don't know if Puff wasn't there. I don't know if Big knew how to make those type of songs and how to break.

[9th Wonder]

It would've been that.

[DJ Envy]

It would've been party and bull. But Puff taught him like, no, you need to make a song like this. You need a hook. You need this. And I feel like that's what's missing a lot of times in this game.

[Reuben Vincent]

Kobe Bryant needed a Phil Jackson, and that's my field.

[9th Wonder]

Jackson, Snoop needed Dre. Facts for sure.

[Podcast Host / Announcer]

So what is the creative process like making this project?

[9th Wonder]

Making this project. Well, welcome home. Welcome home. I called Ruben in a special place. Ruben came to me and said, man, you seen the lego movie? I said, I saw it one Pharrell. He's like, yeah, the Pharrell one? Yeah. He's like, man, I ain't know. Pharrell was close to Tribe like that. That he revered Tribe called Quest. I'm like, yeah. He said, that's who I am. I come from that. I'm not like, yeah. Like, I knew this whole time. I'm just letting him realize, like, you know, sometimes you have to step out the way and let figure it out on your own. But then while we're recording it. We're recording. We're recording. We thought we was done. Reuben, start falling for somebody. Okay, okay. All right. And so I'm coming in the studio. I'm coming in the studio. You always gotta catch them where they are. I'm coming in the studio. He on the phone. He FaceTimed me on the phone.

[DJ Envy]

Oh, you love Jones.

[Ashley Nicole Moss / Cam Newton (106 in Sports Hosts)]

And on the phone, you love him like a mother.

[9th Wonder]

Cupcake.

[Reuben Vincent]

Cupcake at work.

[9th Wonder]

Cupcake at work. And I'm like, you know, but I have to catch him where he is. So now all my beats started to turn a certain way for him to talk about what he wanted to talk about, that he found somebody. And I thought that was amazing, which something we talked about. There's nothing wrong with talking about embracing black women on your project.

[Reuben Vincent]

Yeah, young men don't do that a lot. And I think even the routine again, like, right before, like he said, he let me figure it out on my own. When I got my. When I first got my deal with rock and I was moving around, I was in la. And then, you know, I started to see how weird the industry can get. And then, you know, a lot of people was in my ear, like, you need to make this type of record and this type of record that don't necessarily fit who I am. So when I watched the Lego Movie, I was like, oh, this is my tree. I come from the tree of tribe. I come from the tree of Kanye west in his early stages. I come from that tree. And, okay, let me navigate that and, you know, study and really figure it out. But then also, too, my mom and, like, living in Charlotte, you know, my mom, she's an African mother, You know, she's from Liberia. So she was always supportive of me. But the industry started to change. Money started to slow up at a little bit. And she's like, yo, you either gotta go back to school or get a job. And I was like, I ain't doing none of that. You know what I mean? So I called Knife. We talked about it. He was like, yo, just come down to Raleigh. Sleeping on the couch for six months. My routine was, I wake up, say my prayers, go to the gym. By the time I get back from the gym, I take a shower. Cause we have a shower at the studio, which is a blessing. Like, there's a lot of artists can't say they have a mentor who has a whole studio that you don't gotta pay for studio time, so I'm gonna take all advantage, you know what I mean? I used to.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

You don't know if you don't have to pay for it yet. Wait until you see that.

[9th Wonder]

You don't know.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Might be an invoice on the lady.

[Reuben Vincent]

A million dollars come in.

[9th Wonder]

If I heard, I'm.

[Reuben Vincent]

Nah. But then after that, you know, like, he'll probably get to the studio around 12 o' clock, and we'll sit there, we'll discuss, talk about, you know, what movies remind us of home, what music videos that we. Our favorite rap music videos. Then we going through samples, you know what I mean? So the way the studio is set up, Knife got his beat room and then we got the recording room, and then we got the living area where I used to sleep at. But 9th will come in around 12 o'. Clock. We'll sit there, chop it up, maybe watch some basketball, watch some videos. He finds some samples, he make the beat. I'm sitting there, he gonna air. He's all right. I'll airdrop it to the big computer. I'm gonna run to the other room, accept it on the big computer record. Then he gonna be in there watching basketball. Thirty minutes later, I come back around. I think I got something, I got something.

[Podcast Advertiser / Narrator]

Yeah.

[Reuben Vincent]

And then he'll come in there, hear it, and then do what he does as a producer and then.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

What made you want to work with him, though, Ruben? I mean, Knife? Cause I'm sure it's a million artists that come to you, especially in North Carolina. Yo, Knife, I wanna get with you. I wanna do something with you.

[9th Wonder]

Okay? So I was on tour in Germany and had the day off. And somebody on. I was doing an ask ninth on Twitter. And somebody said to me, I ain't got no question. It's this kid you need to listen to. I have no dog in this fight.

[Reuben Vincent]

I don't know this kid.

[9th Wonder]

I don't know this kid. And usually I, you know, I know how it goes. Some people want. They trying to get their family members on.

[DJ Envy]

You don't know this kid.

[9th Wonder]

That's your name. Exactly. But. But he did not know the dude was from Oakland.

[Reuben Vincent]

Oakland. I never had been to Oakland. I was 13 at the time.

[9th Wonder]

13. And he sent me the link and I listened to it. I was like, man. And I think one of the rhymes, he said something about Coogee rap. And I'm like, hold on, bro. Like this. You're 13 years old. So then I shot him inboxes on Twitter. And I Said, yo, is this. He's like, yeah, how you doing, man? And I was like, hey, where's your parents? Like. And so he put his mom on. And I was like, I'll be home in a couple of weeks. I got home, they showed up. Him and his mom showed up in my studio. I dapped him up. He's about this tall. And I said, man, you want something to eat? What you say?

[Reuben Vincent]

I just want some Pop Tarts, some strawberry milk and some pizza. 13 year old diet. 13 year old diet, literally.

[9th Wonder]

But it kind of went from there. And the first song we did was a song called Extraterrestrial. And I looked at my president cat, my man Cash. I said, man, I said, man, he ain't breathing. He's just rapping. He's not breathing. And he did. You did nine songs that weekend.

[Reuben Vincent]

Three days on a machine that I had never touched before that week.

[DJ Envy]

What got you in the tribe? Was it that Lego movie?

[Reuben Vincent]

No, beforehand.

[DJ Envy]

So what put you on the Tribe and Coogee Rap in that era of.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Music, I can see you playing fife in a biopic.

[9th Wonder]

Oh, yeah.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

I ain't never thought about it till y' all said it.

[Reuben Vincent]

Just that I would love to. I would love to. So my father, you know, again, both my parents are from West Africa, Liberia. And when he came to the States, he lived in New York for a little bit and he moved to North Carolina and met my mom, who my mom. So to give a little bit of background, the Queens.

[DJ Envy]

Jesus, you're talking farmers.

[Reuben Vincent]

And I gotta ask. Yeah, dirty queen like you. Yeah, I probably gotta ask him. But he went from my. My dad experienced the Liberian Civil war in the 90s, so he was a refugee, came to America still very young, while my mom, she got here when she was 16 and lived in the DMV before moving to Charlotte. But her dad fought in the war between. Passed away in the war, all of that. But when he came down, a lot of. He said, in Africa, they used to listen to a lot of Tupac and Biggie during the war. And so when they had me, granted, they had, like separated when I was born. My dad always used to pick me up on the weekends and he used to have a blue Cadillac and he would drive me around playing, all eyes on me, ready to die, Blueprint, get rich or die trying. So that was the way me and my dad bonded when I was 4 years old. So then by the time I was able to write, I wrote my first rap when I was five years old. And so I already had A little bit of knowledge. And my dad gifted me late registration when I was six, seven years old. So those little moments were like rabbit holes for me. Because then by the time I was like 10, 11, YouTube was available. So now I'm looking up. Okay, late registration, okay. Blueprint, okay. Reasonable doubt. Okay. Then the recommended Nas Illmatic. Then it's like, oh, Coogee Rap. Then it's like, oh, Tribe Called Quest, Midnight Marauders. I just started going down a rabbit hole and just became like super like, just like floored with everything, you know what I mean? So by the time I met Knife, I was already like, so knee deep into like what I liked. And then also too, around the same time I was 11, 12 years old, Joey Badass started merging on the scene, you know what I mean? And you know what he was doing at the time. So I was just like, it was floored and I just started to do my deep dives.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

I wanted to ask you what artists. I'm glad you said Joey. Cause what artist, I guess from your generation reminded you of that?

[Reuben Vincent]

Obviously, Joey, Kendrick Lamar, Cole Earl's sweatshirt in the early times. Still to this time, I was big on them, like super early, you know what I mean? The Wale's, like all of them. That era, the blog era, was where I really dived deep into who they were. Those were the ones who raised me outside of like the 90s.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

So how do you balance being lyrical and cultural in a time when music rewards virality over. Over vocabulary?

[Reuben Vincent]

Well, I know I'm playing a different game. I know I'm playing a long game. I know that I've seen in the last three years, people get viral and get lit and then go on the next day, you know, So I know that there's no foundation to that where, like, you know what I'm doing. I know that 10 years from now I'm gonna be able to stand on and be able to like, you know, live off of still because, you know, I'm taking the route. You know, I've been patient this long. I've been patient since 13, you know what I mean? So why would I stop being patient now just to go do something that's not gonna make me fulfilled at the end of the day?

[Charlamagne Tha God]

What do you think, Knife? Like, how do you. How do artists. How should artists balance being lyrical in a time when it's all about going viral over actually rapping?

[9th Wonder]

I think first of all, artists shouldn't be afraid. A lot of artists are afraid to try. They rather do what they think Will work instead of running a marathon. But I also believe, and it's come from me teaching, we cannot get lost on the fact that there is a generation of kids, well, young adults that want to hear that. What you're talking about. They want to hear it. It's out there. Like, I see him all the time. I see him in my classes. And on top of that, it's crazy to say me and his mother are the same age. So now you dealing with. Now you're dealing with the generation that's the offspring of generation X. So now what do we. Like you said, what are we playing in our cars, right? We're playing all of these classic records, and they're picking it up when they're very young and taking it on. You know what I mean? So we can't assume there's a generation of kids that don't want to hear it. It might not be as big as this generation of kids that want to hear this over here, but it's there. When Tribe was Tribe, you had Tribe's fan base, but then you had Ice Cube's fan base. Not to say Cube was on something way different, but Cube was, you know, had a larger fan base. Doesn't mean the native tongues didn't have their own fan base. And you see what the native tongues fan base birthed. Rest in peace, d'. Angelo, right? It birthed an entire Q Tip has his own family tree by itself, bro. And so that's what I'm saying. Like, you cannot deny that that is kids out there that want to hear and want to hear soulful and feel good music, not sitting necessarily preachy all the time. Because I think we needed. We need to separate conscious and feel good sometimes at all. It's not sometimes we put consciousness and a warm feel good beat in the same box. But then you have slum village that talked about a threesome. You know what I mean? Like, you can't do you know what I'm saying? So we have to kind of get out of that, man. It's young adults that wanted something different.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Who's the Q Tip family tree? I can't just. You gotta teach now. I can't just let you say that. Who break down the Q Tip family tree.

[9th Wonder]

Oh, man. So the Q Tip family tree. Q Tip was one of the first ones to not sample funk and soul only, right? Q Tip was one of the ones like, oh, I'm a sample of artist by the name of Kyle Jader. And I'm a sample of artist by the name of Les McCann and Freddie Hubbard. Cause Q Tip grew up in a neighborhood of jazz musicians.

[Reuben Vincent]

You got the jazz.

[9th Wonder]

Exactly. And so that euphoric feel, like I always say, Bonita Applebaum is like the tree of life for everything after it. So if Bonita Applebaum is not made, we're not getting. Well, first, not first of all, with our tribe, we're not getting outcasts. Facts, right? They said it. They said it all, you know, all the time. We're not getting outcast. We're not getting the Roots, we're not getting Badu, we're not getting Jill, we're not getting Little Brother, we're not getting d'. Angelo. We're not getting this thing called neo soul. We're not getting. We're not getting Kanye West. We're not getting anything that feels euphoric and feels good. We're not getting that. Because chord changes wasn't in hip hop in 89, 88. We was just talking about Public Enemy. It was just. You know what I'm saying? With Night Living Bass is. But Q Tip, when he sampled those chord changes and all of that, that's what made everybody turn the corner. And we're still. We owe a lot to that dude for making that turn and making the music that he did. Well, making the music that Tribe did.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

So why. I agree with you, but damn, where did Dayla come into play then?

[9th Wonder]

So Dayla. So Daylight was. Of course, Dayla was before that and Jungle Brothers before that. You know, Native Tongues movement. Also, Queen Latifah was in that box. You know what I mean? Tribe was more. It was a different thing from Daylight. Daylight was way left to center. Right. You know what I mean?

[DJ Envy]

I think Tribe. And this is gonna sound crazy because Daylight was from Long island, more street.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Tribe was.

[DJ Envy]

Tribe was more street. Cause remember, Tribe is really. They're from Farmers, they're from Queen.

[9th Wonder]

Yeah. Like, you go up a little bit.

[DJ Envy]

That's LL Cool J's area. You go to the left a little bit. That's, you know, 50 cent in them. So they were more street than Daylight, I would say.

[9th Wonder]

And you noticed it because when Dayla and Tribe kind of dressed the same on their first on three feet and people distinctive, they dressed the same by the time Tribe did. Low End Theory is baseball jerseys and hats, bro. Like, they totally just changed everything. And even the production of, like I said, Q Tip, he says I made Low End Theory drums sound the way they sounded. Cause I heard NWA's second album, so he was listening to. You know what I mean? But you got these thunderous drums, but then you got this weather report sample on top of it, you know what I'm saying? Like it was just a different thing. But that feeling has extended itself for now, 30 plus years now.

[DJ Envy]

They're always thinking about, you know, you could be a Tribe Called Quest fan and a Coogee rap fan back in the day, right? You could be a Tribe fan and a Mob fan. Fact, it seems like now they put you in a box where you can't.

[9th Wonder]

You know what I'm saying?

[DJ Envy]

Cause back then you could. I could. I listened to Tribe growing up, but then I listened to Mobb Deep, but then I listened to Coogee rap, but then I listen to Kane. But now I feel like it's lanes where they try to stick you. Like I can only listen to Ruben because I can't. If I listen to Ruben, I can't listen to.

[Reuben Vincent]

That's not even how I was raised, right? So, like, it's as much as I'm giving y' all all the influences of like the Outkast, the tribes, the Nas's, and then giving y' all the blog era. I still went to a HBCU where I was lit when they played no hands in the club, you know what I mean? And I was listening to Chief Keef and stuff like that. So I feel like that's why I'm able and that's. I'm glad he said I went to A and T. Yeah, yeah. So I, I'm a, I'm. And that's why even I say I'm so much tribe is because, yes, I loved everything that I just named. I love art, I love Pan Africanism. Everything on me is designed by an African designer, you know what I mean? This is my man's, my DJs, you know, brand. But at this. Yeah, yeah, so. And then.

[Podcast Host / Announcer]

Retarded.

[Ashley Nicole Moss / Cam Newton (106 in Sports Hosts)]

Keep going.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Just ignore him.

[Reuben Vincent]

I let it rock.

[9th Wonder]

I let it rock.

[DJ Envy]

Just ignore him.

[9th Wonder]

But.

[Reuben Vincent]

At the same time, like, I, you know, I, I'm not a. I'm not a street in the streets at all, but I had cousins in the streets, you know what I mean? Like, I grew up around all of it. So I embrace it all. And you hear it in my music, the things I talk about. I'm not sitting there like, you know, conscious Piece B and all of that stuff. It's like, no, it's burning incense.

[9th Wonder]

You burn some incense.

[Reuben Vincent]

No, I ain't burning no incense. You know what I mean? Like, I watch Friday just as much as I might watch the Malcolm X Autobiography, you know what I mean?

[Charlamagne Tha God]

So you know what's crazy though, coming from the Carolinas and ninth Note, at.

[9th Wonder]

Least growing up, we didn't have a.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

There was no Carolina sound. No, we weren't like Atlanta or New York. We had hip hop that we could gravitate towards. We listened to everything.

[9th Wonder]

Yeah, Killer Mike said the same thing. We had to listen to everything. And North Carolina is second when it comes to number of HBCUs. Alabama's first, North Carolina's second. So you gotta think of all the music that's coming from all these places that's being played in the dorms. I remember on my. My dorm room hall, I went to North Carolina Central and I stayed in a hall called Chile Hall. It was a dude from dc, Detroit, Baltimore, then it was like all in the same hall. So you walking down the hall here in Go go Baltimore House, D.C. to go that.

[Podcast Host / Announcer]

Go go down. Down the street.

[9th Wonder]

Right? But yeah, you know what I'm saying? You know what I'm saying? That's what I'm saying. So it's all of that, all of those things and you hearing everything at one time. And like you said, yo, you can tell a lot about people, man, when you open a CD book. Dog word. When you flip that cd flap, flap, flap. When you see that I had a two short album, A Tribe album, that Toni Braxton first album, Souls of Mischief album, and Ice Cube the Predator, like all at the same time. I think now, like you said, I don't think a lot of people are fans of the culture. They're just fans of a person. For us, if we were fans of hip hop, that means we checking out everybody. But the filter was different. We not facing 700,000 new songs a week on streaming either. We didn't face that. We didn't face that.

[DJ Envy]

That's the sad thing. Cause you can't hear everything. That's the difficult part. Because it's like, you know, life, be life. And like before it was like. I remember listening to, let's say Nori's album or Fuji's album or whatever. It lasted the summer. It was like four albums that lasted the summer. And you rock through. I drove to school in it. I drove back to school in it. And now it's like the way music goes. Like, even with Clip's album. Clip's album's one of my favorite albums now. But I haven't heard Clip's album in about a month now. Because I'm listening to new stuff, which is crazy. Cause there's so Many new things.

[Reuben Vincent]

So much.

[9th Wonder]

Yeah. Student. One of my students told me, said, professor Knife, you gotta understand, like, I got 15 albums in the queue I ain't listened to last week. And I'm like, golly, I think one of our greatest release dates was September 29, 1998. That is Outkast, Equimani, Outkast. All the same day.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Jay Z blooms.

[9th Wonder]

Hard Knock life. Hard knock life. Hard knock life. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Tribe, the love movement, and most difficult quality of black star. Like, all this came brand new BE foundation, all came out on one day. So we're going to the store. Like, I got about $15. How much you got, though? You got about 15. You get women, I. I'll get. And so now we got to share it. You know what I mean?

[Charlamagne Tha God]

You forgetting one thing, too. Looking in that Source magazine saying, we got to get a quim because they got five.

[9th Wonder]

They got five mics.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

You got to get Jay, because that's Jay. And he had just got four and a half.

[9th Wonder]

That's right.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Got to get these two. Everybody else I catch later, it's different. But then. But then you heard the most entirely from somebody else was like, oh, I got to go get that right?

[DJ Envy]

See, we was on Canal Street.

[Reuben Vincent]

We go get the bootleg. We get all four. We got all four.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Who was selling them?

[DJ Envy]

I don't know.

[Reuben Vincent]

We are African, y'. All the Africans.

[9th Wonder]

We all African. We all African.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

How does the classroom compare to the studio when it comes to influence?

[9th Wonder]

It's the same thing for me. The classroom has taught me how to communicate, dog. Like, it has really taught me how to communicate. And communicate. You can't. I can't talk to every artist the same way. They don't learn the same way. So in the classroom, I'm standing in front of my hip hop class on Wednesdays at Duke, man. In the spring is 140 kids. So I'm sitting there looking at 140 kids, and I have to get through every kid, whether it be the black kid, whether it be the white kid, you know, you can't assume every kid that takes my class and want to do this. Especially, man, the Duke man, I got. I got girls in my class is like, neurosurgeon, whatever. I'm gonna be a neurosurgeon. But I wanted to take your class, you know what I mean? That knows nothing about the culture at all except the one person they listen to.

[DJ Envy]

And you teach hip hop history for people that don't know, right?

[9th Wonder]

Hip hop history, right. I teach three classes at Duke. I teach Hip Hop history. I teach Black cinema of the 90s where we watch all the black cinema of the 90s like Love, Jones Juice, all that. And the hardest class for they get into is my Hip Hop production class. We just straight make beats and talk about the art of production for a semester. But it has taught me how to not only communicate but how the next generation thinks when it comes to consuming music. What do they think? Our qualifiers ain't the same. Who we think are great rappers and why and who they think are great rappers and why is two different reasons. And we try to force our reasons on them and it don't work like you know what I mean? So that's truly helped me out a lot.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

When you work with people like Jay Z on Thread or Erykah Badu on Honey, how do you stay true to like that artist, that artist's iconic sound, but still staying true to you as a producer?

[9th Wonder]

You know what the turning point for me, man, was when I did Girl by Destiny's Child. That was the one I did, girl. And is she the reason? And when I got in the studio with Bea, Bea looked at me and was like, b was there the night when I played Beats for Jay in 2003. Wow. She was there. And when we got in the studio in 2004, I was like, what do you want for? I'm thinking, what do you want from me? Cause again, we talk about labels. I'm looked at as the backpack nigga to make stuff on. Excuse me? Make stuff on computer the days you.

[Podcast Host / Announcer]

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[DJ Envy]

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[Ashley Nicole Moss / Cam Newton (106 in Sports Hosts)]

Ready, because sports, culture and entertainment is colliding like never before.

[Reuben Vincent]

Wednesday at 10, 9 Central on BET is BET's all new series 106 in.

[Ashley Nicole Moss / Cam Newton (106 in Sports Hosts)]

Sports, hosted by NFL star Cam Newton and sports analyst Ashley Nicole Moss. 106 in Sports is where the biggest plays meet the biggest conversations. Each week, Cam and Ashley are counting down the top five moments everyone's talking about. From the most jaw dropping highlights on the field to the viral clips taken over the feed to the culture shifts shaping fashion, entertainment and black excellence, the Top five Countdown dives into all the game winning touchdowns, buzzer beaters, red carpet fits and headlines, making stories that define our culture. With Cam bringing an athlete's perspective and Ashley bringing an analyst's edge, they're breaking down every angle. The wins, the controversies and the unforgettable moments that keep us talking. Whether it's a wild play that broke the Internet or a championship celebration for the ages or the latest trends shaking up culture. If it's big, it's on 106 in sports. Whether it's stars like LeBron, Steph Giannis and Durant making waves on and off the court, you you know it's making the countdown. So tune in and join the conversation because it's where sports meets style, competition meets culture, and every moment matters.

[Reuben Vincent]

Don't miss the all new series on Wednesdays at 10, 9 Central on bets 106 in sports.

[Ashley Nicole Moss / Cam Newton (106 in Sports Hosts)]

If you want to relive the countdown or catch what you missed, stream the next day on BET.

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[9th Wonder]

You know what I mean? That's what I'm looking at, looked at and I'm like, what do you want from me? Cause they had survivor out and can you pay my bills? I'm like, where do I fit into this? And she said, I want you to do you, but I also want you to think about us as the emotions, the 70s group, the R and B group. And I was like, wow. So I was like, well, how can I bring that up to the. And so is she the reason? And girl, I made them though. I made them records thinking about swv. And so I do that with every artist and I did it with him. His album is a combination of three or four albums in my head together.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

And what are those out?

[9th Wonder]

I can't tell you that.

[Reuben Vincent]

We'll tell you off air. We'll tell you off air. Nobody stealing the sauce.

[9th Wonder]

I can't tell you that.

[DJ Envy]

Who's the most difficult artist to work with and when? I mean difficult, not as in wild out and crazy. But just that artist was tooth and nail. Wanted it done a particular way.

[9th Wonder]

You know what, somebody's asking this question the other day. I've been lucky, man. I've been very lucky to be in the studio with Jay. Wasn't tough at all. Jay was the pressure cooker, man. I had 25 minutes to make that beat. Same thing with Destiny's Child. That was the number one girl group in the world at one point. Mary J. Blige, same deal. Erykah Badu, Same deal. Kendrick, Anderson Paak. I've. I've been lucky when you making like great music and soul music, man, and you working with professionals. But once I got to like Anderson Paak and Kendrick, now I'm not the the young one in the studio just waiting for the chance. Now I'm controlling the session. So it's. It's been. It's. I've been lucky, man. I've been very, very lucky when it comes to working with artists.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

I want to ask you, Reuben, like, in 2025, what truth does your music need to tell right now? That's my other issue with a lot of this generation. With everything going on in the world, I feel like nobody's reflecting that with art.

[Reuben Vincent]

I mean, I think the biggest truth is telling the young black, black experience and me just trying to figure it out, you know what I mean? I'm not sitting on the album like, I'mma shoot you or I'm lying like, I got a million dollars in the bank, you know what I mean? Like, I'm telling you exactly what it is. I'm telling you my real human experience, my real story. And I think that's why I'm so excited for this album to come out, because I think it's going to shift music in that way, because I feel like we haven't, and excuse me if I'm wrong, we haven't had somebody from my age group just talk about their human experience, you know what I mean? And everybody's trying to be a facade and, you know, hold up a mask and, you know, try to be something that they're really not. And everybody's really searching, you know what I mean? And I feel like with this album, you know, I talk about, you know, my upbringing, you know, with my heritage, you know, talking about being from West Africa, seeing, you know, my uncles, talk about the war. I talk about, you know, my desires and aspirations, me coming from an hbcu. I talk about, you know, embracing the black woman. I talk about my mother, you know what I mean? I talk about my family heritage, and I just talk about, you know, I have a song called I'm Good, where it's like, you know, when you people ask you, how you doing? You just say, oh, I'm good. But in the verses, I'm like, giving detail of, like, no, there's stuff wrong. But every time you ask, I'm good, you know what I mean? But I feel like that's needed, you know what I mean? And I feel like that's what I want to do. Just tell, like, true human experiences. Be honest, you know what I mean? Because I feel like honesty is going to take me further than being something I'm not. That's why I went with my real name for my artist name.

[9th Wonder]

So and it doesn't. And also to. We need everybody's story. We need his facts, like, you know what I'm saying? We need your story, like, NBA youngboy story. That's his human experience.

[Reuben Vincent]

Facts.

[9th Wonder]

Yeah, we need that. Like, we need. You know, I don't like when, you know, when people say, oh, we gotta have this and not this and this and that. We need a balance, man. Like, I cannot stop a kid from telling their story, whatever that story is. You know what I mean? So we need it all. I need his. I need young boys. I need. I need it, man. I need it. We had it. What's the difference? You know what I'm saying?

[Charlamagne Tha God]

So. So what does black genius look like in hip hop today? For you, Knife?

[9th Wonder]

Oh, God.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

And who's carrying the torch after you.

[9th Wonder]

Tell a black genius? Yeah, I mean, he's one. I think it goes without saying that Kendrick is another one. Absolutely right. There's a few out there, man, and I'm trying to get out of the hip hop box, man. I like black music, y'. All. You know what I mean? I really like black music. I was talking Nala about. We was having a conversation about this album and that song. This is. It's all about black music. I think we lost an incredible genius the other day, man. Or last. Or Tuesday. Last Tuesday. Yes, man. And, you know, for me and what he's done, it's him, Stevie and Prince. Like, I don't think anybody could have seen this, man, the last 30 years of music, man. When it comes to black music, it's him at the top. But, I mean, that's what it is, man. I just like black music, man. And there's a lot of black geniuses out there that goes across genre, not just hip hop, you know what I mean?

[Charlamagne Tha God]

I want to see more producers speaking of black, you know, music. And correct me if I'm wrong, I want to see more people inspired by what Roberta Flack and Donny Hathaway was.

[9th Wonder]

Doing, talking about, man. It's the. It's the feeling. It's called the feeling, y'. All. It's called the feeling. And that's where we try to do on this album, is create a feeling. It's like a lot of. A lot of music lacks that particular euphoric. The thing about d', Angelo, man, which a lot of us was raised in the church, that feeling is not in music now. And it doesn't mean it can't be there. That feeling has been there since James Brown, man. It's been there since Temptations, like. And it showed up in so many different ways. Whether it be through Rubin, whether it be through A Scissor, whether it be through Solange, whether it be through Cleo Soul, who I love. You know what I'm saying? Like, that feeling is there. And I think hip hop and the feeling has got separated over time, which it used to be like this. Cause it in the 90s, hip hop had samples in them. That was the feeling. No matter what the subject matter was on the top facts. So I think this just has to, you know, got that feel good, man. Nothing wrong with that.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

And then it's also. How do you keep people's legacies alive, right? Cause I swear since d' Angelo died, you can just be out and you'll hear somebody humming a d'. Angelo.

[9th Wonder]

I'm talking about humming.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

I'm not talking about just you hitting on real. I've been around people and they just.

[Reuben Vincent]

Yo, last night I was at the Odell show, and as soon as he.

[9th Wonder]

Got off, they played Brown Sugar Shouts to Odell.

[Reuben Vincent]

Yeah, Odile's in another one.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

But my thing is, where is that when these people are here? Like, how do you keep that alive? Is it urban AC radio? Like, what is it? Yeah, what happened to the 12 o' clock throwback mix on.

[9th Wonder]

Yeah, you know what I mean? I mean, you know, that's a corporate conversation, man. We can head out, but we can go talk nicely. No, I mean, I'm saying, man, like, we gotta bring. Okay, DJ Envy. We have to bring. DJs were the spokesman for the hood, man. Or for black people. On what was good and what was not. Everybody ain't good. No word, right? Just cause you made it. It ain't. Everybody's not. I know. Music is subjective. All right, cool. Everybody's DJs was supposed to be the ones that told us what was good and what was not. We trusted the dj. It's been like that since the beginning of hip hop. And so that's what we need, man. And we can't abandon. We can't get a certain age and just say, man, I don't want to hear that old stuff anymore. Other cultures don't do that, bro. They don't take a Special Ed and throw them to the back burner. Whoever the country version of Special Ed is, whoever the country version of Big Daddy Kane is, they don't throw them to the back burner. We need to make sure our legends are great and revered, just like they do in the Grand Old Opera in Nashville, on any other genre. The Rolling Stones still rocking because people are still going for us, it's out with the old and with the new. That's the thing about black people. Cause we so creative. We just onto the next so fast. We cannot abandon who got us here and who continues to still do music. It's up to us. We cannot wait on anybody else to do it but us, bro.

[DJ Envy]

And they're starting. They're starting with the stations. Because growing up, no matter what market you in, it was always a classic rock station. It was always going to have that. And we're starting to get that now with 80s and 90s hip hop stations and things like that.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

But the reality is, all urban adult contemporary stations have to do is just update the playlist. Like, old school now is what we came up on in the 90s and the early 2000s. But they still playing, and they should. But they playing Earth, Wind and Fire and like.

[9th Wonder]

Yeah, but that's why I'm glad that we do.

[Podcast Host / Announcer]

On Fridays, we do have Pasta Uggs with Nyla. Cause Nyla Simone has put me on to you like that. She's how I found you and Odell and a lot of other artists that she has put me on with. So the DJs definitely, you know, you got DJs with good ears, man. That's like, look, you put your ear to the music, and these are the things that you feel are, like, kind of rare. She putting them out there every Friday. Like I said, she put me on you and a lot of other people that I listen to you now.

[Reuben Vincent]

So it's important. It's important. I even think, like you just said, I think, you know, y' all do a great job of that, just having her on Friday doing the Pass the Ox. And I think it needs to be more. Cause even like Envy, I just saw a video where you. You was the first person to play Hit him up, you know what I mean? And I feel like that's his story.

[9th Wonder]

Don't give him that credit.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

No, I ain't heard nobody else say that.

[9th Wonder]

I got.

[DJ Envy]

Nobody else will go against it.

[Podcast Host / Announcer]

And then he sat over there and accepted it, too.

[DJ Envy]

Like, I short.

[Reuben Vincent]

No, I heard the tape. I heard the tape, and I tell.

[DJ Envy]

You what I mean. I said, I got it from SH Money xl. I used to produce. He gave it to me, left the studio, gave it to me. His first DJ to play it.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

I heard it was on Dirty Harry.

[9th Wonder]

Definitely Dirty Harry. Dirty Harry Harry, though.

[Reuben Vincent]

But nah, like, real talk. Like, I just feel like, you know, you, like, again, she does it Incredibly, with Past the Ox. But I feel like, you know, we need to honor the young DJs and, you know, allow them to have that space, because, you know, they're gonna be the ones putting us on the music now. You know what I mean? Just like you were who kid, you know, Clue. Like, you know, it needs to continue again. Each one teach one, you know what I mean? So I'm with you.

[9th Wonder]

It's wild because now when you watch NFL games, you watch NBA games, when they go to commercial, they playing, like, nothing but a G thing and a war tour. And I remember when Jalen Rose was the NBA commentator, I said, man, I wonder if Jalen Rose got influence on what they playing when they go to commercial break. Cause they play who got the props one day. And I was like, wait a minute, bro. But we are. I think Jimmy Fallon is a prime example of where we are in the time continuum. Because to have the be the Tonight show host and your band be the Roots tells you everything. And he always says, Black Thought's my favorite rapper. T is my second favorite rapper, and he's what, 50 years old? So, I mean, I think we just need to do more of that, man. We just cannot abandon our classics like that.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Yeah, I agree. A couple more questions for you, Reuben. You said Knife taught you a lot of discipline. What's the hardest lesson he gave you that you didn't want to hear?

[DJ Envy]

Oh.

[Reuben Vincent]

Honestly, man, don't listen to people who ain't never did it. You know what I mean? And granted, you know, I always took his. His counsel. Guru's counsel.

[9th Wonder]

Shout out to young guru.

[Reuben Vincent]

Yep. Our label president, Cash counsel. But I. I think, you know, I had a unique situation because I met them super early, so I didn't really put other people's, like, opinions and stuff over there. It's like, I would always go back to them and be like, yo, such and such. Said something to me, what you think? You know what I mean? And they'll be like, man, but there were certain times where people would try to get in my ear, you know what I mean? And be like, oh, don't do this and don't do that, or move this way. And, oh, you don't need to be making them type of records, you know what I mean? It's not gonna get you nowhere and stuff like that. Or just trying to tell me stuff. And they ain't never did it.

[9th Wonder]

Yeah.

[Reuben Vincent]

You know what I mean? You ain't never been in that position. You ain't never did it. For you to be Trying to. And I think, you know, that came with age and, like, you know, growing up. But, you know, when you young and, you know, you around your friends and, you know, they trying to. You trying to feel accepted, you know what I mean? And then you realize, like, I'm sitting in this dorm room with y', all, and y' all trying to tell me when I'm about to go on the weekend to LA and possibly be in the studio with Terrence Martin and all of them. Y' all ain't never been in the studio with these folks, you know what I mean? So I just had to navigate that. But as I got older, you know, it was off to the races with that. And then also, too, I think another thing is discipline wise is, you know, just staying true to who you are. And, you know, it's gonna take longer, but if you continue to be yourself and just follow the course. He said that since the day he's met me. Stay the course. You stay the course. It's gonna pay off. You know what I mean? There's a. There's been times where, you know, I'm like, man, it's not working out. You know what I mean? Maybe I just need to quit, you know, give up. And, you know, a week later, Swizz Beats hits my phone and stuff like that. You know, just stuff like that. So I think he's always told me to stay the course, and it was hard because, you know, you young and you want it. Yeah, you seeing. And then you seeing your peers, like, shoot up. You know what I mean? And I've seen that a lot. So I think, you know, staying the course is one of the. Another hard things.

[9th Wonder]

Swizz Beats hit your phone when you were 16, by the way. Yeah, yeah. Facts.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

And, you know, people describe you, Reuben, as a bridge between eras. Do you ever feel pressure to carry that responsibility or do you want to redefine it?

[Reuben Vincent]

I want to redefine it. I think I am a bridge because, again, like, you know, I've taken counsel, and I'm not a person who's stuck up and stubborn and have an ego where I can't listen to any of y' all in the room trying to give me some game. You know, I'm always trying to soak up the game because I know I got years to, you know, fulfill still. You know, I know I'm still super young, and I rather listen to somebody who's been around the block and know a few things than me. Go make some mistakes that probably won't help me in the long run. But I think I wanna redefine it because they have a stigma on lyrical rappers, you know what I mean? How we dress, how we move and stuff like that. And I think me being young. No one's in. But also still being true to myself, it shows in my style, it shows in how I dress. It shows in how I appear, you know what I'm saying, when I come off. And I think redefining it for 2025, I'm not trying to do what folks did in the 90s, you know what I mean? I'm trying to give y' all the same feeling y' all felt when y' all heard at Aliens and an Equimani. But I'm not trying to recreate that. I'm trying to make A Reuben Vincent 2025, you know what I mean?

[9th Wonder]

Right.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Who are your peers? Who is considered your piss?

[Reuben Vincent]

Marco plus.

[9th Wonder]

Okay.

[Reuben Vincent]

You know? Yes. Chris, Patrick, Kai, Cash, Nico Brim, Suave, Mavi, he was another one from Charlotte. Those are a few people. That's my peers. That's up and coming right now. That's in my class.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Knife. What lane do you think Ruben owns that none of them can duplicate?

[9th Wonder]

I think it's the way he talks about black women. I think that's. That was a. I know it's not about recreating the 90s, but I think that's something that is left, you know what I mean? Like, just the banter and conversation. Honey, check it out. You got me mad. I want a girl with extensions in the hair Bamboo. That, like. It's the way he does it, you know what I mean?

[Reuben Vincent]

I ain't trying to milk it. I'm a spoiled.

[9th Wonder]

Yeah, right. Exactly, exactly. Cause we've had that conversation a lot, man. There's this narrative that's going around that young black. Not all young brothers. Some. Some young brothers only want to be around women when it's time to get intimate, and that's it.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

They love pussy but hate women.

[9th Wonder]

Facts. No conversation, no nothing. No, none of that. You know what I mean? In HBCU culture, we didn't grow up like that. We trying to go chill, you know what I mean, and have conversation and blah, blah, blah, blah.

[Reuben Vincent]

I got five sisters, you know, So I feel like that influences me a lot.

[9th Wonder]

Right? So for him, it's the way he's. To me, I think he's a. If 10 crack commandments was a thing for dope dealers that Biggie put out, he's giving that his version in like, three or four songs on this album. This is what you need to do. This is what you need to say. But he's not telling you. This is what. This is what I'm doing. So if I'm doing it, hopefully it can influence not only a 24 year old, but it may be a 15 year old who picks up his album. You know what I mean? So I think that the way he approaches it in a fun, lighthearted kind of way, and just being unapologetic about feeling for somebody in a positive light. What's wrong with that, man? And that's. I think he does that better than anybody right now his age.

[DJ Envy]

What's your favorite Tribe record?

[Reuben Vincent]

The album or just in general the Tribe record? Oh, my God. Lyrics to go.

[DJ Envy]

Oh, my God.

[Reuben Vincent]

Yeah. Those are two of, like, the top ones. Honestly. Midnight Marauders. From top to bottom, it's just crazy. But favorite G rap record.

[9th Wonder]

Mm.

[Reuben Vincent]

Fastlane with Nas. That's my. Just because I'm a big Nas fan. Yo, I got guns. Specifically Smoke Trees. You know what I mean? Like the way he came on there, like in Just the Beat. So those are two of, like, my favorite records from them.

[DJ Envy]

Can Nas perform at the Super Bowl.

[Podcast Host / Announcer]

Knife?

[9th Wonder]

Nah, man.

[DJ Envy]

Let me answer first, then I'm gonna come to you. Knife.

[9th Wonder]

Okay.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Not what you want to see.

[Reuben Vincent]

Yeah, yeah. I was about to say. I'm like, mind you think about some.

[DJ Envy]

Of them white people performing. You don't have their songs.

[9th Wonder]

That's why they make up 80% of the population.

[Reuben Vincent]

Okay, so this is Jerry. This is my. This is my opinion.

[DJ Envy]

I'm listening.

[Reuben Vincent]

Nas. I think Nas. It just depends on his song selection.

[DJ Envy]

Could he do it? Yes or no? Yes.

[Reuben Vincent]

Yes. Song selection, though, is it got to be song selection?

[9th Wonder]

For me, a song selection? It's a song selection with any artist, man. That's what it is. If it was perfect the way Dre did it.

[Reuben Vincent]

Yeah.

[9th Wonder]

And had different. If Nas does it, in a way, it sounds. But we also dealing. We have. I have to be realistic. We're dealing with the super bowl, man. And it is a majority of people that watch it and majority of people that can even go. Cause I think this is what. We get lost on this, too. I know we at home watching it, but you also got to think about the people that's at the game who paid that ticket to get in. So that's what it's gonna be. I think it needs to be not only one halftime show. I think it needs to be several shows around the super bowl period. Maybe before the show, maybe after the show. But I think if he places it.

[Reuben Vincent]

He gotta place it the right way.

[9th Wonder]

It has to be placed the right shout outs to Adam Blackstone. Cause Adam Blackstone is fantastic musical director that did the Dre show, that did the Rihanna show. Like, he knows what he's doing. So if he got with Adam Blackstone, I think he could. Dude.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Also, I love N. N is one of my top five favorite rappers of all time. But when I see people say things like, if Dre and Snoop can do it, N can do it. I'm like, do y' all realize how big Dre and Snoop was?

[9th Wonder]

Yeah. That's a different conversation. That's a. That's a different com. It's a different combo.

[DJ Envy]

I do feel like guys can do one mic. I know I can. And I. If I rule the world, bring out Lauren Hill.

[9th Wonder]

There's ways. That's what I mean. What you think?

[Podcast Host / Announcer]

I think as a feature, I think Uchi w kill him.

[Ashley Nicole Moss / Cam Newton (106 in Sports Hosts)]

You know what I mean?

[9th Wonder]

Are we doing Uchi w at the Super Bowl?

[Reuben Vincent]

You played it all right, now let me actually play N hits. Are y' all letting him? Do you owe me at the Super Bowl? No, no, no.

[DJ Envy]

One mic.

[Reuben Vincent]

If I rule the world, the world is yours.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

You know how much people hated you think so?

[Podcast Host / Announcer]

Stuck in the house.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

You know how much people hated you owe me when you owe me.

[9th Wonder]

I know, I know.

[Reuben Vincent]

That's why I'm like, would y' all like.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

That was terrible.

[9th Wonder]

If I was there. I'm up for it, though.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Not the Domination cheated on when it came out.

[Reuben Vincent]

Y' all don't think they'll be. Them old white folks would be in that short ass. No.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Maybe.

[Podcast Host / Announcer]

And then he bring out genuine.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

I just got a couple more questions. Knife, you don't have to answer this if you don't want to.

[9th Wonder]

Okay.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

May the Lord watch. Okay, Everybody wanted to know why Knife Wonder didn't participate in the little brother documentary.

[9th Wonder]

That's a long story. I don't think we got that kind of time.

[Ashley Nicole Moss / Cam Newton (106 in Sports Hosts)]

But.

[9th Wonder]

But I will say this, man. You talking about in the documentary.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Yes. Why you didn't participate in the documentary.

[9th Wonder]

Yeah, that's a long story. We gotta. But I will say this.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

We do have as much time as you want.

[9th Wonder]

No, no, no, no. We not doing that.

[DJ Envy]

I forgot they was up here and we had that conversation. That was a while, a long time ago.

[9th Wonder]

I'mma say this. And sometimes people think I say something for political reasons. Y' all watch me for years. Both of y' all have watched me for years. I Have never been a person to go online and in public to try not to say that they did that to me, but to deface and talk negative about another man or woman, that's never been my thing. And that's they feeling. That's how they respect. And you have to respect how they feel about everything or whatever. But as far as their success, as far as we being a part of each other's history, I cannot change that at all. We have our own little brother, has our own children. Kendrick, Drake, Cole, Big Sean, Wale, Ruben, Vincent. We got our own children, right? So again, it's a story behind it. But that's. I believe in family business, bro. This is how I was raised. That's how I am. And, you know, we're at the age now. I'm 50 years old, bro. Y' all know how this goes, man. We lose people every day, bro. We losing family members. Listen, God bless them brothers, man. Let them keep doing what they doing. I think they are on tour right now. They got shows. They still doing shows. Fonte is incredibly talented, although we may have disagreements or whatever. Facts. Incredibly talented.

[Reuben Vincent]

One of the illest pens.

[9th Wonder]

Exactly. You know what I mean? I've seen Pooh go from being one artist, one rapper to another rapper to the level that he is. We've made magic. And without me, they've made magic. And I'm leaving it at that, man. I believe it. Look, bro, I'm serving something else now, bro. This is how I am.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

What would a little brother mean to you, Ruben? A little brother reunion.

[Reuben Vincent]

I mean, I seen it. I seen it. I seen it happen. How old was I? 17. Yeah. When they came to Durham, I was backstage, you know what I mean?

[9th Wonder]

That's right.

[Reuben Vincent]

Yeah. And, you know, I think it was dope because it was something for North Carolina, you know what I mean? They also raised me just as much as Tribe did Slum Village, Kanye, you know what I mean? They were a part of that. Again, like he said. I think the biggest thing is one thing I could say about Knife, and this is not even just because he's sitting right here. I would have said this if I would have did this interview alone is just how spiritually and how, you know, he's handled, you know, the situation with Grace. And I think, you know, that's another thing that I've learned from him. Even with people around me, you know, you gotta move with grace. And, you know, I would love, you know, just me being a fan, Obviously, I would've loved for it, you know what I mean? But we definitely in a different time now. You know what I mean? And it's a new time, it's a new regime, it's a new place, you know what I mean? And it's just. You gotta. Sometimes the history is supposed to be where it is and people supposed to move on. And that's what it is to me.

[9th Wonder]

Without no Fonte Coleman would not be a Drake.

[DJ Envy]

Facts.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

That's a fact.

[9th Wonder]

Drake completely, 1,000%. He says it a million times. Studied him, revered him, imitated him. Everything we know about Drake rapping and singing is Fontae, Coleman, Fontaine, Joe Budden. Huh?

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Fonte and Joe Budden, Fonte Coleman.

[9th Wonder]

And but is my man, you know? But again, going back. Listen, man, like, that's how it is with me. I got to keep moving, man. I didn't see the documentary at all. I never watched it. I've heard about it from everybody. But I gotta keep it moving, man. I cannot stay in that space. We don't have the time on this earth to stay in that space. I got work to do. This is my work now. I got other work to do as well. This is my label, jamla. That's what it is. But again, salute them brothers, man. God bless them brothers, man. That's how they feel. They had the right to express it. I didn't go online and say anything about it when it came out. I heard everything about it. Blah, blah, blah. Difference of opinion and we move on.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

My last question. If hip hop is a conversation across generations, right, what message are you two trying to trying to send back to the culture with welcome home?

[9th Wonder]

Ooh. If it pops a conversation that the feeling is not lost, you can continue to give the feeling. And there's not a division between a generation. There's not a division, man. We have more in common than you think, especially if you're on the same wavelength. And I really, really want the elders. Not old. Old ends and elders is two different things. Everybody. Everybody. Old niggas, yeah. Every. Everybody. Ain't everybody ain't an elder and an og, man. And sometimes, sometimes Old Nick want to talk down to the young ones and try to give them advice. And young, they ain't about to take that from everybody, you know what I mean?

[Reuben Vincent]

Leave him alone, bro.

[9th Wonder]

Leave him alone, bro. Look, the NBA YoungBoy concert is coming to Raleigh, North Carolina, man. Old N. Stay home. We go out there and get hurt and get hurt, but like, you know, it's not for. That's not for us, bro. We don't do a good job of giving the young ones, their space, the vip belongs to them now. The streets belong to them now. We are on the sidewalk. So what I want our album to do is that you can have a relationship. This can work, whatever this is. We are 25 years apart. This can work. And music can be made with this. That's the biggest thing I want to get across, man.

[Reuben Vincent]

And I think, for me, whether you are NBA youngboy, whether you are a Ruben Vincent, whether you are a. Any other name that I can name right now, show up as yourself. Show up as yourself and perform at a high level regardless of who you are, you know what I mean? Regardless of the background you come from. But show up as yourself. And I think with welcome Home, I showed up 100% Ruben. Everybody always say, you know, Ruben, you have an old soul and stuff like that. And this is stuff I've been dealing with since I was a kid, you know what I mean? I remember being made fun of, you know what I mean, for going to my bus stop, and I'm like, yo, have y' all heard Illmatic? And they're like, bro, we on this Chief Keef, I don't know what the hell you talking about. And I embrace Chief Keef, too. I still rock listen to Chief Keith to this day. But they. You know, I would get looked at a certain way if I came. And I'm like, yo, y' all gotta listen to Illmatic. Y' all gotta listen to Reasonable Die. Y' all gotta listen to. Not even just those. Y' all gotta listen to. To Pimple Butterfly. And they like, ain't nobody trying to hear that, but show up as yourself, you know what I mean? And it's like, yo, I want to perform at a high level in rap. I'm not sitting here. I ain't rapping to just drive a Honda Accord, bro. You know what I mean? Like, But I'mma do it as myself. I ain't here to compromise none of that, but I am going to be one of the greatest in my generation. I'm going to say that. That's just a fact, you know what I mean? And I'mma do it. Being 100, Reuben Vincent. I' ma always rep Africa. I'm always rep Charlotte, and I'm always rep showing up as yourself. And that's exactly what this album is about.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Hey, all right, well, get it. What you want to hear right now, man? What are we going to play? We going play Dre and Sydney. What's the joint? What's the joint with the. What's that? Not The Albie Short sample.

[Reuben Vincent]

Oh, gotta get it.

[9th Wonder]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Which one y' all want?

[9th Wonder]

Oh, it's up to you, man.

[DJ Envy]

You pick it.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

Let's do both of them.

[Reuben Vincent]

Yeah, I was about to say let's do both.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

That's my joint Fire, but gotta get it is my joint.

[DJ Envy]

Reuben Vincent, 9th Wonder. We appreciate you, brothers.

[Reuben Vincent]

Yes, sir.

[DJ Envy]

Album comes out this Friday. It's the Breakfast Club. Good morning.

[Reuben Vincent]

Yeah, hold up.

[9th Wonder]

Every day I wake up. Wake your ass up.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

The Breakfast Club.

[Reuben Vincent]

Y' all finished or y' all done?

[DJ Envy]

Johnny Knoxville here. Check out Crimeless Hillbilly Heist, my new true crime podcast from Smartless Media, Campside Media and big money players. It's the true story of the almost perfect crime and the nimrods who almost pulled it off.

[9th Wonder]

It was kind of like the perfect storm in a sewer.

[Charlamagne Tha God]

That was dumb. Do not follow my example.

[DJ Envy]

Listen to Crimeless Hillbilly Heist on the Ice, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

[Podcast Advertiser / Narrator]

The murder of an 18 year old girl in Graves County, Kentucky went unsolved for years until a local housewife, a journalist and a handful of girls came forward with a story.

[Reuben Vincent]

America, y' all better wake the hell up. Bad things happens to good people in small towns.

[Podcast Advertiser / Narrator]

Listen to Graves county on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And to binge the entire season ad free. Subscribe to Lava for Good plus on Apple Podcasts.

[Podcast Host / Announcer]

I'm Hunter, host of Hunting for Answers.

[Podcast Advertiser / Narrator]

On the Black Effect Podcast Network.

[Podcast Host / Announcer]

Join me every weekday as I share bite sized stories of missing and murdered black women and girls in Americ, America. Stories like Erica Hunt, a young mother vanished without a trace after a family gathering on 4th of July weekend, 2016. No goodbyes, no clues, just gone. Listen to Hunting for Answers every weekday on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

[9th Wonder]

I'm Eva Longoria.

[Podcast Advertiser / Narrator]

And I'm Maite Gomez Rajan. And this week on our podcast, Hungry for History, we talk oysters. Plus the miambichir stops by.

[9th Wonder]

If you are not an oyster lover, don't even talk to me.

[Podcast Advertiser / Narrator]

Ancient Athenians used to scratch names onto oyster shells to vote politicians into exile. So our word ostracize is related to the word oyster.

[Reuben Vincent]

No way.

[9th Wonder]

Bring back the ostracon.

[Podcast Advertiser / Narrator]

Listen to Hungry for history on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Podcast Host / Announcer]

This is an iHeart podcast.