← Everything Is Energy with Cathy Heller
Everything Is Energy with Cathy Heller
Kimberly Snyder on The Hidden Power of the Five Hearts
00:54:26
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- [00:00]
Kathy Heller
I'm so excited to invite you to something really special. I have a awesome intro to Kabbalah workshop. It's called the Divine Blueprint. And it's actually Pay what yout Want, where I'm gonna teach you the ancient wisdom that completely changed my life, the spiritual laws behind abundance and miracles, and really, truly why we're here. If you've ever felt stuck or you feel like you're doing all the things but you're not seeing the breakthrough, then this is for you. You're gonna learn how to plug into the 99% of reality to that's actually the real thing. The part that you can't see, but you can shift out of any kind of lack and into abundance and align with the frequency where synchronicities and blessings just start happening all the time. You're going to have this feeling of being grounded and inspired and connected to something so much bigger. And the best part is you can get the workshop for whatever amount feels good to you, because it's pay what you want. Just head to kathyheller.comworkshop and you can grab it. And I would love to hear how this landed for you. So you can DM me on Instagram if you want to tell me your biggest takeaway from watching the workshop.
- [01:01]
Kathy Heller (Podcast Host)
Hey, it's Kathy Heller. Welcome back to the Kathy Heller Podcast. I hope that you had a beautiful weekend. We just came back to Los Angeles for a few weeks, and it's really nice to be able to come and see friends. I had dinner with a friend last night. I had coffee with a friend this morning. And my three daughters have spent so much time already with different friends. One of my daughters went to her friend's birthday party. The other one went to her friend's Bat Mitzvah. And that's really beautiful. And also I can just feel that I have just outgrown the old version of me. And it's really fascinating. I was sitting with my friend at dinner last night talking about how the version of me that lived in LA was really just always hooked into the next event I was planning and the way that I was, you know, hosting things and doing things so much about my external world and the world that I am inhabiting since I moved is really in pursuit of my inner world. Like, really the main characters in the story are my kids. Spending time with my kids and taking them out of school and homeschooling them now has been. It's such a good decision. I wish I would have listened to myself and do it sooner and also just Pursuing a relationship with myself and spending that time every day to sit away from my phone and meditate and take not just one walk a day, but two walks a day. And my goal in the season is not the next achievement. It's how much deeper can my conversation with God be every day? How much more can I find, like, true peace and, like, really just, like, settle into that? And so, yeah, you know, today as, like, I was just reflecting on this, I'm like, wow, we're going to be in LA for several more weeks. And I miss just listening to the rain. I miss. Just like in Florida, it's such a different setting. The radio station is such a different setting. So there's that. And also, it was an interesting moment because we checked into the hotel a couple days ago, and as I'm at the front desk checking in, Marian Williamson comes into the hotel. She's checking in at the exact same time, and she turns to me and she says, kathy Heller. Oh, my goodness. What are you doing here? I said, I just checked in. She's like, I'm just checking in. And she said, you have a few minutes to talk. And we sat down on this couch in the lobby and we caught up for a few minutes. And she said to me, I'm so impressed. I'm so happy for you. Like, your work, it's just doing so well. And I said, thank you. I didn't even know that she. I mean, she's been so lovely, and she wrote a quote for the back of my book and all of that, but I didn't. It was just really lovely what she said. And then as she was walking away, she turned to me and she said, kathy, there are no accidents. And I'm so happy I ran into you. And I just find moments like that so amazing, because there's a part of all of our minds, right when I was growing up, you know, there's like, that little part of us that thinks that in order for us to see the person we need to see or have certain opportunities, like, there's so much we think we have to figure out. And the truth is that God makes all of our appointments. And just like that, like, what if the version of you that is just living your most aligned life just by doing that, that very courageous, powerful thing, which is just waking up every day and pursuing a feeling of inner peace and just making the decisions that always feel like a full yes to you. What if by just living life that way, all of your appointments are being made? And then, of course, you're exactly at the right place, at the right time for all of the most amazing moments. And similarly, I was picking up my daughter from a birthday party yesterday, and this woman who was sitting there, who I've never met, she's a friend of somebody that I know, and she had no idea what I do for a living, nothing like that. We were just having a beautiful, honest conversation. And she. She told me that she had recently gotten divorced. And she started to cry, and she said, it's just been such a hard time. And I said. I told her that I could see that she is such a deep soul and that I could see that it just took so much courage. And I reflected that for her, and she was so touched. And I gave her a hug, and I said to her, I said, no, really, thank you. Because I said, just the fact that I could be there for you in this moment, you gave me such a gift. Like, you made me feel a tremendous amount of connection and meaning. And like I said to her, I think I came to the birthday party not really to pick up my daughter, although I thought that's why I was coming. I really came to just get to have this moment with you. And it's so amazing how you wake up every day and you don't know what the assignment is, but if you just ask that you should be shown, like, how you could best be in service, it's just an unbelievably fulfilling day. You know, I was parking my car at this place in Studio City, and the guy who was running the parking lot, he was just really nice to me. He's like, you know, this ticket. He's like, if you lose this ticket, they're going to charge you 40 bucks. So he's like, just, you know, hang on to it. And he just, like, just the way he was looking out for me, I said, thanks for looking out for me. And then as I was leaving, I said to him, you know, I really appreciate the way you looked out for me like that. And I said, I hope that the kindness you gave me just always comes back to you. And he said, you know what? That means so much to me. He's like, God bless you. I said, thanks. And I thought, there's so many opportunities for us to have these, like, really simple moments that make life so amazing, where we connect with another human being for no reason other than it's such a gift to do it. So, anyway, that's a little bit of where I'm at, and I'm happy because today we're sharing with you a Beautiful conversation I had with Kimberly Snyder. She's a New York Times best selling author, she's the founder of Saluna, she's a nutritionist, she's the host of the Feel Good podcast, and she's been a leader in the world of wellness. And her latest book is the Hidden Power of the Five Hearts. It's so timely. It's all about how you can move out of fear and back into coherence and how your heart literally sends messages to your brain and how living from your heart creates more peace and more health and even synchronicity in your life. This book is gonna teach you so much. Make sure that you get a copy. Kimberly has amazing energy and she's so humble, and I just love this conversation. I think it's gonna give you some equanimity and it's gonna help you feel connected to your own inner light. So without further ado, please welcome the wonderful Kimberly Snyder.
- [08:26]
Kathy Heller
Kimberly, thank you so much for coming on this podcast. And you were so generous and had me on your show and you were so loving and I really enjoyed connecting and I felt like we could have talked for hours and hours. So I'm so happy that we get to talk about your new book and all the things.
- [08:47]
Kimberly Snyder
Thank you so much, Kathy. I'm so glad this finally happened in the right divine timing. We could so much when we spoke about your book a few months ago. So thank you again so much for having me on.
- [08:59]
Kathy Heller
Of course. Yeah. I'm really, really excited to dive into this book that you wrote. I know that there are so many things that you've been writing and so many books and so many conversations that you've had, but I feel like there's probably no better time for someone to have written this book that you just wrote. So for our audience who's listening, it's called the Hidden Power of the Five Hearts. And it came out about a year ago, maybe a little less. First of all, I want you to explain the idea that there are five hearts, and I just think it's so fascinating. So let's just first talk about what that means, and then we're going to dive into how that helps us unlock so much of our own flow.
- [09:40]
Kimberly Snyder
Yeah. So thank you. And this book, actually, Kathy, is my eighth book in 11 years, and I never. That's amazing, really, in this, like, sort of churning of what I really feel like I want to share what I, you know, brimming to get out in the world. And this book really came to me organically after, you know, over 15 years of working in wellness, starting in nutrition and then getting more into the emotional and spiritual side. Our four cornerstones at Saluna are food, body, emotional well being and spiritual growth. And with my last book, which is called you'd Are More Than youn Think youk Are, I started to come across some amazing research around heart coherence and how the heart is another brain. And it was sort of tying together this all my spiritual studies which are bringing me back to this central place in the heart. And so I started to go down this whole rabbit hole about how the heart has been talked about in spiritual traditions around the world. The Egyptians, the Babylonians, the Greeks, the Jewish faith, Sacred Heart of Jesus Christ. In Buddhism, the Anahata chakra. Right. Also in the Quran. So said, wow, like we're in an age right now where there's so much confusion and overthinking. And the more I got into the spiritual aspect, the more I realized that the science of heart coherence, it was all backing everything up. It was a really centralized concept. And after working in wellness so long, I really believe, Kathy, that a big missing piece in wellness for so many people, including myself, was just coming back to this wholeness and the center, this place where we can really feel peace, this place. And we'll talk about the science and the spiritual aspects in a moment where you can expand your perspective out, zoom out of rigid ideas, zoom out of guilt and shame, zoom out of so many things like ways in which we perceive separation with others and have a very different vision, get very different results, and have a much higher level of emotional intelligence. So the five hearts are actually five stages of heart coherence which, where we go from incoherence, where the heart and brain aren't talking and we have a lot of fear and a lot of overwhelm all the way to the clear heart. And these stages were named by Swami Sri Yukteswar, who was a great yogi and a Vedic scholar. And these five heart stages were ones he talked about from the ancient texts. So again, there's this through line of the modern science and the ancient teachings really culminating in the heart inside of all of us.
- [12:11]
Kathy Heller
So beautiful. And I think about my grandmother who didn't even go to school past the fifth grade and had so much wisdom in her because she had such a big heart. She was so compassionate that when we would go to the grocery store and we were checking out, she would say to the grocery, the person who was the clerk, she would say, have you had a hug today? And the person Would look at her like, are you crazy? And then she would give them a hug. And I have often felt that the most impressive person is the most loving person and the wisest person is the most loving. And when you're in a room, I mean, you and I both know a lot of people with a lot to say. And yet the thing that actually creates the most coherence in a space is a person who's making space. And what you just said, it just cuts through all the noise. It's like if you put your hand on your heart at any moment in any given day, is it open or closed? And if you're in a conversation with someone, is the heart open or closed? And what you just said is what very few people are really zeroing in on. And it just becomes like an intellectual. Even spirituality becomes this kind of like, intellectualized pursuit rather than like really anchoring into the. The very powerful practice of what it means to live with an open heart.
- [13:51]
Kimberly Snyder
That's right. I think the science is interesting because it reinforces what I know intuitively. Right. This ide of coherence is when we feel that state of flow and it's measurable with not just HRV numbers, but HRV patterns. And we did a research study with the HeartMath Institute on our Heart aligned meditation. And we found in four weeks of people doing this eight minute practice, four to five times a week, their heart coherence went up almost 30%. Right. So what that means is more immunity, more hormonal balance, better gut health, all these different factors. So the wisdom that you were speaking of your grandmother, which in the modern day, sometimes, Kathy, as we know, sometimes can start to. People start to say, oh, it's, you know, woo, woo, or just being like, overly soft or sentimental, like the heart. The heart. But actually what the ancients always knew was the heart was a power center, right? This direct pathway to the true self, to the higher self, however we like to think of it. And now the science shows there's 40,000 neurons in the heart. And that's why the heart forms first in the fetus, right? And the heart is actually sending more messages up to the brain than vice versa. So you were talking about cutting through. I feel like in the world today, there's so much information and busyness and thoughts and hurried energy and things we're supposed to be doing all the time. But the simple practices I talk about in the book, which are in each stage to get you to the next stage of higher coherence, higher peace, higher clarity, higher abundance. Is they're really simple and it's about cutting through and getting out of the thoughts instead of trying to battle the thoughts from the thoughts. When you come down into your heart, you start to turn on a very different type of wisdom. So it's not, you know, impractical. It's actually the opposite. It's very rational. It's very common sense. You don't have to get swept up in the reactivity of the mind and these old patterns. You can actually start to create neuroplasticity between the heart brain connection and you can just be much more of who you are instead of, you know, reacting all the time from an overly emotional place.
- [16:00]
Kathy Heller
Yeah, I am. It's so beautiful what you just said. And I want to dive in deeper. And I'm sure people who are listening because our listeners are really good students and readers and seekers, they might know a little bit about this or have heard a little bit about this. I know for myself and having done, I think I did four retreats with Dr. Joe. And you know, there's so much to Dr. Joe Dispenza's work about the electromagnetic power in the heart and how we can do a coherence healing when we all synchronize our own hearts. And just having been in rooms like that multiple times, I mean, you are weeping like the. The amount of energy and love and openness and possibility that gets created. And I've been to the lab where we saw, you know, how just people meditating with an open heart can change cells inside of an incubator. So can you talk a little bit about the power we have to walk through, to walk through the world with this turned on and actually create health and give people a biological update just from being ourselves in a state of an open heart.
- [17:19]
Kimberly Snyder
Yes. And I know Dr. Joe has been heavily influenced by the science of the heart math as well. He's sometimes. And thank you for saying that because sometimes I've seen it with people where, you know, I'm going to, I have to go to the spa or I have to go to this retreat or I have to have this experience. And it can be helpful to be with others. Right. And I'm not discrediting that, but what's really powerful is when we start to realize that the power is walking around with us every of every day and every micro moment, we can actually choose to be more in our hearts. And you said, you know, living with an open heart and it's a continuum, it's like over and over again we make this Choice. And so I often, and I say this in the book, it's a really great practice. As soon as you wake up, as soon as you wake up and you open your eyes, you can just start to breathe into your heart, Take heart focused breaths, just putting your attention on your heart. For example, as I'm naturally touching my heart. Research published in the American Journal of Cardiology shows this alone starts to rewire your nervous system. You can start to do micro practices to come into this place, which over time, like I said, our research study was four weeks, but in as little as three days, you start to feel lighter and more energized. Because incoherence means we're in a stress response which we know disables our body. It pulls energy out of our GI tract, it lowers our immunity. We don't think clearly because everything is just out of whack. So coherence is like energy efficiency. Everything starts to come into what's called entrainment. Everything starts to become more harmonious and more efficient. So one of the things that you start to realize as you do this work, remember I said it's one of the missing pieces of wellness, where people walk around and they may be the exact fitness level or body that they want, but they have no peace, Kathy, and their mind is racing.
- [19:12]
Kathy Heller
I have no peace, right.
- [19:14]
Kimberly Snyder
And so this piece of the puzzle makes everything so efficient for me. My body had a lot more energy, my digestion got even stronger, and I never really get sick. Like my skin started to look better. Because everything is part of this wholeness that's inside of us. And the heart is our center. So these practices that I talk about in the book and moving through the stages, which we can talk about, by the way, are dark, propelled, steady, devoted and clear. Means as you progress into spending more time in the higher stages, you have more vitality, you have more lightness, more joy, more peace, more creativity, deeper relationships, and you're less susceptible to stress. Because we do live in a world where a lot of things happen, but it's really our reactions, it's how we really start to rewire our nervous system.
- [20:03]
Kathy Heller
That makes it makes perfect sense. Like, perfect sense. The amount of people who will choose a pursuit that looks like it's about health only to find that that's the newest way for them to actually put themselves in distress. Because now they are punishing and shaming themselves, but they look on the outside like they're vital. And meanwhile the amount of fight or flight and stress, because there's actually not any. There's there's very little peace going on inside. Right. And it's become just another way for them to create shame and pressure for themselves. It's really fascinating. You know, like my grandmother, who I mentioned, she lived in 96, and this was a person who knew nothing about biohacking or whatever. And her biggest biohack was empathy, which included herself and, like, deep intimacy with people. Like, you know what I mean? Like, the connections. The way she, like, kissed people's hands. Who took care of her at the end of her life and still listened to baseball games on the radio and got excited about things and never allowed herself to take on, you know, what was happening globally. But she would say, I. I'm here to change the world for one person every day and not try to, like, it was just her biohack was having so much inner peace and really purpose and really joy and compassion. And so. And she's just one example. But I think it's really interesting how many people can give you, you know, tons of information about their microbiome, which is important, really important. And meanwhile, the amount of intensity that's going on in their mind is making them sick.
- [21:57]
Kimberly Snyder
Exactly. And, you know, it's funny, Kathy, because with the Blue Zones and Dan Buettner, who discovered that Blue Zones is a good friend of mine. He's been on my podcast many times.
- [22:06]
Kathy Heller
Same.
- [22:06]
Kimberly Snyder
I don't watch a lot of things, but I saw his Netflix special and there was this. I think she was one of the elders from Okinawa, and they asked her what her secret was for living to 106 or however old she was.
- [22:18]
Kathy Heller
Yeah.
- [22:19]
Kimberly Snyder
Said I don't hold on to anger.
- [22:22]
Kathy Heller
That's it.
- [22:22]
Kimberly Snyder
Right. So it's like letting go from the heart. Right. Which is the bigger picture. Compassion, self, Anger with ourselves, anger with others. Like, hey, I'm learning and growing. This person is too. Not that clamping down, which is the mind.
- [22:37]
Kathy Heller (Podcast Host)
Right.
- [22:38]
Kimberly Snyder
That clamping down is the stuffing down of vitality and health. And it's so. It's like this openness, like we talk about an open heart is this ability to process and let go over and over again. Right. In the daily life. Oh, the traffic is here. You start to feel yourself constrict and get angry. And then you have to be able to breathe into your heart. Do some of these heart coding art stools, pivot shift, let it go. Flow through the day. Right. All the ancient teachings. The Dao de Jane talks about water. It's like the most prevalent analogy, which is so powerful. Just like love is so powerful without forcing, rigid. It's this beautiful gentleness, but it shows the way. And ultimately. And when. This is one of the things in the book I talk about, because the propelled heart is where we have more energy than the fear of the dark heart. But it's still that always on that burnout. Like we see so much in modern life. Go, go, go, stressed out all the time. We realize that if we can actually be so centered in our heart, we don't have to spin our wheels all the time. We become far more efficient. We have more clarity. Instead of going this way and then this way and back and forth. Right. Which I see so many people doing. They try this diet for a day, then they go back and they forth and they don't know how to eat, and they don't even know when they're hungry. We can start to just find more of this stillness and this inner wisdom that all the great spiritual traditions really did teach us and bring that into our life. Because I feel like that's really been lost in the modern world is this heart wisdom. We've gotten so heady and everything's analytical and everything's like, quantitatively based, and there's more devices and more biohacking. And I'm not saying some of that can't be helpful, because it can, but not at the expense of completely foregoing our innate wisdom.
- [24:27]
Kathy Heller
So what you mentioned before, those are the names of the five hearts. Explain to us what that means and how we can find a way to put them in balance.
- [24:37]
Kimberly Snyder
Okay, so there's five heart stages, and we can dip in and out of all of them in a short period of time. But we tend to spend periods in one stage more than the other. So I'll give you an example. The first one is the dark heart. And dark night is in bad, but dark, like we can't see. Right. Yoga talks about the third eye having higher vision. So we're locked in a limited perspective. And this is where there's a lot of fear, confusion, overwhelm, dark emotions, dark feelings. Sometimes we don't feel at all. We're disconnected from our hearts. And then let's say more energy built. We make a lifestyle change, or, you know, for whatever reason, we start to have more energy. And then we enter the second heart stage, which is the propelled heart. This is a little bit more coherence if we were to look at an HRV pattern. But this is a stage where I mentioned where it's like propelled into action. My worth is equated with how much I Do how much I change what I look like, you know, my family status, how much money I have, what I look like on social media. So there's a lot of stress and a lot of that lack of peace. And then the third stage, we start to move a little bit more into incoherence and we start to feel more steadiness inside. So we realize, Kathy, we can't change the world to be more steady, but we can be more of an anchor ourselves. So we need less external validation. You know, we're looking less to the opinions of others. We start to feel more clear in ourselves. So there's a big jump here. And then the fourth stage is the devoted heart. And this is where we become more devoted, as it would be to inner qualities. So we start to value peace more than just, you know, how many followers we have on TikTok, right. We start to have a very high level of heart awakening and coherence. And the ironic thing is that even though we're really, you know, more kind and compassionate and valuing these inner qualities, things tend to work out more easily because coherence is magnetic. And we can talk about the science of the heart field in just a moment. But it's easier for us to communicate. We have more emotional intelligence. We can really see what someone's trying to communicate, which is so much more than their words. And then there's still one more stage which is the clear heart. And I use the analogy in the book of a prism. So first when you see a prism, it's like, eh, it's just kind of like, you know, clear. It's not flashy. But what happens when you hold it up to the light, Kathy?
- [27:09]
Kathy Heller
Right.
- [27:09]
Kimberly Snyder
It reflects all the colors. So there's this transparency with the clear heart. It becomes one with the universal heart. So this full expression, the ego has really been silence to the extent that the full power of unconditional love and peace and oneness and transcending these ideas of judgment and separation. So these are when we're in these moments. And it sounds like a really lofty stage, but let's say you're doing the dishes and you're just sort of not thinking you're in this like, really still place, or you're taking a shower or you're looking into your child's eyes. So we go into moments of all of these stages. But what we can do with these tools and teachings, that's the purpose of the book, is to get you to be in the higher, the devoted and clear heart and even steady heart stages More and more.
- [27:58]
Kathy Heller
It's so beautiful. And I just love so many of the things that you just said. And one of them is, I mean, there's so many so good. One of the things that you said was like, you can make the peace happen inside of you, which you can't do all around you. You're not in control of that. But even though that's such an obvious thing, it's really so important to know that and to be self directed in that way and everything that you were just sharing about the clarity to see and how the light then shows through all the different possibilities. Because you're open, you're in that beginner's mind, you're in that curiosity rather than the judgmental awareness. You're in this open awareness and, and just sitting here thinking how people often are looking for like business advice, right? And it's like what you just said, that's. You don't need a business coach, you need that, right? Because if you walk into a meeting and you have the capacity and the generosity and the humility to make that kind of space for somebody, it's the most beautiful, potent thing that you could say or do in a meeting is just to come with that kind of heart centered presence. And same thing in parenting. It's like everyone's reading all these books and it's like you had the capacity to drop into your heart what gets revealed, what gets seen, what gets done. It's quant. You're quantum leaping because you're actually moving from the most powerful place within you rather than this thin, really, you know, oh, it's flimsy muscle. Flimsy. Yeah, exactly.
- [29:39]
Kimberly Snyder
Well, no, I'm laughing, Kathy, because I feel, I mean, I can look at this book of all my books. I live this book, right? Like when I'm. When I think about the stages of the propelled heart. And so much of my life was in that that I call myself a recovering perfectionist, vying for achievement, having to be number one in the class, thinking I was a failure if I got an A minus, having eating disorders, like constantly counting every calorie, just so much micromanaging. And people might be like, oh, look like you're doing this, Y, Z, you know, xyz. And you look like this. But there was so much anxiety. And then you start to realize like, you know, what is, what is really what matters to me in my life. And I think about my last relationship and now what I have with my husband and the life that I've been able to create with my kids. And it's funny, Kathy, because I'm not on social media so much, but I was on there and I was answering some of my comments and I saw a flash of this woman who a couple years ago would have been like, oh, like feeling bad about myself. I should be like this person because she has a podcast too and she's an author with the same publishing house. But I looked at her and she was like hustling and doing her like really fast talking videos and all the stuff she usually does, which is great for her. And I said to myself, Kathy, I was like, great for her. I said, it was so clear. I was like, that's not who I want to be. I don't want that. But, but younger Kimberly a few years ago would have been like, I should be bigger. Like I should be this I, you know, this constant striving. And so now when I can say, wow, I just have so much more peace and Kathy, this wholeness. Because anytime we're in propelled heart, there's always a sense of lack. And to your business meetings, people sense it. Like, you don't feel like you're enough. You feel like you need to be smarter, totally freeze. Like you need to have a better idea. And when you're in your heart, there's this abundance that you start to attract because you're not trying to be perfect and you're not pretending, you're not trying to wear these masks. You're just who you are. And it's very magnetic and it's very authentic.
- [31:42]
Kathy Heller
I mean, it's so beautiful what you just said. And that was very generous of you to even share that vulnerable aspect of yourself, by the way. It just makes people like you more because they're like, yeah, I know exactly what I can relate. And I had a similar conversation with someone on my team and it had to do with somebody else who wrote a book. And I wrote a book and this person's book was like, you know, hundreds of millions of copies were sold and I said that I saw this person being interviewed like a million times, thought to myself, it's interesting how on our way through our journey, sometimes we have our ladder right in a particular outcome and then we move the ladder and the only outcome we want is peace and wholeness. And we look back and we say, wow, I was in such an interesting, you know, sort of wounded part of myself that made me feel as though that kind of non stop output would equal a feeling of success. And now what feels like success is having less on my calendar. What feels like Success is really drinking, you know, a cup of tea every morning and having my own garden boxes. And I, like, I feel for that version of myself, you know, that ever thought that that would be a life well lived. It's like, oh, my gosh, you know, and. Yeah, why?
- [33:12]
Kimberly Snyder
And exactly, Kathy. And then also I want to say be incredibly productive and create a lot, but without that feeling of lack. You're never doing enough. Like, that voice that's always like, more, more, more, that I lived with for so many years. So now it's like, you know, when I get coherent and clear, it's like, oh, reach out to this person. You know, my energy is best spent doing this email or doing this. But it's never like, let me, you know, jam in as much as I can. And ironically, I feel like. And I'm a busy working mom, too. You just can create on such a different quantum level with quality, and you're creating from this place of, hey, this is really what's in my heart. This is really what I want to share. This is how I can support others. Like, this is what I feel like this project really needs. Like, it opens up the world.
- [34:02]
Kathy Heller
Yeah. I mean, it was interesting. Somebody recently posted, like, the top 200 spiritual influencers. And I was looking at the list, and I was thinking, like, my rabbi who lives in the old city of Jerusalem for 50 years, who nobody knows, is like, he doesn't care that he's not on that list. You know, the woman that you just talked about in the blue zones, she doesn't want to be on that list. You know what I mean? Like, the people who are actually moving the. The stars to actually bring coherence to our world and ecosystem are like these hidden, righteous truth seekers rather than like, oh, no, you know, why I must be influential? Oh, well, obviously I am, because I have, you know, this particular amount of followers on Instagram. Like, it's ridiculous that we have ever even gotten caught in any conversations about that. Right when we're here to do the work, which is, you know, sit at Walden Pond, you know, that's. That's your legacy. You know, get still. That's your legacy. So I love that you and I can rename that to people listening right now, because that is such a distraction. That world is such a distraction from the deep, incredible, profound peace that lives within you and that you can offer to the world.
- [35:29]
Kimberly Snyder
Exactly. You know, Kathy, what I was saying about my younger. My previous self, let's say from the propelled heart, I wouldn't have been able to see That I would be like, Kathy, but wait, like this and like, you know, I'm doing this and I need to sell some amount of books. So what happens as you go through higher coherence? There is a connection, we can say between the heart and the vision, which the, you know, the yogis called the third eye. Or you could just say higher perspective or whatever it is. So nothing in your life could change except for you working on opening your heart. And suddenly you would see things a completely different way. You could see that person that annoys you in a completely different way and have a lot more compassion. You could see what your mother in law is really trying to say. So like me sitting here like, whoa, instead of, you know, a couple years ago be like, oh, you know, I wish I was like that person. And I sold as, you know, many books in the first month as that. And like, what did I do? Like always the beating up or whatever, the comparisons, you start to see that, wow, I'm so much more calm, I'm enjoying my days. And this really is priceless. And the ancient texts talk about this, the Bhagavad Gita and the Vedic text where Swami Sri Yukteswar is talking about how focusing on the fruit, fruits of your labor, name chasing, fame, all these things, you call it a distraction. It is taking you out of what really brings you peace into external validation. Again, this is all from the propelled heart. And it's okay to have that stuff. And it's not bad to want to be successful, but we can say what's really like, the real success is how peaceful you are. And that is real health, right? Kathy? I worked with celebrities for so many years and it was interesting because I don't, I still don't own a TV and I never watched. I just am more drawn to books. So I never, I never watch movies or TV shows. So sometimes I'd be like, why am I working with all these people? Like, why did God put me here? But it was a really interesting part of the journey where I could see that people were idolizing these, like the most beautiful people in the world. And these people had so much anxiety and had the same problems. And I was like, the world has it wrong. This is not getting us where truth and peace live.
- [37:41]
Kathy Heller
Yeah, it's so fascinating. I was sharing the other day that from a kabbalistic lens, you know, we are here for our own soul correction. And therefore it has nothing to do with what anyone else is doing. Like the soul doesn't even get any reward from outcome. It only gets reward from how it makes choices and how it shows up in experiences and perceives. A moment like that's all that we came to the world to do is to correct our capacity to experience and perceive in full wholeness has nothing to do with achievement. And so we're literally here to answer to that part within ourselves, that soul, and to what the Divine sent us here to do. And everything else is the complete distraction from what you're actually after, which is whatever assignment your soul is on for this lifetime, which is com. It makes everything so irrelevant. And when we are in a world where people have externalized and created that everything that matters is what they achieve, it gets really that confusing because it's really loud. That story is very loud. And yet when you get quiet every time, if you really listen, you're going to hear what you need to remember, which has nothing to do with what you need to achieve externally. And that's why writing books like you're writing are so important. So important. So everything you just said is really such a good, important statement, which is the thing we're seeking is to be in coherence and to have this real luxury which is peace. Like that's. That's it.
- [39:30]
Kimberly Snyder
And it's not a destination like, here we are and we're in Peaceland. We never get off. So there's a section in the Devoted Heart chapter and it's called Never Miss an Opportunity to Serve. I love about service. We think about these big, lofty things, like, maybe I should just be volunteering every weekend, or maybe I'm in this, like, you know, wrong career path. But what this means, Kathy, is moment to moment, doing the kind, the heartfelt, the loving thing. So are you in such a rush that you don't let that person into your lane? Or can you slow down and be like, hey, you look like you're in a rush. Let me just let this extra car in. Or let me really look into the eyes of this checkout person at Target and ask them how they're doing, right? So the mind is like, hurry, rush into achievement so you can gloss over these micro moments which really make up our life. It's like these ideas. We can get rigid, we can get hard. You don't realize that you're walking around with a really tough resting face, shall we say? You kind of like look away from people in the elevator or whatever it is. But what this work is about is saying, as we just said, Kathy, it's not these big lofty things at the end of your life. Like a list. It's this embodiment of hard work, moment to moment. If we're in trauma, if we're in reactivity, if we're in old patterns, we don't feel like ourselves. I remember being in the propelled heart and being like, sometimes I could get snippy because I really wanted to get this project done or whatever. That's not who I am. So what feels really good, what feels like success is if I can be more peaceful, but also kind and loving and stay connected to myself and others. The name of my podcast is the Feel Good Podcast. Not feel good as in like, we're giggly all the time, but feeling good to me is feeling whole and connected and authentic. Right? So then it's like each moment really counts. And if you go away from your heart, it's okay too, right? Because we're all human and we can learn and then we can see, oh, this didn't feel so good. And it keeps directing us back. And the more coherent we become and we do the practices like the Heart Aligned Meditation and the Harmonizing Life that have the research and the scientific practices in the book, it becomes easier and easier. You're rewiring yourself.
- [41:47]
Kathy Heller
Let's talk about that. So if people are listening, we'll obviously direct them to get the book. And in terms of taking one step into the practices in the book, give us one sense of a practice that we might start to work with that can help us to achieve this state of being.
- [42:03]
Kimberly Snyder
Do we have time to do a practice, Kathy? Sure do. Like a. A mini, like a two minute.
- [42:10]
Kathy Heller
I love it.
- [42:11]
Kimberly Snyder
Okay.
- [42:12]
Kathy Heller
What a gift. That's so generous.
- [42:14]
Kimberly Snyder
Okay, so this is a super brief touching in and we see how we really can go directly there. Right. This more still we get. So we're going to close our eyes. Unless you're driving, you can come back to this later. Otherwise we're just going to close our eyes for a moment and straight away you're going to place your attention on your heart. So I mean your physical heart and also your energetic heart right here in the middle of your chest, just dropping in, feeling you can even touch your heart physically if that helps you connect. And now we're going to take a few deep breaths, imagining that you're breathing in and out of your heart, like your heart is your lung. Okay. So focusing on your heart, we're going to breathe in for 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. And exhale out for 1, 2, 3, four, five. Keep bringing your attention back to your heart. And again, one more deep cycle like that breath cycle. Inhaling for 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 and exhaling for 1, 2,3, 4, 5. So now we won't count the breaths anymore. But keep your attention on your heart and I want you to imagine someone or something that makes you feel appreciation. So appreciation is a mix of gratitude, thankfulness and awe. It could be a loved one or beautiful sunset. I just want you to focus on this feeling of appreciation right in your heart. Feel a little tingly, maybe a little expansive or warm. We're just going to rest here for another moment or two, really going into this feeling of appreciation. And take another deep breath into your heart and exhale one more deep breath, breathing in that appreciation which can start to naturally expand out into peace, love and exhaling out appreciation, peace and law. Just take one last moment to thank your amazing heart for all of its wisdom. It's always there for you, right here, right inside. And then when you're ready, you can open your eyes. Beautiful.
- [45:43]
Kathy Heller
So beautiful.
- [45:45]
Kimberly Snyder
And you know, it's. I'll show you this graph really quick. Kathy. The more we get into the. See this little. It's really amazing when you see these self generated emotions, right. We can start to recall someone or something that makes us feel that appreciation. And the reason we did appreciation. This is on page 29 in the book. You can see how it really changes your coherence. Whereas when we're irritated or frustrated, it's very jumpy. And this is your thoughts, this is, you know, your energy going down. This is your gut health being out of whack. So in the research study we went into appreciation and we stayed there for two minutes which over time like your mind starts to jump around. But did you feel a little tingliness actually neurons wiring and shifting and that is creating, creating that entrainment. Something as simple. And appreciation is a little bit more expansive than gratitude. But this is research to bring that heart coherence so that you can feel calmer, you become more resilient to stress and old thoughts. It's really amazing. It's really simple. Like this simple practice the heart focused breathing, which has been shown to start to change your messages up to the brain. So there's science and there's ancient spirituality to it as well.
- [47:05]
Kathy Heller
Yeah. For anyone who was only listening and not watching, Kimberly was just showing a page from the book with two graphs that actually maps the heart coherence and can show the difference between what's happening in the heart and the body, so to speak. When you're focused on anger and what's happening when you're focused on appreciation. So that's really cool. Is there something else you want to add to the science by which doing this actually gives you better quality of like health and vitality? And how does it actually also maybe scientifically help you to. You know, in this conversation we talked a lot about manifestation and finding a life. Like how does the science of your heart coherence actually change your health and change the way you manifest the life around you?
- [47:57]
Kimberly Snyder
So two separate questions. These are great. And again in the book, there's so many research studies that I reference because I think it's interesting, I think for the discerning mind just to say, oh, this isn't published research, so I can start to really believe this.
- [48:11]
Kathy Heller
Exactly.
- [48:12]
Kimberly Snyder
So one of the interesting studies was about hormones, which we know are so important to our health and wellness at all stages of our lives. And this particular study was using the research and I'll hold it up and I know some people are just listening to this, but, but in one month of doing the heart coherence practices that I teach in the book, research based on this dhea, which is a precursor hormone, which is important for vitality, for fertility, for many things, for us to feel that aliveness went up 100% and cortisol went down 23%. So I just got my blood work done a few months ago, Kathy, and my THEA level and all the hormone, you know, the hormone panels were balanced and it was the level of like a 18 to 22 year old woman. Right. So this is going to age into how the energy inside of us, that's incredible. Start to really go to levels that we couldn't even imagine. Again, aliveness, your skin repairing, your body, just functioning. And then the other question you asked was about manifestation. So harmony breeds abundance. Right. Like that graph we just looked at with the, with the anger, it's like all over the place. It repels things away from you and repels opportunities. So when we look at the heart field, which is this picture on 45, what this is, I believe in my heart, no pun intended, Kathy, this is the most powerful way to manifest. Because as we become more coherent, we're aligning with all of life and all of oneness. We're not falling out of sync. We're not going into just me, me, me or isolation or fragmentation or over competition. We're saying, hey, I'm part of this. Part of this is where you can pull anything that you want to create anything right in alignment. And so when I was, I think we chatted about this maybe when we were doing our other show, but when I was in the clear heart moment, I remember coming out of my door in my apartment in New York when I lived there and feeling so clear. A couple of months before, I had Deepak Chopra review.
- [50:26]
Kathy Heller
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that was so cool, that story.
- [50:29]
Kimberly Snyder
But then I was like, I'm going to go to this meet. I had to go to this meeting in the East Village, but I just randomly decided to go around Union Square park, which makes no sense because I would have walked twice as long, but I was just in the flow. So I walked the other way, and I ran into Deepak on the street. I was like, deepak, it's Kimberly. You just reviewed my book. So because of this moment of coherence, he gave me a cell phone number. I imagine other people come up to him all the time. And we met at a coffee shop a few weeks later, and in two hours we decided to write a book together called Radical Beauty, which went on to become a New York Times bestseller. And it was from this place of creating, Right?
- [51:07]
Kathy Heller
Exactly. Ah, love those stories.
- [51:10]
Kimberly Snyder
Anxious ego mind. Kathy was like, keep writing to the email on the website or just like, force your way through or try to show up at a conference and da, da, da. This just happened in the infinite intelligence of the universe, right? We have those moments. We have these synchronicities. So this is the field. The clear heart is really where miracles live. The conscious mind is like, well, I don't know how that could have worked out, but there's so much more than we can see, right? There's just so much quantum energy and alignment. And so the more we open our hearts, the more we get out of the fragmentation of the mind. We open ourselves up to pure manifestation.
- [51:49]
Kathy Heller
It's so pure because it's just happening beyond space and time. It's happening inside the frequency that is the most powerful, which is love. And it's such a magnet. It's amazing. And, yeah, it's so cool. So tell everybody where they can listen to your podcast and buy your book and all the things.
- [52:11]
Kimberly Snyder
So the Hidden Power, the Five Hearts is available anywhere books are sold. My essential hub is mysaluna.com where we have lots of courses and workshops on the heart, as well as wellness recipes, all sorts of things. It's the Feel Good podcast and we have our amazing interview with you, Kathy, up there from a few months ago, which I hope everyone listens to as well. Also social, I guess I should say, at underscore, Kimberly Snyder for positive social.
- [52:41]
Kathy Heller
Right you're also so beautiful.
- [52:43]
Kimberly Snyder
I just want to say, oh, from the heart. And your heart is so beautiful.
- [52:49]
Kathy Heller
Thank you for this conversation. I'm like, I'm so at peace. I'm just like floating right now.
- [52:54]
Kimberly Snyder
Thank you so much, Kathy. I just love you and your big heart and chatting with you. We could chat all day and you know, I'm just so appreciative.
- [53:03]
Kathy Heller
So appreciative.
- [53:04]
Kathy Heller (Podcast Host)
Also. How beautiful is Kimberly? All right, here are the takeaways. Number one, the heart is a power center. It's a direct pathway to the true self, to the higher self. Number two, heart power is walking around with us every second of every day, in every micro moment. We can choose to be more in our hearts. Number three, we can't change the world to be more steady, but we can be more of an anchor to ourselves. Number four, even if you only worked on opening your heart and nothing else, suddenly you're going to see things in a completely different way. Number five, the real success is how peaceful you are. That is also the real health. Number six, moment to moment, do the kind, the heartfelt, the loving thing. Never miss an opportunity to serve. Number seven, the work is not about a big list, lofty things at the end of your life. It's the embodiment of your heart, moment to moment. Number eight, harmony breeds abundance. Because as we become more coherent, we're aligning with all of life and all of this oneness. And number nine, the clear heart is really where miracles live. The more we open our hearts, the more we get out of the fragmentation of the mind and we open ourselves to pure manifestation. Thank you so much for being here. It means so much to me and we have so many good conversations coming up on the podcast. So make sure you follow us on Spotify or Apple podcasts wherever you're loving to listen. And if you enjoy the podcast, please leave us a review, because it just lights me up to read what you have to say. And here's one that just touched my heart so much. It says, truth at work. Kathy is so honest and kind and authentic and radically loving in her expressions of how we can all access an abundant life. All of her experiential learnings are available to each of us right now without expectations. And she so generously gives. If you haven't spent time with this podcast yet, please give it a try. You'll be back over and over again to devour all of the loaded goodness. That is just so nice. Thank you so much. Before we go on, I just want to let you know that you can get this amazing Kabbalah workshop that I did. It's called the Divine Blueprint. It's pay what you want, so you can literally get it for whatever you want. You can make any contribution that feels good to you. Just go to kathyheller.com workshop. Check it out. I think that you're going to love that workshop so much, and I love you, and I hope that you have a really blessed week.