Celebrating Sunset Blvd!

Summary

Episode Summary: "Celebrating Sunset Blvd!"

Released on June 30, 2025

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Introduction

In this captivating episode of The Broadway Show: Uncut, host Tamsen Fadal delves deep into the highly acclaimed Tony-winning revival of Sunset Boulevard. The episode features insightful interviews with Tony-nominated star Tom Francis and the innovative director, Jamie Lloyd. Listeners are treated to behind-the-scenes stories, personal anecdotes, and the creative genius that brought this revival to life.

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Nicole Scherzinger’s Tony Award Victory

The episode opens with a heartfelt moment from Nicole Scherzinger, who recently clinched the Tony Award for Best Actress in a Musical.

Nicole Scherzinger (00:34):
"To win a Tony, Are you kidding me? It still hasn't sunk in. I think when I get home and I'm crying it all out under a hot shower is when I'll really sink in."

Nicole expresses profound gratitude towards the Broadway community, praising its supportiveness and contrast to more competitive environments she previously experienced.

Nicole Scherzinger (00:34):
"The Broadway community is. I've never met a community like this. They champion art, they champion passion, they champion guts and balls, you know, and they embrace you and they take care of you."

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In-Depth Interview with Tom Francis

Broadway Dream and Community

Paul Wontorek welcomes Tom Francis, shedding light on Tom’s aspirations and experiences as a young British actor navigating the Broadway landscape.

Tom Francis (01:28):
"I mean, it's kind of like the dream. Back home, everyone always wants to be on Broadway. It feels like an unattainable dream. And I can't really believe that it's happening, this community as well."

Tom highlights the supportive and vibrant nature of the Broadway community, contrasting it with the more cutthroat environments he was accustomed to.

Audition Process and Role of Joe Gallas

Delving into his role, Tom discusses Joe Gallas, a complex character torn between disillusionment and newfound love.

Tom Francis (03:07):
"He's a very, very complicated man, I think. I think he's so disillusioned with everything, but then finds this beautiful woman and just falls in love."

The audition process was rigorous, with Tom enduring nine auditions over two weeks to secure his role, demonstrating his dedication and resilience.

Tom Francis (07:44):
"I did nine auditions in two weeks... And they saw everyone."

Collaboration with Nicole Scherzinger

Tom shares his chemistry with co-star Nicole Scherzinger, emphasizing their harmonious on-stage partnership.

Tom Francis (08:57):
"We have the same birthday. And she is like a sister to me now... She's the best scene partner you could ever wish for."

Their mutual support and professional synergy contribute significantly to the show's dynamic performances.

Innovative Production Elements: Live Camera Work

A standout feature of this revival is the integration of live camera work, transforming the stage into a cinematic experience. Tom describes the adrenaline-fueled performances that seamlessly blend live theater with filmed sequences.

Tom Francis (11:49):
"People ask me this question and I'm always... I always feel like I give bad answers because honestly, it's kind of a fever dream every single night."

The innovative approach includes Tom performing the title song live on the streets, navigating real-time challenges with in-ear monitors and live camera operations.

Tom Francis (07:01):
"The car chase in this just blows my mind. I mean, it's just the opening credits. The opening credits, it's just thrilling."

Personal Background and Journey

Tom opens up about his unconventional upbringing on a farm, his early love for animals, and his unexpected journey into theater, especially during the COVID-19 pandemic.

Tom Francis (14:56):
"All my family are farmers... I bought three ducks at a farmer's market when I was 11."

His passion for musical theater, inspired by figures like Jonathan Groff, underscores his multifaceted career aspirations.

Tom Francis (19:19):
"I just kind of want to do anything and everything. I'm very much, I don't get bored, but I like having a multi-faceted life."

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Conversation with Director Jamie Lloyd

Inspiration and Vision for Sunset Boulevard

Beth Stevens engages Jamie Lloyd in a discussion about the creative vision behind the production. Jamie recounts a vivid dream that sparked the innovative direction of integrating live camera work with traditional theater.

Jamie Lloyd (30:18):
"I actually had a dream... I saw this kind of, a very large video screen... and she was kind of covered in blood, and I realized in that moment that that person was Nicole Scherzinger."

This dream led to the groundbreaking concept of blending cinematic elements with live performances, enhancing the storytelling of Sunset Boulevard.

Integration of Cinematic Elements and Live Theater

Jamie elaborates on how the production leverages cinematic techniques to create an immersive experience, ensuring that the essence of Broadway remains intact while embracing modern storytelling methods.

Jamie Lloyd (24:32):
"The language obviously is inherent... but it made sense that that was a part of the language of the production."

He emphasizes the democratic nature of close-up shots, fostering an intimate connection between the actors and the audience, regardless of seating.

Challenges and Triumphs in Production

Directing live performances with real-time camera work presents unique challenges, from technical glitches to maintaining the flow of the narrative. Jamie acknowledges the tightrope walked every night to deliver flawless performances.

Jamie Lloyd (25:22):
"Every single shot in this show is live. So we're kind of like on a knife edge every single night. Anything could go wrong at any time."

Despite these hurdles, the collaborative spirit and unwavering dedication of the Broadway team ensure each show’s success.

Personal Impact and Achievements

Jamie shares the profound personal impact the production has had on his life, including forming meaningful relationships and marking significant milestones, such as his tattoo honoring the show.

Jamie Lloyd (41:07):
"This show has changed my life... I'm so kind of like, surprised that it's connected with audiences in the way that it has."

His journey reflects the transformative power of theater, both professionally and personally.

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Future Projects and Directions

Looking ahead, Jamie Lloyd hints at exciting upcoming projects, including directing Evita with Rachel Zegler and a unique rendition of Waiting For Godot featuring Alex Winter and Keanu Reeves. These projects promise to blend traditional theater with contemporary elements, continuing the innovative spirit showcased in Sunset Boulevard.

Jamie Lloyd (43:08):
"It's trying to kind of recreate a kind of Evita for a new generation... Rachel knows what it's like to live under the public eye."

The collaboration with renowned actors underscores the production's commitment to fresh, dynamic storytelling.

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Conclusion

"Celebrating Sunset Blvd!" offers an in-depth exploration of the Tony-winning revival, highlighting the dedication, creativity, and collaborative spirit that define Broadway’s vibrant landscape. Through engaging interviews and behind-the-scenes insights, listeners gain a comprehensive understanding of what makes this production a standout achievement in contemporary theater.

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Transcript

[Tamsen Fadal]

It's the Broadway show Uncut. And we're back with another big one. I'm Tamsen Fadal. So you've got just a few weeks left to check out the Tony winning revival of Sunset Boulevard. On this episode, we'll hear from one of the Tony nominated stars, Tom Francis. Plus a great conversation with the musical's director, Jamie Lloyd. But first, here's what Nicole Scherzinger had to say just minutes after she won for best actress in a musical on Tony night.

[Nicole Scherzinger]

To win a Tony, Are you kidding me? It still hasn't sunk in. I think when I get home and I'm crying it all out under a hot shower is when I'll really sink in. But I'm just so grateful. Oh, man. The Broadway community is. I've never met a community like this. They champion art, they champion passion, they champion guts and balls, you know, and they embrace you and they take care of you. You know, sometimes the community I came from before, it could be really competitive and cutthroat, but this, this community is just. I love it and I can't wait to come back.

[Tamsen Fadal]

Now here's Paul Wontorek chatting with another one of the stars of Sunset Boulevard, Tom Francis.

[Paul Wontorek]

Well, welcome to Broadway, Tom. Look at that. What does Broadway mean to a young British theater star like yourself?

[Tom Francis]

I mean, it's kind of like the dream. Back home, everyone always wants to be on Broadway. It feels like an unattainable dream. And I can't really believe that it's happening, this community as well. I don't think I really understood how beautiful it is until I kind of was in it. Do you know? I mean, it's so, so supportive and everyone's just so lovely and roots for you. Do you know what I mean? And it's. Yeah, it's a beautiful thing.

[Paul Wontorek]

Whenever I hear that, I always think, well, it's not like people in England aren't rooting.

[Tom Francis]

No, it's not.

[Paul Wontorek]

I think it's just the. It's really not American energy. Right.

[Tom Francis]

The American energy is just so infectious, especially around, like a musical theater show.

[Paul Wontorek]

Yeah.

[Tom Francis]

It just feels like a big thing here and everyone gives it a lot of energy.

[Paul Wontorek]

And Sunset Boulevard, when it first came to Broadway, was a big, big show, obviously as it was in London, but, you know, it's a Hollywood story and based on a Billy Wilder movie. It had a lot of sort of Americana to it. Did you know this show?

[Tom Francis]

No, I had. No. I knew a few of the songs. I kind of knew. As if we never said goodbye with One look and sunset. Because everyone kind of sings them at drama school.

[Paul Wontorek]

Is that.

[Tom Francis]

Yeah, yeah. So. So I knew those, but I wasn't incredibly familiar with that or the film. And I told Jamie that in my audition and he was just. He was just like, I don't want you watching or listening to anything. He was like, I want you just come in on day one. He was like, have some note bashes from Alan Williams, our wonderful musical supervisor. And. And, yeah, just come in and be fresh to it. So who is.

[Paul Wontorek]

So who is Joe Gallas?

[Tom Francis]

He's a very, very complicated man, I think. I think he. He's so disillusioned with everything, but then finds this beautiful woman and just falls in love and he just is stuck between a rock and a hard place.

[Paul Wontorek]

And which beautiful woman are you speaking of?

[Tom Francis]

Both of them.

[Paul Wontorek]

The men.

[Tom Francis]

Yeah. And. And yeah, he just. He just gets. He just find in an incredibly sticky situation where one woman's promising him one thing, but he kind of wants another thing. And it's how he deals with all of the trials and tribulations.

[Paul Wontorek]

One thing I love about this production is that there's Norma. Norma's world, obviously, and then there's the young Hollywood world. And you see all these people who have these sort of. Some of them are menial jobs. There's a whole group.

[Tom Francis]

Right.

[Paul Wontorek]

There's a whole. By this time next year, there's a big song about. By next year. We're all going to make it in Hollywood, but right now we're not making it. And what I love about this production is. And don't take this wrong, but there's sort of a dead in the face quality to. To the ensemble and to you and to Joe. Joe sort of. It's just sort of like he's drained.

[Tom Francis]

Yeah.

[Paul Wontorek]

And it's really compelling.

[Tom Francis]

Yeah.

[Paul Wontorek]

Was that sort of something?

[Tom Francis]

Definitely a discussion that we had.

[Paul Wontorek]

Yeah.

[Tom Francis]

Yeah. It's really fun to play as well.

[Paul Wontorek]

Yeah.

[Tom Francis]

And it also makes the switch up between when we're on camera to when we're not on camera.

[Paul Wontorek]

Right.

[Tom Francis]

Way easier. Now, I don't know if that's Jamie being a genius like he is, or if it's a happy accident, but it just means that, like, everything's just always in the eyes. Always. And it's just about that stillness and the sort of, like you say, those sort of glazed over. Yeah.

[Paul Wontorek]

Because normally I've seen the character, he's, you know, wheeling and dealing. He's going to make it in Hollywood. And it was so immediately riveting to see Your take on it. Cause I thought, wow, this guy has something totally else going on.

[Tom Francis]

Thank you.

[Paul Wontorek]

So it was sort of easy to understand this crazy path he goes on right when he drives into the wrong driveway. By the way, some of these video, that first scene, when the.

[Tom Francis]

Oh, Nathan Amzai and Joe Ransom, they've really pulled it out of the park.

[Paul Wontorek]

What was it like creating these video sequences? And I know you said you rehearsed in a very large warehouse that had a video screen so you could sort of be. What was it like discovering and how much of it was sort of. We didn't know, found in the process, or was it all sort of figured out?

[Tom Francis]

It wasn't figured out. We. We. We definitely just did things on the fly. And the rehearsals, the first time round were. Were pretty. Were pretty crazy. Jamie has this thing where he calls them drafts. And every show is a new draft. And so. So each. Each time you work a scene, you'd have, like, draft one, and then you'd have draft two, and then you'd have draft three. And it's like all of these different layers that end up culminating in the locked production. But then it also has space to breathe and do its own thing if you sort of allow that culture to happen. But, yeah, so we did. We didn't really know what was going to happen. We really didn't know what was going to happen. And it was. I still don't know what it looks like every single time when we were rehearsing and I look up and Jamie would be like, stop looking at the screen because I don't want you to see what you look like. Otherwise you're going to change what you're doing. Just do your thing and trust me and trust Nathan and trust Joe and just stop looking. So I still have no idea really what. The production shots came out and I was like, it looks like that. But yeah, no, it was. It was definitely an exciting rehearsal process.

[Paul Wontorek]

The original production on Broadway had one film sequence and it was the car. The car chase. Right. And the car chase in this just blows my mind. I mean, it's just the opening credits. The opening credits, it's just. It's thrilling.

[Tom Francis]

That was like a final idea as well. That happened about two hours before the first preview.

[Paul Wontorek]

Wow.

[Tom Francis]

And they just put it in and. Yeah, they just put it over the top of it. But it's such a. It's such a good idea. It just sets up straight away what we're doing.

[Paul Wontorek]

Is it fair to say so you are, you know what, five years out of School. Four or five. Four years out of school, and you've done a few shows. You were in Rent in London. You were in Ann Juliet, which is now a big Broadway hit. Who'd you play in that premier? Yes, good role. And so you were sort of like a rising musical theater guy. So is it fair to say this was just sort of like you were one of many auditions for this role, Were they? I mean, Nicole was. Was locked in.

[Tom Francis]

She was locked in.

[Paul Wontorek]

And then they were looking for.

[Tom Francis]

They were looking for the Jo end.

[Paul Wontorek]

Up as her Jo.

[Tom Francis]

I did nine auditions in two weeks, which Jamie says I didn't do, but I know I did 9 auditions in 2 weeks because I did 9 auditions in 2weeks. Any actor will tell you they know how many times they've gone in for something, especially if it's that many times.

[Paul Wontorek]

So first you went and sang the song I did like.

[Tom Francis]

But yeah, we. I did. You know, the bit right at the end of the show where I kind of reprised Sunset for the last time. It's like that. So that bit. I had to sing that Too Much and Love to Care. Sunset Boulevard. And I think that they were the songs. And then there was sort of two or three scenes.

[Paul Wontorek]

Okay.

[Tom Francis]

And I basically did that nine times.

[Paul Wontorek]

Oh, the same. Okay.

[Tom Francis]

I did the same material for nine times. And. But they saw. I think they saw everyone. I mean, a lot of my friends are sort of the other sort of people my age and people five, 10 years older than me who are back on the scene back home. And. Yeah, I mean, everyone was in for it. And it was. It was crazy.

[Paul Wontorek]

Was there a chemistry test with Nicole?

[Tom Francis]

No.

[Paul Wontorek]

Did you meet her prior to.

[Tom Francis]

I met her on the first day of rehearsals.

[Paul Wontorek]

Wow. And you said, when's your birthday?

[Tom Francis]

And we were like, 29th of June.

[Paul Wontorek]

You both have the same birthday?

[Tom Francis]

We have the same birthday. And she is like a sister to me now, which is. Which is great. So. Yeah, but. But we just. We just clicked. We really clicked. And I just love going on stage with her every single night. She's the best scene partner you could ever wish for. Like, she just turns up and she'll, like, come up to me and she'll, like, before the show, and she'll be like, I'm tired today, Tom. You know how she talks? Like, she's so soft, so softly spoken. And she's like, I'm so tired. And I'm like, okay. And then she just comes out and does with one look, and I'm like, you're not tired, are you? Like, you're just coming in and just destroying it every single night.

[Paul Wontorek]

I've actually heard you say she eats you alive on stage.

[Tom Francis]

Yeah, she does. If you don't turn up, she eats you alive. And it is so true. But she's so great.

[Paul Wontorek]

Yeah. So was it when you got that show in front of audiences in London, was it just immediately sort of, you were like, oh, this is outrageous. This is special.

[Tom Francis]

Yeah. I think that first preview that we did, because no one, no one knew.

[Paul Wontorek]

What they were doing, I walked into that production fully expecting her to come down in a turban upstairs.

[Tom Francis]

Yeah. And no one knew we'd done a very good job of keeping everything quiet as well.

[Paul Wontorek]

Would you. Did you have to sign like NDA and not tell your friends? I think it was.

[Tom Francis]

I think it was more just like a sort of gentleman's agreement between everyone. But yeah. No, that first preview is a night that I don't think I'll ever forget because we had like five standing ovations on that first preview. And that doesn't happen back home. Like, that's not a thing that people don't tend to show affection like that in the theater. So that was. That was an unbelievably crazy night. I remember because no one knew about the walk around. So that was completely. That was completely a surprise. And when I walked in, I couldn't hear the orchestra. I could not hear the orchestra. It was that loud.

[Paul Wontorek]

Well, let's explain this. So you do the title song, the top of Act 2.

[Tom Francis]

Yes.

[Paul Wontorek]

And you are doing it. You're backstage. We're following you. We're watching it as a movie. There's a lot of movie elements to the production and it's very carefully choreographed. It's very funny. At first you're backstage, you see each of your co stars, and then you go out into the streets and you're actually now you're doing the number on 44th street into Shubert Alley. Into Shubert Alley. So it's a long, quick, brisk walk. The ensembles with you. There's choreography, there's security. What. What is happening? And if I went, what time do I have to stand there? And how do I get your attention to screw you up?

[Tom Francis]

I think it's about an hour and a half. I think it's about an hour and a half ish. After whenever we've like started that show.

[Paul Wontorek]

It's so wild.

[Tom Francis]

It is wild.

[Paul Wontorek]

What is it like doing it in New York? And it is a longer walk. What is it like getting out into the streets of New York.

[Tom Francis]

People ask me this question and I'm always. I always feel like I give bad answers because honestly, it's kind of a fever dream every single night. It's just a blur, like every single time. Because you've got so much adrenaline.

[Paul Wontorek]

Sure.

[Tom Francis]

Because I've got an 18 piece orchestra and me in my ears and. And sometimes if there's like a bus in the way, then that will cut out for 10 bars and I have nothing and I'm just have to go like an. In a metronome.

[Paul Wontorek]

I didn't even think about that. So I'm like, you can't even hear.

[Tom Francis]

So sometimes it cuts out completely, but it doesn't happen a lot. But sometimes if there's certain objects in the way, then that. So it's like it's every single night. I'm like, please, just please make sure this audio works. So it's. Yeah, I'm kind of in it. I'm kind of in a fever dream. And you kind of just lock in with our incredible camera woman, Shayna McPherson, who came over from London as well. She's. She's honestly the heart of this show. And I just look into her and I. And it's like, you know that film Limitless.

[Paul Wontorek]

Yeah.

[Tom Francis]

And you know, when everything's going past and he's just walking straight, it's kind of like that kind of feeling. But yeah, it's exhilarating to do.

[Paul Wontorek]

And by the way, there are a lot of videos on TikTok.

[Tom Francis]

Yes.

[Paul Wontorek]

Of like here's Tom Francis doing his number and you just walk by with the camera. And it's a lot more exciting in the theaters to go see it. Like you actually can only experience it by sitting in the St. James Theater because it's so exciting. The actual camera work is. I mean, it's.

[Tom Francis]

See I. But this again, I don't have that pov. I have no idea what it looks like.

[Paul Wontorek]

You have no idea what you're doing.

[Tom Francis]

I've never ever seen. I've never seen a video.

[Paul Wontorek]

I'm so sorry.

[Tom Francis]

The only version I saw was the one of like the Oliviers.

[Paul Wontorek]

Right, right.

[Tom Francis]

But other than that, none of it.

[Paul Wontorek]

Can people hire you in the future? Like 20 years? Can we be like.

[Tom Francis]

We want to, but they should be.

[Paul Wontorek]

Like, yeah, just this is the path do it number.

[Tom Francis]

I think we should definitely make that thing.

[Paul Wontorek]

It's a fun. Very specific, very. No one else can say that that's there. Like, but no one's ever done that before. And what is. I. What is. What is. I think Actually exciting about it. What Jamie Lloyd, your brilliant director, is so good at is making sure we all know we're watching a show, we're watching a play as an audience, as a live experience. It's not trapped in the proscenium. And I've seen him do it multiple times. And so it's thrilling because you actually. There are references to Nicole as a pussycat doll and to your actors and you're seeing. We all know, your performers, and that video is a huge part of that because we really see you and we're like, oh, he's outside now. And then he's busting through into the theater. That's really what it is. It's really reminding everybody that this is a once in a lifetime moment right now. You're all experiencing this right now. And that's what theater is, right? Yeah. And that's. You're a big part of that.

[Tom Francis]

Yes, it's. It is a beautiful part of the show, I have to say. I can't believe when he came up with the idea, I was like, you what? You want to do what? Yeah, but we're here, we're trying to make it happen.

[Paul Wontorek]

I love it. So you grew up on a farm?

[Tom Francis]

Yes.

[Paul Wontorek]

Tell me about that.

[Tom Francis]

It's very fun. All my family are farmers on both sides of my mums and my dads, all different types of farms. And, yeah, I just kind of, whenever I could, I would always be with the family doing whatever I could.

[Paul Wontorek]

Where was this?

[Tom Francis]

They're kind of dotted all over. There's a few in Essex and then up north, where my dad's from, there's. There's a couple up there as well. And so, yeah, I'd spend most of my summers with my. My Uncle Phil, who was a dairy farmer, and I just spent all my time with him for the whole summer.

[Paul Wontorek]

Milk and cows.

[Tom Francis]

Yeah, milking cows and hanging out and going to markets and stuff. And I bought ducks. I went. I, like, started bidding one day when I was like, 11 and at, like, a farmer's market, and I ended up buying three ducks. And my mum was. Was away with my brother and sister, and then she came to pick me up from. From the farm and I just put them in the back of the car and I didn't tell her. We were driving back and you just hear. And she was like, what the hell is in the car? And I was like, oh, yeah, I may have bought a couple of ducks accidentally. And she was like, oh, God. So, yeah, so I had some ducks at home for a while. Which was fun, but, yeah, no, it's definitely a lifestyle that I love. I want to end up like Jonathan Groff. He has a farm, doesn't he?

[Paul Wontorek]

Yeah.

[Tom Francis]

And I'm like, I want to be Jonathan Groff.

[Paul Wontorek]

That's the. You're following Jonathan Groff's path.

[Tom Francis]

That's the goal.

[Paul Wontorek]

From the farm to Broadway.

[Tom Francis]

There we go.

[Paul Wontorek]

Wow. Okay, that's. Well, that's. I mean, a lot of people, I think, look up to Jonathan Groff, but not specifically because of the farm.

[Tom Francis]

Yeah, no, but I met him the other day. He came to the show, and I have to say, he's genuinely the loveliest person in the world. He bought his, like, sixth grade drama teacher along, and she. She baked everyone cookies, which is the best cookies I've ever eaten in my life. And I was like, this is the most wholesome moment ever. Who does that? I was like, you're great.

[Paul Wontorek]

You. Yes. You've unlocked something.

[Tom Francis]

Yeah.

[Paul Wontorek]

Jonathan Groff is truly remarkable. Yeah, it's.

[Jamie Lloyd]

It's.

[Paul Wontorek]

It's not human, actually. So I'm.

[Tom Francis]

Here's a big reason I got into theater, actually.

[Paul Wontorek]

Really?

[Tom Francis]

Yeah. Yeah. Because I watched his Spring awakening illegally on YouTube and I was like, that's cool. I want to be Jonathan Groff.

[Paul Wontorek]

Well, I mean, you're doing a good job. You're. You're on the path.

[Tom Francis]

Hopefully. Hopefully.

[Paul Wontorek]

So how did that kid on the farm end up at theater school?

[Tom Francis]

I play a lot of music as well, and I had piano lessons with a guy.

[Paul Wontorek]

You're, like, making music, aren't you?

[Tom Francis]

Yeah, yeah. So. So that's all on the back bur at the moment, just because Sunset's kind of taken over my life. But yeah, so I had a piano teacher who's now a very, very dear friend of mine, and he kind of was like, oh, you've got a good voice. He was like, why don't you just kind of give musical theater a go? I done a little bit of. We call it State, like, Stagecoach. Do you have that over here? Stagecoach?

[Paul Wontorek]

Yeah.

[Tom Francis]

Is that a thing over here?

[Paul Wontorek]

Stagecoach?

[Tom Francis]

Yeah, it's kind of like a Saturday school thing back home.

[Paul Wontorek]

Okay.

[Tom Francis]

I done a bit of those kinds of things. And. And yeah, I just was like, yeah, why not give it a go? And then I ended up going to drama school, and then I've just been winging it.

[Paul Wontorek]

Winging it.

[Tom Francis]

Yeah. Now I'm. Now I'm here, and I'm kind of just like, oh, this is really fun. I was actually a good time.

[Paul Wontorek]

I was actually interested, really interested to hear that you at the end of drama school and you didn't really like drama school from what I. From what I've heard.

[Tom Francis]

Yeah.

[Paul Wontorek]

But at the end of it they do like showcase where they bring in all the agents so that you can all get, you know, move on and become Olivier Award winning stars, hopefully. And there weren't. Nobody really showed up.

[Tom Francis]

Yeah. Because it was Covid.

[Paul Wontorek]

And then immediately everything shut down. It's like, that's Covid.

[Tom Francis]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Paul Wontorek]

That's crazy.

[Tom Francis]

We had our showcase and I basically like went on stage and did like just before. And then the principal at the time was. Just came in and kind of said, yeah, no one's coming because Covid and I think you should all go and get your stuff because we don't know how long the school's going to be closed for. And we were like, ah, right.

[Paul Wontorek]

So you just went home. And you were like, I just went home.

[Tom Francis]

Chilled out.

[Paul Wontorek]

Turn into something.

[Tom Francis]

Yeah, chilled out. Started running like everyone. And then. And then that kind of gave up. Tried to learn the banjo. That didn't work, much to my brother's dismay. So. Yeah.

[Paul Wontorek]

So you want to make music, you're on Broadway. What are the. I know you're doing some TV and film stuff. Yes. What is the dream besides trying to be Jonathan Groff?

[Tom Francis]

The. Yeah, I just, I'm. I just kind of want to do anything and everything. I'm very much. I don't get bored, but I like having a, like a multi faceted life. Do you know what I mean? Like different things to sort of pick up and do. That's why I like doing music, because that's really fun. I can go and do that in the days and then I can go and do the show at night or. And I'm definitely very interested in TV and film as well. So whoever will have me during the.

[Paul Wontorek]

Crazy standing ovations at the end of Sunset Boulevard. You're on stage, you're in your underwear, there's blood on your chest, and you're just saying super serious. Is there ever a party that just wants to be like, thanks for coming, guys.

[Tom Francis]

You're all very like, no. And some. No, there's not. Sometimes when we did like tech and stuff, there was like one day where I thought it'd be funny to do it and there was no one in the audience because it was a tech thing. We'd just done it and I came down, I did this and I felt so wrong. It felt so wrong. I was. I'm not gonna do that again. Yeah, no, the serious bows. We've got to keep them serious.

[Tamsen Fadal]

Beth Stevens sat down with the director of Sunset Boulevard, Jamie Lloyd.

[Beth Stevens]

So, Jamie, thank you for joining me here on 44th street where sunset Boulevard is playing.

[Jamie Lloyd]

Thanks for having me. It's great to be here.

[Beth Stevens]

And also where Tom Francis sings live eight times a week.

[Jamie Lloyd]

He does. In all weathers.

[Beth Stevens]

In all weather.

[Jamie Lloyd]

Rain, snow, any. Any kind of weather. Throw it. Throw anything at him and he'll still do it.

[Beth Stevens]

Tell me about making that decision to take the show outside and what it opened up for you.

[Jamie Lloyd]

You know, it was so funny because we. We didn't really plan this originally in the original rehearsal period in London.

So we.

I remember I went into rehearsals with Tom and I said, look, how are we going to do this title song? And he said, well, it's such a great song. It's such an iconic number. I'll just kind of like, you know, I'll. I'll stand center stage and I'll say, sing it. And I said, okay, let's. Let's do it. Let's go for it. And as he was singing, this idea came to me that we would start off in his dressing room and kind of go all the way through the building. And then just at the point where you think he's going to step on stage and sing the song, he then leaves the building. And it's just been a kind of like an adventure to kind of work out the route all the way along.

Here and into Shuba Alley with Times.

[Beth Stevens]

Square and the tourists and the people walking by.

[Jamie Lloyd]

Yeah, yeah.

I mean, it's like amazing, but that's like kind of a part of it that, like, whatever you experience, whoever sees it, or other characters might be there, might be around, might be a part of the.

The story.

It's kind of like it's like Broadway, the streets of Broadway, the streets of New York kind of like, kind of become like a kind of stand in for the streets of. Of Hollywood, the streets of la.

And I love that, you know, like.

When he comes to this picture, he stands at this and he sings. Sure, I came out here to make my name. And of course, he's singing as Joe Gillis, but he's also singing as Tom Francis, coming to Broadway and becoming this kind of amazing kind of Broadway star that he's turned into. So it kind of works on many, many levels.

[Beth Stevens]

You know, I love in many of your productions that you remind us that we're watching a show. You let us see the scenes. What does that open up for you in telling the story.

[Jamie Lloyd]

Well, it really comes from a kind of starting point that we saying that the starting point for all of our productions, not least Sunset Boulevard, is that there's a space and there's some people in it. So what we asked the actors to do is, is to find the characters within themselves and themselves within the characters. So it's, it's not like they're kind of putting on something artificial. They're kind of finding kind of aspects of their, their own lives, their own experiences and bringing those to, to the role. And hopefully that leads to like, even more kind of like truthful, more honest performances. So it's not that they are. Yeah, it's not like, you know, like a traditional Sunset Boulevard, you know, Norma Desmond with the kind of like the turban and, you know, the, you know, and the big makeup and the big elaborate kind of gestures. So it's kind of stripping all of those things away. And it kind of. The production plays a lot with like, the notion of, you know, in the case of Nicole, where does Nicole Scherzinger end and where does Norma Desmond begin? And it's kind of like those blurred lines is where the. Where the kind of fascinating kind of.

Where the interest lies.

[Beth Stevens]

And you are directing both for a live audience because this is Broadway, and a live camera. So those are two different skills. Tell me about doing both of those.

[Jamie Lloyd]

Well, you know, it's the first time I've ever used cameras and it just obviously made a lot of sense because of course, Sunset Boulevard, you know, it obviously is based on Billy Wilder's iconic movie.

So it came.

You know, the language obviously is inherent. The cinematic language is inherent in the, in the, in the text. But of course, it's about movies and movie making and being on Hollywood. So it kind of made sense that that was a part of the language of the production. But what I love about it is that it's incredibly democratic because it's all about the kind of the language of the close up. So wherever you're sat in the auditorium, even if you're in the balcony, in the so called, you know, like the kind of, like the so called worst seats of the house, where like, you know, if you're at the very back and at the very, very side, you still have this very immediate connection with the actors and you're seeing right into the whites of their eyes and you're kind of really seeing into their minds and understanding what's happening on stage in a very, very kind of intimate way and very immediate way.

[Beth Stevens]

And unlike film, there's no Take two.

[Jamie Lloyd]

There is no take two. Everything is live. Everything. Every single shot in this show is live. So we're kind of like on a knife edge every single night. Anything could go wrong at any time.

[Beth Stevens]

Well, let's go inside and. And continue our conversation in the house.

[Jamie Lloyd]

Amazing.

[Beth Stevens]

Well, now we're here in the theater.

[Jamie Lloyd]

Yeah.

[Beth Stevens]

So we're. We can be steady. Not walking. That's very difficult, walking and talking, let alone singing.

[Jamie Lloyd]

Well, that's what we were saying is that, like, even just having a conversation with everything that's going on, all the. All the people on the street with the other conversations that are happening, it's kind of hard to focus. Imagine what Tom Francis is doing. He's got his in ear monitors singing this crazy time signature, trying to remember these lyrics, you know, trying to, you know, kind of navigate the route, you know, and all the things that are kind of unexpected on the streets of New York. It's kind of remarkable what he does. It's kind of really. It's kind of moving to witness every night, you know, that level of focus. And of course, this incredible team with him, Shayna, our amazing camera operator and stage management, who guide them, our security team, sound teams, video teams, Everybody, front of house. It, like, takes hundreds of people every night to achieve it. It's like a huge technical feat.

[Beth Stevens]

It's amazing. All right, I want to go back to your superhero origin story. What made you fall in love with theater? And was there a moment when you knew this was something you had to do?

[Jamie Lloyd]

Well, you know, it's. So I've been thinking about this kind of recently as. As people have asked me, and it's. And it's so odd because I didn't go to the theater as a kid. You know, my mother was a cleaner. She cleaned houses. And my. My father was a truck driver. Although, interestingly, I do remember sitting in the cab of my. My dad's truck, and we would go to various, like, industrial estates and kind of like, you know, long trips along kind of British motorways and kind of like, you know, the kind of typical kind of gray English weather and these long kind of trips on his truck. And he would always play Andrew Lloyd. We. He was obsessed with Evita.

[Beth Stevens]

What is it with dads and Andrew?

[Jamie Lloyd]

I know, I know. It was crazy in his truck. So, like, it's so odd. Like, obviously now working with Andrew, you know, like, that was the kind of, like, score of my childhood. So.

[Beth Stevens]

So these songs must be in your bones, so.

[Jamie Lloyd]

They really are. But I never went to the Theater. And it's so funny. Like a lot of my kind of contemporaries, other directors say, you know, I knew I wanted to be a director when I saw, you know, Surrey McKellen in such and Such a Thing, or Derek Jacoby or at the RSC or something like that. And I never had that experience, but it was very, very interesting and kind of slightly peculiar childhood. At one point, my. My mother ran a fancy. What we call a fancy dress store, I think, like a costume store, you know, like a kind of, you know, like kind of Halloween costumes, that kind of thing. And. And we lived for some time above the shop in a tiny apartment. And I would kind of sneak down and kind of dress up as various characters. And I would like, you know, for example, like, recreate Michael Jackson's Thriller video with my cousins. We'd make like, kind of like polystyrene gravestones and dress up as zombies and.

[Beth Stevens]

And you really got to indulge your.

[Jamie Lloyd]

Imagination, literally, like engage the imagination as a kid. And it was like this kind of like, parade of very fascinating characters that would come into the shop and sometimes stay with us. We had a lodger who was a snake charmer at one point, and she used to keep her pythons in a paddling pool in the backyard. So as a kid, I would, like, paddle with these pythons. I mean, you couldn't make this up. It's such such a weird childhood. So there was kind of like, you know, entertainment of some kind was like, always around. My dad was like a drummer in a local band. You know. My first stepfather was like a kids entertainer. He would do, like, kind of kids birthday parties. He was a clown called Uncle Funny. He was like. And of course, inevitably, like, not funny in any way. And he would keep, like, tiny rabbits in the. In the living room and they'd poop all over the carpet. I mean, honestly, the weirdest childhood ever. But, like, somehow that kind of gave me this kind of like. Yeah, like you say, kind of like engage the imagination, you know, and this kind of sense of play and creativity and kind of. Yeah. When I think back to that, I think that's probably why we kind of like, you know, we're here right now.

[Beth Stevens]

It all clicked for you.

[Jamie Lloyd]

It all clicked. Yeah. Yeah.

[Beth Stevens]

So let's talk about taking on Sunset Boulevard. Was there an idea or an image or a vision that launched you into this production?

[Jamie Lloyd]

Yeah, I mean, look, it's so. It's so weird and kind of sounds a little pretentious and it's kind of embarrassing to say, but I Actually had a dream about doing Sunset Boulevard. It's totally true.

[Beth Stevens]

An actual dream.

[Jamie Lloyd]

I actually had a dream. Now it doesn't. I guess it's not so weird. I guess we all kind of process different things in. In. In our sleep. In, you know, our subconscious is, like, working overtime, isn't it? Like, when we sleep. And I had been listening to Andrew's work, so we had done a production of Evita at the Regents Park Open Air Theater in London. And it was one of the best summers of my life. It was like an incredible, incredible, like, time doing that production. And I. It was during the pandemic, and I thought, you know, like, you know, post pandemic, it'd be great to do another musical. So I was listening to his. His material, listening to other. Other Andrew projects, so it wasn't so weird. So I had been listening to Sunset Boulevard. But I remember waking up. I had this dream, and I saw this kind of. This image of like, a. A very large video screen that was all white, and in front of it was a lone figure standing center stage in a black slip.

[Beth Stevens]

Starting to sound familiar.

[Jamie Lloyd]

You're starting to sound familiar. And she was kind of covered in blood, and. And I realized in that moment that that person was Nicole Scherzinger from the Pussy that Pussycat Dolls. And I was thinking, nicole Shirzinger needs to play Norma Desmond. Can you imagine, like, waking up and thinking that first thing in the morning was like. It's like waking up from some kind of weird fever dream. But somehow it all kind of made sense. I had this kind of idea of kind of, like, camera operators on stage and kind of, you know, kind of declaring that, kind of not trying to hide them, making them a part of the kind of theatrical language on stage. So I reached out to Nicole, who I had met a couple of years before.

[Beth Stevens]

What did you say to her? How did. How did you approach this? And how did you describe what you wanted and convince her to do this?

[Jamie Lloyd]

Well, look, she was not flattered at all.

[Beth Stevens]

She was like, you think of Norma Desmond and you think of an.

[Jamie Lloyd]

A more mature woman.

[Beth Stevens]

That's a nice way to.

[Jamie Lloyd]

And. And she said, you want me to play this old. Has been. And she said, honey, I still look good under these bright lights. I mean, she's right, and she's right. And I said, no, like, just kind of, like, don't think about, like, what's gone before. Obviously, it's. So the role is so, you know, closely associated with Glenn Close, who, of course, kind of came back to the role you know, a number of times. But of course, when Glenn first played the role, I think she was like, 46, 47. Patty was 45.

[Beth Stevens]

Made up to look older.

[Jamie Lloyd]

Yeah, maybe. But it's also the role is like, I mean, even, you know, Gloria Swanson was only. Had only just turned 50 in the original movie. So we're not talking about, like, a kind of, you know, an older woman, really. And actually, it makes it much more tragic. That was kind of what I said to Nicole, that actually she has the experience of being incredibly famous. You know, she knows what it's like to be so famous and so celebrated as a pop star and then kind of discarded and dismissed and kind of just like never been. She was never given the opportunity to really show the world what she was truly capable of. And of course, that. That's very Norma Desmond, you know, like this kind of. Like this idea that she would kind of. Kind of forgotten. And that's what I love about it, you know, that suddenly the world is seeing what Nicole can really do. She's a phenomenal artist. Obviously, she's a great vocalist, but she's an incredible actor. I mean, the stuff that she does, you know, throughout the show, but particularly. Particularly at the end, you know, when she's, like. Really goes the kind of, like, real depths of, you know, humanity and that. It's very dark and very. You know, it's brutal what she does. Kind of like, almost like she could play Medea, you know, like, it's like. And the fact that she does that with such conviction and such integrity is kind of remarkable and I think was a massive surprise.

[Beth Stevens]

You know, I was gonna ask you if it was a surprise because she has said that she had to confront parts of herself in doing this role. Was that a surprise to you, or did you just. Did she just go there?

[Jamie Lloyd]

I mean, she went there right from the beginning of rehearsals, but somehow I had this instinct. She always says to me, how did you know how. What made you think that I could do this? And some. And I can't explain it. I just kind of knew.

[Beth Stevens]

Crazy dreams.

[Jamie Lloyd]

You're just crazy dreams. Like, I just knew that she could do it. And she really has, like, gone above and beyond. She certainly, as she says, kind of working out outside of all of her comfort zone and. But it's incredibly brave what she does. I mean, even in the first. The first day of rehearsals, I remember she was so obsessed with. She's so obsessed. She thinks she has a good side, I guess, like so many of us, she has a good side and a bad side. I mean, as if there's a kind of bad side of Nicole Scherzinger. She's like, incredibly beautiful woman. And she said, oh, no, you can't put the camera. Don't. Don't film me. Don't feel me on my. On my right side. No, on my. Yeah, don't feel me on my right side. That's her bad side, allegedly. And of course, she. She remembers it. The first thing I did was put camera on her right side. I said, we can't. There's no ego here. You know, we've just got to kind of. We've got just, like, commit to this wholeheartedly. We've got to be brave. We've got to be courageous. And she says, I am brave. And I said, be braver. And that she. And she really. And she really is. I mean, it's. It's. It's. It is phenomenal what she achieves.

[Beth Stevens]

I want to talk about your rehearsal room, because you're known for these productions where you strip a lot away. What is something that you say in rehearsal that might sound unhinged outside of the room?

[Jamie Lloyd]

I mean. I mean, just one thing.

[Beth Stevens]

I mean, like, you can give us many.

[Jamie Lloyd]

I mean, there are. There. I guess the thing is, I always say to actors, please come to the rehearsal room with an open mind and an open heart and just be ready to try anything. Because sometimes we'll come up with some ideas that are a little unexpected. And if there's an ounce of kind of caution or apprehension or frustration or doubt or cynicism, you never know if those ideas are really going to work. So everyone has to just commit to them wholeheartedly. If you commit to those ideas full out, you'll know if they work. And I'll be the first to say, look, that was a terrible idea. What was I thinking?

[Beth Stevens]

So there's a lot of experimentation.

[Jamie Lloyd]

So it's all experimentation. We explore a lot of things. We call it drafting, where we just get up in the space and we just try out so many ideas. And it's not just ideas from me. It's ideas from anywhere in the room. I always say, there's no such thing as a stupid question and no such thing as a stupid suggestion. And it's a real collaboration. And if everyone just kind of tries out all of these ideas, then that's how we can kind of move theater into kind of, you know, new directions. But it does take a lot of courage. But hopefully, the space. The aspiration certainly is that the. The spaces are Such where everyone feels really courageous and really confident and also has a really great time.

[Beth Stevens]

Well, I want to talk about your courage because you make such big choices and take big swings. Was there anything that you did with Sunset Boulevard that scared you even a little?

[Jamie Lloyd]

I mean, doing that, like we were saying outside, doing the camera work for the first time was whole new territory for me. But it was just like so thrilling. It was so exciting to explore that language, but totally unexpected. But to do that live every night, not just the walk around, but every single shot. Sometimes a lot of these shots would take hours to set up if you were filming them on a movie, right? And the fact that this whole team kind of recreates these shots every night, you know, every. The precision of the lighting, the kind of haze and smoke effects, you know, of obviously, like exact. The actors need to be exactly in the right spot. The camera operation, you know, live vision, mixing. I mean, it's unbelievable. Literally unpredictable. So of course it's like. Like I was saying, it's like you're literally on a knife edge every night and it could go wrong, the signal could go down. But somehow like this kind of passion and perseverance from this, this team, the creatives, everybody backstage, this entire company, just like they all come together. It's like the real. What I love about it when I watch it is that it's literally the definition of collaboration. Because it really is like this amazing community of people that come together with real focus and discipline, but also like amazing passion to make it happen every night. And their commitment is just. Yeah, it's kind of incredibly inspiring.

[Beth Stevens]

When you are watching the show, have you ever been surprised by the audience reactions?

[Jamie Lloyd]

Oh, entirely. I mean, I had no idea it was so. It was such a kind of big swing, you know. I got to our dress rehearsal in London and I was thinking, God, what are people going to actually think about this? You know, and it's like. It's like so far removed from that original production, that great production by Trevor Nunn of Sunset Boulevard. So. So completely different. I thought people gonna like this. There was so much kind of cynicism and skepticism about the casting of Nicole, that she was too young. Could she really act? You know, was this kind of like just kind of st. Stunt casting? Was I going to do something kind of really weird? I think people came to those first previews expecting a kind of car crash. And that's kind of been part of the story of the production that actually when people witnessed it and witnessed what Nicole actually does every night, it's kind of like blown their minds. That first preview in London was unforgettable. The fact that people were standing after Sunset Boulevard that, you know, see people seeing that walk around for the very first time ever, and they. The whole auditorium just kind of erupted and likewise with one look and as if we never said goodbye. I mean. And I just could not believe what I was witnessing. I mean, like, you're lucky if, you know, like a handful of people stand at the end of a show in London.

[Beth Stevens]

That's true.

[Jamie Lloyd]

The fact that they were standing mid show was kind of, like, kind of really baffling. And then coming to New York is even wilder than that. You know, that, like, it's like everyone's so passionate and so vocal, and that kind of like amazing kind of like vocal support for this cast, this company is. Is kind of unforgettable. So I it. To this day, I'm so kind of like, surprised that it's connected with audiences in the way that it has, but I'm. I'm obviously thrilled and delighted that it has.

[Beth Stevens]

Okay, let's get a little personal.

[Jamie Lloyd]

Yeah.

[Beth Stevens]

You have a tattoo. Well, you have many tattoos, but you have.

[Jamie Lloyd]

I have one or two.

[Beth Stevens]

You have one or two. You have on your neck. 10086, which is Norma Desmond's fictional trailer.

[Jamie Lloyd]

10,086. Yeah.

[Beth Stevens]

There you go. Tell me that's not just like a tribute, that's a mark.

[Jamie Lloyd]

Yeah.

[Beth Stevens]

So I want to know if that, like, have you ever done that before with the show? What did this show give you? What did it take from you?

[Jamie Lloyd]

Yeah, I mean, this show has changed my life. Like, it. It's. It's. I. It's among them. I mean, I think I've directed, I think, over 70 productions now, and this has just been like an amazing. An amazing experience all around. And I guess, you know, like, I was just so determined just to kind of. It's so hard as an artist, you know, that you're constantly kind of thinking, like, you have to really test yourself not to worry what other people think. You have to just kind of make work from your heart. Like, it has to come from you. You can't kind of just like, give people what they want. You kind of have to kind of make something that's really true to you. And I was so determined to do that with this project and to go on this journey with this exceptional group of people that it felt like very appropriate to kind of mark. Mark the moment. It's one of the projects I'm most proud of and. And I just love. I love being here. I love.

[Beth Stevens]

I can tell by your hat, right? Yeah.

[Jamie Lloyd]

Yeah, I. I love being on Broadway. I love being with this group of people. I love sitting backstage even if I'm not watching the show. We just have a really, really great time and, you know, and it also brought someone very special into my life. I fell in love on the show. You know, I met, you know, my new partner. So it's like a very significant part of my life and, like, has. Yeah, it's kind of changed my life in ways that I didn't even expect. So it felt like a very, you know, important moment to mark on my body for life, I guess.

[Beth Stevens]

All right, let's look to the future. This summer, you are again directing Evita with Rachel Zegler.

[Jamie Lloyd]

Yeah.

[Beth Stevens]

How did you know that she should be your new Ava and what are you trying to build together with her?

[Jamie Lloyd]

Well, she is a remarkable talent. I mean, she is like, she's exceptional and she's just such a good person and such a. She's just such a lovely person. Talking about an open mind and an open heart, she's like, so ready to kind of come into that rehearsals in those. Into rehearsals, you know, just with that kind of spirit of kind of collaboration and exploration. But I love that it's kind of like a new gen version of Eva Peron, you know, Also we have Diego, who's playing Che, who's, you know, sadly leaving Sunset Boulevard to come and join us. He plays arty here. They're much younger than. Than they usually are. The entire cast is. So it really is trying to kind of recreate a kind of Evita for a new generation. And the kind of production has the energy of a kind of. Of a pop gig, like a high concept kind of like pop concert. That's the kind of notion of it, you know, this kind of rags to riches story kind of told through a metaphor of like, you know, like a. A pop icon being created in front of your eyes. So I can think of no one better than Rachel to really going to go on that journey and to sing these songs in a way that you've never heard before. Because she's an unbelievable vocalist, but also like Nicole, she knows what it's like to live under the public eye, to be scrutinized, you know, in such detail. And, you know, that gives her, you know, again, an insight perhaps into Eva Peron's life. So there's something about that that I find very intriguing.

[Beth Stevens]

And even looking farther down the road in the fall, you have waiting For Godot with Alex Winter and Keanu Reeves. You're Bill and Ted.

[Jamie Lloyd]

Yep.

[Beth Stevens]

And you're going to go on an excellent or maybe existential adventure with them.

[Jamie Lloyd]

Yeah.

[Beth Stevens]

What do you think they're going to bring to that work that's going to surprise people?

[Jamie Lloyd]

Well, what I love about them, they're such great people, is that. That they've obviously been friends for over 40 years, and the play ultimately is about companionship. It's about friendship, and it's about friendship, you know, clinging on to friendship in the midst of, you know, a terrible situation or a very bleak situation, and kind of the comfort that you find in that. And so, of course, their friendship comes for free, is that they're. They have this amazing chemistry, this amazing kind of shared humor. So that's this. You can't teach that, you know, so they're going to bring that. They're going to bring this sense of, like, having lived a whole life together. And it's amazing when you hear them read the play together, as I've been doing recently, you know, in terms of the kind of rhythm, Beckett's kind of very specific, kind of almost like vaudevillian rhythm. It's just. They just got it to a T, you know, that they kind of work off each other so brilliantly. So it's gonna. But also, it's like they get all the humor of it, but they get the kind of depth of their friendship, the depth of their lives. You know, two men who are, you know, who are turning 60, believe it or not.

[Beth Stevens]

Wow.

[Jamie Lloyd]

Who, you know, are bringing that whole life experience to that play. I think it's going to be really, really original and really, really fascinating to kind of watch them kind of create those roles afresh.

[Beth Stevens]

All right, coming back to Sunset Boulevard, is there a line from the show that echoes with you?

[Jamie Lloyd]

Hmm. I mean, I guess, like, I love when she sings we'll give the world new ways to dream. That actually, you know, there's something about kind of thinking out of the box, exploring new territory, new ideas, you know, but as coming back to that idea of, you know, my childhood, you know, kind of firing up the imagination, that's. That's. That's what we try to do with all of our work, is that we're trying to kind of increase the connection between the people on stage and the people at the auditorium. And by stripping away some of the kind of circumstantial physical detail, we're not kind of giving them all of that information. We're asking the audience to be kind of co authors in the experience. So their imagination is very much, you know, a part of the experience. And if they're willing to do that, hopefully it's a very satisfying and exciting experience. So hopefully we are giving audiences new ways to dream.

[Tamsen Fadal]

The revival of Sunset Boulevard plays its final performance on Broadway July 20th. Hurry and grab tickets [e-mail] until next time. I'm Tamsen Fadal, and this is the Broadway show Uncut.